Haunted

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member FDIC. I'm Lester Holt.
Tonight on Dateline, one of the most haunting cases we've ever covered. After nearly 10 years, a trove of new evidence takes us deep into a family's dark secrets.
This is me. July 29, 2008.
She feared for her life. She feared for her safety.
If something happens to me or my family or all of us. We need to find Susan.
I had no idea of how twisted, how dark that was.

He was obsessed with her.

In a really sick way.

Yes.

I talked with Susan about sex and anything else.

This was her father-in-law.

She was totally creeped out.

Do you not want to find your wife?

Yeah, I do.

Why are you making this so difficult then?

Well, it really hurts that people would try to say

that I don't love Susan.

I'm not sure that anybody said you didn't love Susan.

They were saying that you killed Susan.

Sometimes you kill the one you love. Here's Keith Morrison with Haunted She's out there, somewhere, must be Maybe here, in this desolate keeper of secrets they call the West Desert.
Nearly ten years since she vanished. And finding her is still a kind of passion or folly.
But some stories just won't let go. It is just, it's just so vast.

Really, thousands of square miles of absolutely nothing.

With somewhere out there, mine shafts in the ground, places to hide a body.

But where?

Thing was, right from the start, there was something awful, some hovering presence.

This missing woman, this young mother, was different somehow.

You could feel it here in the room with her husband.

I've never hurt my wife.

I've never.

She's been suffering.

And here, with her father-in-law, it grew, this strange feeling. There have been some accusations that I came on to her not true.
Two extremely perplexing interviews. But of course, I didn't know the half of it, not then.
Much stranger things were going on. In the story of a father, his son, and the woman caught between them.
And by the end of the whole ugly saga, an entire family would be lost. He's born in the house.
Why? Why that? We had an idea we could guess then. But now, nearly ten years after it began, the long withheld evidence is finally revealed.
Private journals, written, spoken, filmed. I'm not as good a person.
I'm rather depressed, moody, irritable when I get away from things that I know are right. Inside, private lives, hoping for redemption, but heading for health.

Inside the story of what happened to Susan Powell. Hope everything works out and we're all happy and live happily ever after as much as that's possible.

It was Monday, December 7th, 2009.

An overnight snowstorm had dropped a white blanket on West Valley City, Utah. Josh and Susan Powell's sons, Charlie and Brayden, missed their usual 6.30 a.m.
drop-off at daycare. Entirely out of character for Susan, said her friend and daycare provider Debbie Caldwell.
This particular Monday, she didn't show up, and I wondered if it was because of the snow. She called Susan, called Josh.
No answer. Called their workplaces.
They hadn't shown up. The whole family appeared to be missing.
So she called an emergency contact, Josh's sister, Jennifer Graves. This is her in 2010.
We were immediately concerned. That's unusual behavior, to say the least.
One morning, I'm sitting in my office with life going on, and it's all changed. This is Susan's father, Chuck, back in 2011.
He hadn't heard from Susan, either So I called around and no one had heard from her. Josh's mom called the police.
My son and his wife and their two children haven't responded to anything this morning. Jennifer and her mom met West Valley police officers at the Powell residence on Sarah Circle Drive.
No sign of Josh or Susan anywhere. So Jennifer gave police permission to break a window, get inside.
When we first walked into the house, there were two box fans pointed at the carpet right in front of their love seat. That was just another layer to the oddness of the whole situation.
Also odd, the couch was damp, the radio was on, and the family minivan was gone. And then Jennifer walked into the bedroom.
Her purse sitting on the table beside the bed, her wallet was in there with credit cards. Jennifer began to worry, and she wasn't the only one.

Hey, Susan, I'm just worried about you.

Yes, we're all worried.

Can I get from you?

Messages began flooding Susan's inbox.

Hi, it's just a nice week, Grace.

We love you.

I really hope everything comes out okay.

Giovanna Owings, the Powell's neighbor, recalled visiting them the day before.

Susan had called her over to help untangle some yarn. Josh was in the kitchen, making pancakes.
He kept the boys in the kitchen with him while he prepared the meal. Susan and I just sat and talked.
After they ate, Josh cleaned up while juggling the boys, so attentive. He went by Susan, and he could see that she was a little bit chilled, so he put a blanket around her.
And I thought, and that is really nice. Chilled and soon tired.
Susan went upstairs to take a nap, said Giovanna. And Josh said, the boys and I are going to go sledding.
I said, oh, that's nice, and I'm still going to stay untangling that.

And he said, well, I really need to lock the door after you leave.

And I thought, oh, yeah, I guess that means I should go, right?

So I went home.

And now, next day, no Susan.

And Josh wasn't answering his phone. What had happened to the Powell family? Where was Susan Powell? There is astonishing new evidence in this heartbreaking mystery.
If something happens to me or my family... Still to come, Susan's secret videos.
Her husband's secretive behavior. Do you not want us to talk to you? Do you not want us to talk to anybody and just leave you alone and hope that she shows up?

And her father-in-law's secret obsession...

She was totally creeped out by my dad. Susan Cox, back at the beginning, seemed primed for a decidedly sunny life.

Certainly not the tragedy it became.

Susan's mom, Judy, back in 2011.

As she grew up, people were kind of drawn to her, and she was just a happy child. Happy, and at times a bit of a handful.
I remember one time I was upset with her because she drew flowers in her bedroom wall. So I asked her, why did you draw the flower on the wall? She said, it's pretty.
So I had to say, okay, let's not draw it on the wall, okay? After high school, Susan announced she intended to go to beauty school. Why do you want to be a beautician? And, well, because that's what she liked, was making people happy and making things pretty.
But even more than that, more than anything, Susan wanted to make a family of her own. She was still a teenager when the romance began with a young man named Josh Powell at a function of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
Josh kept an audio journal back then. It's just recently been released.
And here he is describing the first time he noticed Susan. Well, I didn't know who she was.
She was about to leave. I called her back and I was like, hey, come here, talk to me for a while.
And she did. And she seemed to like him.
Even though, as Josh himself admitted, he was nothing at all like Sonny Susan. People find it difficult to remain in my company over extended periods of time.

Susan has loved every minute with me.

She loves the things that other people cannot tolerate about me.

Must have, because less than three months after they met, they got engaged.

