Adam Kinzinger: All the Little Bros

Speaker 4 Get ready for Malice, a twisted new drama starring Jack Whitehall, David DeCovny, and Carise Van Houten.

Speaker 7 Jack Whitehall plays Adam, a charming manny, infiltrates the wealthy Tanner family with a hidden motive to destroy them.

Speaker 10 This edge-of-your-seat revenge thriller unravels a deliciously dark mystery in a world full of wealth, secrets, and betrayal.

Speaker 12 Malice will constantly keep you on your toes.

Speaker 2 Why is Adam after the Tanner family?

Speaker 9 What lengths will he go to?

Speaker 7 One thing's for sure, the past never stays buried, so keep your enemies close.

Speaker 2 Watch Malice, all episodes now streaming exclusively on Prime Video.

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Speaker 16 Hello and welcome to the Bulwark Podcast. Happy Halloween.
I'm your host, Orville Peck, and I'm here with my partner, contributor to the Bulwark.

Speaker 16 He's a former former Republican congressman, a veteran, founder of Country First, which packs pro-democracy candidates. It's Adam Kinzinger.
How you doing, partner?

Speaker 15 Hey, good, man. My Halloween costume is a washed-up has-been.

Speaker 16 A washed-up hack? Has-been. It's not really working for you.
I don't know. You're filling out that shirt with those muscles, and I don't know.

Speaker 16 You look like you have a second wind in you to me, brother. Well, thank you for joining the podcast.
Donald Trump got into costume last night, so I figured I had to. So I wanted to start there.

Speaker 16 Have you had a chance to look at it? I mean,

Speaker 16 he is wearing this like triple XL like dump truck driver costume that doesn't fit. So he looks like kind of a small oompa loompa in a big costume.
And then he didn't do his makeup right.

Speaker 16 So there's like a big hole right around his mouth. So he kind of looks like a sex doll.
Yeah. What do you think about his clothes in kind of visual? It was amazing.

Speaker 15 It was amazing because of two reasons. So number one, yeah, he didn't do his makeup right.
He's been doing his makeup wrong lately. It's like worse.

Speaker 15 Like he, you now see that like pale line, you know, now around the side. And I don't know what's going on.

Speaker 16 Contouring.

Speaker 15 Yeah, maybe his skin's just so old that he needs to like change his makeup, you know, to match it. But the best part is like, you know, MAGA is so obsessed with like visuals, right?

Speaker 15 They don't care who this guy is as long as the visual is good.

Speaker 15 And so him going up, looking, you know, overweight, unhealthy, and then reaching twice for that doorknob and then like kind of tripping when he grabbed the doorknob to the garbage truck like you know that drives him nuts and that drives his supporters nuts and so it was like his little McDonald's thing which was actually smarter where he was just trying to at the moment make something but I think it just makes him look dumb and it's not going to change it nobody's going to be like gosh I was going to vote for Kamala but but Donald Trump awkwardly got in a garbage truck I just can't help it I have to vote for him now Also, I touched on this a little bit with Sam Stein last night.

Speaker 16 Like, the metaphor doesn't work for me. Because it's like, I thought they were supposed to be offended that they were called garbage, but so he's taking out the trash.

Speaker 16 But meanwhile, Donald Trump's been saying on the campaign trail multiple times that America is a trash can for migrants.

Speaker 16 So wouldn't the metaphor have worked better if he was saying, I'm taking out the migrants, I'm taking out the trash? It just, it doesn't, it didn't work for me.

Speaker 16 I didn't understand what they were going for.

Speaker 15 No, and it was probably his idea, to be honest with you, because he's like, that is one thing that Donald Trump is good at is like, I'm going to come up with a visual. And sometimes he gets it wrong.

Speaker 15 And I think this was a case of that. And plus, again, to them, it's, I think we have to get in their mind and understand that it's not about doing something that is going to win an election.

Speaker 15 They've already been convinced they're going to win. It is about how do I needle the other side? What is it that I can do to just tweak it and make them even more angry?

Speaker 15 And like the garbage truck metaphor they thought would do it. And,

Speaker 15 you know, it just, it's, again, it's unfortunate that the whole thing happened because we were coming off a pretty good news cycle, Kamala's speech, and then, you know, frankly, the Madison Square Garden.

Speaker 15 And this kind of blunted some of that. But yeah, I don't think it's going to be quite the panacea they say it is.

Speaker 16 Yeah, thanks for nothing, Mr. President.
All right. Yeah.
Well, I guess you mentioned Madison Square Gardens. So we'll flip this wrong.

Speaker 16 We have a segment that I used to do, man. I used to do a lot.
But then the political news cycle got kind of crazy.

Speaker 16 You know, there was a debate, a couple of assassination attempts, and, you know, a little gimmicks. We didn't have enough room.
You know, we had to do real business on this podcast.

Speaker 16 But now we're in the home stretch for the OGs. I want to bring back one of my favorite segments.
And it's where we talked about a guy named Johnny McIntyre, who was Trump's deputy president.

Speaker 16 He was in charge of staffing at the White House.

Speaker 16 He left the White House and he started up a dating site for incels called Right Stuff that has kind of failed as a dating site, but has succeeded as a place for offensive conservative TikTok memes.

Speaker 16 And so I want to get to the segment here, but today it's a bonus. I want to play for you not just Johnny McIntye, but also clips from Charlie Kirk and Jesse Waters.

Speaker 16 So let's take a listen to our old news segment, The Right Stuff.

Speaker 17 So I guess they misunderstood. When we said we wanted male-only voting, we meant male M-A-L-E.

Speaker 18 Hilarious. His wife is wearing the, you'll show it, wearing the American hat.

Speaker 18 She's coming in with her sweet husband, who probably works his tail off to make sure that she can go, you know, and have a nice life and provide for the family.

Speaker 18 And then she lies to him, saying, Oh, yeah, I'm going to vote for Trump. And then she votes for Kamala Harris as her little secret in the voting booth.

Speaker 18 Kamala Harris and her team believe that there will be millions of women that undermine their husbands.

Speaker 16 If I found out Kamala was going into the voting booth and pulling the lever for Harris, that's the same thing as having an affair. That to me.

Speaker 16 Oh my God.

Speaker 16 Let him finish your business. Go, Jesse.

