Trump exempts smartphones and computers from tariffs

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This is the Global News Podcast from the BBC World Service. I'm Paul Moss, and in the early hours of Sunday the 13th of April, these are our main stories.
Electronic goods are exempted from Donald Trump's list of tariffs? Is it another climb down? And as the

president's negotiators begin nuclear talks with Iran, we assess their chances of success.

Also in this podcast, Melinda Gates, former wife of Bill, tells us about her latest campaign.

I felt that I didn't want to live in a world where my two beautiful granddaughters, where they had fewer rights growing up than I had. We start this edition of the podcast with a bit of good news for beleaguered American tech companies.
Smartphones, computers and other electronic goods are to be exempted from Donald Trump's tariffs. It's the weekend and stock markets are closed, but it's a fair bet that shares in businesses like Apple will be on the rise come Monday morning.
Now, if you bear in mind that the White House had at one time insisted there'd be no special pleading for particular sectors of industry hit by the tariffs, then this news does sound like a major concession. So I asked our North America correspondent David Willis in Washington why Donald Trump appeared to have changed his mind.
I think it is a sign of the fact that the White House had become aware that the American consumer was going to be the first to feel the pain of these tariffs in the short term, at least,

on high-tech products such as smartphones, computers, flat-screen televisions, flash drives, memory cards, and so on. The sort of consumer electronic goods that are very popular here in the United States, and the bulk of which, of course, are made in China.
Apple, for example, makes an estimated 80% of its iPhones in China

and the Trump administration's 145% tariffs on Chinese imports threaten to raise the cost of a $1,000 iPhone by, according to some analysts here, about a quarter. That means then that effectively he's not only making a concession on goods, he's making a concession to China, isn't he? Absolutely.
And I think the very fact, Paul, that this announcement came late on a Friday evening, not in a statement from the White House or the United States Commerce Department, but in a notice issued by the US Customs and Border Protection Agency, is a pretty strong suggestion that all this amounts to a concession that the White House wasn't particularly keen to draw attention to, not least because it will be seized on by opponents as a capitulation, as a sign of a softening of those tariffs on China, as you were just mentioning, and a departure, of course, from Mr. Trump's stated desire to revitalise American manufacturing industry and bring production of products such as smartphones and computers back here to the US.
Briefly, David, as well as China, we know that Donald Trump's close to people in the world of tech. Is it also that they managed to have a word in his ear and get him to change his mind.
He is close to many of the key figures in the tech world.

You're absolutely right. And many of those companies have gone to great lengths to try to woo the president and to keep on his good side.
I mean, Apple, for example, recently announced plans to invest about $500 billion in the United States over the course of the next four years. years.
And these exemptions will be taken as an indication that Americans not only can't live without these products, but that they need them. And therefore, I think we'll see a rebound in shares in these companies when the stock markets open again on Monday.
David Willis in Washington. When Donald Trump first unveiled his global trade tariffs, there were a variety of reactions from political leaders around the world.
But one of the more nakedly angry came from the president of France. Emmanuel Macron called the tariffs brutal and unfounded, and he urged French businesses to stop investing in the US.
But in many ways, Monsieur Macron was merely continuing a long-standing tradition of French resentment towards its sometime ally across the Atlantic. Our Paris correspondent, Andrew Harding, has been sniffing around to hear what people in France make of the latest stage in what's always been a love-hate relationship.
It is a gorgeous day here in Paris. I'm standing outside the Louvre Museum beside the glass pyramids, and I am hunting for American tourists.
Barbara Wilson. Rick Wilson.
We're old people. What are you feeling today about the way Americans are being perhaps looked at, perceived here? We're sick about it.
We didn't vote for Trump. We're upset about the tariffs.
You've taped over something. What's that? It's a flag.
The American flag. You've taped over that on your cap.
Yes. So you're here in disguise then.
Yes. You feel that's necessary or is it a bit of a joke? Oh no, everybody's been nice to us.
I should stress there's no sign that American tourists are being mistreated here in France, but the fact is the French are sounding angry and disillusioned. Amandine Chatelier is a commercial buyer of French wines for the US market.
It's not just my job, it's people jobs and winemaker waking up at 4am and making wine in an entire country, in entire Europe and continent. And already travel to the US this year is predicted to drop by almost 10%.
A new opinion poll is showing 73% of French people no longer see Washington as an ally. I've come to see Philippe Glorgen, who is the publisher of France's most famous travel guides, Le Routard.
And interestingly, it turns out within the last few weeks, sales of his American guide have dropped drastically. Right now, the bookshops buy 25% less on the United States.
I am very proud of my customers. When there is a dictatorship in a country, our readers don't want to go there.
In recent weeks, French universities have begun offering safe haven to American colleagues who are losing their jobs. French students are being advised not to take personal computers to the US in case they're searched at immigration and found to contain anti-American messaging.
But in a busy Parisian cafe, I found one man confident that all would be well. Hello, I'm Nicolas Conquer.
I'm a French-American citizen. I'm based in Paris, and I'm the spokesperson for Republican Overseas in France.
What Trump is doing, he's doing it for the American people first, so there might be a short campaign for a longer-term benefit. I'm still reminding people that France and the US have

