Park Bench Murders ////// 856

TV's number one drama, High Potential, returns with star Caitlin Olson as the crime-solving single mom with an IQ of 160.

Every week, Morgan uses her unconventional style and brilliance to crack LAPD's most perplexing cases.

It's the perfect blend of humor and mystery.

She's breaking the mold without breaking a nail.

High Potential premieres Tuesday at 10-9 Central on ABC and stream on Hulu.

I I don't mean to interrupt your meal, but I saw you from across a cafe and you're the Geico Gecko, right?

In the flesh.

Oh, my goodness.

This is huge to finally meet you.

I love Geico's fast-and-friendly claim service.

Well, that's how Geico gets 97% customer satisfaction.

Anyway, that's all.

Enjoy the rest of your food.

No worries.

Uh, so are you just gonna watch me eat?

Oh, sorry.

Just a little starstruck.

I'll be on my way.

If you're gonna stick around, just pull up a chair.

You're the best.

Get more than just savings, get more with Geico.

Welcome to True Crime Garage.

Wherever you are, whatever you are doing, thanks for listening.

I'm your host, Nick, and with me as always is a man who knows that all of my intros last week were meant for the week before.

Here is the captain.

It's good to see you and good to be seen.

Thanks for listening.

Thanks for telling a friend.

It's really heating up in the garage.

So this week we are cooling off with some delicious garage beer, classic lime.

This is a great summertime beer.

Heck, chug one after cutting the grass on a Saturday.

This is very refreshing.

And when the days are hitting 94, 95, 96 degrees, I go for something.

a little lighter.

And when I said garage beer, that's the name of the actual beer.

We're not just calling it any beer, garage beer.

This is garage beer.

ABV, 4% garage grade, 3 and 3 quarter bottle caps out of five.

And let's give some praise to our good friends for helping us out.

First up, a shout out to Jodi Harding.

in Sturgeon County, Alberta, Canada.

We love the Canadian listeners.

One of my fondest memories, Captain, is fishing up in Canada, the best tasting fish in the world.

And a a big, we like you, Jib, goes out to Danielle in Vermont.

Next up, here's a cheers to Nikki from Cincinnati, O-H-I-O, Go Reds.

And a big tall cans in there to Candy from Bristol, Indiana.

And last but certainly not least, we have a double-fisted cheers to Emily and Violet.

from Knoxville.

That's in Tennessee.

Everyone we just mentioned went to truecrimegarage.com and clicked on the pint glass helping us to fill up the old garage fridge for this week's show.

And for that, we thank you.

Yeah, BWWR, you and Beer Run.

If you're listening on the Apple Podcast app, then you can see all the extra goodness that we're giving you.

And to listen to the extra goodness, just hit subscribe and check out Off the Record in Colonel.

That's Enough of the Be is, Nia.

And my, my, my, it's so much goodness.

All right, everybody, gather around, grab a chair, grab a beer.

Let's talk some true crime.

wednesday

june 4th 2025 came and went just like most wednesdays for me and likely all of you listening in as well That was six weeks ago, and for most of us, it was just another day, just another cog in the middle of another mundane work week.

For me, I can look back at the calendar and fill in some of the blanks of what I was doing on that Wednesday.

On that day, a man named Grant Hardin, a one-time police chief and convicted murderer who had escaped from prison on May 27th, was still on the lamb.

I, no doubt, was busy learning about the prison he escaped from and the crimes he committed that landed him there.

I very likely ran an errand or two, completed a house chore, had a nice dinner, and if I was lucky, I did a little reading before bed.

That was very likely my day and yours probably shared some similarities.

But up in northeastern Ohio, just about 99 miles up 71 north from my place, There were two families grieving the loss of their dear loved ones.

Catherine Brown was 33 years old.

She was a daughter and a sister.

She was loved, is loved, and missed dearly.

Carnell Sledge was 40 years old.

He was a son and a brother.

He was loved, is loved, and he too is missed dearly.

Sadly, June 4th, 2025 marked six years since the two friends were murdered.

They were talking in a park on a beautiful sunny afternoon when someone very evil chose to take these two lovely people out of this world and away from their family and friends.

So on that day, Catherine and Carnell's families and friends know exactly what they were doing.

They were hurting.

Their hearts were very heavy, filled with love, fondness, sorrow, and anger.

The Brown and Sledge families have been hurting and grieving for six years.

They have been reminding those that will listen and pay attention that their loved ones were taken away, murdered.

They have been asking the public and the police for help.

Because while they will always miss Catherine and Carnell,

and while they will always be grieving this very difficult loss, They are also hoping to start healing someday.

But the healing process most likely can only start for them after we get justice for Catherine and Carnell.

Their killer is still out there.

The victims' families are out there to remind you of that.

And we are too.

This is the still-unsolved double homicide case of Catherine Brown and Carnell Sledge.

And this is True Crime Garage.

The Cleveland park bench murders, the Rocky River double murders, the Cleveland Metro Park murders all refer to one single case.

No matter what you want to title it, these are names given to the unsolved double homicide of Carnell Sledge and Kate Brown, who were shot and killed while sitting on a park bench in the Cleveland Metro Parks Rocky River Reservation.

This took place on June 4th, 2019.

Going forward, I think it's most appropriate to title this the park benched murders.

Now, if this is sounding familiar to you, well, then you would be exactly right, as we like to say.

That is because we covered this case in episodes 660 back in April of 2023, and then again earlier this year in episodes 820 and 821, where we were able to do much more of a deep and more thorough examination of the circumstances of this mystery as more information had come out.

But sadly, the case drags on with no justice.

for these two folks who just seem like some really good people.

Carnell Sledge and Kate Brown were very family-oriented individuals who loved and enjoyed their families and their community.

In our most recent episodes, we were able to push forward a very good suspect.

So if you have not heard those episodes, cue them up on your garage listening device, but you can finish this up first if you wish as they work hand in hand here.

So stick with us here because we have a big batch of new information, two other cases and items to be discussed.

Are these other murder cases connected to the double unsolved homicide case, the park bench murders?

Well, that is what people here locally are asking and what we will examine here today.

Now the internet, Captain, this might be the garage beer talking here, but remember that really great kid show Fraggle Rock?

Do I remember?

It's one of the best.

freaking theme songs of all time, man.

There was a character called the Trash Heap, and the Trash Heap knows all and sees all.

The fraggles would travel to the trash heap to ask it questions seeking knowledge and wisdom that's the internet speaking of giving things titles let's rename the internet the trash heap in some ways it certainly feels right

the internet tells me that the case has gained renewed attention due to its inclusion in the netflix series unsolved mysteries I'd say that is somewhat true.