Speaker 16 That vile

Speaker 16 the sanctity of our

Speaker 16 Adam,

Speaker 16 what are they doing here? This is what we're closing the deal with the bro fest in Madison Square Garden. Got the surrogates out here trying to shame women for who they want to vote for.

Speaker 16 Trump at the rally last night said, I'll be your protector whether you like it or not. They want all male voting.

Speaker 16 I guess at some level, there's a serious element to it, but it's also very pathetic and sad.

Speaker 15 Yeah, I mean, look,

Speaker 15 here's what this is. It really is.
And, you know, Nanke Haley, I hate to give her credit for anything, but she called it right with the bro culture, and you've talked about this too.

Speaker 15 There is a massive gender split, obviously. There always kind of has been, but, you know, Democrats are going to crush it with women.
And Republicans are going to do really well with men.

Speaker 15 And part of this, and this is a whole hour-long conversation in and of itself, but I've said for the last 10 years, like we were kind of in this moment where everything masculine was called toxic, and that went way too far.

Speaker 15 And so there were these young men, particularly, that felt like they didn't really have a place. What is my role? And Donald Trump comes along with actual, real toxic masculinity.

Speaker 15 And in the absence of another version of masculinity, men just kind of gravitated to that.

Speaker 15 And so that's what you're seeing here is an extension of this like angry, you know, I'm in charge of the house type masculinity.

Speaker 15 And I think they're just doubling down on saying we're going to win men.

Speaker 15 We're going to win them big outside of the morals of it politically, because it's kind of dumb because women tend to turn out in much higher numbers than men do. But that's what you have.

Speaker 15 It's again, it's the Joe Rogan/slash Andrew Tate bro culture, and they can't go back on that. So, you know, does Johnny McIntye really believe that he wants to repeal the amendment for women to vote?

Speaker 15 Probably not, although maybe he would if he could, honestly. But for him, it's all about like, I'm so anti-PC.
I'll so say what's on the edge that I can win these folks.

Speaker 15 And that's kind of been the new Republican Party is just how much can we trigger the left? and the more we trigger it the more popular we become within our own little movement yeah i mean

Speaker 16 like regardless of whether it's a it's clearly not a serious proposal to repeal the 19th amendment but like putting it all together you know you have it within project 2025 and some of these guys they've they've re-brought up the the fact that we should re-look at no-fault divorce i held jd vance even mentioned that in one of the million podcasts he did shouldn't be letting people you know women should stay in these sorts of marriages obviously you have the abortion issue you know, birth control.

Speaker 16 Like, they're talking about how it's undermining of the man of the house to vote against them.

Speaker 16 Regardless of which of those particular things you think is doable in a Trump term, like the fact that you're going to have all these little

Speaker 16 bros running around who have not yet matured into men and that they will wield the power of government, that's got to be pretty alarming to any on-the-fence women.

Speaker 15 It does have to be. And I can't, here's the the thing.
Like, I can think of times in this country's history, obviously, when races have been pitted against each other.

Speaker 15 Obviously, there were times when women didn't have equal rights as men, but I can't necessarily look back and figure a time when actual genders have been pitted against each other.

Speaker 15 I mean, and maybe I'm wrong. I'm no, you know, clear historian, but I can't think of a time when other political leaders have so openly tried to turn men against women.

Speaker 15 I mean, it's wrong to say, like, we're going to turn blacks against whites or use race, but that's happened before.

Speaker 15 The fact that you are within each home now trying to pit men against women, you think what this is doing to relationships, by the way.

Speaker 15 If there's a dude that's in a marriage and he thinks this kind of stuff's funny and his wife is feeling very minimized because of this, you know, we've had trouble with marriages staying together anyway, particularly in the pandemic era, the post-pandemic era.

Speaker 15 Think of what Donald Trump, Johnny McIntye, and others, Tucker Carlson, are happily doing to marriages now, creating a real stress point.

Speaker 15 I mean, look, I actually think that, you know, somebody that votes Republican and Democrat should be able to be married together. But the reality is that is a stressor in marriages.

Speaker 15 And all these guys are doing is inflaming that further. This is not the pro-marriage, pro-family party anymore.
It really isn't. This is the trolling party.
And literally, that's all it is.

Speaker 16 My colleague Kathy Young sent a tweet about this, which I liked, which was like, you know, all these guys do the lip service to raising children and, you know, being a homemaker is so important and valuable.

Speaker 16 And the left wants to take that from you. And

Speaker 16 the feminists and third-wade feminism, and they want to put you out in the workplace for something that's less fulfilling. And the real fulfilling work is being a mom.
And they say that and say that.

Speaker 16 And then the minute it becomes convenient, it's like, oh, what? You're ungrateful. You're so ungrateful sitting around at home eating your bon ponds.
You're not going to vote for Mr.

Speaker 16 Trump, like the man of the house who's providing for you does. Like it reveals just the hollowness of

Speaker 16 the whole endeavor.

Speaker 15 You're right, because what you see is, and this has kind of been something I've been on a little bit lately, which is like, you know, there's this kind of belief that the 1950s was really like what you see on Leave It to Beaver, right?

Speaker 15 It was just this amazing time. Mom loved being at home.
She loved, you know, not having a microwave and having to cook everything in the oven for seven hours.

Speaker 15 Like, that's what, that's what this view is. And the kids just go outside and play.

Speaker 15 Now, you don't think about like, you know, Back to the Future with Biff the Bully and how, you know, everything, if you were slightly different, you literally would get assaulted back in the day.

Speaker 15 And, you know, all the sexual abuse that happened that you couldn't report because police wouldn't take you seriously or racial violence that would happen and the police would always take the side of the white guy.

Speaker 15 Like, no, you think back to the 50s. And the thing is, is we're getting a bit of a preview now that the 1950s weren't quite this idyllic time where everybody was happy.

Speaker 15 I bet in the 50s, there was a lot of things where men are like coming home drunk at 9 p.m.

Speaker 15 from the bar after being at work and the wife wanted him home with the kids and he strikes her because she's not grateful enough for all the hard work he's doing.

Speaker 15 We're seeing a little preview of that now. This is what these guys want.
And honestly, I think that's a miserable life, to be honest with you.

Speaker 16 We're not going back. You know, you'd think maybe, whatever, maybe we're just cucks.
Maybe we're soy boys that don't understand, right? We've turned on Mr. Trump.
We don't understand how it goes.

