It’s Rom-Complicated! How Nice Guys Can Get the Girl: Lessons from ‘Say Anything’ (with Hollywood Producer Cristina Nava)

Speaker 1 When it comes to love, you just have to take a chance. I think that we should spend some time apart.

Speaker 2 Oh, yeah! Where'd she dump you, man? No car. Just in the mouth, man.

Speaker 2 Your only mistake is that you didn't dump her first. All you gotta do is find a girl who looks just like her and then dump her, man.
You guys know so much about women.

Speaker 2 How come you hear like a gas and sip on a Saturday night? No women anywhere.

Speaker 2 By choice, man.

Speaker 2 Say anything. Rated PG-13 starts Friday at theaters everywhere.

Speaker 5 Welcome back to the How to Get a Girlfriend podcast. I'm your host, dating coach Connell Barrett.
I'm the real-life hitch.

Speaker 5 If hitch was a skinny ginger with glasses, I'm here to help you flirt with confidence, get a great girlfriend, and do it by being authentic.

Speaker 5 And this is the second in a recurring series of episodes that I'm calling It's Rom Complicated.

Speaker 5 I believe that a lot of really great insightful secrets to how to have a great dating life are hidden within rom-com movies.

Speaker 5 And so every once in a while, I bring on a special guest to talk about a great rom-com movie, talk about some of the love lessons and dating lessons in the movie, and also just talk about what makes the movie great, the good, the bad, the ugly.

Speaker 5 And today I'm joined by an incredibly talented guest. She's a writer, a producer, and director in Hollywood.
She makes rom-com movies. Her name is Christina Nava.

Speaker 5 Christine has co-written movies like Divorce Bait and In Other Words, and her latest film is called Say a Little Prayer. It's a very charming rom-com and I just watched it with my girlfriend.

Speaker 5 We watched it and loved it this weekend. It's coming to Amazon Prime and Apple Plus just in time for Valentine's Day.

Speaker 5 It's a really heartwarming story about three best friends who recite an ancient prayer to the patron saint of all things lost to help them find true loves. And a lot of unexpected events happen.

Speaker 5 So today, Christina is here to talk about a classic rom-com called Say Anything, the 1989 movie starring John Cusack, Ione Sky, and written and directed by Cameron Crowe.

Speaker 5 Christina, thank you so much for joining us here on It's Rom Complicated.

Speaker 1 Thank you for having me. I'm really excited to talk about say a little anything, say a little anything.

Speaker 5 I love it.

Speaker 5 It's a mashup. I love it.

Speaker 1 It's a mashup of both. No, but Say a Little Prayer and Say Anything.

Speaker 5 I can't wait to talk to you about Say A Little Prayer. There's a lot to learn in that movie.
It's also just a good fun watch.

Speaker 5 Before we get to that, I'm curious, you chose the movie Say Anything to talk about today.

Speaker 5 From a lot of rom-com movies, tell us a little bit about your relationship to rom-com movies and why you chose Say Anything.

Speaker 1 So I grew up in the 80s and I absolutely loved those movies from the 80s. But Say Anything

Speaker 1 was, I think, the first movie that I remember where you kind of, as a preteen and then teenager, learn about love.

Speaker 1 And a very, what I now know

Speaker 1 is real.

Speaker 1 The other movies that I was watching at that time were like other John Cuzak movies.

Speaker 1 And, you know, it was like Fast Times at Ridgemont High.

Speaker 1 That wasn't John Cuzak, but

Speaker 1 also One Crazy Summer. And they were, these were all about love.
And obviously, Fast Times at Ridgemont High is crazy love. But this one was just so sweet.
It spoke to my heart.

Speaker 1 And there were so many iconic things about it.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 1 it kind of set the tone for what I kind of wanted in a guy.

Speaker 1 You know, that Lloyd Dobbler,

Speaker 1 real love.

Speaker 5 Absolutely. I love Lloyd Dobbler.
I think Lloyd Dobbler is me in a lot of ways. Lloyd Dobbler is so many men.
I think the guy listening to this podcast, he's a lot like Lloyd Dobbler.

Speaker 5 Maybe he's not the richest guy in the world. Maybe he's not the best looking or the smoothest guy, and Lloyd certainly isn't, but he wins over an incredible woman, Diane Court, played by Ioniskai.

Speaker 5 He's just, he's being, he does it by being real, being funny, being confident, and kind of leaning into his quirky side. And I just love that message.

Speaker 5 I guess it spoke to me because I wasn't the best looking, smoothest guy in the world. And it just gives regular guys, quote unquote, hope.

Speaker 1 Absolutely. Absolutely.
I mean, Lloyd Dobbler was, as you said, I think quirky is the... most appropriate, but he was so brave.

Speaker 1 I love, you know, the first, from the first scene, they're in someone's bedroom, and he's with his two girlfriends,

Speaker 1 played by Lily Tyler and Amy Brooks. And he's playing the guitar, and they're talking about, he's like, I'm going to ask her out on a second date.

Speaker 1 And she, and his friend Corey, who's played by Lily Tyler, is like, that's interesting. You haven't even gone on the first date.

Speaker 5 What about the first date?

Speaker 1 I got the first date. And we find out that he kind of followed her to the mall at the food court and sat across and had lunch with her.
That was his first date without her knowing about it.

Speaker 1 So he was so brave, though. And I mean,

Speaker 1 it borders on a little stalker nowadays, but he was just so sweet. And you were rooting for him.
And, you know, he was harmless, you know. So I just, I appreciated his bravery.

Speaker 1 So much.

Speaker 5 Well, we're gonna get, we're gonna dive deeply into Say Anything. We're gonna to break the movie down into what I call the rom-comies.

Speaker 5 Fun little categories and awards that are going to be really fun to listen to. Tips, jokes, all kinds of insights.
And I can't wait to hear yours. Before we do that, I want to talk about your movie.

Speaker 5 Say a little prayer.

Speaker 3 $3,000.

Speaker 6 That is a down payment on a minivan.

Speaker 3 This is when I take my food soft.

Speaker 3 See a great booty. Beauty.

Speaker 5 I'm not

Speaker 5 ever known.

Speaker 5 And

Speaker 3 Nothing beats a picnic by the river.

Speaker 6 When you see a painting and you have that connection with the artist, it's magic.

Speaker 5 I've had that song in my head now for a week. The classic song.
I know it's not in the movie.

Speaker 5 Tell me a little bit about Say a Little Prayer. It's so charming.

Speaker 5 How did it begin?

Speaker 5 Talk to us about why this movie is so special.

Speaker 1 Well, this movie is written by Nancy de los Rosantos. And Nancy de Ros Santos was like associate producer back in the days when Selena was shot in San Antonio.

Speaker 1 And so she began to write this movie probably about 20 years ago and around the same time.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 1 it began with her grandmother.

Speaker 1 Basically, you know, Nancy was accomplished. She had been

Speaker 1 doing so much work as a producer in television but her grandmother all she could think of was you're not married and so she calls her to her home and Nancy goes over and the grandmother gives her this prayer to Saint Anthony to San Antonio and it's the patron patron saint of lost causes as you or lost things not lost causes lost things and she said you need to say this prayer because your husband is lost

Speaker 1 so Nancy ignored it ignored it but she thought it was a very funny story and so

Speaker 1 she she wrote it as a short story back then I think it was it won awards she got into the Equinox program with HBO

Speaker 1 and she tried to produce it meaning she tried to get them to produce it like someone in Hollywood, but she really ran up against a wall on that.

Speaker 1 and I you know it's it it was not like a true romantic comedy you start off with the it's more about the friendship with these three young women looking for love and

Speaker 1 and they're already in their 30s so they've lived

Speaker 1 they've lived their lives and they're entrepreneurs so Nancy

Speaker 1 you know it took about 20 years and at the same time I'm building my career and

Speaker 1 she was she was watching me now with social media, she was watching what I was doing.

Speaker 1 Myself and my husband, Patrick Perez-Vidaudi, who we together have been making independent movies and mostly romantic comedies.

Speaker 1 And so she just asked me to breakfast one day, and she's like, How do you, how are you making your movies?

Speaker 1 And she pulls out this little pad and is about to write down like my, what, 10 steps to producing a movie? I don't know. And I just said, do you want me to produce your movie?

Speaker 1 And she reached over and took my hand and cried. And it's like, Yes, I would never ask you.
It's so much work. And, but I love the story.
I wanted to work with Nancy. And so

Speaker 1 she had an army of people behind her, you know, who wanted to see her succeed with the story. And we started there.

Speaker 1 And the first thing was to try to find like that one lead that would eventually sell our movie. And that's where Luis Fonci came in.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 One of our co-producers knew him and gave him the script and he resonated with it and that's where it all began.

Speaker 5 He's fantastic in this. Every man listening to this needs to see this movie, not just because it's funny and because it's really sweet.

Speaker 5 If you want to see a man who's got real a character played by Luis Fonsi, pardon me if I said that wrong,

Speaker 5 he's very relaxed in his confidence. He's got great style.
I love his got the right stubble. He's got great style.
And there's a fantastic scene that I love as a dating coach.