However, I think a more accurate statement is that the case has received national attention because of Netflix Unsolved Mysteries.

And that was a great episode, by the way.

Go watch it.

Here, locally, especially if we go up to Northeast Ohio and the greater Cleveland area, this case has never really strayed very far from the media at all.

It's received a good amount of coverage.

And of course, we've covered it here on our podcast.

Bill Huffman, friend of our show, who hosts Who Killed, covered it on his show as well.

And some other podcasts have hit this case over the time.

Now, sadly, it's been just over six years.

The six-year anniversary was in June, less than six weeks ago, and these poor families are still left without justice for their loved ones.

A little recap of the case summary for persons who are new to this case and listening in today.

Thank you for listening, by the way.

June 4th, 2019, in the Rocky River Reservation.

This is near the Lorain Road Bridge.

We have victims here.

We're longtime friends, Carnell Sledge, he was just 40 years old, and Catherine Kate Brown, who was 33.

The two were meeting at the park.

It is believed that they had likely done so before, as the park, and specifically this location of the park, was close to where Kate lived, and she was known to frequent.

the park.

This was an impromptu meeting, though.

In fact, Carnell had somewhere else that he needed to be that day.

That was a scheduled event.

It was a dinner with family at grandma's house.

So this meeting with his friend Kate, longtime friend Kate, would cause him to be late for that meeting.

But Kate was a dear friend, and Carnell was known for helping people and being a very loyal dude.

And wasn't she seen crying while talking on the phone earlier that day?

Her movements are fairly well documented.

One part that is intriguing to me is there seems to be a little window of time or two during the portion of that day where she is not accounted for, or we don't know what she was up to at that time.

Could simply have just been at home.

But yeah,

something was up with Kate that day.

And that is what her family and Carnell's family have always said from the beginning.

That they think that this impromptu meeting was brought up by could have been either party, but

it seems to be that the general consensus here leaned toward that Carnell was probably there to help Kate with something or talk through

something with Kate that day.

It was only because of interaction between the two of them that they came up with, hey, let's meet over here at the last minute.

The other thing, too, with this last minute meeting here, Captain, that I think it's easy to come to this speculation here or conclusion in the speculation is that I think this meeting was supposed to be a rather quick meeting, rather short, because as said, Carnell had somewhere else to go and he wasn't going to let his family down.

He wasn't going to be a no-show.

And we talked about this when we covered it last time.

He didn't call or text anybody in his family to even let them know that he would be late.

To me, this dude's rather responsible.

I think to me, that shows, and he's considerate as well.

That shows that he didn't plan to be there very long.

Yeah, if you don't have a buddy that you can vent to about life, get you one.

And that's what these buddies were.

They were like vent buddies.

So, hey, something's going on.

Can you meet me real quick?

Let me get this off my chest.

That's what it seems like to me.

And like you said.

because of his actions and be or lack of actions, one could assume that this meeting was going to was going to be a pretty quick meeting.

I agree 100% with that so shortly after arriving at the park carnell sledge and kate brown were shot and killed carnell was shot in the head the murder scene suggests this happened while he was sitting on a park bench and this park bench is fairly close to the pull-off small gravel parking lot located near that lorain road bridge He

very likely never saw the attacker or attackers.

Kate was shot and killed as well.

She may have been sitting on the park bench as well when the attack first occurred.

However, the crime scene suggests that she likely had enough time to stand up or even possibly try to flee, but was then gunned down.

It is uncertain if she ever saw the attacker or attackers.

And the murder weapon, a small caliber gun, was not found at the scene and to this day has not been recovered.

It was initially thought

by police when they're arriving on the scene that this could have been some kind of murder-suicide.

I've heard the audio from the body camera footage or the audio from the call,

but when the officers are on the scene, you can hear clearly one of the officers saying to the other one after sounds like they're out of breath, like they've been working the scene vigilantly.

Right.

They can't seem to locate the gun and they don't locate the gun.

And the officer's telling the other officer,

we couldn't find any, there's no weapon there.

And he almost sounds like out of breath, but also like confused.

Like this is, I think, a part of the reason why it may not be solved.

You know, and look, we're all fallible.

And so they show up on the scene.

They think they're arriving to one type of crime or one type of situation.

and it turns out that it's not that kind of situation.

You can hear almost the confusion or the surprise in the officer's voice.

Yeah, but it's also more complicated because this is a crime that takes place in a park.

In broad daylight, there's a lot of land that somebody could dispose of a weapon on the land, but there's also water right by.

Be hard enough to find a gun in a field, let alone in water.

The Cleveland Metro Parks Police Department has been leading this investigation.

Recently, we've learned that, and we covered this earlier this year with the assistance from the FBI.

Now, what we learned more recently is that there is also additional outside assistance.

This is according to the current police chief for the Metro Parks,

where they're saying that they've also communicated and had interaction and involvement by the U.S.

Marshal Service and Ohio BCI.

Of course, we would expect Ohio BCI to be involved, the U.S.

Marshal Service apparently involved as well.

So kudos to the Metro Parks for getting other agencies involved in this investigation, which clearly seems to be a complicated investigation as the time drags on.

And it's now six years.

We've not seen an arrest.

But like you said, law enforcement shows up and initially they're like, is this a murder-suicide?

Okay, we can't find the weapon.

So that doesn't make much sense.

Okay, well, they're at a park.

They're in a public location.

So maybe it's a theft.

And then nothing stolen.

Phones, cars, jewelry, valuables, they'll all remain with the victims.

So then you go, well, this doesn't seem like it was a robbery.

Exactly.

And it's important to note here that both Kate and Carnell drove separately to this location.

Carnell was coming from work, and Kate, it appears, was coming from her apartment complex, which was not terribly far from this area of the park.

And they arrived separately in their respective vehicles.

And, like the captain said, their valuables that they would have had on their person or in their vehicles, all those valuables were located at the scene, either on their person or in their vehicles.

After the airing of the Unsolved Mysteries episode, as said, this brought the case to a wider audience, but also generated tips, new tips, which obviously is great.

The two families, Carnell's and Kate's, were begging the public for tips, information, and help, even posting signs and setting up at the park, asking folks in the park and driving by for anything at all, any information at all that they may have had.

They had signs saying, were you here on this date at this time?

Or were you driving by on this date at this time?

They were seeking information, as we say.

The Metro Park, while beautiful and harmonious, the folks in charge, maybe not so much, as they ordered the removal of all and any signs posted and set up by the families.

