Is Elon Musk Failing Shareholders? Teaching Kids About Money, and Scott’s Wildest Fan Encounter

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Speaker 2 Welcome to Office Hours with ProfG. This is the part of the show where we answer your questions about business, big tech, entrepreneurship, and whatever else is on your mind.

Speaker 2 Today, we have two great listener questions questions lined up. And then after the break, we're continuing our new segment, The Reddit Hotline, where we pull questions straight from Reddit.

Speaker 2 If you'd like to submit a question for next time, you can send a voice recording to officehours at profitmedia.com. Again, that's officehours at profitmedia.com.

Speaker 2 Or if you prefer to ask on Reddit, post your question on the Scott Galloway subreddit. Jesus Christ, that's something I never thought I would say, Scott Galloway subreddit.

Speaker 2 And we just might feature it in our next episode. What a thrill.

Speaker 2 Let's bust right into it. First question: I have not heard or seen these questions.

Speaker 2 Hey, Prof. G.

Speaker 2 Given the recent performance of the stock and his dual roles as the CEO of Tesla and chief Doge Douche, is there a point where Elon's divided attention and or ever-increasing negative public perception become a violation of his fiduciary responsibility to shareholders?

Speaker 2 Thanks for all you do. Jacob in Kansas City.
Jacob in Kansas City. So, yeah,

Speaker 2 but he doesn't have a board. So this is how corporate corporate governance works.
Shareholders elect the board and the board really has two jobs.

Speaker 2 They're supposed to, one, what does it mean to be a fiduciary? I love the word fiduciary. I think it's a fantastic word.

Speaker 2 And that is once you have your deal, once you say, okay, I'm getting paid X, your job is then, as a fiduciary, to represent the interests of others. I love that.

Speaker 2 When someone asks you to be their fiduciary for their estate, that's a real compliment because what they're saying is, I think you can represent other people.

Speaker 2 I think you have the skills to represent somebody else. And also, you have the integrity to think about or look at the lens of decision-making through other people.
It's very difficult.

Speaker 2 Other than instincts, then one of the things that separates us from the animals is that we have the ability to be just better fiduciaries. We can represent society.

Speaker 2 We can represent people that we will never meet. I mean, I guess the board really has two jobs other than being good fiduciaries.

Speaker 2 And then where you become a good fiduciary, you kind of have two things. One, the chair of the audit committee just needs to make sure there's not fraud and no surprises.

Speaker 2 And then the other two real responsibilities of the board are one, when to hire and fire the CEO, CEO, and two, when to sell, and if and when to sell the company.

Speaker 2 But your primary job is to make sure you have the right guy or gal running the company.

Speaker 2 That's the most important decision they make. I have found with almost every company I'm with, if you have the right guy or gal, things work out.

Speaker 2 If you don't have the right guy or gal, it's just not going to go well. A good board can't save a bad CEO.
A bad board can probably fuck up a good CEO.

Speaker 2 But it really is about finding the right person and then having the sober conversation with other board members who the CEO tends to weaponize and play golf with and help get their kids into the school he went to.

Speaker 2 And before you know it, you have a board that is just their buddies. I have a four-year statute of limitations.
I leave every board within four years because I want to do a series of different things.

Speaker 2 And I also find that boards need churn.

Speaker 2 And on every board I've been on, there's at least one or two people, if not three or four, that are golfing buddies with the CEO and just don't objectively evaluate the CEO.

Speaker 2 And the CEO likes that because they don't want to be objectively evaluated. They want a a board that's going to continue to increase their compensation and agree with them and provide advice.

Speaker 2 Is that fair? Some CEOs do like pushback.

Speaker 2 It's probably somewhere in the middle. Anyways, in the case of Tesla, the board there has made so much fucking money, they would let him, I don't know,

Speaker 2 kill puppies on live TV and they'd say, oh, he's a genius.

Speaker 2 That's a strategy around autonomous driving.

Speaker 2 The chairman of the board, I think, has made $150 or $200 million. So her job is just to make excuses for his behavior.
He was, he basically engaged in market manipulation or securities fraud.

Speaker 2 He said that he was taking the company private at $420 a share and that the funding was secured and the stock skyrocketed. And then it ended up that, what do you know? He was probably on ketamine.

