Rebecca Braswell

Everyone's talking about weight loss meds, but these days, fewer people are talking about how hard they are to access.

That's because HERS is changing that with transparent pricing, expert care, and a personalized plan that's actually built and priced for where you are at.

If prescribed, you get medication as part of a doctor-developed weight loss program, complete with ongoing care, check-ins, dosage, and medication adjustments, and access to 24-7 online support at no additional cost, no hidden fees, and no membership fees.

fees.

Whether you want to lose weight, grow thicker, fuller hair, or find relief for anxiety, HERS has you covered.

Visit forhers.com/slash snapped to get a personalized, affordable plan that gets you.

That's F-O-R-H-E-R-S.com/slash snapped.

ForHERS.com/slash snapped.

Weight loss by HERS is not available everywhere.

Compounded products are not approved or reviewed for safety, effectiveness, or quality by the FDA.

Prescription required.

See website for full details, important safety information, and restrictions.

Actual price depends on product and plan purchased.

This episode is brought to you by Progressive Insurance.

You chose to hit play on this podcast today.

Smart choice.

Progressive loves to help people make smart choices.

That's why they offer a tool called Auto Quote Explorer that allows you to compare your progressive car insurance quote with rates from other companies.

So you save time on the research and can enjoy savings when you choose the best rate for you.

Give it a try after this episode at progressive.com.

Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and Affiliates.

Not available in all states or situations.

Prices vary based on how you buy.

They were a young couple just starting out in the Navy.

They had an affinity for each other.

It was charming to see.

But the couple's lives are torn apart by a hailstorm of gunfire.

They heard the shots,

the sound of burning rubber.

When I did step out of the door, I stepped into a puddle of blood.

As local and naval investigators team up to find a killer, dark secrets are exposed.

She had a black eye, busted lips.

Looked like she had been in a fight.

In a quest to uncover the truth, detectives question if this was an act of self-defense.

She says that Kia has an extremely dark side or a cold-blooded crime orchestrated by the ultimate puppet master.

They're following him around.

They're planting bombs in his car.

This is one of the most diabolically evil persons that I prosecuted.

This is a schemer beyond imagination.

December 1st, 2006, Camarillo, California.

Just before 6 a.m., the 1200 block of Mission Verde Drive is startled awake by an alarming sound.

Several 911 calls came into the sheriff's office and the highway patrol from people reporting a shooting in the area.

The sound of shots fired.

One of the calls is from a woman named Cheryl O'Neill.

She informs Camarillo police that her her roommate has just been shot in front of their condo.

Camarillo patrol units arrive at the scene.

The deputy met the victim's roommate in the street and she said he's laying over there.

The deputy finds a young man sprawled on the stoop in a pool of blood.

They check for life signs.

There are none.

The fire department gets there.

They also check for life size, and there are none.

He is very obviously deceased, and everybody backs away.

Once they determine they're not dealing with an active shooter situation, deputies secure the scene.

Before turning to the 911 caller, Cheryl O'Neill.

Cheryl identifies the victim as her roommate, 27-year-old John Marmo.

They were hoping that she might have some information for them as to who could have done this to him.

Cheryl tells the officers that she was upstairs in her room asleep before she heard the shooting.

John and I usually woke up about the same time.

December 1st, things were just a little out of alignment.

He got up a little earlier.

I was lagging behind a little bit.

He gets up in the morning, like he normally does.

He then goes down the stairs.

And she woke up at the sound of two gunshots, possibly three.

I knew immediately it was gunshot.

I pick up the phone, dial 911.

As I'm running down my interior stairs, I stepped out of the front door into a puddle of blood, literally both feet soaked in blood.

He was laying profusely bleeding out on the pavement.

I'd never seen anybody shot before.

Seeing John laying on the ground with the blood the shock of it all

I will never get over

it's a tragic end to a promising young life that began 27 years ago

born in 1978 John Marmo Jr.

grew up in West Palm Beach Florida

He was doted on by his loving parents and three sisters.

John was a marvelous young man, very friendly, very open,

liked people.

John played the guitar a lot.

He was very, very courteous, very helpful.

He was just a very caring young man.

When he graduated high school in 1997, John decided to serve his country by enlisting in the Navy.

