Becoming Brigitte: MK Ultra And The French Gold Rush.

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All right, you guys.

Well, never in a million years did I believe that this investigation would lead us to this moment.

And I am not even referring to the lawsuit.

I'm referring to something much bigger.

Foremost, I should let you guys know that it was announced just three hours ago that the French government has collapsed.

Oh, okay.

Yeah, there it is.

New York Times.

French government collapses again, deepening paralysis.

But I don't want you guys to get distracted because I think it is sort of a distraction a little bit.

They don't want you watching Becoming Brigitte Season 2.

I personally think Emmanuel Macron wants out.

No, instead, they're telling the French people, take to the streets.

I hope by now you guys realize that these decisions, like who is going to be president and when,

those decisions are actually made in a boardroom.

If you don't understand that, then I hope you will by the end of this episode.

So, welcome back to Becoming Brigitte 2.

A lot going on, you guys.

A lot going on.

I want you to take me seriously when I say this, okay?

Seriously, I'm not trying to be funny here.

Brigitte Macrone does not walk right.

She doesn't walk right.

There's a lot that can be discerned from someone's gait.

And I want you guys in this moment to pay close attention to how she walks.

Here is a clip of her walking out of a shopping store in Paris.

Take a look here.

This is slowed down for you.

Just look at the legs, the posture.

It's interesting.

Okay.

And of course, to add to that, the now infamous clip of Brigitte as a drama instructor.

And you can watch the way that she walks, but more importantly, the way that Brigitte sits.

Take a look at this clip.

And yes, it's real.

There's something about the manner that Brigitte is sitting that you look at that as a woman and you go, that's just not the way that women sit, right?

We do not widespread in that manner.

We tend to understand that when you look at that image, you're looking at somebody that is a dude.

But I'm more concerned in that moment of the way that she's sort of wide walking, right?

When you see her coming out of the store,

I would say that that gate in particular is quite military because it's difficult if you have been in the military for a long time to sort of shake that training.

Now, to remind you guys, Jean-Michel Tragneau, Brigitte's quote-unquote brother, has a military file that the government is refusing to release for whatever reason.

It is a pretty long military tenure, and this is when Jean-Michel Tragneau sort of just disappears.

You should also know that what has been confirmed is that he held the rank of sergeant in Germany.

That's really relative.

He held the rank of sergeant in Germany when he was at the Spires Club.

And we can track him.

The most that we can do in terms of tracking Jean-Michel is in large part thanks to Xavier's book.

To recap, I'm going to show you photos of Jean-Michel Trogneau through the years.

Here he is in 1953 in school in Amiens.

We also have the 1954 photo of Jean-Michel in school in Amiens.

And finally, we have that 1955 photo of him in school in Amiens.

Of course, the big photo, the big premiere was seeing him, which was very difficult for Xavier to get his hands on, in 1963.

At the age of 18, he is in engineering school.

But Xavier Poussard reveals in his book that that period, that time that he was at engineering school was a bit complicated.

I want you to think of that period of time as we would in America as a high school.

It's the simplest way to think about that time.

So in 1963, at the age of 18, John Michel should have been awarded his diploma.

Instead, Xavier Poussard discovers that for whatever reason, despite being in that 1963 class photo, Jean-Michel Tragneau hadn't actually graduated.

And there were all sorts of oddities as he was trying to get these files.

I'm going to read you this from his book.

He wrote, quote, the 20-page document shows, and that's he's referring to his school files, that Jean-Michel Tragneau, then aged 18, the age at which typically the diploma is awarded in France, had not attended school for the previous years, the previous three years.

And he had no diploma, not even the BEPC, which is normally awarded at the end of the third year.

Okay, so that's weird.

Where was Jean-Michel Trogneau when he was 15, 16, 17?

He also says that he had so many absences while he was at this school.

Then we fast forward to 1967.

And at the age of 23, we know that Jean-Michel Trogneau is in Germany at that Spire Club again.

I want you to also know that that is in the Rhineland.

Okay, that's the area that caused a lot of drama during World War II, right?

German Rhineland.

We also know, like I said earlier, that he held this rank of sergeants.

But Xavier Poussard, in his book, Becoming Brigitte, is unequivocal about exactly who Jean-Michel Tragneau is.

He wants you to know that Jean-Michel Tragneau becomes Brigitte.

He wrote this, and I quote, Therefore, we can conclude that Jean-Michel Tragneau has been living under the civil birth identity of his sister, Brigitte Tragneau, since at least 1986.

Logically, then, Sebastian, Laurence, and Tiffan Ausier, Brigitte's children, are administratively his nephews.

That's remarkable that he wrote that in the book, because Xavier Poussard was never sued for defamation.

Why is that?

Why hasn't Xavier Poussard, if that is the wrong information, been sued for defamation, he is a French citizen?

That would make the most sense.

That is a clue, you guys, okay?

President Macron, who was panicking at the moment, was unable to really offer an explanation for this lawsuit in America.

He said that it was because the story had become so big in America, they had to do something.

The story had become so big in America that they had to do something.

That, my friends, is another clue.

I'll tell you this, when you panic, you tend to make mistakes.

Even before we had jumped into this series, the Macron's had already sent lawyers.

They had already sent investigators to look into me.

Emmanuel Macron flew to the United States to speak to Trump shortly thereafter.

So we have to ask ourselves, what is it in particular about my voice and my reach within America that has the Élysée Palace so concerned?

While tracing the life of Jean-Michel Tragonaud, Xavier Poussard unwittingly, I think, stumbled upon what is likely to lead us to the truth.

Here is what he wrote in Becoming Brigitte.

He wrote, quote, or asked rather, quote, what did Jean-Michel Tragenau do between June of 1968 and 1973?