Speaker 2 That was a lie. And then the stock fell.
So anyone who bought the stock thinking that was credible information is owed money by Tesla, whose CEO was lying to them.

Speaker 2 And what does the board do of 499 of the SP 500 companies? They fire this all right, boss. You're in trouble.

Speaker 2 At a minimum, they would say, you need to go on a rehab, and maybe we give you your job back, but unlikely. Anyways, they have not done their job.
They're not fiduciaries.

Speaker 2 They made so much money that they're basically the worst board now. He could absolutely leave Tesla.
Why?

Speaker 2 Because to his credit, he does what a good CEO is supposed to do, and that is he builds a really strong team.

Speaker 2 Supposedly, the way they describe him at Neuralink or at SpaceX now is he shows up, gives a bunch of speeches, kicks over a bunch of trash cans, and then he leaves and they get back to work.

Speaker 2 He's clearly a visionary.

Speaker 2 But what people don't appreciate or what he doesn't get the credit he deserves for is that he clearly can put together really talented management teams such that even when he's off impregnating anyone he can find at a conservative CPAC conference such that they can give birth to someone he will ignore and then ultimately get sued for sole custody of that child because he hasn't seen them.

Speaker 2 That, all right, he's able to do all these different things because he's put in place competent management teams.

Speaker 2 Now, having said that, typically what happens in competitive markets is that a company establishes differentiation based on technology or distribution channel, which translates to margin power, which translates to above-market shareholder gains.

Speaker 2 And then the rest of the market goes, huh, maybe electric cars are the thing. Huh, maybe tune-ups over the airwaves are something.

Speaker 2 Huh, maybe we can come up with better battery technology, see, above BYD. And the differentiation gets reverse engineered out.

Speaker 2 The margins or unkind of irrational margins get starched out, and the company just trades within a normal trading range. The majority of car companies trade it somewhere between, I don't know,

Speaker 2 six or eight and twenty times earnings. And this company, C Abub, is trading at 144.
And that's what I think we're about to see over the next 12 months. This is not financial advice.

Speaker 2 I have been wrong on Tesla over and over and over. But if this stock was trading at the same multiple as other car companies, it'd be trading at about 14 bucks a share.

Speaker 2 And I think today it's at 260 or 270. So, yes, they have violated their fiduciary duty.
Thanks for the question. Question number two.

Speaker 3 Hello, my name is Clara. I'm from California.
I have a 15-year-old grandson who is desperate to learn something about money. He wants to learn about money.

Speaker 3 Unfortunately, neither his parents nor I have a clue as to how to guide him.

Speaker 3 His school is of no use in that regard. What do you suggest? Thank you.

Speaker 2 Claire, I love this question. 15.
So my son is 14 and he's constantly asking me, how can I make some money, Dad?

Speaker 2 And I sit down with him and I say, all right, let's go to ChatGPT and let's say, all right, I'm a 14-year-old. I have a little bit of money.
I'm good with technology. I'm super into

Speaker 2 football, soccer. How can I make extra money? And it comes back with five ideas, including buying shirts.

Speaker 2 unprinted shirts, football shirts, and then figuring out a way to embroider them or put cool stuff on them using Shopify for the back end. And we'll do this together.
And then another idea was

Speaker 2 the AI suggested that we buy sneakers during sneaker drops at Nike and then try and resell them. And you have to have some money.
Some of the times the sneaker drops are $150 or $200.

Speaker 2 But he learns about it. He learns about taking risks.
He learns about trying to examine the market, look at data. Customer service.
You got to ship those shoes once you get them to a buyer.

Speaker 2 How much money did he make? Well, it ends up with shipping and everything and taxes. We lost a little bit of money, but that's a life lesson too.

Speaker 2 So I think the way you learn about money to a certain extent, if you're talking about money, is you start a little bit of a small business. I've been an entrepreneur my whole life.

Speaker 2 I started walking dogs when I was his age to try and make some money.

Speaker 2 Now, in terms of learning the markets for money when you're 15, I don't know if it's too early for him to be reading the front page of the Wall Street Journal, but I love that you're involved in your grandson's life.

Speaker 2 What a gift. What a gift for you.
And what a gift for him that you're thinking this way.

Speaker 2 So to the extent that he's willing, read the front page of the Wall Street Journal, those little bullets, and then discuss them with him and say, you know, what does it mean? What are earnings?

