Master Multiple Credit Cards Without Tanking Your Credit Score (Plus: Giving Tuesday Tips)

This episode is sponsored by Rula. Over six years ago, I felt like I was sinking into a dark hole and I knew I needed to find a professional to speak with.

Finding the right therapist at a price that was right for my pockets at the time wasn't easy, but thankfully I eventually did and my life is better for it.

It was also easier to be consistent with therapy because I had the option of doing it virtually. Telehealth has made mental health care more convenient and also accessible for millions of people.

However, challenges like finding the right therapist, scheduling appointments, and also the expensive out-of-pocket cost still keeps many people from getting the care that they need.

Rula is on a mission to make high-quality mental health care from a licensed professional easy and affordable for everyone. Rula's got you covered.

They take most major insurance plans and the average copay is only $15 per session. You can also now get the quality care that you need when you need it at a price that you can afford.

With Rula, every provider is carefully vetted and chosen for their expertise.

Now you're always going to know you're in the hands of quality providers who are dedicated to making real progress on your care.

Thousands have already trusted Rula to support them on their journey toward improved mental health and overall well-being. Head on over to rula.com slash smartmoney to get started today.

After you sign up, they ask you where you heard about them and we want you to please support our show and tell them that we sent you.

Go to rula.com slash smartmoney and take the first step towards better mental health today. You deserve quality care from somebody who cares.
This episode is sponsored by Quince.

When it comes to holiday gifting, I want to give things people really love. And that means beautiful, timeless pieces that they're going to wear for years.
And that's why I'm going with Quince.

From Mongolian cashmere sweaters to Italian wool coats, everything is premium quality at a price that actually makes sense for your wallet. Quince has something for everyone.

Soft Mongolian cashmere sweaters for $50

that look and feel like designer pieces. They've got silk tops and skirts for dressing up if you like to go out.
And also perfectly cut denim for everyday wear.

And they have outerwear that actually keeps you warm.

I personally love the Italian wool oversized blazer that I got for just $100, which in my opinion is a steal because it's 100% Italian wool and I got it for 100 bucks.

I wear that thing all the time during the winter. It keeps me warm and it also also looks very elegant and fashionable.
Find gifts so good you'll want to keep them with Quince.

Go to quince.com slash smartmoney for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns. Now available in Canada too.
That's q-u-in-ce.com slash smartmoney to get free shipping and 365-day returns.

Quince.com slash smart money.

Did you know that a man in India made the Guinness World Record for the largest collection of valid credit credit cards in 2021? Yep, he had a whopping 1,638 credit cards.

You probably didn't have to worry about a credit score, but today we're going to look at how having multiple credit cards could impact yours.

Welcome to NerdWallet Smart Money Podcast, where you send us your money questions and we answer them with the help of our genius nerds. I'm Elizabeth Ayola.

In a bit, we'll discuss how having multiple credit cards can affect your credit score. But first of all, it's almost time for Giving Tuesday.

To explore the topic of giving, we have Grace Nicolette on as a guest.

She is the Vice President of Programming and External Relations at the Center for Effective Philanthropy and a co-host of the Giving Done Right podcast. Hello, Grace.
Hello. It's great to be with you.

So first of all, can we talk about what Giving Tuesday is for those who have never heard about it before? Giving Tuesday is a global movement that started, boy, maybe 20, 25 years ago now.

And it's this idea that during the season of the year where we're thinking about what we're thankful for and being with family members, that it's actually a really great opportunity to band together and to give.

And it might be a great way that people can be teed up to think about giving if otherwise they might not think about it that much. So they can kind of wait until this date if they needed to.

And so it's since really grown and exploded. And it's now a global movement where, you know, across many countries, nonprofits and donors are excited about it.

It's so interesting that you talk about how after we've done all that spending, right? Giving Tuesday comes right after Cyber Monday, which is like the cousin of Black Friday.

And I find it interesting because there's this big push for spending mostly throughout the holidays. And then you have this one day for giving.

But after people have spent all this money, where do you budget in charitable giving or spending? If it were up to me, I wouldn't have put those two dates together.

You know, one of the things that we talk about at the Center for Effective Philanthropy where I work is that it's really important to actually be very intentional about our giving.

So I know that sometimes we can end up buying things that we don't mean to buy. And then it is actually really hard to have money left over for giving to others who might be in need.

And so we always recommend being really intentional. What are your values? What would you like to give this year? And really setting goals and meeting those goals.

