Raging Moderates: Why Jimmy Kimmel Returned

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Welcome to Raging Moderates.

I'm Scott Galloway.

And I'm Jessica Tarlove.

Jess, how are you?

It's time for banter.

Shanatova.

Yes.

Let's jew it up.

Right back at you.

I did not know this, but our producer, David Toledo, grew up near me in the valley and went to school.

Oh, I didn't know that either.

Yeah, and went to school with all my buddies who ended up populating my fraternity at ZBT, where I ended up rushing because I heard they had live-in spaces, and I didn't want to live with my mom the rest of my life.

And it ended up being a Jewish fraternity.

And anyways, David, is David Jewish?

He doesn't look Jewish.

He looks a little too tall.

He's not honorary, though.

So David's like

an employee and kind of a second son because he comes from this area that your friends populated.

Yeah, I immediately think of him as the son I never had.

You put words in my mouth.

Yes, David, you're a huge disappointment to me, and the best part of you ran down my leg.

That's what I tell my sons.

Is that wrong?

Don't say that during Russia, Shana.

Is that wrong?

I don't go.

Yeah.

You had to bring religion into it.

Well, yeah, we we started with Shanatova.

Yeah, no, if he's, if he's, uh, if he's going to be my son, I've got to figure out a way to constantly communicate what a disappointment it is to me.

As long as you leave him money, which I think is what we're all working towards.

Yeah, that's, I plan to spend it all.

I'm, um, and I'm getting, I think I'm tracking.

I think I'm going to leave them with almost nothing.

Do they know that?

My kids, well, your kids are too young.

My kids are shockingly, I don't know where they got it.

They have really good values around money.

I took my son, you know, I want to live my life.

The bad news is talking about kids for a minute, and I think you'll find this, or I found it.

I have a favorite.

That's the bad news.

What?

Yeah, I have a favorite.

You know, we're in public.

Yeah, I know.

I know.

Whatever.

At this point, you know, whatever.

Counsel me, Bob Iger.

So,

but that's the bad news.

The good news is, is it switches?

Like, I go through phases where I'm really into an Alec phase and I'm really into a Nolan phase.

And the reason I think I'm

so fond of my oldest is that he's a mini-me.

I mean, literally, like when I hug him, it's like hugging my 18-year-old self.

And he just looks like me.

He kind of acts like me.

He's just me as a younger man.

And then the reason I'm so sort of just fascinated by his younger brother, Nolan, is it's as if we're from a different species.

He's just so, he couldn't be more different than me.

And I just find him.

Is he just your partner?

Like, is he a total reflection of her or he's an alien to everyone?

Yeah, he's, he's, I guess, but I didn't know her as a child.

So he's just so different.

I mean, I'm just, he doesn't look like me.

He doesn't, in no way behaves like me, interested in different things.

And it's, it's just kind of fascinating to watch someone.

see the world with a totally different perspective than yours.

So, but yeah, I'm uh the fun of this, right?

It is the fun of it.

Yeah.

Anyways, this has been, this has been an unusual banter, but I think we should get to the

get to the actual news of the day.

Slow news day.

We're going to talk about why Jimmy Kimmel returned, Trump's unproven medical advice on autism, acetamenophen, you fucking idiot, and how the White House is being remodeled in Trump's taste.

All right, let's get into it.

On Monday, we got a Rosh Hashanah miracle.

There's that, there's that David Toledo.

That's right.

There's that Judaism creeping in.

ABC and the Walt Disney Company announced Jimmy Kimmel would return after a brief suspension that set off a nationwide backlash.

Media critics, Hollywood unions, celebrities, and even some Republican leaders, including Senators Ted Cruz and Rand Paul, condemned it as an attack on free speech.

Online, fans threatened boycotts of Disney, Nexstar, and Sinclair Station, framing the decision as a dangerous precedent for political pressure on the media.

Jess, what do you think of Disney's walking this decision back?

Brendan Carr really fucked up, huh?

I mean, this, the need to run

to get in front of a camera

will always be the downfall of these Trump appointees and people in Trump's orbit.

If he had just kept his mouth closed, he perhaps could have gotten away with it and found some other way to signal to, you know.

Sinclair and Nexstar what was a, what was being planned.

But I think there's a good pro-democracy message laced in here, which is you are not powerless.

And that has been the big concern since Trump came back into office.

Like, what can we do?

And you can cancel your subscription.

If you're one of those adults that wants a Disney wedding, you can cancel your $150,000 wedding.

