The Promotion

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I'm Jenna Fisher.

And I'm Angela Kinsey.

We were on The Office together and we're best friends.

And now we're doing the Ultimate Office Rewatch podcast just for you.

Each week, we will break down an episode of The Office and give exclusive behind-the-scenes stories that only two people who were there can tell you.

We're the Office ladies.

Hello, everyone.

Hello.

Hello, and to Leves Eternal Gory.

Oh, lady, we should tell people this is the first podcast that we are recording in 2022.

The other ones you've been listening to this year, we recorded before the new year.

This is our first one back after our vacations.

We are back.

We are semi-rested.

We're also semi-back.

I am back in my closet.

You are.

You are in the studio.

Oh, guys.

There are some stricter protocols here at the beginning of 2022.

So I let Angela have the studio.

Me and Sam.

What's up, Sam?

Hi, everybody.

Hey, Sam.

Cassie and I are over here on Zoom.

Hi, ladies.

Hi.

I will point out, you guys, Jenna, is that a ginormous plant in your podcast closet?

It is.

Do you notice Cassie's got a plant over her shoulder as well?

I guess when you podcast from home, you need a plant.

That's totally a quick.

Sam has a little Christmas tree.

Damn it.

Lady, are you the only one without a plant?

I'm plantless.

Which is so crazy because you're the plant tracker.

I love plants, guys.

I guess I'm going to have to start traveling with my own plant.

I'm going to be that lady.

You know how you see people that travel always with a pet?

Maybe I'm going to be the lady that's like, hey, do you see that lady with a little tiny succulent in her lap on the plane?

I would love to travel with you as old ladies where you just clutch a tiny succulent the whole time.

That's the thing.

You guys, I should share with you that for Christmas, Jenna and I exchanged gifts.

I got her some cozy pajama pants and she got me a succulent throw pillow it looks like a giant succulent but it's a cozy pillow it really does i brought it home and isabel said mom is that pillow a succulent and i was like yes yes it is isabelle oh my god you guys sam just brought me a plant

Wait, Cassie, can you get a picture?

Oh,

Cassie, you need to get in this picture with your plant.

Okay, Sam, you hold up your tree.

Ready?

Here we go.

One, two, two, three.

That is amazing.

Well, you know, listen, we might have some protocols that keep us apart, but we're enjoying plants together, you guys.

That's something.

It's something.

It's huge.

I'll take it.

Should we get into this episode?

We really should because there's a lot of fun stuff to discuss.

This is the promotion.

It is season six, episode three.

It is written by Jen Salada, directed by Jen Salada.

And here is your summary.

Michael and Jim's managerial power struggle intensifies when David Wallace reveals that they don't have enough money to give everyone in the office their yearly raises.

So he leaves it up to the co-managers to determine who gets a raise.

Meanwhile, Pam tries to get people to give her money instead of traditional wedding gifts.

That storyline really cracked me up.

It did me too.

All right.

Fast fact number one.

I have a location breakdown.

I thought you would.

You might be thinking, wait, they didn't go anywhere on location.

Please tell me your location breakdown is Jim's glass cube.

It is, lady.

Is it really?

Well, we got a bunch of fan questions, including from Tara Jade L in South Australia.

Can we please talk about the layout of the office changing?

Because I don't think it's ever mentioned.

A new office just appears for Jim to move into that was never there before.

And from Seoul C in Taiwan, what was involved in making Jim's office?

Did they break down the wall behind Kevin's desk to make space?

And Molly S.

from Arkansas says, how long did this process take?

Did it slow down the shooting at all?

See, lots of questions.

Lots of questions.

I'm going to have to agree with Tara Jade.

It's true.

Jim is just suddenly in a tiny glass cube in the office and no one says anything.

No one says, where did this come from?

I know.

I would have loved just one talking head where someone was like, what the hell?

I know.

Like, you know, who would have been perfect is Ryan.

Ryan being like, what the hell?

Jim's glass box took over the whole corner of the office.

I agree.

Well, Jim's office was actually a pretty simple addition that was installed over the weekend.

Randy Cordray shared with us that this is because we were able to build all the walls in our scenery mill, which was across the street from our studio lot.

Michael Gallenberg designed them.

They were built by our construction coordinator, Tim James, and then the walls were installed pretty quickly.

They did arrange our shoot schedule so that we didn't shoot inside Jim's office until later in the week.

This was mostly so that set dressing could decorate it.

Right.

I did zoom in to see if the glass walls went all the way to our faky ceiling.

And they did.

Oh!

The top part is frosted, like these frosted rectangles, and then the bottom part is clear glass with blinds.

Wow.

Well, Randy mentioned that the new office was kind of right behind Creed's area.

They didn't have to modify anything that was existing.

It just kind of fit.

That's what she said.

There was one piece of set dressing that Randy pointed out that he says you can't see in the episode, but he absolutely loves it.

He sent us a picture of it, which is Jim's diploma.

What's it say?

It's just, you know, that he graduated from college.

It was created by our graphics designer, Ryan Cosgrove.

So we can post that in Office Lady's Stories.

Oh, fun.

That was your breakdown of Jim's Cube.

Well, you know, I noticed a few things in Jim's Cube.

Oh, yeah?

Mm-hmm.

I noticed a calendar, which seems important.

But did you see the giant poster of a train?

Yeah.

What's that?

And then I thought, is there a train club at Dunder Mifflin we don't know about?

I mean, Dwight and Toby love trains.

We learned that in the meeting.

Is there a train finer's thing club?

Oh my gosh, a train club.

I don't know.

These are now three people at Dundromifflin that clearly have a thing for trains.

I'm just saying, I see a theme.

I took a picture of the train.

I zoomed in.

I couldn't make out.

There's some kind of like saying underneath the train.

I really wish I could have made that out.

