Maya Hawke

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Hello, everyone. Welcome to another episode of Good Hang.

Speaker 1 I'm really, really excited about this episode with the great Maya Hawk. We had such a good conversation.
We used so many words, and I just love talking to her.

Speaker 1 And we talk about really interesting things today. We talk about growing up in New York City and being a kid there.
We talk about her love of magic and wonder and a life of imagination.

Speaker 1 And we talk about joy and anxiety, the characters that we played together in Inside Out 2, and also how those emotions interact and connect in real life. So it was a great convo.

Speaker 1 And as always, we like to

Speaker 1 ask someone who knows our guest, a friend, a fan, someone who has a question that they think I should ask the guest before we start the podcast. So we...

Speaker 1 are joining with Willa Fitzgerald. Willa is an actress.
She's on Pulse right now, a medical show on Netflix. She was in Little Women with Maya Hawk.

Speaker 1 And most excitingly, she's joining us from Hungary, which I believe is also where Budapest

Speaker 1 is.

Speaker 1 So,

Speaker 1 Willa, can you hear me?

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Speaker 1 I'm so grateful. Thank you for calling in from there.
And thank you for talking about the great Maya Hawk today.

Speaker 3 My delight. My delight.

Speaker 2 I know.

Speaker 1 Now, tell me how you two met.

Speaker 3 We met actually in Ireland doing Little Women

Speaker 3 in

Speaker 3 2017.

Speaker 3 And

Speaker 3 I mean, we just fell in love, I think. That would be, it was a love story.
It was a love story for sure.

Speaker 1 You

Speaker 1 both were, she was playing Joe, you were playing Meg. What was it like to play Meg? What did you bring to this Meg?

Speaker 3 I feel like my personal mission was to bring a humanity to her because I feel like she's often sort of like the, she's like the, the two perfect sister a little bit, which is, I think, why people don't love her and relate to her.

Speaker 3 And she also feels a little bit,

Speaker 3 you know, out of our time in the sense that she makes very classically gendered choices with her life.

Speaker 3 And so I feel like, I feel like my personal mission was just to like kind of elucidate why we should like Meg and why we should understand her as like a really kind of relatable, lovely character.

Speaker 3 And I think we did it. I think we actually, I think we did manage to pull that off.

Speaker 1 And here you are, two young actresses at the time joining this production. I think for Maya, it was her first big production.
And what did, how did you, what did you see in each other?

Speaker 1 How did you become friends?

Speaker 3 We really just like bonded because I had already been working, but I was suddenly kind of entering a new phase of my career where I was getting to do this project that I was like just so excited about.

Speaker 3 And it was her first job and she was so excited about it.

Speaker 3 And we just, you know, we would like go to the, we were all staying at this hotel together outside of Dublin and we would like go to the pool together or the steam room and just like talk about what really excited us about being actors.

Speaker 3 And, and we just like really kind of connected on, on like an artistic level and also.

Speaker 3 I think on just a personal level, because I think we're kind of very opposite people in a lot of ways.

Speaker 3 I think that we both like learn a lot from the other person and the way that they navigate the world because it's so different from maybe the way that we ourselves navigate the world.

Speaker 1 How are you different?

Speaker 3 I think that, I think that I'm, I think, you know, the most like reductive two second answer would just be, I think I'm a very cautious person.

Speaker 3 And I think Maya is like full of just like a lust for life and a, and a real sort of like verve that she just is, is unafraid in situations that I sometimes feel a little bit more unsure in, I think.

Speaker 1 Maya does a lot of things, you know, she does, she's on Broadway show.

Speaker 1 She performs, records music with a lot of different bands including solo stuff she's you know she's writing she's acting like she to your point she it feels like she um

Speaker 3 ventures and is adventurous in the stuff that she does what I admire about her so deeply is that she just kind of has this sort of like infinite curiosity and like well of creativity that she seems to be able to draw on.

Speaker 3 She has like a real, she's really interested in just the world around her in a a way that's like so kind of pure and like limitless.

Speaker 1 So we're going to get to the question you have for me to ask Maya, but just before we do, I want to say congratulations on Pulse.

Speaker 2 Oh, thank you.

Speaker 1 I love a medical show.

Speaker 3 Well, you know, Maya was a big reason of why I took that job.

Speaker 2 Ooh, how come?

Speaker 3 Because she loves Gray's Anatomy and she was the one who made me love Gray's Anatomy. And when I was calling her and I was like, I've got this like possible job.
What do you think?

Speaker 3 I want to talk about it.

Speaker 1 And she was like, do it.

Speaker 3 She's like, I will be the biggest fan of this show, please.

Speaker 1 Has it been fun to play that kind of part and like get into the jargon and get into the vibe of what it would be like to be in an emergency room? What's what's been fun?

Speaker 3 I feel like it's like, it's one of the most

Speaker 3 I feel like in those sort of situations where you're like really just playing at a job, it's kind of like the purest expression of like the childhood fantasy of being an actor where you're like, I am now a doctor and I can now save people's lives.

Speaker 2 Like, wow, wow.

Speaker 3 And I think, you know, like, that's like a really cool thing. But no, I loved it.
I love, I do love learning new things. And I learned so much.

Speaker 3 And I'm also just like a little nerd and like loved just going through like the big ass medical pamphlets that we would get given for every episode.

Speaker 3 And stressing, like, you know, oh, yeah, like watching like cadaver videos of like the surgeries and being like, wow, medical school.

Speaker 1 Do you, when you, I, I always try to ask people who are on medical shows, when you cut, do you cut into fake bodies?

Speaker 3 Real bodies.

Speaker 2 Like, do you ever have to put a scalpel in?

Speaker 1 You know, I know that there's fake torsos and stuff.

Speaker 2 Do you do that? Yeah.

Speaker 3 No, we had our like a prosthetics person was from Walking Dead. So our prosthetics were like next level.

Speaker 1 They were like, we're going to use some old zombies. We're going to use this.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 3 They're like, we got this.

Speaker 1 Okay. So.

Speaker 1 Thank you for getting on. And what question do you think I should ask Maya today? Do you have any thoughts?