So the families, both very smart.

They have leaned on the media and the local media.

This is getting a good amount of coverage, as we've already said.

Regardless, it has now been six years and the case remains unsolved.

Family members in the community have been working to keep the case in the public eye, including organizing events and spreading awareness.

The FBI is offering a $25,000 reward for information leading to an arrest and conviction with additional reward money possibly.

available as well.

Yeah, I think possibly the reward goes up to $100,000.

That's correct.

I believe a big chunk of that reward offering is coming from the families or money raised by one of the families.

As said, these families have really

been very visible and incredibly vocal about this case and getting justice for their loved ones.

Just a quick background, because

we did go a little more in depth with this in our previous coverage, but Carnell was an AV tech at Crescent Digital in Strongsville, Ohio, so very nearby.

And he also volunteered as a youth consultant for Applewood Centers.

He was known for volunteering there, coaching youth sports, and much more,

he was referred to as Coach Sledge.

And the kids, from my understanding, still call him that and very...

They miss him dearly.

He's described as a big teddy bear of a man, friends and loved ones.

Many called him Nell.

And Catherine affectionately was called Kate by just about everyone that we could find in our research.

She worked at the KCG Goods in Brook Park, Ohio.

So also nearby as well.

Nell and Kate were killed, shot and murdered in the greater Cleveland, Ohio area at the Rocky River Reservation.

The Rocky River Reservation is a 2,500 acre preserve along the Rocky River.

It's very expansive and beautiful.

Looking at Cleveland on a map, you will see this large green line.

That is what they call the Cleveland Metro Parks Emerald Necklace Trail.

The Emerald Necklace connects Scenic Park at the north end of the Rocky River Reservation, goes south through Millstream Run Reservation, and then east to Brexville Reservation and the Towpath Trail.

A lot of bicyclists and pedestrians you would expect to see in this area, especially at the time of this murder.

As we said, this is late afternoon, early evening.

So this would have been in broad daylight.

The trail is part of the Metro Park's extensive trail network of over 325 miles of trails across 18 park reservations spanning nearly 25,000 acres.

So that's a big, huge, beautiful park.

that has these different parks inside, right?

With these different reservations, as they are called.

And again, given all that trail trail work that is there, you would expect to see hikers, bicyclists, and yet on this day, when these two good people were killed, there is apparently no eyewitnesses.

And remember, there was a gun used in this homicide, in this double homicide, and there's no ear witnesses either, which is incredibly difficult to believe.

It's something the family has had a hard time even trying to conceive the idea that nobody saw anything, nobody heard anything,

even with cars going over that bridge and traveling nearby, even persons not in the park per se.

But one of the people we brought up, obviously, was somebody that was parked in that pull-off gravel parking lot, which is in view of the park bench where Carnell was sitting when

he was shot and killed.

Well, there's so many things that make this case fascinating.

One, it takes place in a public location, So we should have some eyewitnesses or some ear witnesses.

It also happens during the day.

What law enforcement is able to figure out based on cell phone data and other determining factors is that both of these victims arrive just after 5 p.m.

and the bodies are discovered around 5.18.

So that gives us roughly a 14 minute time period.

And that that's really fascinating.

It's hard in a lot of cases to shorten that time frame or to get that timeline down to just 14 minutes.

And some of the things that law enforcement kind of speculate, because there's no eyewitness, there are no ear witnesses, did this

suspect, did they have extensive knowledge of the park, the entrances, the exits of the park, and also just the daily traffic through those areas.

And then the other speculation that has been made, not just by law enforcement, but many armchair detectives on the interwebs is

there a silencer used.

Many armchair detectives on the trash heap speculate maybe that there was a silencer used.

You get an extra garage beer lime here today because you are spot on there, my friend.

That's got to be the speculation, right?

That you would be a moron to not have that cross your mind that there's a possibility that a suppressor was used.

And we've,

we don't have, we're not going to pretend, we're just a couple of garage guys here.

We're not going to pretend to have extensive knowledge on firearms, but we have covered other cases where we do know and have 100% proof and know that it's fact that a suppressor or silencer was used.

And so we've gone through the research of what does it take to legally obtain a suppressor.

And

it's a rigorous process and it's an involved process.

It can be expensive and your name is forever tied to the serial number on that suppressor.

And we talked about this before.

So it's, it's a, they call it a stamp to that you receive a stamp, you apply for a stamp to be approved to purchase one.

And then the way that they would try to police this or keep keep tabs on things is meaning like if somebody from the ATF knocks on my door right now and I have a stamp allowing me to buy a suppressor, they can knock on my door 24-7 for no rhyme or reason and say, we need you to produce that silencer right now,

showing that I didn't apply for the stamp, purchase the silencer, and then just give it to the captain.

as a birthday gift and he's running around pointing it at people.

Let me point something out that I I think is obvious.

If I tell you, hey, Colonel, sit down for a second.

I'm going to play you a sound.

You tell me what this sounds like.

And I played you something that sounds like a gunshot.

You would go, that's a gunshot.

But when you're in an apartment across the street, or you're on a bike ride, maybe with some earphones in, listening to your favorite band, like Creed.

No.

How about no?

When you're just blasting Creed, trying to get your miles in, and then you hear something in the distance, or again,

on top of other noises you're hearing.

I think there could be some ear witnesses that just don't know what they heard that day.

Well, that's a great question.

And I think that's interesting to ponder.

But with all of the media coverage that it's received and the

people looking for information here, I would hope that that request hit the earballs of those people and they would at least come forward and say, Look, I heard something.

I was uncertain of what I heard at the time.

This is what I remember.

Maybe I remember seeing a blue truck.

Even if you think it's something of no significance at all,

let the police sort that part of it out.

I feel what you're saying because, you know, I used to live in this not-so-great neighborhood for many, many years, and we would regularly get cars, you you know, old junk cars just kind of backfiring, right?

And you would, you would think, partly because of the area, my mind jumped to like, oh, that must have been a gunshot.

No, it's usually just the car backfiring.

And now I live in a much more fun neighborhood where there's, and especially given the calendar this time of year, you get a lot of fireworks and it might just be a single one.

Heck in my neighborhood, they will light off fireworks for, it doesn't take the fourth of July.

Halloween, it's it's surprising.

They fire off so many fireworks on Halloween.

It makes very little sense to me, but I but I do enjoy it.

So, within that Rocky River Reservation, right inside that beautiful park, this is located at the city of Fairview Park in Cuyahoga County, Ohio.

