How to Heal Intergenerational Trauma with Teal Swan | EP 60

If you understand safety strategies, you understand the world. People are walking around in safety strategies all day long, and we've got to take our minds and expand them.
Everyone's in a protection strategy. It's whatever kept them safe in their particular experience.
So one of the most important things when we're examining ourselves is to be like, wait a minute, maybe my personality is false, and maybe the things that I am doing, especially in a social setting, it's all to keep myself safe. Whether it's yelling at the top of my lungs or making sure everyone has what they need at the party.
Right now we're at a time and a place within not only human society, but where the universe is right now. We're in a pressure cooker in a big way where each individual is being forced to is towards the very thing that they've been spending their entire life running away from.
That's because right now the human race is being asked to break free completely from their addictive strategies. Now, most people don't look at their everyday life and the way that they've done things as an addictive strategy, but it actually is.
Now, most of us have addictions wrong. We think it's about the thing that we're going towards when it's really the thing we're running away from.
Welcome to the Healing and Human Potential podcast, where today's conversation may just challenge your perception of traditional therapy, healing trauma, and how to create deep lasting change. I am honored to have Teal Swan on today, who is a bestselling author.
She's an expert in human development and healing trauma. I'm so happy that you're here, Teal.
There's so many reasons why I invited you on. One of them is because I think we share a similar intention of helping humanity heal and elevating consciousness on the planet.
So thank you for doing that work in the world. So happy.
Yeah. I wanted to kind of kick us off talking about traditional therapy and some of the limitations of it, because I think I've heard you talk about this and I think it's important to share because sometimes people try a therapist and it's not necessarily in alignment with the ways that they're wanting to change their life.
And I used to be a psychotherapist doing somatic and spiritual psychology. And then I moved over to coaching.
So I can talk a little bit about it as well, but I'd love to hear from you some of the limitations that you see of traditional psychotherapy. How long have you got? Yeah.
One of the number one things that I see in traditional therapy that doesn't work is this very adverse relationship with emotion. I know that kind of takes people aback because you'd think, wait a minute, if I'm going to a therapist, especially a psychologist or something like that, I'm going to be talking about my emotions.
But what most people don't understand is that most therapists actually have a very, very resistant attitude towards emotions. And so the entire attitude towards it is going to be, how do we get these emotions to go away? Obviously, when you're trying to make something to go away or trying to make something be under your control, you're almost like fighting with an emotion.
And that is a huge misunderstanding about what emotion is, what the value is in emotion. And you can't actually work with a person's deeper truths if you're in that attitude towards emotion.
And a lot of people have these splits in their consciousness where they resist their own emotion. And that's part of why they've got the symptomology that's presenting that has forced them to go into therapy in the first place.
And so in fact, traditional therapy can fuel that resistance that's already causing the symptoms they went into therapy for. That's problem number one.
Problem number two is that there's this real focus on things being an illness rather than an adaptation. That is something that I see really as being the cornerstone of change within traditional therapeutic models, because we right now don't understand that half the things, not half the things, I mean, the vast majority, vast majority of things that we're looking at in the DSM are adaptive strategies that we've just noticed sort of elements of and are grouping together.
And if we don't understand that adaptation lens through which to view a person's behaviors, the ones that have driven them into therapy, we can't actually understand the full picture of what's going on so as to deal with it. These are not illnesses.
Okay. So that's number two.
Number three, issues with the healthcare system itself. I mean, yeah, all the way to the systematic failure, you know, system failures.
There's no way for people to get the kind of help that they need and especially not to get the kind of help they need fast enough. We've got this attitude, interestingly, around mental health issues where it's like, oh, well, you can afford to like book a session in two weeks or a month.
I'm telling you, like you, there are people who will get into problems on a mental and emotional level where it is not an option. And if our only option for those people is to go call a suicide hotline or to go check themselves into the hospital, and we're thinking that that's going to somehow fix the issue that they're having, which, believe me, relates to elements of their life that they're living, then we're sorely mistaken.
In fact, a lot of those venues we push people to that are in crisis make things much, much worse. The next issue that I see with modern therapy is this constant focus on the brain.
