Fallout from the Karen Read trial. The Ponzi and poison case. And for Domestic Violence Awareness Month: how to help.

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Hi, everyone. It's Andrea Canning back with the latest episode of Dateline True Crime Weekly.
Episodes drop first thing every Thursday morning, and you can also find them by searching for the Dateline True Crime Weekly feed. So give us a listen and follow the show wherever you get your podcasts.
And tell your friends. Hey, good morning.
Hey. You're listening in to Dateline's morning meeting in 30 Rockefeller Center.
What's the status of our update? Our editorial team is catching up on breaking crime news around the country. The DA said, I'd like to get this finalized.
It was technically the sanitation worker spotted and texted it to me. They put acid all over to try to dissolve her, but then they feed her to alligators.
I'm Andrea Canning. Welcome to Dateline True Crime Weekly.
It's October 10th, and here's what's on our docket.

In small town West Virginia, after a pharmacist was convicted of masterminding a multi-million dollar fraud, prosecutors weren't done. Next, she's going on trial facing charges of poisoning her husband.
The theory is that she used insulin to kill him. In Dateline Roundup, we've got the latest on music mogul Sean Combs' legal troubles and a surprise new chapter in the Menendez brothers saga.
There is a possibility that the brothers could get out. And for our safety tips this week, October is Domestic Violence Awareness Month.
What you can do if someone you know is experiencing relationship abuse. If there's something that doesn't feel right, or you've seen behaviors that don't make you feel comfortable, be a friend and ask, hey, are you okay? But before all that, we're heading to a part of Massachusetts we've talked about a lot on the podcast.
Norfolk County, home to the Karen Reed trial. Now, another high-profile murder investigation is making headlines there.
on new Year's Eve 2022, Anna Walsh, a 39-year-old mother of three, called her mom.

Twice.

She didn't pick up.

A few hours later, according to a Massachusetts prosecutor,

someone in Anna's home used her six-year-old's iPad to make these disturbing Google searches.

How long before a body starts to snow?

At 4.58 a.m., how to stop a body from decomposing.

At 5.47 a.m., 10 ways to dispose of a dead body if you really need to.

The prosecutor says it was Ana's husband, Brian Walsh, who made them.

Ana hasn't been seen since that night.

Her body has never been found, and Brian was charged with her murder. Do you understand I was charged since long? I do.
He has pleaded not guilty, and last week his defense attorney filed a motion raising serious questions about the investigation. And it's all because of its connection to another big case in the same courthouse.
NBC10 Boston's Kirsten Glavin is here to tell us more. Kirsten, thanks for coming back.
Thanks for having me. All right, let's start with Anna Walsh.
Two years ago, her disappearance was big news in the Boston area, but also in the Washington, D.C. area where she worked.
Yeah, so Anna was working for a real estate company in D.C. and she lived there during the week and then would go home to Cohasset, which is a suburb south of Boston, right on the water.
Brian took care of their three kids, which he could do because he was actually on house arrest at the time. It's a bit complicated to get into, but federal prosecutors had charged him with art fraud for selling somebody fake Warhol paintings.
He pleaded guilty to those and was sentenced to three years for them. What was the state of their marriage at this point? The state of their marriage was in a tough place.
Brian's mom had given him money to hire a private detective the month before Anna went missing because he thought she was having an affair with someone in D.C. So investigators have said that Brian was right.
The man did tell investigators that she spent Christmas Eve with him. Okay, so we have Brian reporting her missing, and we have Ana's colleagues reporting her missing as well.
And this is January 4th of last year. Yeah.
Law enforcement told people early on, the public, that Brian Walsh was cooperating with them, but they did end up searching the family home four days after Ana was reported missing and arrested him shortly after. Do we know why? Do we know what happened during that search? They did find knives, one of which was bloody.
And they also did find blood in the basement. Oh my goodness.
So were they able to charge him with murder based on that search? They only were able to charge him with misleading investigators at that point. Prosecutors said that he lied when talking about what he was doing on January 2nd.
He told them he only left the house to take one of his kids over to get ice cream. But prosecutors say investigators found surveillance footage of him at a Home Depot that day.
He was wearing a mask, blue gloves, paid only in cash, and bought about $450 worth of cleaning supplies, including a tarp, a Tyvek suit, and a hatchet. Sounds almost like the show Dexter.
It really does. It's disturbing.
This was not enough to immediately charge him with murder, but eventually they get there.

