Episode 213: Barnes And Noble Super Panel - Max Lugavere, Darin Olien, and Dr. Emily Morse

All right, guys, we made it.

We made it to 2023.

Happy New Year!

This is going to be the best one yet.

I'm not a big person in these new year resolutions because I don't ever believe in waiting till January 1st.

I believe in starting right away.

Finally, my book, Bigger, Better, Bolder, has been out now for probably a week.

And I want to say thank you to everybody who pre-ordered it because it debuted at number one in business.

And I'm just so grateful and thankful for you guys.

I really do believe that we all can be more bold and show up in our life in a real way with a little introspection, a little self-awareness, and we can design whatever we want for ourselves.

I believe in creating a rich life and that's not just money you guys.

That's about relationships, meaningful relationships, meaningful experiences.

Now if we're not born being bold, you can learn being bold.

I have a workbook in the back of the book so it keeps people accountable and you see yourselves getting bolder by doing these little bold moves.

So we are not just acquiescing to a good enough life, but we're actually

really

going after and chasing the life we want.

I want this to be a two-way conversation.

I want you guys to leave me reviews and comments.

Let me know what type of guests you want me to go after, chase after.

Let me know what you like, what you don't like.

Your words are valuable and they mean something to me.

So please let me know.

Check me out and Habits and Hustle on YouTube now as well and on Instagram.

Facebook now, we have a Facebook community.

Here's to 2023, everyone.

Let's make it the best one yet.

Hi guys, it's Tony Robbins.

You're listening to Habits and Hustle, Greg.

Thank you so much for coming, everybody, to this book launch panel evening for Bigger, Better, Bolder.

I appreciate every single one of you guys coming out on a Tuesday night.

Thank you very much.

We're going to be doing something a little bit different.

This is a live podcast,

and it will be, it's not live streaming, but we're doing it obviously live, and then

we're going to upload it.

But what I thought would be really interesting was if I got a few of my close friends who have been extremely bold in their life and really kind of talk about what they think bold is, what I think bold is, and kind of how they've kind of used boldness in their careers, in their personal life to kind of build the platforms they have and

how you guys around here and listening when they listen,

how they can harness their boldness skills.

So basically, it's going to be a bold conversation with, like I said, three great, great friends.

First up is,

I always call, I just say sex with Emily.

She's like Madonna, you know?

That's how I say.

I don't even know her last name, really.

I do, but I never ever call her that.

So Emily, obviously, not obviously, but for those of you who don't know, Emily is not only an expert, a connoisseur, but probably the best in her field in sex education, sex, how do you even call, what do you, what's

sex educator, sex therapist, sex, yeah.

I love getting people to feel comfortable talking about sex and relationships and pleasure in a way that's not awkward.

Just makes it all feel good.

Speaking of awkward, my two kids are in the off in the

audience, so let's just be careful of maybe use some different wording sometimes, but just be just be mindful of that.

Euphemisms.

Euphemisms, exactly.

And then we have Darren Ollion, who is everything wellness.

He is a super food hunter.

He is the host of Down to Earth with Zach Efron, two seasons already, an ME Award winner.

He is exceptionally knowledgeable on so many different things.

Again, I don't even know how to even pigeonhole these people because they've created such a niche for themselves.

But we're going to hear from Darren.

Darren, how would you describe yourself?

What would you say in one?

That was great.

No, that was great.

Okay, thank you.

But if I wasn't saying it,

what would be your title?

If you just met somebody, what would be your elevator pitch?

What would you say that you were?

Escalator pitch as I was coming up.

You know, I'm curious, that's for sure.

Curious about bettering the gnarly systems that we have going on in the environment.

Certainly

interested in continuing the documentary docuseries world, working on more books about.

Oh, tell them about that.

So, you have one book called Super Life, which is a huge New York Times bestseller.

This one.

Yeah.

It so happens to be here.

And he just finished his second book that is called

Fatal Conveniences.

Which is going to be massive.

And we're going to talk about that.

So he's obviously also an author.

And we'll talk more about you in a moment.

I wanted to move it on to the next, the third, the third person, which is Max Lugavier, who

is just super smart.

And he is all about brain health.

And actually, he'll tell you his whole story, how he kind of evolved.

His brand is called Genius or Genius Foods.

Was that enough to say?

Yeah, that's

a fair statement.

A fair statement.

And he's just exceptionally knowledgeable about wellness, health, overall health.

Very articulate.

You're going to hear in two seconds.

So this is the panel, you guys.

And like I said, thank you.

all of you for being here tonight and supporting me and this book.

I really appreciate it.

So thank you.

We're so proud of you.

Yeah, we're so proud of you, Jen.

How look you know all these people?

You're gonna make me blush.

So, okay, so now I want to, so let's start on that lovely note.

Great segue.

Does anyone know about your book, though?

Have you talked about it yet on your podcast?

I've been talking, I've been talking about Borner, Boulder, live the life you want, not the life you get.

Yes, thank you.

That's exactly.

The book is called Bigger, Better, Boulder.

And we're going to talk, let's start.

So let me ask all three of you what is what does boldness mean to you?

Who wants to start?

Emily?

So perky.

I'll ask Max if you want first.

Max.

Okay Max is very okay.

Go ahead Max.

What is boldness to you?

Oh my God.

I think it's just

it's it's like following, it's learning how to hone your your own internal compass and to go bold boldly.

in that direction.

I use the word in a sentence.

Is that fair?

Is that okay?

That's good.

And to go in that direction and to be

and to not necessarily be fearless.

I think what's so wonderful about courage is that

what we see from like the

icons that we look up to in mythology, whether it's on screen or throughout history, it's that fear always exists, but it's the courage ones who

feel fear, but then go in that direction anyway.

And so for me, it was really tackling the topic of nutrition and health for people.

I was not a medical doctor.

I didn't go down the path of academia, but I felt really entitled for answers for myself and for my family, which we can talk about why.

But then I started to put out work

and I felt really empowered that I was living in a time where I was able to do that.

And I could have said to myself, who am I?

I'm not a medical doctor.