Susan's parents worried about that,

thought maybe Susan and Josh were moving too fast. But Susan seemed determined he was her guy.
Here she is leaving a playful message in his audio journal. Josh is mean to me, but only because I was mean to him.
And then he was mean back to me, so I was mean to him more. And now he's being mean to me again.
But I still love him. I think she felt sorry for him.
He didn't have many friends. And I think she felt she could make him happy and that he would change.
She was 19 years old when they married. He was 25.
His father, Steve, shot this wedding video. Steve was always hovering around with a camera.
Seemed so innocent at the time. We're too close.
And as it happened, Steve recorded just the kind of thing that made the Cox's cringe when it came to their new son-in-law. So he was shopping for a ring, and told me it was going to be for his mom.
So I was helping him look and he was looking at this ring that I have on. Actually I paid for it so he could get an associate discount.
Hoping to save a few dollars, Josh had tricked Susan into buying her own engagement ring from the department store where she worked. He paid her back, but still.
Susan though didn't seem to worry about it, was eager to start a new life with Josh. There's my handsome husband.
Hi, Susan. I love you.
I love you. She was an outgoing, bright person.
He's less social, and so I think that probably was a draw to him, too. There wasn't a lot of money at first, so they moved in with Josh's dad near Seattle.
And private places. It would be years before the real story emerged, but for now, let's just say things didn't go well.
Which is why Josh and Susan left Steve's place and eventually moved to Utah, where, said Jennifer, they seemed fine. It was pretty good in the early years when they first came here, you know.
It was pretty happy. Susan's best friend, Kiersey Hellowell, remembers the Powells.
Then, three years into their marriage, they still behaved like newlyweds, she said. They would always be cuddling at my house.
My husband would walk by and see them kissing on the couch and say, get a room. They had two sons, Charlie and Brayden.
Stayed married for almost nine years. Until that cold December day, when everyone was frantically searching for the Powell's.
I thought they'd gone up for a drive up in the mountains and slid off a cliff, or knowing Josh, he took them on some dirt road. They're stuck in the snow and freezing to death.
Friends and family tried to reach the couple all morning, but their calls kept going to voicemail. So neighbor Giovanna had her son call from his phone.
And this time, Josh answered. And I said, Josh, nobody knows where you're at and you've got to get home right now.
Everybody's worried. And he said, OK, I'll be home soon.
Giovanna explained the urgency of the situation. I told Josh that Susan hadn't gone to work and that no one knew where she was at and he said oh I'm sure she went to work she must have gone to work.
More than two hours went by and still no sign of him. Police had asked Jennifer and her mom to leave while they searched the Powell home for clues.
Now back at her own, Jennifer kept dialing Josh's cell, and he finally picked up. For a moment, Jennifer thought maybe everything was okay.
But as she listened to Josh talking, she realized... No, it's not okay.
Susan's not with him. The boys were with him, but Susan's not there.
He said he went to pick her up at work, and

she wasn't there. Which didn't make any sense, because Giovanna had already alerted Josh that

Susan did not show up to work. Josh and Jennifer agreed to meet back at his place, so she raced

back over. And Josh did make it home, eventually.
And the story he had to tell well you'll see coming up there's this pink motorola razor flip cell phone a new clue for police and new questions for josh why do you have susan's phone and he was just like a deer in headlines you feel like you're I don't know.

When Dateline continues. I've never had a case like this where a family's missing and nobody has any idea where they're at.
Ellis Maxwell was the lead detective on the Powell case back in 2009. It's only now, now that he's retired, that he's able to talk about the investigation that still haunts him.
I was in the office and the sergeant came in. It was like, hey, patrol's out on a missing family.
We reach out to him and see what we can do to help him. Yes, sir, said Maxwell, and off he went to the Powell House.
So when you got there, did you have any indication, any inkling, that this was going to be a big deal? No, none at all. In the beginning, you're just kind of open-minded, going, okay, maybe they chose to elope with the kids and not tell anybody, and they'll be back this afternoon or tomorrow.
But then Detective Maxwell heard from Giovanna. Josh had resurfaced with the boys, but without Susan.
So he waited around for hours. No Josh.
Josh's sister Jennifer was waiting too. And when Josh called Jennifer's cell phone around 6 p.m., an inpatient Maxwell asked to speak with him.
I identify myself and say, hey, you need to get to the house now. Like, we need to talk.
We need to find Susan. Well, she should be at work.
Well, she's not, Josh. Come home.
Well, I need to stop and get my kids something to eat. Did he say where he was at that point? No, no.
And then he kind of ignored me and was talking to his kids. You guys want pizza or you want burgers? And I'm like, Josh, stop and listen.
You need to come home and get the kids fed. It was close to 7 p.m.
when Josh finally arrived home with the boys, about an hour after that phone call, and nearly nine hours after everyone had started frantically searching for the family. Detective Maxwell thought that for a husband whose wife was missing, Josh seemed oddly unemotional.
He didn't seem bothered or moved by anything. Maxwell asked Josh why hadn't he been answering his phone all morning.
Josh said he had it turned off. He was afraid of draining the battery.
However, as I'm leaning into this minivan, there's a charger plugged into the cigarette lighter. So I just noted that for later.
Meanwhile, Maxwell asked Josh to follow him to the station, answer some questions. The boys came along.
Okay, it's 1915 hours on the 7th of December 2009. I'm with Josh Powell in regards to his missing wife, Susan Powell.
These recordings of Josh's first interview with police were tightly guarded by law enforcement for years.

Do you know where Susan's at?

No.

When's the last time you've seen her?

Probably about midnight of last night.

Susan had gone to bed, said Josh.

So what did he do?

Well, Josh told the detective he loaded his boys then two and four into the minivan in the middle of the night. What time did you leave the house? Seems like 1.30 or 2.
To go camping, he said, in December in the middle of a snowstorm. Maxwell was, to say the least, skeptical.
I mean, the last thing I'm going to do in, you know, 18-degree weather is load up my

kids and go drive out to the desert, you know what I mean?

Well, for some reason, well, I know, but I wanted to try out the generator.

And what about that damn couch in his living room?

He wanted me to clean the couch, so I did.

So like what, like a washcloth or something? Actually, a cleaner. Okay, so you used the rug doctor and cleaned the couch? Yeah.
And that, said Josh, is why the big fans were blowing. Detective Maxwell returned to the main question.
Where was Susan? So where would you think she would be at? Well, I think she would go to work. She didn't go to work, dude.
Where's her cell phone at? I don't know. Detective Maxwell asked to search Josh's minivan.
And they found something significant right there, buried in the center console. There's this pink Motorola Razor Flip cell phone.
And I remember my partner saying, why do you have Susan's phone? And he was just like a deer in headlights. Josh stumbled through a story about how he forgot he'd borrowed Susan's cell phone the day before.
It's just lies. Just a bottle of lies.
If Josh came in as a witness, he walked out as a person of interest.