We don't really understand that consciousness is much more than the brain itself. And so when we're constantly pointing to the brain and the chemicals of the brain is the issue, it's like we've missed this entire kaleidoscope of what could be going on in a person's life holistically that is causing them to end up in this place where they're in such a state of duress.
I obviously don't like this sort of idea that diagnosis is cut and dry. It is not.
There's a ton of gray area when it comes to mental and emotional issues. And let's just be honest right now.
Besides the fact that we're throwing darts at a dartboard with medicines, we are in the dark ages. And I don't think most people appreciate this.
Psychology is a very brand new field. With psychology, we are where modern medicine was in terms of the sort of mechanical aspects of putting a body together in the 1500s.
So, I mean, it's something that's scary to admit, but I feel like most people who are in this field of helping people should be able to admit that we're fumbling around in the dark, figuring things out as we go. That's the reality.
It doesn't matter whether we're, you know, in the coaching business or the spiritual teacher business, or we hold a psychology degree or we're a psychiatrist. It's like, it's very much experimentation.
So when we walk into this field, kind of hoping that it's going to be this cut and dry thing where people have figured it out already and we're going to walk in and it's just going to make sense. They have to understand it's, it's very different.
I mean, very different than a lot of the more physical elements that we've been dealing with or elements that we've been dealing with for years where there's like, oh, this is what we can tell you you have exactly. And this is the treatment.
And there is a result. It doesn't work like that in this field.
That's so brand new. Yeah.
There are so many elements that you hit on. And the first one talking about emotions is like not, not thinking that they're wrong or bad, you know, not indulging and not resisting, just allowing them and that there are gifts inside of them, which is part of your second point, which is like, if you actually meet them, you may uncover some wisdom inside of them.
I love Inside Out, the movie. I think it's starting to change culture.
I think media has a way of opening our minds and I, especially for younger kids, like, oh, maybe sadness is okay. Maybe there's nothing wrong with it.
Maybe there's feedback or wisdom in it. And so I love that you're bringing that forward and just helping shift the narrative.
But ideally we keep evolving as a society and we keep being honest about where we are and where we're not. And I do think it's like dating, find somebody that's a good fit.
I don't, I'm not a fan of just staying in analysis for 17 years and like knowing about the problem because therapists wouldn't have any issues if that was actually helpful. Awareness is first step, but then there's so much going deeper into the body, into the nervous system and keep evolving together.
So I love that you share that and just talk about, let's be honest with ourselves and keep moving forward in terms of a society, but the foundation being acceptance. And when it's really accepted, the next action is really clear.
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And most people hear what I'm going to say, and they think they know what it is, but they don't. And it's projections.
And I don't see a lot of people online talking about projections in a clean way. I think because it's an ego defense, there's ways that we think we understand, but it's really sometimes hard to apply.
And I remember seeing a video of you explaining projections and I was like, she gets it. And you have such a beautiful way to articulate some pretty deep concepts.
And so I'd love for you to share, if you're open, how you see projections and how people can apply this to actually changing their lives as a result. I think something that people need as kind of like a baseline from which to understand this concept is they have to look at the picture of socialization within society.
When we come into a society, which we all did, if we're speaking a language, we were socialized. So that's all of us.
We learn very quickly what's acceptable and not acceptable, what's okay and not okay, what's good and bad, what's right and wrong. And when we get these types of categories, it's a little bit dangerous in a group setting because we need to be the things that are good and right in order to stay close to our social group.
And human beings are profoundly social species. So our entire survival and capacity to thrive is dependent upon being part of a social group.
That's awesome in some ways, where it's not really awesome is that it means that we tend to suppress, deny, and disown and reject aspects of ourselves that are not good, that are rejected in some way, that essentially would make us disincluded or rejected by the social group. We can't have those things be a part of ourselves, even a part of our conscious awareness.
And so we tend to suppress those things into our subconscious mind. So that means that we may have anger issues, but we're not going to be consciously aware of those things because it's suppressed and disowned.
Then we're going to line up with people on the external that are a mirror of these things. Potentially not even, but like oftentimes we are recognizing something in them, but it's also in us.
And what we're going to do is we're going to ignore it in us and see it in them. That's essentially the essence of projection is taking something that's internal and projecting it out on the external.

