Part Two: How The U.S. Government Used Aliens To Destroy a Man's Mind

call zone media oh man welcome back to behind the bastards all of you beautiful people and also all of you ugly people you know all all people are beautiful uh except for i just kind of said that i didn't that they're not uh that was inside and outside beauty you know well there's only one kind there's only one kind i'm not gonna say what it is i'm not gonna say which kind of beauty but there's only one kind.

That's fair yeah it's elbows i'm an elbow guy i'm an elbow guy yeah i'm starting the wiki feed of elbows it's just a bunch of like really blurry cropped photos of like elbows of different celebrities oh my god do you know there's no uh nerve endings in your elbow skin um that's the hottest thing about it yeah i know as an elbow guy i had a friend in my comparative religions class that discovered weed and would make everybody bite his elbows the beginning of every class and oh that that's a pervert that's a pervert oh that's an elbow pervert right there yes he is a well currently he's a born-again meteorologist in North Carolina. So yes, that is a pervert that's an elbow pervert right there yes he is a well currently he's a born-again meteorologist in north carolina so yes that is a pervert no i i can see why you'd be scared that god is angry at you if you're that kind of pervert because he is um but that that makes it hotter for a lot of us brandy posy welcome back to the program you want to plug anything at the top before we get too too deep elbows? Yeah, of course.
Before we get elbow deep into aliens. Bowen.
Bowen with Robert and Brandy. Getting it down, baby.
Yeah, I run a comedy record label. It's called Burn This Records.
We seek to create equity between our artists in a way that most comedy labels don't I have put out 17 albums last year, it was our first year this year we have about 15, it's digital only and everybody is not only funny but a good person which is a Venn diagram that I wish more people in comedy paid attention to yes, well I think that's awesome so check that out everybody and let's get, are you ready to get back into this story, into these aliens, into these aliens and spooks? Bow deep in aliens. Let's go.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Speaking of bows, Richard Doty probably doesn't have nice elbows.
He's our Air Force Office of Special Investigations agent. When you said Bose, I was like, are we talking for your hair? Are we talking?

Nope. Are we talking speakers? Are we talking? There's so many bows.
Does he have no bows? No, no, no partners. What are we talking about? You know what? Speaking of bows, I will let people.
Yesterday I wound up just because it happened as I was driving, like responding to a three-car crash. And there was a young woman in the middle car who was the only one who was hurt.
And she was hurt because she had a beret in the back of her hair. A claw.
It was a claw-shaped one. Yes, which is a no-go.
Anyway, don't wear those in the car. Don't wear those in a car.
Do your hair. You can bring your claw clip in the car but do not wear it while you're in the car because it's bad.
Bad. Yeah.
I have a friend that is, her sister's an ER nurse and when she gets in her car her whole backseat is full of those claws because when she gets in her car and she throws it, she just takes it out and throws it in the back seat because the number one thing that she sees in her ER room

is that in women's skulls from car accidents.

Thankfully, this lady seemed fine.

I do like you saying Barrett, the way you said it.

Barrett?

You said it so surgical.

I thought that's what it was called.

I thought that's what it was called.

You're not wrong, but you're also wrong.

Anyway, don't wear those. And also, if you're ever in a car accident and your head is hurt in any way shape or form uh go get checked out by a professional um don't just assume it's okay you don't want to wind up like uh that famous guy's wife um no you got one brain man that to be wasn't saying that to be uh uh flippant it's a real problem yes um go to the doctor wasn't saying that to be flippant.
It's a real problem. Yes.
Go to the doctor. Wasn't that delicious? So good.
Your bill, ladies. I got it.
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The most parody we've seen in years with games coming down to the wire and everyone wondering which team will be crowned national champions this weekend in Tampa. Listen to Good Game with Sarah Spain on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Prohibition is synonymous with speakeasies, jazz, flappers, and of course, failure. I'm Ed Helms, and on season three of my podcast, Snafu, there's a story I couldn't wait to tell you.
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Listen and subscribe to Snafu on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. going through TikTok, you come across a video of a teenage girl and then a photo of the person

suspected of killing her. It was shocking.
It was very shocking. Like that could have been my

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I'm Jen Swan. I'm the host of a new podcast called My Friend Daisy.

It's the story of how and why a group of teenagers turned to social media to help track down their

friend's killer. Listen to My Friend Daisy on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
So let's talk about fucking UFOs. And a guy who didn't go to the doctor maybe enough, or maybe went too much, I don't know.
Richard Doty was born sometime around the immediate post-war period. He is, I haven't actually run into his exact, that said, I didn't like go super hardcore digging into it.
His father and his uncle Edward were his chief influences growing up and both were military men. This guy is kind of, you know, an early, I think like mid-boomer or something like that.
And his uncle Edward had been a career officer and meteorologist in 1947. He'd been made chief of an Air Force weather research station working on something called the Atmospheric Divergence Project.
Now, decades later, because Richard Doty is not just the guy who's going to spread a bunch of lies to Paul Benowitz that helps drive him mad. He also becomes like an alien influencer claiming that like, oh, no, I actually did also see real aliens, guys.
And you can totally trust me. I know that like my whole thing is I lied to a guy about aliens for years, but also you can trust me when I tell you about aliens that I saw.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I lied because I also tell the truth.
Yeah, exactly. Exactly.
Now that I'm out, you can trust me. So Richard Doty, the spook and liar kind of guy, has in kind of modern interviews, tells viewers that the atmospheric divergence project his uncle worked on was an attempt to, quote, change or neutralize gravity around a rocket to aid in space travel.
Now, I haven't found the exact details in the specific project his uncle worked on, but I don't think this is true. Because while I did not find the reports on that project, I did spend way too much of my research time reading through an Air Force handbook on meteorological techniques, and atmospheric divergence impacts the growth of storm systems in a bunch of ways that are obviously relevant to an Air Force meteorologist and not at all involved with fucking up gravity for space travel, right? This sounds like a normal meteorologist thing to do.
Richard is a tall tail spinner, right? Yes. Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah.
And one of the issues with my sources, because the two of the, I've got a bunch of articles in here that you can, you can find, but there's also two books that I read for this. One is Saucered Spooks and Kooks by Adam Go-Rightly, and one is Project Beta by Greg Bishop.
Both of them are very entertaining. I think Greg's book, Project Beta, is the better book.
Both of these guys also believe in stuff I don't, particularly Bishop. Well, I think he, because I've caught, there's some stuff in Go-Rightly's book that I caught that's just not factually, just slips, that he slipped up on.
I think Bishop is more familiar with the subculture. But also Bishop definitely believes a bunch of shit I don't.
And he's, you can tell he kind of is excited at like talking with these spooks and spies. And I think he gives them a lot more credit than he ought to.
Oh, got it. He caught up in the romance of it all.
I think he is not in a way that I think makes his his basic conclusions wrong or his book not worth reading. Again, I think it's actually quite worth reading.
It's quite a good book. And I think he's a good writer.
I just don't I'm not simpatico with him on on all of the conclusions he comes to about these guys. I don't mean that as an insult to the man.
Because again, I liked his book a lot. So, but that is an issue when it comes to like trying to figure out shit here, right? And in Project Beta, Bishop does do about like the best of any of them at kind of questioning Doty by saying, perhaps this had something to do with weather control or maybe it was something more prosaic.
And like, it didn't, It wasn't weather control or gravity. It's just studying how this thing that affects meteorological forecasts work.
Very normal thing for a meteorologist to do. Anyway, Doty joined the Air Force as a young man, just like his pa and uncle, and per bishop.
He entered in 1968 as a combat security policeman. Doty would later claim he was, quote, tested and tracked throughout his career to become a base security guard and then a special agent for AFOC, the Air Force Office of Special Investigations.
Now, that's how Doty tells the story. And I don't think he's I don't I think that's very silly because I'm not an expert on this, but I've known a number of people who were in different military intelligence roles.
And I will tell you one thing that is very consistent. Base security guard is not a job that you are scouted for your entire career, right? No.
Like, it's kind of a shit gig, actually. like nobody likes base security and it's not really what most kids join wanting to do with