I don't have the sort of formal education, but I know that I'm really passionate and I know that I'm intellectually, I have certain faculties that might predispose me to being good at what it is that I aspire to do.

And I just went in that direction.

Boldly.

Yeah.

Because you were at Current TV doing something different or were you kind of reporting on...

Yeah, I mean, I've always, I've had a very interesting career.

I've never had a resume.

So I've, from, upon graduating college, I got a job working for Al Gore on TV.

So I was put on TV.

post-graduation anchoring and that's when we met anchoring a TV network that Al Gore owned and so I was sort of like a journalist

producer, host, or whatever.

And I was like in my early 20s and I did that for six or seven years.

And sometime after that,

I was at this point in my life where I both had trouble finding another job that I really felt passionate about.

And my mom got sick.

And that was really the turning point for me.

It was the diagnosis of

a form of dementia that my mom had incurred and that really kind of set me off on a completely different path than I ever would have thought I'd

had gone down in my life.

You know, it's interesting, and what you just said, it's interesting because I know you, but everyone always asks you very much about Alzheimer's and brain health, and now about all these other nutritional things.

It's interesting because you were super bold, because, like you said, you don't have a medical background, but you had a lot of passion and interest because of your mom in that direction.

And you just kind of like, you didn't think about it, you just went for it because it it was something that innately you were really interested in doing

yeah i mean i'm a i'm a realist and i'm i i regularly i'm a very self-aware person i regularly take stock and take inventory of my own faculties and i've tried a bunch of different you know i've tried a lot of different things in my life and i failed at a lot of different things where did you fail at well i um you know i'm super i'm super passionate for one about music and i there was a point where i tried to like you know see i didn't i didn't i'm not gonna say i tried to make it but i definitely tried to see if I had the chops to Ascend in the in the music world as like a singer-songwriter, which is something that I really wanted to do.

No way

No, I knew you played guitar, but I thought you just did it like at your house.

Yeah, what girls?

I didn't know you did this like for girls

That's not false

But um but no, I did there was a point I was I was like I was like making use of the fact that I took take taking advantage of the fact that I lived in LA and and I tried to do it.

And I realized very early on that like there are people

that are doing this for whom there is no plan B, that are doing this from the moment they are able to learn to play an instrument.

They're doing it from childhood.

And that

that wasn't my thing,

that I wasn't meant to do that.

But then I realized at a certain point that

I was a fairly intelligent person.

I was a good communicator, proven by this incredible job that I had on TV, that I was comfortable in front of the camera, that I had an aptitude for understanding and assimilating research, that I was like really interested in this, that my brain is, we talked about this on my podcast, that my brain is like a light switch.

Like when I'm interested in something,

there's no stopping me in terms of the depth that I'll go.

But you retain information in me, like really well.

And then you can like.

Yeah, I have a very selective photographic memory.

I don't know shit about like the vast majority of topics.

Like,

I don't know anything about most things.

but I know, but I have a photographic memory for the things that I'm really interested in.

So it's like either, which are, by the way, three things.

One is like cinema, music, and health.

So.

Well, it worked out for you.

Yeah, it suits me really well.

Right?

Really well.

And so how about you, darling Darren?

What is boldness to you, and how have you been bold in your life?

I mean, that's a big one.

It's really hard to kind of

grok it, but I think it's definitely in the vein of what Max said in the sense that in spite of your monkey mind saying whatever, and even in spite of the world giving you any sort of feedback, that you have this inner feeling and this inner sense.

And you wrestle with that.

And then you ultimately listen, hear it, and then take a step in spite of everything else.

And so I think that and cultivating that, by the way, still cultivate it every day because it's way too distracting out here and

it blasts us every day.

So I think cultivating boldness is a practice and it is a muscle.

Sounds familiar.

I wonder who else said it.

Yeah, yeah.

And I think maybe there's people that through I mean, hell, insecurity can create a massive amount of boldness which is a superpower right because you have to understand like from my perspective this this yin and yang this light and dark of this world this tragedy and happiness they equally exist so the one hand pain and suffering and challenges are the propeller

creating from your mom's challenges into like what I want to create.

So it is the propeller and our feeble little minds barely grasp it, but in the reflection of trying to grasp it, you've come to realize that

I come to realize that it is a gift telling me and showing me the next step.

And so it's like, you know, I lost my house in 2018, lost everything I owned except a suitcase and the car that I drove to the airport.

And luckily my dogs were away.

And you can't possibly understand that.

You can't possibly get your head around that.

However, through the grief and understanding, you realize that I realize that one of the greatest gifts of my life, and there's no way I would change it.

Do I want that for anyone?

Fuck no, right?

I mean, fudge, no.

Fudge.

Oh, this is going to be hard.

It's going to be.

So, so that poor Ebelishi's neck.

Oh, God.

Yeah, it's that all dirty.

I opened up the door.

Sorry.

So I think,

and I'll step on that, step on the next step of, you know, the start of most of my career with the superfood hunting thing.

That was when I lost my father in 2004.

And I was playing around.

I had physiology background, nutrition background, and I was playing around and looking at supplements and looking at why are people doing this and there's some shitty sorry damn

no you could say that you could say that there's some there's some there's some not good things in products and foods and everything else and so I said you know my dad passed away and I got you know just a you know 15 grand from whatever was left in his in his will

And I started my company and I said, I need to do actually do something with what I'm playing around with.

And so that started me

literally, I'm a small town kid from Minnesota.

Like there's no part of me that would have thought I'd end up in the Amazon looking for medicinal plants.

And I literally did it innocently.

And I was like, I was just like, I got to know

what these things are.

I got to know what's in here.

I got to know who's creating it.

I got to know where it's from.

It's curiosity then.

Curiosity.

And so.

And with you, curiosity.

and through again through the pain my dad passed away what am i gonna do quit messing around just jump into something and do it and then

through that doing

I got basically a phone call serendipitously from Beachbody and I created one of their largest selling products of all time.

Of all time.

Shakeology, by the way, for those of you who don't know.

So I started that in 2006 and it launched in 2008.

And, you know, it's like, can you make this shake for us?

I'm like, sure.

