The After Show: Since You've Been Gone

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Speaker 1 Hi, everybody. Welcome to 2020 The After Show.

Speaker 1 I'm Deborah Roberts and today we're diving into a case that people in Phoenix, Arizona have been haunted by for two decades when 17-year-old Alyssa Turney disappeared on the last day of her junior year of high school.

Speaker 1 Authorities at first believed it looked like a classic runaway case. There was even a note saying she was leaving for California.

Speaker 1 But eventually, as authorities began to explore testimonies from her friends, they look at her stepfather, Michael Turney.

Speaker 1 This episode of 2020 explores the twists and turns of that case, and there were many, including a false confession from a serial killer, the discovery of pipe bombs, and a murder trial acquittal of Alyssa's Alyssa's stepfather.

Speaker 1 A lot to dig into. Our 2020 team was there from the beginning, even sitting down with Michael Tourney twice along the way.

Speaker 1 Joining me now to talk a little bit more about it is Mary Ellen Resendez-Schuizzo, one of our editorial producers who was along for

Speaker 1 quite a ride with this story. Hey, Mary Ellen.

Speaker 3 Hi, Deborah. Good to be here.

Speaker 1 You and I have worked on a number of stories together.

Speaker 1 Often when I come out west, you're on a story and you dig into them and you you know all the details, you know, from having, you know, been involved in them for a while.

Speaker 1 And it's always been such a pleasure working with you.

Speaker 3 Same. Love working with you, Deborah.

Speaker 1 This case, we already know that it had quite the twist with investigators going from thinking Alyssa was a runaway, then initially putting their effort into investigating whether her stepfather might have something to do with it.

Speaker 1 So before you and I jump in, let's listen to a clip and remind our listeners of the details of this story with correspondent John Kiñonis.

Speaker 4 The last time I set foot on this dusty desert road between Phoenix and Los Angeles was 2009. I was reporting on a vibrant teenage girl named Alyssa Turney.
She had disappeared in 2001.

Speaker 4 And to this day, some wonder if this unforgiving and lonely landscape might hold secrets of her fate.

Speaker 3 17-year-old Alyssa Marie Turney was disappearance and presumed death of 17-year-old Alyssa.

Speaker 8 Alyssa Turney hasn't been seen in more than seven years.

Speaker 9 Just a bombshell arrest tonight, almost 20 years after Phoenix teen Alyssa Turney vanished.

Speaker 4 My report on her case went on to have a life of its own.

Speaker 3 This is the story of Alyssa Turney.

Speaker 4 Showing up in countless stories about Alyssa on the internet and podcasts. And recently, it was even at the center of a trial aimed at answering once and for all what really happened to Alyssa.

Speaker 2 Wow, you hear John there talk about our involvement in the case for a long time, 2020. And, you know, this happens sometimes in these stories.
We have a history, and this one goes back to 2009, right?

Speaker 3 It does. We did our first show in 2009.

Speaker 3 At that time, Alyssa's case had gone cold, but it caught the attention of these two missing person detectives in the Phoenix Police Department, William Anderson and Stuart Somershu.

Speaker 3 Those names start to become very familiar with her case. And it caught their attention when a Florida convict, Thomas Hymer, confesses to killing Alyssa.

Speaker 3 We hadn't heard anything about Alyssa until this time. He then recants that confession, though, after they kind of confront him and they bring some pictures.
He says it's not Alyssa.

Speaker 2 And people don't think she ran away. I mean, when you're starting to talk to people, right?

Speaker 3 Yeah, she was reported as a runaway by her father, but police are starting to suspect she didn't run away. Something's afoul with this.

Speaker 3 Now, up until this time, because she was a runaway, there wasn't a huge police investigation. There also wasn't a lot of media coverage, and we're going to kind of get into that a little bit later.

Speaker 3 Michael Turney says, all along, he has been searching for his daughter, Alyssa, and he's been working with the Center for Missing and Exploited Children.

Speaker 3 He goes to California, he's putting up flyers, this effort of looking for Alyssa. And then he agrees to give John Quiñonez an exclusive interview.

Speaker 3 And it's that that interview that ends up getting used a decade later in court. It catches these two detectives' attention because they say Michael wouldn't grant them an interview.

Speaker 3 And it's also where his children kind of start questioning what really happened to their sister. The story.

Speaker 2 Yeah, he's talking to us, but not so much to authorities. Now, what are you making of him?