Speaker 3 I'm curious whether her sort of like lust for life, her ability to be so interested in the world around her was something that she feels is innate to her as a person, or whether it's something that she feels like was cultivated either by herself, by her community, by her parents.

Speaker 3 And

Speaker 3 if so, like whether there's a specific moment in which she like recalls seeing the world in that way from a young age.

Speaker 1 You know, what's great about that question is I think people really reduce

Speaker 1 the children of of actors and artists in the way that they talk about, you know, what is it like being, you know, considered a Nepo baby? You know, you're in the same profession as your parents.

Speaker 1 When, in fact, like, what is it like growing up with artists that are parents and how do they introduce you to art? And also, what is it like being a New York City kid?

Speaker 1 I mean, a lot of people don't know the feeling of growing up in the city and what that's like, like what you're, what you get to see or, um, or what you don't get to see, you know, like, how does it limit you and how does it open you up?

Speaker 1 And I think that's a great question. Really? Well done.
You seem like a woman in her 30s who has her shit together. Congratulations.

Speaker 2 Thank you.

Speaker 3 I mean, you know, it's all an illusion.

Speaker 1 Really, really nice to meet you. It's such a pleasure.
Thank you so much for the time and for helping me get to know Maya a little more. I really appreciate it.

Speaker 3 So fun.

Speaker 1 Thank you again.

Speaker 1 Bye.

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Speaker 1 Maya Hawk is with me. Maya, I'm so happy to see you.

Speaker 2 I'm so happy to see you. You know, we haven't seen each other in person since Inside Out 2 premiere

Speaker 2 shenanigans. Dude, that movie.
I know.

Speaker 2 That movie made people so happy. I know.

Speaker 2 I feel so seen.

Speaker 1 What have you had people come up and say to you about that movie?

Speaker 2 It's been one of the great honors. Like my little sister was asking me the other day, she was like, do you get annoyed if someone asks you to do the anxiety voice? Or do you get annoyed?

Speaker 2 And I was like, not at all. Like, sometimes if someone wants me to go put on like an ice cream scooper uniform, I'm like, I'm done with the ice cream scooper uniform.

Speaker 2 But, and like, and, but if there was a while where that wasn't true, but with this movie, the, that character, I've had so many people feel so seen by it. And like little kids feel so seen by it.

Speaker 2 And like it helped them understand their brain better and like I'll get a call from a friend's parent like from like a parent a friend of mine who is a parent not a friend's parent um and be like hey would you do a recording like my kid's going through this hard time would you record something in the voice for my kid and I'll be like sure and I'll turn on the little speaker and be like hi oh I know it's really scary when parents have to go to the doctor's office and I know that it makes you nervous and I and I but the thing is you just take deep breaths and trust that your daddy will be safe and that the doctors are gonna take great care of him and like I um, and so I like, we'll do things like that.

Speaker 2 And I don't mind at all. I love it because it's so.

Speaker 1 I know. I feel the same.
I feel like you and I had a couple moments when we were doing press where we kept looking at each other like, whoa, this feels so much bigger than us.

Speaker 1 And the response of the movie was so beautiful. And

Speaker 1 I know that that is very rare to be in something good

Speaker 1 that people like, that people go to see,

Speaker 1 that is a good experience. Those don't always

Speaker 2 good for the world. And that is good for the world.

Speaker 2 That's like, it's so, so rare to have it hit all those benchmarks. It's like a rainbow.

Speaker 1 I know. Plus a billion dollars, babe.

Speaker 2 Well, that's what I'm saying. For someone that makes a billion dollars and is good for the world, I don't think there's anything that does that.

Speaker 1 No, it's crazy.

Speaker 2 No, I mean, it is so true.

Speaker 1 Like the word billion and good for the world doesn't go together.

Speaker 2 It does not go together. No, of anything.

Speaker 1 What have you learned about anxiety in the past year, your own or others, because you played that character?

Speaker 2 So much. And I think with like the joy-anxiety relationship,

Speaker 2 it taught me a lot about showing love.

Speaker 2 to that part of myself

Speaker 2 and like allowing other people to see it so they can show it love.

Speaker 2 And that that is all

Speaker 2 actually a way to calm it down

Speaker 2 is like inviting it into the conversation, like looking at what it thinks and is worried about and kind of addressing each point and then ask, and then like offering it a comfortable chair and saying, Okay, you're invited.

Speaker 2 You know, you're not, I'm not trying to shut you out behind a door. Yes.
Because that, of course, just works it up even more. Yes.

Speaker 2 And so I think in giving, the biggest thing I learned from doing this and being allowed to be welcomed into the beautiful world of this movie is to give my anxiety a comfy chair. Yes,

Speaker 2 that's so well said.

Speaker 2 And for people listening right now, like everybody is so stressed.

Speaker 2 Of course they are.

Speaker 1 Of course they are.

Speaker 2 And I mean anxiety might be the defining emotion of our time.

Speaker 1 It's been, it was so fun to work

Speaker 1 on on those characters together because

Speaker 1 when the time is very scary, like these times, you know, you want to find a way to tune in, check out, help yourself, help other people. Like you want to dip in and out.

Speaker 1 But when you're just getting someone going, like toxic positivity, like this is great. It's like, babe, things are bad.

Speaker 2 Things are bad.

Speaker 1 These are real bad. So anybody listening, I want you to know that we know.

Speaker 2 Things are bad. Bad.

Speaker 2 But also if you shut joy out completely. Yes.
Like

Speaker 2 then

Speaker 2 you still need to welcome in some. Like you're not helping anybody if if you shut out joy completely.

Speaker 1 Well, there's a beautiful moment in the movie, and it's such a testament to the work you did as anxiety and the work the animators do and the work that Kelsey Mann did, the director, and Pete Doctor, the producer, and all the artists, and Pete, the creator, and just all the writers.

Speaker 1 Meg,

Speaker 1 when

Speaker 1 anxiety,

Speaker 1 does a small little gesture to let, when joy is being finally called back. Yeah.
Finally, Riley, our character, has finally calmed herself down on the ice. She's talked to her friends.