been the oldest allies. So where is all this heading? The French still adore America,

its culture, its cinema. But perhaps the old Serge Gainsbourg song,

I Love You, Nor Do I, captures the growing ambiguity of today's transatlantic relationship. Andrew Harding in Paris.
The last time the US signed a nuclear deal with Iran, it took about two years to negotiate. But with perhaps characteristic impatience, President Trump has insisted that the latest attempts at a deal must be completed in just two months.
And time pressures aside, these negotiations are in any case a knotty affair. For a start, it's not clear what the US is looking for.
A complete dismantling of Iran's nuclear program, more thorough inspections perhaps. As for the Iranian side, we know they want to see sanctions lifted, but how much freedom to trade will they demand? Well, the two sides sat down for an opening round of talks in the Omani capital, Muscat.
The White House says they were positive and constructive. And as I heard from Parham Kobedi from the BBC's Persian service,

there were similar comments from the Iranian side. The Iranian delegation is headed by the

Iranian foreign minister, Abbas Arochie. He said that the talks were constructive and

Americans showed that they're willing to reach a fair deal. During the meeting, I think we came

very close to a basis for negotiations. At our next meeting, if we can finalise that basis,

Well, I think it came very close to a basis for negotiations. At our next meeting, if we can finalise that basis, we'll have gone a large part of the way.
Iranians are saying that the talks are through intermediaries held indirectly. However, the Americans insist that it's direct negotiations.
But Iranian foreign minister acknowledged that the two delegations met after the negotiations and they chatted briefly. But he said it was because of the diplomatic courtesy.
But this shows because Iranian hardliners have put a lot of pressure on Iranian delegations not to talk directly or release any photos or take part in any photo ops with the American delegations. Are we any clearer as to what the United States is hoping to achieve in these negotiations? What is its end goal? So the messages have, US has been sending really mixed messages.
At first, they included also the Iran's missile program and its regional influence. Well, Iran's regional influence has been diminished in the past few months anyway.
But in the past few days, Donald Trump has been saying that Iran only should not have a nuclear bomb and we should be 100% sure that they cannot have that capability. But Israelis, on the other hand, are saying that we are looking for a Libya model in Iran, which means getting rid of the entire Iranian nuclear facility.
It seems that it's Iran's red line. So positive signs from the opening day of negotiations.
What happens now? So next week, there's going to be another round of talks. However, there is some ambiguity because Iranian foreign minister said that, again, Oman is going to host the talks, but in a different location.
However, he did not mention different location means elsewhere in another country, but Oman is going to be the intermediary still, or it's different locations just in the same country in Oman. We don't know that yet.
Parham Gobedi. Our chief international correspondent, Lise Doucette, reported extensively on negotiations which led to the previous nuclear deal known as the Joint Comprehensive Plan of Action.
That eventually succeeded, but President Trump later pulled the US out of the agreement. And the experience of seeing those negotiations, she says, leaves her with a certain amount of scepticism about the prospects for agreement this time round.
The negotiations of last time underline just how long and arduous the path is to reach what will be a very complicated nuclear deal and bear in mind that Iran's program now is significantly more advanced. It's now said to be a threshold nuclear power than when those extensive negotiations took place in 2013 and 14, leading to the Iran nuclear deal of 2015.
But there is also a sense that they can perhaps build on that experience. It all depends on whether they can agree what the final goal is.