And when you say being intentional, what I take from that is maybe planning ahead. So how far ahead should people be thinking about charitable giving?

Because usually there's a lot of talk around it around the end of the year. I think that there is room for what people call expressive giving.
So you are asked or you're moved.

And so you may not have planned to give something, but then you did. I think that's absolutely great and very needed and really much a part of the giving traditions that a lot of us come from.

I think though, that given the needs of the world, especially those with means, and that would include many people in the Western world, that we should think about what can we give to those around us who may not have as much, or even those across oceans who may be struggling.

And so I do think that thinking ahead, thinking what proportion of my income or even wealth should I be giving and when.

So certainly by default in the United States, a lot of people wait until the end of the year.

Historically, that's been for tax reasons. There really is no reason why it has to be done this time of year.

If you talk to any nonprofit leaders, they would rather that you do it and spread it out throughout the year.

I think that even just having these conversations, maybe with your family, maybe with a financial planner, or even just people who are working in causes that you care about can really start spurring some of that thinking.

And you mentioned a little bit earlier that for Giving Tuesday specifically, you know, the idea of giving on that day or around that time has blown up over the years.

What trends have you seen, if any, in terms of maybe how people are giving? It's an exciting time to be in the giving space.

I think that donors who are now starting to open up their eyes to how I can give more smartly or how I can give with other people, whether it's people in my family or people in my community.

It's actually a really exciting time to be diving in. There's a lot of interesting innovations.

You've had people like Mackenzie Scott, who's the ex-wife of Jeff Bezos, who's literally given billions of dollars to all different kinds of causes, including most recently a lot of HBCUs.

And there's a way that she does it that I think has really spurred a lot of really interesting conversation. I think we're also seeing a lot more giving together, so giving circles.

So sometimes it can just feel really lonely to give. You want to make sure that you're giving in a way that...
is having an impact.

And there's actually like a learning journey to be had along the way. And so doing it with others can be like a really transformative experience.

I love that you you mentioned McKenzie giving these large amounts to the HBCUs.

And it makes me think about people who sometimes don't want to give because they say, well, you know, there's these large organizations and they're getting all the money and how much is actually trickling down to the people who need it, right?

So for people who are not sure where to give to but want to give, how can they think about their decision-making process in giving or where to give their money? I would say it takes all types, right?

Like the big organizations are big because they have the ability to attract donors. Now, if you talk to people who work there, they'll probably dispel the myth that they don't need the funding.

I would just say, starting with getting curious, like, what are causes that you care about? Do you know anyone who works with those causes? And then doing some online research.

What's great about in the United States is that, you know, there's tax filings for all these nonprofits. You can actually go on and look, read their inner reports and kind of learn about them.

You don't have to give to an organization that you don't trust or you feel like may not need your funding, but do find one that really aligns with your values.

And if you're planning to give a big gift, reach out to them, have a conversation, ask your questions. They would welcome that.
Pay them a visit.

Nonprofit leaders really love to show you the impact that they're making.

And it really is starting a journey that will get you deeper and deeper in understanding some of the issues that you care about.

So what are some red flags that people should look out for when they're doing that research?

If you don't have any connection, to a nonprofit, I think it is worth maybe reaching out, having a conversation, you know, doing some online searches just to see have they been in the news?

What are they working on? And what might some of the biggest needs be?

In terms of red flags, is if the IRS has tagged them as not having like a completed or a clean audit, that would be a major red flag, or if their leadership or the organization itself has been involved with any kind of legal action.

But that is such a tiny proportion of nonprofits.

And sometimes I feel like we can have this outsized view that nonprofits are somehow very dangerous to give to or somehow bloated and there's real risk in giving to them because it might be wasted or even corrupted.

And that just simply isn't borne out by the facts.

One myth that I love to bust since you asked about kind of flags is for a donor, I would say it's really important not to think about whether you should give to a nonprofit based on like something like an administrative overhead ratio.

I hear this a lot. It's like, well, I don't want to give this nonprofit because, you know, 35% of their money goes to admin overhead versus this one where it's 15%.

And I feel like what that shows is actually a fundamental misunderstanding of how nonprofits operate.

So when you are working on an issue, depending on the issue and depending on the type of organization, that overhead can be really important, especially like if you are, let's say, your organization is all about the people, right?

Like let's say you're a tutoring organization or something like that. Attracting and keeping talent in nonprofits is really important.