I think that it's used as an ego defense a lot of times, like you said.

And so, you know,

when we talk about this concept of projection is always assumed that when

you're projecting, it's not yours at all. It's just, or sorry,

it's only yours. It's not the other person's,

but it's actually more complicated than this.

A lot of times when we're projecting, it's like the other person does possess that trait as well. It's just that we don't recognize it in ourselves as well, right? We can project both positive and negative things.
So I've right now had this little conversation about projection in the context of suppressing things that are not okay and bad and wrong and whatever, but that does not mean that the only thing that's rejected by a group that you are involved in was inherently negative. In fact, a lot of the time, like if you picture like a Justin Bieber concert, and you've got all these girls in the stadium, they're like screaming their head off.
I love you, Justin. A lot of that is actually the projection of disowned traits in the self that we would have identified as positive, but that the social group that we're essentially coming into as a child does not allow us to maintain.
Yeah, it doesn't feel safe, right? It doesn't feel safe to maintain maybe a degree of intellect. And so you're like projecting your own sense of intellect that you can't recognize in yourself on something else.
So there's a lot of, of meat of projection inherent in admiration. And there's a lot of meat inherent in, you know, that sort of projection inherent in when we see something and we are really in resistance to it.
So the way that we work with this is that we work with our strong reactions to anyone or anything. And we start to explore why we have that rejection.
What would be so bad if that was me? And we start to try to recognize ourself in others. This is, of course, the highest practice that you can go to is like, sort of to see the entire external world as a projection of the self.
And therefore, you walk in with the assumption that anything you see in another person is inherent in the self.

And so you are turning your attention towards the self to look for that trait and then integrating it intentionally. Yeah, beautifully said.
And just to give one grounded example, too, is like, and I love that you're speaking to positive and negative projections because a lot of people miss the positive. And it's just as important because then we don't envy and have jealousy.
It's like, what do I see in them? That's looking with the qualities that's looking to be expressed more fully in my life so that I own it. And with a negative, just to ground with an example, let's just say you were raised in a household where anger was bad and you still are going to feel the human emotion of anger.
And so you repress it, but then you attract somebody that expresses what you repress. And so you get a partner that's super angry and you're like, they're so angry.
And they're teaching you about how to have a healthy relationship within your own anger. And it's not bad.
It's allowed. It's part of the emotional tapestry of being human.
And we don't have to unconsciously express it through behavior like violence, but we can have a healthy relationship with our anger as sacred of its feedback. And how do I integrate and allow it? And my partner may be teaching that.
So yeah, we're on the same page. I love it.
I heard you talk about that unresolved childhood trauma is silently controlling our adult relationships. Can you unpack this for us or talk to us about this? Oh God.
I think people have a really hard time honestly accepting that the foundations of their life, which have the roots in childhood, have such a massive impact on the totality of our life. You know, we would love to get to a point where it's like, oh, that was so many years ago.
That was your childhood. You're not a child anymore.
Why is it an issue? But we have to understand those are the building blocks of who we are in this life. So let's go back to childhood.
Every single person in their childhood did experience trauma. But We have to define trauma as distress that did not have a resolve to it.
And so because it didn't have a resolve to it, we had to find a way to adapt to that distressing situation. those adaptations are really what holds the key to this whole picture of the impact and influence

on our our future adult lives because it dictates the way we interact with people