their life career right no like it's kind of a shit gig actually like nobody likes base security and it's not really what most kids join wanting to do with their lives right no no it's like a step above base janitor but like also the same kind of yeah not to besmirch either job necessarily but also like you're not i'll besmirch it some i'm smirching a little here i'll let you just a Scooch of smirch, we'll take it. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I'll smirch it some. I'm smirching a little here.
I'll let you just a scooch of smirch. We'll take it.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And Dodie really wants people to believe that he was like, he was scouted by the Air Force because like, we need a guy we can trust to do security for our very secret, very real alien projects.
And like, wow, we noted from the beginning of his time in the Air Force that he had something special. Right.
And that's the way he talks about his background.

This is very observative report, but with aliens, it feels like. Yes, yes, yes.

And, you know, Afo-C is more prestigious than base security.

He eventually does, you know, he's a special agent.

He's a sergeant, but he's also a special agent for this.

And that is like a more prestigious role.

But also, his job within Afo-C isn't the most prestigious thing.

Because other... you know he's a special agent he's a sergeant but he's also a special agent for this and that is like a more prestigious role but also his job with an afo c isn't the most prestigious thing because other members of that agency are literally this is like the time that he's in is one of like the high points for like spy shit anywhere in the world like history right other guys in afo c are locked in life and death spy battles with like fucking got some spies on planet Earth.
You've got Russian and Chinese agents. There's some really interesting shit going on here.
Dodi's job during this great international game is to lie to people who believe they've been molested by Martians. So he doesn't have the sexiest job within this sort of field, right? Not quite espionage with a capital D.
He's not James Bond, you know? There are some guys in Afosy doing some really, like, you talk about the ethics of it, but like interesting spy shit. I mean, it is interesting, but not in the same way.
I'd like to see his Bond movie, though. I would like to see this low-rent Bond, which is definitely a movie that I'd be into.
Well, that's kind of the premise of the Slow Horses TV show, right? Which does have, what's his name? Commissioner Gordon's in it, and he's great writing the show. I have mixed opinions on it, but he's always a charm.
The original, well, not the original, the one from the Nolan movies. I forget his name.
Gary Oldary oldman so dodie today claims that right after basic training and again this is also bullshit he was taken to a room and shown footage of ufos and like i don't believe that if there are aliens that the government has evidence of obviously there's some people that they let into that secret within military intelligence it's not going to be anyone who just finished basic because you know who can finish basic training almost anyone like that's part of the point yeah hey 18 year old without a frontal lobe that is fully formed you want to see aliens right yeah like unless they want to fuck with you specifically maybe but like not in a like an official uh uh constructive capacity for sure yeah hey guy whose primary hobby is getting blackout drunk every single night of the week let's let's show you an alien video yeah yeah exactly you know all those push-ups you did guess what here's also aliens you passed the test yeah now this is generally described as a test and i think that's how like Bishop describes it in his book, is that Doty was being tested to see, or at least Doty claims he was being tested to see if he could be trusted with more detailed info about extraterrestrials. So I guess there's a possibility that maybe something like this did happen, and it wasn't real aliens, but it was just like, let's show a bunch of guys alien footage and see who leaks it, right? That they saw something, you know, see who we can trust stuff.
I don't think even then I kind of doubt it because they weren't really doing that to guys who just finished basic. But shit like that is happening within different kind of intelligence agencies.
And it's not just aliens. They lie about disinfo is given out to people during this period of time in different intel roles just to see if they can be trusted.
Right.'s a thing that happens dodie also claims that he served as a guard at area 51 where he saw a ufo um now again area 51 is a real base they are really trying doing experimental shit with planes there this could be true and in fact the story he tells might might be true but not in a way he wants you to think because he he claims while he's there, he sees them wheeling out this huge black disc that's some sort of craft that they're trying to get into the atmosphere that they launch. And it doesn't look like anything he's ever seen.
And his commanding officer takes him aside, right? Because he sees Doty's fascinated in this. And here's the conversation that is related in the book Project Beta.
Airman Doty, do you know what that craft was? Asked the officer. No, sir.
That's what is generally known as a UFO, and it's not one of ours. It's on loan.
Yes, sir. Someday, if you play your cards right, you will learn, know a lot more.
But for now, you are to tell no one about this, and you are not to discuss it with anyone. Is that clear? Doty never talked about it again.
And first off, obviously he did, because you're telling us this story. So like, from reading it in the book, it's definitely been recounted several times.
But also, that could be basically true and have nothing to do with aliens. He could have been on guard duty, seen a weird craft that maybe, maybe like it was a fucking French or Canadian thing that like we were doing tests on, right? So it's on loan, and his boss is just kind of like, hey, you know, maybe if you play your cards right, we'll trust you with more stuff, right? And I don't know if Dodie actually gets much more trust, but this could be largely accurate, although I don't think that's likely.
Yeah, yeah. That said, there's evidence.
He definitely does see experimental craft through his job for FOC later in his career because he's working at bases where they're doing that. That doesn't mean that he's told what it all is because they silo that info.
Even if it's your job to stop people from finding out about these programs, you may not be told much about them because it's a need-to-know thing and you don't. Right.
You need to stop people from filming the weird craft. You don't need to know how it works.
You don't need to know what it is. Right.
Like, no, no, no, no, no, no. They don't want curious people working on like lower levels of this stuff at all.
Like they're not. They want you to just come in and be like, my job is to do this and then have blinders up to everything else.
I didn't see shit.

