Strangers on a Train

Speaker 1 Hey everybody, Ted Danson here to tell you about my podcast with my longtime friend and sometimes co-host Woody Harrelson.

Speaker 1 It's called Where Everybody Knows Your Name, and we're back for another season.

Speaker 1 I'm so excited to be joined this season by friends like John Mulaney, David Spade, Sarah Silverman, Ed Helms, and many more. You don't want to miss it.

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Speaker 9 She was the love of my life.

Speaker 9 Katie and I had a very special bond,

Speaker 10 always.

Speaker 11 We called the police station. We called some of her friends, and nobody had heard from her.

Speaker 9 A daughter in danger.

Speaker 12 We were absolutely convinced that foul play was involved.

Speaker 13 And no one could find her.

Speaker 14 I was concerned.

Speaker 11 We got to get going. We got to get moving on this.

Speaker 9 On the train coming home, she had met this woman. Could a brief encounter hold the answer?

Speaker 11 She's talking about how someone has tried to assume her identity.

Speaker 15 There's more to this story, and you need to tell it right now.

Speaker 11 Somebody was after her.

Speaker 16 True fear.

Speaker 17 I could really see it.

Speaker 18 I said, hey, hey, y'all, tell me I think I found her.

Speaker 21 It began on a bright morning in May.

Speaker 20 The Palmetto

Speaker 22 slipped from its platform at Washington Junior Station.

Speaker 25 and eased out into an eight-hour run down the eastern seaboard to Charleston, South Carolina.

Speaker 21 On board was a beautiful, tall, and feisty redhead named Kate Waring, a daughter of the South, of a fine southern family, an often troubled young woman who, sitting on this train, was finally on the brink of something very good.

Speaker 33 And what is it about trains?

Speaker 21 The ease there in that enclosed space of befriending perfect strangers.

Speaker 36 Somewhere along the line, between a greeting and goodbye, Kate Waring's invisible fate jumped its track.

Speaker 39 And quite unaware of the dark force descending, she disembarked to a future utterly changed.

Speaker 42 Charleston, South Carolina, it almost goes without saying, is a showpiece of American history and southern manners.

Speaker 43 Its charm as deeply embedded as the families who count seven, eight, ten generations here.

Speaker 21 Kate Waring was born to one of those families, grew up in a fine big house along the historic waterfront called the Battery.

Speaker 28 Dance lessons, birthday parties.

Speaker 49 Dad, if we catch a turtle, can we keep it?

Speaker 29 Doting parents, Janice and Tom, who adored their only daughter.

Speaker 13 And she had you essentially wrapped around her finger as the thing.

Speaker 42 Oh, absolutely.

Speaker 9 She was the love of my life.

Speaker 53 And

Speaker 9 not stupidly so.

Speaker 9 I mean, I could not always tell when I was being manipulated, but

Speaker 9 some of the time. Sure.

Speaker 9 No, Katie and I had a very special bond.

Speaker 10 Always.

Speaker 28 She was the middle child, sandwiched between two brothers, older Joe, younger Richard.

Speaker 56 She was bright.

Speaker 23 Maybe too bright.

Speaker 26 School bored her.

Speaker 35 Animals, all animals, enchanted her.

Speaker 46 She was naive, sweet. As younger brother Richard saw it, she could not turn away astray, animal or human.

Speaker 17 She was a very, very kind person, whereas some people would dismiss someone who wasn't generally accepted by most.

Speaker 60 She would kind of try to help those people out.

Speaker 47 But somewhere in the course of an enchanted childhood,

Speaker 62 something happened to Kate.

Speaker 46 Outsiders saw a fearless tomboy morph into a sophisticated debutante.

Speaker 30 But at home, Kate struggled, often in secret, with eating disorders, depression.

Speaker 39 College was a frequently interrupted disaster.

Speaker 11 She sort of ran toward risk.

Speaker 11 I noticed that in a lot of things that she did. She seemed to court it.

Speaker 47 Her parents discovered she'd been sexually abused when little by someone they knew.

Speaker 63 Years of therapy followed.

Speaker 30 Still, she drank to excess, lost her driver's license.

Speaker 23 She abused drugs.

Speaker 65 She soapered up.

Speaker 66 She fell off the wagon.

Speaker 47 She came home.

Speaker 28 to live with her parents, tried and failed at dozens of strategies to achieve the straight and narrow.

Speaker 70 And then finally, out of desperation, Tom Waring offered Kate a trip with him anywhere she wanted to go, anywhere on the planet, to see polar bears.

Speaker 73 And it must have been an amazing trip.

Speaker 9 Oh, it was the trip of a lifetime. I'm so happy that we shared that together.

Speaker 11 The photographs show how happy she was there.

Speaker 9 And she saw young men who were with their families, about her age,

Speaker 53 who were

Speaker 9 happy. And she said to me, Dad, I don't have to settle for what I've settled for, do I?

Speaker 9 And I said, no, honey, you don't.

Speaker 9 You can basically write your own script.

Speaker 74 And it was a bit of magic.

Speaker 68 The change seemed almost instant.

Speaker 64 Kate reborn.

Speaker 20 On board the ship was a Russian crewman who was amazed how quickly Kate picked up his language.

Speaker 66 Which is why, months after that trip, the newly inspired inspired Kate traveled to Moscow to meet him again, to explore the city, the culture, and to test drive both a budding relationship and her fledgling Russian skills.

Speaker 21 The snapshots taken of Kate on Red Square in Moscow were far more than just souvenirs.

Speaker 68 They were portraits of a young woman transformed.

Speaker 23 The Kate who stood on Red Square had a new passion in life.

Speaker 46 The depressions and failures in the past had fallen away.

Speaker 6 She was consumed by all things Russian.

Speaker 46 In fact, she was making plans even while there to return to Moscow in the summer to take up Russian studies.

Speaker 68 Finally, her life was taking off.

Speaker 22 And that's why Kate Waring was in Washington that fine May morning.

Speaker 70 She was on her way back to Russia, but there was a problem with the visa, a paperwork mix-up sort of thing that would have sent her into a tailspin once, but now the new Kate vowed to try again later, boarded the palmetto for Charleston, and once home threw herself into college classes and a children's book she'd been writing.

Speaker 71 Big Brother Joe was, to say the least, encouraged.

Speaker 80 She, when I talked to her, was the happiest I can remember hearing her in the last 10 years.

Speaker 81 She sounded good. She sounded as if she was ready, had a conviction about what she wanted to do.

Speaker 40 And then it was June, heat rising in Charleston's deepening green.

Speaker 25 On Saturday morning, June 13th, Tom Waring, at his summer house outside the city, felt an absence.

Speaker 48 Cell phone hadn't rung.

Speaker 8 No call from Kate.

Speaker 30 Kate, who always called or texted her parents practically hourly.

Speaker 9 She always checked in, and it was unusual.

Speaker 75 He drove home to check her room here in the big silent house on the battery.

Speaker 11 And all the lights were on.

Speaker 11 And it looked like obviously Katie had planned to come back. And

Speaker 11 she left her medicine.

Speaker 11 She never went anywhere without her medicine.

Speaker 9 And then

Speaker 9 on Sunday, we came by the house also.

Speaker 9 No sign of her.

Speaker 21 Now there was dread.

Speaker 56 Was it possible that Kate had slipped back into that old destructive life?

Speaker 11 We called the police station. We called a detention center.

Speaker 35 Wow.

Speaker 6 So this is...

Speaker 30 And this is by the end of the weekend.

Speaker 11 Nobody had a Jane Doe in the hospital. Nobody had been brought in.
We called some of her friends, and nobody had heard from her.

Speaker 51 What to do?

Speaker 20 Kate was 28, and though she lived at home, she was an adult.

Speaker 28 Her decisions, bad or good, were hers.

Speaker 30 They elected to give it one more day. If she wasn't back by Monday, they'd call the police.

Speaker 35 And then, when Monday came, there was word.

Speaker 21 No, not from Kate.

Speaker 74 From Kate's bank.

Speaker 9 Once I got off the phone with the branch manager, I called the police.

Speaker 19 Yeah, what were you thinking then?

Speaker 53 I was thinking something is wrong.

Speaker 13 Something was wrong, but could they discover what and would the police help?

Speaker 77 I thought, I'm not going to put up with this.

Speaker 11 We got to get going. We got to get moving on this.

Speaker 22 It was Monday morning, the 15th of June, 2009.

Speaker 3 Kate Waring had been missing for 48 hours when a surveillance camera captured a young man named Ethan Mack standing at the counter of a bank, waiting to cash a check signed by Kate Waring.

Speaker 21 Problem was, her account barely totaled $100,

Speaker 56 and this check was for $4,500, and the signature seemed off.

Speaker 8 The teller called Kate Stan, he called called police.

Speaker 9 I never met Ethan. I didn't know Ethan's last name.
All I knew was the name Ethan, who was a friend. It's too strong to say that she had a secret life,

Speaker 9 but she certainly had

Speaker 9 friends and did things that we didn't know anything about.

Speaker 39 Of course she did.

Speaker 58 She was 28 years old.

Speaker 26 And even though she was financially and emotionally dependent on her parents, she had lots of friends.

Speaker 21 Some they knew, some they didn't.

Speaker 21 There was Howard Gatch, for example, a martial arts trainer in the midst of a contentious divorce with whom Kate had been carrying on something of a romance.

Speaker 14 I felt that in my heart something was wrong, and

Speaker 14 I was concerned.

Speaker 75 Then there was Jason Luck, a young lawyer with whom she often shared lunch and a spirited debate.

Speaker 80 Oh, she was strong-willed. She was very energetic.
She was rarely, rarely incorrect.

Speaker 88 That's uh

Speaker 4 but her best friend, as she made clear to all the others, was Ethan Mack.

Speaker 80 She really liked Ethan. She really trusted him.
She said, This is my best friend, Jason.

Speaker 80 She put a lot of trust in him.

Speaker 89 She's a lovable person, full of energy, always rambles.

Speaker 87 Ethan worked in a local hotel, very different background than Kate.

Speaker 30 But he'd been her best buddy for years, and in a way, her protector.