Speaker 3 He's intense. There's no doubt.
He's an intense character and, you know, very protective father.

Speaker 13 All I can say till hell freeze is over, I didn't do a damn thing to my daughter.

Speaker 5 Did you kill her?

Speaker 6 No,

Speaker 12 absolutely not.

Speaker 2 Oftentimes, these stories that we stumble upon have just had local attention. And, you know, nobody really has been talking about them in a big way on a national scale.

Speaker 2 So when you're having suddenly national attention focused on a story, I mean, obviously, if somebody's missing, that makes a big difference. How did that impact this case to start off?

Speaker 3 Well, there was a big need to find answers. I mean, when you're talking about someone who's missing, those first 24, 40 hours are crucial.

Speaker 3 We're talking seven years later when we're coming on board this and when police are actually, you know, going and starting to interview people.

Speaker 3 So our first show did not necessarily create the momentum for detectives to look at Michael Turney.

Speaker 3 They had been a year into their investigation after reopening it, and they were looking at him as a person of interest.

Speaker 3 Local podcaster Octavia McHenry said after watching the ABC interview with Michael Turney, she was inspired to start a podcast. That podcast starts in 2017.

Speaker 3 Sarah Turney, who is Alyssa's younger sister by five years, she tells McHenry that she had supported her father, but after watching her father's interview with John, she starts to have doubts little by little.

Speaker 3 Interesting. Her confidence is sort of chipping away here.
She says she wasn't aware that her father had had taken her out of school.

Speaker 2 And then now suddenly they're hearing it on 2020. Yes.

Speaker 2 You know, it's interesting because sometimes people sit down to do these interviews with us and maybe they have a certain expectation of how it's going to go.

Speaker 2 But in this case, it kind of shined a different light on him. You've been a reporter in Phoenix for a long time.
This story was clearly being talked about out there.

Speaker 2 You can't have a disappearance of a young teen girl and people not talking about it.

Speaker 2 What had you been hearing over the years and what was sort of the general thinking in the community and in the area? What was known?

Speaker 3 I don't recall a lot from her initial disappearance and that might be because she was reported as a runaway. You know, we don't tend to cover, there are so many runaway cases.

Speaker 3 And while our hearts go out to all the families, we don't tend to cover them unless there's a dangerous component.

Speaker 3 Let's say it's a minor that took off with a 30-year-old or, you know, they've taken off without their insulin. But we do cover missing persons cases, especially if they're in danger.

Speaker 3 And investigators told us in their interview, and they testified in court to the jury, it is the same for them. A report of a runaway is handled very different than a report of a missing person.

Speaker 3 And according to them,

Speaker 3 Runaways will typically resurface. There's something.

Speaker 3 They show up at a relative's house. They take money out of a bank or they use a credit card.
Missing people don't. And Alyssa has never been seen since she was taken out of school in 2017.

Speaker 2 You know, you raise a very interesting point because we all do hear these stories about missing people, but it is fascinating that the way a case is reported influences how it's being investigated, how much, you know, police and detectives are digging into it.

Speaker 2 Mary Ellen, don't go away because when we come back, authorities ratchet up the investigation into Alyssa's disappearance and make some surprising discoveries.

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Speaker 2 We're back now with Mary Ellen Recindez-Schuizo, who helped produce Since You've Been Gone.

Speaker 2 It was the story of a list attorney's disappearance more than 20 years ago, which we reported on for 2020 on multiple occasions, by the way.

Speaker 2 And Mary Ellen, we talked about the fact that original ABC reporting was very influential for the Terney family.

Speaker 2 Seeing this man interviewed by our reporter and folks having a chance to sort of see him in a different light.

Speaker 2 Tell me a little bit about that because when we jump into a story, we think we're just reporting the story, but to have an impact on the family is really kind of interesting.

Speaker 3 I think it always really helps to have the family participate with us too, because it kind of gives us some insight.

Speaker 3 In this first case, Sarah Terney, the sister, participated along with two of her brothers. She also became very active afterwards trying to solve her sister's disappearance.

Speaker 3 At one point, Sarah turns to TikTok, and this is covered also nationally, to keep her sister's name in the media. And she develops this huge following.

Speaker 3 She eventually even creates her own podcast, which now brings attention to not just her sister's case, but other unsolved cases.

Speaker 2 So she really began to become an advocate in this case. Eventually, law enforcement, of course, are intrigued and they search Michael Turney's home.