This is why I've been saying this for years.

The government should have all of its security done by street level drug dealers.

You know, those guys can keep their fucking mouth shut.

You know, absolutely.

Ain't no snitches.

Exactly.

Exactly.

Area 51, all security provided by Coke dealers.

Just don't give them any Coke.

Then they talk about everything. Yeah.
You got to got to keep them sober, otherwise it ends very badly. Ooh, man, what a fun place.
Just a bunch of sober Coke dealers. Yeah, a bunch of sober Coke dealers at Area 51.
This is going to end well. So there's evidence that a lot of, you know, Doty is a credulous guy.
He does come to, at least he will claim to believe in this. He might just be fucking with everybody.
I don't really know. But a lot of guys in his kind of level in different intel agencies are believers themselves, right? So at any rate, Doty claims that his chief mentor in spy shit was a guy named Seely Howard, a former insurance salesman.
According to Doty, he gave him this sage advice early in his spook career. There are three sorts of people you will be dealing with.
The first are the ones who will believe anything you say. The second are those who will, at least at first, refuse to believe you.
The last is the group who won't believe you at first but might be willing to be convinced. And what I find interesting about that is those last two groups are the same group of people.
Yes. The people who don't believe you at first, but you can make them believe you.
I don't see the difference. Yeah.
No, it's just one is just on a longer timeline and eventually, yeah, yeah, sure. So as soon as Paul Benowitz called the Air Force with results of his surveillance, they knew they might have a problem.
The Air Force Office of Special Investigations very quickly became concerned that Paul Benowitz had stumbled onto a secret laser-based tracking system located in Kirtland. At least that's one of the things he might have stumbled on.
Greg Bishop, who wrote Project Beta, noted that these transmissions sounded like gibberish language that had been distorted and sped up. Or, to a true believer like Paul, they sounded like alien speech.
Edwards, chief of Kirtland-based security, had previously described Doty to a friend at the NSA as his drug man. And so that's less cool than it sounds, as Greg Bishop writes.
The duty simply involved checking for allegations of illegal drug use on the base, but it was only one of Agent Doty's minor assignments. The FOC has jurisdiction over all criminal and security investigations at Air Force facilities.
Most FOC agents must carry a high security clearance. Agents need to know what they are protecting so that security threats can be recognized quickly.
Benowitz carefully described to Doty what he had seen and recorded, all while trying to keep what he really thought was going on to himself for the moment. And this is where I think Bishop is too credulous.
Because again, think back to Roswell, the first guy, like they don't tell the people who are looking and responding to that crashed balloon that Project Mogul exists. It's very common for these guys not to be in the loop about stuff, right? Especially since he's just a sergeant, you know, like he's not a super high level guy here.
That said, Dodie is kind of sent to talk to Benowitz. And he's like, hey, you know, why don't you come to the base and we can talk about your research.
And so Paul heads to the base and he shows Dodie what he's got. And Dodie is initially kind of, you know, bored.
And then he perks up when Paul starts to show him his radio array. He returns to the base to talk with some NSA colleagues about bringing an expert out to Paul's home to see what he'd built.
So he visits Paul at his house. And this time with an actual scientist in tow.
Another engineer, a guy named Lou Miles. And the fact that Paul has now been invited to the base to talk, he's had, you know, a guy come over to his house from Air Force Intelligence.
Paul is like, takes this as evidence that like, I'm on the right track and the Air Force supports me. I'm now kind of helping looking, helping the Air Force find evidence that there's aliens.
You know, I kind of got my X-Files job because they think I'm so cool and smart. Oh, buddy.
I know. It's really sick because he's just trying to help, you know? Yeah, no, he is just trying to help.
He just wants to keep his country safe. Oh, they're sizing you up, buddy, to see what kind of a threat you are.
Oh, no, my man. No, not at all.
So the expert Doty brings to Paul's home is Lou Miles. Like Valdez, that state trooper, Miles was a guy who wanted to believe.
He had been involved to an extent with Project Blue Book, which was like a multi-year Air Force investigation into UFOs. It's one of the big seminal moments in early UFO history, right? Yeah, yeah.
He was also now the chief scientist for Kirtland's test center. So he knew the reality behind a lot of the strange aerial phenomena that guys like Paul credited to aliens.
So he's both like open to believing, but also like, oh, but I know that I know what you're actually seeing. And it's not aliens.
It's this thing that we're working on. Nevertheless, he was good at talking to Benowitz while Dodie hung back and took photos with a hidden camera for the NSA, who was also involved in this.

It's kind of murky exactly where a FOC begins and the NSA ends.

And like there's some evidence the CIA is also gets involved.

There's like a lot of people are kind of interested in what Paul is doing. But no one's interested in Paul's evidence of alien interference.
They're, again, worried about like interested in whether or not he's actually like gotten any encrypted shit. And they also think he might be useful because being an actually brilliant engineer working in the aerospace industry and someone who goes to these UFO conventions, he's kind of trusted within the UFO community.
So if they want to get a lot of people to like pay attention to something other than the real shady shit they're doing at Kirtland, he might be able to convince them, right? He might be able to distract attention away from the real shit that's being done that they want to hide. So yeah, for the next year, Paul waits for updates from the military and he continues his special interest exploring extraterrestrial phenomena.
In May of the next year, 1980, a 26-year-old woman named Myrna Hanson called the state police to claim that she and her six-year-old had been accosted by alien visitors near Eagle Nest, New Mexico. The state troopers basically shrugged and handed the case over to the only cop they knew

who dealt with this sort of shit, Gabe Valdez.

Yep.

If I'm remembering correctly, I believe Valdez's attitude is that Myrna was probably a plant.

That's not clear to me.

Again, a lot of sketchy shit's going on here.

Immediately doesn't trust the woman.

Okay, good.

Well, but also, this kind of shit was going on, so I don't know. He's like, man, this is a six-year-old fucking with me.
Right, right. So Gabe calls our boy Paul, and they go off to meet Myrna.
Now, by the start of the 80s, the science of hypnotic regression, which is not really a science, had taken off among people who believed or wanted to believe that they had been abducted by aliens, right? So let me turn you into a chicken first and then tell me if you saw the aliens or not. Right.
Yeah. I'm going to hypnotize you and then walk you, like say a bunch of leading things that get you to tell a fun alien story, right? Yeah.
You know, a lot of this stuff is some similar shit's happening with like the satanic panic. We're just into the idea.
I mean, there's a lot of this in the X-Files, right?