and i'm going to tell you that the vast and influence on our future adult lives because it dictates the way we interact with people. And I'm going to tell you that the vast, and I mean vast majority of trauma is interpersonal trauma.
So it would be all about our relationships with other people. So let's just go back and I'll give you like one example.
Let's say you've got a little girl and that little girl has a very dictatorial father. And so everybody's kind of walking on eggshells around the house.
This little girl doesn't feel like she has any way to get out of the distressing situation. She can't get out of the home and therefore is stuck in this place where she's got a volatile father.
All right. So how does this child adapt to that situation? Probably by becoming a people pleaser and a regulator.
And so their entire personality structure is going to go towards whatever kept them safe. That's the case for all of our adaptations.
So that person's adaptations is going to go towards, oh, I'm going to be the person who makes that person stable. Now, how does this affect us going forward besides things like trauma repetition compulsion, where we try to find somebody who reminds us exactly of what caused us to stress so we can try to resolve it in real time in our adult life on top of the fact that being in our childhood home, that's our definition of love.
And so if home felt like walking on eggshells, then we actually associate love with walking on eggshells. Okay, but the primary element here that's going to be the one that we need to really focus on is our adaptations.
So let's say that, like we said, that that individual is somebody who became a person who stabilizes others, and that's their adaptive strategy socially. Well, what happens when you try to go into a relationship with somebody who is stable? Now all of a sudden you're out of control.
Oh my goodness, I don't have power in this relationship. I don't know how to make them stay with me.
I don't know how to have a relationship with this. And so in fact, you feel safer in an unsafe situation.
You feel safer when, not only safer, more valued in a situation where you find somebody who's dysfunctional, who you have to constantly stabilize because that exchange of I stabilize you and therefore I need you dysfunctional so that I can stabilize you so that you will keep me in your life now has made it so that we have a profoundly unhealthy relationship in our adult life. And I'm telling you, this is just one pattern.
I mean, if you start to really unpack the amount of negative trajectories, quite frankly, that our childhood experience has set us on, it gets a little bit daunting. I mean, it's pretty amazing.
And you keep coming back to these adaptive strategies, which I love. I call them safety strategies.
Same thing. It's like, that was really intelligent at the time that you did that.
And so now we just get to upgrade and kind of move beyond it by getting uncomfortable because uncomfortable just saying that it's new. And so like breathing into that uncomfortable edge and having more self-awareness after this self-awareness, then you create, I talk about insourcing safety, like really bringing safety to that energy in your body or to that part of you that's scared so that you can start changing your life through it and recognizing this may feel familiar.
And my, my subconscious is thinking that means it's safe, but this is actually not healthy. And this is how, you know, just being with yourself, kind of guiding yourself to take different actions.
But I think when people feel uncomfortable, I think that might be a good sign to lean into it, to get curious and to say that that's something new. I know for me with my husband, I didn't recognize him when I first met him because I had done so much work.
I just graduated from a master's program in spiritual psychology that I didn't attract a template of my past. So I didn't recognize him at first.
I was like, I don't, I would, this is the one man that I said I was going to be with for a short amount of time. I was like, I don't want to get your hopes up.
This is a for now thing. It's been 15 years now.
And so I, I, and for me, I just noticing that I had done so much healing work around my past and some of these conditionings I didn't recognize because he was a new slate. And so I just want to give people some of those contexts for if you're in relationship and you're like, this is uncomfortable.
That's good, right? That's okay. And so in terms of like these toxic patterns that people get stuck in, how do you suggest that they start breaking that cycle? well i mean awareness is always the first step but once you become aware of the pattern itself then it's all about creating that pattern break obviously having to create that pattern break means like what you said, confronting very uncomfortable emotional states.
It means being with the emotion. It means looking at the truths that are inside and inherent within that emotion.
It means finding different ways to meet needs first and foremost, because when we start to really break down what is keeping us in these dysfunctional dynamics, it's all because we feel like that is how we're going to get a specific need met. That's why people can't let go of them.
It's like we're basically asking them to give up the one thing that's their lifeblood. So we need to find a different way to essentially achieve the same aim or to meet the same need that we were trying to meet, but in a different way.
Is there like a grounded example of that? I mean, you've been talking about on safety, which is pretty interesting here because I've been noticing this a lot in my work lately where, you know, a lot of women essentially have been raised in this way where they were made unsafe in a lot of different ways. And this is obviously we're coming at this from this perspective also that women in general experience high degrees of unsafety in the world.
But let's say that you, in your younger years, were quite literally in a very unsafe situation. And there was very little empowerment for you around getting out of that unsafety or troubleshooting that unsafety or becoming empowered.
So you didn't line up with whatever you were worried about or in distress about. You're just kind of expected to put up with it.
What I notice is like a lot of women will go towards relationships with men

specifically for that sense of safety.

But see how it's like very roundabout.

It's like all of my safety needs are going to be met in this roundabout way

by virtue of getting into a relationship.