Speaker 2 Also, I think an interesting way to learn about the markets, when I was 13, I wasn't very popular. I know that's hard to believe.
I know that's hard to believe. And my mom's boyfriend.

Speaker 2 gave me $200. By the way, he had his own family.
We were the second family, but that's an entirely different story.

Speaker 2 But he gave me $200 and said, if I get back next next weekend and you haven't bought stock, go to one of those fancy brokerages in Westwood. I want my $200 back.

Speaker 2 So I went down to Dean Witter Reynolds, I think it was, and I met this guy named Cy Serro. This was literally 45 years ago.
And I walked in with $200 and I ended up buying.

Speaker 2 He came out and introduced himself. We bought.
12 shares or 16 shares in Columbia Pictures. And I used to call him from the Emerson Jr.
High phone booth and ask what the stock had done that day.

Speaker 2 And then he would give me a lesson on why the stock moved. He said, okay, there's buyers and there's sellers.

Speaker 2 When there's more buyers one day than there are sellers, the sellers get to increase the price or the buyers, actually, the buyers have to increase their bid such that they can attract more sellers into the market to sell those shares.

Speaker 2 And then where they two meet is the market. And these platforms are market makers.
That would be a lesson. And then he would say, okay, I would say, why is the stock up today?

Speaker 2 He said, well, close encounters of the third kind is a hit. I'm dating myself.
Why is the stock down today? Well, Casey's shadow is a bomb. And I start learning about the market.

Speaker 2 So maybe reading together the front page of the Wall Street Journal and discussing it, maybe buying a couple of shares in stock, download the public app and buy a couple of shares in companies and say, why do you want to buy this company?

Speaker 2 Discuss it with them. I've made a good amount of money starting and selling businesses, but where I've made a crazy amount of money is investing in stocks.

Speaker 2 And I go back to that moment where I walked into a brokerage and I used to call Sy

Speaker 2 from Emerson Junior High School and talk about the markets. It gave me a love for the markets.
It got me thinking about investing early and often.

Speaker 2 And just a quick side note: Cy and I are still in touch. 45 years later, every Christmas, my birthday, Father's Day, he sends me a nice text message to say that he hopes I am doing well.

Speaker 2 Anyways, Clara from California, thanks for the question.

Speaker 2 We have one quick break, and when we're back, we're diving into the depths of Reddit, the bounds of Reddit.

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Speaker 2 Welcome back. We asked and read it delivered.
Let's bust right into it.

Speaker 2 Our first question comes from Pancake Gold E, as in Goldie Han. Huh, that's weird.
They say, okay, okay, what is the craziest fan encounter you've ever had? Generally speaking, they're not crazy.

Speaker 2 Generally speaking, they're

Speaker 2 super lovely.

Speaker 2 I don't know if it's a good or a bad thing. I had breakfast today and we're talking about addictions.
I think that every person has a certain level of addiction.

Speaker 2 It's just important to be in touch with it. Addictions are for survival.
You're supposed to be addicted to gorging food because there was an absence of salty, sugar, and fattery food.

Speaker 2 But now that industrial production has vastly outpaced our instincts, we gorge even when we don't need to. But there's a reason for addictions.

Speaker 2 I'm addicted to the affirmation of others, specifically strangers, but I can modulate it. I can realize that, okay, what's really important is to have your friends and family love you.

Speaker 2 That's like job number one. And if strangers don't like you on threads or on Blue Sky, you know,

Speaker 2 is that relevant? Yeah, is it meaningful? Maybe. Is it profound? Absolutely not.
I've gotten much better at that. I don't get as rattled by strangers' comments anymore.

Speaker 2 Actually, I kind of stopped reading the comments. I want to write and act as if no one's reading or as if no one's commenting.

Speaker 2 It's like I've always thought the people I just so admire, the people at restaurants where I'm on vacation and a good song comes on and they get up and they dance on the table like no one's watching them.

Speaker 2 I like really, I think you want to live your life that way. I think the most successful people in the world have one thing in common, and that is they dance as if no one's watching them.

Speaker 2 I try and remember that when I dance, I try and think, well, what happens when I'm home alone? Like after when Trump was elected, I literally the next morning spent the entire entire day,

Speaker 2 entire day experimenting with Xanax and Peroni, or as I call it, my panics method. And I found out that I am an outstanding dancer to 80s music.
The dogs were totally freaked out. Didn't matter.