Speaker 1 She's feeling a little bit like herself. She gets back on the ice.
She starts skating. And Joy is being called back.

Speaker 1 And anxiety does a little, I told you this, like a little genu fleck, like a little gesture of like this way.

Speaker 1 Like, for people listening, you can't see what Maya and I are doing, but we're doing a little bit of a little bit of a little bit of a little, like,

Speaker 1 your table is over here.

Speaker 2 Michael, yeah.

Speaker 1 It made me cry so hard. And I just thought, oh, like the tiny gesture of that is like what we're just, we must try to do during this bananas foster time we're living in.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 Because that is, I mean, whatever we can do, babe.

Speaker 2 Well, and to make room for each other. Yeah.

Speaker 2 And like, and to make room to get off of our phones, which we were talking about before we started rolling, but to get off of our phones where we're just being bombarded by like, here's a funny video of a cat.

Speaker 2 Here's a video of the apocalypse. Here's a like, here's a funny joke that is offensive.
Here's a funny joke that's your humor, but would offend someone else. Here's another video of the apocalypse.

Speaker 2 Like, it's like to get out of that and into, like, oh, here you and I are sitting with each other. We're looking each other in the eyes.
We can still do this. Yes.

Speaker 2 We can still talk and be and make space for each other and like, you know, look at the people around us.

Speaker 2 And that we have to make time to do that, even as we make time to try to figure out out what is happening.

Speaker 1 I agree. And I, you know, I kind of experience you as an old soul.
Have you been told that?

Speaker 2 I have been. There's been some ageist claims about my soul made.

Speaker 1 You must get this a lot. People talk, they roll their eyes about their twenty about people's 20s.
And what's good about being in your 20s?

Speaker 2 Oh, what's good about being in your 20s? I mean,

Speaker 2 I'm already starting to have more random body pain,

Speaker 2 but I know I have less than I will have. So like it's a more pain-free time.

Speaker 1 Recovery is faster.

Speaker 2 Recovery is faster. Yes.

Speaker 2 So, that's good. I still like,

Speaker 2 I can still,

Speaker 2 I, yeah, just general recovery, bounce back from things more quickly, emotional recovery, um, indepe, like independence. Yeah.

Speaker 2 You know, it's like this kind of miracle window before insane amounts of responsibility, but after independence where no one's telling you what to do.

Speaker 2 And that's like, that's the miracle of your 20s, right? Is that like your responsibilities are there, but they're not like usually kids and family, you know, or they can be, but, you know,

Speaker 2 yet, but they are, but you have this freedom. And that's a cool window of time.
And so me.

Speaker 1 The Concord window is such a good way to say it, Maya, that like you're very wise. It's true.
It's like, if only one can know the time they're in and appreciate the time they're in, it's hard to do.

Speaker 1 Yeah, it is. Yeah.

Speaker 1 Okay. Speaking of the time you're in, I want to jump back to little Maya.

Speaker 2 Yes.

Speaker 1 Because I'm always really interested in what it's like being a New York kid.

Speaker 2 I was kind of a sad kid or like set point melancholic, you know, like moody and emotional and homey and like, I, but a New York City kid is awesome. You so much stuff to to look at and do.

Speaker 2 Like my favorite place to go was the Metropolitan Museum of Art, Temple of Dendor, because of the mixed up files of Mrs. Basile Frankweiler.
Do you remember that book? Of course. And the kids like

Speaker 2 ran away, for anyone who hasn't read it, they run away and they live inside the Metropolitan Museum of Art and they sleep in the queen's bed and they steal money from the fountain and it's awesome.

Speaker 2 And I love that book and I loved going to the Met and I loved going to the Natural History Museum and I loved going to the zoo. And there was just like so much to do

Speaker 2 activity based on a general as like a little kid. And I love that and so many different ways to express all your weird interests.
Like I had lots of weird interests as a kid.

Speaker 2 I loved like dead insects, like the ones that preserve dead insects. And I loved going to see them at the science museum and I loved rocks.

Speaker 2 And there was like, you know, just so much exposure and different kinds of people you could decide to be. Yeah.
And so much interaction with difference. And that was so.

Speaker 2 cool and I think so rare because so many people grow up in these little communities where it's like everyone feels the same.

Speaker 2 But in this city, you're like interacting with humanity all the time and you get to decide who you are, which is great.

Speaker 2 And then you get to high school and it's like being in college for other people like it is crazy I went to more clubs between ninth and 12th grade than I have been since like right like there's a lot of pressure for New York kids to be very

Speaker 1 interesting

Speaker 2 They there's a lot of pressure to be interesting, to be adult, to be on the town. Yes.

Speaker 2 There's a lot, a lot of that.

Speaker 1 Did you ever have like a 13-year-old like, I'm in studio 54 and I don't know how I got here. Like

Speaker 2 you did. Yes.

Speaker 1 Where you're just in a club and it's like, I'm little.

Speaker 2 I might be too young for that. I'm too little for this.

Speaker 2 Interesting. Seemed like a good idea at first.
I'm proud of myself for getting in here, but now how do I get out? But I love it. I would do it.
I would raise kids in New York.

Speaker 2 I think it's awesome, an awesome way to grow up.

Speaker 1 To your point, there was an independence. You took the subway, you walked around, you kind of figured out life.
What were some memories of that time time when you felt like adult or grown up? Ooh.

Speaker 1 You know, a moment where

Speaker 1 you had like an adult moment.

Speaker 2 Well, I realized in high school that I could cut class. Yeah.

Speaker 2 And that like, the, that there was like no real ramifications to doing it. And so I started like just doing my own thing like like during the day.

Speaker 2 And I probably, I, at high school, I experimented with smoking cigarettes um which you shouldn't do and is bad but very very bad very very very bad very very bad do not do it you look very cool don't do it yeah don't do it don't do it but you look cool yeah and I but I couldn't buy cigarettes because I was a kid and so I would occasionally like walk around to try to bum cigarettes off people.

Speaker 2 This is what I'm talking about.