You want your best and brightest working on some of the most intractable problems, and you simply cannot tell anything by an administrative ratio like that.

So I wish there was that one thing that could just check the box and tell you, but it does take more research than that. And I wouldn't rely on any one single measure.

I know one of the tax benefits of charitable giving is that you can potentially lower your taxes. What are some of the tax benefits of charitable giving? And actually, it's been changing a lot.

I think in the Big Beautiful bill, we see a lot of changes that are coming our way. My understanding is that the changes actually make it easier for smaller donors to itemize their giving.

So we're hoping that that actually encourages more donors to give. And I think it's important to point out that in other countries, many other countries, there is no tax deduction for giving.

It is in some ways a unique feature of the U.S. tax system.

And there really is this sort of understanding that by charitable giving, you're actually partnering with the government in some ways or or partnering with the social compact that we all have that we're kind of doing our part to give back to society.

So I think it's a great thing. Nonprofit leaders will be the first to tell you they need large, generous donors, right, to sustain them.

I think that donors often say, oh, I want to find a nonprofit that is, you know, going to be self-sustaining. There is no such thing.

Nonprofits are self-sustaining when donors actually choose to sustain them. We shouldn't expect every nonprofit to like, you know, bust out a business model.

Some of these nonprofits are specifically working on issues caused by market failure. And so a business model isn't necessarily going to be the answer for every organization.

So, you know, that sustainability question really can be answered by faithful and generous donors.

For those who are curious about potentially how much you could deduct through charitable giving, and generally you can deduct up to 60% of your adjusted gross income via charitable donations, but you might be limited to 20%, 30%, or 50%, depending on the type of contribution and the organization.

But NerdWallet has information on that as well as the IRS in case you wanted to know. So this year, we experienced a myriad of challenges that have impacted the economy and our pockets.

Many people unfortunately suffered through the government shutdown. And I personally have noticed several grassroots initiatives and community fundraising to help people in financial binds.

What role does that type of giving play in our current socioeconomic landscape? Oh, it's so vital.

You know, we saw this starting in COVID that I think there was a greater recognition that people who are in communities that are historically overlooked or marginalized, they experience the first brunt of really big macro trends that happen.

So like the COVID pandemic with job losses and not being able to show up in person, we're actually seeing that play out again this year with government funding cuts, widespread job loss from loss of federal jobs, and also just the economy not being as strong as one would hope.

And so I think that those kinds of mutual aid organizations and functions are really, really vital right now.

And sometimes they are more formalized in the form of a nonprofit, but they can also be part of religious institutions. They could also be just neighbor to neighbor.

I would say if you haven't really gotten involved in that way, This is actually the perfect time to do it. Donors are often really worried about whether or not they can make an impact.

They really want to know that their involvement and their dollars are really going to go the distance. I'm telling you right now, they will go the distance.
People are really hungry.

Food insecurity is at an all-time high. We just did a study.
30% of nonprofits have lost government funding. People are getting let go left and right from the sector.

And there really is a way to help people with some of their most basic needs, putting food on the table, medical bills. I mean, you name it.

There are so many groups in civil society that focus on these issues. So get started.
If you haven't already, ask questions. This is really a moment to not sit back.

And Grace, I will say sometimes if you're anything like me and you get overwhelmed by all of the problems in the world and you want to help everyone, sometimes you end up helping no one because there are too many choices and you don't know where to start or you feel like it's not enough.

So what advice would you give people who maybe feel a little overwhelmed? I can really relate to that. I mean, it is very, very real.
We can't save everyone.

I mean, and none of us are are Mackenzie Scott where what we would give would really kind of move the needle in a big way, but we still can play our part and it is important that we do.

And so I think that just start somewhere. I was actually speaking with someone recently who said, I try to say yes when I'm asked to do something.
And I thought that was really great.

It's like, what a great kind of posture to live with. You can't solve everything, but you can start.
somewhere and who knows where that somewhere will lead you.

And so I would say, whether that's calling up the one person that you know who works in a cause that you really care about or going online and doing some research about nonprofits in your area, contacting your local community foundation, which is usually a great resource for understanding the needs in your community.

Just get a start, you know, one step after another, one foot ahead of the other. Let's not be paralyzed by the scope of the problem, but we have a role to play.

I give to several different organizations and usually I choose when I'm pulled to something. Honestly, a lot of them came through Netflix documentaries.
Oh, nice.

