Mariska Hargitay On Freeing Herself From Generational Trauma

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This is Fresh Air.

I'm Tanya Mosley.

For more than two decades, Marishka Hargate has held a singular place on American television.

as Olivia Benson on Law and Order Special Special Victims Unit, the longest-running character in a prime-time drama.

She's become an emblem of justice and empathy, receiving thousands of letters over the years from real-life survivors.

But behind the on-screen strength is a personal history Harcaté has never publicly told until now.

When she was just three years old, Harkatay was in the backseat of a car when her mother, Hollywood actress Jane Mansfield, died in a tragic accident.

Though she and her siblings survived, Hargate has no memory of the crash and never had the chance to truly know her mother.

In her place stood a public image, the platinum blonde, hypersexualized starlet, a persona that felt disconnected from the woman Hargutay was told her mother was.

For years, she wrestled with that legacy, not sure how to embrace or escape it.

choosing to keep her distance as she searched for her own identity.

But in her new documentary, My Mom Jane, Hargutay looks back at her mother's life, and along the way, she unearths a complicated truth about her own identity, including her biological father.

Though she was raised believing actor and bodybuilder Mickey Hargate was her father, the full story is more layered, and now she's ready to tell it.

Reclaiming my own story.

That is what this is about for me.

I'd spent 35 years trying to hide that story,

to honor my dad.

But something that I've also realized is that sometimes keeping a secret doesn't honor anyone.

And it's taken me a long time to figure that out.

Hargajay does in this documentary what her fictional character Olivia Benson has asked of countless survivors on Law and Order.

She tells the truth and makes meaning of her pain.

Before landing her Emmy and Golden Globe award-winning role on SVU in 99, Hargatay appeared on a number of television shows, including Baywatch and The Heat of the Night, Seinfeld and ER, as well as the soap opera Falcon Crest.

In 2018, Hargatay appeared and served as executive producer on the Emmy-winning documentary I Am Evidence, which exposed the nationwide backlog of untested rape kits in the United States.

And Mariska Hargatay, welcome to Fresh Air.

Thank you.

I'm honored and so happy to be here.

You were just three years old old when your mom died in that car accident.

And as I mentioned, you all were in the car with her, but you were so young that you didn't have memories of the accident or of your mother.

And I was wondering, what kinds of things did you grow up hearing about her?

One of the things that I grew up hearing is how smart she was.

how determined she was, and what a wonderful, wonderful, wonderful sense of humor she had.

And those were such treasures to me.

Those were things that I kept close, you know, in my heart.

And I've always been somebody who loves and values comedy deeply.

Yeah.

Really uses it as survival mechanism.

Oh, this might be surprising to folks who know you from the family.

Oh, yes.

People are always surprised.

They're like, oh, I had no idea you were funny.

I'm like, I thought I was going to be a comedian, actually.

But so, you know, because she I knew that she played the violin since she was a child and that she played piano and my grandmother always told us stories about that and my grandmother played the organ and the piano and so she had shared you know photos of the two of them doing that which I of course put in the movie but I knew that she was an artistic soul on some level I knew hearing that but never firsthand and so as I got older and started to see sort of this public image and the photos of her, it was all very confusing because nothing lined up with what I had heard about her.

Aaron Ross Powell, you, in particular, hated the voice that you heard her

use when she was performing or in interviews.

It really got under your skin.

Yeah, I think we all felt that way in terms of my siblings.

It was just something that

I just didn't think it was real.

And

that, I think, is scary, right?

When our parents aren't being real or we hear some kind of false voice, you know, for me, the tone of somebody's voice has always been been like where I go in, do I trust them or not, right?

Are they authentic or not?

So the lack of authenticity and the fact that she was playing this role and doing a voice per se was

just very unsettling and unbalanced to me.

There's a moment in the documentary, I actually want to play it.

You featured a clip from your mother's appearance on Groucho Marx's show, Tell It to Groucho.

And this clip is from 1962 and in it, Groucho asks your mother about this voice and the persona she presents to the world.

Let's listen.

You know, you're actually, and I've told this to other people, you're not the dumb blonde that you pretend to be.

And I think the people ought to know that you're really a bright, sentimental, and understanding person.

And this is a whole, this is a whole facade of yours that isn't based on what you actually are.