John was stationed in Sigonella, Italy, which is in Sicily, and he had an easy transition there.

He melted into the community.

People just found him to be entertaining and just appreciated his existence.

While serving overseas, John became close with a fellow Navy sailor two years his junior named Rebecca Braswell.

They immediately connected, and then eventually their friendship blossomed and they became lovers.

Rebecca had grown up in Arizona.

Her laid-back but self-assured demeanor captivated John's attention from the moment they met.

She was just very confident and comfortable.

John treated her the way she felt she should be treated, like a princess.

The Navy does have strict rules about who might become involved with each other, so this was something that they wanted to keep private.

Although after about a year of secretly dating, evidence of John and Rebecca's romance proved impossible to hide from their naval superiors.

Rebecca found out that she was pregnant, and this changed everything.

At that point, they could no longer keep the relationship secret.

The Navy has some rules.

They frown upon single women who are pregnant and John immediately stepped up to do the right thing.

On December 1st, 2001, John and Rebecca officially tied the knot in a small ceremony.

John knew this was the right thing to do, and it really seems like it wasn't that hard of a choice.

They were in love and this was really an exciting time in their lives.

Three months later, the young couple welcomed a baby daughter they named Heather Ray.

But John and Rebecca received some unexpected news the following year when Rebecca was restationed to Port Waimene, California, with the United States Naval Construction Battalions, better known as the Seabees.

There was about 600 males and 26 females for one battalion, and there's at least four battalions.

These guys are dedicated, they're determined, they're smart.

Not wanting to split up his young family, John made the tough decision to end his naval career.

John loved being a father.

He left the Navy so that he could raise Heather.

John served his time and was honorably discharged.

While John stayed home with the baby, Rebecca continued her work in the Seabees.

But after three years of marriage, Rebecca and John started to struggle as a couple.

Parenthood and managing their careers just really wasn't working out for John and Rebecca.

Being married in the military is hard, I've done it.

And we have, I think, one of the highest divorce rates.

John and Rebecca filed for divorce in July 2004, and a judge awarded them joint custody.

Rebecca continued to live on base with their daughter while John rented a room nearby.

He had a new roommate, a safe place to live.

He had his daughter joint custody.

John was a nurturing father.

He wanted to raise his child.

That was very important to him to be able to be that kind of a father.

But now, just six months after John moved into his new apartment, he's dead.

And it's up to homicide detectives to determine who could have killed this beloved father and veteran in cold blood.

It was very scary because that's a very safe neighborhood, and nothing like that had happened before.

And so it put everybody on edge.

This kind of a thing wasn't happening in Camarillo at all.

Coming up.

Witnesses point to a possible shooter.

He heard the shots, the sound of burning rubber, and a male voice going low in an excited manner.

And in their search for a motive, investigators learn of some possible skeletons in their victim's closet.

She says that John has an extremely dark side.

In Camarillo, California, 27-year-old John Marmo has just been found shot to death in a pool of blood on his doorstep.

Investigators question whether John had been intentionally targeted by his killers.

I've got an open mind about everything, and I don't draw any conclusions from the first moment I get there.

Detectives notice a blood trail on the driveway,

leading from the driver's side of John's car up to the front steps where his body lay.

The evidence allows detectives to envision a a possible scenario for the shooting.

His keys are lying on the ground next to his car.

So he's clearly, he's trying to get into his car when he's attacked.

And he's trying to walk the 50 feet back to his house or get back into his house.

And he collapses halfway.

We found three spent bullets, one on the driveway, one inside of Marmo's car.

and one on the sidewalk near his body.

The size of the bullet was a nine millimeter.

When the coroner arrives on the scene, he makes a preliminary assessment that only one of the bullets actually hit John.

It severed the subclavian artery in his shoulder

and he bled out from that.

That was the bullet that is recovered on the sidewalk next to him.

A thorough examination of the scene gives investigators a good idea of where the shooter was positioned.

The crime lab was able to match the trajectory of all these rounds that were fired and trace it back to this driveway immediately next door to the victim sparked car.

A higher impression was on the cement driveway with excess rubber, like someone had burned rubber out of the driveway.

Knowing that John's killer fled the scene in a car, police canvassed the area for potential witnesses.