Speaker 16 So I was interested to hear Megan Kelly's take.

Speaker 16 Not those particular clips, but on just the general culture at Madison Square Garden and the various speakers and what she noticed from the Madison Square Garden event. Let's listen to Megan Kelly.

Speaker 19 But I'm telling you, even for me, and I voted for Donald Trump last week, it was too bro-tastic.

Speaker 16 Okay, it was.

Speaker 19 You're trying to win an election in which you're hemorrhaging female voters.

Speaker 19 Maybe when you present in front of hundreds, thousands at least, at Madison Square Garden, you clean up the bro talk just a little so you don't alienate women in the middle of America who are already on the fence about Republicans.

Speaker 19 Do they have no women advising their campaign?

Speaker 19 Is there no actual woman sitting behind the scenes, coming up with the guest lineup and saying, Let's just have a word with the guys who are going to be speaking about this isn't the bar.

Speaker 19 This isn't their living room. This is a campaign.
This is politics. We're trying to get him elected.
We don't need to rally the base or guys anymore.

Speaker 19 And it's not helpful, even if we do want to rally the base or guys, to go full off-color insults to different racial groups and so on.

Speaker 16 Worst person in the world makes a great point.

Speaker 16 Meme. That was great.
Oh, man. Megan Kelly.
There was something I liked about Megan Kelly at one point deep in the recesses of my brain, and I haven't seen it lately. And there, there it was.

Speaker 16 That's pretty good.

Speaker 15 So, I'm going to give Megan Kelly a reverse compliment sandwich.

Speaker 15 She's insane. That was a good point.
I don't know what happened to her. Okay.

Speaker 15 And because she, remember, she's the one that was taking out Trump like in 2016. Like, you know, you said women, blah, blah, blah.

Speaker 15 But I mean, she's right here, which is there really is no campaign strategy behind it. Again, it's like how much more, how much over the edge? How intense can we get? How much can we troll the left?

Speaker 15 And at some point, while that may feel good, that comes into conflict with we actually need to win this election.

Speaker 15 And, you know, if we don't win this election, all this will have just been a good time and not worth anything.

Speaker 15 And so, yeah, I mean, if Megan Kelly's ringing the alarm bells, if I were the Trump people, I'd actually listen. The problem is, the Trump people are probably actually listening.

Speaker 15 It's Donald Trump that isn't. And every speaker knows that if they can go there and say extreme stuff.
stuff, that Donald Trump will love it. And look, let's be very clear.

Speaker 15 Maybe this guy was a comedian. Maybe he shouldn't have said it.
Maybe everybody was disgusted by it. They knew what the reaction was to it prior to Donald Trump going up and speaking.

Speaker 15 And if he'd have gone up and simply said, Look, we had a speaker here prior, I totally disagree with him. I disavow that.

Speaker 15 He would have probably jumped 20 points in the polls because the first time he would have seen contrition from Donald Trump. And this wouldn't be an issue we're talking about.

Speaker 15 But they can't bring themselves to do it because, at the depth of their heart, this stuff really is funny to them.

Speaker 16 Yeah, they agree.

Speaker 15 I mean, Donald Trump can't say that doesn't doesn't represent me because it does i mean like yeah it's his stated talking points that there are shithole countries out there and that that they're garbage and that other countries are sending us their garbage so you know the joke is like right in line with donald trump's actual views and i went i went off on this actually on twitter i put out a video a little two-minute video just like listen spare me and i think i put a yeah i did i put an article on sub stack about it which is like spare me your indignation trump people when you sit here and you say you know that joe biden's called you trash and you're like, oh my God, I'm so aghast.

Speaker 15 Spare us your indignation because you are worshiping a man who basically says that on a Tuesday, who divides genders against each other, who divides race against each other, who divides socioeconomic status against each other, who divides nations against each other, who divides neighborhoods against each other.

Speaker 15 All he does is divide, stir divisions, stomp on heads, punch down. That's what he makes his money on.
That's what he basically is known for.

Speaker 15 And yet you're outraged that the current president honestly misspoke but let's even say he didn't misspoke he said something you didn't like guess what he's not even running for president but quit being outraged when your guy has spent eons dividing and destroying people against each other like i have no room for your outrage i'm sorry zero back to your point about uh you mentioned nikki haley earlier and how like there's no strategy there i guess the one thing i disagree with on your point is that you're like that the strategists are on something and it's Trump that's not.

Speaker 16 I don't know. I mean, Trump's speech at Madison Square Garden was way less

Speaker 16 offensive on its face. I mean, it was baseline Trump offensiveness, but it was way less offensive on its face than like a lot of the warm-ups and like Stephen Miller's Nazi comments.

Speaker 16 Stephen Miller's one of his advisors, and it was his advisors that decided they needed to have 18 fucking dude bros doing, you know, insult comedy before him. They didn't have to do that.

Speaker 16 It's the advisors that also made this mistake, as as far as I can tell. Let's listen to Nikki Haley.

Speaker 22 The Associated Press says, as Democrats court Haley supporters, the former U.N. ambassador is still waiting to hear from Trump.

Speaker 23 When was the last time you talked to the former president?

Speaker 24 Last time I talked to him was back in June.

Speaker 23 So are you surprised that you haven't been deployed out to campaign or have you volunteered to go out and campaign for him directly?

Speaker 24 They're very aware that we're on standby. They know that we would be there to help.
I've helped with some fundraising letters and text messages and those types of things. So we've done that.

Speaker 24 But look, we're on the same team. It is their campaign's decision on what he needs in these last final days.
It does not bother me at all.

Speaker 24 I think they need to do what they need to do to get across the finish line. I just think that they need to focus primarily on who it is they're talking to.

Speaker 24 You've got Americans who are absolutely going to vote for Trump. You've got Americans who are absolutely not going to vote for Trump.

Speaker 24 And then you've got a percentage in the middle who like Trump policies but don't like his style. That is what they need to focus on.

Speaker 24 So when you look at these things, it has got to be a story of addition. This is not a time to have anyone criticize Puerto Rico or Latinos.

Speaker 24 This is not a time for them to get overly masculine with this bromance thing that they've got going. 53% of the electorate are women.
Women will vote. They care about how they're being talked to.