Speaker 68 Everybody in Ethan's neighborhood knew you didn't mess with Kate when Ethan was around.

Speaker 45 They loved each other like, well, siblings.

Speaker 89 I mean, so no harm would come to her when those certain little boyfriends would act like they got hand problems and I would put them in their place.

Speaker 62 It wasn't a romance at all, then.

Speaker 89 Never at all. It just was like she was just like a little sister to me.

Speaker 51 And it was a token of his family's regard for Kate that she was godmother to Ethan's nephew, Malachi.

Speaker 59 On her Moscow trip, Kate bought herself and Ethan matching brass bulldog keychains.

Speaker 7 And on that Monday morning in June, said Ethan, he was very worried about Kate, just as he had been for years as he helped her battle her demons.

Speaker 89 Calming her down and talking to her and understanding that was going on in the world of kids.

Speaker 85 But now, he complained, here was Kate's dad sending the police to talk to him about a check Kate told him to cash.

Speaker 94 What do you want to do with that one?

Speaker 30 So Ethan explained to the cop, David Osborne, about the money he'd given Kate for jewelry and other expenses, and that the check was to pay him back.

Speaker 95 He was basically best friends with Catherine, had been for several years.

Speaker 28 In fact, Ethan told Detective Osborne he was very likely the last friend to see her before she disappeared.

Speaker 95 He said that he had saw her Friday night, had dinner, had drinks, came back, dropped Kate off back at her house.

Speaker 48 Did he say what time?

Speaker 95 Yeah, I think the time would have been probably around 11.30, 11.45 at that time.

Speaker 27 The detective checked, of course, and found text messages that confirmed what Ethan told him.

Speaker 91 He even went to the house Ethan shared with his mom.

Speaker 95 And they both let me in and they both allowed me to search it. The mother and Ethan both told me that this is his room.
This is where he stays.

Speaker 38 But to say that the instant suspicion on the part of the Warings and the police was upsetting to Ethan was probably an understatement.

Speaker 38 Good evening, Mr. Waring, or Ms.

Speaker 96 Warren, this is Ethan Mack calling.

Speaker 6 This is the voicemail he left for the Warings after that policeman poked around his place as if he was some murder suspect.

Speaker 96 Well, I think you need to really check that and go find out and go see what really happened and find the person who did something to her and stopped harassing me because the only thing I ever did was try to help her and mold and mugging waves.

Speaker 19 So, dead end.

Speaker 78 The police moved past Ethan, checked Kate's cell phone phone record, found she'd made a call late that Friday night that pinged on a tower in a place called James Island, several miles from her house.

Speaker 46 But phone pings can be funny that way sometimes. They told the Warings one tower is busy, the next one over picks it up.

Speaker 35 Probably made the call from home, they said.

Speaker 97 They also promised to keep looking for her.

Speaker 68 But really, Kate was known to have gotten herself in and out of trouble a time or two, and police resources were limited.

Speaker 29 And, well, Tom Waring got the cop's message.

Speaker 9 We do not not know for a fact that a crime has been committed here.

Speaker 90 After all, the Warings were reminded.

Speaker 43 Kate was a world traveler, could well have just picked up and gone back to Russia, might be aboard some tramp steamer even now.

Speaker 29 Or if something bad happened to her, could have been a drug overdose, even suicide.

Speaker 92 Impossible, thought Kate's parents.

Speaker 46 Even in her darkest times, she'd never failed to call.

Speaker 42 If she

Speaker 9 spent the night out unexpectedly, I mean, we'd get a call first thing the next morning

Speaker 9 because she knew that we would worry about where she was and was she safe.

Speaker 22 So the Warings began picking apart that Friday, the last day anyone saw Kate, looking for something they may have missed.

Speaker 68 But it had been such a normal day.

Speaker 5 She had no driver's license, remember, so she asked Howard Gatch to give her a lift to her therapist's office.

Speaker 14 Gave me a hug, say goodbye, said thank you so much, and she's actually in a very good mood.

Speaker 8 An hour and a half later, Howard saw her again, this time at the gym.

Speaker 14 She said, is it okay? I skip rope over here, Howard. And I said, sure, Kate, that's fine.

Speaker 26 Mind you, there was an incident at the gym.

Speaker 65 Howard's soon-to-be ex-wife came around. She and Kate had words.

Speaker 21 But at 8 p.m., a drugstore camera showed Kate all relaxed again, talking on her sale, buying wine and snacks while waiting on her prescription refills.

Speaker 25 Ethan paid for dinner, salmon, chicken, teriyaki.

Speaker 89 It's like a Japanese, like kind of like cuisine type thing.

Speaker 56 She didn't drive, so he took her home, dropped her off before midnight.

Speaker 78 But something else, something earlier that Friday that bothered the Warings at first was terrifying them now.

Speaker 21 And the more they thought about it, the worse it seemed.

Speaker 75 Just before she went to the drugstore Friday evening, she started telling her father about some problem.

Speaker 9 Saying that she felt like she perhaps had unintentionally gotten herself in trouble.

Speaker 9 And I said, well, why don't you tell me about that? And she wouldn't tell me any details.

Speaker 42 Was she clearly worried?

Speaker 9 She was concerned about something

Speaker 9 about something.

Speaker 28 Naturally, they told the police about that.

Speaker 45 But nothing came of it.

Speaker 8 And as the air thickened into a steaming August, the weeks that passed brought no new leads, just tourists clamoring for the cool shade of historic carriage rides.

Speaker 26 And Kate Waring, the urgency of finding her began to fade.

Speaker 11 And that was driving me nuts. I thought, I'm not going to put up with this.

Speaker 11 We've got to get going. We got to get moving on this.

Speaker 35 And in the hushed cool of his perch overlooking the city, someone was listening.

Speaker 97 A new investigation begins, but it's not the police who are behind it.

Speaker 10 We're the cream of the crop, and our job was to find Kate Waring.

Speaker 100 Not finding Kate was not an option.

Speaker 13 Who are these guys?

Speaker 85 Take a little drive beyond the grand old homes and markets and churches at the historic center of Charleston, South Carolina.

Speaker 37 Enter quietly, a hushed suite of rooms overlooking the city, where an influential philanthropist flipped through his mental Rolodex and placed a call to his friend, the chief of police.

Speaker 17 I really need a favor. You know, I really need some help with this situation.

Speaker 23 The caller, John Rivers, happened to be a childhood friend of Tom Waring, watched Kate Waring grow up. John Rivers told the police chief he was worried about Kate too.

Speaker 17 And he told me that, you know, they got a lot of stuff going on, but that he would assign his best and brightest to the case.

Speaker 51 And I felt pretty good about that.

Speaker 21 But now, almost two months later, Kate was still missing.

Speaker 43 And the investigation, such as it was, had accomplished nothing.

Speaker 51 And John Rivers couldn't stand what it was doing to his best friend, Tom Waring.

Speaker 36 I could see that he really

Speaker 17 was having a hard time functioning.

Speaker 46 So Rivers picked up the phone again, enlisted a seasoned pro, and told him, do what it takes.

Speaker 46 His name is Andy Savage, former prosecutor, now famously tenacious criminal defense attorney.

Speaker 45 Savage had heard about Kate too and how police had no evidence of any crime.

Speaker 8 Really?

Speaker 12 As soon as we scratched the surface just a little bit, we were absolutely convinced that foul play was involved.

Speaker 46 Savage was given just two mandates.

Speaker 21 Find Kate Waring.

Speaker 41 Tell police everything you find.

Speaker 20 That last part, keeping the police in the loop, should be easy, figured Andy, given the team he assembled.

Speaker 74 A band of retired policemen turned private eyes, each with a particular talent.

Speaker 102 I'm Bobby Minter.

Speaker 23 Bobby Minter, human bloodhound, tracking people without them knowing it, his specialty.

Speaker 13 My name is Bill Capps.

Speaker 66 Bill Capps, techno geek.

Speaker 101 Tracks bad guys through cyberspace.

Speaker 81 Happens to be a crack shot.

Speaker 9 My name is James Randolph.

Speaker 8 James Randolph, ex-police department rebel.

Speaker 36 Strategy, his specialty.

Speaker 5 Shaking things up, a particular skill.

Speaker 10 But we're the cream of the crop, and our job was to find Kate Waring.

Speaker 100 Not finding Kate was not an option.

Speaker 5 Experience told James the best place to start was with Kate herself.

Speaker 16 If we listen to Kate,

Speaker 100 she'll tell us where she is.

Speaker 25 James went to the house on the battery, up the stairs, down the hall, and into Kate's bedroom.

Speaker 100 These type cases, you have to take on the personality and you have to see this person's world through their eyes.

Speaker 6 He sat there for a bit, looked around.

Speaker 85 The Russian notes in Kate's handwriting made sense.

Speaker 68 But why Chinese paper money?

Speaker 69 And why was her brand new prescription sitting there untouched?

Speaker 100 The medication in which she had gotten at her prescription was still on her dresser, unused.

Speaker 84 That medication was her lifeline.

Speaker 21 She needed it to counter depression, anxiety, insomnia.

Speaker 70 She never left home without it.

Speaker 51 Meanwhile, cyber sleuth Bill Caps buried himself in social media sites.

Speaker 5 Kate used them.

Speaker 66 Bill scoured them all.

Speaker 60 If she was awake, she was Facebooking, she was texting, she was calling people on the phone, she was emailing.

Speaker 60 And at the time she went missing, when everything immediately ceased, I mean, that was completely out of character for her.

Speaker 30 Using Kate's friends, Capps built an electronic map of her communications the Friday night she vanished.

Speaker 66 From Kate's lawyer friend, Jason Luck, Caps retrieved a weird voicemail left late that evening.

Speaker 88 10.06 p.m., missed call, left voicemail. Voicemail said that someone had, quote, stolen her identity, close quote, and had obtained a couple of credit cards in her name.

Speaker 88 She wanted me to sue the person responsible.

Speaker 103 The gym trainer and Kate's romantic interest, Howard Gatch, told Caps he heard from her about 10.30 p.m. p.m., still at dinner with Ethan then.

