All About Angela Martin

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I'm Jenna Fisher and I'm Angela Kinsey.

We were on the office together and we're best friends.

And now we're doing the Ultimate Office Lovers podcast just for you.

Each week we will dive deeper into the world of the office with exclusive interviews, behind the scenes details, and lots of VFF stories.

We're the Office Lady 6.0.

Hello.

Hi.

Today it is all about Angela Martin.

And it is also Angela Kinsey's birthday celebration.

It is.

It is.

You guys, I walked into,

I mean, just such a beautiful arrangement on the table.

You guys clearly know me.

There were roses, a cake, a little bottle of rose.

Yes.

A little sloth for my tea.

Yes.

You put like loose tea leaves inside the sloth and then he hangs on the side of your cup.

He's so cute.

I can't wait.

And then maybe my favorite, it looks like a pad of butter.

Yeah.

It looks just like a pad of butter, but it's notepad.

It's like sticky notes.

Lady, I've had that butter pad of paper for so long and I've been saving it to give to you.

I'm so delighted.

The day has come.

I'm so tickled by it.

And then there's some bags, but I'll wait and open them later.

I think you should open them now.

Oh, okay.

I'm so excited to give you these gifts, Angela.

I think maybe they're the greatest presents I've ever given a person for any occasion ever.

Wow.

I'm so excited.

And I had help.

I'll explain.

Okay.

I want you to start by opening the small bag.

Okay.

I love it.

You have to read the bottom.

It's a hummingbird mug.

There's hummingbirds on it.

It's clearly handmade and they're surrounded by flowers.

To Angela, Jenna is sorry.

Because about a month ago, I broke your hummingbird mug that we got from Katie Bowler.

I know.

By accident.

Yes.

Doing the dishes and it just slipped off the rack.

And lady, I contacted Katie and I asked her if she would make you another one.

And she did.

It is so beautiful, Katie.

I love it, Jenna.

Thank you.

I didn't want to make you feel bad, but I was really sad.

I knew you were really sad because you were going out of your way to not make me feel bad, which was a major tell that you were so bummed.

And you know, during season nine of The Office, my beloved Pam mug fell on the ground and broke.

I remember.

I know what it's like to lose a precious mug.

My favorite mug.

Yes.

This is so beautiful.

Thank you both so much.

Well, I asked Katie to make you something else.

Oh my goodness.

And that's in the big bag.

Okay.

You guys.

Oh, this is so beautiful.

It is this beautiful pitcher that you would like put water in or iced tea.

And it's got these beautiful plants etched on it.

She's such a great artist.

And it says, for the plants.

Lady, that's because the pitcher you have in your kitchen where you put all your leftover water, we were saying someone came to your house and they accidentally drank water out of it thinking it was for people.

And I said, you need a pitcher that says for the plants.

I do.

Now you have one.

Oh, this is so beautiful.

Thank you all so much.

Thank you, Jenna.

Thank you, Katie.

And thank you, Cassie, for the flowers.

Of course.

Happy birthday.

Thank you.

What a wonderful way to start the day.

Well, Katie said she had never made anything like the for the plants picture before.

I think it's such a good idea.

I said, I'm worried people might want them.

And she said, okay, well, you just tell everybody that I was so delighted to make these items for Angela, but I'm actually on pause right now with my ceramics store.

She is getting married this summer.

Her daughter's graduating from high school, but she said in the fall, she's hoping to restock.

And you can follow her on Instagram at Katie's underscore sketchbook.

She said, quote, quote, if I get my act together, that's where I'll keep everyone up to date.

Well, Katie, when you're ready to open your store back up, you just tell us and we'll share about it in our Insta stories.

Aw, this was so fun.

Katie and I have been spending the last month going back and forth for these gifts.

I just love it.

I love it so much.

All right, lady, before we pivot into all about Angela Martin, You know, when we did our episode, All About Pam Beasley, you wore a special shirt for me to celebrate Pam Beasley.

I did.

You wore a Pam sass.

Yes.

Well, I wanted to wear a special shirt today.

Wait, is this why you haven't been able to take your hoodie off?

Jenna has been having a hot flash.

And I said off the mic, I said, take your hoodie off.

And you wouldn't.

I said, I will eventually.

Yes.

So this shirt is really more in honor of Angela Kinsey.

Okay.

But here it is.

Lady, look at you

in Star Wars merch.

Star Wars merch, just for you, lady.

Wait, I have to take a picture of you.

Did you buy this shirt special?

I bought it at Disneyland.

That's hilarious.

Well, thank you.

Yes.

Angela Kinsey is delighted.

I went to Disneyland with my family recently and we went to Star Wars Land.

And, you know, now I've seen the first three movies.

Yeah.

And I was just so tickled.

I became, I couldn't help myself.

I bought a shirt.

Well, now you knew what different things meant.

I did.

I was like, look, it's the Millennium Falcon, and I know what that is.

Not only am I so tickled that you're wearing that, but I know you have a whole day after this.

So you'll be wearing that everywhere you go today.

I will.

All right.

Now it is officially time to pivot into all about Angela Martin.

And I thought that we could kick things off with this haiku.

A haiku.

Yes, written by Cat M in North Carolina.

Here is the Angela Martin haiku.

Little Little cat lady always seemed to be angry.

Just needed some love.

Cat, that completely sums her up.

Really does.

It's a well-written haiku.

And then, of course, as you know, we always like to visit the show Bible for our all-about characters.

And yours did not disappoint, Angela.

First of all, it lists your full name, Angela Noel Martin, and it lists your job as head accountant.

Thank you for noting that I am the head accountant.

And then per the art department, this is a note in the show Bible.

It says per art department, you have an address.

Oh,

you live at 948 Bednar Street in Scranton, Pennsylvania.

I never knew that.

So I realized that the art department would always assign us addresses.

And then I had one on my fakey driver's license for Pam.

And you probably had it on anything that they made for you that was personal.

But I don't don't think it ever appeared in the show for any reason.

So that's why it said per art department.

Although you also lived in Ohio at one point, season five, episode 15, that little nugget is revealed.

Angela's backstory.

Also, you have additional jobs.

In addition to being head accountant, Angela Martin was also head of the PPC and safety officer along with Dwight.

Yes.

I made a list of Angela Martin's dislikes and likes.

Okay.

Here are Angela Martin's dislikes.

Thinks green is whorish.

Also thinks orange is whorish.

Yep.

Doesn't like to gamble.

Nope.

