Top Money Expert: How To 10x Your Income & Turn Your Passion Into A Thriving Business | Daniel Priestley

Speaker 1 Welcome back my friend. I have been quietly away for this past month.

Speaker 1 I've been in Spain actually and I haven't been posting what I've been up to, but I'm going to be sharing everything I've been up to behind the scenes here very soon.

Speaker 1 I'm going to be talking about it on social media, on Instagram, all my social channels, and I'm going to be launching a new YouTube channel to actually show kind of like a lifestyle documentary behind the scenes of a big dream that I've been working on and pursuing.

Speaker 1 And I'm so excited about it. There's been a lot of exciting moments.
There's been a lot of downs as well, some highs and lows all mixed up in this past month.

Speaker 1 And I just wanted to remind you that whatever dream you have, it's worth pursuing. It's worth going after.
It's worth taking the next step. It's worth seeing how far you can take it.

Speaker 1 And it's really not about whether you accomplish the goal or not, but who you become on that journey, who you're becoming through all the adversity and the pursuit of that thing.

Speaker 1 And if you feel like you've just been kind of on this hamster wheel of doing the same thing over and over again, and you haven't been exploring the parts of you or the parts of your mind or your heart or your soul that are telling you to work on that art project that you have or create music or publish a book or whatever it might be or just go travel, I encourage you and I empower you to start taking those steps.

Speaker 1 And a lot of times we feel stuck or trapped is because we're just doing things that we're we're not fully excited about.

Speaker 1 And if you do those things all the time that you're not excited about and you never have time on the weekends or nights or take those

Speaker 1 you know, holiday trips to actually pursue those things on the side, then you're going to feel like you're stuck and like you're burnt out. So we need that time, that space to pursue those things.

Speaker 1 And I get it. A lot of us have responsibilities.
We don't have all day, all month, all year to do everything we want. But you do have some time.

Speaker 1 And when you start taking those action steps, nights, weekends, holidays, whatever it might be, on the thing that your heart speaks to you about, man, life just gets so much richer.

Speaker 1 And I want you to live a richer life. That's what this is all about.
It's about creating abundance in our life.

Speaker 1 And we've got a powerful episode today with a wealth expert, someone who's lived a rich life.

Speaker 1 And he's actually talking about that there's more to life than money and business success and how to really create a fulfilling life in an ever-changing world. His name is Daniel Priestley.

Speaker 1 He's one of UK's top entrepreneurs and successful business builders with seven thriving companies.

Speaker 1 And he breaks down the myth that entrepreneurs have to be exhausting themselves and shows how following certain principles can dramatically increase your chances of success.

Speaker 1 He also shares his strategic frameworks with a refreshing perspective on wealth and fulfillment from other areas of life.

Speaker 1 Again, if you're trying to make more money, but you feel like, ah, this money has been stressing me out, or I'm just working so hard and it's so hard to make the money, this is going to give you tools and a different framework on how to scale that time that you're putting into your business, your career, and also make sure you're having a life worth living outside of money.

Speaker 1 Because it doesn't matter how much money you have in the bank or how much net worth you have. If you don't enjoy your life, you aren't living a rich life.
There's so much in this episode.

Speaker 1 I hope you enjoy it. Make sure to share it with a friend as well.
Tag me over on social media. Let me know that you're listening to this or that you're watching it.

Speaker 1 I'm so grateful for you, and I hope this has been a friendly reminder that you deserve a rich and abundant life.

Speaker 1 And it just takes some shifting in the way you think, how you act, and how you feel about what you have and where you're heading.

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Speaker 1 Daniel, welcome to the show. Very excited that you're here on the School of Greatness.

Speaker 2 Thank you for having me on the show.

Speaker 1 Very excited. You've got a lot of success as an entrepreneur, one of UK's top entrepreneurs, money experts.

Speaker 1 And I believe you have seven successful businesses right now. I'm not sure how many unsuccessful businesses you've developed.

Speaker 1 But for people in America, the stats are crazy with... the failure rate around businesses.
Within the first year, I think it's over 20% of businesses fail by year five. It's over 50% of failure.

Speaker 1 And it just seems really hard. It seems really hard to launch.
It's easy to launch a business, but it seems hard to make a business profitable. Yeah.

Speaker 1 Where you're actually able to save money, invest money.

Speaker 1 And even the 50% of businesses that don't fail within five years, it doesn't mean they're thriving.

Speaker 1 It doesn't mean you're not grinding 80 to 100 hours a week to just keep the doors open.

Speaker 1 You're managing stress of employees coming and going, onboarding, training processes, products failing, all this stuff.

Speaker 1 How can someone watching or listening right now who has no desire to be an entrepreneur or run a business be convinced that starting a business isn't going to exhaust or kill them?

Speaker 1 Or if someone's not interested in starting a business, how can they double, triple, quadruple their income, whether through investing or some other element? There's a lot to unpack there. Yes.

Speaker 2 And what you've said is true. Entrepreneurship is really hard.

Speaker 2 So like at the other end of the spectrum, you you know you talked about the failure rate uh only five percent of businesses hit a million or more of revenue uh

Speaker 1 five percent yeah about the world five percent in in america

Speaker 2 in in the number one place in the world to be an entrepreneur only five percent have hit a million about five percent it might be six or seven percent but it's about five percent it's not um in the uk it's about five percent so five percent get to about seven figures of revenue uh or more so what you're saying is absolutely true that it's not something for the lighthearted and to be honest i don't really convince people to do it.

Speaker 2 I help a lot of people who are doing it. And if they're already an entrepreneur and they want to be an entrepreneur, then we talk.

Speaker 2 If someone says it's not for me, that's totally, I completely respect that. Entrepreneurship is a team sport, as you know.

Speaker 2 And one role is the founder, the guy who starts it and takes on the most risk at the beginning. And then another role is the, you know, the people who come and be part of that entrepreneurial team.

Speaker 2 And being part of an entrepreneurial team can be incredibly rewarding financially and intangibly.

Speaker 2 And I think entrepreneurship, that shared experience of building a business

Speaker 2 is for everyone who wants that. That's definitely a thing.
Being a founder, not necessarily for everyone. But here's what I'll say.

Speaker 1 Have you ever built Lego?

Speaker 1 Back in the day, yeah.

Speaker 2 Okay, so get a box of Lego and you look at the front of the box and you see the front of the box and you see the picture and you go, oh, that would be fun.

Speaker 2 And then you tip out all the Lego on the table and it's just a big mess. And you think, how on earth do I put this together?

Speaker 2 fortunately they put instructions in the in the box and they say put this one on this one this piece by this piece by this piece and if you follow piece by piece by piece it's actually incredibly easy to build what looks like the front of the box now what happens with entrepreneurship is people see someone's life on Instagram and they go oh I want that right that's the front of the box But then they look at all the things that you need to do for entrepreneurship and they go, oh, I've got to hire people and create products and have a website and set up a LinkedIn post every day and I've got to do all these things.

Speaker 2 And then they feel like total overwhelm.

Speaker 2 And what actually is needed is a piece-by-piece, step-by-step approach where it's like, okay, first do this, then this, then this, and then you go through and actually you can build something that's on the front of the box.

Speaker 2 To use another analogy,

Speaker 2 we you and I we would jump on an aeroplane without even thinking twice about our safety but a hundred years ago It was one of the most dangerous things in the world to do but they figured out the process they figured out aerodynamic principles and the combination of knowing the principles and knowing the process means that it's the safest way to travel.

Speaker 2 So, you know, I think entrepreneurship is the same. There's a process, there's principles.
If you follow process, if you follow principles, you can actually safely build a business.

Speaker 1 What's the mindset of someone who can succeed at launching a business?

Speaker 2 The mindset is curiosity. So it's all about conducting fast and cheap experiments.

Speaker 2 So what you're really trying to do is you're trying to have a dance with the marketplace and you're trying to come up with a bit of a hypothesis like a scientist would and you see what the market how the market responds and then if you get a good response you double down on it and if the response is not so great you adapt and you you change so you've got to stay curious you've got to be a bit like a scientist

Speaker 2 I'll give you an example

Speaker 2 so about a year ago my team came to me and they said we want to build a new piece of technology as a product

Speaker 2 and I said I don't necessarily want to launch a new product you know I'm spread too thin I don't want to launch a new business actually

Speaker 2 and they said well, can we test it? And I said, okay, let's test it. So we put up a landing page that was called a waiting list landing page.