Oh, that's sweet of you.

Thank you.

I think you're aware of that, Jane.

This is a kind of an act you do, isn't it?

Oh, it's

people don't know that, though.

I think that it's like this.

The public pays money at the box office to see me a certain way.

And they get their money's worth, too.

So I think it's just all part of the role I'm playing as an actress.

That was Jane Mansfield in 1962 talking to Groucho Marx.

And Marischka, I chose chose that clip because there's something that he does that stood out for me.

He doesn't make your mother the butt of the joke as we see throughout the film others did.

Instead, he seems to be opening up space for her to show a more authentic version of herself, but that was something that she wanted but couldn't quite attain.

And I was wondering, what did you learn about her desire to be seen as a serious actress, as a serious talent?

Well, I just, I loved that moment in the film.

And I think, you know, Groucho is so kind and generous, but also authentic because he did know her

and he did see her.

But one of the things that really struck me is how smart she was because she did make a decision.

And it was a time when the studios wanted, you know, that buxom blonde.

And, you know, it was a studio system.

And part of the way she was sort of, you know, groomed to to be the next Marilyn and to keep Marilyn in check.

And so she knew that she had a role to play.

And he was just calling her out in this beautiful way on who she really was, which I absolutely loved.

The other thing that really hit me, because she's so gracious and polite and demure, right?

You know, she was southern in that way and she was raised in Texas.

And my grandmother was

all about manners and very strict that way with us and

I remember she used to sort of coach me on how to answer the phone and the tone of my voice and she would teach me how to say hello Pierce Residence who may I ask is calling one moment please and I remember going wow this is this sort of presentational

voice that my grandmother wanted me to use and

that also

really hit me during the making of this film about why, even with the Jack Parr interview, you could see how sort of demure and

she responded in just this very polite, gracious, I'll just sort of take it instead of like a one-liner or a zinger or giving it back to him.

So I also understood that was so much of her upbringing.

That Jack Parr clip, he had a show back in the day, and she has her violin, and she is talking about playing the piano and the violin and the fact that she could speak multiple languages.

And he is just

coming out of the house.

He's horrible.

Yes, and she is so polite.

She continues to answer the questions and kind of sidesteps him, just kind of like pretends like he's not making those really off-putting jokes.

But you just said something there about your mom's journey from Texas to LA.

So she had all of those attributes your grandmother had

armed armed her with about being polite and being a lady.

But her journey is kind of remarkable too, because she moved to LA with your eldest sister and kind of lived there by herself as she was making a name for herself.

That just seems pretty, how remarkable was that for the time period.

It was unbelievable.

I am so in awe of what she did, of how ambitious she was and how, you know, undeterred she was.

She had a plan and decided she was going to do it.

And I just don't know that I could have moved to a different state, you know, alone with my four-year-old or five-year-old daughter.

I just am so truly flabbergasted and in awe by what she achieved.

How old was she when she moved to LA?

I think she was 21.

Wow, yeah.

But you didn't always feel that way about the story.

Like you had to come into feeling that pride.

Yes, and I think as a young child, I was like, things were more black and white, and I wanted things to fit nicely in a box, and I wanted a, you know, quote-unquote normal mom and, you know, polite and respectful mom.

And, you know, not this sort of wild card with this voice that I didn't understand.

But now...

later and having a career, I'm married, I have three children, I have a foundation for victims of sexual assault, and it's so much.

And this is, you know, we're in a different time.

And the fact that she navigated so much in the 50s, a girl from a small town in Texas, I just don't know how she did it.

There's this candid photo you talk about often where there was just something about this photo that allowed you to really see your mother, not like this Hollywood bombshell, but like the woman.

And I was wondering, what was it about the photo?

Can you describe it?

Well, I think there were several.

There were several photos.

I think one of the things that I

was searching for in the making of this documentary was were the candid shots, were the woman behind the pose.

I think that

to be glamorous and what that takes to have the perfect outfit and to do your hair and makeup and to have all these children who always looked impeccable and all the focus, external focus that was going on at the time, and what it took to be just so.

And then this pose of I'm a sex symbol, I'm a bombshell, I'm glamorous, and all those things.

I think I was just looking for

the person behind that.