This idea that people have memories locked away that this psychologist or psychiatrist who definitely doesn't ever wind up fucking his patients can unlock.

Yeah. Yeah.
It's super cool.

Yeah. People aren't susceptible to being influenced to say things to right please somebody either yes nothing sketchy here whatsoever um yeah speaking of things that aren't sketchy sponsors of this podcast never never they would never do anything illegal although we did just find out that what's that food box company uh has child labor So I don't know.
I'd be curious. I don't know.
Sophie, which one was it? I don't remember. One of them.
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Hey, that's their problem for going dynamic. That's right.
That's right. So Gabe called our boy Paul and off they went to meet Myrna Benowitz, who is working for that civilian organization, not working for, but is like one of the head guys at APRO, that civilian looking into UFO things.
And like is also working with this actual sheriff's deputy uh partners he and and uh gabe partner with a university of wyoming professor who's who's an ex a quote-unquote expert in hypnotic regression and this guy's name is literally dr leo sprinkle fuck yeah great stuff what a name great stuff man good on you leo for making into adulthood yeah yeah that's a real boy named sue situation leonardo sprinkle no no leonardo sprinkle yeah oh fuck me so in his book saucer spooks and kooks adam go rightly summarizes binowitz by this time had convinced himself that the ETs were transmitting a mind control beam to repress Myrna Hansen's memories. Benowitz believed that the ETs were likely beaming him in an attempt to disrupt his ongoing UFO probe.
To thwart this extraterrestrial electronic harassment, Benowitz arranged for Hansen's regression to take place in his 1979 Lincoln town car with multiple sheets of aluminum foil draped over the windows to deflect the dreaded alien beams. Benowitz connected these perceived beams to cattle mutilations.
It's so cool. I love this shit.
He's fucking wrapping his car in tinfoil. No, he sees it.
The aliens are blocking our memory with the beams. He's married, right? Oh yeah, he's got a wife and she is a long suffering.
I don't know much about her but a saint i'll say that much no the power of a lot i know the power of disassociation this woman is capable of man oh yeah it's like honey i need the car to go to the grocery store no i have to go interview this woman i guess got the aluminum cable get the tinfoil out babe we need it for the potatoes tonight absolutely not i need it to protect us from aliens and again he's he's been talking to dodie for months at this point and dodie is kind of just like every he's yes anding everything paul says right like oh yeah that sounds real paul yeah definitely oh yeah no no aluminum foil great idea man yeah absolutely um so is this where the aluminum foil comes from is this like the the origin of that like this will block waves part of it yeah i don't know that paul is the only guy who starts it but this is like he is on the ground floor of the aluminum foil will stop the aliens from reading your mind thing yes that's definitely fair to say he's among among because he's very influential in this culture too yes yeah yeah so we can see at this point he's already kind of starting to go over the edge right yeah paul begins writing analysis of myrna's hypnotic regression regression sessions replete with lines like the alien does all caps kill with the beam generally generally huh, huh? Kill with the beam, huh? Yeah. Where are those bodies? Where are those bodies, Polly Roy? Okay, Paul.
Yeah. Now, the reality is that Hansen had just brought up a bunch of existent UFO lore during her sessions, right? She complained about missing time.
She described being picked up in a tractor beam. She claimed an alien crewman had brandished a silver knife before cutting into a cow's chest.
And she eventually described being taken to an underground base where a metallic device was put inside her brain. Now, this is part of why there's some theorizing that like maybe she was a plant is this is when and Paul is the guy who really does more than than anyone to start this this is when you start getting these these ufo conspiracies about underground bases and they're usually either like bases that are our military shares with the aliens or maybe the aliens run the base you know there's some stories about them having fights with the army and whatnot and these bases underground um but the real thing behind this is that a bunch of people in Albuquerque had watched.
And like, this is something that Paul would have seen from his house as the Air Force dug this massive underground nuclear storage space, like the largest weapons, underground weapons storage base ever, or at least at that point in time. And so people are like wondering, well, what's this really for? And the answer is pretty evil.
Like it's for nukes, but yeah, it's a whole full of nukes. Yeah.
There's a lot of theories as to why. So Hansen also claimed, per Benowitz, that she had picked up an STD described as a vaginal disease like streptococci bacillus from the aliens.
Paul wrote to his colleagues at the volunteer alien hunting group that quote, we are trying to culture it. No luck as yet.
Also, it has evaded all of our known antibiotics with penicillin. Damn, nobody's doing sex ed on these aliens.
That's the problem. They gotta learn to wrap it up.
Whatever it is, you gotta wrap it up though paul you are an

electrical engineer i don't think that you are qualified to say that it's an un like it can't be like it's it's a it's got to be an alien std maybe it's a normal one maybe it's just a normal one yeah exactly you're not a doctor paul you should first off you should be given this lady antibiotics, Paul. You're not a doctor.

You're really not. So he also revealed that Myrna was being, quote, badly beaten on by the alien with their beams 24 hours a day.
And once Myrna starts talking to him about how she's just constantly being beam attacked, Paul starts to believe that he, too, is being beaten on with beams. And he urges his colleagues who plan to do regression work to lock themselves in a car in a garage coated with three layers of aluminum foil to protect themselves from the beams.
He's doing well, is what you'd say at this point. He's doing great.
Our boy Paul, very, very healthy, making rational choices. Oh, Paul.
Paul, you've fallen so far. You were doing so good, buddy.
So Dodie is occasionally checking in with Paul, but he's also spending the intervening months, you know, 79, early 1980, working on another mark. And this guy is a journalist or a quote unquote journalist, depending on how you see it, with a reputation for he is considered to be one of the more rigorous guys within the UFO community by the UFO community.
Take of that what you will. His name is George Moore.
At least that's how he's described in Project Beta. But also the author of Project Beta really likes this guy and is like impressed by him.
So I don't feel the same way about more go rightly's narrative makes him out to be like less more of like one of an interchangeable number of ufo kind of weirdos although one who is you know reached out to by the government to spread disinfo and more claims that like he's down with this right um and the reason we're talking about him is that he is the co-author of that book that first big book that gets like um ufos back in vogue right he's interviewing that guy from roswell he's one of the guys who helps make roswell into like the thing that it is in in our culture right um yeah he's written He's written a bunch of other stuff. You know, he's a very influential figure within this field.
And that inspires Doty and a colleague to approach him. In July of 1980, Jim Lorenzen of APRO receives a letter with no return address claiming to tell the story of an 18-year-old Civil Air Patrol member who had sighted a UFO and then been threatened by a man in black named mr huck the young man had reported this to a mr doby at afosai right that's the air force that that's uh dodie's um agency so lawrence gets this letter and he thinks it's weird and he sends it to bill mitchell who's the best journalist he knows and or bill moore who's the best journalist he knows, and Moore immediately is like, oh, this is bullshit.
And he knows it because he does some actual journalism. He reaches out to the named witness, and the witness is like, well, yeah, I saw some weird lights, but I was never threatened by a man in black.
None of the rest of this is real. Man, the tiniest amount of journalism.
Yeah, really, that's all it takes at Yeah, yeah. Let me just double check this.
Just ask this guy if this happened. The letter was actually the creation of Dodi and his colleagues at Afosai.
They were hoping to rope in somebody like Bill, right? Somebody smart enough to have credibility in the subculture, but also who might fall for a fake, right? They didn't succeed in tricking him, but they continued fishing in September of 1980. Moore finished a blockbuster book, The Roswell Incident, which is, yeah, that's one of the things that reignites public entrance.
Yeah. Yeah.
So military intelligence gets very interested after this point.