So, you know, they might have a foundation and then I'll end up just giving a recurring donation.

But all that to say, everything that I donate to aligns with my personal values and the things that I would like to see in the world. So how can people give in accordance with their values?

Your example speaks to me that the story and the understanding that you gained by watching those documentaries has really kind of changed your perspective on it. And now you're involved, right?

And so I would say for most folks, that's a great place to start if you don't know where to start reading the news.

Like, what are some of the things that when you read it, you're like, man, somebody should really work on that. Kind of listening to yourself and asking those questions.

We often don't make time to do that. We might be thoughtful about doing research on things that we buy or things that we want to do, like vacations and all that.

But, you know, it really does take a level of intentionality. and even strategic thinking when it comes to where we should give.
And we can make such a big difference if we do that.

And so, yeah, just getting started anywhere is great my last question for you grace is

what are some ways that you personally like to give and will you be giving specifically on giving tuesday it's funny i have grown so much now that i'm working in philanthropy it's interesting i i am still changing in the ways that i give every year it hasn't been this static thing i'll be honest that the mckenzie scott example as we've studied it in our organization has made me understand more deeply how impactful it is to nonprofits when donors don't spread their giving around, but actually give really deeply to just a fewer number of nonprofits.

And so I've been trying to do that a little bit more. Certainly food banks are a big part of what I'm thinking about right now.

The number of people that they're serving is like at record-breaking levels. We're talking about people who are the working poor.
Most people are working.

They just cannot afford to keep the food on the table because of either disability or their jobs are just not paying as much. So that's very front of mind for me.
Yeah.

And I would also just say, if there are opportunities to give with your friends or with your family, that can just be really special.

Over the years, I've had a couple opportunities to talk to my elderly parents about giving together. And it's been something that we've really enjoyed doing.

Like they've actually introduced me to a couple of nonprofits and vice versa. And so there's been a richness to that interaction.
And I also have kids now.

So I'm trying to involve them in thinking about how they can give back. So doing it with other people can be really special.

Thank you so much, Grace Nicolette, for coming and talking to us about giving. Thanks for having me.
Next up, we'll be chatting about whether having multiple credit cards can hurt your credit score.

But before we get into that, think about where you need some guidance with your money.

Maybe credit cards have hurt your score and you need tips for getting out of debt, or you're anxious about the upcoming tax season and need strategies for preparing.

Whatever your money question, we nerds are here to help you. So leave us a voicemail.
You can also text us on the nerd hotline at 901-730-6373. That's 901-730-NERD.

All right, let's get to this episode's money question segment. That's up next.
Stay with us.

Today's episode is sponsored by ADT. You're ready for the holidays.
The turkey has been going since this morning. The sides are perfectly seasoned.

The out-of-towners have a bed, couch, or futon to crash on for the night. All that's left to take care of is your peace of mind.
And that's why ADT is here.

With their professionally installed home security systems, you get protection that helps you feel safe. So you can focus on that pie that you forgot to bake.
When every second counts, count on ADT.

Visit ADT.com or call 1-800-ADTASAP to find out more.

The seven-seat Volvo EX90 is a car made for finding tranquility in traffic with a serene Scandinavian interior. Made for safely navigating the Golden State, from Big Sur to the Bay Bridge.

And with intuitive technology and Google built-in, it's the car made for finding the best taco truck in East LA. The fully electric Volvo EX90 is perfect for California.

Visit Volvocars.com slash US to learn more. Google is a trademark of Google LLC.

We're back and answering your money questions to help you make smarter financial decisions. This episode's question comes from Eileen, who sent us an email.

I've listened to several of your podcasts regarding all the travel rewards credit cards, including the recent one where a travel writer, I think, took her whole family to Europe in business class.

She mentions their household has over 40 credit cards. Can you address how having so many credit cards affects your credit score?

Do people open cards, get the points, use the points, close the card, and get a new card with sign-up bonus points? What does this do to your credit score? Thank you, Eileen.

Now, to help us answer Eileen's question on this episode of the podcast, we are joined by that travel writer in question, nerd wallet credit card with Aaron Hurd. Welcome back to Smart Money, Erin.

Thanks so much for having me. Hey, Erin, let's start with a simple question and some fact-checking here.
How many credit cards do you have? Well, you know, that question really is not so simple.

I had to go in and count because I knew you were going to be asking me that so that I could give you an exact number.