Although little is known about this period of his life, Brigitte has always claimed to have watched the 1969 American moon landing on TV from the United States.

Yeah,

the answer is obvious if you're paying attention.

It's that Jean-Michel Tragoneau must have been here in America from 1968 to 1973.

They are panicked because there is something here in the United States that we should have access to.

The Macrones very much needed the investigation into Brigitte's life and background to be contained to France, right?

Because Jean-Michel Tragoneau wasn't in France during those years.

Therefore, it is unlikely that a French journalist could have solved the mystery alone.

Unfortunately for the Macrones, fate would have it that that French journalist Xavier Poussard teamed up with a very persistent Candace Owens.

More panicking, more mistakes from the Elysee Palace.

The lawsuit filing in and of itself was a bad idea, but beyond that, it was sloppy.

MK Ultra, MK Ultra, MK Ultra, MK Ultra, MK Ultra, MK Ultra, MK Ultra, MK Ultra

said 18

times,

dogs do not bark unless they perceive a threat.

So I will quickly remind you that we caught a Jean-Marie Trogneau, I'm thinking this could maybe be Brigitte's father, on a ship in 1961, coming from France, stopping in Canada, and then arriving in Oakland, California.

And it's just our luck that that particular ship got caught up in a lawsuit from that same year, which allowed us to know what sort of cargo it was carrying.

Oddly, I had mentioned to you guys that it was an 8,000-pound magnet.

And I asked offhandedly, what do you do with an 8,000-pound magnet?

That's weird.

My husband instantly said, that's military grade.

Okay, interesting.

Also,

the person captaining, that was the captain of that ship was

a man named Guy Choplin.

Okay.

He was manning the ship, and yet we could not locate photos of this individual beyond two pictures.

And one, which is like his official filings as a captain, looks like he's a child.

Here it is.

That's Guy Choplin there in the corner.

All we are able to determine about Guy Chopelin is that he was born in 1910 and he died in 1994.

Oh, okay.

And then I kind of a little bit think he's got the Trogno face, like the ears, but that would just be speculation.

So let's move on.

What is not not speculation is that in the 1960s, MKUltra was in full swing across California.

And our government was pretty deranged, really deranged in what they were trying to do with that program.

They were interested specifically, that's just one facet of MKUltra, in using magnets, I kid you not, to hack our brains.

I wish I was kidding, honestly, but you should know that among the many projects that were using magnets, one was called Sub-Project 119.

Government wanted to see if they could alter our brain waves by using big magnets.

Yeah, I'm not kidding.

This was the era of just deranged psychology.

By the way, there was no era when psychology was not deranged, but this was extra special.

They needed to see if they could hack and control our minds, and electromagnets were a massive piece of the

MKUltra experimentation agenda.

That project, in particular, the Sub-Project 119, was led by two doctors at UCLA who realized that the brain, that brains irradiate low frequencies with respective activities.

So they're saying, oh, the brain's got these frequencies going on.

And they're wondering if they could then manipulate those brain waves electromagnetically.

Stanford University similarly picked up research regarding electromagnets in the early 70s.

That is, if you look throughout the Stanford yearbooks at that time, they speak a lot about it.

And like I said, I know this because I accessed those yearbook archives.

They're very interesting.

The head of MKUltra was Dr.

Jolly West.

We know this.

And per Tom O'Neill's book, Chaos, we know that Jolly West went to Stanford University in 1966.

And what I am about to tell you about the Stanford University prison experiment is going to positively shock you.

Because of course, you know me.

I'm nosy.

I had to send somebody there to access those files.

And of course, I also had to contact one of the prisoners that was involved myself.

But first, I want to tell you a little bit of background about the experiment, okay?

So the reality is that the more dramatic stories pertaining to the Holocaust did not actually begin to manifest until decades after the event.

In fact, even the stories about Dr.

Mengele,

an Israeli historian, Ephraim Zaroff, discovered that his image among former Auschwitz inmates who were interviewed right after the war was harmless.

The angel of death who committed unspeakable tragedies evolved slowly over time.

And in this evolution, regular people began to wonder, are we really to believe that everybody just jumped in and

took place and took part in this evil?

Are people just intrinsically evil?

That if you see somebody doing these terrible things, you're going to jump in like all of these Nazis did this, because, you know, you got to justify the Nuremberg trials.

You're killing everybody, right?

And people are going to ask that question.

Is it possible that a person who has never harmed an individual in their entire life can radically transform into a monster?

Is there a quiet monster that lives inside of all of us?

Well, Philip Zimbardo at Stanford University set out to prove that, yeah, in the right environment, very quickly, people are going to do unspeakably evil things if everybody else is doing it.

If management tells them, hey, carve out this person's eye, they're going to do it, okay?

Almost instantly, by the way, without thought, they just do it because it lives in all of us.

So you shouldn't question any stories that you read.

And also,

you should be forgiving and understanding of future military-grade torture.

like what happens in Abu Ghraib.

This is just what people do.

They get sadistic.

The Stanford Prison Experiment was funded by the U.S.

Office of Naval Research, and I'm going to let you hear Philip Zimbardo in his own words here explain how it all came together.

Take a listen.

Our goal, back in 1971, was to study the behavioral and psychological consequences of becoming a prisoner or prison guard.

To do this, we decided to simulate a prison environment, both physically and mentally.

and then observe the effects of this institution on all those within its walls.

We used the basement of the psychology building to stage our little drama, scheduled to run for two weeks.

A corridor of small offices was converted into a functional prison environment.

It was complete with three cells.

There was a guard's room, the warden's office, my superintendent's office, and a closet used if necessary for solitary confinement.

We recruited the help of some prison experts to assist us with our prison design and construction.