Speaker 16 Haven't talked to him since June. Susie Wiles can't set up a phone call? That is crazy.
I mean, AA, it goes to show you that you get nothing for sucking up to Trump. You get nothing.

Speaker 16 He just takes your soul and you get nothing in exchange for the deal. But just as a strategic matter, I mean, wow.

Speaker 15 I think it's, first off, I just, I can't stop laughing that she call it this bromance culture because it's true, but it is like, you know, like they pride themselves on being so manly, but yet they are just literally sitting around like googly-eyed at each other, all these men, right?

Speaker 15 Like if Andrew Tate walked in or if Joe Rogan walked in, it's like this male worship culture, which to me is, I don't know, it doesn't seem very masculine, to be honest with you. But maybe, yeah.

Speaker 15 Yeah, maybe I'm wrong.

Speaker 16 But I'm not sure if Donald Trump's feeling very gay, but he is giving out in the first round of RuPaul's drag race

Speaker 16 with the amount of makeups that he's putting on right now. Like he is giving full last place in RuPaul's Drag Race energy over the last few weeks, which is kind of gay in its own sense.

Speaker 15 Yeah, yeah, well, that's Trump for you.

Speaker 15 But the Haley thing, look, there is nothing more pathetic to me than Nikki Haley clearly wanting to be used by Donald Trump, clearly wanting to be out there on the trail, clearly with her feelings hurt, and clearly probably sitting around going, gee, did I actually do the right thing by coming out and supporting him?

Speaker 15 Because her assumption was, which happens to so many others, it's why Trump is a good cult leader.

Speaker 15 If you ask for forgiveness, he'll forgive you and usually bring you back into the cult and you learn not to do that again. She miscalculated that.

Speaker 15 And like from a Trump perspective, I think it's really bad politics.

Speaker 15 If he'd have had Haley out there pretty hard, I mean, she would have been a pretty serious contender against those of us in the Republicans for Harris coalition because she's, you know, she was kind of the meme of the Republicans for Harris.

Speaker 15 But her feelings are hurt. And you know what?

Speaker 15 And I don't care because if you're going to turn against everything you said in the primary because you want to still be in the in club, then you deserve to be ignored, honestly.

Speaker 16 It is pretty crazy when you think about it how much more effort the Harris campaign is putting into reaching Haley voters than the Trump campaign. Yeah.
And it's pretty wild. The Harris campaign.

Speaker 16 like has made a real concerted effort that through what you're doing with Robinkins for Harris, the little tour she did with Liz, through we could go down the whole list, like the ads, her rhetoric, freedom signs.

Speaker 16 And it's like the Trump campaign is just not even trying.

Speaker 16 It does feel a little bit though like like there's some Stockholm syndrome with some of the Haley voters that they're not the message isn't getting through to them that they're not invited to the party that it's a no-Homers club you know but and given that there are probably some listening to this now I think it's important to say this which is look

Speaker 15 the party that you think you still have affection for that party that believes in a strong national defense a smaller government you know the one that we all remember I know it's hard to come to grips to this but it doesn't exist.

Speaker 15 It literally, if you're going to put policies up against each other, you are closer to the Democrats, even in their most liberal form, than you are the current Republican Party.

Speaker 15 Doesn't mean you're close to Democrats, but on a spectrum, you're closer to Democrats because you believe in kind of the liberal small L order out there. And the Republicans don't anymore.

Speaker 15 And look, I know it feels like it happened extremely suddenly, too. It didn't.

Speaker 15 This has actually been in the works for about 20 years, maybe longer, but really, the last eight years since Donald Trump came down that escalator and on the scene, the last nine years, it's gone from being the party you remember to what it is today.

Speaker 15 That's not a quick happening. Nine years is a decade.
Like, you can change the tone of a party in a decade. You don't have a place in that Republican Party anymore.

Speaker 15 And I know it hurts because our political identity is tattooed on our foreheads and we never want to get rid of it. But you are the outsider now.
It's not that there's outsiders in the party.

Speaker 16 Yeah, over a decade, your little kindergartner started to drive their car. You know, I know it happens fast.

Speaker 16 You know, the days are long and the years are short, but like, you know, that's that's what's been happening. All right, one last thing on the Nikki Haley voters.

Speaker 16 I've said this a couple times, but I've received several texts. This is not a fake sir story.

Speaker 16 I've received several texts and DMs from people that shared my pitch to Nikki Haley voters that said they sent it to their dad or their friend in Pennsylvania, and it helped. It worked.

Speaker 16 It nudged them over into Como's camp. So we'll put the link in the show notes again.

Speaker 16 You should be out there knocking on doors or doing whatever, you know, postcarding, but send this article around. You have somebody in your life.

Speaker 16 You have a Wall Street Journal reading Brett Bear Watcher in your life. Send it to them.
Maybe we can nudge him over. Okay.

Speaker 16 Here's one last point that I think should maybe be relevant for them that I don't feel like I've spent enough time talking about on the podcast because there's just so much shit going on.

Speaker 16 RFK said this in an interview a couple of days ago, and it's pretty alarming. Let's listen.

Speaker 25 The key that I think that President Trump has promised me is

Speaker 25 control of the public health agencies, which are HHS and its sub-agencies,

Speaker 25 CDC, FDA, NIH, and a few others. And then also the USDA,

Speaker 25 which... you know is key to making america healthy because we've got to get off of

Speaker 25 uh seed oils and we've got to get off of um pesticide-intensive agriculture.

Speaker 16 Talk about spooky. There's my Halloween fright for you.
RFK has been promised the head of HHS and NIH and USDA.

Speaker 16 That's alarming.

Speaker 15 Can they do something about his cough?

Speaker 16 But look, I, dude, is that

Speaker 16 that audio isn't giving health to you. That's not giving making America healthy again to you.

Speaker 16 He's not helping out. He ate glass.

Speaker 15 Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 15 But listen, man, like the seed oils and the, you know, the fluoride and the EM electromagnetic frequency that's coming off of your Wi-Fi's and the 5G towers, this is all in the same thing.

Speaker 15 And by the way, the Earth's flat. We never went to the moon.
And Fahrenheit is just a construct.

Speaker 15 I mean, and honest to God, if you have a Republican Senate and you can imagine the pressure coming on the Republican Senate to allow this RFK appointment to go through, because all of a sudden RFK's people are going to be going crazy, you very well may end up with with this.