They do. At his January arraignment, prosecutors said that they found surveillance video of a man resembling Brian Walsh throwing what appeared to be heavy trash bags into a dumpster.
And then at a trash processing facility, investigators found trash bags that contained a hatchet, a hacksaw, even a Prada purse like the one Brian said Anna had with her when she left, and her COVID-19 vaccination card. We've heard a little bit of his defense as far as the Google searches.
It was his six-year-old son's iPad and not his. That's right.
He says that it wasn't his. And in response to him being at these dumpsters, he says he just got lost driving to his mother's house.
The defense isn't just challenging details of the investigation. They're also challenging who ran the investigation.
What is that all about? The lead investigator on this case was a Massachusetts state police trooper named Michael Proctor, and I'm sure that name sounds very familiar to you.

Yes.

A year before the Anna Walsh investigation began, Proctor was the case officer in the John O'Keefe death investigation, which did result in second-degree murder charges being brought against John O'Keefe's girlfriend, Karen Reed.

But her defenses claimed that she was framed and set up by Michael Proctor

and other investigators. And it did result in a mistrial this past July.
Our listeners following

the Karen Reed case may remember that Trooper Michael Proctor got into a lot of trouble for

text messages. And he was asked about them when he took the stand during her trial.

So these came from me. From all accounts, he didn't do anything wrong.
She's a whack job.

She's gross. What if any impact did that have as far as your investigation was concerned? These juvenile, unprofessional comments have zero impact on the facts and the evidence and the integrity of this investigation.
His testimony created serious outrage in this area. Michael Proctor was relieved of duty.
Yeah, he was suspended without pay shortly after the mistrial was declared. And there is currently an internal affairs investigation into Proctor's handling of the case.
And we also know separately, there is a federal investigation into his communications with other law enforcement officers. So how does that play now into Anna Walsh's case? Michael Morrissey, who is the Norfolk County District Attorney, had to notify a number of defense teams that his office had a full extraction of Michael Proctor's phone and what they found on the phone might have bearing on their cases.
Just before a court hearing last week, Brian Walsh's defense attorney asked the prosecution for everything on Proctor's phone.

And to be clear, even the defense attorney says this was speculative.

He has no evidence that Proctor did anything wrong, but he wants to see it.

Absolutely.

Walsh's lawyer was very clear.

There's no implication.

There's no evidence that they're involved in some type of conspiracy here or cover up. But we can say that Michael Proctor has been under the microscope since the Karen Reed case really came to light.
What is next in Brian Walsh's case? So there's going to be a hearing in early December about what his team will get from Michael Proctor's phone, but there still isn't a trial date yet. Okay, so much going on in your neck of the woods, Kirsten.
Thank you for breaking it all

down for us. Thanks for having me.
Up next, the story of a West Virginia pharmacist who pleaded guilty to fraud and then got charged with murder. As she gets closer to trial, what do we know about the defense? For the next 20 seconds, picture yourself in a small town.
Historic buildings, hip galleries, and a chairlift. Right on Main Street, smack in the middle of town.
Now picture yourself on that chairlift. Skis on your feet and sunny blue skies overhead.
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For our next story, we're heading to a small town in West Virginia for a complicated case that involves a pharmacist, a Ponzi scheme and possibly poison.

In September 2019, Natalie Cochran from Daniels, West Virginia, was indicted on multiple counts of fraud.