Foremost among them was Carlo Prescott, an ex-convict recently released from serving 17 years behind bars bars in San Quentin and Soledad prisons.

We placed an ad in the city newspaper asking for participants for an experiment studying the psychological effects of prison life.

They would be paid $15 a day.

Over 70 people applied.

They were given diagnostic interviews and psychological tests to weed out all those with any signs of psychological abnormality, medical disabilities, or history of crime or drug use.

24 were selected.

They were all healthy, normal, intelligent, middle-class males from colleges throughout the United States.

And with a flip of the coin, each was randomly assigned to play the role of prisoner or guard.

It was only by chance that someone was chosen as prisoner or guard.

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By chance.

Middle class?

Okay.

Zimbardo himself calls the experiment a drama, so let's meet the prisoners.

Let's just meet the cast because I think it's kind of relevant.

It's going to be very relevant.

Pay attention.

Let's go through these.

First, we have Doug Corpy.

Doug graduated from Stanford in 1989.

His father was a Freemason, member of the Sons in Retirement Society.

We can also go to the next guy.

Who do we have?

Clay Ramsey.

Clay Ramsey was in the Marines and he worked on a merchant ship.

I was able, by the way, you cannot find this in Zimbardo's book or Letexier's book.

I discovered these facts about these individuals.

Let's go to the next slide.

Richard Yaco, prisoner 1037.

His father was Samuel Yako.

Samuel Yako was in the U.S.

Navy.

He worked for NASA as an engineer.

Richard produced and directed commercials for NASA.

Okay, let's go to the next slide.

Glenn Gee graduated from Stanford University.

He's prisoner number 3401.

He had a degree in chemical engineering a year before the experiment.

He received that degree from Stanford University.

Let's go to the next one.

We've got Paul Baron.

He worked for Halliburton after graduating with a master's and a PhD from Stanford University.

His father, we wrote, might be Paul Baron, the electrical engineer who worked for the RAND Corporation.

Next,

Stuart Levin worked for Halliburton Energy Services and Standard Oil as a geophysicist, graduated with a degree from Stanford, a master of science from Stanford.

We've got Jim Roney, 4325.

His father is Captain James Roney of the Moffett Naval Air Base, also commander of the ship that recovered the Apollo 8.

His father was also an aeronautical engineer who was the director of science and engineering at the Naval Academy.

Okay, we've got Jerry Shu,

who is prisoner 5486.

We find out from Jerry Shu that he spent time in Canada before the experiment.

Okay, he's originally from Pennsylvania and he's a college dropout.

Lastly, though, of course, is the prisoner that we're concerned with here is Thomas Williams.

Thomas Williams was homeless.

We are told from Latexier in his book that he was

an undergrad who was living in his car before the experiment, and that's all we know.

So I was interested, okay?

I was interested.

We were also informed that one of these prisoners was actually a mole, meaning that the prisoner was working under Phillips Embardo and really just acting.

This prisoner was just an actor.

I felt in my gut that that prisoner could potentially be the Jean-Michel Tragoneau lookalike, prisoner 2093.

But we really only had one clue to go off of about that mole, which was given to us via one of the prisoners named Jonathan Mark.

I mean, one of the guards parted named Jonathan Mark, who did a Reddit feed in 2015.

So that's 10 years ago.

He jumps onto Reddit and says, I was a prisoner in the Stanford, I mean, a guard in the Stanford experiment.

Ask me anything.

And this is what he wrote in that Reddit post.

He lets us know

that the prisoner who was removed from the experiment for a breakdown, that's Doug Corpy, was the younger brother of one of my friends, but I never had any subsequent contact with him.

When he was removed, he was replaced by a new prisoner who was in fact a grad student working with Zimbardo, who was placed as a mole to find out what the student prisoners were up to.

This new prisoner slash grad student was also an acquaintance of mine.

So while I didn't out him, and I'm sure none of us were supposed to know that he was a part of the research team, nor was his background ever published to my knowledge, I knew who he was.

Okay.

Now, I thought that that was really interesting.

Just in general, first and foremost, we're going to get to the timing that he posts this in 2015.

He says very clearly there that the mole was an acquaintance of his and also a graduate student.

Macrone gets elected in 2017.

Thibault Letexier, a business management major with a background in business management, randomly publishes a book the following March about the experiment.

And then some French girl, Juliet Eisner, then does a documentary about the experiment.

My instinct told me that the sudden, very French interest in this experiment was not actually random.

And I can tell you that my instincts have been proven correct.

In Latexier's book, he asserts that the mole

was a graduate student.

He said this student was receiving his master's at Stanford University.

So he agrees with Jonathan Mark when he says that in the Reddit feed, the Reddit feed, except he is clear.

Latexier, in his book, he names the mole.

He said it was a student named David Gorchoff.

Came across the first mistake.

The problem is that a simple check let me know that David Gorchoff never received or pursued his master's at Stanford University.

Factually, David Gorchoff was an undergraduate student who happened to have a class with Zimbardo.

So that felt to me like when Xavier says, you got to tell kind of little lies to get people confused.

I felt like I needed to confirm who the mole was and to confirm why Latexier put in his book that it was David Gorchov.

It was, of course, like I said, prisoner 2093, who is referred to as the Sarge, the Sargent in particular, that I was interested in.

One, because obviously my eyes, he looks like Jean-Michel Trogneau.

Also, he, if it is Jean-Michel Trogneau, he would fit the description of a graduate student that might have been working with Zimbardo.

Zimbardo is referring to this as having a degree of acting that's involved.

And also, because when I access the footage that's publicly available of that prisoner, 2093,

I am able to detect an un-American accent.

Listen very closely to this, okay?