Speaker 15 And you could imagine a surgeon general warning against seed oils, for God's sakes, or a surgeon general warning against just virgin olive oil and not extra-virgin olive oil, whatever it is.

Speaker 15 But this is just crazy stuff, you know, and it's not based on science. It's based on somebody that wrote an internet article.

Speaker 16 I think with what we know about RFK,

Speaker 16 he's into extra-virgin olive oil.

Speaker 16 Yeah, probably so. I don't even know if it matters if the Republican Senate would confirm him, right? Like they could just make him the czar.

Speaker 16 And the people around, you know, Andrew Egger wrote about this in in the newsletter this morning.

Speaker 16 That guy that spoke at MSG, Howard Lichnick, the CEO, whose employees died during 9-11, he's supposed to be one of the business guys, the practical guys around Trump.

Speaker 16 He's on CNN last night with Caitlin Collins. Do you see this? And he's like...
RFK was convinced me. He's making some good points about autism and all this stuff.

Speaker 16 We should maybe re-re-looking at vaccines.

Speaker 16 You know, worst case scenario, I don't think it's just Surgeon General warnings.

Speaker 16 You know, I think that vaccine mandates for kids, bringing back smallpox, measles, rebellion, like all that stuff is potentially in play because there are no normals around.

Speaker 16 And like the people that are around are going to be pliant to this crazy stuff.

Speaker 15 I mean, look, Tim, I've said this, and I kind of jokingly, but kind of serious, which is like the dark ages would be looking at us going, holy shit, you guys need to just start paying attention to some science, right?

Speaker 15 And these are the people that would like burn everybody as a witch because, I mean, like the seed oil thing, maybe their seed oils aren't healthy I don't know but I also know that like two years ago everybody was on this kick called the croissant diet because it didn't have some ingredient in there and croissants don't have that and so you can eat like crap as long as it's not and then that was found to be crap is that real the croissant diet did you just make that up that was a real thing and uh then there's real yeah it lasts that one i know dude look it up and you can find you can find anything to support like there's an ice cream diet out there somewhere i'm sure but like it's always like you know one month eggs are bad for you and one month they're good for you right like but the seed oil thing is when he said that i'm like okay we're we're in cuckoo territory now completely completely cloud cuckoo land

Speaker 7 get ready for malice a twisted new drama starring jack whitehall david decovney and carice van houghten jack whitehall plays adam a charming manny infiltrates the wealthy tanner family with a hidden motive to destroy them this edge of your seat revenge thriller unravels a deliciously dark mystery in a world full of wealth, secrets, and betrayal.

Speaker 12 Malice will constantly keep you on your toes.

Speaker 2 Why is Adam after the Tanner family?

Speaker 9 What lengths will he go to?

Speaker 7 One thing's for sure, the past never stays buried, so keep your enemies close.

Speaker 2 Watch Malice, all episodes now streaming exclusively on Prime Video.

Speaker 26 We know no one's journey is the same.

Speaker 27 That's why Delta Sky Miles lets you do it your way.

Speaker 21 From earning miles on reloads for coffee runs, shopping, and things you do every day, to connecting you to new places and experiences, a Sky Miles membership fits into your lifestyle, letting you do more of what makes you, you.

Speaker 28 It's more than travel.

Speaker 30 It's the membership that flies, dines, streams, rides, and arrives with you.

Speaker 31 Every great journey deserves a great story.

Speaker 21 And when you have a membership that's as unique as you are, there's no telling how your story will unfold or where that journey will take you next.

Speaker 27 Skymiles is the membership that will be here for all your big and small moments.

Speaker 31 The membership that's there for every solo adventure or family trip.

Speaker 28 The membership that comes with the power of partnership from brands you love.

Speaker 21 The membership that moves with you.

Speaker 30 Learn more at delta.com slash skymiles.

Speaker 16 Let's stay in Cloud Cuckoo Land for a while. I want to talk about Elon Musk.
Eventually, we're going to get to the election. But this is the election.

Speaker 16 I think that this is, it can get flattened, you know, in the final days, people, and we deal with this yesterday, my buddy Laksha, and like you can get focused on, oh, what's the early vote showing?

Speaker 16 And what's this showing? And it's like, a lot of that is a lot of smoke and mirrors, frankly, a lot of worry about things that are out of control.

Speaker 16 And what is in our control is making sure people understand just the degree of fucking lunacy that is going to be around Donald Trump if he gets in there.

Speaker 16 And so I want to talk about Elon Musk, who was, it seems to me, like going to be his closest advisor in the White House, gonna be in charge of cutting things.

Speaker 16 He said he was gonna cut the military-industrial complex yesterday on Twitter.

Speaker 16 He said that there is going to be some short-term economic hardship while they right-size government and start tariffing a bunch of people.

Speaker 16 And then yesterday, his PAC, I saw you tweeting about this, in Michigan, canvassers and paid door knockers for

Speaker 16 Musk's America PAC have been subjected to being driven around at the back of a seatless U-Haul van and threatened that their lodging in a local motel wouldn't be paid for if they didn't meet canvassing quotas.

Speaker 16 One canvasser says that they didn't even know they were signing up for anything having to do with Musk or Trump.

Speaker 16 This is a totally unhinged man, oligarch, with unbelievable powers that they just want to unleash. on the government if he gets in there.

Speaker 16 So I'm curious your thoughts on the domestic side, and then I want to talk about Russia.

Speaker 15 Yeah, so this is truly like what you see see oligarchs do in countries like in the Russian sphere. You know, the country of Georgia, by the way, just had an election, totally fraudulent.

Speaker 15 So there's a lot of unsteadiness there. But their party is basically run by an Elon Musk in that area.
And he would do the same thing, pay people, you know, like threaten people.

Speaker 15 And this is a huge problem. I mean, this whole million-dollar lottery thing is clearly corrupt and clearly illegal.
The fact that they are basically using slave labor and and then

Speaker 15 the better is maybe indentured servitude because they're threatening their lodging and stuff for them to go do this.

Speaker 15 Like, if we really want this, and by the way, let me just say too, you know, they talk about right-sizing government and putting tariffs on everything.

Speaker 15 I'm going to tell you what industry will not have tariffs? Probably the Tesla electric car industry because Elon Musk will not tariff to his own detriment.

