(Guest) Are Fast Food Jingles Pop Music?

Support for this episode comes in part from Vitamix.

Quick kitchen history lesson.

Electric blenders, first introduced in 1922, were invented to make milkshakes.

What followed was iconic Americana, the era of teenagers in checkered floor soda fountains and drugstores, jiving to jukeboxes, slurping shared milkshakes through two straws.

In the late 1930s, Vitamix began promoting their new blenders for use beyond making milkshakes.

Soon, electric blenders found their way into kitchens across the country where they've been essential cooking tools ever since.

Vitamix reimagined the blender as a powerful, versatile tool ideal for making soups, nut butters, marinades, and, of course, delicious nostalgic milkshakes.

Vitamix's trusted versatility blends together culture, science, and history right on your countertop.

Only the essential at vitamix.com.

Support for this episode comes in part from Starbucks.

Fall is finally here.

After a summer full of beach days and backyard barbecues, those moments can't touch the best that fall has to offer.

Starbucks pumpkin spice lattes.

Embrace fall with the seasonal classic pumpkin spice latte, handcrafted with Starbucks signature espresso, steamed milk, and real pumpkin, then topped with whipped cream, cinnamon, and nutmeg for comforting tastes of fall.

Starbucks pumpkin spice latte.

Get it while it's hot.

Or iced.

Here's a special bonus episode for you all.

Last week, we interviewed our friends at Switched on Pop for an episode all about why restaurants sound the way they do and why they're getting louder.

They invited us onto their show to talk about four iconic fast food jingles and why they sound the way they do.

And we're bringing you their episode this week.

I have to say, singing fast food jingles certainly did take me back.

If you too want to have it your way or love that chicken, then you will want to hear what Nate and Rihanna have to say about them.

Enjoy, and we'll be back in a week with a brand new Gastropod episode.

Welcome to Switched on Pop.

I'm musicologist Nate Sloan.

I'm producer Rihanna Cruz.

All right, Rihanna, a few months ago, we talked about this classic tune on our live episode about Spawn Con in music sponsored content.

That, of course, is a few variants of McDonald's iconic jingle.

I'm Loving It.

This was originally written as a full-on pop song for none other than Justin Timberlake to perform, but the song flopped.

Now, while the song itself flopped, the jingle lived on and arguably is one of the most memorable fast food jingles of all time.

And we couldn't get this story out of our heads.

And we wanted to ask, what makes a jingle work and what makes it not work as a pop song?

Like, this is is something we couldn't stop thinking about.

So, Rihanna, we want to talk today about the jingle as a concept and specifically its relationship to food.

And who better to discuss food with on Switched on Pop than the two hosts of Eaters podcast, Gastropod?

Welcome, Cynthia Graeber.

Hello, great to be here.

And Nikki Twilley.

Hello, delighted to join you.

All right, Cynthia, Nikki, you're two people that know food, you study food, maybe in the same way that we study and dissect music here on Switched on Pop.

So we wanted to talk to you a little bit about this relationship between food and music.

Now, I think a good fast food jingle would mirror the sort of values of the world of fast food.

So I'm curious if you can help us understand this world of fast food.

When you think of the qualities of fast food, what comes to your minds?

Fast.

That's one thing.

Definitely cheap.

And I also think of colorful.

When you picture like McDonald's, you played that earlier, really trying to entice families and kids, and everything is very vibrant and it's very kind of catchy.

Those are some of the first things I really think of with fast food.

I mean, when you say fast and cheap, I always say out of control.

Just a little homage to Errol Morris there, but I feel like they are uncontrollably catchy.

The food is supposed to be irresistible and the tunes have to go with that.

So, you know, if the food is supposed to be you can't stop popping those chips in your mouth, then the molten lava cake for dessert and

just cannot resist the music is the same.