This is a person when I hear it.

that knows how to speak English, but is struggling with their Rs, right?

You got to bring in somebody like Hugh Laurie, you know, the show house.

He, I mean, I had no idea that that man was not American.

It shocked me to my core.

But most people, when you learn a language, especially when you learn a language like, you know, English, you might struggle a bit with the R's, maybe holding them on a little bit too long.

So I'm going to show you a clip of The Sarge, Prisoner 2093.

And I want you to pay attention to the speech pattern.

If we to wound you today,

would you be willing to give up the pay that you've earned so far?

I feel the only answer to that question would have to be no, sir.

Why?

My reasoning behind it would be that

were

I to give up the pay thus far, it would be an even greater loss of five days of my life than it would have been otherwise.

I feel that.

In other words, the pay compensates for the time?

It doesn't, sir.

I began to realize more and more during the five days that having the time to spend and study

to advance my studies at Stanford University

could not be compensated by $15 a day.

Okay.

I said,

I feel like someone's trying to put on an American accent.

And it's about to get weirder.

As we, like I said, of course, I had to send somebody to Stanford University to access the documents.

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Okay.

Remember, it should have been very easy for me to debunk myself on the point of prisoner 2093.

Was he the actual mole?

Was this prisoner the graduate student that was working under Zimbardo?

So I decided we just have to learn everything that there is to learn about Sarge, you know, prisoner 2093, the Sarge.

Surprisingly, Philip Zimbardo didn't actually publish a book about the Stanford experiment until 2007.

He releases in 2007 the book entitled The Lucifer Effect of all Things.

And I was wondering why that was.

Again, as a part of investigation, you do have to speculate.

You have to think, right?

You have the permission to think.

And I'm going, is there anything going on in 2007 that made this relevant?

No.

Okay, I download the book.

If my theory holds that this could be Brigitte, then I'm wondering, is it possible that something happened to Brigitte and or Emmanuel in 2007 that would have required this kind of going back, rewriting history, if you will?

And as it turns out, that just happens to be the year that Brigitte and Emmanuel Macron get married.

They got married in 2007.

Now, again, I'm just thinking out loud here.

In Zimbardo's book, he speaks about the Sarge quite a bit.

The description of him is that he obeyed all orders in a way that was almost twisted, that made people uncomfortable.

More on that later.

Now, some things, again, that could have easily debunked my theory is just the physical description that we can find that's available regarding prisoner 2093.

What is his height?

Well, in terms of physicalities, the Sarge was on the short side for a male.

The Sarge was just 5'8, okay?

Brigitte, Macrone today, is just above 5'6.

And we know that males shrink one to three inches between the ages of 30 and 70.

We're all going downwards, okay?

So this is still a very, very much possibility.

So I then decide, like I told you, someone's got to go access the files.

Someone must immediately go to Stanford University.

I will put you on a plane.

And lo and behold, we made that happen.

And there were just more unusual things when it came to prisoner 2093.

First and foremost, all of the prisoners involved in the experiments and all of the guards were made to sign a media release.

Obviously, you have to sign a media release form.

Their signatures, while they were signing this, obviously, were to be witnessed by a third party.

All of the prisoners had a third party witness, meaning someone other than Philip Zimbardo, who signed off on their media releases, with the exceptions of Glenn Glenn Gee and The Sarge, known as Tom Williams, both in the Lucifer effect.

His name is Thomas Thompson, and then he's Thomas Williams in Latexier's book.

And the signature reads Thomas C.

Williams, but the only person that witnessed that signing is dead and would have been a conflict of interest for a witness signature.

It's Philips Zimbardo himself.

Okay.

Then there is a box at Stanford University, which holds the prison uniforms.

Curiously, prisoner 2093 smock is missing.

There's a small off chance that it could be in Ohio.

We have somebody going to access that now.

They're being very cagey about what they have and what they don't have.

But suffice it to say, the majority is all supposed to be at Stanford and it's not there.

Maybe because that would have held DNA of some description if you're sweating in the prison, right?

Also in the archives at Stanford is a list of all of the addresses that correspond to the prisoners, Because remember, they had to pick up the prisoners for their fake arrest.

These prisoners had to be fake arrested so that they could, so they therefore arranged where the pickups would take place.

Prisoner 2093 is the only prisoner whose address is listed as the first floor of the undergraduate library.

The man has no address.

Oh, that's right.

He's living in his car.

No way to trace him that way.

We can always go back with address records and look through things.

That's That's a dead avenue.

On days four and five of the experiment, Philip Zimbardo allowed the parents to visit their sons.

And there exists in the archives a typed up list of those parents who visited.

Zimbardo curiously remarks that he's not sure who it is that visited prisoner 2093.

He writes, maybe

his dad.

Okay, let's take a look at the individual because this exists, there's a tape of this, who visits prisoner 2093.

This is the only footage that's been made available from visiting day regarding prisoner 2093.

Take a look.

Now, there's no audio on this, but I don't think that that individual looks like they could be a dad.

This person actually looks like he's maybe the same age, exact same age as our 2093 okay

there's also a digital archive a typed up sheet obviously must have been typed up decades after um where they record that 2093 was visited by someone named warren faras okay warren last name spelled f u r a s

we have no idea who that individual may be.

That doesn't even sound like a real last name.

I have looked through online available records.

I can't find even one person with the last name, F-U-R-A-S, to begin tracing.

So that's rather mysterious.

And of course, the biggest thing is going through these media releases, which included, like I said, all of the guards and all the prisoners, there is no David Gorchoff who has signed a release.

But I thought David was the mole.

Surely you would have had David sign one of these media releases if he was your mole.

It's been released to the media, this footage.