Speaker 5 He breaks the ice with the lead actress in the movie, Vanessa Vasquez. He breaks the ice with her in an art gallery.
And it's very smooth and natural.

Speaker 5 It's a meet-cute, but

Speaker 5 it's not an unbelievable meet-cute. It's very real world.

Speaker 5 And

Speaker 5 you should check it out just to watch his fantastic, if you want to know how to talk to a beautiful, well-dressed woman in an art gallery, watch the movie just to see the way they meet.

Speaker 5 It's really a good scene.

Speaker 1 you're absolutely right like Luis Fonci and part of part of and he's these are his words that part of the reason he took the role was because he said this is not a stretch like this is really this feels like me I could this speaks to me I am this guy I am Rafael Reza and he was just he's just such a kind soul but he he did such service to this role.

Speaker 1 He was such a natural.

Speaker 1 He was funny. He had comedic timing.
But you're absolutely right.

Speaker 1 If you're taking notes on how to do things right in the dating world, yeah, yeah. This one's to watch.
This was one to watch.

Speaker 1 Have you been to Oaxaca? Oh.

Speaker 3 Oh, I'm sorry.

Speaker 6 I apologize. I saw you staring at the painting.

Speaker 3 It's just

Speaker 3 heavenly.

Speaker 2 It is.

Speaker 6 This is called Dance at La Guillaguetza. It's a celebration held in Oaxaca since pre-Hispanic times.
I was actually there last summer.

Speaker 3 Really?

Speaker 1 On vacation?

Speaker 6 No.

Speaker 3 No, I was working, curating, actually.

Speaker 6 Yeah, I'm one of the many who helped put, well, all of this together.

Speaker 3 So, what do you think?

Speaker 6 Well, all the pieces are just...

Speaker 3 so inspiring.

Speaker 5 And he did what I call an indirect approach, which is he noticed Vanessa's character looking at a piece of art, and he asked her a question about the art. I just watched the scene.

Speaker 5 It's very fresh in my mind. And it's perfect, pitch perfect for the way to start a conversation with somebody in the real world in a charming way that's not creepy, that's not

Speaker 5 stocky. Like we'll talk about Lloyd Dobbler later.

Speaker 5 A little stocky back in the 80s, but I love the way they break the ice. Also, his character does something really good on their date.

Speaker 5 And if you can possibly do this as a single guy on a date, it's a nice thing to do. He does something he's good at.
He plays guitar on their first date. And she watches him play guitar during at this

Speaker 5 bar slash music venue.

Speaker 5 And that's also a really cool scene because a great simple move I teach my guys is I say, if there's a way to do something that you're good at on the date, maybe not play guitar and sing, but it'd be good to do something you're good at because that can be really attractive to a woman you meet.

Speaker 1 Yeah, you know what? That's a really good point. Yeah, that's a very, very good point.
Well, if you if you do sing and you play guitar, there's always karaoke.

Speaker 5 Yeah.

Speaker 1 Yeah, absolutely.

Speaker 1 When I was dating, like, I remember this guy was

Speaker 1 pursuing me, and then he invited me to like this

Speaker 1 shorts film

Speaker 1 festival.

Speaker 1 His directing and the movie was just so beautiful. I remember seeing him in a different light.
You know, like,

Speaker 1 it ended in like, we were dating the very next week, you know, like, um, it just, it did. It captured, it caught my attention.

Speaker 5 Yeah.

Speaker 5 Well, on my first date with my now girlfriend, Jess, I was a dating coach when I met her, and I invited her out to go out with me with my clients just because I thought, well, I want to see her.

Speaker 5 watch me do what I do. Maybe she'll be into that.
And if she's not, that's okay. There was no pressure to do that.
But she later said how that impressed her, that she got to see me doing what I do.

Speaker 5 So whether it's a karaoke bar date where you can sing your favorite karaoke song, that's a good first date move.

Speaker 5 Or just letting the other person see you in your element and maybe giving her a chance to see her in her element, that's a great way for two people to connect, I found.

Speaker 1 When

Speaker 1 my husband and I met

Speaker 1 for the first time in an after-school program, but we were both,

Speaker 1 I was coming out of a five-year relationship, and he was in a five-year relationship, and he was unhappy. He stayed in for another four years, so we met up four years later.

Speaker 1 And I was actually back then acting and touring a one-woman show.

Speaker 1 And I was really nervous because I was going to go promote my show, my show on this radio station.

Speaker 1 And I get there, and it's him,

Speaker 1 and he's one of the four hosts. And so I just felt like I felt at ease.
And

Speaker 1 I got to see him in his element. And it was fun.
And all the nerves went away. And he went out to see me in this show.
And

Speaker 1 he got to really know me because that show was completely about

Speaker 1 my pursuit of love. It was called Rocks and My Salsa.

Speaker 5 Okay.

Speaker 5 Great title.

Speaker 1 Yeah,

Speaker 1 it was about all of

Speaker 1 the rocks and like along the way and and trying to find love and so he was like you know he was just taking notes and and now we're married 17 years later with three kids

Speaker 5 congratulations well you anticipated my next question i wanted to ask you

Speaker 5 you know there's a lot of rom-com movie tropes right there's the meet cute there's the grand gesture there's klutziness but there's also just moments that are sweet and adorable from movies.

Speaker 5 And when you think back on your single

Speaker 5 life back in the day, are there any moments that stand out to you as, oh, wow, that was such a rom-com movie moment that happened in that dating world?

Speaker 1 Yeah, I mean,

Speaker 1 I think like grand gestures, speaking of grand gestures, I think like, honestly, it wasn't even in the dating world. It was,

Speaker 1 if I had, you know, I was thinking about my, in eighth grade, I was 14 years old. and

Speaker 1 you know we're in the classroom it's the second it's the day before we're about to graduate and you know you're off to to high school and these

Speaker 1 this huge bouquet of roses is brought in by our principal and everyone's ewing and awing and I'm like

Speaker 1 I wish those were for me you know and so he goes to our teacher and she points to the back of the room and I turn around and he heads straight for me you know and

Speaker 1 and they were for me from not even from the person that i had a crush on it was like this boy this seventh grader who had silently had a crush on me for who god knows how long and it was the most it was to this day i don't think that i actually have ever had like this this grand of a gesture from really anybody who that really took me by surprise and i guess like in thinking about it i was just thinking like

Speaker 1 i i wish he would have told me, or maybe not. I mean, I just, you know, he held on to that for so long.
And I was gone. You know, I thanked him and I was so flattered.

Speaker 1 And to this day, it's like probably the biggest,

Speaker 1 the grandest of gestures next to my husband asked getting on his

Speaker 5 knee

Speaker 1 without, we were swimming and he just was overcome with emotion and he got on his knee and asked me to he proposed to me in his swimming trunks with no ring, no anything, no shirt.

Speaker 1 So those are the two, but those are probably like, even though it was middle school, I mean, I was 14 almost in high school, but I feel like that was such a rom-com moment.

Speaker 5 It's so innocent and sweet.

Speaker 1 Right. And it, but it, but it's a lesson, like, if hopefully in the future, he just really let women, the girl know sooner.

Speaker 5 So

Speaker 1 he might have, he might have had a chance. I don't know.

Speaker 5 I've done that. I did the same thing.
Yeah. My big crush, her name was Betsy Baker.

Speaker 5 Age. I remember, you know, there's something about middle school, high school, there's just a moment where you look at a person and say, I think I'm going to have a crush on them now.

Speaker 5 It's almost like it overtakes you. You don't choose it.
It just chooses you.

Speaker 1 What do you call it in Twilight series? Like you're not a zinger, but you're.

Speaker 1 I can't remember what it is.

Speaker 5 In the Twilight movies?

Speaker 1 The Twilight series, they call it

Speaker 1 when you're almost zapped.

Speaker 5 Like

Speaker 1 they call it imprinted.

Speaker 5 Ooh, okay. Yeah.

Speaker 5 I guess Betsy Baker imprinted herself on me in circa seventh grade and I pined over her for three years. I sent her anonymous love poetry.

Speaker 5 Wow. And I never, I told her later and it was awkward.

Speaker 5 But I said, oh yeah, those letters, those are from me. And she's like, oh, that explains a lot.
And anyway,

Speaker 5 that was my Lloyd Dobbler favorite.

Speaker 5 Before we get into the movie, I've got to ask you a little bit about your incredible career. You're a movie producer, a writer, a director.

Speaker 5 Why rom-coms? Why have you specialized in rom-coms?

Speaker 5 Tell us more about that.

Speaker 1 Well,

Speaker 1 I think that when I transitioned from theater to writing for film, I just thought that through film we were able to reach more people.

Speaker 1 That transition came at a moment when I was really looking for love.

Speaker 1 I was um

Speaker 1 about

Speaker 1 33 years old, and actually, I'm wearing the shirt that I wore um when I had my birthday.

Speaker 1 And I, it was, I turned 33, and I called it my Jesus year, where my, you know, I was gonna find the love of my life, it was like my calling. You know, I was just ready for love.