And guess what?

They're going to pay attention to that.

I also think, you know, it's a very bad day for those folks who were arguing that this was just a straight-up business decision because it's very clear that that is not the case and that Brendan Carr played such an important role in pulling Jimmy Kimmel off air and then getting him back on air.

So NetNet, you know, good day for democracy, good day for the First Amendment.

A lot of pressure on Jimmy Kimmel, though.

It'll be interesting to see, you know, what he has in his monologue.

And when we recorded that rapid response video, organic plug for our YouTube.

Please subscribe to the Raging Moderates YouTube channel because Scott and I are posting there all the time.

You know, I said, what's been nice about this is it's really felt like a grassroots movement.

I think that that letter that the ACLU organized with over, you know, 400 artists and entertainers, actors, et cetera, that signed on Meryl Streep, Tom Hanks, Selena Gomez, et cetera, made a big impact.

And things like Zoran Mamdani saying that he wouldn't participate in a town hall that would be televised on ABC because ABC doesn't support the First Amendment.

You know, people hear about those things and they take stock of it.

And ABC has already capitulated to Trump once in paying the settlement over George Stephanopoulos.

And hopefully this is the start of saying, I'm not so fast.

I'm not going to bend the knee that easily.

What's your updated thinking?

Yeah, I just, I'm fascinated by corporate communications.

And corporate communications has been

one of the greatest ROIs for corporate America.

And that is they are spending money on AI, obviously increasing that, increasing money on direct-to-consumer technologies, what have you.

But the greatest increase on a percentage level across corporate America has been in corporate comms.

And that is, they recognize that increasingly companies used to

a stock that was in the steel sector or in the weapon sector or in the technology sector would trade within a fairly narrow bound of a multiple in EBITDA.

And who traded at the high end usually had better positioning, better brands, and a CEO who's a little bit more charismatic.

Now the band of the multiple on EBITDA or earnings is so dramatic.

And much of it is about the storytelling capabilities of the CEO.

Amazon was essentially a company built on a story.

And that is, if you read Amazon's or Jeff Bezos' 1997 letter to shareholders, you just wanted to go out and buy stock, and you did, which gave them access to such incredibly cheap capital, they could buy more planes, build more warehouses, hire more logistics people, and get you basically anything in the world for free with Amazon Prime within 48 hours.

And no one else had the capital to go to war with Amazon, and they just kind of blew everyone out of the water.

So you're sort of your storytelling capabilities here have become incredibly powerful.

And so corporate communications departments have been just booming and hiring more people.

It's all about the story.

And then when Alexander Karp, is that his name, the CEO of Palantir, does this really innovative thing where he walks around his office doing the earnings call live on Instagram, everyone's like, wow, this company is so innovative.

And the company trades at 100 times revenues, which makes absolutely fucking lutely no sense.

So, and also

Elon Musk commands $1 to $3 billion in...

earned media by just being crazy and being on Twitter all the time and has a huge advantage versus General Motors.

And no one really cares what Mary Barra says or threads or tweets.

So, Tesla gets all this incredible free advertising because of, in some ways, storytelling or just having a blowhorn.

So,

this press release from Disney,

it can go wrong, though.

And this press release, I would describe, is being gangbanged by what must have been two dozen crisis management experts who were parsing every word and ended up with a press release that was milquetoast and totally disingenuous.

They said after discussions with Jimmy Kimmel, we further understand,

you know, we decided to bring him back.

They don't give a flying fuck what Jimmy Kimmel thought.

I mean, what, they didn't think to do this before they fired him.

And then they'd also said that because of some ill-timed and insensitive comments, they decided to bring the show.

Ill-timed and

insensitive?

We have said, there isn't a, I don't think there is a progressive

media personality or even a conservative comedian who hasn't said things much more quote-unquote insensitive.

And here's the thing:

you don't need a First Amendment when people say things slightly insensitive.

You need a First Amendment when people say really stupid, provocative, angry shit.

There are some limits.

You can't incite violence.

You can't spread lies about somebody that hurt their economic livelihood.

That's defamation.

But other than that, a hallmark of a free society is you can pretty much say anything about pretty much anyone at pretty much any time.

And so the infraction here of not even a speeding ticket and then firing him and then pretending that after speaking to him and that these were ill-timed comments,

they continue to lie.

This is the bottom line.

This is about money,

full stop.

And that is, they recognize someone called and said, our site is crashing because so many people are trying to cancel Hulu, ESPN, and Disney Plus.