Speaker 105 But then there was another call at Gatch, and it was after midnight.

Speaker 98 Well, after police believed she was dropped off at home.

Speaker 107 She told me she was at some friend's house. They had already made it to the house.

Speaker 107 She'd sounded a little buzzed.

Speaker 85 And then, a very last message from Kate, a text.

Speaker 26 Very strange.

Speaker 107 I'm off to Greenville to pick up some lovely.

Speaker 53 And

Speaker 107 whatever lovely was, I had no idea and

Speaker 107 you know and I'll be back in a few days.

Speaker 108 Did that make any sense to you?

Speaker 9 No.

Speaker 71 Be careful, he replied.

Speaker 22 But this time she did not text back.

Speaker 84 Silence from Kate.

Speaker 24 Except, middle of the night, her cell phone pinged out on James Island, miles from her home.

Speaker 46 The cops at Surmise remembered that a closer tower to her house may have been too busy to handle the call.

Speaker 26 But at 1.53 in the morning, not a chance, thought Andy Savage.

Speaker 60 It's just preposterous.

Speaker 12 They were looking for an explanation, plausible explanation, consistent with their theory

Speaker 12 that she voluntarily left.

Speaker 30 That middle-of-the-night call, by the way, was to her voicemail.

Speaker 35 A mailbox is full and cannot be used.

Speaker 8 A voicemail box that had been jammed full for months, during which time she hadn't used it or called it at all.

Speaker 7 So the question...

Speaker 60 Why would she call the voicemail?

Speaker 16 She would not be doing it.

Speaker 8 Only one conclusion to draw.

Speaker 60 Somebody else was using her phone.

Speaker 42 But where was Kate now?

Speaker 21 Had she, as that one text suggested, left town looking for drugs or lovely, if that's what lovely meant?

Speaker 58 For the moment, it was a dead end.

Speaker 8 And then, then he called.

Speaker 24 Eugene Frazier, legendary 34-year homicide detective, now retired.

Speaker 89 I believe that if a man commit a crime, he should be prepared to do the time.

Speaker 46 Thing is about Gene Frazier, over here on Charleston's James Island where his ancestors go back to slave days, Gene gets tips, all kinds of tips.

Speaker 70 And one day a church friend told Gene he'd heard the police had been to Ethan Mack's house and something strange about that.

Speaker 89 He said, listen, I don't think this is right. He says,

Speaker 89 Ethan Mack is living in an apartment

Speaker 89 that I have rented up to his father.

Speaker 44 But the police didn't search this place where Ethan actually lived, said the landlord.

Speaker 47 They searched his mother's house on a different island miles away where Ethan told them he lived.

Speaker 89 And he says, I think that he's trying to mislead the police office.

Speaker 42 What'd you think when you heard that?

Speaker 89 This guy got something to hide.

Speaker 66 And on that very day, Gene Frazier joined a band of ex-cops, which from now on, we'll call the A-Team.

Speaker 73 A mysterious woman enters the picture.

Speaker 11 Katie had this strange girl in the room with her.

Speaker 73 Who was she?

Speaker 75 The A team was about to launch a hidden camera surprise.

Speaker 21 By the time Andy Savage put his A team together to look for Kate Waring, that lovely young Charleston woman had been missing two months.

Speaker 21 And according to Kate's parents Tom and Janice the Charleston police were still saying this

Speaker 11 they think

Speaker 11 maybe she went somewhere she's probably just up in Greenwich

Speaker 51 it was after that when the A-team's Gene Frazier got his tip Kate's best friend Ethan had lied to the police about where he lived he didn't live at the house he allowed police to search he really lived behind the house in one of two apartments five miles away which you presented to the police.

Speaker 42 Yes.

Speaker 13 And?

Speaker 12 They didn't search the house. They never got a search warrant.
They never asked for permission to search the house. They never went back to them and said, hey, you misled us two months ago.

Speaker 56 But as the A-team discovered, Ethan failed to mention something else, too.

Speaker 21 He had a girlfriend in this little place, a woman named Heather Angelica Camp.

Speaker 37 And when Janice Waring heard that, her mind went straight to an afternoon at home three months earlier.

Speaker 11 I heard voices upstairs and so I went up and Katie had this strange girl that I'd never met before in the room with her.

Speaker 21 And that was her name, Heather Cam.

Speaker 105 Kate explained she met and rapidly became fast friends with Heather on the train, the Palmetto, during her trip down from Washington.

Speaker 55 Typical Kate, Janice thought back then, drawn to someone who needed help.

Speaker 41 who had told her a hard luck story.

Speaker 11 She said when she got on the train, her pocketbook was stolen. And she's here in Charleston, and she doesn't have any money.
And I'm helping her out until she can

Speaker 54 whatever.

Speaker 39 But Kate told her mother that Heather would pay her back soon because she was a pediatric surgeon in Charleston to take a new post at the local medical center.

Speaker 26 Then a few days later, a distraught Kate told her mother that Heather's daughter back home in New Jersey had been killed in a car accident.

Speaker 6 But something seemed odd about that, said Janice.

Speaker 11 Didn't seem like she was rushing to go up to New Jersey to attend to the child that just was a grief-stricken woman. A grief-stricken woman.
She did not look that way at all.

Speaker 67 And now, here was news that Heather was living with Kate's friend, Ethan, in this tiny apartment.

Speaker 11 To me, she just looked like a kind artist.

Speaker 64 But no, said Kate back then.

Speaker 4 Janice had it all wrong.

Speaker 21 Heather was nice.

Speaker 30 In fact, Kate said she'd introduced Heather to her friend Ethan and very quickly a romance had blossomed.

Speaker 70 They were even talking marriage.

Speaker 72 Really?

Speaker 110 If Janice Waring was suspicious about Heather back then, the A-team was doubly so now.

Speaker 103 And sure enough, a few keystrokes on the internet told Bobby Mitcher that mother's intuition was right.

Speaker 18 That's all where she had been arrested for forgery and

Speaker 102 in Indiana.

Speaker 102 But she'd been arrested in other states, too.

Speaker 108 Essentially, if you just Googled her name, I suppose you could find out a fair amount.

Speaker 54 That's how I found her.

Speaker 60 She'd been impersonating a doctor.

Speaker 60 I just googled her.

Speaker 103 And Ethan wouldn't be her first husband.

Speaker 70 She'd been married before and had four children.

Speaker 103 Now that they knew about Heather, a few fuzzy details were suddenly clearer.

Speaker 25 For one thing, the bill for Kate's last dinner with Ethan made more sense because there were three meals on that dinner bill.

Speaker 98 The other diner was Heather Camp.

Speaker 64 And more important, that check Ethan tried to to cash, the one the Teller flagged, maybe that was another Heather forgery.

Speaker 55 So right away, point man James Randolph rushed that information over here to police headquarters.

Speaker 55 Surely somebody here had put two and two together, a woman known to have committed forgery in Indiana and other states, a so-called best friend who tries to cash a bogus check with Kate's name on it, then lies to police.

Speaker 55 Seemed like evidence these two were involved in her disappearance up to their necks.

Speaker 70 Enough to haul them in anyway.

Speaker 112 But...

Speaker 100 I was told that this story panned out and that these are petty criminals and the check was going to be taken separate from the missing person.

Speaker 90 What did you say to that?

Speaker 100 I just didn't think it was the right thing to do.

Speaker 54 We had to figure out who wrote and endorsed those checks.

Speaker 10 Who signed and wrote those checks.

Speaker 46 It was obvious the A-team would have to find the connection between Ethan and Heather and Kate's disappearance without police help.

Speaker 100 We always sort of remain stealth as much as possible.

Speaker 66 Time to keep a careful, quiet eye on Ethan Mack and Heather Camp.

Speaker 101 So Gene Frazier persuaded his church friend, Ethan's landlord, to allow surveillance specialist Bobby Minter to tuck a hidden camera into a corner of his kitchen window.

Speaker 21 A camera trained right at Ethan's front door.

Speaker 18 It was motion detected, just like that light that they've got over the door is. So when they drove in, it would light up and it would light up for our camera.

Speaker 60 The whole camera itself, Keith, was about the size of this little flashlight.

Speaker 60 It was pointed directly at the apartments. That's pretty slick.

Speaker 100 No doubt about it. And enough illumination to illuminate, to see what they would be carrying.
And that would lead us to know that they had something to do with Kate's disappearance.

Speaker 4 And when Ethan and Heather left the apartment, Bobby had that covered too.

Speaker 66 He'd already tracked Ethan to his job at a local hotel and attached a GPS locator on his car as it sat in the parking lot.

Speaker 45 Now there was no minute of the day when the team didn't know where Ethan and Heather were and what they were doing.

Speaker 70 And almost immediately they got a surprise.

Speaker 21 When Ethan was at work, Heather sneaked over to visit the man living next door, rode around town with him.

Speaker 102 They were going to the bank a lot, and I called the investigator, one of the investigators of the Wachovia.

Speaker 18 As a result of that, they found that they were kiting checks.

Speaker 102 They were actually stealing money from the bank.

Speaker 101 Despite what Bobby told the bank, it never resulted in charges against anybody.

Speaker 13 But that wasn't all he discovered.

Speaker 59 The GPS tracker on Ethan's car led Bobby to a couple of local pawn shops.

Speaker 18 They were pawning jewelry.

Speaker 99 The jewelry was a red flag to us.

Speaker 5 Was it Kate's jewelry?

Speaker 30 They couldn't be sure yet, without more surveillance, that is. And then, the landlord called Gene again.

Speaker 26 Another tip.

Speaker 67 This one bad.

Speaker 30 Ethan and Heather weren't paying rent.

Speaker 89 He says,

Speaker 42 I have, I'm going to evict these people.

Speaker 89 So after he said that,

Speaker 54 I said, hold on a little.

Speaker 89 If these people are evicted, we don't know where they're going.

Speaker 21 If the A team didn't think of something, and fast, Heather and Ethan might slip out of their sight and Charleston for good.

Speaker 85 An enticing offer from the A-team.

Speaker 99 10,000 reasons to start talking.

Speaker 53 10, 20s, 50s, everybody sees that.