And then I thought, considering that she has filed a complaint against everyone in the office, she probably dislikes everyone in some way.

Someone.

Everyone has bumped her at some point.

Yes, Angela Martin does not like germs.

She is constantly sterilizing her hands and she wears a mask to work.

She does not like Movie Monday.

She is offended by the Kama Sutra.

She thinks malls are awful and humiliating.

She does not like making people laugh.

And she does not like murder mystery games.

But she has a number of likes.

Okay, let's hear them.

She's a very balanced person.

There is a ying to her yang.

She likes the colors gray, dark gray, and charcoal.

She likes performance reviews as she enjoys being judged.

She likes babies dressed as adults.

She thinks it's okay to drink.

She has sleep apnea and likes to read before bed, but she hates mysteries because she hates being titillated.

So I get a little bit of a like-dislike there.

She is a history buff and she enjoys Ben Franklin's lecture.

And of course, she loves her cats and dressing her cats in outfits.

And she also licks them and she sleeps with them in bed.

So Angela's cats are a very famous part of her personality.

Oh yeah.

Her identity.

And when we had our interview with Billie Eilish, you guys did a cat naming contest.

But do you know how many cats Angela has?

How many cats, she might have more.

So maybe I should say, how many cats does she mention in this series?

Oh my goodness.

Is it around 13?

It's more.

How many?

18.

18.

I was going to guess 13 or 17, and I went lower.

And I have all their names.

Oh, great.

Here they are.

For the record.

Yes.

All 18 cat names.

Sprinkles.

Yeah.

Garbage.

Bandit.

Although, and I'll get to this later, there's a big fan theory going around that garbage and bandit are the same cat.

So

18 names, maybe 17 cats.

Princess Lady, Mr.

Ash, Petals, Comstock, Ember, Milky Way, Diane, Lumpy, Philip, Tinky, Crinkle Puss, Bandit 2, Pollock Baggins, and Lady Aragon.

That's all of them.

I mean, I just love, love, love that she has a cat named Diane.

I know, of all these names.

That is my absolute favorite.

But I would say, almost as famous as Angela is for her cats, she might also be famous for her lovers.

She has a few.

While she has called Pam the office mattress and was disgusted seeing Michael and Donna making out, Angela Martin has had sex with Dwight in his barn and also in the warehouse and also in the office.

She dated Andy and the senator.

However, she does consider first base to be just a kiss on the forehead, and she wouldn't hug Andy in public.

So she's an interesting

interest.

Yes.

And finally, I thought we should note, Angela is very good at making brownies.

Very good.

Yes.

I mean, they're Kevin's favorites.

Double fudge.

Yeah.

And there you have it.

That is your summary.

Office Bible tribute to Angela Martin.

Well, I am so glad that you listed all of the cats because I get asked that a lot.

So I'll have to like save that audio clip.

Oh, yes.

Well, I printed it out for you if you want.

I even have a breakdown of when each of the cats' names appeared in the show.

Oh, my goodness.

Yeah.

So I can give that to you if you want.

Serious Dr.

Thibodeau action.

A little bit.

Yeah.

Well, that was a wonderful show Bible.

I mean, I did learn a few new things like her address.

Yes.

Yeah.

Well, when you did my show Bible, there were things in there I didn't even remember.

And it was very fun to hear it all.

Yeah.

All right.

Well, why don't we take a break?

And when we come back, we are going to go through our Angela Martin favorite moments and our areas of interest.

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All right, we are back.

And you know what, we should say, unfortunately, Sam is not here with us today.

He woke up sick and he couldn't come in the studio to celebrate your birthday.

But Angela, he says, happy birthday.

Thank you, Sam.

I hope you feel better soon.

And I had also asked everybody if they would please pick their favorite Angela Martin moment.

I want to start with this one that was sent in by Denise S.

in Medford, Oregon.

I have a nice comforter and several cozy pillows.

I usually read a chapter of a book and it slides out by 8.30.

That's how I sleep at night.

Well, Denise, I love that you love that quote because several people have asked me to write that on things, like when I sign things.

Well, Denise went on to say, the audacity of the documentary crew and the reveal of the question at the end, it's just so perfect.

It was really fun.

That was a fun one.

It is a fun one, like the way it pays off.

You realize what they asked you at the very end.

At the end.

Yes.

All right.

Well, next up, lady, I'm going to share my favorite.

It is from Launch Party.

This is a scene that leads into my favorite Angela Martin talking head.

It starts with Angela and Phyllis are hanging up a sign, and Angela realizes that Phyllis has hung up a sign that says Lunch Party instead of launch party.

And then Phyllis has a talking head where she says she's been doing some research on how to deal with difficult people.

Yeah.

Here it is.

So how do you feel about the fact that the banner says lunch?

I feel angry.

Angry at you.

Angry at you for doing something stupid.

Angry at me for believing you could do something not stupid.

I'm so sorry to hear that.

That must be awful.

It is awful.

You've made this day awful.

Maybe you could just change the U into an A.

Then it would say lanch party, Kevin.

Would it really be better if it said lanch party?

Oh, lunch party.

It's supposed to say launch.

Okay, wow, easy booster.

See, nobody cares about this party anyway.

I care.

Plan a party, Angela.

Oh, and the entire world will see it.

Oh, and here's $65 for your budget.

Oh, and here are four idiots who'll do nothing but weigh you down.

Oh, and your cat's still dead.

Lady,

the whole thing, it's so, it is just

so funny.

Your reactions to everybody, the, just like how put upon you are by the inefficiency of everyone around you.

I don't know.

It just, it's wonderful.

And a $65 budget.

I know, to throw a party for how many people are in this office?

The whole office.

How do you feed everyone?

No, especially if you spent a lot of money on a banner that was worded wrong.

So listen, Sam couldn't be here, but he did send in his clip.

Should we have a listen?

Yeah.

Hello, Angela.

Happy birthday.

I'm really sorry I can't be there today.

I am sick.

My personal favorite Angela moment is,

I forget what episode it's from.

It's where Dwight is hitting on Isabel and Angela walks up behind him.

Just something about her face, it's so earnest and so sincere.

And the way Rain reacts, it's just great.

This clip, I think, is from the bloopers because you can hear everyone laughing afterwards, but it's great.

So here it is.

What's your blood type?

Oh, negative.

Universal donor.

Universal donor.

Oh, that's a little bit of a visual one, but I know exactly what he's talking about.