Speaker 2 And the waiting list is essentially, we're going to build this product. We mock up some designs.

Speaker 2 And we say, if you're interested in this, join the waiting list and answer five questions to be on the waiting list for when it launches.

Speaker 2 I put a post on my LinkedIn and I said to the team, if 150 people fill this in, then we'll explore this as if this is a good idea. Right.

Speaker 1 But that doesn't mean they're going to give you their credit card. It doesn't It's like they might say, Yeah, this is some cool, interesting idea.
Here's my email.

Speaker 2 We just want to set a low, first test, fast, cheap experiment. Because if they did give us the credit card, we'd have to do it.
So, like,

Speaker 1 yeah.

Speaker 2 So, we just asked five questions.

Speaker 2 Um, and we said, you know, which best describes your current situation, which best describes what you're trying to achieve, what best describes your biggest obstacle, how much would you be willing to pay?

Speaker 2 Um, and um, what else do you want us to know about you? So, we asked those five questions.

Speaker 2 750 people filled it in.

Speaker 2 I was expecting 150, 150 and I was like okay and not only did they fill it in on the price data we were expecting $29 a month would be the subscription price for this product and the price that came back most common was $59 a month so we're sitting there going oh okay we're onto something with this idea now did you give them options for price yeah we did okay yeah and of course I'm expecting that everyone's going to click the lowest price five dollars a month yeah yeah but no $59 a month was because the way we worded the question was which price point best describes your budget bearing in mind lower price would be less features and higher price would be more features and how many price what was the price point we did i think we did 29

Speaker 2 59 99 and 129.

Speaker 2 yeah 59 was 59 was the most common yeah

Speaker 2 so um 750 people opted in as a wait list said i'd be interested if this product was out there yeah and this is a software yeah it was a piece of ai technology to help people write books so it's like acts like a creative editor and a creative um it uses some ai tools to help you structure your thinking around a book.

Speaker 2 So, you know, so that's, that's called a fast cheap experiment. Launch a waiting list.
So a lot of people, when they think about launching a business, they think about huge commitments.

Speaker 2 And it's like the stress and anxiety. I've got to have an office.
I've got to pay a registration fee. I've got to hire five people.
You know, I've got to do all these things.

Speaker 2 And if it doesn't work out, I've lost $100,000. That's not how I start business.

Speaker 1 Six months of my life and time wasted.

Speaker 1 I start businesses with lead generation first can we generate leads can we collect data um and if we can't generate leads and if we can't collect data then we just don't even make any progress with the idea why when you have seven businesses would you even want to launch new businesses why not just say hey let's double down on the businesses we're making let's they're already making seven eight figures let's get them to nine figures as opposed to putting all this time energy resources thinking hiring recruiting to say let's launch some new idea and put out a

Speaker 1 minimum viable product and scale it from there and then hire teams around the world and manage those teams and create processes. Why not just 10x the businesses you have?

Speaker 2 Well, the businesses I have are incredibly fast growth. Like

Speaker 2 in software and technology,

Speaker 2 there's a rule of 40, which is that your growth and your profitability should be above the number 40. So 20% growth and 20%

Speaker 2 profit margin would be 40. So essentially, this is called the rule of 40 in software companies.

Speaker 2 Our software company, ScoreApp.com, is 127. So we grow at 100% a year and we have 27% net profit margin.

Speaker 1 So it's growing.

Speaker 2 It's super fast growth. And my other company, Dent Global,

Speaker 2 15% quarter-on-quarter growth for years now, and it just keeps growing and growing and growing.

Speaker 2 My core competency is getting things started and putting great teams in place and launching launching those. Now I'm with you.

Speaker 2 I'm probably getting a little bit,

Speaker 2 it's a little bit ridiculous.

Speaker 2 The reason that so many, I've got so many businesses is because AI came along and I owned a group of agencies and I said, strategically, we're going to spin an AI product out of each agency.

Speaker 2 Interesting. So each agency has its own intellectual property.

Speaker 1 Yeah, if you're like a design company,

Speaker 1 like how do we build AI within this? Exactly. It'd be a software or a tool that we could sell as a standalone product versus a service.
Yes.

Speaker 2 So I owned a publishing company,

Speaker 2 which was the one that did the book software that came out. And then I own a PR agency and we're creating a piece of AI technology for PR.

Speaker 2 So because of that technology that came along,

Speaker 2 we said, hey, let's do it. Let's lean into this and do it.
There are different ways to get businesses. So a lot of my businesses I bought.

Speaker 2 I didn't start them, I bought them and we've started stuff off the back of them.

Speaker 2 So I have a lot of fun starting businesses and pretty quickly I put a team in place and the team runs with it.

Speaker 2 And we've got a game plan, we have playbooks and we just execute the playbooks.

Speaker 1 But how do you find great people to hire for your team?

Speaker 2 Well in the early days you just work with whoever's there.

Speaker 2 You make them great.

Speaker 2 The commitment is not that you find great people, it's that you make great people.

Speaker 2 When I first started my first company, I was 21 years old. No one great was going to come and work with a 21-year-old.

Speaker 2 So I had a spotty 19-year-old who came and joined the team and I had a friend from school who came to join the team.

Speaker 2 And we were not great as a team and then we became great together. So, you know, I'm a really big believer that when you start, you find whoever's willing to be part of the team.

Speaker 2 You find someone, you know, you go down to Starbucks and say, are you ready to quit your job and come work with me, to the person who serves you, and see if you can do it.

Speaker 1 If you could give an entrepreneur or someone that wants to launch a new business three pieces of advice, and if you only did these three things,

Speaker 1 you could set yourself up for a lot of success. What would those things be?

Speaker 2 In the very early days,

Speaker 2 I want chaos. I want chaos.
C-A-O-S, right? So I want a great concept and I want to test the concept. I want...
a really clear understanding of who this is for. We call that an audience.

Speaker 2 Whose attention do we want? Who do we want to be the audience for this product?

Speaker 2 Offer, how do we create something that really speaks to their needs and desires? And then a sales process.

Speaker 2 So concept, audience, offer, sales, those are my first four things that I want to get right when we're launching.

Speaker 2 And, you know,

Speaker 2 we can go through some of those, but like

Speaker 2 concept is, I want something that you're passionate about. I want something that solves a problem in the world.
And I want something people are willing to pay for.

Speaker 2 I want those three things to have a good time.

Speaker 1 A lot of entrepreneurs launch something that they're not passionate about, but they see an opportunity to make a lot of money. Yeah.

Speaker 1 Is there anything, what's the downside of that approach or thinking?

Speaker 2 Well, if you're chasing the money,

Speaker 2 it's very hard to beat someone who's genuinely passionate about it. So money will attract all sorts of people.

Speaker 2 So if you imagine there's this big pile of money, people are coming at that from all angles.

Speaker 2 The person who's ultimately going to win is the person who recognizes there's a lot of money and they're passionate about it. They love it.
They love it. They've got an origin story for it.

Speaker 2 They've got a vision for the future of it. They've got a clear mission about what they want to do with it right now.

Speaker 2 And it tends to be that people who are chasing the money, they don't have origin, mission, and vision. They don't have a background that says this is what they should be doing.

Speaker 2 They don't have a vision for the future as to what they want to do with it next. And they don't have a clear mission as to the highest value things they could do today.

Speaker 2 They're just captivated by the money. And I get that, like money is important.
But ultimately, the best opportunities, you need all three.

Speaker 2 You need a passion, you need a problem, a real problem that people want to solve, and people want to pay for that. So those are the three.

Speaker 2 It's sometimes the case that you can open any one of those three doors. You can just spot a problem that needs solving and you can get yourself passionate about it.

Speaker 2 You can cultivate the passion.

Speaker 2 Sometimes you do notice that there's a new lucrative thing that's going on and you can, you know, you then find yourself like you get bitten by the bug.

Speaker 2 And, you know, yes, you're excited by the money, but then suddenly you start researching it and you realize it really lines up with who you are and it really lines up with what you've been doing for the last 20 years.

Speaker 2 And you go, this is the opportunity I've been waiting for. So, but

Speaker 2 you can enter the room through either of those three doors, but ultimately we need all three of those doors open.

Speaker 1 And what if someone's not looking to be an entrepreneur, but they want to make more money?