You know, in terms of McDonald's jingles, I still, from my childhood, can sing to all beat patty special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions, on a a sesame seed bun that will be with me for my entire life

when I told my parents that I was doing an episode on fast food jingles for the show that's what they launched into right off the battle special sauce lettuce cheese pickles onions and a sesame seed bun they sing that it's lodged in their brains and I think that's a testament to the jingle where much like the food it's supposed to represent, it sticks around.

And I feel like you can crave it in a similar way where you're like, I need to hear this right now because it's not getting out of my brain.

I feel like the jingle is the closest I've been to some of these.

Like, I didn't grow up in the U.S., so I've actually never been inside of Popeyes, even to use the bathroom.

But I know that I love that chicken from Popeyes.

So

I'm loving it isn't the only massive jingle.

So using this framework that we just established, I'm thinking, let's get into some of the most famous fast food jingles of all time, see how they wiggled their way into our brains, and try to think about how they properly represent the food they serve.

But before we do, we have to establish what counts as a jingle.

Hmm.

Okay.

An important ontological question.

So this is something I'm curious about because is that Taco Bell Bell a jingle?

It's one note.

And same thing with the description of, you know, that whole list of ingredients that were part of the sandwich.

Like, is that a jingle?

And, you know, does it have to be shorter?

Like, is there a specific length?

Yeah, that feels like too long.

That's a whole song.

Exactly.

That felt too long for me to be a jingle jingle, but it definitely is a fast food song ad.

I mean, what's the difference?

I think our definition, for the sake of this show, is going to be very loose and broad.

You know, I think the dictionary definition of a jingle is a song with a melody used to represent a product.

But for the sake of musicologically unpacking some of these jingles, a couple of which you've already mentioned, the main distinction that we have to make is the difference between a slogan and a jingle.

I'm loving it.

Quintessential example of a jingle, but something like Arby's, we have the meats, not a jingle, a slogan.

Orbies,

we have the meats.

We are looking at jingles as something featuring some kind of music.

And so, yes, for us, the Taco Bell dong

is a

example of a jingle.

And in fact, maybe that's a great place for us to start.

One of the biggest fast food chains, the Taco Bell Bell Chime.

Let's get that in our ears now.

I think it's going to to ring a bell.

Oh, man.

Brutal.

It's so funny when you hear it on its own because now it's making me think of like that Intel Inside sound.

Boom peep, boom, peep.

Exactly.

Or the Netflix.

To do.

Right, exactly.

That's what it reminded me of.

But don't those have a name that isn't a jingle?

I hate to ruin your show.

Yeah, I thought a jingle had to have words.

I thought that was like a sound mark or something or a brand sound or whatever advertising people call these things.

Yeah, I'm feeling a little attacked, you know, coming coming on our show,

correcting our musicological insights right off the bat, but I can't deny that you make a good point.

Let's amend it to jingles and sound marks.

Okay, that's that's now our purview.

Jingles and dings.

Jingles, jingles, and dings.

Oh, yeah.

That sounds like fast food.

Sounds like a pop-up restaurant already.

There's something they're missing out on, though, by not having something you can sing along to, because it doesn't get stuck in your head the same way.

The longevity of this sound kind of surprised me.

In our research, we found that the ding goes back to 1989.

We can hear it here in situ from a commercial of that era.

It don't take any basils in Taco Bell.

So come on a beagle, let's go.

I hear what you're saying, Nikki, and I wonder if part of the appeal of this sound is simply the sort of heritage that it brings to the brand, a certain sense of familiarity and maybe even comfort that people feel when they hear that sound.

That's really interesting.

It makes me wonder if you have to pick one or the other too, because listen, a bell, you can't go wrong.

You're not going to have to update it for a new audience.

You're not going to find it's suddenly not speaking to your demographic anymore.

Are you allowed to do both?

Has Taco Bell done both?

Have they had jingles as well as the sound mark?

They've had songs.

So the 1989 commercial that we just played features a full-length song that did not last the test of time the way that the bell did.

Don't take many pains to run for the board.

But that goes back to the thing, it's just it's so long and it doesn't have that like one little hook except for the like running for the border.