But if you guys caught it, let us know.

I just want to say, Ange,

I feel like maybe you're the person who has a thing for trains.

No, I don't.

You zoomed in on a picture of a train to see what model it was, and then you Googled all the models of the trains from the meeting.

I just feel like maybe, maybe you're projecting, do you love trains?

Listen, first of all, dig deep.

Really think hard.

First of all, how dare you?

And yes, I do love trains.

Secondly, whenever I see a train on a road trip, I get really excited and I point it out to the kids.

I say, Look, train.

Look at the train.

My uncle was a conductor of a train.

Lady, this is a breakthrough.

But come on, Jim has one poster in his whole little glass cube and it's of a train.

Of course I'm going to notice that.

I mean, I just assumed it was like some leftover poster in storage and he was like, sure.

Yeah, you're right.

You're right.

I don't know.

Jim is probably not attached to it at all.

I'm going to get you a picture of a train next year for Christmas.

Are you really?

Maybe.

You know what I've always wanted to do?

What?

Is take the train through Scotland?

Yes.

Yes.

I want to do that.

I want to do that too, but I'm afraid I won't sleep well and I'll just like be grouchy the whole trip.

You know I don't do good without sleep.

Lady, the Queen of England does it.

You can do do it.

The Queen of England has a fancy train car.

Well, that's true.

Would I take the Queen of England's train car through Scotland?

Sure.

Definitely.

I want to go.

I want to do it.

You have to do it with me.

All right, I will.

You and your little succulent can ride the train.

Thank you, because I'll jump in something icy with you at the end.

Yay!

This is great.

Done.

And then we can make a Hallmark movie about it.

Two ladies and a succulent traveling through Scotland to jump in an icy cold pond.

Tune in.

This is a Hallmark movie.

It's going to go with laundry and betrayal.

Oh, God.

I really want that to happen.

We should really be producers.

All right.

I'm going to move us on to fast fact number two.

We should run a network for boring middle-aged women.

Okay, move us on.

Move us on.

Fast fact number two: this this episode was originally titled Co-Managers.

It aired on October 1st, 2009, when it was retitled The Promotion.

Here's something crazy.

I was in a movie called The Promotion.

I know.

It was released in 2008.

It starred John C.

Riley and Sean William Scott as these two guys who are dueling for the same job as a grocery store manager.

We shot it in Chicago.

You know what I I had to do in order to shoot that movie?

I would shoot on the office all during the week, Monday through Friday.

I would get on an airplane, take the red eye to Chicago, sleep on the plane.

I would work Saturday and Sunday on the movie, take the red eye back to LA and just go to work on the office.

One morning on a Monday after I had done this, I was in a wardrobe fitting and I fell asleep standing up.

I was so tired.

It was insane.

That's the kind of stuff you can do when you're young and

I couldn't do that today.

There's no way.

Lady, guess what?

What?

I remembered that you were in a movie called The Promotion, and I looked through my digital clutter, and guess what I found?

What?

I went to your premiere.

Oh, yeah.

And not only did I go, Ed Helms and I carpooled.

Oh, my gosh.

I found our emails back and forth about like who would pick up who or who could drive who.

And Ed said, all good.

He came and picked me up.

You said, let me know what time and I'll pick you up.

And maybe i can meet isabel

that is so sweet because isabel was only a few weeks old your premiere was may 28th lady and she was born may 3rd you came to my movie premiere just a few weeks after your baby was born yes this is something i did not appreciate at the time because i was not a mother yet well i looked to see if there were any photos and In our emails, Ed and I were meeting up with Rachel Harris and we were all going to go.

And I found photos of Rachel Harris.

I found photos of Melora, Oscar, and Kate all at your premiere.

Not a single photo of me and Ed.

Oh no.

I don't know if we were running late.

I don't know if because I had just had a baby, I was like, yeah, no, I'm not walking that red carpet.

But we did go and we carpooled.

Oh, well, I really appreciated that.

I loved being in that movie.

I made a really good friend on that movie and Fred Armison.

He had another supporting role.

So we had a lot of downtime together.

We hung out a lot.

And he was one of the people like you who really took care of me in New York when I broke my back.

And yeah, that was, I loved that movie.

I loved it too.

Fred is one of the funniest people I've ever met in my life.

And Jenna, you and I have worked with a lot of funny people.

So that is saying a lot.

Yeah.

But I remember one time coming over and hanging out with you and Fred, and I was crying.

I was laughing.

Like I was laughing so hard, I couldn't catch my breath.

Just at him just riffing about, I don't know what we were talking about, just random stuff but he's so flippin funny no him and chris parnell oh forget it forget there's not i can't yes too much ah chris parnell and fred armiston will you be in our movie where we travel with the succulent through scotland we would just laugh the whole time it would be wonderful i want that experience All right, are you ready for Fast Fact number three?

Yes.

Jen Salata, as I said, was our writer-director.

And I reached out to her because I noticed that this episode is basically just one big A story,

like including the cold open.

It's not even like a standalone cold open.

It's an on-plot cold open.

Yeah, it's one big story start to finish.

There's no B story.

There's this little bitty runner about Pam and her registry.

But here's what Jen had to say about that.

I think because it was a bigger story for Michael and Jim and a story which affected everyone in the office, we opted for no B story on this one.

But I noticed when I re-watched it that a lot of the how it affected everyone in the office didn't make it into the episode.

There were some really fun talking heads about who everyone preferred as a boss, Michael or Jim, but they didn't make it in.

I love the small money runner for Pam.

The moment you see your new last name on the check was my favorite.

I like how different it felt in this episode to see Jim in his own office.

You'd imagine Jim having his own office would be a nice thing, but then it separates him out from the others in a way that Michael is also separated out.

So there's definitely good and bad in this promotion.

I always love when writers speak thematically about an episode.