We found a witness who said he heard the shots, the sound of burning rubber, like someone was rapidly accelerating away, and someone, a male voice going, whoa,

kind of

in an excited manner.

Based on all the evidence, it's clear to detectives that whoever killed John had been waiting for him when he exited his home.

Someone was parking in the next-door neighbor's yard.

They're sitting up for an ambush.

They were stalking him.

They were lying in wait.

Hoping to get a better idea of who might have wished John harm, investigators turn back to his roommate, Cheryl O'Neill.

Cheryl reveals that she's the homeowner and that John had been leasing a room from her for the past six months.

There was an ease to him that made me feel comfortable both with him and him with me.

So it was almost like a surrogate child I had living with me.

Cheryl tells investigators that John has an ex-wife, Rebecca Braswell, and together they have a young child.

Detectives learn that 26-year-old Rebecca Braswell is in the CB's Naval Construction Battalion and is stationed at Port Waimeni Base.

Ventura police contact NCIS and meet at the naval base to notify Rebecca of John's death.

When police brought Rebecca in, she wasn't emotional.

Rebecca didn't seem all that broke up about it at all.

Investigators asked Rebecca where she was earlier that morning when John was shot.

Her alibi was she was home with her child.

I know nothing.

I am not involved in any of this.

Don't know what happened.

She actually paints a new picture of John for police, and she starts to explain perhaps why she was emotionless when they told her that he was dead.

Rebecca explains that she filed for divorce from John in 2004, not because they'd drifted apart, but because their three-year marriage had been rife with physical and emotional abuse.

She says that John has an extremely dark side and he was abusive, that he likely cheated on her.

It's a startling allegation that runs counter to the kind image that John's friends and family had painted of the 27-year-old father.

But Rebecca insists that she's had to file a restraining order against John to protect both herself and their young daughter.

It came to light that there were serious child custody issues going on between he and his former wife.

She did not want John having any contact with Heather at all.

Rebecca hid her daughter with her family members so that they wouldn't do a custody exchange.

She was deliberately keeping her daughter from John.

She says that she's filed reports against him and that she has witnesses.

I remember asking Rebecca, what happened to you?

And she said she got beat up by John.

I don't remember specifically what was said during that whole thing.

I remember her saying she'd been beat up by him.

Rebecca tells police that if they want a second witness account of John's abuse, they should talk to her friend and fellow CB, Shannon Butler.

Shannon allegedly experienced John's rage firsthand.

Shannon turns up for muster and she's got black eye, scrapes, bumps, bruises.

She said John beat her up, jumped her from behind, and just attacked her.

Shannon had a black eye, busted lips, stuff like that.

Looked like she'd been in a fight.

And then Shannon started talking more about getting beat up by John.

Investigators meet with Shannon Butler the next day.

She backs up Rebecca's claims that John had been abusive.

Shannon also tells investigators that even though she and Rebecca were just friends, John had been suspicious of their relationship and blamed Shannon for their divorce.

And then when she divorced him, he blamed me for them getting divorced because he thinks it weren't a lesbian relationship or whatever.

Shannon claims that both before and after their divorce, John threatened her with violence if she didn't stay away from Rebecca.

Shannon was saying that John kept beating up her.

She would be underneath her truck, working on her truck, and be pulled out from underneath the truck and beat up.

Did you make a police report?

Yes, I did.

Who did you make the police report with?

The Oxford Police Department.

I filed a couple of police reports.

He'd be following me and stuff.

She implied that he was stalking her.

Shannon was saying that she was chased down Pleasant Valley Road, which is out here in the county area, by John.

To investigators, the accusations against John levied by Rebecca and Shannon are as disturbing as they are unexpected and raise the question, could John's alleged abusive personality have somehow gotten him killed?

Following up on this theory, investigators dig deeper into John's background, looking for any possible connection between John and the types of unsavory characters usually associated with violent crime.

They go through their database with John's name, and what comes back, it opens a whole new

world for them.

Coming up, investigators uncover details of an intricate murder plot.

I heard something hissing from underneath my car.

And the web of conspiracy is much larger than police had ever imagined.

She said, I didn't kill anybody, but I have a story to tell you.

You know, over the years, I've had my fair share of financial stress, overdraft fees out of nowhere, forgetting a payment and getting hit with penalties, or just wishing I had a better way to stretch my money between paychecks.