The reason why everyone's laughing is because on that particular take, it was the first time we did sort of this gag where our director, Matt Stone, was like, Angela, I want you to sneak up as close to Rain, you know, like kind of get almost right under his armpit, like get as close to him as you can and just kind of peer up at him.

And we didn't tell Rain how close I was going to get to him.

And so when we did it, when he turned, his elbow was like kind of right at my face.

So he's like,

oh my God.

And he like cursed and everyone started laughing.

And then Matt was like, okay, you guys have to do that exactly again.

We have to do it again.

And then that's the one that ended up in the episode.

Well, the other thing about it that's so funny, Angela, it was such a good piece of direction and you so nail it is because Rain and Kellen, who played Isabel, are so tall.

Yes.

And you are so sneaky and tiny as you sort of come up and you just appear.

And also, normally my character wore like really high heels.

And for that particular scene, because we wanted that sight gag, I wore like ballerina flats.

Oh, my gosh.

So I'm basically my full 5'1

right there.

Oh, my goodness.

All right.

Cassie, do you have a favorite Angela Martin moment?

I do.

And I think it's probably the most famous one, but I have to go with it because it's what my heart tells me.

And it's the safe bandit moment.

I think it's just perfect television.

Every beat, every moment is perfect.

And when you broke down the episode and talked about all that was involved and the crew, like truly incredible work.

So here it is.

Remember your exit points.

Exit points, people.

What's next?

Stay alive.

I'm getting health.

Pull me up.

You're too heavy.

I only weigh 82 pounds.

Safe bandit.

Sometimes you just hear hear a little bit of a scene and you are right back there.

That is one for me.

Like,

one of the things that cracked me up is after we did our first take, the director for that episode, Jeff Blitz, was like, I want to just like up the anxiety of this moment, like up the stakes, like even more, like heighten it.

And I didn't intend on doing this, but

after I did it, Jeff was like, you have to do that every time.

So Oscar yells down at me.

And I did this like, you know, that like gravel thing you do with your voice.

I'm like, I only went 82 pounds.

Yeah, yeah.

Like, I kind of, because I was just so in the moment.

And he was like, you have to do that every time now.

I was like, okay.

Oh, my gosh.

Those are so fun.

I loved hearing all of those.

Well, Angela, do you have a favorite Angela Martin moment?

Oh, man.

You know, there's so many moments I'm so thankful I got to play and scenes I got to be a part of.

But I have, I think, one of my all-time favorite speeches, and it's to phyllis and it's also in launch party oh my gosh that it's such a good angela phyllis episode yes and and that is one of my favorite dynamics is between you and phyllis i feel like i could watch a whole show about you guys

i asked for assorted cutlery and i got back spoons these are worthless I want to understand what you're saying, but it's difficult for me when you use that tone.

Phyllis,

these are spoons.

Spoons have rounded tops and are used to scoop things.

What we need are forks, which have prongs or tiny spears on top.

And we need knives which have blades.

Do you understand me now?

Yes.

Goody.

That was such a blast to do.

I feel like the reason I love Angela Martin in that episode so much is that she is my like interior monologue for every time I've had to deal with like an inefficient situation.

Like I managed to suppress it, but on the inside, that is, I have a little Angela Martin saying all those things.

You're like, I only got 65 bucks and four idiots.

Exactly.

Well, that was really fun.

I loved hearing everyone's favorite moments.

Well, now, Angela, I'd love to turn it over to you.

I'd love to hear about your Angela Martin area of interest.

Okay.

First, to kick things off, I'd like to share a character review that I found of Angela Martin because several of you wrote in to ask me what it was like to play a character that was, well, many times very unlikable.

She could be hypocritical, judgy, downright mean.

And, you know, I have seen the Reddit threads about, you know, some of the most unlikable characters on the office, and Angela Martin usually makes the list.

She also made some internet lists of unlikable characters, like this one titled, quote, after re-watching The Office, I made a definitive ranking of all of the characters.

Here's what I came up with.

From worst to best.

Oh, uh-huh.

There are 23 characters.

At number 23, ranked the worst.

Angela Martin.

No.

Yes.

Okay.

This is.

Worse than Ryan Howard.

This is what they go on to say.

Quote, okay, some might think that this is unfair to her, but honestly, she was just not a good person.

The only good thing about her character was how she complimented Dwight.

She was a cheater, a liar, and actively aimed to hurt other people.

Not to mention that she was also annoying, mean, and showed no remorse for her actions.

Hmm.

I do think she did show some remorse.

She had some growth.

That's

I don't agree with.

And why i would put ryan howard lower than angela was because ryan was also a liar and a cheater and he strung people along for his own benefit he was very manipulative he was yeah and he never shows any remorse for it whereas angela she has growth

so lady i would put ryan howard as number 23 and maybe you're number 22.

i don't know i definitely hear this person on a lot of those points would you like to know who made the number one best character?

Favorite, favorite in this list.

Meaning like best person or favorite?

Phyllis?

Michael Scott.

Oh, well, I mean, he's

a crowd pleaser.

He's a crowd pleaser.

Well, I would like to point out that Angela Martin did not make the most unlikable The Office characters list on movieweb.com or screenrant.com.

I love that you're shouting out the two places that left you off the list.

That left you off the list.

Thanks, guys.

It's okay.

Anyway, I thought we had to address and all about Angela Martin the fact that, you know, she's not very likable a lot of the times.

All right.

Well, you know, I also felt like a big part of my character was her wardrobe.

And the costume department on the office really came through for me and really helped me build this character.

So my area of interest is how to dress like Angela Martin.

Oh, I love that you're going to talk about this, Angela, because it really is true how there are some roles that you have where your costume is, as soon as you put it on, you just immediately feel more in character.

Yeah, like that person.

Yes.

The first thing you need to know is you do not need to wear pantyhose or stockings of any kind.

All right.

Now, that is like Angela McKenzie.

Second, you you are allowed a comfortable shoe like SAS shoes, but you will also need a three-inch heel because the love of your life is very tall.

Okay.

Third, you need at least one pencil skirt.

Four, you will need several floofy blouses with a high collar and a minimum of 32 tiny buttons.

Five, you will sometimes wear a sweater vest.

Be sure and change out the regular buttons on it for buttons with cat faces.

I loved that detail that they did for you.

I did too.

Six, you will need a color palette.

It will be shades of gray and beige, sometimes a pastel if you're feeling flirty.

Seven, you will need only one Halloween costume to wear each year.

It will be a cat and you will make it yourself.

Eight, Christmas is its own category.