Speaker 1 This is what I picture a New York kid doing.

Speaker 2 But I went to school in Brooklyn Heights. And the only people who smoke in Brooklyn Heights are like construction workers and they smoke Newports and I hated Newports.

Speaker 2 So I would take the subway to, this is a ridiculous story, to the East Village so I could bum Marlborough Golds off of, because people in the East Village smoke Marlborough Golds like outside McNally Jackson bookstore.

Speaker 2 And so I would like take the so on my free period, my lunch break or whatever, I'd like be like, I won't go to math today.

Speaker 2 I'll just like take a double peer free period and I'll go take the subway to Greenwich Village or the East Village and bum a Marlborough Gold off some like intelligent, like handsome man smoking smoking outside of a bookstore.

Speaker 2 Some documentary filmmaker. Some documentary filmmaker, like sipping a cappuccino.
And I was like, I am a grown-up and this is an adventure.

Speaker 1 That's exactly the kind of story I picture.

Speaker 1 Just getting on the subway for a cigarette.

Speaker 2 Because you have a preference, a neighborhood-based cigarette preference.

Speaker 2 Truly ridiculous.

Speaker 1 I mean, during that time, there was probably a sense of you when you knew deep down, even in high school, like, I'm not going to worry so much about math. I'm going to be an actor.
Yes.

Speaker 1 I know what I'm going to do. When did you know you were going to be an actor? You know, when did you feel like I'm going to really make this my job or my life?

Speaker 2 I knew I was going to be like an artist of some kind. I think I was, I mean, I think I was really afraid.

Speaker 2 of being an actor because my parents are both actors and I got to see that, you know, they were as successful as one as I could ever have dreamed to be in that profession and still had so much job insecurity and stress and highs and low moments.

Speaker 2 And I was like, I don't know if this seems fun.

Speaker 2 And like, and, you know, I had experiences of like going to school and like trying to leave my house with like an umbrella because there was some article out and there was paparazzi around the house.

Speaker 2 And I was like, this seems, eh,

Speaker 2 like, I don't know about this.

Speaker 2 And so it wasn't until like 11th grade where I realized that there was nothing else that I was good at and liked.

Speaker 2 And I was like,

Speaker 2 you know, like, I just, I like this. I am good at it.
I feel like this is my community, like the other people who like this, I like them.

Speaker 2 And

Speaker 2 they put up with me because they'll put up with anyone. You know, that's great about the theater community.
They will put up with anyone unless you're mean.

Speaker 2 And, but

Speaker 2 I, so I just like found my home and I was like, okay, I'll figure out that other stuff. This is what I want to do.

Speaker 1 Okay, this is a great, that's a great segue into our, so we do this thing at the beginning of each show where we talk to people who know our guests.

Speaker 2 Oh, no. Yes.

Speaker 1 And just to talk well behind their back. And it always kind of helps me figure out if there's questions I should ask.
of my guest and also to get to know the guests more.

Speaker 1 And we talk to your friend Willa, Fitzgerald.

Speaker 2 She's the best.

Speaker 1 She's the best. Now, you two met on the set of Little Women.

Speaker 2 Still the greatest experience of my life.

Speaker 1 Wait, tell us why.

Speaker 2 It was my first professional job. I

Speaker 1 had to,

Speaker 2 I had to drop out of school to do it, and I was really worried about it, and it was like, oh, whatever. I get to Ireland.
We're in this town called Dunlearie.

Speaker 2 I've just never had an experience this positive. It was the four sisters and the guy who played Laurie.
And we...

Speaker 2 fell in love with each other. And we were staying at this seaside hotel in this port town.
And it was the Royal Marine was the name of this hotel.

Speaker 2 And it was like walking distance from this farmer's market and these restaurants. And we just loved each other.
And, you know, it's gone for me now. I'm already so old.
I can't stay awake forever.

Speaker 2 But do you remember when you were like 18 and 19 and you just didn't need to sleep at all? Yes. Like somehow I could work a full 14-hour shooting day and then be like, should we go out? Yeah.

Speaker 2 Like, and then like, you know, and then I'll learn my lines and then I'll go to sleep for two hours and then go back to her.

Speaker 2 I don't know how we did it, but it might have just been the raw joy of how in love with each other we were.

Speaker 2 Like we were going to set on the days that we weren't working and being like, I have a note, you should try this in the next scene.

Speaker 1 We just, it was just like acting, acting like that.

Speaker 2 It was just like acting. We love it.
And we love each other. And we're all,

Speaker 2 this is just Ireland and it's the ocean.

Speaker 2 And like, we did a moon spell where there was a full moon and we bought crystals from this guy in town and we put the crystals in the moon and then we went skinny dipping in the port and it was freezing and it was like just

Speaker 2 happy. It was a happy.
That sounds fun. That sounds so fun.
I mean,

Speaker 1 she was talking, I mean, she adores you. And she was talking about exactly that, like how you all connected so fast.
And she was saying that there is this, you have this lust for life.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 1 that

Speaker 1 one of her questions was,

Speaker 1 do you feel like that's always been innate? Like, it's kind of what we're talking about, nature versus nurture. You're the, you're, you know, you have, you're the daughter of artists.

Speaker 1 You're looking at want, you want to be an artist. Do I want, like, do I want the life of an artist? What does that even look like?

Speaker 1 But there is always like this little thing inside all of us from the minute we're born, anyway. Like, did you always feel like you had that some kind of lust for life?

Speaker 1 And her question is: Do you think it was innate or was it nurtured by the environment that you were in, or both?

Speaker 2 I think both. Yeah,

Speaker 2 I think I've like always believed in magic and always believed in love in a really intense way. And I think that that was nurtured in me from a really young age.
Like,

Speaker 2 my, you know, my parents are magical and like my mom like you know was this magical creature who like you know would come home from work and she was like looking fabulous but she'd take everything off and immediately put on like a big velvet skirt and gardening gloves and go outside and like teach me how to like pull up stinging nettles to make soup and like and the soup would be a witch's potion because it was good for you and like she just had this magic to her and my dad would be like, we're going to watercolor together and we're going to make a masterpiece.

