True Crime Vault: A Family Affair

This show is supported by Unicorn Girl, an Apple Original podcast.

Meet Candice, mother of two, nurse, CEO, and founder of multi-million dollar companies.

Candice went from being a stay-at-home mom to making millions, traveling the world, and saving lives.

There was just one problem.

Was it all a lie, or was it all true?

It turns out the truth might be even harder to believe.

From the creator of Scamanda, this is Unicorn Girl, an Apple original podcast produced by 7 Hills.

Apple TV Plus subscribers get special early access to the entire season.

Follow and listen on Apple podcasts.

This is the 2020 True Crime Vault.

Your father says, I have a plan to rob a bank.

Shouldn't your first reaction be, are you crazy?

I asked my dad, are you the devil here to tempt me?

And he said, yeah, probably.

I remember thinking, is this normal?

Does everybody do this?

The three of them.

A family affair.

He had recruited his own children to be his accomplices.

And they're yelling and screaming and scaring the daylights out of everybody in the bank.

Give us all your money.

In just moments, they're out.

I mean,

how long does three people think that they can just rob banks for?

You know, it doesn't last forever.

You got your kids involved in this, and you're asking them to do time for you.

Who would want their own child ever arrested, much less doing hard time behind bars?

They'll be fun.

This guy possesses an addict's brain and a sociopath's soul.

You may think that Scott Kat manipulated and used his own children

to rob banks,

but it doesn't end there.

On October 1st, 2012,

in Katy, Texas, a suburb of Houston,

It was a pleasant afternoon,

1.50 p.m.

It's a little bit quiet on on this particular Monday.

Not a lot going on at all.

You know that lazy feeling you get after you have lunch?

And everything gets kind of quiet and subdued?

That was exactly the atmosphere in First Community Credit Union.

There were seven people inside the bank.

All employees.

Yes, sir.

And a silver Ford Ford Focus drove down a street called Cinco Ranch Boulevard toward First Community Credit Union.

And the car stopped near the bank, and out come two men.

What we're seeing here is the two suspects have arrived on the scene.

And they have on orange vests like construction workers or street crossing guards often wear.

The first thing that stood out to me were the bright orange construction vests they had on.

And I thought to myself for a split second, what are they here to fix?

One man has a painter's mask on his face.

Another man is wearing a fake mustache.

They're wearing blue latex gloves.

One of them is brandishing a gun.

This is a bank robbery.

Give me all your money.

Hands up.

This is a robbery.

The older suspect, he takes control of the room.

He's got the weapon.

Immediately, the younger suspect pops the teller counter.

When he jumps the counter, that's a takeover robbery.

One of the men rushes toward a teller and says, give me everything you've got.

I've got bills to pay.

What goes through a banker's mind when a robbery happens?

Fear.

Just to do what they say.

Give them what they need.

They have guns.

One of the tellers actually is able to slip a pack of bait money into the bag.

This is money with the serial numbers recorded, so the cops are able to trace it.

It was pretty brave on her part.

One of them jumped the counter.

One of them rounded up everybody in the office.

You can see that he goes directly for the bank manager.

Because she's in charge.

She's the one that's going to have access to the safe.

She becomes instantly aware that there's a robbery taking place.

She activates her silent arm.

Several of the tellers were actually still on their lunch break back in the break room.

Were you having lunch?

What were you doing on the break?

I was sitting in there.

I was heating up some food.

I was talking on the phone.

One of my other co-workers was in there.

She had just come in to have her lunch.

They didn't even realize anything was happening until they see a blinking alarm going off.

And I just kind of stopped and I looked up and I told them the person on the phone, I was like, I've got to go.

They get everybody together in the safe room and they order them to open the safe.

The only thing that tripped them up, they were so flustered they couldn't get the combos right to open the safe fast enough.

You remember the thoughts that went into your mind as soon as you realized that this is real, this is happening?

To be honest with you, I wanted to go out because I didn't know what was happening.

My heart was racing, I felt a pit in my stomach, I felt scared for my coworkers.

They asked somebody where the back door is.

Head straight to the back door,

out the back of the building.

Little did they know that they passed right by the break room where these other two employees are monitoring the situation.

Like a bolt of lightning, ran right past the break room, out this back door.

As soon as they busted through that door, the alarm sounded.

So this door right here is the back door of the bank, and this is where they busted out the door that moment it hit me.

They just robbed us.

It took everything I had to remember: oh my god, look out the window and look for them.

So I, these blinds, I did like this real quick.

They literally walked down the sidewalk fast as they could until they got to the curb and then they stopped and they just kind of casually walked to the car.

Bank employees just inside here saw them heading down the alley.

One of them said she saw them get into a silver car,

which was the car parked over here.

And this is the first time we get the description of a silver vehicle.

And they're gone.

What seemed like 30 minutes was, I believe they were in and out in less than three minutes.

Because they knew exactly what they were doing.

They had done this before.

And a successful bank robbery is completed.

When you heard that this bank had been robbed, were you at all surprised?

I was because we had had a previous bank robbery here about six months prior.

And I was thinking, well, if that guy's in jail, who's robbing it now?

That detective and other Texas lawmen I interviewed for this story had one question.

Who were these guys brazen enough to knock off a bank in the middle of the afternoon during bank hours?

And investigators immediately try to find eyewitnesses, noticing that there's a chiropractor who works right next door.

He had noticed two men wearing contractor reflector vests as if they were simply taking a break.

They were sitting right there next to my back.

Like against the wall.

Yeah, they were actually, and I, yeah, they were actually

right here.

And that's unusual for anybody to be sitting here in the middle of the day.

So I said, you know, hey, how you guys doing?

And they said, fine.

And I told the little guy, I said, nice mustache.

And he kind of giggled a little bit.

Could you tell that the mustache was fake?

Oh, it was fake.

Oh, you could tell.

And then the FBI actually came back and they're the ones who told me that those were the guys who robbed the bank.

A closer look at the older bank robber reveals that he's got a walkie-talkie.

Because of the walkie-talkie, we believe that there is someone on the outside of the bank giving them a hand.

So they had those trash bags.

How much money did they actually get put in there?

A little over $29,000.

It's a pretty good haul.

I've had bank robberies where they've had $3,000 or $4,000 total.

Can you imagine what these employees went through?

Oh, my goodness.

I mean, you start walking into a bank with a weapon and you start pointing that at people and ordering them to cough up the money.

I mean, that can change your life forever.

The sheriff's detectives are about to make a series of really jaw-dropping discoveries about these robbers.

For one thing, this isn't the only bank they've robbed.

There was a robbery with similar M.O.

at the Comerica Bank.

And another thing, those robbers, one older, one a little bit younger, the way they work so well together, almost like they were family.

That was noticed by all of the employees there, that there was something special about that relationship.

They could have been father and son.

The quest to identify the people who robbed the bank in Katy, Texas, the robbers with the family resemblance, sparks curiosity even among the most seasoned detectives.

Our only thought was, you know, we've got to find out what this story is.

It'll eventually lead from the Lone Star State all the way to the Pacific Northwest and back in time to when a a man named Scott Catt met Beth Worrell.

Scott and Beth grew up 40 miles south of Portland in a picturesque town called McMinnville.