The U.S. Attorney's Office accused her of stealing $2.5 dollars from victims who believed they were investing in her and her late husband's businesses.
But it wasn't the end of the charges for Natalie, which our NBC affiliate WVVA has been reporting on from the beginning. Natalie Cochran, that name may be familiar.
She's the Daniels pharmacist being formally charged with the first degree murder of her husband, Michael. This week, Cochran was in court for a hearing as the case gears up to go to trial.
Here to bring us up to speed is Dateline producer Jay Young. Jay, thank you for being on with us.
Thank you for having me. All right, let's start by hearing about Natalie and Michael Cochran.
What can you tell us about them, Jay? Well, they were childhood sweethearts. They had two kids.
They were well-known in the community, well-respected. And by all accounts, they were the picture-perfect couple, picture-perfect family.
She was a pharmacist, but she and her husband had businesses together. Well, what happened is in 2017, they decided to launch a business, basically contracting with the federal government, selling guns and ammunitions to the DOD.
So she's going from pharmacist to providing the U.S. government with firearms.
Yeah. I mean, a crazy, crazy pivot, an unusual new chapter in their lives.
And they had invested a lot of money in this new business that they had received from, you know, friends and family. That's right.
We're talking a lot of money, hundreds of thousands of dollars. This is no small potatoes operation.
All right. So they're investing all this money, but nothing was what it seemed from a business perspective.
That's absolutely correct. Essentially, there was no business.
And it was a kind of a scam where new investors are brought into the scheme in order to satisfy the original investors. But there's nothing there other than that.
So let's fast forward to February 2019. Michael suddenly falls ill.
What was he ill with and what happened next? One day he just, according to Natalie, keeled over, fell over in their house. And it was a mystery.
Michael was 38, in really great shape. And so for him to have some sort of seizure, according to Natalie, I think initially it might have looked like, was a very strange thing.
So she called friends and family to come over and help her out. Ultimately, they got him to a hospital.
And unfortunately, he died several days later. Initially, the ME ruled that he died of natural causes.
If the ME ruled this natural causes, why do police and prosecutors start suspecting murder? Well, I think they first started investigating the finances of these two companies, and they ultimately started uncovering this extraordinarily complex scheme. Investigators believe that Michael was about to find out, and that motivated Natalie to want to kill her husband to keep him from coming forward and exposing her scheme.
Is the belief that he was involved in it or wasn't? That's depending on who you talk to. The prosecution will say they have absolutely no evidence that Michael knew anything about the scheme.
He thought the companies were legitimate. He allowed his own parents to invest in the companies.
The defense will say, of course, Michael knew what was going on. He knew exactly what was going on with these companies, and he was a party to it.
The prosecutors point to some odd timing of things. For example, on the day that Michael became sick, he and Natalie were supposed to charter a flight to Virginia for a meeting at a bank to discuss their financials, but she cancels the flight that very day.
Absolutely. They believed that it was that trip that was going to expose the entire scheme and really propelled Natalie into action and ultimately want to kill Michael, according to the prosecution.
How did they think he was murdered? The investigators discovered in the Cochran house a vial of insulin. And based on the discovery of the insulin and reports that they'd gotten from friends and family, the theory is that she used insulin to kill him.
Natalie has an answer for the insulin being in the house. She does.
She says that she was holding it for a neighbor whose son was diabetic. And she was just doing a favor for a neighbor.
There wasn't enough room, perhaps, in the refrigerator of the house. And she offered to put the insulin in her refrigerator.
Investigators thought, well, this is an interesting story. So they went to the neighbor and the neighbor said, no, we didn't ask Natalie to keep the insulin in her refrigerator.
She asked for the insulin. What exactly is Natalie's defense? Natalie's defense is that Michael Cochran died of natural causes, and she pled not guilty.
She says, I took advantage of investors. I admit to that, but I did not kill my husband.
And she actually talked about Michael during the sentencing of these fraud charges. So at sentencing, what she said is that she did this because of her relationship with Michael.
She basically said that he was having issues with rage and he would take out his anger on the family. And so she started using investors' money to essentially buy Michael gifts in order to keep him happy, and it just snowballed.
It got out of control. And she stepped down that rabbit hole and couldn't get out.
What has the reaction been from Michael Cochran's family? This is a lot between the financial crimes and now the murder charge. Yeah, you're absolutely right, Andrea.
I've been to several hearings so far, and you can see the pain in their faces at the loss of Michael. And on the heels of losing everything of their life savings, it's been devastating for them.
Okay, Jay, thank you so much. And I know you'll be there at the trial, so we will look forward to speaking with you again about this case.
Thanks very much, Andrea.

Up next in Dateline Roundup, the Menendez brothers get a lifeline behind bars. And the latest in the Sean Diddy Combs case.
Plus, it's Domestic Violence Awareness Month. We've got some tips for you on how to recognize abusive relationships.
For the next 20 seconds, picture yourself in a small town. Historic buildings, hip galleries, and a chairlift right on Main Street, smack in the middle of town.
Now picture yourself on that chairlift, skis on your feet, and sunny blue skies overhead. And now you're looking at that charming town from the top of the mountain.
Hey, is that a moose down there? If you can't wait to find out, you're the mountain kind, and you need to visit Park City, Utah. Own a 2020 or newer car or truck that's been in for repairs under warranty? You might have a lemon.
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Hey, everybody. It's Rob Lowe here.
If you haven't heard, I have a podcast that's called Literally with Rob Lowe. And basically, it's conversations I've had that really make you feel like you're pulling up a chair at an intimate dinner between myself and people that I admire, like Aaron Sorkin or Tiffany Haddish, Demi Moore, Chris Pratt,