As said, Nell and Kate met there late afternoon, early evening.

Someone snuck up on them and fired three shots: boom, boom, boom, hitting all three

and left them there to die.

The first few weeks of school are in the books.

Now it's time to keep that momentum going.

IXL helps kids stay confident and ahead of the curve.

IXL is an award-winning online learning platform that helps kids truly understand what they're learning, whether they're brushing up on math or diving into social studies.

It covers math, language arts, science, and social studies from pre-K all the way through 12th grade with content that's engaging, personalized, and yes, actually fun.

And in case you didn't know, IXL is used in 96 of the top 100 school districts in the U.S.

It's the start of school.

This is when you learn if your kid is struggling with a specific topic.

And if so, IXL is the way to catch up.

It's the way to give them a leg up and to keep up.

Or if you want to get ahead, it's great too.

Studying for test, they have features on there that families are finding especially helpful.

I think you are going to like and enjoy, and your kid is going to like and enjoy and learn with IXL.

Make an impact on your child's learning.

Get IXL Now and True Crime Garage listeners can get an exclusive 20% off IXL membership when they sign up today at ixl.com slash garage.

Visit ixl.com slash garage to get the most effective learning program out there at the best price.

This show is sponsored by BetterHelp.

Where do you go in order to solve your life's problems?

Do you call your best friend?

Do you have a group chat?

Are you standing in line to get coffee oversharing with strangers?

Well, let me tell you, don't do that.

There's a difference between that and actually talking to a therapist.

That's where BetterHelp comes in with clinically trained and licensed therapists.

They've been around for over a decade, helped millions, and out of 1.7 million client reviews, they got a 4.9 rating.

BetterHelp does the initial matching work for you so you can focus on your therapy goals.

A short questionnaire helps identify your needs and preferences.

And if you aren't happy with your match, switch to a different therapist at any time.

It's fully online, and you can pause your subscription whenever you need to.

With over 30,000 therapists, BetterHelp is the world's largest online therapy platform, having served over 5 million people globally.

As the largest online therapy provider in the world, BetterHelp can provide access to mental health professionals with a diverse variety of experience.

Find the one with BetterHelp.

Our listeners get 10% off their first month at betterhelp.com slash garage.

That's better,

H-E-L-P.com/slash garage.

This show is proudly sponsored by BetterHelp.

Check out betterhelp.com slash garage today.

While you're buying new school supplies and trying to plan a new schedule this season, the last thing you want to factor in is a giant wireless bill.

But with Mint Mobile, you can get the coverage and speed you're used to for way less money.

For a limited time, Mint Mobile is offering three months of unlimited premium wireless service for $15 a month.

That's right, $15 a month for really great premium wireless service.

I love Mint Mobile.

Why?

Because it's the same great service that I get with other providers that shall not be named at a fraction of the price.

So great service, save money.

That's Mint Mobile.

Get this new customer offer and your three-month unlimited wireless plan for just 15 bucks a month at mintmobile.com/slash TCG.

That's mintmobile.com/slash TCG.

Upfront payment of $45 required, equivalent to $15 a month.

Limited time, new customer offer for the first three months only.

Speeds may slow above 35 gigabytes on unlimited plan.

Taxes and fees extra.

See Mintmobile for details.

What does feeling safe at home really mean to you?

Many think that having good locks and alarm that makes noise is good enough, but true security takes more.

With Simply Safe's new active guard outdoor protection, you get a system that works to prevent that break-in, that violation of your space from ever happening in the first place.

AI-powered cameras plus live monitoring agents detect suspicious activity around your property.

If someone's lurking, agents talk to them in real time, turn on spotlights, and can call the police, proactively deterring crime before it starts.

This is why we love Simply Safe.

This is why we use Simply Safe to protect the garage studios and our homes.

With Simply Safe, you're going to feel confident that you're protecting yourself, but more importantly, protecting your loved ones.

If there is a Looky Lou lurking around our studios, look, we can't be here 24-7.

But Simply Safe has our back.

They see that looky loo and they say, Hey, stop your lurking.

And if they don't listen to that agent, the agent can contact the police.

And this is why we love Simply Safe because you're going to feel confident that you're protecting yourself and protecting your loved ones.

Visit simplysafe.com/slash garage to claim 50% off a new system with a professional monitoring plan and get your first month free.

That's simply safe.com/slash garage.

There is no safe like Simply

All right, we are back.

Cheers, mates.

Tall cans in the air.

Cheers to you, Colonel.

Tall cans very high in the air, and cheers to all the people up front.

And cheers, double cheers to the people in the back.

Now, we gave that description of the Cleveland Metro Parks, which is a,

for lack of a better definition, it's a conglomerate of all these smaller parks that make up this big, huge, beautiful area.

Now, we want to really echo names of two of the locations within the very large metro parks from that description.

One, the Rocky River Reservation, which you've heard that name multiple times already in this podcast.

And two, the Mill Stream Run Reservation.

These more precise locations are paramount to this week's true crime story because, more recently, since the park bench murders, a murder took place in the Mill Stream Run Reservation.

And then a homicide took place very recently that has a direct connection to the Rocky River Reservation portion of the Metro Parks.

The first case that we need to discuss here, Captain, is

the body of Leroy Johnston was located deep in a wooded area of the Mill Stream Run Reservation on September 30th, 2023.

Now, I got to walk something back here a little bit.

I heavily criticized the Metro Parks for what I thought was their

bungling of the park bench murders investigation.

And I have to walk it back a little bit, but I'm not walking it back all the way because I still stand by that.

I think there were things that there were missteps, which again, we're all human.

I make mistakes every week, right?

Every week of my life, I've made a mistake.

I guarantee it.

But I also think that there's things that they've not corrected.

And I also, I, I think that there is a weird like posturing that they're doing that it's like we're doing everything we can and we're very capable.

And, and I question both of those,

both of that posturing.

But anyway, you shouldn't apologize until they actually solve the case.

Well, I'm giving a partial apology here because I said that I don't think that they were equipped to solve a homicide, and they did solve a homicide.

So

either they got the comeuppance that they needed, or

I was wrong.

They were able to sort this out fairly quickly.

It took a while to make an arrest, but there was an arrest of a

Victor Vedler.

His last name is spelled V-E-N-D-L-E-R.

He was arrested in May of 2024.

Remember, the body was found in September of 2023.

When he is arrested and charged with the murder of this Leroy Johnson, he initially pled innocent back in 2023, but then just last month, he changed that to plea guilty.

This was just two weeks ago on June 30th, 2025, that he was sentenced to life in prison.