Like, I was playing around with this stuff and I just said yes.

It's unbelievable.

And so, yeah, so it's like, again, I think the being bold in the face of fear, in the face of challenge, in the face of, again, cultivating that inner

kind of work to realize what's the propeller that's that's operating in in me that wants to to show me something.

And then in spite of family and people and friends, I'm going to freaking do it anyway.

Right.

And that's the bold step.

I love that.

So like curiosity is more or less the gateway to opportunity and being bold because we all had it, right?

That's what it really was.

You were curious and you didn't let things deter you from pushing forward and acting.

Yeah, in order to get to that curiosity, you have to kind of, you know, clear some debris, right?

You have to clear some understanding of yourself to realize like this creative curiosity is just,

it's now got me.

It's got me so

involved.

I have to learn more.

I have to dig in.

Okay, Em.

All right.

You're up.

Bull.

Bull, bold, bold.

Well, I think it's interesting, but all everyone said here so far, that I think that when I think of

finding like the spark and finding that thing in your life that you just have to learn more about, and that you have, that you're so curious about, which you talk so much about in your book, that is thing that boldness is a skill.

And a lot of that, which I think was so fascinating in your book, too, because I've actually read it, going, pop, I'm sorry.

Some places I'm so bold, and all the things I've done are really bold, but that it's like in these little places, sometimes I'm like, oh, I could work on that skill, asking for what I want even more and going after all those things.

But for me, bold, when I think about it now after this, it's going through

really not being afraid of taking risks, but also knowing that it's when that spark happens that you know that there's something that you have to do.

And that's how I kind of felt about my field when I realized that there was no, that this was 18 years ago now, but really there was no sex education out there.

There wasn't a lot of information.

It was before there, I did start a podcast 18 years ago, believe it or not.

There were podcasts.

There was like three of us.

Was there really just, hold on, who was 2005.

No, I mean, there was more than me.

No, besides dr ruth at the time who and dr joy's brother who was besides sex so when i went to talk about sex in 2005 i realized i was always very i love reading in your book it's just so gen like she was like five years old and peppering all of her mom's friends about like

where do you live do you live in a house how much did you pay tell me about your relationship how much money you made i was like really i'm like but that's what jen already does and that's why but it's so infectious because she does it in such a loving way when you get to be a friend of jen it's such a loving thing and she's actually asking because she's curious but then she can kind of using your skill set to kind of help and support.

And you're a very loyal friend and all the things.

But in reading that, I was reminded that I really was like that from a young age too around sex.

I would ask people about, not just sex, but I would meet a couple and I'd say, how'd you meet?

How'd you fall in love?

And I was like five or six or eight or ten.

I'd always been really interested in like romance and love and

what makes a happy couple, what makes an unhappy couple.

And granted my parents, you know, side note, like, probably no surprise, they were divorced.

So that's kind of led up to it.

But I was like, oh, so some couples work house.

I always had a lot of questions.

And I was always very, very curious.

But then as I got older, I realized like sex was happening.

So I was a happy, I was a sexual being.

And I realized it was really only Dr.

Ruth.

So 18 years ago, she was probably the only person.

There was not, you couldn't really Google it.

It wasn't really on the internet.

There was a few books.

And so what I realized is I wasn't really armed with the knowledge about having like, like I thought it was good, but I'm like, could it be a lot better than this?

Because no one's talking about it.

No one has any sex was talking about it.

Either you had sex, you didn't have sex, and maybe it was good or bad.

But even when people would say, I had great sex last night, I used to like stop them in their tracks and be like, what do you mean by that?

Like, what do you mean by good sex?

And I would literally say, like, back up, like, good why.

Like, did you have 18 orgasms?

You know, Sarah.

I can do that.

Whatever.

It's like,

listen.

So I would take my kids.

I would like break it down.

I would break it down.

I'd be like, what do you mean?

Because I don't understand.

There's no barometer.

Who tells you what's good and bad?

And so there wasn't information.

So I believe that that for me, realizing.

How about love line were they around love line was around okay so love who did love line adam corolla and adam carolla which yes and that was the only show that was out there they were answering questions with people calling in i grew up on that show i was like obsessed with that show

it was such a good show right we didn't have it in san francisco at the time but it was before podcast but when i moved here actually was that was the one show that i could point to that was doing it and then i was actually on it the last four years with dr drew like hosting it which was a wonderful moment in my life oh i didn't know that i know look at all these oh my god i'm gonna learn all these things okay So the point is, like, for me, being bold, it was just about,

I felt that there was, it almost became this passion, like you were both saying, like, you have to find that spark in your life.

And I know we won't be the first person to tell you that, but I could not not ask.

Like, I was like, I can't believe that no one's telling us.

Kids are growing up and going out in the world and having sex, and there's zero information.

This has got to stop.

So I did everything I could to educate myself.

And then I went back to school, got my doctorate.

And again, at the time, like, talking about it was like, no one thinks that's a good idea.

I came from a career in politics.

My mom would be like, you have a really great career.

Like, what are you doing?

You know?

Right, because you were doing politics in San Francisco.

Yeah.

So how did you then like make the shift?

Like, that's a huge pivot, right?

It was a pivot.

I kept pivoting.

So my thing, if anyone here is like, I don't know what I want to do yet, like this was my second career at like 35.

I was like, I don't know what I want to do.

But I knew when I was no longer passionate, I cannot fake it.

So like the light bulb moment in your brain, like my light bulb, it goes out.

Like I can be really passionate.

And then when I'm not, I'm like, well, I will not be useful to anybody unless I constantly love what I'm doing and I'm passionate and I'm asking questions all the time and that's what keeps me going that is the fuel so I was doing politics but then I became really disillusioned by it because I was like oh it's all about fundraising and that is not fun I thought it was about you know making a difference in the world so I realized at the time I was like I really want the right people to get elected but then you gotta you know do the muddy things and it was that wasn't fun but then I made a documentary about politics and I realized from there I actually loved the process of getting people to open up and I turned that into a podcast.

Was there like a lot of, so that was, so that was the first thing then?

You went to school for it first, or you did the podcast first?