Speaker 3 They discovered a lot. They did.
Police and forensic psychologist Aaron Nelson tell us they had no idea what they were walking into. Now, just a reminder, this is in the early 2000s.

Speaker 3 This is a time when home surveillance cameras were not common like they are today. But Michael Turney had surveillance cameras, both outside and inside his home.
He even had one in a vent.

Speaker 3 He would record everyone's phone calls, the incoming calls, the outgoing calls. Investigators told John Quiñonez they were looking for this eight-hour tape from the day that Alyssa was last seen.

Speaker 3 The audio tape from the call that she allegedly made to the home after she disappeared. So there's all these phone calls.
This is what investigators go in looking for.

Speaker 5 Why did you record so much?

Speaker 12 The videos are recorded because I love my family. Those are home videos that I've recorded since I can remember.

Speaker 5 But weren't these surveillance cameras in the house?

Speaker 12 Yeah, there's very few of those.

Speaker 4 Those aren't home videos.

Speaker 12 No, those aren't home videos. Those are from Protection of My House.

Speaker 6 So for security?

Speaker 12 Yeah, most of it's for security. Why? Because I want to spy on everybody?

Speaker 7 So from Michael Turney's perspective, he feels like he's assisting in the investigation by handing over some of these tapes. But from the detective's point of view, they're like, hold on a second.

Speaker 7 If you have this videotape, do you have any videotapes of the day that Alyssa went missing? And Michael Turney says to police, no, I don't have it.

Speaker 5 But why didn't you hang on to the surveillance video from the day Alyssa disappeared?

Speaker 12 There was nothing on the tape. They were told that.
I saved it and said, you want me to give you this tape? A detective told me, no, man, this is just a runaway. I don't need all that stuff.

Speaker 7 So now police are asking, is it possible that you have a recording of that phone call that you say Alyssa made to you early that morning?

Speaker 6 No.

Speaker 12 It was when Alyssa called is like four or five o'clock in the morning. And you know, if I don't reset the tape, then I have to do it that morning and reset it, turn the tape over.

Speaker 5 It would have been great to have that tape.

Speaker 2 They're looking for what was alleged to be a runaway note, too, right? They are.

Speaker 3 They don't like to call it a goodbye note. And the reason they don't like to call it a goodbye note is because they say nowhere in there does Alyssa say she's actually leaving.

Speaker 3 I I mean she says she wants to go to California but she doesn't say she's leaving and they can't actually prove when the note was actually written.

Speaker 3 So this is one of the items that they're looking for when they go into Michael Turney's house. What they find instead are explosives.

Speaker 3 Michael Turney downplays the explosives in his interview telling Quiñones they were just a few firecrackers, just enough to get attention for Alyssa's case.

Speaker 5 What did you have in your house?

Speaker 12 Firecrackers, a few things to make some noise, start a fire. So when I blew my head off, at least it would make some kind of noise and maybe some national news would pick it up.

Speaker 12 I wanted the attention brought to Alyssa.

Speaker 8 Investigators arrested Michael Turney after tight bombs and numerous guns were found inside the home.

Speaker 12 These things weren't in there.

Speaker 13 They were not in that house.

Speaker 16 The discovery of these bombs changed the entire focus of the investigation. They filed charges against Michael Turney for possession of these bombs.

Speaker 2 Well, that kind kind of shifts things. How did it affect Alyssa's case?

Speaker 3 Well, it's no longer a Phoenix police investigation. It now becomes a federal investigation and a federal case.
The federal case puts Michael Turney behind bars.

Speaker 3 Michael Turney ends up admitting to illegally possessing these 26 pipe bombs. He pleads guilty.

Speaker 3 to unlawful possession of an unregistered destructive device, and he ends up being sentenced to 10 years in prison. In the end, he serves about seven of those 10 years.
He's released in 2017.

Speaker 3 And meanwhile, while I say it becomes this federal investigation, there's still Alyssa who's missing. And that is still the Phoenix police investigation.

Speaker 2 And they're still looking into that.

Speaker 3 They are. They're still going through the case, slow, methodical, sifting through the evidence from the seizure, but they never get a body.
And it still remains that way today.

Speaker 10 Did you look for forensic evidence and did you find that?

Speaker 17 The home that they had been living in when she disappeared, yes, we did an in-depth forensic review of that home. We did luminol, we're looking for blood, we're looking for body fluids.