I'm real nerdy like that.

I just love how smart they are.

And

I just loved it.

I know.

I'm just like, ha ha ha, this is so funny.

And they're like, I'm going to break down how this comedy works.

Yeah, exactly.

Well, Jen is right.

There are a lot of deleted scenes.

I really enjoyed them.

I'm going to share a few later in the episode where they would have come, but there's maybe just a little teaser here, my favorite Stanley talking head ever that got deleted.

Oh, it's going to come later.

But yeah, if you have the DVDs, go to the deleted scenes for this one because they are delicious.

Well, lady, that's all I've got.

I think we could take a break and then we'll get into it.

Let's do it.

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All right.

This episode starts with Dwight needing a signature for an expense report from Michael.

But Michael says, you know what?

That doesn't fall under his category of boss, right?

He's big picture.

And he sends him to Jim.

And poor Dwight now is a ping-pong doll going back and forth between these two guys.

Yeah, Jim is kind of like, hmm, I don't know.

I'll sign it, but only if you say please.

So then Dwight tries to file a report on Jim.

Oh, it's a mess.

This co-manager thing is a mess.

It's already a mess.

Dwight has a talking head where he shares what he'd like to do to Jim, put him in a triangle, chokehold, force him down.

He basically, Dwight wants to be like a professional wrestler, right?

Is that what's happening here?

That's what he's describing.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Well, I have a couple of observations about this cold open.

Okay.

Number one, Jim is suited up.

Well, yeah.

He's got his ambition jacket back on again.

He's super serious.

He's boss man.

His boss.

Dwight

is not wearing mustard.

Did you notice?

Oh my God.

Yeah.

I mean, I didn't, but now I, yeah.

He's also in a full suit, and his shirt is like this blue, gray, green color.

Very interesting.

Because he's vying for the position.

Perhaps.

So he has to look serious.

Another observation about this cold open actually comes from our writer director, Jen Salada.

And she talks a little bit about what it was like to shoot.

Here's what she said.

I always really respected the directors that would play by the two-camera dock rule that was established early on.

Many did, but I really remember Jeff Blitz always sticking to that rule.

There were so many good and beautiful episodes where you could feel the presence of more than two cameras, but I loved when directors would have to reach to get what they wanted using only the two.

I tried hard to figure out a way to lose the third camera in that cold open when Dwight was running back and forth between Michael and Jim's office, but I never cracked it and it still kind of bugs me.

It's so funny.

I didn't even notice.

I didn't either, but I, you know, I do remember Jeff Blitz really trying to stick to a traditional documentary.

I remember that about him.

Well, he was a documentarian.

Yeah.

You know, so that makes sense to me.

And I know that Jen worked really closely with him.

So it also makes sense to me that she would want to adhere to it as well.

Yeah.

Well, I guess if you re-watch that cold open, you can look for the three camera angles instead of two.

But I have to say, Jen, I didn't see it.

So you tricked me.

You got us.

So now we're going to get into this episode.

And Michael wants everyone to gather in the conference room.

He wants to have a meeting.

And he suggests that everyone bring a snack because this meeting might take a while.

Oh, Lord.

And Jim is like, Michael, can I speak to you in my office?

And Michael is like, Maybe you can come speak to me in my office.

And then Stanley says, wait, can I be a boss too?

Yes.

And then Oscar has a talking head where he says it doesn't take a genius to know that an organization thrives with two leaders.

Lady,

I looked up some organizations that have two CEOs.

Oh.

And guess what?

Not the Popes, I'm guessing.

No, not the Popes.

Who?

Netflix.

Okay.

Warby Parker.

Oh.

Salesforce.

There's a very successful meal delivery service called Fresh and Lean.

And most notably,

Ramble,

our company.

Woohoo!

We are co-CEOs.

And by the way, our organization is thriving with two leaders.

Oscar, you got it wrong.

We are doing great.

So this really starts a whole bunch of deleted scenes that Jen was talking about.

One of them involves Kevin, just in the fact that he doesn't know how to relate to Jim anymore as a boss.

Jim was his buddy, right?

And it's really funny.

He ends up over-sharing a whole bunch of things he shouldn't be saying to a boss.

We have to hear it.

I just wanted to congratulate you on your promotion.

Oh, thanks.

Yeah.

And also, I

was wondering if you could forget what I said last week

about the fact that I don't really do my job.

Oh, sure.

Is that why you've been avoiding me?

Oh, no, I wouldn't do that.

Oh, it was just that I was late today, and I took a nap in the bathroom for a while.

All right.

I think you're going to want to stop telling me those things.

Gotcha.

I will stop telling you things.

Aw, that kind of breaks my heart.

I know.

But also, how often is Kevin napping in the bathroom?

Exactly.

So Jim ultimately decides, I guess, he will go into Michael's office, right?

He won't make Michael come into his.

And right when he sits down to talk to Michael, I caught a little background surfing the internet.

Oh my gosh, me too.

It's at four minutes, 12 seconds.

It's also at 3 minutes, 34 seconds, and it's Rain Wilson.

Oh!

I caught myself scrolling the internet.

Did you really?

I caught Rain and you caught, you guys are both surfing the internet during this whole scene.

We really are.

That's hilarious.

This is the scene where Michael calls Jim Jim James Jimothy.

Mm-hmm.

He's like, oh, that just sounds weird.

Can I go back to Jim?

So Jimothy is explaining that these conference room meetings are eating up like a large part of the day.

They are very disruptive.

And Michael's like, you know what else?

Eats up a large part of the day, napping.

You fall asleep, you wake up, and it's evening.

Yeah.

So I'll tell you what, Angela, this is a delightful scene.

It's very funny.

But all I noticed in this scene was the blooming plant behind Jim.

Yes, I did too.

I had to Google it.