The reason why

this one is looked at and was looked at by at least the public as a possible connection to the still unsolved park bench murders is the victim is found in another location of this Metro Parks, found as said in a deep, deep in a wooded area.

The body was discovered by two mushroom hunters whose, their dog went rogue on them and took off.

And when they find their dog, the dog is what stumbled upon the body, if you will.

And this poor guy, Leroy, he was 77 years old, an elderly man.

And what they were able to determine here, Captain, is that Leroy was killed in...

the park.

He was killed where his body was found.

The early reports that were coming out shortly after the arrest of this Victor was that the two knew each other.

Now, they didn't give any background on that at the time.

What we would then learn when he changes his plea to guilty, and I don't think this is anything that they learned from Victor.

I think this is information they already knew within their investigation, information that they had sussed out themselves.

But the details of it and best that we we get is that, in fact, actually, the two of them were in a relationship.

And Victor is much, much younger than the victim, Leroy.

I believe Victor was only 22 years old at the time of the homicide.

So they're in some kind of relation.

And when we say relationship, it seems like it was a romantic relationship because the judge that had to hand down the sentencing on June 30th of this year said one of the worst parts, one of the worst details of the case that he had learned about

was that this Victor individual was able to murder somebody that he,

that loved him and that he once loved.

And the details of the case are this.

We knew initially after the arrest that police were saying that Victor lured Leroy to the park that day, then killed him.

So not on the day that he was found.

It was about six days later that the body was found.

But I'm guessing they probably found

this is this is the Batman Utility Belt tool that is that is helping law enforcement, as I said, cell phones.

I'm guessing that there was cell phone communication between victim and perpetrator, where they have communication saying, hey, meet me at the park.

And of course, we know six days later, they find the victim's body there.

And what they sorted out is that they went for a hike.

So I'm guessing the plan was meet me here.

We're going to go for a hike.

And at some point, Victor pulls a gun on Leroy, walks him deep into the woods, kills him, leaves him there, and then police are left to sort it out after the body is then found six days later.

This was looked at for obvious reasons.

The Metro Parks is involved.

It's a gun crime.

One thing that I find to be intriguing as far as does Victor make a good suspect, he'll be awfully young, and it appears that there was a direct firm relationship between the victim and the perpetrator here.

I think that had that been the case, which I don't think, you know, that's been the debate all along with the park bench murders.

Was this a random thing where they targeted?

I really think that they were.

They were very likely targeted.

And if that's the case, then one of them had some kind of relationship.

One of them knew the killer.

And it doesn't seem like they've drawn any line between Victor

to either of our victims here in the park bench.

Well, one, he killed somebody in the park, but two, he does live close to

their murder scene.

Yes, he does.

And now he's been sent away for life in prison.

But do we know what kind of gun was used?

Because we know what kind of gun was used in the park bench murder.

That's correct.

No, we don't know what kind of gun was used for the Leroy Johnson homicide.

I don't believe that has been reported.

There's been very little reporting on that case.

And I think in large part, that's because police and then later the prosecutor had a whole bunch of information that they figured out in their investigation.

And that's why I think ultimately he changed his plea from innocent to guilty.

I think he realized, realized, look, I don't stand a chance once I get the court here.

And I don't think that because it appears to be a open and shut case, that a lot of the details of it didn't make their way to the media and then to the public.

But they do have the indictments are on the Cleveland Prosecutor's website.

the Cuyahoga County Prosecutor's website.

The indictments are short.

I did find one person who posted and said that a portion that's being left out from the storytelling in the media is that Victor actually went by Victoria.

And I think that the indictments initially charged with four different counts, right?

Charged with the kidnapping because walking the victim off of the path into the woods.

charged with the murder, charged with leaving the corpse there.

So there were four different charges, and I can't remember the fourth.

I could pull it up here on my other screen.

But

the indictments read as

on his or her person with everything, with the gun, with his or her, his or her.

So I think that there is some possible validation that maybe Victor was going by the name of Victoria at the time of this homicide.

But maybe they're holding back this information because they do have some connection to other crimes.

Possibly.

I think that had that been the case, especially had it been in this case, with this case being such publicized, I think we would be hearing that.

Again, it's been relatively soon since, or sorry, relatively recent since he was sentenced.

So maybe that's not the case.

But again, there doesn't seem to be any line that one can draw from that perpetrator to either of our victims here.

And as said, he would have been quite young when that took place.

One that I think is of, that seems to be fascinating and capturing the attention locally here with much more suspicion, which with a higher degree of suspicion of possibly being connected, is a case that just three weeks prior to the very sad sixth anniversary of the day that Carnell Sledge and Kate Brown were so senselessly murdered, there was another disturbing and troubling case of a very violent and very public murder that takes place.

This time not in the Rocky River Reservation, but just a short drive away in a place called Cam's Corners.

Cam's Corners is a neighborhood on the west side of Cleveland, Ohio.

This is another gun homicide in broad daylight in the middle of what should have been a great afternoon in Cleveland.

The sun was shining, folks were outside enjoying the sun when a very loud gunshot rang out on a an otherwise quiet residential street in Cam's Corners.

When we are talking Cleveland News, you know, my go-to is News 5.

So, of course, most of this is from the good reporters at News 5.

It's a sunny Wednesday afternoon, May 14th, 2025.

So, kids are still in school at this time.

Folks are out going about their day.

One man is outside of his home tending to his lawn.

A neighbor of his is in her living room inside her home.

This is across the street.

It's about 1:30 in the afternoon.

She hears a bang.

She hears the gunshot.

She looks across the street.

She sees two things right away.

Her neighbor is down on the ground and a dark SUV is driving away.

So she springs into action, runs across the street.

She knows the neighbor.

He has lived there a long time.

He is well liked.

As she gets closer, she sees he's covered in blood.

She tries desperately to help, yelling his name, Tom, Tom.

He is not responding.

She kneels down and checks his pulse.

He's gone, dead by the time that she gets across the street.

Emergency services are called and they are on the scene with the quickness.

And sadly, the EMS confirms what the neighbor found.

Tom, the neighbor, was shot and killed.

He died in the street of his neighborhood.

Responding police were now on the scene and looking for that dark-colored SUV.

It was determined that Thomas Barton Overall, age 68, died after being shot while he was outside mowing his lawn.

He moved to Cleveland in the 80s.

He was retired.

He worked part-time at Rocket Arena, mostly in guest relations at the Cavs games.

Several neighbors told News 5 that they were struggling bad with the loss.

They were all in shock.