Michael J. Fox.
There are new episodes out every Thursday. So subscribe, please,

and listen wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome back, everyone.
Joining me for this week's roundup is NBC News correspondent Chloe Malas. Welcome back, Chloe.
Hey, Andrea. Okay, so for our first story, the blockbuster Menendez brothers case is making headlines again.
For listeners who don't know this one, Eric and Lyle Menendez are two brothers who were convicted of gunning down their parents in their Beverly Hills mansion back in 1989. They were sentenced to life in prison without the possibility of parole.
But now, 35 years later, the Los Angeles District Attorney's Office recently made a big announcement. Chloe, what happened? Andrea, so the DA has actually agreed to review their sentence, meaning that there is a possibility that the brothers could get out.
So why now? So George Gascon, the district attorney, says that he is actually responding to new evidence contained in a writ of habeas corpus filed by attorneys for the brothers last year. One of the things that he is reviewing, he says, is a letter written by Eric Menendez in 1988.
This was written to his cousin, Andy, before the murders of their parents. And in this alleged letter, he writes, I've been trying to avoid dad.
It's still happening, Andy, but it's worse for me now. So basically supporting the brother's accusations that they were molested by their father, Jose Menendez.
Also, among the evidence that the DA is looking at is a sworn affidavit by a member of the 90s boy band Menudo. His name is Roy Rosello.
and he claims that he was sexually abused by Jose as well in the early 80s when he was just getting his start in Hollywood. So this really is consistent with what the Menendez brothers said from the beginning.
Exactly. They have always maintained that they killed their parents out of fear because their parents were allegedly concerned that the brothers were going to go public and tell people that they had been sexually abused.
All right. So what comes next in this? There are three options right now.
So basically, Gascon could do what I'm calling the three R's. He could re-sentence them, release them or retry them.
So we'll know more next month. Next up, the latest on Sean Diddy Combs.
So you've done some more reporting on the attorney who came forward last week, Chloe.

This attorney saying that he's representing 120 new sexual assault accusers with allegations against Sean Combs and others.

So this attorney's name is Tony Busby.

He is a well-known litigator out of Houston, Texas.

And since the press conference, which was really explosive,

he says thousands of people have reached out to his law office with tips and that they're vetting all of these accusations. And, you know, he hasn't filed any civil suits just yet, but he does say that there are some high profile defendants that will be named when they are filed.
Yeah, I mean, this could send some shockwaves through Hollywood. That's right.
I mean, the language that he used at the press conference was that there are many powerful people. There are many dirty secrets.
So we'll have to wait and see what happens on that end. In the meantime, Sean Combs has pleaded not guilty to the criminal counts he's facing in New York.
And his attorney has pushed back really hard on all these civil lawsuits filed against him so far. For our last story, we're going to go to the so-called suitcase murder that we talked about last week.
Sarah Boone was accused of suffocating her boyfriend in a suitcase in 2020. Her trial at a Florida courthouse has been delayed again.
So what is the latest? So it's been delayed because of Hurricane Milton. Jury selection, though is set to resume, Andrea, on Monday, October 14th.
I also want to point out that Boone rejected a plea deal this week. So they made an offer to the prosecutors that she could have been sent to prison for 15 years, but she's willing to see this through to trial.
She's going to roll the dice. All right.
So we'll be back next week on this case if there are no other delays. Thank you so much for coming back on the podcast, Chloe.
Thanks so much for having me, Andrea. October is Domestic Violence Awareness Month.
Anyone who watches Dateline knows that domestic violence or relationship abuse is all too often at the heart of the cases we report on. So for our final story this week, we wanted to talk to someone about what the warning signs might be of an unhealthy relationship and what you can do if you think a loved one is experiencing relationship abuse.
In 2010, Julie Myers, a former University of Virginia lacrosse coach, lost one of her star athletes and mentees to intimate partner violence. Since then, Julie has educated herself and others about these issues.
She's the CEO of One Love Foundation. Julie, thank you for joining us.
Thanks for having me. Tell us a little bit about your organization, One Love.
And I have a feeling I know how it got its name based on your connection to this lacrosse player.

So you can tell us it was a very high profile case back in 2010. May 3rd, 2010, as you mentioned, Yardley Love, the player that the foundation is named for, lost her life at the hands of her ex-boyfriend.
We didn't know what Yardley was going through. We learned an awful lot in the court appearances that came afterwards and all the conversations,