Speaker 15 And, you know, we can get into the whole security clearance thing and maybe that's coming up with Russia. But that's a huge issue with me too.
So we cannot, we cannot as a country do this.

Speaker 16 I mean, it's crazy like that they're planning for the tariffs.

Speaker 16 And it ties to the Nikki Yale discussion because like to me, in addition to the article I mentioned to send to the Brett Baer person in your life, to the person that's in the stock market in your life, to the dad that just cares about their 401k, trying to shake them and being like, this is their plan.

Speaker 16 Like, it is not the 2017 Paul Ryan tax cut plan that is coming.

Speaker 16 Like it is putting Elon Musk in charge of indiscriminately cutting things in the government, including from the Defense Department, and then tariffing all foreign goods.

Speaker 16 Well, not all foreign goods, indiscriminately, tariffing foreign goods and making it especially high on companies or CEOs they don't like. Like that is turning this country into hungry.

Speaker 16 And the hungry economy is not humming. Okay.
Like this is not, this is not your daddy's, we're going to cut some red tape. Nope.

Speaker 16 Kamala Harris talks more about cutting red tape than these guys do like they want to slash huge segments of the government and reorient the taxation system to tariffs in a way that will totally disrupt things that they admit that they admit will cause short-term pain like that is a crazy pitch and the only reason people are going along with it is because they don't believe that it will happen they believe that it will be 2017 and it's not fucking 2017.

Speaker 15 So there's this belief that globalism in and of itself is really bad and evil. And you have to think as an evangelical to understand this.

Speaker 15 But I'll give you the 12-second overview, which is we were taught growing up as evangelicals that we were always on the edge of the apocalypse and the one world government, right?

Speaker 15 The Antichrist, this one world government. The thing that we were constantly told was leading to the one world government is globalization.

Speaker 15 So to many of these people, anything that reverses globalization, including destroying trade routes, including big tariffs, is a good thing because of the whole one world government situation and the Antichrist.

Speaker 15 And obviously, that's all evil evil and cashless society and whatever else you can throw out there to you people that think that the old republican party is going to come back just soon and you know but it's not it's gone maybe it'll come back someday but it ain't here right now the old republican party is coming back the lindbergh republican party that's what we're coming back to yeah it's not the regan republican party we're going way back all right so he's talking to russia So I guess I'm interested in your take on, you mentioned the security clearances.

Speaker 16 So open floor to just kind of riff on both of these things. But I think it's kind of crazy how little attention it's gotten.

Speaker 16 I mean, it's gotten some attention, but like the fact that the biggest government contractor and the biggest donor to one candidate is having back channel conversations with an adversary and apparently being asked to do favors for that adversary, including, including limit Wi-Fi access to another independent ally, quasi-ally in Taiwan.

Speaker 16 It's a scandal without precedent. And it's just kind of like, oh, well, Elon's being crazy.
So anyway, I'm curious your thought on that. And then we can get into the security clearance stuff, too.

Speaker 15 Yeah, it's absolutely a scandal without precedence. Like, here's the problem with Elon Musk.
He has done so well with SpaceX.

Speaker 15 And Boeing has crapped the bed so hard on literally everything. If you're a Boeing executive listening to this, get your shit right, okay?

Speaker 15 Because Boeing has been trying to, in essence, compete with SpaceX. And as you know, they put that rocket up.
They'd end up stranding these friggin' astronauts in space.

Speaker 15 Whatever is going on at Boeing it has led to SpaceX being really the only way to get astronauts in and out of space that's not Russia as well as satellites and stuff like that so the government utterly needs Elon Musk the problem is Elon Musk knows that and he can go and do whatever he wants if it was me as a government contractor let's say I was selling I don't know Coca-Cola cans to the U.S.

Speaker 15 military but I was also having back channels with Russia I would lose my contract because there would be other people people that could go out and provide Coca-Cola cams.

Speaker 15 But for some reason, Elon Musk is exempt from that. And he is, in essence, doing more damage to U.S.
foreign policy than anything. And I got to tell you, I don't understand.

Speaker 15 I don't understand. You know, I've been holding back certain criticisms of the Biden administration until the election's over.
But I don't understand where the Biden administration is on this.

Speaker 15 I've not heard a word out of them. I see weak actions in Ukraine continuing to deny Ukraine the opportunity to strike long into Russia, despite North Korean troops now in Russia.

Speaker 15 It's like they are asleep at the wheel right now. And this Elon Musk thing is a huge deal.
What's also going on with TikTok? TikTok has been banned.

Speaker 15 It's supposed to be sold off to a different company. I don't know what's going on with that.
Are they pursuing the sale? Because we all want to keep TikTok here.

Speaker 15 We just want to get it out of the purview of the CCP.

Speaker 15 And so I am angry at Elon Musk, and I'm also angry at the lack of action. Now, before somebody uses my words to say, see, vote for Trump, it would be way different under Trump.

Speaker 15 Well, let's just be very clear. Trump would be embracing this garbage.
Biden's just kind of asleep at the wheel at it.

Speaker 16 When I interviewed Walter Isaacson about his Elon book, I got to tell you, I mean,

Speaker 16 you can hate Elon.

Speaker 16 and despise him and loathe him and think he's pernicious and all this and also maintain that the correct thought in your head that it hasn't just been the Biden administration, but the last Trump administration, also, apparently, and the Obama administration has totally abdicated this space, pun intended.

Speaker 16 It's unbelievable that, like, that Elon was like filled this gap.

Speaker 16 And with all of the resources of the federal government, that Elon is the only person, and that not Elon himself, because he's not the technologist, but that SpaceX and Starlink are that with Starlink, are the only people that are able to do this.

Speaker 16 Like, that should be a crisis. And it's a crisis that we've known about for years now, like for years.

Speaker 16 You know, and Walter was writing about this in the book when he's interviewing Elon two, three years ago.

Speaker 16 And smart people who are paying attention to this industry obviously were aware of this before that.

Speaker 16 And so it's like, it is totally unacceptable that the government has just completely abdicated this arena.

Speaker 15 Yeah. And look, here's the thing.
1960s, we send men to the moon. Okay.

Speaker 15 We are trying to recreate that now.