It's not like I was gonna say I was ready to get down to running for the border.

They got like a Huey Lewis thing going with that singer

very much.

I was like, keep more of that piece.

Yeah, bring it back.

Well, it does make me think that the longer your jingle, the more danger there is of it becoming dated.

Because when I hear that, I think, wow, that sounds really old.

It sounds of another era.

The melody, the instrumentation, it doesn't make me want to run out and get a taco for 69 cents.

Though that does sound like a good deal.

The bell maybe provides a sense of a sonic signature while it doesn't have any danger of becoming outmoded.

It is eternally sort of relevant.

And not offensive to anyone.

I mean, running for the border.

Didn't age well.

Yeah, the bell is a safe, safe sound.

Well, the simplicity of the bell is interesting, right?

Because sonically, it is a simple E

note.

And the tubular bell that we hear actually comes from a regular patch on the synthesizer Yamaha DX7,

which is one of the most popular synthesizers of all time.

It's simple, and I think it suits Taco Bell because both the sound and the food are cheap, it's processed, and it's easily accessible.

You know, Taco Bell is Mexican food for people that don't have time or access to Mexican food.

And the jingle quotes around that, because it's just a bell, it makes sense because it's a simple note from an extremely popular synthesizer.

It's similarly accessible.

Lowest common denominator of both food and sound is what we're saying here.

Right, which makes sense then.

And as we're discussing it,

it makes me realize that, yeah, not only is the sound and the food cheap, processed, lowest common denominator, it's also entirely whitewashed in the sense that this sound doesn't try and really make any

overtures to the culture that this cuisine nominally represents.

It's a very American Mexican in quotation marks, food as fast food.

And I think the sound is a like we would prefer you not to think about this too much sort of sound.

Yeah.

Like, let's not go into the history of Spanish colonization, folks.

Let's have a crunch wrap.

Let's move on to a jingle that's a lot more modern and a lot more involved.

We're moving from taco to burger and the new Burger King song.

Whopper, Whopper, Whopper, whopper, junior double, triple, whopper.

Flames real taste with perfect toppers.

I rule this day.

FBK

have it your way.

It's very catchy.

This feels to me like the type of thing that you could imagine, you know, if it catches on the same way the McDonald's one did in a few decades, people singing it the same way that I was singing the McDonald's one.

It's interesting that you mentioned the catchiness because this tune has inspired such anger, such vitriol.

There's a subreddit that's r/slash commercials I hate.

And there's a Reddit post on that subreddit about the tune with comments such as it's effing annoying.

I changed the channel.

Why anyone thought this was a good ad campaign should be fired.

Another one that says, people in my area apparently hate this commercial so much, they've gone and shut the local Burger King down lol.

So that is so funny because I feel like the, I mean, it just sounds to me like the classic type of fast food jingle, right?

It's like catchy, it's kind of silly, it's got a little bit of whatever the sound of that particular moment is, just a little, but not too much.

It's, I would say, bland, but meant to be an earworm.

And I kind of wonder like if there had been social media in the same way when some of the earlier jingles were coming out, what the reaction would have been to things that kind of ended up lasting but might have inspired really strong negative feelings at the time.

Well, it's interesting because this tune is decades old.

It comes all the way back from 1974.

Hello.

Wow, I've never heard that.

And that is, that's hardcore 70s.

That's amazing.

It's beautiful.

You hear the tune match up in the way that they say, have it your way.

It's the same in the rap.

But I think what really aggravates people is the way that the new version is sung.

Well, the new version is the kindergarten version.

It's like bat, bat, bat, bat, bap, bat, bap, ba.

Right.

Whereas the old version had some like, some harmonizations, some musicality to it.

This feels like the wheels on the bus go round and round.

Don't you feel like that's what, to me, that's what fast food jingles have always sounded like?

I think that's why it just sounded so familiar.

It sounds like those like,

the kids kind of start snapping along to it type jingles.

I mean, I understand those Reddit people because that's the only ad that gets silenced in our house.

