#563 - The Major Murders - Pembroke, Kentucky

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This week in Pembroke, Kentucky, three mysterious murders in one night get much less mysterious when detectives figure out that someone who looks very upstanding might

not be so upstanding and may actually be a full-fledged monster. back to Small Town Murder.
Yay! Oh, yay indeed, Jimmy. Yay indeed.
My name is James Petrogallo. I'm here with my co-host.
I'm Jimmy Wissman. Thank you, folks, so much for joining us today on another insane edition of Small Town Murder.
And man, do we have a crazy one for you today. As usual, hope you've been enjoying lately.
Definitely head over to shutupandgivememurder.com right now. Get your tickets for live shows.
Pittsburgh, February 7th. You are on deck.
First up for the year. Let's start the year off right, Pittsburgh.
Next night in Columbus is already sold out. Unbelievable.
Unbelievable. Thank you.
And also, the ones later on, Portland is just about sold out, and that's in November. So get that.
Seattle's getting close. Get your tickets there.
Also, Philly and D.C. in December are getting there.
So seriously, if you guys want to go this getting close get your tickets there also philly and dc in december are getting

there so seriously if you guys want to go this year get your tickets right now everywhere except pittsburgh they're flying out the door so do that get in there right now that is shut up and give me murder duck yeah and then our newest date we just announced madison wisconsin now you know why we didn't announce it because we announced like the day after they had a pretty bad thing happen in their town.

So we didn't want to be like,

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hey, announced madison wisconsin now you know why we didn't announce it because we announced like the day after they had a pretty bad thing happen in their town so we didn't want to be like hey shut up and give me murder coming to you know we're decent people as we say we're assholes but we're not scumbags and you know let that simmer down a little bit let it have a little time to simmer on the back burner there so definitely head over get your tickets right now also listen to the other two shows that we do, Crime in Sports, which I assure you, you do not have to like sports. We're doing China right now.
Remember the rest of China, Joni Lohr? We're doing a multi-parter on her right now with Evil Knievel coming up next. That's a lot of fun.
Then for definitely do that and also listen to Your Stupid Opinions, which is just goddamn hilarious. You can hear about me getting a concussion in a diner.
It's a lot of fun. Check all that out.
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That said, disclaimer time, it's a comedy show, everybody. It's a comedy show.
Now, we're comedians, so there's going to be jokes, but the murders are all too real. There's nothing made up about the murders, nothing embellished for comedic effect.
Nothing has to be embellished. There are crazy, crazy things that happen here.
And we're going to say there's going to be murder and there's going to be jokes. Those two things go together.
But it makes it a little more digestible, I think. None of this dark, then her head was cut off.
That's a little disturbing. Let's keep it a little lighter, dance around the edges of it a little bit.
That's how we do it. And how we do it is we never make fun of the victim or the victim's family.
Why, James? Because we're assholes. Yes, but? But we're not scumbags.
See how that works? There you go. So if that sounds good to you, we have a crazy show for you.
Can't wait to get into it. If you think true crime and comedy should never, ever, ever go together, maybe we're not for you but maybe we are either way no complaining later that

said i think it's time everybody here we go it's time to all clear the lungs let's go here arms to the sky let's all shout shut up and give me murder let's do this everybody okay let's go on a trip shall shall we? We are going to Kentucky this week. Yes.
Pembroke, Kentucky is where we will be. And Pembroke.
Pembroke. Pembroke.
And this is in western Kentucky, only over on the west side there. It's about an hour to Nashville.
It's kind of the nearest big city to the area is Nashville. about an hour 15 in the other direction to Benton, Kentucky, which was our last Kentucky episode, taking in the strays.
That one was. I remember that one.
That was a crazy one. This is in Christian County.
I have nothing subtle about that area code, but it was named after a guy area code two seven Oh and three six four. Both of them in this town.
This is a tiny town, by town by the way yeah talk about another one of these towns that's under a thousand people which is oh those are small towns uh this town was settled in 1836 and named for someone who does not exist okay this was named after a fictional character it was named after after Pembroke Somerset Esquire. Is that a lawyer? A character in Jane Porter's 1803 novel Thaddeus of Warsaw by Dr.
Lunsford. That one missed me.
Yeah, I didn't realize it either. You know, it was on my list, and I just never got to it.

It's one of those books, you know.

There's a lot of words in there that feel old-timey.

Yeah, I know.

Thaddeus started it.

First of all, Thaddeus of Warsaw.

Would you read a book called Thaddeus of Warsaw right now?

Who knows?

Maybe it's a literary classic.

We're dumb, so we don't know anything about that kind of stuff.

So Dr. Lunsford Lindsay is the guy who named the town after this.
So he was a local store owner. I assume they sold books there at the store he ran.
The doctor has a store. Yeah, the doctor has a store, which, I mean, maybe he was a pharmacist, too.
Yeah. Who knows? Or maybe he was just a doctor of literature.
We don't know. We don't know.
So the county is named for Colonel William Christian, who is a native of Augusta County, Virginia. He's not even from here.
Who was a veteran of the Revolutionary War. He settled near Louisville in 1785 and was killed by Native Americans in southern Indiana in 1786.
So he survived the British, but not the Comanche. So reviews of this town.

Okay.

Here we go.

Here's four stars.

There's only two reviews.

There's less than 1,000 people.

So four stars.

Pembroke is a very nice town.

Good way to start it.

Very quiet with friendly neighbors.

I wish their pest control service was open on the weekends as we woke up to a viper in our bedroom one day and no one to help us okay this place is hell on earth now a viper in your viper in your bedroom not even like you know i was in the yard in my bedroom just i you wake up it's sitting on your chest staring at you that's what i picture like viper hill waking up with a gun in his face this is a viper um wow and i don't know really how you can take a star away from the town because the pest control business is closed on the weekends that has nothing to do with the town and it's weird it's it's a it's more than a pest it a pest. It's a viper.
Call animal control maybe then probably I would think. A poisonous loose snake in your house.
I don't know. Here's four stars.
I enjoy being in the country. Things to do are reliant on your own proactive participation.
Which means there is shit to do. That's what that means.
You have to come up with shit. You want fun.
You got to have an imagination. You got to be like eight-year-olds without an iPad.
Like you got to make some shit up and figure it out. A stick, a shoestring, and a fucking coat hanger.
Get to work and make something fun. You're going to make a game out of this.
Do it. It is quiet and calming when the sun goes down, yet close enough to many activities.
Would certainly do all over again. Really? If I died and they said, you want to go back? Only if I'm getting sent to Pembroke, is what they said.
Yeah. Fine.
People in this town, 791. Wow.
Very small town. That's extremely small.
More male than female people here, which is not usual. That's usually the other way around.
Median age is 38. It's right around the national average.
Otherwise, it's all 56% married, which is well above the national average. Also, a lot of people, it's weird.
You usually don't see a very high marriage rate and a very high single with children rate. But this town figures it out.
I figured it out. 56% are married and 25% are single with children.
Incredible. That's wild.
That says that, what, 25% are neither, less than 25% or 20% are neither married nor have children. That's very low.

That's very low. Race in this town, 78.5% white, 18.2% black, and then pretty much zeros through the rest of the way there.
2.6% Hispanic, that's about it. Religion in this town, 50-50 is the national average here.
It's 54.6%. And the definite mother load here goes to the Baptists.

33.8% Baptists. Baptists, as we know, are the Catholics of the South.
They're everywhere here. Down here, only 4% Catholics.
So that's how that works. The unemployment rate here is a little higher than the national average, but nothing out of whack.
Now, the median household income here is actually really good.

Yeah.

In the rest of the country, $69,000 is the average.

Here it is $72,798 a year, which is not bad. Not bad at all, especially when you consider the cost of living is a little bit lower.

$100,000 is average.

Here it is $74.4.

So not bad.

Housing, the median home cost here is $217,700,

which is also very doable,

especially if, you know, 72 grand a year.

It's not bad.

That all equals out.

So maybe we've talked you into it.

Maybe you have a good imagination

and you can come up with some shit to do for yourself.

You'll figure out fun.

If you can, we have for you

the Pembroke, Kentucky Real Estate Report. Average two-bedroom rental here goes for about $840, which is, well, yeah, it's about a third under the national average.
Here's a three-bedroom, one-bath home here. It's 1,052 square feet, so not a lot of room in there.
And it's basically a shed house, I would call it. A house shed.
It's an apartment that is by itself. Yeah, but it's a shed that they put rooms in.
It's a metal building. It's all metal.

It's just metal sides, metal top.

It looks like you put the lawnmower here

and the kids' room over here.

It's a real weird shed house.

There is this trend with barn dominiums.

This may have been the inspiration for it.

This is a shed where they're like,

y'all could live in that if you really needed to.

Someone said that.

Some drywall, set up some aluminum channels

and built a wall.

It's plain.

The kitchen and bathroom,

they actually did some nice work on it where it's not too bad. So that is $160,000.
No thank you. What? Yeah, it's a little much there, I think.
Here is a five-bedroom, three-bath, 3,268-square-foot house on two acres.

And it's a basic suburban dwelling is basically what it is.

You can see it and go, oh, there's a nice kind of bigger average home.

Yeah, it's on two acres, which is nice.

Inside, it is very, very like early 2000s.

It needs a big-time renovation. The carpets look a little sketchy in the bedrooms.
It's one of those. It could use some help.
$484,000 for that. This place doesn't sound that affordable.
That's not that affordable at all. And then finally, four-bedroom, four-bath, T-Bowl for each and every B-hole right there, baby.
4,570 square feet. It's a big house.
3.63 acres. It's a big house.
It's fine. It's nice.
It's good. It's got pillars and stuff.
I mean, it's got a lot of fancy stuff in it, too. It's got a sauna and a tennis court and shit like that that like somebody really fancied it up somebody that like someone who's like pinnacle of high style was whatever was hot in 1987 decided to really do this place up 80s beverly hills i'm gonna put it in kentucky yes but i'm getting a tennis court with a sauna next to it.
$990,000. Almost.
You're out of your minds. Out of your fucking minds.
No. No.
No way. Things to do here.
The Hopkinsville International Festival. International.
International Festival because obviously. We got tacos.
Obviously, what do you think of when you think of international culture? Kentucky. Western rural Kentucky.
That's what I think of. It says immerse yourself in global culture without leaving Christian County.
Well, I mean, doesn't get more convenient than that, everybody. That sounds great.
Hopkinsville International Festival has been rapidly expanding since the first event in 2009 over the years it has evolved into a bigger venue and more variety the event celebrates our vast the vast cultural diversity found in hopkinsville i gave you the cultural diversity it's fucking 80 white 20 black cultural diversity. Very diverse.
The global village is an essential festival destination. You're invited to join in this exciting cultural exchange.
They're like, it's like Epcot center, except in Kentucky. We get Doritos in a bag.
Yeah. We're walking, walking, whatever, walking tacos.
We are looking for people with an international heritage who are willing to set up a booth showcasing their country of origin. Because we don't have any that live here.
We're looking for you if you're out there. You don't have to be from here.
No one said that. The International Festival presents a variety of different cultural dance performances as well as musical groups.
The variety is growing every year and many of the performers provide an interactive session so that attendees can learn the dances for themselves. Okay.
Now I looked it up. Oh, the 2024 festival was canceled.
So they said they were taking a year off. They said, okay.
So once a year festival, we'll take this year off. it's a little too much for us so i looked it

up there is uh these are the bands they've had over the past um let's see we've had travis tritt actually headline the fifth annual hopkinsville summer salute he did um to the limit the ultimate Eagles experience.

An Eagles cover band.

An Eagles cover band. The Ultimate Eagles Experience.

An Eagles cover band.

An Eagles cover band.

Africa Nashville.

A band that performed 2023.

The Jimmy Church Band.

Yeah.

A local band.

Yep, there you go.

A local band.

I'm Jimmy Church.

We knew.

The Jason Montgomery Band.

Guess what that is? A local band. A local local band all these people open for travis tritt oh totally that's how they got on the gig travis turned me on to it uh clint holmes nicky harris keith gans these are all jazz performers um travis tritt olivia fay what's the chances it's just a dude named travis tritt that lives there yeah well they say it's a country music icon otherwise i would say travis tritt with one t probably is not an up-and-comer from us with a y yeah olivia fey is an up-and-comer from western kentucky who Travis Tritt at the 5th Annual.
Yeah, we know. And Kyle Daniel, also a country artist from Western Kentucky, who opened for Travis Tritt.
So, crime rate in this town. Jesus Christ.
Property crime, a little bit over half of the average. So, almost half the average.
So, low is what we're saying. violent crime, murder, rape, robbery, and assault, the Mount Rushmore of crime, is a little less than half the average also.
So it's pretty safe here, I would assume, obviously. What are you going to do? That's right.
There's nobody here. You'd know exactly who killed you.
That said, let's talk about some seriously wild murder here. Let's get into this right let's talk about a guy first uh christian richard martin talk about first he doesn't go by any of those names though no uh no he goes he goes by kit k-i-t yeah which is exactly what you would think right wait till you hear how he got that nickname because it's fucking ridiculous yeah it's a It's a self given nickname which is is that always great yeah you can't do that uh he was born in 1968 and uh his family's a big military family everybody in the family's military all the guys his dad's a 30-year air force veteran uh veteran served in v.
His sister served in the Air Force and retired after 20 years.

So they're a hardcore military family.

The grandfather was in the Army Cavalry.

Wow.

Yeah, grandfather was riding a goddamn horse with a fucking sword and shit.

They still have the cavalry, but they're mainly fun.

It's mainly ceremonial.

We're not going into ground combat against tanks and fucking missiles and sending a bunch of guys on fucking horses. I would hope not.
Like those shoulder things? Yeah, with a big sword coming off and a plume on their hat. I don't think that's going on right now.
I hope not. With a strap across their chest.
Let's hope not. Let's just say that.
I hope we've come more... If we have stealth bombers and we're still like, mount the horses, gentlemen.
Mount up. We got problems.
We are not using our resources efficiently, I would say, at that point. So, yeah, there's even a – they would travel a lot.
When he was two, Kit's family moved to Europe. Oh, where at? Around, I guess.
He lived in Germany and other – Oh,any and other all over they got transferred i guess around a few times they traveled throughout europe and he got to experience all these other countries and maybe the international festival thing was his idea he came here he's like guys flavors he knows you have no idea everything from kraut to different kind of kraut. It's great over there.
Yeah, the French got a lot of desserts.

So he lived in different parts of the world and um this didn't make him like the world more it made him appreciate his own country more he said that's what he said i've heard that made me appreciate you know i guess just uh it makes you appreciate a standard toilet i think probably yeah and and the same outlet in the wall the outlet yeah and you can get like cocoa puffs like whatever you know what i'm saying just taco bell's helpful yeah yeah they have those in england now and they are really excited about it are they oh my god english people are jacked about it too. Fucking love Taco Bell.
I was watching, there's these videos of these, they give American foods to these British high school kids. I've showed you in some of these videos before.
And there's one where they give them Taco Bell. And the looks on these kids' faces, it's like you gave them their first hit of crack.
The look is like, oh, shit, I got to get more of that. The look on their face is crazy.
Their eyes, you could see the whites of their eyes all around. They're like, oh, my God, this is proper.
This is amazing. Oh, my God.
Holy shit. And they're just dousing this shit.
They love it. It's crazy.
My kids eat it. They certainly, like, when i give them options of things that we because for whatever reason we're not making dinner there's this this and this nearby taco bells they all go taco bell uh yeah all right well that's what i'm making you eat then all right i guess and then you eat it anyway i make them eat that too because then it kind of like it's reverse psychology to me i don't know it's me showing them what bad fast food is, and hopefully they don't want it.
But I fucking love that. Yeah, and Taco Bell's actually the least bad for you, kind of out of all of them.
Yeah, because it's not even real beef. It's soy shit.
Yeah, nothing's real in there. Or no, they use real beef.
They use beef, yeah. Jack in the Box uses soy in the tacos.
Really? Yeah, that makes sense. I don't even care, because they're delicious.
Right. right it's some weird paste i don't give a shit i don't give them in my face they're so good i love a jack-in-the-box taco every once in a while i'm sitting in new york just craving a jack-in-the-box taco every time i go back to phoenix it's one of the first tortilla it's not meat that's probably not cheese no but their hot sauce is so good too it's like actually hot taco sauce is amazing fucking oh my god taco fucking jack-in-the-box taco sauce is crazy god damn it okay so um one thing about kit moving around a lot and i understand this because i went to fucking eight different schools or whatever is when you move around a lot you have to keep starting over, which is hard.
You know what I mean? I'm never in a place long enough to really settle down. Never like, you know, get on a baseball team or something for a couple of years and have any lasting relationships or anything like that.
He ends up, before he graduates high school, he signs up for the Army Reserves at age 17. Really? Yeah.
So he graduated high school, then went right into basic training at Fort Knox. After that, he enrolled in the University of Nebraska and joined the ROTC program at the University of Nebraska.
So he's in the Reserves and the ROTCs, and he worked nights and then attended school and did the weekends with the Army Reserves. So busy.
Very. Busy guy here.
But the Army ended up gifting him with a scholarship or gifting him or whatever. I guess he earned a scholarship because of all the shit he was doing.
So they helped him out with this college here. He meets a young lady named Stacy.
Okay. Now Stacy, he meets her at Fort Lewis, Washington.
He is completing officer training for the ROTC and Stacy was in the ROTC program at Middle Tennessee state university and they dated a little bit and you know, all that kind of thing. He finished his degree in Nebraska.
She was doing her thing in Tennessee. They have a bit of a long-distance relationship that they're going to keep together, basically, here.
Now, Kit graduates from the University of Nebraska in 1990. He's got a degree in geography, which I did not know you could earn a degree in.
I know where things are is a really strange college. Yeah, I memorized the globe.
That's good for you. You can point out Ghana on the map without any countries being labeled.
Terrific. How many countries are there? It's like 144 or something.
There's more than that. Yeah, There's 200 something.
There's not a gross of them? Yeah, no, no, not 144. No grosses.
So, yeah, geography, like I said, I didn't realize that was a, like a. Yeah, that's wild.
You could get a degree in that. It's a class you take.
Yeah, it feels like a month of studying a globe. You should be done, right? You should be done.
I don't think four years it takes to figure out where the countries are probably but who knows i could be i'm sure there's something more to it and we'll get messages saying you know actually it's all this there's like cartography involved in it and matt almost i don't know so his scholarship came with the stipulation because the army gave him the scholarship to do this but obviously the stipulation is once you're, then you come full time in the Army. Your ass is ours.
That's how that works. So he does that.
His first assignment was with the Signal Corps at Fort Ord in California. Fort Ord has come up so many times on this show.
It's ridiculous. It's a very common place to send people, I guess.
It's a very popular base. Really weird how many people on this show have gone, had Fort Ord roots or whatever.
So he's not real thrilled with this, by the way. This isn't his top assignment.
He doesn't want to be a signal officer. So he applied and was accepted to Army Ranger School.
Great. So, yeah, he said it was really bad Army Ranger training.