Speaker 2 And like, I'll do this blue and you do red and we'll see what we create. Like there was just this imagination fostered in me from a really young age.
And I just like, I believed

Speaker 2 I was really lucky to get that kind of love and that kind of exposure to seeing the world as a place where magic is possible. And I just, it's like the luckiest thing ever to have that happen.

Speaker 2 And I think it, like, I always think about it as like the Harry Potter. You know, in Harry Potter, how when his mom dies, she puts a spell on him that protects him from dying? Um, we love.

Speaker 1 I kind of remember.

Speaker 2 Okay, you kind of know this.

Speaker 1 Um, I've read all of them out loud, and I still Harry Potter's mom protects Harry.

Speaker 2 I remember the mother dying because, of course, the mother always has to die. She always has to die for the kid to be on an independent adventure.

Speaker 1 By every single story. Yeah.

Speaker 2 There's actually a whole theory about that, but

Speaker 2 about children's stories. And then you have to kill the parents in children's stories because that's how children become the unfolding of their own story, right?

Speaker 2 They become little adults because

Speaker 1 they can live long enough to see her child succeed.

Speaker 2 God forbid.

Speaker 2 But I always feel like that period of time in my life where my parents, what my parents did and gave me this magical spell, like love, love spell, where like, you know, then there were other different hard times in all of our lives, but that early

Speaker 2 magic's protected. Oh my gosh.
And they do say that like from like one to five or one to three, like

Speaker 2 so much, I mean, it's a lot of pressure on young parents because that time is so important.

Speaker 2 Like, but like so much of your belief system about the world and how you feel and if you feel safe and your attachment style is formed like so early.

Speaker 1 And are you, I mean, because I've, I've sense from you both introvert and extrovert.

Speaker 2 This is true. Oh my God, I got it right.

Speaker 1 You got it right. So what, tell me about that.
How have you figured that out?

Speaker 2 Okay, I see myself as having three cups. There's the extroversion socialization cup, the alone time cup, and the with one other person having an intimate conversation cup.

Speaker 2 And I need all three cups to be somewhat full to be functioning. Yeah.
Like if I've had too much parties, work,

Speaker 2 like not no alone time, and just these two cups are full. Oh, I'm gesturing, and this is audio.

Speaker 1 Like, um, the people,

Speaker 1 you're making, you're gesturing cups.

Speaker 2 I'm gesturing cups. But, um, the, you know, if I'm then I really feel bad and I need alone time.
If I've got too much alone time and not enough socialization, I really feel bad and drained.

Speaker 2 So I'm always trying to like look at my schedule and my life and be like, am I getting enough friend time in one-on-one? Am I getting enough alone time?

Speaker 2 And am I getting enough like energizing social outside in the world, going to see a concert, going to see a play, going to something? Like, I need a little bit of everything.

Speaker 1 I love the cups idea.

Speaker 1 I do something similar where I think about a refrigerator and I think about magnets. And then I,

Speaker 1 in an in the best day ever, all five magnets are on the refrigerator, but I try to get three. So it's like work, motherhood, friendship, you know, spirituality, wellness, some kind of care.
And um,

Speaker 1 and uh, what's my fifth magnet? Uh, a relationship.

Speaker 1 So, it's like if you can get three out of five, it's like today I was a good partner, today I did like some good mom stuff and I worked a little bit, or it's like, no, today I took care of myself, today I met with friends, and today I, you know, um, gave my kids some good advice, whatever is the magnets that you can put on there, very rare to get five, yeah, but you don't want to go too long without having a day that has

Speaker 2 like you don't want to leave one of them,

Speaker 2 You don't want to get a dusty magnet. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 We could go, we could, but we, you and I could sell the cup and magnet.

Speaker 2 I was just thinking,

Speaker 1 we could do separate podcasts just about this, and we could make billions

Speaker 2 of dollars, and it would be good, another good billion.

Speaker 1 And it would be like, with me today is Aya

Speaker 1 Kung. She's, of course, the inventor of the cup theory.

Speaker 1 She brought me that theory when I was working on my magnet project.

Speaker 2 And together, we've got cups and magnets. We're touring the world.
Yeah.

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Speaker 1 Okay, you've finished Stranger Things. It's done.
What was it like when it's, that's a rap on Maya Hawk, a series rap? I know you can't tell us anything, but I do hope you tell us how it ends.

Speaker 1 But I will, of course, I will.

Speaker 2 Great. Thank you.

Speaker 1 You can tell me off the air. But

Speaker 1 what was it like hearing series rap?

Speaker 2 Well, I want to hear what it's been like for you, like what it was like for you on parks.

Speaker 1 You know, it's, I think for people who don't know, right? So if you're an actor on set, you get like, oh, that's a season rap on my like season four, all right. And you get your last shot.

Speaker 1 And often people kind of clap and stand around and say stuff. But series rap is a big deal.
And on a show like yours,

Speaker 1 which has been such a long journey for you and for everyone involved, and there's been strikes and there's been COVID in the middle of all of it, and everyone's gotten older and grown up, and everyone's been watching and watching and watching.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 1 A good AD will make sure that

Speaker 1 that series rap

Speaker 1 means something, that people are there and they're there for you. And like, it's just a, it's a big moment.

Speaker 2 Matt and Ross, who are amazing, wrote scenes that seem to have some connective tissue for the characters and for us.

Speaker 2 And on this last day of shooting, we got to film these scenes that had this beautiful connective tissue.

Speaker 2 And I actually think I like learned something about acting that day and being present in your own emotion as a person and the emotion of the character and allowing those two wires to connect.

Speaker 2 And

Speaker 2 my life has been changed as an actor. The way that I act has changed since that series rap day.

Speaker 2 And it was so emotional. I cried all day long from beginning to end in these like kind of crashing waves.
And I just love, I love everybody on that show so much.

Speaker 2 And it's been so, it's shaped me so much. And we've been on such a long, complicated journey together.

Speaker 2 And you were what, 19? I started when I was 19, which is like, you know, lots of them started at like nine and have been doing it for 10 years. And I've been doing it for seven and started at 19.