Speaker 2 So I'm a big believer, as I said, that entrepreneurship is a team sport and in the first 10 people there's a lot of magic and there's a lot of opportunity to make money whether you're the founder or whether you're one of the first 10

Speaker 2 so sometimes you can get in an early stage team that has equity

Speaker 2 that's being shared sometimes you can get performance bonuses that are pretty high

Speaker 2 so

Speaker 2 And sometimes the knowledge that you gain from being part of a small 10-person team can actually set you up for a lifetime of opportunities as well.

Speaker 2 So for me personally, I was 19 years old. I dropped out of university and I got invited to go knock on the door of this guy who's starting a new company.

Speaker 2 And he's 37, I'm 19, and it was the biggest house I'd ever been to. And it was like this beautiful big house.
And

Speaker 2 I knock on the door, I've got a 30-minute meeting, and I end up talking to him for three hours. and he becomes my mentor.

Speaker 2 And basically I was employee number three or something like that. We're in the kitchen.
We end up building 60 employees. We built, you know, multi-million revenue.

Speaker 2 And those two years taught me so much about myself and about the realities of business and how to access resources.

Speaker 1 And I got all of that.

Speaker 2 And then at the end of two years, I went to John and I said, John, I'd really like to get equity in this business.

Speaker 2 And he said,

Speaker 2 you know what he said.

Speaker 2 He said,

Speaker 2 if you want equity in a business, you go start your own.

Speaker 1 He was like, I put up all the money. I put up all the risk.
I put up, I put it on.

Speaker 2 You're a snotty-nosed 19-year-old kid when I met you. So what was funny?

Speaker 1 Is there something wrong with that mentality from him?

Speaker 2 Nothing wrong. No, it's totally his prerogative.

Speaker 2 He was trying to sort of like say, hey, not yet.

Speaker 2 That was his way of saying not yet. But what I heard as a 21-year-old is, oh, go start your own.
I just start your own business.

Speaker 2 So I actually did. So at 21, I went and launched.
And because he had mentored me so well, we did 1.3 million in the first 12 months. We did 10.7 million in the third year.
So it was just a

Speaker 2 yeah, I built my own team and I'd learned a lot. I learned about how to generate leads and how to make sales and all of those sorts of things and how to build a team.

Speaker 2 So from being part of that small team,

Speaker 2 that set me up.

Speaker 2 The problem with being part of a large corporate is often you have no idea what that whole company does. I don't know if you ever, you've never worked in a large corporate.

Speaker 1 Never have. No.
Yeah, I mean, I worked odd jobs like in college and after college, but I was like a truck driver. I was like a bouncer at a nightclub.

Speaker 2 Me neither, right? I've not done it, but I hear consistently that you work for a large corporate, they shove you in a corner, they get you working on some spreadsheets. You have no idea.

Speaker 2 how much you're charged out at or whether the company's making profit or how they won that client. None of that.
It's just go do this little component.

Speaker 2 So being part of a small business, an entrepreneurial business gives you this complete picture. Yeah.

Speaker 1 So much better. You do so many different jobs.
You see what other people on your team are working on. You, you know, you're collaborating a lot more and you hopefully become more resourceful.
Yes.

Speaker 1 You become more entrepreneurial when you're in a smaller team. That's a startup.
Yeah, you have to.

Speaker 2 You gain self-awareness, you gain commercial awareness, and you gain resources. So those are good reasons.

Speaker 1 Yeah, and usually, you know, the team is all talking about what they're working on together. Or, like, hey, we're after this big project over the next few months.

Speaker 1 So we've got this launch and we're all working on this together. And what do you need? And what do you need? It's more of like a team effort.
It's like a sports team. It is.

Speaker 2 And it's crazy how transparent small teams are. Like, it's often the case that you know the revenues, you know the profits, you know how many customers are coming through each month.

Speaker 2 Like all of that stuff tends to be in full display in small businesses or a lot of it.

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Speaker 1 So how come someone, you know, who launched a business, let's say they get to $100,000 or they get to a million in revenue after a few years.

Speaker 1 How can someone think to themselves and act in a way where they can generate double, triple, quadruple the revenue without feeling like they have to do double, triple or quadruple the work?

Speaker 1 How can they really? Because when we launch something, it takes all of us. But when we get to the next level, it takes a different part of us that we haven't developed.

Speaker 2 Yeah, that's true.

Speaker 2 There's two things that really change the game. One is having a key person of influence at the front of

Speaker 2 the business.

Speaker 2 So this is someone who is going to be the voice of the business, the face of the business, and obviously that should be the founder.

Speaker 1 Why is having a key person of interest so important for a business?

Speaker 2 Okay, because in the early days you pitch one-to-one,

Speaker 2 but then to scale you pitch one to many. So like in the early days you might be doing sales meetings one-to-one and then there comes a point where the best way to scale is to put videos out,

Speaker 2 to put ads out to do group presentations or events

Speaker 2 to create social media content that gets a bit of cut through so all of that stuff is massively amplified by a personal brand online we don't really pay attention to business brands so like Richard Branson has 12 million followers on X and only quarter of a million followers for Virgin

Speaker 2 Even Tim Cook has twice as many followers than Apple's out wow right so

Speaker 2 I think LinkedIn did some research and they basically found that if you were to start a business brand and a personal brand on the same day and you post exactly the same time, exactly the same day, by the time the business brand gets a thousand followers, the personal brand will have 20,000 followers.

Speaker 2 So it's 20 times more powerful. So when you scale up, you need to be one to many.
You've got to get your message out to a larger number of people.

Speaker 2 And people underestimate, you know, you need something like you need something like two to 20,000 people to really know what your business does in order for it to start that upward curve. So

Speaker 2 personal brand is a huge growth driver, especially from six to seven figures of revenue. You want to go from half a million to five million, personal brand, key person of influence brand.

Speaker 2 You build that personal brand and you're going to see some growth because you're going to be hitting larger numbers of people who know who you are.

Speaker 2 The next thing is digital assets. Digital assets means that you take all the stuff that's happening and you digitize it.

Speaker 2 So if there's a happy customer, you get a video of that happy customer and put that on the YouTube channel.

Speaker 2 If there's a system or a process that is your signature method, you create a diagram of it and you make sure people can see it and they can find it.

Speaker 1 Like some of the stuff you have here in your books. Yeah.
It's like creating your own IP.

Speaker 2 Entrepreneur. Yeah, exactly.
So that's my entrepreneur journey method. And,

Speaker 2 you know, there's different ones here, like the entrepreneur sweet spot and all of that sort of of stuff. So everything that I talk about, I create digital assets like books, videos, diagrams, because

Speaker 2 that's the stuff that scales on the internet.

Speaker 2 See, we're living in this incredible time where the internet gives us access to 70% of the world's population who have fast internet, 1.8 billion English speakers.

Speaker 2 You only need the tiniest little fraction of people to discover you. And if you've digitized what you do, do, including the value and the product and the delivery, you can have incredible scale.

Speaker 2 We are living through the most unbelievable time. Like

Speaker 2 this is the equivalent of

Speaker 2 the agricultural age turning into the industrial age. We're going from the industrial age to the digital age.
So, you know, this is where we start to surf these big trends that are happening.

Speaker 1 But I've heard you talk about the dying economy versus the new economy.

Speaker 1 What is the dying economy and what is the new economy coming?

Speaker 2 The dying economy is the economy that you were prepared for in the schooling system.

Speaker 2 So in the schooling system they had this vision for you and they said you're going to work in an office or a factory or a construction environment.

Speaker 2 And basically they said, here's our vision for Lewis. Our vision is that you're going to do 15 years of school and then you're going to do 25 years as

Speaker 2 a worker, then you're going to do about 10 years as a manager, five years as a leader,

Speaker 2 and then you're going to do 15 years of retirement and die. Wow.
So that was the plan,

Speaker 1 whether you were aware of that or not.

Speaker 2 And for a long period of time, the industrial age, that was a good plan. From 1850 to 2000, those 150 years, that was a pretty decent way to approach what was possible for most people.

Speaker 2 But since

Speaker 2 the 2000s, and especially since 2020 when we had the pandemic, the way that the world works no longer sits like that. So we're now in this digital age.

Speaker 2 So, for example, geography is not a big dictator of value anymore. So, it was almost always the case that where you grew up was probably where you would work and live, and

Speaker 2 you would be basically within a 10-mile radius, and that was you.