With instructions from Maxwell, return to the station first thing in the morning.

And then Maxwell made a decision that at the time seemed reasonable.

We discussed whether or not we had enough for a search warrant to keep the house.

And it was decided that we did not. Looking back, if there was one thing I'd do different, it'd be write that search warrant that night.
That's because the next morning, Josh did not report to West Valley PD. He stayed home, cleaning.
Recently, I sat down with Josh's sister, Jennifer, again. He was running around the house, cleaning things, wiping things down, picking things up.
Why would you do that? Your wife's missing and you're doing your laundry. Josh finally showed up at the police station nearly four hours late and said...
On the way over here, I actually did call my attorneys and they said I should definitely have an attorney. If I didn't read you, you were under a vest.
Have I? Do you feel like you're under a vest? I don't know. I didn't even think it was that.
I didn't even sink in yesterday, but I don't know where she's at, and she ain't back yet.

Do you not want us to talk to you?

Do you not want us to talk to anybody and just leave you alone and hope that she shows up?

Is that what you want us to do?

No.

At the very same time, a few miles away,

another detective was conducting a different and much more revealing interview. The person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person who is a person was conducting a different and much more revealing interview.
The person being questioned? Josh and Susan's son. Okay, Charlie.
How old are you today? Four. You're four? Coming up, newly uncovered interviews reveal new clues from Susan's own young boys.

Who were you camping with?

My dad and my mom.

Your children are telling our detectives that mom went with you do last night?

Go camping. You went camping? Tell me about camping.
Camping is like where we'll have snow. Little Charlie Powell telling a detective about that mysterious late night camping trip in the snow.
Who were you camping with? My dad and my mom and my little brother. Dad, your mom, and your brother? Yeah.
Dad and mom, which of course contradicted Josh's story that he took the kids camping while Susan stayed home. Charlie said his mom went with them, but she did not come back.
My mom stayed where the crystals are. Where what are? Where the crystals are.
The crystals? Crystals? Yeah. Your mom stayed where the crystals are? Yeah.
Okay. Crystals are things that grow in rocks.
Crystals that grow in rocks? It was hard to know exactly what four-year-old Charlie saw. But the key thing was, he said his mom went along on the camping trip.
Maxwell decided to roll the dice and confront Josh. And your children are telling our detectives that mom went with you guys last night.
And that she didn't come back. She did not go with us.
They know that she didn't go with us. Maxwell didn't think he had enough for an arrest.
So he asked Josh if he was willing to cooperate further. When Josh declined, Maxwell told him he was free to go.
You could leave any time anyways. Yeah.
I mean, let me think about it for a couple days. Your wife is missing, Josh.
Yeah, but I've always... And you want to think about it for a couple of days? But before Josh left, Detective Maxwell shared some news.
Your house is ours for right now. We're not going to let you back into that house.
Detectives had, perhaps a little late, obtained a search warrant. And while Josh was at the station, investigators scoured the just-scrubbed house of his and detected tiny drops of blood beside the living room couch.
They were about the size of a ballpoint period. And when tested, turned out to be drops of Susan's blood.
Not enough to prove anything, but more than enough to ramp up suspicion about what happened to her.

Investigators also seized Josh's computers, and that rug doctor he said he cleaned the couch with, and his cell phone. And they got a warrant to search Josh's minivan.
He agreed to wait in the lobby, and they did find something. In a compartment in the floorboard of the van is a white garbage sack that is full of pieces of sheetrock that is heavily burned from an object that he destroyed.
And that object is in there as well, but it's obliterated. It looked to Maxwell as if Josh had put something on that piece of sheetrock and then incinerated it.
Maybe with the acetylene torch Maxwell saw in the Powell's garage. He was obviously very concerned about whatever that item was.
And so, yeah, you got to think that, okay, that had something to do with her disappearance. They sent the burnt object out to get tested.
And meanwhile, hoping that Josh might lead them to Susan, police installed a GPS tracking device in the van. But when Detective Maxwell tried to return the van to Josh...
I missed him by 10 minutes. He took a taxi out to the Salt Lake International Airport where he rented a rental car.
And once he rented the rental car, he was gone. Josh disappeared for two days.
And when he finally turned up, Detective Maxwell discovered he'd racked up more than 800 miles on that rental car. Where did he go? No idea.
He could have went into Nevada, Colorado, Idaho. We never, ever found out where he went.
Josh could have done anything. Destroyed more evidence, even moved Susan's body.
They just didn't know. And however much they suspected Josh, they couldn't prove he'd harmed Susan.
So they kept investigating. In particular, Maxwell wanted to trace Josh's movements in those crucial first hours and days after Susan disappeared.
Police had confiscated both Josh and Susan's cell phones, but... Josh had removed the SIM card out of both of them phones.
So there was no SIM card in Susan's phone, and he somehow popped a SIM card out of his cell phone before we took it. When nobody was looking.
But they were able to get Josh's phone records, and discovered he did something odd that very first morning, after his neighbor Giovanna called. Data from cell phone towers placed Josh in West Valley during the call.
But as soon as he hung up, he drove about 20 miles south toward the campsite where he said he'd taken the kids. And then he turned around back toward West Valley.
And it's at that point that he calls Susan's phone and leaves her a voicemail that he's on his way home from their camping trip. Hello, Susan.
We are on our way back. And I can't work.
And Josh had confirmed with his sister Jennifer that Susan wasn't at her office. And yet minutes after he did that, he pulled up outside Susan's building and left her another voicemail.
Hello, I'm out here in front. He knew that she wasn't there, but that was part of his plan.
But for all their suspicion, they still needed proof. Detectives spoke to a long list of people, including Josh's brother, Michael, who'd come down from Washington shortly after Susan disappeared.
The police suspected he knew something, but he never told them what. And Josh kept slipping through their fingers.
Endless frustration. When Maxwell got the lab result from that object, Josh had apparently worked so hard to destroy.
The FBI gave us a report back saying that it was some sort of metal but they couldn't identify it either. And Josh after taking some time to think about it never again talked to the police without an attorney present.
But even as the investigation continued he did decide to talk one-on-one with me.

Coming up, Josh Powell tells his story.

Well, it really hurts that people would try to say

that I don't love Susan.

I'm not sure that anybody said you didn't love Susan,

but they were saying that you killed Susan.