So at the same time, I had Schuyler, my producer, reach out to Jonathan Mark, the guard who did the Reddit AMA.

And he said he knew the mole.

So the easiest way to debunk myself, because truly I wanted to quickly debunk this, was to just have him say, yeah, this is David Gorchop.

I know him.

Miraculously, we were able to get in touch with Jonathan Marks.

He told us that he was happy to jump on the phone with me the next morning, even though he was in Asia.

So it was nighttime, our time.

We got on the the phone with him at about 10 p.m.

at night.

And the conversation, I mean, Jonathan Mark was detailed.

He was descriptive.

He spoke about all of the flaws in Zimbardo's experiment.

He told me that he thought Latexier did a really good book.

And I told him, like, no, I feel like Latexier kind of left out the part where it was one big giant conflict of interest because so many of these people had ties to the military and the military funded the experiment.

Then I asked him about that mole.

I asked him about that Reddit AMA that he had done just 10 years ago and got a little bit iffy.

He told us that the mole was, he thought, married to a girl that a friend of his in high school used to date.

But then he let us know he doesn't really remember much about the mole.

He doesn't even really remember his name.

Maybe it's, maybe it's David Gorchov.

He's not sure.

I didn't feel great about that part.

So then I started asking myself, why did Jonathan Mark, the guard, suddenly do that AMA in March of 2015?

That's nearly 45 years after the initial experiment.

This guy jumps and he does an AMA on Reddit to talk about this experiment.

Asked the question again, thinking out loud, was there anything going on in Emmanuel Macron and Brigitte's life that might have been significant?

And I kid you not, in March of 2015, the exact week that he did this AMA Reddit feed, is exactly when Emmanuel Macron is first introduced to the French public.

You can see this on his Wikipedia page.

I can't make this up.

It says, Macron first became known to the French public after his appearance on the French TV program Des Parole et des Axes in March of 2015.

Okay,

that's pretty particular.

I thought that's a little bit weird.

Let's just keep going.

We got to try again.

And I tell Skylar, reach out to him this time with a very clear picture of David Gorchov.

I've now hunted that down.

This person he described 10 years ago as an acquaintance.

He was supposedly, this guy is supposedly the mole.

Ask him point blank whether or not this man, this photo of this man was the mole that he remembers in the experiment.

He tells us he doesn't know.

He doesn't remember now.

So that's a dead end.

At this point, I wanted to look more closely at the language of

prisoner 2093, because even if you do master a language, it's difficult to master its delivery.

Do you guys know what I'm saying?

Like there's slang, there's dialect, there's a certain swag and delivery when you speak a language.

So you can always kind of spot a foreigner.

They're almost a bit too proper is one thing.

Obviously, you learn a language, you learn it properly, you don't learn slang.

And so we just decide to take a look at the transcript.

So, we can't hear him say this, but there's a transcript that's available on the Stanford Archive website of The Sarge.

It's his exit interview, and he's asked about his behavior, about him obeying every single order.

He did not, he did everything that he was supposed to do.

He says, you know, he kind of loved the orders and following along.

And we're going to read from that transcript.

Okay,

this is what

Prisoner 2093 said.

Let's pull up the transcript.

I suppose you could say I was playing my best role because I believe that life is really, it depends upon what role you play as to how you act.

In almost any situation that I've been in, I can describe it in terms of the role that I am playing.

And being in prison, having to follow all these rules, it was one of the first opportunities I've had to play the basic role, or at least as far as I can understand, the basic role on which the other roles are built.

And I can't describe self in terms of anything but role.

I believe that the most important thing is results and not what the attempts are.

Person comes back to them and says, I'm not quite sure what you mean by that.

2093 continues.

I mean I would change to most any role, not most any role that can be built upon the basic role in order to accomplish what the basic role would want to accomplish, but could not accomplish by itself.

Oh,

I see, okay.

And then they go on and ask,

the person asks him, okay, I see.

Suppose the random selection had ended up with you being a guard instead.

How do you think you could have gotten into the role of a guard?

2093 says, I think that I could have gotten into the role of a good guard.

I think I could have gotten into the role to where I would be satisfied by someone else's standards.

I don't know.

That's just weird.

Can we just all acknowledge that that's weird?

All this role talk saying the self,

what?

That's not how Americans speak.

Okay.

That's certainly not.

You just tell me this is some person that was just in this car and was a student.

And we're talking about everyone's on LSD because the CIA is just putting it all over California.

Hippie generation.

Yeah, man, that's cool.

This guy just pops in and is talking about the role of self in this and all.

Like, it's way too

proper.

It's also weird.

It's like detached from their self and saying that they could fill any role.

It feels like they're laughing at us a little bit there.

You can compare that, by the way, to other transcripts and the other people that are being interviewed sound like Americans.

They sound casual.

This is Jim Roney, prisoner number 4325.

And he's asked about whether or not the experience has been hard on him.

He says, It's a lot stricter.

It's a lot well.

It's my vision of being a prisoner, something you've seen in the movies as someone who lies around in a cell.

This takes a little bit more than that.

You have to give up just about all individuality.

I'm doing exactly what the guards tell me to do, just being pretty obedient.

And then the person's going back and forth.

And you can just see it's when you go through the transcripts, everybody else is so much more casual.

So now I'm locked in.

Something is not right with prisoner 2093.

I don't know, no, but I know, you know,

I'm not kidding when I say that I even prayed on it because I felt spiritually something very evil was going on.

And all of this, I want to be clear, is God's timing, right?

Because naturally right now, what's coinciding with this is that we are learning and reading about Sigmund Freud.

In my book club, we are reading the assault on truth.

We are reading about Sigmund Freud.

the rapid abuse of children that was happening in Paris, how he gaslit these children.