Speaker 17 We checked through the backyard, but no violent crime scene is identified.

Speaker 2 And it's sort of hard to make that case, but they are still suspicious of him. So he serves his time, as you said.
Then he's released, but not long after that, he is brought in again.

Speaker 2 and this time on second-degree murder charge. As you said, even though they don't really have all the goods there,

Speaker 2 but had anything big changed in the case at that point?

Speaker 3 No, there wasn't really anything new. There's no smoking gun, and I think that was the big problem in the case.
Now, between 2017 and 2020,

Speaker 3 the relationship between Michael Turney and Sarah starts to disintegrate. She starts participating in podcasts about Alyssa where she's questioning her father's innocence.

Speaker 3 And then, as we mentioned before, she starts her own podcast. Sarah makes this huge push to have charges filed against her father.

Speaker 3 And eventually, the evidence is presented to a Maricopa County grand jury, and Michael Turney is indicted on the evidence.

Speaker 3 Turney, though, pleads not guilty. He maintains his innocence throughout.
the whole trial and he still does today.

Speaker 2 No body, no crime scene. And so, you know, there's a reason to question whether he is guilty of anything.

Speaker 3 Yeah, anytime you go to court with a case where there's no body, no crime scene, it's an uphill battle. And I think the prosecutors knew that.

Speaker 3 The federal charges, they aren't able to bring those in because they can't prejudice the jury with bringing in, you know, charges of conviction.

Speaker 3 It might lead the jury to convict him, even though they may not have the evidence. So the federal charges can't be brought in to the trial.

Speaker 3 In opening statements, prosecutor Vincent Berdino lays out the evidence of a very controlling father with no boundaries. And he talks about these contracts where Alyssa had to sign off.

Speaker 3 They're strange contracts. And then, of course, what surprises us, the prosecution uses a couple of clips from John Quinone's interview with Michael Turney.

Speaker 2 Yeah, that's the thing. I mean, you know, and this has happened to us before in other stories we've covered.

Speaker 3 The defense team sort of treats these clips as hearsay. They don't believe it's really any evidence.

Speaker 3 They instead paint Alyssa as this sort of unruly child throughout the trial, but they knew they had a job to do.

Speaker 3 And that was, you know, to prove that Michael Turney didn't do it or that there wasn't enough evidence against him.

Speaker 2 Yeah, yeah, it was going to be a tough case. I mean,

Speaker 2 for everybody all around. Well, we're going to take another quick break.
And when we come back, wow, you're going to take us to the courtroom because there was a scene there that nobody expected.

Speaker 2 And then Michael Turney sits down with us again.

Speaker 1 Stay with us.

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Speaker 2 We're back. So, Mary Ellen, you were in court when Michael Turney's defense team asked the judge to throw out the case.
That happens all the time.

Speaker 2 You know, they keep making arguments throughout that, you know, the prosecution has no real case here.

Speaker 2 But then, a shocker, the judge actually agrees. And I'm sure that had to be stunning for you and everybody else in the courtroom.

Speaker 3 Yeah, it's not unusual for the defense team to bring up, you know, any type of motion to throw out the case. That's pretty common.
What's not common is the judge actually agreeing with them.

Speaker 3 That just threw me for a loop and also the entire courtroom. I was in the courtroom that day.

Speaker 2 Was there a gasp?

Speaker 3 There were a lot of jaws that were just dropped. I just remember the judge was sort of like walking us through.

Speaker 3 you know,

Speaker 3 his ruling. He was just kind of taking us along.
And so there was this build in the courtroom. And that build leads to confusion.
And it's not just us that's confused.

Speaker 3 I mean, the defense table also looks a little confused. And I can remember the photographer that we had in turning and looking at me.

Speaker 3 And it's almost like we're talking with eyes and he's like looking at me like, is this happening?

Speaker 3 And I'm like thinking, am I hearing what I think I'm hearing? And

Speaker 3 so, and then he pretty much says it. He's dismissing the case.
He's going to, you know,

Speaker 3 let Michael Turney, you know, out of jail.

Speaker 2 I mean, shocker.

Speaker 3 Exactly. As he's walking us through with this ruling, he agrees with the prosecution that there's enough evidence to say Alyssa isn't alive.

Speaker 3 But then he says these words, and this is what shocks the courtroom. He says substantial evidence does not exist to warrant a conviction.

Speaker 3 And he grants the defense their motion, ordering the defendant be released. The case never even makes it to the jury.