I had to know what is this plant.

You know what it is?

Yes, I do.

It is a peace lily, aka

the closet plant.

I found out it is very popular in homes and offices because they don't need a ton of light or water.

So when I realized I would be podcasting in my closet this week, I got myself a peas lily.

That's my plant that you noticed.

I did notice.

No, it's not blooming because if it's blooming, it's white with like a little yellow thing.

And that's how you can tell.

Yes, it is not bloomed yet, but it's substantial in size.

And I have to say, it's really making my closet experience better.

I think it's beautiful.

Give it a little bit of sunlight.

It likes a little bit.

I have one in my backyard and it just will bloom spontaneously.

I just love it so much.

And it's blooming right now.

You have it planted in the ground?

No, no, no.

I have it in a pot.

But outside?

I have it outside in a pot.

It's in a sort of shady part of my backyard.

And I also have it near some hydrangeas.

Well, let me tell you what.

When I called my local nursery to ask them if they had a peace lily, Because I wanted to buy one, they gave me a little sass.

They did?

Yes.

First off, they said, oh, yes, we do.

And I said, great.

So when I get there, you know, this nursery is big.

I said, where will I find it?

Is it in the outdoor section?

Because most of it is like an outdoor nursery.

And they sassed me and said, no,

it would be in the indoor section because it's an indoor plant.

It is an indoor plant.

They are not wrong.

I wouldn't normally put a peace lily outside, guys, but I was given a gift of a pot full of a bunch of different plants plants, and none of them had bloomed yet.

And it wasn't doing so great in my kitchen window where I put things.

So I set it outside in this little shady nook where my hydrangeas are happy.

And voila, I have a peace lily outside.

Wow.

Wow.

Well, the next time I go to my nursery, I'm going to tell them that story because the lady who ended up helping me when I got there was amazing.

I mean, she knew everything about plants.

I feel like she would want to know.

I feel like she and I would be friends.

Oh, lady, actually, now that you mention it, I should bring you there because you and this woman would hit it off.

I mean, maybe I shouldn't bring you there because I might lose a BFF.

I mean, the two of you are total plant nerds.

I love her.

She's not the person who answered the phone, by the way.

She did not sass me.

She was wonderful.

She wasn't a snarky phone person.

Well, I want to meet her.

I can't wait.

It's a plant date.

It's a plant date.

All right.

The next scene, Pam is eyeing a donut in the kitchen and Phyllis enters, kind of asks her what she's doing.

I loved this scene so much.

It's so funny.

I mean, what the heck?

Phyllis has a cousin that makes romantic birdhouse mailboxes?

What is a romantic birdhouse mailbox?

Are the birds making out?

Like, what are they doing?

Why is it romantic?

I don't know.

Maybe they make a heart with their beaks or something.

Maybe they kiss a heart.

Maybe they do.

I feel like you might have one of these.

I could see you having a romantic birdhouse mailbox, lady.

Let me tell you, the minute I read this, I had to know.

And then I found mailboxes that look like birdhouses.

And I actually need a new mailbox.

And I was like, Josh?

And he was like, no, no.

I guess I'm a little confused, though.

I mean, is it going to confuse the birds?

Like, are they going to try to nest in your mailbox?

Or will it confuse my mail carrier?

And then I I won't get mail.

I don't know.

I did want to point out at four minutes and 58 seconds, I am holding my favorite donut.

Our craft services guys would have donuts out every morning, and they always had our favorites.

That one was mine.

It's a cake donut with icing and sprinkles.

I'm kind of wishing I'd also gotten myself a donut for my closet.

Oh.

I didn't think of it till just now.

Wait, I have to show you.

I was listening to your donut selection, but I have to show you the picture of the birdhouse mailbox that I want.

Okay.

Okay.

It's like a three-story

birdhouse.

It looks like a combo mailbox and birdhouse.

If I were a bird, I wouldn't want to move into that.

It feels, I don't know.

It feels like it's going to be like living above a busy store.

Also, though,

will I just have like bird poop on my mail?

I don't know.

I guess Jim walks out of his office and notices that there's a bunch of people missing.

Where are they?

I don't know.

Maybe I'll go see what Michael's up to.

And he's having a sneaky meeting.

Yeah.

He's got Oscar, Stanley, Creed, and Kelly all sitting in chairs across his desk.

Michael claims it's a product expansion focus group.

They all want to go back to their desks.

And Jim says, what kind of products?

What happened in here?

You know, what was the last thing that was said?

And Stanley Stanley said, Michael said, if you don't smell this, you're fired.

This leads to a Kelly talking head where she says she loves rivalries.

Michael or Jim, Paris or Nicole, hi to your LC.

It's so fun.

This was the beginning, Jenna, of people comparing Jim and Michael as bosses.

There are a series of deleted talking heads.

They are so fun.

We have to hear them.

Let's start with Toby's.

Comparing Jim and Michael is like comparing apples and oranges.

I like apples.

I really, really don't like oranges.

Oranges are annoying and hate me.

Oranges are annoying and hate me.

Hmm.

Who's the orange?

That made me laugh.

Now for maybe my favorite Stanley talking head ever.

And it wasn't in the episode, and I'm so sad.

You have to hear it.

When you ask Jim a question, he'll tell you an answer.

When you ask Michael a question, he'll do an imitation of you for five minutes.

Then he'll show you three YouTube videos.

Then he'll try to tickle you.

And if that's not enough, he'll ask you to repeat the question.

Meanwhile, he's wandered off somewhere.

He comes back, looks at the clock, and leaves for the rest of the day.

But he also doesn't care if you come in late.

So I prefer Michael.

That is amazing.

I love that he said first he'll do an impression of you, then he'll show you YouTube videos.

It just cracked me up.

