Update On: A Short-Lived Pardon

Speaker 1 This is an iHeart podcast.

Speaker 2 Stop settling for weak sound.

Speaker 3 It's time to level up your game and bring the boom.

Speaker 6 Hit the town with the ultra-durable LG X-Boom portable speaker and enjoy vibrant sound wherever you go.

Speaker 9 Elevate your listening experience to new heights because let's be real, your music deserves it.

Speaker 10 The future of sound is now with LG X-Boom.

Speaker 8 And for a limited time, save 25% at lg.com with code Fall25.

Speaker 11 FALL25.

Speaker 4 Bring a boom. X-Boom.

Speaker 12 Life's messy.

Speaker 13 We're talking spills, stains, pets, and kids.

Speaker 15 But with Anibay, you never have to stress about messes again.

Speaker 17 At washable sofas.com, discover Anibay Sofas, the only fully machine-washable sofas inside and out, starting at just $699.

Speaker 15 Made with liquid and stain-resistant fabrics. That means fewer stains and more peace of mind.

Speaker 17 Designed for real life, our sofas feature changeable fabric covers, allowing you to refresh your style anytime. Need flexibility? Our modular design lets you rearrange your sofa effortlessly.

Speaker 21 Perfect for cozy apartments or spacious homes.

Speaker 17 Plus, they're earth-friendly and built to last.

Speaker 15 That's why over 200,000 happy customers have made the switch.

Speaker 17 Upgrade your space today.

Speaker 15 Visit washable sofas.com now and bring home a sofa made for life.

Speaker 17 That's washable sofas.com.

Speaker 14 Offers are subject to change and certain restrictions may apply.

Speaker 22 Tired of flipping through apps to find something good? Meet TiVo Plus, your one-stop, free streaming network, no credit card required.

Speaker 22 With over 300 free channels, you get binge-worthy movies from action and comedy to Indian award winners. Plus, top TV shows, live news, sports highlights, and family programming all in one place.

Speaker 22 Watch live or on demand right from your home screen. Free, no sign-ups, no fees, just press play.
That's TiVo Plus. Free, binge-worthy, and always on.
Check us out at TiVo.com.

Speaker 24 The wait is over.

Speaker 25 Ladies and gentlemen, the next up live music finals are here.

Speaker 24 On September 26th, TikTok Live and iHeartRadio bring you the biggest night in live music discovery.

Speaker 25 Streaming live from the legendary iHeartRadio Theater in LA.

Speaker 24 The top 12 artists hit the stage for one career-defining performance.

Speaker 25 The judges will crown the winner and you'll help choose the People's Choice Award.

Speaker 24 Don't miss it. September 26th, 7 to 9 p.m.
Pacific.

Speaker 25 Follow at TikTok Live underscore US and watch it all go down.

Speaker 24 Only on TikTok Live.

Speaker 26 CoolZone Media.

Speaker 26 Hey, Molly Conger here.

Speaker 26 I know I left you with a bit of a cliffhanger last week, and I'm so sorry I don't have the second half of that story for you this week.

Speaker 26 I thought maybe it was the subject matter giving me a stomachache at first, but I spent half of this week laid up with a stomach virus and there was just no way to write that story the way I wanted to in the time that I had left after I finished puking.

Speaker 26 That'll have to wait until next week. So we've got a rerun this week, but don't switch it off just yet.
We do have a little update to the episode for you here at the top.

Speaker 26 The episode originally ran a month ago, so it may still be fresh in your mind.

Speaker 26 It's the story of Matthew Huddle, the January 6th writer who was shot and killed during a traffic stop just days after he received his federal pardon.

Speaker 26 And when I wrote it, there were still a lot of unanswered questions.

Speaker 26 We have some of those answers now.

Speaker 26 Here's where I left things a month ago.

Speaker 26 It's unwise to speculate about the altercation that may have occurred in the minutes before Huddle was shot and killed by a Jasper County Sheriff's Deputy.

Speaker 26 I don't know what happened there on the side of Indiana State Road 14.

Speaker 26 We don't know what was said, or why things escalated, or where exactly the deputy saw the gun.

Speaker 26 But I do know that Matthew Huddle was due back in court next week for a status conference on a stack of still unresolved felony cases for driving without a license.

Speaker 26 Just days after getting his federal pardon, He was probably happy for his Uncle Dale.

Speaker 26 But he'd already done his federal time, and now he was looking down the barrel at another stay in the county jail.

Speaker 26 And when those blue lights came on behind him, he probably knew that this would be yet another felony charge.

Speaker 26 After the episode originally aired, I saw some listeners expressing displeasure, disgust even, that I'd framed his story as a tragic one.

Speaker 26 I'm not here how to tell you how you should feel. That's your business.

Speaker 26 But for me, his story is sad.

Speaker 26 He wasn't an evil man.

Speaker 26 I wouldn't go as far as to say he was a good man.

Speaker 26 He had a slew of DUIs. He had some history of domestic violence allegations and a stint in jail for child abuse.
He stormed the Capitol. He owed a lot of child support.

Speaker 26 I don't think he's a person I would have liked.

Speaker 26 But he was also a man who struggled with alcohol addiction. And regardless of what he'd done, his death left two children without any chance of ever reconciling with their father.

Speaker 26 And for me, at least, there's never any peace in knowing a person's life ended violently, particularly when the cause of death was a bullet from a police officer's gun.

Speaker 26 I have to believe that people can change, that redemption and atonement are always possible for those who sincerely strive to earn that.

Speaker 26 But a dead man cannot make amends. That possibility is gone now.

Speaker 26 And that makes it a tragedy, in my mind.

Speaker 26 But however you feel about the way things ended for Matthew Huddle, we do at least have some answers now that the Jasper County Sheriff's Office has released the body camera footage of the traffic stop that led to the fatal shooting.

Speaker 26 And it is, for the most part, exactly what I thought it would be.

Speaker 26 The deputy stopped Huddle for speeding. But with his pending felony cases for driving without a license, getting caught doing it again would lead to even more felony charges and even more jail time.

Speaker 26 And he couldn't bear the thought of it.

Speaker 26 The footage of the traffic stop shows it was, all things considered, going fairly well in the beginning.

Speaker 23 Hello. How you doing?

Speaker 27 Good, how are you today? Pretty well.

Speaker 27 Reason I'm pulling yours for 70 and a 55. Any reason for going that fast today?

Speaker 28 No, just keeping up with traffic.

Speaker 27 Okay, okay, fair enough. You got your license and registration on you?

Speaker 28 Can I put in parks?

Speaker 23 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 26 Huddle had been pulled over for speeding.

Speaker 26 The deputy was in good spirits, and he wasn't approaching the car confrontationally.

Speaker 28 I just want to let you know that I'm a January 6th defendant.

Speaker 29 What do you mean? I stormed the capital.

Speaker 28 I'm waiting on my pardon.

Speaker 23 Really?

Speaker 28 Yeah, Yeah, and I can't really afford to get into any trouble right now.

Speaker 23 Okay, I understand. Okay, understand.
I am driving without a license right now.

Speaker 27 Okay, so why are you doing that then?

Speaker 26 And early in the interaction, as he's producing his identification for the officer, Huddle raises the issue of his ongoing legal problems.