And so, in going through hundreds and hundreds, well, I think thousands actually of photos of her and finding those private moments, those were my ways in, into her soul.

I would catch an expression that I never saw or just a private thought or a private moment and I would be like, ah, there you are, there you are.

And one of the most, I think, sacred and profound moments for me and getting to know my mom and seeing another side of her was in 1957 watching her play the violin on the Ed Sullivan show and seeing the expression on her face and seeing

her focus and her private connection to the music and the violin and just witnessing her artistry in such a pure way and so simply and in such a quiet way was

extraordinary to me.

Marishka, let's talk a little bit about this archival material because you had so much and there is this very powerful moment when you take us inside of this storage unit that no one had gone through since 1969?

No.

Okay.

Which was, which just in itself was absolutely staggering to me.

Yes.

Right.

But I,

you know, this, this film was, was, a, was an archaeological dig.

I'd like to sort of call it that, because that's truly what it felt like.

You know, once I decided it was during COVID when I had the time and space to sort of think about all of this and think about her and finally face some of the letters and that people had written me over the years, you know,

and many of them are about my mom, but they were so personal and just it felt so overwhelming to me to even address them because I had so many feelings about it that I just put them all in a box.

So it was during 2020 when I finally had the space and I started to open these letters and read them and take in all the gorgeous things that people were saying and these moments that people were sharing.

And they were just felt like I was holding treasures in my hand, these precious memories.

This one woman had said who played violin with her.

She said she used to sit out in my mom's driveway and listen to her practice the violin.

And that was so extraordinary and just exquisite to me.

And so what I did is I started cold calling these people.

You would wait, wait, wait.

You would call up fans who wrote you and they'd pick up the phone and you'd say, hi, this is Marishka Harcate.

You wrote me 10 years ago.

Yes.

Yes, that is actually what happened.

And sometimes 20 years ago.

And then sometimes maybe the person wouldn't no longer be with us and I would speak with their, you know, either their spouse or their children.

But it was so beautiful.

But I got to speak with at least, I would say, five or six people that shared all these, you know, people that went to school with her, people that did, you know, violin with her, people that went to college with her.

It was so amazing and unbelievable, you know, but that's the gift of just doing it, right?

Don't second guess yourself.

So in these letters, I found so much.

And then I started with what else is out there.

And I I realized that we had all these boxes in my parents' garage that nobody had ever opened.

And I

was ready.

And so I said, I'm doing this.

And that's when I actually made the decision to make this documentary and to, you know, do the deep dive.

And some of those boxes were from 1969.

Yes.

Many of those boxes were from when she died between 1967 and 1969 were packed up, right?

I mean, it was, I just hit the, you know, no pun intended, but the mother load here.

There is this moment where you're looking through all of the pictures and awards and stuff, and you say, I wish my siblings were here.

And they're in the documentary.

Actually, the documentary is primarily told through you and your siblings.

But why weren't they there with you during that time?

You know,

I think all of them were a little reticent.

they were hesitant a little scared you know when i approached them and asked them you know if they would do this with me you know when i told them i was doing it at all they were sort of like wait what why why why can't we just let sleeping dogs lie or leave it alone or you know it took them a moment understandably to come around to the idea and again one of the most beautiful moments for me is when they all gave me their blessing and they said,

yes, we'll do this because we trust you.

But when I did start, you know, still, I said, I'm shooting this day and I want to go open the boxes and I would love you to come, you know, but all of them were working.

You know, they were like, I can't, I can't, I can't.

I said, okay, okay, guys, I get it.

You know, all on your own time.

So,

you know, it took a little convincing on my part.

Finally, I said, please come.

I just don't want to open these boxes without you.

I don't.

It's ours to open.

It's our mother.

It's not mine.

I don't want to have this experience alone.

And so that's when they said, okay, okay, okay.

And they came.

I wanted to know

how it's been now that you all have spoken about it, now that you all have talked so openly about it.

You know,

my

feeling in life is

the only way out is through.

That is sort of my anthem or philosophy.

And so

I know that hearing the truth can be

extremely painful and there's a lot of painful things about this story.

But for me,

making this film

has been

extremely organizing to me.

Instead of being bombarded by all these things and clips and stories and like images and

putting it into a linear frame has been healing to me.