Lastly, you have to hear Andy's comparison of Jim and Michael because Andy is doing that thing, Jenna, that we do when a question makes us uncomfortable.

Michael is like the fun dad, and Jim is like the serious mom.

And little Andy is stuck in the middle, but he loves them both very much.

But if he had to pick one, he would probably pick Jim because because Jim gives him his num nums on time.

Num nums are, of course, my commission checks.

Oh,

oh, Andy.

But we've talked about this how sometimes you get asked a question that you're like, I don't want to, this might come across mean to someone.

I'll do a little voice or I'll sing it.

Yeah, the lady at the nursery was real mean to me.

Yeah, she told me peace lilies have to stay inside, and I didn't like it one bit.

Well, now we're going to get into the major conflict of this episode.

David Wallace is going to call and explain that Dunder Mifflin cannot give out cost of living raises this year.

There's a finite amount of money, and it's up to these guys to figure out how to distribute the money amongst all the employees.

And Michael and Jim start vying for this.

They're like, I got it.

No, I got it.

And David's like, is there going to be a problem?

Also, Michael, are you texting me?

Oh, yeah.

I guess in the end, David is like, you need to figure this out together.

Terrible idea.

It starts some really funny Jim and Michael scenes because at first, Michael's acting like that, sure, great.

They can do this together.

And then Jim is like, tell me how you really feel.

And he goes, I hate the fact that we have to do this together.

And then he's like, all I can see is your big and gross pores and your nose.

Like, it gets so personal.

Later, he points out his crusty eyes.

Like,

what, Michael?

What happens to you when you get back to the corner?

You just get really mean.

Lady, I literally made a list of all of Michael's jabs at gym.

He also calls him Skippy at one point.

Big pores, crusty eyes, Skippy.

That was as far as my list went.

Also, we learned that Michael hates a pros and cons list.

Oh my gosh.

Hates Hates it.

Absolutely hates it.

And then he has that amazing quote where he says, sometimes the smartest people don't think at all.

Well, lady, I had to know.

I don't know why.

I just on the fly decided to Google who invented the pros and cons list.

Did you really?

The answer is fascinating.

Oh my gosh, I want to hear it.

There is an inventor of the pros and cons list, and it is Ben Franklin.

What?

Ben Franklin!

All right, this is where everyone thinks the pros and cons list came from.

He wrote a letter in 1772 to Joseph Priestley, where he described in great detail how he makes a decision.

I'm going to read it to you.

Every word fascinated me.

He said, quote, my way, he capitalized way, by the way, his way.

Okay.

Frank Sinatra, we hear you.

Is to divide a half sheet of paper by a line into two columns, writing over the one pro and over the other con.

Then, during three or four days of consideration, I put down under the different headings different motives that at different times occur to me for or against the measure.

When I have thus got them all together in one view, I endeavor to estimate their respective weights.

Where I find two, one on each side, that seem equal, I strike them both out.

If I find a reason pro that is equal to two reasons con, I'll strike out all three.

If I judge two reasons con equal to three reasons pro, I strike out all five, and thus proceed until the balance lies.

And if after a day or two of further consideration, nothing new of importance occurs on either side, I can come to a determination accordingly.

Then he said, I have found great advantage from this kind of equation.

And he said, I believe I have discovered what could be called moral or prudential algebra.

He believes that he had found a mathematical equation for making a decision.

Well, I can tell you right now, he would have driven Michael Scott crazy.

Crazy.

If he walked in and said, listen, it's going to take me three days

with this pros and cons list to figure out what we're going to do, Michael would have been like, I'm out.

Well, when I read this, I also realized I've been doing pros and cons lists wrong, I guess.

I just make lists of pros and cons and then I can see them all in one place.

I didn't realize I was supposed to strike them out if I consider them to be of equal importance.

I didn't realize there was a whole striking out process that Ben Franklin intended.

Well, Jenna, I know you love a list.

I have no doubt you've made many pro and con lists in your life.

True, true.

Well, I'll have you know, Angela,

next Jim is going to make a pie chart of Michael's time,

how Michael spends time.

Yeah.

It looks like he used crayon, by the way.

I know.

I also googled who invented the pie chart.

Did you really?

Yeah.

Who did it?

Oh, lady.

Also, fascinating.

Who knew these Googles would be so interesting?

The earliest known pie chart is generally credited to William Playfair in 1801.

He was a businessman, engineer, and economics writer from Scotland.

But get this.

What?

Florence Nightingale is credited with adapting the pie chart and basically making it go viral.

Did she use it for pain?

Like, what's your threshold for pain?

No.

But it's interesting you ask that because I will remind people that Florence Nightingale is the woman who pioneered the field of nursing.

She started a nursing school.

She tended to wounded soldiers during the Crimean War.

But she was also a pioneer in the area of statistics, and she made a pie chart that showed the impact of poor sanitary conditions on mortality rates.

And some people believe that this is the first time that a pie chart was used to persuade people to change.

Oh, wow.

And it kind of went viral.

So she's credited as, you know, making the pie chart accessible.

There you go.

There you go.

Well, I looked at Jim's pie chart, took a picture of it, and you know what I thought?

What?

He was just procrastinating.

I mean, really, how different would Jim's pie chart be from Michael's?

The biggest part is in green.

It's procrastinating.

Then the other biggest part is yellow and it's distracting others.

And then there's a tiny sliver of red for for critical thinking.

I mean, Jim's wouldn't be that different.

He's always distracted.

He's procrastinating.

Come on.

You're so right.

Jim just drew his own pie chart.

Pretty much.

While Jim's making pie charts, Pam is still trying to hustle up some money as wedding gifts and finally finds someone who's going to write her a check.

Kevin.

He writes her a check for $40

and he says he's going to put to love's eternal Glory in the subject line.

But also, you know, can you wait until you cash it till Monday?

Yes.