Speaker 2 Now, you could be contracting for a company on the other side of the world, you could be selling to customers in 150 countries, your boss could be someone you've never physically been in an environment with, your best team member could be someone who's in Brazil.

Speaker 2 Like, all of this, you know, all of this geography gets removed.

Speaker 2 Physical products used to, physical products and directly delivered services used to be the main engine of the economy.

Speaker 2 Now it's intellectual property, media, data, software are the main, and finance, main engine rooms of the economy. So

Speaker 2 we need to recognize that the future of the career looks very different to the previous one.

Speaker 2 So what's happening for the future is we're moving into a very high velocity economy that is fast action loops and these little loops are

Speaker 2 you notice a problem you put together a small team to explore it you launch something to test it you scale up the team you scale up the technology you formalize it you exit it you can move on to the next problem and these are you know these are these are the kind of careers that we're seeing in the future I don't know whether you're seeing this as much as I am but I might ask a high performer these days, tell me, like, what are you doing for work?

Speaker 2 And they'll give me like five things. They'll say, I'm writing a book.
I'm doing some podcasts.

Speaker 2 I've launched an agency. We're spinning out an AI software product.

Speaker 2 We're organizing a festival. We've got a live event that's coming up.

Speaker 2 And

Speaker 2 you go, how many hundreds of people are on your team? And it's like, no, it's just me and five other people, right? We're just a little group of five. And these fast, dynamic

Speaker 1 value loops get created.

Speaker 2 And you can have several of them on the go.

Speaker 2 You can be a leader in one and a

Speaker 1 supplier to another.

Speaker 2 You know, you might on any given day, you might be a paid speaker at a conference, but also leading a team running your own conference. Right.
You know, so. Yeah.

Speaker 1 I mean, we have an annual conference called Summit of Greatness for the last nine years, but I also speak around and at other people's offense.

Speaker 2 And you're writing a book. And, you know, so, so it's this kind of like

Speaker 2 plural career. And I don't know, can you relate to this idea of these fast little loops? Things happen quickly.

Speaker 1 I mean, for the first 10 years of like running my business or businesses, I guess, I was doing that constantly to the point where I had, I don't know, 15 different revenue streams within a business.

Speaker 1 And it got to the point where about five years ago, I felt like I was a seven out of a 10 with everything. Yeah.
You mean because I was doing too many things. Yeah.

Speaker 1 And it was almost like this fast action loop. Yeah, everything was exciting and I took every opportunity, which led to me getting to a certain level financially and opportunity-wise.

Speaker 1 But then I didn't feel like I was able to break through because I was spreading my time, bouncing around thing to thing every day to the next internal project. Yeah.

Speaker 1 That, wow, there's money here. Let's go do this.
And people need, there's a need, there's a problem. And it's something I'm interested in.
And I like this too. And I like that too.
And I'm passionate.

Speaker 1 So do it all.

Speaker 1 But that only works for so long until you get kind of burnt out and resentful of your business.

Speaker 2 Yeah, well, it's not a permanent state.

Speaker 2 You feel that you've kind of like taken yourself and spread yourself yourself too far So then you dial it back and you say all right, I'm just gonna focus on the highest value things Mm-hmm, but what will predictably happen with you is that you'll get you'll get really strong at a few key things Yeah, and naturally that's gonna exactly

Speaker 1 I'm kind of at that point where I'm

Speaker 1 ready to attract the next bigger things right it's like maybe it starts small and it scales but I'm ready to take on and it doesn't mean ready in the next day it if it's a year from now cool ready when the right field comes along like this is alignment and it doesn't mean it's going to work but it's like yeah this feels like it has the potential to really be exciting be sustainable energy renewable energy serve and impact people in a meaningful way and bringing in meaningful revenue where it's like a win-win-win and it and it just feels like a perfect fit yeah and i'm like i'm right at that stage where you know I feel like we're ready to do that.

Speaker 1 But it has to be the right opportunity. And we're also, I mean, I'm turning down a lot of financial opportunities that are big.
It's not the right fit.

Speaker 1 And I'm like, ah, it just seems like too much of my time. Yep.
I'm like, that's not scalable.

Speaker 1 If I'm just doing it for a certain amount of money for the next six to 12 months, that's not where you're at right now. So much of my time, I'm like, it just doesn't feel right.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 Well, that's, you're doing the right thing. And that's what, that's, that's kind of what's going to happen.
So contrast that with the old model of you literally just get put into a job.

Speaker 2 and you just only do that job and then you've got a hobby on the weekend and like, you know, you kind of just on somebody else's path.

Speaker 2 You know, so that was the old industrial revolution system. In this digital system, you've got to develop a sense of feel as to am I taking on too much? Should I dial it back a bit?

Speaker 2 What should I say yes to? What should I say no to? So, part of the new skill set that we need is the ability to be discerning.

Speaker 2 In an AI-driven world where anything's possible, you can speak your ideas into existence at light speed. You need the ability to have taste and discernment.

Speaker 2 So, you can say, that's not to my taste, It's not to my, it's not, it's not the thing that's the perfect thing for me.

Speaker 2 You know, a big skill is knowing what to say no to now.

Speaker 1 It's huge. And it's hard to like turn down money.
You know, you don't want to turn down financial opportunity in a world of, you know, just money as the tool to support you in your lifestyle.

Speaker 2 And there's different phases in life. You know, so there are times in your life where you definitely wouldn't have turned down money.

Speaker 2 And then there are times in your life where you have a bit more discernment, which is, okay, this is short-term money and it's not long-term scale.

Speaker 2 And what I'm looking for is something long-term games with long-term people.

Speaker 1 Yeah, and listen,

Speaker 1 I'm all for like creating incredible financial wealth.

Speaker 1 I'm all for it. Like, if it comes to me over my lifetime, great.
I want to be like a steward of that wealth. And I hopefully want to do the right things with it.

Speaker 1 to serve in the right way with that money. Not just for me alone and my family, which yes, I want to provide and create experiences that are unforgettable moments.

Speaker 1 That doesn't mean you need lots of money all the time to create these unforgettable moments with family and to feel like you're living a healthy lifestyle with the right foods and having the right housing.

Speaker 1 And, you know, you don't need

Speaker 1 tens of millions of dollars to live a good life.

Speaker 2 It's interesting because you've sat down with 1,700 people

Speaker 2 who are living amazing lives. So you've picked up on this theme that there's got to be a bit of balance.

Speaker 1 Yeah, I mean, it's just kind of like, is the, what is the end goal? You know, how much money will make you feel like you are enough?

Speaker 2 And what number did you arrive at?

Speaker 1 For me,

Speaker 1 I don't think I've arrived at the number because it's not like when I'm a billionaire,

Speaker 1 then I've made it. Or when I've exited a company for nine figures, then I'll be enough.

Speaker 2 Yeah, your enough is already, the enough is built in.

Speaker 1 I feel enough right now, and I'm so grateful and blessed for the abundance that's come to my life. Yeah.
For the peace I have internally,

Speaker 1 for the health that I currently have, for my marriage, for, you know,

Speaker 1 everything that I'm creating. Yeah.
And the opportunity to wake up another day, I'm blessed. It's a great specialty.

Speaker 1 And there's so many people that I've met or I've known who have struggled so much and they have all the money in the world.

Speaker 1 So if all the money in the world isn't going to create inner peace and fulfillment. Yeah.

Speaker 1 Then what's the point?

Speaker 2 That's a great point.

Speaker 1 I'm not saying don't go after building extreme wealth. Yeah.
That's something you're excited about,

Speaker 1 but at what cost, what price?

Speaker 1 And are you going to have regrets that like, oh, I wish I would have spent another 10 years building more companies to make more money and become a higher net worth millionaire instead of becoming a self-worth millionaire?

Speaker 1 Yeah. And how can I develop more love, more peace, more

Speaker 1 inner expansion rather than focus on external expansion. And there's, again, I'm not saying there's a right or wrong, good or bad.

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Speaker 2 The one thing I would say is entrepreneurship is the most incredible personal development journey. Like it really teaches you so much about yourself.
It challenges you.

Speaker 2 It brings out your inspiration. It forces you to explore,

Speaker 2 you know, your edges and your limits.