As said, he was well known, well-liked.

Folks said he was meticulous about taking care of his house and his property, in particular his lawn.

He was a member of a hiking club.

He had hiked over 6,000 miles with the Cleveland Hiking Club.

On that Friday, so two days after he was murdered, on that Friday, Tom was going to travel overseas for a two-week hiking trip with the Cleveland Club.

They were to be hiking in Spain.

Police quickly located the dark SUV that was spotted at the scene of the murder right after the gunshot was heard.

According to Cleveland police, officers responded and located a vehicle believed to have been involved nearby.

A suspect was found dead inside the vehicle from what appeared to be a self-inflicted gunshot wound.

The vehicle was found on Hogsback Lane.

This is near the Stench Combe Groth Memorial in the Rocky River Reservation.

The perpetrator, the killer, has been identified as 66-year-old Brian Hurt of Cleveland, and the identification came by way of the Cuyahoga County Medical Examiner's Office.

Brian Hurt lived at 15717 Munn Road.

Okay, these two were neighbors.

So neighbor shoots neighbor, drives to the very nearby Stones Throw Park, Rocky River Reservation, and turns the gun on himself.

Wow.

This seems very crazy, very bizarre, but when you start digging into it, a lot of it kind of suddenly makes sense.

So apparently, Captain, when the police call Tom's sister, so Tom didn't have any kids.

He wasn't married.

He didn't have any kids.

So they call his next of kin to notify her that sadly

brother has been killed.

And her reaction is, was it Brian, the neighbor?

So

obviously there was something going on here that

others knew about because the neighbors said the same thing.

But from what I can gather based off of what other people in the neighborhood have said on the record to reporters, it sounds like Brian Hurt

really sucked and that Tom overall was really cool.

I don't want to pretend to know the details of that, but it was interesting to me to learn that when they notify the sister,

her first reaction is, was it Brian?

And so that tells you.

And then, of course, Cuyoga County Medical Examiner's Office confirmed that yes, it was Brian.

Yeah, it kind of tells you everything you need to know.

He can't be charged and tried, obviously, at this point, but all signs are pointing to that

they know who did this and that there won't be any further investigation.

However, the further investigation comes is now Brian Hurt is being looked at because, one, he lives so close.

So both him and his neighbor that he killed lived very close to this Rocky River reservation.

So close that the police didn't have to look very far to find the dark colored SUV.

And I also

am very suspicious.

This has not been said on the record, but Captain, I bet you that neighbor across the street, she probably has witnessed some kind of beef between the two.

She's going to know her neighbor's vehicle.

She's probably telling them, look, I can't say 100%, but it looked like Brian hurt the neighbor's vehicle that was,

he was, this guy was cutting his grass and he shot and killed.

He laid in that street.

Thank God he was killed instantly and didn't suffer.

But he laid in that street while they conducted their

investigation.

Tom's family and the neighbors, I mean, this is very, very tragic.

And now, Brian Hurt, you can't make this stuff up.

He is properly named, my friend, as he has an extensive history of violence.

So let's go through this guy's rap sheet here, shall we?

Brian Hurt,

the rap sheet on him shows shows us 25 criminal arrests.

Wow.

Wow.

Yeah,

that's a five with a two in front of it, right?

Wow.

More than two dozen.

And look, I'm not, I know that this shouldn't mean anything, but that's a nice neighborhood.

It was hard for me to believe that a dude with this many, this

lengthy of a criminal history lives living with somebody

because he could have been living with somebody that did well for themselves and was just trying to help out this shitbag.

It just looked like one of those neighborhoods where people live and stay in their homes for a very long time.

And clearly, the neighbors that were good people all knew each other.

Now, so this includes aggravated robbery, aggravated assault, aggravated menacing.

One of the more notable offenses, he attacked an officer in 2010.

This was at a Rocky River courtroom.

This is all on, you can view the video of him attacking the bailiff.

I guess you would call it,

you know, the court officer, the bailiff there.

And from my understanding,

the judge is looking at the case, and I think Brian Hurt thought he was going to get released on bond, and something changed with that, or he, or he was just wrong, and this set him off.

He then attacks the bailiff, gets five years in prison.

So, some a little more clear and concise information on this guy here.

So, Cleveland City leaders said Brian Hurt, the perp in the murder of Tom Overall, was problematic for years.

A three news investigative reporter found that in 2010, Brian Hurt was convicted on charges from an incident at his home in which police say he let his dog out and encouraged it to attack a census taker.

You know, the census takers, they come around and they ask some questions.

They have a little questionnaire to fill out.

I think this takes place every 10 years.

He

unleashes a dog,

telling the dog to attack the person.

There's probably not a lot of people showing up to work going,

I have to collect these surveys.

I'm loving my life today.

And then they knock on this asshole's door, and the guy's like, hey, dog, sick balls.

The judge gave him a suspended sentence and probation for this offense.

Seems reasonable.

Kudos to the judge.

Seems like a give this guy a second chance.

Two months later, police arrested Brian Hurt in a road rage incident in West Park, according to the indictment.

This is, again, according to Three News.

According to the indictment, Brian Hurt followed a driver.

of another vehicle who was with his wife and two kids, pulled alongside of that family's car, car and pointed a gun at them.

It was then,

right, he's facing those charges at the Rocky River court that police say Brian Hurt became enraged that his bond changed and reportedly lunged at the bailiff.

Reportedly, is a

word we don't need to put in there.

It's on video.

You can see him charge the bailiff.

If you have eyeballs, you saw it.

And so he.

And the photographer typed it up.

What is exactly?

What is part of this, though, too, that wasn't clear in the video that I saw is, according to this report, when he lunged at the officer, he was trying to take the officer's gun.

So Brian Hurt had to be tasered.

Man, I hope they tased him good, too.

The officer

wound up with a broken nose, and then it was in 2011 that Brian Hurt was sentenced to five years in prison for that attack.

Here's what I see.

This guy, look, some of the city leaders in Cleveland have already said this: that he's a whack.

Mental health.

Yes, mental health needs to be a concern here.

Did we miss something?

Were there red flags that were missed?

No, no, no, no.

You saw all the red flags and he got punished for those actions.

I was just going to say, sometimes we take this mental illness a little too far.

If you're a good person that's struggling with depression or anxiety or whatever, fine.

But some of these people, their whole life, they were born with quote-unquote a mental illness.

They're born with evil.

They're born with hatred.

They're born with anger.

That's something that

I don't think sometimes we can fix.

Well, yeah, clearly this guy is one of these

full-on rage, angry, angry dudes.