We are getting calls from our cruise line saying people are canceling.

We just heard from, I don't know, Zendaya that she doesn't,

her agent is worried that she should pull out of a movie because of what is going on here.

And they got together and said, oh, it's costing money.

Let's backtrack.

This is a prime example of how societies...

continue a downward spiral into fascism.

They have a strong man,

and this isn't the first time Bob Iger has really fucked up.

You know, he's the one who initially started this bullshit by settling with, you know, over the whole George Stephanie Ombuds, settling with Trump.

And when you throw, you know, when you think the alligators around you, and if you just cut off a finger and give it to them, be clear, they're going to come back for the arm.

And so they started this.

They were the first ones.

They could have been the front lines and said no and sent a signal.

And just FYI,

Jess, I'm going to buy $10 million in equity and then be the beneficial owner of another $10 million in Disney stock, file a 13D to replace the entire board and fire Bob Iger, who has shown that he is not only a terrible fiduciary for all Americans, has no fidelity to the principles that have made him a billionaire so he could walk around in cashmere sweaters and go to the Oscars, but he should be fired.

They fired the wrong guy.

This guy,

okay, any one of these things, you could say, all right, he made a mistake.

This guy is clearly the 73-year-old Bob Iger clearly doesn't understand the atmosphere.

Let's ignore the fact that he is a terrible American.

Bob Iger, you are a terrible American.

You have turned your back on the ideals and the principles that have made you a fucking billionaire and have given you an extraordinary life.

But in addition to that, he clearly has lost all ability to read the room and read the culture and understand new technology and new platforms and what it means to be in the business of media.

There has never been,

I can't think of a CEO in the Fortune 500 that is more ripe to be fired.

There absolutely is someone at Disney right now that should be canceled.

And it should be the CEO.

And also there should be more scrutiny on the board.

A board board is there to save the CEO from him or herself, to go, this could be really bad for us.

And instead, they were listening entirely to what they thought were their consumers, and that is the broadcast station Sinclair and Nexstar, who distribute Jimmy Kimmel across local TV stations.

But this indicates to me that Bob Iger absolutely needs to go.

A terrible American, a terrible fiduciary for shareholders, and someone who has whose judgment, that expiration date has clearly passed.

Your thoughts?

Well, I mean, you made a pretty clear case there.

I wonder if there'll be some scrutiny of Dana Walden as well, who I think is the one that has really the close relationship with Kimmel and was the one who like went and met with him right after the Brendan Carr comments, et cetera.

But I'm sure, and I don't know Bob Iger personally, but he's been rumored to have pretty thin skin.

And seeing Michael Eisner, the ex-CEO of Disney coming after him and saying, you know, what a capitulation.

How could you possibly do something like this really stung.

I'm curious to get your take on the fact that Sinclair is saying that they are not going to start airing Jimmy Kimmel again.

They're in charge of 31 of the affiliates, right, that would normally air it when they took.

Jimmy off air.

Last week, they aired a Charlie Kirk kind of documentary that made him out to be a prophet.

The CEO of Sinclair donated a quarter of a million dollars to Turning Point and I believe is waiting on Kimmel's donation, which I imagine is not coming.

I could see a world in which Kimmel makes a donation to a cause in Charlie Kirk's memory or something like that, but I assume that he's not going to just say, oh, yeah, you know, you said jump.

I say how high.

And now I'm going to give gobs of money to an organization just because you said so versus it's something that I really believe in.

What do you think the future is of the deal that actually set all of this off?

Because Brendan Carr was speaking on Monday at the Concordia summit and tried to backtrack and say, you know, I wasn't right out of goodfellas, as Ted Cruz put it.

I was just saying that the hard way is when you have to actually lodge an FCC complaint.

Everyone sees through it.

Donald Trump sees through it, I'm sure, as well, and knows exactly what's going on here.

But do you, do you think the merger will still go through?

Or what are the kind of business implications of Sinclair saying we're not going to be airing Kimmel?

I think the merger will likely go through because the merger is a function of consolidation and cost cutting, which is happening across this industry because, you know, their audience is literally dying.

Local TV stations, people tune into local TV stations to see a guy who's in his 60s or 70s that they trust.

and a hot woman in her 30s in a sleeveless dress to find the weather, basically, you know, to get get the weather.

And the only reason these things have survived is that two or three out of every 24 months, they quintuple their ad rates and they get a tsunami of political spending because political campaigns are under the impression that old people vote and that old people still watch the local news.