By the way, I keep most of my credit cards in a baseball binder because they all don't carry with me all the time in my wallet.

So I currently have 27 cards in my name and my husband, who I call my player two, my P2, has 24 cards open in the moment. So that's a total of 51 in our household right now.

That is impressive and a little intimidating. Do you ever forget that you have certain credit cards open? Because it seems like a lot to manage.

Well, I don't because I am a nerd and it is my hobby turned into my job. So I love my cards like they're my babies, but I would understand understand that most people would have a hard time.

I have five, and I'm not saying I have a hard time, but sometimes I have a hard time. So, how did you get to this point, Erin?

Very slowly. The game of credit card rewards and rewards are the reason why I have so many cards.
This is a long game. My husband and I built this portfolio of cards over many, many years.

We're not rushing in and opening a ton of cards and then moving on to the next. It's truly a long game.

And I also wanted to point out that most of the, well, not most, many of these cards are small business credit cards.

My husband is self-employed and I have a few side hustles that make me eligible to apply as a sole proprietor. And actually, many people are eligible for business cards and may not even realize it.

But business credit cards can offer really great rewards and they don't show up on your personal credit report. And that means they largely do not affect your credit score.

I imagine that at a certain point, you might get diminishing returns of having so many cards because you, I assume, have applied for and maybe been approved for many, many cards on the market.

Do you find that you have fewer options nowadays? So each of the issuers has their own guardrails against people just wanting to earn a lot of rewards.

And so sometimes we'll see what we call family rules that forbid you from getting this card if you've ever had it before or if you've had it within a certain amount of time.

And still, there's still plenty of opportunity out there.

So as it relates to our listener's question, having a specific number of cards, whether it's four or 40 or 51, won't necessarily impact your credit score one specific way or another.

What's more important is how you manage your credit, like making on-time payments, not using too much of your available credit, that sort of thing.

Your credit score may temporarily dip after you apply for a credit card due to the credit card company checking your credit, but that's not likely to cause too much damage or last that long.

Erin, can you talk with us about how your credit has been impacted positively or negatively as you've acquired and managed all these various credit cards over the years?

So one of the first assumptions that many people make when they hear about my credit card collection is that I must have a terrible credit score. But actually, that is far from from the truth.

My credit score right now is well above 800, and that's considered an excellent score.

So one of the biggest factors that determines your credit scores is your credit utilization or how much credit you're using compared to how much available you have to you.

So therefore, the more credit cards you have, the more available credit you have.

And that means that opening new cards can actually help improve your credit utilization, which can in turn help your score. Now, of course, that assumes that you aren't maxing out all these cards.

You're not not spending up to your limits. That would not help your credit utilization ratio at all.

And this also assumes that, like I do, that you make on-time payments and you use your credit responsibly.

And in order for this to make sense for me and for anyone doing this, I pay all my bills in full each month.

And that's because the interest that you would pay in carrying a balance on a credit card would far outweigh the rewards that you earn. Quick follow-up question.

Do you know how much total available credit you have across all of your cards? Just yours, not your husband's? Not offhand. A lot more than I would ever spend.

Yeah, I would imagine it's well north of $100,000. Yes.

I'm close to that with my five to six credit cards that I have. So yeah, I'd say probably 3x that, 3, 4x that.
Yeah.

So you, you have to be really diligent and responsible with how you're managing your credit so that you don't go into debt or overspend.

And that I think is a reflection of who you are as a money manager and a person, because for a lot of folks, it can be easy to rack up debt when they see they have so much available credit. All right.

Our listener, Eileen, asked about whether people cycle through credit cards, which means opening them, getting the points, using them, and then closing the card to move on to another card.

Is this a common strategy, Erin? I'll say it's a strategy that will not work for you in the long run. That's because credit card issuers are, they're looking for good customers.

They want to build a relationship. These rewards cost them money.

And so credit card issuers are not looking for fly-by-night churners, we call them, who kind of collect the points and then close the card and move on.

This may have been a more common strategy in the past years ago, but over time, all the credit card issuers have established their own set of guardrails to protect against this kind of behavior.

So it's really not super possible these days. That said, I want to make sure I'm clear that if you open a card today, it does not mean that you're stuck with this card forever down the line.

You're not getting married to this card. You can certainly open a new card.
You can earn the bonus points. You can try it out for a year or two.

And then after that, if you decide that you're just not getting enough value from the card or it's no longer a fit for your spending patterns, you can absolutely re-evaluate.