When Dateline continues. More than a year and a half had gone by since Susan Powell's disappearance when we set up our cameras in a suburban hotel near Seattle.
By this time,

Josh was living not far away with his father and had agreed to talk to us. We'd made an appointment for a late afternoon and we waited and waited.
He arrived close to midnight, two very hyper little boys in tow, and offered us his theory. I think that Susan simply left.
Simply left? I mean, just midnight, one o'clock in the morning, just, I've had enough, I'm out of here. Was she angry those days? No.
Was she distressed? Was she upset about anything? No. Did she express any, you know, desire to have things change? No.
Did she continue to assert that she loved you? Yeah. And God knows she must have loved your children.
Yeah. She loved them probably more than she loved her own life.
Would that be fair for me to say? And yet she, at midnight or 1 o'clock or 2 o'clock in the morning that night in December, got up out of her bed and simply left, and hasn't even sent you a note to suggest she's still alive. Is that what's happened? I don't know what's happened to her.
I don't know where she is. She must have left while he was out camping with the boys, he said.
But of course, that was another question. Was it reasonable to believe a man would suddenly decide to wake his kids in the middle of the night and take them camping in a snowstorm? Those are just the kind of things that we do.
We go out and have fun. In the middle of the night? We have a habit of traveling at night.
Susan learned it even as a child. Why didn't she go with you? She didn't want to.
Why not? Because she was mad about something. No.
She was tired. And then Josh brought up a whole new idea, a nasty allegation.
Was this the real reason Josh agreed to be interviewed? Josh said Susan must have run away because of damage inflicted by her parents. She's been suffering.
She has a very low self-esteem because of severe emotional abuse as a child. He knew all this, he said, because Susan documented parental abuse in her teenage journals.
Susan's journals are clearly extremely important to her disappearance. Odd, then, that he refused to show Susan's journals to the police, even though they asked repeatedly.

And anyway... If she's alive, why wouldn't she contact you?

I think that the pressure that is surrounding this entire situation

is making it very difficult on her.

This is a very hard thing on her self-esteem.

Why would it be a hard thing on her self-esteem?

People are trying to paint her as the image of perfection.

Her parents want to deny everything about her that is real

and that makes her who she is,

whether it's good, bad, or indifferent,

she does not feel that her parents love her.

By this time, we knew a lot about Susan and her family.

We knew Josh was lying.

We asked him to describe his own loving relationship with his wife.

Was he struggling here? Tell me about Susan. We asked him to describe his own loving relationship with his wife.

Was he struggling here?

Tell me about Susan.

You have the floor.

Anything you want to tell me about her?

Well, she and I have always had a lot of good times. We have a lot of fun.
We have a lot in common. What do you have in common? Well, we're both very diligent about our finances, and we try to be diligent about cleanliness.
Of course, we have our children in common. When she loves me and I love her, we love each other.
Make no mistake, said Josh, he wanted his wife home. I would like her to be found.
I would like her to come home. I want her to see my sons.
They're her sons, too.

They love their mommy.

What do you tell them about her?

I just tell them that we don't know where she's at.

Do you worry that somebody will charge you with a crime

that will prevent you from being with them?

Nope.

Don't think that's going to happen?

Nope.

What makes you so sure? Because I never did anything that someone would be able to charge me with. As he said all this, Josh was well aware that the investigation was continuing and police might be getting closer.
This is kind of ramping up, I suppose, of the pressure that surrounds you. Why? They must be on to something, people assume.
I would think no. I would think that they're probably not on to something.
According to my attorney, the less they have on a person, the more they basically harass a person. So what you're suggesting is they're just trying to rattle your cage.

It would seem.

Are you rattled?

I'm pretty pissed off.

And then, as we talked, you return to the question of love and Susan.

Well, it really hurts that people would try to say that I don't love Susan.

I'm not sure that anybody said you didn't love Susan, but they were saying that you killed Susan.

Sometimes you kill the one you love.

Well, I never hurt Susan.

Never hurt her.

I've tried to defend her.

But was he really defending Susan? Or someone else? Susan never told me about any inappropriate relationship. My dad never told me about any inappropriate relationship.
His dad? Now we were getting somewhere. Coming up.
I talked with Susan about sex and anything else.

Did it strike you as odd that you talked to your daughter-in-law about sex?

Another disturbing conversation.

Josh wasn't concerned about this?

I didn't talk to Josh about tree. I'm conversation with Josh was strange, my interview with his dad was very disturbing.
I mean, I talked with Susan about sex and anything else. Did you strike me as odd that you talked to your daughter-in-law about sex? That's very odd, very odd, but she was very open about things like that.
Remember, Susan and Josh lived in Steve's house for a few months, about a year after their wedding, during which time, Steve claimed, his daughter-in-law kept coming on to him. Susan would come in to my office after she waxed her legs and she would say, you know, feel my legs.
They're pretty smooth. Susan was very open, and I would say very aggressive in male-female relationships, and she called the shots.
What did Josh make of this openness, if I can put it that way? Presumably he experienced that sort of thing, too? Well, he got upset about it at one point, but he seemed pretty cool with it too because sometimes, you know, Susan would want me to massage her back or something. She would, I mean, Josh would be right there and she would ask me to massage her back, that kind of a thing.
She was very relaxed around me. More than relaxed, he said.
In Steve's mind, Susan wanted him. He said he could see it clearly after her second child was born, and he would hold the baby.
She would come up, and rather than reach out and grab Braden and take him from me, she'd come up and press herself against my hands, and then I'd have to, you know, pull my hands out from between her and Brayden, just, you know. Very strange.
Josh wasn't concerned about this? You know, I didn't talk to Josh about it. I mean, you know, I just enjoyed the moment.
Yes, he said that. He said he had no idea why Susan would ever leave her kids or him, Steve.
We're on board with anybody else who says Susan loves her kids. And it's difficult for us to understand why she would walk away from them.
It's difficult for us to understand why she would walk away from her parents, why she would walk away from Josh.

I even wonder why she would walk away from me.

She and I had a good relationship.

Even though he couldn't explain Susan's disappearance,

he said he was convinced Josh had nothing to do with it.

If I were you, I would have had those dark nights of the soul, too,

wondering, am I wrong about my own son?

Could he have done that? Where do you put those thoughts, and how do you work through those? Oh, when Susan first disappeared, I was totally devastated because I was worried about her, I was worried about my son, and I was worried about my grandsons. But it was all dispelled within a week after Josh arrived with the boys.
Steve claimed he did probe Josh about Susan's disappearance.

What did he tell you?

I mean, I just observed him, and I observed,

and I would say things like,

Josh, you know, the most abusive thing

that a father could ever do is murder his wife.

You know, things like that.