He was working under Charcot in Paris, when he then flips the script and says, no, no, the children are attracted to their parents.

It was incestuous abuse.

And in the next book that we're going to read, we're going to learn in my book club about Sigmund Freud again, but we're going to learn about the fact that he was a cabbalist.

He owned a Zohar.

If there is anything to know about cabbalists, it's that the numbers matter deeply to them.

Numerology is important.

So I say to myself, the numbers of the prisoners, they cannot be random.

Like they are random, but they can't be random.

They have to hold some sort of a meaning.

They're all over the place, right?

Some of them are three digits, some of them are four digits.

There's no flow.

Why would somebody do this?

More than anything else, just difficult for you.

If you're controlling this experiment, it's difficult to keep track.

of all of these numbers.

Wouldn't you just want to make somebody like three, four, five, whatever it is?

And then it hits me.

Everything about this experiment is military.

These numbers must be military.

They must hold military significance.

And lo and behold, I'm so ignorant about the military.

I didn't know people that are in the Navy.

How do you send a letter to someone that is on a military base?

What does it mean when you put a zip code and then you have to attach to it a unit number?

If you're going to send mail, it corresponds to military bases and lo and behold the prisoner numbers just so happened to correspond to 1971 military bases and i'm going to go through those for you guys right now

doug corby's was uh 8612

That is the number for that was assigned for the Naval Weapons Station in Long Beach, California.

And it is

incredible that that one took me a while to hack because apparently when it's a medical center, a medical facility, they give them what's known as DMIS numbers.

But again, Long Beach, California.

We then have Clay Ramsey, 416, correlates to the engineering team in Vietnam, the Naval CB team, 416.

I found their yearbook.

I'm going through it and I suspect that I'm going to find a familiar face.

1037, I told you that Richard Yako Spadder was in the Navy.

I told you he was an engineer.

That corresponds to the USS Bronstein.

The commander was Stanley Thomas Count, who ran engineering at Hughes Aircraft, Ship Hole 1037.

Glenn Gee, that 3401 corresponds to the USS Darter.

Darter in 1971 was moved to San Diego in that very year to support 7th Fleet operations.

Paul Baron, 5704,

That is the armed forces of Europe, Canada, the postcode 5074, and the Middle East.

Wit Hubble, we've been having trouble finding anything about Wit Hubble, so we are unsure about 7258.

Somebody out there will be able to let me know.

We have had trouble even establishing who his family is if he's connected to the Hubble telescope.

So we just have nothing but question marks when it comes to Wit Hubble.

Stuart Levin, 819, that was the naval post in 1971 in Spain.

They sent out the MC4 engineering team.

They arrived there in July of 1971.

Jim Roney 4325,

that corresponds to the Moffett Air.

I'm sorry, Camp Pendleton.

And am I bringing that right?

Moffitt Federal Airfield.

Yeah, Mountain View, California, sorry, where the Army Reserve's 7th Psychological Operations Group is based.

We also have

Jerry Shu.

Jerry Shu, we have Camp Pendleton CA.

That is, of course, also a naval base in California.

And then,

last but not least, and you guys don't have to show this next one because I want to speak through this.

Tom Williams, Prisoner 2093.

Is this a naval base?

I get a hit, guys.

I do get a hit of a naval base that it corresponds to, the naval unit rather, that it corresponds to.

And it is the only naval unit on the list that is not American-owned.

And it just so happens to be French-owned.

Clipperton Island.

Who knew a naval base on Clipperton Island?

First thing I'm thinking is: what the heck is Clipperton Island?

I'm wondering if it's me.

My husband then says he's never heard of Clipperton Island.

And that's crazy because my husband is the king of geography.

Xavier Poussard says he's never heard of Clipperton Island.

So let me show you this island that apparently not many people have heard of that has had a military naval base and presence that is a French island.

Check this out on the map.

Yep, let's go in here.

Clipperton.

What the heck goes on at Clipperton Island?

It's incredible.

Yeah, it is the, I believe it said, the only French island in the Upper Pacific.

I think that's correct.

You can fact-check me on that.

So I'm wondering what goes on on Clipperton Island.

Nobody knows, okay?

It's like people are asking questions.

The most you can find really is that it's got a pretty gory history.

I think even on that clink that you said, that you just had up, it says that there's a lot of weird stuff that happens there.

It's got folklore.

I'm wondering what kind of folklore, why is France, what's France doing on Clip Road and Island?

And now I'm starting to feel real

sure

that prisoner 2093 is suspicious.

So Skylar says, let's just message Jonathan Marks.

He's being open and communicative.

Let's just ask him flat out about prisoner 2093.

And of course, we should have done that from the beginning.

The Sarge was a very big deal.

Per Zimbardo's book, all of the inmates allegedly hated him.

They gave him that nickname, the sarge, because he was so militant.

Schuyler texts Jonathan Mark and he tells him the truth: Hey, we've gone through the Stanford files, we're a bit struck by the fact that there's no information that allows us to look further into Prisoner 2093.

His name, Thomas C.

Williams, can you can you help us out?

Like, who is this guy?

Kid you not, when I say that he comes back with the response and he says,

I have no recollection of him and wasn't even aware of his existence.

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Shut

down.

Shut down.

Oh, I'm sorry.

You were not aware of his existence.

There were only nine prisoners that were involved in this.

You've been speaking about this from the very beginning.

You are in magazines.

You were involved in documentaries.

You were involved in the recent documentary that was involved, that was about this on Hulu.

You're telling me now, all of a sudden, this prisoner who Zimbardo has featured prominently in his book, you don't remember, you know, nothing about this guy.

You told us that you read Latexier's book,

that you read Zimbardo's book.

They talk about the Sarge.