Speaker 26 He told the deputy he was still working on getting his license back, but I'm actually not entirely sure that's true.

Speaker 26 He had filed a a case back in 2022 seeking the reinstatement of his license, but court records show he'd withdrawn that petition voluntarily in early 2023, probably because he was preoccupied during that time with his federal criminal case.

Speaker 26 I can't find any indication he'd filed a renewed petition to have his license reinstated after he wrapped up his federal case.

Speaker 26 But the officer's demeanor doesn't really change. He's keeping things light, chatting with Huddle about the dog in the back seat seat of the van.

Speaker 26 And then he returned to the cruiser with Huddle's documents.

Speaker 26 And at this point, he knows he's going to be making an arrest. Whatever comes back from dispatch, Huddle has already told the officer that he's driving without a license.

Speaker 26 So he radios for Animal Control to meet him on the scene to take Huddle's dog. And he walks back to the minivan and he asks Huddle to step out of the car.

Speaker 26 And as the two men stand behind Huddle's van, the deputy explains that he is going to have to place him under arrest.

Speaker 27 Okay, so today you're getting off with a verbal warning for the speed.

Speaker 30 However, you're a habitual traffic violator. I know.
Which means that you are

Speaker 30 at a felony status for driving while suspended.

Speaker 27 So today you are going to come with me.

Speaker 29 Well, I can't, I can't.

Speaker 27 You're going to have to, okay? You're going to come with me today, all right?

Speaker 29 Well, I can't go to jail for this, sir.

Speaker 27 You're going to have to come.

Speaker 29 Can I get a ride?

Speaker 23 No.

Speaker 26 And at this point, Huddle looks visibly distressed. He looks very anxious.
He's picking at his cuticles and he's trying to find some way out of this situation.

Speaker 26 And the officer explains that there's really nothing he can do. Maybe if this were a misdemeanor, they could find some other resolution, but there's no wiggle room here because it's a felony.

Speaker 26 And as the officer starts to ask him to turn around and put his hands behind his back,

Speaker 26 Huddle makes a break for it, back to the driver's door of his van.

Speaker 26 As Huddle crawls into the vehicle, the deputy is inches behind him saying, don't you do it, buddy? And he's reaching for him and grabbing at his jacket.

Speaker 26 And the officer begins to shout, no, no, no.

Speaker 26 And the video at this point is obscured by a large, pixelated rectangle. You don't see Huddle reach for the gun.

Speaker 26 But it seems like it may have been in the glove compartment or somewhere on the passenger side, maybe on the floor.

Speaker 26 And you hear Huddle say, I'm shooting myself.

Speaker 26 And the deputy cries out again, no, no, no.

Speaker 26 It's just 10 seconds.

Speaker 26 From the time Huddle is scrambling back into the front seat of the van to the sound of the five shots from the deputy's gun as he's retreating backwards away from the door, it's just 10 seconds.

Speaker 26 And you can't see most of what's actually happening. You can't see where Huddle pulled the gun from or where he was pointing it once it was in his hand.

Speaker 26 And that's all that was said. Huddle says he's going to shoot himself.
And the deputy shouts no over

Speaker 26 and over again.

Speaker 26 And then it's over.

Speaker 26 The state police investigation into the incident has concluded. And it was presented to the Clinton County Prosecutor's Office for independent review.

Speaker 26 They found the deputy's actions were legally justifiable under Indiana state law, and no charges will be filed.

Speaker 26 Matthew Huddle is dead.

Speaker 26 We can't know if he would have shot himself or the officer. We can't know if he would have appeared in court two weeks after that traffic stop for his still pending felony cases.

Speaker 26 We can't know if he would have made amends, paid his child support, tried to be a better father, or tried to find a place in the right-wing media ecosystem that has now made him a martyr.

Speaker 26 We'll never know, because he died there on the side of State Road 14.

Speaker 26 That's the end of his story.

Speaker 26 And here's the episode where I tried to tell the beginning of it.

Speaker 26 I'll be back next week with a new episode of Weird Little Guys.

Speaker 26 On January 26, 2025,

Speaker 26 Matthew Huddle died.

Speaker 26 That much we know for certain.

Speaker 26 Usually I tell you a story that's old enough that the ink is not only dry, but it's begun to fade a little. The reports are in, the motions have been filed, argued, and ruled on.

Speaker 26 The official story is set in stone.

Speaker 26 That's not the case today.

Speaker 26 As I'm writing this, there are still questions left unanswered.

Speaker 26 There is a state police investigation into an officer-involved shooting still underway.

Speaker 26 But Matthew Huddle is dead. That much we know.

Speaker 26 Just days before he died, he'd gotten some long-awaited good news. His uncle Dale was coming home.

Speaker 26 Both men were among the nearly 1,600 people pardoned by Donald Trump in one of his first actions after being sworn in as president.

Speaker 26 Matthew had already served his six-month sentence, but when the pardons came through, Dale Huddle was just a few months into a two-and-a-half-year term at a prison in Illinois.

Speaker 26 On the afternoon that he died, Matthew Huddle was driving somewhere in Jasper County, Indiana. I don't know where he was going, but I do know he wasn't supposed to be driving.

Speaker 26 And according to the Jasper County Sheriff, he was speeding.

Speaker 26 I can only assume that the altercation that allegedly ensued began after the sheriff's deputy discovered that Huddle did not have a valid driver's license.

Speaker 26 The deputy claims Huddle resisted when he tried to place him under under arrest, and it was during this altercation that the sheriff says the deputy discovered that Huddle was in possession of a firearm, which he was not legally allowed to have.

Speaker 26 The final moments of Matthew Huddle's life will, eventually, be settled in some sort of official report. Maybe they'll release the deputy's body-worn camera footage.

Speaker 26 Maybe his family will file a lawsuit. The final page hasn't been written yet.
I don't have the answers.

Speaker 26 All I have is a sad story about a man who believed in nothing and died on the side of Indiana State Road 14.

Speaker 26 I'm Molly Conger, and this is Weird Little Guys.

Speaker 26 At noon on January 6th, 2021, President Donald Trump took the stage at the ellipse, a generally unremarkable patch of grass between the White House and the Washington Monument.

Speaker 26 More than 50,000 of his supporters had been standing out in the cold all morning, waiting to hear from him.

Speaker 26 For months, he'd stoked the fires of a growing conspiracy.

Speaker 26 The election had been stolen.

Speaker 26 He gave speeches, held rallies, fired off late-night tweets, and filed lawsuits.

Speaker 26 For those who wanted to believe, there seemed to be mountains of evidence of a deep and systemic rot.

Speaker 26 But the lawsuits were failing. The votes were counted, and time was running out.

Speaker 26 Today was the day that Congress would have the final say in the 2020 election, and less than two miles away, legislators were taking their seats in the Capitol building to certify the election.

Speaker 26 The crowd at the ellipse had come from all over the country to be a part of history.

Speaker 26 And as their president spoke, many of them heard the permission they'd been waiting for.

Speaker 31 And we fight. We fight like hell.
And if you don't fight like hell, you're not going to have a country anymore.

Speaker 26 This profound corruption would have to be excised by force before this grave injustice could be done. He'd all but confirmed that for them.