Speaker 2 Incredible. And obviously, it had to be shocking, not just to the bystanders, but to Turney himself.

Speaker 2 We've got a clip here of defense attorneys, then prosecutors, and finally Michael Turney reacting to the news of his case getting thrown out. Let's listen.

Speaker 20 Michael cried when we told him that he was acquitted and that he was going home.

Speaker 11 I think the first thing he said is he couldn't hear her.

Speaker 19 So I had to go. Yeah, that's true.

Speaker 11 I had to go around the other side and tell him in the other ear.

Speaker 6 And then he said.

Speaker 3 He was like, What? What just happened? Like, you're going home. The judge acquitted you.

Speaker 8 I was shocked.

Speaker 12 I really was. I just sat back in total disbelief.

Speaker 13 And I went on and on, and I'm looking around, thinking to myself, is this real?

Speaker 12 This can't be real.

Speaker 6 It's going to end here now.

Speaker 5 What was going through your minds?

Speaker 17 Abject failure.

Speaker 17 Again, it's disappointment. I've always known that a no-body homicide is so significantly difficult to prove that I may not convince all those jurors.

Speaker 6 The lack of a body. Yes.

Speaker 17 I could have had a hung jury. I could have gotten not guilty.

Speaker 17 But for it to be cut off before ever going to a jury, I didn't see that coming. So, I mean, that was especially painful.

Speaker 10 It was a gut punch.

Speaker 10 You know, our goals in this case were to find Alyssa and to get justice for her. And we've failed in both those goals.

Speaker 13 I've still got to look for my daughter.

Speaker 12 Alyssa's gone. No proof that I had murdered her.

Speaker 3 Never was.

Speaker 2 What about Michael Turney's family? How do they react?

Speaker 3 It was shocking. It was really shocking.
I mean, a gut punch when you looked at Alyssa's brothers and sisters in the front row. It was definitely a gut punch for them.

Speaker 3 On the other hand, when you're looking at the defense table, like I said, they were kind of in shock. We learned afterwards.

Speaker 3 We did a post, you know, trial interview with defense attorney Jamie Jackson and Olivia Hicks.

Speaker 3 And I asked them, you know, because I had never seen this in 30 years of covering news and trials, had they ever seen it? And Jamie told us that he turned to Olivia and said, he's doing this.

Speaker 3 And Olivia responded, I don't think so. And Jamie responded back, nope.
This is happening.

Speaker 3 And then Olivia turns to Michael because at that point, if you remember, I said Michael turned to Olivia and Michael Turney's asking,

Speaker 3 what's going on?

Speaker 2 Heads are whipping throughout the courtroom.

Speaker 3 Yes. And Olivia says, you're going home.

Speaker 3 They kind of quip that Michael Turney, because he's kind of hard of hearing through one of his ears,

Speaker 3 couldn't hear Olivia. So Jamie had to actually get up, go around the table and tell Michael, you know,

Speaker 3 you're being acquitted.

Speaker 2 We cover these stories from time to time. I've been in courtrooms and, you know, it can be very interesting.

Speaker 2 I mean, it can be very mundane for a while, but then when there's a big development or a big change like this on the part of a judge, it can be really intriguing.

Speaker 2 And in this case, once the charges were dismissed, I mean, he can't be tried again on those same charges, right?

Speaker 3 That's right. Double jeopardy definitely comes in on this case.
He can't be charged again with second-degree murder.

Speaker 2 And I have to tell you, what shocked me, and probably those who've seen this program already, after Tourney's acquittal, you got some surprising news. And this one kind of surprised me.

Speaker 2 He was willing to sit down with us again, even after the ABC interview had been entered into court as evidence against him. He's going to sit down and talk with us again.

Speaker 2 You're great at doing your job, but wow, to get him to do it again.

Speaker 3 I was in contact with his lawyers, but I will tell you, it was not an easy interview to round up at all. It was surprising.
Michael Turney was angry with ABC News and he was angry with 2020.

Speaker 3 He was not happy. The clips from our interview made it into his trial.
He kept refusing us for probably three weeks. We were preparing to go to air without his interview.

Speaker 3 And then, and while we're doing this, we're kind of a little bit surprised. Wow, because we do know that, and he admits that he's, he's, you know,

Speaker 3 tends to need to be in control of things. And I got a call from Jamie Jackson, his attorney, that said he'll do it.
And

Speaker 3 we didn't waste time. We quickly started hammering out a date that we could get Jamie, Olivia, and

Speaker 3 Michael Terney into a room.