Speaker 2 I have incredible moves to the straight line beats of George Michael, Tom Petty, R.E.M.

Speaker 2 I mean, I can just fucking, I can just burn up the rug in my pajamas with a Peroni in hand and with a little bit of, little bit of Xanax kind of helping daddy, helping daddy give a little bit of that rhythm that every 49 year old white guy has is that racist is that racist anyways probably hate Graham

Speaker 2 so when I get fan encounters they're really nice people come up to me they're super wonderful they want to take photos even when they disagree with me they go I the most common comment I get hands down is the best comment and it's the following and people say the following while I don't always agree with you you make me think and that's folks that's why I'm here.

Speaker 2 If I'm just reinforcing your current beliefs, then I'm just fucking Fox News, tickling your censors and dividing America.

Speaker 2 The whole idea is to occasionally, and I do this sometimes, sometimes I'll say something I know coming out of my mouth, I don't know if that's right, but it's provocative and I want people to think.

Speaker 2 I want us to look at the issue from all different angles and think, are we getting this right and wrong such that we can express different viewpoints and hopefully craft better solutions and learn and stretch and strain and damage the muscle in between our ears ears such that it grows back stronger.

Speaker 2 Anyways, I can't tell you how lovely the encounters are. The craziest ones.
One comes to mind.

Speaker 2 I was at Cannes and this guy came up, this nice guy in kind of a leather jacket. I was saying, why is he in a leather jacket? It's so warm.
And he came out and he's like, I love your videos.

Speaker 2 And I had a line actually develop. I'm kind of a big deal at Cannes.
Anyways, and there was a line of people who wanted to say hi or get their books signed. So he said, I love your video.

Speaker 2 I'm like, great. Do you want to get a picture? And he was sort of like, well, okay.
And we took a quick picture and I said, boss, big line. He started asking me a question.
I cut him off.

Speaker 2 I said, I really apologize, but I got to get through the rest of the line. He said, oh, I understand.
And he left. And then the next person comes up and goes, you know, that was Jensen Huang, right?

Speaker 2 That's the CEO of Nvidia, who's built an amazing company that's worth more than Intel. And I didn't know what to do.
And I turned around and went, Jensen, Jensen. He'd already walked off.

Speaker 2 He did need to hang out with me. Anyways, that was sort of funny.
Is there another one?

Speaker 2 Is there another one?

Speaker 2 Someone, when I was in, where was I? I was in LA, said, wait for a minute, wait for a minute.

Speaker 2 And she pulled her kid out of the car and it was like a three-year-old and she held the baby in her arms and she said, Johnny, Johnny, what do you say? What do you say when the radio comes on?

Speaker 2 And he went, go, go, go. Because I guess they listen to my podcast in the car and his favorite part is when they say, when I say, go, go, go.

Speaker 2 So in general, they haven't been that crazy, but what they have been is lovely.

Speaker 2 And I've often said, or I believe that LLMs, it's a shame that LLMs are crawling the online world because I think the online world is, while fascinating and interesting and can be inspiring, there's a lot of toxicity and it is a bit of a cesspool.

Speaker 2 But on the whole, I find in general people out in the real world are really nice and I don't always find that online, but nothing that crazy, just mostly really lovely.

Speaker 2 And I really do appreciate when people come up and say hi. It's really nice for me, really rewarding.
Thanks for the question.

Speaker 2 Next and last question, a faceless void reads, before having kids, where did you find meaning in your your life? Whoa.

Speaker 2 Before kids, where did you find meaning in your life?

Speaker 2 I don't think I did.

Speaker 2 I had motivation.

Speaker 2 I grew up without money or without enough money.

Speaker 2 And I quickly learned in a capitalist society that your ability to take care, I would say the reason I'm rich is

Speaker 2 because of, I mean, there's a lot of reasons.

Speaker 2 the generosity and vision of California taxpayers and the Regency University of California that let unremarkable kids into UCLA, 76% admissions rate, 2.27 GPA at UCLA, then got into Berkeley.

Speaker 2 So public, I'm a product of big governments. The United States government, being born in America,

Speaker 2 the United States and all of the sacrifice and commitment people have made to build this incredible infrastructure, these incredible public works, including the University of California, is a key component of my success.