Speaker 113 Eyes just jump.

Speaker 57 The team of retired detectives searching for Kate Waring had a big problem.

Speaker 20 Crime Solving 101 told them Heather and Ethan had to be serious suspects, last people to see Kate alive, one a known forger, the other on tape trying to take money from Kate's bank account.

Speaker 3 But they were about to be evicted for lack of a rent payment.

Speaker 20 And if that happened, they would slip the invisible net the A-team had so carefully woven.

Speaker 12 Mind you, we have the camera, we have the GPS, we're tracking every movement that they have.

Speaker 55 So they made a call to a quiet office overlooking Charleston, where the team's moneyman, John Rivers, decided he'd pay Ethan's rent.

Speaker 40 Secretly of course.

Speaker 55 And it was a plan which after a little brainstorming offered a bonus, a built-in opportunity.

Speaker 35 Here's how.

Speaker 75 The A-team wanted to know if Heather or Ethan forged Kate's $4,500 check, but they needed original handwriting samples.

Speaker 12 We determined what was on the check that we needed comparison samples to, and we had numbers, obviously, on a check.

Speaker 55 Then the A-team helped Ethan's landlord prepare IOUs that contained the needed numbers and letters.

Speaker 42 And when Heather and Ethan signed the documents agreeing to pay the rent in installments, they were giving the team the very samples that could prove they forged Kate's check.

Speaker 43 The team took the handwriting to their waiting expert, Mickey Dawson, the man who set up the state police handwriting lab.

Speaker 91 Their question was simple.

Speaker 55 Did Heather and or Ethan forge that check from Kate, the one Ethan tried to cash?

Speaker 42 Immediately that day,

Speaker 12 our handwriting document examiner said,

Speaker 12 that's that, no question about it.

Speaker 40 So, if Ethan and Heather forged a check from Kate, what else did they do?

Speaker 43 Someone on the team needed to get a look inside that apartment.

Speaker 47 If Kate had been there, there still might be evidence of something.

Speaker 62 But how to get in?

Speaker 12 Well, the landlord has a right to inspect

Speaker 12 a tenant's homes

Speaker 12 for health and safety and welfare. And the landlord decided that he needed to go in and spray for bugs.

Speaker 92 You can understand why that might be done in that little place.

Speaker 12 James thought it would be best that if he went with him to make sure that the bugs were all taken care of.

Speaker 7 Surveillance expert Bobby Minter's GPS device showed Ethan's car was out somewhere.

Speaker 61 Well, when we opened the door to go inside, Ethan's Max sitting on the couch smoking a joint.

Speaker 53 Oh, for God's sake. And I'm like, oh, hell.

Speaker 113 I'm like, hey, away with the exterminating company.

Speaker 61 We're going to be using some dangerous chemicals, so you'll have to step out on the outside while we get this done.

Speaker 52 No idea who you were?

Speaker 100 No, no, no.

Speaker 40 You sure about that?

Speaker 16 Absolutely.

Speaker 100 So the exterminator and I went inside, we closed the door behind us, just searched the apartment, and in one of the

Speaker 100 backpacks, an Ethan Max backpack, was some Chinese money, Chinese currency.

Speaker 59 Chinese money?

Speaker 8 Yes.

Speaker 68 Just like the Chinese bills James saw in Kate's bedroom.

Speaker 21 Janice Waring had brought those bills to Kate from Hong Kong, souvenirs.

Speaker 6 Had Ethan stolen them?

Speaker 18 I put it here on this pole.

Speaker 91 Time to stir things up, apply some pressure.

Speaker 42 And Bobby Minter knew just how.

Speaker 12 Bobby went out and put on every telephone pole, every vacant house, every oak tree, every stop sign, wanted information, missing person, Kate Warings, posted that way.

Speaker 54 Right around where all those people hung up.

Speaker 12 Wherever they went, including on Max Windshield, when he was working that day, we put posters to send a psychological message to them.

Speaker 26 But no response.

Speaker 85 At which point, John Rivers said.

Speaker 17 Perhaps what they do understand,

Speaker 17 and on the street, as it were, is Andrew Jackson and maybe Benjamin Franklin, and they would recognize their faces on a $20,000 or $50 bill.

Speaker 6 $10,000 worth of those bills went into a grocery bag.

Speaker 53 10, 20s, 50s, and 100.

Speaker 54 And it's a little good bag.

Speaker 113 And when you open it up, you know, two rows, and then everybody sees that, and they show them their eyes just chill.

Speaker 21 And where better to wave that bag of money, they decided, than under the nose of that neighbor Heather was going to see, the man named Terry Williams, the one who seemed to be kiting checks with her.

Speaker 100 So we knocked on the door, and Terry Williams came to the door with no shirt on.

Speaker 61 He has no shirt on, short pants.

Speaker 100 He said, Terry, listen, we know you're great friends with these people, Mike and Camp. You don't have to live in this condition.
We know you're back on your rent.

Speaker 16 Look at this bag.

Speaker 100 Look at this bag of money. This could be all yours.

Speaker 75 Now to close the sale with Terry Williams, they try to bluff.

Speaker 100 Tell us what happened to Kate and where we can find her. We know Mike and Camp killed her and this money could be yours.
And at that point, that's when

Speaker 71 the side the bedroom door bust open and a lot of yelling and screaming and to their utter surprise there came Heather Camp angrily and quickly pulling her clothes back together didn't appear to be a business meeting the team interrupted the detectives told her who they were and who they worked for and then Heather Camp gets on the cell phone and makes a call to Ethan Matt and say, Ethan, Andy Savage's investigators are here trying to get Terry Williams to roll on us.

Speaker 100 And when she said that, the three of us looked at one another in police terms.

Speaker 89 We knew that was definitely the case.

Speaker 100 We knew, hey, they had done it.

Speaker 110 Oh, yes.

Speaker 56 Decades of investigating made it perfectly clear to the A-team.

Speaker 21 Whatever happened to Kate Waring, Ethan Mack and Heather Camp were in it up to their eyeballs.

Speaker 13 We knew something was up.

Speaker 36 A new direction.

Speaker 99 The search for Kate Waring takes the A-team to a wild and desolate place.

Speaker 99 What would they find there?

Speaker 48 28-year-old Kate Waring has been missing since June 12th.

Speaker 28 It was so awkward now, but necessary.

Speaker 27 The once very private wearings and and their only daughter's intensely personal struggles were now so glaringly public.

Speaker 72 They had to be.

Speaker 11 And you can't just sit back and hope that she'll be found. I mean, we worked every day,

Speaker 77 all day long,

Speaker 11 trying to find her.

Speaker 42 That's when it hit home.

Speaker 46 Kate was the latest of hundreds of people still lost in South Carolina, and it seemed to Janice and Tom that police weren't taking cases like theirs seriously.

Speaker 6 So what about all those other families also also desperate for help?

Speaker 24 The Warings held a vigil to make common cause.

Speaker 11 Somehow or another, somebody will be will be moved and want to come forward and tell us where Katie is.

Speaker 21 That was the public Waring family.

Speaker 24 At home, the private Tom Waring couldn't help but be drawn to the playback button on their voicemail just to hear her voice.

Speaker 54 Dad, Mom, through there, pick up the phone.

Speaker 54 She's there, pick up the phone.

Speaker 54 Call me back later.

Speaker 18 Bye.

Speaker 17 I would look at photographs of her or play those

Speaker 9 voicemail messages, just keeping her voice current in my mind.

Speaker 74 Meanwhile, Andy Savage's A-team of ex-detectives was making progress.

Speaker 30 And when they flashed that fat grocery bag of cash around the neighborhood, they certainly got a rise out of Ethan and Heather.

Speaker 76 A furious Ethan called Andy.

Speaker 12 Your investigators are out here and they're accusing me of being involved in this homicide. Kate was my best friend in life.

Speaker 42 As he's on the phone, Kim calls.

Speaker 12 She starts out in his rage about,

Speaker 12 you know, what are you doing out here? You're accusing me of this. We had nothing to do with that.

Speaker 70 Fascinating reaction,

Speaker 67 thought Andy Savage.

Speaker 8 And perhaps an opportunity.

Speaker 12 We had done a lot of background on Kim.

Speaker 12 And so we knew her and we knew her personality and we knew a little bit about what buttons to push. So the reaction we had towards Heather was one of comfort, not one of angst.

Speaker 12 And during that time, we planted the seeds as a mother.

Speaker 12 She must know the feeling of Janice wearing missing her daughter and try to ply to her empathy for a mother.

Speaker 25 But the call from Heather wasn't all that fat bag of money accomplished.

Speaker 55 Before long, it reeled in a fish.

Speaker 26 That neighbor Heather was sneaking off to see called too.

Speaker 47 The A-team went to talk to him.

Speaker 61 And he said, I know Ethan and Heather did something to Kate.

Speaker 61 And Terry went in the back room, came back out, and had this iPod.

Speaker 61 And Terry said, I believe this iPod is going to belong to Kate.

Speaker 8 Now that was huge.

Speaker 26 Last time Kate was seen with that iPod, it was at the gym the day she went missing.

Speaker 25 Now a man Kate never met said Heather gave him the iPod days after Kate disappeared.

Speaker 51 But just to be sure this was in fact Kate's iPod, tech expert Bill Capps got the serial number and within minutes had the proof.

Speaker 60 I examined the registry file of smaller computers that we'd had access to that Kate had used in the past.

Speaker 60 We knew proof positive that that was Kate's iPod.

Speaker 64 Of course, right away, the A-team told the police about the iPod.

Speaker 68 and also handed over the handwriting expert's report showing that Heather and Ethan forged Kate's check two days after she vanished. And now now things started happening fast.

Speaker 103 After her heart-to-heart with Andy Savage, Heather made a remarkable decision.

Speaker 84 She called the Charleston Police Department and confessed.

Speaker 24 No, not to murder.

Speaker 86 Instead, she said it was she who forged the bogus check supposedly signed by Kate Waring and Ethan who tried to cash it two days after Kate disappeared.

Speaker 84 Now surely the police would swoop in and arrest them both.