Speaker 2 It gets you to be creative yeah so entrepreneurship is personal development in motion it's it's like you can go from reading a book which is academic to I'm gonna bring something into the world which is like okay I'm riding I'm you know you can't ride a bicycle you can't learn to ride a bicycle by reading the book you got to ride the bicycle yeah yeah so I feel like entrepreneurship is just this personal development journey that is unfolding in real in real life it's a way of living a personal development journey it really does take you on that

Speaker 1 and What's the number for you?

Speaker 2 So for me, it's all about am I in line with my passion? Am I in line with what I'm meant to be doing?

Speaker 2 Like I, see, my work-life mission is to develop entrepreneurs who solve the world's most meaningful problems.

Speaker 2 And what I want to do is I want to build out a community of people who are solving meaningful problems in the world, who are elevating the world, right?

Speaker 2 They're standing out, they're scaling up, they're solving problems, they're having an impact.

Speaker 2 And for me personally, I like creating businesses that help entrepreneurs to stand out, scale up and make an impact. So like, for example, the book writing software is

Speaker 2 bookmagic.ai is a example of helping people to express themselves through writing a book. Because that allows them to stand out, scale up, and make an impact.

Speaker 2 So I'm very much like only doing things that are in alignment with my personal mission.

Speaker 2 And I do stuff that's fun. The crushing thing about having too much money is that

Speaker 2 if we want to go down the path,

Speaker 1 thing about having too much money?

Speaker 2 The crushing thing is that you go from being highly creative to being a money manager. And this is a real problem because the thing that gets you the company exit is that you poured out creativity.

Speaker 2 And it was all about expansiveness and it was all about building something that belonged in the world. And you saw it before everyone else saw it.
And you just wanted this thing to exist.

Speaker 2 So you almost willed it into existence.

Speaker 2 You enrolled members of the team. You took something that didn't exist and you brought it into the economy and you made it real.

Speaker 2 And then someone else saw so much value in that that they buy it for nine figures.

Speaker 2 The problem then is that if you do get a check for a lot of money,

Speaker 2 you then become what's known as a wealth manager or a money manager.

Speaker 2 By default, you've gone from this fully creative, expressive thing called your business to this thing that is all about risk and caution and not breaking it and not doing it.

Speaker 1 Putting it forward as opposed to holding it to it and risking and

Speaker 1 putting it out there. How many people do you know who've exited

Speaker 1 eight, nine, ten-figure businesses that then go depressed within weeks after having all this money in the bank?

Speaker 1 It's almost like you hear more stories of billionaires exiting companies who are depressed for two years than people who are like, I've made it and life's amazing now.

Speaker 1 It's like there's almost a depression from it.

Speaker 2 I'm not going to say that happens all the time.

Speaker 1 I also know

Speaker 1 more stories than that.

Speaker 2 You have some great times

Speaker 2 post-exit and that actually they live a very great second chapter as well. So it's like it's not a

Speaker 1 takes a while to get... It's almost like...

Speaker 2 Yeah, it's the next personal development journey.

Speaker 2 So like I've got plenty of friends who have sold for hundreds of millions and their second chapter is even greater than their first chapter.

Speaker 2 And it's a new form of expression. It's a new form of creativity.
And

Speaker 2 they're ready for it and it's great. There's always the mourning and the loss of selling a business.
Not always. I've sold businesses I've been super happy to sell.
I sold a business.

Speaker 2 I bought a business, grew it, sold it, sold it to a New York publicly listed company, and it was a great deal. And I was like, sweet, fantastic.
On to the next thing, right?

Speaker 2 So I've had times where that's happened.

Speaker 2 For me personally, what I've noticed as a common theme is that you want to sell a company for enough money so you can do anything, but not enough that you can do nothing.

Speaker 2 You know, you see, like a lot of the happiest people I know, they sell companies for like 10 to 50 million and they've now got capital behind them and they can do big things.

Speaker 2 Something else with it, yeah. But they're, but they're still like energetically in the game.

Speaker 2 Um, I've got some friends who have sold money for like, you know, closer to a billion, and that's kind of weird because almost nothing becomes like mean, like everything's meaningless at that point.

Speaker 1 Oh, just buy this, spend this, yeah.

Speaker 2 Like, I'm just going to have houses around the world, and I'm going to travel in private jet. And like,

Speaker 2 and it's like, oh, and everyone's busy. Like, I can do anything, but everyone else is busy.

Speaker 1 Everyone's Everyone's trying to make a living. Yeah.

Speaker 2 And then you scroll through, you know, I was talking to a friend of mine who had that situation.

Speaker 2 He said, you know, you scroll through the news or you scroll through Facebook, and it's actually quite painful because you kind of know in the back of your mind you could take action on this, you could solve that problem, you could help that person.

Speaker 2 And then it becomes overwhelming. So you then have to develop a crust.

Speaker 2 So interesting.

Speaker 1 Yeah. And you can't help it.
You can't save everyone. Yeah.

Speaker 2 But mind you, let's not throw a pity party.

Speaker 1 For the billionaires of the world.

Speaker 2 Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 2 You know, here's the cool thing.

Speaker 2 These days, it's totally possible for really normal people to start a business that is a lifestyle business that does

Speaker 2 six and seven-figure revenue, six-figure, maybe seven-figure profit.

Speaker 2 and you have fun, freedom, and flexibility, and it becomes a vehicle for being able to live and work from anywhere. Like, let's not discount the real opportunity at the moment.

Speaker 2 The biggest opportunity at the moment is that small dynamic teams of less than 10 people can have a really significant impact and business. We live in a time where small teams have infinite leverage.

Speaker 2 They can have a YouTube channel, they can use AI tools,

Speaker 2 you know, they can have a software stack. And that whole team can live and work from anywhere and be earning incredible money.

Speaker 2 I have countless examples of people who are doing one to five million of revenue, half a million of profit to a million of profit, and they don't have to be anywhere in particular at any given time.

Speaker 2 No one's disappointed with that.

Speaker 1 Right, right. It's a good lifestyle.
That's a good lifestyle.

Speaker 2 On this entrepreneur journey here, we talk about one person to three people is the wilderness. This is a really tough time in business where you're figuring things out, figuring out your value.

Speaker 2 Three to 12 people is the lifestyle boutique.

Speaker 2 And then 12 to 30 is the desert, too big to be small, too small to be big. And 30 to 250 people is your performance zone.

Speaker 1 So 12 to 30 is the worst place to be in terms of

Speaker 2 that's a hard one.

Speaker 1 Having 12 employees to 30, I'm talking about.

Speaker 2 12 to 30 people on a team is too big to be small, too small to be big.

Speaker 1 Why is it so hard? And how do you break, how do you know that you should break through to 30 plus or stay under 12?

Speaker 2 Well, if you want a lifestyle business, then it's the three to 12 person team.

Speaker 2 That's where you want to be. Because it's a self-organizing team.
You've got a core team of about 10.

Speaker 1 Yeah, here's a virtual team as well. So yeah, that core team,

Speaker 2 like, I bet you find that it's just very self-organizing. Like,

Speaker 2 people just figure out what needs to be done and they're doing it and all that sort of stuff. What's weird is about 13 people splits the team into two or three sub-teams.

Speaker 2 So when you hire the 13th person, now you've got a sales team who don't talk to the finance team, who don't talk to the ops team. And now there's dramas.

Speaker 2 When you get 17 people, two of them start dating and it gets weird. Has that ever happened?

Speaker 1 Not that I can think of. I was just thinking how it could you kept it under 12.
Yeah, exactly. Yeah, yeah.
It's like, I'm interested.

Speaker 1 I don't think that's ever happened. Unless it happened without my knowledge.

Speaker 2 Yeah, well, that happens too.

Speaker 1 Right, right.

Speaker 2 Sometimes in your boardroom, right?

Speaker 2 So you get 17, 18, 19, 20.

Speaker 2 You really are, you're too big to be small, you're too small to be big. You're in this awkward zone.

Speaker 2 When you get to 30, you've got typically a four or five person leadership team who can then lead the teams of teams.

Speaker 2 And now you've got a proper business you're in the zone of being able to sell that business for tens of millions

Speaker 2 so

Speaker 1 so I mean you got to go from 12 to 30 like how do you do that so quickly so that you're in more of a high performance business rather than a lifestyle boutique the fastest I ever did it was three days oh oh if you just acquire a company well you can

Speaker 2 acquire boom I'm gonna hire an eight but what we actually did is we had a conference so we had a three-day conference and we invited about 70 people and we basically said by the end of this three days we're putting together a team of 30

Speaker 2 and we brought the team together yeah so what was that business it was well that particular business was a business that I was brought in to take them through it rapidly

Speaker 2 and it was a consulting business based out of Boston

Speaker 1 So we just hired 30 people.