Yeah.

My mother, back in the day, we lived with a guy who was her boyfriend who was a Navy SEAL.

Uh-huh.

And I—

Your mom dated a Navy SEAL?

Yeah, we lived with him for years.

Yeah, yeah.

He, number one, told me a bunch of crazy shit, but also, like, they have a video.

They have, like, a yearbook and a video when you graduate from the thing.

Thank you. Yeah, yeah.
He, number one, told me a bunch of crazy shit, but also, like, they have a video. They have, like, a yearbook and a video when you graduate from the thing.
So, yeah, no, not like a video. Here's us torturing a fucking Saudi Arabian man.
No, no. So he had, like, they made video of their training.
It's fucking insane, dude, the shit that they make those guys do. So any those special forces it's wild i mean the stuff he told me about like they damn near drown them

oh they drive they drop about miles out they they run the boat in circles so they don't know where

they are they drop them off with nothing and they're like find your way back to shore assholes

yeah and they have to like make fucking flotation devices out of pants and shit while they're doing

it it's fucking crazy.

So it's wild.

And also, I guess that's to build a, you know, if one guy's drowning, help him and all that kind of shit, I guess.

And it teaches them how to lower their heart rate so that they're just fucking calm.

What they do is teach them how to just be murderers.

That and the tear gas shit they had to do was nuts.

It was crazy.

So anyway, that's what he does. He described this as really, really shitty, essentially, here.
He said later that he had signed up for the ranger course for more leadership skills, saying, though, that it took him about six months to recover physically from the ranger training. Abuse.
From just, yeah, horrible abuse while he's at fort ord he flew to tennessee to marry stacy okay this is may 1991 he marries stacy he's 22 she's 25 they had a military wedding like military all in uniform and all that kind of shit they said their vowsows. They walk through the, you know, sabers that they do, the whole military thing.
And that was that. They walk off into the sunset here.
Stacey ends up moving to California a month after that. She's done with her thing.
They have their first child, a girl named Megan, in December of 1992. so then yeah they and they liked California kitten Stacy as a family they like going to the beach all the time a lot of hiking and that kind of thing because there's a lot of that there you know what I mean so California's got the outdoor life if you love it that is absolutely so So the hiking and doing all that beaching and everything.
So. Hey, everybody.
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Thrive market.com slash small town murder. Stacy, the thing that she doesn't like here.
Um, she's not from a military family, by the way. So she didn't move around a ton as a kid and all that.
So all this moving around that they have to do, she's not used to and doesn't really like it. No.
So they moved to Fort Lewis in Washington and were there for a while. He had a brief stint on active duty during Desert Storm.
Or she did, I'm sorry. Then she resigned her position.
And she said that the primary factor was the possibility of the two of them being deployed. Megan, what the fuck are we going to do with her? Okay.
I don't understand. If you're the Army and you have a married couple with a kid, you can't deploy both of them.
There you go. Problem solved.
There it is. Yeah.
Only one of the couple can be deployed. That's it.
I mean, you've got rules for all kinds of other shit. I shit i don't understand why that's even difficult to fucking that should be like the easiest thing to deal with yeah we can't send both parents over there to get killed that's crazy unless there's like an obvious enormous conflict where everybody's involved then unless it's world war two even in world war ii though there was no you know what i mean if you were the breadwinner for the family and you had four kids, they didn't send you over there so your family could starve.
That wasn't part of it. You know what I'm saying? There's certain extenuating circumstances.
If they have a little kid, I would say, all right, well, yeah, only one of you. So I don't know.
Kit wants to fly helicopters. That's his ambition, to fly helicopters, which to me is the scariest thing in the world.
I don't know how it works. I don't like it at all.
I'm terrified by it. They just crash a lot.
I don't want to be in there. It doesn't make sense.
I'd rather fly it than sit in it. Put it that way.
I don't want to fly it at all. I'm not doing that shit.
doing that shit it doesn't make any sense i don't know physics but if i did i would say that doesn't make any sense yeah if something spins anything attached to it is gonna fucking spin i i don't get it well i mean yeah that's that's a whole other i mean you're you're by your car wheels spin i suppose but they something. The rest of the car doesn't tumble past it, like, with it.
That's all right, but I don't like it. I don't know how that does it.
I don't get it. I don't want to just see it stop and then we plummet from the sky.
That's what I'm worried about. You guys, the big fan's going to stop in a minute.
That's fucking crazy, dude. I can't.
The big fan's slowing down. I would never stop staring at it out the window.
That's all I'd be doing is making sure. There it goes.
Okay. I couldn't stop.
I knew it. I knew it.
So he resigned from active duty, and he returned to the Army Reserves, which would allow him to take up flying. That was his point.
So Stacy and the daughter here go back to tennessee and stay with

stacy's parents for a little while while he completes his flight training and um as stacy

gets a real estate license and all that kind of thing and she's got her mom watching the kids so

it's it's an easier deal for her he tried to kit tries to get jobs with different civilian

organizations while in flight school uh he he has a few little jobs just to you know make ends meet

Thank you. Kit tries to get jobs with different civilian organizations while in flight school.
He has a few little jobs just to make ends meet. The flight school is in Fort Rucker, Alabama, by the way.
He worked at a casket factory. How many of those could there be? You know what I'm saying? That's like how many hearses are made a year.
There's a finite number of caskets that are going out every year. I mean, you could really generate a shitload of them and then just sit back and coach.
As many as you want. They don't go bad or anything, right? No, and they're in constant need, right? Yeah, and you know about how many you're going to need every year, too.
That's the other thing. You could just chart the population, how many many people die and you can get probably within a couple thousand people of how many caskets are going to be needed for a year you know so that's that's interesting uh he also worked part-time as a karate instructor so the two most weird jobs i can think of are karate instructor and casket factory worker.
Those are so weird. Caskets and karate, this guy likes.
And he eventually landed a job that paid a little better in telecommunications in Atlanta, Georgia. He tried to commute from Alabama to Atlanta, which seems like quite the ride, I would say.
But it became difficult, and then he had to quit because he couldn't do it. If you're commuting two and a half hours each way, it's not worth it.
Why don't you get the job closer to home in telecommunications? I don't think it existed. That was in the city of Atlanta.
I think he was in Fort Rucker, Alabama. I don't think they had a casket factory.
That's what they had. And a karate school.
And four kids with rickets and scurvy that wanted to learn karate. That was it.
So after getting his helicopter license, he took a job with Air Logistics, which would fly helicopters out to oil rigs in the Gulf of Mexico. Like land the crew out there? I guess, yeah, to ferry people back and forth.
Or supplies they need to yeah exactly if someone needs to get off the rig they can't turn it around and take it all the way back to shore so they get a helicopter that rig is is it's kind of anchored right it's out there yeah it's not moving no one's making a pit stop for you like if you if you have to piss do it now because we ain't pulling over it's one of those those things. You don't go to shore for lunch break.
You're there. No, definitely not.
So this would spend a lot of time away from the family with this too because you would basically have to go all the way down there and you'd be on for two weeks and then you'd get five days off. On for two weeks, you get five days off.
So that's how they did it. It's like a firefighter but like a little more strenuous before you get your time off.
No shit. So now Kit, how he got the name Kit.
I guess his family called him Chris. No one ever called him Christian.
That was never. His family called him Chris.
Stacey, his wife, only knew him as Chris. But apparently, because Chris is a very common name, real common name, apparently when he was in the guard, there were just shitloads of guys named Chris in his class, just tons of guys named Chris.
So he felt, he felt, not other people, all the Chris's should have got together and go, we all need nicknames. Let's give each other nicknames or something.
He said, I need a nickname. I can't just be another chris in the crowd i'm not that kind of guy here so he said that he remembered one camping and hiking trip as a boy scout where he visited the grave of christopher kit carson you know the frontiersman kit carson yeah and uh kit carson was also a cavalry scout an army officer.
So he said he just adopted the name, just started introducing himself as Kit Martin. And people just, all right, he said his name's Kit.
How you doing, Kit? Which if you moved to new places, you could say your name's anything and just introduce yourself as that. That's your name now.
Big Kit Carson fan. That's it.
That's fucking fucking hilarious you can't do that if you live somewhere for like 30 years you can't just turn around and say i'm this guy now they're like no you're not shut up chris shut the fuck up chris god damn it we'll call you chrissy until you're a grown man then we'll call you chris we'll call you chris god damn it we we went to third grade together Don't you tell me what your name is. So Kit and Stacey are going to end up having two more children, boys named Chase and Zachary.
And Kit spent, you know, he liked hanging out with his family and shit like that. Apparently, he claims that he would, you know, help with all the chores and the dinners and all that kind of thing.
That just his words who knows how true that is um they they he liked to take the boys outside apparently um to help them show them how to tend to the animals they had on their property they had chickens horses and miniature horses oh and the little ones aren't they ponies i think yeah that's a miniature horse i think that they have maybe the real tiny horses. Oh, like the, yeah, the ones that you have.
They have like the toy horses, yeah. Rainbow colors and shit.
Yeah, I think maybe one of those. But their relationship starts faltering here.
They've been married 12, 13 years. And in March of 2004, Stacy asks for a divorce for a divorce now okay he doesn't know what to do with himself they get they're gonna get divorced they're gonna split up here okay he's been in the military he met her in the military other than he knows his military yeah he doesn't really know how to date he's never really you know gone out met girls and dated them and done any of that kind of shit like i'm.
I don't know if he's met them in bars and went home with them for a night or something, but he doesn't know how to get a girlfriend, really, unless he runs into them at a work function. I don't know.
At a ball in your whites. Yeah, but at this point, he was an army ranger.
He has had over a thousand hours of combat flying including 500 hours while using using night vision gear which is a separate thing that's a lot yeah you know all that kind of thing he flew an uh an apache attack helicopter and you know all that kind of shit so you know he's got a lot of life experience but doesn't really know how to date so he married young didn't do that so he wrote a few words about himself and posted them on the on yahoo personals which is the greatest thing i've ever fucking heard in my life in 2004 in 2004 yahoo personals that's a very 98 thing to do i feel like right do those still exist we have to find those dude i don't know but they do have yahoo answers which are fucking hilarious great there's just ask any quest they're so funny just it's the funniest oh it's so funny dude yeah it's hilarious we'll do we'll do it as a bonus episode one of these days but yahoo personals is where he posted. One of the first women to contact him back was a woman named Joan

and I guess her screen name was Surfer Girl. All right.
So they meet in person for lunch at O'Charlie's. Is that – I don't know if that's an Irish sports bar or that place in the mall with bad sandwiches in the food court.
Which one is that? That's just called Charlie's. Okay.
Charlie all the time it's not oh char that shit is awful that is so bad it's so fucking bad i gotta buy one get one at your house and i housed both i remember i remember i didn't even know that i was getting to it just showed up with two i was like well I'm eating all of it And then what happened to you I got sick Yeah you did You got good and sick from that shit You were like I shouldn't have eaten that much Charlie's I remember you were like what is wrong That was a lot of Charlie.

I blame the hot mayo still.

Yes, that's exactly what it was. Oh, they gave you cooked mayo.

They put fucking mayo on it, and I was like, well, and I noticed it halfway through the second.

I was like, well, that's that, I guess.

Well, I've already put all that in me.

Whatever.

They cook it like bakes into the bread.

It's not good.

Yeah.

Can't get it out.

You can scrape it off or anything.

Boy, did I get sick.

Oh, yeah.

That was a good one

i was like i don't want to kick you while you're down but you think maybe you brought this on

yourself oh christ so uh yeah kit now the divorce final, but Kit is still living at the house.

Yeah, that's good and awkward.

Yeah, I guess he, I don't know if this is true or not, but he's telling everyone that he was staying in the bonus room, in their extra room, while waiting for the house to be sold.

So he's like, well, we can't afford to go get separate places.

So Kit said they were just roommates by this point. That's what he's telling everybody.
So he has a date with Joan. He told Stacy he was leaving early to go to work rather than saying that he had a date.
So Stacy said, hmm, I don't know about this. So she followed him.
We're divorced. It's over.
We are divorced.

Yeah.

And this is why.

So, no.

This is certainly an indicator.

She, Stacy, was very upset when she saw Kit be actually going out on a lunch date to O'Charlie's with Joan.

Don't worry.

They're going to get hot mayo, and this will be a bad date anyway.

It's all right. He'll be back later at home.
Trust me. He's going to want to stay next to that home base toilet later.
Hope there's a bonus toilet. Yeah.
No one else has to use. Let's hope for that.
A bonus shitter. So now Joan Harmon is Joan.
Joan Harmon Guerra, actually. She was married to a guy named Carlos Guerra.
Joan's parents were divorced. Her father, who she accused of abuse also, her father was a Navy officer.
Okay. So this makes sense.
This is, you know. Yeah, I can see.
A lot of times the people who come from military families look for military people because they're just used to that. Fascinating.
But if your ex-wife was, or if your mom was a Navy officer and beat the shit out of you, would you look for a Navy officer woman? No, but also people get abused and then look for people with the qualities of the abusers. That's psychology's psychology until you get a shitload of therapy that's how your brain works you know like you look to repeat cycles so maybe that's i'm not sure um her mother was a nurse and um yeah she's pretty attractive here she's described in a book as quote petite but had a shapely figure and long blonde hair.

Blonde with big tits.

Very nice.

Big-titted blonde girl.

Yeah.

That's going to be – that's a tough sell.

They're oftentimes single forever.

It's a real tough sell.

Yeah, you can't get them out there at all, you know, especially – they just sit on

the shelf, those gals, you know.

Those are not in demand.

No, no, no.

No one likes big- breasted blondes.

Quite obsolete.

Basically non-existent at this point, really.

So she she told Kit that she had three children, oldest one being seven years old at the time.

She's got two little girls and the oldest is a boy, by the way.