And I just gauged his reactions. You were testing him.
I was testing him. I wanted to see his reaction to this kind of stuff.
And? It was good. I was totally satisfied with it.
I mean, you know, I was totally comfortable with everything he said he passed with flying colors. Investigators and at least one family member suspected Steve was covering for Josh.
So what is it like for you when people accuse you and revile you and or your son as the case may be? Well it just doesn't happen that often. I mean we know where we stand.
We sleep well at night. We don't feel any guilt for anything that has to do with Susan's disappearance.
You know we're totally comfortable with our own position. So, no, it doesn't affect us at all.
So what happened to Susan? Well, he said, he thought about this, and maybe, he said, maybe she was a thief on the land. Susan worked for Wells Fargo Investments.
She worked for Fidelity Investments before that. She had access to all kinds of private information and investment accounts.
So you're thinking that she may have embezzled? I'm thinking it's a possibility. They haven't discovered it yet? I don't know.
Or maybe she knew if she stayed, she might hurt her boys, said Steve. What if, as it seemed to him, she was on the verge of an emotional crisis? We're very, very grateful that we have two little boys that are still alive.
This is a woman that had some really deep problems. Josh has even suggested that maybe she left because she was concerned about what she was doing to the kids.
But even more likely, said Steve, she just ran off with another man. Was she leaving because she was so involved with this other guy she just wanted out? And Susan was very suggestible.
I can see that from her journal. Her journals again.
The police still wanted them. The Powell men still refused to hand them over.
But that was about to change, along with just about everything. Coming up, Steve Powell's secret obsession.
The videos never seen on network television before. This was her father-in-law.

She was cringing inside.

And later, a daring plan to learn the truth about Susan's disappearance. That was going into the lion's den.
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Escalate IQ, Optic, and Lyric. Back to our story.
She vanished nearly 10 years ago.

What happened to Susan Powell?

I think that Susan simply left.

Simply left.

Her husband quickly came under suspicion.

Do you feel like you're under arrest?

I don't know.

Her father-in-law under scrutiny, too. Did it strike you as odd that you talked to your daughter-in-law about sex? That's very odd.
Now, something never seen on network television before. Evidence of a strange obsession.
She was totally creeped out by my dad. And ominous new evidence from Susan herself.
If something happens to me or my family or all of us. Will any of this help solve the mystery? Here again, Keith Morrison.
Detective Maxwell had been trying to get his hands on Susan's high school journals for months, hoping they would provide a clue to finding her. He suspected Josh had brought them to Steve's place.

But we didn't have enough probable cause or evidence to say that these journals were inside of Stephen Powell's house.

And then...

This has divided two families bitterly.

It's put deep suspicions on Susan's husband.

My interview with Steve aired on the Today Show, and I didn't know it back then, but that video we shot proved what Maxwell suspected. The journals were in Steve's home.
Yeah, that was huge, huge, because that's what got us inside the house. If we didn't have that, I don't...
There's no way we've got it. August 2011, more than a year and a half after Susan disappeared, citing our video as evidence,

investigators obtained a warrant to search Steve Powell's home.

And there they found Susan's journals.

Pages filled with normal teenage angst, nothing whatever to suggest abuse by her parents.

Police never found any evidence of that at all. But those journals were not all they found.
Not even close. Steve, they discovered, kept a trove of videos.
They've never been shown on network TV before. They range from the mundane...
I got you the second season last year, Susan? Second season for my birthday. For your birthday, that's right.
To, well, creepy doesn't begin to describe it. I just had what is probably the most erotic experience I've had in my entire life.
Susan has been feeling ill, she had a cold, and I offered to rub her feet, to rub her toes, to give her some stimulation, and oh my god. Josh was sitting across the room on the chair, and he wasn't always watching,

so I sort of took liberties as he didn't watch.

Steve had claimed in our interview that Susan came on to him.

What the video showed was something else entirely.

He was obsessed with her.

I'm going to walk past you now.

In the video, Steve followed Susan around with a camera.

Oh move your hand, move the box. You know I just wanted to get you in that dress.
Sometimes Susan seemed to play along. Do something good for the video camera.
No I'll do this. Stop it!

Your dad zoomed in.

She did show off her leg. Stop it!

Your dad zoomed in.

She did show off her legs once. This is a week after waxing.
No hair. Other times, she seemed to have no idea her father-in-law was stalking her.
When Detective Maxwell watched the tapes, he could plainly see. There was something deeply off-kilter about Steve Powell's behavior toward his daughter-in-law.
See, I'm married good. Yeah, no kidding.
Wow. We married too.
He even recorded music about her.

I can love you in a secret way.

I can love you each and every day.

It's awful.

It's awful.

It's awful.

I don't ever want to hear it.

It was an out, I think, for him to display his love for her. Another tape captured a conversation Steve had with Susan in his car.
He didn't realize, though he'd put the lens cap on his camcorder, he'd left it running. I'm probably wrong, but I've really fallen in love with you.
For the last year and a half, you're about the only thing we can think about. We probably began to come into my office and feel your legs, smooth, relax, whatever.
He recalled the time he gave her that massage. You know, that experience on the couch.
I mean, I know that, I mean, it was a massage, right? But, you know, just being with you for two hours and holding you. I mean, I was extremely aroused, and I think you were somewhat aroused, at least I thought.
I don't know where you're going with this. I'm married to your son, and I should just be the daughter-in-law.
I know. Which puts me a step beneath your own children.

That's where I'm comfortable.

Oh, she was totally creeped out by my dad.

Did she talk to you about it?

Definitely.

Josh's sister Jennifer told us Susan felt trapped.

This was her father-in-law and she was trying to put on a good face, even as she was cringing inside. What did your dad want out of this? Besides Susan, of course.
You know, I don't know. That obsession with Susan.
It's just this sick, weird, twisted fantasy that I just don't even understand how people can get to that place. Jennifer said Susan was an innocent, Steve a sick man, determined to see flirtation where it simply didn't exist.
At that time, Susan showed off her wax legs. She trained in cosmetology.
Sure. And so that was like a focus of her life.
It was like, look, this is my creation. I have clean legs.
And of course, she's going to tell other people. Susan told Josh about Steve's inappropriate attention.
And Josh was furious with his dad. But...
But he allowed my dad back in. Steve assured Josh it was all Susan's fault.
And apparently Josh believed him. Steve wrote in his journal, Josh seemed upset with me for a while after I told her I loved her.
Now, he openly despises her.

Was that a motive?

And Steve added in another.

The reality is, I don't think Susan is upset at me.