Speaker 2 So, I mean, I got nothing on them.

Speaker 1 But it's funny that you've been on a show for seven years and you still think you're the new kid.

Speaker 2 Exactly. That's crazy.

Speaker 2 I do. I do still think I'm the new kid.
And, but it was really emotional. And, and

Speaker 2 I don't know if I'll ever have another experience like it.

Speaker 1 Yeah. I mean, congratulations on that show.
It's your work is so good. That show is so great.
And it really,

Speaker 1 I mean, just to, you know, I'm sure you can feel the anticipation growing.

Speaker 1 I can't even imagine the press junket you're going to have to do when this, when this show comes out of like,

Speaker 1 it's going to be bananas

Speaker 1 of how you're going to be talking about like it, that show feels like.

Speaker 1 I don't know, that the audience has been through it with you too. Like it feels like the audience has also been through it.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 I guess is the only way to say it, that the kids on the show and the audience have not had an easy couple of years.

Speaker 2 No.

Speaker 1 And it's, there's something about it that feels very cathartic about the end of it. Yeah.

Speaker 2 And I don't even know if I'm right about this, but I've always seen the upside down as a metaphor for depression and anxiety. And in some ways of like your teen years.

Speaker 2 It's really hard to be a teenager. And the

Speaker 2 like

Speaker 2 the hormones that get released, the new emotions

Speaker 2 that get released of depression and anxiety and self-awareness and self-consciousness, it's like a hard period of life to survive.

Speaker 2 And I've always seen the upside down as like this, you know, portal that opened up to all those emotions for these young people.

Speaker 2 And like navigating one's way out of it and through community and bravery and friendship.

Speaker 2 It's really emotional. And like the, you know, the allegories to what's going on in the world right now are plentiful.
Yeah. And

Speaker 2 it means a lot to me to get to be a part of something like this because it's really a once-in-a-lifetime thing.

Speaker 2 These like adventure stories and these hero stories about kids and groups of kids grow up with this. You know, they grow up simultaneously with you.
And it's, I'm so grateful.

Speaker 2 I just, it's such a special thing to get to be a part of.

Speaker 1 That's so awesome. And you and your friends, like Joe and Sadie, like doing music, you're on stage, you're all doing a bunch of things together at the same time.

Speaker 1 Can I talk about your music for a second? Yeah, because I would be curious your relationship to,

Speaker 1 you're such a

Speaker 1 talented and multi-talented artist who can do a lot of things very well.

Speaker 1 And like what I imagine for you, what I picture in the future is us hearing you writing and directing and producing and doing so many things as well as acting and music.

Speaker 1 But right now, you have two very big careers in what are, it sometimes feel like very disparate ways of participating in the arts. It's like

Speaker 1 if

Speaker 1 acting is one kid and music is the other. Who's my favorite kid?

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 1 Who's your favorite kid?

Speaker 2 Well, okay, the way I like to see,

Speaker 2 first of all, I don't always do a good job balancing. I don't have a favorite kid.
I love creativity and I love storytelling. And I see them as completely connected.

Speaker 2 And like, if there was an outlet in the wall with two plugs, it's like different lamps that you plug into the same power source is how I feel about it.

Speaker 2 That said, I'm a much more trained actor than I am a musician. And I'm a much more confident actor than a musician.

Speaker 2 Walking onto set or onto state, like, you know, a rehearsal period is where I feel confident and comfortable.

Speaker 2 And I feel like I know the rules and I know, like, I like, I like it there. And I feel really grounded.
Music is really scary. And it's like, it's like, it terrifies me.
Performing live terrifies me.

Speaker 2 Writing terrifies me. What people are going to make of my lyrics terrify me.

Speaker 2 Like, it's all really scary. So it's the same power source.
One of the lamps is like a scary Halloween lamp that I like don't totally know how it works.

Speaker 2 And the other lamp is like my favorite bedside night light or something that's like, this is my comfort zone.

Speaker 1 And if you want to listen to Maya's lamp workshop, you need to go to the Beverly Williams.

Speaker 2 You should go to Cups and Magnets. Lamps and Magnets.
Cups and Lamps and Magnets.

Speaker 1 No, it's so true. You've got a whole product line.
Just to put out, just to manifest, just for a second, for fun.

Speaker 1 Do you ever,

Speaker 1 like, do you ever think about

Speaker 2 writing a musical? Ooh, do you think about writing? Yeah, but, but, but that's not what you were going to say. Oh, my God.

Speaker 1 But what musical do you want to write?

Speaker 2 I don't know. Yes.
Okay.

Speaker 1 So great, write that. Okay.
But do you ever have like a

Speaker 1 fantasy of being on stage singing and singing with someone who you like, you know, deeply, like, do you have

Speaker 1 an artist whose voice, a musical artist, whose voice you fantasize about harmonizing with and singing with?

Speaker 1 Alive or dead?

Speaker 2 You know,

Speaker 2 I, I have a lot of different people that I love.

Speaker 2 I am terrified of harmonizing. You are?

Speaker 1 That's the only thing that I can kind of do.

Speaker 2 Really? It really scares me. I am not a good harmonizer

Speaker 2 and it scares me.

Speaker 1 So what about forget the harmony?

Speaker 2 But just singing. It's back and forthy.

Speaker 2 I would love to sing with Joni.

Speaker 2 I mean, I would have to do like a harmony, like a one-note harmony while she danced all over the place. But I love Joni.

Speaker 2 I mean, this morning I was listening to Judy Sill a bunch, and I love Judy Sill, and I love Joni, and I'm obsessed with Adrienne Lanker.

Speaker 2 And I'm obsessed with Taylor Swift, and I'm obsessed with, I mean, I just love

Speaker 1 you love singer.

Speaker 2 I love singer-songwriters. Yeah, I love songwriters.
I just think they're so cool. Yeah.
And it's like almost that fantasy is more like to get to write a song with someone. Yeah.

Speaker 2 Not like singing it and performing it is less the dream. It's like writing a song with someone that would be the dream.
Ooh, I love.