And I also made this movie to break generational trauma

because so much, many of us carry generational trauma with us, generational trauma that we're aware of, and so many times generational trauma that we're not aware of.

And so, in

our

quest to heal,

that has to be something that we take in, like what is ours to carry, and what is not ours to carry, and learning for ourselves, how do we separate that out?

And so, in making this movie, that was also one of my agendas, is how do I I take what's mine, carry that, work through that, but not carry what is not mine to carry?

How do I break that cycle so I don't pass it on to my children?

Our guest today is award-winning actress and documentary and Marishka Hargate.

We'll be right back after a short break.

I'm Tanya Mosley, and this is Fresh Air.

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Mickey Hargate raised you.

He was the only father you knew, but one of the big revelations is that Mickey was not your biological father, but another man, Nelson Sardelli, is your biological dad.

And I wondered about that, if there was a moment, because he died many years ago, but if there was a moment when you realized you didn't have to keep this secret in service of him.

Well, I think there was a lot of things.

I think that, you know, I have two adopted children, and it's been extraordinary to look at myself like as adopted and how beautiful that is, that idea of being truly chosen in that way.

And I think that is what this story has given to me is that

the antithesis, right, of feeling unclaimed or not worthy of being chosen or unimportant or all these things that I sort of couldn't make sense out of.

You know, why wasn't I claimed, as I say in the movie, why didn't he come find me?

And why wasn't my dad honest with me?

Why did everybody keep this secret for me?

But at the end of the day, I feel more claimed, more chosen than ever.

I think as I matured, I realized there is nothing to be gained by keeping this untruth going.

And

because I have the utmost love and respect for my father, I wanted to make a movie that was truly a love letter to him.

You never doubted the love that the people around you had for you.

You knew you were loved, but you always suspected there was something that you didn't know.

Can you describe that feeling of just knowing there was something?

I always

felt that I didn't belong on some level.

I always felt that I was

different.

I was other

in some way.

And I just couldn't put my finger on it.

But it made me crazy because

when you have your

intuition

and when you're told, you know, my father was so,

he really instilled in us that we have our own sense of honor, our own sense of truth.

We know.

And one of the greatest gifts of my life, really,

and for anyone, I think, is to trust their own intuition and to learn to trust that inner voice, that super quiet inner voice, you know, of knowing.

So there was just something always off.

And, you know, when we feel like that, we look for ways to make that true.

Like we have a predictive brain, right?

So I looked for that.

You know, when I was little, my grandmother would say this thing, you know, I'm all you have.

Or when my parents sent me to be with my grandmother without my brothers, I was like, they don't love me as much.

Something's wrong with me.

I'm different.

Why did they only send me?

Why are they separating the family?

And there were little things like that, millions of little things.

So I just felt

that on some level,

I didn't belong with them.

I wasn't of them, but it didn't make sense.

You found out like the first inkling from the president of your mom's fan club.

That's just a detail that I find, wow.

But did you ever carry any anger that those around you knew more about about you than you knew about yourself?

Yes.

Yes, yes, yes.

I remember, like it was yesterday

sort of keeping myself together in front of Sabin after he showed me the photo and knowing in a moment.

Saban is the president of the fan club.

Yes, Saban Gray, who's just, you know, lovely and did nothing but love my mom and honor her and is just was

always a very positive, I think, force and positive person.

And I held it together, but when I got in my car, I remember having an out-of-body experience.

And one of the things that I didn't put in the movie, which I wish I had,

when I left Sabin's house, it was in Hollywood, and I drove to West Hollywood where my father was literally building me a house.

How is that for a metaphor?

Wow.

And I went up there to the house, you know, and that's when I confronted him.

And that's when I said, why didn't you tell me?

Why didn't you tell me?

And, you know, the vehemence with which he denied it was

extraordinary.

You know, he just said, that's not true, Marishka.

You're my daughter.

What are you talking about?

This is ridiculous.

And that is the moment I remember it happening physically in my body when when I

looked at him and saw his pain and saw that he wasn't ready to deal with this new reality, this new fact that he made since I was three years old.

And that's when I went, this is mine to carry, not yours.

And I love you.

And I knew that he was coming from the most

pure

place.