You will need some holiday plaid and you will always wear a Christmas brooch.

Nine, should you find yourself by a lake, you will wear a bucket hat.

Ah, yes.

Sun protection.

That's right.

10.

You will rarely wear dressy trousers, but if you do, they will need to be a dark color, nothing bright, nothing with a print design, nothing flashy.

And that's how you can dress like Angela Martin.

Now, I would add to this

that

Angela Martin's hair was part of her overall look that was just as important as her costume.

So I think you might want to add some sort of braid or tight bun to this list of how to dress like Angela Martin.

I don't know, is hair considered dressing?

I kind of think it is.

Yes, no, I think you will need to make sure that you have something high and tight

and very groomed.

Yes.

No hair out of place.

No.

And I do want to give a shout out.

This is a gift that I treasure.

I framed it.

It hangs right outside my closet door.

A wonderful artist named Morgan made such a beautiful watercolor for me, and it features several of Angela Martin's looks.

Yes.

You know, Morgan is the artist who did Beasley's Botanicals.

That's right.

Where she made a little drawing of every one of the plants that was ever on Pam's desk.

Right.

And she made a mug out of it.

I have it as a mug.

I have the original.

And then she made one of little, they're little like watercolors of all of your elaborate blouses.

Yes, and dresses.

And I just love this so much.

I'm going to share it in our stories.

Morgan, I just, I smile every day I see it.

Well, Angela, my area of interest is called Angela Martin Fan Theories.

Oh, there's fan theories?

There are many fan theories about Angela Martin.

And I realized that, you know, some of them we've touched on, but many of them we haven't, I feel like, discussed quite enough.

Okay.

And when we opened up our mailbag for questions for this episode, so many fan theory letters.

Okay.

I mean, I feel like I know a few of them, but I didn't know there were many, many.

Well, we're going to discuss three today.

Okay.

Here is the first one from Frankie M.

in Burkhampstead, UK.

I was just re-watching Funrun, and I realized that the death of Sprinkles and the breakdown of Dwangela's relationship is completely Pam's fault.

Oh.

She was organizing for people to visit Meredith in the hospital and Angela said she couldn't go because of her cat.

Pam guilts her into going anyway by bringing up the PPC, which is why Dwight is left in charge of Sprinkles.

And Linda C.

from Phoenix, Arizona said, how do you feel about the theory that Pam is responsible for Sprinkles' death because she guilted Angela into visiting Meredith instead of going home at lunchtime?

Oh,

that's a good one.

I feel like we touched on this a little bit when we broke down that episode, but lady, so many letters and there's like articles online about is Pam really responsible for the death of Sprinkles.

I mean, if Angela really connected with that, look out, Pam.

I know.

I mean, here is my thought.

I think Pam was kind of right to encourage Angela to visit Meredith in the hospital, but at the same time, like as Jenna, if I knew how sick like someone's cat was, I would certainly excuse them from attending because Sprinkles really needed her medicine.

Yeah.

And unfortunately, Angela thought Dwight could handle it.

Yeah.

When he could not.

Yeah, I think

if it were me in that moment, I would just be like,

here's a card, give it to Meredith.

Yeah.

I'm going to go check on my cat.

I know.

But yeah, she kind of felt peer pressure a little bit.

I mean, I think it's fair to say that both Pam and Dwight contributed to Sprinkles' death.

But then also maybe Meredith did by getting hit by the car in the first place.

Well, then we need to point to Michael.

Exactly.

This goes, this trail goes, maybe it's all the way to Michael for creating this moment.

Kind of true.

All right.

Fan theory number two.

Oh my gosh, this was also a fan mail flurry.

People would like us to discuss.

Are Garbage and Bandit the same cat just renamed?

From Alpha M in Utah.

In Dunder Mifflin Infinity Part 1, Dwight releases a cat that he had trapped for Angela named Garbage, tries to win you over with garbage.

He releases this cat down in the warehouse area.

Okay.

And then in Money Part 2, Andy gives Angela a cat that he found in the warehouse, in this same general area.

So the theory goes that garbage

is the same cat.

So basically they're saying the cat that Dwight released into the warehouse and then the cat that Andy brings to Angela are one and the same.

Yes, but then the cat that Angela gets from Andy is the same cat that lives in her drawer that then goes in the ceiling.

So that must be bandit.

So the question is

from Gen B in Crawford, Georgia, garbage is bandit, right?

Was the same cat used?

Well, no, the same cat was not used.

The cat that played garbage is not the same cat that played bandit.

However, we did talk about this in our breakdown of money part two.

And you and I agreed, Angela, that we think that garbage is the cat that Andy trapped and gave to Angela.

We agreed that she renamed him Bandit.

Yes, we followed the logic that this is the same cat that was in the warehouse.

Yes.

Yeah, I remember that.

And then I think I shared this, but just for everyone to know, the cat that played garbage was one of the biggest cats I've ever held in my life.

It was so big.

It was huge.

It was so big.

Yes.

And I don't think I could have put that cat up in the ceiling.

So that's the question, which is like, was it intended to be the same cat?

Like, is this theory like what was intended?

And did we just switch cats because you couldn't physically throw the original cat up into the ceiling?

We had to recast?

Or was it like, we don't know?

Yeah, we don't know, except I do agree.

I think that garbage is bandit, that Angela renames it.

I also think Angela would never, ever call a cat garbage.

So if she was given that cat again from Andy and she's trying to be spiteful to Dwight, and this time she's taking the cat, even though it was the same cat, she would rename it for sure.

Well, I went back and I watched this part of the episode where Angela discovers this cat in a box on her desk.

There's a look

that she shares with Dwight when she receives the cat, but then thanks Andy for it.

And then Dwight's face just falls.

He's so sad.

And

I think that she knows it's the cat he gave her.

Yeah.

And now Andy's getting credit for it.

Yeah.

Like she wouldn't accept it from Dwight, but she'll accept it from Andy.

And it's like this extra dagger.

Yeah, because you would have to know, and Dwight would have to know, how much willpower it would take for Angela not to accept a cat from anyone.

Correct.

All right.

Well, I enjoyed that discussion.

I did too.

Now we're moving into fan theory number three, which is that Angela is not really a vegetarian.

Oh.

Lady, there is so much conflicting evidence.

I have a question for you.

What is it?

Did people bring up the chicken picada at the hospital?

Okay.

Yeah.

So it all starts in email surveillance.

She's at the barbecue.

Jim offers her some barbecue and Angela says, I'm a vegetarian.