That's why I love what QIIME is doing.

As a fee-free banking app, Chime understands that every dollar counts.

When you set up direct deposit through QIIME, you unlock fee-free features like free overdraft coverage, getting paid up to two days early with direct deposit, and so much more.

QIIME is banking done right.

You can open a checking account with no monthly fees and no maintenance fees.

And when you set up direct deposit, you can actually get paid up to two days early.

Imagine that.

Plus, with qualifying direct deposits, QIIME has your back with free overdraft, up to $200 on debit card purchases and cash withdrawals.

No more sweating, that surprise coffee charge.

In fact, QIIIME has already spotted members over $30 billion to date.

And when it comes to access, you're covered with over 47,000 fee-free ATMs nationwide.

That's more than the top three national banks combined.

I use Chime, and you should too.

Getting paid early has actually made budgeting easier for me.

It gives me a head start on rent, groceries, subscriptions, everything.

And I love getting those real-time alerts when I spend.

It keeps me way more aware of my daily habits.

And the thing I love most, QIIME's customer support agents are available 24-7.

It's been super helpful to get the support I need when it works best for me, not trying to cram in extra calls during the workday.

Work on your financial goals through Chime today.

Open an account in two minutes at chime.com/slash snapped.

That's chime.com/slash snapped.

Chime feels like progress.

Chime is a financial technology company, not a bank.

Banking services and debit card provided by the Bank Corporation Bank NA or Stride Bank NA.

Members FDIC.

Slot me eligibility requirements and overdraft limits apply.

Timing depends on submission of payment file.

Fees apply at out-of-network ATMs, bank ranking, and number of ATMs, according to US News and World Report 2023.

Chime checking account required.

This show is sponsored by Liquid IV.

All right, so let's talk about the seasonal shift.

Summer's full of fun, late nights, and honestly, being a little too relaxed.

Then suddenly, bam, it's fall.

You're juggling a new work schedule, trying to get back into a routine, maybe even heading back to campus.

And if you're anything like me, that shift hits hard.

One thing that's seriously helped me stay focused and energized without feeling totally drained, Liquid IV's new energy multiplier, sugar-free hydrating energy.

I'm loving this stuff.

It gives me a clean energy boost without the crash or that weird jittery feeling you get from energy drinks.

I keep a few packets in my bag ready to go.

Whether I'm running between meetings, hitting the gym, or just need an afternoon pick-me-up, it's super easy.

Tear, pour into six ounces of water, shake it up, and boom, hydration and energy simplified.

Personally, I'm obsessed with the lemon lime and Yuzu pineapple flavors.

They taste so fresh and light.

Liquid IV isn't just about energy.

Just one stick hydrates better than water alone, and it's powered by LIV Hydroscience, which means you're getting an optimized ratio of electrolytes, eight essential vitamins, and clinically tested nutrients.

Plus, it's non-GMO, vegan, gluten-free, dairy-free, and soy-free.

Whether you're powering through work, recharging after a workout, or trying to avoid that afternoon crash, Liquid IV has your back.

Get focused.

Ditch the glitch with zero sugar and zero crash from Liquid IV.

Tear, pour, live more.

Go to liquidiv.com and get 20% off your first order with code SNAPT at checkout.

That's 20% off your first order with code snapped at liquidiv.com.

Ventura County detectives and NCIS are trying to determine who killed ex-Navyman John Marmo.

Interviews with John's ex-wife Rebecca Braswell, as well as her close friend Shannon Butler, have painted a disturbing portrait of the victim.

John Marmo was supposedly abusing both of them.

Wanting to learn more about John Marmo, investigators dig deep into his background and discover a disturbing police report that John had filed not long before his death.

Police learned that just two months prior in October, John found a bomb attached to his car.

John went to have his car serviced for a smog check, and the person doing the smog check found, hey, you got this under your car.

What the heck's going on with this?

And there's this small propane tank like you use for a camp stove lashed to the catalytic converter of his car.

John had immediately notified authorities.

The implication is the heat from the catalytic converter was going to ignite the canister and cause it to explode.

And being next to the gas tank, it would fragment into the gas tank and cause a fire while John's driving the car.