Speaker 26 And then, in the final seconds of his speech, before he was played off the stage by his favorite song, the Village People's Gay Anthem, YMCA,

Speaker 26 he gave the crowd their marching orders.

Speaker 31 So let's walk down Pennsylvania Avenue. I want to thank you all.
God bless you and God bless America. Thank you all for being here.
This is incredible. Thank you very much.

Speaker 26 Some in that crowd, perhaps anticipating the instructions he would give at the end of his hour-long speech, never even heard him say that line.

Speaker 26 They'd already started walking the mile and a half to their final destination that day.

Speaker 26 The Capitol Building.

Speaker 26 You almost certainly already know how that day ended.

Speaker 26 Even if you live in a cave in the woods without access to the internet, you can't possibly have escaped this news.

Speaker 26 Thousands of Trump supporters descended on the United States Capitol building. They tore down police barricades.
They engaged in a pitched battle with the Capitol Police on the steps outside.

Speaker 26 And some of them forced their way into the building.

Speaker 26 People died.

Speaker 26 United States Capitol Police officer Brian Sicknick passed away on January 7th after suffering a series of strokes.

Speaker 26 His cause of death was eventually ruled to be natural causes, though several neurologists have argued that the events of the prior day almost certainly contributed to his death.

Speaker 26 QAnon believer Ashley Babbitt was shot as she forced her way into the building through a broken window.

Speaker 26 Roseanne Boyland was trampled by the stampeding crowd, though her official cause of death was ruled to be an amphetamine overdose.

Speaker 26 And Kevin Greeson had a heart attack on the Capitol grounds.

Speaker 26 This week, as I was combing back through my own videos of that afternoon, I discovered that I had captured the moment that I realized I was watching a man die.

Speaker 26 Over the roar of the crowd, you can hear someone next to me say, they've been giving him chest compressions for way too long.

Speaker 26 And then there's my own voice. I know it's my voice, but I don't remember saying it.
From years in the past, I heard myself say,

Speaker 26 he's going to die.

Speaker 26 And a few minutes after that, I saw his dead body being carried away.

Speaker 26 Surely, other people saw him too, but no one seemed to react at all to the sight of a corpse making its way through the crowd.

Speaker 26 Over the last four years, federal charges were filed against nearly 1,600 members of that crowd.

Speaker 26 Nearly 1,300 had been convicted. with another 300 cases still open as of the four-year anniversary of the riot.

Speaker 26 Those cases will never go to trial, though, because last month, hours after being sworn in as president for the second time, Donald Trump issued a blanket pardon, pardoning almost every single one of them with the small exception of a handful of rioters who only had their sentences commuted.

Speaker 26 There are those who would rewrite the story of that day.

Speaker 26 People who would tell you that it was a peaceful protest, that they were patriots and tourists, that they couldn't have known that their conduct was unlawful.

Speaker 26 I'm not sure there's anything I can do to change anyone's mind. The evidence to the contrary is readily available, but it's never seemed to matter.

Speaker 26 I could tell you that I saw a man, eyes red with pepper spray and wide with wild determination, pry a metal drain grate out of the ground.

Speaker 26 with the end of an American flagpole before pressing back into the fray with his newly acquired weapon.

Speaker 26 I could tell you I saw a man with a literal pitchfork sprinting down the Capitol lawn.

Speaker 26 I could spend the next year covering a different January 6th rioter every week, painstakingly tracking their affiliations with militias and white supremacist street gangs.

Speaker 26 But I don't really want to.

Speaker 26 There's plenty of media about the men who were there that day. Whole books have been written about them.
Whole podcasts have dedicated themselves to that work.

Speaker 26 There are some weird little guys who ended up there that day that I'll get to.

Speaker 26 But I can't bear the thought of returning to that well for too many stories.

Speaker 26 Because a lot of those stories are kind of the same.

Speaker 26 While the seditious conspiracy at the heart of the violence was cooked up by oath keepers and proud boys, men with an ideological commitment to violence and ties to organized groups dedicated to carrying it out.

Speaker 26 Most of the crowd was made up of men far too ordinary to be considered a weird little guy.

Speaker 26 And maybe that in itself is a subject worth exploring.

Speaker 26 How could an ordinary man end up crawling over broken glass on his way to break into a senator's office?

Speaker 26 How could a realtor from the suburbs step over a woman's dead body in his haste to physically confront a member of Congress?

Speaker 26 How did men with back the blue bumper stickers on their brand new Ford pickup trucks end up fistfighting cops on the steps of the Capitol?

Speaker 26 I don't think I'm equipped to answer that.

Speaker 26 But I can try to tell you the sad story of how one of them ended up dead.

Speaker 26 Matthew Huddle did not vote for Donald Trump in the 2020 election.

Speaker 26 Perhaps he would have, it's impossible to say. But he'd lost his right to vote years ago after his first felony conviction.

Speaker 26 He struggled with alcohol addiction for his entire adult life, racking up charges for driving while intoxicated at a pretty alarming rate.

Speaker 26 And he was back in jail for yet another DUI in November of 2020 when the election took place.

Speaker 26 He was fresh off this stint in the county jail when his uncle Dale asked him for a favor.

Speaker 26 He needed a ride to Washington, D.C.

Speaker 26 The reason given in the court documents is that Dale, at 69 years old, had poor eyesight and, quote, should not drive, especially at night.

Speaker 26 But I'm not sure how to square that with the knowledge that Dale was, at that time, employed as a delivery driver at an auto parts store.

Speaker 26 Nor is any explanation offered as to why Matthew agreed to drive his uncle 700 miles from Indiana to D.C.

Speaker 26 without a valid driver's license.

Speaker 26 In Matthew's own words, though, he had nothing better to do at the time. So he agreed.

Speaker 26 According to his defense attorney,

Speaker 32 Matt is not a true believer in any political movement. He cannot legally vote, and he knows very little about politics and does not follow it.

Speaker 32 He is somewhat distrustful of the government in general, but he did not know if the 2020 election was stolen or not.

Speaker 26 So he claims he was only there that day as something to do, a favor for his uncle, and he thought maybe it would be a historic event that he could document through photos and video.

Speaker 26 And he did. He took quite a bit of video that day, recording himself as he and his uncle made their way down the National Mall after listening to Trump's speech at the ellipse.

Speaker 26 As the Capitol came into view, Matthew Huddle says aloud to no one in particular,

Speaker 26 we're going to see if we can get inside.

Speaker 26 But moments later, he turns to his uncle Dale and says, he's not sure they're going to be able to get close because of the police presence.

Speaker 26 His uncle replies, quote, I think we ought to bum rush the Capitol building, arrest them all. We've got enough people to do that.

Speaker 26 And Matthew agrees they could try to get close.

Speaker 26 By 2 p.m., they were deep within the mass of rioters at the base of the steps at the west entrance of the Capitol.

Speaker 26 Police on the steps were firing flashbangs and tear gas canisters trying to keep the crowd at bay.

Speaker 26 In his video, as described in the court filings, Matthew is surprised by the flashbangs and asks if the cops are shooting a cannon.

Speaker 26 I didn't manage to dig up the video evidence filed in his case, but based on the description of flashbangs and scattered chants of USA, USA,

Speaker 26 and it being shortly after 2 p.m.,

Speaker 26 here's my best guess at that exact moment being described.