Speaker 2 So we just brought we brought together a team of 30 in three days and it was amazing. We put up the org chart, we got people to sign on to which roles they wanted.

Speaker 2 And by the end of three days, we'd organized them into a team and they were ready to go. So it doesn't have to necessarily take too long.
When you hear about Silicon Valley.

Speaker 1 They also need the money to do that too.

Speaker 2 Yeah, or you just need the agreements.

Speaker 2 Look, a performance business is a more advanced business.

Speaker 2 And when you hear Silicon Valley startups, they go out and they secure that first three to five million worth of capital to go and put together that first 30 people team, right?

Speaker 2 So they put together their leadership team and then their developers and their customer success team and their

Speaker 2 sales representatives. So they kind of like recruit, that's like part of the founding story in the first 12 months.
They put together that team, and that's why they get the three to five million.

Speaker 2 But it only works if you intend to sell that business for a lot of money.

Speaker 1 If you're trying to get an exit in five, seven, 10 years, that's what you need to be doing.

Speaker 2 It's a little bit like sport. There are plenty of people who love playing tennis, but lifestyle tennis.
And then there are people who want to tour professionally, and it's very different.

Speaker 2 It's a whole nother life.

Speaker 1 It's a different life. Yeah, it's a different life.
That's interesting.

Speaker 2 So how many of your businesses out of the seven that you have currently are lifestyle businesses versus so we got two that are in performance and we got five that are coming up through uh that process of going from their uh boutique to getting ready for their performance jump interesting so none of yours are under 12 then that uh they're always intending to go big yeah for for me um where i'm at is that pretty much on day one i want a team of about eight so if i'm launching anything it's uh well i work on this Two-person scout team to scout the opportunity.

Speaker 2 Can we sell it? Can we build it? Four-person fire-starting team, which is just an initial team to run the launch campaigns and to get those first customers, figure out how this business works.

Speaker 2 Eight-person boutique core team, which is here.

Speaker 2 And then

Speaker 2 when we get the signal that the business is ready, we then jump to our performance team.

Speaker 1 Got it. To 30.
To 30. Yeah.
And that is kind of like clockwork. You know that, hey, I can only get get to 3 to 5 million with 10 people.
Yeah. Maybe it gets to 10 if I'm lucky, but it's like

Speaker 1 a scale.

Speaker 2 I learnt it from the army.

Speaker 2 Yeah, the army, they never send one person off on their own. They call it a scout team, two-person scout team.
Then they have a four-person fire team.

Speaker 2 They have an eight-person section, and then a 30-person platoon. So I've just modeled that straight off the military.
It's 2-4-8-20.

Speaker 1 Sorry, 2-4-8-30. Wow.
How many companies have you exited now?

Speaker 1 Four.

Speaker 2 Four. Yeah, so

Speaker 2 four proper

Speaker 1 exits. When you know it's the right time to exit.

Speaker 2 There's three things that the business has.

Speaker 2 You know that it's the right time when you don't actually want to sell it.

Speaker 2 When you want to sell a business, that's actually because it's not saleable.

Speaker 2 There's this horrible point that you're...

Speaker 1 How do I get rid of this and then trick someone that this is valuable?

Speaker 2 And that's definitely not the time to sell it.

Speaker 2 The feeling of a company,

Speaker 2 what a company feels like when it's saleable is it's like, why would I sell this? This is a great company because that's the maximum point where people are going to feel the same way about it.

Speaker 2 But there's three big things that companies have when they sell. So number one is recurring revenue contracts.
Businesses that sell for a lot of money, they've contracted their recurring revenue.

Speaker 2 They can forecast really far forward into the future. And they have some metrics that are all about like how much of our revenue is recurring and how much does it churn?

Speaker 2 Like how much does it go down if we leave it over time? So those numbers are super clear.

Speaker 2 It has a 30 person or more team. So you've got to have 30 people on the team so that

Speaker 2 when the founder leaves, the business doesn't fall apart. Because typically less than 30 has what's called founder dependency.

Speaker 2 And then you need what's called proprietary assets. And proprietary assets are your unique brand, your database.
It could be your systems and processes. It could be trademarks,

Speaker 2 you know, whatever it is that makes that business very hard to compete with. That is your moat.
That is your proprietary asset. So those are your three big ones.

Speaker 2 Proprietary asset, 30 people plus on a team and recurring revenues into the future. You get those three things right.
You're going to change your life with an exit.

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Speaker 1 The challenging thing is, you know, I've heard you say, and I've been a big proponent of building a personal brand for for since day one, since 2008 when I started judging, right?

Speaker 1 It's like, I learned about personal brand

Speaker 1 end of 2007. Yeah.
When I started getting into like online entrepreneurship and learning about the digital world and what was coming in social media.

Speaker 1 And so I've been a big fan of that. That was the year Facebook launched.

Speaker 2 You were super

Speaker 1 on Facebook when it was just for college. I remember when our five years ago.

Speaker 1 2004. Yeah, it was.
2004 was college.

Speaker 1 I was in college. And it was like, oh, we're about to get Facebook.
Like, it's the next wave of school.

Speaker 2 2007 was Twitter just launched.

Speaker 2 YouTube was kind of like becoming brand new.

Speaker 1 I opened a YouTube channel in 2007, posted my first video in 2007.

Speaker 1 I was on LinkedIn in the end of 2007 when it was like, I don't know, 8 million people. It was like very, very small.
And I wrote a book about LinkedIn.

Speaker 1 I was one of the first people to write a book about LinkedIn in 2009. Yeah.
about how to like build relationships

Speaker 1 in the digital world and then take them in the physical world. And I was hosting networking events all around the country awesome

Speaker 2 LinkedIn networking events in 2009 2010 and I was using the platform to drive people to the events and by the way going back you and I very similar yeah 2009 I was running events called you blogging twit face and it was all about how to use social media for business and that was my one of my first things and it was YouTube blogging Twitter Facebook that's cool you yeah you blogging twit face it was cool that's cool exactly and it was like all these new events were popping up because it was like tweet-ups and meetups and blog world.

Speaker 1 And like, Gary Vaynerchuk came along, and we were all like, wow, this guy. Exactly.
And I met Gary Vaynerchuk in 2009. Uh-huh.
Similar. And

Speaker 1 Tim Ferriss and all these different

Speaker 1 workers. Before our workers.

Speaker 1 There's almost like this new wave of how to create this lifestyle entrepreneurship.

Speaker 2 I wrote Key Person of Influence in 2009

Speaker 2 and it came out in 2010. And it was the book on how to build a personal brand.

Speaker 1 So you and I lived a very, very similar experience.

Speaker 1 Now, here's the thing, with AI coming, and it seems like more and more content creators are doing these things to put their message out there, to build awareness, to create more touch points, to have communities and audiences.

Speaker 1 And it seems like content creation is on the rise. Podcasting is on the rise.
Vlogging is on the rise. It is.

Speaker 1 Short form content. AI tools are churning it out.
And AI tools are helping people amplify their message.

Speaker 1 The challenge is, if everyone's doing it and the tools are more and more accessible, how do you stand out in a noise in a sea of personal brands now? Like, how do you really

Speaker 1 gain audience when everyone is making noise? Totally, totally.

Speaker 2 So from 2009 to 2020, all you had to do is show up consistently. That's it.

Speaker 1 That was it.

Speaker 2 And just showing up consistently, you would do this. Now you've got to be an A player.
You got to really have your A game if you want to show up.

Speaker 1 So

Speaker 2 if you imagine an airport and the fog has come in and it's very hard to take off because there's so much fog, if you're already up there, like you are, you've got millions of people, then you're already above the fog.

Speaker 2 So you can continue that journey and you're already an A player and you can throw budget at it.

Speaker 2 How do you do it if you're starting out? How do you do it if you're actually on the ground and surrounded by this massive amount of noise? So a couple of things.

Speaker 2 You've got to tune out from what everyone else is doing and say, I'm going to be committed to adding value to a small group of people, and I'm just going to start small and keep adding value and show up powerfully.