Then in business ethics, she only eats potato salad.

This is when Meredith has slept with the rep and has gotten everyone's steak.

That's right.

And then there's other little moments where this idea of her being a vegetarian plays out.

For example, Kate H.

from Parkersburg, West Virginia pointed out, while watching dinner party, I noticed something that is a true testament to the attention to detail in the show.

When everyone finally gets their long-awaited dinner, Angela Martin covers the meat on her plate with a napkin.

I thought it was so cool.

I improvised that.

Yay!

I just thought she wouldn't want to look at it.

Kate said, as a super fan, I know that Angela is a vegetarian, so it came as no surprise, but I love when there are little details that are callbacks or support a character's backstory.

So wonderful support for that character backstory.

But there are a lot of times when Angela seems to not be a vegetarian.

For example, in Money, when Andy asks her out to dinner, she says she'll go, but she insists, quote, no vegetables and no seafood.

What is she eating?

Listen, I have two very good friends who are vegetarians and they don't like vegetables.

What do you think?

And they don't like seafood.

What do they eat?

They eat a lot of like beans,

pastas, but they don't want a Brussels sprout or carrots.

Like they eat potatoes.

So that wasn't too far off the mark for me.

She just might not like some vegetables.

Okay.

But then as you mentioned, Angela, how do you explain this one?

In jury duty, she says Philip was conceived after, quote, too much wine and chicken picotta.

And also in moving on, she eats the meat stew with Aunt Shirley, which you said she did as a courtesy.

Yeah, I sort of thought maybe she just had the broth.

The one that is the most puzzling to me is the chicken picada, the wine sauce.

So I'm like, did she decide to eat meat when she was pregnant?

What?

She wasn't pregnant yet.

No.

No.

That's how she got pregnant.

That's how she got pregnant.

That's the one that's like, that doesn't quite track.

Yep.

Well, listen, why don't we take a break?

And when we come back, we're going to do our all about Angela Martin QA.

I'm so excited about this.

You guys wrote in the best questions, and I'm excited to hear the answers i am too

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All right, we are back, and I'm just so excited to dig into this Q ⁇ A section.

Angela, I think the character that you developed is so

just deliciously complex and interesting.

She is full of surprises and she is nothing like you in real life.

In fact, we got a letter that made me chuckle and I'd like to start with it.

Okay.

It's from Lisa in Calgary, Alberta, who said, not a question, just a cute story story for Angela.

I was telling my mom, a new office fan who I got listening to the podcast too.

Thanks, Lisa.

I know, getting us new listeners.

Yeah.

I was telling my mom about the podcast and my son Liam piped up and said, it is good.

It's good to know Angela isn't a B in real life.

Thanks, Liam.

Anytime we talk about the Office, he assures people that Angela is a really good actor and not really a B.

Liam out there spreading the good word for me.

I know.

This family is doing a lot for us.

I know.

All right.

Well, let's dig into the questions.

Question number one.

It's a twofer.

First from Colette V in Long Island, New York.

Hello, ladies.

So I know you've poked fun at Jenna for her actory background prep, but I was wondering, Angela, how much of a background did you mentally develop for Angela Martin?

Like, I wonder what happened in her upbringing that made her so particular.

And then Eli B.

from Maryland said, I'd like to know about Angela Kinsey's backstory for Angela Martin.

Is she from Scranton?

How did she end up at Dunder Mifflin?

Why did she choose accounting?

Okay.

Well, Colette and Eli, those are great questions.

You know, I never thought Angela was from Scranton.

I saw her sort of like my friends that I grew up with in Indonesia whose parents were in the military and they moved around a lot, which might also explain her need for structure and why she liked Dwight.

And I also saw her as someone that needed order and rules.

And I think that's why she picked accounting.

You know, numbers make sense.

Yeah.

And as far as my actor prep, you know, I'm a people watcher and I kind of collect characters as I go through life.

I'll jot down little notes about people I meet.

Jenna, I'll leave you messages about people who I think are great characters.

And we kind of do that all the time with each other.

You do do it more though, Angela, and your descriptions of people you've observed, they are always so loving and so detailed.

And you find like just in the world, you find so many characters.

This is so true about you.

Well, I think people are so fascinating, you know?

And I usually mesh a few of those different people when I start to create a role.

So for Angela Martin, She was a combination of this woman who I worked with at 1-800 Dentist.

She was the office manager.

She was in charge of front reception, the mail room.

And I've shared this before on the podcast.

She was in charge of planning the Christmas party, the big company Christmas party.

And she was allowed a few people to help her and you got a little extra money.

And I signed up to do it.

But man, was this party high stakes for her?

She took it so seriously.

And I've shared this before, but she literally yelled at me because I was doing a Christmas bow incorrectly on this stair banister leading into the party.

She was like, let me do it.

I was like, okay.

So I had that lady in mind.

And then the second person I used for Angela Martin was my grandmother.

Now, she wasn't judgy or mean, but she was very, very proper.

She was just a very proper lady.

She always dressed up for the day.

She wore lots of brooches and she had a lot of cats.

She had this barn.

And she had all these barn cats that she would feed.

I mean, I remember one time going over there and I looked out the back door because it was getting near dinner time and there were so many cats.

And part of my family lore story is that as her eyesight grew worse, as she aged, one time a bobcat came up to the back door and she fed the bobcat.

No.

Yes.

And she was like, oh, I've got the biggest cat.

And we were all there one time and it walked up.

And my dad was like, mom, that's a bobcat.

So that is also part of Angela Martin for me.

Now, is that why you had a picture of her on your desk?

Yes.

Yes, I had a picture of her and I.

It was a black and white photo.

It was in a frame that said, iHeart Grandma.

And my eyes are closed in the picture.

It's so wonderful.

But she would do that.

She would frame pictures of you and there would be someone's finger over the lens, but it went in a frame.

Yeah.

You know?

Yeah.

It didn't matter if your eyes were open or closed.

She was going to put it in a frame and display it.

Another thing I drew on as I shaped Angela Martin was actually, and I've never shared this before.

I have never told you this, Jenna.

What?

So when I was doing all my auditions, you know, I auditioned first for Pam.

Yep.

And then between that time and when I came in for Angela Martin was several months.

And I had started reading the book, The Age of Innocence by Edith Wharton.

Okay.

And I look back now on that and I think about how informing that book was for me as I went in.

I didn't know, you know, I didn't know I was going to audition for Angela Martin.

It just sort of happened.