Speaker 55 But here's something you should know about the way it worked between between the A team and their former colleagues, the cops. The deal was entirely one way.

Speaker 43 That's to say the A team told the cops everything they uncovered.

Speaker 62 The cops told the A team

Speaker 112 nothing.

Speaker 44 So they kept their ears to the ground, waited for something to happen, but they didn't have to wait for long.

Speaker 102 We knew something was up.

Speaker 13 And

Speaker 77 so the first thing we did was yank the

Speaker 18 GPS off the car because we didn't want the police to seize his car and have our GPS.

Speaker 45 Ethan was easy enough for the Charleston police to find.

Speaker 47 They arrested him at his hotel job, but they didn't seem to know where to find Heather.

Speaker 13 So.

Speaker 18 Of course, we had to tell her where she was working.

Speaker 53 Obviously, they didn't have a surveillance on her, so.

Speaker 62 And you could tell them that.

Speaker 54 Yeah, we told them where.

Speaker 16 We told them.

Speaker 10 We told them where Heather Camp was working.

Speaker 16 I mean,

Speaker 16 she's working at the Biden Local gas station.

Speaker 60 Actually, I walked into the gas station and bought a Pepsi, paid for it, and walked out, and a police officer in uniform had pulled up. He was peeping around the corner of the building.

Speaker 60 I said, that's her inside.

Speaker 71 Ethan and Heather were charged with forgery and obstruction of justice.

Speaker 26 Will the murder charge follow shortly?

Speaker 100 We get a call from, of course, we do have friends that's still at the police department.

Speaker 16 We get a call that, hey.

Speaker 77 The police are searching Wadmala Island for Kate Warren's body.

Speaker 32 Wadmallah Wadmilla Island.

Speaker 29 Wild, beautiful, isolated.

Speaker 30 And 20 miles from Kate's home on Charleston's Battery.

Speaker 60 So I got in my car and I drove out to Wadmalo Island.

Speaker 45 And there were the police.

Speaker 58 A serious search going on.

Speaker 60 So I sat there in the shade and watched them all afternoon. Didn't attempt to interfere.

Speaker 23 Just watched the police, see what they're doing.

Speaker 60 Just watch lots of officers and cadaver dogs also.

Speaker 100 There's a ton of folks out there. A ton of folks.
Sheriff Shows your bank.

Speaker 111 So this, apparently, is where their primary mission would end.

Speaker 26 And if it was the police department that found Kate's remains, at least she'd finally be coming home.

Speaker 106 And the A-team could take quiet satisfaction in the belief that it was their investigation that made it happen.

Speaker 110 Except, it didn't quite work out that way.

Speaker 16 She said, well, they didn't find her, did they?

Speaker 10 I know they wouldn't find it.

Speaker 97 Was Heather Camp, the con artist, at it again?

Speaker 8 Where was Kate Warry?

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Speaker 59 A lingering summer heat lay close to the marshes of Wadmalaw Island, steamed up through the dense bushes toward the city beyond.

Speaker 91 It was October 2009. A delegation of Charleston policemen sifted through the brush, eyes to the ground.

Speaker 5 Police cadaver dogs nosed along the shoulders of Pauly Point Road.

Speaker 78 Heather Camp sat in the back seat of a police cruiser.

Speaker 50 And Bill Capps, off on the sidelines, watched it all from his car.

Speaker 75 The cops had brought Heather here to lead them to Kate Waring's body.

Speaker 60 There's a couple of detectives that I knew left. I did ask them, you know, any luck? And they just simply said no and continued driving on.

Speaker 81 Police called off the search, drove Heather back to jail.

Speaker 30 Had she intentionally given them bad information?

Speaker 21 Perhaps nobody would find Kate.

Speaker 40 Not the police, not the A-team.

Speaker 77 And then?

Speaker 12 We got a terrific break by the criminal justice system. Mac and Kemp both came to the bond hearing and it's done by video.
At the bond hearing, Mac shows up with his family,

Speaker 12 who were all there to support him.

Speaker 54 And

Speaker 42 not only a public defender,

Speaker 42 but the chief public defender.

Speaker 13 Wow.

Speaker 54 Kemp has no one.

Speaker 12 She has no family. She has no friends.
She has no support to speak on her behalf. Now, I immediately said, James and Jean, go see her.

Speaker 12 Treat her with kindness.

Speaker 19 Treat her with caring.

Speaker 79 And within minutes, the same men who'd so upset Heather with their bag of money were face to face with her.

Speaker 111 What was the look on her face when she came out and told me?

Speaker 16 She was stunned, very surprised.

Speaker 61 And I said,

Speaker 54 Heather,

Speaker 42 We need to help here.

Speaker 90 We just, all we want is the body.

Speaker 16 And she said, well, they didn't find her, did they?

Speaker 100 She said, I put them through the test.

Speaker 16 They told me they were going to help me.

Speaker 100 They wouldn't arrest me.

Speaker 91 And the minute I told them the area in which she was, the general area in which she was, they got all abusive with me.

Speaker 16 You know, and they berated me. So they failed the tests.

Speaker 28 And just at that moment, what happened was, well, sheer luck.

Speaker 60 Directly across the lobby in the mail side of

Speaker 60 the visitation area, They brought Ethan back to see his attorneys who happened to arrive at the same time we did.

Speaker 87 Just coincidentally.

Speaker 13 Just coincidental.

Speaker 66 And also coincidentally, the jailers positioned Ethan and Heather across a hallway from each other, separated by glass partitions.

Speaker 41 So they could see each other? Oh, yeah.

Speaker 16 And I told her, here's his lawyer and the detective over there with him. And she's over there ratting you out.
So she stopped waving her arms trying to get Ethan's attention, so she snaps and she

Speaker 28 With a little more encouragement from Andy Savage, that is, his deal?

Speaker 62 If Heather told him exactly where to find Kate's body, and if it turned out she had nothing to do with any murder, Andy would help her with her forgery charges.

Speaker 41 And at that moment, Heather Camp agreed to tell the A-team what they needed to know.

Speaker 101 Her directions were precise.

Speaker 30 They drove out here right away.

Speaker 89 That's the large oak tree that she described with them.

Speaker 89 And then she says, if you look farther up to your left in the marsh,

Speaker 89 you'll see a dock that running down to the water. And she says, after you do that, you will look to your left over here

Speaker 89 on my right and left, and you say you will see some underbrush growth. And she said, that Kate remain,

Speaker 89 or she would say the body, is five feet from this path, from this roadway.

Speaker 42 Incredibly detailed. just the sort of place to leave a body.

Speaker 42 But just like the police, the team found nothing.

Speaker 17 I was very disturbed.

Speaker 60 Well, why are we not finding her?

Speaker 60 Because we were, as I said, we were convinced that she was here.

Speaker 87 They searched until darkness finally forced them out of the marsh.

Speaker 47 And then they called Andy Savage, who was out of town on business.

Speaker 12 They're on a cell phone from where they are. I'm in a hotel in Boston.
I punch up the address for Google Earth, and I'm looking at the satellite imagery of where they are.

Speaker 12 I said, well, James, is there a dock off to your left? And so I was pretty well able to identify where they were. So I said, what you've got to do is just print that off.

Speaker 92 Isn't that amazing? You can do that from thousands of miles away?

Speaker 12 You could also do it from the police station.

Speaker 56 The Google map clearly showed the A-team exactly how and where they lost the trail.

Speaker 26 After investigating so much, Savage wasn't ready to give up on Heather,

Speaker 70 But he wasn't naive either.

Speaker 12 We knew that she was a sociopath liar. I wanted something specific from her.

Speaker 12 Give me something that nobody else knows so that we can believe what you're saying is truthful.

Speaker 12 And that's when she told us about the souvenirs from Kate's body, the jewelry she was wearing and where it was located.

Speaker 84 They found Kate's jewelry at a pawn shop.

Speaker 101 And behind the dresser in their tiny apartment, Kate's bulldog keychain, the one she'd gotten in Moscow, Ethan, said Heather, took it from Kate's purse as a memento.

Speaker 68 She was telling them the truth.

Speaker 78 So they decided next morning, first light, armed with Andy's Google Map and more to tell from Heather, the team would return to Wadmala Island.

Speaker 12 You know, all what we were believing was now coming to fruition.

Speaker 12 All our suspicions about her activity and Mac's activity, at that point, we knew we had the right people.

Speaker 51 One thing, they'd be going without the police.

Speaker 45 Good idea?

Speaker 59 Maybe not.

Speaker 99 The A-T under arrest?

Speaker 77 You mean you were arrested?

Speaker 60 We were not afraid to leave.

Speaker 54 They made that clear.

Speaker 13 This was a twist even they didn't see coming.

Speaker 101 The early sun had cooked the mist off the marshes of Wadmala Island.

Speaker 26 Now the still air was heating up toward another dripping hot day.

Speaker 29 Bobby mentor Bill Capps and Gene Frazier shared a car from the city.

Speaker 78 They rode in silence most of the way, confident the precise directions Heather Camp had given them were correct this time.

Speaker 77 So, this was it.

Speaker 92 It was somehow fitting that Bobby, the one they called the human bloodhound, was the first to spot her.

Speaker 18 And I saw what looked like an animal path where animals or something had pretty much beat down the bush.

Speaker 18 So I walked out to the animal path and started walking parallel with the road and walked up and I saw what looked like bones and I said,

Speaker 19 I think I found her. I said, hey, hey, y'all, come here.
I think I found her.

Speaker 18 And I said, it was just like a ton of bricks come off of me at that point.

Speaker 18 I said, oh, my God, there she is.

Speaker 18 Wasn't much left, you know, just bones.

Speaker 56 In the end, it took only six minutes to find the earthly remains of Kate Waring and thus at last fulfill their promise to her parents.

Speaker 60 I saw where Bobby was standing and took two shots with my camera just to document the scene the way it was when we saw it.

Speaker 60 And then I just backed back out of the woods and Bobby followed me out and we called 911.

Speaker 118 9-1-1 911, what's the address of emergency?

Speaker 119 Yes, ma'am. This is Robert Mentor.

Speaker 118 Okay, you need police fire or email, sir.