John confided in me everything that was going on.

I got a call from him and he said, don't be surprised and I don't want you to be concerned.

And he went on to explain to me that there had been explosive devices attached to his muffler system, his exhaust systems in the car.

Just two weeks later, on October 28th, John called the fire department again to report a second bomb he'd found underneath his car.

John is checking his car before he drives away.

And he comes out one morning and he looks underneath his car and there's another propane caster tied to the catalytic converter.

I heard something hissing from underneath my car and when I looked to see what it was, I saw some string hanging and you can smell propane.

Somebody had tied a bottle of propane right by my exhaust.

Unfortunately, the investigation hadn't turned up any suspects before John was killed only a month later.

It's clear someone had been making multiple attempts on John Marmo's life well before he was shot to death outside his residence.

There was this ongoing terrorism act being perpetrated against John.

We knew that he was being stalked.

Police ask John's friends if they know of anyone who'd recently had conflict with the former naval enlistee.

Three names come up.

Two investigators are are already familiar with.

Rebecca Braswell and Shannon Butler.

But the third name is new to police.

At this point, Seth Hardy's name comes up.

Seth Hardy was one of the crew members of this battalion that Rebecca and Shannon belonged to.

Seth believed that Braswell and Butler's lives were in danger and that they were being threatened and terrorized by Rebecca Braswell's ex-husband, John Marmo.

Seth did admit to his friends to paying a visit to John's workplace with the idea that he was going to attack him if the knife hit the workplace.

Following up on the lead, NCIS officers and homicide detectives head to the Seabee's barracks to question Seth Hardy.

At first, detectives find the 20-year-old less than cooperative.

I personally was speaking with Seth, and he was just really arrogant.

You know, he just had this air of being just better than anybody else.

But when investigators reveal they know about the two bombs planted beneath John Marmo's car, Seth's defensive veneer crumbles and he makes a shocking admission.

Seth already admitted that he was involved in the bombing attempts.

When investigators asked why he was trying to kill John Marmo, Seth claims he did it in an effort to protect his close friend and fellow CB, Shannon Butler.

According to Seth, Shannon had come to him with a black eye and multiple contusions several weeks before he planted the first bomb.

She told me John had had her jump.

Well,

she asked me if I'd like to help.

I said, hey,

whatever I can do, let me know.

Okay.

Well,

she brings the idea to me that he needs to to be dealt with.

He said that he did this because Shannon told him to do it, that Shannon paid him, and the reason she paid him was because she was in fear that John was hurting her.

She brought the Blue Baron bottle to me, some bungee cords, tied down with, and some balanced wire.

She had all this stuff already?

Yes, she brought it all to me in one bag.

When their first bombing attempt was spoiled, Seth agreed to plant another.

But when the second bomb was also discovered, Shannon approached Seth with an idea about taking care of John another way.

She comes up to me and goes,

I can get a gun.

Okay.

And I just looked at her.

I'm like,

you're joking, right?

And she goes, no.

She's like, this is the last resort.

Seth says, look, when the bombs failed, I told Shannon, I can't do this anymore.

He wanted nothing to do with actually going out and shooting somebody.

Whether or not Seth is telling the truth about his refusal to take part in John's shooting, investigators charge him with two counts of attempted murder for the prior bombing attempts.

Detectives then turn their attention to speaking with Shannon Butler again.

But they have a hard time tracking her down.

We need to talk to Shannon and she's in the wind.

We can't find her.

We don't know where she's living because she's not living in the barracks and she doesn't have a house anymore.

So where is she?

Investigators turn to Shannon's fellow sailors for help.

Many of them know about Shannon's obsession with John Marmo.

It was complaints at first, like, you know, this guy is a bad guy.

He's not a good father.

He's not doing right by Rebecca or their daughter.

Then it became an obsession over every time that you saw her, she wouldn't talk about other things anymore.

She would just talk about John and Rebecca and their daughter.

When Shannon started showing up with bruises, the sailors claim they all became concerned.

Everybody's like, oh my God, what happened to you?

I remember her saying she'd been beat up by him.

and that he was abusive towards Rebecca in front of their child or in front of Shannon and stuff like that.

Before long, Shannon started asking for help dealing with John from her squad.

And it turned into, I hate this guy.