Speaker 1 I wanted to find my husband and my partner, and um,

Speaker 1 I think that that was when

Speaker 1 I started to to write and so then my husband and I got married and that's

Speaker 1 I know you're gonna cut this out but can you hear the trash truck yeah I can should you want we can stop until it leaves It's okay.

Speaker 5 I find it kind of strangely charming when I hear dogs barking and trucks going by. So I don't mind if you don't mind.

Speaker 5 We can hear you fine. That's all that matters.
But thanks for asking.

Speaker 1 So,

Speaker 1 anyway, so we were approached by

Speaker 1 an investor once we were married to produce, and he was also a fanatic of rom-coms, and I loved them too. And so, that was our first opportunity to make

Speaker 1 an indie film. Well, a second time we made our movies, but the first time we made our indie film.
And I loved writing it. In other words,

Speaker 1 I wrote, and

Speaker 1 that one is on Tubi. You can go find it and watch it.

Speaker 5 And

Speaker 1 it was very easy for me to write that because I loved love. And I just really dug into my own experiences.

Speaker 1 And honestly,

Speaker 1 I feel like I do channel the movies of the 90s when I write.

Speaker 1 romantic comedies or comedies.

Speaker 1 I have a fascination with them. So

Speaker 1 that's where it really started. The opportunities that were coming to us were

Speaker 1 in this

Speaker 1 genre, to be honest.

Speaker 5 Well, what I like about Cameron Crowe's movie, this is the second movie I've talked about on this podcast feed. I haven't done it yet, but I had a conversation about Jerry Maguire, Cameron Crow movie.

Speaker 5 And there's something about Cameron Crowe's writing. There, his characters, here's my amateur viewpoint.
Tell me as a professional writer and director, I'd love to hear your take.

Speaker 5 To me, what's great about his dialogue is very natural. I don't feel like I'm watching a movie.
It seems really naturalistic.

Speaker 5 And every character, even small characters, get those little grace note moments. Like you mentioned,

Speaker 5 Lloyd Dobbler's two female friends, one played by Lily Taylor, the other is, I believe, James Brooks's daughter. And even...

Speaker 5 James Brooks's daughter gets a little moment in the movie. Everybody's a person.
Nobody's just a rom-com trope. That's what I really love about Cameron Crow's movies, at least the rom-coms.

Speaker 1 Yeah, I agree. Um,

Speaker 1 there

Speaker 1 there's just something, like you're saying, very natural, but and the interactions with the characters

Speaker 1 are really funny, though. And I, what I love is that it's it's like it's not just about the plot.
You really, Cameron Crow presents

Speaker 1 each character with just such

Speaker 1 a

Speaker 1 nuances about them. Even what's it, Jeremy Piven was in it, and he was hilarious.
Like,

Speaker 1 Cameron Crowe does not,

Speaker 1 there's not a wasted character. You know what I mean? Like, there's a purpose for it, but they're funny or

Speaker 1 they lend such a

Speaker 1 beautiful palette to

Speaker 1 say anything.

Speaker 1 And, you know Jeremy Piven plays this drunk character at the party and he just is hilarious you know he and he and it's he's there for like 30 seconds maybe and and he's gone but he's he's hilarious you know yeah he makes a big impact and he's yeah he's gone yeah yeah yeah

Speaker 5 I love it I love his writing Cameron Crows great let's get to it let's get to say anything and let's break this down with these categories here we here we go these are the rom-comies.

Speaker 5 Let's start by rating the meet cute.

Speaker 5 Now in this movie there's not a meet cute per se so for this category I'm going to consider that first phone call basically a meet cute and I thought it was fantastic. I loved how nervous he was.

Speaker 5 That was so relatable and I liked how at first she Diane Court played by Ione Skye. At first she says, hey, I'm busy.
But then she seems to be charmed by him.

Speaker 5 So they didn't have a meet cute per se because their characters had already met before the movie started but that phone call I just thought that was so relatable yeah I mean awkward for sure

Speaker 1 awkward for sure

Speaker 1 and what I found adorable

Speaker 1 was

Speaker 1 you know she said he said I'm Lloyd Dobler I don't know if you know me she said yeah you

Speaker 1 We ate together or we had lunch together. He's like, oh, you remember? She said, no,

Speaker 1 I took the message. You told my father or something like that.

Speaker 1 You know, and she wasn't weirded out by it, right? You know, and uh, I really, I really love that, you know. Number one, I really miss the phones with the cords.

Speaker 5 I just have to say,

Speaker 5 remember the days, yes, it was that was a good, good, um,

Speaker 1 that was really fun to watch.

Speaker 5 I love how he says to her

Speaker 5 father in the movie, he says, Isn't she great?

Speaker 5 Isn't she great? Yeah, isn't she great?

Speaker 5 Talk about getting on the dad's good side. There's a move to steal.
There's a move to steal if you ever talk to a woman's dad.

Speaker 7 Lloyd Dobbler, 555-1342.

Speaker 7 It's 554.

Speaker 7 555-11342. Okay, I'll get her the message.
Okay.

Speaker 7 She's pretty great, isn't she? What? She's really pretty great, isn't she? Yeah, she is.

Speaker 7 Good luck, kid. Good afternoon.

Speaker 5 Not that that would happen in 2025.

Speaker 1 And I'm going to geek out now, but that just the line from the father, he's like, you know, when he answers the phone, he's like, this is Lloyd Dauberry. Are you the guy with the truck? No.

Speaker 1 Are you the guy with the Mustang? Like, the father is testing him with these three questions. It was just really brilliant.
Like,

Speaker 1 as a parent, I'm like taking notes, like, oh, this is really great

Speaker 1 to get info very quickly.

Speaker 5 No, I'm the guy with the Chevy Malibu. Yeah.

Speaker 5 Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 5 Really great.

Speaker 5 Let's talk about their chemistry from sparks to duds. I thought that, I think Qzak and Ioni Sky have a really sweet chemistry.
It's innocent.

Speaker 5 For most of the movie, it's very innocent. It's not like a fiery passion, but there's sort of this sweet, there's a sweetness to it.
There's this earnest, innocent, offbeat connection.

Speaker 5 It's almost like they're both equally quirky and strange. Not strange, but in a way, they're both outcasts, and they seem to see that in each other.
And it creates a sweet, almost innocent chemistry.

Speaker 1 Yeah, you know, I feel like

Speaker 1 for them, it's it was timing, right?

Speaker 1 Like, I feel like, so Day, it was, it was graduation, and Diane Court kept saying, like, I've, she had been away for to college, for college courses and not really been a part of like high school.

Speaker 1 And she didn't go to the parties, and she didn't do this, and she was really fully aware. She shared that with her father.
And so, this random guy calls her, and she was like, I'm busy Tuesday.

Speaker 1 I'm busy Saturday. I'm busy like for the rest of my life almost, right?

Speaker 1 And he says, well, what about tonight? There's a high school party happening. And it was timing because she had just said,

Speaker 1 I kind of missed it. I missed high school.
I missed that connection. They don't know me and I don't know them.
And so I think in love that that's true. Like it's timing, you know? Yeah.

Speaker 1 Someone, both parties have to be ready.

Speaker 5 If the iron was hot, there was a moment for them to meet up. I tell my clients, I say, Oh, you matched with her yesterday, or sorry, he said, A client might say, Oh, this girl went quiet.

Speaker 5 And I said, Well, when did you match with her? Like, 10 days ago. He said, Well, did you ask her out? He's like, No, waiting till the moment's right.
I'm like, It's been 10 days.

Speaker 5 You got to strike while the iron's hot. So, yeah, the time

Speaker 1 rules still apply nowadays.

Speaker 1 I haven't been in the dating scene for obviously 17, 18 years.

Speaker 1 But is it wait? Is there like a, are people still doing the waiting period?

Speaker 5 Well, I coach men and I teach my clients. I say, don't wait.
Just basically be Lloyd Dobbler. Ask for what you want within reason

Speaker 5 and go for what you want until you get a clear yes or a clear, hey, thanks, but no, thanks.

Speaker 5 And don't play any kind of games like, oh, I need to wait two or three days because people just have so many dating options today in the swiping tender era that if you wait too long, somebody else is going to snag that person up or they'll be distracted by other shinier objects.

Speaker 1 Yeah, you know, my husband and I told you we met on the radio on a Friday, November 3rd of 2006. And

Speaker 1 I had been alone for two and a half years, like single.

Speaker 1 I didn't,

Speaker 1 we connected after we had gone out for a drink right after the radio show. That was on a Friday.
And he was going to wait until like the next week to ask me out. But I really wanted to see him.

Speaker 1 So I reached out and I called him. And I said, do you want to go see Babel on Sunday? And we went out on Sunday.
But I just, I was so over the games of that meeting that I...

Speaker 5 You went all Sadie Hawkins Day on him. I did.
Nice. That's great.
Hey, when that happens, that men, we appreciate it so much.

Speaker 1 Oh, good. Good.