And I was immersed in this world of like 1870s New York society.

It was the golden age.

There were all these social rules.

There was repressed feelings and unconsummated love.

And I just feel like Angela is someone that would have felt right at home in an older, more conservative world.

For sure.

And that's what I was reading.

When I went into audition, and I'd sort of forgotten about that.

And then I went back to my journal that I was keeping that year.

And I wrote in my journal about this book and how I kept thinking about it.

And I kept thinking about these characters and how the ending broke my heart.

And that's what I was reading.

when I went in for my audition.

I am getting chills at the serendipity of that.

How there are these times in an artist's life where there are things that are informing your art and your career and you don't even know it.

You don't even know like why you're doing it or how it's going to happen.

It's It's this like, it's part of the weird magic of our industry and what we do that, oh my God, I love that story so much.

Yeah.

I was sort of inviting this creative

narrative.

I didn't even realize I was inviting.

And when I went into a read for the role of at the time, just the persnickety accountant, right?

I made this choice to have really, really good proper posture.

And I sat shoulders back, like straight up and almost to the point where like, I like got a back like

because you were really forcing this posture.

Yeah, that's how I went in the room with this posture.

And I think that book sort of was informing me.

So I sort of feel like I went in there with this sort of like persona.

I didn't even realize.

Yeah.

I just love that so much.

Now, lady, I have usually been reaching out to Greg about the origin of people's names, but you said you played a part.

I mean, obviously, Angela is Angela, but that you played a part in how she got the last name, Martin.

Will you share?

I will.

So Greg came over to the accounting department and he was like, hey, you guys, we need last names for you.

And we were like, oh, he goes, why don't you jot down a few that you think fit your character?

And we were like, okay.

And Brian felt very strongly about Malone.

Yes, and that connection to the Irish.

And I wrote a few down and one of the ones I wrote was Martin.

At the time, I had a friend, like we were like all in our 20s and his name was Martin.

And I thought, oh, that might be kind of fun.

I didn't even really think about it.

And me and Brian and Oscar talk about this, but Greg ended up picking Malone, Martin, and Martinez.

Oh, my gosh, the three M's of accounting.

That's right.

So we always thought that would be a fun spinoff, you know?

Yes.

M, M, and M.

Yeah, accounting for

us.

Well, Angela, we got a fun letter from someone about your name, Angela Martin, and it made me laugh because remember we did have a discussion about mensa yes they didn't let you in they didn't let me in i didn't i'm sure i'm not in either i didn't make it but here is a really fun share from emily l in charlotte north carolina who said Hello, I recently joined Mensa and was checking out their website to see what they offer to members.

First of all, Emily, congratulations.

Yeah.

Emily said, they have a gift shop online and various things to purchase.

I saw they have membership certificates that you can purchase with your name on them.

Well,

all of the examples say Angela Martin.

No way.

Yes.

Angela, Angela Martin is the Mensa certificate shop store, I guess, template example.

It's so amazing.

She put a link.

So we're going to have to link to this in stories.

I'm looking up Mensa right now.

I'm looking up the website.

It's mensastore.com/slash slash collections slash members.

Okay.

Gosh, just so you guys know, Mensa has a lot of merch.

Oh, really?

Yes.

But she's absolutely right.

If you go to that link and I'll put it in our stories, it says Angela Martin.

There you go.

That's so funny.

I wonder if someone.

that does merch for Mensa is an office fan.

They must be.

And also, this does beg the question, do you think Angela Martin is a Mensa?

Yes.

I do too.

I do.

I do as well.

This is why life is so frustrating to her.

Yes.

All right.

That was just question number one.

Look at how much wonderful information we got from just one question.

Here's question two.

We've talked so much on the show, Ange, about how different you are from your character.

I mean, anyone who listens to the podcast can hear that.

And we had a lot of people write in about the differences between you and your character.

For example, Amanda E.

from Illinois said, I'm so excited for this episode because I think Angela is one of the most underrated characters in the show.

A question I'm curious about, and I'm sure many people will ask, is, how did it feel to play a character that has a demeanor so opposite of your natural self?

Was it difficult to play a cold and stony character for almost a decade?

Oh, well, Amanda, that's really nice of you to say all of that.

You know, Angela Martin was just an escape for me.

In real life, I am not a very confrontational person.

I don't like to make a fuss.

So getting to play someone who is not afraid to just let people have it

was, it was actually really fun.

I do have to say, I had the hardest time being mean to Phyllis.

Phyllis is literally the nicest person on the earth.

And she just has the sweetest face.

And it was so hard to be mean to her.

And I did struggle with how judgy Angela could be.

And I also struggled with all the buns.

Oh, literally headaches.

Headaches, like the pulled hair and the bobby pins.

I don't know how people wear such high tight buns for hours and hours.

And, you know, my friends did joke that like, if I would go and meet them out after work, after a day of filming, like, you know, go do improv or whatever, they said I would have resting bitch face

that I had spent all day not allowing myself to smile.

And people, I've had strangers like stop me and be like, hey, you okay?

And I'm like, what?

No, I'm great.

But I guess I just have this like

scowly frown on my face.

Did you feel like that finally went away after the show ended?

Do you still get that from people?

I feel like not as much anymore.

I think my face is finally relaxed.

It took years, though.

Well, I have a question, sort of a follow-up, which is, how has playing the role of Angela Martin affected you in real life?

I mean, I know you said people would stop you on the street, or, or I guess another way to say it is like, how has it affected your career being so known for for a type of person that is like so different from who you are?

And we also got a fan letter from Kelly W in West Africa slash Oregon slash Ontario.

Kelly.

You get around Kelly.

Who said, Angela Martin has quickly become my absolute favorite character.

She always has the best reactions and also fully embodies the concept of Schneidenfreude.

Look it up.

Schneidenfreude.

Okay.

Knowing Angela's true personality now makes it an even more outstanding performance.

My question is, was Angela being typecast before the office or did it begin afterwards?

And have you had to work hard to get different roles?

Oh, gosh.

That's a lot of questions I just threw at you.

It is.

Well, you know, no, Angela was the first B-I-T-C-H I ever played.

Okay.

Yeah.

And Greg did say to me, you know, there's good career safety because in an office, there's always one bitch.

So he said, that's actually job job security.

Yes, for future office-related

projects.

That's right.

But, you know, after the office, I did.

I got a series of roles where people wanted me to play the personickity lady.

Yeah.

I had a few jobs right after the office.