He was still convinced Susan secretly loved him. See, we're all hiking together and I'm here too.

We're watching Friends.

Thank you. See, we're all hiking together and I'm here too.
We're watching Friends. Poor Susan, trapped in a sick triangle with a father and a son.
That's about it. But it turned out Steve wasn't the only one recording things.

Coming up, newly released evidence from Susan herself. I'm trying to deal with forgiving my father-in-law.
Susan hated him with a passion. Personal writings share her private pain.

There was definitely domestic abuse in that marriage. So much of Susan and Josh Powell's marriage was captured on video, with Steve Powell obsessively documenting his own perversions.
This is what I got Susan for Christmas. But now we know something else.
Newly released evidence that shows Susan had been doing some secret documenting of her own. Journals, emails, messages to friends.
A detailed record of her concerns and fears about the men in her life. In her journal, Susan made it clear Steve Powell creeped her out.
I'm trying to deal with forgiving my father-in-law of what he said, done. As I try, he continues to re-offend, which makes it even more difficult.
I'm to the

point where if I had fur, it would bristle whenever I know Josh is talking to his dad.

Susan's best friend, Kiersey, knew her true feelings. Steve seemed to think that Susan

was terribly attracted to him, that there was a reciprocal relationship there. That's what he

told people. Yeah, Steve was very deluded, if he thought that, because Susan hated him with a

Thank you. It was a reciprocal relationship there.
That's what he told people. Yeah, Steve was very deluded, if he thought that, because Susan hated him with a passion.
Susan thought Steve was determined to come between her and Josh. Susan would tell me, no, his dad is trying to break us up, because somewhere in his sick, twisted mind, he thinks that if we're broken up, that I'll go live with him.
Wow. But even Susan had no idea how deep-seated Steve's infatuation had become.
When police raided his house, they didn't just find videos. They found trophies.
Horrific, awful, sick things that Steve collected of Susan's, like her tampons and pubic hair and her garments and her underwear. I mean, all the way down to her fingernail and toenail clippings.
All very creepy, but not criminal. And while Steve's behavior certainly troubled Susan, newly released evidence shows she found Josh's behavior even more troubling.
I can't believe our marriage deteriorated so quickly. I feel so blind and naive and foolish.
Josh had stopped going to church, couldn't seem to hold down a job, but he did everything he could to control Susan. Even though she was the main breadwinner, he insisted on managing their money.
He told her that it was too expensive to have two vehicles, so he sold their second car and told her that he needed the van and so she needed a bike to work seven miles each way. And it was down a very busy street without a bike lane.
And she did it? She did it. And after a few months of that, myself and some of our other friends convinced her to stop because we told her how dangerous it was.
This from Susan's Facebook message to a friend. He is mainly emotionally, verbally, and financially abusive.
Basically, I'm a single mother with this guy that lives with me and dictates to me what I can do in my spare time. Ann takes my paycheck and spends the money.
She didn't have access to her paycheck. Josh managed all of that.
Josh would give her an allowance to go buy groceries. But that allowance was maybe acceptable in the 1950s, not in the 2000s.
When she was really strapped for cash, said Kiersey, Susan would call her. Begging for hot dogs to feed her children, and I would immediately be horrified and say, please come over here.
Yeah, there was definitely domestic abuse in that marriage. You had the financial abuse, and then you also had verbal abuse where he would belittle her and talk down to her.
Their relationship was structured as if the male is the dominant and the female is beneath him. Privately, Susan told her friend she believed Steve was to blame for Josh's behavior.
Anytime he's talking with his dad, I'm irritated. He accidentally swears or slips snide negative comments about me, the church, my family.
I think a lot because he's talking to his dad so often, who truly thrives on negative and seems to encourage it with Josh. But the more hostile Josh became, the more Susan seemed determined to make things work.
I'm bothered that he's not going to church and is opposite of everything I married, but I'm willing to be patient even into the eternities for him. I said, Susan, it's kind of like the analogy of how to boil a frog.
Put him in a bucket of cold water, and gradually turn the heat up until

they don't realize it, and then they're boiled, and that's exactly what's happened to you. And the way he's treating you is not okay.
How did she react to that? She was very thoughtful. That's when Susan began keeping a file folder at work titled, Josh Issues, and told a co-worker if she ever went missing, hand it to the police.
A file folder with letters that she had written. In one of those letters, about six months before she disappeared, Susan described a family camping trip in the West Desert.
So we left about four in the afternoon and started driving south. Josh got advice from some friend about a place where you can dig for geodes, crystal sparkly things inside rocks.
Crystals in rocks.

Eerily similar to the description her son Charlie gave in his interview with the detective after Susan vanished.

An unwitting clue?

Perhaps it was.

And then there were more in a safety deposit box,

whose contents were secret for years.

But now we know what was in it.

Coming up.

This is me.

A secret video and growing fear.

Making sure that if something happens to me or my family or all of us.

She was actually afraid that Josh might do something to her.

When Dateline continues. To her friend, Susan Powell seemed like an open book, willing to share the ups and downs of her marriage to Josh.
But it turned out she didn't tell them everything. Detective Maxwell discovered that Susan kept a safety deposit box, and inside it was a handwritten will.
Chilling to read it now. For mine and my children's safety, I feel the need to have a paper trail at work which would not be accessible to my husband.
The will was dated June 28, 2008, nearly a year and a half before Susan disappeared. In a margin, she wrote, When Susan's will became public and Kiersey saw it...
I was shocked and I couldn't understand why she didn't tell me that. She was actually afraid that Josh might do something to her.
Earlier, as their troubles were increasing, Josh had doubled her life insurance to a million dollars. Susan mentioned it to her friend Debbie Colwell.
I said, that's just an enormous amount. You're worth more dead than alive.
And maybe sensing she had to protect herself, Susan also left this. This is me.
July 29, 2008. A video she recorded about a month after she wrote the will, after she met with a divorce attorney.
Covering all my bases, making sure that if something happens to me or my family or all of us, that our assets are documented. Hope everything works out and we're all happy and live happily ever after as much as that's possible.
Once she asked her father, Chuck, if he thought Josh was abusive. I said, well, he's not hitting you or anything, so it's not maybe physically abusive at this point, but it's certainly emotionally abusive.
When Josh canceled Susan's cell phone, Chuck got her a new one and urged her to take the boys and leave. Why didn't she? Debbie told us that Susan, devoutly LDS, felt forever committed.
She really hung on to the idea that she was going to have an eternal family. When we get married, we believe that we are going to be families for time and eternity.
But in the year after Susan wrote the will, she did get tougher. I think the biggest change with Susan was she was building this confidence within herself.
She wasn't being submissive to Josh. She was standing up for herself.
And apparently Susan believed it was working. An email to a friend.
Things have totally changed, mainly me having more of a backbone. And in response to this, Josh is surprisingly more reasonable.
Josh became affectionate. This weeks before she vanished.
Josh said, I love you as he dropped me off this morning. But Detective Maxwell found evidence he was actually planning something that had nothing whatever to do with love.
That same month, Josh bought a roll of tree wrap and a settling torch, deep cleaning supplies, tools to make Susan disappear. It's all kind of premeditated purchases.
By that time, according to her emails, Susan was beginning to feel ill. So the nausea I'm experiencing right now and daily throughout the day since last Friday is all in my head? Then she disappeared, and loved ones wondered.
The night before, remember, she'd eaten the pancakes Josh prepared, and then complained of feeling tired. When I heard Josh had fixed them pancakes for dinner and put the pancakes on each person's plate and then cleaned up the dishes immediately afterwards, I mean, I just get chills down my back.
I just, I've seen how he treated her in the house. I've seen how much he cares to help with dishes or cooking or anything.
Which is to say, not at all. Not at all.
Absolutely not. That was so out of character that it was just, that was scary.
We have a suspicion of, you know, maybe he drugged her, poisoned her with some sort of a substance.