Speaker 5 It feels so good because we know how scary it is to ask somebody out and to be the one to make the move. So, when the woman makes the move, I have no problem with that at all.

Speaker 5 In fact, we're very grateful when it happens.

Speaker 5 We do, I do tell my guys, hey, you want to be the one to lead the dance. Dating is a dance, generally, generally, a man's going to lead that dance.
But if you want to take the lead, God bless you.

Speaker 5 So, it worked out for the two of you. Speaking of which, next award, the Steal This Dating Move Award.
I have two tied for two in this category, this award.

Speaker 5 First of all,

Speaker 5 on that phone call, I really like how vulnerable and authentic and sort of genuine Lloyd is.

Speaker 5 He's openly expressing his interest in her. He's not playing it cool.
He's not being all cocky and doing any kind of play it cool. He's being genuine both with first.

Speaker 5 with her dad when he leaves the message and then when they have that phone conversation. So that's a great thing to steal from Lloyd, which is just put it out there.

Speaker 5 Let a woman know that you're intrigued by her, that you would love to take her out. And she'll say yes or no, and either answer is fine.
So that's one little move to steal.

Speaker 5 And the second one, curious to hear your point of view on this,

Speaker 5 as a woman and as a woman who writes, produces rom-com movies, I also noticed how he was persistent with her.

Speaker 5 Because her initial reaction on that phone call is, oh, you know, I'm really busy with these 19 things.

Speaker 1 But she was talking to him.

Speaker 5 She did call him back, right? And so he did, he combined persistence with charm. He didn't give up right away.
He didn't, at that part anyway, he didn't edge into stalker.

Speaker 5 He just said, okay, that's fine. I know you're busy.
There's his party tonight.

Speaker 5 He didn't give up. And you could kind of see her sort of be like, all right, all right.
He's not taking my busy for an answer. And then she basically said, let's do it.

Speaker 5 So I say persistence plus charm is a nice way to

Speaker 5 ask a woman out until you know for sure she either is or isn't available. What's your take?

Speaker 1 I agree. I agree.
And

Speaker 1 I liked

Speaker 1 his shift into just like

Speaker 1 finding the moment,

Speaker 1 finding that connection. And you never know, right? Like he actually said the right thing, and he didn't even know it.
You know, he just kept saying, how about Saturday?

Speaker 1 How about Sunday, or whatever it was. And then when he switched, there's a part, he added a little more story behind it, right? Oh, there's a party.
I'm not going to let you

Speaker 1 run off to England or Europe before getting one, getting, you know, having a taste of one of these parties. And there's a story behind it that really intrigued her, you know, and so she

Speaker 1 said yes. So

Speaker 1 that was curious. I mean, that was really

Speaker 1 cool, a very good shift, and I appreciated that.

Speaker 5 Okay, so it's Lloyd, and

Speaker 8 let's go out.

Speaker 5 You want to go out?

Speaker 1 Oh Thanks, but I'm busy

Speaker 5 Busy?

Speaker 1 Yes.

Speaker 1 Things are pretty hectic right now, but thanks

Speaker 8 busy on Friday

Speaker 1 Yeah, I have to help my father.

Speaker 8 Are you busy on Saturday?

Speaker 1 Saturday I have some things to do around the house

Speaker 8 So you're

Speaker 8 monumentally busy?

Speaker 4 Well, not monumentally.

Speaker 8 What about tonight then?

Speaker 8 Can you go to that party for Lears?

Speaker 8 Look, Dan, I'm sorry, but I can't allow you to leave the country without attending Valiers' graduation event. This gentleman is 22 and

Speaker 8 comes out of hiding like once a year for this occasion. And he dresses up as the lakeside rooster and he makes this drink called the Purple Passion.

Speaker 1 Actually, I think that.

Speaker 8 You know, and you're not in England yet. We know that, of course.
But by the way, I wanted to just tell you that I lived in England for three months.

Speaker 8 And my parents lived in Ireland, you know, so we lived in England and Germany. I could give you an enormous amount of tips.
Many tips.

Speaker 8 English tips.

Speaker 8 Well.

Speaker 8 No tip. No, any tips of any kind.

Speaker 5 I'll go.

Speaker 8 Pardon me?

Speaker 5 I'll go. You will?

Speaker 8 Excellent. All right.

Speaker 1 So I would take notes from that, like add a little narrative behind it.

Speaker 5 That's a great point. He made it

Speaker 5 to her benefit. Yes.
That's how you frame it. Actually, I can't let you go to Europe until you experience a party.
Exactly.

Speaker 1 Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 5 Clever. Clever.
Good job, Lloyd. Lloyd's got some hidden game.
Oh, absolutely.

Speaker 1 You know,

Speaker 1 I don't know if you remember the part where

Speaker 1 they had already gone out on the first date. It was after the party.
And the two girls, three girls now were in their bedroom talking about, they were saying, oh, no, she's setting him.

Speaker 1 Diana's setting him up for a failure. This is Lily Tyler.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 1 he's going to meet the family. Like, you know,

Speaker 1 he's going to ruin it with that talking thing. And then

Speaker 1 she says,

Speaker 1 if you were Diane Court, would you fall for Lloyd Dobbler? And there was this pause where the obvious thing to say was no, but they all really thought about it.

Speaker 1 And they're like, yeah, we would fall for him. All for women, you know, because he's charming.
He's a sweetheart.

Speaker 5 Yeah.

Speaker 1 So,

Speaker 5 yeah.

Speaker 5 No, that was, yeah. He's very likable and he's got great intentions, and I think that's really attractive.
Absolutely. Just letting those good intentions come out.

Speaker 5 The next category actually is one that I didn't tell you about, so no pressure to answer this one, but I'm ready with an answer.

Speaker 5 And that is the worst piece of dating advice from a character within the movie. And for this one, there's a scene where Lloyd has been dumped by Diane.

Speaker 5 And he's talking to all these guys outside the gas and go or the gulp and go or whatever that gas station is. And one of the guys says, oh, well, just here's what you do.

Speaker 5 Go out and find the girl who looks just like her and nail her.

Speaker 5 That's how to get over it. So there's the worst piece of dating advice from the movie.

Speaker 1 Absolutely. Look at Kanye.

Speaker 1 She looks like Kim Kardashian, but no.

Speaker 5 Oh my God, that's so right.

Speaker 5 Kanye's got such a type. He can't get over that lesson.

Speaker 1 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 5 That's challenging.

Speaker 4 All you got gotta do is find a girl who looks just like her, nail her, and then dump her, man.

Speaker 3 Dump her. Get her off your mind.

Speaker 9 Your only mistake is that you didn't dump her first. Diane Court is a show pony.
You need a stallion, my friend. Walk with us, and you walk tall.
Walk tall, my man.

Speaker 1 Itches, man.

Speaker 9 You can give that kid a compliment.

Speaker 1 Hey, dude, I've been here down.

Speaker 4 I got a question.

Speaker 7 You guys know so much about women.

Speaker 9 How come you're here at like a gas and sip on a Saturday night completely alone drinking beers? There's no women anywhere

Speaker 4 by choice, man.

Speaker 3 That's right, man. It's a conscious choice.
A choice, man.

Speaker 5 Oh, my, my, um, I have three sisters. My one of my big sisters could not stop dating guys named Dave.
So, hey,

Speaker 5 I've had three different Christines in my dating past, so maybe we all have titles.

Speaker 1 My friend did that with Tim's. I think

Speaker 1 that is a perfect, really piece, bad piece of advice.

Speaker 1 I think one of the worst in breaking up with someone was here, give them a pen. Like the dad.
Oh, yeah.

Speaker 5 John Mahoney's advice.

Speaker 1 Yeah, Diane Court's advice to her for breaking up with Lloyd is like, here, give him a pen.

Speaker 5 Right. Yeah.

Speaker 1 That's horrible. That's the worst way.
I mean, that's on, that's out there with Sex in the Cities

Speaker 1 getting dumped with a post, a post-it.

Speaker 5 Oh, I don't know that episode. Yeah.

Speaker 1 Karen Bradshaw gets dumped

Speaker 1 through a post-it by one of

Speaker 1 her suitors.

Speaker 5 Okay. Gotcha.

Speaker 5 Well, in Lloyd's defense, when the character says, oh, just go nail a girl who looks just like her, he said, look, I'm taking advice from three guys who are at the gas and gulp and go on a Saturday night.

Speaker 5 It's like, can I really, can I really put value in this advice? Yeah.

Speaker 1 He's really just smart, and he knows it's all BS. He knows.

Speaker 5 He's so smart. Yeah.
He's so smart. Maybe that's another hidden dating tip from this movie is just

Speaker 5 like one of my mottos is your true self is always coming out so just let it shine. And if you're a smart brainy person let that intelligence come out.

Speaker 5 And I love how Lloyd just likes to lets his, you know, wears his, or his brain on his sleeve. The intelligence is obviously really attractive to Diane.

Speaker 1 Definitely, definitely.