One was on New Girl, and I did not play the bitch on that one.

So that was fun.

But I did get a series of offers to play the bitch.

And I only took one because it was with Betty White.

It was hot in Cleveland.

That's a good one.

And I was like, I have, I mean, she's just this legend, and I just want to occupy the same space with her just once.

And I was trying not to just go back to that well of like, oh, people are wanting to cast me as the personic V lady.

But I remember telling my agents, yes, I will do it.

I will absolutely do it.

And I found an interview where I was asked about it.

I was on the set of Hot in Cleveland, and here's what I had to say.

Hello, my name is Angela Kinsey, and and I will be playing Dr.

Teresa Carson.

I am the headmistress of a snooty preschool

in Cleveland.

Wow, that is a big hand.

She reminds me a little bit of my office character and the fact that she's, um, well, she takes everything very seriously, but she wears a lot better suits.

You know, I met Betty White and she held my hand when we were talking and I was like, she totally.

She's like so cute.

I don't want to hug her.

And I don't know why everyone's so tall.

Mine is Betty.

Of course, Betty's taller than me because, you know, I'm 5'1.

But no, it's like the land of tall people.

This week we also have guest starring Craig Ferguson, who I love.

He's already cracking me up.

So I'm a little worried about tape night because he looks at me with the goofiest look on his face so many times in the scene and I just lose it.

So yeah,

I realized I was playing another version of Angela Martin on that show, but I just was so delighted to be there.

But it is one reason why I was so thrilled to be in Haters Back Off on Netflix and the Tall Girl movies, because I got to play sort of just like these moms that were very interesting like characters, but they weren't bitchy.

And then your Hallmark Christmas movie.

Oh my gosh.

Which is maybe the closest thing to you in real life.

Probably.

Just like.

You love a holiday.

I do love a holiday.

You're a good neighbor.

I'm not going to make everyone wear a onesie all day, though.

That's true.

You love a holiday, but you don't force people to dress up or anything.

That's true.

All right, Angela, question number four.

We got this fan question from Ella M in Louisiana who said, Angela, your character changes so much over the course of nine seasons.

She shows emotion to Dwight and even Pam at times.

In early season, she's strictly private and severe, but toward the end, she is more open with her coworkers and shows different sides of herself.

How did you show this new emotional side of Angela that people sympathize with in the later seasons while also still maintaining her stern personality?

And also, Kristen A.

from Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania said, looking back on Angela's journey, is there a particular moment where you feel she grew the most as a character or one that you were particularly proud of her?

Such thoughtful questions.

I'm really just moved by the time and care that people put into writing these questions.

I know.

So good, right?

So nice of them.

One of the things I loved about the fact that our show was on for nine years

is that you really felt the passage of time with these characters, with this world.

And all of the characters got progressively more comfortable with the documentary crew being there.

Just naturally, you would.

And I do think a lot of the characters over time evolved and changed.

And I always felt like for Angela, it was the love of Dwight that helped her come out of her shell.

And he challenged her in so many ways.

And she loved the challenge.

It made her try new things and meet new people and do experiences that she would have never done, except that she loved him.

And I think she was the better for it.

And Angela, do you have a moment where you were particularly proud of the character?

I was most proud of Angela's growth with her relationship to Oscar.

Yeah.

I always truly saw Oscar as Angela Martin's best friend in the office.

He's who she would talk to and commiserate with.

And they had the same taste as men.

Yes.

And although they certainly had their differences of opinion and they would often butt heads, I always believe she really cared for him.

So I was really happy when the writers wrote the arc where Oscar offers Angela and baby Philip to come live with him.

I loved their dynamic as roommates.

That That was so much fun to play.

And if you watch the wedding of Dwight and Angela, it is Oscar who is taking care of baby Philip.

So she trusts him with the things that matter most to her.

Yeah, that's beautiful.

Yeah.

So that, that growth in that relationship meant a lot to me.

Well, listen, Angela, you also mentioned Doangela.

Lady, I know that you and Rain share a special bond after playing one another's fictional love interests for nine years.

Can you talk a little bit about it?

Yeah, I mean, you know, it's so interesting to me because pretty much right away, the first time we had to be in a scene together where there was this undercurrent of romance, you know, we just had an instant chemistry.

And he had sat at that desk across the way for a while, you know?

I don't know.

I didn't ever see who Angela's relationship would be in the office.

Like, I just assumed she would have a relationship outside of of the office.

And the minute the writers wrote that storyline, it just instantly made so much sense.

And I remember at the table read when it was revealed that their Birkenstocks were rubbing back and forth at Jim's barbecue, the whole table, like the whole room let out this like,

Yeah.

And there was like light bulb, light bulb.

Like everyone, it was like, oh my gosh, of course, of course, Dwight and Angela.

I hadn't thought of it at all, you know?

And then we didn't get much direction our characters and who they were to each other in this relationship.

We were given great dialogue, but all the rest of it just really happened spontaneously.

I think it was just Rain being Dwight and me being Angela Martin.

It just all kind of happened.

You know, you've said that thing where When you auditioned with John, it was like you guys were doing this dance, but neither of you even knew it, you know?

It was as if they turned on a a song and John and I both started dancing the same dance routine, but we'd never talked about it.

Yeah, that's exactly what I felt with Rain.

I knew whatever he did as Dwight, it was so instinctively in me how Angela would respond.

And doing those scenes with him were such a joy.

And it's also funny.

And I think maybe why we have chemistry.

because we really are like brother and sister and we really just tease the crap out of each other and we're real smart asses to one another.

We just played doubles tennis together a while back and he came up to me and he was like, I think they're hitting them to you because they know they'll get the point.

They're avoiding me.

And I said, Rain, they've hit them to you.

You couldn't run and get that.

Like you literally like

do some cardio.

You know what I mean?

Like we just kind of always go at each other like that, but it's always loving.

And my favorite thing is when I get a text from him that's like, hey, idiot, I miss you.

And I'm like, I miss you too, dumbass.

But yeah, he was just there.

I don't know how to explain it.

All right, lady, during our All About Pam episode, I shared about the music I listened to that made me cry as Pam.

And you said you would share your Angela crying song.

So do tell.

Okay.

Well, when I first started acting, I had taken a class that explored emotions and scenes.

You know, we would take a scene, we would write markers alongside the dialogue that would show the emotion going on in the subtext of whatever we were saying.

And as part of that class, we explored how music can affect you and help you be prepared for a scene that has a lot of emotion.