To find out, they'd have to find her.

And they had at least an idea where to look.

Once, Josh had joked that if he ever murdered someone,

the perfect place to dump the body would be an abandoned mine in Utah's sprawling West Desert.

The West Desert is also known for something else.

Geodes, the crystals in rocks.

Both Charlie and Susan described, it all seemed to fit.

But...

We searched and searched that West Desert.

We didn't find her.

Police needed help.

And Josh's sister Jennifer came to them with an idea.

She too suspected Josh.

So she offered to meet with her brother, confront him,

and wear a wire when she did it. What was that like? That was going into the lion's den.

Coming up...

For the first time on network television, the undercover plan to learn the truth. It was scary.
We got two. We got two.
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Just go to Indeed.com slash podcast right now and support our show by saying you heard about Indeed on this podcast, indeed.com slash podcast. Really, honestly, that's what I went to go do, was to try and get a confession.

Josh's sister Jennifer had grown close to Susan after the Powells moved to Utah,

and now with suspicion surrounding Josh, she felt she had to know what happened to her sister-in-law.

She approached me and said, hey, what do you think about me wearing a wire and going to Steve's house and confront Josh? Detective Maxwell liked the idea. We were really hopeful that maybe by her catching Josh off guard and saying, hey, we're getting a lot of evidence on you.
Like, it's probably time now that you come clean. We thought that would work.

Josh was living in their father Steve's house. Jennifer went there, knocked on the door.

So it was like, you know, fortress. They're fortressing up, protecting Josh.
And I am

walking in. It was scary.

Detective Maxwell sat in a car just a few blocks away, listening in as Jennifer and Josh talked. We've been hearing rumors.
This is the first time this audio has been aired on broadcast TV. It's just rumors that you're finding us this time.
No, I don't understand why there's rumors here. Why are you just too good? Jennifer asked Josh about the night before Susan disappeared.
What happened? What happened? What happened? What happened? What happened? What happened? What happened? What happened? What happened? What happened? How he responded and what he said to her, I think, was also telling and guilty.

He was telling her that his attorney told him that he can't talk to nobody about this case.

She's not a cop. It's a sister.
I don't know what happened. I don't know what happened.
I asked very direct questions to

Josh, trying to get him to confess. She asked him about his two-day 800-mile drive in that rental car.
She asked Josh about all that house cleaning he'd been doing the morning of his interview with the police. Who heard that right after their wife is pronounced missing? Why weren't you out working? Why are't you out trying to keep something? Why were you running around the house doing you? I don't get it.
Are you trying to cover it up? I bet that escalated pretty fast. Yeah, and yet he was surprisingly devoid of emotion even then, which disturbing too i lead it up to the point where i finally am i'm like just tell me where her body is where is she's up where is she's out where's her body did you dump it somewhere.
I have no idea what has happened to her over the years now. Direct questions didn't seem to work.
Jennifer tried a different strategy. Why is it that you absolutely refused to go to church? You said it was completely, absolutely a waste of time, and then suddenly you started going recently.
I don't understand what that was. Like, three weeks before she disappeared and you suddenly decided to go? Was that a plan? This is part of a plan.
I don't know what you're trying to say here, Jenny. And it was...
I pushed. I did.
I tried.

And then, as they talked, got in her car, and she just knew Josh did it. See you, I'm telling you.
See you, I'm telling you. She didn't know it then, but even as Steve was defending his son, he was writing this in his own journal.
I feel like Josh did a truly stupid thing and probably disposed of her body in a very grotesque way. I want Josh to be with his boys, but I'm also angry with him for murdering such a beautiful woman.
And Steve wrote something else that plays now like a terrible prophecy. That he could do such a thing once suggests he could do it again.
If things go too badly, he could murder the boys and hang himself. But at the time, there just wasn't enough evidence.
Police couldn't arrest Josh, but they did arrest Steve for something else he was doing with that video camera. He was videoing little kids out of his bedroom window into another home.
Right next door. Right next door.
Steve Powell was charged with voyeurism and possession of child pornography, and because Josh had let his young sons share a home with an accused pedophile, the court took the boys from him and sent them to live with Susan's parents temporarily. For a moment, it seemed the law had the upper hand over the Powell men.
That is, until Josh played his final card.

Coming up... I'm sorry to everyone I'm hurt.

Josh Powell's last message and his ultimate unthinkable act.

He wouldn't let me in the door.

It's just been, what do you do next? What do you do next?

When Dateline continues. We looked at the Powell boys here in the place where Josh allowed us to film them.
And our heads were full of questions we couldn't ask them. What happened to their mother? What had those little boys endured? We can't talk about Susan or Calvin.
When a detective interviewed Charlie, the older one, back in 2010, it was clear he'd seen things he'd been told not to talk about. I always keep things as secrets.
Susan's parents, the Coxes, were relieved when the boys were sent to stay safe with them. But Josh vowed to get them back and took his argument to the judge.
I'm here for the best interest of my sons, and I believe that in the best interest of my sons, they should come home and be with me. It was Detective Maxwell who provided the evidence that made the court's decision easy.
During those early searches of Josh's home, police had confiscated his computers. In one of them, a collection of cartoon pornography.
Once the judge saw that... The Cox family was awarded a temporary custody.
With the boys safely in the care of their grandparents, the judge ordered Josh to take a psychosexual evaluation and a polygraph test. Maxwell thought after two long years on Josh's trail, maybe finally he was closing in.
We were all excited. And then the judge allowed the boys to visit Josh.
A social worker was to take the boys to Josh's house, then stay and observe. But that's not what happened.
He's shorted the house. It was incomprehensible, horrifying.
Do you know if anyone's in the house? Yes, there was a man and two children. I just dropped off the children and he wouldn't let me in the door.
He had booby-trapped the house, snatched his sons, locked out the social worker, and lit the match My phone started ringing, and it was a reporter.