I've never heard that ad before.

This was literally the first time I've ever heard it.

I live in a house where I'm not allowed control of the remote, mainly because I don't know what I'm doing,

but it gets silenced because

it is unbearable.

The point of the ad does seem to be to provoke you a little bit because it is so simplistic, because the voice of the lead singer is a little bit out of tune.

Right.

And I'm trying to think why they would do that.

And maybe it's supporting their slogan of have it your way.

It's like, this is very inviting.

You know, this isn't saying you need to be an opera singer to eat this food.

Anyone can come to Burger King and have it their way, so to speak.

A talent-free two-year-old is welcome.

Anybody is welcome at the BK.

And I have to say, every time I see this ad, and like you, Nikki, I see it a lot.

I always wonder who is singing this because I think it's kind of a masterful performance.

To answer your question, I did some digging, and the man that sings the BK jingle is a man named Will Crown,

who is a musician behind the self-described conscious alt hip-hop project, Crown and the MOB.

Here's a clip of their song, Love My People.

Peace to the soldiers abroad.

We salute you.

Protect and serve all.

It's beautiful.

Go off of yours, life's sweet.

Feels good having y'all across seas.

Right for the people.

That could be a fast food jingle.

That kicked butt.

I know.

So he's a real rapper.

And the way that he got in the stew to record this jingle was that he was just hanging out around where the Burger King spot was being recorded.

And allegedly, he walked in the room.

And the people that were working on it were like, hey, Will, you should give it a try.

And the rest is history.

And I find it fascinating that this is the music that this man makes.

He's very clearly a skilled rapper with a very skillful flow.

And on this Burger King jingle, it's so simplistic.

But I want to push back a little bit.

I mean, because think about who is going to be begging their parents to go to a fast food restaurant, Who's going to be running around and singing the jingles?

We may be the target audience because I'm sure, you know, it's adults who are going and buying stuff, but it's the kids who it gets into their ears, who run around singing it, who then go to their parents and saying, so you're saying it's simplistic, but

I think it's supposed to be simplistic.

Like I can sing so many jingles from my childhood because I was a kid, they caught my ear, and kids are going to sing those types of things.

The other thing I'd say is the same way that, you know, the Burger King burger is not the Michelin Stard burger, it represents a lot of ingenuity, R ⁇ D, hardcore, you know, experimentation to refine it to what it is.

There's a lot of effort that goes into simplistic as well as complicated.

Once again, Cynthia and Nikki, your descriptions make me think that so much of what you're saying could be used to describe pop music as well.

is carefully crafted, it is RD'd, it is assembled by a team of artisans working in a sort of atomized assembly line to create something that will have the most universal appeal.

So these playbooks are looking more and more similar as we go through these different examples.

And the music that, like, I would very quickly turn off, my 10 and 12-year-old nieces cannot get enough of.

So, the Burger King jingle was carefully engineered in a different way than a pop song might be in order to stick into our brains or maybe kids' brains, right?

And trigger a craving for this carefully engineered fast food.

After the break, we're going to get into two more iconic jingles and the cravings that they trigger in us.

With the Spark Cash Plus card from Capital One, you can earn a limited 2% cash back on every purchase.

And you get big purchasing power so your business can spend more and earn more.

Stephen Brandon and Bruno, the business owners of SandCloud, reinvested their 2% cash back to help build their retail presence.

Now, that's serious business.

What could the Spark Cash Plus card from Capital One do for your business?

Capital One, what's in your wallet?

Find out more at capital1.com/slash spark cash plus.

Terms apply.

Support for this episode comes in part from Square.

If you've ever tapped to pay at your local farmer's market or the nail salon or your favorite taqueria and it was a fast and easy payment, there's a good chance it was through Square.

It's the tool built for the way people actually run their businesses.

Whether you're on the go, in person, or online, Square lets you take payments, payments, manage inventory, run payroll, and send invoices.

And you can track everything from one place.