It's not even like they're walking into relationships,

getting into this conscious conversation with the person being like,

just so you know,

the whole reason I'm with you is so that you will caretake my best interests, right? You're going to keep me safe emotionally and physically. If you don't, we're done.
So nobody's saying that. It's just kind of like, oh, if I sneakily look as good as I can possibly look, like he's going to worry if I'm in trouble.
So this is one of those examples where obviously like women who have been in that situation over and over again, you know, can tell you themselves, getting into one of those dynamics doesn't necessarily mean a man's going to keep you safe. In fact, that guy may just be your next biggest on safety.
So what this practically looks like is, is recognizing that pattern like, oh, wait, I can see why I just keep going from man to man to man to man to man is because I'm so,

I feel so unsafe in the world and I don't know how to be safe in the world. Okay.
So getting out of that pattern means I'm going to look to a different strategy for staying safe than a man. What might that be? Well, it depends on what I feel unsafe about in the moment.
You know, if I feel unsafe about driving my car, then, you know, troubleshooting how we could feel safer driving a car. doesn't look like going and getting a man, does it? Maybe it looks like reading books about cars.
Maybe it looks like hiring somebody to drive you. Maybe it looks like all kinds of different things.
In that type of a situation, you're looking directly at what you feel unsafe about. And unlike you got to do in your childhood experience, you are finding much more direct ways to experience a sense of safety and to prevent things that you're afraid of happening from happening.
Yeah. And I love that you bring this up about, you know, women not feeling so safe in the world.
I obviously have, I've experienced that. I thought more men were aware of that until I ran into Alison Armstrong's work and she had people raise their hand.
I was like, oh, men don't realize the level of unsafety. And I think it's biological.
I think we're wired, you know, men are bigger typically than women. And so there's like this, we're wired biologically to not feel as safe.
And so for those conscious men that are listening or that the women that want to share this with their man, how can they create some more emotional safety and support and really create more of a conscious container if that conversation is available? I'm always inside out, like yes, insourcing safety and having conscious communication. So for those that want to do that work, what would you suggest? I would suggest they make men aware of this.
I mean, really what makes the difference I think for men is for men to have a kind of understanding of the fact that this is how women are and this is where women live. And it helps to sometimes ask them about a situation that they were in where they felt the most unsafe ever so that they themselves can go back to, Oh yeah, that was really sucky, you know? And then, and then be like, okay, so what's going on with, with us, with me, you know,

is, is on safety. So what I'm needing is for you to try to answer to that safety.

I just need that to be your go-to.

Like usually when women ask men for that to be their go-to, it's easier for men to be

like, oh, I'm getting a direct ABC, very upfront directions about how to make this relationship successful. They tend to go along with it.
So if they're like, well, I don't know what to do in this moment. Be like, okay, well, can you just ask me what about this is making you unsafe? Or what are you afraid of? And then I'll tell you.
And then I really need you to help me find strategies where I am not going to experience that level of pain that I'm afraid of experiencing. Yeah.
And guys are pretty good at, honestly, pretty good at problem solving. It's just that most of the time they're registering that things are unsafe, whereas a woman's registering it's not safe.
And so it's very, it's really scary. Almost like, you know, to be in a relationship as a woman who's in a lot of unsafety with a man feels very bizarre it's it's kind of like those bad scenes in a horror film where you know the one of them is like wait a minute people are getting killed and everyone's like i don't know what you're talking about outside and it can kind of feel like that and so if guys are are able to know that this is the issue that women are in and to sign up to answering to it rather than to just invalidate her and be like, you're safe, period, the end.
It usually goes a lot better. And quite frankly, it's pretty rare that I run into guys who are like, I don't even want to put that effort forward.
Yeah. Most of the people are like, oh, wait, what? You feel unsafe? Like, what about this feels unsafe? And then you tell them, they're like, oh, well, what? Then it's like, they can actually tell you in reality things about that should, you know, calm you down, that should make you feel more reassured and take actions that directly answer to what you're afraid about.
And I love that you said this clear request of like, here's what I need to feel safe right now. So like the more we request that or be clear about it, the easier it is.
We got to go out on on a limb here and we've got to, like, at this moment, we're going

to make it, we're going to genderify this conversation.

Men, in general, need things to be so direct, it's out of control, which is difficult for

women who have been trained away from directness, quite frankly, away from authenticity and

towards manipulation.

This is the worst thing you can do with men.