And while he's doing his book tour, he keeps getting calls at radio stations where like guys will be like, hey, do you want to have a meeting?

You know, I'm from a government intel agency and I'd like to talk. And he eventually agrees and he's met by a man who dresses and acts very much like a spy in the movie.
Now, my opinion on what's happening here is that there's some two-way feedback more desperately wants to be a journalist working on classified fringe like x-files kind of stories right and he wants to feel like he's part of this great game of spies and spooks now the spooks he's talking to these are real spies but they're not the high-level operators working to unearth you know russian nuclear secrets or doing the fucking cool shit that they make movies about. There are some enlisted guys at the Air Force, mostly tasked with lying to rubes to cover up flight testing.
Right. And they here's the thing.
This is like a two way street because they also want to feel like they're doing cool spy shit. Right.
And so Dodie and George Moore, part of what they're both doing, because they're both much more rational than Paul is at this point, they're kind of LARPing together, in my opinion. They're kind of like, well, Dodie, I get to play like I'm this very serious man in black, and Moore is like, and I get to play like I'm fucking Fox Mulder almost, right? The show's not on the air at this point, but that's what they're both getting here.
Right. And more is offered a deal by by Doty and a colleague.
Help us out with some odd jobs. Right.
We need some like deniable work that you can do and we'll pass you some classified UFO information. Right.
Oh, I see. Got it.
Yeah. That's how that.
Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah. And the first dossier that Doty and his friend hand over is bullshit.
Like George, again, does some minor reporting and is able to figure this out from Bishop's book. Quote, after a few preliminaries, the question started.
Well, what did you discover? Moore threw the paper down on the table and trying to sound less annoyed than he actually was replied. This whole mess is a lie.
None of these people exist. The agent and Dodie looked at each other and smiled.
What's going on? Asked Moore. You passed the test, said the man whom he would eventually refer to with the codename Falcon.
Within a few years, Moore and his colleagues would begin to assign codenames to their growing coterie of contacts so that they could talk freely about developments without fear of identification if they were overheard. And, you know, maybe this was a test.
I think it's likely that they were like, okay, so we figured figured out this is bullshit let's just tell him that that was a test and then you know stroke his ego and he'll believe the next thing we say maybe right yeah yeah exactly we're just we're gonna keep refining from our side until we actually make him a believer and he'll feel great because he's passed all these tests so he's right gonna start looking less and less because of how smart he believes he is too yeah right and they Right. And they hand him some shit.
And he'll admit, like, I knew some of what I was putting out into the UFO community was bunk. But I think some of it's real, too.
And, like, he's, you know, he's being a shady character here as well. Now, unlike Paul Benowitz, George is a pretty, I think, a mentally resilient guy.
Like, he definitely a believer to some extent, but I think he also I don't think he takes it as seriously as Paul does. Right.
I don't think this is breaking his brain. I think he's having a good time.
Right. Yeah.
My favorite story from Moore is that Dodie and his partner apparently thought Moore might be gay and decided to test him by like one day when they're hanging out, they like park the car and Moore is like in a bunch of men start walking past the car wearing tight pants or high heels and dresses that like fit really weird. And like, it doesn't seem like they would like are comfortable in.
And apparently this is a test because they want him to troll the gay bars of santa monica looking for a guy that the afo c wants for some reason um i don't know um it was a slow day in the office when they came up with that one they're just like ah well we gotta do something this weekend right all right so dodie and his colleagues they get some of what they want out of more right he launders some info into the UFO community, some of the disinfo they want to distract from their real programs. But he's also not, he's a little too smart, right? He's not willing to destroy himself publicly as much as was necessary for the kind of misinformation that they wanted to get out.
And this is where Paul Benowitz reenters the story. It is obvious by 80, 81 that this is a guy who is not well, but also he's respected.
And he is a guy who, because of his tech acumen, might endanger some top secret operations. So the decision was basically made.
Let's fuck him up a little. Right.
Paul gets invited to give a speech at Kirtland and most of the attendees leave before he's done. But like one of them like oh this is really interesting stuff paul and that just lights his ego on fire paul so happy to hear this um he applies for air force grants which he does not receive but he apparently gets an nsa grant um and i think that's maybe the nsa fucking with him because some real fuckery is about to happen here.
Hey, I love an ironic grant. It's a ironic grant money still spends.
It's a little more messed up than even that. So Dodie is now spending hours with Paul Benowitz.
And he claims that they became friends and that he found the orders he received to spread lies to Paul personally distasteful. If you watch the documentary Mirageman, you'll see a lot of Doty, and he does express a degree of what kind of feels like real regret over what he did to Paul.
He is also a spy and a professional liar, so I don't know that I believe he's really, or he just knows that he needs to perform regret, right? I think that's probably like so god what's what do you think like the like the internal notes of a person that constantly lies are like is it just like a notebook is it like a series of post-its around their house how do you keep that shit straight it sounds exhausting i i don't you know one of the things that you get when you like read these stories and like the way in which a lot of the writers and quote unquote journalists who cover this stuff, the degree of credulity they have to these guys' stories. The thing that becomes clear to me is like, oh, this is your first time being lied to by a weirdo in the desert.
Like I spent a lot of my childhood and like, oh, not childhood, my young adulthood and like off grid places just listening to like lies from dudes at bars and stuff. I've heard a lot of my childhood and like oh not childhood my young adulthood and like off-grid places just listening to like lies from dudes at bars and stuff i've heard a lot of crazy stories that definitely aren't true and that's a ton of fun um but i i think some of these these people just like decide they want to live as if that's real um you know that's fair yeah god how How many timeshares do you think they own? It feels like.
Oh, my God. These guys are these guys are very, very vulnerable to timeshares.
So on some of his early visits to hang with Paul, he's shown a complex computer system. Doty is that Benowitz had constructed and had his employees help him build to translate these encrypted messages.