Speaker 8 I thought about this quite a bit, sir, and I would have to say, considering what's waiting out there for me,

Speaker 8 I don't want to sell anything, buy anything, or process anything as a career.

Speaker 8 I don't want to sell anything bought or processed, or buy anything sold or processed, or

Speaker 8 process anything, sold, bought, or processed, or repair anything sold, bought, or processed. You know, as a career, I don't want to do that.

Speaker 5 Next award.

Speaker 5 This age like fine wine. What is something from this movie now, gosh, 35, 36 years later, that has aged really really well and

Speaker 5 for me as watching this over this last weekend a couple things stood out one is the music the music is aged like fine wine oh my god peter gabriel that song's incredible

Speaker 5 my pride.

Speaker 5 I reach out from inside,

Speaker 5 the light, the heat in your eyes.

Speaker 5 I am completely your eyes. I see the door in your eyes, a thousand churches.

Speaker 5 Just late 80s music. And

Speaker 5 not to sound cheesy here, but just Lloyd really believing in his worth.

Speaker 5 He knows he's not the cool kid in school. He's not rich.
He's got to live with his sister, his real-life sister, the amazing Joan Cusack.

Speaker 5 But he really believes in his worth. And there's a great moment when one of the classmates at the party comes up to him and says, how did you get a date with her?

Speaker 5 And he says, I'm Lloyd Dobbler.

Speaker 5 And he's just understanding his worth and value as a man, as a young man, I think that's timeless. You really have to understand what the worth you bring to the romantic table.

Speaker 5 So that's my choice for what's age-like fine wine. Any thoughts, Tremor?

Speaker 1 Yeah, no, I agree with everything you're saying. And I think

Speaker 1 that just the pursuit of love is timeless. Yeah.

Speaker 1 That I can just imagine like cavemen clonking

Speaker 1 some animal on their head and bringing it over this to the cave woman and you know pursuing their pursuit.

Speaker 1 I just feel like my children could watch this and

Speaker 1 it's still relevant to them.

Speaker 1 That and

Speaker 1 Lloyd's trench coat.

Speaker 5 Oh, they trench coat. They're timeless.

Speaker 5 Absolutely. Wow, I've got this image now of a caveman standing outside a cavewoman's cave, holding a giant rock over his head, like, or smacking a couple rocks together.

Speaker 5 Completely. Completely.

Speaker 1 yeah my husband and I always talk about that like that it's the

Speaker 1 it's that some of these things are just primal like with love you know yeah

Speaker 1 and

Speaker 1 we talk about that as he calls himself a caveman sometimes in that pursuit you know in the pursuit but it's it's timeless pursuing love is timeless to me

Speaker 5 yeah

Speaker 5 and I think Cameron Crowe's writing

Speaker 5 his screenplay, the writing is timeless. And these characters, I should have mentioned earlier, I just think John Cusack and Ione Skye are absolutely ethereal.
10 out of 10.

Speaker 5 They're just so, they embody these people.

Speaker 5 I never feel, I can never catch them acting per se.

Speaker 5 Maybe that's partially the dialogue, but I think their performances are so real. John Mahoney is incredible, but these two leads are absolutely incredible.

Speaker 5 As a rom-com movie expert, do you feel the same way, or how do you feel about their performances?

Speaker 1 I love their performances.

Speaker 1 One of the things that I found, I guess,

Speaker 1 uncomfortable and awkward is, and that's just because

Speaker 1 it's a cultural thing, right? And is that Diane Court's relationship with her father, where she tells him everything.

Speaker 1 You know, usually if you're going to talk about the first time you... you have sex with someone, you go to your girlfriends to talk about them.
He goes to his girlfriends, like Opera does.

Speaker 1 But she went to her father, and

Speaker 1 that was awesome, but would never, ever, ever, ever happen to me. You know, my father's a Mexican man from Mexico and no,

Speaker 1 to this day, I, in his eyes, I have not had sex even.

Speaker 1 We have three children, but so it's not that it's unrealistic. It was just, wow, that is very different.

Speaker 1 And that's, I guess, like when writing, in writing romantic comedies, and

Speaker 1 I

Speaker 1 write them, and I am Mexican-American, and so if I tend to write them with characters that are Latino, and that brings the cultural element of

Speaker 1 things.

Speaker 1 And I just don't think that I could ever write

Speaker 1 Latino characters telling their parents, you know, that they just had sex for the first time.

Speaker 5 I don't know. I know, I couldn't

Speaker 5 ever imagine my younger self having told my parents, either one of my parents, about that. Yeah.

Speaker 5 Yeah.

Speaker 5 I was raised Roman Catholic, so you just didn't talk about that in Ohio in the 80s and 90s. Forget about it.

Speaker 1 I mean, and now I really think about my own children, and I'm like, I don't know.

Speaker 1 I

Speaker 1 don't know that I would want to know either.

Speaker 1 You know, I don't know. That's that is one left to be addressed, I guess.
We're not there yet.

Speaker 5 Yeah, no, totally.

Speaker 5 I imagine the casting in a rom-com is just so important. Finding the right people to embody these roles.

Speaker 5 In your movie,

Speaker 5 again, there's Vanessa Vasquez and there's Luis. I'm sorry, say his name again.
Lucy. Luis Vucez.

Speaker 5 But her female friends.

Speaker 1 Oh, they're fabulous.

Speaker 5 They're incredible. I just want to hang with them.
I want to be one of the girls. Yeah.

Speaker 1 Jackie Cruz plays Ruby.

Speaker 5 And Ruby's great.

Speaker 1 Aspiring social media influencer. And Jackie Cruz was on Orange is the New Black.
She played,

Speaker 1 I can't remember the name of her character, but she was one of the Cholita, as we call them.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 1 she's actually so, so, so funny.

Speaker 1 She's, she, I think her character was the hardest to play because Jackie is very smart and very, um,

Speaker 1 she's also very light, so she brought that to Ruby for sure. Yeah, you know, we had Vanessa Vasquez played Adela, and she's an entrepreneur, um, aspiring,

Speaker 1 aspiring to have this beautiful art gallery, so she's got this serious business side to her. And then Christina, played by Vivian Lamoli, what is a single mother in our movie, Say a Little Prayer.

Speaker 1 And so, I think Ruby, the kind of flighty, free spirit, has 10 jobs because she won't be tied down, to me seems like the hardest one. And Jackie Cruz nailed it.

Speaker 5 And she has to.

Speaker 1 I thought she was one of the favorites of our audiences.

Speaker 5 I thought she was wonderful. I thought the writing of the...

Speaker 5 So, just for the listener who hasn't seen the movie yet, Ruby is under the impression that the main male actor is into her rather than the Vanessa Vasquez's lead female character.

Speaker 5 So Ruby's character, sorry, the character of Ruby has to

Speaker 5 think that Luis's character is into her. And the reasons why he's not are very believable.
He's a gentleman. He doesn't want to make her feel bad.

Speaker 5 But it leads to some conflict between the girlfriends, but Ruby was really embodied in a very real way.

Speaker 5 So who you choose really helps deliver a believable character as much as the words on the page, I would think.

Speaker 1 Absolutely. Absolutely.
And, you know, the audition process

Speaker 1 is very important.

Speaker 1 But it all, I don't know, there's not been one movie that I've produced or written,

Speaker 1 more produced on the producing side, where we felt like, oh, we didn't,

Speaker 1 that was just bad cast. We didn't cast that very well.

Speaker 1 It has really

Speaker 1 been presented with such beautiful talent. So in this particular one, Say a Little Prayer, we keep getting that comment over and over that the relationship with the girls is so wonderful.

Speaker 1 Yeah, Nancy de Dosantos did a wonderful job in her writing.

Speaker 5 Yeah.

Speaker 5 And be warned, guys, if you watch the movie, you're probably going to fall in love with Vanessa Vasquez, the lead actress. I did.
My girlfriend said, okay, she's your hall pass if it ever happens.

Speaker 5 Oh, wow.

Speaker 1 That's awesome.

Speaker 5 Although back in the day, my hall pass would have been Ione Skye from Say Anything.

Speaker 5 Okay, back to the rom-comies. Let's talk about the the next category.

Speaker 5 What aged like warm milk? What has aged poorly from this movie? I think the big thing is

Speaker 5 there's something was going on in the 80s rom-coms. There was a lot of

Speaker 5 overly persistent men who were coming on a little strong at times. And there's, of course, I think the boombox scene from this movie is arguably more famous than the movie itself.

Speaker 5 Such an iconic image. Such an incredible image that more people probably know the boombo scene than actually have seen say anything.

Speaker 5 But of course, there was a lot of movies happening back then where the guy would just, you know, I don't know if you've ever seen,

Speaker 5 what was the

Speaker 5 Brat Pack movie, San Elmo's Fire, where

Speaker 5 Emilio Estevez's character drives hours and hours to essentially stalk

Speaker 5 a female character.

Speaker 5 We've got Lloyd with the boombox outside her window. And anyway, I think that has not aged all that well for obvious reasons.

Speaker 1 No, no, no.