She said that the father of her son had died in a logging accident and had been decapitated in that accident. God damn.
My son's father has been fucking beheaded in a logging accident, which is a very odd. No matter what.
2004, that's a wild time. That's a wild.
Yeah. Yeah.
If you heard that happen in 1876, you'd go, that's dangerous dangerous work right there but decapitated in a logging accident probably probably fell into that saw with that eight foot uh diameter from the patreon episode yes totally man yes exactly but this is like i mean from what i understand it's one of the most dangerous jobs actually logging probably it's very But I don't know about decapitations if that's normal. That seems like they should probably work something out where people's heads stay on.
Yeah. Oh, she should get on board with that.
Yeah. Yeah.
So she said that was her first child's father, decapitated. She said the two girls at that time, at the time they were two years old and nine months old.
She said that husband, she was divorced from him. She painted a negative picture.
Didn't say that her ex-husband was pretty shitty and that she had concerns for her safety. She said that he used to stalk her and threaten her.
Once they broke up up, he broke into her apartment. I mean, it's only been at least 18 months since they stopped seeing each other.
You know what I mean? At the most. So now I don't know, like I said, if this is just how someone she was like looking for.
You know what I mean? Almost not consciously, but subconsciously, which your brain does here. So Kit agreed to rent a U-Haul and help Joan move into a rental property that he owned.
So you can move into my rental place. And he didn't charge her rent and even paid for her food and bills.
That's an interesting choice. That's what he says.
Yeah, that's what he did. He's like, yeah, I had to had to help help old Joan out here.
Get her away from rental property. and he's staying in his ex-wife's house.
That's what he says. Yeah, that's what he did.
He's like, yeah, I had to help old Joan out here. Get her away from that.
He's got a rental property and he's staying in his ex-wife's house. That's what I'm saying.
And he's staying in the bonus room of his ex-wife's house. How about I'll be at the rental property that we own if no one's there.
If it's open and just ladies can just move in at any time. Now, she apparently, from what some people say, they say she had some inconsistencies in her stories about her parents and the fathers of her children and stuff like that.
Kit said he broke up with her shortly after she moved into his rental property because he was unsure of her and what she was all about. But they got back together when Joan called to say that her brother died in Iraq.
Like, not just had a heart attack eating a falafel, actually, like in the military. So, yeah.
So Kit met with Joan to offer his condolences. And then, you know, that's always going to lead to fucking death.
We'll lead to fucking every time. It's real weird.
There's only so many rubs on the shoulders you can do in a friendship way. It's impossible to not feel a little better, I think.
That's why. And also, eventually, you've got to meander around to the titties.
If you just come, you've got to feel a little better. At least for a minute, you know what I mean? Just a little bit.
There'll be regret in a little while, but for now. So at that time, Kit applies for the aviation captain's career course at Fort Rucker, Alabama.
So, yeah, and he's kind of getting into her family as far as the kids know him and all that kind of thing. He decided he was going to go back to active duty.
Yeah. And he was, they were saying that, you know, he'd probably be sent overseas somewhere.
So they discussed getting married. And they do.
They get married. I guess, oh, they showed up at the courthouse December 7th, 2004, to inquire about getting a marriage license, but ended up just getting married on the spot.
just getting the license and putting it through and then they realized they got married on pearl harbor day which they're like oh shit that was a dumb i mean it's the day they'll live in infamy yeah i guess we'll never forget it i guess yeah yeah you can't forget it what's your anniversary 11th what's your anniversary hold on a second this day december okay wait yeah that's

december 7th 19 1940 no night 1941 no no no i'm sorry uh yeah i almost said we were married in 41 my bad so uh he is having money problems at the time um here he is i guess he's not making a lot of money in the army and he was paying Stacy $1,728 a month in child support as well. God dang.
Three kids. So, um, yeah, it's, uh, he's not, not doing well there.
Uh, obviously financially that's, that's tough. So 2005, he is assigned to go to Germany with the army.
So Kit and Joan took a belated honeymoon cruise of the Mediterranean before the move to Germany. Well, they must have had some money.
Doing fine. You know, $5,000 it cost, they said.
Sure. They basically put it in credit cards, debt, just to do it, you know.
So I some fighting between us. The weird thing is they seemed to get along, but Joan and Stacey would fight, Kit said.
Yeah, he said that he wrote, quote, my daughter Mackenzie, that's Megan Mackenzie, the first kid, has always been very smart, a straight-A student. If given the choice, I think she would prefer to live with us.
As they were, he was trying to, they were doing a court thing here. And the, I guess the kid, Megan McKenzie there, I guess Kit wanted to fly his kids to Germany to show him, to show them where he lived when he was a kid.
Stacey, though, the ex-wife, would only allow them to visit Germany if she was allowed to come along. I guess so he couldn't keep them in Germany.
I guess that's her fear. Yeah, there's that.
So Kit said Joan wasn't going to be okay with that, so Kit would end up having to fly back to the United States when he wanted to see the kids, rather than that, rather than have his ex-wife come stay at the stay with you guys, that could be weird.

So now during their marriage here, they end up moving back to the States, as we'll talk about.

But during all this, Joan and Kit live with her daughters and also her son, Justin Elijah, who goes by Elijah.

Nobody goes by their first name in Kentucky, by the way.

Nobody does, it seems like. We've had four characters.
None of them go by their first name. Male characters.
So Iraq now, too. Kit served three tours of duty in Iraq.
And then in 2010 is when they moved back to the States. They head to Rhode Island, where I guess Kit pursued a master's degree

in national defense at the Navy War College.

Hell yeah.

By this time, he reached the rank of major, by the way.

That's a big deal.

Pretty good up there.

Yeah, majors, it's high up there.

His first military assignment after war college

was Fort Campbell, Kentucky,

with the 101st Airborne Division. So, moves to Kentucky.
That's the first one, right? That's like the first deployed, right? The first deployed. I don't know.
The numbers in front of the air, it's just to throw off the enemy. But that 101st, I think that's the first ones deployed.
No fucking clue. I couldn't have any less idea about that.
No clue. So they moved to Kentucky, Fort Campbell's in western Kentucky, and Joan found a house online in Pembroke, Kentucky.
Okay. This is where we are.
So she told Kit she needed something to keep her occupied and fixing up an old house would work. So she wanted to get an older house and fix it up.
You bet it will. Yeah.
That'll keep you occupied for five, ten years. That'll keep your whole entire life every second of your goddamn day occupied.
And your dreams, too. Yeah.
Unless you're hiring a contractor to do everything for you, this is going to destroy you. And even then, it will take over your life and destroy it also even if the just not doing the work doesn't help at all your house is still destroyed and you can't live in it and it's it's almost i think doing the work would be easier at least you know what's going on as a contractor you're like it's never gonna stop at least you know the stage you're at yeah they just keep showing up and i don't know why they're gonna be done i keep hearing hammering i don't know i wake up to saws every day that's all i know i stage you're at.
Yeah, they just keep showing up, and I don't know when they're going to be done. I keep hearing hammering.
I don't know. I wake up to saws every day.
That's all I know. I wake up to sawing.
They're drooling again. I thought that was done.
I don't know. So Kit said, yeah, he liked an older home, and he found, you know, one, he wanted some extra land, too.
He wanted some acreage, and he wanted to get a couple farm animals. Fuck yeah.
Mini horses, you know what I mean? It's his favorite. It's those ponies.
Yeah. A kid had lived on a farm before and he said he thought that maybe caring for animals would also help the kids learn some responsibility.
It will, yeah. So they bought a house at auction for $60,000.
Wow. Yeah.
60 grand at auction. That's awesome.
Yeah. And this was in 2010, I believe.
So there's a lot of houses open. So their first job they did to it was to repaint it.
And they did. Because I guess paint falls off.
And you've got to have good paint on there or else your house will rot away. Sure, sure.
So they paint it bright yellow, which is quite the choice. That is a choice.
That's something. That's something.
There's a few colors I will never do and that's no no no no no okay for like a weird sports car or something not okay for a house not your house nope there's a few yellow houses around me and they are hideous fucking every time hideous never seen a yellow house and been like that's the ticket that's the shit we i've showed you the school bus yellow, that one house that you can see it from space.

It's a huge, like a 7,000 square foot fucking monstrous house.

Bright, horrifying yellow.

You can see it from miles away.

Dude, it is.

It really is.

It's scary.

So they're in Pembroke, and this is when they actually get to spend some time together, Joan and Kit, because they're actually doing normal shit here.

You know what I mean?

Like living a normal life.

And then he would get a military assignment and be gone for a while, and he'd come back.

And so obviously this is going to cause some strife in the relationship, as it often does here.

And by the way, Kit claims that Joan lost interest in the remodeling efforts and caring for the animals and the garden just gave up right away oh this gave up i don't want to do this well that's overwhelming she's probably just like i don't know i can't fucking do this all by myself this is crazy these these geese shit a lot so much now apparently kit claims that joan spends much of her day hanging out across the street with a married neighbor. A guy, by the way.
Yes, not another married woman that they discuss their shit with. Joan said that they were discussing business opportunities.
You know, that goes, obviously. Lots of business opportunities.
They needed to be discussed all day long, all the time, too, every day. Lots of new stuff coming up all the time.
So this neighbor's name is Calvin Phillips, and he goes by Cal, and he lives across the street from their house there. He was also a 17-year military veteran.
And, yeah, I guess they wanted to offer one of their business ideas, Joan and Cal, was to offer concealed carry classes behind Cal's house because he has land. So they can do shooting shit back there.
Concealed weapons class should only be on paper and in books. No, no, no.
You do it in the backyard. No, no, you do it in the backyard.
All right. You do it in the backyard in rural Kentucky.
Don't you know anything, Jimmy? Jesus Christ. Sorry I have to keep educating you about shit, Jimmy.
No, that's what I mean. It's dangerous.
The place where Cal's backyard is a little odd. So Pembroke does not allow target shooting within city limits, but Cal's backyard crossed the county line.
The county line runs through his property. Cal's backyard.
Oh, my God. Ah, fantastic.
So he was able to set up a shooting range just over the county line over here. 50 yards from the house.
Jesus Christ. They even held a class there.
They had an instructor and everything like that. Joan took the class using a pistol that Kit had here.
Cal's wife, Pam, worked at a bank in Hopkinsville, Kentucky. Kit always suspected that Joan and Cal were having an affair.
Kind of have to. You know, because they're home during the day, and it took every day all afternoon they came up with, we could put a shooting range in your backyard.
Yeah. What were you doing the rest of the time, guys? Jesus Christ.
So September 5, 2012, Kit asks Joan for a divorce.

Oh, he initiates it. Yes, he initiates a divorce.
Apparently, now this is the only person, people who say this are Kit and Kit's daughter. Okay.

That during an argument regarding the divorce, Kit's daughter says she overheard Joan tell Kit that she would ruin his life and military career if he left her, which, I mean, people have said worse than that. I don't know.
But either way, they claim that she said that, but that's the only proof we have here. So she decides she wants to move out of the house since you know they're getting a divorce and shit so she asked her neighbors cal and pam the couple across the street to help her move out of the rest the residence here so uh cal by the way is 59 his wife pam is 58 okay little nice-old people across the street, and you're like, get in the middle of my fucking marital strife, would you? Will you drive a U-Haul for me? Jesus.
If this was like 100 years ago, those people would be considered like elderly, and you leave them alone. Not that that's elderly now, but it goes from that to, hey, guys, will you help me move out of my fucking house? Don't bother them.
They're contemplating and very depressed about how they're about to die. They want to know where their final resting place is going to be, and they're talking about it.
Leave them alone. That's all.
Leave them to their bread pudding. That's it.
Yeah, they have no teeth left. That's how it was 100 years ago.
So during this, Cal observes what he believed to be because he's in the military so he you know can recognize some shit i wouldn't know my ass for my elbow with this stuff but this show small town murder is sponsored by better help we're huge proponents of therapy because everybody needs it too and it's independence is very glor. It's easy to forget that we're all better when we have a little support system behind us.
And therapy could be a great source of support for any area of your life. When it's time to shift the focus here from doing it all on your own to maybe, maybe it's a little better if we ask for some help here or there, it doesn't hurt and there's nothing wrong with it.
And we've benefited greatly from therapy. Just talking to Jimmy about something he wanted to talk to his therapist about this week.
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Now back to the show. In the early hours of December 4th, 2024, CEO Brian Thompson stepped out onto the streets of Midtown Manhattan.
This assailant starts firing at him. And the suspect.
He has been identified as Luigi Nicholas Mangione. Became one of the most divisive figures in modern criminal history.
I was meant to sow terror. He's awoken the people to a true issue.
Listen to Law and Crimes Luigi exclusively on Wondery Plus. You can join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app, Spotify, or Apple Podcasts.
He observed what he believed to be classified military information located on a laptop computer and computer disks. Why he was firing up laptops and browsing through the files and looking through the disks, I have no fucking clue in the world.
But that's what happened. Unless the computer and the discs all had classified stamps right the fuck on them.
Real big sticker across the top of the laptop. Big red letters that are just like a rubber stamp.
Yeah, big one. Part of the letters are missing, but he can tell that that's classified.
He knows. So Cal took the items and turned them over to the fbi what yeah that's a step

that's a big step he took you took shit out of my garage and called the fbi called the fbi on me for it yeah for uh this so um turns out there's some reason for that apparently that there was They were classified?

Yeah.

Now, Joan has some problems also here.

They basically found out that there's accusations from her ex-husband that she basically kidnapped her daughters from her ex-husband. That's what the accusations are.
So that's what's going on. Now, at the same time, this is when Joan tells Cal and Pam that Kit has been physically abusive to both her and her son, Elijah.
Oh, so there we go. Uh, she gave Cal photographs depicting the young man's injuries, which Cal then turned over to military police.
Cal will tell on you, boy. Cal's a rat.
Jesus Christ, don't smoke a joint in your back porch. Cal's going to be on the phone with the local cops immediately.
Cal's got some loose fucking lips. Jesus.
Man, I would say so. So Cal tells another neighbor named Danzerow is his last name that he wants a divorce from Joan.

And all he said, I think she's been having an affair.

Kit says that.

Yeah, Kit says that.

So and everything like that.

So they're talking all their neighbors here.

Now, the accusation she levels at him for child abuse get deeper than that. Okay.
She also accuses him of molesting her daughters. Okay.
Yes. One of the daughters said that Kit had given them baths more than five times, but less than ten times.
The other daughter couldn't remember more than one or two times. Elijah, the son, said he witnessed the abuse on at least one occasion.

The one daughter said she couldn't

remember Elijah being present when

she and her sister took bats.

The first daughter that we talked about said

that Kit was clothed when he gave them bats,

whereas Joan claimed

that he took bats

with the girls while fully nude,

which would be obviously

horrifying. It's a terrible thing to do.
Yes, and Alma said in one statement that Kit always used a washcloth when bathing them. And then in another statement, she said sometimes he used his bare hands.
She said the one girl said that when she was about five, Kit would bathe her and her sister. This is from what she told investigators now.
She claimed that he would put soap on a rag and insert his finger into her oh my god elijah then said that that he had witnessed the abuse which this young lady said happened more than five times but less than 10 see this is different versions of the story here um but there's always that number that comes up. Now, Elijah said that Kit would hit him with his hands, a belt, a whip, or anything else he could get his hands on.
He said that Kit would get angry for no reason and beat him up. He said that he never did his chores well enough for Kit and that Kit, and that, you know, Elijah said he'd always get a beating, no matter what he had assigned to him.
So there's pictures of this here, and Elijah said it happened when they lived in Rhode Island. He said he and some friends accidentally knocked over a port-a-potty, which is disgusting.
Accidentally? I don't know how you accidentally knock over a port-a-potty. Yeah, unless you did it with like a vehicle or something there's no way they're not like a lamp no soccer ball oh shit no you know i mean unless you had like a like a pickup truck you backed into it with or something it's hard to knock those fuckers over you'd have to both of you throw shoulders into that like a like a football tackling dummy and i've seen people do it and they usually rock it from both sides yeah because that's how liquid in there and that's the stable It's like a football tackling dummy.
I've seen people do it, and they usually rock it from both sides. Yeah, because it's got liquid in there, and that's the stable part.
It's like a basketball hoop in your driveway. It's one of those with the sand and the liquid in the base.
That's what it's like. With hundreds of pounds of liquid in there.
There's a lot. They don't want it to be tipped over by the wind while you're shitting in it.
That would be bad. Or when you're not, and you just did.
Bad feature, that would be would be yeah so he said when kit found out about it he made elijah and his friends put the porta potty upright and clean up the mess which seems extremely reasonable yeah i if my kid knocked over a porta body i'd be like you fuckers are picking that up i'm not touching getting some gloves and some paper towels and you're going to work here. Sorry.
He said he then made Elijah take a shower

after I'm not touching it. Getting some gloves and some paper towels and you're going to work here.
Sorry. He said he then made Elijah take a shower after the shower, which, I mean, he was covered in shit.
So that's, again, reasonable so far at this point. After the shower, while Elijah says he was dressed only in boxer shorts, Kit started beating him with a belt.
He told investigators that Kit hit him with the leather and the buckle end of the belt. Both.
Elijah also told investigators after the beating, Kit made him cut the grass with scissors. Okay.
That took a while. That'll take it.
They have acres. That'll take a minute, I would say.
My question is, do you make them get a comb in there, too, and do it so it's even, or how do we do it? Willy-nilly. Or is it just all hacked up? Willy-nilly hacked up like somebody who's sat at two in the morning.
Which one? Does he get the texturizing scissors and give it a real nice? Oh, there we go. The thinners? Yeah.
Yeah. Good luck.
Love those thinning scissors. Those are great.
According to Elijah, he got a lot of abuse from Kit, including whippings from a Roman whip made of leather straps with stones attached to the strip's ends. That's what he claims.
Wow. Joan later said that the Roman whip had metal burrs on the ends

of each strip, not

stone. God damn.
Either way,

hard things. It's a cat of nine

tails, right? Isn't that what that is?

That shouldn't make your dick at all hard.

No. Nobody should be hit

with that. That's crazy.
No, that's horrible.

Another instance of abuse, according to

Elijah, occurred when he got caught

stealing a necklace from his mother to give to a girl, which says dumb teenager shit here. Kit took him down to the basement where he essentially he essentially treated him like he was Marcellus Wallace going to the pawn shop.
Oh, boy. He tied him up with duct tape and blindfolded him.
Uh huhhuh. Okay.
After 20 minutes, Kit returned. He said he left him there.
In about 20 minutes, he returned and punched him in the stomach. He said Kit then used a knife to cut him loose and made him stand in the corner until his mom told him he didn't have to stand in the corner any longer.
Oh, boy. Okay.
Elijah also said that Kit always wanted to wrestle.