So these things get sold out and they basically lose money 18 to 21 months a year.

It's like special retail.

The dirty secret of special retail is that they they lose money for basically

50 weeks, 48 weeks a year.

And then from Thanksgiving to Christmas, they just make a ridiculous shit ton of money.

The same is true or becoming true of these local news stations.

And that is, they make a lot of money during the election.

However, however, I think Trump has changed that.

And that is, and it's the same reason MSNBC and CNN are dying.

And that is

a

70-year-old white woman, she knows who she's voting for.

She's driving her old, you know, she's driving her,

you know, her 2012 Audi A6, which is just fine for her.

She doesn't need a car.

And she's spending money on health care, some time with her grandkids, and saving money.

Advertisers hate those people.

The politicians used to love them.

And since Trump showed that you can win presidency by going on podcasts and ignoring cable news and broadcast, ad-supported broadcast, you're now seeing, and I'm talking my own book here, but it doesn't mean it's not true.

Ad rates have gone through the roof and ad spending on podcasts have gone through the roof.

And I think you're going to see a dramatic transfer of capital from these local news stations to, as always, Google, Meta, but also podcasts, which are growing faster than any ad-supported medium out there.

So what do you have to do when you're in a declining business?

They can still be good businesses, but you have to consolidate.

So Sinclair and Tegna will merge, and then there will be two CFOs, and whoever plays golf with the new CEO will get to hold his job, and the other will get a decent package and get out of there.

But they will basically go in, and they will have, you know, if there's 2,000 people of corporate at one and 1,500 another, 3,500, that'll go down to 2,400 or 2,300.

It's what happens to mature industries that are in decline.

It's consolidation and cost cutting.

So that'll still happen.

The question is, and this goes back to what I find most encouraging about all of this, is, you know, I've been thinking a lot about a national economic strike where consumers, especially wealthy consumers, make a concerted effort to slow their spend or target the slowing of their spend.

This was exactly that.

It wasn't that Bob Iger or anyone on the Disney board woke up one day and said, you know, I've rethought this decision.

I've listened to our customers.

I've talked to some people.

And I realize what we did is wrong.

And a step back from the wrong decision or the wrong direction is a step in the right direction.

No, it was none of that.

It was, oh, fuck, people are flexing their economic muscles and canceling Disney Plus.

So people and also artists could say, if Jerry Seinfeld raised his hand and said, and he may not have the ability here because he's probably sold his rights, and I don't want Seinfeld on Sinclair or Tegna Stations,

you know, or Nexstar or whatever it is, that would scare the shit out of them.

They'd be like, okay, maybe we should get out of the business.

of censorship.

So

the most exciting thing about this, the most heartening thing about this, is that people, consumers are starting to flex their consumer muscles.

And at the end of the day, everything these people do,

and this is one of the reasons we love private companies in capitalism, is that they are totally focused on nothing but the value of their shares.

Full stop, full stop.

And the unfortunate thing.

is that I don't think they recognize that they haven't read World War II history.

They haven't read, you know, basically how people are perceived.

And that is people are actually more hostile towards the cowards than the strongman themselves.

And that is, you know, you hate Trump or you love him.

That's not changing.

The people who are really going to ruin the reputations are the people who are seen as cowards that facilitated this slow burn to fascism.

The people who enabled it.

The people who

their whole lives pretended to give a flying fuck about America and American values and wrapped themselves in the flag when it was convenient.

And then when they were tested, they failed.

I hope you're right.

And we're going to take a quick break so we can talk about this war on Tylenol.

But I think that same sentiment will be very valid in discussing all of those Republican senators that put Bobby Kennedy Jr.

in one of the most important roles in America and the vast implications for the health and safety of Americans, especially American women.

So let's take a quick break.

Stay with us.

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There is a lot to talk about when we talk about Donald Trump and Jimmy Kimmel.

One big question I've got is why in 2025 are late night TV shows like Jimmy Kimmel's show still on TV?

Even in our diminished times, Jimmy Kimmel, Stephen Colbert, they're just some of the biggest faces of their networks.

If you start taking the biggest faces off your networks, you might save some nickels and dimes, but what are you even anymore?

What even is your brand anymore?

I'm Peter Kafka, the host of Channels, and that was James Ponowozek, the TV critic for the New York Times.

And this week we're talking about Trump and Kimmel, free speech, and a TV format that's remained surprisingly durable for now.

That's this week on Channels, wherever you get your favorite podcasts.

Welcome back.