And that's when I decided that I was the one that would say, okay, dad, got it.

I'm sorry.

It must be bad information.

I just read it in a book.

And we let it go.

And even, you know, 10 years later, after that, he said, remember when you thought that crazy thing?

And I would be like, yeah, that was nuts.

How old were you around that time?

How old were you?

Well, when I found out 25, when I learned of Nelson and saw the photo and just knew it was true.

And then I just, you know, that, as I say in the film, that's after that, there were some bad bad years.

My identity crisis and me just trying to figure out where to put it.

And I had to deal with it on my own.

And then when I went to my sister, she said, I thought you knew.

Everyone knows.

And then I went to Tony, my little brother, and he goes, oh, yeah,

I thought you knew.

But Mickey and Zoli, my brothers, they didn't know.

And, you know, that's also why my dad said, don't read the books.

Can you describe for me, though, what it was like to look into your biological father's face, to look into Nelson Sardelli's face for the first time?

Gosh, I don't know that I have the words for it, but

it was like putting in that final piece of the hardest puzzle you've ever put together.

It was,

I could actually

feel

my cells in my body

like exhale.

It was

like such a

affirmation

that I was right,

that I that I knew something.

And I think it's funny, I don't think I've thought of this until this moment in your question, but I think it was the moment too that I learned to trust myself in such a deep level because I always knew something and I was right.

I was right.

So when I met him

and everything made sense and he was kind

and he was protective and so loving and loved his own daughter so much and understood me and what I needed and understood the boundary.

And I said, listen to me, I have a father.

I don't want anything from you.

I just wanted to know.

And we stayed up all night, and it was like finding your long-lost,

a long-lost piece of you.

And it was also really beautiful because one of the things was so hard for me is I used to study my dad's face and be like, but I don't, he has this perfect Roman nose.

It's so sharp and perfect.

You know, he was so perfect looking, but I couldn't find the similarities.

And when I saw Nelson's face, I went, oh,

that's my face.

You have that nose.

You have, I mean, every single feature.

And everything made sense.

And I just felt strangely,

uncomfortably hum.

Our guest today is award-winning actress and documentary and Marishka Hargate.

We'll continue our conversation after a short break.

This is Fresh Air.

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You mentioned earlier that you thought you were going to be a comedian, like you were totally into comedy.

And I want to know first off when you decided you wanted to be an actor and what your actual aspirations were.

It was in high school.

And I went to an all-girls private Catholic high school.

And my favorite nun, who was also my English teacher, wait a minute.

Was she my science teacher?

Wait, I'm trying to think because now I'm confusing the years.

That's That's just age, people.

I forgot what she taught me.

It doesn't matter.

But the point is, is that she said, I think you should try out for a play.

And at the time, I was not interested in being an actor.

People had asked me my whole life, are you going to be an actor like your mother?

I said, nope, not interested.

And on the other hand, was interested in languages and did.

want to do something where I would travel.

I love traveling.

We traveled a lot as a family.

And

I spoke French at the time.

And the idea was to be a French diplomat, something that connected people, where I could translate and bring people together.

And then she said, I think you should try out for a play.

And so I did.

It was a French farce.

And I've never had more fun in my life.

And then

my senior year, I tried out for the lead in our play,

and I got that.

And it was obviously a straight play and

I

fell in love with acting.

It wasn't until I started

in my 20s and I would get a lot you know guest spots and stuff and I just fell in love with comedy and so then I thought okay this is what I'm gonna do.

You know I had done Seinfeld and you know single guy and a bunch of shows and auditioned for friends and I thought that was my genre.

That's what I wanted to do.

I actually want to play a clip from Seinfeld.

This was the fourth season.

It was a season finale, 1993.

And in this clip, it's kind of meta because you are actually reading for the role of Elaine Bennis in The Pilot.

Let's listen.

Melissa Shannon.

Hi.

Hi, Susanna.

Melissa is reading for Elaine.

It's like a bald convention out there.

Sorry, I made a football.

No, he didn't.

He knows he's bald.

So how about the guy wearing sweatpants?

I mean, did he do that for the part?

Does he walk around like that?

Okay,

shall we start?

You know what?

I'll read with her.

Oh, great.

Alright, want to start?

Yeah.

Okay.

What was that look?