And he said, did you hear that there was an explosion at the house Josh is renting in Graham, Washington?

And I said, what do you mean?

And he said, we're getting reports that there's three bodies found and two of them are the children.

And I just screamed no, and I hung up on him. Right away, Kiersey called Susan's dad.
Chuck, is it true? And he said, I don't know. I'm driving there right now.
When I got there, there were police cars, fire trucks, and a line, and the house was smoldering. So I'm going, OK, yeah, it happened.
We spoke with them days later, Chuck and Judy Cox. They were still very much in shock.
So I went back to the house and my wife is there and I said, yes, it's true, they're gone. And it's just been, what do you do next? What do you do next?

What do you do next? Susan's friend, Debbie Caldwell, who had helped care for Charlie and Brayden, tried to process it. It was my worst nightmare.
I went instantly from wishing Susan was alive to wishing she was dead so that she could be there to greet her boys as they went to heaven. And into this terrible time came Josh's own voice.

One last voice. she was dead, so that she could be there to greet her boys as they went to heaven.
And into this terrible time came Josh's own voice, one last voicemail to his sister Alina, perhaps in his way, finally, a confession. I'm going to say goodbye.
I am not able to live without my sons, and I'm not able to go on anymore. I'm sorry to everyone I've hurt.

Goodbye. But why? What drove that man? How has it informed your life these past 10 years?

You know, it became an awfully central piece of my life for a long time. A whole family destroyed.
Many more lives shattered. How do you make sense of something like that? Well, Josh's sister, Jennifer, told us she thinks she knows.
My family has a pattern in it.

A pattern.

The Powell family's final dark secret.

Coming up.

This thing hit you really hard.

Yeah, it did.

Susan Powell's enduring mystery.

Do you think you'll ever find her?

I hate that question, to be honest with you, Keith. Jennifer Graves is her married name, but she was born Jennifer Powell.
She's had a lot of time to reflect on that legacy. It was a tough family to grow up in.
Yeah, it was a little bit rough. Steve Powell and his wife had five children.
Jennifer was the eldest. Josh was second.
As Jennifer grew up, she began to see her father's many deceptions, and she gradually withdrew from him and watched in some dismay, she said, as his hold on her younger siblings appeared to grow. My dad, he was really good at being charismatic and weaving those lies into something that my siblings found believable.
Sure. Were all your siblings so much under your father's influence? Quite a bit, yeah.
It was pretty strong in all of them. He could reel them all back in whenever he had to, except for you.
Well, yeah. I wasn't taking the bait.
Jennifer is the one member of the Powell family to say openly she thinks Josh killed Susan, and Steve may have helped instigate it. My brother Josh would frequently talk to my dad on the phone.
He would call multiple times a week and talk to him for sometimes multiple hours at a time, and every time, he would become more agitated and mean to Susan. And she complained about this on many occasions.
It was more than just Josh's meanness, said Jennifer. And she revealed to us a family secret, which may explain quite a lot.
My family has a pattern in it. There has been generational abuse that has not just begun with Josh.
It didn't just begin with my father. It began before that, perhaps before I even am aware of it.
It was seared into memory, she said, starting all the way back with her grandparents. They played this game they called the kidnapping game.
They tried to keep the kids away from the other parent for as long as they could. And then the other one would find the children eventually and kidnap them again and go hide.
Her father Steve's version of the kidnapping game? Instead of playing a physical kidnapping game, he played a mental kidnapping game. He twisted everything.
He tried to turn the kids against their mother and really created a strong division in the family. So when Josh was under suspicion and felt the walls closing in...
What does he do? He turns to murder, the ultimate form of kidnapping. During the investigation, Detective Maxwell had become aware of the generations of abuse that plagued the Powell's.
But Josh's last desperate act left him reeling.

I never would have ever thought that Josh would have done what he did with those boys.

But if I can't have them?

But if I can't have them, nobody's going to have them.

A year after the fire, Josh's brother Michael also committed suicide.

Detectives had long suspected he helped Josh cover his tracks and maybe helped get rid of Susan's body.

It was a degree in psychology. I went to school so that it would help me, I think, kind of understand people of his caliber and how they can do something so awful and not express an ounce of emotion.
This thing hit you really hard. Yeah, yeah, it did.
It wasn't until the beginning of 2019 that I really fully dealt with all the trauma that came from that case. This December marks the 10th anniversary of Susan's disappearance.
Officially, it remains an open investigation. And for all the time that's passed, public interest has not waned.
This is Cold. Episode 1.
I'm Dave Cauley. Dave Cauley, an investigative reporter for KSL Newsradio and NBC affiliate in Salt Lake City, recently created Cold, an 18-episode podcast on Susan's case and the new evidence he's helped uncover over the years.
It's almost a foregone conclusion that Josh killed his wife Susan in December of 2009. COLD has been downloaded 25 million times in its first 10 months.
In May of this year, volunteers again walked the West Desert, and like everyone before them, came up empty. Do you think you'll ever find her body, whoever is looking for it? I would hope, and I hate that question, to be honest with you, Keith, because the way he carried himself throughout this investigation, I think speaks volumes that he's confident that she would never be found.
The Coxes are suing the Washington State Department of Social and Health Services for failing to protect the boys from their father. The DSHS denies the allegations.
The trial is set to start early next year. And they're thinking about other women now.

Chuck and his wife travel the country to tell about their Susan,

her life, her disappearance,

and its meaning.

What has she come to represent?

I guess Susan's come to represent

what happens when you stay too long,

when you don't get out and get some help. Still think about her every day? Oh, definitely.
I know she'll be very happy that we have not given up looking for her, but also that we are turning this mess that Josh Powell created into something positive for other people.

That's all for this edition of Dateline. We'll see you again next Friday at 9, 8 central.

And of course, I'll see you each weeknight for NBC Nightly News.

I'm Lester Holt. For all of us at NBC News, good night.
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