Speaker 3 It took about, not a week, I want to say it took about a week, but it really was like some, for us, working fast because of the amount of moving parts that have to come together.

Speaker 3 And so I had actually left town.

Speaker 3 and quickly had to fly back to Arizona in order to be on location and just make sure that everything, you know, got off the way it was supposed to.

Speaker 2 And Mary Ellen, when you think about how we get these stories to air, I mean, there's a lot of work and calling, you know, to try to get people to come to us.

Speaker 2 And, you know, you do this on a regular basis. And sometimes you're surprised, too.
Well, we've got an extended clip of our interview with Michael Turney here.

Speaker 2 He had just been released from custody after his acquittal. So let's take a listen.

Speaker 13 I've only been out less, well, it'd be a month on the 20th, I feel.

Speaker 12 Like,

Speaker 13 first off

Speaker 13 at any moment are they going to attack me again and throw me back in the dungeon it's it's there I can't get rid of that and of course not believing that what is happening is

Speaker 6 real

Speaker 13 you know am I really here am I really out of that draconian dungeon

Speaker 13 I can't shake it I'm trying

Speaker 2 and to get back into some kind of physical and mental shape is important it's hard to get medical care so you can hear in his voice his exasperation his frustration I mean, he is obviously very much proclaiming that he's not only innocent, but nervous about the future.

Speaker 2 Tell me about being in that room. You mentioned that Terny was intense.

Speaker 3 I do want to mention, like, I mean, it's not unusual for defendants to be intense because this is their life on the line.

Speaker 3 He had just spent another three years in jail, and he's still kind of stunned over what happened and whether it really did happen. So he's very mad at the fact that he has spent this time in jail.

Speaker 3 And there were times in the interview that he got heated and we just kind of had to keep him on track. But he had spent years under investigation.
So yeah, the room was definitely tense at times.

Speaker 3 And finally, you know, in the second interview, what Terney really wanted to tell everybody was that everyone got it all wrong in thinking that he was the one that had anything to do with his daughter going missing, especially since now the judge had ruled in his favor.

Speaker 2 Do you think they're ever going to solve this case? I mean, all these years later, I mean, do you think they'll find evidence of her, of Alyssa?

Speaker 3 You would hope so. I think it's so important for the family.
You know what? Phoenix Police is always following up on leads. This is one of the top unsolved cases in Arizona.

Speaker 3 People are fascinated by what happened to Alyssa. Like what it's just, it's one of those big mysteries.

Speaker 3 Michael told us during his interview interview that he was going to continue to try and find his daughter.

Speaker 3 Sarah continues to search for Alyssa and for answers and recently posted about some hope in the case, but there are no confirmed answers as far as anything that we could report.

Speaker 3 It might not turn out how they want it to turn out. And I think they're expecting that by now with how many years have passed.

Speaker 3 But there's a part of closure that's kind of relieving to families when they get, you know, that person back and they can say goodbye in their own way and they can put them to rest.

Speaker 3 That is so important for families of victims.

Speaker 2 Absolutely. We hear it all the time in all these stories we cover.
And these cases continue to captivate us too, especially when there hasn't been an ending to it.

Speaker 2 It's, you know, more than two decades, as I said, and a case like this sticks with people there, and I'm sure it sticks with, you know, you too. You've been working on it for a while.

Speaker 2 So Mary Ellen, you'll keep us up to date. And if there is anything new, we'll probably be updating it again.
It was such a pleasure to talk to you.

Speaker 2 We don't get a chance to do this very often, only to just work together very quickly. So, thanks for guiding us through the ins and outs of the story.

Speaker 3 Thank you, Deborah. Always a pleasure to work with you too.

Speaker 2 See you soon.

Speaker 1 All right, that does it for us today on the 2020 After Show.

Speaker 2 Make sure you tune in on Friday nights for 2020, of course, at 9 o'clock Eastern Time.

Speaker 2 The 2020 After Show is produced by Amira Williams and Sasha Aslanian with Sean Dooley, Brian Mazurski, and Alex Berenfeld of 2020. Theme music by Evan Biola.

Speaker 2 Janice Johnston is the executive producer of 2020. Josh Cohen is the director podcasting at ABC Audio.
Laura Mayer is the executive producer.

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