Trump announced Monday that the FDA will alert doctors that acetaminophen used during pregnancy can be associated with a very increased risk of autism, urging women to use Tylenol only when medically necessary, such as for a fever.

Experts caution that autism has multiple causes, and the science linking Tylenol to the disorder is far from settled.

Acetaminophen remains the safest over-the-counter option for pain or fever in pregnancy, while alternatives, including ibuprofen or aspirin, can be risky, and untreated fevers can also harm mother and baby.

Tylenol maker Kenview said there is no credible evidence linking the drug to autism and urged pregnant women to consult their health care providers before taking any medication.

Let's listen to what Trump had to say.

But this is a very strong recommendation, maybe stronger from me than from the group because they're waiting for certain studies.

I just want to say...

I want to say it like it is.

Don't take Tylenol.

Don't take it.

If you just can't, I mean, it's just fight like hell not to take it.

There may be a point where you have to and that you'll

you have to work out with yourself.

So don't take Tylenol.

I hate him.

I mean, I don't really mean that.

I'm not a hateful person, but

the anti-science angle, the stupidity, the cruelty.

I mean, have you ever witnessed a group of people so hell-bent on making the lives of women harder than the Republican Party right now?

You know, between the Dobbs decision and just kind of saying, if you, you know, if you live in a state that doesn't really

care about women's reproductive health, that's on you.

Cutting people's Medicaid, millions of kids born every year on Medicaid, rural hospitals closing.

I mean, I'm watching all these men.

There was one woman in there, and I don't know how she didn't just say, like, F you all, but I'm thinking about that drive uptown to go and deliver.

My water had broken.

I'm sitting in the front seat on a towel.

And Brian is trying to find the perfect song, right?

Like for our ride up the West Side Highway, as if I care that I like, you know, drive into the hospital listening to Fleetwood Mac and like it crescendos at exactly the right moment.

And I'm just thinking, you have never in your life experienced pain like what I am feeling at this moment.

And you play D1 football, like you've had the shit kicked out of you a lot, and you still don't understand what's going on.

It's not like Brian didn't understand that.

He was, you know, very generous and kind through the entire pregnancy, but you're watching these guys.

It's like Tylenol is the one thing that a woman can take during this nine-month period where you have to give your body over to somebody else.

And it's all that you think about is caring for this little person that you are going to love more than anything else in the entire world.

The guilt that women feel for eating a piece of salami on a charcuterie tray.

I, you know, I had to, I went to my doctor to say, is it okay if I have a diet Coke?

Right.

Because that, that's my vice.

You know, some people are like, Javi, I wanted one diet Coke a day.

And she had to sit down with me and say, yes, it's fine.

You know, and I said, but what if, but what if?

You know, women don't have a glass of wine in America, even though all over Europe, they're more comfortable with it.

but the anxiety about what could happen and that god forbid something is wrong with your baby and you think back to that night where you had a glass of chardonnay just because you needed it while you were watching love is blind and the implications of that and these guys just stand up there with nothing grounded in science.

I mean, every medical association has to release a statement right after saying, do not believe your government about what they're telling you.

I mean, there's a much higher risk to the mother and the baby if you have a fever.

And again, you can't get rid of a fever any other way during pregnancy than taking Tylenol.

And they just stand there.

They're so smug.

And that Trump is vacillating between don't do this.

And also, I don't really know.

Like, I'm not a doctor, his usual.

And of course, they're not mentioning that the drug that they're, they're, the cure that they're pushing, this luvocorin, as a cure for autism, not borne out by any studies, by the way, is sold by Dr.

Oz's supplement company, iHERB.

So, again, there's always a grift element to it.

So, he's going to get a kickback.

Bobby Kennedy Jr.

probably going to get a kickback because he loves all of these trial lawyers, right?

You know, he's made millions of dollars off of bringing frivolous lawsuits against drug makers.

And Elizabeth Warren, rightfully so, grilled him in his confirmation hearings about it.

He had nothing to say, stammering through it.

I'm upset.

How do you feel?

Yeah, obviously you have more personal experience here.

No, but you've loved somebody that's going through this.

I mean,

can you imagine if someone had said, oh, no, you tough it out.

Just tough it out.

I don't know.

I mean, it was weird when my partner's water broke.

Yeah, it is weird, right?

Well, I don't know.

It's like my first dog.

I never actually believed this dog was ever going to die.

I couldn't imagine it.

And the same with my partner's partner's water breaking.

I just never believed it was actually going to happen.