Speaker 26 Yes, that is my little squeal of surprise at the sound of the flashbangs.

Speaker 26 I was having a weird afternoon.

Speaker 26 And it was chaotic.

Speaker 26 At this point, the crowd was starting to press forward and engage with the officers.

Speaker 26 No longer a mere observer of history, Matthew Huddle joined them.

Speaker 26 He and his uncle Dale fought their way to the front of the crowd where rioters were tearing down the bike racks that had been set out in a feeble attempt to keep people off the stairs.

Speaker 26 As officers struggled to keep the metal bike racks out of the hands of the men who were trying to seize them as weapons, Dale Huddle lunged forward.

Speaker 26 jabbing his wooden flagpole into an officer's stomach, knocking him off his feet.

Speaker 26 During the battle on the stairs, Dale is seen in an officer's body-worn camera footage screaming at them, saying things like, look back there, there's a million of us. You think you can stop us?

Speaker 26 And, it's going to get real ugly if you don't let us in, man. It's going to get real ugly.
We're coming in.

Speaker 26 And at some point, he turns to his nephew and points up at the Capitol building, and he says,

Speaker 26 We're going in the front door.

Speaker 26 But Dale Huddle never did make it inside.

Speaker 26 The men got separated on the steps. The officers who'd been trying to hold them at bay retreated under attack, giving Matthew Huddle an opening to run up the stairs.

Speaker 26 But Dale stayed behind and kept fighting. Instead of taking his chance to climb the steps and actually go inside, he followed the retreating officers, continuing the attack.

Speaker 26 Another video shows the old man, red-faced with tears streaming from his eyes from pepper spray unloaded by a rioter behind him,

Speaker 26 and he's charging toward an officer trying to rip his gas mask off.

Speaker 26 And then he tries to wrench the baton out of another officer's hands.

Speaker 26 With his uncle preferring to stay behind and fight, Matthew followed the crowd through the now open doors on the upper west terrace.

Speaker 26 In his own video, he says,

Speaker 26 We're going in as he crosses the threshold.

Speaker 26 And for 16 minutes,

Speaker 26 he just

Speaker 26 wandered around in there.

Speaker 26 He didn't hurt anyone. He didn't steal anything.
He didn't break anything.

Speaker 26 He really was just kind of wandering around.

Speaker 26 It's hard to square the reality of the situation with his behavior.

Speaker 26 On one hand, you have to assume he knew what he was doing was wrong.

Speaker 26 He hadn't actually engaged in any of the violence outside, but he knew full well he was only standing standing inside that building because men like his uncle had fought their way through a police line to clear the path to the stairs.

Speaker 26 But once he's inside, he's trying to chat up the cops.

Speaker 26 He sidles up to one officer and casually asks him,

Speaker 26 Has this ever happened to you guys before?

Speaker 26 He briefly joined in with a group of guys just marching around chanting, USA, USA.

Speaker 26 Another rioter asked him if he knew what floor the legislators were on.

Speaker 26 And oddly, considering he claimed to know nothing about the situation he'd found himself in that day, he answered confidently: the third floor.

Speaker 26 And then he thought for a moment and turned to a nearby police officer and asked the cop if the legislators had already gone down to the basement.

Speaker 26 And by that point, the Senate chambers had indeed been evacuated through the underground tunnels.

Speaker 26 And as the group piles into the elevator, leaving Huddle behind, he turns back to his phone, which is still recording, and he narrates into his video,

Speaker 26 they went up, third floor, to the offices.

Speaker 26 He would later tell the FBI that when he told that group of rioters they should head up to the third floor, He was actually trying to divert them away from members of Congress, who he assumed were already being evacuated through the underground tunnels.

Speaker 26 Either way, though, that is a curious level of insight into the building's floor plans for a man who said he was just somebody else's ride.

Speaker 26 After getting maced again, the novelty of being inside the building seemed to have been wearing off.

Speaker 26 Officers were, relatively futilely, trying to convince people to leave, trying to direct them down a hallway and towards an exit.

Speaker 26 And Huddle says into his video that he has a bad feeling about that, and that it might be a trap.

Speaker 26 So he found his way to a different exit.

Speaker 26 Outside, he found his Uncle Dale again, and the two men just hung around outside on the Capitol grounds for a few hours.

Speaker 26 And then they went home.

Speaker 2 Stop settling for weak sound.

Speaker 3 It's time to level up your game and bring the boom.

Speaker 6 Hit the town with the ultra-durable LG X-Boom portable speaker and enjoy vibrant sound wherever you go.

Speaker 9 Elevate your listening experience to new heights because let's be real, your music deserves it.

Speaker 10 The future of sound is now with LGX Boom.

Speaker 8 And for a limited time, save 25% at LG.com with code Fall25.

Speaker 4 Bring the boom.

Speaker 4 X-Boom.

Speaker 16 There's nothing like sinking into luxury.

Speaker 12 At washablesofas.com, you'll find the Anibay sofa, which combines ultimate comfort and design at an affordable price.

Speaker 17 And get this, it's the only sofa that's fully machine washable from top to bottom, starting at only $699.

Speaker 15 The stain-resistant performance fabric slip covers and cloud-like frame duvet can go straight into your wash. Perfect for anyone with kids, pets, or anyone who loves an easy-to-clean, spotless sofa.

Speaker 16 With a modular design and changeable slip covers, you can customize your sofa to fit any space and style.

Speaker 15 Whether you need a single chair, love seat, or a luxuriously large sectional, Anibay has you covered.

Speaker 17 Visit washablesofas.com to upgrade your home.

Speaker 15 Right now, you can shop up to 60% off store-wide with a 30-day money-back guarantee.

Speaker 12 Shop now at washablesofas.com.

Speaker 2 Add a little

Speaker 21 to your life.

Speaker 15 Offers are subject to change and certain restrictions may apply.

Speaker 22 Over 300 channels, zero bills. That's TiVo Plus.
Live news, reality, movies, and more. No credit card, no sign-ups.
Available on smart TVs powered by TiVo.

Speaker 22 Grab the remote, press play, and start watching. TiVo Plus.
Free, binge-worthy, always on. Learn more at Tibo.com.

Speaker 33 This message is brought to you by Apple Card. Each Apple product, like the iPhone, is thoughtfully designed by skilled designers.
The titanium Apple Card is no different.

Speaker 33 It's laser-etched, has no numbers, and it earns you daily cash on everything you buy, including 3% back on everything at Apple. Apply for Apple Card on your iPhone in minutes.

Speaker 33 Subject to credit approval, Apple AppleCard issued by Goldman Sachs Bank USA, Salt Lake City Branch. Terms and more at applecard.com.

Speaker 26 In the days after the Huddles returned home to Indiana, the FBI set to work identifying the rioters.

Speaker 26 Those who had assaulted federal officers were, understandably, a high priority. And the Bureau released images of those those suspects, each identified by the letters AFO

Speaker 26 for assault on a federal officer and given a unique number.

Speaker 26 Just three months after the riot, photos of AFO 299 went up on the FBI's website.

Speaker 26 Over the next few months, more than a dozen tips came in about AFO-299.