Speaker 54 Police.

Speaker 118 What's the address, then?

Speaker 119 There's no address. It's in the woods.
We found the body of

Speaker 119 Kate Waring.

Speaker 118 You believe you found the body of Kate Waring?

Speaker 119 Yes.

Speaker 28 We know we did.

Speaker 118 In the woods?

Speaker 28 Yes. But...

Speaker 56 Listen to what happens after Bobby hangs up.

Speaker 21 The 911 recording continues.

Speaker 56 You can hear the operator spreading spreading the word around to other officers, a bit skeptical that the four-month-long mystery is finally solved. Hello.
Hey, Sarge.

Speaker 118 You ready for this? No. This guy is adamant that he found Kate Waring in the woods off of Pauly Point Road.
Off of where? Pauly Point Road in Guatemala Island.

Speaker 11 Alright.

Speaker 79 How's he adamant?

Speaker 118 He says he knows it's her.

Speaker 78 Out on the island, off Pauly Point Road, the trio of former cops instinctively reverted to long-practiced standard procedure.

Speaker 60 We said, okay, let's just secure the crime scene, back out, wait for law enforcement to get here.

Speaker 91 So far, so good.

Speaker 81 But what happened next was quite a surprise.

Speaker 102 The first officer was a Charleston County deputy, and I said,

Speaker 18 we're going to show you where the remains are.

Speaker 102 Took him out there and said, it's your crime scene now, and we're backing off.

Speaker 77 And that's what we did.

Speaker 62 But that wasn't the end of it, was it?

Speaker 54 No. No.
We were

Speaker 60 detained, to put it mildly.

Speaker 60 Detained and placed in separate police cars.

Speaker 42 You mean you were arrested or just?

Speaker 60 Well, very strictly, I guess, by the legal definition. We were not free to leave.
They made that clear.

Speaker 60 And when we couldn't leave, because they took my, they seized my car.

Speaker 94 But wait a minute, you found the body and showed them where it was.

Speaker 16 That's correct.

Speaker 60 They wanted a statement from us as to everything that we had done from the very beginning, not just what we had done that day.

Speaker 108 The whole long story.

Speaker 60 That's basically what they were asking for.

Speaker 60 And in fact, they had been given the story along and along as it occurred.

Speaker 109 Hours later, the ex-detectives were finally released.

Speaker 72 But not Bill Cap's car.

Speaker 56 Didn't get that back till they filed motion papers for an injunction.

Speaker 47 They would take anyway.

Speaker 55 And even now, the memory still rankles.

Speaker 35 All of them. I don't know if they had to know what it was.

Speaker 92 34 years in the police department.

Speaker 87 To sit in the back of a police car and have some guy question you, get you to take a statement.

Speaker 54 That's right, like a criminal.

Speaker 54 We've been sitting there in the back of a car like a criminal.

Speaker 6 And those less call it like we see him.

Speaker 44 Still, this was it.

Speaker 97 The news traveled to the house on the battery.

Speaker 30 The wearings fell from their anxiety and into grief.

Speaker 9 Mixed emotions.

Speaker 9 Relief that she's been found,

Speaker 9 but at the same time,

Speaker 9 devastating grief that now you have conclusive evidence that your only daughter is dead

Speaker 9 and that you're never going to see her again.

Speaker 56 And then, as soon as they were allowed after the crime scene tape came down, after all the evidence was taken away, the whole team assembled at the spot where Kate lay hidden for so long.

Speaker 35 All except Tom Waring.

Speaker 30 who did not want the image burned in his brain, the dismal place the love of his life lay dead.

Speaker 70 But perhaps it was a mother thing.

Speaker 30 Janice had to be here, she said.

Speaker 59 Had to see it.

Speaker 11 It helped me to see for myself.

Speaker 11 It was so remote. We wouldn't have found her in a million years.
And not knowing where she is. I mean, it's just,

Speaker 11 it would have been horrible.

Speaker 8 They formed a circle, held hands around the place they knew she had been.

Speaker 11 One of the investigators is a deacon in his church and he said a prayer.

Speaker 117 And there's beautiful water, marsh, and docks and I think it might have given Mrs. Warren some peace thinking, you know, at least

Speaker 18 it wasn't in a garbage dump somewhere.

Speaker 91 It was a peaceful place and, you know,

Speaker 91 God's place.

Speaker 63 So now the A-team had done its job and Kate's killers could finally be brought to justice.

Speaker 68 Or so you'd think.

Speaker 56 But the mystery, the web that was spun on that train down from Washington, was far stranger, more bizarre, than you have so far heard.

Speaker 99 And justice?

Speaker 71 Well,

Speaker 28 we shall see.

Speaker 76 They thought they solved the case, but would it stick?

Speaker 11 Actual evidence. It just wasn't there.

Speaker 75 And the close call that just might have saved Kate Waring's life.

Speaker 83 I could have hung on one more month.

Speaker 116 I could have helped them get her.

Speaker 30 Most everybody around Charleston, South Carolina, seems to know who the county solicitor is.

Speaker 42 Scarlett is what people call her.

Speaker 41 Solicitor Scarlett Wilson, officially, a well-known and popular prosecutor. And Solicitor Wilson had a problem.

Speaker 77 Actually, two problems.

Speaker 70 For one thing, though Heather Camp practically leapt at a deal to turn state's evidence against Ethan and plead guilty to murder in exchange, her credibility, as you'll soon see, was not exactly AAA.

Speaker 46 And despite all the information the A-team uncovered, what could be used in court was thin.

Speaker 11 I mean, frankly, we didn't have a lot of evidence. We had a lot of opinions and we had a lot of

Speaker 54 but

Speaker 11 actual evidence, it just wasn't there.

Speaker 92 Kate's skeletal remains gave the solicitor none of the forensic evidence the juries like to see.

Speaker 92 The coroner was unable to establish even the cause of death.

Speaker 92 As for those personal items of Kate's that they found in Ethan's apartment, those could just as easily have been gifts.

Speaker 91 The two were supposedly best friends, after all.

Speaker 87 And to top it off, there was the amazing tale that came with the state star witness, Heather.

Speaker 62 It's true, she helped the Warings investigators find Kate's body and agreed to testify against a man she revealed she actually married soon after the crime.

Speaker 106 But Heather was also, as Ethan's lawyer was discovering, a gray day world-class liar.

Speaker 15 Not only was she adrift, I mean, this was a true con artist, just with just the most horrid background of just anyone I'd ever seen. I mean,

Speaker 15 a true sociopath.

Speaker 21 David Ehler was certain that Heather Camp, back on that train to Charleston the Palmetto took one look at Kate Waring and knew she'd found her ideal next mark.

Speaker 28 Why was Ehler so sure?

Speaker 30 His research he said had turned up enough camp victims to fill a small bus to the poorhouse.

Speaker 15 We had 13 different names for her that we could use and we called all the 13.

Speaker 15 I mean these were men and women all over the country. She would say that you know she was pregnant.
She would say that her children had died of leukemia, that men had beat her.

Speaker 6 Her scam?

Speaker 33 Troll the internet for men, latch onto one, move in, fleece him, and leave him with a mountain of debt, all the while pretending to be a doctor, an heiress, or the daughter of a mafia-style drug family.

Speaker 82 That was probably the worst whirlwind I've ever been through, seen, done in my entire life.

Speaker 75 There was Chris Beard, for example, in Pennsylvania.

Speaker 82 Just being around her made me feel better because that's what I wanted.

Speaker 77 You know, I wanted to be loved.

Speaker 45 He found her on the internet.

Speaker 58 In less than two months, they were engaged, and she said she was pregnant.

Speaker 82 At the time that I had met her, I had no credit cards to my name whatsoever.

Speaker 103 She persuaded him, he said, to get 15 cards, which she maxed out, leaving him $33,000 in debt.

Speaker 49 Oh, and by the way, she told Chris's sister-in-law, Lori, that she was a pediatric burn specialist and she had worked with children, and that was her specialty.

Speaker 64 And as Lori had been having some behavior issues with her daughter, Heather gave the girl a blood test.

Speaker 77 See if, you know, there was anything wrong with her.

Speaker 8 And?

Speaker 49 She said, I just want you to know that, you know, your daughter's bipolar.

Speaker 72 But it was odd.

Speaker 25 How would she know, based on a quick blood test, whether or not her daughter was bipolar?

Speaker 69 And why would Heather use her own diabetes kit for the test?

Speaker 98 Lori hit the internet just to check out the woman who was playing doctor with her child.

Speaker 49 And found that, you know, she actually was a wanted fallon.

Speaker 106 So she called the cops, who arrested Heather in the act of spending more of Chris's money.

Speaker 103 But somehow, Heather slipped off the hook.

Speaker 106 Though Lori pressed charges and pushed hard for a prosecution, nobody followed through.

Speaker 25 And Lori eventually gave up.

Speaker 51 Lives with the guilt now.

Speaker 49 I think it was a month or so after I gave it up. That's when she came to DC and she had met Kate.

Speaker 83 And I always feel if I could have hung on one more month, I could have helped them get her.

Speaker 44 Now, as he prepared to defend Ethan, David Ayler was feeling much better.

Speaker 84 His client's chief accuser, it appeared, was a practiced con artist.

Speaker 106 Would any jury believe her?

Speaker 67 Ethan might be naive, said Ahler, but his story, after all, had never changed.

Speaker 94 They had gone out to dinner, he, Kate, and Heather.

Speaker 15 And then after they went out to dinner, he dropped Kate back off at her parents' home here in downtown Charleston and spoke with her a couple times via text message that night, and he didn't talk to her again after that.

Speaker 72 So it was all on Heather.

Speaker 68 And with her as Ethan's chief accuser, how could any jury convict him?

Speaker 29 But just days before the trial was to start, Solicitor Scarlett Wilson finally uncovered something the case lacked, a clear motive.

Speaker 78 She found it, she said, in letters Kate wrote to a friend just before she disappeared.

Speaker 11 She's talking about how someone has tried to extend her credit limit or has

Speaker 11 tried to assume her identity and mess with her money in her bank. And she was livid.
And I think Kate was threatening to get her father involved. And that was a new dimension for Heather Camp.