Speaker 1 But the boombox scene,

Speaker 1 so I'm, again, I'm

Speaker 1 Mexican-American, and in

Speaker 1 our culture, we have the SENA, the serenade.

Speaker 1 And it was with trios outside of the window.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 1 that really was, I'm even watching it with my husband on Friday, we were re-watching it. And he's like, oh, this is the modern serenade, you know, for Seranata.

Speaker 1 And so I really, truly appreciated it.

Speaker 1 I think

Speaker 1 that would have aged

Speaker 1 well.

Speaker 1 The kind of imposing nature of these male characters. Yeah, that didn't age too well.
Right. That is very, very much a part of the 90s back then, I think.

Speaker 5 Yeah. Luckily, we're in a different era now.

Speaker 5 But, okay, next category, the recasting couch. according to my very cursory internet research, a couple other

Speaker 5 actors considered for the role of Lloyd were Robert Downey Jr.

Speaker 5 and Christian Slater.

Speaker 5 And I could see Downey doing this. He has that hyper-verbal vibe of Lloyd Dobbler.
Christian Slater, though, I just feel like he's too cool, too handsome at that age to come off like

Speaker 5 the guy nobody could imagine with Diane Court. Any thoughts on either Downey Jr.
or Christian in these words?

Speaker 1 I researched that as well, and I saw Robert Downey Jr.

Speaker 1 But yeah, Christian Slater, I agree. No, he was too

Speaker 1 bad boy, too

Speaker 1 cool for this.

Speaker 1 That would have actually been a very, like, oh yeah, they belong together. There's no

Speaker 1 pursuit.

Speaker 1 I think that would have been a slam dunk. But I could see Robert Downey Jr.

Speaker 1 I think Matthew Broderick would have been a good

Speaker 5 I can see Broderick for sure.

Speaker 1 Right?

Speaker 5 Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah, that would have worked. That would have worked.
And I didn't really look into find out who Ione Skye was up against, but I just can't imagine. Jennifer Connolly.
Ooh, okay.

Speaker 5 There you go. Yeah.
There you go. And

Speaker 5 yeah.

Speaker 5 I think I. How do you think that would have been if Jennifer Connolly played that role?

Speaker 1 Well, there was another one that was also Elizabeth Shu was being considered for that. I think Elizabeth Shu

Speaker 1 would have been just as good as in that role over Jennifer Connolly, I think.

Speaker 1 I think. I used to love Elizabeth Shu, and, you know, she was in the babysitters club and all that.
So I think that

Speaker 1 I think she would have been great too.

Speaker 5 Cocktail? She's in cocktail. Oh, yeah.

Speaker 5 Crying kid. Yeah.
I had a major crush on her back in the day.

Speaker 1 Oh, yeah.

Speaker 5 There's something about Ione Sky's smile.

Speaker 5 She's got a beautiful smile and you can imagine, oh, that's the beautiful woman, young woman, who was just so focused on school and grades that she just basically was not very socialized until very late in the day.

Speaker 5 And somehow she captures that really well.

Speaker 1 Yeah, she did a great job.

Speaker 1 She's just so pretty. And when she came out in that dress, the white dress, when Lloyd went to pick her up at the house.
His reaction, I reacted the same way.

Speaker 5 I was like, whoa.

Speaker 5 She looked at me. That's always.

Speaker 5 Yeah. Well, that's the next category.
The what are they wearing award?

Speaker 5 In a good way, I think she looked incredible in that dress. They did a great job of having the, oh my gosh, isn't this person beautiful moment?

Speaker 5 And yeah, I think that white dress did it. And of course, as you mentioned, Lloyd's trench coat is.
pretty iconic.

Speaker 1 Yeah. Although both my husband and I, when we were watching it, I was watching it again.
He had not seen say anything, which surprised me.

Speaker 1 The white dress was gorgeous, but when

Speaker 1 she arrived at the school, I was, I mean, at the school, I'm sorry, at the party, I was just like, oh my God, she's so overdressed with the flower in her hair.

Speaker 5 Yeah.

Speaker 1 But he didn't, you know, there's no way he cared.

Speaker 5 There's just no way he cared. How great was that party scene?

Speaker 1 Oh, it was amazing.

Speaker 5 It felt like I was watching almost like an Altman movie. It's It's like there was just random moments happening.
There wasn't a real narrative.

Speaker 5 They're not even together at the party. It reminded me of party.

Speaker 5 I don't know what parties are like now, but it reminded me of parties back then where you just go and go off to whatever room or your click and just

Speaker 5 see. All right, see you later.
I'll be with these people over here. Yeah.

Speaker 1 I loved, you know what I loved about that party was

Speaker 1 how responsible

Speaker 1 the kids were,

Speaker 1 the party goers. They had a, was a key master

Speaker 1 where one person would not allow anybody to drive.

Speaker 1 I thought that was so responsible.

Speaker 1 It made me feel better about, like, why didn't people do this? You know?

Speaker 1 So, and that was part of the whole

Speaker 1 charm of it. Like, people saw Lloyd Dobler as a responsible person,

Speaker 1 you know, someone they could count on to not, to help them not make the wrong decisions.

Speaker 5 Right.

Speaker 5 And

Speaker 5 imagining Diane looking at Lloyd from that point of view. I've forgotten that they aren't even together for most of the party because he's the key master.

Speaker 5 But it's so cute. They keep checking in with each other.
Yeah.

Speaker 5 He keeps checking in with her.

Speaker 5 Right.

Speaker 5 Yeah. And

Speaker 5 it was just silly because she could have just walked over and stood next to him as he was the key master, but whatever, fine, fine.

Speaker 5 But I feel like one of the things I tell my clients is, I say, a woman's gonna notice everything,

Speaker 5 great and small. And so

Speaker 5 don't be on all the time in terms of having to be witty and amazing, but just be aware that little things make a big difference.

Speaker 5 And so I imagine Diane noticed how he kept checking in with her, which was sweet. And there was that incredible moment later when he says, oh, don't watch out for that broken glass.
The glass.

Speaker 5 And then she just said, oh, finally, a gentleman who's thinking of me first. And I just thought all these little moments that kind of allow us to,

Speaker 5 in storytelling language,

Speaker 5 it's showing, not telling, which I love as a

Speaker 5 movie fan.

Speaker 1 To add to that, when Lloyd, Lloyd was checking in on her, and this is like, this may have been a, well, it's the director and the writer are the same, but in one moment,

Speaker 1 Lloyd was checking in on her and she's by herself and she turned to the camera and kind of cringed and rolled her eyes and I thought

Speaker 1 he lost her. Like we both my husband and I were like, oh no, he's sort of like stalking stalker, getting stalker vibes again.
But then the next scene was with Corey,

Speaker 1 the Liv Tyler character, Lily, excuse me, Lily Tyler character.

Speaker 1 Lily Tyler is talking about Lloyd to her. You're so lucky.
And then she, and that's when Diane says, he's so sweet. He checks up on me.
Look. And they turn around and sure enough, he's there.

Speaker 5 So

Speaker 1 it also helps when like somebody else talks you up.

Speaker 5 Yep.

Speaker 5 New category, wingman or wing woman award. Absolutely.

Speaker 5 I love that.

Speaker 5 Yeah, I love Lily Taylor. We're going to get to her in a second because I'm a huge fan of her in this movie.

Speaker 5 Next category, next award, Did They Make Kisstery? Where we talk about their kissing chemistry. Actually, you're welcome.

Speaker 5 I would love to hear your point of view on kissing and rom-coms and what can go right or wrong. But it wasn't the first time they kissed that kind of melted me.

Speaker 5 It was when they said goodnight at the end of that first night in the morning. And they don't kiss, but they hug.

Speaker 5 Oh,

Speaker 5 that little hug. It was so sweet and innocent.

Speaker 1 She liked threw herself into him.

Speaker 5 That just melted me. Yeah.
Yeah.

Speaker 5 Talk about a rom-com moment that I've had that kind of moment happen a couple times in real life. and wow

Speaker 5 so it wasn't even their first kiss that I that stood out to me although their chemistry was I think very you know pretty uh above average it was just that sweet way they kind of fell into each other's arms and like and it was just wow they really like each other it was just it was so

Speaker 1 yeah I agree I loved that hug it was I don't think I've ever seen

Speaker 1 that

Speaker 1 since then. Like it was just a hug where you you she was hooked.
And because their first kiss was awkward, it was like after her driving.

Speaker 1 Um, he was helping her learn how to drive, and they kind of kissed.

Speaker 5 Um, you're right, it was a little awkward, wasn't it?

Speaker 1 It was just like pecs, like you know, like

Speaker 1 Woody Woodpecker. And so, the next, but the next scene, there was one of my favorite where they were kissing in the rain,

Speaker 1 and um, oh, that was just so beautiful, like just visually beautiful and romantic, and not a care in the world.

Speaker 1 So, yeah, for the first hug was great, the first kiss, not so good, but that, you know, obviously it got better.