Come on, let's wrestle.

And that the wrestling would often end with him in a choke hold

and not able to breathe.

Come on, let's wrestle so I can choke you.

So what you're saying is you lost a lot.

Yeah, he didn't do very well.

He said that Martin referred to the wrestling as WrestleMania,

which is great.

It's WrestleMania time, motherfucker. No, I don't want to have WrestleMania.
Main event, bitch. Let's go.
Me and you. Me and you.
Cutting promos on him. Wow.
He described one occasion where he had purple dots all over his face due to a lack of oxygen. Is that petechia? Yeah, I was going to say, you know, petechia, like if you're strangled.
And one of the young ladies here, the daughters also added that they would all get smacked if the daughters would get smacked if they tried to intervene in this at all. Well, I mean, yeah, it's against the rules.
You can't hit them with a chair on the outside of the ring the ref isn't going to call for that

you can't grab my leg

you can't grab for that when I'm going to the ropes

to come off with a clothesline this is crazy

obviously

trying to do my finishing move

the fuck man

obviously you know nothing funny but it's crazy

anyway the idea

of I'm going to have Wrestlemania with my

stepson and choke him out

you can't cheat

kick his little girl manager

I'm going to have WrestleMania with my stepson and choke him out. You can't cheat.
Kick his little girl managers away as they try to run in the ring is fucking crazy. Your nine-year-old bitch valet is really getting in the way.
Take that. That's right.
He's cutting promos. So Elijah's first account here, like I said, the Port-A-Potty incident.
Now, he says that he was beaten with a belt after the port-a-potty incident, but Joan said it was a bamboo stick. And Elijah later said that it was a belt and a bamboo stick.
Okay. Now, Elijah said his mom took pictures of his bruises the day of the beating, and that's what he said joan will testify later that she took photos the day after the beating oh so they're gonna say obviously the beating didn't happen because they got they're not on the same page of a day of and day after so obviously they both made it up clearly that's that's his his you know his uh stance on the whole thing here.

In one version, Elijah said the beating lasted three minutes,

in another he said it lasted 20 minutes.

The duct tape incident.

Elijah said his hands and feet were duct taped,

and his eyes were covered with what he thought was also duct tape.

He said that he was sitting on the bed and that Major Martin came into the room and punched him in the stomach. Elijah then claimed Kit returned a few minutes later, removed the tape of the knife.
Joan's version was slightly different. She said, quote, my daughter Alma came running into the kitchen saying, Daddy's hitting Elijah.
We had a basement and she told me Elijah was down in the basement. I ran down there and looked in the guest room, which was dark.
and her eyes were swollen. And then ran to get the scissors and ran down and cut the duct tape off him.
He immediately started crying. So I stood him up and walked him upstairs.
Now, Kit, Elijah said Kit came in, punched him and cut him loose. And in a sworn statement, Joan said Elijah told her that Kit kept coming into the room and hitting him, implying that it happened more than once.
So they're taking slight discrepancies and saying it obviously didn't happen. That's their thing, which is, you know, a crazy abusive night a couple years beforehand.
I feel like maybe things get a little, you know, whatever. A little hazy.
A little hazy.

He found an email that Joan sent to herself on

May 2nd, 2011.

The subject line read

Elijah tipped over the portable

toilet. Email contained

four images and the following

message, pictures of what Kit did to

him after he got in trouble for tipping over

a porta potty with a neighboring boy near our home, which is what neighboring means. OK.
Here are the pictures. Holy fuck.
If that's real. That's crazy.
If that's real, that is fucking horrifying. It's in the face.
He's got all over his face his back oh my god his back looks like he is in he was a fucking starting Django it looks fucking crazy he's got a kundakinte back right now this is fucking bonkers oh my god just say Toby Elijah Jesus Christ don't take the beating anymore your name is Toby. Fuck my life, dude.
That's so bad. It's everywhere.
I can't imagine being so mad at a child that you hit him like that. I can't imagine it.
No, no. It's arms, face.
The back is horrifying and the arms and the face. It looks like the cheeks on the left side of his face were hit because he was swinging so wildly at his back that he just tagged him in the face.
That's what it looked like. It almost looks like a buckle mark up there.
I don't know. So Joan said she deleted the pictures off the camera, then sent them to herself in an email so Kit wouldn't find them on the camera and get mad at her.
So anyway, Joan also tells investigators that Kit would slap her across the face whenever she tried to intervene when he was abusing Elijah. She said he would choke her to the point of nearly losing consciousness, which seems to be a routine, a thing, a common theme here.
She claimed that Kit would threaten to kill her if she ever left him. So according to Joan, also here are some more accusations from Joan once this all comes out and the divorce is on the table here.
According to Joan, while in Germany, Kit once held one of the little girls by her foot and dangled her off the balcony of a three-story marble staircase and laughed. he was just doing a Michael Jackson impersonation that's all yeah that's hilarious

she said he would whip

the other little girl with the Roman He was just doing a Michael Jackson impersonation. That's all.
Yeah, that's hilarious.

She said he would whip the other little girl with the Roman-style whip.

He would take baths nude with the girls,

telling them they had to get comfortable with nudity

because they were in Europe and there was a lot of nudity in Europe.

That's not.

That's.

How about no?

No.

Just because you can have your tits out at the beach

doesn't mean there should be a cock floating in your fucking baby's bathwater.

I don't think so.

Totally different thing there, guys.

He said that?

Wow.

Joan also told a story about Kit punching Elijah in the face so hard that it knocked his glasses off.

And then she said Kit stomped on his glasses with his foot and crushed them. Which is like jokes on you, asshole.
Now you got to buy me new glasses. You just made yourself a bill.
You moron. When I go to school and I can't fucking see, they're going to go.
They're going to send a letter home going, get this kid glasses. He can't see.
You just cost yourself $400. That was stupid of you.
Joan also told the investigators that she took the concealed carry class at Cal's house because she feared for her life and wanted to protect herself from Kit. Joan said, quote, I just felt trapped.
I felt like I could knock it out and it was hopeless. In the beginning of the relationship, I thought he just needed help or counseling.
But as time went on, I wanted out. I just wanted to get us out.
So the agent asked her

if she could expand on her fears. And he, she said, I was afraid he was going to kill me.
And I was afraid he was going to kill or seriously hurt one of my children. My son was trying to protect me as he got older.
And I was afraid he was going to get seriously injured or killed as time went on okay that's a's a pretty, you know, on-the-nose statement there.

So, wow.

Now Alma, one of the kids also, I think that's the one kid,

said that she said that Kit told her if she or any of the other kids told anyone

about the abuse, he would kill them.

She said that if any of them had a black eye,

they were supposed to say they ran into something.

Right. She claimed that when they lived in Germany he always walked around naked I'm just being German you're lucky I'm not pooping on stuff it's cool no that's Germany is it? that's very awkward and uncomfortable clothing you can't wear that everywhere especially when that's all you're wearing.
Yeah. Just that with your cock dangling down.
It's not good. I'm putting the hose in Hosen.
Exactly. My own version of Leder Hosen.
So Elijah tells a story about how Kit injured his foot. He said that he was in a barn and didn't put a lid on a container correctly.
Elijah did. And he said that Kit got angry, pushed him down, and scraped his foot on the barrel.
The picture that they all paint of Kit was that he is a lunatic and that he would basically just be horrible for them. They said that he treated his biological children well, but not them.

Some evil stepdad shit they're

claiming here. They said that

the biological kids would get new clothes

and nice things while

these kids had to

shop at Goodwill.

He's like, well, they're not my kids. I ain't fucking

buying them clothes.

The one daughter said when she started

her period, Kit

called her fat, ugly, and worthless

and that

I'll see you next time. buying them clothes so she uh the one daughter said when she started her period kit called her fat ugly and worthless and that elijah said he was often called an idiot a loser a four eyes and a dork four eyes four eyes yeah hey four eyes how'd you like the it's bad enough going to school you gotta come home and you're like oh fuck this is worse than gym class jesus christ man he's gonna start pegging me with a kickball next just fucking over and over again at least i can fight those kids we're the same size this guy just wants to call me a dork and then body slam yeah he's a fucking major in the army wants to choke me out he's gonna dd team after he calls me four no shit? Elijah said that Kit had a friend who was a police officer.
He said that on the night of the big argument that his, that Kit's friend said that he didn't see any signs of abuse. This police officer, Elijah said he and his mom had large red marks across her face, or he said his mom had large red marks across her face.
And one of the daughters added that Kit threatened to kill her that night if she said anything to the police. So these are the accusations that are leveled against Kit.
They're heavy. Holy shit.
They're fucking heavy. So during all this, by the way, she moves out and all that kind of stuff.
He has another girlfriend. So at one point her name is Laura.
They interview Laura. The police go to interview Laura to do a welfare check on her to make sure that she's not full of black eyes and belt marks and shit like that.
Laura told the investigators she was aware of the allegations against him. And Laura told the cops she coaxes her kids to lie about things that happened oh yeah um so but they i guess the investigators tried to question basically kept asking her if she was in an abusive relationship and kept asking and asking now there's this book that is very much um a kits the man book basically and they say that the cops harassed her to the point of badgering her to see if she was in an abusive relationship.
I think they're doing their job. That's what they're supposed to do.
Right. I mean, oftentimes somebody in an abusive relationship will say no.
You have to ask several times in several different ways. Assure them you can keep them safe.
Things like safe things like that yeah it's gonna be okay if yeah you feel that you are threatened they ask different different verbiage to get them to admit because eventually it's like you're being extorted by the mafia you ask them the first time the mafia extorting you no no no no vinnie's my pal no we're great no we're tight charging you money for what he calls no no no no no no i mean i lend him a couple of bucks once in a while but that's just because vinny gambles oh okay has there ever been any mysterious fires around here well no and well actually there was but not after i started loaning vinny money then they all stopped are you see what i'm saying you to keep going with it. So they asked about Kit's temper and whether she had ever witnessed him losing it.
She replied she'd never seen Kit lose his temper with her or anyone else. They showed her the picture of the alleged abuse of Elijah.
And her quote was, I'm sorry, she said that the agent told her women don't often want to admit they're in an abusive relationship at the time or they miss early abusive behavior. Let me show you this.
Laura said she was a nurse and knew the signs of abuse. She told them that she had endured 17 years of verbal abuse by her previous husband and would not allow herself or her kids to be around that kind of abuse again.
And, um, they talked to her kids and I guess her kids, one of them described Kit as cool and said the only time he ever heard Kit yell was at the dogs. The other kids said that she felt safe, didn't have any concerns and that Kit never abused or touched her inappropriately.
Okay. Um, so there's Anyway, they said that while they looked around here, they didn't find any Roman whip anywhere, by the way.
Well, they didn't have like a search warrant looking through the house. Yeah, just a browsing.
Yeah. And Laura told them she didn't know anything about bamboo sticks.
Yeah, that's it. So Kit now, he complains.
He says, Joan, abandon her. Abandon him.
That's what it was. Yeah.
He says that basically Kit learned that, I guess, when he was in Iraq, he learned that she wasn't getting along well with the other army wives. And before leaving Germany, Kit came home from work to find what he claimed was total chaos with Joan cussing at Elijah and beating him and the girls screaming.
And that's when he wanted a divorce at that point. That's when he first started wanting one because she was out of, out of mind so september 11th 2012 this is when kit learns about the photographs that they police have and that she has with elijah so this is six days after he asked her for a divorce and seven days before there was an emergency protective order hearing now in his, Kit mentioned the photographs in a statement to a family advocacy representative.
He said, or this is the representative, said, I had a follow-up appointment. Oh, no, this is him.
This is Kit. I had a follow-up appointment with LCDR Belgrave of the family advocacy program.
I was hoping this meeting might provide some information as to the health and safety of my stepchildren as I had requested or maybe a follow on to my wife, Joan's mental health. Instead, I learned that my wife had escalated her attacks and slander on me by claiming I had abused my children.
She even produced photos of my stepson, EJ, apparently depicted extensive scratches or burns across his back. I had never seen these photos before, nor those alleged injuries.
I was shocked by what they apparently showed and the accusation that I had done this. So, yeah, he said that his first thought was they told him these injuries occurred while you were living in Rhode Island.
And he said, oh, I think I know what those were. That's not abuse.
Those are rug burns from his jujitsu lessons I was giving him. On his back like that? On his face? Yeah, just all over himself.
The rug burns from juiu-Jitsu lessons. What kind of rug are you wrestling on? Hey, get a mat, asshole, number one.
Grab a mat, why don't you? Crazy. This is crazy.
He said Elijah also practiced with a high school wrestling team for several months when they first moved to Pembroke. Another possibility Kit offers was that Joan may have been the one who caused the injuries.
Okay. He said, the only time I've ever witnessed a serious incident with my stepson was when I returned home from work one day while stationed in Germany.
I heard yelling and screaming from the backyard and thought someone was hurt. When I ran around the corner, I saw my son EJ, which it's J-E, it's Justin Elijah, it's so weird.
Okay. On the second rung of the ladder, about a foot off the ground.

Wait, it's Elijah Justin.

It's Justin Elijah, and he goes by Elijah or EJ.

Don't get it.

Okay.

Whatever.

His sister Alma was on the sub roof of the main roof above him,

and my wife Joan was beating EJ with a broom or a stick across the back and shoulders,

yelling obscenities such as fucking pussy and fucking coward. Wow.
I yelled at her, but she didn't seem to notice I was there. I didn't know how long she'd been doing this, but I had to restrain her to get her to stop.
Imagine being the Germans what they thought of all this if this happened. Like, fucking America.
Just what we all thought, everybody. Holy shit.
Nope, no, it's Jerry Springer. Yeah, I know, we got it out here.
Same thing. I was then finally able to ask what happened.
She told me Alma had gone to retrieve a toy stuck on the roof and then was afraid to come back down, so she told EJ to get her. I don't know why why joan didn't do it ej was apparently also very afraid of heights and could not climb the ladder past the second rung so joanie had gotten violently upset and started beating him he says i mentioned this only as a statement of fact not to counter my allegations oh no no just just like to give all the information yeah just the facts now now here's the problem with Joan it comes out when they file for divorce and everything she is not she's already married what she never divorced her husband Carlos she's still married to him she's a polygamist yes well a bigamist anyway a polygamist would be if she was living with both of them, but she's a bigamist anyway.
Oh, boy. She's a bigamist here, so there's going to be bigamy charges against her for that.
She's going to plead guilty to charge of bigamy and granted a pre-drial diversion. You know, they're not going to put her in fucking prison for that, but yeah.
Now, the military is going to charge Kit with various offenses relating to the mishandling of classified information from the laptop and the disks and physical abuse of the boy as well. Now, there is a court martial scheduled.
December 15, 2015, there is a court martial hearing scheduled here. And Cal is supposed to testify at that court-martial hearing about finding everything here.
Because that's part of it is where they got the shit from. He's a rat, so yeah.
Absolutely. Cal and Pam made several statements to individuals indicating that their fear that Kit would come and kill them.
Or if anything happened to them, tell the cops to look at Kit. Because we're going to testify against him, and at best he's going to lose his pension, which he's not going to be fucking happy about.
He's going to be very upset. Very upset.
So after a bunch of continuances, court-martial proceedings scheduled for Decembercember 2015 now november the 18th 2015 less than a month away from these court martial proceedings pam cal's wife pam left for work around 7 a.m now around noon she was informed that a washing machine she had ordered could not be delivered to her home because no one was there which is a nightmare if you order appliances you have no idea when they're coming yeah and then they give you a fucking window eight to ten eight to noon whatever the fuck but you have no idea when they're coming and then when they do come you not only have to be there you have to be like ready with the door open and the place open for them to put it and it's all prepared and hope you bought the the hoses and the hose is the plug oh my god so i'm on a fucking refrigerator there's no plug are you shitting me are you fucking jesus christ how is that possible yeah i remember that doesn't fit the new fridge what the fuck is going on every washing machine yeah they sell you a plug everything yeah they sell you a plug what how charge me 50 more and give me the motherfucking plug how the hell am i supposed to is there a choice here they run it with no plug what are we talking about did you not do that in case i buy it in germany and you can put the right plug you know where you're sending it send the plug is this a solar washer do i put it out in the yard for a few hours and then it's got enough juice to do a load?

What do I do?

How does this work?

Who the fuck is so cheap that they're like, take $50 off and I'll buy it.

Well, then you don't get the plug.

Deal.

What? Deal.

Who does that?

It's insane.

Just give me the fucking plug.

Give me the plug, please.

So she was informed the washing machine was there.

She was concerned, so she left work earlier than usual around 5 p.m because she usually leaves at 6 but she's leaving at 5 even though it was at noon when the you know when the call came now cal's usually home so that's why she's like what are you talking about there's nobody home cal's home so she left at 5 to go check on cal because she hasn't heard from him

and this is 2015 so people are always incessantly texting each other and hasn't heard from him and no one could deliver the washing machine she arrived at her residence and called her friend francis marlene larac here she said hey francis have you seen cal so francis said she had called Cal earlier in the day to check on his sick dog, but nobody answered.