Speaker 2 Because think about like this: your best friend is your best friend, not because you've got lots and lots of different options and you've selected carefully from all the options.

Speaker 2 Your best friend is your best friend because your best friend has figured out how to build a relationship with you. So, the game is relationships, it's not noise.

Speaker 2 So, trying to build relationships over noise.

Speaker 2 The other thing too is partnering with someone who's already above the fog.

Speaker 1 So, like you did starting out.

Speaker 2 Yeah. I think, yeah.

Speaker 1 So I when you got into business, I mean, you were with a guy who was 20 years older than you who was successful. And yeah, when I taught you the road.

Speaker 2 When I launched my first company, I had a guy who was the face of the business who we paid 5% of revenue to. Really? Yep.

Speaker 1 Who had more authority than you, more credibility, whatever it might be.

Speaker 2 Even today,

Speaker 2 it's very possible to

Speaker 2 hire someone as a speaker and they come in and they deliver a talk and 500 people show up to see them, but you position yourself alongside them.

Speaker 2 So you can do those sorts of things. You can do joint ventures and partnerships with people who've already got the face of the business, who can be the face of the business.

Speaker 2 But

Speaker 2 having your A-game, there's five things you must get right. The way that you pitch has to be really on point.
You've got to pitch yourself in a way that's going to get cut through.

Speaker 2 So you've got to make sure that when you answer the question, who am I? What do I do? Who is that for?

Speaker 2 That that really comes across in every communication. So you've got to get good at pitching.

Speaker 2 Publishing content, regular publishing and having a publishing schedule. Publishing a book, one of the best things you can do because it makes you an authority in your space.

Speaker 2 I had a look at major podcasts when we did a bit of an assessment into this and found that 78% of guests on big podcasts have written a book.

Speaker 2 Like only 1% of the population has written a book and 78% of guests on the podcast have written a book.

Speaker 2 So authors end up on bigger platforms. You've got to have a way of monetizing your brand.
So we call that a product ecosystem. If you don't have products, then you run out of money.

Speaker 2 promoting yourself, promoting your brand. You've got to have a monetization method.

Speaker 2 The profile that you build, you need to do joint ventures and partnerships with people who have profiles so that it elevates your profile. And the fifth one is joint ventures, partnerships,

Speaker 2 almost think about flying together as a squad. There was a photo I saw of you.
and you're in front of a jet, a private jet, and there's you and Tom Billiao and there's Jay Shetty.

Speaker 2 And you would think, oh, these people are all competitive.

Speaker 1 But no, they're all all collaborative.

Speaker 2 They're working together. And it was funny that you're in front of that jet and it's like, boom, we're taking off together.

Speaker 2 And it was, I think you know the picture I'm talking about. Yeah.

Speaker 2 So there's this idea of forming a squadron. And forming a squadron is where you say, we're all going to build our own brands, but we're going to support each other.
We're going to help each other.

Speaker 2 The mastermind.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 2 And it's like, I'm going to, when I see you post on LinkedIn, I'm going to like it and comment on it.

Speaker 2 When I see that you've launched a podcast, I'm going to recommend some guests to the podcast and help you with that. And I know that you're going to do the same thing back.

Speaker 2 And you can formalize these little squadrons in a WhatsApp group.

Speaker 2 You can have a monthly meetup. So you can kind of just get that tight-knit,

Speaker 2 collaborative environment together.

Speaker 1 Yeah, that's cool.

Speaker 1 I think you mentioned

Speaker 1 that there were five things that you need to do to build key person of interest also. And I think we only talked about two of them, right?

Speaker 2 Pitch, publish, products, profile, and partnership.

Speaker 1 Okay, that's what it is.

Speaker 2 So those are the big five.

Speaker 1 There you go. Yeah.

Speaker 1 Here's the thing that everyone's talking about, which is AI. Yeah.
And everyone's talking about it. People are starting to test it.
Part of me feels like it's going to be the biggest thing ever.

Speaker 1 And part of me feels like it could be the biggest distraction for people ever because there's always going to be a new tool, a new software, a new plug-in, a new something that solves some problem.

Speaker 1 Right.

Speaker 1 So how do people actually make money in an AI world? Yeah. When everything it seems like you can get for free?

Speaker 1 And if you launch an idea, someone else is going to launch it for free when you're trying to charge a premium membership for it and they're going to be 10 times better than your thing.

Speaker 1 And AI is just going to keep evolving. How do you stay focused when it is evolving so fastly? And everyone has access to it?

Speaker 2 What's happened is we've invented a technology that is going to fundamentally change the nature of the economy and society.

Speaker 2 Imagine a couple of hundred years years ago, 100 guys are out plowing a field on a farm, and two young guys turn up with a tractor and they say, watch this.

Speaker 2 And they drive the tractor up and down and they plow a whole field in a day that would have taken 100 guys a month.

Speaker 2 And

Speaker 2 when that happens one time,

Speaker 2 That's called a singularity moment. And a singularity means we don't know what the future looks like now.
We can't see around the corner.

Speaker 2 Because every single guy says, well, what are we all going to do? It only takes two guys to plow a field. We don't need to plow that many fields.
And what actually happened is that

Speaker 2 97, 98% of the people who used to work on farms got completely displaced. By the late 1800s, early 1900s, all the farmers had moved to the cities, and

Speaker 2 all the people who worked in agriculture had to move to the cities. We didn't know what the jobs would look like.

Speaker 2 So, like, even my grandfather, try and explain to my grandfather what is a personal trainer

Speaker 1 He's like, huh? So I have fitness back in the day.

Speaker 2 I say to my grandfather, imagine if I said to my, he's passed away, but imagine if I said to my grandfather,

Speaker 2 well, I don't really want to go to the gym. So I pay a guy to meet me there.
And then he counts how many heavy things that I lift and tells me that I've done a great job.

Speaker 2 And then he makes another time for me to meet at the gym. And my grandfather would go, what on earth? Like, are you guys being scammed? Like, what is going on?

Speaker 2 it's like yeah and he's like how many people have a personal trainer well lots of people it's a whole industry right so this idea of the personal training you know or a therapist or you know all of these couples therapists those things didn't happen 50 years ago yeah 60 years ago it's like you were just working outside all day or a podcaster right right so like the idea that you could be creating content and putting it on a free platform and and anyone can watch it and that you don't need permission to do it uh so all of this so we've hit a singularity moment and the singularity moment is as soon as that AI created the first legal agreement that was a real-life legal agreement, the legal profession, we know that 97% of people don't need to be in the lawyers anymore.

Speaker 2 And as soon as the first AI diagnosed an illness, we know that general practitioners are going to be, 97% of general practitioners don't need to be there anymore.

Speaker 1 What are people going to do?

Speaker 2 They're going to do something different.

Speaker 2 Life is going to look very different. We're going to have the, unfortunately, I've got a bad prediction for you.
There's going to be the bifurcation of society in the short term. What does that mean?

Speaker 2 It means that it splits in two.

Speaker 2 And what it means is that, I'll tell you what, AI has two superpowers. Superpower number one is the ability to distract.

Speaker 1 Huge distraction. Huge distraction.
It's like it's a massive distraction.

Speaker 2 Yeah. And it's actually in particular.

Speaker 1 If you're not focused in like how we're using this to grow and achieve our goals, you're just like, let me try this new thing this new tool yeah it's really important to know that AI is really good at turning people into hyper consumers and

Speaker 2 do you think there's anyone on earth who could be and beat an AI at chess no no not one single person zero and in the same way there's not a single person that can beat TikTok at holding their attention If you go on TikTok, it's game over.

Speaker 2 The minute you open TikTok as an app, it's game over.

Speaker 2 You're done.

Speaker 2 If you wanted to be there for one minute, it'll keep you for 10. If you want to be there for 10 minutes, it'll keep you for an hour.

Speaker 2 It is game over, it is going to turn you into a consumer at a much greater level than you wanted to consume.

Speaker 2 If you go on Amazon, there's a very high chance you'll buy something you didn't intend to buy when you logged in.

Speaker 2 So if you listen to Spotify, you're going to listen to more songs than you intended to listen to because their AI

Speaker 2 is turning you into a hyper-consumer.

Speaker 2 So the first thing you need to know is that some of the smartest people on the planet have invented AI technology to get get you to hyper consume and your time is limited so that's just going to take up your life.