Right. It's unclear what's actually happening.
Is he just getting random static and then like running it through an algorithm to like create text based on that? And then kind of going through it almost like it's one of those like word puzzles and just like picking up words out of a feed of words that like and then saying like oh this is you know a message from the aliens right um because some people will say like it looked like gibberish to me but he would pull out you know five or six words from this like paragraph of nonsense and say like this is the real message right yeah um and this is a quote from dodie uh benowitz had the computer rigged up to antennas on his roof that included a small microwave dish. And he would look at the screen and there would be images on the screen that certainly wasn't an alien.
But he was convinced that it was. I would actually tell him, I don't see anything.
And he said, I see it and I can hear them. And he had these earphones that he would put on.
And he said, I can hear them talking. And I asked Paul, what language are they speaking? He said, they're speaking their language.
And he wrote a hundred page document about the alien language. When he went out to Kirtland to give his presentation to all these generals, he presented them with that information.
So the NSA, and this is probably where the NSA gets heavily involved and maybe why they give him that grant, because a plan gets hatched to gift Paul with a new computer, right, that he's told is a gift from AfoC. Some accounts, maybe Doty offered him the machine.
The story you'll hear more often is that an Air Force consultant named Dr. J.
Allen Hynek, who's a former scientific advisor for Project Blue Book and a big guy in the alien community now. I think he denies this, but you'll hear that too.
We don't really know exactly what happened here because I've also heard the NSA did it. I've heard that the Air Force did it.
I don't know. Adam Goe rightly notes, This computer had been provided at the behest of the U.S.
Air Force, and embedded in the software was a code that generated an alien language. With the aid of the Air Force computer, Benowitz claimed he established constant direct communications with the alien using a form of hex decimal code with graphics and printout.
Now, so what's happening here probably is that because some versions of the story say that the NSA was literally set up across the street in a rented house sending messages directly to Paul's computer um it was maybe a little less direct than that but basically he's got this machine that's probably programmed to allow them to send him fake messages from aliens uh and so he starts getting messages like this ground ground women of earth are needed flexible the next just charges our ship women do not command the north among us you have many friends water very short resist all attempts at alteration listen orange make peace and paul doesn't know what to make of this he becomes convinced actually that this is the aliens trying to trick him into thinking that they're peaceful but he knows they're're really dangerous. Oh, he's so close.
He's getting there. Yeah, he's getting there.
Yeah. Greg Valdez, who's Gabe's son, visited Benowitz during this period, and he described seeing the computer in use.
He would type a question into the computer in a very complex for the time period form of a computer program, much like a current email. Much to everyone's surprise, he would get an answer to the questions he was asking.
Sometimes he would get an immediate response, and sometimes it would take several minutes. He would even receive very crude and basic pictures or graphics on his computer of these aliens.
Some of these pictures resembled birds with reptile features, and some resembled reptiles with bird features. During this question and answer session, Gabe instructed Paul to ask the simple question, where are you from? Paul already knew the answer to the question because he had already asked the question, and he answered it verbally when a response came back on the computer.
It simply said the Zeta Reticuli star system. So they're now really fucking with this guy in a way that's very irresponsible.
I mean, I want to know who's writing this stuff because that's the best job on the base. Right.
Maybe Dodie. It's probably a team of guys, right? Probably, yeah.
Because Dodie, there's some evidence he was working with the NSA. So maybe it's multiple.
It's almost certainly multiple people feeding him bullshit. Yeah.
But yeah, the result is that Paul Gross convinced that the U.S. government has signed a treaty with aliens, perhaps to breed some sort of hybrids.
And they've been given real estate in an underground base near Dulce, New Mexico. This played the happy dual role of covering up ongoing weird experiments around Dulce.
You know, there's that poison gas fucking hole. and diverting the attention of Paul and others away from Kirtland Air Force Base and towards somewhere less harmful, right? For their ends, you know? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Definitely. Now, during his communications with the ETs, Paul became convinced that there was a secret war going on.
Dozens of base security and Dulce had been murdered by the aliens in a gunfight. He wrote up plans to lay siege to dulce base and began working to develop a sort of beam weapon that could kill aliens now oh paul wow okay yeah now we're making beam weapons huh buddy oh yeah he's like i better hope the aliens don't have aluminum foil listen folks if you if you have a friend who's making beam weapons to fight the underground aliens i actually don't know how you should handle that situation but probably don't give him a computer that that lies to him i think you gotta sign him up for bowling league or something i think get him bowling yeah yeah let's get some more social take him out camping maybe yeah that social schedule a little bit you know what see if he wants to play dnd maybe his imagination needs a little bit of a workout you know that might be great yeah yeah now if a lot of this sounds like the overarching conspiracy plot for the first like five seasons of the x-files that's because this is almost certainly the direct inspiration for a lot of the x-files right like this is in fact because this is all happening in the 80s, not long before the X-Files starts, right? Yeah, yeah.
So, Benowitz, as he's communicating with these aliens, he's gathering information on this secret underground base and this war he believes is going on underneath everyone's noses, he's sending back everything he's getting, the special agent, Dodie, his good friend. And Dodie dutifully forwards this up the chain and encourages Paul, keep digging, you know? You're getting doing the deep throat thing right he's like yeah keep keep digging agent murder you know yeah yeah yeah so close you're gonna get there yeah yeah uh he's telling him that the aliens at Dulce base had been responsible for what he'd seen over Kirtland and he does this because he's like oh yeah man you know what I I ran it up the flagpole and that underground base, that's why you were seeing those weird lights.

Don't look near the Air Force base.

Keep hanging out around Dulce.

You know, that's where the shit's going on, right?

Yeah.