I can't stand this guy.

I want to beat this guy up.

Two, I want to get rid of this guy.

Do you know where I can get a gun?

It's like she couldn't let it go.

She couldn't think of anything else to say or to talk about.

It was just consuming her mind.

Shannon's obsession with John makes makes her the top suspect in his murder investigation.

We've always known about Shannon, and after interviewing witnesses, it was decided we need to take a second looking at her.

Investigators finally get a lead on Shannon's whereabouts on December 5th, when one of her fellow sailors admits he not only knows where Shannon is, but he also has information about a crucial piece of evidence.

He tells them he knows where the murder weapon is.

The informant admits that Shannon has been hiding out at his apartment with the murder weapon since John was killed.

Investigators then come up with a ruse to ensnare Shannon Butler using the informant as bait.

He had gained the trust of Shannon Butler, and we used that to get to Shannon.

So they came up with a plan.

They decide to have him call Shannon and say, look, I'm going out of town for a few days.

Why don't you let me get rid of that gun?

Shannon, did you get the gun out of the apartment?

Yes, there's one.

Where's it at?

Yeah, I'll take it.

Police decide to set up a sting in the parking lot of a fast food restaurant.

Shannon agrees to meet him in the parking lot, drop off the the gun how long will it take you

uh 15 20 minutes maybe she called him and she's on her way and there's a surveillance team following her is it in a bag

it will be in it when i get there

the gun is in a backpack

She drops the backpack in the vehicle and leaves.

As soon as Shannon drives away, officers seize the backpack with the weapon and a full clip inside

they then give the order for officers to take shannon into custody the undercover detectives surround her

and her response at that time to those detectives was what am i being arrested for the detective told her murder she said i didn't kill anybody but i have a story to tell you

Coming up, Shannon Butler points the finger at the person she claims is the real killer.

She described in graphic detail about how that whole thing went down.

And next thing I know, I hear gunshots going off in my ear.

And he's known at me.

Get out of here, get out of here.

On December 5th, 2006, Ventura County investigators arrest Shannon Butler for the murder of John Marmo.

Shannon has the the murder weapon, so we had her arrested.

We sat down and I read her rights and told her, I hear you have a story to tell me when we hear it.

And she said, I was there.

I saw it happen.

I didn't do it.

Shannon claims she was at John's home that morning with a fellow CB.

Not her bombing co-conspirator, Seth Hardy, but another Navy enlistee named Matt Turner.

Matt is a young man from Laguna Hills, California.

He's just started his naval career.

She told me that she had taken her friend Matt along for protection.

And they had driven over to John's house at 5.30 in the morning and waited for John to come out.

She wanted to confront him about all the attacks he was committing against her and tell him to leave her alone.

He's been threatening my life for the better part of three years that I've been friends with his ex-wife.

And

they just went down and opened the marsh.

Shannon at first insists her plan had been to simply confront John and that she hadn't known that Matt had brought along a gun.

She said she was sitting in the driver's seat and Matt was in the backseat.

She saw John come out to his car and she started to open the driver's door to get out when Matt started shooting out the passenger window

and hit John.

I had no idea what my buddy had planned.

When John walked out, next thing I know, there's shots going off.

You know, my first reaction is get the hell out of there because I didn't know what was going on.

But detectives are having a hard time believing Shannon's story or her supposed motive for wanting to confront John.

How long have these assaults been going on?

Uh

two years or so.

So for two years you've been getting assaulted.

How many times have you been assaulted in two years?

I lost track to say the truth.

Shannon and I talk at length about all the assaults that were going on.

Whereas the police reports, I haven't seen any police reports.

It didn't make sense to us.

Under pressure from police, eventually she folded completely and told them that John actually never hurt her, that it was all made up.

All so that she could get Matt and Seth to join her in this concocted, made-up manhunt of John Marmo.

But why had Shannon recruited Matt Turner and Seth Hardy to kill John Marmo if he'd never hurt her?

According to Shannon, the entire murder plot had been conceived by someone else entirely.

Shannon's actually pointed the finger at Rebecca.

Rebecca's telling Shannon, John's bad.

He hits me, he's upset, he yells in front of, you know, our daughter.

We need to get rid of him for

Heather.