Speaker 1 Okay. And speaking of writers and artists, you have worked with in the in in films, you've worked with really talented, uh, distinct voices, Wes Anderson, um, Bradley Cooper, Quentin Taratino.

Speaker 1 That experience of getting on a set with someone who feels like they have a very strong sense. Do you like that? You like being in someone's simulation, basically? Do you like jumping in there?

Speaker 2 Yes. I find it extremely fun and really relaxing.
Yes.

Speaker 1 You were in Once Upon a Time in Hollywood with like five actors. You were all playing Manson, Manson Shelby.

Speaker 2 Manson people. Manson-ish.
Manson. Manson-esque.

Speaker 1 And did your mom give you Uma Thurman as your mom? Did she give you any advice about working with Quentin? Keep your shoes on. Keep your shoes on, Miles.

Speaker 1 Keep them on, baby.

Speaker 2 Are you going to try to get...

Speaker 2 Keep them on, baby.

Speaker 1 Keep them on. Keep those shoes on.

Speaker 2 Perfect advice. Perfect.

Speaker 1 Did she come to the set?

Speaker 2 No.

Speaker 1 Yeah, it's weird to have your parents come to set. Yeah.
I know. It's just, I don't even find it.

Speaker 2 I don't even find it weird. The shoes just wasn't in town.
Well, I don't like it. It was New Yorkers.
It was L.A. Right.
She's like, I'm not going to LA. No.

Speaker 1 No, I have too many things to do.

Speaker 2 I've been to that set. Because I was a set kid.
I think it's the best place on earth.

Speaker 1 Okay, tell me about sets you were on when you were a kid.

Speaker 2 Oh, oh, so many. I mean, one of the most memorable ones was the set of my super ex-girlfriend because I got to get into the flying suit.

Speaker 2 And there's a movie that my mom did. It's really good and really funny.
And but she had, she was a superhero, and so she flew in it.

Speaker 2 And I got to be like, I got to get into the thing and like fly across this studio.

Speaker 2 And I, but really the thing I remember about sets is they all blur together, except I love Crafty, and And I loved the, it was like this safe little world where I could be alone.

Speaker 2 So like no one needed to be watching me.

Speaker 2 I could walk over to Crafty and take cookies and M ⁇ Ms and gummy bears and get them and I could go watch the stunt people practice and then I could go watercolor in the trailer and I could go to the costume shop and help them sew.

Speaker 2 And it was just like Disneyland basically, where I was independent and left alone and allowed to explore and allowed to just like park my butt at the monitors and watch take after take after take after take and it's really where I fell in love with acting was backstage at the theater and on set.

Speaker 2 And so I think it was the most fun thing ever. What always shocks me is when I invite people to come to set, they don't want to come.
And when they come, they get bored.

Speaker 2 I'm like, what do you mean it's Disneyland? And they're like, you just did the same scene nine times from one direction and then moved the camera and are doing it nine more times.

Speaker 2 How on earth is this like Disneyland?

Speaker 1 This is so interesting. I'm the exact opposite.
People want to come to set because they seem like it's interesting. And I say it's not.
It's boring.

Speaker 2 Well, it's very true. And I will say, one of my favorite things in the world generally is to be not busy around a busy person.

Speaker 2 So I still like to go with people to set because it's where I'm the most at peace because all my cups are getting filled.

Speaker 2 I'm not alone, but I also, and there's tons of exposure to people if I want it, but I can be totally alone and not busy and just like reading my little book somewhere and it's fine.

Speaker 2 So it's got this like social, not social, privacy, all these different things all at once. And it feels so good to me.
It's like such a nice way to spend time with someone.

Speaker 2 It's like five minutes when they have a break. Hi, how are you?

Speaker 2 That was cool. That was good.
Goodbye. I'm reading my book again.
Like, it's,

Speaker 2 I love it. So, I think there's something I really love about visiting other people on set and having visitors on set

Speaker 2 when they feel like I do.

Speaker 1 You brought up the cup system. And just once again, for $59.99, you too can learn Maya's Cup system.

Speaker 1 It comes with a workbook. There is a, we do a, a in-person you have to watch a seven-minute video before a paywall.

Speaker 1 You're going to be in Reno November 15th. We're very excited.

Speaker 1 Okay. And then

Speaker 1 the other question I wanted to ask you is, because, you know, you played anxiety, the world is anxious.

Speaker 1 You're really in touch with those feelings and you take great pride, and I think in being part of like a big discussion about it. What do you

Speaker 1 listen to, watch, read? How do you make yourself laugh? Like what are you getting? Where are you getting your joy?

Speaker 2 Where are you getting your joy from? Where am I getting my joy from? Well, recently I got a lot of joy from the Fourth Wing book series.

Speaker 2 It's fantasy. It's like romantic, fantasy,

Speaker 2 dragon college, basically, a dragon war college.

Speaker 2 And that was my escapism of choice.

Speaker 1 Unfortunately, you said so many things just now. Okay, so say again.

Speaker 2 It's called The Fourth Wing is the name of the first book.

Speaker 1 And it is a dragon college.

Speaker 2 It's a war college for dragon riders in a fantasy universe. It's romantic.
It's very sexy.

Speaker 1 I've been looking for a new fantasy, is my new,

Speaker 1 like, I never thought it would be a genre I'm into. I'm so into it.

Speaker 2 I'm so into it. I felt the same way.
I'm so into it.

Speaker 1 Have you read The Name of the Wind?

Speaker 2 No. Okay.

Speaker 1 Patrick Rothfuss,

Speaker 1 R-O-T-H-F-U-S. Rothfuss.
Rothfuss. Rothfuss.

Speaker 1 He wrote a book called The Name of the Wind. Okay.
And

Speaker 1 it is

Speaker 1 a series.

Speaker 1 It's part of the King Killer Chronicles.

Speaker 1 And it's a fantasy novel. And it's basically just like, it's just a...
the story of

Speaker 1 like a child who grows up in an inn and how he becomes like this king killer. It's cool, but it's very like school to train to get to the thing.

Speaker 2 I love, I'm not sure. Give me a training sequence.
I love it.