What a nice person. She called to check on the sick dog.
A text would have been sufficient, I think, there. Don't call me for that.
Yeah, I mean, I don't know. Both are thoughtful, I suppose.
It's not thoughtful to call someone out of the blue for no reason. That's not thoughtful.
It's like giving someone, like, a bill for something. That's, something that's like not thoughtful text if they want to call they'll they'll i'll tell you all about it i'll call you or something but don't just assume they want to get on the phone and talk to you i think older people might be different though good afternoon let's talk let's talk about depressing shit yeah i think older people are different with they're okay with getting phone calls yeah i think it's like 55 and over are okay with getting phone calls 55 and under is like you called me for what how could this this could have been accomplished way easier in a text why are you doing this text me and see if it's okay yeah text me and see if i'm busy first you want to talk that? That's all.
No? Okay. There you go.
Just saved us both an awkward conversation. Can't imagine why you wouldn't want to talk about your dog with cancer.
Weird, right? So Marlene also said she had gone to the Phillips residence around 2 p.m. and found the front door open, which was unusual, but she assumed Cal was working out in the back field and just left the door open.
So Pam told Marlene to hold the line because she saw something. Now, she's at home, Pam.
She's looking around. Now Marlene heard a scream as if someone had been startled and then silence.
Okay, a scream and then silence. And that was it.
Never heard from her again. Okay again okay so marlene returned she gets in the car to go drive over and check on pam and she found the front door open but no one there no one asked no one answering that yelling hello no one's answering shit so pam's car um i guess at that time pam's car was parked in the driveway normally, like it normally is.
About an hour later, so Marlene didn't call the cops or anything like that. She left and came back an hour later.
Okay. Okay.
So she returned to check on them. At this time, Pam's car had been moved to face the other direction, and the front door of the house was closed.
Okay. So you go, okay, well, they're around.
And that's what she figured. She figured, well, they must have come home or whatever the fuck.
I don't know. That's what they do.
Well, I know that Pam's back and everything's fine. She just left it alone at that point.
She figured everything's fine. So whatever.
So that morning at 2.15 a.m., okay, so middle of the night, a nearby neighbor named John Hommick or Hommick was awakened by the sound of two explosions or gunshots coming from somewhere on his farm, he said. He thought the sounds were possibly caused by trespassing hunters, so he didn't investigate any.
He's like, I'm not going to go out there and get shot by idiots at three in the morning that's stupid so later that morning he went outside and saw a car smoldering in his field oh my god yeah a car burned to shit in his field those hunters killed the car fucking they got themselves a pontiac grand dam it looks like that's a I don't have my tag for that let's get out of here it ain't even in season let's go it ain't pontiac season we gotta get out of here he's gonna arrest us we gotta run god damn it i said i was after mustangs but damn it this is ridiculous high knees t-roy let's go let's. Move it.
So the police look inside the vehicle when they get there and discover that there are two sets of human remains inside the burnt vehicle as well. Two bodies.
Two burnt up bodies inside this vehicle. So the vehicle is registered to Cal and Pam Phillips.
Yep. Okay.
Now, here we go. All right.
There's more to this as well, by the way, here, as we'll talk about. Quite a lot more.
So the cops head over to Cal's here. They head over to Cal's residence where they discover, because they get that call, and they have the registration, so they go to the house.
When they get to the house, they find that Cal is at home. Huh? But he's dead.
Oh, shit. His remains are in the cellar among more signs of a fire being set around him.

Someone tried to burn the house down. Someone tried.
Yeah. Either that or Cal killed whoever that was and then went home and tried to off himself and burn the house down.
One of the two. What the fuck? So police continued to search the property and they located, they discovered blood in the backyard next to a distinctive World War II era pistol, which was known to belong

to the Phillips neighbor, Ed Danzaro, who's 63 years old. Ed Danzaro's got a pistol in their yard.
In their yard. Subsequent testing indicates the blood in the yard belongs to Ed Danzaro, not to Cal.
What the fuck? This is crazy, right? Yeah. Pam's blood was also discovered on the back door and in the yard.
They discover that the remains are super burnt in the car. They get them in.
They finally process and figure out that the fucking bodies are Pam and Ed Danzerow in the car. And Cal is dead in the basement okay fucking crazy so their injuries by the way you'll probably want to know about here because it's a lot Cal suffered five gunshot wounds and blunt force trauma to different locations of his body.
He was tortured and shot a lot.

This is fucking wild.

They said there are two kinds of gunshot wounds, penetrating and perforated.

A penetrating wound means that the bullet remained in the body.

A perforated wound means that it got through and through.

So Calvin had both types of those.

Okay.

They said as for the blunt force trauma injuries, they said that the injuries were to the face and upper and lower extremities. So that's the whole body as far as I'm concerned, or at least legs and arms and face.
In response here, they also say the trauma injuries occurred anti-mortem or before death. It's important because it indicated that he was beaten before he was shot.
They said they asked if the injuries could have been caused by a butt of a gun and they said they could have. That's what the doctor says.
The facial injuries, though, occurred near the time of death. They were paramortem.
And they said this lends credence to the possibility that all the blunt force injuries may have occurred due to the victim being tossed down the stellar the cellar stairs while still alive. OK, blood on the stairs and a tooth discovered under his body also suggest that he may have been dumped down the stairs face first, possibly by, you know, anybody throwing him down there.
Who knows? So, one finding that wasn't fully

explained related to the

I guess the bullets

here. There's

different types, I guess, different

bullets. Trocars, is that how you say it?

I don't know. They're designed

to separate after the bullet hit the

target, such as skin

come apart in you. Right away,

huh? Yeah.

I guess they said Calvin had three

entrance injuries like that to the left

Thank you. Right away, huh? Yeah.
I guess they said Calvin had three entrance injuries like that to the left side of his chest, indicating that the bullets had separated before entering the body. Oh, God.
One possible scenario is that at least one shot fired at him hit something else first, causing them to separate. He sustained three penetrating gunshot wounds to his chest.
They were still in the body. Other ones were in the neck and the right clavicle.
They were perforated, meaning they exited. The bullet bases from the two perforated gunshots were never recovered, and they don't know.
So they don't know if the shots were fired outside, inside. They don't know what.
They said the trocar, I guess that's how you say it, entry wounds also support the possibility of one bullet striking something like anything, a window or mirror or anything like that, breaking off from the main bullet. The gunshot wound to the neck entered Calvin's left ear but exited the right side lower on the neck.
There's also a smaller exit wound where the

trocars exited. All exit

wounds were lower on the neck than the entrance

wounds. The same is true for the

perforated wounds on the right clavicle.

The exit wounds were lower than the entrance

wounds. So we're talking

from above.

The trajectory of the bullets suggests

that they were fired from above. This could also indicate someone standing over Calvin as he shot.
Any of that shit is possible. So, Pam Phillips and Ed here, and Ed Denzero.
Here we go. Almost Jerry Springer.
Dr. Jeffrey Springer enters the equation here.
Medical examiner for Kentucky here. He has his brother.
He examined Pam and Ed. They said both bodies had been consumed in the automobile fire.
The doctor was able to examine the remains that were recovered from the front passenger seat and the rear passenger seat of the car. Front and back.
Front and back. So they were driven there and no one was put in the driver's seat.
Yeah. That's not even trying to act like they did this themselves.
Right. That's just putting two passengers and then getting out.
Getting the fuck out. X-rays of both victims revealed bullet fragments in their brains.
In Pam's case, the X-ray also showed the presence of a mostly intact .22 caliber bullet in the charred remains of her heart. Oh.
So, yeah. Interesting.
So, this is a fucking mess, obviously. An absolute mess.
How did Ed die? Gunshots as well. Same thing.
Yeah, gunshots. Gunshots and burning.
Yeah, multiple gunshot wounds. So, okay.
It was a .22.

They recovered fragments from the bodies of Ed and Pam and confirmed they'd both been shot multiple times with a .22 caliber firearm.

Okay.

Okay.

Now, several hairs were recovered from the vehicle, from Danzaro's vehicle.

Okay.

Not the one they were burning in.

This had been located between his residence and Pam's Burton vehicle, his car.

Somewhere in the middle.

Yeah.

While certain hairs were consistent with a sample taken from Kit, only one hair was suitable for definitive DNA testing, and it, I guess, apparently didn't match Kit.

All right.

Now, projectile fragments recovered from the bodies of Pam and Ed confirmed they'd been shot multiple times, like we said. Kit owned several .22 caliber firearms as well.
Forensic testing was inconclusive, meaning that the examiner could neither confirm nor exclude the possibility that the recovered fragments were linked to his .22 caliber firearms. There was a lot of damage to the bullets.
So that's hard. Cal was killed by a unique G2 RIP .45 caliber bullets.
That's what he was killed with. Unique bullets fired from a Glock.
He suffered several gunshot wounds and blunt force trauma, like we said. The police found a .45 caliber Glock pistol when they searched Kit's home.
So when they search his safe at home. And forensic testing of the fragments was inconclusive again.
No ballistics on this. So nothing happens.
No arrests are made. Yeah, because his gun doesn't match it.
Yeah. Nothing matches it.
Well, they don't know if it matches. It's just not.
They can't tell if it matches it. Oh, yeah.
Okay. All right.
It's just, yeah. If the fragments are too fucked up, they don't know.
If they say it could have been. Yeah.
They can tell you whether it could have been or couldn't have been. Can't confirm it, but it can't.
It can't. But they can't.
Yeah. The other word.
Deny. Exclude.
Exclude. Exclude.
So the Phillips property was processed for evidence on three separate occasions, November 19th, November 30th, and December 4th, 2015. They keep coming back to process to look for more shit.
Now, a neighbor named Mark Harris lived next door to Danzerow and across the street from Kit and Pam. And he said in 2015 he could sense something was wrong on the street.
Caught a weird vibe on the street. Yeah.
Yeah. This is what Mark said.
Mark said that he went and talked to or he was talking to to and said, he told me about a week before this happened. I need to stay away from here.
There's something going on bad. Cal told him that.
Yeah. So, um, now the neighbor, his theory theory is that Kit went to Cal Phillips home, killed him in the basement and then Pam or collateral damage.
Yeah. It seems like he waited for fucking Pam to get there.
Right. And then nailed her.
He probably hid, like, you know, and then fucking popped out because that's where a scream would come from. Then silence.
She probably saw Cal, screamed, holy shit. And then that was that.
He went out and got her at that point. And then maybe Ed heard the scream.
I don't know. That's possible.
Yeah, Ed might have come over. Who the hell knows? Ed might have seen.
Seems like they all just involved themselves with each other, so they're going to be around A little much. Totally.
This guy said, I don't know what was said. Took him to the basement of the house, maybe found him in there, and he walked in and shot him.
So, who knows? Now, they talked to Elijah, the the son here uh jones son and he's saying that kit's a fucking monster uh he said in public he'd be the nicest person you'd ever meet but behind closed doors phew he was a monster in the early hours of december 4th 2024 ceo brian thompson stepped out onto the streets of mid Midtown Manhattan. This assailant pulls out a weapon and starts firing at him.
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And he also says that they're not going to be like, I love beating the shit out of my kids out in public. At work, they usually don't say that.
So they also said, do you think that your stepfather did this? And he said he's 100% because of the person he was being behind closed doors. So a private investigator working for the defense team in the court-martial case now.
Okay. This private investigator had interviewed Cal Phillips two weeks before the murder.
In the interview, the detective was convinced that something would turn the entire case on his head. He said something that nobody else knew that Cal Phillips would have flipped on Joan and testified for Kit.
That's what he says. But there's no proof of that.
The private investigator wrote in an email to police, it's the professional opinion of Mary Martins that I and I that Calvin Phillips was murdered in order to prevent his testimony on behalf of the defense think about that witness statements strongly point to Joan Harmon as the person most likely to benefit from his silence so here is what their theory is Joan is fucking badass Joan did this because if apparently if she was alive and he basically she could have gotten a really good settlement from the military about the abuse shit she could have gotten a settlement from the military that's what that's what his defense saying. Rather than it's Kit who did it because he doesn't want them testifying against him.
They're saying Cal was going to testify actually for Kit and Joan found out and killed three people over it. So both of these sides are going to say that the other person did it because his testimony would benefit them.
Yes. Yeah.
That's exactly what it is. So Kit said that she knew that was her last chance to ruin my career.
She couldn't do it. Now, by the way, the evidence against him is there's all sorts of physical evidence about physical evidence about the laptop shit.
Is the military still looking into that? Right. The CDs labeled secret in the laptop computer.
Also, a thumb drive and an HP personal computer that Kit had given to Joan also turned in for analysis. And also, Kit said this is when he was brought in and questioned about the laptop.
He said, I do not know how the FBI gained sensitive information that has my name associated with it. I may have been hacked in the past.
Oh, no. There we go.
He literally went to hacked. That's the last bastion of a truly desperate jerk off that's been caught doing something bad.
I got hacked the uh admission of guilt without saying i did it yes exactly ever present anytime anybody says i was hacked okay i was hacked man if that is not the case i believe that my ex-wife and he put wife in parentheses in uh in quotes by the way act not ex part wife yeah like she was never his wife, may have found sensitive items on some damaged discs she stole along with most of the items from my house and then turn them into the police as a part of her ongoing plan to ruin me out of spite. She did this even though I provided sole support to her and her children for nine years and she was the one that had an affair.

I have consistently had to defend myself against accusations made by my ex, quote, wife.

And then in parentheses that I later learned was a bigamist and that I was not even legally married to.

Since I asked for a divorce in September of 2012, I was forced to call the police when she became violent.

She vowed to ruin my career and has utilized every venue to do so.

She's continued to harass me and has even recently vandalized my vehicles.

She has accused him of abuse and then later abuse toward her children, charges which I have been cleared. Despite her documented perjury, I've continually had to defend myself in a guilty until proven innocent system for the last 10 months, as well as attend family advocacy training and fat.
That would be which is hilarious and have my name listed on a fat blacklist that is used to check soldiers backgrounds prior to come to promotion or command assignment.

Oh, my God.

He said when Kit learned about the charges against him, he still held out. Hope he could prevail in a court martial trial.
Kit's attorneys, though, they informed him that he was facing serious charges that could end his career and put him behind bars for a very long time. So the court martial hearing here.
Yeah. He is convicted of yeah here um we'll talk about this here uh the um one of the the guys involved in the trial one of the lawyers said it was one of the most heated trials i've ever been in in the military it's his charges that he has classified information and sexually assaulted a child they got him on that too too? Yeah, they're charging him with it.

They have little girls who said he touched them.

So, I mean, got to do it.

He was basically found not guilty of some charges,

and then he was convicted of mishandling classified information

and simple assault.

So he gets cleared of the major charges, they give him like lesser, lesser shit for this. And, uh, he was sentenced to 90 days in prison.
Okay. That's what he got.
He was also dismissed from the army as well. And, uh, also forfeiture of all paying allowances and a reprimand.
That's all over. Shit out of luck.
So now he became a huge fucking case for certain groups out there. Big time.
I mean, lots of these groups. Basically, these, quote, men's rights groups were getting involved to try to help him out.
That was a big deal.

He's convicted of hurting children, man.

He's a giant cause for these people to this day.

It's a huge cause.

So now Carlos and Joan were finally actually divorced on April 20th, 2016.

Oh, they figured it out, huh?

They figured it out, yeah.

Oh, yeah.

Very nice.

Let's sign this paperwork.

So Kit here, after his 90 days, he heads to North out. Yeah.
Oh, yeah. Very nice.
Let's sign this. Whoops.
Yeah. So Kit here, after his 90 days, he heads to North Carolina.
Yeah. Where he is going to get a job as a commercial airline pilot.
Really? American fucking airlines hired this man. Really? American Airlines, just everybody out there so you know.
Simple assault. Okay.
American Airlines, actually we got the one of their subsidiaries psa airlines oh it's the little yeah it's the little ones i got a psa for you don't fly that airline i don't know where the fuck it is but did you say he moved you said he moved he's in north carolina yeah he's flying out of charlotte yeah well no because I think he's going to end up in Norfolk. This is going to be his home base.
It's a weird thing. So, yeah, the PSA is wholly owned subsidiary of American Airlines and operates an all-jet American Eagle fleet.
Right. So he began working there.
He wasn't the oldest pilot in his new higher class. They said there was guys older than and he was almost 50 so um yeah he he liked that um basically he said he didn't like the uh the small jet was less responsive and nimble than an apache attack helicopter is that right no shit surprise surprise it's not delivering payload of fucking weaponry sir the american eagle fucking 9.30 to Palm Springs isn't fucking as nimble as an attack helicopter with missiles on it.
Jesus Christ. A plane that was built in 1987.
That's what they are. That's the American Eagle.
The ones built in 1987 that have a fucking welded shut ashtray on the fucking thing. You'd think those aren't as nimble as an Apache attack helicopter, huh? Can't do barrel rolls in this?

Weird.