Speaker 26 But none of them were right.

Speaker 26 It sounds like it was facial recognition that got Dale Huddle. The charging documents just say that law enforcement databases were used to match the images to his passport photos.

Speaker 26 And by August, FBI agents were watching Dale Huddle.

Speaker 26 They surveilled him at his home and his workplace several times in late 2021.

Speaker 26 In March of 2022, they approached his boss, who identified Dale in several photos from the riot and provided records showing he'd taken off work the week of January 6, 2021.

Speaker 26 Both Matthew and Dale Huddle were eventually charged and arrested in November of 2022.

Speaker 26 Dale was picked up in the parking lot on his way into work one morning. And Matthew was, for reasons not entirely clear to me, arrested in Boise, Idaho.

Speaker 26 And both men would, eventually, take plea agreements, just like over a thousand other of the approximately 1,300 January 6th defendants who'd been convicted before those blanket pardons.

Speaker 26 Matthew pled guilty to a single misdemeanor count of entering and remaining in a restricted building and was sentenced to six months.

Speaker 26 He finished serving that sentence in July of 2024.

Speaker 26 Dale pled guilty to a single felony count of assaulting an officer with a dangerous weapon, specifically for jabbing that officer with his flagpole during the struggle on the stairs.

Speaker 26 He was sentenced to 30 months in July of 2024, meaning he was one of about 200 January 6th defendants who were actually still in federal custody at the time of the pardons.

Speaker 26 And like I said, almost everyone who was convicted pled guilty.

Speaker 26 Actually going to trial in a federal criminal case is pretty rare, a fact we've talked about before in other episodes. It's not really a good system.

Speaker 26 There's a lot of pressure to take a plea deal, and that may not always be fair.

Speaker 26 In Dale's case, though, I think the plea was absolutely the right call.

Speaker 26 A few days after his arrest, after he'd been released on bond, a CBS News reporter from Chicago knocked on his door.

Speaker 26 In a conversation that lasted more than seven minutes, much to his attorney's dismay, I'm sure,

Speaker 26 the reporter pulled out a printed copy of the criminal complaint.

Speaker 1 You know, they're saying that this is...

Speaker 1 that this is you, that, you know, you have a flagpole and that you're assaulting an officer.

Speaker 30 Well, you know, they were trying to take the pole from me, the flag from me. As you can see, they're bent over backwards, trying to get the pole away.
That's what looks like an attack.

Speaker 30 It was not that, though.

Speaker 1 Okay, so you're saying in court you'd like to see video.

Speaker 23 Absolutely.

Speaker 30 I want to see testimony and body camps as well.

Speaker 1 But you agree this is you.

Speaker 23 Absolutely. Okay.

Speaker 23 This is you.

Speaker 30 I'm not ashamed of being there. It was our duty as patriots.

Speaker 26 First of all, never admit to a crime on camera. Even if you don't think you're guilty of it, don't say you did it.
Don't talk to the reporter.

Speaker 26 And second of all, I'm not sure they were trying to take my flag is a great defense given the context here.

Speaker 26 Even if this picture did show an officer trying to take Dale's flagpole away from him,

Speaker 26 it's not like he was taking candy from a baby.

Speaker 26 Dale Huddle was not the only man out there that day using his American flag as a deeply ironic weapon.

Speaker 26 I'll link the criminal complaint in the show notes, and you can see the picture they're talking about on the second page.

Speaker 26 The officer is leaning back, almost as if he could be engaging in a sort of tug-of-war over the flagpole, but Dale's right about one thing.

Speaker 26 Pictures can be deceiving.

Speaker 26 The officer isn't leaning back, he's falling down

Speaker 26 because an old man poked him hard in the torso with a big stick.

Speaker 26 And while Matthew's lawyers had argued that their client had no real opinion on the 2020 election one way or the other, that he'd simply found himself there,

Speaker 26 Dale's lawyers did have to concede that he was a true believer.

Speaker 26 In that on-camera interview right after his arrest, he told the reporter that he still believed the election had been stolen and he believed he'd been following a lawful order from his president.

Speaker 1 And do you believe that Trump invited you there and that he wanted you to overthrow

Speaker 1 the city?

Speaker 30 He invited to go down there as you've seen on film.

Speaker 32 Let your voices be heard.

Speaker 1 Okay. But do you think he encouraged violence?

Speaker 30 Well,

Speaker 30 I listen sat there or stood there with half a million people listening to his speech.

Speaker 30 And in that speech, both Giuliani and his self said we were going to have to fight like hell to save our country.

Speaker 30 Okay?

Speaker 30 Now, whether it was a figure of speech or not,

Speaker 30 it wasn't taken that way. Right.

Speaker 1 You didn't take it as a figure of speech.

Speaker 23 No.

Speaker 26 So they couldn't really say that he didn't mean it.

Speaker 26 And instead, they argued that he'd been tricked. He was 70 years old in 2021.
He was a blue-collar worker who didn't even own a computer.

Speaker 26 From the defense sentencing memo.

Speaker 32 He is not knowledgeable about the internet.

Speaker 32 He was not aware that Facebook and other social media platforms use machine learning algorithms to individualize ads and to dictate content based on previous clicks. Mr.

Speaker 32 Huddle believed that the news he was reading was covering the general scope of mainstream media and that it was a representation of current events.

Speaker 32 From his viewpoint, the vast majority of the media agreed that the democratic process had been undermined by fraud.

Speaker 26 And I don't doubt that he and many men just like him have absolutely rotted their brains on Facebook clickbait right-wing news.

Speaker 26 I have no trouble believing that he was trapped in a cycle of seeing nothing but memes where a minion in a MAGA hat is spreading election misinformation or links to stories on sites called patriotwindnews.biz

Speaker 26 with headlines like deep state destroyed, new election lawsuit, bombshell, rocks, DC swamp.

Speaker 26 I have a separate email account where I get a hundred emails that look like that every single day. I know exactly what his Facebook feed looked like.

Speaker 26 So that part's probably true.

Speaker 26 But I wish that the government, with their vast investigative resources, had dug into a curious incident in Dale's past.

Speaker 26 Because I don't think this was the first time that Dale Huddle got worked up about the need to go to war with the government.

Speaker 26 Now, to be clear, Dale Huddle had no criminal history. That's true.
The government didn't miss something that egregious.

Speaker 26 And I'm even willing to believe the defense memo is being truthful when they say that at 70 years old, Dale wasn't a member of any extremist groups.

Speaker 26 But I found a picture, a single photograph taken on November 14th, 2000.

Speaker 26 And if I had the kinds of resources that the government has,

Speaker 26 I would have tried to find out more about this picture.

Speaker 26 It's just one picture in the newspaper snapped by an Associated Press photographer. And it's a picture of Dale Huddle with a flag.

Speaker 26 Unlike the photo of Dale using an American flag as a weapon on January 6th, this photo shows a slightly younger Dale Huddle, and he's trying to figure out how to affix his Gadsden flag, you know, the one with the snake that doesn't want to be stepped on, and he's trying to affix it to the window of a church.

Speaker 26 November 14th, 2000, was the first day of a 92-day standoff with U.S. Marshals at the Indianapolis Baptist Temple.

Speaker 26 After years of litigation, a federal judge had finally given the order for the church to vacate the premises.