Speaker 77 And she didn't need Katie as an enemy.

Speaker 11 And I have no doubt Katie confronted Heather Camp with that.

Speaker 106 That, the prosecutor said, is when Heather Camp and Ethan Mack must have decided they had to keep her from talking.

Speaker 31 Kate Waring had to die.

Speaker 11 He began to make the choice to join in the scam, to rip off Kate Waring.

Speaker 84 Finally, the prosecutor Scarlett Wilson felt ready, and almost a year to the day after Kate was found, she launched the trial of Ethan Mack, the sole defendant in the courtroom, Heather having taken that plea plea agreement.

Speaker 25 The Warings tried to prepare themselves, though what they saw defied preparation.

Speaker 11 We had to see images and see what it was like when they found her and then go through all the forensics. And

Speaker 11 we were seeing that for the first time along with the jurors and all those other spectators in the courtroom.

Speaker 47 One by one, the A-team took the stand, as did detectives and experts from the Charleston Police Department, to present the evidence.

Speaker 11 Over a stupid forgery.

Speaker 66 Prosecutor Wilson told the jury that Ethan and Heather killed Kate to avoid getting caught for forging Kate's checks and using her credit cards.

Speaker 51 Then Heather took the stand and told the jury it was Ethan, not her, who lured Kate to their tiny apartment, then smothered her, shocked her with a taser, drowned her in the bathtub, and dumped her body out on Guatemala Island because he thought no one would ever find her there.

Speaker 110 So?

Speaker 42 did you think that you'd convince that jury?

Speaker 11 I thought that the trial went better than I ever could have hoped.

Speaker 68 Except that is for two things.

Speaker 7 One, would the jury believe Ethan actually killed his best friend, Kate?

Speaker 11 And two, Heather Camp's a liar. Heather Camp's jealous of Kate.
Heather Camp's the one stealing.

Speaker 68 But Heather's testimony did did seem to terrify one person,

Speaker 66 Ethan Mack himself.

Speaker 71 And it showed.

Speaker 52 When he was in the courtroom, waiting for the jury to come back, we have that picture of him, that shawl then.

Speaker 16 What was happening with your client?

Speaker 112 At that point, you know,

Speaker 16 true fear.

Speaker 15 You know, true fear, I could really see it.

Speaker 68 What hold did Heather have on this man?

Speaker 70 Did the jury, did anybody have this crime figured out?

Speaker 36 A surprise from the jury.

Speaker 13 And another one from Ethan Mack's mom.

Speaker 15 His mother said, there's more to this story, and you need to tell it, and you need to tell it right now.

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Speaker 23 You just never can tell how a jury will react to the facts of a complicated murder case or the accusations of a person like Heather Camp.

Speaker 92 Ethan Mack cooled his heels while his jury tried to decide if he did or did not smother, beat, taser, and drown his best friend, the woman he claimed was like a little sister to him.

Speaker 62 And then, after 14 interminable hours, they trooped back into the courtroom and told the judge they could not decide whether or not Ethan was guilty of murder.

Speaker 18 All right. What I'm going to do is on the murder charge, I'm going to declare a mistrial on that.

Speaker 110 Mistrial.

Speaker 103 A hung jury.

Speaker 9 Huge letdown.

Speaker 54 Right.

Speaker 9 It wasn't going to be over. It wasn't going to end.
We were going to possibly have to relive that whole event.

Speaker 9 again.

Speaker 44 As she packed up her files, Solicitor Scarlett Wilson vowed to find justice somehow.

Speaker 29 And then, quite unexpectedly, there was an

Speaker 42 intervention

Speaker 91 from a surprising source.

Speaker 44 It was Ethan Mack's own church-going, no-nonsense mother.

Speaker 42 She had testified during the trial, for her son, of course, gave a hint then of what she was made of.

Speaker 60 Corrine MacDean,

Speaker 60 D-E-A-N.

Speaker 17 Ethan's sort of a mama's boy, isn't he? Yes, he is.

Speaker 94 Do you know know anything about your son having any involvement with Kate Waring's murder?

Speaker 14 No.

Speaker 17 If you did, would you stand here today and support him?

Speaker 14 He knew I'll turn him in.

Speaker 46 Then, as Ethan's mother sat through the rest of the trial, she heard things.

Speaker 43 She knew her son knew when he was hiding something, and so she went to see him in jail.

Speaker 21 Ethan's attorney, David Ehler, heard it all.

Speaker 52 So it did get loud in that cell when they were talking.

Speaker 15 It got very confrontational. Basically, his mother said, there's more to this story, and you need to tell it, and you need to tell it right now.

Speaker 15 You know, his mother wanted him to tell the truth and tell what happened.

Speaker 51 And so it was decided.

Speaker 23 Soon after Ethan and his mother had their talk, he appeared before the judge and admitted he did participate in the murder of his good friend Kate.

Speaker 97 He agreed to plead guilty to voluntary manslaughter in exchange for a 25-year prison sentence.

Speaker 122 Do you understand that the court still treats this as a guilty plea? Yes, ma'am. And that your criminal record will reflect it as a guilty plea.

Speaker 89 Yes, ma'am.

Speaker 39 Of course, since Heather pleaded guilty to murder and forgery and obstruction of justice, they didn't need a trial for her either.

Speaker 29 Guilty but mentally ill, by the way.

Speaker 30 At her sentencing, her therapist told the judge that Heather developed after a deeply traumatic childhood a whole basket of serious psychological disorders, some of which rendered her virtually incapable of separating truth from her elaborate fictions, and which led into her years of failed marriages, abandoned children, and constant grifting.

Speaker 41 If Heather was hoping for a shorter prison term because of all that, she didn't get it.

Speaker 66 Instead, Solicitor Scarlett Wilson noted she continued to lie about important details after she made her deal to testify.

Speaker 41 And because she broke the deal, the sentence, 39 years, 14 more than Ethan.

Speaker 11 This was Heather Camp's kill. While certainly Ethan Knight was involved, and certainly he laid his hands on Kate, I do not believe that but for Heather Camp, we would be here.

Speaker 75 Still, said Andy Savage after the fact, Solicitor Wilson could have had a much stronger case had the Charleston police acted more aggressively.

Speaker 105 Just one example. When police arrested Ethan and Heather.

Speaker 12 Because of their own incompetence, they released the property, the crime scene where the homicide took place. They turned it back over to the landlord without examining it.

Speaker 12 And so the landlord went in and vacated the premises. He took all their furniture out and put it in storage.

Speaker 42 Cleaned the place.

Speaker 13 Cleaned the place.

Speaker 42 It wasn't until over two weeks later.

Speaker 12 They go in there knowing that the property had already been tamed that the crime scene was destroyed.

Speaker 68 No wonder Scarlett Wilson didn't have all the ammunition she'd have liked, said Andy Savage.

Speaker 68 But the Charleston police said they didn't see it quite that way.

Speaker 46 They did take the case of Kate Waring very seriously, they said, right from the beginning.

Speaker 30 And the second guessing from the A-team was rather puzzling, at least according to Captain Thomas Robertson.

Speaker 16 I'm surprised. I really am.

Speaker 9 I think we both did a fabulous job. And I think the team of detectives that I had working from this agency and the support that we had

Speaker 9 was fantastic.

Speaker 51 What may have looked like inaction, said Detective David Osborne, was actually a careful and thorough investigation, one that didn't leave out any possibilities.

Speaker 101 Was there some point at which you thought this girl has, she's probably dead.

Speaker 48 She's come to some serious harm.

Speaker 16 Early on.

Speaker 24 Early on.

Speaker 77 How many days after would you say?

Speaker 16 Within that first day?

Speaker 95 I would say that, I mean, within that first week for sure.

Speaker 77 Yeah.

Speaker 12 So you knew it was a murder investigation at that stage?

Speaker 95 No. I mean, it could have been an overdose.

Speaker 95 It could have been an accidental death. I think we felt like we were probably dealing with a death investigation.

Speaker 16 Right.

Speaker 79 But neither Tom nor Janice Waring was the least bit satisfied.

Speaker 23 Hadn't the police suggested early on that Kate may simply have skipped town on her own?

Speaker 46 Didn't seem to the Warings they were trying very hard to find her. And what about all those other families of missing people?

Speaker 38 They asked.

Speaker 5 Families without the resources to hire an A-team.

Speaker 9 Unfortunately, missing people are low on the priority list nationwide.

Speaker 11 I feel like

Speaker 11 that a missing person or missing child

Speaker 11 should be just as important as a bank robbery because lots of people never find out what happened to their child.

Speaker 91 It was late after midnight when she came to the end of her story, ushered there by two people she believed to be good friends of hers.

Speaker 91 And nobody, not the Warings, not the A-Team, not the police, has heard the story you are about to hear. The competing stories of the last hours and minutes of Kate Waring's life.

Speaker 69 Question is, whose story will you believe?

Speaker 21 Her longtime friend, the uncle of her godson, or the charming grifter, the woman who played with fate on the train?

Speaker 73 Heather versus Ethan.

Speaker 123 I had a big conscience, and he doesn't. He doesn't have conscience.

Speaker 29 Who was really behind Kate Waring's death?

Speaker 99 Two different tales.

Speaker 92 They call it the Palmetto, the train that glides down the eastern seaboard, eight hours from Washington to Charleston.

Speaker 48 A fine setting to meet a stranger.

Speaker 123 Sat in the same seat? Sat in the same seat,

Speaker 83 laughed, were joking the whole way, started talking.

Speaker 74 Heather Camp, freshly supplied with jewelry and cash from her last mark, just by chance, found herself sitting with a young woman wearing jewelry and perhaps with access to such cash as Heather had never seen before.

Speaker 43 What did you see in her?

Speaker 44 Why'd you like her?

Speaker 123 She was funny. Very funny.

Speaker 103 Now, sitting here in jail, Heather claims she came to see Kate not as her next victim, but as a friend.

Speaker 55 And when in Charleston she professed her love for Kate's buddy Ethan Mack and then eventually married him, that love was true too, so she says now.