Speaker 2 Two, or maybe it's one, the irrational passion for my well-being of my mother. But every day in small and big ways, she told me she loved me.

Speaker 2 And if you do that with a child, I think over time they start to believe you. And I think that's really important.
The thing that was most motivating for me was women, specifically two types of women.

Speaker 2 And one's a Hallmark story and the other's like kind of crass. The first is I wanted to take care of my mom.

Speaker 2 I got, My mom got very sick when I was in graduate school, and it was the most kind of rattling, traumatizing thing I've ever been through because I didn't, I wasn't capable of taking care of her because I was in graduate school.

Speaker 2 I didn't have any money and

Speaker 2 she was discharged from the hospital early and it was just a very ugly situation and I didn't know what to do and I felt powerless.

Speaker 2 And that was the first time I really felt this sort of masculine instinct kicking in that I'm the man of the house. It's me and my mom.

Speaker 2 I am supposed to take care of my mom who took great care of me and I couldn't. And it was just incredibly humiliating and upsetting.

Speaker 2 And I thought, all right, there's a lot of things outside of your control in terms of making money, but the things that are in your control, getting your shit together, being disciplined, working really hard, none of which I had done to that point, I decided, all right, that's it.

Speaker 2 I'm going to, I got to get my act together because I got to take care of my mom.

Speaker 2 And from that point forward, quite frankly, I just worked all the fucking time, took a lot of risks, and really tried hard to

Speaker 2 make money. Money was my motivation.
And then the second thing also involves women, and that is I wanted women in my life. I wanted romantic and sexual partners in my life.

Speaker 2 And I noticed I did the math pretty early that women seemed to be attracted to guys who had their shit together and could signal resources.

Speaker 2 So for me, my motivation, I don't really think I had meaning, was making money. And I'm not proud of that, but that's the truth.

Speaker 2 Up until the age of 45, my identity and my motivation was to be economically secure so I could take care of my mom and be more attracted to potential mates and also just be relevant to other men and be interesting.

Speaker 2 It wasn't even about living well. Like I wasn't addicted to things.
I didn't, you know, I never like had fat cars or anything like that. I lived well.

Speaker 2 I didn't deny myself of anything, but it wasn't, that wasn't the motivation. The motivation for me was relationships specifically to take care of loved ones and to be, you know, to find a great mate.

Speaker 2 That was my motivation. I did not have purpose in my life and I kind of knew it.
I kind of knew like, I don't know what this is all about.

Speaker 2 I can't get enough of anything. I can't get enough of experiences.
I can't get enough of money. I can't get enough of dating.
I can't get enough of anything.

Speaker 2 I recognized that I was like a hunger monster. And when I had kids, which I didn't want to have, I didn't want to have.
I was with a partner who was, you know, higher character, much hotter than me.

Speaker 2 And she basically said, I want to have kids. And I said, well, I don't want to have kids because I don't want to get married.
And she said, I don't need to get married.

Speaker 2 She's called my bluff to have kids. And boom, we pulled the goalie for like three minutes and she was pregnant.

Speaker 2 The dog is fertile. That's right.

Speaker 2 Anyways, when that kid came rotating out of my girlfriend, I felt tremendous anxiety at first, not like, oh, I have purpose because it was a rough time for me economically.

Speaker 2 And I felt shame that I already wasn't taking care of him.

Speaker 2 Jesus Christ, I think about the two hardest moments: coming home, not being able to take care of my mom, and feeling as if I failed my brand new son.

Speaker 2 But slowly but surely, and Frasier Crane said this on the Frasier show, that

Speaker 2 you don't immediately love your kids, but you fall in love with them. I found that to be true.
And I have found

Speaker 2 that caring more about these kids than I care about myself is an unlock. It's relaxing.
What are you doing this weekend? Shit, I don't know. It's Friday.
I need to be fucking fabulous. I'm a baller.

Speaker 2 I'm living in New York. I'm a tech guy.
I need to be around super interesting people at super interesting venues and be with super hot women and do incredible things.

Speaker 2 And then, okay, next weekend, how do we raise the bar? Once you have kids, oh, what are you doing? Oh, I'm going to soccer practice. What are you doing? Yeah, it's the same soccer practice.