Do you believe everything Rebecca told you?

For the most part.

I mean, I'm not gonna question what she's doing with her daughter.

Is what Shannon's saying true?

Was Rebecca really behind the plot to kill John?

Police know that there was no love lost between the ex-couple, and that their heated custody battle over their daughter just might be motive enough for Rebecca to want to see her ex-husband dead.

This is a huge turning point.

I think the haze really begins to clear.

And investigators can see through this intricate web that Rebecca might have really been at the center of it.

While Shannon denies having feelings for Rebecca, police suspect that Rebecca decided to take advantage of their close relationship.

Is it possible Rebecca believed Shannon had a romantic interest in her

and manipulated Shannon into killing John so she could win custody of Heather?

Shannon Butler was willing to do anything to win the favor of Rebecca Braswell.

I think Rebecca only had an interest in using Shannon.

Shannon.

As for the abuse allegations against John, investigators suspect Shannon and Rebecca made it all up to recruit potential accomplices to help them carry out their plot.

Rebecca would actually punch Shannon and give Shannon injuries and Shannon would punch her so they could be photographed with injuries.

Shannon had been egging herself out to be the victim, and she was hoping her brother sailors would step up and protect her and go seek retribution on John for things that he really and truly didn't do.

Seth Hardy took the bait and helped Shannon plant two bombs under John's car.

Police believe that Shannon, following Rebecca's orders, used the same tactics to convince Matt Turner to shoot John outside his home.

Rebecca's in charge, and Shannon now is subleasing all of this work out

other people.

But Shannon implicating Rebecca in John's murder isn't enough.

Investigators still need the evidence to prove it.

Once their interview with Shannon is complete, investigators set their sights on apprehending the accused mastermind behind the conspiracy, Rebecca Braswell.

We were waiting outside the base, pulled her over in a traffic stop, and took her into custody, brought her to the office of Ventura.

Rebecca immediately denies having any knowledge of John's murder.

When they started that interview, she was as confident as I've ever seen anybody.

But

I just,

I mean, I don't have a lot of hatred towards John.

I was waiting for him to, you know, grow up a little bit, you know, realize the fact that he has a kid.

Not enough, not the ex-wife who wants to go out and have her ex-husband killed.

Oh, no, no, no.

I believe that Rebecca's feeling was, if I don't touch this, no one can touch me, kind of thing.

And I think that was the mindset of these two women was if I don't do this crime, I can't be touched for this crime.

But Rebecca doesn't hesitate to throw Shannon under the bus.

She was saying Shannon was crazy, Shannon was a stalker.

Oh, yeah, was Shannon obsessed with Joe?

She just has an obsessive hatred.

She hates him.

Well, yeah.

She hates him because of everything that I've been through with him.

In an effort to up the pressure on Rebecca, investigators tell her they have Shannon in custody.

She's implicating you in the murder of your husband.

Of course she is.

And at that point, you could kind of see her world collapse.

And she finally, after a long pause, says, okay, I gave Shannon a gun.

I shouldn't have, but I gave it to her for her protection because of all the harassment that was going on that we were getting from John Marma, which is of course all made up.

While Rebecca never admits to her role in the conspiracy, authorities have enough evidence to arrest her for suspicion of murder.

Police are under a big time crunch.

They can hold Shannon and Rebecca, but not for long.

They need more information.

We had no physical evidence.

We had Shannon Butler saying it, but we would have had to give her a deal.

We weren't willing to do that.

Even if we gave her a deal, there's an accomplice corroboration rule.

You have to corroborate the testimony of an accomplice.

We didn't have corroboration.

To detectives, the one missing piece of the puzzle is the suspected trigger man, Matt Turner.

But when investigators try to track him down, they run into a big problem.

He's in Okinawa, Japan, and was actually deployed the day before.

Coming up, detectives head halfway across the world to question Matt Turner.

But will he provide investigators with the information that they need to make the charges against Rebecca Braswell stick?

Without a confession from Turner, we did not have a case at that time.

Rebecca Braswell and Shannon Butler are in police custody in Ventura County, California for the murder of Rebecca's ex-husband, John Marmo.

But authorities need more evidence if the charges against the two women are going to stick.

And they believe the key to locking up the case is suspected trigger man, Matt Turner.