What do you mean you don't know he existed?

That's pretty strong.

I know he exists.

You don't know that he exists?

Skyler goes back, gives a little bit of details.

This is the Sarge.

You know, Thomas, don't you know him?

He says,

not really.

Nothing.

Shut it down.

Okay.

All right.

We're on to something here.

It's prisoner 2093 that's being protected, to say the least.

Okay.

The last piece of this that I had to solve for, though, was Zimbardo's lie.

But the biggest piece of the lie that he tells where he says these were all middle class was when we realized, as I told you guys in last Thursday's episode, that one of the guards, Chuck Burton, was a Rothschild descendant.

Rothschild.

Middle class kids?

No, Chucky Burton.

Granddad's running Sears.

You're the Herzstat family, like Herzstat, like the bank.

What are we doing here?

Feels kind of weird that you're pretending to be a poor kid that was backpacking and needed 15 bucks.

And then now, if I'm correct, and this is Jean-Michel Trogneau, then that would mean that at least two Rothschild agents, you could say, maybe,

were there.

Connections, connected to the Rothschilds, maybe maybe a more appropriate way to say that chuck burton and john michelle trugdeau why

what is it about the rothschilds that would have put these individuals here

historically speaking and i'm going on gut here i'm thinking to myself the rothschilds are really only known to care about one thing i mean this is a family that's been around for generations but when we're talking about gold the rothschilds come up you know just historically speaking.

I know today that's considered anti-Semitism, but it's just a fact, you know,

they're known to care about banking, the banking dynasty, right?

And then I think to myself, okay, but obviously nothing was going on in 1971 pertaining to gold.

You guys,

you guys,

this is

crazy.

Wrong.

Major stuff was going on, okay?

So first and foremost, you should know that from 1959 to 69, the president of France was Charles de Gaulle.

Okay.

He was Charles de Gaulle.

And what happened was Charles de Gaulle got a little bit MAGA in the end because the conversation of

globalizing the Federal Reserve System was coming up.

America had already domestically converted to the fiat system.

Okay.

So it used to be that your dollar was backed by gold.

And then they said, you know what?

We're doing away with that.

We're kind of moving to a debt society.

The government's going to kind of make the decisions, LOL, about what actually exists.

America had already moved away from that domestically.

But in 1971, Richard Nixon

is president, right?

And they're talking about, like, lo and behold, hey, we're going to do this thing internationally.

Like, we are like, we're going all fiat.

We're just going to globalize this Federal Reserve system, right?

Charles de Gaulle was anti-this.

He didn't like this at all.

And he starts saying he's not going to do this.

And so lo and behold, what happens is effectively a color revolution.

People start protesting in the streets in France and he's got to just step down.

It's got to be over.

Charles de Gaulle gets overthrown.

Get out of here, you MAGA guy, talking about concerns about French citizens, making sure that they didn't become slaves to debt.

You got to go.

And in his place gets installed George Pompadou.

Okay, George Pompadou becomes the president of France.

He was initially the prime minister.

He now becomes the president.

And in 1971, the very year of the Stanford experiment, guess what France did?

France repatriated all of their gold from America.

They said, give us our gold back.

We want all of our gold.

And this

military effort, obviously the military had to transfer this literal gold from America.

It has never to this day been revealed what naval ships were involved in moving this gold in 1971 from America back to, presumably to France.

I don't know if it went to France.

Nobody knows.

There's no answer to where all of this gold went.

I don't know.

But it would make sense.

that

maybe this could be a reason that if you are the Rothschilds and you're concerned with banking, you would want to make sure that family members and people that were very close to you were involved in this.

So I am seized.

I am seized.

I must know what goes on.

Anything.

If you guys know anything about what goes on on Clipperton Island, you must

email tips at candaceowens.com

because I'm on to this

if you guys know anything about prisoner 2093 the very mysterious tom williams uh you must email tips at candace owens.com to let you guys know we have already gone through the files that are public and available um on the stanford website we are we know

i know

that we are close here and the implications as I begin to look at what was going on and this CB team and what these engineers were sent out to do in Vietnam

and what

other teams that were involved in Korea,

the implications here are quite severe.

We're talking about the Federal Reserve.

You want to get unalived real quick as a president in America.

You start saying, bring back the gold standard.

No, no, no, no, no.

We will enslave the world with debts.

That is the purpose of the Federal Reserve.

So I'm on to you, prisoner 2093.

Like I said, the wonderful thing about the stupidity of this lawsuit is that it will allow for us to subpoena this information.

I'm sending you guys down a lot of rabbit holes, but certainly any information about Guy Chopelin, also information about where that moniker, Thomas C.

Williams, could have come from.

Does it perhaps correlate to the military?

I think I saw that there was somebody in the military named Thomas Carroll Williams.

Maybe people that can search in the National Archives.

We can prod the narrative further about the Clipperton Island.

I would be very grateful.

Tips at CandiceOwens.com because we are essentially right now the decentralized intelligence agency.

That's why I'm wearing our new gear here, decentralized, the Candice Intelligence Agency.

We've been able to put together a lot of this because of you guys.

Last thing that I want you guys to let me know, again, we are having having a lot of trouble identifying this Wit Hubble, what those his number could have corresponded to.

If you know anything, feel free to email tips at candaceowens.com.

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What are you guys thinking?

Where are my military military men in the chat?

Okay.

Where are my military guys right now?

I'm telling you, you would have cracked things a lot faster than me.

You're going to give me even more details about units.

Postcode 71.

I need my military guys ASAP.

ASAP.

Because something funny happened.

I read Chaos.

Again, God thing that I read that book.

My friend sent it to me, my friend Paula.

I read it.

I'm learning about MKUltra.