He said, yeah, the Apache had full-color screens with 3D map presentations.

Yeah, and this is still...

Because people were shooting at you.

They assume...

This is still got the Apple green screen.

Yeah.

They fucking assume that the PSA flight to St. Louis isn't going to be under attack, probably.

It's not flying through enemy territory.

I assume it's just going to be a, you know. But to make it feel more real, he does fly it with night vision.
He's like, can I just wear night vision so I feel cool? Let me just put the goggles on while I fly. It's 10 p.m., man.
It's dark. so he had a choice of pilot

bases and he chose Norfolk

Virginia which is a two-hour drive from Roanoke. He said he liked the small town feel and he found a hotel near the water and all that kind of shit.
So he was a reserve pilot then he could bid on four-day trips which would limit the amount of time of commuting. So he could only commute once and then go back.
Now, during this, a couple of years have gone by since the Phillipses and Ed Denzerow have been murdered. And the families are getting pissed off here.
Fuck yeah. Like, what happened? And as we found out in other cases on this show where the worst was the Brighton, New York one where the cops were like, I don't know, we didn't have the family in here banging on our desk saying, please solve the crime, so it just goes to the back burner.
We need motivation, guys. Come on, come in and motivate us.
Fuck you. Fucking goddamn solve this shit.
Do this job with no credit. Yeah.
Because if your family member's murdered and they don't arrest somebody immediately, you gotta bother them or they will just give up. That's how it works.
So the Kentucky Attorney General said in a video statement that his office has now picked up the case after the Phillips' son came into the office. He said about two years ago, Matt Phillips came into my office.
He talked about losing both of his parents in a brutal murder that also took the life of a third individual. He was worried that the case was stalled and was worried that justice would not come.
So, yeah, he said that of the whole thing, Phillips had he told CNN, by the way, that his father had evidence that was harmful to Kit's military case. And he also said that Kit was shamefully kicked out of the military.
He said, my father had a lot to do with that. And I think we should all be frank, thankful for that, frankly, that this guy isn't fucking flying attack helicopters.
Wow. So he said he, meaning his dad, handed over pictures of a sub 16 year old boy that had been bitten, choked violently multiple times.
He also told CNN. He said that his dad also handed over disks that had classified information and should have never left an army post.
Now, Kit's lawyer, he said that, no, no, no. They got it totally backwards.
Cal was going to defend us, actually. So no motivation.
He said that, yeah, he said if their motive is that he killed Calvin Phillips because he was going to testify in his upcoming court-martial, well, that was nothing further from the truth. Now, there's cameras everywhere, by the way, now.
Yeah. 2016, cameras are everywhere.
We have some footage of something. Well, following this, I guess Phillips' son, this is Cal and Pam's son, Matt, and his aunt Diana installed cameras at the residence, at the Phillips residence.
Okay. Just to make sure, because it was secured and they wanted to make sure that nobody was breaking into it or anything.
So they secured cameras. And it's a little late, but we should have had these in the first place.
We should have had them in the first place. So several months later, Diana notices a metallic object under some wood on the breezeway to the back porch.
There, this is on the camera. So they went out and looked.
She showed the object to Matt, who recognized it and realized it was a shell casing oh so he called the cops yeah and uh yeah police had concerns regarding the circumstances surrounding the discovery of the evidence how you found it whatever but they did it and uh in 2018 testing reveals the casing was fired from A .45. Kit Martin's Glock .45.
Hey. His gun, too.
His gun. They finally had some shit.
Yep. They got the casing and it worked out very well.
Do we got a fingerprint from his thumb putting it in the fucking bag? We don't have that, but we have his gun, his casing. That's not good.
A lot of his motive. Also, this is fucking great.
There's some issues here they have phone data records that show on november 18th 2015 which was the you know early morning late night time that this murder happened kit set his alarm on his phone to wake him up at 1 10 a.m remember the murders happened at two something in the morning right that's when the explosion was heard and gunshots heard And the farm property Why are you trying to wake up so early Kit? So, okay Obviously the state is saying that he used that time To sneak out of the front door of his home Move the bodies And burn the vehicle that they were found in Do all that shit That's what say now well his explanation is gold when he testifies we'll get to that okay um may 11th 2019 here um they talk about uh because he hasn't you know he hasn't been arrested or anything this is just evidence they have right so may 11 2019 now kit here you know he doesn't like some of the younger pilots no he works with nah just doesn't like them they just don't get it not they're not military guys they're not like him he likes the older guys in the military yeah they're doing this for pussy so he almost backed out of the trip when he saw who he was paired with but you know he said he could have called in sick because he was off probation and with the company everything. But he said he didn't want to fuck anything up, so he figured he'd just do the trip and be done with it.
So he treated the two flight attendants to dinner at Panera Bread on their first layover. The captain, whom Kit didn't like, was in good spirit, so that was good.
The second day of the four-day trip had a layover in Louisville, and the captain was planning on meeting up with a girl he knew in the area, and everything was going to be all fun here. So they get back on the flight to fly out of Louisville here, and I'll let a passenger take over from here.
This is Ashley Martin of Elizabethtown, who has no relation to Kit, by the way. Martin's a common last name.
She says it was something like it was like something you would totally see in a movie. Her and her mother, Frances, were at the airport boarding American Airlines flight 5523 from Louisville to Charlotte.
And the mother said it was very tense. I think it was I think it was very tense.
You could tell the employees knew something was going on. They said when they first heard their pilot had been arrested, they took him off the fucking plane, bro.
It's hilarious. They both assumed he must have been shit-faced.
Because I showed up drunk. That was a very common thing.

Because they do that all the time.

Later in the day, though, they learned different.

And the mother said, oh, my gosh, when they learned he was in for murder.

Ashley Martin said, it's startling.

It's scary to think that this happened so long ago,

and they're just now getting around to catching the guy.

Then the mother said, we were inconvenienced a lot.

She's still looking for free fucking miles here or something.

This is crazy.

We need a room.

We need a dinner.

Give me a couple upgrades here.

What are we doing?

Also, what if that guy found out mid-flight?

You know what I mean?

And somehow found out mid-flight that he was going to be arrested when he landed and just drove this motherfucker into the mountain.

Fucker right in the ground.

Oh my god. We're going to Bolivia,

everybody. That's where we're going.

Rerouting this flight. We're going to Cuba.

This is your captain speaking.

It's going to be hard where we're going because we are

destined for hell. We're going to

be headed for Cuba. Change of

plans, everybody.

Might want to contact your loved ones in your

destination city. Let them know you've been

rerouted to Cuba. Perhaps

Google the nearest consulate. We're going to be

Thank you. plans, everybody.
Might want to contact your loved ones in your destination city. Let them know you've been rerouted to Cuba.
Perhaps Google the nearest consulate. We're going to be landing.
We're going to be landing in the water. Not sure of the legalities of our attempted immigration.
Hope you brought your passport. Enjoy the flight.
Mother, we're inconvenienced a lot.

Like missed an entire day of a vacation that's been planned and saved for for an entire year.

I can't imagine. Better than being flown into a mountain probably.

So they were going to St. Lucia.

Going to an island.

Oh, yeah.

We're going down to the fucking Bahamas.

Yeah.

If you were in Kentucky and you thought you'd be in an island in three hours, I guess that would piss you off. That's way different.
We're the fucking bananas and coconuts. This is bullshit.
Someone get me a pina colada or I'm going to stab somebody. It was a very hot, bare-chested man.
She said, the daughter said, I was definitely stressed. It felt like it was a little chaotic and unorganized.
The workers, you could tell they were stressed. You could feel the energy.
You could feel the tension from the flight attendants. And then there's an American Airlines statement they give out here.
What do they say? That's what you get for flying American. Go fuck your mothers.
Oh, no. What do you expect? What do you expect? It's American.
Fuck you. We're the largest carrier in the country.
We hire anybody. We hire anybody hire anybody by the way if we lose your bag we're keeping it fuck off all of us at american airlines and you'll fly with us again it's cheap it's cheap we might be where going where you're going where no one no one else goes there nobody else is going there you'll fly with See you on the next flight.
That would be me in an American Airlines seat in a commercial. I'd be going, they were the only ones flying where I needed to go.
I thought about taking a layover to fly a better airline here, but I just said fuck it. Nonstop to Norfolk doesn't exist.
I just said fuck it, and then they come on american airlines fuck it is their new slogan and that's it yeah i just said fuck it i'll take a chance one of us me or my bag will get there oh my god all of us at american airlines and psa airlines are deeply saddened to have learned about these allegations from 2015. Our team was made aware of the indictment this morning after his arrest at Louisville International Airport.
We have an unwavering. Who cares? Okay.
He was placed on administrative suspension pending the outcome. Wow.
They must really need pilots. They're like, he might get off.
Hey, remember that one guy we hired? Look, he's on trial for triple murder right now, but he could get off. If he gets off, we could put him right in the schedule.
We'll go and do him in the Norfolk round again. Administrative suspension is with pay.
That's crazy. I think it is.
That's awesome. Wow.
So he is now indicted on three counts of murder, two counts of burglary, one count of arson, one count of attempted arson, and three counts of tampering with physical evidence. Yeah, it's not good.
Wow. Okay.
Now it gets fun. Yeah.
Well, a little bit after this, but he calls his mom from jail when he gets arrested. She picked up the phone and heard about accepting a call from an inmate and was like, what? And just hung up.
She didn't have's just like that's crazy click wrong number frank caller obviously oh my god uh that's amazing um when her mom when his mom did find out she had to be taken to the hospital for she thought she was having a heart attack really she's having an anxiety she's gotta be 70 something years old yeah yeah he's in his 50s his 50s. So I mean, Christ, he's like 50, 49 or some shit.
So he pleads not guilty. As you do.
His lawyer said his client would plead not guilty and said, that's what they said. Basically, like, why? He said, why did they wait so long to indict him? He said, that's what we're all curious about.
What evidence do they have that they didn't have almost four years ago? Well, a bullet, a bullet that matches your gun is one. That's a big one.
You'll know. That's a big one.
Yeah. So he's arraigned.
Elijah was there during the arraignment because they were asking him questions. And Elijah said this to a reporter.
He gave an on, an on-camera interview to Nashville station. He said he would hide behind a mask out in public in front of everybody and act like he was this great major in the military.
Behind closed doors, he was very evil. He was a tyrant.
He was a monster, all of the above. I was the one he targeted most.
Beat me all the time, smack me around, punch me, whatever. He then gave another example of maltreatment.
He he said i was out mowing the lawn one day and i made a line the line a little too crooked and he started smacking me around for it and told me i was doing it wrong and then cal came over and took me out of there that's part of it cal apparently came over and helped he's yeah. So that, I think, baby, it's not just the military stuff.
Cal knows about the— He's well aware of what goes on over there. Yes, that's what I mean.
These people seem very enmeshed in their neighbors' lives and very fucking nosy, all of them. So everyone in this neighborhood knows exactly what's going on with everybody, it feels like.
The kid's beating the kid again. I'm going to go get him.
I'm going to go get him. So the news reporter stated that Elijah told him that he and his mother and sisters left immediately after the murders, and they never doubted who was behind them.
Elijah said, I believe that he took out the witnesses. I hope he gets the worst punishment that's available to him.
Now, the venue is going to be transferred from Christian County to Hardin County. Little tiny venue.
You got to move that shit because everybody heard about it. During an evidence suppression hearing, it was revealed that police requested Diana, the Phillips, the aunt of the kid of the Phillips on there, to submit to a polygraph examination, which she apparently failed.
However, the trial court excluded the evidence at trial anyway. So, they just...
What were the questions? Basically, the question... I don't know if they're trying to say that...
The only thing I can think of, the defense is saying that they basically, the Phillipses, went and got a shell casing from somewhere else oh okay and said they found it yeah where the near where the murder happened so that's what they said um but the the bullet case the casing was still allowed into the trial other pre-trial shit here um they said that the the commonwealth filed a notice of its intent to admit hearsay statements under the forfeiture by wrongdoing exception, which is in the law here. That is about two weeks before he died.
Cal told Stephen Durham that he feared Kit would kill him before the court martial trial. Cal told a guy named Stephen Bollinger that if he ever ended up missing or dead, to point the authorities old Kit Martin's way.
Cal told Major James Garrett, one of the prosecutors from the court-martial, that he was afraid of Martin because Martin knew he had provided the information that led to the court-martial. Pam told Penny Case that she and Cal were afraid to leave the house unoccupied because they were afraid Martin would be in the house when they got back.
Wow. Pam told case she was worried Martin would hurt her and the authorities should look at Martin if anything happened to her.
So, okay. The court determined these statements were admissible under the forfeiture by wrongdoing exception.
Okay. Now he brings up in their defense, they're like, what about all these other deaths around Joan? Okay, listen to this.
On June 28, 2015, an elderly couple was brutally attacked at their residence on Old Trenton Road in Guthrie, Kentucky. Both had been bound and beaten.
Joan had been renting a house from the couple, not that house, not near there. That was just her landlords.
Okay. Her landlords were beaten to death.
Yes. But they said it was unclear if they were her landlord at the time of the attack or not.
They operated a large farm. Amos Yoder, who was 79 and his wife, Marjorie Y Yoder died from severe head trauma there.
Joan talked about the Yoder murders to her co-workers at the soda shop. She described the Yoders as being like grandparents to her kids.
Over the following weeks, though, they said Joan seemed to come into a windfall. She bragged about new furniture and a car she had purchased.
She showed up to work in new outfits.

When asked where the money had come from for all these purchases,

Jones said her mom had sent her money.

He said the Yoder beatings are still unsolved and robberies believed to be the motive.

Okay, so she stole enough money to get...

So Cal's defense team wants to put in that

even though there is zero evidence she had anything to do with these people's murder or anything like that, he wants to put into evidence the fact that they were murdered and that she knew them and that she bought a new dress in the next couple months. She got a new couch.
So, you know what I'm saying? So that means I'm innocent. Okay, so that means because of that, I didn't do this.
Sure. The victim's family statement here, they said that this is from all the families together.
Cal Phillips, Pam Phillips, and Ed Danzerow were brutally extinguished beyond recognition from family. Did they say extinguished when two of them were burned to death? What is what the fuck is why do they do it why do they do it your brain must do that it must because all these statements where you're like what's the last thing you'd want to say well that it's every fucking time make a pun about fire don't do it just leave it out anything beyond recognition out of them it's totally.
They're not doing it. It's crazy.
For jokes. No, I don't think they're trying to help us out.
But thank you. Anyway, beyond recognition from the family.
Every day we were haunted by what was done to them and haunted further that someone was still free to do as they wish beyond the civility of mankind or laws of our nation.

We are overwhelmed with this positive step toward resolution for the people we love dearly, Cal, Pam, and Ed, and the hundreds of friends, family, neighbors, coworkers, and others deeply affected by their brutal end. We look forward to justice in court, and we look forward to a verdict to bring an end to this terror and start a fresh start at healing.
So 2021 here, Joan completed her pretrial diversion for her bigamy shit two days prior to this trial. So because of that, I am pretty sure they did this on purpose when they did the trial, the date for it.
The state then filed a motion to exclude any reference to the bigamy charges since she wasn't under anything anymore. Oh.
So they said, you can't talk about that. You can't talk about that because she's not a bigamist anymore.
The trial court ruled that she could not be impeached with the bigamy conviction because it was dismissed and it was dismissed as diverted because she was in a diverted thing which means it got dismissed so as soon as it's got dismissed technically she no longer did it so you can't bring that up anymore so that's what the court decided so that won't come up in court that she was a bigamist which is way different than a triple murderer by the way so it doesn't matter really i mean and and who's to say that it was not just an accident you know what i mean yeah that's yeah she signed all the he signed one of them just didn't file it you know i mean might just be lazy it's possible man pure lazy bad at paperwork yeah so the defense as the defense basically kit's defense is the alt perp defense somebody what me yeah somebody And they know, not just somebody else, her. Okay.
Fucking Joan. Yeah.
Yep. She said Joan wanted to ruin him, so she had her boyfriend commit the murders and plant the shell on the Phillips porch to frame him.
Not only did I not do it, I've been framed. I know I've been framed.
Yes. My wife didn't do it.

She manipulated another guy to do it. Then they framed me together.
Framed. Framed.
Framed. Yeah.
Okay. So at that point, because of the theory of the case, both Joan and Elijah both invoke their Fifth Amendment privilege against self-incrimination on this because they can, I guess, their lawyers advise them to.
If they're going to accuse them of crimes, don't let them accuse you of crimes and actually answer their questions in court. That's stupid.
So, and at a following hearing, the circuit court ordered that neither Joan nor the son could be called as a witness at at trial so they're both out which i mean they're it's pretty irrelevant honestly at this point because it's a murder trial it's not anything else pleading the fifth has now become such a uh it it means that you're guilty thing that like that could have been if they called them like that could be you know i mean uh helpful because it yeah it could sway the jury any jury who knows be like i don't know they won't even talk so what are we talking about exactly that's that's you're absolutely right you're not now they anybody taking the fifth the judges instruct the jurors that that is not allowed to be taken as anything but but that's they're your human beings right you send 12 humans back in a room they're not law books they're humans're humans, and they're going to think dumb shit because they're humans.