But this is the moment that Pam sees the name Mrs.

Pam Halpert for the first time.

Aww.

She gets all excited.

And I have a question.

Pam is doing her talking head out in the little, I don't know, what would you call that?

The vestibule, the

like inner lobby from right outside the door of Dunder Mifflin.

Oh, yeah, like the entryway.

Yeah, that Dunder Mifflin sign that Pam is standing next to, isn't that the one that John like took and you saw him putting it in his trunk?

Yeah, at the end.

That's the one John stole when we wrapped.

That's what I thought.

I was like, oh, hey, John's got that at his house.

Yeah.

Well, listen, I think we should take a break because when we come back, Jim and Michael are going to try a lot of strategies to divide up this money, and pretty much none of them are going to go well?

You mean putting beans on people's faces isn't a great way to figure out if they get a raise?

We'll talk about it after the break.

We will.

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Jim and Michael are in the conference room, and Jim proposes that they give the raises to the salespeople.

He said, they're the ones who bring in the money and this will keep them happy.

Well, Michael doesn't think that's going going to go over very well.

Well, these guys are going to kind of argue now.

And I thought this scene was a little bit dramatic.

And even Jen Salata mentioned it.

Here's what she had to say.

When I was directing a scene with Steve and John in the conference room, I think it was the scene where Michael criticizes Jim's way of thinking and Jim tells Michael that he has weaknesses.

I kind of popped out of the moment and looked at us and said, I think we're doing a drama right now.

It occurred to me that I wrote it kind of dramatic and their instincts were dramatic as was fitting for the scene.

And I was steering steering it in an even more dramatic way.

I remember trying to push things to their edges a bit more in the sixth season, maybe as a reaction to having done so many episodes in a row fifth season, that I was looking to shake things up a little.

And drama is definitely where some of those scenes went.

Maybe with me writing and directing, there wasn't enough quality control.

I think I even asked Paul, like, is this too dramatic?

Did I make this into a drama?

But then John and Steve and I paused and talked about the balance and landed in a really nice place, I think.

I love what Steve and John did in that scene and throughout that episode.

It was really fun getting to dig into their relationship in a deeper way.

Yeah, I can feel that in this scene.

I mean, Jim's like, you know what, Michael?

Here are your weaknesses.

And Michael's like, oh, yeah, you want to tell me my weaknesses?

Like, it gets really personal, not to mention Michael goes there with the crusty eyes.

Yes.

I really like it when our show would dare to kind of let comedy go for a second.

Sometimes it was in those romantic moments.

Sometimes it was emotional with all the stuff about sprinkles, all the stuff about your heart getting broken, Angela.

Like I liked it when the show didn't need to be funny or ring that funny bell every three seconds, which is kind of your traditional comedy.

So I really appreciated this scene.

I did too.

And of course they found like the moments of comedy.

And one of the lines that made me laugh was at the very end when, you know, Jim is going to go out there.

Michael's like, okay, Skippy, give it your best shot.

Go tell him.

And Jim leaves.

And then Michael turns to Cameron and says, this had better be terrible.

Yeah.

Like he's rooting for him to fail.

And when Jim does just lay it out there, he's honest.

He's going to shoot everyone straight.

And right away it doesn't go well.

Well, he comes off condescending.

He's talking about, I'm going to talk to you all like adults because you're very smart.

Yes.

And then Oscar says, thank you, Jim, for thinking that we're smart people.

And then Angela, sort of playing dumb, goes, but I do not understand.

If we're such smart adults, then why don't we get raises?

And Oscar's like, excellent question, genius.

Also, by the way, if you go back and rewatch this, tell me if you think I sound southern when I say, I do not understand, because it's all I could hear was my accent.

Anyway, so the scene starts to really get out of hand and it builds with this crescendo.

You've got to hear it.

We work just as hard as the salespeople.

We deserve raises.

Yes.

Yes.

They don't get them if we don't get them.

My kid needs shoes.

You want to tell him he doesn't get shoes?

Yeah.

Her kid kid needs shoes, Jim.

What the hell?

Girl, Tommy, how are you?

I mean, Michael got his wish.

That went terribly.

Terribly.

Jim is going to need to rewind out of that.

He's going to do his best little rewind back into the conference room.

And Pam's face where she's like, oh, no, not rewind, guy.

Not rewind, guy.

I went to the script and that reaction was in the script.

It literally says, Pam is embarrassed

for Jim.

Jenna, I don't know if you remember one time when I did a rewind bit, but it killed.

Do you remember?

Yes.

I do.

We co-presented at the 57th American Cinema Editors Awards and Jenna and I announced the winner of the best edited one hour series for commercial television.

I did my rewind bit.

Jenna, come on.

It was so good.

It was so good.

Want to hear it?

First of all, we had great banter.

I thought we were great co-presenters.

I thought we should get asked to host a whole award show based on that one appearance.

I really did.

I was like, I was so pleased with us that I was like, I'm sorry.

Give us a call, Emmys.

We need to host the whole shebang.

Or at least present one award.

Yeah.

Here's my editor's bit.

Ready?

Yeah.

So we did this bit.

Jenna, remember you set up how.

Yeah, I was like, we are very close with our editors.

we're always walking by their edit bay and here's what we hear and then I jumped in and went

it's so good and it got a big laugh we crushed it

and you folks listening out there guess who won the award we presented it was none other than the editors for Friday night lights so cool so cool and it was a show Jenna and I both loved.

We were so excited to meet them.

That was a really fun night.

I found fancy photos of us.

Oh, I found fancy photos of us from that night.

And then also, Jenna, I meant to bring up your red carpet photos for the promotion, you were all about the over-the-shoulder.

I was.

You're like, tonight's tonight.

I am going to finally get the over-the-shoulder look.

Wait, I have to show you.

That's very funny.