And the value of that signup bonus that you'll get almost always makes it worth it to try a card for the first year.

But an important rule of thumb here is that you never want to close a card before the one-year mark because that's just the mark of a bad relationship with the credit card issuer. Huh.

So would they maybe be less likely to approve you for another credit card in the future if you do close before that one-year mark? Yes, that's right.

And they could even claw back some of the reward, the bonus points that you have earned. Oh, boy.
Okay. Read the terms and conditions, people.
Yes.

And when you say they, you mean that same issuer or any issuer? That same issuer.

I do see how the strategy that Eileen mentioned could lower your credit score because closing a credit card can reduce the average age of your credit profile and also reduce the total amount of available credit that you have at hand, like we mentioned.

So in this case, just leaving a card open might be the better option. Is that how you approach getting the maximum benefit from your various cards long term? You nailed it.

Closing that card will definitely affect your credit age and your available credit, which will affect your utilization like we just talked about. So here's what I like to do.

If you've tried a card for at least a year and you're pretty sure it's no longer a good fit, maybe the annual fee is too high or it just doesn't fit your spending patterns anymore, there's a few things that you can do first before you cancel it.

So if the card doesn't have an annual fee, that means it doesn't cost you anything to keep it in your lineup. So I'd recommend just holding on to it.

Now, make sure to use it periodically, even just for small purchases, so that you keep the account open and you keep all that good credit age and credit history with it.

But I would just keep it open in most cases there.

And so if the card does have an annual fee, you could first see about downgrading to a card that doesn't have an annual fee or has a lower annual fee.

So that would allow you to keep the card's credit history and the credit line intact.

And you can just call the issuer and ask them what options are available to downgrade or product change your credit card.

And we'll put a link in our show notes with more information about how to do that.

Erin, when someone is evaluating a card and considering whether they might want to downgrade it or maybe even cancel it, what should they be looking at?

Well, they should definitely be looking at all of the benefits that come along with the card that you might not be thinking about in the everyday.

And so, for example, many co-branded airline and hotel credit cards, they often earn high rewards rates on purchases with that hotel or at that airline.

But for most other purchases that you make, you know, at the grocery store, at the gas station, most of those purchases will be earning just one times points on all your purchases.

And that's not a great rate of return. And so if I was evaluating a card just based on that, I might decide to ditch that card after the first year because it's not a great earner.

But I need to make sure to remember to look at all the benefits that the cards come with. So airline credit cards often come with perks like free check bags, priority boarding.

Hotel credit cards often come with a free annual night certificate. And the value of those things, if I'm using them and I'm traveling, those can more than make up for the annual fee.

And so they're worth holding for those reasons. Now, there are a lot of considerations beyond your credit score when you're thinking about how to manage your credit cards.

And one that comes to mind is that while there isn't a specific limit to the number of credit cards that you can have before your credit score is impacted, each person likely has their own individual limit on how many cards they can reasonably manage without feeling overwhelmed.

Erin, Erin, how do you stay on top of all of your cards? I think you have a higher threshold than most people I can think of.

It is such a valid concern that so many people have because you're absolutely right.

It can become overwhelming pretty quickly and it can be really easy to make costly mistakes that will hit you with big fees and really damage your credit. So like I said before, this is a long game.

Go slow as you expand your credit card portfolio. Don't go from zero to 100 all in a day.

So a good way to start is maybe branching branching out to a new credit card that's offered by the same issuer of a card you already have.

So if you have an American Express card, a Chase card, they issue many cards under that brand.

And so if you are opening a new card with an issuer that you already have, you're not juggling a new site, a new login, a new app.

You'll be able to just log into your same account and see your new card there along with your old card. And so that's a good way to kind of ease into it.

Then another tip I have is that some people may not know this, but you can actually request to change the date that your credit card statement closes each month.

So that way, if you have multiple cards, it may help you to keep them straight. If they all have the same due date, that could help keep it simple.

And so you could also set up auto payments that help you make sure you never miss the minimum balance each month to make sure that you're not making any costly mistakes.

Well, what about all of the various rewards that you have to try to earn from these cards and maybe like a minimum for a sign-up bonus and making sure you have regular like charges on each of the card to keep them open?

That just sounds like a lot to keep track of. Do you have some sort of spreadsheet? And how much time do you spend managing all this? I do have a spreadsheet.
Of course.