Go Rightly claims the ultimate intent of stringing Benowitz along, according to researchers like Greg Bishop and Christian Lambright, was to shift Benowitz's attention away from Kirtland to a remote area like the Archuleta Mesa near Dulce, where Afosai could ramp up their disinformation operation and more easily stage UFO events. Speaking of staged, you know what's not staged? Is the reliability of our sponsors.
That's completely legitimate. You know, don't even question it.
Don't think about it. Hand over your credit card information.
Text it to me. I'll buy stuff for you.
And we're back. Okay.
So near the end of 1981, Richard Doty convinces his superiors to let him take Paul on a special helicopter flight around the Archuleta Mesa. Since Paul is a pilot, and they see some stuff, you know? There's some, and apparently, Doty claims that he and other agents put out props, right? To look like air vents for the secret underground base and other evidence, right? This is so crazy, because now there's an art director involved.
Yeah. There's an art director.
There's production. There's production meetings about what to do to this poor man.
Like. Yeah.
They're having pitches and stuff. They've got like pitch meetings on fucking with this guy.
There's a whole. There's a prop team now.
Oh, no. So because Paul's a pilot's a pilot after this first trip he follows this by doing his own recon flights over the area and he gets very obsessed with this and i have some questions i don't know if i believe doty entirely that like he's being handed all of the men and equipment necessary to carry out a staged operation on the scale he describes.
But also it's possible. And in fact, maybe likely Paul is sometimes seeing some real stuff like he reports seeing what he describes as a crashed Delta wing aircraft.
And in this area at this time, they're working on prototypes of the stealth bomber, which is a looks like uh and in fact greg bishop's project beta like that's his basic conclusion is that like paul might have seen like some of the testing stages of the prototype of like the stealth bomber right uh and maybe that was like part of what dodie was doing was if we get this guy to talk about if we if we show if we get if we let this guy see a little bit of the real stealth bomber program, but convince him it's aliens, then anybody who's talking about like a Delta wing aircraft, right, will be like, oh, you're just talking about a UFO, not this actual thing that we're working on, right? Yeah, exactly. Let's get everybody off the scent once again.
So maybe that's what's happening. Or maybe it was just an easy thing to make look like a plane from the air.
Shit like this.

They do this in World War II a bunch.

We do it.

And actually the Nazis do it too.

Where you'll like make basically fake out of like wooden shit and spray paint tanks and stuff.

So people think there's an army where it isn't.

Right.

So.

Oh, yeah.

Yeah.

Where I'm from in Maryland, there's a there's a fake cop car on like one of the highways. Oh, the highways that is up just to slow you down.
Yeah, love that shit. Now, there are other claims about what happened to Paul and his wife during this period that are more questionable.
One write-up I found by the Cyberthetic Project claims that Paul and his wife developed red sores or perhaps some sort of rashes on their body.

I've seen that a few times. The Cyberthetic Project describes itself as a token project with a mission to unite holders so that they can communicate in an open forum on the blockchain without fear of being judged or censored.
So you'd be right about questioning it as a source. That said, this is all a lot of fun, so I'm going to quote from it anyway.
Just, you know, a lot of salt here. It has since been revealed that the NSA was in possession of sensitive documents concerning advanced technologies such as active denial systems and active denial technology.
These technologies were apparently being developed by Sandia Labs and Kirkland Air Force Base, with the aim of producing a non-lethal weapon that could be used against enemies. Were they using this technology on the Benowitz the answer to that is also unclear what is clear is that paul and his wife were being physically impacted by the re his research into ufos um and that's maybe not like i don't i think probably likelier than some sort of weird beam weapon is that paul is losing his mind and he and his wife are both very stressed out by this yeah and convinced that they're being targeted by aliens and they have like shingles a stress rash something like all sorts of shit you know no yeah it feels like they probably would have like broken out in some sort of like yeah stress rash of some kind like yes that's fair i have several friends from the california fires that had them a week ago right right imagine prolonged experience to potential aliens for years.
Yeah, you have rashes too. Right, I don't think that that's, it's at all unlikely that something like that is the case here.
And yeah, so as he grew more obsessed with seeking out the truth, Paul's business declined, which is another reason why maybe he's dealing with some stress-related problems. God, his his poor office manager.
Oh, my God. I just need you to sign off on this.
Paul, we just really need to make this censor, man. Could we? Okay, you've got the whole team working on translating alien speech.
All right. Well, I'm going to maybe print out some resumes.
Yeah, exactly. In 1978, Thunder Scientific had 30 employees.
By 1981, the number was down by almost half. He starts hiding guns and knives around his home as the 1980s wore on because he's just incredibly paranoid now.
And he continues to attend UFO events throughout the mid to late 1980s. His yarn about Dulce Base, which was almost certainly invented or at least heavily egged on by Richard Doty, had been a magnificent success.

In 1987, John Lear, a prominent ufologist, stated that he had independently confirmed elements of Benowitz's story, right? That there's this underground base at Dulce. Several books in the late 1980s published their own variants of the story, which helped to spark a paranoid belief in secret underground alien bases that is still a significant part of QAnon today.
A lot of QAnon guys believe that there's a base under the Getty in Los Angeles. That's why I didn't burn.
That's why I didn't burn. They kept it safe.
That's where they keep the kids. Yeah, exactly.
Center or villa? I think it's the center. Either way, do a pizza gate at both places, Sophie.
You know what? No, that didn't end well for that guy. There's a lot that's sad about this, but one of the worst things is that Paul had almost certainly stumbled upon a very real and very important conspiracy at Kirtland.
See, today Kirtland Air Force Base is a major testing site for advanced drone technology, including weapon systems to defeat drone swarms and other experimental tech. We know that in 1980, a black mystery vehicle was spotted at the base.
This is right around the same time Paul is making his initial reports. So he's going to show you a picture of this mystery vehicle that is being tested at Kirtland Air Force Base when Paul is observing shit, right? It looks kind of like an SR-71, but it's like a drone version almost.
This was apparently what's now we know this was called at the time TD, a TDUX tow target. A write up in the War Zone describes it as high-speed towed aerial target to support the testing of infrared and electronic

countermeasures, or IRCM

and ECM, respectively.

Something like this would both look very

weird in the sky, and

also might put off some

of the signals that Paul was, you know,

receiving, right?

Makes sense. Now, I don't know if this is what he

saw. It was other stuff, because other shit is being tested at kirtland including precursors to our modern drone program right paul very likely came across evidence of the development of unmanned weapon systems that have gone on to kill huge numbers of people no aliens need to be involved at all for this to both make sense and be a real conspiracy theory it It's also very likely Doty wasn't fully in the loop

as to what was being developed there

because he wouldn't need to be.

And in fact, the more he believed the bullshit

he was pushing on Paul,

the safer the real secrets were.

In 1988.

Yep, yep.

Cool stuff.

The drone program.

It always comes back to that.

Hooray.

So exciting.

But they make pretty firework alternatives. It's fine.
to that. Hooray.
So exciting. But they make pretty

firework alternatives.

It's fine. Yeah, it's all good stuff.

Yeah, don't worry.

They can form Steve Harvey

in the sky. Yeah, they can make Steve.

It's fine. They should have done that.

What if the aliens

love Steve Harvey? Oh my God.