Speaker 15 In the year of our lord 2024 we had an artemis one mission where a rocket basically went around the moon that was basically like apollo two or three or whatever now artemis 2 is supposed to be next year and that's where we actually have a manned mission around the moon not landing yet because god forbid we do that it's only been 70 years we got to reinvent the wheel and probably artemis 2 is not going to go in 2025 like they say it is that is way behind schedule how is it that we have abdicated this so badly i mean again we are basically redoing what we did in the 60s, but yet just like what happens with every new Air Force airplane that comes in, instead of relying on pilots, you have to load it with so much technology that doesn't work, or like these new electromagnetic catapults on aircraft carriers, because we just can't use an old mechanical catapult anymore.

Speaker 15 And instead of having, you know, Buzz Aldrin piloting his aircraft or having an astronaut, Neil Armstrong, fly it to the moon, you have to have some technology and it puts everything way back.

Speaker 15 Like, I could go on an hour about how we've screwed this up, but the fact is we're just trying to land a man on the moon again, and we can't do it.

Speaker 4 Get ready for Malice, a twisted new drama starring Jack Whitehall, David DeCovney, and Carice Van Houten.

Speaker 7 Jack Whitehall plays Adam, a charming manny infiltrates the wealthy Tanner family with a hidden motive.

Speaker 3 to destroy them.

Speaker 10 This edge-of-your-seat revenge thriller unravels a deliciously dark mystery in a world full of wealth, secrets, and betrayal.

Speaker 12 Malice will constantly keep you on your toes.

Speaker 2 Why is Adam after the Tanner family?

Speaker 9 What lengths will he go to?

Speaker 7 One thing's for sure, the past never stays buried, so keep your enemies close.

Speaker 2 Watch Malice, all episodes now streaming exclusively on Prime Video.

Speaker 26 We know no one's journey is the same.

Speaker 20 That's why Delta Sky Miles lets you do it your way.

Speaker 21 From earning miles on reloads for coffee runs, shopping, and things you do every day, to connecting you to new places and experiences, a Sky Miles membership fits into your lifestyle, letting you do more of what makes you, you.

Speaker 28 It's more than travel.

Speaker 30 It's the membership that flies, dines, streams, rides, and arrives with you.

Speaker 31 Every great journey deserves a great story.

Speaker 21 And when you have a membership that's as unique as you are, there's no telling how your story will unfold or where that journey will take you next.

Speaker 31 SkyMiles is the membership that will be here for all your big and small moments.

Speaker 21 The membership that's there for every solo adventure or family trip.

Speaker 28 The membership that comes with the power of partnership from brands you love.

Speaker 21 The membership that moves with you.

Speaker 27 Learn more at delta.com slash skymiles.

Speaker 16 The story, I think it was Maggie Haberman and John Swan at the New York Times, if I had that right.

Speaker 16 I apologize to the reporter who had this, if it was not them, reported that the Trump administration is already looking at workarounds for not having to go through the normal security clearance process.

Speaker 16 If there's to be another Trump administration, they're going to hire some private vendor, I guess, and change the rules. Talked about all the implications of that.

Speaker 15 Yeah, I mean, they can do it. Look, keep in mind, when you're president, you're the head of the executive branch.

Speaker 15 So everything that falls under the purview of the executive branch that's not explicitly in law, like you can just do it. And even if it is in law and you do it, what are you going to do?

Speaker 15 Is the Congress going to sue you? What if they win? How are they going to force you to change that? So, these are the kinds of questions we're going to have to think about now.

Speaker 15 But, yeah, you look at all the garbage folks, like, and I'm not talking about the supporters. I'm talking about the people that actually worked for Donald Trump, right?

Speaker 15 I'm talking about the Stephen Millers. I'm talking about the whatever.

Speaker 15 These awful people that would never get a security clearance because they've had contacts with foreign agents, they have debts, they have domestic assault charges. I'm thinking of

Speaker 15 whoever, what was his name?

Speaker 16 Parscale. Yeah, Brad Parsal.

Speaker 15 There were two of them. Parscale.
Parscale and then another one. But anyway, yeah, but Parscale.
Oh, yeah.

Speaker 16 Oh, my God. See, this is like, I hope we don't have to remember all these fucking characters from the universe again.
He was the staff secretary.

Speaker 16 I can picture him. Oh, he's such a douche.
Anyway, I can't think of his name. He's the staff secretary guy.

Speaker 15 So you think about anybody that's got arrested on domestic violence, domestic assault, or got convicted on it, can't get a security clearance. But if you change that, you can.

Speaker 15 Or if somebody has a gun charge or somebody has, you know, anything. And again, even just things like too much debt, too much debt to income ratio denies you of a top secret security clearance.

Speaker 15 And let's take Elon Musk for a second.

Speaker 15 Again, if I would have reached out to Vladimir Putin, now I'm talking about not my congressional security clearance, my clearance that I got cleared for in the military.

Speaker 15 If I would have reached out to Vladimir Putin and tried to negotiate things with him, honest to God, if the government found out about it, I mean, if you even, like, if I would have even dated a Russian girl, I could have lost my top secret security clearance for that and probably would have.

Speaker 15 Now, calling Vladimir Putin and negotiating things that affect U.S. policy, your security clearance would be stripped faster than you can even say the word security clearance.

Speaker 15 Why is nobody doing that with Elon Musk?

Speaker 15 He is in a unique place of his own that he can somehow engage in diplomacy against the wishes of the United States government with our chief enemy, but they won't take the fact that he has a security clearance or he's the number one contractor to the federal government.

Speaker 15 To me, again, it's mind-blowing, and it goes to show the vulnerabilities that we have.

Speaker 15 And I'm not here to be like doomsday naysayer, but like if we don't recognize this stuff, we can't fight back against it.

Speaker 15 Because the fact that we haven't talked about this the last 10 years is how we got to this moment we're in.

Speaker 16 No doubt. All right.
I want to close with some Kamala stuff. Arnold got off the couch, said he was endorsing Kamala yesterday, the governator.
Thank you. Could have used it a little bit ago.

Speaker 16 Could have used a couple interviews. Whatever.
We'll take it, though. We'll take it.

Speaker 16 Water's warm. Come on in.
Chris Christie, you're still out there. You're still out there on the beach, you know, laying in that beach chair

Speaker 16 like you were. You can do it.