Speaker 2 On the flip side of the coin is that AI makes you into a hyper creator

Speaker 2 and as a hyper creator you can be doing 10 things at once that used to take 10 people to do one thing.

Speaker 2 So when you have AI powers you can have what's called agentic AI which is having agents that go do stuff for you. So you might say gee I wish I knew the name of every doctor in LA.

Speaker 2 You can send an AI agent to go find that.

Speaker 2 You could say, I wish I could write a personal message to all my followers on LinkedIn. Okay, well, we can do that.
I wish I could take all of this data and put it into a spreadsheet.

Speaker 2 We could just tell an AI to do that.

Speaker 2 I wish I could create a software business, but I don't know what software business to create. Well, let's ask the latest O3 model and it'll tell us our options.

Speaker 2 We'll upload all of our stuff into there and it'll spit out some options. We'll pick one.

Speaker 2 And then we'll go to Replit and get them to build it as a software and it'll spit out some software and what would normally take months now happens in minutes.

Speaker 2 So

Speaker 2 when I say society is going to split, this is a warning.

Speaker 2 A bunch of people are going to be hyper consumers and a bunch of people are going to be hyper creators. And it's probably going to be 98% and 2%.

Speaker 2 So like

Speaker 2 One in 50 people are going to be doing so much money and success and productivity and they're going to make it look effortless and easy because they're using AI as a superpower.

Speaker 2 49 out of 50 are just going to get dragged under with TikToks and endless this and endless that. And, you know, they're going to get brainwashed from AI overwhelming them with a hyper consumption.

Speaker 2 So this is the last moment where you really get to decide. You have to decide and say, am I going to be disciplined and be a hyper creator or am I going to be undisciplined and be a hyper consumer?

Speaker 2 How do you make that decision?

Speaker 2 You delete your apps, delete them off your phone, you get rid of, you have an outsourced agency that does your social media for you where it's their job to do it as creative and

Speaker 2 you try and set up your life where you can distinguish between creativity and consumption and

Speaker 2 you can be very disciplined in limiting your consumption.

Speaker 1 Have you done this for yourself? Of course, and by kids

Speaker 2 and the people on my team and the people I work with. And that's why I'm even sharing it here.
Because I can see that as someone who works with this technology, I can see,

Speaker 2 you know what it was like for most of human history, we didn't have a lot of access to sugar. And then we just surrounded humans with sugar.
And then our brain was easily distracted by sugar and

Speaker 2 we end up with too much sugar in our system. So it's the same thing with content.
You know,

Speaker 2 it's the same thing that AI is going to do. It's going to hyper-consume.

Speaker 1 What's the greatest fear you have? I mean, you've got three kids. They're about to be, you know, some in their teen years in a few years.

Speaker 1 What's the fear you have around where they will be in society and how to set them up for success and be more creators versus consumers? Yeah.

Speaker 1 When it is so easily in an adolescent brains to do what your friends are doing and want to be on social media because they're on it.

Speaker 1 And then that leads to just more consume, consume, and then reflection of how can I look better? How can I I become more

Speaker 1 good looking in the world and get more validation, more attention, and go down that slippery road.

Speaker 2 I guess my greatest fear is that my kids stop coming to me to talk about this stuff.

Speaker 2 That they're dealing with something and I don't know about it.

Speaker 2 That would be a great fear of mine.

Speaker 2 Because as someone who I was born in 81.

Speaker 2 So I experienced life before

Speaker 2 computers and phones. And I also experienced the shift to personal computing, shift to mobile, cloud, now AI.
So I have this longer term context window

Speaker 2 of what life can be like and what life should be like and

Speaker 2 enjoyable,

Speaker 2 what's good,

Speaker 2 what has worked for many, many generations. So I would just hope that we always have an ongoing dialogue about this sort of stuff and that they can understand

Speaker 2 that this stuff can be the greatest asset, the greatest tool.

Speaker 2 But like any super super powerful technology, it's going to be a double-edged sword.

Speaker 1 It seems like school is kind of irrelevant and what they're teaching these days. It seems like just going to learn math or...

Speaker 2 The genesis of school was to create factory workers. That was that, like, this is not some conspiracy theory.
That's what it was for.

Speaker 2 It was the Prussian, the German army wanted to create soldiers. They created the Prussian schooling system.

Speaker 2 Guy from Massachusetts came out and saw it was like blown away it was based on a barracks with uniforms and all this sort of stuff and he was just like this is what we need because we we don't have enough factory workers for our industrializing America so

Speaker 2 so I think his name was Horace Mann so he comes out and he like says we're gonna get this like militarized schooling system and we're gonna adjust it to make factory workers I think Rockefeller had a famous quote about, I do not want a nation of thinkers, I want a nation of workers.

Speaker 2 And that was the schooling, and he said that in the founding of the school system.

Speaker 2 So,

Speaker 2 and that, by the way, I'm not against that because that was probably what was needed to build the world that we now take for granted.

Speaker 2 That's probably the best thing.

Speaker 1 You start with the dying economy. Yeah.

Speaker 2 So it's just that that system is just not going to serve you because ultimately that system is like training you to be an AI.

Speaker 2 It's actually training you to be like an AI. It's forcing data into your head and then then getting you to hallucinate answers on command, which is what AIs do.

Speaker 2 You just force lots of, it's just they do it better.

Speaker 1 Way better.

Speaker 2 Force the entire internet into its head and then it hallucinates answers and then we can tweak it and it does a better and better job.

Speaker 2 So we need kids who now know how to be the prompter, not the prompted. We need kids who now have to, they need to understand

Speaker 2 what it means to

Speaker 2 what I'm teaching my kids to be is high agency generalists.

Speaker 2 So a high agency generalist, a high agency means that you get stuff done in the world, you bring things into the world, you're a creator, not a consumer.

Speaker 2 And a generalist is someone who knows a little bit about a lot.

Speaker 2 They know about history and geography, they understand a bit about politics, they understand a bit about business, they know a bit about health and wellness and sports and all of those kind of things.

Speaker 2 And it's like the person who's going to rule the world in the future is the high agency generalist.

Speaker 1 The high agency generalist. What did you say? Generalist.
Generalist. That's British in your

Speaker 1 generalist. I was like, oh, it's generalist.

Speaker 2 It's British Australian society. So I have to go to the US.

Speaker 1 Now,

Speaker 1 as a parent,

Speaker 1 what are the three things you wish they taught in school moving forward in the school systems? If you can only teach three things, what do you wish all kids could learn over the next decade?

Speaker 2 Yeah, so I think taste and discernment, developing your own taste, developing discernment, what's not for me,

Speaker 2 team dynamics, putting together high-performing little teams,

Speaker 2 how to use teams to get the answer. One of the things I hate about the school system is this idea that you take a test on your own.

Speaker 2 In life, you take very few tests on your own. You take almost all tests as part of a team.
So

Speaker 2 when you are under pressure here, the first thing you do is bring together your team.

Speaker 2 You know, if you were suddenly to face a big challenge, you'd have a board meeting about it and bring together people in that room out there and everyone would love it.

Speaker 2 And you would get the answers by discussing the answers. There also wouldn't be one answer.
There'd be many answers to most problems. So this is critical thinking.
This is

Speaker 2 ideation and team dynamics and team play.

Speaker 2 I wish they would teach the idea of a completed loop. What does it look like to discover a problem, to then find co-collaborators, to do

Speaker 2 some diligence,

Speaker 2 to then invent something, to scale it up with team and technology, to formalize it and exit it and move on to the next problem. Like the understanding of that loop

Speaker 2 and the fact that you could, if you want, you can get paid for the loops. You don't get paid for the time.

Speaker 2 You can do a loop in a week, get paid a lot, you can get paid a lifetime's amount of income in a month if you can do a big loop in a month.

Speaker 2 So,

Speaker 2 like, it's not, it's not turning up and selling time for money that makes any money anymore. It's completing a cycle.

Speaker 1 I have a brand new book called Make Money Easy.

Speaker 1 And if you're looking to create more financial freedom in your life, you want abundance in your life, and you want to stop making money hard in your life, but you want to make it easier, you want to make it flow, you want to feel abundant, then make sure to go to makemoneyeasybook.com right now and get yourself a copy.

Speaker 1 I really think this is going to help you transform your relationship with money this moment moving forward. I hope you enjoyed today's episode and it inspired you on your journey towards greatness.

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