but there were lots of signs that we just didn't recognize as signs. So our foundation focuses on teaching kids, youth from 11 to 24, what the healthy behaviors are in a healthy relationship and the unhealthy behaviors in that unhealthy relationship and really making sure that you can learn the difference.
You can spot the signs, you know the signs, and then we teach kids how to have these really important conversations. So what are the signs that you should be looking out for that this is perhaps more than just, you know, spats within a couple that this is serious? So there are the 10 signs of healthy behaviors and 10 signs of unhealthy behaviors.
And what you're really looking for is, is there a pattern that's escalating? The healthy signs would be trust, honesty, independence, respect, equality, kindness, healthy conflict, comfortable pace, taking responsibility, and fun. On the flip side, the unhealthy behaviors, we have intensity, possessiveness, deflecting responsibility, manipulation, isolation, sabotage, belittling, guilting, volatility, and betrayal.
And I would say every healthy relationship does some unhealthy things for sure. But is that person taking responsibility? Are they accountable? Are they saying, I am so sorry that I just looked at your phone when you didn't want me to.
You know, I'm so sorry that I really made you do something that I wanted to do. Julie, what were some of the specific signs that you may have missed with Yardley or that some of her friends may have missed? It started all good.
Very loving. You know, it was fun, supportive, encouraging.
And then it became a little bit possessive probably in that last year where he didn't want Yardley to be friends with other people. He certainly didn't.
They had broken up. Well, he certainly didn't want Yardley to date anybody else.
So I think that possessiveness, we just chalked up to it's just how he is or it's just when he drinks. I think we gave so much of what he did an excuse.
My heartache is he had actually strangled her a few months earlier. He was mad that there was another gentleman that came to visit her from another school, and he found out, and he went, and he strangled her.
I didn't know that until after we lost her, but I don't think anybody understood that she was now more likely to die at his hands. I feel like, you know, for college students, teenagers, adults, I think the hardest part is when you do see that something might be wrong, it's tough because you don't want to get in the middle of things all the time.
How do you go against the grain and say, no, you know what, I am going to say something? We say just be consistent and be there and be caring and talk about not the person or telling the person, like, you should break up, but say, hey, when he doesn't want you to come out with me, like, it hurts my feelings, you know, how does it make you feel? So you really make the person that you're worried about see the behaviors through the emotions that it evokes. And nobody's gonna say you're right the first time and jump out of a relationship.
I'm going to say, hey, I'm here. If you want to talk today, I've got you.
But if it's tomorrow or next week, I'm here for you. One of the things that we've learned on Dateline, sadly, is that the most dangerous time can be when the person is trying to leave the relationship and they finally are doing it.
Obviously, very important to have a safety plan in place before you cut things off. Absolutely.
We also encourage people to have, no matter how old you are, have friends you could turn to, your peers, have parents or trusted adults that you could loop in and that you could ask for help and support as well, and professionals. There are amazing shelters and orgs that really help everybody with a safe place to stay if you

know to reach out to them. You're never alone.
Absolutely. And we should say Yardley's ex-boyfriend, George Hughley, was convicted of second-degree murder in 2012 and is currently serving a 23-year sentence.
He was also ordered to pay the Love family $15 million in a civil suit back in 2022. If someone you know is experiencing

relationship abuse or domestic violence, a good place to go for advice and resources is the National Domestic Violence Hotline at 1-800-799-SAFE. 1-800-799-7233 or text start to 88788.
That's start to 88788 or go to thehotline.org. And we'll put that number in the episode description.
Thank you so much, Julie, for joining us. Thanks for having me.
That's it for this episode of Dateline True Crime Weekly. Next week, Keith will be here to tell us about his new original podcast series, The Man in the Black Mask.
Even the detective was drawn in, obsessed. I was sitting there listening to his story and I had chills going up my spine.
But then, it was just a movie, wasn't it? And coming up this Friday on Dateline, after a Texas woman is found stabbed to death at home, investigators find themselves with two suspects, a confession, and no idea what really happened. And he looked at me and he shook his head and he said, she didn't make it.
And I said, Dad, I'll kill him. And he said, son, there are some things you don't say out loud.
You can catch Keith's all-new two-hour mystery, Down the Rabbit Hole, this Friday at 9, 8 Central on NBC or stream it Saturday on Peacock. Also, please check out a great new series we've been working on called Dateline, The Smoking Gun, which airs Thursdays at 8 p.m.
Eastern on Oxygen. Each episode tells the story of how detectives uncovered the one critical piece of evidence that cracked a murder case.
Thanks for listening. Dateline True Crime Weekly is produced by Frannie Kelly and Katie Ferguson.
Our associate producers are Carson Cummins and Caroline Casey. Our senior producer is Liz Brown-Koroloff.
Production and fact-checking help by Sarah Kadir.

Veronica Mazzaka is our digital producer. Rick Kwan is our sound designer.
Original music by Jesse McGinty. Bryson Barnes is head of audio production.
Paul Ryan is executive producer. And Liz Kuhl is senior executive producer of Dateline.
Okay, bye. Bye-bye.
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