Speaker 26 For 17 years, the Indianapolis Baptist Temple under Pastor Greg Dixon had not been paying its taxes.

Speaker 26 You're probably saying, wait, I thought churches were tax exempt.

Speaker 26 And they are, that's true. Churches are generally speaking automatically exempt from federal income tax.

Speaker 26 But if they they have paid employees, they still have to withhold and remit employment tax. And the Indianapolis Baptist Temple had been refusing to do that since 1984.

Speaker 26 And so by the year 2000, they owed the IRS over $6 million.

Speaker 26 And this was an intentional, deliberate act. They didn't forget that they had to do payroll tax.
They didn't make a mistake.

Speaker 26 The church had originally been incorporated in 1950, and for almost 34 years, the church had a valid employer identification number.

Speaker 26 They filed paperwork with the state to keep their corporate entity in good standing. They paid employment taxes to the federal government.

Speaker 26 And then in 1983, Greg Dixon, who'd been the pastor of the church since 1955,

Speaker 26 changed his mind.

Speaker 26 He transferred all of the church's assets into an unincorporated religious society. And then he changed the corporation's name, which had previously been Indianapolis Baptist Temple.

Speaker 26 He changed it to Not a Church Incorporated. And so the church itself no longer exists on paper at all.

Speaker 26 And Dixon is using this Not a Church corporate entity to run a group called the American Coalition for Unregistered Churches.

Speaker 26 It would later be known as the Unregistered Baptist Fellowship.

Speaker 26 Greg Dixon believed that doing business with the federal government was against his religion.

Speaker 26 Having to do things like tell the IRS that your church would like to be recognized as a 501c3 tax-exempt entity or filing paperwork with the state actually contravenes the authority of Christ.

Speaker 26 And if you make him do it, you're violating his religious liberty.

Speaker 26 The unregistered church movement wasn't just refusing to pay their taxes. They wanted to avoid almost any contact with the government.

Speaker 26 Churches shouldn't have to abide by building codes or zoning laws or get fire inspections. Babies shouldn't have birth certificates.
A wedding shouldn't involve a marriage license.

Speaker 26 In fact, no one should have any kind of license.

Speaker 26 Many of the articles I found about this movement make sure to add that they do believe that they can use the United States Postal Service, but it is a sin to use zip codes.

Speaker 26 The almost complete overlap of guys who don't want to pay their taxes and guys who are willing to take up arms against the government is something I'll surely explore in depth in an episode dedicated to some character in the tax protester movement.

Speaker 26 But the reason for it is probably pretty obvious.

Speaker 26 And Pastor Greg Dixon wasn't just refusing to pay his taxes, he wanted war.

Speaker 26 In 1992, Greg Dixon gave a speech at an event nicknamed the Rocky Mountain Rendezvous.

Speaker 26 After the siege at Ruby Ridge, a Christian identity preacher in Colorado put out the call.

Speaker 26 The disparate elements of the radical right needed to put their heads together and come up with a strategy.

Speaker 26 Klansmen, neo-Nazis, anti-Semitic pastors, militia leaders, neo-Confederates, tax protesters, bigots, and anti-government extremists of all stripes convened in Colorado.

Speaker 26 And all the big names were there. Willie Muther Pierce from National Alliance, Richard Butler from Aryan Nations, Louis Beam, Kirk Lyons, James Wickstrom.

Speaker 26 As Kathleen Blue wrote in her book, Bring the War Home, the militia movement as we know it today, quote,

Speaker 26 emerged from the leaders, organizations, and tactics of white power organization.

Speaker 26 And this meeting is widely regarded as the birthplace of the modern American militia movement.

Speaker 26 And so, at the Rocky Rocky Mountain Rendezvous, just before Louis Beam's speech about leaderless resistance, Pastor Greg Dixon took the stage to call for the establishment of Christian militias, declaring, we are at war.

Speaker 26 And Greg Dixon was hardly new to organized racism. In the 1970s, his church had hosted meetings of a group called Americans for America, a KKK-affiliated organization that opposed school integration.

Speaker 26 Indiana's grand dragon Bill Cheney was a member of the congregation.

Speaker 26 But in the early 90s, he was at the bleeding edge of a new frontier in white power.

Speaker 26 All that to say, this old picture of Dale Huddle outside of a church might sound terribly innocuous. Maybe that's his church and maybe he didn't know why his pastor wasn't paying his taxes.

Speaker 26 But

Speaker 26 it was not.

Speaker 26 Dale Huddle isn't even Baptist. He grew up Lutheran, but has been a member of a non-denominational megachurch called the Family Christian Center since 1988, ever since his mother died.

Speaker 26 No, Dale Huddle had no direct connection to this church that I can find.

Speaker 26 But a call had been put out.

Speaker 26 In September of 2000, after years in court, a judge gave the order.

Speaker 26 They had until noon on November 14th to get out of the building. The government was taking possession of the property, and U.S.
Marshals were authorized to use force if necessary.

Speaker 26 Michigan militia leader Norman Olson ordered militias around the country to do their duty and defend the church, telling his followers that this was going to be Waco Part 2.

Speaker 26 Charlie Puckett of the Kentucky militia was there on November 14th as congregants waited for the U.S. Marshals to arrive.

Speaker 26 And with news crews rolling in the parking lot, Pastor Dixon asked the contingent of Klansmen who showed up to support him to maybe stay outside the church.

Speaker 26 But he didn't ask them to leave or disavow their support.

Speaker 26 And that's when this photo was taken. On November 14th, 2000.
Parking lot full of Klansmen, militiamen standing by.

Speaker 26 And Dale Huddle is outside the Indianapolis Baptist Temple, trying to figure out how to hang a Gadsden flag on the windows.

Speaker 26 He'd driven two hours from his home in Crown Point,

Speaker 26 and there was no Facebook in 2000. He didn't see a meme that convinced him to go to Indianapolis.

Speaker 26 There's no indication that he was a member of any of the militia or clan groups that were there that day, but it does seem quite possible that he got the same message they did about showing up.

Speaker 26 for Waco Part 2.

Speaker 26 And just so this thread isn't left hanging, hanging, the big crowd that showed up on day one of the standoff

Speaker 26 got bored and went home.

Speaker 26 U.S. Marshals obviously did not want Waco Part 2, so they just kept their distance and waited them out.

Speaker 26 It took three months, but in February of 2001, they did seize the building.

Speaker 26 No one was injured, but Greg Dixon was carried out on a stretcher because he refused to walk.

Speaker 2 Stop settling for weak sound.

Speaker 3 It's time to level up your game and bring the boom.

Speaker 6 Hit the town with the ultra-durable LG X-Boom portable speaker and enjoy vibrant sound wherever you go.

Speaker 9 Elevate your listening experience to new heights because let's be real, your music deserves it.

Speaker 10 The future of sound is now with LGX Boom.

Speaker 8 And for a limited time, save 25% at lg.com with code FALL25.

Speaker 4 Bring the boom.

Speaker 4 X-Boom.

Speaker 33 Let's be real.

Speaker 17 Life happens.

Speaker 12 Kids spill.

Speaker 16 Pets shed.

Speaker 15 And accidents are inevitable.