Like men, they need you to hit them between the eyeballs with the stuff that you need them to do. And then you get much better results.
Trust me. But to do that as a woman, you have to get over all of that shame that you have towards putting your needs on the table, setting boundaries, making requests, talking directly, being yourself, you know, all that kind of being yourself.
Yeah. So being, being direct, being clear.
It's, it's almost like, this is how to love me. Like give them the instructions.
Oftentimes they want to, they want to know, like they want the checklist and they show up and it's beautiful and test it. So much, so much of couples therapy is that it's a guy that's like, what do you want? I don't get it.
You know? Yeah, totally. Totally.
Okay. I hope this is helpful for people to just test out and see that I want to change directions a little bit.
Cause I want to talk a little bit about intergenerational and ancestral healing. Talk to us about how you like what this means and some of the benefits of doing intergenerational healing.
Okay, you're going down my passion lane here. Just to give you an overview, the story of you did not begin when you came into this physical life.
In fact, one of the primary contracts that you opt into by coming into this life is the is to take on, in fact, the consciousness of your entire family line. Now, that's your whole tree.
That's both parents, right? So you have so many multitudes of great-great-grandparents who are bleeding directly into you. You are the culmination of them.
So you can think of it like by coming into this life, you're opting into this deck of cards.

And some of those cards are really,

really great.

And some of those cards are really,

really not so great.

And it's your job in this life,

primarily to progress the family line,

not just your own individual consciousness,

to progress the family line by virtue of how you play those cards.

That's intergenerational healing in a nutshell.

And so it's very important for people to understand that there is no such thing as a person that does not have intergenerational trauma. It's not a thing.
So it's not even like, you know, sometimes I hear questions like, how do I know if I have trauma from my great grandparents or whatever? I'm like, you know what? Just drop it like you do. Everyone does.
I think it's helpful for people to see trauma as a spectrum and that, you know, when it's disintegrated, it's usually big T trauma. That's where it's out of your window of tolerance, where you flip your lid.
It's too much, too fast or not enough for too long. But yeah, everyone has trauma.
There's definitely a spectrum to it. I want to hear more.
I want, tell me more about intergenerational trauma. I want to, I want to dive into this topic quite a bit.
All of us have these patterns that are running through family lines. Some of those patterns are really, really awesome, and some of those patterns are very, very detrimental, and we adopt a lot of those.
So there's, upon coming into life, there are many of those that are active, we should say. Healing intergenerational trauma is about really learning how to embody and express the ones that are beneficial while changing the patterns that are not beneficial.
Something to know about this intergenerational trauma picture is that we are all actually doing ancestral healing without even knowing it. We're just calling it our own personal healing story.
But if you are going to define these, these traumas that are running through a family line, it's simply those negative patterns that are passed from one person to the next person, to the next person, to the next person. If you sat here for long enough, any, anybody who's listening to this right now, if you sat there long enough and thought about, you know, mom and thought about dad, you could identify some pattern that they had, that their mother or father also had, that their mother and father also had, that you have.
Now, you may be in therapy today for that exact thing. Be like, oh gosh, my family, in this family, nobody talks about their feelings.
It's just constant manipulation. You know, if you're in therapy doing that, you're actually doing intergenerational healing.
You just are calling it by that name. So when we start to engage in intergenerational healing, what it means is that we're just more consciously aware that the patterns that we are working on apply to our family.
So they didn't just start with us. Yay.
That brings a lot of compassion where it's like, oh, this isn't personal. This is programming.
And one of the things I did when I was getting licensed as a therapist in my training was we did a genealogy, which is kind of like a family tree around patterns. So mom and dad going back, like you're saying, but looking at the positive and the negative, right? What are the opportunity for, you know? So we did like my dad's side, for example, had a lot of gratitude.
They like to like party and make the most out of the moment and family secrets was on the negative side. So like looking at both and then how does that play out in our own lives? It would be one exercise people can implement.
Yeah. You're smiling.
Yeah. What I'm hearing you say is like actually becoming more aware and doing our own work does help heal future and past generations, right? There's no, yeah.
It's so talk to us about the benefits of it. Oh man, the benefits are so multifold.
Coming into powers that you never knew that you had. Sometimes I wish I could put kind of esoteric goggles on people for them to see what happens when they're uncorking the powers that are running through their family line.
Because it's tempting, especially if we come from a super dysfunctional family line to look at that family and be like, why couldn't I have come into a different family? But it's very important to understand that there's not a single family line that doesn't have very, very, very big values running through them, like veins, almost like veins of gold running through the family line. And there are things that we often take for granted.
Things like all of us have a sense of humor, but because it comes so easy to all of us, none of us really value it that much. But you know, another family may come in and be like, oh my God, I would love to be able to have just impromptu humor, be an element of my life.
But here it is. You don't even have to work at it.
So when we're identifying these, these strengths, we should say that run through a family line, things that we don't have to work on, we can draw from that resource. And it gives us major advantages.
So that's number one. Number two, when we uncork that sort of connection that a lot of us have sort of cut ourselves off from to the larger family group, and I'm not just talking about mom and dad, it's very important to understand that like your heritage is massive, right? And it's cultural.
And when you uncork that stoppage, I would say that you have put into that entire picture of your heritage, and you open that valve again, it's like all of that energy is flowing like straight into you. And you can really feel yourself as the continuation of all of that.
So it kind of starts to feel like you're backed by a tsunami, which is a very cool feeling, especially for people who, you know, don't maybe don't feel as empowered in the world. Maybe who feel like they're up against a lot.
So that's, that's one of the benefits. Another benefit is when you're changing these patterns, they don't get passed on.
I mean, the patterns are causing you enough trauma and pain as it is. But this is the hell of a family line is that we have these experiences.
We adapt in these ways. It's profoundly dysfunctional.
We just pass it on. And then it's like we're setting ourselves up as a family unit for a version of pain and a version of failure.