You know, we did from time to time, a red carpet would come up and we'd be like, listen, I'm going to nail this new situation.

I don't know what it would be.

We'd be like, I'm going to get the pout right tonight or I'm going to nail an over-the-shoulder.

I clearly decided to take on over-the-shoulder.

The promotion was your night for it.

I'll put it in stories, guys.

I can't wait.

Well, listen, in this whole scene, we did get a fan question from Heather B in Victoria, British Columbia, Canada, who noticed when Oscar tells the office that Jim is only giving raises to his friends and the people he sleeps with, Pam turns around in her chair and mouths something in Oscar's direction.

It's at 13 minutes, 18 seconds.

Jenna, what were you saying?

Oh my God, I saw it.

I'm saying, Oscar, but they cut my audio.

And I went to the script and it was not scripted.

So clearly I improvised Oscar.

And when they got in the editing room, they were like, we are not interested in this improvisation.

We are cutting your audio, cutting you out.

So, anyway, after Jim rewinds back into the conference room, they still have to make this decision.

Michael suggests maybe they do a merit-based raise, and this is going to lead them to putting the Boston baked beans on the photos of the employees.

But first, we're going to hear from the largest talking head in office history.

Six people, it's at 14 minutes, 45 seconds.

There is sort of a pyramid shape of office co-workers.

Creed at the top.

In the back row, Meredith, Kevin, and Angela.

In the front row, Dwight and Oscar.

And they are not happy.

Meredith says, I am so pissed at this company.

Yeah.

And then Dwight goes, and Jim.

And Meredith said, who says that?

And Dwight says, I think it was Creed.

Creed's like, yep, Creed hadn't spoken.

What's happening, Creed?

I loved the big group talking head.

I thought it was really fun.

I did too.

It was fun to shoot as well because we each had a line and it was sort of like rapid fire and it was just a ton of fun.

Well, listen, Dwight is going to sneak into the conference room and he's going to discover all these little beans on everybody's face and he's going to blow their cover.

I did a deep dive on Boston baked beans because why not?

As you do.

Here's what I'm going to let you know.

Were they invented in the 14th century by...

I'm just kidding.

Well, first of all, I have to say, as I researched them, they sound delicious.

I've never really been drawn to the Boston baked bean because the name baked bean, it doesn't like make me want to eat it as a candy.

So, I mean...

Wait, they're candy?

They're candy.

See, right?

Oh, my God.

I thought they were putting actual beans.

No, Boston baked beans are a sugar-coated peanut candy.

Oh, yes.

Okay.

The name Boston Baked Bean is a generic name used throughout the whole candy industry to mean sugar-coated peanut.

But the Ferrara Pan Candy Company developed their line of the Boston baked beans in the early 1930s.

Those are the ones in the red box that you see all the time.

Right, right.

They're made in this process called cold panned candy process.

And the pans kind of like move in a circle or something, almost like a record.

And you throw the peanuts in, and then like the sugar kind of coats them slowly until you get them the right size.

I don't know.

They sound really good.

Do you need some Boston Baked Beans, lady?

Do I need to drop some off?

Maybe I do.

Why did I only get a plant?

Why didn't I also get Boston Baked Beans and a donut?

I don't know.

I did find out a few fun facts about the Ferreira company that makes Boston Baked Beans that I thought was kind of cool because they make a bunch of different candies.

They make 800,000 sweet tart rolls every day.

It's the size of 2,700 football fields a day.

Wow.

They run out of Chicago.

They also make nerds.

Oh, the candy nerds.

Yeah.

And they make 135,000 pounds of nerds every day.

Whoa.

They also make trolly sour bright worms.

Don't know what that is.

They're like, you know, sour worms.

Okay.

They make 127 pounds every minute.

Wow.

And they are the largest producer of candy canes.

And most jelly beans that are consumed in the United States are made by this company.

They're very busy.

And now they are a licensed Girl Scout cookie baker.

What Girl Scout cookie do they make?

They make them all.

They can bake them all.

They're one of the licensed bakers.

Oh.

They have a person, Natalie Hagstrom, who is the general manager of cookies.

That is her title, general manager of cookies.

I kind of want that job.

I want that on a business card.

Me too, right?

Yeah.

So that's everything I learned in my deep dive about the Boston baked bean.

You never know, lady, what you're going to find.

You never know.

You never know.

I try to bring a lot of special facts to the podcast to make

your dinner party conversations delightful.

A little more interesting.

That's right.

Maybe so.

Dwight is going to lead everyone into the conference room to show them the beans on the photos.

One of my favorite lines that he says with such seriousness is:

they determine our worth by putting beans upon our faces.

I know.

And then Kevin cannot stop saying, what does a bean mean?

What does a bean mean?

Oscar's like, will someone tell Kevin what a bean means?

They are not happy with how they're shaking out with the beans on the faces.

So after this experience in the conference room, they're back in the bullpen and Dwight is going to give a rousing speech.

I mean, he is trying to form basically a mutiny against Jim in particular.

Oh, yeah.

It's at 18 minutes, 18 seconds.

He starts off with, are we idiots?

What right does Jim have to claim authority?

Hmm?

Is he as good a salesman as I?

Is he as matronly as Phyllis?

There are moments where we can affect change.

For a few seconds, every decade, we exist.

And these are those seconds.

Let us storm his castle.

Come on, tick.

Let's get him.

Tuck.

Let's get Jim.

Tick.

And drag him out of his office.

Tuck.

Take his keys away from him.

Tick.

That's a clock.

The time is getting very close.

It's now or never.

What say you?

Does Dwight think he's in a Shakespearean play?

I don't know.

Of course, the speech made me think of those famous battlecry speeches, Jenna.

You know I love them.

We know you love them, lady.

So I just had to re-watch a whole bunch last night.

I did.