It even includes hardware that's designed to fit nicely into your space without feeling intrusive.

And the software is straightforward and intuitive because you don't need a degree to run a smooth operation.

Just set up Square and start taking payments quickly.

If you're starting a business or running one that deserves better tools, Square helps you sell, manage, and grow without slowing down.

Right now, you can get up to $200 off Square Hardware at square.com/slash go slash gastro.

That's square.com slash go slash gastro.

Run your business smarter with square.

You can get started today.

Support for this episode comes in part from Starbucks.

And just like that, we're into the fall season.

I love fall because I love watching the leaves turn glorious shades of yellow, red, and orange.

I love breaking out my favorite cozy sweaters and roasting seasonal Brussels sprouts.

We are on Team Brussels Sprout.

And of course, all the squash.

What's more, now you can enjoy one of fall's greatest traditions and that's getting yourself a pumpkin spice latte from your local Starbucks.

That's right, PSL is officially back.

Handcrafted with Starbucks signature espresso, steamed milk, and real pumpkin, then topped with whipped cream, cinnamon, and nutmeg for the comforting tastes of fall.

Real pumpkins are harvested to make the iconic pumpkin sauce used in your favorite fall drinks, like the pumpkin spice latte or pumpkin cream cold brew.

So, now that fall is in full swing, coffee lovers everywhere can return to Starbucks cafes to embrace all the warm moments that come with the fall menu.

Starbucks pumpkin spice latte, get it while it's hot or iced.

All right, y'all, let's take it down south to Louisiana for some chicken.

Love that chicken.

Love that chicken.

Love that chicken from Popeye.

Everybody loves Popeyes.

That's a classic.

Stone Cold classic right there.

I think this is honestly better tuned than the BK one and catchier.

More of an earworm for me.

Shorter too.

That's what I like about it.

Yeah.

That particular version we just heard was from 2000, but it's still in use today, and it goes all the way back to the 1970s.

And I think part of the reason we're all responding to it in a favorable way, myself included, is because the author of this jiggle is a legendary New Orleans musician, Dr.

John.

This is someone who's in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, has won multiple Grammy Awards, known for songs like Right Place, Wrong Time.

I've been in a right place,

but it must have been a wrong time.

My head is in a bad place.

So this is someone with some real bona fides to this musical tradition and perhaps this culinary tradition as well.

It sounds good.

It sounds real.

I feel like this is a smart choice by Popeyes to have this iconic musician providing their jingle.

He's a Louisiana icon.

And even in right place, wrong time, like you can hear a distinct voice and groove.

You know, that song is a hybrid of blues, jazz, funk, RB.

It has a pop songwriting quality to it.

Writing the Popeyes jingle makes sense.

Like, I'm surprised that not every place gets storied songwriters to write their jingles.

It works better.

But what you're saying is really interesting because Popeyes deliberately still plays up its Louisiana connection.

You don't find Burger King being like, oh, we're from wherever they're from or McDonald's.

No one can tell you where that was founded.

And they don't want you to know.

That's not something they want you to think about.

So I do feel like Popeyes is...

playing off a culinary connection and trying to almost get some of that sort of aura of, oh, we all know Creole Cajun food is good.

That transfers onto your perception of Popeyes, maybe by playing on that Louisiana connection.

So it makes sense for them to get a jingle that ties into that and helps reinforce that message.

I have a question, though, for Nate, which is, he did a great job with a jingle that has stuck with all of us for decades, right?

Love that chicken from Popeyes.

You know, that's just, it's classic.

Is it really every musician who's going to be able to take their their skills at writing a full song, write a hook that's maybe four or five words, four or five notes, can be transformed into different things over the decades and really works?

Cynthia, I think that's a great point.

You know, when I think about New Orleans culture, it's really mirrored in the kind of music that Dr.

John makes.

And even as silly as this is, we could take this Popeyes jingle and break it down a little bit.

Love that chicken.

Love that chicken.

I mean, there's all these different elements.