What looked?

That look you just gave me.

I gave a look?

Yes.

Thank you.

Thank you, Vimel.

Let's see some more framers.

That was Marishka Hargate from season four of Seinfeld 1993.

What do you remember about that particular being on Seinfeld and kind of playing these roles where you get to stretch your comedic chops?

Oh, I loved it.

I mean, I remember my first episode of ER.

It was the same thing where,

you know, I was reading, you know, it's a drama, and I went in there and tried to find as much funny as I could.

And my scene on ER was

like a comedy scene.

And that's also when I said, this is what I want to do.

Now, it's very difficult for me to do that on SVU, but I miss it.

I miss it so much, you know, finding that lightness.

And those are some of my favorite shows, right?

When you're laughing and crying and laughing and crying, you don't know what to do.

Our guest today is award-winning actress and documentary and Marishka Hargate.

Her new documentary, My Mom Jane, explores the life and legacy of her mother, actress Jane Mansfield.

You didn't like the way your mother had to kind of adhere to the studio system, the kind of thing she had to do in building this persona.

How did that affect the way that you approached acting and trying to be successful in Hollywood?

I just went in with a little bit my own point of view and had a little bit of

armor, maybe,

and I wasn't as accommodating and tried to check with myself as much as I was capable at the time, even being young, where if something didn't feel right to me, I'd push back.

Like, you don't tell me, I tell you, because so many people told her what to do, and people with bad advice, and people with not the best intentions, and people that were disrespectful and rude and had an agenda.

And when I think back to that Jack Parr interview, I mean, that is the thing that people say

that was one of the most painful parts of the film: watching Jack Parr be so disrespectful.

It's disgusting how he was and how he treated her and the sexism.

Like, it always heartens me when people come out of the movie and they tell me all their feelings, but one of the things they always say,

that Jack Parr.

And it's something that, you know, still goes on, but hopefully much less so.

And at least women have their voices more than they did then.

Well,

that's a discussion for another day.

But the point is, is that I had to do it my way.

Yeah.

There are so many prophetic moments that you bring up.

I mean, this is what makes you mentioning intergenerational trauma from generation to generation until someone like you actually makes the point to see it and stop it.

And name it.

Because if it's not named, it's just out there floating around.

And so that's why I say this was organizing, both internally and externally.

Organizing to name what happened.

I wonder how you make sense of some of those prophetic moments.

Like we learn in this documentary that your mother lost her father at three years old after he had a heart attack.

while driving and she was in the car.

And there's also this interview where your mother talks about that if she's ever in a car accident or in a terrible mishap, that her children will always be

cared for.

How do you interpret those things?

Do you see them as coincidences or something bigger?

Do they hold meaning for you?

They hold a lot of meaning for me.

And I think that in many ways, our word is our wand.

It is prophetic.

And so it's something that made me understand her and think, what what was she thinking?

She carried that.

She carried her father dying in a car with her whole life.

And then she said it, consciously, unconsciously.

And so for me, I'm very aware

that when I turned 34, I was very scared that

I was going to die.

Because that was the age that she died.

Yeah, that was the age that she died.

I was very scared.

And actually at 34, I ended up having a

I was in a motorcycle accident and

I was on the back of a friend's motorcycle and I remember when the car hit the motorcycle I went flying through the air and I remember going because it all happened in slow-mo and I remember going oh my god this is it this is how I'm gonna die I can't believe I'm gonna die at 34 like my mother and then I landed on the asphalt and I said said,

I'm alive and I'm not dying.

And that was my aha moment.

That is when I said,

this cycle is breaking

now.

I will not carry this with me.

Her life is not my life.

And I remember very cognizant that this accident was somehow some kind of wake-up call or something because it was just too weird.

And from

then, that day, I mean, I couldn't walk for like, I don't know, 10 days, but it ended up, I didn't even break my ankle.

It was like a bad, bad sprain.

And I just remembered going, God,

I got it.

I got it.

And I will not carry this anymore.

So again, this whole journey has been a long time coming.

And I'm so grateful for all of it because that's what it took.

to shake me out of that kind of generational trauma, the stuff that I carried, always being so scared.

Well, my mom's dad died when he was 34, she died when she was 34, so I must be on my way out here.