I'm learning that it corresponds to torturing people in Vietnam.

Like we were like, literally, we were just torturing in sadistic experimentation.

And it's all leading to this moment.

It's all leading to this moment.

Tropic rights, I wish true justice will be seen, me as well, very much.

Also, Tropic rights, all experiments belong to the military, good and bad.

It's all about the military.

Yeah.

I am thinking that we do exist under the military.

That's why I even noticed on some of my episodes, there are like military bots, literally, people whose jobs it is in the military to dissuade americans from watching certain content you we saw a lot of that uh when israel wanted to go after iran you saw suddenly this increase in bots it was so botted marbley writes Is the CIA shirt a case of the truth hidden in plain sight?

We need to ask these questions.

It's maybe you can't see it, but it's our, you know how we say that we are the new CIA, the Kansas Intelligence Agency.

No, that wasn't me saying I was in the CIA.

It was me saying that we are the decentralized intelligent agency and we dropped this line because everybody was like, we need a hat.

So you can actually go get that.

It's available on our website.

We have new merch.

It's obviously tongue-in-cheek.

If I'm in the CIA, man, I don't know what their aim is.

That would be absolutely crazy.

Jay No Cow writes, it takes a lot of balls to be the first lady of France.

Liam Momberg writes, love and light from South Africa.

We are with you.

Jonathan Werner writes, and thank you, by by the way.

I love South Africa.

A lot of stuff, a lot of funny business going on there, and a lot of funny business that happened there.

Jonathan Werner writes, hey, Candace, keep spreading the truth.

Have you seen the new trailer for the biblical horror movie, The Carpenter's Son?

I would love your thoughts on it.

I have not seen a trailer.

I don't watch movies anymore.

I just kind of read books.

I'm just fascinated with learning real history because I think that truth is kind of, I mean, what actually has happened, the events of our world is obviously, as the expression goes, way stranger in fiction than fiction.

Sparky writes: Don't make too much about the 800-pound electromagnet, 8,000-pound electromagnet until more is known about it.

They're commonly used in cranes, in scrap metal yards.

That's probably what it's for.

Don't give Brigitte and Co.

ammo.

Oh, no, there's more.

There's more about that particular ship and what it was involved in.

But thank you for your commentary.

I can only give you guys so much in one episode, but that's not the only lawsuit that it was involved in.

And of course, where it was going in California and what time it was going there.

Brian Schwartz writes, the basic role may be a brainwashing model for the rest of the prisoners.

Perhaps.

Yeah, it's very strange.

The interviews that you watch with that prisoner, what's made available, they're weird.

They're just very, very weird.

And it feels like theater.

Mary Everett writes, I went through withdrawals when you were gone.

Don't do that to us again.

You get no sick days.

Okay, fine, fair.

I got it.

Adventure, Fun Times writes, Hagger says in his book that in the 1770s, Freemasonry was used to foment revolution, not to practice the occult, and that some factions of Freemasonry were upset with other factions because many were not practicing the occult.

Macron's close friends are pedophiles.

George Washington's close friends were devout Catholics and Protestants.

We should really talk about American history.

Time to join.

Like that's something we, everything you think you know about American history is wrong, except for the fact that, yeah, it was a Freemason race and the wrong Freemasons won, is what I'll say.

Alaska Dog Lady writes, Cradle Catholic who left the faith for ages, returned as a Protestant, but I've gone back to mass and the Holy Spirit led me to enroll my kids in OCIC today.

Celebrate with me.

That is absolutely amazing.

And let me tell you guys, that is the one resource that they are most interested in.

It is our children.

It is incumbent upon us to guard our children, mind, body, and soul.

Not kidding, that is, there is, it's so so obvious.

We now live in what I would describe a post-Epstein world, okay?

Where they're just masked down right now.

They are masked down in this moment.

They are trying to lay on the Freudian strategy of gaslighting us as they abuse us.

Fick, the media is trying to make us think we're crazy.

Why are you paying attention?

Like, nope.

You guys have all gone masked down.

Of course, by the way,

I was telling you guys that there's this show that was very popular in America.

It is very popular, White Lotus.

And then this last season of White Lotus, there was unnecessarily

incest and people just turned it off and didn't want to watch it.

And then it turns out that there was this K-pop, very popular K-pop singer that was in that season.

She did not take part in the incest scene, but she had never before acted.

And she was put into this particular season, the incest season, so to speak.

Well, it turns out they believe she got this role because she is dating Bernard Bernard Arnaud, who we know is in the orbit of the Macrones.

And Brigitte Macrone herself gave that K-pop singer an award.

And beyond that, they have just announced that the new season of White Lotus is going to be filmed in Paris the next season.

So it's just, I know, there's just so much happening right now.

We just go, I don't know France, but perhaps the government collapsing is

what needed to happen because I I don't know what is in the LASA palace.

But it ain't, it is not a woman named Brigitte Macron.

It is not a woman by any stretch of the imagination.

And this person is quite evil, quite sinister.

The things this person, I believe, has always been involved in.

So we're going to keep prodding the narrative on the Stanford Prison Experiment.

Send us.

everything you have.

If you want to support our decentralized intelligence agency, send us the tips to tips at candaceowens.com.

Buy yourself a hat.

Decentralized intelligence agency is all over the world.

Okay, there's no way to stop us.

We're just all being awakened to how evil, how sick, and how sinister it all is.

But Brigitte, wow, the linchpin of it all.

Why make Brigitte the first lady?

I want you to think about that.

We're going to jump back into it tomorrow.

But that's something, right?

Quite stunning to go, okay, you got weighed so much.

What's this next step?

What's this represent to you?

It has to be almost theological.

I'll leave it there.

We'll see you guys tomorrow.