Speaker 17 Find a sofa that can keep up at washable sofas.com.

Speaker 15 Starting at just $699,

Speaker 17 our sofas are fully machine washable inside and out. So you can say goodbye to stains and hello to worry-free living.
Made with liquid and stain-resistant fabrics.

Speaker 21 They're kid-proof, pet-friendly, and built for everyday life.

Speaker 15 Plus, changeable fabric covers let you refresh your sofa whenever you want.

Speaker 17 Neat flexibility? Our modular design lets you rearrange your sofa anytime to fit your space, whether it's a growing family room or a cozy apartment.

Speaker 21 Plus, they're earth-friendly and trusted by over 200,000 happy customers.

Speaker 15 It's time to upgrade to a stress-free, mess-proof sofa.

Speaker 17 Visit washablefas.com today and save. That's washable sofas.com.

Speaker 14 Offers are subject to change and certain restrictions may apply.

Speaker 22 Over 300 channels, zero bills. That's TiVo Plus.
Curated movies, news series, and sports highlights. No credit card, no logins, just TV that gets straight to the good stuff.

Speaker 22 Grab the remote, press play, and start watching TiVo Plus. Free, binge-worthy, always on.
Check us out at TiVo.com.

Speaker 24 The wait is over.

Speaker 25 The next up live music finals are here.

Speaker 24 On September 26th, TikTok Live and iHeartRadio bring you the biggest night in live music discovery.

Speaker 25 Streaming live from the legendary iHeartRadio Theater in LA.

Speaker 24 The top 12 artists you've been following will take the spotlight for one final career-defining performance.

Speaker 25 Judged by music gurus and industry powerhouses.

Speaker 24 Tom Pullman, Chief Programming Officer at iHeartMedia.

Speaker 25 Beata Murphy, program director of 102.7 Kiss FM.

Speaker 24 Justina Valentine from MTV's Wild and Out.

Speaker 25 And viral guitarist John Dretto.

Speaker 24 Hosted by iHeartRadio's JoJo Wright and EJ.

Speaker 25 This is the ultimate showdown.

Speaker 24 The judges will crown the next up live music winner, and you have the power to decide who takes home the People's Choice Award.

Speaker 25 Don't miss a second. Follow along at TikTok Live underscore US.

Speaker 24 And be there live, September 26, 7 to 9 p.m.

Speaker 25 Pacific. Together, let's witness the dawning of the next music superstar.

Speaker 24 Only on TikTok Live.

Speaker 26 So that's a rather lengthy aside just to contextualize a single 25-year-old photograph that doesn't prove anything at all, but it left me wondering,

Speaker 26 if the U.S. Marshals had taken a heavier-handed approach at the Indianapolis Baptist Temple, would I be looking at two photos, 20 years apart, of Dale Huddle trying to skewer a cop with a flagpole?

Speaker 26 His lawyers argued that he was just a confused old man who didn't know how to use the internet and he got tricked into believing he needed to go to DC to stop the steal.

Speaker 26 But the possibility that 20 years earlier, some militia newsletter tricked him into thinking he needed to stop a different theft, that of church property by the IRS,

Speaker 26 really changes the story for me.

Speaker 26 Back in 2021, though, After the riot at the Capitol, Matthew Huddle was just living his life as usual.

Speaker 26 Matthew Huddle's life as usual involved getting charged three separate times between July and November for driving with a suspended license.

Speaker 26 As a habitual offender whose driving privileges had been revoked after repeated DUIs, each new offense of this kind was a felony. In August of that year, his son's mother died of a drug overdose.

Speaker 26 He filed for bankruptcy that same week and Filings show he owed more than $13,000 in child support to a different woman, the mother of his daughter.

Speaker 26 Neither of those children were in Matthew's custody. After his conviction in his January 6th case, his lawyers wrote that he had a quote, great

Speaker 26 relationship with his son.

Speaker 26 I hope that's true. And even if it's not, my heart breaks for a teenage boy who lost his mother to an overdose in 2021.
He saw his father go to prison in 2023,

Speaker 26 and then he lost his father entirely just last month.

Speaker 26 But

Speaker 26 great

Speaker 26 is the only word used there to describe a relationship that I suspect may have been more complicated than that.

Speaker 26 In 2009, Matthew Huddle flew into a rage after his son, who was just three years old at the time, had what court records describe as a bathroom accident.

Speaker 26 It's a very normal thing for a three-year-old to do. At that age, you're still sending a change of pants with them to school just in case.

Speaker 26 What's What's not normal, though, is beating a toddler so severely that he can't sit down for a week.

Speaker 26 And the court records call it a spanking.

Speaker 26 But nothing I could find offered me any kind of explanation for how a spanking could leave bruises on a child's neck.

Speaker 26 After Huddle died last week, Several of the articles I read about his death quoted an attorney who'd been representing him in his DUI cases for nearly 20 years.

Speaker 26 And his lawyer says that the man he'd known was not violent.

Speaker 26 I don't know what else you call this.

Speaker 26 I guess in that lawyer's defense, it does look like he'd hired a different attorney when he was charged with beating his son and his son's mother.

Speaker 26 After Matthew Huddle pled guilty in 2023 to that single misdemeanor charge of entering and remaining in a restricted building on January 6th, his lawyers asked for a sentence of probation with no jail time.

Speaker 26 They cited his lack of ideological motivation for being there, his need to be there for his children, and his tragic backstory and struggle with alcoholism.

Speaker 26 And there is a strange and tragic backstory here, but they don't actually get into it in this court filing.

Speaker 26 This part I pieced together from state court records, old newspapers, and Facebook posts.

Speaker 26 After serving his sentence for beating his son, he was released from jail in 2013, and he very quickly took up with a new girlfriend.

Speaker 26 Based on the apparent age of a photo of their daughter that he posted online in 2015,

Speaker 26 she had to have been pregnant with Huddle's child before she ended her marriage to another man.

Speaker 26 I have said this before, comes up often, oddly.

Speaker 26 But I don't care about that. Her infidelity is between her, her husband, and and her boyfriend.

Speaker 26 I only mention it because of a curious coincidence of dates.

Speaker 26 The same week her divorce was finalized, someone shot Matthew Huddle.

Speaker 26 There's a single mention in the local newspaper in February 2015, just a few days after his daughter's mother finalized her divorce, that Huddle had been shot.

Speaker 26 in what was only described as, quote, an incident between family members

Speaker 26 And the article quotes an officer who says that no one was taken into custody at this time, and he wouldn't say how the shooter was related to the victim.

Speaker 26 I couldn't find any court records that indicated the charges were ever filed against anyone, but I could only check the names I thought of as suspects, so it's a bit of a needle in a haystack.

Speaker 26 Whoever it was, though, Someone close to him shot Matthew in the back of the knee and left him with a lifelong injury.

Speaker 26 And three years later, in 2018, he was asleep in his bed when he woke up to two men beating him with baseball bats and hammers.

Speaker 26 The local newspaper reported the attack was motivated by a child custody dispute.

Speaker 26 One of the assailants, Kurt Falkenberg, was in a relationship with the mother of Huddle's son.

Speaker 26 The other man was Falkenberg's uncle, Jeffrey Martin, though the two men were only a few years apart in age.