That's what we do.

So in the openings here, the defense opening, they basically say that the whole opening is it was Joan Harmon that did these murders, not my client.

Also presented testimony. This is they're going to say they're going to present testimony from Kit's daughter saying that Joan threatened to ruin him in his military career.
Remember that? If he left her. Other people testifying here, Pam's co-worker.
This woman here said that she testified regarding statements that Pam made that she was afraid to leave her house for the holidays because if she did, Martin would be in her house waiting for her when she got back. She told everybody this shit.
She further testified that Pam also said she believed Martin would hurt her, and if anything happened, that's your guy right there. Clearly, yeah.
So the defense team, their big thing is they try to get the images of Elijah forensically analyzed to see if they have those pictures. Yeah.
And they look bad. So if you can say that Joan fabricated that, then she's capable of anything is basically what they're trying to do.
Okay. She likes to frame this guy, and we're saying he's framed.
So one plus one equals two. Sure.
So, yeah. One times one equals one.
Sorry, Terrence Howard, but that's how it works. The resulting analysis was unable to determine definitively when or where the photos were taken.
Big deal. It doesn't matter.
There was also questions about the reliability of timestamp data related to emails Jones sent that contain the images. They said, while the pictures, while the content may show injuries, there's nothing visual in the pictures validating date and time without the camera being submitted and the time verified as accurate.
These pictures should not be used and should not have been used as evidence. So basically, they said the time on a camera can be easily skewed or changed.
That's his defense team saying that. Here's his ex-wife's work boss here.
So Kit presented testimony from Joan's work supervisor, Lisa, who said that Joan was strangely excited and almost happy in the immediate aftermath

of the murders. The state, Joan's statement about the murders and other behavior disturbed this Lisa Petri to the point where she reported Joan to the police.
Oh, I think she was happy. Her husband was going to go to prison because he thought he was a dick.
Um, another thing here here, Kit presents evidence about a month after the murders

that Joan brought Pam's cell phone to an AT&T store

claiming she found it in the yard of her residence

in Elkton, Kentucky, which is 10 miles away.

When Harmon returned the phone to AT&T,

it had been reset to factory settings.

So because she tried to get a phone hooked up, that means that she killed her. And it was reset to factory settings, which you do that to get it going.
Yeah, anytime. Now, he also is trying to say that Joan carries a .45 Glock pistol.
Oh. Really? That's a big gun.
Yeah. Most ladies don't carry a .45.
That's a carry a .45 Most petite blonde ladies don't carry a .45 Just because of the kick on that thing Listen, you got a lot of trauma in your past and you don't want that shit happening again. That's a big gun to carry though.
Even then you might not be able to control it if you weigh a buck twenty. That's a big gun.
So and also they say that her boyfriend was, quote, in the area on the day of the murders of Kentucky. So, you know, Kit further attempts to cast out on the integrity of the investigation because Joan was romantically involved with William Stokes, who was related to Ed Stokes, who was a sheriff's deputy.
Related. Not his brother.
So because she fucked a cop's cousin, that means that the whole police force is going to frame a man. Going to frame a major in the Army because she fucked a cop's cousin.
She must have fucked him good. Next time I have any police interaction, I'm scream that i've been framed i'm framed framed hey it works for tons of people at least in the public eye frame yeah but you have no idea how much that does in the public eye though yeah if you say you're framed there's so many people that will that just believe that yeah yeah that that's

because people have been framed but they think that everybody's framed then so it's crazy and especially if you're in whatever group that they like that's also going to be part of it so said that to that cop in texas damn it i've been framed i was i had the cruise control on 77 i swear Cadillac framed me.

Framed me.

Yes.

That's fucking funny.

So now the wounds, the prosecution's theory of, they said the wounds on Cal were made with military-like precision. Oh.
And the words are very carefully chosen. In Pam's case, they said a shot to the brain or the heart would have been enough to kill her instantly.
The fact that there were multiple shots indicates that it wasn't the defense is saying it wasn't quite as precise of a shooting as the prosecution claimed. In the case of Ed Danzerow, investigators found two different areas outside separated by some 60 yards that contained his blood.
He wasn't killed instantly since both Pam and Ed's bodies had been mostly consumed in the fire, there's no way to know how many shots might have been into their bodies. What the prosecution claimed was military-like precision was more likely a chaotic stream of gunfire.
The gunshots to the brain and heart were probably fired after both had become incapacitated by shots elsewhere in their bodies. Ed had multiple bullet fragments in his skull.
So they said Pam's official cause of death was multiple shots to the torso, and Ed's cause of death was multiple gunshots to the head. They said besides the bullet fragments, an examination of Ed Dancero's remains revealed the presence of a metal plate attached to a leg bone.
His girlfriend Sally Jackson confirmed he had a metal plate in his leg, the result of a skiing accident. Now, Kit testifies.
Really? He has to. His whole case is a huge conspiracy against me.
I've been framed. Yeah.
I've been framed. So if you're going to say that, you've got to go up there and be hella believable.

Let's just say that.

So they said, Chris, did you murder these three people?

He said, no.

No, sir, I did not.

Oh, really?

No contraction.

But he's also a military guy,

and they don't like contractions quite as much.

It's not official enough for them.

They continued questioning.

They said, did you have someone else murder

these three people? He said, no.

They said, are you

behind this whole

thing? And he said,

no. I think the evidence

and the expert testimony has shown that.

He said that the prosecution

in the case believes he did it, stating

that he's been in jail for, quote, 768 days and five and a half hours. And the hours.
And the hours, just to show how, you know, on top of everything he is. They then asked him about his military dog tags and the dog tag that had been collected as evidence from the Phillips home.
There was one of his dog tags was found in the home over there. That's not great.
He denied that the dog tag on a string collected from the Phillips home was his, even though it had all his info, explaining all his dog tags had always been on breakaway chains, came in pairs, and had rubber boots, meaning the case around it, a little like the license plate holder, which he said were pieces of rubber that covered the edges to prevent them from glaring or making constant fucking jingling noises. He specifically stated he would never have placed his dog tags on a string and that they'd always been kept on a metal breakaway chain.
He said no soldier would do that, especially a white string, but they wouldn't put it on a string at all. Yeah, but you're not in combat.
You're in Pembroke, Kentucky. I get if you're in the field, you wouldn't do that.
You work for American Airlines. Yeah, you're not.
There's no counterinsurgency here. This is what you're talking about.
He added that also anyone can get a dog tag made anywhere or ordered online. So, I mean, anybody can do that.
He said that also, they said, why was your alarm set for 1.15 a.m.? Why? Okay. He said, well, you see, what happened was.
What happened was. I like to jog.
No, no, no. I had a new kerosene heater that I recently bought to warm my house.
So, the heater was new. So, he wanted to make sure it was running correctly and safely.
So basically he said, he didn't know if he had to refuel it in the middle of the night or anything, didn't know about it. So he set his alarm for one 15 so he could check on the kerosene heater and then go back to sleep.
One 15. He said, I think that was the first night I was running the new heater, so I was a little concerned about it, obviously.
So I would usually set my alarm for November through March and during the night to go check on it at least once to refill it and make sure everything was going all right. That's convenient.
In the middle of the night. Yep, he said he checked.
After he checked the new heater that night, he went back to sleep. He said that also he'd been on the Phillips property several times to target shoot his guns with Cal Phillips, which is true.
We know that. He also confirmed during his testimony that his ex-wife, who the defense has suggested may have committed the murders instead of him, had also fired his guns behind the Phillips home.
He recalled Cal Phillips asking him to help run a concealed carry permit class, but that he didn't have the time or money to do it. But he encouraged his wife to take part in it.
He said, I encouraged Joan to do it. And I think Joan, Ed, and some other people did it.
And I think they actually did it in his backyard. You would know if there was a firing range going say, the amount of rounds that these people absorbed, how would nobody fucking

hear all that?

You know, it seems like a lot.

Yeah.

He also said the night that they separated him and Joan, he said the two of them got

in an argument and that she had been yelling loud enough for the neighbors to hear.

He said she started yelling at me some more and finally I got to the point where I was like, look, I talked to you about this before. I'm done.
I want a divorce. And he said she acted, quote, she acted violently and told me straight up, the first thing that came out was, if you divorce me, I'll ruin your career.
I know how to do it. So he continued to testify that that night, deputies were called to the home by both of them, both he and Joan, to intervene in the dispute.
Following the dispute, he said that Harmon issued an emergency protective order against him. The judge later ruled in favor of Kit, he said, after Harmon failed to meet the burden of proof of the threat of domestic violence.
during his testimony. Martin also confirmed that during the court-martial that Joan and Cal had been, began against him.
You know, they're against him, basically. But that he and his defense counsel subpoenaed Cal as he was a key witness, and he said he, at this point, intended to call Cal as a witness for him.
Yeah. He said my private investigators had interviewed Calvin and we have his audio that was actually played on Channel 4 Nashville.
And he denied all that. He was key for me to disprove the lead prosecutor in the court martial there.
So he said that's why at that point he was, for me, he was my most important witness.

Yeah.

Nobody's more upset about this than me.

Oh, I'm so upset.

Kit also testified he'd never owned the type of ammunition that was found to have killed Calvin, the G2 Research RIP .45 caliber. when they mentioned that the prosecution's firearms expert testified that the .22 caliber bullets could have been fired by any of Kit's weapons, Kit replied that his guns didn't fit them.
That's what he said. Well, my gun, those don't fit my gun.
They asked Kit if he disagreed with the ballistics expert, and Kit said he remembered hearing the experts say that they didn't match and that the truth was that the conclusions about the bullets were that none of Kitts' guns could be excluded,

meaning they could be his guns.

They shared similar rifling characteristics as test bullets fired from his guns, but that the expert could not match the guns.

He continued to testify that on the night of November 19th, after he and his lawyer and private investigator learned of the murders, the two advised him to move the Glock that he usually kept in his truck into his safe out of fear that Joan might do something. He keeps a gun in the truck? In the truck.
Are you out of your fucking mind? Even if he's not in the truck, doesn't even take it in the house. Wow.
Finally, he testified that on the night of November 18th, he spent the day after coming home from work at Fort Campbell, celebrating his and Laura Spencer's anniversary by watching TV, eating dinner, and spending time together at home. Well, you could have done all that and got up at 1.15.
That's the point. That's the whole fucking point.
Now, during cross-examination here, I bet they couldn't wait to get their fucking claws into him. They asked him when he learned the court-martial against him came as a result of what Harmon and Cal Phillips turned into the laptop.
He said, I didn't find that out until much later. I was just

informed that there was a laptop. I had background information showing that it actually hadn't been

an army laptop since 2007 and belonged to a unit in Maryland, which I had never been to,

but I tried to provide that. They asked him if it didn't, if that didn't stop the court-martial.

It continued. So he said, they said, so you knew that Joan Harmon, with the help of Cal Phillips, not only turned over the laptop that was found in belongings that had been in your house, turned it into the FBI, but also the Cal had provided a photograph of Joan Harmon's son showing bruises and so forth.
He replied, stating he didn't know any of that information for several years, but added that he knew Joan was obviously behind it. Obviously.
They said, you at some point said that you hired private investigators who specifically went to interview Cal Phillips. And he said later on, yeah, they said, so, you know, they're asking him to, he was saying that Cal was going to testify for him again.

They said, so it wasn't that you thought he would be favorable to you.

Because they said Martin originally stated he needed Cal to discredit Harmon and Garrett, but later confirmed that discrediting Cal was only a small part of his importance as a witness.

So they said, so it wasn't that you thought it would be favorable to you.

The effort was to discredit him.

And he said, that's what the attorneys put down there, but we also had the private investigator interview. So now he's saying two different things.
They wanted him to testify so they could discredit him to get rid of all the evidence, but he's saying, no, no, he's going to testify for me. Sounds like he takes something that very small and makes it into something that would be helpful for him and that he would like it to be.
They said, you heard the pathologist testify that both Ed Densarow and Pam Phillips were murdered with .22 caliber bullets, any of which could have been fired in any one of either of the .22 caliber pistols you owned or the .22 caliber Smith & Wesson rifle. And he said, not my rifles or pistols, And that's what the experts say.
And the prosecutor said, actually, the 22 bullets could have been fired from either of those guns. And he said they weren't.
Okay, but you just said he, see what I mean? They said it might have been in it. We can't confirm it.
So he said, that means they wasn't done Done. Not mine.
Like, he just extrapolates something that's better for him.

So in closings, his lawyers continue to say Cal was on his side.

Joan was the one who did this.

And the prosecutors are like, Jesus fucking Christ.

How much circumstantial evidence do you need?

This is a lot, man.

So the verdict comes in.

He is found guilty of everything. yes across the board sentencing comes around oh boy you sir may fuck off three life sentences without the possibility of parole it's over a life sentence for arson oh 20 years for attempted arson, 20 years for each count of burglary, five years each for each count of tampering with physical evidence for a total sentence of life without parole.
Yeah. Why don't they give him fucking littering for where he parked that car? That's what I mean.
Anything else. Jesus Christ.
Yeah. I think his emissions tag was out of date, I think, on that.

Pretty sure.

Yeah.

Pretty sure they did that.

So the reactions are here.

The prosecution claims that Ed Dancero and Pam Phillips were just collateral damage.

Yeah.

They weren't the reason he was there.

No.

The families in the Pembroke County community have endured a profound loss.

While this verdict in no way eases that pain, I hope they in some way find some peace and comfort today. So there's juror number five, by the way, that this book talks to.
Juror number five is a very similar guy to Kit. Career military guy.
Same thing. They both did helicopter flight training at Fort Rucker, Alabamaama yeah um but juror number five was in nam that's the only difference he was in vietnam he's an older guy where he flew a cobra combat helicopter oh oh my god uh yeah so he was 74 and uh they talked to him about all this and in the book they're trying're trying to, like, convince him that he was wrong.

They said, when confronted with the testimony that there was no evidence that the barrel had been altered on the gun, meaning he claimed it could have been switched out after the murders, something not discussed at trial. He also agreed with the prosecution that the manufacturer of the bullet could have used different shell casing during the assembly process, which the prosecution explained could be why the metals in the shell casing didn't match the metal combination normally used for the RIP rounds.
As for the .22 caliber evidence not conclusively matching any of the defendant's weapons, he said that that didn't matter to him because they could have just as easily matched him. So they said the dog tag evidence was of concern for him.
he said he told his fellow jurors how it was Sure. Sure.
He followed that up by telling his fellow jurors that he was aware from people serving in Iraq and Afghanistan that soldiers would sometimes wear their dog tags on something other than a chain due to the desert heat.

Okay.

It's hot metal.

A string is actually and it's just uncomfortable. he had no explanation of how the dog tag ended up on a bookshelf next to the next to the victim's

phone and wallet commentating or commenting that the fact it wasn't found until much later

indicated to him it was unlikely to have been planted evidence. Some of the other evidence, they said the DNA testing came back for Ed Dancero, blah, blah, blah.
He keeps going. He said, I'm glad they got it straightened out, is what he said.
He said the security camera footage didn't cover the front of the house. When asked about the front door, he agreed with the defense that the front door was unusable, but claimed the defendant could have gone out through a window.
Leaving the house by an open window wasn't something that was ever discussed at trial, but worth considering. So basically, he's just saying that they're trying to go over him.
He goes, no, I thought he was guilty and blah, blah, blah. Once deliberations began, the first task was to choose a foreperson.

They got some other guy.

The next job was to do a poll.

And they said after the first poll, several people voted guilty.

A few were undecided.

And at least one voted not guilty.

That's what he said.

He implied that his explanation about why the dog tag might have been on a string, he thinks helped sway a few votes. Okay.
They were like, he would have never kept it on a string. He's a military guy, so we can believe him.
So he said he's only had it on a chain. And he was like, nope, you'll separate him and do that.
So he said after that process and further discussion, another poll would be taken. The number of jurors willing to vote guilty increased.
And he said from there, just a couple more votes and then snowballs from there. Now, once he's in prison, he directs his family.
He calls his family on the phone and directs them to find a box hidden beneath the stairs of his previous home in North Carolina. Oh, Jesus, this is scary.
That contained weapons the deputies believed were used to kill the victims. He made phone calls from prison.
He asked his sisters to retrieve this box under the stairs of the rally house. And he and I guess he and Laura Spencer had broken up,

and the house was for sale.

They said, quote, he was definitely urgent that she find it.

They know this because they're recording his phone calls.

He's in prison.

So Smith said that when, this is one of the cops, when he and a fellow deputy arrived at the house in Raleigh

to find out what was in the box, they were able to gain entrance,

but the box was missing from the hidden location.

Already gone.