The rhythm is drawn from the Latin history of New Orleans as this port city with access to the Caribbean.

It's got this syncopated tricillo rhythm.

The piano lines that we hear are drawn from the African-American tradition of jazz, which New Orleans was one of the most important spots of development in the United States.

And then the vocal melody is like part of this blues gospel tradition, which was popular throughout the southern United States.

So in just this small snippet of music, you can hear a lot of like complex cultural history.

I'm sure some of which is mirrored in the kind of cooking itself, which brings together all these diverse influences.

I'm not saying that like any popeyes location is uh is carrying the torch for the the great uh you know creole cajun culinary traditions but certainly they're trying to mine that in order to get people in the door 100 yeah i think that's a sort of positive aura to be associated with for them um even if the fried chicken which i have not tried wouldn't necessarily live up to everything promised by that but um people really you know people love popeyes so like the song they really

do i love that chicken from popeyes me

i get the sense that even though fast food is something that is maligned and not really taken seriously and criticized it's also something that people have a really strong emotional connection to.

Cynthia and Nikki, where do you think that comes from?

Well, I mean, we've done some reporting on fast food.

In general, we focused on McDonald's.

But if you think about people's childhood, you know, where they grew up, where they went with their parents, where they went after school or after sports or a theater or whatever, you know, this was a place, both in cities and in the suburbs, these were places that kids could go and hang out.

And so I think that there's...

you know, a really strong connection that lasts because of that.

So it just has, I think no matter matter what, whether you like the food or not, or whether it's a place you go to frequently or not, I think it really plays into a strong emotional tug for a lot of Americans because of that.

It's a place of comfort when you're a kid.

It's always the same.

That is very comforting, deeply comforting in a world that is not always the same and that is changing very fast when you're a kid.

And then that there aren't that many places where people are like, yeah, let's have a crowd of teenagers hang out.

And not that many places where teenagers can afford to hang out.

And so fast food places often fit that bill.

And having those two experiences, you can imagine it gets sort of burned into you that sort of loyalty, which is why people then still have strong feelings and strong cravings and that kind of proustian feeling of coming home almost when they do taste these flavors.

Those feelings paired with a spot like Popeyes, right?

Which prides itself on its home-style cooking.

It's bringing together all of these memories.

I like it.

Support for this show comes from Nike.

No matter the team, no matter the ranking, every season starts with the same goal, win it all.

And Nike knows that reaching for that goal starts long before the final whistle.

It starts with the battles at practice, the losses that keep you up at night, and everything in between.

Nike has the best gear to get you on the court, field, or track and pushing through the hardest moments.

So whether you're the champ or you're looking to knock them off the pedestal, Nike is there to help you with winning no matter where you play.

Visit Nike.com for more information.

And be sure to follow Nike on Instagram, TikTok, and other social platforms for more great basketball moments.

This message is brought to you by Apple Card.

Each Apple product, like the iPhone, is thoughtfully designed by skilled designers.

The Titanium Apple Card is no different.

It's laser-etched, has no numbers, and it earns you daily cash on everything you buy, including 3% back on everything at Apple.

Apply for Apple Card on your iPhone in minutes.

Subject to credit approval, AppleCard is issued by Goldman Sachs Bank USA, Salt Lake City Branch.

Terms and more at Applecard.com.

This episode is brought to you by Progressive Insurance.

Do you ever find yourself playing the budgeting game?

Well, with the name Your Price tool from Progressive, you can find options that fit your budget and potentially lower your bills.

Try it at Progressive.com.

Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and Affiliates.

Price and coverage match limited by state law.

Not available in all states.

All right, Rihanna, take us home.

All right, we're gonna end on a high note here: the jingle to end all jingles,

the Chilies Baby Back Ribs song.

I want my baby back, baby, back, baby back, baby, back, baby, back, baby, back, baby, back, I want my baby back, chili.

I want my baby back, chilies, baby, back ribs.

Barbie can soul, I want my baby back, chili.

Short, sweet, to the point.

Love it.