Well, I started the podcast, and I was not an expert in the field at all.

I was like, well, I had some hands-on experience, but I was not a fan of the future.

Did you ever not have to.

I was kidding.

I didn't have to.

Thanks, Jen.

I had a, you know, I didn't have a degree, and I read everything to get my hands on.

And I was just talking, literally, I read hundreds of books.

I asked everyone at Nausea and grilled them really about their sex life.

But then I think about three three years into the podcast, people started asking me for advice.

And although I like had a lot of therapy and read a lot of books, I was like, I want to go back to school and get my doctorate.

So I did that after I started the podcast.

And that was 12 years ago I got the doctorate.

You know what I find so interesting that like the people who become the most successful in like in their area, like you, like Max and you, Darren, and you, Emily, like you didn't have the wherewithal.

Like you were very naive about how it would happen.

And because of that, like I like I say this, like naivety is a strength, right?

Because what you don't know doesn't stop you from going and trying something, right?

So if you know too much information, you think about all the things why you shouldn't.

You don't have the experience, you don't have the talent, you don't have the wherewithal.

But having none of it actually is how you become successful.

Yeah.

I love that you flip all that, the two, about also in your book about being mediocre.

I'm like, that's awesome.

You're right.

That has been a skill set.

You know, like, that has been a strength.

Like, not being the best.

Like, I wasn't one of the all-A students in school.

I was, no, it's like very mediocre.

But I wanted to figure out what else I wanted to do.

So, yeah, I mean, you just.

You had that curiosity.

You had that interest.

Yeah.

And I knew that I also being somebody whose focus is a challenge, I knew that if I'm not completely into something, I'm out.

And you know, when you lose my attention, you know, when I'm talking about what sex is like, and relationships and dating and love, it's not all sex, but that's endless.

Like, think about it.

It's like, there's so much.

There's so much to unpack about like other people, educating people, but also my own, my own life.

Like, it's just, you know, it's like health.

You're never done learning about like how.

it's still health it's sexual health yeah it's sexual health we are all what we are one so important exactly exactly so then how how come you think in your in your industry especially there hasn't been like that many thought leaders come out of from like from it even though it's becoming much more popular and people are talking about it more and there's all these different like versions of it but still you're still like like in the top top top tier i mean i think that there's a lot of shame around it i think there's a lot of fear and there's a lot of people like who still kind of trying to figure it out.

And I think, also, to be honest, a lot of people just think that they,

and I can't think this is changing with a different, you know, younger generation, but I think people believe that if you have to talk about sex or work on your sex life, that there's something like wrong with you, and that there's so much shame and embarrassment because we don't see it in our culture anywhere that there's just people are thinking, like, I don't know my own stuff.

How am I going to go out and figure it out?

And I think there's not a lot of places to go.

Like, literally, there's not a lot of grad school.

I mean, there's, again, starting out more so, but there was not a lot of places to go to learn more, maybe perhaps.

But I hope, I mean, I hear from a lot of younger people all the time who are getting into this field.

So I think it's wonderful.

But I think, again,

it's stress, trauma, shame, fear,

religion.

There's a lot of reasons, I think, why people don't venture into it.

Even for themselves, they don't even want to go inboard and think of like, who am I as a sexual being?

Like, that's just off limits for many people, too, because of unresolved challenges.

And then society isn't actually backing you up, saying like, Come on, let's learn.

And like, schools teach it for half a day, right?

By your gym teacher.

Like, you think that's a cliche, but everyone's like, oh, yeah, that was my gym teacher.

That was actually my gym.

That's what I was thinking.

Yeah, that was my gym teacher.

So, what do they know?

Like, they just have a big gym.

I guess you could all sit on the floor.

I don't know why they did a gym teacher.

Does that happen, though?

Do you feel like you're getting asked more?

That is true, actually.

Half a day, but like this thing.

That's like really, really important.

No, that's true.

Like, I got taught on a VHS tape for like two hours or split into two by my gym teacher.

Right, exactly.

And they're like, don't get pregnant, don't get an SDD, have a nice life.

Yeah.

And see ya.

Exactly.

And no, it's 100% true.

Now that you say that, it's actually true.

Really?

And then you, and then when you're young, you're told, like, oh, it's, it's this coveted thing that you're going to get to do when you're an adult.

And then you do it.

You're like, I don't know what I'm doing.

Was it like, I guess it's okay.

You know, I think many people have that experience.

Then no one else talks about it.

So anyway, so it's

bold just to even, even just be here and hear me talk about it now.

Exactly.

It's very bold that you're actually, but the two of of you, men, are sitting on the stage with Emily.

You're very bold and very, I mean, to be doing this.

How are you going to

try to introduce you guys like years ago?

God.

Anyway, not like that.

I mean, like as friends.

God, you guys.

Seriously.

I didn't mean it like that.

So how do you like, so let's go back to you, Darren.

Okay, so segue into you.

How do you, what do you, where do you go from there?

Tell us about some bullies.

Tell, I mean, I don't even know what to ask you from after that.

Emily, that was so great.

You're leading her.

So you're going to be able to do that.

Listen, I think I just like

there is so much there.

And I think just to make a comment on it, it's like,

no, but

the shame

around sex and the dirtiness, just, you know, and the religious kind of connotations around it has just painted this horrible kind of situation.

And so I applaud you for boldly going where very few people will go.

Captain Kirk.

So

I'm dating myself, right?

No, you're not.

I got it.

I got it.

But yeah, so I mean, it's how, you know, again, that's kind of excavating oneself, too, right?

Can I help you do it?

Can I go ahead, please?

Because I want to say tonight thinking, yes, we've all done really bold things.

And I think a lot of people, but what I love, I want to bring you back to to your book for a minute.

Oh, of course.

She's such a good friend.

No, but I mean, because what I love, I actually read it going, shit.

I texted you last time.

I'm like, I got to be bolder because I bold every day.

I do big, bold things.

But sometimes I self-doubt.

I hold myself back.

This is bold to say all of you.

Like, I'm not, I'm bold, but I have a lot of, like, maybe I don't do the.

