The After Show: Unholy Matrimony

Hey Prime members, are you tired of ads interfering with your favorite podcasts? Good news! With Amazon Music, you have access to the largest catalog of ad-free top podcasts included with your Prime membership. To start listening, download the Amazon Music app for free or go to amazon.com slash ad-free podcasts.
That's amazon.com slash ad-free podcasts to catch up on the latest episodes without the ads. Hey, Prime members.
Are you tired of ads interfering with your favorite podcasts? Good news. With Amazon Music, you have access to the largest catalog of ad-free top podcasts included with your Prime membership.
To start listening, download the Amazon Music app for free or go to Amazon.com slash ad-free podcasts That's amazon.com slash ad free podcasts to catch up on the latest episodes without the ads. Hi there, everybody.
It's Deborah Roberts here and welcome to 2020 The After Show. Today, we're talking about one of our classic true crime tales that we bring you on 2020 on a regular basis.
This one is a story of love, betrayal, and murder. The episode was called Unholy Matrimony.
The couple at the center of it, Robert and Sabrina Limon, they appear to be living an idyllic life with their two kids in Silver Lakes, California. And by all accounts, they were an outgoing couple.
They loved to party. They'd become a part of a tight-knit group of couples who called themselves the Wolfpack.
But then Robert was found murdered in a remote industrial complex where he had been working. The illusion of their perfect marriage and life just crumbled.
As authorities investigated the death, they discovered that not only did the couple have an open marriage, but Sabrina was having a full-blown relationship with a man who was much younger, a firefighter named Jonathan Hearn. After Robert's murder, detectives decided to wiretap Sabrina and Jonathan's phones to listen in.
Let's hear a clip from the show. In the days, weeks, months following the murder, Jonathan and Sabrina talked a lot on the phone.
And through these wiretap recordings, we catch this glimpse into what they're discussing. And they talk a lot about God.
They talk a lot about faith. I want to be used for His glory.
Whatever He wants me to do, I mean, I would cut my arm off, I would shave my head, I would if that's like what God would want for me, you know, like I feel that, like whatever. I do too.
I do too. It was quite odd.
And in these conversations, Jonathan actually at one point in time talked about a passage in the Bible talking about David and Bathsheba. I've been reading Psalms 51.
The Psalms are so good. David is a lot like you and I, Sabrina.
He was someone who committed adultery. Actually, that's what Psalm 51 is about.
He had an affair and then he even went on to kill the guy, like sent him into battle and pretty much had him killed off. It's a really twisted take on religion.
Is this just a spiritual discussion or is it a roadmap to foul play? Well, police arrested Jonathan and Sabrina for the murder, but without enough evidence against her, Sabrina actually was able to walk free until, that's a big until, in a shocking twist, Jonathan agreed to testify against the woman who was his lover in exchange for pleading guilty to manslaughter. And this all happened just days before the trial.
Wow, it was a doozy. I reported this story with producer Gary Wynn, whom I've had the pleasure of working with for years.
Gary, this is so great to have you actually in the studio to talk like this. Absolutely.
Always a treat to work with you. You and I have worked together over the years.

Yes, I remember we did some stuff at GMA, and this was our first opportunity to work

together in 2020, and what a great story.

What a story.

I remember when you came to me about it, and Joe Reed, the senior producer, was involved

in it, and we were all talking about how bizarre this story was.

And also, the area, out in this sort of remote part of California, you and I headed out

Thank you. And we were all talking about how bizarre this story was.
And also the area, you know, out in this sort of remote part of California, you and I headed out to Tehachapi. I still have trouble pronouncing it.
Tehachapi. And I remember driving through the Mojave Desert and it was just so bizarre.
Absolutely. And you were coming from Los Angeles.
And it's about 90 miles from Los Angeles. So that morning we were going to a diner that we had rented to set up

and do your interview with Detective Grantham.

And coincidentally or horribly,

the night before there was a pipe burst in the hotel.

All these little behind the scenes moments.

Yeah, so it was kind of like a waterfall in the room

and we're like, oh gosh,

I hope we just need to get on site

to make sure we're ready for Deborah.