Just for you watching Battlecry speech.

I did.

I re-watched the St.

Christmas Day speech from Henry V.

I re-watched the speech in Gladiator.

Oh my god, so good.

And then I forgot about the speech Kate Blanchette gives as Elizabeth I, amazing at the Battle of Tilbury.

I mean, come on, Bill Paxton and Nepend State.

I had to watch a whole bunch of them.

I love them.

This brought me to this conclusion.

I would like to do a podcast about battle speeches.

Just one episode.

One episode, please.

We have to.

I would love it.

Lady, I just love this.

It's so funny because I feel like this is like,

this touches in you the thing that watching like the revenant or the edge touches in me.

I mean, it's very similar.

It's just like people overcoming tough odds.

I know.

Everything is stacked against them.

But they go anyway.

Let's do it.

I know.

Well, I want to point out that at 18 minutes, 40 seconds, as Dwight is giving this speech, Meredith

in the background, who is very mad that she's not getting a raise,

has free sale on her computer screen.

I just have to say, Meredith, you're not making a great case for yourself.

Kate Flannery, turn your screen off.

During all of this rally cry, Michael sneaks into Jim's office.

He brings two world's best boss mugs, and guess what's inside them?

Gin.

Gin!

Does this mean Michael has been drinking gin out of his world's best boss mug more often than we know?

Maybe so.

But this made me think of Paul Fig.

Our lovely Paul Fig has his own gin.

Me too.

He has two babies, as he calls them.

He has Ardingstahl Gin, and he has a pre-mixed Negroni number one cocktail.

It's amazing.

The bottles are beautiful.

That's what I wrote.

I wrote, not only are the bottles beautiful, but it's really good gin.

We'll take a picture of ours and we'll put them in stories.

Yes, and we'll put a swipe up so you can find Paul Feig's gin because it's delicious and we love Paul.

He's been working on that for a long time.

And you know that man loves a cocktail.

He likes a fancy cocktail.

He's a mixologist.

Yeah, so you know it's going to be good.

Jim and Michael cheers their gin.

There's a knock on the door.

Then there's a pounding on the door.

They look at each other.

And Michael says, just pretend we're not here.

We had a fan question about that.

It's from Rachel D.

in Pennsylvania.

She said, when Michael and Jim are hiding in Jim's office, someone is knocking at the door.

Who knocked?

Was it a cast member or a crew member?

Well, I'll tell you, it was a crew member because the cast was not there.

If you notice, all the blinds are shut, you know, on purpose, but we did not have to be in the background of that scene.

We did not have to be out there.

So maybe we were getting a snack.

Who knows?

Maybe we were done for the day.

I just know that we were not on the schedule for that one.

And so it was just those two guys and they had a crew member do the knocking.

Well, Jim Salata shared with us that this was one of her favorite scenes.

It's when Michael smiles at the end in Jim's office and Jim is struggling and Michael finally has someone who has to go through the tough parts of being a boss with him.

And Jen said that she just loved that they could hide in the boss's office together at the end of the episode.

Yeah, I liked that moment too.

I did too.

Well, now we're going to have this final tag at the end.

Ryan's going to come into the break room where Pam is dipping her pretzels in something.

What am I dipping them in?

I don't remember.

I don't know why I made this choice.

Do you think it was some actory method choice?

Like, oh, I'm pregnant.

I'm probably having odd cravings.

I'll take pretzels and dip it in something weird.

Yes, I think you're right.

That sounds like me.

It does.

Because in real life, I don't dip my pretzels in anything.

So I don't know what this was.

I cannot believe that Pam falls for this, Ryan.

Crapola.

I cannot believe she falls for it.

He's like, would you rather have $100 today or $5,000 a year from now?

Well, at first, she says $100 today.

No, I know.

I know her first instincts are so right, but Ryan is such a con man and he wears her down.

Well, listen, he has a guy that has an algorithm that can determine the winner of any given college basketball game.

Why is Ryan still working as a temp then?

So I did the math.

Pam writes Ryan a check for $50.

Kevin gave her $40 earlier.

She has lost $10

today.

Yep.

It's not going great.

Why can't Crate and Beryl just make a toaster full of cash?

I don't know.

We'd all register for that.

We sure would.

All right, that is the promotion.

We hope you go out today and have a fantastic day full of love's eternal glory.

We're sending you big hugs.

Yeah, maybe get yourself a plant.

I recommend it.

Maybe you need to go watch a battle prize speech.

Get you going for the whole week.

Hmm.

Make a pros consoles and see how you feel in three days.

Then decide.

Have a great week, you guys.

Bye.

Bye.

Thank you for listening to Office Ladies.

Office Ladies is produced by Ear Wolf, Jenna Fisher, and Angela Kinsey.

Our show is executive produced by Cody Fisher.

Our producer is Cassie Jerkins.

Our sound engineer is Sam Kiefer, and our associate producer is Ainsley Bubico.

Our theme song is Rubber Tree by Creed Bratton.

For ad-free versions of Office Ladies, go to StitcherPremium.com.

For a free one-month trial of Stitcher Premium, use code Office.

You don't just live in your home, you live in your neighborhood as well.

So, when you're shopping for a home, you want to know as much about the area around it as possible.

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Everything you'd ever want to know about a neighborhood, including the number of homes for sale, transportation, local amenities, cultural attractions, unique qualities, and even things like median lot size and a noise score.

Homes.com.

We've done your homework.

Hey, Fidelity.

How can I remember to invest every month?

With the Fidelity app, you can choose a schedule and set up recurring investments in stocks and ETFs.

Huh, that sounds easier than I thought.

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Yeah, I do.

Now, where did I put my keys?

You will find them where you left them.

Investing involves risk, including risk of loss.

Fidelity Brokerage Services LLC member NYSE SIPC.