And then when it happened, we had been told that rookies during a first-time pregnancy often showed up way too early, that they the thing takes a while.

Relax, you're going to be fine.

So she broke her water.

So the first thing I did was I ran a bath for her and said, all right, let's not be those idiots and jump to the, get to the hospital too early and get sent home.

Yeah, and get sent home.

It's the worst.

Get sent home.

Yeah.

I'm like, let's relax.

And I made, you know, candles, did my best, nice bath.

And I heard her let out a scream.

And it was all I could do to stop shaking to turn the bath off because we were going straight to the fucking hospital.

And then we went downstairs.

And in one of those New York moments, there was a cab and a bunch of young people jumped in the cab.

And I screamed at them.

I said, get out.

My wife's in labor.

And they immediately got out.

And that's the one time you can kick people out of a cab.

And my only value add was when we got there, it was like, she was screaming.

And they said, and I said, get the epidural.

And they said, it's too late.

The baby's coming.

And I'm like, get the fucking epidural.

I don't care.

I don't care if the baby's already out.

Drug her up.

And they said, for the good stuff.

And they went in in the spine or whatever it is.

And I think that was a good, that was a good move.

And then being the man I am,

I couldn't stand.

I was so nauseous.

I had, they were more worried.

At one point, I felt like they were more worried about me than about, and they kept saying to me, if you, you need to sit down, they said, because if you pass out,

we're not going to do anything.

We're focused on the mother and the child, because they could tell

I was in a very,

very

bad way.

But anyways, as usual, I'll turn this back to me.

There are currently,

the studies are inconclusive.

There have been some large observational studies that have shown the prolonged acetaminophen use during pregnancy is associated with higher rates of neurodevelopmental disorders in children.

But these studies aren't controlled, meaning this hasn't actually been proven yet.

Researchers at Yale are currently doing extensive research on the topic, and currently there's no safe alternative to Tylenol for pregnant women.

Until more definitive research is published, the FDA and the CDC will continue to recommend acetaminophen as the safest OTC pain reliever for pregnant women.

In 2006, one out of every 110 children was diagnosed with autism.

Now it's one out of every 31.

My thesis is here, is that every wealthy family whose kid

is a kid and is not getting straight A's and playing the violin by the time he's 13 is clearly autistic.

And I don't mean to diminish the real issue of autism, but every parent I know from a wealthy household has had their kid tested for for autism.

It just feels to me like, and maybe you would say, well, that's good.

It's better recognition.

But I think a lot of it is just

a massive increase in diagnosis

across the whole ecosystem.

I mean, the answer to the treatment for autism when I was a kid was sit the fuck down.

I mean, it was just, there was no,

I never heard the term.

Anyways,

I'm doing what you're not supposed to do.

I'm doing what RFK does and making assumptions with having no credibility here.

No, but it's true.

You know, in 2013, they expanded the definition of what falls into the category of autism.

So it used to only apply to people with really extreme cases, you know, kids who were, let's say, nonverbal, who would never live independently, you know, like the most severe cases.

And now it includes Asperger.

So like Elon Musk, right, is now on the spectrum.

And you hear this, and people use it to describe anyone from like a guy you went on a date with who didn't make great eye contact to someone who has to live with their parents or in a group home for the rest of their lives.

So, of course, you're going to have a huge uptick in the number of people that are being diagnosed with quote unquote autism.

I also think there is an over-testing and over-diagnosing problem, which we have, you know, across medicine generally.

But in terms of the study on this, so yes, there's no causal relationship.

What the administration is doing is they're running with the study and not noting the fact that they then took the results, which was a preliminary 5% risk, but then they checked it by adjusting for siblings within the same family.

So the same mother who'd had the same kind of pregnancies.

And then the outcome completely disappeared.

It got the 5% risk went down to 0%.

So completely vaporized.

That's kind of floating all over social media.

So you should go and look at it in the Journal of American Medical Association.

And they looked at over 2.5 million kids.

It's not that like they looked at 10 kids, you know, in an Amish country.

And we should note that the Amish have autism.

And also, they do have some vaccines.

They also have it in Cuba.

Those were the examples that he was using yesterday.

Also, we know some things about what causes autism, and it's old dads.

So are we banning Viagra or Cialis?

Because like I dropped my daughter.

Those are fighting words.

Those are fighting words, Josh.

I'm not trying to ruin your mom.

Oh, my God.

But I dropped my kid off at pre-K and there are plenty of 65-year-old dads there, you know, saying, oh, your your first day of the threes.