10 tries or whatever, your 10 second, 10.

10% target.

I'm like, I write.

I'm going to write a book, though.

Good thing.

I do.

No, but like your target of like, keep going.

Like, I think that what I love about your book is that it's like that boldness is a skill that you can cultivate, which I never thought about that way.

If you're born bold or you're not, and there are some ways you're bold, but there's other ways that really in thinking about getting what you want in life.

And when you're even just the cover, you're like, don't live the life you get.

I'm like, oh, God, what am I just accepting right now?

That I, you know, I think as a friend, you do push me there sometimes.

So I appreciate that.

That bold is like just a, I love that we were all doing cool things, but like they day to day sometimes I don't maybe always ask for things that I need like professionally, or I don't, I hold myself back in ways where I overthink overthinking dude what do you say like if the overthinking is like the enemy of boldness it is well I think when you're too smart you tend to overthink things right right because you think I'm also mediocre and smart I've realized but I'm I mean being mediocre is great I told you it's a it's a superpower it is no but I I love the bold tips in here thank you so then what would you say what kind of boldness where in your life max would you have to say that you have to like work on your bold area because you could be bold in one area in your life and not so bold in in another area.

What would you say?

Well, I, jumping off what Emily succeeded.

Everyone wants to talk about Emily.

It helps us succeed.

No, it's good.

Began to allude to.

I think oftentimes we get in our own way.

And for me, as somebody who's very creative, and even though my work focuses on health science and nutrition, I very much consider myself an artist and my work

a sort of outgrowth of

my artistic tendency.

And I think like as an artist, you tend to be, I don't know if others in the audience feel this way, but I feel very like precious about like anything that I create.

And that's like something that I've always felt.

Like if I'm going to put something out into the world, it has to be amazing.

It has to be something that I consider to be perfect.

But when you're first getting started with any kind of creative endeavor, there is the tendency of course to let perfect be the enemy of the good.

And you know, as they say at Facebook, you got, you know, done is better than perfect.

And so just, you know, for example, with me and my podcast, which I launched in 2018, I never thought that, I never actually, at the beginning when I launched it, I didn't think that I was any good as a host.

I didn't think that it was going to be successful.

I very much thought at the time that there were enough podcasts.

You know, like, what, what, does the world need like another?

Yeah, another guy with a podcast.

Like,

and apparently it did.

Yeah, well, I mean,

i basically i followed like a formula and it's not a formula that i discovered on any website or any you know hidden like back channel i it was just like consistency and it was about not letting perfect be the enemy of the good and just putting out the content and realizing that with the process comes eventually mastery you know whether or not you can see the end of the tunnel with whatever whatever it is that you aspire to do um

you know you're sort of like i think of it i think of it as being sort of like a miner in a coal mine Like, as long as you stay focused on like the chipping away of what's in front of you, there is an end.

Even if you can't see it, like for me, I was never, I never would have predicted that I would have written a book, let alone a book that would go on to become like a global, you know, New York Times bestseller, anything like that.

Genius Foods is the first one.

Was it first one?

Was it Genius Foods?

Genius Foods was the first one.

That was massive.

So I'm not even just saying that because to be polite.

If you haven't read it, it's amazing.

That's how, that's when I first met you.

Yeah, that was the first book.

Yeah.

And the second one?

The Genius Life, which came out March 2020, which was

a book.

So yeah, it's sort of the middle child.

And then

the,

and I, and I love it, nonetheless.

And look over there.

And then this is the third book that came out.

this year called Genius Kitchen, which is a cookbook.

But yeah, I never would have thought, never, ever, ever would have anticipated that this would be my career because what I've always been focused on, I don't know if it was like, you know, something that was just intuitively that I, that I knew to do, but I just stayed focused on, stayed focused on like the chipping away of what was like immediately in front of me.

But you also knew, I remember like, let's talk about like the social media part and digital and all that, because you had to kind of evolve and

grow these businesses.

So even if that was your world, you had to become

well-known in social media.

And you kind of grew, like you kind of grew pretty fast, right?

Like your on social media?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Everything kind of grew separately, but in tandem.

The social media thing for me,

I,

there was something that clicked for me with

social media where I completely relinquished the desire to appear cool on social media.

And you had an opinion.

You have an opinion on there, too.

Yeah, but it wasn't even about expressing my opinion.

I became solely focused on adding value.

That's it.

And like putting out free content because I knew that I would eventually grow a following and that I'd be able to do something with that following.

But I think when I first got on social media,

I aspired to just look cool and look like a guy who's like doing cool things.

And at a certain point, I just like that completely went out the window.

And I just, I started...

thinking in terms of how can I create content that is going to create value for whoever gives enough about what I have to say.

And that's what I did.

And the minute that that clicked in my brain, it was like night and day.

It was like a switch.

And my following started to grow really quickly after that.

Yeah.

And now I feel like you picked a lane, so to speak, right?

Like people know when they go to you what to expect.

Yeah.

Same with you, Emily.

Like they know what, like, they know what to get when they, when they, when they know what they're going to get when they come to you.

So you're very deliberate.

Same thing.

I want to provide value.

And yeah, Max, maybe, I go to his Instagram, like, I want to eat broccoli now.

I want to have, I want a celery.

His face to the steak.

I'm like, okay, I'll eat that.

I'll do that.

I love that.

It was very meat, whatever it was.

Grass bad.

And broccoli.

Yeah, bro.

I just have, no, I love

pivoting.

Max is good.

So I, yeah, so for me, yeah, very specific.

I want people to, but it's been a lot, you know, a lot of road to figure out what, what works.

And like, for a while, I didn't like if I posted a picture of me, like, everyone's like, pictures of you do great.

I'm like, yeah, but that's, that's not, I don't know, it's not about me.

And like, that was early, you know, a few years ago.

I was like, I really want people, that was a separate thing.

It's like, I really didn't want it to be about me per se.

It was like, I, even though it's Sex with Employee in the title, I think that if it could help people listening to my voice and the podcast and all that, but if you're like thinking about social media, it's like, I definitely want every post to educational, every podcast.