And so by changing these patterns, you're changing that for these future generations.

There is no bigger gift in the universe than doing that.

And I don't know about you guys, but I would way rather be the one to do that than my son.

I want to see him on a way different trajectory than the one that I saw my grandma and grandpa on and mom on and me on. I think you're right.
It's like the, one of the greatest blessings we can offer humanity and ourselves is to do our work and to make healing more accessible. And it also gives a perspective of compassion of like, oh, this is more than mine.
And I also, you know, some spiritual traditions say you chose that you chose to come into this family line with these karmic lessons to learn at earth school and like embrace it and move it forward. You don't have to do all of it, but move the lineage forward and do what you can.
And, and you can ask for support, you know, spiritually or for, from your ancestors to support, you know, cause that momentum, that tsunami that's there, there's also blessings in that. So to intentionally call on the support that's here, there's no separation.
So like, in terms of time and space and a deeper truth. And so as you do it now, you're doing it for future and past generations in this moment.
Yes. You've also got a deeper sense of connection with which a lot of people are missing.
Something that I have loved working people through ancestral healing is that a lot of people feel profoundly alienated, honestly, from their immediate family. And because of that alienation or trauma that they've experienced with their direct parents, it's like they've got a resistance to their entire family tree, not realizing that when they start to go down the line of figuring out who these people were, they will find someone in that line somewhere that they absolutely do belong with.
So even finding out the stories of these other people that are outside of just your nuclear family unit, it gives you a sense of belonging. It really does.
That's beautiful. Yeah.
And to even, you know, on a micro level, you're saying macro, which I love just opening that perspective. And even on a micro level, making sure that they embrace the part that feels rejected or doesn't feel included because then they don't abandon the part of them that feels like it's not belonging.
They belong to themselves. And then that gets to be reflected in the world.
Talk about projection work as well. So it's all kind of looping.
I'm wondering how important you feel like it is for people to understand some of their family, their lineage, and some of the trauma lines to heal it. I think it's incredibly important.
I mean, I'm afraid of going down that road to as aggressive degree as I want to, because I very much recognize that we have varying degrees of capacity to get this information. I will say that if you really want this information, like a detective, you're going to find way more than you think you're going to find.
Like, it doesn't matter what situation you're in, you're going to find way more than you think you're going to find if you want to. However, I mean, there are some people who never know their birth parents, documents are sealed type of situation.
I don't want people like that to panic and fret about the situation because anything that is active within them, that is something they notice is detrimental, that they're trying to heal. Believe me, so much of that corresponds to your birth family.
You just don't know it. So it's like I want this to be a kind of thing where it's the more information, the better.
Okay. So knowing that, that you don't need to panic.
If you're in that type of a situation, it is so important and so valuable to get as much information as you can. And epigenetics, like it's in our DNA, it's in our body.
So we can also just, if you can't access it, you know, through your lineage, or if you have cut ties with your family, you know, that also might be part of the, the line of, in your lineage where there's like, you know, cutting relationships out could be part of it. And you realize that, and I honor and trust people to do what feels right for them.
Cause sometimes there is creating that boundary is a form of self-love and that is important. So I trust you to do that.
And it could just be something that you're playing out on consciously too. So just to hold yes.
And, and to look more deeply into it. I'm curious if there's a story of your own or a client's around kind of the ripple effect of doing this generational healing work that you want to share just to highlight the power of it.
I think one of my favorites, honestly, was that I was working for a while with a woman who is Vietnamese. So she had been moved to America by her family.
She was the first generation. Now she starts waking up through doing this ancestral healing work, starts waking up to the fact that, wait a minute, in our culture, it's like you don't even get to have a self.