And I'm thinking, like, you're more of a risk than the fact that I had a Diet of Coke and some Tylenol, but no one talks about that.

It's true.

No, it's, it's, uh, I'm not trying to take your drugs.

I think you're also not having more kids.

Yeah.

So, not a problem for you.

But the store is closed.

I think at the end of the day, what this is, is one, Trump likes the sort of kind of Maha movement and likes the attention and the controversy that RFK Jr.

foments.

And more than anything, again,

there are five or six people armed with AI

in a room going over every possibility to every day release, announce something.

It can be stupid.

It can be crazy.

It might be a trip to hang out with the royal family.

It might be a 50% tariff today on Brazil to do one thing, and that is get him to mispronounce acetamenophen, and

that'll dominate the news cycle and push out the word people can easily understand and pronounce, and that is Epstein.

This is nothing but an attempt, in my view.

I mean, it does, let me be clear, let me give RFK Jr.

credit.

He is an idiot.

He is a dangerous man who will likely create, you know, with poor, uninformed medical advice, has the potential to create more death, disease, and disability than any cabinet member in history.

But their job right now, everyone's job, oh, good.

You know, and they weren't happy about Kirk's murder.

Many of them were friends with him.

I think there's genuine concern there.

But this is great.

This will keep Epstein out of the news for three, maybe four days.

Oh, we need something new.

Let's announce we're banning where people shouldn't take Tylenol.

Also, the lawsuit.

that's coming their way is going to be absolutely massive.

Talk about your crisis comms situation

from the Disney thing.

Like,

what must be going on in Canview HQ right now?

So,

just as a side note, because I do think it's relevant, in my brand strategy course, we spend an entire session on crisis management.

And there's really only three things you have to remember in crisis management, but they're difficult to do.

They're easy to say, but they're difficult to do.

The first is to acknowledge the problem, to say, we screwed up.

This is an issue.

Two, to have the top guy or gal take responsibility and be out in front.

And then three, and this is the hard part, overcorrect.

And the case study that we always cite is Tylenol.

And that is, I think it might have been in the 80s in Illinois, some madman had altered the bottles or perverted the bottles of Tylenol and stuck in cyanide.

And a family, someone took the cyanide, died.

And then where this really gets horrific is the family, after taking this person to the emergency room and then them being declared dead, went home and took more Tylenol and they died.

This is what Bob Iger would have done.

This is a limited instance, isolated instance, you know, madman.

This is what Tylenol did.

They cleared the shelves within hours, if not days, of every box of Tylenol nationally.

That must have been so expensive.

And also, when you walk up and you see no Tylenol on the shelf, you think, what's wrong?

And then you read the story.

This was them saying, this was Johnson ⁇ Johnson saying,

our brand is about trust.

And even if it costs us shareholder value, we are fiduciaries for Americans, fucking Bob Iger.

We have a responsibility to other people, not just our shareholders.

Stakeholders actually has meaning here versus shareholders.

And what happened?

Tylenol was eventually not only recovered, but people started switching their pain relief to Tylenol because they said, I like Johnson Johnson.

By the way, it's a great company.

It's one of the most valuable companies in the world.

And I trust these guys.

I trust these guys.

It's just ironic.

The ultimate example of crisis management, how to do it well,

is Johnson Johnson and Tylenol.

Anyways, with that, we'll take one more quick quick break.

Stay with us.

Welcome back.

Before we go, since returning to the White House, Trump has been busy redecorating and remodeling.

The oval office now gleams with gold, from the 18-foot ceiling to cherubes in the doorframes.

Speaking to Fox News this spring, he said the room needed a little life and that no paint could match real gold.

The updates don't stop there.

Trump is planning a 90,000 square foot ballroom, the first of its kind at the the White House, capable of hosting 650 guests.

It will replace the East Wing and is funded by Trump and private donors.

Here's a clip of Trump giving donors a tour of some of the renovations.

Thousands, actually, of pictures, beautiful paintings,

some of them

in the vault for over 100 years.

And we added a lot of 24-carat gold, and it's very expensive.

And I think very beautiful.

You know, when you look at the fireplace, when you have a leader sitting on the the one side and the other side, and you look at what's behind with the lights beaming, and that's all 24-karat gold.

And that's why it just beams.

Was it not gold before the sword?

No, it wasn't.

They didn't have really any gold.

They didn't have gold.

I just, in those moments, it's so clear to me that.

He really liked his life as a reality TV host and real estate developer.

And

it it would have been nice if he had just stuck it out.