Yeah, but you know, there are really a slew of apps that have popped up in recent years that are designed to help solve this very problem. They help you keep track of your cards and your rewards.

You know, of course, the NerdWall app can help you see and track all of your credit cards accounts in one place.

And I also really like an app called Award Wallet. This helps you keep track of all your cards.

It helps you track all the perks and benefits, what we sometimes call the coupons that come along with a lot of these cards.

And you can also input all your travel loyalty accounts and your trip plans, and it helps keep it all there in one place. So, Erin, you mentioned you have 27 cards in your name right now.

Do you find that you are using all 27 pretty equally, or do you find you have one or two that are your go-to cards? Definitely not carrying all 27 around with me on the daily basis.

You don't have your baseball card folio with you anywhere you go.

No, so there are cards that are in my wallet always that are really good earners on everyday spend.

So there are some cards that are really good at the grocery store and I'm constantly going to the grocery store and those are kind of a mainstay in my wallet.

There are other cards that rotate their categories every quarter. And so those cards will kind of rotate in and out of my wallet depending on what bonuses they have that quarter.

I will always have whatever new cards I have open that I'm working on the minimum spending period because meeting that minimum spend to earn the bonus is a critical part of that game.

But then, like I said, I do have a good stable of cards that I call sock drawer cards that live in my in my sock drawer and I keep them active in order to take advantage of the benefits that they have, mostly travel benefits like lounge access and free check bags.

We didn't even get into your digital wallet. Are you a digital wallet user? Do you have all 27 of your cards loaded up on your iPhone or whatever smartphone you have?

I don't have all 27 because that would be a lot of scrolling at the checkout if the wrong card pops up.

I have a few in there, but not a lot.

And is there anything that's really surprised you or maybe been easier or harder than you expected as you got into this game over time that you think would be helpful for folks to know?

I think that one of the things that makes me kind of successful in this game is that I am fearless in it.

Meaning that once I opened a few new cards and I got the hang of how it feels to manage multiple cards, I'm not scared to apply for a new card because I know that the short-term ding to my credit by applying for the card and having someone view my credit report is pretty minimal.

And I know that my credit is a good place. And I also know that in a lot of day-to-day life, it doesn't matter if my credit score is 800 or 750.

That really matters when I'm taking out a loan or making a big purchase, you know, buying a house. But I'm okay with my credit fluctuating in that way.

And so I've gotten to be kind of fearless over time.

Well, Erin, I think the biggest takeaway for me, because as I said, I have five credit cards and I have lots of fees, is that it's important to have a system in place if you plan to do this and you plan to have a lot more credit cards.

Anything else you think those hoping to break into the credit card optimizing game should be aware of when it comes to their credit and just day-to-day management of credit cards?

I'll give you a few tips here in a second. I will say that our writers, our nerds have dedicated countless hours to researching these very things.

And so I'll drop some links in the show notes with some really beginner-friendly tutorials of how to tell you how to manage this stuff.

But for me, you know, opening and managing multiple credit cards is super rewarding, but mismanaging them can have really real consequences.

And so if earning lots of rewards is your goal, it is imperative, like we talked about, that you do not carry a balance full stop.

If you don't trust the temptation to have larger, large amounts of credit available to you and to not go crazy at the mall and charge beyond your budget, don't play this game. Don't do it.

And, you know, you don't have to open 10 or 20 or 27 or 51 cards either.

If you've had one card you've used for many years, just considering adding one new card this year, earning a nice bonus, earning some new perks, that can help jumpstart your rewards and make your credit card journey a lot more rewarding, just one card at a time.

Wonderful. Well, Erin, thank you so much for coming on and talking through all this with us.
Absolutely. Thank you so much for having me.
And that's all we have for this episode.

Remember, listener, that we are here to answer your money questions. So turn to the nerds and call or text us your questions at 901-730-6373.
That's 901-730-NERD.

You can also email us at podcast at nerdwallet.com. And we want you to join us next time to hear about when you can pull back on saving for retirement.

Follow Smart Money on your favorite podcast app that includes Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and iHeartRadio to automatically download new episodes. Here's our brief disclaimer.

We are not your financial or investment advisors. This nerdy info is provided for general educational and entertainment purposes and may not apply to your specific circumstances.

This episode is produced by Tess Viglund. Hilary Georgie helped with editing.
Nick Kursimi mixed our audio. And we want to say thank you to NerdWallet's editors for all their help.

And with that said, until next time, turn to the nerds.