As you heard from Param, if it is just about a deal to limit Iran's nuclear program, to verify it in exchange for sanctions relief, that's possible. If it's to dismantle the program, the talks will fail.
Lise Doucette. She was for many years one half of the most wealthy couple in the world.
Melinda Gates divorced her husband Bill four years ago, but has continued to play a prominent global role, not least perhaps because she retained many billions of dollars, which she's continued to hand out to worthy causes. But now Ms.
Gates has joined the political fray, claiming that her granddaughters have fewer rights than previous generations of female Americans. She was speaking as she launched a new book the next day.
My colleague Emma Barnett asked whether she now has a bigger job to do in America than she previously thought. Absolutely.
And it's part of the reason I stepped out of the foundation. I felt that I didn't want to live in a world where my two beautiful granddaughters, where they had fewer rights growing up than I had.
And are you talking specifically about abortion rights or are you talking about other things in America as well? Both. I'm talking about reproductive rights across the spectrum.
I believe a woman should decide whether and when to have a child. But also I believe we need to get women further in society.
We need more women in our state legislatures, more women in Congress. When we reach those points, women make different policy than men because they have a different lens on society.
Did you watch the inauguration of Donald Trump? I watched it after the fact. You were a big backer of Kamala Harris.
What did you make of some of those tech billionaires who I imagine you've met over the years standing behind him on that day. I was disappointed to see that, as you can imagine.

I think we have to stand up for our values in society.

So it has me asking myself, what are those people's values?

We have to stand up for what we think is right.

Having sat in many ways on the front row of the evolution of digital and the Internet,

are you remorseful about how the Internet has grown up and what it's done and what it's doing?

Well, I think it's had unintended consequences that maybe weren't part of the origination of it or the goals setting out. But certainly, like the adolescent mental health numbers in our countries, you can't believe them.
And so it's incredibly disheartening to see that. And I think we need to make changes so that our children aren't in these situations where they're being bombarded online with messages that don't make sense or that cause them to feel worse about themselves, not better.
Do you trust those technology bosses to do that? I think you always need to have regulations alongside business, smart regulations that help tamper the business interest. I totally believe in capitalism.
I'm a beneficiary of capitalism, but it doesn't work perfectly. We have a lot of gaps in society, and that's what I try and work on with philanthropy.
But you have to have government regulation because a business is always trying to reap more profits, you know, satisfy its shareholders. That is government's role that we need more regulation.
Melinda Gates speaking to my colleague, Emma Barnett. Still to come, the three Scottish brothers aiming to row across the Pacific with an interesting choice of onboard luggage.
We're actually taking three musical instruments. So Jamie plays the bagpipes, Ewan plays the guitar and I play the accordion just so we can arrive in Sydney with hopefully some style.
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Together we got here in Gaza to evacuate again after we returned back to our villages. This is not the meaning of stability that we were searching for a long time.
So right now, all the time, the drones are in my background. So this is something causing a lot of noisy for me from my

psychological um and mental mental health and i think one of the rockets right now is falling

down oh my god today is really hard today is really hard in the city uh right now you know

like the planes um the israeli planes are attacking my city from everywhere because they were warning

the people uh to evacuate i right now i think they're attacking so heavily for more than one