Beth was a champion swimmer.

Scott played on the football team.

She came home and told us that she'd met this wonderful blonde, handsome cowboy.

Beth was all very, very loving.

Good mommy, terrific mother.

She kept him sane.

She knew how to bring him back from some of his crazy times.

They lived in a nice house with four bedrooms.

They had two beautiful children.

Life was good.

And then she got sick.

She went for a regular mammogram.

And

She called me and said they want to do some more tests.

I remember going from crying to laughing to crying to talking about going wig shopping to it's all going to be okay.

You have a two-year-old and a five-year-old and

I mean I think we were really positive that it was going to be just a bump in the road and that wasn't the case.

She didn't live long after that.

It just went rampant through her.

Do you have any memories from your mother?

Just one when she was sick.

I just remember her being carried down on a stretcher, bright orange.

It was the brightest orange I've ever seen in my life.

That's it, just that one memory.

That's all I remember.

Doesn't sound like so much fun.

No, no.

But I still have that image of her in my head.

I can still see her.

You know, even if she was on a stretcher, I could still see her

face, which is cool.

In the years after Beth died, Scott goes to pieces.

He begins drinking, he's doing drugs, he falls into a depression.

He does let alcohol get a hold of him.

He turns to cocaine.

He begins to slide and lose his footing.

But somehow, despite his life falling apart, he manages to hide it all from the kids.

To his credit, Scott picks up where Beth left off.

He's playing the role of mother and father and doing a very fine job of it.

My dad was right there for everything.

It was always just us three.

He cooked for them.

He cooked lavish lavish meals for them.

He was the president of their swim club.

We go before school, we go after school, swim meets on the weekends.

I mean, it consumed our life, but we loved it.

We were part of a team.

It was our swim family, and my brother was always there, and he was my favorite person in the world, and he still is.

We were very close.

My sister is the only consistent thing I've had in my whole life, and

I'm the only consistent thing that she's had too.

I can just look at her and know what's on her mind, what she's worried about.

Despite the fact that outwardly it seems like a solid cat family foundation, the fact is there were cracks.

His persona outside the house was dad of the year,

volunteer of the year.

He said all the right things, he did all the right things, he took his kids to church.

And then once he was home and he was alone, I think the real Scott came out.

There wasn't really a disciplinarian.

I mean, there was no one there hounding us to do homework or keep up our grades.

Did you guys start drinking in the house?

How old were you when that started?

High school.

And then he told me he got his dream job in Texas.

A Texas recruiter calls him and says there's an engineering job with the Houston area oil company.

So many bad memories here.

He wanted to get away from it.

It would be a fresh start for everybody.

And no matter how good Scott's jobs are, it always feels like the family is just a little bit short of money.

And so Scott goes to his son Hayden with this insanely outlandish idea.

Hey, we're going to rob banks together.

He says, I made a decision that this is what I want to do.

I want to rob banks for a living.

When he approached me and said, would you be willing to do something to get some money more illegal than selling drugs?

And I said, yes.

Your father says, I have a plan to rob a bank.

Shouldn't your first reaction be, are you crazy?

Looking back on it, I can't believe that wasn't my first reaction.

Why did you go along with it so easily?

I had a real struggle and a real internal struggle.

I knew it was wrong, but I was really motivated by the money.

Now, it's bad enough that Scott asks his own son, Hayden, to commit this felony with him, but then he ups the ante.

He used Hayden to convince Abby.

to going along with the plan to rob banks.

How did you react?

Well, the way that

he presented it to me was like, we need you in order to be successful.

And

then it was just like, okay,

you know?

Why do they need you?

Well, so that they didn't have to drive.

Did you have any hesitation about this?

Really, there was no question.

I was going to do it.

There was no questions.

I had no questions.

They told me they needed me, so I did it.

And the way Scott explained it to me was that he didn't see this as a chance to teach his kids about crime.

It was a chance to teach his kids about self-esteem.

And this is how the CAF family decides to start robbing banks together.

Hayden and Scott, they're going to be the stick-up men inside the bank.

Abby is going to be the getaway driver.

Simple plan.

What could possibly go wrong, right?

The morning of the first bank, I asked my dad, you know, are you the devil here to tempt me?

And his answer is what really scared me.

This show is supported by Unicorn Girl, an Apple original podcast.

Meet Candace, mother of two, nurse, CEO, and founder of multi-million dollar companies.

Candice went from being a stay-at-home mom to making millions traveling the world and saving lives.

There was just one problem.

Was it all a lie, or was it all true?

It turns out the truth might be even harder to believe.

From the creator of Scamanda, this is Unicorn Girl, an Apple original podcast produced by 7 Hills.

Apple TV Plus subscribers get special early access to the entire season.

Follow and listen on Apple podcasts.

In March 2017, police in Ketchiken, Alaska got a worried call.

And I haven't heard from them, so I'm getting worried.

It was about a beloved surgeon, one of just two in town, named Eric Garcia.

When police officers arrived to check on the doctor, they found him dead on a couch.

Is it a suicide?

Is it a murder?

What is it?

From ABC Audio and 2020, Cold-Blooded Mystery in Alaska is out now.

Listen wherever you get your podcasts.

In Katy, Texas, just outside Houston, Scott Cat has recruited his two kids, Abby and Hayden, to join him in the family business, robbing banks.

A father who was a structural engineer, 50 years old, his 20-year-old son, and his 18-year-old daughter, both of whom looked like classic American kids, and somehow he had recruited his own children to be his accomplices.

No one had ever thought of that before.

This is the only one I've heard of.

Well, it's the only one I've worked.

When Scott first came to Texas, he called Hayden and said, I love Texas.

There's a bank on every corner.

These are big banks.

They're beautiful banks.

There are banks after banks after bank.

Scott will later tell a reporter that this is his way of motivating his kids.

Needed to do something where they would get a reward and feel good about themselves.

And so somehow,

Scott thought,

if I teach them how to rob banks with me, they'll feel this sense of accomplishment accomplishment they can't get in high school.

And for their first family outing, they choose the Comerica Bank.

Picture this.

A Thursday morning in August, 2012, a strip mall.

It's got it all.

It's got the donut shop.

It's got the radio shack.

It's got the wedding dress shop.

And it has a bank.

a Comerica Bank wedged in with all of the other businesses.

Now the getaway driver is Abby and she's just recently gotten her license, barely knew how to drive stick.

Now this is something they definitely don't teach you in Driver Z.

How long did it take you to drive from your house to the bank?

Oh a minute.

Two blocks away.

You robbed the bank two blocks away from your own house.

Does your dad do like a mental checklist for everybody, like remind everybody what their jobs are going to be?

You know like okay well drop us off here and then you know we're going to walk here and then, you know, pull around back and

you pick us up here.

The doors fly open.

In comes two armed bank robbers.

They both have pistols.

They're both wearing white painters overalls.

They've got white latex gloves.

And they're yelling and screaming and scaring the daylights out of everybody in the bank.

Give us all your money.

She walked in first and said,

nobody move or put your hands up or I really don't even know.

He was kind of like the muscle with the gun and I was the money guy making sure I got all the money.

They demand money from the tellers and from the safe?