I want people to take something away from it and to be able to learn action items, actionable.

Yeah.

And same with you.

So, like, Darren, you kind of went from being the super food hunter to then like having like a major show on Netflix and now this new show.

Can I talk about the new show?

No?

No.

Well, there isn't, yeah, there is a new show.

We just can't talk about it.

Oh, okay.

Well, we can't give any

information.

Okay.

Well, it's going to be huge, okay?

I'm telling you no.

But you really made, like, and you got into all this other stuff.

Like, how did you go so deep into the weeds with like your this new book coming out and all of that stuff?

You became like very much like the

spokesman for things that are

helpful, yeah.

Harmful.

Harmful and helpful.

So this

second book is called Fatal Conveniences.

We're all holding one of them right now, and that's the phone.

So they're so great.

They're so convenient, but they all have a little rub, right?

You put that up to your head.

The electromagnetic fields, which, by the way, in the fine print, I'm not going to go too much in this one.

Get comfortable.

The fine print says it should not be closer than nine inches to your body.

And everyone's got it in their bras or their pockets, And it's very clear, and then I'll just leave it.

Thanks.

It's very clear that it turns on reactive oxygen species.

So

it's a free radical igniter.

It suppresses the immune system

and it creates a whole lot of response and of neutering in the reproductive system.

So it's a really bad thing.

And again, so there's things.

So the whole book is not about just to poo-poo everything because believe me,

the whole,

so why I got into that was, again, there's like safe sleep, right?

There's things you can do for it.

But my father suffered,

he was part of

the Naval Academy or the Naval Fleet in the Cuban Missile Crisis, and he worked on atomic bombs, and he got exposed to a lot of radiation.

And so his immune system was shot.

So by the time I could realize like he was taking thyroid medication and then in the 90s, he developed chemical sensitivity.

So, his immune system couldn't deal with normal stuff like deodorants and shampoos.

And so, I was in college, so he's sending me these care packages: Hey, you're coming home this weekend.

You need to shower with this, you need to put this deodorant on.

And I was like, What the fuck is this in his head?

Like, and so he was a professor, so he was very

making VHS tapes, trying to educate his whole world around him.

And then the more I realized, I started looking into it.

So it affected me then.

So the book is dedicated to him.

And I just kept pulling those strings.

And the thing is, it's all out in the open.

I'm not making this up.

It's like cosmetics and personal care items.

There is...

AirPods, like you were talking about your phone.

Yeah, the Bluetooth.

You would never wear.

Never.

And this guy is like, this guy, he practices what he preaches.

He's not just saying it from like,

it is 100%, you like live and breathe everything that you talk about.

Yeah, but I mean, the thing is,

it's not to be overwhelmed.

There's always a better solution, right?

There's always a better way.

What is a better solution for the phone?

I think the AirPods and the phone, because everyone here uses it.

Yeah,

never, ever put your phone up to your head.

Ever.

How about the AirPods, though?

So

the, well, there's Bluetooth.

I would never put those in your ear canals and just sit there.

Right.

Because that's just a

lower voltage of the same frequency of the cell phone.

Right.

And it already shows that it's dangerous.

So you can use

air tubes.

for your you can plug it back in.

So I have a hashtag plug everything back in.

Everything's like the ones that I would get.

Plug everything back in.

And just if you use a speakerphone, if you're alone, just use a speakerphone and don't.

So there's always a solution for this stuff.

Can you give us one other one that's very...

Dental floss.

Really?

Yeah, so dental floss,

that damn stuff that's so slippery and it fits between the teeth really well.

The thin film.

And it's like, so that shit is PFAS.

So

the grandfather of PFAS is Teflon.

So DuPont made that so it slips in between your teeth and it is a proven

carcinogenic.

Really?

To your kidney.

All Gentophos is rather good.

Well, organophosphosidos.

Is it the wax one?

I mean, you can, you know, you can bamboo and charcoal and wax and you can get

do your due diligence on that stuff.

But any of that shit that's like, again, it's a hell of a convenience, right?

Yeah.

It doesn't, you know,

you mess up your

gums and everything else.

But like for me, I use a regular one.

I just wet it first.

And I'm like, that's it.

A regular one.

What do you mean?

Yeah, so a nice clean one that doesn't have that PFAS on it.

I just wet it first, and then it slips in between the

dry floss.

It's just a dry floss.

That was so creepy.

And then you move.

You should see your face.

I feel like I'd rather get the kidney cancer.

Oh, my God.

Okay, so give us one other one, one more.

That's why I think this book is going to be so massive because I think everyone's

fascinated by it.

The good news is there's just great products that you can replace this.

Give us one more.

Your book can't just be two.

Well, clothing.

Camphlets.

Clothing.

Okay.

Clothing.

Like

most of it is synthetic fiber and petroleum.

So you're wearing oil, right?

Formaldehydes,

formaldehydes, phthalates are all endocrine disruptors.

So if you look at all of this stuff,

they're doing three major things.

Again, they're neutering you.

Again, and you got to

think about your children.

Okay, like here's another one that I would say never

put throwaway diapers on a child.

Ever.

Because that's around their private parts.

And

it's very clear that it's affecting their hormonal system immediately.

Plus,

the big rub is 200 known chemicals, most of which are carcinogenic, are already in the umbilical cord of every mother giving birth today in the United States.

Really?

So all of the stuff

from the paints to the carpets to the sprays that make the room smell good, all of this stuff is absolutely gnarly.

So my point to this whole thing is you may not feel your suffering, but you're suffering.

You're in it.

Your body's being exposed to it.

And over time, you're like, why do I have a headache?

Why do I not have the energy?

Where is my testosterone?

Right?

You go to these bioac conferences, everybody's talking about testosterone.

They're running around with freaking weird-ass clothes and tight clothes and Bluetooth and monitoring devices.

I'm like going, oh my God.

And then they're like, yeah, I just got my testosterone checked.

I'm like, oh my God, you guys are crazy.

So I think it's an elephant in the room in our society.

It's an elephant in the room in our, you know, listen, 2.7% of the United States are deemed healthy by the Male Clinic.