I mean, he was 66 years old, so maybe this was just something that was going on in the later part of his life.

But

in a basically a 15-year time span, he sicks a dog on some poor innocent person.

He pulls a gun on a family in a road rage incident.

He attacks a bailiff in a courtroom, goes to prison for five years.

And then after he gets out, a handful of years after, well, it would have been less than 10 years after he gets out, he shoots his neighbor who's cutting the grass.

He went unhinged at some point.

Somebody, after I say this, is going to say, Well, Captain, that's a dumb thought.

But what I wonder in this guy's life, if nothing,

if there's no traumatic thing, like if he didn't lose a loved one or something, is it possible that he got in a car wreck or something happened where he had some kind of head injury?

Because

I've I've only really seen it a couple times in person

of individuals that had severe head injuries and their personalities shift completely.

And some of them either become

just more reckless or seeking like adrenaline rush,

but some of them become angry and violent.

because of a head injury.

Oh, yes, we know all of that to be true.

And

look, we just don't have enough time here to be sympathetic to the murderer here today.

So

this, of course, catches the headlines.

And then people want to know, well,

why did he choose to go to the park and take his life?

Does that have some significance to anything else?

We can clearly see he has a lengthy history of violence.

He was not in prison at the time of the park bench murders.

I mean, he could have went inside his home and taken his own life he could have went in his backyard and did this he could have drove anywhere and did this he could have drove and tried to flee the scene well is law enforcement telling us what kind of gun was found when they found his body

so great question what we do know here is that the gun that the gun that was used to kill his neighbor and the gun that he used to take his own life with was the same.

And it, it is not, they don't need to do ballistic testing on it because the caliber is nowhere near what was used in so a very small caliber i believe 22 was used in the bench the park bench murders and this was a higher caliber gun that was used so they don't need to do that testing now well that's why i'm doubling down because the speculation is well did he go to the park to kind of leave law enforcement breadcrumb well if he's going to really leave them a breadcrumb you think he would leave the murder weapon that he used if he was involved in the park bench murders.

Yeah.

And if he wanted to tip, I think that this is more of a

thought that this was a knee-jerk reaction.

Like he just went to a place for some reason that is familiar to him and that maybe

has some significance for some other reason.

I mean, he could, if he wanted us to know, he could have simply left a note if he was the person responsible, but that didn't happen.

I see, this is, again, it goes back to the idea that I really firmly believe, and I, until I'm proven otherwise, I, I really think that there was a direct connection between the

gunman for the park bench case with one of those victims.

I don't see any line that you can draw between either of these perpetrators.

I really think the Brian Hurt situation is more of a

ticking time shit.

Yes, he knew he was a ticking time bomb.

We've seen it time and time again.

And this time he, he, he recognized, oh, my, I finally, finally lost it.

I killed this man.

I'm not going back to prison.

That's what this one looks like to me.

Now, that's from, that's from a

from an overview, right?

We, we can't say and we don't know for certain.

And again, it's very early in the goings on here to believe that they've completely dismissed that as a possibility, they being the investigators.

Now,

thank you for bringing up the gun because I want to give a big shout out to 19 news anchor Nicole Versansky.

She interviewed the current Metro Parks police chief, Kelly Stillman.

To be clear here, Kelly Stillman was not the chief at the time of the 2019 park bench murders when that took place, but has since taken over as the police chief.

And I'm giving, I want to give Nicole a big shout out because I listened to the interview she did and conducted.

I listened to it twice, and she asked all of the right questions at all the right times and in the perfect order.

This was the question that really stood out for me.

And talking about guns, she asked the chief, did Brian Hurt have other guns, right?

The one that was used in this murder-suicide, we know is not a match to the double homicide, but did he have other guns?

When you went into his home, and again, everything that I'm seeing in type and everything that I'm hearing by people's words keeps saying his home.

So I've got to take that to believe that

that was his home.

And I couldn't find any information to suggest that he was married.

So he may have lived there alone.

This is a beautiful, great.

quaint neighborhood.

It is smaller homes in this neighborhood.

Brilliant question.

Did Brian Hurt have other guns?

I hate this answer.

Chief Stillman, I hate this answer.

The answer he gave is: that's a Cleveland Police Department case.

You'd have to ask them.

Bullshit.

Why didn't you ask them?

Why isn't your department asking them?

It's not 19 news anchored Nicole's job to solve your double homicide that is sitting there for six years.

And I think this is where I share the frustration that the families have here and question

how hard is this case being worked?

Because when presented to the police chief about any questions of evidence or what is being done, the answer that we get time and time again is, well, these things don't happen overnight.

No shit.

We know that, chief.

Guess what?

The murders didn't happen yesterday.

They happened six years ago.

And I don't want to go too far down this road because we've already recommended that people go back and listen to those other episodes, had they not, where we go way in depth on the timing that all the vehicles arrive into that pullout, into that parking space for the Rocky River Reservation, where they found Carnell's vehicle, where they found Kate's vehicle, where the guy that everybody just wants to call him the roofer.

was sitting and like Carnell's family says his mother and his grandmother, they say it so perfectly when you hear them.

That man was there before the murders, during the murders, and after the murders.

He was the only person that checks all three of those boxes.

The only person that we can find that checks all three of those boxes.

Very likely the only person in existence that checks all three of those boxes.

And they are very concerned with that guy, and so am I.

And that's what we told you in those previous two episodes.

Yeah, a couple points.

One, I think with Brian killing himself in the park, to me, that's more, well, somebody else will find me.

Not if I kill myself in my own house, then maybe one of my loved ones will find me.

And maybe he was trying to save them from that experience.

But to the park bench murders, you know,

we covered this a while ago, but I dove back in.

And the speculation that you hear coming from the public and coming from law enforcement was, well, Kate had this ex-boyfriend and Kate also went on this date that was with some kind of weirdo and she was on dating apps as well yeah dudes stop being creeps but on top of that could it been racially motivated it's possible well yeah that's something that's come up time and time again in this case right but there's a lot of people in the in the in public's eyes that go no absolutely not well until you solve it you can't roll out anything and then also,

like you were saying, this roofer.

But when you hear these updated reports, you hear from people, well, these individuals were cleared.

Now, I don't think they were publicly cleared by law enforcement, but six years, maybe you need to double back,

re-interview these people, double-check their alibis.

Double-check your paperwork.

Maybe there's something that will jump out at you.

We've seen this in other cases.

Double check your work, but this is where

my questions are the same as yours.

How hard is this investigation being worked?