And then he could talk about the Liberace

vibe for hours.

And it wouldn't have vast implications for the global order because that's really what's going on here.

And like, I'm always struck by, well, A, how

I don't want to just say his taste is bad.

It's not my vibe.

I'm like a mid-century modern type of gal, but that's part of it, that it's so gaudy and it's so gold.

But also that he has no sense of history or desire to be part

of presidential history.

You know, this rewriting of everything and this coming and I'm just going to blow absolutely everything up and install my vision of it is

it's so

lacking in perspective on what role he's actually playing in our history.

I mean, people will be studying him, obviously, for the rest of time.

But the real giveaway is obviously that this is being funded by private donors.

So, another way that you can gain access to Trump and to his family.

And, you know, we've obviously been talking about the $3, $4 billion that he's made off of crypto.

But I was looking at how much his kids have made now since he's been in.

Eric Trump, $40 million last year to an estimated $750 million.

That's a lot of crypto.

Don Jr.

is up to 500 million.

He was at 50 million last year.

Baron Trump, even worth $150 million on his own at 19.

And then obviously Jared Kushner, he's a billionaire now because of the investments coming in from the Mideast into his private equity firm.

They're taking us to the cleaners.

They are just laughing.

They're sitting on the set of CNBC, you know, fielding these questions.

just blatantly laughing at us that we are allowing this to happen and that our ethics laws and our norms and frankly, our metal sometimes is not strong enough to meet the moment of this level of grift.

And that's more disturbing to me than the gold-plated everything.

Yeah, so we know what happened here.

He sat down with the interior decorator that they hired, and he said, I have a vision for this thing.

I want it to look like an Iraqi whorehouse.

And

this thing is so tacky, and he has violated the first rule of interior decoration.

There was clearly no gay man involved in this process.

This was some straight white woman out of Bob Jones University whose husband is a donor.

This thing is so tacky.

And by the way, Bosch, it's not your house.

It's your residence.

for the next three and a half years.

And it's supposed to be steeped in tradition such that people in 20 years from one party or the other, that when people come into the house,

they feel as if they're in

an embodiment of America and American culture.

And some people might say, well, gold is part of American culture.

But again,

this came up from AI.

Give him a tour of the house.

People will talk about it for a day and they won't talk about Epstein.

Have you seen these TikToks and architectural digests?

I hate them.

I love Arc Digest.

I love interior digest.

Oh, the welcome to my home?

Yeah, I'm going to pretend that I did this and not

my hairdresser who became an interior decorator.

I'm going to pretend that me, David Schwimmer, to pick out this painting.

And I went to Spain to pick out the right fabrics.

Give me a fucking time.

I carried the Calcutta marble myself on my back.

I just, you know, I love the veining in this marble.

I do like seeing in their homes, though.

Oh, it's totally.

Yeah, it's like great porn.

It's wealth porn.

But it just strikes me.

I just think, do you think anybody,

come on, do you think really anybody believes that David Hasselhoff just has incredible taste around, you know, definitely not Hasselhoff.

Around mid-century modern architecture.

So those things, I just wish they were forced to have the person or the people who actually

did this stuff.

Anyways, but like you had to go around with your decorative.

I mean, some of them do give the appropriate shout outs, but yes,

they're probably way too busy to have played that level of a role in creating their abode.

It does not stop me from watching, especially ones around the New York City area where I'm like, oh my God, if I just had $12 million, that could be my brownstone in Brooklyn.

I just want to say there are, you know, it's fun to make fun of him, you know, and I enjoy it.

Real implications of the fact that this is the kind of stuff that Trump is focused on and the Tylenol ban.

He is down 19 points on handling the economy and 30 points on handling tariffs, even minus 10 on handling crime.

And Democrats are up nine on the generic ballot in the latest Washington Post poll.

So the house is on fire while he's caking it in gold.

And, you know, I don't want to get over my skis.

I don't know what is going to happen in the midterms.

I feel good going into it.

Can always feel better.

Democrats keep working on the messaging, but they're paying absolutely no attention to the things Americans actually care about.

100%.

All right.

That's all for this episode, Jess.

Thank you for listening to Raging Moderates.

This is a production of Prof G Media and the tribe, David Toledo.

That's right.

David Toledowski.

Our associate producer is Eric Jennicus.

Our technical director is Drew Burroughs.

Our engineer is William Flynn.

And our executive producer, as always, is Catherine Dillon.

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Jess, have a great rest of the week.

You too.