Robbing somebody at gunpoint was not something I would think I would be capable of.

But when I opened the door to that greed,

it wasn't an issue anymore.

And in fact, I was probably willing to do more than that.

Were people scared?

Absolutely.

That's been one of the hardest things to deal with is the look of fear on some of those people's faces.

I was actually shaking so bad that the employees grabbed the bag and started throwing money in for me.

The employees at the Comerica Bank also noticed that at least one of them was wearing a walkie-talkie.

These employees actually heard communication coming across on that walkie-talkie.

The tellers hear a female voice coming out of Scott's walkie-talkie, counting down the time.

30 seconds, one minute, minute 30, two minutes.

Because at the three minute mark, they had to go.

That was Scott's rule.

That was probably like the most nerve-wracking part of it was just like, just come out, you know, just get out of there.

Because my dad kept, well, hold on.

And it's like, hold on for what?

What do you mean, hold on?

Now, they're ready to hightail it out of there.

But guess what?

The back door is locked.

They can't get out.

And this was a very tense tense moment.

They went to run out the back door and ran right into it because it was locked.

And they have to get a teller to unlock it for them.

High drama was not as carefully planned as we thought.

Did you just drive right back home the two blocks home?

Yeah, I did.

It was a stick shift and I could barely like do the stick.

You know, when you take off, you got to make sure you take off without killing it.

And I was like,

They walked away with $70,000, which is a huge awe in the bank robbery business.

Most bank robbers are lucky to get away with $2,000 or $3,000.

I assume you'd never seen so much money in one place in your life.

No.

It was quite overwhelming.

The cash in your hand

totally changed my mindset, my thinking.

All I did was feed the greed.

All I wanted was some more now.

So you were willing to rob again?

I was, yeah.

Now you'd think that most people after a major score like this would lay low for a while, get off the radar, not make any extravagant purchases.

That's not the cat family.

They used that money to purchase vehicles with it.

And then there was some partying going on.

What kind of vehicles?

I believe they have a motorcycle and they have a Tahoe and they have a Ford Focus, things like that.

I went and I got my nails done.

I remember that.

And I just drove around and did my thing.

That was kind of my thing.

And I definitely looked at my dad differently after that, though, that's for sure.

I remember thinking, like, is this normal?

Like,

does everybody do this?

Shopping, cars, partying, really nothing to show for it.

Was there anything left over?

I don't believe so.

They didn't manage their money well because two months later, you need to rob another bank.

How long could you last?

With $70,000.

The problem

for them wasn't so much the pre-planning.

It was the post-planning

that was the problem for them.

And are you thinking to yourself,

what what is happening here?

It was kind of like a dream.

It was kind of unreal.

And soon they realized the money was gone.

Within just two months, the Cat family is already running out of money and they begin plotting their next heist.

But this time, their luck runs out even faster than their cash.

They were trying to take shots of alcohol and they couldn't even get the alcohol down because they were so nervous.

And I'm like,

this is not...

We need to just not.

My dad, very much.

No, we have to.

We have to.

We have no money.

We have to.

After the Comerica bank robbery, the robbers walk off with $70,000.

And in no time at all, it was all gone.

So imagine you're a father who has just pulled off a bank heist using your two children.

You might say to yourself, wow, what did they just do there?

You'd think maybe that's what Scott would have thought.

Oh, but no.

He had no inclination to keep his kids out of it.

He thought they were a great team.

So they start looking around and what do they see?

They lock in on the First Community Credit Union.

Why this particular bank?

Well, there are a number of reasons, but one of of them is the bushes right in front of the bank that block the view from the street.

So after you robbed the first bank, your job was to go scope out the second bank.

What was that like?

I was very nervous to do that because I felt like everybody knew what I did.

Everybody could feel why I was in there, could feel my vibe.

And that was super scary and nerve-wracking.

When any of us walk in a bank to cash a check, whatever, we're caught on camera.

Surveillance cameras actually capture Abby on her stealth reconnaissance mission of this bank.

Let me tell you, she is not opening an account.

It's Abby Kat doing a little recon before the robbery.

We wanted to know some of the details going into it, I guess, about how we were going to enter and how we were going to exit.

And when she gets back, she, her brother, and her father sit down and essentially draw up maps to use as a guide for once they get inside the bank.

Now, the next step in the planning is to change their disguises.

They swap out those white painter overalls that they used in that first robbery for something else.

Some reflective orange vests, some mustaches, glasses, hats.

They were doing some construction in the area and that was

our disguise I guess to maybe walk around and millabout a bank without drawing too much suspicion.

So it seems a safe bet would be to purchase those contractors' reflective vests.

vests so Abby and Hayden go to the Home Depot.

And you chose Home Depot because?

Proximity to our house.

And you didn't think that someone could trace that?

I didn't think there would be anyone following up behind us.

And like Scott did on the first robbery, he had Hayden, the night before the second robbery, go out, steal some license plates from a car in a adjoining parking lot, tape them to the license plates in the car they were going to use to hide the real license plates, but to be able to rip them off as soon as they could when the robbery was over.

Now it's the day of the robbery, October 1st, 2012, and as they prepare to leave the house, Abby says her gang is not exactly brimming with confidence.

They were trying to take shots of alcohol and they couldn't even get the alcohol down because they were so nervous.

And I'm like,

this is not.

We need to just not

my dad very much.

No, we have to.

We have to.

We have no money.

We have to.

Were you scared?

scared

yes i was scared and it's just something you just like want one to be over with you remember feeling nervous you know i remember feeling nervous and anxious um a lot of adrenaline

did you announce it was a robbery we did we would we would shout something or yell something initially it's definitely not like the movies or at least that ours wasn't like that were people scared Absolutely.

I remember a few people's face still.

Total shock.

Terror?

Yeah, they were scared, terrified.

Caden jumped behind the counter and then asked for the money to come out of the different hills.

Scott was able to get the employees huddled into the bank vault and they removed some money out of the bank vault as well.

In just moments they've come in, they've gotten the money, they're out.

They head out of the credit union and of course Abby is ready and waiting.

My dad's just like, go, go, you know.

And he was saying, don't go too fast, right?

Oh, yeah.

He did not want you to speed.

Yeah.

By the time we got on the highway, he was fine.

He just, he relaxed a little bit and we drove home.

You guys went home.

You had a pile of cash in the house.

Yeah.

Sure, you could keep doing this, right?

You didn't get caught.

Yeah.

In their minds, they made a clean getaway.

Little did they know how many things they did wrong.

They thought they had pulled off another perfect crime until they got home and realized that one of the license plates that had been taped on had fallen off somewhere.

It was found in the alley laying next to a dumpster right where Abby had been parked.

The license plate had Scott's fingerprints on it.

Why didn't you just screw the new plates on?

That was for

being able to remove them quickly.

So smart, but not smart enough.

Sure.

Then the second mistake they made was in the planning.

They had no idea that bank employees were still having their lunch in the break room.

And as they were watching the closed circuit TV, they were actually writing down a description of the bank robbers.

But the biggest clue of all is something that a very astute police detective spots as he's going over that surveillance tape.

I mean it's so small that you wonder that anybody noticed it at all.

He's looking at those reflective contractor jackets and he notices, well

They look like somebody just took them right out of the package because they have nice cases in them.

What did that mean?

That they were just purchased.

And we were able to isolate those vests at Home Depot.

The purchase of those vests were made with Scott's debit master card.

And it wasn't a stretch to get him identified after that.

Then they looked at the Home Depot security video of the purchase made, and they saw that it wasn't a Scott cat.

It was a young man and a young woman.

But they don't know who those two people are on the surveillance tape.

Now we use the modern day tools that cops like to use, and one of them is social media.

Cops look for Scott Cat on Facebook.

And on Facebook, they saw Scott Cat's photo with his two children, Hayden and Abby, who looked exactly like the two purchasing the orange vests.

Suddenly, Detective Martin had the entire Cat family sort of at bay.

Did you think that that would be the thing of everything that gave you guys up?

Not even a little bit.

They go back and look at more video and they find Scott Cat buying Painter's mask.

So at that point, they've got it all.

A man and his two children are now in custody tonight, accused of robbing.

It wasn't until they took the Katzes into custody that the police really realized how horrible a father Scott really was.

Abby called and she was yelling at me.

I'm in jail and I need $10,000 to get me out of here.

Get me out of here right now.

And I said, you have to get that money from your father.

She says, he's the reason I'm in jail.

On the morning of November 9th, just after sunrise, members of the Sheriff's Department show up at the Cat's apartment to arrest Scott, Hayden, and Abby.

They have no idea that Scott and Hayden were planning to do a robbery that very day, and they were just waiting for Abby to show up in the getaway car.

Shortly after that, Scott comes walking out of the apartment and detectives were able to take him into custody.

It's been about a month since the first community bank heist.

They say you're being arrested for bank robbery.

And Scott looks at the cops and says, which one?

We then went inside the apartment, arrested Hayden without incident.

All of a sudden, our door gets kicked in, and you're surrounded by police officers, guns, weapons.

My world came crashing down at that point.

What a wild story this is.

A 50-year-old Scott Katz behind bars awaiting trial.

What is it like to see your son associated with that?

Horrible.

How can I wrap my brain around this?

It was so unbelievable and all I could think of was I was glad their mother was gone

so that she didn't have to see this.

The police get a search warrant and they go to their residence and they were absolutely shocked based on what they found.

We found some bank straps.

A bank strap is a little paper strap that wraps around a certain quantity of money.

Apparently they just would pull cash out of those bank straps and when the cash was gone they didn't throw the bank straps away.

They find no cash.

$100,000?

There's nothing, no cash.

Incredibly, they also found a crumpled sheet of paper which was the script that Scott had written out for Hayden to say when he came into the bank robberies.

It says, this is a bank robbery.

All we want is the money.

20s, 50s, 100s.

No alarms, DIPACs, or GPS.

Or

you,

family, and co-workers will be hurt.

But now, as they're bringing Scott and Hayden in for questioning, they want them to be able to help them answer the biggest mystery of all.

Why would Scott enlist his own kids to to rob banks with him?

You're going to figure out.

I'm going to be forthright, okay?

I'm going to be forthright.

We began talking with Scott in such a way where we were just having a conversation with him.

Was there some things that you did

without the kids and then that led up and then the kids got?

I'll give you the whole thing.

I swear.

I'll give you the whole thing.

How much did he tell the officers?

He spilled the beans.

He waived his right to counsel, and he just told investigators exactly what happened.

I was always thought that

a bank was federally insured.

I thought that if there is a bank robbery, we're told to just give the money and get the guy out of there.

So, in my mind, I thought that's kind of,

you know, an easy pick.

I guess in my mind, I thought that it was, you know, no victims.

Yeah.

It seems Scott didn't recognize the legal magnitude of bank robbery.

This was all kind of casual.

Aggravated robbery in the state of Texas is a big deal.

God, help me understand how did you broach this topic with

the kids?

Well, I think you have to go way back to the very beginning when their mother passed away.

You've got to understand it was just the three of us.

You know, it kind of segregated us.

You know, it kind of made it so that he really couldn't get close to us.

He had manipulated them to think he was the only person that could take care of them, and they would do anything for him.

Going through that kind of very segregated kind of grieving puts them more at risk to future manipulations from that individual who now controls them psychologically, physically, financially.

Tell me how that

first time went down.

You know, y'all, you'd sat them around the dinner table and said, let's go around the bank.

I guess

it wasn't around the dinner table, but it was, you know, this little

Friday night

gathering, you know, just sitting around watching movies or something.

I really don't remember the details of all that.

I mean, how it happened.

Scott's own words were that...

He was completely responsible for manipulating his children.

It was all my manipulation of

the two of them and her.

I mean, I did this whole

spiel about, you know, how easy it was going to be and how we didn't have to worry about it.

These poor kids need him so badly that they choose wrong instead of right, not so much because they're evildoers, but because they loved their father.

And he took advantage of that unconditional love.

He doesn't know anything about unconditional love.

He loves Scott Scott Kat.

Scott was the first one that we interviewed.

And then we interviewed Hayden.

Okay.

Hayden, before we start.

When Hayden was initially approached by law enforcement, he said he didn't want to talk to them.

And have you talked to your father?

Yeah.

And did your father give you any advice?

Just to cooperate.

But after having a conversation with his father, Scott, he then decided to tell them the truth.

It's a great example of how much control Scott has over Hayden.

Is anybody forcing you to do this?

No.

You doing this on your own?

Yes.

Because you want to cooperate.

Is that right?

Yeah, okay.

How did it feel to confess?

To be honest with you, I was still full of some pride.

I was still full of some arrogance.

Oh, so you felt good about it because you were bragging.

Yeah.

Not surprising he feels that way.

Remember, Scott told him bank robbing would boost his self-esteem.

So he he approaches you about this and then tell me how did it progress from there?

Well,

you know,

I was scared.

You know, I was really scared at first.

It's so heartbreaking when you think about it.

The point here is that Hayden does what daddy says.

He definitely,

as far as like what to look for in a bank, he,

you know, I mean, told me, you know, what to look for and stuff.

Fear was our biggest tool, I think.

So y'all would have to just use fear would help y'all?

Yeah.

I mean, that's all I needed.

But one of them, there was a girl that was, you know, she thought she was going to die.

And,

you know, we felt bad about that.

You know, like, no, no, no, honey, we're just here for the money.

You can see this in that grainy surveillance video.

The absolute horror and terror that's all over their faces.

You can only imagine what kind of fear they must have felt.

You may think that Scott Kat manipulated and used his own children to rob banks,

but it doesn't end there.

Scott confessed, Hayden confessed, and then Abby was brought into the interrogation room.

You know, he's always been there for me.

He's been the only person that I have, so it was just like

okay almost, you know.

If you thought a parent manipulating their children into robbing banks was bad, well, wait till you see what happens now that they've been caught.

We have a downed spacecraft.

FX's alien earth all new Tuesdays.

This ship collected specimens from other worlds.

Invasive species.

Predatory.

From creator Noah Hawley and executive producer Ridley Scott.

If we don't lock them down, it will be too late.

What did you do?

FX's Alien Earth.

All new Tuesdays on FX and Hulu.

Fridays, Project Runway is back in dramatic fashion.

This is more stressful than Cinderella at the ball.

Welcome to the runway.

Heidi Klum returns as host.

One day you're in, and the next day, you're out.

I'm here to show them who's the queen.

With Christian Siriano.

I'm excited.

And judges Nina Garcia and Law Roach.

I hated your dress.

Hate is such a big word.

It's a short word.

It's only four letters.

Project Runway.

New episodes, Fridays.

Stream on Hulu and Disney Plus.

You hear of bank robberies every day.

The geezer bandits.

Barbie bandits.

And they're a dime a dozen.

But it is very rare that you hear of a father reeling in his own children to rob banks with him.

A man and his two children accused of robbing banks.

The made-for-great headlines.

The family affair, all in the family.

The family that robs together stays together.

Oh, son, if I didn't know better, I'd say that was you.

The family stole thousands of dollars.

Abby Cat drove the getaway vehicle.

People were fascinated with breaking bags.

What the hell is wrong with you?

We're a family.

I think they kind of see some of the same thing with this particular story.

How did such an ordinary-looking, normal family turn into bank robbers waving pistols and driving getaway cars?

And you're asking them to do time for you.

It says it right here.

Where did you get this?

I talked myself into robbing banks.

I'll just f it, I'll just rob banks.

I'm probably better at that anyway.

Investigators were very pleased, obviously, when Scott started talking about the robberies in Texas.

But they were totally taken back when he started talking about robberies in another state.

Now, detectives have those bank straps they found on the floor of Scott's apartment.

And some of them come from Oregon.

So now detectives are suspicious that, well, maybe Scott robbed banks there too.

Okay, I'm just trying to think about

the first one.

We had a big chalkboard in there and he was writing on this chalkboard.

First federal savings alone.

Bank robbery one in Oregon.

Number two was another one.

It was in McMinnville.

Bank robbery two.

Number three

was in Portland.

Wow.

Why would he volunteer that?

I don't know.

Maybe he had a guilty heart.

I think that's all about it's going to help him.

In his mind, he's going to come clean and he's going to end up with less of a sentence.

And then that one, same thing, some sort of cover with a painter's mask, a hat,

sunglasses.

The painter's mask thing is pretty consistent.

It was with me because of my goatee.

Not only is he confessing to the crimes that they're aware of, But he's now confessing to others that they didn't even know about.

Starting off, believe it or not, in the same bank for Scott Katz's dad retired.

The newspaper printed a classic grainy photo of the robber standing in front of the teller.

And Scott's mother saw it in the newspaper.

And I said, oh, son, if I didn't know better, I'd say that was you.

And he grabbed the paper from me and he looked at that.

I remember so vividly and he said,

Yeah, it does kind of.

And that was it, no more conversation.

And you had no idea that he was doing this in Oregon and then that he was doing this in Texas.

I swear to God.

I got lucky on that one.

If I'm surprised about anything, it's the fact that he was able to remain undetected.

You would think that someone in his hometown would have known him.

His first five were in Oregon.

How many of those

did either Hayden or Abby know about?

None.

And now Abby's about to learn everything also.

Scott Kat leaves the interrogation room and the next person in is Abby.

She's also under arrest and the first thing she sees in that interrogation room is this whiteboard with the list of all the banks that her father robbed in Oregon.

I saw on the whiteboard that he had wrote out some things, but I'm sure it was more than that.

It struck her the enormity of what her father had done and what he had persuaded her to be a part of.

You know, he's always been there for me.

He's been the only person that I have, so it was just like,

okay, almost, you know.

And even then, she says to the investigators, he's my dad, and I love him.

I mean, how's your dad?

I didn't know him until today.

I mean, he's a pretty good guy, other than what he got mixed up in here.

Good father.

So I mean a pretty normal and happy childhood.

Normal, everyday kind of family, I guess.

Despite the horrendous things that a parent can do to a child, in so many circumstances, that child will still find a reason to believe in that parent and to make an excuse for that parent no matter what.

I've trusted him my whole life and I just continued on to do so.

In the position that I was put in, it was more like,

well, I have to do it to protect my family.

That if you didn't help them, then they would do it themselves and get arrested.

Exactly.

If there is a victim in a group, of bad guys, she would be a victim.

He didn't approach her initially.

He used Hayden to convince Abby to go along with the plan to rob banks.

What exactly did they ask you to do to help?

Just drive.

Okay.

When you say drive, I mean like, like, getaway, drive.

The getaway, the getaway car?

Yeah.

Did they ask you to do anything else?

No, never.

And never.

Not once.

She's being made to believe, ah, it's nothing.

You're just driving the car, kiddo.

You just

said it.

I mean, we need we need a getaway driver to drive and for because we're gonna rubble bank yeah

but what anyone knows who follows crime and justice is that you could just be the passenger in a getaway car and still be equally responsible to anyone who's inside that bank did it seem like Abby was comfortable in her role as getaway driver.

Absolutely not.

I know that it was only the influence of me and my father that pushed Abby to that.

I don't think anybody in their right mind would really understand how you get your children involved.

I mean getting your two children involved in robbing banks with firearms.

But it made you feel better when they told you the gals were right.

Um yeah.

I mean of course just knowing that no one will get hurt.

Until they told you they weren't real you thought they were real, right?

Yeah.

Did you ever think that your dad would get hurt or Hayden would get hurt or they might hurt someone during this?

Honestly, no.

No, I don't think they would hurt anyone, and I don't think anyone would hurt them, but that's not true.

But

it shouldn't come as a big surprise for you that you're going to have some legal consequences.

No, no, it's not.

No, I know.

I understand that.

Now, both of these kids are facing big trouble and big prison sentences.

At the same time, Scott is starting to scheme.

He's trying to get them to do more time so that he can do less time.

Why don't you read something for me?

This is your letter to Abby, by the way.

Where did you get this?

Now they're only indicted for their second robbery in Texas that heist at the first community credit union.

How many sins must I confess?

And they're facing five to 99 years in prison.

Texas, like most states, has an accomplished liability law.

If you intended to be part of the robbery, you can be charged with the exact same crime as the person who was at the center of it.

Now, these are kids from a middle-class family, and now they're in this Texas jail.

Hayden and Abby's lives are already completely changed.

I never thought about jail or any of the repercussions from walking to the bank.

This has been life-shattering for me.

And I feel like now I've lost my mom and now I've lost my dad because

most parents don't do that, so.

No, parents are supposed to keep you away from trouble.

Yeah, that's hard to

deal with and to grasp on to.

It's 2013 and I I sit down with Scott Kat for a series of interviews for 2020 while he's awaiting trial.

Scott?

A little more to your right, just a little more.

Everybody good?

I'm a little bit.

What I'm struggling with is how your kids got involved, how they are sitting in jail right now.

Is that a mistake?

Is that an error in judgment?

Or is that just...

What is that?

It's all of the above.

You know, it's probably an error in judgment on all of us, and

especially my partner.

You're sacrificing your children for your own needs.

So are we looking at some sort of a narcissistic personality, antisocial personality, borderline personality, maybe a combination of all of those things?

When I went to interview them, Scott said, I would only rob banks for my family.

He wants you to believe that everything he does is in the interest of the entire family unit.

That is really a bunch of baloney.

This was in his blood.

This guy possesses an addict's brain and a sociopath's soul.

What would your mother have said about all of this?

It probably never would have happened if my mother was here.

What would Beth say, your first wife?

What would she say about you dragging your kids into, as you said, your sex?

I can't even imagine.

Can't even imagine.

I'm just, I'm really ashamed.

You would expect that a father who's convinced his kids to join in a bank robbery would, after they get caught say look I'll take the heat

and that's how he starts

if you were offered a deal where you had to spend 25 30 40 years in prison in exchange for both of your kids going free would you take it for them going free absolutely what about life in prison sure

but as time goes on he starts talking to them about what they can do to help him.

And even though all three of them are locked up in the Fort Bend County Jail, they're all in separate cell blocks, and the only way they can communicate is by handwritten letters.

Now, at this point, Abby's lawyer gives us letters that Scott sent his kids.

Now, apparently, he was trying to encourage his kids to do hard time so that he can do less of it.

A month later,

I speak to Scott again.

This time, I'm allowed to be face to face.

All right, all in.

Why don't you read something for me?

This is your letter to Abby, by the way.

Where did you get this?

We wrote this to Abby.

As long as you, Abby, are ready to do some time, I think it will better my chances, I hope.

Here, you aren't asking her essentially to do time for you.

Yeah, I was trying to manipulate.

I'm trying to get something for you.

I'm trying to get everybody something that they can live with.

You told me that you would be willing to spend life in prison in order that your kids do not spend time in prison.

You got your kids involved in this and you're asking them to do time for you.

It says it right here.

I do believe that you doing prison time will be good for me and I know that wasn't an easy choice for you.

And that's what she said to me in the previous letter that she was willing to do that.

Wouldn't most parents say, I will take the entire blame here.

I would love to, but they have so much evidence on everybody that what

are we supposed to do?

Again, it seems like like Scott is manipulating his kids and us.

He encourages Abby to talk more about his addiction and his dual life.

Why does he do that?

To gain sympathy.

You tell your daughter.

So if and when you do your interview, exaggerate about me, tell them I led a dual life involving drugs, alcohol, and women, and we connect with them a little.

Haha.

It was a joke.

I was joking around.

Everything that he was doing and telling them was all for the sake of himself, for his own image.

He has done research on what would make them have a better story to sell.

So being a drug addict,

being an alcoholic, your audience would look at that and excuse it and maybe feel sorry for him.

You clearly told your kids to manipulate us,

just like you were manipulating them.

I wanted to get some sort of

of

movement on my case.

I was going to do anything to get that.

I'm just so angry about what this dad did to his children.

Angry as I am at Scott Cat, There was a moment I broke down in tears.

And that is when, against all the rules, the sheriff allowed Hayden and Abby to see each other.

A serial bank robber who disturbingly recruited his own son and daughter to help him during a string of holdups has learned his fate.

Scott would have almost certainly been convicted at trial.

He was facing up to 99 years.

He would have been convicted on all counts and got a maximum sentence.

He did a very smart thing taking a plea deal.

How do you plead for the offense?

Are you pleading guilty freely involuntarily?

I hear by planning guilty of the offense of aggravated robbery, which is a first-degree felony.

Ronald Scott Catt took a deal to avoid trial and the potential of life in prison.

He was sentenced to 24 years behind bars.

After the sentencing, a reporter asks Scott about the impact that his actions have had on his kids, and he seems to get genuinely emotional.

They're pretty strong.

They'll be fine.

It won't be easy for them, but they've worked hard.

They know how to do it.

Hayden Kat took his own plea deal and was sentenced to 10 years behind bars.

What do you expect prison life to be like?

Hell.

As close to hell on earth as you can go.

Abby took a plea deal for five years behind bars.

How do you plead for the offense guilty?

Five years for an aggravated robbery conviction is a good deal for her.

It's clear that prosecutors and the judge believed she was the least culpable of the three.

It breaks my heart that ultimately I'm the one that sent my sister to prison.

Do you think that you two can be close again after this?

Oh, this will never come between me and my sister.

And she forgives you?

I haven't asked her to forgive me.

I think that

the possibility that she might not is too scary a thought for me to think about.

If your father were right here, Hayden, what would you say to him?

You know, I'd tell him that I forgive him

and that I don't want him to carry this burden around with him for the rest of his life.

And his sister tells me she feels the same way.

It is what your dad did to you.

Is that forgivable?

I've forgiven him.

You have forgiven him?

I have to forgive him.

So I can start to live a normal life.

I don't want hate, anger, any of that in my heart.

Now the three of them, father, son, and daughter, are in the same jail, but they're separated.

And for Abby, who tells me that her brother is her best friend and her soulmate, being separated from Hayden is devastating.

I think we both hate to see each other in this situation.

And there's just nothing we can do for each other.

You know, I just

feel like I can't help him and I

can't comfort him.

And

that makes me sad.

Okay, I want to show you something.

So as we're sitting there interviewing Abby, we've got a surprise for her.

Okay.

So

boom.

Just boom it.

So you may notice something's happening.

Yeah.

Sheriff Troynells makes this unprecedented gesture.

He's allowing Abby and Hayden to meet.

This just doesn't happen.

So

with the help of the sheriffs,

we asked if we might be able to

bring Hayden in here for you to see him.

If you're okay with that.

I thought you might like that.

So they're going right out and he's going to sit here.

Look at that smile.

How long has it been since you've seen him?

Um

since I've talked to him a year.

Jailhouse rules are strict.

Hayden is brought in shackled hands and feet, and the rules say no touching.

But Hayden and Abby just can't seem to help themselves.

Abby.

Can you?

Are you doing okay?

Yes.

Okay.

I'm just happy to see you.

Yeah, me too.

Abby, I'm sorry, okay?

I don't blame you for anything, Hayden.

Just know that I love you forever.

I love you too.

I don't blame you for anything.

Nothing.

Okay.

I don't want you to know that.

Okay.

We can see the future now, at least.

Yeah.

And it's going to be okay.

We'll get to be normal brother and sister again.

Right.

I love you.

I love you too.

Can I give him a hug?

No, I can't hug you.

No?

No.

It's gonna be a long time until I see you.

I know.

I'm glad.

I know I can take care of myself, so I just worry about you, Abby.

I'm fine.

Okay.

And then we get the sign from the sheriff.

They can hug.

You guys want to give each other a hug?

The sheriff says it's okay.

Really?

It could be 10 years before they see each other again.

And if you listen closely,

That's the sound our mics pick up of their hearts beating.

When I heard that heartbeat, I said to myself, please, please somehow let them move ahead and break the chains of that father and live to have happy lives.

I know.

It's just going to be a couple years until I kiss you.

When they asked me, is it okay for Abigail to hug her brother Hayden, I felt, why not?

She needed that.

There were kind of desperate souls there at that point in time.

I don't want you to go.

I know.

Thank you for the hug.

I needed it.

I know.

All right, we're gonna have to come back.

All right, happy.

Be strong, okay?

I love you.

Happy, I love you too.

I'll see you soon.

Okay, bye.

Allowing them to touch and hug that way, I felt was in many ways the beginning of some sort of a healing.

There is a life thread between those two kids and even between the two kids and their father still.

You know how a lot of people see a program on television and they go, oh, that's so sad.

And then they forget about it?

That's not what happened.

Turns out a 2020 viewer who actually works at the jailhouse saw the program.

Tonight, on 2020, the unbelievable story of a father who turned his own kids into hardcore criminals.

Saw Abby and decided to open up her heart and her house to her, taking her in after her sentence was up.

Abby, this is your new house.

Fairy tale ending, right?

Not quite.

Let me tell you something about the prison system.

You do not want to end up in a Texas prison.

The temperatures go up over 100.

When they say say hard time, they mean hard time.

After their sentencing, Scott and Hayden are shipped off to a Texas state prison.

And Abby was almost sent to state prison as well.

But then in a real

act of mercy, Fort Bend County Sheriff Nels did something pretty incredible.

He arranged for Abby to stay in the local jail.

I just feel that she's more of a victim in this and I'm going to do my part to try to help see her become a productive member of society.

So this was a really good break for Abby Kat not to have to go to state prison and deal with hardened criminals.

We had her enrolled in the GED program.

She was learning how to sew.

We were doing everything we could to set her up for success.

It takes a little bit of time too to learn this, doesn't it?

Yes, but I learned very fast.

And we get a lot done in here.

I don't think it's every day that you see a sheriff intervene and say, listen, have some mercy here.

Can I check your work?

To go out on a limb for a double bank robber.

That never happens.

So here's a second chance, another opportunity for you.

And I thank you for that.

So make me proud while you're here.

All right.

All right.

Very well.

Thank you.

I've been here for just over two and a half years.

Since the last time you saw me, a lot has changed.

Emotionally, I'm doing a little bit better.

And I have become a...

better and stronger person in here.

Abby apparently had no visitors while she was in jail.

But her aunt and grandmother traveled from Oregon to the jail in Texas to visit Abby and that's the first time they have seen her in three years.

It was so emotional seeing Abby.

Can you look at her?

I had so much hope for her and all I could do was just give her a big hug and tell her how much we loved her.

Oh, I love her.

But this visit is also a cause for celebration because Abby learns that she got parole, and that means she's going to be released in just a few months.

Do you know how lucky you are?

Yes.

Okay.

You've been given an opportunity here that many others don't ever get to start a new life.

Abby's new life on the outside is going to start with a woman she met on the inside.

a volunteer sewing teacher named Susie Gregory.

See how you?

Now Susie Gregory is a married mother of two grown sons and she watches the original 2020 piece.

I believe he feels remorse, but he's still going to have my best interest through all of this.

Becomes very emotional about it and she was open enough to try to give Abby a second chance.

We watched the 2020 show and I said, this is just wrong.

She should not be in jail for this.

And I just felt like God put me in that sewing room for Abby.

I couldn't balance robbing banks, driving a getaway car, with the sweet little girl in the jail.

They didn't equate.

There's something wrong with that equation.

I said, how would you feel if I would find some in our church that would be willing to take you in when you got out?

She said, well, could I meet them first?

I said, well, I was kind of thinking about Steve and I.

And she said, oh, I would love that.

Thank you.

It's pretty extraordinary that a volunteer sewing teacher at the county jail finds it in her heart to open her home to Abby.

Gives you hope about the human race.

To put herself out there to try to help Abigail, just incredible.

Not anyone would just do that.

It's an amazing story.

Abigail Cat will be released today, and it's an exciting time for her.

This is a big day.

A new beginning.

Go ahead.

We met that day manage one.

Well,

two years and ten months.

I walked her out of the facility and told her, you have a second chance?

I believe I even told her not to let me down.

I put myself out there for her, like several other people did as well.

I gave her my phone number, said, Abby, call me anytime.

I feel great.

I'm ready to go.

It was the first day of the rest of her life.

She had people who really cared about her.

She had a plan to go to college.

She really wanted to do the right thing.

So who are you calling now?

Everybody.

Everybody.

Time to go home.

The idea that Susie took her in, there's a certain risk with that.

Yay, we're home.

Finally.

Abby, this is your new house and here's your room.

Make yourself at home.

It's not uncommon for people like Abby to get out of jail and in a short period of time stumble.

Abby did well after being released from jail and then I think her demons started to creep in.

Abby's future looked so bright.

It didn't work out that way at all and I put the blame squarely at her father, Scott Katz's feet.

In your wildest dreams, did you think that within a year you'd be back in doing time?

No.

The twisted tale of Amanda Knox is now streaming on Hulu and Hulu on Disney Plus.

Amanda, where did you go the night of Meredith's murder?

Do I need a lawyer right now?

Inspired by the infamous story.

We cannot do our jobs unless you are honest with us.

I swear to God, I'm innocent.

You only thought you knew.

For 15 years, I've been defined by something I didn't do.

Watch the new Hulu original series, The Twisted Tale of Amanda Knox, now streaming on Hulu and Hulu on Disney Plus for bundle subscribers.

Terms apply.

Labor Day grilling is a tradition in my house.

Steaks, burgers, the whole deal.

That's why I stock up with Omaha Steaks.

Their USDA-certified tender steaks, juicy burgers, and meaty chicken wings make cookouts easy and unforgettable.

I recently grilled their filet mignons.

Incredible flavor and perfectly aged.

Right now, during the Labor Day sale, get 50% off-site-wide at Omahasteaks.com, plus $35 off with code FLAVOR.

Don't miss out.

Omaha Steaks brings Heartland quality right to your door.

Get fired up for fall grilling with Omaha Steaks.

Visit Omahasteaks.com for 50% off-site-wide during their Labor Day sale.

And for an extra $35 off, use promo code Flavor at checkout.

That's 50% off at Omahasteaks.com and an extra $35 off with promo code flavor at checkout.

See site for details.

It's been years since I've last seen Abby and

the last time we saw her, we thought that things were looking up.

Well, it didn't turn out that way.

The last time we saw Abby, she was walking into a loving home with everything mapped out for her to start all over again.

Take me back to 2015.

What was it like living with Susie?

It was amazing in some areas.

In other areas, it was so different.

What was different about it?

Some of kind of some of the rules.

She just came from jail.

Could any rules be any worse than in jail?

Right, but I didn't want any rules.

Our number one requirement was that she attend church on Sunday morning.

We said, school night, you really need to be in by 10 o'clock because you're going to have to get some homework done.

On the weekends, you need to be home by midnight.

Those were our rules.

And she just started not coming home at all at night or coming home at two or three in the morning.

My problem was that the only people that I knew were the people I had met in that, in the jail.

I'm bored.

I need someone to hang out with.

And slowly that kind of takes you down the wrong path.

Where did this wrong path lead you?

You know, maybe there was a little drugs involved here and there.

Just ripping and running.

After Abby was not coming home for several days on end, we told her we would change the locks if she didn't come home.

She didn't.

So we changed the locks.

I would say in the end I just left.

It was really hard.

I really considered Abby to be the daughter of my heart.

We let her see a family that cared for each other, that didn't rob banks.

But

it just seems like the more I reflect on it, I feel like she just wasn't ready for it.

People think leaving prison, hallelujah, you're out, you're free, it's a new life, but people don't understand that's a whole different set of challenges trying to reintegrate back into society.

Abby ends up in Laredo, Texas.

She gets a job driving a pilot car for wide loads.

Laredo is a border town 150 miles south of San Antonio.

Thousands upon thousands of trucks go by there every day.

And that's where you met Ricardo Gonzalez, right?

Yeah.

A little eye roll there.

Yeah.

Why?

Because I'm just going to say he's just not a good person.

When you look at Ricardo's rap sheet, which is really quite long, one after another arrests.

He's got convictions for theft, aggravated robbery, terroristic threat of a family.

We all hung out and partied.

Can I ask what that means?

Because I'm

not going to know what that means anymore.

Partied, you know, there's, well, obviously alcohol and maybe some cocaine and, you know, some weed, stuff like that.

Whatever.

I don't have another choice.

You know, that's kind of how I felt.

Oh, I don't have have another choice.

We'll see where this goes.

Where did it go?

Jail.

It's 1.30 a.m.

in August 2016, and Abby goes with Ricardo Gonzalez to a Stripes gas station in Laredo.

I was high, passed out.

I had parked at the Stripes while he was going to put gas in the car.

And I ended up falling asleep right away.

What happens?

Next thing, I was woken up by the police knocking on my window, pulled me out of the car and onto the ground and um handcuffed me.

So they say, Do you realize that he's over here robbing people in the store?

And

I said,

No, I didn't realize that.

I'm sorry.

She ends up in the car with a guy who allegedly holds somebody at gunpoint.

Well, that's clearly a parole violation.

Clearly, she's back in trouble again.

Come on, wow, deja vu, All over again.

Ricardo pleads not guilty to aggravated robbery, and his trial is scheduled this fall.

Abby is never indicted for the holdup at the gas station.

However, she has violated her parole.

She had not been regularly reporting to her parole officer for the previous crime, and she gets held in this jail for over a year.

When you're sitting in that jail in Laredo, did you think about Sheriff Nels and you know you had promised him that you'd stay on track?

Of course.

Didn't that go through your mind?

Of course.

And not just him, but everybody that that was involved.

And myself too.

I was disappointed in myself just as much as everybody else was disappointed in me.

But it's always better to be in jail than it is to be dead.

Did you ever think growing up that that's the kind of thing that you would say to yourself in your head?

It's better to be in jail than being dead?

Oh no,

I would always say I would never go to jail.

What happened was reality.

It's not an easy fix, but going back to a behavior that is inappropriate is really just part of the long healing process.

The person who has set all of this in motion, Scott Kat, declined to do another interview with us.

But Abby says that she has visited him in prison and still forgives him.

I think sometimes I blame myself

more than him.

But he invited you to go on a bank heist.

I know he loves me.

I know he loves me as his daughter.

So it's hard sometimes to really get what happened.

How often do you think about your brother?

Every day.

Every day.

Yeah.

Both of them every day.

I'm definitely waiting on them to get out.

If you could send a message to Hayden, what would you say?

I love you.

Anything else?

No, just I love you.

Waiting on him to come home for sure.

Waiting on Hayden to come home.

I just want him to be okay when he gets out because I know how hard it was for me.

Just worry about him.

Because he's really got to be strong when he gets out.

He has no idea.

He has to be so strong.

Life out here is just different from in there.

Light after our interview with Abby, we got a chance to bring her together again with Sheriff Troy Nels, who tried so hard to help her after her first arrest.

I want to have an opportunity to say a few things to her.

Now turning into the small road that leads to this prison in the middle of looks like prairie land

It's been about six years since I last saw Hayden.

He had just taken a plea deal for a 10-year prison sentence and I'm here to see how he's doing behind bars

Hayden.

Hey.

Hey, how are you?

Good.

How you doing?

Good.

You're looking good.

Thank you.

Very tan?

Been working outside.

Feel good.

How's things?

Great, actually.

Really?

Yes, sir.

I mean, last time we spoke, about almost six years ago,

you said that you expected prison to be as close to hell on earth as anything you can imagine.

Yeah.

Doesn't seem like it's been that.

Not at all.

You know, I came in here very lost, very broken.

And here I found a piece that was missing.

I found a faith, a faith in Christ.

I feel more free and I feel more alive in here than I did out in the world.

And I see now that I was basically the walking dead out there.

You know, in many ways, your father was with you but abandoned you.

Still, the last time we spoke, you were pretty forgiving of him.

Do you feel the same way now?

I do.

You know, I think that he did the best job with me and Abby that he could.

He lost his way, that's for sure.

Have you been in contact with him?

Usually every week, due to our letters.

What do you talk about?

I think that he's found the same faith and redemption that I have here as well.

Do you really think he's changed?

I do.

What about Abby?

Have you kept up with your sister?

You know, I don't hear from Abby as much as I would like to, but I love her so much.

And I can't wait to show her what these six years have meant to me.

Do you think that Abby can turn her life around?

Absolutely.

The best thing that we have right now is we're both young and we've learned huge life-shattering lessons at a young age.

I really feel like it's put us ahead of our peers.

You feel like you're ahead of your peers?

Absolutely.

So in the next three years, I'll be going home and I can't wait for it.

I'm going to attack life with everything I got.

As for Abby's future, there is big news in her life.

She's now 25 years old, and she went to work in a fish processing plant.

There, she met her now-boyfriend, Trenzel, and they're now expecting a baby.

Look at that!

It's amazing!

Do we know the gender?

Oh boy.

I'm six and a half months pregnant currently with my first child.

Everything changes once you find out you're pregnant, but you can't be selfish anymore, that's for sure.

I think she's going to be a very wonderful mother.

Too easy, probably.

I don't go to the store to buy myself things anymore.

I go to the store to buy him things, and that feels so awesome.

That's cool.

We had a chance to reunite Abby with the sheriff who helped her years ago.

Can I give you love?

I just want to see a bright future for you.

I just wanted to tell you, I thank you for everything that you have done for me.

Obviously, I let a lot of people down, and

I apologize to you if I thought it was embarrassing to you.

I learned from it all, and I came out a stronger woman, and I thank you for believing in me then and believing in me now.

Abby's aunt has invited Abby to live with her once her baby's born.

You seem to have had so many chances, right?

With Sheriff Nels, with Susie.

What makes you think it's going to actually be different this time?

My son and my relationship.

Those are two things that I can't lose.

So

that's it.

You're saying the stakes are too high this time?

Yeah, I have too much.

There's two people that need me.

You start to put your life into perspective and and like the person you are and the people you want to be around.

And

now we just have our son and he's going to be with us and that's all we need.

Thanks for listening to the 2020 True Crime Vault.

We hope you'll join us Friday nights at 9 on ABC for all new broadcast episodes.

See you then.

You've seen the headline, heard the debates.

The three-point ball has created a monotonous rhythm to the game, and others has the three-pointer ruined basketball.

And how did we get here?

The rise of the three-point shot can be partially traced to an eccentric Kansas genius named Martin Manley, whose story didn't turn out quite the way he imagined.

I decided I wanted to have one of the most organized goodbyes in history.

30 for 30 podcasts presents Chasing Basketball Heaven, available now wherever you get your podcasts.