We had to pick a song, go up on stage, sit in a chair by ourselves facing the entire class.

The teacher would hit play.

And then we would have to slowly cry throughout the song in front of everyone.

Oh my gosh.

It was so daunting and terrifying.

And I did it.

And this is the song I picked.

It's called That's the Way Love Goes.

I've been throwing horseshoes

over my left shoulder.

I've spent most of my life

searching for that falling clover.

yet you ran with me,

chasing my rainbows.

Honey,

I love you too,

and that's the way love

goes.

Okay, so you seem like you're getting a little choked up even just listening to that clip.

Does it still trigger you?

Yeah, I mean, okay, when I picked that song, my dad was still alive, but my dad loved loved Merle Haggard.

Okay.

He loved all the old country musicians.

Yeah.

And the interesting thing for me now is that I think that song always just made me think of just this unconditional love that I had from my family and

what that means to me.

Now for me, when I have to get emotional in a scene, I don't need the song anymore.

I think a lot of life has happened to me and I will sort of tap into some of the sadness that life has brought.

And then you're there.

And so I think hearing that song now and sharing it with you, because I've never shared it with you before, and you're someone who holds such a special place in my heart, that I just thought about like how thankful I am to have you in my life and to have this job that we get to do together.

My tears and my emotion are very connected to the fact that like, I feel so safe sharing with you, Jenna.

Oh, my gosh.

So, that's kind of why I got a little tearies that I was like, it felt so lovely to be able to share something like that with you.

Well, thank you.

Lady, I'm so glad that we're doing this episode and that you're getting to share so much about your process and your approach to character, because as we all know, I will drone on and on and on about my process as I am a nerdy, nerdy, theater nerdy nerd.

And I love to break down character.

I I love to talk to other actors about how they do it.

You do not often share those things.

You're very, very humble, but you are a very technically proficient actor.

You are a thoughtful actor.

You add complexities to your character.

And this has been such a joy.

getting to draw that out of you for the world to know, which I knew, but for the world to hear the time and care that you put into your acting work.

Oh, I've loved it.

This is your theater nerd dream.

Yes.

And also because I'm getting to get you to talk about it.

Yeah, I don't know why.

I'm very shy about it.

I don't know what that is.

I just sort of keep more of that to myself.

Maybe because I feel a little vulnerable sharing about it, but I'm happy to do it here with you.

All right.

Well, To finish things up, we got a couple questions about what has happened to Angela since the show has ended.

We got a question from Emily M in Brisbane, Australia, who said, Ms.

Angela, can I ask where you see Dwight and Angela now?

Did they have more children?

Did Angela get her pair of small, well-behaved boys in the end?

I would love to hear your thoughts on Dwight and Angela and how their life played out together.

Miranda B.

from Brazil was wondering, did Angela stop working at Dunder Mifflin after they got married?

Oscar has her position as head of the accounting department, and Dwight describes Angela as his, quote, former accountant, but do you think she would be happy being a homemaker?

Because I've always felt that Angela is the kind of woman who likes having a career.

Finally, Gavin Jay from Cardiff Wales said, when Angela's cats got taken away by animal control near the end of season nine after leaving Senator Robert Lipton, did she eventually get them back?

Please say yes.

As a cat dad, I hope the answer is a positive one.

So, Angela, where are Dwight and Angela?

Did they have more kids?

Did she keep working?

And did she get her cats back?

First of all, this is a very international question.

We have Australia, Brazil, and Wales.

That is awesome.

Okay, you guys, here are my thoughts.

I definitely think Dwight and Angela had more children.

I definitely think she got her pair of well-behaved boys.

And I think they're very happy.

I think they found their person and they're living their life on that beet farm.

I think, Miranda, in answer to your question, I think that Angela is probably running the bed and breakfast on shoot farms.

That is, yes.

Oh, I like that.

I think she would probably want to be a very hands-on mom.

So I think she would probably even maybe homeschool, but I think she is running the bed and breakfast.

And I think she does all the bookkeeping for the farm.

It's a very big property, you know, it's a very big property.

So I think she does the bookkeeping.

The Schroots now also own the business park.

Yeah.

So I think Angel has quite a bit of accounting that she's still doing.

And

lastly, Gavin, I do think she got all of her cats back.

Oh, good.

100%.

And I think they're all on the farm.

I mean, there was a deleted scene that was written that her cats attack the doves that are released at her wedding.

Yes.

So I do think all of her cats are there on the farm.

Don't you worry.

Aw.

Well, lady, I loved this episode all about Angela Martin and Angela Kinsey's birthday.

It was super fun.

And before we go, I wanted to give a shout out to Kaylee from Tyler, Texas.

I have driven through Tyler many times.

And Kaylee said she felt a real connection to Angela Martin.

And here is what she wrote.

I just want to send some love for my girl, Angela Martin.

She is the character I relate to the most, though hopefully not the bitchiness and judgment.

And I think she doesn't get enough credit.

As a rule follower and introvert who often feels more comfortable holding some boundaries between my work life and my personal life, Angela makes sense to me.

She's not perfect by any stretch, but she's a hardworking, dedicated woman who is a reasonable person in a very unreasonable workplace.

In the Dundees, it's funny when she refuses to get up and accept the tight ass award.

But in real life, Michael is beyond inappropriate.

Angela stands up for herself by saying no, and I appreciate that.

And one last thought: having a theme for a party can make it more fun, even if she might be a little too strict sometimes.

So thank you, Angela Martin, for making all of us, quote, buy the book work until five spreadsheet making people out there feel seen.

I love you both.

Aww.

Thanks, Kaylee.

Kaylee, I love your take on Angela Martin.

I love that you're relating to all those things.

What a great episode.

Thank you, everybody.

And thank you guys all so much for your questions.

They were so

just really wonderful.

And I hope this wasn't too much, Angela Martin, for everyone, but what a great, fun birthday.

And I can't wait to have some of my cake.

I will not eat it on the mic, but I am about to have a piece of birthday cake.

All right, everyone.

Thanks for writing in.

We'll see you next week.

See you then.

Thank you for listening to Office Ladies.

Office Ladies is a presentation of Odyssey and is produced by Jenna Fisher and Angela Kinsey.

Our executive producer is Cassie Jerkins.

Our audio engineer is Sam Kiefer, and our associate producer is Ainsley Bubico.

Odyssey's executive producer is Leah Reese Dennis.

Office Ladies was mixed and mastered by Bill Schultz.

Our theme song is Rubber Tree by Creed Bratton.

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