Speaker 26 And the men focused their blows on Huddle's left leg because they knew he had a metal rod in there from the surgeries he'd gotten after getting shot in the leg in his last domestic dispute.

Speaker 26 Much like the story of Matthew and Dale Huddle, this story of a very stupid crime committed by an uncle and a nephew ends tragically.

Speaker 26 As Falkenberg and Martin fled the scene, They crashed.

Speaker 26 Falkenberg, who'd been driving, was pronounced dead dead at the scene.

Speaker 26 Officers responding to the car accident, which put another driver in the hospital with two broken legs, found an open bottle of whiskey in Falkenberg's car, and they eventually found Jeffrey Martin passed out drunk in a creek bed on the side of the road.

Speaker 26 The following year, in 2019, Matthew Huddle was diagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver. 20 years of alcoholism had finally caught up to him.

Speaker 26 The DUI he got that summer was the one that put him back in jail until shortly before he drove to Washington, D.C. in January of 2021.

Speaker 26 Now,

Speaker 26 I've read a lot of sentencing memos.

Speaker 26 That's the document filed at the end of a case, after a guilty plea or a guilty verdict, where each side makes their case one last time.

Speaker 26 Not about guilt or innocence now, that's settled. But about what they think the punishment should be.

Speaker 26 And we have an adversarial court system. Everyone is technically, ethically bound to be honest, and the purpose of the courts is supposed to be to seek the truth, but

Speaker 26 really everyone is there to win, to have their version of the truth ruled to be the most true.

Speaker 26 So I'm really used to seeing a defense attorney's sob story and a prosecutor's exaggeration.

Speaker 26 But I wonder, maybe,

Speaker 26 if Matthew Huddle's lawyers really were telling a mostly true story.

Speaker 26 He didn't vote. He couldn't.
His family doesn't seem very political. No one in his family has ever donated so much as a dollar to any federal election.

Speaker 26 And he did have a long history of making spectacularly bad decisions and finding himself in some really outlandishly bad situations.

Speaker 26 I mean, he got his legs broken in two unrelated domestic disputes that doesn't even sound possible.

Speaker 26 So maybe Matthew Huddle is the only January 6th defendant who really did end up there by accident, with no ideological motivation or violent intent.

Speaker 26 Plenty of them claimed that in court, and it never really rings true.

Speaker 26 But maybe for Matthew Huddle, wandering into the Capitol that day was just the same kind of criminal accident he was... often finding himself in.

Speaker 26 Like driving away without paying for a tank of gas because he was too drunk to figure out how to operate the payment system, but somehow not too drunk to drive.

Speaker 26 When I first saw the news that a recently pardoned January 6th defendant had been shot and killed while resisting arrest during a traffic stop, I can't say that I was surprised.

Speaker 26 But I was wrong in my initial assumption.

Speaker 26 I figured a guy who found himself on that trajectory would be, I don't know, a sovereign citizen, or a guy who'd done real violence at the the Capitol, a guy who had violent plans for the future.

Speaker 26 Surely those two facts about his life, being at the Capitol that day and dying the way that he did, surely those two facts would be directly related.

Speaker 26 But I'm not sure they are.

Speaker 26 It's unwise to speculate about the altercation that may have occurred in the minutes before Huddle was shot and killed by a Jasper County Sheriff's Deputy.

Speaker 26 I don't know what happened there on the side of Indiana State Road 14.

Speaker 26 We don't know what was said or why things escalated or where exactly the deputy saw the gun.

Speaker 26 But I do know that Matthew Huddle was due back in court next week for a status conference on a stack of still unresolved felony cases for driving without a license.

Speaker 26 Just days after getting his federal pardon, he was probably happy for his Uncle Dale.

Speaker 26 But he'd already done his federal time, and now he was looking down the barrel at another stay in the county jail.

Speaker 26 And when those blue lights came on behind him, he probably knew that this would be yet another felony charge.

Speaker 26 He had a long list of state charges. A federal pardon did nothing for him.

Speaker 26 In the end, it didn't matter who the president was.

Speaker 26 But I guess it never really did matter to Matthew.

Speaker 26 Weird Little Guys is a production of CoolZone Media and iHeartRadio. It's research, written, and recorded by me, Molly Conger.
Our executive producers are Sophie Licherman and Robert Evans.

Speaker 26 The show is edited by the wildly talented Rory Gagan. The theme music was composed by Brad Dickert.

Speaker 26 You can email me at WeirdLittleGuyspodcast at gmail.com. I will definitely read it, but I'm not going to answer it.
It's nothing personal.

Speaker 26 You can exchange conspiracy theories about the show with other listeners on the Weird Little Guy subreddit. Just don't post anything that's going to make you one of my weird little guys.

Speaker 2 Stop settling for weak sound.

Speaker 3 It's time to level up your game and bring the boom.

Speaker 6 Hit the town with the ultra-durable LGX Boom portable speaker and enjoy vibrant sound wherever you go.

Speaker 9 Elevate your listening experience to new heights because let's be real, your music deserves it.

Speaker 10 The future of sound is now with LG XBoom.

Speaker 8 And for a limited time, save 25% at LG.com with code FALL25.

Speaker 4 Bring the boom. X-Boom.

Speaker 15 Tired of spills and stains on your sofa?

Speaker 12 WashableSofas.com has your back.

Speaker 17 Featuring the Anibay Collection, the only designer sofa that's machine washable inside and out, where designer quality quality meets budget-friendly prices.

Speaker 12 That's right, sofas started just $699.

Speaker 15 Enjoy a no-risk experience with pet-friendly, stain-resistant, and changeable slip covers made with performance fabrics.

Speaker 15 Experience cloud-like comfort with high-resilience foam that's hypoallergenic and never needs fluffing.

Speaker 17 The sturdy steel frame ensures longevity, and the modular pieces can be rearranged anytime.

Speaker 17 Check out washable sofas.com and get up to 60% off your Anibay sofa, backed by a 30-day satisfaction guarantee.

Speaker 12 If you're not absolutely in love, send it back for a full refund.

Speaker 17 No return shipping or restocking fees.

Speaker 18 Every penny back.

Speaker 12 Upgrade now at washable sofas.com.

Speaker 14 Offers are subject to change and certain restrictions may apply.

Speaker 22 Tired of flipping through apps to find something good? Meet Tebow Plus, your one-stop free streaming network, no credit card required.

Speaker 22 With over 300 free channels, you get binge-worthy movies from action and comedy to Indian award winners. Plus top TV shows, live news, sports highlights, and family programming all in one place.

Speaker 22 Watch live or on demand right from your home screen. Free, no sign-ups, no fees, just press play.
That's TiVo Plus. Free, binge-worthy, and always on.
Check us out at TiVo.com.

Speaker 34 What does Zinn really give you? Not just smoke-free nicotine satisfaction, but also real freedom to do more of what you love, when and where you want to do it. Why bring Zinn along for the ride?

Speaker 34 Because America's number one nicotine pouch opens up all the possibilities of right now. With Zinn, you don't just find freedom, you keep finding it.
Find your Zen. Learn more at Zinn.com.

Speaker 34 Warning: this product contains nicotine. Nicotine is an addictive chemical.

Speaker 1 This is an iHeart podcast.