And of course we made it and we were there

and waterfall in the room and I you know and we're like oh gosh I hope we just we just need to get on site to make sure we're ready for Debra and of course we made it and we were there and but the best part was that we'd been there several days shooting around that complex where Rob Lamone had worked yeah and the weather was awful yeah rained every day but then I show up and you brought the sunshine the sun came out yeah you often ask about how we, you know, shot our stories and what it was like on the ground. And it is sort of interesting.
I mean, obviously, we're reporting on these very intense and tragic stories. But those little moments like your flood in the hotel and us, you know, and my driving there.
And, you know, literally, it looked like a moonscape when I was out there, you know, and you and I laughed a little bit about that. But this is a story that had mystery, infidelity, religion.
I mean, it was one of those classics that almost felt like a TV show, right? You've got a couple who seem to have like that great marriage. But, you know, there were challenges in trying to report this, too.
I mean, the crime took place in an industrial park, private property. you know, people don't realize what we have to go through to kind of get these things going.
Absolutely. And that's a great point that, you know, it really is in the middle of nowhere.
And if you did not know that that industrial park was there, you wouldn't stumble upon it, you wouldn't find it. Which is part of the story later too.
Absolutely. And so when we went actually to scout it on the first trip out there, we realized that there was no way to see where this happened.
And there were train tracks right next to it also. Exactly.
It was next to a train that was running one of the BNSF trains. And so I was able to get in contact with the owners of the industrial park where because the BNSF rented a space there and that's where Rob Lamone was murdered.
We rented a unit in that industrial park so that we could be in there and get shots of the exterior. We actually could see the unit where this took place.
Yeah, because it was like a big storage unit. And sometimes these things aren't the most attractive things that we're shooting.
So you have to find the producers, you have to find a way to sort of bring them to life and make it make sense to the audience. Because otherwise, you know, visually, it just doesn't, it doesn't tell the story.
You know, you can have a sit down interview, and that's going to give you your information. But when you have an opportunity to be out there, you know, where this actually happened so that we can help the audience sort of visualize.
And that was, you know, not only where the crime happened, there was another key piece of evidence, which was that camera that you and Detective Grantham talked about. And that was in that industrial park.
And this camera actually saw a figure limping across. Yeah, the security camera.
Exactly. And that, as we later find out, you know, turned out to be the person who committed the crime.
Yeah, that played a big part in the story, that security camera footage. But being able to be there, you interviewed Detective Grantham out there, and he was able to explain to you exactly, you know, the significance of that and what that meant to see Jonathan.
Let's listen. You get on the case.
You're looking at all the crime scene pictures, video, so forth. Now, when you're looking out here,

many times there's cameras everywhere. Did you even think that there might be surveillance cameras

out here? Sure. So absolutely.
Once we, the following day, during daylight hours, we came out