That barbecue sauce line there.

Beautiful.

Yeah.

Another stone cold classic.

That's from 1997.

And Chili's, of course, is a fast casual joint.

It's making me wonder in its competitor league, like Sizzler, or are there other catchy jingles?

Or is Chili own this space?

I don't know.

TGIs?

I don't think TGIs has a jingle.

I don't think Applebee's has a jingle.

I can't think of him.

It's interesting.

And this jingle, the Baby Back Ribs jingle, is catchy.

It was named the number one song Most Likely to Get Stuck in Your Head by Ad Age in 2004.

And the jingle, rather than being created by an established musician or somebody in the industry, This one was created by a man named Guy Bomerito, who was the executive creative director at an Austin-based ad agency in the 90s.

This goes along with what I was saying earlier, that I really think that it can be kind of a different skill to get that right, you know, the hook and the earworm and the length that it takes that kind of ad brain, you know, in addition to the music brain.

Also, I'm curious about this one because it's really about baby back ribs.

It's not about chilies.

Like I feel as though When I think about chilies, there's a vast menu.

Whereas this is giving me the feeling that I'm going there for ribs.

And so I am curious if that's something they've had to fight, if that's something they've played into.

You know, the way that like red lobster, it's not just lobster.

They have to sort of always work with that as both a sort of plus and a minus for how people think about them.

So I wonder if Chili's has found that this plays well for them because it does sort of pin you down in a carnivore mode.

Yeah.

This song, I think, has come to stand as a larger representation

of Chili's.

This song is Chili's legacy.

The song has a life of its own.

It's been featured in media like The Office and Austin Powers.

Chili.

And ironically, one person who doesn't think much of the Chili's jingle is Guy Bomerito, the guy who wrote it.

In interviews, he's called jingles the lowest common denominator form of advertising, that they were quote unquote typically annoying and unpleasant.

He said he wrote the chili jingle in five minutes and didn't particularly enjoy writing it, and the jingle just took off.

That is hysterical.

Yeah.

It's his legacy.

Literally, what else has guy Bomerito done?

Sorry, my friend.

He's the baby back ribs guy.

Yeah.

Can you imagine being known for something you did in five minutes and kind of regret?

Yeah.

So like I said, said, the jingle has a life of its own.

People liked the original so much.

A later version was retracked by four musicians.

Three of them provided backup vocals for Michael Jackson.

And one of them, the guy who sings the famous barbecue sauce line, he was the Temptation's lead singer in the 70s.

Wow.

So there is a litany of musical talent contributing to this jingle.

And there's a video of the four of them in the studio.

That's one of my favorite YouTube videos of all time.

Barbecue sauce.

Exactly.

Sauce.

Sauce.

Sauce.

Barbecue sauce.

Sauce.

Barbecue sauce.

Barbecue sauce.

Sounds great.

So much better.

Barbecue sauce.

I have to say, it's interesting that you say that because the jingle and the singing really reminded me of old, you know, I was wondering when it was going on, like what year it was created.

And it reminded me of music in the late 80s and even going back to the 70s.

Like there's a sound to it that's, I wouldn't want to say timeless because that's obviously not true, but it, it isn't one particular moment in time.

There's a bunch of different moments in time that it could be.

It seems like an example of how,

even though these fast food restaurants are these carefully corporatized and planned entities, these jingles can sort of expand in ways that maybe the company itself couldn't predict.

And I think that they even retired this in 2006, you know, possibly because of what you were saying, Nikki, that it was sort of diminishing chilies into just the baby back rib,

you know, place.

And yet they discovered that people were so enamored with it that they had to bring it back just three years later.

So the image, I guess, that they wanted to portray was sort of out of their hands at a certain point.

That's an interesting thing that happens with fast food, though, like that sort of fan dynamic where you get Taco Bell that I think is being one of the best at embracing this, where it will bring in, you know, crossovers and fan-inspired mashups, and those become hugely popular menu items.