Wait, I didn't realize that your grandfather died at 34?

Oh, yeah.

Wow.

Yeah.

So this is what I mean about the generational trauma that we carry unconsciously.

And I mean, not to get into the whole, you know, psychology of it, but I, but I am a big fan of Jung.

And I do believe that, you know, our unconscious is trying to heal and move us forward and if we don't get it if we don't do the internal work if we don't look at our shadow side it will deal with us

our guest today is award-winning actress and documentary and Marischka Hargate we'll continue our conversation after a short break this is fresh air support for this podcast and the following message come from Fisher Investments.

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Marishka, can we talk about Olivia Benson?

We're learning right now the embodiment of the person behind that character.

And you are known as one of the most nurturing female characters on television.

When people meet you, they treat you as if you are her, don't they?

They do.

And a big part of me is.

And a big part of you is.

I mean, you have now taken that work that you do on Law and Order, and it is now a part of your life through your foundation, through your documentary work.

You're also a real-life certified rape counselor.

Can you tell us quickly how that came about?

It was very simple.

It was the statistics that I learned when I started the show and when I started doing the research for SVU and to play this character.

And I

went to

a gala by the Mount Sinai Sexual Assault Violence Intervention program honoring Dick Wolfe.

And it was that night when I learned the statistics of sexual assault that one in three women would be sexually assaulted in their lifetime and one in four women would be assaulted by the time they were 18 and one in six men.

And these statistics are changing all the time.

But the night that I learned that, which was the first year of SVU, I

could not believe what I was hearing.

And I felt like it was my business, my calling.

to help at least join forces with those who'd been fighting this fight and try to do what I can and understanding that I had this incredible platform.

And so it really just became a calling to me And that so much of sexual assault was being swept under the rug and living and breeding in this darkness.

And here SVU was this fantastically progressive show that was shining a light on it.

And the fact that it was on television made it water cooler conversation.

And all of a sudden, the fan mail that I was receiving was very different from the fan mail I had received on ER.

You know,

Marishka, I love your character.

I love that show.

Could I get an autographed picture?

Became, dear Marishka, I was sexually abused and I've never told anyone.

It was women and men disclosing their stories of abuse for the first time and learning that all of them were living in shame and isolation and blame and fear.

And

it was the privilege, really, of my life to be able to

give back and help elevate these voices and these stories.

You know things that we don't know because you receive these thousands of letters over the course of your career.

What's the one thing about abuse, about

this issue that you take on oftentimes on the show that still frustrates you that like society doesn't get?

That the blame is placed on the victim, victim-blaming attitudes,

And

even in the way we talk about rape, we say,

I was raped.

Where is the perpetrator in that sentence?

Why is our language about sexual assault constructed like that?

Why is it I was raped instead of he raped me?

And that's something that I'm actively trying to change now about how we talk about it.

Because the fact that the perpetrator is not in the construction of that sentence is

a crime.

Marishka Hargatay, what a privilege it has been to be in conversation with you.

Thank you so much for this documentary and for your time.

You're welcome.

Thank you for having me.

Marishka Hargate's new documentary is called My Mom Jane.

She's also the founder of the Joyful Heart Foundation, which has worked since 2004 to support sexual abuse survivors and end violence.

Tomorrow on Fresh Air, comic comic and actor Mark Marin talks about panic, grief, his problematic cats, and his expanding acting career.

He also shares why he's ending his popular podcast, WTF, which he launched in the early days of podcasting.

Marin has a new HBO comedy special called Panicked, and he's the subject of a new documentary.

I hope you can join us.

To keep up with what's on the show and get highlights of our interviews, follow us on Instagram at NPRFreshAir.

Fresh Air's executive producer is Danny Miller.

Our technical director and engineer is Audrey Bentham.

Our managing producer is Sam Brigher.

Our interviews and reviews are produced and edited by Phyllis Myers, Anne-Marie Boldonado, Lauren Crinzel, Teresa Madden, Monique Nazareth, Thea Challener, Susan Yakundi, Anna Bauman, and John Sheehan.

Our digital media producer is Molly Sebi-Nesper.

Our consulting visual producer is Hope Wilson.

Roberta Shirock directs the show.

With Terry Gross, I'm Tanya Mosley.

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