Paul Benowitz went to the Air Force. I keep seeing

Steve Harvey's face in the night sky. i don't know what's going on uh in 1988 paul published plans for an assault on dulce base which he'd become convinced was the nexus of an alien plan to control the world that same year he became convinced that his wife was working with the aliens or perhaps in control of the entire alien conspiracy conspiracy.
Poor wife. Yeah, she's really going through it here.
And in this passage from Go Rightly's book, which is based on interviews with Bill Moore and Richard Doty, he describes a profoundly ill man. Both Bill Moore and Richard Doty on separate occasions witnessed firsthand Benowitz's mounting paranoia, describing him as spun out and barricaded inside his home, chain-smoking cigarettes, waiting in fevered anticipation for the final E.T.
showdown. In Project Beta, Greg Bishop recounted, Benowitz told Moore that after the aliens injected him, they would make him drive his car into the desert in the middle of the night, but he couldn't remember what he did after he got there.
Around this time, Benowitz's family committed him to a mental health facility for nervous exhaustion. Oh, man.
And you will sometimes hear it errantly stated that he commits suicide as a result of this. He does not.
This thankfully doesn't have as sad a story as it might. Paul gets out after about a month, and he seems to have pulled himself out of the UFO community community after this point um he and his wife stay together they're married more than 50 years and he lives until 2003 um so you know kind of a happy ending but boy it didn't it almost wasn't um yeah for real man also shout out to the place he was committed apparently apparently they did the job yeah that's serious deprogramming paul paul man you you gotta stop you gotta stop using the computer the nsa gave you yeah we had a computer man some poor doctor just cracked all over their knuckles and said, all right, let's get into it.

Paul, we need to have a long conversation about things that are real and things that aren't.

So Richard Doty would eventually retire from the Air Force and spend much of his retirement and golden years doing the UFO convention circuit.

He will say that he was hired to consult on two seasons of The X-Files and that he wrote the screenplay for an episode. He's not credited as the writer for that episode.
But, you know, his stuff definitely helps inspire the X-Files, right? He is for sure involved in what becomes the X-Files purely because of his role in UFO culture. I'm sure he wrote a script.
yeah i'm sure he wrote a script yeah a lot of people have written scripts and he is he's a member of a couple of different organizations now he's a very controversial figure within the ufo community because he both definitely worked for air force intelligence and tells a lot of stories about seeing aliens he claims to have literally seen them and also admits that he lied about aliens for years to a guy who nearly lost his mind forever. I wouldn't trust him.
But for an idea of how Richard Doty presents himself now, here's a clip from him on the New Realities YouTube channel being interviewed by a UFOology author named author named alan steinfeld stein i i i mean you're no longer working for the air force intelligence right um but sure that's right i don't work for air force intelligence well don't be offended by this question but how do we know you're still not working for them and you're just saying you're not working for them? Well, there's a lot of controversy over that, but number one, I wouldn't

have any reason to. I left the intelligence agency back in 1988.
Although people bring up the fact that I was brought back to active service in 91 and 93. But that had nothing to do with UFOs, or disinformation, it had to do with what I did in Europe when after the wall fell.
So I work as a private investigator, I have no connections, official connections with the United States government or intelligence community I do have a lot of friends that still work within the intelligence community and they feed me a lot of information that I share um with you I mean I shared it with you at the UFO Megacon yeah so yeah I mean I think he's still... I even found an interview where he's, like, talked about, like, he's asked about, like, because Tom DeLonge of Blink-182 is a big guy and is involved with Doty and one of the organizations he's in.
And one of the interviews is like, are you doing a Paul Benowitz to Tom DeLonge? He's like, of course not. I would never.
I absolutely would would never do that i think he might be doing a

paul benowitz on a couple of guys um maybe that's just fun for him yeah it reminds me of uh what's the um uh in the tanya hardy in the assault of nancy kerrigan tanya hardy oh yeah yeah yeah The Galooly and his idiot friend.

The amount of bullshit that they just believe about themselves and talk about like yeah like the the other guy he like talked about um how he like was a special forces guy and had all this shit made up like damn you believe this though i've heard so many fun lies about being special forces from dudes like oh especially out in like the mountains like every old man you meet who like will tell you about all of the crazy shit he did in vietnam um and it's it's just always it's always nonsense like yeah i i know a guy who's out we're in the little mountain town where i used to live who was SEAL team member during Vietnam. And his reaction was very different, which was like, he handed me a book that was written about like him and his colleagues.
And I was like, you want to know anything? Just read that. I don't like talking about it.
Yeah. If you've actually done any of this stuff, you're like, it's not, it's not what it's, it's not the movies, but it's kind of a bad time.
yeah yeah i i have a lot to answer for and process didn't like it not not happy with how that all went no no not worth the free beer to talk about jovially no yeah anyway well that's the aliens uh or not but maybe there's aliens i don't know this is not conclusive on that matter one way or the other, but there's definitely a bunch of spy agencies who will lie to you and destroy your brain if they think it will help them hide a fact that they're making some fucked up shit to kill people in other countries. Of course.
Maybe the alien was inside of you, listener, the entire time. The real alien was always the military industrial complex.
Yeah, exactly. Because, you know, define what an alien is.
Is it something that works against the good of humanity? Then in that case, the government is run by aliens. I don't know.
Who knows? Who knows what's out there? Or in here, apparently. but what is out there and what is in here are your pluggables, Brandy.

Bam.

What a transition.

Nice work.

Thanks, Sophie.

Yeah, you can find me online at Branddazzle on all of the platforms, including the new ones and the old ones.

My podcast is called

Lady to Lady.

It comes out every Wednesday

and has been around

for 13 years.

Burn This Records

is my comedy label

that I run

where I put out

amazing comedy albums

from people all over the country

that are very funny

and also good people.

And then

I have my own album

coming out on that label

in the middle of

March. And I would love for you to buy it.
That'd be amazing. So yeah, brandyposey.com has all the information for all of the things.
But yeah, come say hi. I, if you're a fan of the show, you'll like me, I promise.
So come on over. All right, everybody.
Well, that's the episode until next time. Again, folks, I I say this every time.
Head to Kirtland Air Force Base. Get a camera out and just start filming and go slowly insane.
Get a pilot's license. Fly over some random mesa.
You know, just just just just do some shit. You know, why not? Nothing bad can happen.
Look, the world's going to hell in a handbasket. You might as well lose your mind about some alien shit.
If you want to test your relationship, go down an alien hole. See if your wife really loves you.
You know, this is the only way to know. It's the only way to know.
Behind the Bastards is a production of Cool Zone Media.

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