It's very difficult, I think, for a fast food place that is so built around control, and you have to be built around control to deliver that many identical meals at that pace, at that scale.

To have that flexibility to then also go with your fans to where they're going.

So I could see how they're trying to control the message, and then baby back ribs get away from them.

It's good that they were able to sort of embrace that and play with it because it's tough for a corporation.

All right.

We have gone deeper into these four jingles than perhaps anyone has, or frankly, should.

And if we zoom out now, I'm curious to get your insights on a more sort of moral and ethical judgment of these jingles and their respective fast food brands.

Because as we saw with the Burger King example, for instance, people hear certain jingles and they have a really negative reaction.

And I think that's true of fast food in general.

It's perceived as processed, exploitative, destructive for the world and society, perhaps, even.

And yet, as we've seen, people also have these profound connections and even love for these fast food brands.

As people who spend a lot of time thinking about food and its role in culture and society, how are we supposed to judge fast food?

Is it something we can just dismiss and sort of wish away from the earth like we might an annoying jingle?

Or is it something that we have to sort of reckon with and acknowledge and even find ways to love?

Well, I would say we can't ignore it, right?

It's too big to just say it's bad and forget about it.

I'm going to take one example, which is, you know, there was a big issue with tomatoes in Florida and the condition of the workers.

And to make the condition of the workers better, they had to try to get fast food companies on board with paying like a couple of cents more.

And not every company agreed to go along with it, but this was a huge movement.

And often to get change in the food system, you have to go with big players.

And they're just a big player.

Like we can't say, oh, it's it's horrible, it's destructive, you know, all the processed food and all the all the meat from these big factory farms and we're just going to ignore it and it's bad.

On some level, it does have to be engaged with.

And I don't know, really know how to bring that back to music.

I mean, the music is just something that you can't help but engage with.

I mean, I think that's what we've been saying.

It sticks with you.

It catches you.

It just sort of helps complexify this issue of good and bad.

I think, you know,

it's not as easy as it looks.

Well, it's interesting that you say that because much like fast food, jingles exist in this kind of gray area.

Despite them being musical, they're not the same as a pop song.

And I think a jingle, because of its association with fast food, can also be seen as cheap and processed and not worth any musical merit.

But similar to fast food, maybe a jingle is okay to consume in moderation, much like a whopper or a Big Mac.

You know, you can have it every now and again.

It can make you smile.

And at the end of the day, what's better than that?

I love jingles.

I think they're awesome.

They just, they make me laugh.

What's better than that?

Totally.

Cynthia, Nikki, thank you so much for stepping out of your gastropod world for a moment to come discuss jingles with us.

I don't think I'll hear a Burger King, Taco Bell, Popeyes, chilies jingle the same, and I'll probably never eat this food the same way again.

So we really appreciate you joining us today.

Thanks for having us.

This was super fun.

They're all stuck in my head now, too.

I hope you're putting a warning at the top of this show.

Totally.

Switched on Pop is hosted by me, Nate Sloan, and my erstwhile partner Charlie Harding.

We are produced by Rihanna Cruz.

Art Chung is our editor and Brandon McFarland is our engineer.

Iris Gottlieb does illustrations and Abby Barr does community management.

Our executive producer is Nashat Kirwa.

We're a member of the Vox Media Podcast Network and a production of Vulture.

You can find more episodes of our illustrious show at switchedonpop.com or anywhere you get your podcasts.

And you could find Cynthia and Nikki's podcast, Gastropod.

Similarly, anywhere you get your podcasts and on gastropod.com.

We are also on social media at switched on pop.

Hit us up.

Tell us what your favorite jingles are.

We'd love to hear them.

We'll be back next week with a brand new episode.

And until then, thanks

for

listening.

Listening!

Support for this show comes from Capital One.

With the VentureX Business Card from Capital One, you earn unlimited double miles on every purchase.

Plus, the VentureX Business Card has no preset spending limit, so your purchasing power can adapt to meet your business needs.

Capital One: What's in your wallet?