and began canvassing the area. And upon doing so, we found this video surveillance camera right here.
And this is the camera that actually captured the person walking through the complex with an exaggerated limp, walking towards the BNSF location where Rob was found dead. You were just hoping that this would show you something.
You didn't know what you were going to get. Correct.
And he was quite a character. Not only was he thorough, but I just remember he had this sunburn on his face because he had these lines on his face.
He had his sunglasses on, but that's how hot it was out where we were. Absolutely.
Yeah. It was red all around and you just saw the white streak going back above his ears.
Yeah. I noticed that as soon as we sat down.
But what a police officer, though. Yeah, terrific guy.
And they were from Kern County, which is, you know, Bakersfield way. He really knew the area.
You know, all the detectives, him and Tommy Robbins, who we spoke to as well. Yeah, those guys just, they did not stop digging.
And it was fascinating. One of the things that our audience doesn't always know is even though they see all these like sweeping, interesting shots of the story, there's a lot going into putting all this together.
And I remember you had drones out there. So, you know, I want to talk about the clues in solving this case.
But let's also talk about how we brought it to the audience. because I remember being out there and you're placing me in this place and that place and trying to make sure we captured the camera.
And you even had the camera rolling to take shots of us while we're out walking. So talk about how you bring all of that together for the audience.
It really is just about trying to have as much production value as we can in every scene. So This is a scene where you are actually on, you know, where this crime happened, where there's a key piece of evidence that that camera and that is, you know, what we try to do is bring people in there so that it's one thing to have, you know, an interview and someone's telling you about what happened, but when we can get out there and you can actually visualize it and see and help the audience see, that makes a big difference.
In a very creative way. Well, let's get back to the story then.
So Gary, the detectives had evidence that the assailant actually fled on a motorcycle. It's a great visual, but we didn't have it.
So how do you work to bring that part of the story to life? On that road, Goodrick Road, going into where the industrial complex is, there was a business that had a camera, a surveillance camera, and they saw a motorcycle go by, which was, of course, Jonathan Hearn, as we learned later. So what we did is, okay, we need to show this motorcycle.
We need to worry about the visual things, trying to illustrate what this looked like. So we rented a motorcycle and, you know, we had point of view shots so that we could actually take that motorcycle on the same route that Jonathan had taken that day when the murder took place.
And he rode a long time on that motorcycle to get to this location. Absolutely.
It was a good hour away. And, and then afterwards, there was more security footage that they saw him in a convenience store, you know.
So, you know, that was, for us, we wanted to be able to show visually, you know, what that, that's like the B-roll, what we call B-roll, and be able to show the motorcycle and show how it came in here and show the whole route. Then police learned, of course, this guy who's on the motorcycle was Sabrina's lover, Jonathan Hearn.
And in the story, you learn how as they start to untangle, they realize that she's having this affair. He owned a motorcycle.
All the details matched up. And on that camera, it was so interesting, that security camera, the person that they saw was limping.
And this guy was faking a limp on the way into the industrial park. And that was also something that was significant because they weren't sure, was it a disabled person? And they went looking for people in the neighborhood, maybe there was somebody who was homeless.
And that was a whole ordeal as well. You know, and it was also strange because what would somebody be doing there? You know, they thought it was probably just a transient a transient because it didn't make any sense

why this person would be picked up on that. Yeah, exactly.

Yeah. Oh, so many great details.
Well, when we come back, the kinds of small details that

producers look for when they're out shooting a story for us that help tell the story of the

victim and who they were in life. So stay with us.
Hey, Prime members. Are you tired of ads interfering with your favorite podcasts? Good news.
With Amazon Music, you have access to the largest catalog of ad-free top podcasts included with your Prime membership. To start listening, download the Amazon Music app for free or go to amazon.com slash ad-free podcasts.
That's amazon.com slash ad-free podcasts to catch up on the latest episodes without the ads. Hey, Prime members, are you tired of ads interfering with your favorite podcasts? Good news.
With Amazon Music, you have access to the largest catalog of ad-free top podcasts included with your Prime membership. To start listening, download the Amazon Music app for free or go to amazon.com slash ad-free podcasts.
That's amazon.com slash ad-free podcasts to catch up on the latest episodes without the ads. All right, we're back and I'm here with Gary Wynn, my partner in crime, as we can say, I guess, when we're out shooting these stories.
Let's get back to our story, Gary. So after Sabrina Limon was first arrested and then released because police didn't really have enough evidence to charge her, talk about the community's reaction because this was a small community.
They were well-known in this community and liked in this community.

It kind of led a little bit of a racy life there with the kind of open marriage and all of that.

But what about the community?

Initially, in the aftermath, people were shocked, devastated, really rallying around them.

The funeral, I mean, it was overflowing with people.