Speaker 5 What about when you're making a movie? Pull back the curtain for us if you can. Okay, in terms of getting a really good kiss,

Speaker 5 any do's and don'ts that you have to help your actors achieve. I don't know what that's like to make a movie.
What's it like trying to get that great kiss happen

Speaker 5 on the screen?

Speaker 1 So, I directed a movie called Free Lunch, and this was with all seventh graders.

Speaker 1 And that one is on Amazon Prime as well. And I had, there was a kiss that had to happen, and it was in the middle of a dance.
And

Speaker 1 they're seventh graders. And so, but these two kids, Connell,

Speaker 1 Connor, William, Barrett, and Joe V. Lee,

Speaker 1 such professionals. But

Speaker 1 it was COVID around that. It was, it was like 2021, post-COVID, right up.
So we still had to follow all these protocols. And so we were outside and we made this outside area look like we were inside.

Speaker 1 But behind the cameras were,

Speaker 1 no lie, probably about 65 people watching. parents who were there

Speaker 1 other kids who were there

Speaker 1 and Connor leans in and he's like can you make them all go away

Speaker 1 and I said Connor that would take so long just

Speaker 1 just they're not here and it doesn't have to be you don't have to hold it for long just enough for us to capture it and and they were so nervous and so you really we in that moment we couldn't we couldn't clear the stage fast enough because of time and so we just had to make them as comfortable as we could in that moment um and and uh

Speaker 1 and they did great and they did great and nobody oohed and owed which was really helpful because that would have been the end of us but um i think that it's like really creating a comfortable for even for adults a comfortable comfortable set you know um

Speaker 1 and now what i actually love for more you know this isn't more this isn't really in rom-coms but for example divorce bait is a comedy and it's a little bit more of a like ranch comedy like in the spirit of girls trip and there were moments where it was alluded to you know things that were intimate and so i love that we now have the intimacy coordinators you know that there's these rules and i as a woman appreciate it so much and i when we didn't have like an official before that we would have women in the in the room and i would be in the room and

Speaker 1 if i was just producer so

Speaker 1 um

Speaker 1 yeah that's what happens behind the scenes Just really making people feel comfortable step by step.

Speaker 5 At any age. Oh, man.
I can't imagine being seventh grader with all those people watching me. Oh, my goodness.

Speaker 1 They did a great job. And they had to do it.
I think they had to do

Speaker 1 five takes maximum. And every time I would say, okay, we need it.
We need to get one more time. Both of them would give me the evil eye.

Speaker 5 Are you kidding me?

Speaker 5 So cute. Okay, next category is the No One Talks Like This in Real Life Award.
Oh my gosh.

Speaker 5 That's a little tricky because Cameron Crowe movies are so naturalistic and it's hard to find that that sounds like a movie. For me, what stood out was,

Speaker 5 again, back to the gas and sip when the guy, when Lloyd's been dumped and one of his pals says, we're going to find you a hot-lipped babe. Nobody talks like that.
I was alive in the late 80s.

Speaker 5 Nobody was such a hot. hot-lipped babe.
That was the one moment that didn't sound like believable dialogue to me. Did anything jump out to you?

Speaker 1 So the one that that jumped out to me was the scene at the party where Lloyd's outside and the counselor comes to her.

Speaker 5 Oh,

Speaker 5 B.B Newerth, yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 1 so the counselor gets out of the, and she goes to this party. Like, that to me was unbelievable, right? And she sits there and they talk about, like, what are you going to do with your life,

Speaker 1 Lloyd? Everybody told me, told us what, what their career choice was going to be. And it just, it seemed

Speaker 1 a little expository for me. That's like the only

Speaker 1 writing critique I had that really stood out. Like, number one, why would anybody invite adults to this party?

Speaker 5 Why is the 30-year-old counselor at this eight party with a bunch of 18-year-olds? Correct.

Speaker 1 Yeah, that was the only thing in it.

Speaker 5 Gotcha.

Speaker 1 Just because I had to find something.

Speaker 1 Right. But you're right.

Speaker 1 That's weird.

Speaker 1 What is it? The sip and go or whatever?

Speaker 5 The gas and sip. Yeah, gas and sip.
Find you a hot-lipped babe.

Speaker 5 And then, oh, man, how about this? So BB Newearth, who plays Lilith on Frasier, I'm sorry, on Cheers and guest starring on Frasier in a movie with Frasier's dad. Oh, man.
Parallel universes.

Speaker 5 Who knows?

Speaker 5 Okay. Next category, the Judy Greer Award.
for the side character who deserves their own movie. For me, this is an easy choice.
I think Lily Taylor, as Corey, is incredible.

Speaker 5 The song she sings, the heartbroken song she sings about the guy who ended it with her. I think she's a scene stealer.

Speaker 5 The whole movie about her writing bitter love songs, her finding love. I would love to see a movie about Corey, Lily Taylor.

Speaker 5 That'll never be me. That'll never be me.
That'll never be. Never be me.
No.

Speaker 5 That'll never be me. That'll never be me.
That'll never be me. Joe'll never be ready.

Speaker 1 Absolutely. And that song, Joe Lies, Joe Lies,

Speaker 1 must best be made into a single.

Speaker 5 Right now.

Speaker 5 Joe Lies.

Speaker 5 What a scumbag he is, that character.

Speaker 1 Oh my gosh. So hard.

Speaker 1 But the fact that he's even in there, the fact that we get to meet him and see what a douchebag he is.

Speaker 5 Yeah.

Speaker 5 And again, it had been so long since I'd seen this until recently for for your chat with me today that

Speaker 5 I wasn't sure what was going to happen. I'd forgotten.
And I was waiting for her to collapse into his arms. Instead, she's like, eh, you're not good enough for me.
Yeah. Yes.

Speaker 5 I love her in that. Yeah.

Speaker 5 Okay. Next, we have another category I just made up, so it's okay if you're not ready for this one.
I just was thinking of some fun things to talk about.

Speaker 5 This is called the Oscar Doesn't Go To Award for overacting.

Speaker 5 It's It's just a small moment. This is when an actor just dials it up to an 11 and isn't necessary.

Speaker 5 It's when Jeremy Piven is freaking out at the party and about the keys or whatever he's yelling about. And that's the moment when Lloyd has to say, you must chill.
You must chill.

Speaker 5 But Piven, Piven dials that way up to 11. Other than that, I felt like everybody was really grounded and totally believable.
But that was the moment where I thought, okay, dial it down there, Jeremy.

Speaker 1 Yeah, I would have to say say I agree. I totally agree.
The first time was really funny,

Speaker 1 and then it was a little much. But I still, again,

Speaker 1 I appreciated it was these characters

Speaker 1 in the 90s movies that like there, I don't know what was the movie, another John Cuzak movie where there was this kid that was running around asking John Cuzak's character.

Speaker 1 I think it's One Crazy Summer for $2.

Speaker 1 And the kid would just go.

Speaker 5 be like, Oh, my $2.

Speaker 5 $2.

Speaker 5 Yes. I forget the name of it, but I know exactly what you mean.
Summer,

Speaker 5 I think it's a different name, but I know exactly the movie.

Speaker 1 Better Off Dead.

Speaker 5 Thank you. Nailed it.
Yes.

Speaker 1 Better Off Dead. And it's just these random little moments.
And I think that this was one of them. It really made me

Speaker 1 think, like, oh, this is those quirky moments, these quirky characters that just

Speaker 1 have a presence for like 15 seconds and then they're gone.

Speaker 5 Right.

Speaker 5 The

Speaker 5 genre swap award for possible other names for this movie if it was remade in different genres. Let me throw a couple ideas at you.
Okay. Horror Movie.

Speaker 5 I know you said anything last summer. Yes.

Speaker 5 Or Nightmare on Dobbler Street.

Speaker 1 Oh, that's a good one.

Speaker 5 I wouldn't mind seeing that. Or Cinemax After Dark.

Speaker 5 Lay Anything?

Speaker 5 Oh,

Speaker 5 Starring Deep Lloyd.

Speaker 1 Oh, goodness. You went there.

Speaker 1 Mine for the Cinemax After Dark was Moan Anything.

Speaker 5 Ooh.

Speaker 5 There you go.

Speaker 5 There you go. Terrible.

Speaker 1 Terrible. Oh, my goodness.

Speaker 5 All right.

Speaker 5 Next, the tear-jerking trophy. I think we already talked about this, the moment that really got your heart.
Well, maybe you have another one for this.

Speaker 5 For me, it was that sweet little non-kiss hug at the end of their first date that we already talked about. That teared me up a little bit.

Speaker 5 And then just the moment when they're holding hands and about to fly off into the great unknown in the airplane in the very last scene, that got me.

Speaker 5 I didn't actually choke up, but I could feel the heartstrings being tugged.

Speaker 5 What moment tugged most of your heartstrings?

Speaker 1 The moment where after she breaks up with him and she hands him the pen.

Speaker 5 Oh,

Speaker 1 it's it's raining once again, so it was really juxtaposing the kiss in the rain for me. He's on the phone with his sister in the phone booth and

Speaker 1 he says,

Speaker 1 she gave me a pen. I gave her my heart and she gave me a pen.
Like,

Speaker 1 even now,

Speaker 1 I'm affected by that. Like, it was tearjerker.
I felt so bad for him, you know? Yeah.