2.7%

of all people are actually deemed healthy.

So we are sprinting towards our own demise.

These things, the point to this whole thing is to expose these systems that we have in place that we're apathetic towards.

I want to just shake you a little bit to go like, oh, I don't, I can still floss my teeth.

I just don't need to put chemicals in my mouth and be absorbed by my body or my children.

And also toothpaste, right?

Okay.

Like

kids and toothpaste and fluorides and like...

So what do you use instead of, so what kind of toothpaste?

Oh, so you can use it.

I use this stuff called bite.

Oh, bite, that's a toothpaste, which is great.

It's just little pellets,

and it's clean.

And I know that he doesn't, like, honestly, he's super particular with every single company he works with because I work with him and he won't work with anybody.

And

it's serious.

Well, it's serious that, like, you're very serious.

And

it's just over time.

Yeah.

You just do this over time so you don't get overwhelmed with it.

You just take one step at a time.

And you're boldly putting it out there to

the world.

It sucks with the creative stuff like this.

You have no idea.

I'm like, and I'm talking to the publisher going, you sure you want that title?

You sure you want Fatal Convenience?

Yeah, we love it.

You sure,

I don't know if anyone's going to

want to look at this stuff.

What do you mean?

Everyone loves that stuff.

But that's the thing.

Anything creative, even the TV shows that come out, you're going, oh, fuck, they edited that out.

This show is going to suck.

Like,

I said all this stuff, they cut all that out you're like i don't know do they cut it out because they don't want to kind of cause but it's a million reasons yeah you have no idea and so it's like with any book you put it out there and you just go okay i just got to keep going i just get put it out and i just got to keep going and just take it however it goes and that's life man it's like you know anything happens in life it's like have have the conversation with your partner about sex if it sucks like have those radical honest conversations That's bold.

Everyone's avoiding direct eye communication conversations.

It's a plague.

That's the freaking pandemic, right?

We need to interact, look at each other, be honest and open and caring, but honest, truly, right?

So we can have real conversations.

That's what I love about you.

You're like, there's no, there's no bullshit, right?

It's just, that's Jennifer.

And then, and then she creates a space because she, again, going back to her book, she is this book.

And I don't care if you feel you're successful or know what you want to do.

You're going to gain and garner something from this book.

Just like Emily, right?

You go through this thing going, oh my God, I totally failed.

Right.

Or on any moment, right?

Where I'm like, oh, I don't want to do that.

And I'm like,

do it, right?

Yep.

And it's a practice, too.

Like, what I loved is how real you were, too, the what your book because I did.

You're talking about the Mark Waldberg thing.

You're like,

you saw him somewhere and you're like, I've gone up there.

I've been.

I still think about that.

Rejection over regret.

I mean, right, but just stop yourself in the moment.

Yeah, you don't want to be like, what else am I going to do?

Like, what is the worst?

You have to think of what's the worst thing that can happen.

What's the worst that can happen?

And the worst thing that happens.

And then I was also reading something about that, like, like some study about, like, most people, maybe it was in your book.

That most people, like, they do, like you said, but you regret the shots you don't take.

I guess that's part of it.

But like, we, people on their, their deathbed are literally saying, like, like, I just regret that I didn't, that I didn't do these things, not what they did.

They're like, I can't believe I made that phone call and asked for that.

whatever it is, that raise or that person to call me or that person to talk to me or I made that move.

It's more about like beating yourself for not doing things.

She's referring to something.

Yeah, thank you.

Because she's referring to this thing I always talk about, rejection over versus regret.

And I'd always rather be rejected versus having regret because rejection, you feel it and it hurts, but then it kind of fades away after a while.

And regret, that lives with you all the time.

And so I'd always rather, I always pick rejection over regret anytime.

And rejection, you can learn from.

And you can learn from, and also a lot of times with that rejection comes another thing that you never even knew existed by just, you know, but you don't know that at the time, but it shows itself later on down the road.

And you realize how often you keep yourself safe because you don't want to feel rejection, but then you realize the more you do it, like, really, what is the worst?

So you get rejected.

Like,

What's the worst that can happen?

And then it's a muscle.

Have you ever been rejected, Max?

Never.

Yeah.

No.

Many, bajillion times.

Yeah.

I'm actually in the process right now of...

I'm being rejected?

Being rejected.

See you, Max.

No, all the time.

I mean, that's part of the reason why I decided to build my own empire, so to speak, because I came through the Hollywood system.

And then

when my job ran its course, you know, the Al Gore network thing, and I tried to leverage that job into a career, I found myself being thrown against brick walls over and over and over again.

I signed with like a major agency, and it ended up not working out.

Like none of the jobs that they put me up for was I was I booking, they ended up dropping me.

It was like a, yeah, it was like a, it was actually like that, that saying, like, when life falls apart.

That moment for me, there was this, there was a year where like my agent dropped me, I wasn't making any money, I,

felt like I had deferred you know like my young adult like the young adult like what am I doing with my life thing because I had that job but I wasn't able to transition it to a career and then my mom got sick so for me I mean that was like the lowest of the low that I've ever experienced in my life I mean it was it was a pretty dark time but um but yeah but but from that you know like I mean that's the beautiful thing about hitting rock bottom so there's only you can only go up from there right that's true so um so yeah so that was it and right even right now, like, I mean, with all the, all the things that I've this is rock bottom for you?

No, now is not rock bottom.

I'm very, I'm very grateful, but I'm still getting rejected.

Like, I, you know, I'm, uh,

one of the projects that I'm working on that I'm really excited about is a documentary that I've been working on for eight years.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So it's been this like labor of love, um, lots of rejection over the course of eight years to get it done.

And like a major pain project.

I did a Kickstarter campaign for it eight years ago.

And the backers are like when's this film coming out?

Did you just take all the money and like use it to fund your lifestyle, you fraud?

Oh my god.

Like a very small, a very small, tiny, tiny, tiny proportion of the 1800 people that contributed to it are like really evil.

And these people contributed like the least.

Of course, always out of the way.

There's like a $5 donor to the Kickstarter campaign eight years ago.

They're like, you're like really, really terrible.