Thank you. The Israeli planes are attacking my city from everywhere because they were warning the people to evacuate.
I think they're attacking so heavily. For more than one month recently, they did not allow any of the trucks of food or water to be reaching Gaza.
Thousands of trucks are waiting right now, the permission in order to reach Gaza. But today they're talking about a very happy news, which is next Tuesday, maybe it's going to be returning back to its normal operation.
I mean, the Karmab-e-Salam corridor is going to be up and again in front of thousands of trucks. Imad Kudaiha from Khan Yunis.
A US immigration judge has ruled that a student who led pro-Palestinian protests at Columbia University in New York last year can be deported. The 30-year-old Algerian-born Palestinian Mahmoud Khalil was detained more than a month ago after the Trump administration claimed his activism was anti-Semitic.
Mahmoud Khalil denies that and says he's being persecuted for criticizing the Israeli government and the war in Gaza. Well, Daniel Lippman is a reporter for the Politico News website in Washington, and he's been telling Rebecca Kesby more about Mahmoud Khalil's case.
His legal team is expressing outrage, saying this is basically fake due process, that this judge works for the executive branch of the US government run by President Donald Trump. The judge in this case is not someone who is an independent actor as much.
And so they could be fired if they ruled against Khalil. We've seen that across the federal government, where people who go against what Trump wants, they have to find a new paycheck.
And so there are competing claims in a federal court in New Jersey, where Khalil could get a reprieve. So the case is not over just yet.
Okay, so there could be a mechanism to appeal it then. But I mean, we've heard from the Secretary of State, Marco Rubio on this case, claiming that Khalil could have adverse foreign policy consequences.
Can't the word of the Secretary of State alone be enough to deport him? It could very well be enough. And so this case may eventually get to the Supreme Court if there's competing rulings in the lower courts.
And so this is a landmark case because usually the federal government has not tried to deport people who did not commit any crime. And so what Marco Rubio is saying is that Khalil, by protesting against the Israeli occupation and the Israeli offensive in Gaza after October 7th, that he was being anti-Semitic and he did not have a right to do that.
What Rubio is saying is that it's a privilege to study at top universities in the United States and that people should just focus on their classes and not get involved in politics. Well, right.
And the administration has said that Mr. Khalil was leading anti-Semitism and making Jewish students on campus feel unsafe.
He's denied all of that, of course. What's also interesting is Mr.
Khalil has written from detention a piece seeming to blame the University of Colombia itself. He says they laid the groundwork.
What does he mean by that? Columbia has had their federal funding, I think $400 million in federal research funds that were suspended from the Department of Education and other parts of the US government. And so they have kind of started to cooperate with the Trump administration because they want to unfreeze that money.
And so they have put in new policies against people masking themselves when they are protesting and other ways to crack down on these protests. And so Khalil is saying that Colombia has not shown a backbone and that they are not backing their students and that it's sending a dangerous signal.
Daniel Lipman, a reporter with the Politico News website in Washington. In areas of Ukraine currently under Russian control, residents have described to the BBC a climate of fear, where expressions of Ukrainian identity can lead to severe repercussions.
Even private conversations, they say, can put them at risk, as Vitaly Shevchenko reports. This is a Russian army recruitment advert broadcast by a Russia-run TV station in the occupied Ukrainian town of Melitopol.
Propaganda like this is part of Moscow's efforts to stamp out Ukrainian identity in occupied areas. However, many of the locals are resisting Russian rule and long for a return to Ukraine.
Maria, not her real name, uses a Ukrainian proverb to describe the danger she's facing. There is a saying here, you have fear in your eyes, but your hands are still doing it.
Of course it's scary. Russians are trying to forbid here everything that is Ukrainian, language and also traditions.
Even Ukrainian holidays are forbidden. Broadcasting Maria's voice or revealing her name would put her in great danger.
This is why she's voiced by one of our colleagues. Maria is a member of an all-female underground group, distributing leaflets and newsletters as a form of peaceful resistance.
We are doing a lot of different actions, and we are trying to use a little bit of art. So we are creating leaflets with our messages to Russian occupiers and Russian soldiers.
For example, you are in Ukraine, so don't forget about this. We are trying to burn Russian flags, Russian propaganda.
propaganda. Aside from Maria's group, there are others practicing various forms of resistance,

from distributing Ukrainian symbols to subversion and reconnaissance. An atmosphere of fear and suspicion is ever-present, though.
I reached out to friends to speak to their relatives living in occupied areas. All of them said, no, that is too dangerous.
My friend Sophia now lives here in the UK, but is originally from an occupied village in Zaporizhia region. About a year ago, my parents were searched by the Russian Security Service FSB.
They confiscated their phones, accusing them of telling the Ukrainian army about where Russian troops were stationed. That wasn't true, and later the Russian army told my parents that they had been reported by their neighbours.
I try not to provoke anything like that. I have to read between the lines when they tell me about what's going on.
Many members of the diaspora are keeping their conversations with friends or relatives in occupied parts of Ukraine to trivial topics, small talk. Yeva, also not her real name, who is in Montenegro, has a sister working at the Russia-occupied Zaporizhia nuclear power station.
Whenever we move from the weather or our children onto other subjects, her tone changes. She tells me, you don't understand.
What I do understand is that being a nuclear power plant worker, her phone is likely bugged. Another friend, Kateryna, tells me that someone she knows in the occupied part of Kherson region was thrown into jail for talking to her brother who supports the Ukrainian army.
According to the Ukrainian government and independent investigators, more than a hundred Ukrainian activists and journalists have been killed under Russian occupation and hundreds more are imprisoned. Besides broadcasting on their TV stations, there are numerous other ways in which Russia is attacking Ukrainian culture, language and history in the occupied regions.
Russian propaganda posters line the streets and in schools, children are forced to attend classes glorifying the Russian army and school books justify the invasion of Ukraine. The Kremlin is also forcing Ukrainians in occupied territories to take Russian passports.
Sofia tells me that her parents are unable to top up their mobile phones or insure their car just because they are refusing to take Russian passports. With the US-led efforts to negotiate peace in Ukraine, the fear rises that Kiev could be forced to give up at least some of the territory occupied by Russia.
Vitaly Shevchenko. Three Scottish brothers are planning to become the fastest people to row across the Pacific Ocean.
In a boat they help design and build. It uses technology from Formula One racing.
And Jamie Ewan and Lachlan MacLean are hoping it will get them from Peru to Australia, 14,000 kilometres away. Richard Hamilton reports.
What the McLean brothers themselves have described as a daft challenge is in honour of the sister they never had. Rose Emily died six months into their mother's pregnancy, and the boat is named after her.
They also hope to raise more than $1 million for clean water projects in Madagascar. Jamie, Ewan and Lachlan will row in two-hour shifts and be entirely unsupported, with no safety boat, resupplies or outside help.
So what do three men in a boat need to take with them? Speaking from Lima before they set off, Lachlan explained what's in the lockers. We have all manner of things on this boat, everything ranging from over 2,000 meals, freeze-dried food, so it's essentially spaceman food, but we'll be taking some fresh fruit with us, we've got tools, we've got sort of spares for our spares.
We're actually also taking three musical instruments. So Jamie plays the bagpipes, Ewan plays the guitar and I play the accordion.
So we're all taking sort of mini versions. Well, Ewan and I are taking mini versions.
Jamie's taking the full Highland bagpipes just so we can arrive in Sydney with hopefully some style. Along the way, the McLean brothers will face sharks, marlins, extreme isolation, sleep deprivation and exhaustion.
Five years ago, they broke the record for crossing the Atlantic, and now they hope to become the quickest team to complete a human-powered crossing of the Pacific. It's an ambitious goal, but they have at their disposal the lightest and fastest ocean rowing boat ever made, a carbon fibre vessel which they helped design and build with Formula One engineers based in the Netherlands.
Richard Hamilton. And that's all from us for now, but there'll be a new edition of the Global News Podcast later.
If you want to comment on this

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hashglobalnewspod. This edition was mixed by Paul Mason.
The producer was Carla Conte.

The editor is Karen Martin.

And I'm Paul Moss.

Until next time, goodbye.