Speaker 1 Such a beautiful.

Speaker 5 It takes you back to whoever your first breakup was, the first time you were broken up with. For me, it was Angie in college.

Speaker 5 And I remember I just slept on a cot in my apartment for two weeks, never talking to anybody, thinking, well, life is over for me. I'll never find love again.

Speaker 5 And come to think of it, yeah, that's how, probably how, how Lloyd felt. Yeah.

Speaker 5 Okay.

Speaker 5 Happily ever after or happily never after? In other words, what's the over-under on how long? these two last.

Speaker 5 They're so young. I mean, they're going off to London, so I suppose it'll last as long as she's there in London.

Speaker 5 But I can't see it going more than more than the duration of her.

Speaker 5 Yeah.

Speaker 5 You know, basically, as long as they're in London, they have a shop, but

Speaker 5 they're kids. They're basically each other's first loves.
So they're going to look back on each other

Speaker 5 as each other's first true loves. But I think it's got, you know, six months max.

Speaker 1 Oh, six months. Wow.
Okay. I'll leave it till like the end of their 20s.

Speaker 5 Ooh, you really think there's a longer-term chance?

Speaker 1 Yeah, well, I mean,

Speaker 1 I don't know.

Speaker 1 I'm a believer in that in your 20s, you should

Speaker 1 go out and date as much as you can and

Speaker 1 get that out of your, out of your system,

Speaker 1 kiss a frog or two.

Speaker 1 And then in your 30s, that's when you can start really

Speaker 1 thinking about marriage and stuff like that. So I just,

Speaker 1 I gave him just a little more than, I mean, a lot more than you did, but I mean, if they were, I think he would want to marry her, but I think she would eventually get bored.

Speaker 5 Okay.

Speaker 1 You know, I don't know.

Speaker 5 But you know what? But there's another moment in the movie where, and I forget the exact quote, but he basically says, no matter what happens, I had the time with her I had.

Speaker 5 And I feel like he's always going to have Diane Court. is

Speaker 5 something to feel confident about. I tell my clients that.
If it ends with a woman you were really into,

Speaker 5 I try to encourage them to say, okay, well, she wasn't the one long-term, but that means you're capable of a wonderful woman in your life.

Speaker 5 And it won't be her maybe forever, but that means you can find somebody fantastic. So hopefully, if, I think you're right, I think Diane will end it with Lloyd eventually.

Speaker 5 And Lloyd is smart enough and resilient enough to say, okay, this happened for me, not to me. Let me find somebody who's even better for me.

Speaker 1 Agreed.

Speaker 5 That's my hope anyway. Two final categories.
The Grand Gesture Award. Here's my question for you about this.

Speaker 5 Since we already pretty much talked about the boombox moment, this iconic grand gesture that's arguably more famous in the movie itself.

Speaker 5 If you, back your younger self, your younger single self, if a man was standing outside of your home with a boombox, what song would you want him to be playing?

Speaker 1 With a boombox?

Speaker 1 Oh man.

Speaker 5 Or would you prefer it to be, you mentioned the

Speaker 5 trio of singers, right? The trio.

Speaker 1 I mean, not that I prefer it, but what, I mean, any, any,

Speaker 1 I used to be into RB a lot. Okay.
And so

Speaker 1 I don't know. It's so RB love songs back then, like Keith Sweat, you know,

Speaker 5 Johnny Gill. Okay.

Speaker 1 Any of those really romantic

Speaker 1 songs that they sang

Speaker 1 would really tug at my heartstrings. Because just it's so nostalgic for me.

Speaker 1 So any of those songs on a boombox would be fun.

Speaker 5 Great. I love it.
For me, if a woman were ever going to do that to me, I'm a musical theater nerd. So

Speaker 5 give me suddenly Seymour.

Speaker 5 Okay.

Speaker 5 You're so funny. I'm a sucker for musical theater.

Speaker 5 Okay, last category, last big question.

Speaker 5 What is this movie's biggest love lesson? I thought about this as I was watching it, and to me,

Speaker 5 this movie just hit me in the strongest way, like a sledgehammer in a great way, when Lily Taylor's Corey

Speaker 5 says to Lloyd, you know,

Speaker 5 so Diane is broken up with him, and he's, you know, he's...

Speaker 5 He's upset, and he's trying to decide how to play it. You know, should I do this? Should I do that? Should I play it cool? And Lily Taylor just says something so powerful.

Speaker 5 She says, Look, the world is full of guys.

Speaker 5 Don't be a guy. Be a man.
Basically, she's saying to him, You know, she's dealing with a lot of stuff. Her dad's issues with the law.

Speaker 5 Empathy. Give her space.
Don't play games. Just be a man, not a guy.
And I thought, oh my god, what an amazing lesson from this movie.

Speaker 5 Be a man, not a guy. That was my biggest love lesson.
What are you talking about? Lloyd, why do you have to be like this? Because I'm a guy. I have pride.
You're not a guy.

Speaker 5 I am. No.
No, the world is full of guys. Be a man.
Don't be a guy.

Speaker 1 Yeah, no. I love that.
I didn't even think of that. I feel like,

Speaker 1 you know, in the beginning scene, they say

Speaker 1 they're having that conversation, and then they're like, he's like,

Speaker 1 they discuss, like, what's a scam? It was like, Lloyd says, what's a scam? Corey says, going out as friends.

Speaker 1 DC says, no, it's not. The scam is lusting.
And then Lloyd and Corey say, then what's a date? Pre-arranged with the possibility for love. And then Corey says,

Speaker 1 well, then what's love?

Speaker 1 So I feel like this whole movie answers just that. And for me, it's like

Speaker 1 when it comes to love, you just have to take a chance.

Speaker 1 You know, and to what you're saying, I think with Lloyd, it was

Speaker 1 even if it was 16 weeks, he he was willing to be with her, and that was his sole purpose, and then he'd worry about

Speaker 1 16, you know, past the 16 weeks when it came.

Speaker 5 Right. Well, the cliché, it's a cliche, but I think it's true.
Better to have loved and lost than never to have loved at all. Right.
And he will always have had her.

Speaker 5 in his life and vice versa if it doesn't last long term. And hey, by now he's probably a champion kickboxer

Speaker 5 Right. You know, with some

Speaker 5 of

Speaker 5 wife and kids.

Speaker 5 Wonderful.

Speaker 5 Christina, thank you so much for being here. This was a blast.
Well, thank you for having me.

Speaker 1 And I want to

Speaker 1 let everybody know that Say a Little Prayer is

Speaker 1 coming out on Amazon Prime and Apple TV on

Speaker 1 Valentine's Day. And so it could be a Galentine's or a Valentine's Day

Speaker 1 event for you.

Speaker 5 Yep.

Speaker 1 But please enjoy it. It's directed by Patrick Perez-Vidauri, written by Nancy de los Santos and led, produced by yours truly.

Speaker 5 And the very funny Chris Catan is in it from SNL fame. He's great.

Speaker 1 And Tatanka means.

Speaker 1 We have

Speaker 1 telenovela royalty and Jelica Maria. Yeah.

Speaker 1 For those of you out there whose parents watched telenovelas growing up.

Speaker 5 Okay.

Speaker 5 And there's just, again, there's so many moments in the movie that are just fun and charming and sweet.

Speaker 5 And also, again, as a man who coaches men in dating, there's lots of little tips that are sort of buried in the movie. You know, how to start a conversation with a woman in an art museum.

Speaker 1 Or say a little prayer.

Speaker 1 There's an actual prayer that they say

Speaker 1 to Saint Anthony,

Speaker 1 and this is how they all find love. So

Speaker 1 when in doubt, light a candle.

Speaker 5 And what's next for you in movies? Any projects you can tell us about that are coming down the road, down the way, down the road a ways?

Speaker 1 Yeah, so

Speaker 1 currently

Speaker 1 I'm writing a horror.

Speaker 1 Yeah, I'm going to deliver that. And then I wrote a romantic comedy.
It's a teen comedy. And actually, I really have John Cusack in mind and Molly Ringwald.

Speaker 1 And so that is something that we're going to try to get funding for this year and package. But

Speaker 1 I wrote a teen comedy that harkens back to the 90s, the movies of the 90s. So

Speaker 1 that's what my focus will be this year.

Speaker 5 Count me in. Well, Christina Nava, thank you so much for being on the How to Get a Girlfriend podcast, talking about one of your favorite rom-coms.
Thank you for listening, by the way.

Speaker 5 I know you have a million podcasts out there you can be listening to. Thanks for spending some time today with Christina and myself.

Speaker 5 And don't forget, just like Lloyd Dobbler learned with Diane Court your dream girlfriend, she's out there and she's going to love you, but she's going to have to meet the real authentic you.

Speaker 5 So go out there, take those romantic risks like Lloyd had to take and be authentic. And Carpe Datum sees the date.
Till next time.