We learned everything there was to learn about Turner.

He was at Camp Nelson in Okinawa.

From what Shannon Butler said, we knew Matt Turner was the shooter, but we needed a confession.

We didn't have physical evidence connecting Matthew Turner to the crime.

Investigators fly to Okinawa and interview Matt at the naval base where he's stationed.

When Matt learns that Shannon Butler has implicated him in the crime, it doesn't take long for the 19-year-old sailor to admit his role in the murder.

He was there and he was the shooter.

He tells them that Shannon was fearful of John, that John might hurt her.

He says he did it because he wanted to protect his friend.

That was what we needed, because without a confession, we would not have been able to make a case.

Shannon Butler's testimony alone would not have been able to do it.

On December 11th, 2006, police charge Matt Turner with the murder of John Marmo and bring him back to the States for prosecution.

When I heard that everybody had been arrested,

which was within a week of the incident, I was just very much relieved.

On March 3rd, 2007, Shannon Butler pleads guilty to first-degree murder and is sentenced to 25 years to life in prison.

Two months later, Seth Hardy pleads guilty to two counts of attempted murder for placing the propane canisters on John's car

and is sentenced to life with the possibility of parole.

With both Shannon and Seth locked behind bars, prosecutors set their sights on the upcoming joint trial of Rebecca Braswell and Matt Turner.

I want to try those two together.

Because if Matt Turner testified, and I figured he would, then I could use his statement because it would be subject to cross-examination about how he waited for John Walmer to come out of his house and basically execute him.

By being able to put that in through him, I could put that on Braswell.

And that's a lying-in-wait special allegation, which makes her eligible for life without the possibility of parole.

Rebecca and Matt are each charged with first-degree murder and conspiracy.

Both face life in prison when their trial begins in January of 2009.

Prosecutors opened their case by painting Rebecca as a vindictive ex-wife who would rather kill her former spouse than share custody of their daughter.

The mastermind behind all this was Rebecca Braswell.

She was the one that had the most to gain.

Everything was about her winning.

Part of winning was going to be preventing him from having any kind of a relationship with his daughter.

It wasn't about their daughter, really.

It was about winning.

Using court records and testimony from her fellow CB sailors as evidence, prosecutors explain how Rebecca manipulated the court system by making false abuse claims against John.

At first, it seemed to work until the courts started to catch on to her game.

Rebecca snapped because she was losing in court.

She couldn't get the custody orders that she wanted anymore.

When that happened, that's when she changed her game plan from deceiving the courts and lying and filing false documents to an actual plot to murder.

Shannon Butler was willing to do anything to win the favor and I believe the love of Rebecca Braswell.

Matthew Turner was stupid and was suckered into it.

Rebecca is one of the most diabolically evil persons that I prosecuted because she is a schemer beyond imagination.

The jury agrees.

In February 2009, Rebecca is found guilty of first-degree murder.

Her co-defendant and accused trigger man Matt Turner is also found guilty.

They are both sentenced to life without parole.

I was

extremely happy

that they would never be of harm to anybody anybody else.

I just

feel so bad for Heather.

I don't know that we can call it justice.

I don't think we can call it closure because Heather's without parents.

Both of them are gone.

She's never going to get to know her mom or her dad, and it could have all been avoided.

Rebecca Braswell is serving her life sentence at Central California Women's Facility.

Shannon Butler will be eligible for parole in March 2025.

She'll be 41 years old.

Rebecca and John's daughter was raised by his family.

How hard is it to kill a planet?

Maybe all it takes is a little drilling, some mining, and a whole lot of carbon pumped into the atmosphere.

When you see what's left, it starts to look like a crime scene.

Are we really safe?

Is our water safe?

You destroyed our top.

And crimes like that, they don't just happen.

We call things accidents.

There is no accident.

This was 100%

preventable.

They're the result of choices by people.

Ruthless oil tycoons, corrupt politicians, even organized crime.

These are the stories we need to be telling about our changing planet.

Stories of scams, murders, and cover-ups that are about us and the things we're doing to either protect the Earth or destroy it.

Follow Lawless Planet on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts.

You can listen to new episodes of Lawless Planet early and ad-free right now by joining Wondry Plus in the Wondry app, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify.