EP 16 - Chelsea

Transcript

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Speaker 48 There were no red flags I could have seen with Eric. On paper, he seemed like the perfect therapist.

Speaker 48 I shared things with them

Speaker 48 I have never said out loud.

Speaker 48 And I am looking at a photo of his face

Speaker 48 being charged with the exact same things that had traumatized me.

Speaker 44 I'm Andrea Gunning, and this is Betrayal, a show about the people we trust the most and the deceptions that change everything.

Speaker 44 This is Chelsea's story. Chelsea has a high-profile career.
So for this episode, all the names have been changed to protect her anonymity.

Speaker 48 I really hope that one day

Speaker 48 I will be in a place where

Speaker 48 I can present myself publicly and say, look, this is me. This is my real name.
This is where I'm really from.

Speaker 44 Chelsea's been through more abuse than anyone should have to experience. As a child, she was trafficked by her parents.

Speaker 44 She says that her experience wasn't like the movies, where she was kidnapped and held against her will. Instead, her mother brought her to adults' homes who groomed and sexually abused her.

Speaker 44 At the time, her mom worked for a man who was later charged with multiple counts of child sexual abuse. Chelsea knew she needed to get away from home for good.

Speaker 48 Education was my escape from home. I got scholarships.
I was an amazing student.

Speaker 48 I went to every opportunity I could find for any sort of out-of-the-home program, whether that was camps, whether that was college courses over the summer.

Speaker 48 I used education as my way out.

Speaker 44 She got a scholarship to college and stopped talking to her parents. The further away she got from home, the angrier she became about the abuse she experienced as a child.

Speaker 48 And then there are all those feelings of betrayal of like, what were all of these adults doing? Was there no responsible adult in my life?

Speaker 44 In order to survive, Chelsea focused on building her own life. And outside of home, she not only survived, she excelled.
She got an advanced degree and began a highly competitive, successful career.

Speaker 44 And she threw herself into work.

Speaker 44 She says that on the outside, it looked like she had it all together. But on the inside, it was a different story.

Speaker 48 I was a scared little child walking around in like an optimist prime suit.

Speaker 48 I think anyone meeting me on the outside just thought, wow, that person has it all together. Like, that person is invincible, indestructible.

Speaker 48 Meanwhile, I was just dying on the inside.

Speaker 44 She got married after college, but quickly realized she needed to work on herself and her trauma before she could invest in a successful marriage.

Speaker 48 My ex-husband and I

Speaker 48 were

Speaker 48 very amicably splitting up.

Speaker 48 And also during that time, I was starting to confront some of these things that had happened to me when I was younger that were negatively impacting the way I was able to show up in relationships.

Speaker 44 She started working with a therapist online, processing the abuses from her childhood. And around the same time, she reconnected with an old friend who we're going to call James.

Speaker 48 James began reaching out.

Speaker 48 He had also gone through a breakup and we were kind of just processing this idea of us both having this rebirth of rediscovering ourselves after a long-term relationship.

Speaker 44 She and James started talking every day. After a few months, she realized that there was something there we wanted to explore.

Speaker 48 It just felt like he was this person who was there the entire time, right under my nose.

Speaker 44 James really saw her and met her where she was emotionally.

Speaker 48 One of the things that really drew me to him was just how focused he was on my emotions. It felt really wonderful and it felt really safe and really attentive.

Speaker 48 And he just had such an incredible way of viewing the world and was also just very cultured in a way that I hadn't experienced.

Speaker 44 He gave her access to a world Chelsea idealized, a community of artists who expanded her worldview.

Speaker 48 James had this like whole artistic side to him. Like he was a visual artist.

Speaker 48 His medium was kind of like social commentary, photography, but not your typical photography, like a lot of like distortions of images. And I just really appreciated him as an artist.

Speaker 44 James came from a wealthy family. and he had inherited a large real estate portfolio.

Speaker 44 It meant his schedule was flexible and he had a lot of disposable income.

Speaker 48 So, for their third date, I remember him standing there and just saying, This might sound crazy, but are you doing anything for Thanksgiving? I was like, No, I'm not.

Speaker 48 I'm estranged from most of my family, so holidays are always kind of a weird time. And he's like, I'm kind of doing a solo thing in New York City.
Would you want to fly out with me?

Speaker 48 And

Speaker 48 I was like, Why not? Let's do this.

Speaker 48 Our third date was this week-long trip in New York City where he planned everything.

Speaker 48 And it was Peter Luger's steakhouse and amazing seats at some jazz venue and going and seeing a Broadway production. I've only been to New York once before.
It was really amazing.

Speaker 48 He was just showing me New York, and it was pretty incredible.

Speaker 44 After their week-long third date, they became a couple.

Speaker 44 They lived a few hours apart. So on the weekends, they'd go to each other's cities, where James planned elaborate outings.

Speaker 48 James was really into arts and culture, so we would go to museums and see different musicians or plays, and it was really fun.

Speaker 48 Everything just happened so fast. It felt like out of a fairy tale.

Speaker 44 These dates quickly progressed into a relationship. And Chelsea says that above all, being with him felt so easy, so right.

Speaker 48 And that was something we would always say together. This just seemed so easy.

Speaker 44 One of Chelsea's friends was married to James's best friend. So, right away, they had a community together.
But that also meant Chelsea's friend had seen James in prior relationships.

Speaker 48 She did warn me early on that he had a history of,

Speaker 48 she described it as being selfish.

Speaker 44 Early on, Chelsea saw a little bit of that, but she didn't necessarily necessarily see it as selfish. It was more overbearing.

Speaker 48 He was very concerned about my sexual history, frequently asking questions about the identity of my prior partners, the number of prior partners I'd had.

Speaker 44 He would ask to go through her phone. She hated that, and it gave her pause about the relationship.
So she addressed it with him directly. His reply made her feel better.

Speaker 48 He said that he started therapy and became very open

Speaker 48 about his efforts to try to address his insecurities.

Speaker 48 He started telling me about this therapist he started seeing, and it meant a lot for me to hear this level of accountability from someone.

Speaker 48 So I was willing to continue to try to explore something with James.

Speaker 44 Because they both believed in therapy, they started couples' counseling together. It was only three months into the relationship, but they both wanted to improve their communication and connection.

Speaker 48 I was at this place in my life where I was very vulnerable, but also energized to do the work to heal myself.

Speaker 48 And to have James reflect that back to me was

Speaker 48 really significant.

Speaker 48 I was dealing with a lot of personal sexual dysfunction as a result of digging into my own trauma history and he was very open to hearing about my boundaries.

Speaker 48 He was very open to try to make our sexual connection a safe place.

Speaker 32 He

Speaker 48 had his own sexual dysfunctions so that was something that we were able to talk about openly.

Speaker 48 And this was the first relationship I had been in where I was aware of those things for myself and I was communicating with them and he was very receptive to that and that made me feel very safe.

Speaker 44 They were communicating better than ever. They were still long distance, but James began staying at her place more often.

Speaker 48 So James had a key to my house pretty early.

Speaker 48 I worked really long and crazy hours, so I wanted him to have a key so he could just let himself in and out and had a dog at the time and he and the dog had really bonded and it was nice to have him around.

Speaker 44 When When the pandemic started in 2020, their lives officially merged.

Speaker 48 Neither one of us wanted to be alone through that.

Speaker 48 And suddenly, five months into dating,

Speaker 48 James and I went from living a few hours away to we were living together

Speaker 48 and

Speaker 48 me working within 20 feet of him at all times.

Speaker 44 Now, quarantining together with Chelsea working from home, James's controlling behavior returned. As the couple grew closer, James couldn't hide his jealous side.

Speaker 44 He became more controlling about who she was talking to and why.

Speaker 48 I work in a fairly male-dominated industry, so most of my colleagues and my team were men.

Speaker 48 And James was constantly fixated on who I was talking to. He would always ask, what's their story? And I'd say, what does that mean? They'd say, are they married?

Speaker 48 It's like, well, I think so, but what does it, what does it matter? They work for me.

Speaker 44 He became almost paranoid, and Chelsea wasn't having it.

Speaker 48 And I was getting more confident in standing up for my own boundaries around my communication with other people.

Speaker 48 And frankly, I was just getting sick and tired of feeling constantly monitored by this person.

Speaker 44 One day, they got into a heated argument about his behavior. He insisted on going through her phone.

Speaker 28 She refused and locked herself in the bedroom.

Speaker 44 That's when things escalated even further.

Speaker 48 James, from the other side of the door, told me that if I did not come out and speak to him, and if I did not give him full access to my phone, he was going to distribute private images of me to my coworkers.

Speaker 44 They were photos from early on in their relationship. Photos James said he would delete.

Speaker 48 I spoke to him to the door and was like, you said you deleted those. And he said, well, I didn't.
I lied to you about that.

Speaker 48 He went on to say, they meant a lot to me. You're just so beautiful.
And I wanted to keep them.

Speaker 48 And I was

Speaker 48 livid that he had violated that trust. I was sick of it.
The fact that he had just told me that he had images that he didn't have consent to was enough.

Speaker 48 I wanted his phone, so I stepped outside that door, I grabbed his phone, I went back inside my bedroom, and I locked the door.

Speaker 48 And I went into it, went back through our messages, found the images, and deleted them.

Speaker 48 And on an iPhone, it's not enough to delete them, you then have to go to the deleted folder and delete them from there.

Speaker 48 So when I was going to the deleted folder,

Speaker 48 right below the deleted items,

Speaker 48 There's a folder called the hidden folder.

Speaker 48 And I'm seeing all sorts of things in this folder.

Speaker 48 I don't really know how to grasp what I'm seeing, and I can feel myself

Speaker 48 start to leave my own body,

Speaker 48 and I can feel myself start to just float away because what I am seeing, I just cannot comprehend.

Speaker 48 And while I'm holding this phone in my left hand, I take my phone in my right and I just start recording.

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Speaker 6 But here's the plot twist. It's not your fault.

Speaker 13 When the alarm goes off, you drink and it's like flipping a switch.

Speaker 19 There's clean, natural caffeine, mood-lifting nootropics, and a supercharged electrolyte blend to combat dehydration.

Speaker 29 Discover how good it feels to rise and grind on your own terms.

Speaker 30 Visit clubearlybird.com and use code BETRAL for 20% off.

Speaker 33 Tired of spills and stains on your sofa? Wash away your worries with Anibay. Anibay is the only machine-washable sofa inside and out where designer quality meets budget-friendly prices.

Speaker 33 That's right, sofas start at just $699.

Speaker 33 Enjoy a no-risk experience with pet-friendly, stain-resistant, and changeable slip covers made with performance fabric.

Speaker 33 Experience cloud-like comfort with high-resilience foam that's hypoallergenic and never needs fluffing. The sturdy steel frame ensures longevity, and the modular pieces can be rearranged anytime.

Speaker 33 Shop washable sofas.com for early Black Friday savings up to 60% off site-wide, backed by a 30-day satisfaction guarantee. If you're not absolutely in love, send it back for a full refund.

Speaker 33 No return shipping or restocking fees, every penny back. Upgrade now at washable sofas.com.
Offers are subject to change and certain restrictions may apply.

Speaker 40 Pendo Agent Analytics is the first tool to connect agent prompts and conversations to downstream outcomes like time saved, so you know what's working and what to fix.

Speaker 42 That's pendo.io/slash podcast.

Speaker 44 Chelsea thought she and her boyfriend James were on the right track, going to individual and couples therapy, working towards a healthy relationship.

Speaker 44 But during the pandemic, James's controlling behavior took a dark turn when he threatened to release nude pictures of Chelsea to her colleagues.

Speaker 1 Pictures he said he got rid of.

Speaker 44 When she went into his phone to delete the photos herself, she discovered another folder on his photo app, the hidden folder, which exists on every iPhone, by the way.

Speaker 44 It's right next to the deleted folder.

Speaker 48 The first thing I noticed was a series of photographs of Mayacondo, where it looked like he was documenting or spying on me.

Speaker 48 That kind of triggered this, oh shit, what the fuck am I looking at? feeling.

Speaker 48 It looked like he had maybe gone through rooms, placed objects in certain places to see if they were moved between when he was leaving or coming back and forth, and they had date stamps on them.

Speaker 48 So that was really strange.

Speaker 44 She kept scrolling through the folder, which had hundreds of images in it.

Speaker 48 There were whole collections of nude photos of different women.

Speaker 44 She recognized some of these women. There were photos of his best friend's wife, the one that was Chelsea's friend, the one that had warned her about James's selfish tendencies.

Speaker 48 I'm like,

Speaker 48 God, that looks like her.

Speaker 48 But why would he have naked photos of his best friend's wife? Why would he have these?

Speaker 44 Right away, she called her.

Speaker 48 I was like, I remember you had a tattoo on your ankle. Which ankle is it on?

Speaker 48 And she told me, and I was like, he has photos of you.

Speaker 48 And she was just like, that's not possible. I have never, never, never.
And I was like, no, I don't think you sent these to him. I don't think you sent them.

Speaker 44 Chelsea sent her friend the photos and she confirmed that, yes. They were photos her husband had taken of her, but she didn't know he shared them with anyone, much less James.

Speaker 48 And you could just hear like

Speaker 48 the breath come out of her, and she says, I'm going to talk to my husband.

Speaker 44 Before she hung up, she asked her friend.

Speaker 48 I'm like, there's all sorts of other women in here. Do you know any of these women? And she did.

Speaker 48 She did. A lot of these were the wives of James's friends.
It appeared that James and his male friend group were exchanging these intimate photos with each other.

Speaker 44 As Chelsea kept looking through James's hidden folder, she found something even more disturbing.

Speaker 48 The other category of images that he had

Speaker 48 on this phone were

Speaker 48 dozens of photos of children,

Speaker 48 young children,

Speaker 32 two,

Speaker 48 four, six years old children.

Speaker 48 They were like little girls in bathing suits. And

Speaker 48 I don't know if he was taking these at some public park. I don't know if he was taking these off of social media sites, if some well-meaning parent was posting something.

Speaker 44 Her mind was racing. Who were these girls? And then she found one particular photo.

Speaker 20 The photo.

Speaker 44 The one she'd never be able to unsee.

Speaker 48 The moment I looked at that photo, I knew something was

Speaker 48 fucking wrong. Something was absolutely wrong.

Speaker 44 Chelsea disclosed what she saw in detail. It's too disturbing to share here, but what she discovered, she clearly believed was CSAM or child sexual abuse material with a girl's face cropped out.

Speaker 48 Everything in me just told me,

Speaker 48 especially in the context of where this was kept with all of the other images, I was like, this is 100%

Speaker 48 something he is sexually interested in. And

Speaker 48 I did not know how to handle that.

Speaker 44 She was having an out-of-body experience looking at these photos.

Speaker 44 But at the same time, she was still in her apartment with James on the other side of the door, screaming for his phone back.

Speaker 48 I'm just like, I can't do that. You threatened me.
Can't do that.

Speaker 48 And he can tell by my voice. He can tell.
And I open the door and I tell him you need to leave.

Speaker 48 I've seen something.

Speaker 44 Scared of him and unsure of what to do next, she gave him back the phone. She didn't tell him that she recorded anything.
So he left in a rage and Chelsea quickly locked the door behind him.

Speaker 48 But then he spends the entire drive back

Speaker 48 calling me

Speaker 48 over and over and over again

Speaker 48 and yelling. and raging and saying, I'm going to turn you into the police.
You took something from my phone. What you just did is illegal.

Speaker 48 You better delete everything. And I was just like, look, I'm not talking about this.
I'm not talking about it. I'm not talking about it.
And finally, I just turned my phone off and I tried to sleep.

Speaker 44 When she woke up, her first thought was that picture, the one with the child's face cropped out.

Speaker 48 My mind went in a million directions. as to why he would have this, but I couldn't identify who the kid was.
Did someone take this photo and then he just somehow found it? Or did he take it?

Speaker 44 Day after day, the photo was all she could think about.

Speaker 44 She talked with an attorney and described the image, but he confirmed one of her fears that the image might not meet the standards needed for an arrest. It was right on the edge.

Speaker 44 A month after the discovery, James agreed to a joint counseling session. They hadn't seen each other or talked since their fight.

Speaker 44 Chelsea wanted the the support of a mandated reporter, and she wanted to confront him there in a neutral environment to see if he'd confess to more.

Speaker 44 On top of all that, she was also trying to understand something that was just incomprehensible.

Speaker 48 This is part of my trauma too. My go-to coping mechanism is denial and rationalization.

Speaker 48 And I think I wanted a reason for this not to be what I thought it was.

Speaker 44 It might sound naive, but part of her her still couldn't believe this was real. She started by asking James about the photos of his friend's wives.

Speaker 48 I said, Why do you have these? Do you have permission to have these? Did she know and consent to having these photos?

Speaker 48 He looked at me and he said, I don't need her consent.

Speaker 48 It's his property. He took that photo.
It's his property to share with me.

Speaker 48 And I wanted to puke hearing that.

Speaker 44 It was clear that he had thought about this extensively and that he knew how to operate just under the radar.

Speaker 44 Finally, at the end of their session, she asked about the photos of children and that one photo in particular.

Speaker 48 And so

Speaker 48 in the presence of the couple's counselor,

Speaker 48 I pulled out my phone. And I showed him that image and I said, what the fuck is this?

Speaker 48 When I handed the phone to him with the child image, the tension in that room was just, it was wild. You saw him immediately start to shake.
His hands started shaking. He immediately said,

Speaker 48 that is not a crime. There is no penetration.
That is not illegal.

Speaker 48 He just kept repeating that.

Speaker 48 He instantly just went into, she stole things off of my phone. I'm going to prosecute her for that.

Speaker 48 And at that point, he just said, I'm going to have to go talk to my attorney about your theft of information from my phone. And he left.
Just got out and left.

Speaker 29 She sat there stunned.

Speaker 44 Chelsea and the therapist sat in silence as they waited for James's car to leave the parking lot.

Speaker 44 Why did he even bother to come that day?

Speaker 44 Chelsea has a theory.

Speaker 48 Looking back, I think he was trying to figure out what I knew because he knew I found something and he didn't know what I knew. And I think he was doing this to try to protect himself.

Speaker 44 Her relationship with James was over, but it was only the beginning of a horrible dilemma for Chelsea.

Speaker 44 She grappled with reporting him to the police, but she was worried that she didn't have enough evidence.

Speaker 48 I felt like what I had wasn't going to be enough. This is right on the cusp.
And if I report James,

Speaker 48 what is going to happen to me?

Speaker 44 Chelsea was afraid of James's wealthy, well-connected family. She was also thinking of the legal threats he made and the threats about releasing photos of her.

Speaker 44 But more than that, she was afraid to report and have nothing happen at all. It took her back to the way she felt as a child.

Speaker 48 When I saw these images on James's phone, it took me back to being

Speaker 48 those children.

Speaker 48 And it was so hard not to think

Speaker 48 about what those children might have been experiencing if they were being abused. And I can report this person to the police, but is anything going to happen?

Speaker 48 And can I emotionally handle that? Can I emotionally handle having nothing happen as a result of it? Because unfortunately, that was the childhood thing that was playing out.

Speaker 44 I understand where Chelsea is coming from. If you've listened to season two of Betrayal, you heard Ashley Lytton's story of how her husband had over 1,000 images of CSAM in his hidden folder.

Speaker 44 But he served less than a year. These cases are wildly underprosecuted.
And with only one image as evidence, Chelsea's concerns were valid or rather realistic.

Speaker 44 But that didn't change her feeling of moral obligation to the girl in the photo and victims like her.

Speaker 48 My biggest priority at that point was protecting this particular little girl.

Speaker 44 She knew if she was going to report James, she needed professional support to get there.

Speaker 48 I knew I was going to need a lot of therapy, and that's how I met Eric.

Speaker 44 Eric was a therapist who checked all the boxes and then some.

Speaker 44 In fact, he'd been a prosecutor on sex crimes before he went into counseling.

Speaker 48 There were no red flags I could have seen with Eric.

Speaker 48 On paper, he seemed like the perfect therapist.

Speaker 44 But she would soon find out he wasn't.

Speaker 29 Discover how good it feels to rise and grind on your own terms.

Speaker 30 Visit clubearlybird.com and use code betrayal for 20% off.

Speaker 33 Tired of spills and stains on your sofa? Wash away your worries with Anibay. Anibay is the only machine-washable sofa inside and out where designer quality meets budget-friendly prices.

Speaker 33 That's right, sofas start at just $699.

Speaker 33 Enjoy a no-risk experience with pet-friendly, stain-resistant, and changeable slip covers made with performance fabric.

Speaker 33 Experience cloud-like comfort with high-resilience foam that's hypoallergenic and never needs fluffing. The sturdy steel frame ensures longevity, and the modular pieces can be rearranged anytime.

Speaker 33 Shop washable sofas.com for early Black Friday savings, up to 60% off site-wide, backed by a 30-day satisfaction guarantee. If you're not absolutely in love, send it back for a full refund.

Speaker 33 No return shipping or restocking fees. Every penny back.
Upgrade now at washable sofas.com. Offers are subject to change and certain restrictions may apply.

Speaker 40 Pendo Agent Analytics is the first tool to connect agent prompts and conversations to downstream outcomes like time saved so you know what's working and what to fix.

Speaker 42 That's pendo.io/slash podcast.

Speaker 44 Chelsea began working with a therapist for going to call Eric. And quickly, Eric became a big part of her life.
She started seeing him three times a week.

Speaker 48 I felt like I was coming into into that scenario with my guts pulled out.

Speaker 48 It was just like,

Speaker 48 what do I do with all this?

Speaker 44 She was working up to being able to report her ex James, and she needed a safe place like Eric's office to process her trauma, starting with her childhood abuse.

Speaker 48 Working with Eric, he was able to help me accept some of these bigger terms that I was uncomfortable with.

Speaker 44 Terms like trafficking and incest.

Speaker 48 Like, is this the right term?

Speaker 48 I started seeing Eric to have that space to unpack the sexual abuse trauma

Speaker 48 and was just very early stages of unpacking that.

Speaker 44 At the same time, she was haunted by the images she'd seen on James's phone. It became all-consuming.

Speaker 48 I couldn't close my eyes at night and not see these children.

Speaker 48 I just kept fixating on who is this child.

Speaker 44 Because Eric had been a prosecutor, she trusted his perspective. And Eric wasn't so sure she should report James.
In fact, he worried she was taking on too much personal responsibility.

Speaker 48 And one thing Eric would tell me all the time was Chelsea,

Speaker 48 you can't solve this. You are not.
Batman. You can't figure this out.

Speaker 44 Since they broke up, James deleted all of his social media. She heard through the grapevine, he was saying he'd been hacked.
But Chelsea suspected it could be related to what she saw on his phone.

Speaker 44 She worried that while she waited to report him, he could be deleting or destroying evidence. And Eric helped her understand the pathology of people like James.

Speaker 48 Eric would talk to me about these types of individuals, these types of predators. He would talk about their behaviors.

Speaker 48 His exact quote was, every once in a while, they freak out and purge, but they eventually go back to doing it.

Speaker 44 After two months of working with Eric, Chelsea felt ready to report James. She began to see it as the only way out.

Speaker 48 I thought that maybe if I could face these things now, maybe that would make the nightmares of the kids stop.

Speaker 32 But Eric dug in.

Speaker 44 He still wasn't sure reporting was the right decision for Chelsea.

Speaker 48 When I started saying that I really felt like I needed to turn James in,

Speaker 48 Eric was encouraging me not to.

Speaker 48 He said I needed to let go of the relationship.

Speaker 44 Eric felt like Chelsea wasn't properly grieving and moving on from her relationship with James, and that by fixating on these photos, she was trying to stay connected to him somehow.

Speaker 44 One night, it just hit her.

Speaker 44 She knew who the girl in the photo could be.

Speaker 48 This image that's been haunting me, there's no face.

Speaker 48 But the ages are the right ages.

Speaker 44 James did have a friend with two young daughters. Chelsea hadn't put those pieces together before.
So she did some internet sleuthing.

Speaker 48 I turned Facebook on.

Speaker 48 I went on these parents' Facebook profile and couldn't believe what I saw.

Speaker 48 I was like, that's it. It's got to be this kid.

Speaker 48 The ages are the right age. The cabinetry looks the same.
It's like in these photos that are showing up. I'm full-on Facebook detective at this point.

Speaker 48 This could be that same house, same wall color, same cabinets. This has got to be it.

Speaker 44 James had access to these kids.

Speaker 25 If this was the girl in the photo, reporting him felt more urgent than ever.

Speaker 44 Despite Eric's advice, Chelsea had made up her mind.

Speaker 48 I called my lawyer. I'm like, I gotta report this.

Speaker 48 And he helped set up a meeting with a detective in the town that James lived, who was the head of the Internet Crimes Against Children Task Force.

Speaker 48 And we set up a meeting for that following Monday.

Speaker 44 After she set the meeting, she went to her regular therapy appointment with Eric, and she felt empowered.

Speaker 48 I remember sitting there with Eric saying, things are going to change. I'm going to identify.
I'm going to know. The next time I'm in a room with a person like this, I'm going to know.

Speaker 48 I'm going to know it. I'm going to know everything about this person.
I'm going to be able to pick them out of a room.

Speaker 32 And I remember

Speaker 48 Eric was really uncomfortable.

Speaker 44 Eric ended her session early that day. Chelsea planned to prepare for the meeting with police in her next therapy session.

Speaker 48 And I remember going to his office and I was hyped. Like I had my narrative partially written.
I was like, I'm going to do this.

Speaker 22 But on the day of that therapy session, Eric wasn't there.

Speaker 48 He was never late.

Speaker 48 I usually, when I pulled in, I would park next to his car.

Speaker 48 The car wasn't wasn't there.

Speaker 48 10 minutes go by.

Speaker 48 I'm looking at the receptionist. They're like, this is really weird.
We can't get a hold of him.

Speaker 48 And she's calling. She's like, the phone's going straight to voicemail.
I don't understand what's happening.

Speaker 48 They said, we're going to get another clinician. Just please wait.

Speaker 44 This was her last session before she finally went to the police. She really needed guidance.
So another therapist from the practice agreed to see Chelsea that day.

Speaker 48 And I was like, something is is wrong. Eric is never late.
Our last session was kind of weird. I felt like maybe I made him uncomfortable.
And I could tell by the way she was responding to me too.

Speaker 48 She was like, something's not right either. I could sense it.
And I started telling her what happened. I was like, this is what I've been dealing with.
Eric was telling me not to do it.

Speaker 48 Like, I needed to like grieve this relationship, that doing this was just going to like let it perpetuate on. I wasn't going to need a closure.
She's like, no, you're doing the right thing.

Speaker 48 You're doing the right thing.

Speaker 44 After that session, she finally reported James.

Speaker 48 That Monday morning, I got up, I met with the detective, and we had a three-hour recorded interview. I showed him everything, told him the same story that I'm telling you now.

Speaker 48 He was so validating.

Speaker 48 And he said, he told me, he's like,

Speaker 48 This isn't contraband, but it is absolutely wrong. And you are doing absolutely the right thing by reporting it.

Speaker 48 But I want to manage your expectations.

Speaker 48 There are things I can try to do, but this by itself isn't enough.

Speaker 48 And I was like, I know.

Speaker 48 That's why it's taken me so long to get here.

Speaker 44 At the end of their meeting, the detective assured her that they'd do everything they could. She left the station relieved.
It had been a difficult and draining day, but the day was far from over.

Speaker 48 So I got my car, went back home to where I lived. I have been in my house for less than 15 minutes.
I've literally walked in the door, gone to the bathroom, opened a LaCroix.

Speaker 44 And then she saw an email come in from her therapist's office.

Speaker 48 And it says I'm receiving this letter because I'm a client of Eric's.

Speaker 48 and that they were notified that he was arrested and that he was immediately terminated and they were reaching out to me to facilitate continued care.

Speaker 48 One of the last things it says is: any questions related to the status of Eric may be directed towards, and they provide a detective's name and the phone number, and I'm like, oh

Speaker 48 my God.

Speaker 48 I already knew.

Speaker 48 Everything in my body knew what had happened.

Speaker 44 She went to the court records website and typed in Eric's name.

Speaker 48 I see possession of child pornography.

Speaker 48 I am looking at this mugshot

Speaker 48 of this person.

Speaker 48 And this is a person I have just spent the last several months with.

Speaker 48 In the most

Speaker 48 intimate and trusting of a relationship, I shared things with this person

Speaker 48 I have never said out loud before.

Speaker 48 And I am looking at a photo of his face

Speaker 48 being charged with the exact same things that had traumatized me.

Speaker 48 Just sat there staring at the screen, just feeling like I wanted to tear my skin off.

Speaker 48 Thinking about every detail

Speaker 48 I told this person

Speaker 48 and then thinking that they were sexually aroused by these things.

Speaker 44 Then she pulled up the police report. And what she read there was a nightmare.

Speaker 48 They seized all of his electronic equipment. They found thousands.
of videos and the descriptions

Speaker 48 are horrific.

Speaker 44 She replayed all the things he'd said in sessions with her.

Speaker 48 Then thinking about all of those things he told me about how a predator would behave. I'm like, he was telling me about his own behavior and I started vomiting.

Speaker 44 The person she'd turned to in this situation would be a therapist.

Speaker 48 I didn't know what to do next. There were so many layers of things I had to process.
I could not have told this story to a worse person.

Speaker 44 For the first time in her life, she took a leave of absence from work.

Speaker 48 When Eric got arrested, I just hit an emotional rock bottom and I realized my coping mechanisms don't work anymore. I can't outperform this.

Speaker 44 During this time, mental health was her main priority. She started group therapy, which proved to be healing.

Speaker 48 I needed a room of people to say, that's fucked up.

Speaker 48 That shouldn't happen.

Speaker 48 I needed to see that outrage from someone. And what we called it in my program, this reality checking.

Speaker 48 You need the validation.

Speaker 48 Oh, like, wow, this feels really wrong. Would this be wrong to you? And people are like, yeah, that would be really wrong.

Speaker 44 While she was working on stabilizing herself, she got an update from the police about her report on James. They didn't have enough to arrest him, but the police had done a knock and talk.

Speaker 48 When they told him that someone observed a concerning image of a child on his phone, he said, it didn't come from my phone, and if it did, it wasn't illegal. And then this is the really telling thing.

Speaker 48 He asked the police officer if they're prosecuting me for taking stuff off of his phone.

Speaker 44 As far as Chelsea knows, that's the only outcome of her report.

Speaker 48 So to this day, this guy will stand out there and scream that he was in this relationship with this crazy woman who's trying to ruin his life. And,

Speaker 48 you know, that I was the bad guy.

Speaker 44 As for Eric, he pled guilty to distributing child sexual abuse material and was sentenced to 12 years in federal prison. That same year, Chelsea decided to move across the country and start over.

Speaker 48 It ended up taking about four years before I was able

Speaker 48 to confidently say that these things happened and not doubt myself, not blame myself,

Speaker 48 not think that this is my fault or my responsibility.

Speaker 48 And today, I'm really proud to say I have created the life I've always dreamed of.

Speaker 48 And I'm glad that every day now going forward is better than any day that I've had before this happened.

Speaker 48 So there's a rebirth in it.

Speaker 44 We end all of our weekly episodes with the same question.

Speaker 44 Why did you choose to tell your story?

Speaker 48 The reason I reached out is I was just so inspired by the stories that were shared. I was so inspired listening to other survivors.

Speaker 48 And the ability to retell this story and release it is so significant.

Speaker 48 And I hope that someone else hearing this feels empowered to do the same. These kinds of things only exist in a world of silence and denial.

Speaker 48 And I hope by breaking my silence,

Speaker 48 it allows someone else to feel empowered to break their own. Whether they got a conviction,

Speaker 48 whether the police took it seriously, whether their abuser acknowledged it, whether their family believed it.

Speaker 48 It doesn't make it your fault.

Speaker 48 It happened.

Speaker 48 And it was never your fault.

Speaker 44 On the next episode of Betrayal.

Speaker 40 This is the first time I was seeing him in four years.

Speaker 50 And I remember being like,

Speaker 48 I am in big trouble.

Speaker 44 If you would like to reach out to the betrayal team or want to tell us your betrayal story, email us at betrayalpod at gmail.com. That's betrayal,

Speaker 44 at gmail.com. We're grateful for your support.
One way to show support is by subscribing to our show on Apple Podcasts.

Speaker 5 And don't forget to rate and review Betrayal.

Speaker 44 Five-star reviews go a long way.

Speaker 2 A big thank you to all of our listeners.

Speaker 44 Betrayal is a production of Glass Podcasts, a division of Glass Entertainment Group in partnership with iHeart Podcasts. The show is executive produced by Nancy Glass and Jennifer Faison.

Speaker 44 Hosted and produced by me, Andrea Gunning. Written and produced by Monique Laborde.
Also produced by Ben Fetterman. Associate producers are Kristen Melcurie and Caitlin Golden.

Speaker 44 Our iHeart team is Allie Perry and Jessica Kreinchek. Audio editing and mixing by Matt Delvecchio.
Additional editing support from Nico Aruka and Tanner Robbins.

Speaker 44 Betrayals theme composed by Oliver Baines. Music library provided by MIBE Music.

Speaker 8 And for more podcasts from iHeart, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Speaker 29 Discover Discover how good it feels to rise and grind on your own terms.

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Speaker 42 That's pendo.io slash podcast.

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