Speaker 46 And when she told them both all those well-practiced lies about being a doctor, about her husband and child being killed in an accident, etc., etc., those stories, she says, were just part of the shtick, she admits it, of a con artist.

Speaker 123 That's what I do. That's who I am.
That's the way I've learned how to survive.

Speaker 21 But remember, in court, the prosecutor called Heather the mastermind who lied to con Kate, lied to manipulate Ethan, lied about murder.

Speaker 68 You were the decision maker.

Speaker 36 You were the person who caused Kate's death.

Speaker 123 I don't take it as that.

Speaker 8 Stole from her, yes, but kill Kate?

Speaker 21 No, Heather Camp will not cop to that.

Speaker 76 Instead, this was the story the Grifter had for us.

Speaker 68 It was all Ethan.

Speaker 7 Right from the start.

Speaker 123 My husband wanted to rip her off because she had money.

Speaker 59 But wait, why would Ethan want any harm to come to his good friend Kate?

Speaker 123 The trouble was, is that Ethan never considered her a friend.

Speaker 19 Not a friend of hers at all?

Speaker 77 No.

Speaker 62 Not like a sister or anything?

Speaker 13 No.

Speaker 123 He was babysitting her, and she became a problem for him.

Speaker 57 Became a real problem, says Heather, when Kate found out that she and Ethan were stealing from her.

Speaker 123 She was like, I'm going to put you guys in jail. And that scared Ethan.

Speaker 123 And the whole nightmare began that night because he was not going to go to jail.

Speaker 48 So you're saying Ethan was the mastermind, not you?

Speaker 123 Yes.

Speaker 31 And so after dinner that last night, says Heather, they took Kate back to their apartment.

Speaker 78 Ethan got her a little high.

Speaker 123 After a couple of drinks, she was in a very good mood.

Speaker 46 There was a big suitcase on the floor.

Speaker 74 Ethan dared her, says Heather, get in.

Speaker 68 She did.

Speaker 46 Didn't see the taser he was holding.

Speaker 123 He starts tasing her and doesn't stop. And by the time he removes the taser, she's not moving

Speaker 113 inside the suitcase at all.

Speaker 123 He races into the bedroom, grabs a pillow off the bed, comes back in, pushes me away, unzips the suitcase, takes the pillow, compresses it over her mouth, grabs the wine bottle that is maybe four feet away, takes the wine bottle, crack, crack.

Speaker 123 I think maybe it's three times he hits her. He tells me to go inside the bathroom, start the water.

Speaker 28 She was terrified, she says.

Speaker 12 Didn't you say Ethan?

Speaker 13 Stop.

Speaker 123 I didn't say anything.

Speaker 35 Didn't say anything at all?

Speaker 112 Why not?

Speaker 123 I cried, but I didn't say anything.

Speaker 123 I didn't know what to do. I didn't know what to say.
When he told me to do something, I did it.

Speaker 91 She filled the tub, she says.

Speaker 123 He asked me to help him put Poland in there. I try, but I can't do it.
I start crying, and I throw up in the toilet.

Speaker 90 Why didn't you pull her out of the water?

Speaker 123 At that point, the only thing I was thinking about was, how am I going to make it out of this house?

Speaker 108 Did you think Ethan would kill you too?

Speaker 113 Why not?

Speaker 123 Who else knows but me?

Speaker 113 Why not?

Speaker 123 Why wouldn't I be next?

Speaker 22 So she helped him put Kate's body in the car, watched him dump her out on Wadmala Island.

Speaker 26 And of course, she lied, she admits, when she told Ethan she was pregnant, but that was just for the sake of her own safety, said Heather.

Speaker 123 I thought, well, if I'm carrying his kid, I'm okay. He's not going to try to hurt me.

Speaker 110 Really?

Speaker 65 And so then a moment later, later, when asked why she didn't just leave Ethan, slip away like she always did, she quite reverses herself.

Speaker 123 I didn't want to.

Speaker 123 I really, I really loved him.

Speaker 39 But eventually she says she just had to confess.

Speaker 123 Conscience is a bitch, and I had a big conscience. And he doesn't.
He doesn't have conscience.

Speaker 41 And that's the God's honest truth, says Heather Camp, every single word.

Speaker 51 And then Ethan Mack is led from his cell and tells his version, which comes with a revised opinion of Heather Camp.

Speaker 89 Conniving, evil,

Speaker 89 evil, lying type of person that do anything that she can to basically get her away.

Speaker 66 Of course, it was different when Kate brought Heather around to see him that first time.

Speaker 89 I say she attractive. She ain't an ugly female at talk.

Speaker 32 And talkative.

Speaker 34 Told him all kinds of things.

Speaker 89 She told me that her son died. from a disease that she was trying to help find

Speaker 89 the cure for because she was supposed to be a doctor and told me that her daughter and her husband got killed in a bad car accident.

Speaker 46 Ethan was entranced, he said, claimed he believed everything she told him.

Speaker 63 That's when they moved in together.

Speaker 5 And each day he'd go to his hotel job and she'd head off to the hospital to her doctor work.

Speaker 89 She would be getting up, putting on her makeup, putting on her scarves, putting on her white jacket with her name that was sold in it.

Speaker 62 But Heather had another story, says Ethan, one she had used on other marks, but he didn't know that, that members of her family were violent and powerful drug dealers.

Speaker 91 And one day, he says she told him a terrifying story. Her family members had learned that Kate Waring had sold out.
She had ratted them out to police. Kate was going to have to die.

Speaker 43 And those drug kingpins decided Heather and Ethan would be the executioners.

Speaker 89 She's saying that her family damn Basley telling her that she better get rid of Kate or they're going to get rid of us. Basically, and they gonna handle my family too.
They're gonna kill my family.

Speaker 44 You believe this actually could happen?

Speaker 89 I done seen people done get beat up over five and ten dollars and done get shoot after behind less than that.

Speaker 50 So, Ethan's version of that awful night?

Speaker 89 Basically, he had zipped her up in the suitcase, and then that's when she came at me, like, Ethan, you got to

Speaker 89 kill her.

Speaker 13 Now, right

Speaker 40 then, Ethan,

Speaker 47 she's lying in that suitcase,

Speaker 44 top is zipped up.

Speaker 111 What you do as her friend is you go and unzip the suitcase and say, ha ha, okay, come on, get up.

Speaker 91 Right?

Speaker 89 No, it wasn't.

Speaker 90 That's not how it worked.

Speaker 89 No, it wasn't like that. Because it's my mother, my sister,

Speaker 89 my daddy damn at stake, too, and my life.

Speaker 68 But, says Ethan, it was not he, but Heather who smothered Kate with the pillow.

Speaker 89 I couldn't do it to her or kill her, so Heather pushed me out of the way and she jumped on top of her and started smothering her with the pillow.

Speaker 89 And I went into the room and I dropped down on my knees. And I've been like, Have me, Father, please forgive me for what is going on and what I'm kind of witnessing and let happen in front of my face.

Speaker 90 Well, yeah, you were praying, but you weren't pushing her off. You weren't stopping it.

Speaker 89 No, I couldn't stop her because

Speaker 89 as it was said, that I still was thinking that those people were going to kill me.

Speaker 42 I know, but let me challenge you for a minute because I know you're a good friend to

Speaker 77 her.

Speaker 108 Yes, sir. It's like killing your sister for God.

Speaker 89 Yes,

Speaker 89 And that's exactly what it's like.

Speaker 24 The rest of it, the taser, the wine bottle, bludgeoning, the drowning in the bathtub, all Heather, says Ethan, not him.

Speaker 6 And when he helped hide their crime, when he actually married Heather, that, says Ethan, is because she told him she was pregnant.

Speaker 71 She wasn't, of course.

Speaker 39 But Ethan says he believed her, as usual, and he wasn't about to abandon his child.

Speaker 92 Yeah, I mean, but you're married to a killer.

Speaker 62 You got married to her after the murder.

Speaker 89 Just for her to stop always threatening me with running off and taking my baby.

Speaker 68 God's honest truth, says Ethan, every single word.

Speaker 28 And now, at night, in his jail cell, how often do you think about that moment?

Speaker 16 Oh, I think about it a whole lot.

Speaker 89 Misses Yap real bad. Thought I could have saved her and always been there to save her all the rest of the time.
I wouldn't let nobody harm her. But now

Speaker 89 look at me.

Speaker 51 You're getting about what you deserve?

Speaker 42 Yes, sir.

Speaker 89 I'm getting exactly what I deserve. I know I got to do this time in jail, but still, I can't bring her back.

Speaker 89 Wherever all of the powers that I ask for and how much I ask the Heavenly Father to take my life away to bring hers back, it will not be that.

Speaker 24 No, it will not.

Speaker 57 Not for him.

Speaker 33 Not for the Warings.

Speaker 57 It was in court that Kate's father, Tom, read one of the last things she ever wrote.

Speaker 75 They had gone to church together, he and the daughter who adored him, the girl about whom he worried so.

Speaker 68 And she scribbled something on a prayer note and stuffed it in a church pew just a couple of Sundays before she boarded that fateful train.

Speaker 9 She wrote:

Speaker 9 Please pray for my father, Tom Waring, who worries himself sick and for nothing. I am and will be fine.
If I die tomorrow, I have lived through almost everything and more.

Speaker 9 And I am not afraid of anything.

Speaker 9 Just know that I pray for God's forgiveness for bringing tears to my daddy's eyes.

Speaker 124 Hi there, it's Andy Richter, and I'm here to tell you about my podcast, The Three Questions with Andy Richter.

Speaker 124 Each week, I invite friends, comedians, actors, and musicians to discuss these three questions: where do you come from? Where are you going? And what have you learned?

Speaker 124 New episodes are out every Tuesday with guests like Julie Bow and Ted Danson, Tig Nataro, Will Arnett, Phoebe Bridgers, and more.

Speaker 124 You can also tune in for my weekly Andy Richter Call-In Show episodes, where me and a special guest invite callers to weigh in on topics like dating disasters, bad teachers, and lots more.

Speaker 125 Listen to the three questions with Andy Richter wherever you get your podcasts.