Speaker 2 Make me into the person I was always meant to be.

Speaker 1 I know, I love it too.

Speaker 2 Force me to do it.

Speaker 1 I love that because what do you like about the fourth wing? What did you like?

Speaker 2 It just. Well, there's incredible hardcore training sequences.

Speaker 2 There's a very hot

Speaker 2 guy who's like, he's a rebel and maybe he's bad, except obviously the bad guys are actually the good guys and the good guys are the bad guys and you have to figure that out. And it's awesome.

Speaker 2 And he trains her because he's like, their lives get wed together. Spoilers.

Speaker 2 And he's like, you have to live so that I can live.

Speaker 2 And so he's like, do sit-ups. And she's like, okay.

Speaker 2 And it really,

Speaker 2 it really works for me is all I can say.

Speaker 2 And do sit-ups. Do sit-ups.
sit-ups. Do sit-ups.

Speaker 1 You got to have a strong core if you're going to fight those dragons.

Speaker 1 Those dragons go right for your core. You got to.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 And she's like stabbing him with knives. And he's like, yeah, good job.
Good job. Good job.
You know, it's amazing.

Speaker 1 Do you read or listen?

Speaker 2 I read those.

Speaker 2 I do both. I do a lot of audiobooks, but I've recently been trying to get back into

Speaker 2 paper books.

Speaker 2 Yeah. And so that's been bringing me joy.

Speaker 2 I watch piles of TV. I love comedy.
Recently, I loved the studio. That was really fun.

Speaker 1 So funny.

Speaker 2 It wasn't Han and Sony.

Speaker 1 I mean, the choice, the sartorial choices and that alone, but incredible. The way that character is so ridiculous.
And my buddy Ike is in that, who was so great too.

Speaker 1 That episode where he kept getting thanked at the Golden Globes. Yeah.
And Adam Scott was thanking him. It's just

Speaker 1 so extraordinarily fucking stupid and funny.

Speaker 2 Also, the old school Hollywood party where uh Zoe Kravitz is like, old school Hollywood means there's drugs in the food. I love that.
What really got me?

Speaker 2 That's not what touching me.

Speaker 2 She was so good in that episode.

Speaker 2 Yeah, so

Speaker 2 I've been doing that.

Speaker 1 Would you ever like,

Speaker 1 I mean, I guess strange, you know, Stranger Things is like, it's a new, it's like current fantasy. I mean, that's fantasy.

Speaker 1 But

Speaker 1 would you ever want to? Yes.

Speaker 2 Okay.

Speaker 2 Great.

Speaker 2 I don't need to finish it.

Speaker 1 Because I think that what I'm getting, like, I really don't need to finish it because what I'm getting from our convo today is like story, adventure, fantasy,

Speaker 1 the kind of bigness of life is like what energizes you. Like you're excited about the next, like you're really looking forward.
You have like a really big capacity for big, swirly ideas.

Speaker 2 Yeah, I really love them. I mean, not to mention that like almost all of the best fantasy is about humans banding together to take over fascist regimes.
Like, it's just a general theme. Yes.
Of

Speaker 2 fantasy and, like, about the little guy rising up.

Speaker 2 And I really, and I think that's partly why it's that as a genre is kind of exploding right now.

Speaker 2 Like, people, like, romantic and fantasy people are really, it's, like, always at the top of the bestseller list these days. And I think it's because...

Speaker 2 community, it's always about like a unlikely band of maniacs and different different people from different places that find each other and come together to try to build a new world that works better for them than it used to.

Speaker 1 I just want to say that like getting the experience of talking about Inside Out 2 with you and getting to know you has been so great. And I hope we get to make another one.

Speaker 2 I would really like to, I mean, I would like to do anything with you.

Speaker 2 It would be so wonderful. But I will really hope we get to make another one because I want to see more of anxiety and joy learning how to work together.

Speaker 1 I know. And they have the same physical symptoms.

Speaker 1 And they, look, they get things done Okay, they get things done and they're excited some emotions like to chill out and lie on the couch and those are important too

Speaker 1 But anxiety and joy are gonna like keep things moving. Yeah.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 I know they are I'm so happy that you came today.

Speaker 1 Joy. I'm joyful that you came today.

Speaker 2 I was anxious about it. No, I wasn't actually.
I was just excited. Thank you so much.

Speaker 1 Thank you so much for coming, Maya. Thanks for having you and love seeing you.

Speaker 2 Thank you so much. You're the best.
You're the best. And I would do something with you even with our real flesh and blood bodies.

Speaker 1 Okay, yeah, we can do that too.

Speaker 2 I mean, I prefer animated, but

Speaker 2 it's just a lot easier for me in terms of her name.

Speaker 2 Also, just the pajama pants aspect.

Speaker 1 But if you do make a fourth wing movie, I will

Speaker 2 be the dragon. I'm

Speaker 2 in charge of making it. Here is hoping.
Here's begging the world.

Speaker 1 I will donate my body to be the dragon.

Speaker 2 I will donate my body to dragons.

Speaker 1 Thank you, Maya Hawk. That was such a great conversation.
I loved And

Speaker 1 for this polar plunge, I just want to talk about books because we talked a little bit about books and how they are bringing us joy. And I want to mention again a fantasy book that I love.

Speaker 1 It's called The Name of the Wind by Patrick Rothfuss.

Speaker 1 Eagerly awaiting the next book, sir. So chop, chop.
So check it out. And,

Speaker 1 you know, get your dragons on.

Speaker 1 You can't ever have too many dragons. But thank you, everybody, for listening to Good Hang.
And

Speaker 1 bye, see you soon.

Speaker 1 You've been listening to Good Hang. The executive producers for this show are Bill Simmons, Jenna Weiss Berman, and me, Amy Poehler.
The show is produced by The Ringer and Paperkite.

Speaker 1 For The Ringer, production by Jack Wilson, Kat Spilane, Kaya McMullen, and Aalaya Zanaires. For Paperkite, production by Sam Green, Joel Lovell, and Jenna Weiss Berman.
Original music by Amy Miles.

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