And those are the kinds of comments that I have to like.

Oh my God.

But it's fine.

It's fine.

I've got this amazing project I'm super super excited about it you can take five dollars I'll give you five dollars for the Kickstarter I can't even refund them because half of their credit cards are like not active anymore seriously yeah yeah

you can like in the Kickstarter thing

yeah you can go

and refund backers but only if their credit cards are active otherwise you have to like reach out to them which I don't want to do right so but we're now in the process of uh but it's fine we've got this amazing film after eight years and we're in the process of submitting it to film festivals It's my hope to do it.

Yeah.

Thank you.

But like, you know, not every film festival is going to like accept it.

So

it's just a.

Can you go back on Joe Rogan and talk about it?

Maybe.

He was on Joe Rogan.

He was on Joe Rogan, Max.

And it was one of those most shared episodes.

I saw that.

I was so proud of you.

Thank you.

Yeah, no, you're welcome.

It was a big one.

Yeah.

It's very big.

And also because, you know,

you're very articulate and you're very good at getting some message that can be complicated out to and to like the lay the layman's person and so that's why I think you're I love your information your content and you thank you

you're so sweet I'm obsessed with health and nutrition like and I come at it from a place of I mean I think I think authenticity because it really is motivated by the fact that my mom was sick and I aspire to not suffer the same fate that my mom suffered and to have if I am if I'm able to have any impact on others that I care about and the world at large I mean that to me would be a dream and so for me it really is about understanding as much as I possibly can and then and then sharing that information out with people and I found this like interesting like zone for myself where I'm doing like all the things that I feel like I'm meant to do you know and you're so good at it thanks but it's taken you know I get a lot of well I was gonna ask the panel like how do you deal with naysayers because I mean I you know for me the bigger you get in any area right you get hate right like

and it's, I think, important to remember that there are freaking people that hate Disney World.

There are people that hate pizza, you know, like there are going to be haters, right?

As long as you're doing anything of note, like, there is going to be haters.

So,

so, yeah, I mean, even today, like, even after Rogue and everything, all the positive feedback that I get, I still get a lot of like, I mean, are they hating you because you're eating meat?

Because I know Darren hates you because of meat.

No, well, you eat meat, yeah,

occasionally, yeah.

He's a major vegan, Darren, and Max is not.

But we respect each other.

But we love each other nonetheless.

Yeah, yeah.

Exactly.

But yeah, it's always interesting.

How do you handle it?

Because you seem like a sensitive type a little bit, you know?

Like, how do you handle it?

You don't like it, obviously.

I am sensitive, but

I'm able to take my ego out of it.

because I have what Jordan Peterson calls a noble aim, you know?

Yeah, I know, yeah, yeah.

It's something larger than myself that I do this work for.

And I think it's really important for you to find that, whatever that happens to be.

That's like a really important part of the puzzle.

I like that.

Is a ray, I think we gotta wrap.

Yeah, I gotta wrap this up.

They probably want us out of here, and I'm just droning on and on over here.

But

this has been very fun.

And again, I am so appreciative to all three of you guys for coming out here and supporting this book launch.

And And can you guys just all quickly say how people can find you and all your stuff?

Yeah, so I'm Max Lugavir.

I'm very active on Instagram and I have a podcast called The Genius Life.

So if you listen to podcasts, come over.

We talk about fitness and nutrition.

It's great.

It's in the top health in the world, like in the top five in the world all the time.

So you should definitely listen.

He's got great content.

And the books.

Oh, yeah, books.

Genius Kitchen.

They have a bunch of copies here.

I love it.

Being bold.

You got to be bold.

Yeah, you got to be bold.

Go ahead, Darren.

You're correct.

Yeah, Darren Aline on all the platforms.

Darrenaline.com,

The Darren Aline Show,

Super Life.

And pre-order is the fatal convenience.

Already on pre-order?

Already?

Yeah, it comes out May 15th.

Nice.

Wow.

I'll order a copy.

Me too.

Well, thank you.

You're welcome.

Sex with Emily and all platforms, all social media.

The podcast is sex with Emily, sexwithemily.com.

You can also pre-order my book.

Already today, yeah, it's called Smart Sex.

And it's called Smart Sex, How to Uplevel Your Sex IQ and Own Your Pleasure, because I've developed a whole new way of thinking about sex.

It's called sexual intelligence.

I release two podcasts a week.

I've been heading into my 18th year.

I have thousands of podcasts.

If you've had a question about sex, dating, marriage, love, relationships, date, all the things, I've got a podcast about it for sure.

You sure does.

If you have any questions, you can also find me, DM me on all the things.

It's all at Sex with Emily.

Also, she has a really famous masterclass that she did.

The platform, the masterclass platform.

Learn from the world's best.

The world's best.

I was like, oh,

that happened.

I was like, oh, God, that's a lot of pressure in the bedroom.

Jesus.

But yeah, you can check that out too.

My masterclass on sex.

That's true.

A lot of other things coming soon.

Yeah.

Check it.

Right, and they both, Darren and Emily both handed in their new book like this week.

Yeah.

Yeah, so that's amazing.

How about that one?

So thank you, you guys.

Hey, first, let's give it up to the

beautiful.

Yay!

Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you.

Wow.

What about you, Jen?

What's your takeaway from the next one?

What's my takeaway?

Exercise people can do tonight.

They have a work.

What's your favorite thing in here?

She's got bold moves.

Get it?

I do.

I have a lot of bold moves, but you got to get the book and

the workbook.

We're not telling you.

Yeah.

And it's basically a blueprint for people who want to be bolder in their lives.

It's very actionable.

It's very practical.

And you can integrate it today.

So pick one up if you haven't had a chance yet.

So that's it.

Woo!

Thank you.

Thank you.

Habits and hustle, time to get it rolling.

Stay up on the grind, don't stop, keep it going.

Habits and hustle from nothing into something.

All out, hosted by Jennifer Cohen.

Visionaries, tune in, you can get to know them.

Be inspired.

This is your moment.

Excuses, we ain't having that.

The Habits and Hustle podcast, powered by Habit Nest.