You have a guy that should have been an eyewitness, should have been an ear witness that just doesn't know anything, sitting in a parking lot, not far away from the crime scene.

And

I don't think his background shows that he's a saint.

No, he's been charged with he has a history of violence as well.

He was a known gun owner.

And then we personally had several people that told us, and this is hearsay because they heard it from other individuals, that he regularly would keep firearms in his vehicle.

And what was also reported directly to us is that he owned the same caliber of gun that was used in the double homicide.

He was interviewed and then

when we say interviewed, that sounds like there was a lot of work done no he he was probably asked a few basic questions and then sent along his way and then they realize it's not a murder suicide it's actually a double homicide oh we better call some people back to the scene and and talk to them again so look i i i can't i won't fault them for exact for

every misstep that I think occurred on the day that they the bodies were found

because I think a lot of this things are happening quickly.

I think their intent was to do the very best job that they could.

I really think that they thought they were going to find a firearm in the water.

That didn't happen.

And when that didn't happen, they realized that the case is not what they thought they were responding to.

And we've said this a hundred times on this show that

that always puts

the investigation at a significant disadvantage when you think you're arriving to one crime and it takes you a little bit of time to figure out that it was actually something entirely different.

Now, where I will give the Metro Parks Police Department and the chief of police, Kelly Stillman, credit and kudos.

It's been reported that they did take the investigation to the VDOC Society, which is a crime-solving club in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania.

Members of the Society, so there's like 80 people in

this

VDOC Society, and members are forensic professionals, current and former FBI profilers, homicide investigators, scientists, psychologists, prosecutors, and coroners whose

experience and expertise provide or hopefully provide new insights for the investigations that have gone cold.

And

Chief Stillman is on record saying that we took it to the V Doc Society and they said that their findings were that

we did everything we could, we've done everything we could, and that there's nothing that they would have done differently.

That's great.

If that's something you want to hang your hat on, Chief Stillman, go for it.

But I also have an understanding of how the V Doc Society works.

I think you should get much credit for taking it to them.

It's some of the most brilliant minds in this country for solving homicides, especially cold cases.

But your outfit has been working this case for six years.

When you take it to the VDOC Society, it is usually reviewed for an afternoon.

That's about the best they can do because they are hearing cases from all over the country.

If that is your rebuttal to, well, no, we worked it correctly.

I don't know that that That doesn't make me feel any better.

I still think that there have been things that that could be done, things that should be done in this case.

And again,

there are things we brought up in the first episode in 2023.

And then there are a lot of things that we brought up in our more recent coverage in

February with episodes 820 and 821.

Right.

But when you go to this crime scene, view it as the worst possibility, not just, well, this is a murder-suicide.

Because if you take that witness that could have been an eyewitness, could have been an ear witness, the roofer, and you just say, hey, we're going to take you down for questioning.

Now, the questioning might not matter.

Maybe you get a little bit of information from him, but he keeps saying, I didn't see anything.

I didn't see anything.

But what do we know?

The victims were killed by gun.

So, is there a test that we can do to figure out if this roofer fired a gun that day?

Yes, there's a test that we could do.

So, just administering.

There's actually two tests that you could do.

One, the gunshot residue test, the gunpowder residue test, obviously.

The other test you could do is, hey, before you leave, do you mind if we search your truck?

Right.

You didn't see anything.

You didn't hear anything.

This might be a murder-suicide, but we're just asking this of everybody that parked here.

Right.

You mind if we search your truck?

Oh, and by the way, if you want to take a polygraph test, that's fine too.

Again,

to stand on this hill.

of we did everything you could have found that murder weapon in that dude's truck right

or in his pocket.

Is that a 22 in your pocket?

Are you just happy to see me?

He wasn't happy to see him.

I'll tell you that.

Well, like the family says, somebody knows something, somebody saw something.

You can find a seeking information poster available on FBI.gov for Cardell Sledge and Catherine Brown, who were the murder victims in Fairview Park, Ohio, June 4th, 2019.

As said, there is a reward available

that leads to an arrest and conviction in this case.

Anyone with any information regarding these murders is asked to call the FBI's Cleveland Field Office at 216-622-6842.

Or you can call Crime Stoppers of Cuyahoga County at 216-252-7463.

And tips can be submitted at tips.fbi.gov.

I do want to

really emphasize something here, though.

If you do not feel that you need to remain anonymous when giving your information or your tip, I'm suggesting that you call the FBI's Cleveland Field Office at 216-622-6842.

I want to thank everybody for joining us here in the garage each and every week.

Thank you to your mother.

Thank you to your brother.

If you want to support True Crime Garage, make sure you subscribe to the show.

If you need more True Crime Garage, make sure you subscribe on Patreon or Apple Podcast app to off the record.

Colonel, do we have any recommended reading for the beautiful listeners?

We do.

And something we never really say on the show, and we probably should say it from time to time, or at least mention it from time to time.

So I will do so here.

If you love the show and any of our sponsors that you hear are of interest to you, use the code, the promo codes that we provide.

Or if you go to their websites and you make a purchase or you sign up for anything and they ask you where you heard about their product or their services, their company, please let them know that you heard it from the garage guys, True Crime Garage.

It would mean a lot to us.

It really helps the show out.

And we want to thank all of our listeners for the longtime listeners who have stuck with us through all of the years and been chilling with us in the garage for year after year, but also the new listeners that are getting some garage goodness maybe for the first time or just this year.

You got to love the old garage listeners because they got that garage musk.

The Centennials.

So for the recommended reading for this week, I feel like like we are going all the way back to the beginning here with this one.

This week, we are recommending Amy, My Search for Her Killer.

Bay Village, right up there near Rocky River, Ohio, is where this all took place.

10-year-old Amy Mihalovic was abducted after being lured to a local shopping plaza by a mysterious male caller who called her home.

Thousands of volunteers, police officers, and FBI agents searched for the girl who was tragically found dead a few months later.

Her killer has never been found.

Amy, my search for her killer, is by a longtime friend of the show and truly a great writer of both true crime and science fiction.

His name is James Renner.

Go to our website and check out the recommended page for that great title.

Other great books, docu-series, documentaries, and podcast recommendations are all there for you at TrueCrimeGarage.com.

And until next week, be good, be kind, kind, and don't let it.

I don't mean to interrupt your meal, but I love Geico's fast and friendly claim service.

Well, that's how Geico gets 97% customer satisfaction.

Yeah, I'll let you get back to your food.

Uh, so are you just gonna watch me eat?

Get more than just savings, get more with Geico.