Speaker 16 You're welcome to get off the beach chair, off the Barka Lounger, off the couch, take the double M ⁇ M box. You can just come on in.
We're going to welcome you with open arms. Very open arms.
Yeah.

Speaker 16 Widely open. Yeah, come on.
So anyway, I'm wondering your thoughts on Arnold.

Speaker 16 And then I got one more thing for you.

Speaker 15 Yeah, I mean, look, it's good. And I think, again,

Speaker 15 you know, what we're up against, what we're competing against is, first off, if there's a so-called Democrat for Trump, it's really people that basically used to be Democrats that became hardcore Trumpers.

Speaker 15 And now they're pretending to be Democrats for Trump. They're not.

Speaker 15 What you're seeing among our uneasy alliance to support democracy, to defend democracy, are people that still kind of hold their, not not really Republican values, because Republican values are no longer that, but like old school Republican values and recognize that Kamala is the best.

Speaker 15 And obviously, Arnold is one of those. And I think the more that these happen, the more it gives those, because there are still people out there that are just like, I can't vote for Kamala.

Speaker 15 It's a Democrat. My whole identity is wrapped in my politics.

Speaker 15 But the more and more people that do this give them permission to say, okay, my dad, for the first time, voted for a Democrat, you know, and I don't think he liked doing it.

Speaker 16 Much love, Mr. Kinzinger.
Yeah.

Speaker 15 And part of it was probably to support me, I'm sure, and the things I've been through. But the fact that there are more and more people make it easier for somebody like him.

Speaker 15 And so I think it's great that Arnold's done this.

Speaker 16 I concur. Rob Porter was the guy's name.
So, you know, I don't want you to feel like you can just disappear into obscurity.

Speaker 16 Rob Porter was the staff secretary guy that had some domestic abuse issues in the Trump administration. All right.
Lastly, let's end on a positive. You saw Kamala.

Speaker 16 we saw kamala at the ellipse earlier this week i just want to have an updated temperature check for you on the type of campaign she's been running what you're hearing from her particular on the kind of national security stuff that you really care about and how you're feeling in the last few days well i'll start with the only negative thing i can say which is look

Speaker 15 democrats it's not going to happen in the next five days but you need to look longer term at this you need to start being part of defining and this is what i want to be part of too defining for america's young men what is healthy masculinity versus unhealthy masculinity, you know, defending the defenseless, stuff like that.

Speaker 15 You do have a problem with men. You know, I get it that, you know, it's great to have these events where it's all women and all women in the background.

Speaker 15 I think Democrats need to actually do some more events where it's all men and all men in the background.

Speaker 15 It's tough for them, I think, to get past that old muscle memory where everything is identity politics. So that's my only negative thing.

Speaker 15 The fact that Kamala has only been in the race for three months, that she, you know, basically came in six points down where Biden was to where we are today, is I think you could have run this scenario a hundred times and 99 out of 100 would not have ended as good as this one has.

Speaker 15 I think she has done literally everything right. I can't think of a massive mistake and any mistakes I find are just small ones that can happen with any campaign.

Speaker 15 I think it has been a master class in how to run a positive campaign. I say that Democrats kind of feel a little addicted to identity politics.

Speaker 15 I exempt Kamala from that because she's the opposite of that. She doesn't talk about the fact that she's a minority.
She doesn't talk about the fact that she's a woman.

Speaker 15 And frankly, when I was at the DNC and hearing USA chants and I heard and I saw this at the ellipse again, Kamala saying we need a lethal U.S. military.
Democrats never uttered that word.

Speaker 15 And it is brilliant.

Speaker 15 And if you're a Democrat like worried about that, listen, the Republican Party has become what you guys were in the 80s, the blame America crowd, the ho-hum, everything's awful crowd.

Speaker 15 That is now the Republicans. You can be the optimistic, proud American crowd and take that real estate back.
So my view is this.

Speaker 15 This has been probably one of the most flawlessly run campaigns that we possibly could have. There's still five days left, so God knock on wood, please.

Speaker 15 But my feeling is last week, I was basically saying, I think she's going to lose. Today, I feel much, much more confident that she can win, but there is no doubt it's a dead tie.

Speaker 15 It's a dead tie, but it feels like there is a little momentum on her side and in a tie that matters, that matters a lot.

Speaker 16 All right. I agree.
You know, we have the men that like know how to cry, you know, and I love those kind of men. I'm one of those, but we can expand.
We can expand out.

Speaker 16 We can expand out from there, hopefully enough to get across the finish line. Adam Kinzinger, I appreciate you so much.
I appreciate your service to the country, your clear-eyed nature on this.

Speaker 16 And the next time I see you, we'll have a president-elect. God willing, it's president-elect Kamala Harris.

Speaker 15 You bet. Great to see you, buddy.
Good, good hanging out.

Speaker 16 Thanks so much to Adam Kinziger. We'll be back tomorrow.
We're gonna do something a little different tomorrow. It's Friday, it's before the election.

Speaker 16 We're gonna have all your faves next week for election week. So I'm gonna bring a new voice into the board podcast tomorrow.
I'm looking forward to it. We'll see you all then.
Peace.

Speaker 16 I

Speaker 16 only ride

Speaker 16 in the night

Speaker 16 Some

Speaker 16 drown

Speaker 16 in the wars of home

Speaker 16 But nothing

Speaker 16 fades

Speaker 16 like the light

Speaker 16 Blackened houses, morning skies

Speaker 16 on my mind

Speaker 16 April showers,

Speaker 16 June is the same

Speaker 16 in your eyes

Speaker 16 Something tells me you know why I lie

Speaker 16 But nothing

Speaker 16 fades

Speaker 16 like the light

Speaker 16 The Bullard Podcast is produced by Katie Cooper with audio engineering and editing by Jason Brown.

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Speaker 26 We know no one's journey is the same.

Speaker 27 That's why Delta Skymiles moves with you.

Speaker 21 From earning miles on reloads for coffee runs, shopping, and things you do every day to connecting you to new experiences.

Speaker 28 A Sky Miles membership fits into your lifestyle, letting you do more of what makes you, you. It's more than travel.

Speaker 30 It's the membership that flies, dines, streams, rides, and arrives with you.

Speaker 21 Because when you have a membership that's as unique as you are, there's no telling where your journey will take you next.

Speaker 28 Learn more at delta.com/slash skymiles.