But as time went on a little bit and details started to come out about, you know, what might have been going on, Sabrina started to get harassed in Silver Lakes, according to her sister, her older sister who we spoke to. And her friend, when she moved away to Camarillo, California, Karen Hudgen, said that people, they bumped her car.
She had to homeschool her kids because they were getting harassed. So, you know, life for her and the children became untenable in, you know, this place that had been such an idyllic spot for them.
Yeah. Yeah.
So she moved to Camarillo, California. Just to get away from all of that.
Exactly. She had a cousin there named Billy who we interviewed.
And basically basically, she just needed a fresh start. And the irony is she's getting this fresh start.
She's getting her kids connected in a new community. And Jonathan's in jail.
So let's talk about Robert Limon, because he was a very well-loved guy. He was a devoted dad from everything that we heard.
And the night that he died, his daughter was calling him because she wanted to talk to him about the first day of school the next day. But of course, when somebody dies, they're very much of an offstage character.
So you have to work a little harder to paint a picture of who they are. And you went out of the way to find people who knew him to paint a nice picture of who this guy was as a dad and a husband.
Absolutely. And one of the other producers on this show booked his Robert Lamont's high school football coach who was really just such incredibly nice things to say about what he was as a young man.
This coach said that Rob was one of his special players. And he was just that kind of a guy that would thrive with positive reinforcement.
And they were humble. They were not wealthy.
His father would make breakfast burritos. And Rob would go out with his father and they would sell them.
He would actually sell them at school to different kids at school and stuff. So everyone, every single person that you speak to and ask about Robert Lamont says that he was just the greatest guy and I think you know you mentioned his daughter wanting to talk to him I mean that just gives you a glimpse into you know the kind of father he was it was going to be her first day of school and she wanted to kiss her dad good night yeah you know those are the things I think that um our viewers and then of course here our listeners really gravitate to because these are people.
You know, we do these stories and yes, they're crime stories, but these are real people. And I remember our producer, our executive producer was really touched by the football coach.
And that was a little element that we found that we just thought would shed light because this is somebody that this guy knew long ago, but it told you a little bit about who they are. And somebody said to me the other day, one of the things they find so interesting about these stories of true crime is not the crime itself, but who the people were and how they got to that point, whether it's the victim or whether it might be the perpetrator.
And the same thing with Sabrina Lamone too, just trying to get to know her. And we did, I think, a good job of painting that picture of her, too, as a person.
Absolutely. And it's funny.
I was thinking about this. We talked to her friend Karen Hudgens.
So that was when she went and started a new life in Camarillo, California. This woman met her after this crime happened.
They became the best of friends. Their sons were born the same week.
They were married on the same day. Karen knows everything that happened.
You cannot tell that woman that Sabrina is guilty, you know? And she actually was such a good friend that she took in Sabrina's son. Yeah, her son.
Yeah, the human touch, I think, is what's so important. And that's what you and our producers do so well.
And Gary, you did such a great job on the story. Thank you.
And a treat to work with you again. We're going to do more of it, you and I.
And as for Sabrina Lamone, her federal petition challenging her convictions was denied. So she's still in prison.
We'll do a follow up, I'm sure, on this at some point. Absolutely.
Well, Gary, thank you so much for coming in. This is so rare that we actually get a chance to take a moment and breathe and talk about these stories that we cover.
But it's always a pleasure to work with you. Same, same.
Well, we'll be back next Monday with a new 2020 After Show just for you. And we're curious, what questions do you have about 2020 that you might want us to answer on this podcast? Because we're here to do that for you.
Are there things you've always wondered about? We're planning a listener mailbag episode when we can answer your questions. So reach out to us.
We want to hear what you have to say and make them interesting questions. Okay.
Well, tune in on Friday nights at nine to watch the latest 2020 show on ABC, or of course, you can listen Saturday in your 2020 podcast feed. 2020 After Show is produced by Cameron Chertavian and Sasha Aslanian.
And of course, we always have help from our producers like Gary Nguyen, Joseph Rhee, who's here on this one, Brian Mazursky, and Alex Berenfeld of 2020. Janice Johnston is the executive producer of 2020.
Josh Cohen is the director of podcasting at ABC Audio. Laura Mayer is the executive producer.
On April 8th, the final season of The Handmaid's Tale arrives. This is the beginning of the end.
And the revolution... What's happening? Rebellion.
...begins. How many bodies are you going to throw in the fire? When is enough enough? When there's no one left to fight.
Where is June Osborne? Rise up and fight for your freedom! The Hulu original series, The Handmaid's Tale. Final season premieres April 8th, streaming on Hulu.
Hey, I'm Brad Milkey. You may know me as the host of ABC Audio's daily news podcast, Start Here, but I'd like to add aspiring true crime expert to my resume.
And here's how I'm going to make it happen. Every week, I'm going to unpack the biggest true crime story that everyone is talking about.
ABC's got some unique access here,

so I'll talk to the reporters and producers who have followed these cases for months,

sometimes years. We'll bring you the latest developments and the larger context on the

true crime stories you've been hearing about. Follow the crime scene for special access to

the people who know these stories best.