He's going to be a good one. is one of the cops, when he and a fellow deputy arrived at the house in Raleigh to find out what was in the box, they were able to gain entrance, but the box was missing from the hidden location.
Already gone. It was already gone.
He said, I can't imagine what you felt when, this is a question an interviewer asked him, when you opened it up. You'd come all this way and it was gone.
What did you think? And he said, I thought it was time to get to work. So according to this investigative report he compiled the follow the following trip uh following the trip to rally he began raleigh he began to try and track down martin's family speaking with his sister juliet and her husband keith at first they denied having any knowledge of it but an hour later the investigative report shows that they got back in touch with smith and told him the.
Oh, we've been thinking about it. And a recorded call between the Andes and this investigator, he admits he removed the box from within the stairs, saw the 22 AR-15 and a long box inside.
Oh, my God. He said this, the husband said, I don't even remember.
The gun freaked me out. I just put the shit back.

And the sister said, we did not ask for any of this.

We don't want to be involved in any of this.

He made us do it.

This sucks.

No.

While he said he didn't know what was in the long box, the deputies would later learn it was a silencer.

They believe that both the AR and the silencer were used in the murders. Really? Wow.
Deputies then said, well, if he put the box back under the stairs, why was it gone? And according to this, they said it had been picked up by Emma Spencer, the daughter of his ex-fiance. He got his ex-fiance, Laura's daughter, to do it.
So they said, how do you address the elephant in the room with these people that they are now passing off weapons from a man convicted of triple murder? The cop said, until I had retrieved the items, I had to play in between everybody's emotions. He said, once he got all of this, he said he first contacted Emma Spencer, who testified on Kit's behalf during the trial, but she wasn't cooperative.
He said at first she's acting like she doesn't know anything about it. She's very standoffish.
I told her, I don't want to get in any trouble. I don't want you to get in any trouble being in possession of something that's regulated by the ATF.
And she said, I'm at work. I have to go right now and all that kind of thing.
Then at one point she said, okay, I moved it. My neighbor has it.
And they tracked it down to a neighbor who confirmed he was given the 22 caliber AR-15, but that Spencer still had the silencer. She kept that herself.
Interesting here. Those are quiet enough.
If somebody puts a silencer on that, dude, you can snuff out an entire family with those things and not hear not hear pete that's crazy they then asked if emma could turn could instead turn the silencer over to him and um she showed up and the cop said he wasn't pleased she said he said in a nice way to put it she said here it. Now get out of North Carolina and never come back.
She was rude to them, but they got the silencer. Um, and he said, well, I just said, thank you for bringing this to me.
This kept you out of a lot of trouble. Yeah.
You can't have that, ma'am. I can absolutely charge you as an accessory after the fact And also, you're in possession of a fucking suppressor

with no stamp. You are in

federal... That's a

crazy charge. You don't want that,

ma'am. No, you definitely don't.

So, they communicated

through this daughter

through text, and she wrote to the news,

if any information I give you is to

discredit me or Kit, you can kindly piss

off.

Ma'am, you were holding a silencer.

You're holding a silencer, and you're not British. You're a criminal.
Stop saying piss off. Put that shit in your pocket.
Jesus. So the appeal, he argues that they admitted hearsay statements.
They allowed his ex-wife and stepson to refuse to testify. Excluded certain alleged alternative perpetrator evidence, admitted

evidence of a bullet casing that was discovered by a lay witness and excluding evidence that the same witness failed a polygraph examination, denying his motion for a directed verdict on the arson and murder charges, allowing his convictions on two counts of first degree burglary to stand in violation of double jeopardy principles. so the arson charges, he's got a point because a deceased person cannot occupy a building.

Only a live person can occupy a building.

The court has specifically held a defendant cannot be convicted of first degree arson when the Commonwealth failed to produce sufficient evidence that the person inside the building was actually alive at the time of the fire and that the defendant was aware of that fact. Has to be both.
They have to be alive and the guy has to know he's alive. They're alive in there.
They said they point to the evidence of the bodies of Pam and Ed Denzerow who were badly charred. The Commonwealth refers to the evidence of a fire discovered near Cal's body.
Thus, the Commonwealth argues the evidence was inconclusive, So, life without, cocksucker. Keep it going.
So you're not a flamer. So you're not a flamer.
Yeah, so they have all of this shit here. Now, the book is called I Will Ruin You, The Twisted Truth Behind the Kit Martin Murder Trial.
And it's by Emilio Corsetti III. And here is just a quick little thing, a synopsis that they say here.
Guilty until proven innocent. The true story of Christian Kit Martin, the former Army major and airline pilot convicted of a triple homicide.
The true story of the former Army major and airline pilot charged in a triple murder and the web of lies that led to his problematic conviction. Are you kidding? Yep.
Swear to God. He said, why were so many observers convinced of his innocence? The evidence against Kit Martin consisted primarily of a dog tag with the defendant's name on it and a shell casing that was identified as having been fired from his gun.
Yeah, that's... What more do you want? His identification...
That's called evidence. That's called evidence is what that's called.
Identification and murder weapon tools were there. That was it.
They said both pieces of evidence were supplied to the police by family members of two of the victims months after the crime.

The defense suggested both pieces of evidence had been planted to frame the defendant.

The dog tag, for example, is not an official military dog tag.

It was discovered on a bookshelf next to the victim's phone and wallet, and it was on a string, which the one guy explained away pretty easily here.

They said, lastly, Kit Martin had alibi witnesses and security camera footage that proved he could not have committed any of the murders.

I think that's a good one. explained away pretty easily here.
They said, lastly, Kit Martin had alibi witnesses and security camera footage that proved he could not have committed any of the murders. That's not true, though, because they found work records and stuff showed that, no, he had plenty of time to do that.
Yeah. So anyway, that went on.
And then Kit, because this causes this giant, like, weird fervor here. By the way, Kip right now is DOC number 318956, serving life without parole at the Little Sandy Correctional Complex.
And then he wrote an article in 2016, by the way. This is before the murder conviction, before he was even charged with it, while he was at the Fort Leavenworth for 90 days.
Oh, yeah. Remember for the other shit for the kitty stuff? It's called NCFM hero Christian Kit.
Quote, the real expendables, falsely accused military men. Oh.
He then has a picture of Joan here. And it says, felon, check.
Abuser, check. Fraudster, check.
Liar, check. Murderer, maybe.
Yeah, well, she's hot. Jesus.
She's pretty late. So they said, he goes, I'm not going to read this whole thing because it is propaganda.
Honestly, it's like fucking there's a certain area of the Internet right now where this is the hot propaganda. I ain't going to give this shit a fucking breath of air because it's bullshit.
He basically says, yes, let me look through this. Yes, court marshals, they said, are up 550% since 2007, he says.
Convictions are similarly growing exponentially. Army prisoners are up from 119 in 2010 to 593 in 2014.
That's because they made a concerted effort to fucking prosecute criminals. The whole point was there was decades and decades and decades of fucking documented shit that said the army doesn't do shit when people get do things to other soldiers.
Constant rapes don't get prosecuted. Assaults don't get prosecuted.
So they said, let's start prosecuting those things. Sure.
It wasn't that they just were making those up. They just were actually prosecuting crimes.
They said this is due to the primarily, this is due primarily to false sexual assault epidemic. He says false.
This is politically motivated narrative, almost identical to what's happening in our universities. You know who this asshole is now.
He's trying to use political things for his own advantage for his own scummy crimes, and it's fucking pathetic. Hiding behind that fucking uniform.
What a twat. U.S.
veteran men are now the new political prisoners of the world. The real expenditures are expendables.
Wow. This is fucking wild.
after years of working to earn rank and respect these combat veterans are now being treated like children and guarded by children too most guards are teenage private straight out of high school and basic training yeah because it's a shit job nobody wants to care who else i don't care who has the job when i was a teenage private i would have been too humbled to even speak to a real veteran such as my current brothers and i are then brothers i am confined with now i was in awe of real soldiers that had actually fought in war men who were paratroopers blah blah blah blah blah he wants the fucking guards in there to be in awe of him right well yeah they probably they would be if you weren't a fucking piece of shit they would be in in awe of you. If you weren't a murderer and convicted of a simple assault on a child.
That's like, imagine that. I respect a lot of people, but if I was guarding them because they killed three fucking people, I don't respect you anymore.
Fuck you. I respect you less because I'm trying to become this and you have now denigrated the fucking image of this.
You sullied my uniform, you cocksucker. Yeah, no one should dislike this guy more than military people.
He is disgracing their fucking uniform, not other people. Anyway, so it's fucking wild.
Anyway, they say that he goes on to really go off on the sexual assault thing.

Like, it's fucking wild, some of the shit he said.

These poor soldiers, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

The machine spares know this.

When you have an epidemic, you must show your solutions working.

When you're spending $257 million a year to convict veterans and and building 95 million dollar prison you have to have a lot of hammers you must find nails to justify those hammers i bet you don't mind when they build fucking prisons and put fucking civilian criminals in them though you're happy about it probably because that's where most of you go to fucking work after you're done but also not most of you but a lot of you cops and prison guards and shit he's acting like a soldier and a veteran doesn't commit crime sometimes and if they do the respect of what they done should wipe it all out they should get a nice prison so where people are in awe of them he goes through all this and says maybe that's why 22 vets a day take their own lives oh don't pull that you fucking piece of shit god fucking. Oh, you piece of shit.
Fuck you. Okay, I'm done with this asshole.
There you go, everybody. Pembroke, Kentucky.
So I wasn't. I was 98% positive he did it.
Then I read that. Now I'm 3,000% positive he did it.
Go fuck yourself right in your ass, Kit. He's a bad man.

Your dog tags, your medals, and your Apache helicopter right up your fucking asshole.

He really wants accommodations for nothing.

For nothing.

Wow.

Just for doing his job, which, yes, thank you for your service.

No thank you for everything else you've done in life. Fuck you.

Every day he needs a blowjob for what he's done.

Even by prison guards. Yeah, yeah.
So anyway, there you go. That's that.
Check that out. Definitely rate and review on any of the podcast apps you're listening on.
Please shut up and give me murder.com. Tickets for live shows are right there.
Pittsburgh, February 7th. You're up first.
Columbus, you're sold out, babe. Love you.
Thank you, Columbus. I think we probably have comps.
There might be 10 more tickets we'll release, but that's it. Pittsburgh, you're up next.
A lot of the others are selling out, too, so get your tickets right goddamn now. Even if you want to go in December, November, get your tickets now.
Do that. Shutupandgivememurder.com.
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Crime and sports. Travis Rudolph, an NFL player who just finished up a murder trial.
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Now, Jimmy, hit me with the names of the people who would never, ever, ever, ever try to use whatever uniform they were wearing to justify horrible crimes. Hit me with them right fucking now.
This week's executive producers are Andrew Newman. Yep.
Mark and Chrissy Such. Hey, happy birthday.
No, happy anniversary. It's a 32nd.
Happy birthday. 32nd.
Jesus. Happy birthday.
That's so many. I could never.
Matthew Reed. Thank you, bud.
That was very nice. Happy Hour got a mortgage in Texas.
Hey! That's too bad. I'm sorry about it.
I hope you get home to, I guess, a better place. That's a lateral move.
At least you're home. At best.
But home is always a positive move. Joe Gleason won the Crime and Sports and Small Time Motor Fantasy League, James.
Good for you. Well, then.
Congrats to you. We should give him something.
They did. He won money.
No, no, no. From us, though.
I mean, we just did. We'll give him something.
We'll find something. I'm going to find something in the office to send him.
Joe, message somebody and we'll send you something. And also, Tracy Lisquia.
Likwia. Tracy, thank you.
You went above and beyond and that deserves something. Thank you, Tracy.
All of you, thank you so much for what you're doing. You amazing people other producers this week liz vasquez peyton meadows 12 year old lucas martell 12 year old what are you doing listening to this i don't know if that's great or bad for your future but either way we love you lucas god damn it god damn tell your parents maybe though they won't want this or don't tell your parents we'll be like your judas or something, you know what I mean? Did your parents buy you an iPhone and they don't even know you do this? He plays it quiet at night and shit.
On his fucking airbox. Flashlight under the fucking sheet tent.
Oh, Lucas. I don't know if you're a good kid or a bad kid.
I can't tell. I hope.
You're fucking great. Rock on, Lucas.
Don't break off. That's all.
Janice Hill, Andrew Bailey, Will with no last name, Brandon Camarato, Camarota, Sammy Wright, Jordan Kippen, Carmen McTurner, it's Russ, man, Chris Cope, nope, Chris Pope, Sarah with no last name. Amber Kramer.
Cranmer. Olivia Horniak.
Horniak. Is that right? That is.
Horniak. Grace.
One, two, three, four. Crystal Volts.
Elizabeth Van D. Velde.
Duanya. Duanya Kelly.
Ellen Medley. Michael Baird.
Zach Chipman. D.
M. D.
Like the person. D.
E.E, like Mr. Brown, but with the letter M.

Andrew Gilliam.

Andrew Gilliam?

Do we know Andrew Gilliam?

We know the good reverend.

We know the good reverend.

That's a different Gilliam.

It's a different Gilliam, isn't it?

Different Gilliam.

The good reverend Jonathan Gilliam.

That's it.

This is Andrew Gilliam.

Not a reverend at all.

Was there a gilliam uh armand gilliam armand gilliam the nba player that's a different totally totally different guy all right well gilliam thank you mike with no last name megan d'allaire uh steven baker beth kufel couple uh carla mc receiver. Stephen Baker, the touchdown maker.
That's the guy. That's the guy.
Yes, number 85 himself. Fuck yeah, Stephen Baker.
Carla McGee. Manders with no last name.
Mitchell Forrester. Justine Rogers.
Karen Lowe. Alex with no last name.
Bethan Williams. Beth Hurst.
Yeah. Matt Helmers.
Addie Barote. Barote, maybe.
At I. Vaughn Robinson.
Linda Hefner. Hugh's daughter, I imagine.
Jesus. Would Hugh have a daughter named Linda? Is he that old? Carrie Bargin.
Bargin. He died at like 114.
I think he was that old. Ryan McCarty.
Tony McKay. Bowtie Mouse.
Joseph Lehman. Bradley Myers, Erica Maxson, Allie Mack Attack, and Stroke Malone.

What the fuck?

Nicola Everson, Julianne Cabrera, Amy Hagerman, Kristen Camille, Connie Walters, Mary Kramer Wachter, Watchter, Laura Freeze.

Watchter do what? Watchter. I'll watch her.
I can't get sanitarium out of my head now. Watched her Kramer.
Watched her Kramer. Laura Freeze, Jonathan Bird, Elena with no last name, Julian Beck, Walter Bubba Brooks III, Ann Robinson, Tracy with no last name, Tony Maldonado, Maldonado, Natazia, Stacy with no last name, Barb Pressler, Shizuka

with no last name, Morgan Bowling, Lacey Lynn, Courtney, I said that, Monica Hammons,

Mads, what did she donate twice?

Courtney, damn it.

Courtney, so nice, she did it twice.

Unbelievable.

Mads Wilkins, Ellen, Elian with no last name, Tarla Baloo, what is it?

Gonzalez?

Yes, Elian Gonzalez. He's back.
The himself a rap. Melinda Johnson.
Camila Rodriguez. De Pinto.
De Pino. Carson with no last name.
Mike Sipko. Paige Burns.
Burris. All right.
Zach Kell with no last name. That is a last name, Kell.
Jesus. Colleen Connolly.
James Petrigala with no last name. Christine MacArthur with no last name.
Taylor Strouch. Karen Napoli.
James Gilstrap. Jesus, Gilstrap.
That's okay. Ansley Wimbish.
Ryan Critchett. Abby Hubble.
Madeline Kaczarski. Nick Legault.
Joseph Reynolds. Sweet Biggins, good for you, Alexandra Smith, Ian Boxell, Joseph Payne, Mike Forehand, Charles Hafter, Georgie Dunn, Elton, Elta, Abbott, Lauren Coulter, Christian F.
Lindsay with no last name, rather Not, Hannah Sonnenberg, Patricia Dishman, Charity with no last name, M&D, Chris with no last name, Sierra with no last name, Rob Bossman, Spencer Davis, Kira Lee, Michael King, Nick Kiefer, Louise Falzerano, Dave Clark, Hannah Souza, Amanda Enright, what? Is that right? Yes, it is right. All right.
Papa Tanku, Jason with no last name, Larry Barnhart, Virgil Casanova, Mike Manchak, Prophet Black, Angie Green, Zach Jackson, Sarah Vand, Hallie Vieira, Gina Rodriguez, Laura Wilkinson, Diane Schneider, Amy Mackey, Luis Martinez, Luis Martinez, Steve Fullard, David Scott Rine, Jute Boot, Mary Cass, Laurel Mitchell, Clay Billingsley, Amy L. Erica with no last name, Mike LaChase, Terry Trufant, Jessica Boucher, Boucher, Krista Isabel Reyes with would know a last name.
That is a last name. Jeffrey Gregg, Jana Matthews, Nathan L., and every one of our patrons.
Thank you all so much. Thank you, everybody, so much.
Appreciate all that you do for us. Honestly, we can't thank you enough for that.
Patreon is the lifeblood of the show. Thank you for what you do for us and we will keep that shit cranking for you.

Thank you, thank you, thank you. So do that.

Keep coming back. Tell your friends.

Keep hanging out with us. You want to follow us on

social media, shutupandgivmemurder.com.

You can find all that shit right there.

Until next week, everybody, it's been our pleasure.

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