Speaker 2 And I'm going to some lame birthday party on Sunday with all the other dads to give their partners a break.

Speaker 2 At first, it's like, this fucking sucks. And then it becomes sort of relaxing.
It's like, okay, that's what I do. I'm dad.
That's what I do.

Speaker 2 And being involved or caring more about someone else than you care about yourself has been incredibly cathartic for me. And I do finally have my purpose.

Speaker 2 My purpose is to raise loving, patriotic men. I want

Speaker 2 boys who will find a good partner. I try to be really good to their mother.
I model that. I try to motivate them to a variety of things.

Speaker 2 And I want them to be patriotic, not only to their country, but to the world, to think about the human race, to be good, kind to others, build a better world, and absolutely build a better country.

Speaker 2 And that's my purpose. That will be the last thing I think that will run through my mind is that I want, have I done that? Have I tried to model that behavior? Have I given them the resources? So

Speaker 2 it's really nice to feel a sense of purpose. In a weird way, just to get existential, I'm not ready to die, but I feel like it's no longer going to be a tragedy.

Speaker 2 I feel like I've mostly accomplished that. We'll see.
They're still young. But it just makes the idea, when I was young, the idea of dying was just terrifying to me, as it should be.

Speaker 2 And now I'd like to be around for another 50 years. But if I'm not,

Speaker 2 I've kind of checked the box. And that is, I have produced offspring that I think will add more value to the world than I've added.

Speaker 2 And at the end of the day, that is our, really our core and only mission here is to produce, in my view, or make the world a better place.

Speaker 2 And one way you can do that is by producing offspring that are smarter, stronger, faster than you. And it's so nice to have that purpose.
I'm not saying everyone needs that to have purpose.

Speaker 2 But that was where I found mine. But pre-kids, I didn't have meaning.
What I had was motivation. and my motivation in a capitalist society was quite frankly money.
Thanks for the question.

Speaker 2 That's all for this episode. If you'd like to submit a question, please email a voice recording to officehours at profitmedia.com.
Again, that's officehours at prop2media.com.

Speaker 2 Or if you prefer to ask Reddit, just post your question on the Scott Galloway subreddit, and we just might feature it in our next Reddit hotline segment.

Speaker 2 This episode was produced by Jennifer Sanchez. Our intern is Dan Shalon.
Drew Burroughs is our technical director. Thank you for listening to the Profit Pod from the Vox Media Podcast Network.

Speaker 2 We will catch you on Saturday for No Mercy, No Malice, as read by George Hahn. And please follow our Profit Markets pod wherever you get your pods for new episodes every Monday and Thursday.

Speaker 4 All right, remember, the machine knows if you're lying. First statement, Carvana will give you a real real offer on your car all online.
False. True, actually.
You can sell your car in minutes.

Speaker 7 False? That's gotta be.

Speaker 4 True again. Carvana will pick up your car from your door, or you can drop it off at one of their car vending machines.

Speaker 7 Sounds too good to be true, so true.

Speaker 4 Finally caught on. Nice job.
Honesty isn't just their policy, it's their entire model. Sell your car today, too.
Carvana! Pickup fees may apply.

Speaker 8 Support for this show comes from Volkswagen. As the U.S.

Speaker 8 gets ready to host soccer's biggest moment on a worldwide stage, Volkswagen is helping people discover new turfs and new ways to play the beautiful game right here in the U.S.

Speaker 8 From deaf and power wheelchair soccer to beach and futsal, Volkswagen is actively supporting all the communities and teams within the U.S. soccer ecosystem.

Speaker 8 They're supporting talent from across the U.S. soccer extended national teams and are focused on helping to give these less widely known forms of soccer a platform moving forward.

Speaker 8 From the pitch to the sand and everything in between, welcome to our turf.

Speaker 9 Mercury knows that to an entrepreneur, every financial move means more. An international wire means working with the best contractors on any continent.

Speaker 9 A credit card on day one means creating an ad campaign on day two. And a business loan means loading up on inventory for Black Friday.

Speaker 9 That's why Mercury offers banking that does more, all in one place, so that doing just about anything with your money feels effortless. Visit Mercury.com to learn more.

Speaker 9 Mercury is a financial technology company, not a bank. Banking services provided through Choice Financial Group column NA and Evolve Bank and Trust members FDIC.