You're born and you're expected to be whatever mom and dad want you to be. In this case, it was a doctor.
And, you know, cause you get to be a doctor or a lawyer or you get it right. So she's basically like, I don't, I don't, I don't even know who I am because of this, because it's like, I was told I was going to be a doctor since four years old.
They're buying me stethoscopes at four years old. What four year old knows that they're going to be a doctor? And it's really started with that.
I don't understand what I want for my life because I was never allowed to want for my life. My life is just whatever my parents want for me.
So when she starts seeing this pattern and starts recognizing, wait a minute, this is exactly what my mom's parents did to her. It's exactly what those parents did to them.
She started peeling back the layers, started to look into, you know, the picture of her ancestry, found out that her grandmother was the fourth of five wives and a very, to a very wealthy man in Vietnam. And it was like her entire life was decided.
She was married to 13. So she starts going, this is, this is a no for me.
So, so she starts, you know, changing these patterns around specifically, she would say her authenticity, where she starts being like, what do I like? Why am I doing this? So part of that, the changing of the intergenerational pattern was I have to figure out what I like versus what my parents like for me. So she threw out all of her assumptions because a lot of us, when we've been programmed in this way by parents, it's like, oh, I like wearing these clothes.
How do you know you like those clothes? If mom put you in those clothes since you were four? Oh no, I don't know if I like these clothes. So it was like with food, with clothing, with locations, with activities, anything she did, it was, okay, do I like this? How do I know that I like this? What in my body is telling me that I like this? If I explore liking this, is it because of the reactions I'm getting from other people? Or is it because I intrinsically would do this? What if they weren't here to react to me? Would I still like it? Things like that, right? So she starts...
That's a good question. I like that.
I want to double click on that. If people weren't watching me or experiencing this, would I still enjoy it? Thank you.
That's great. Yeah.
So she starts, because of this whole endeavor that she's on, she starts really unpacking who she is and what she's liking and what she gravitate towards and what she's good at. And so she starts developing a sense of identity.
As a part of this, she starts to become aware of the fact that in her family unit, typical of a dysfunctional family, she was more what you would have called the golden child, whereas her sister was more of what you would consider to be the scapegoat child, the one who could never find an adaptation that worked. And so because of this realization that she came into by finding her own personal identity, she's like, my gosh, I just realized that my sister really could never abandon herself enough to make my parents pleased.
And she did suffer this kind of push away or this abandonment. How horrible is that? So she picks up the phone, reaches out to her sister.
This is when this becomes a compounded, you know, family healing. She reaches out to her sister and is like, this was so awful for you.
I just realized because I watched the old tapes of us as a kid, how terrible I was. We were all terrible to you.
You just must have felt so rejected by us your whole life. She bursts out in tears.
Her life is a mess, of course. So she's like, what are you doing? You know, that's making this whole thing happen for you.
I feel like I have my sister back. So she starts going down this train, right? Now you've got these two sisters that are both doing this healing together.
And so what happens inevitably, they flip and turn back on mom. And they're like, you know what? No, we're going to start setting boundaries around you telling us what we get to do for our lives.
One of them drops out of college. Disaster.
I mean, for a family, for a first generation family from Asia, this is like, the whole reason we brought you here is that, you know, at first you've got this crisis happening in the family, which is oftentimes how family systems change looks like a crisis at first, because you're changing these patterns that were very much in place. And so it destabilizes everything.
So they drop out of college. Actually, that puts mom in a total crisis.
Why? Because she's like, oh my gosh, I'm putting all of myself on my daughters and they've just went and messed up their lives. And so now I can't feel good about me.
But where does that force her into figuring out for herself what it looks like to feel like she has value separate from her daughters. Now, in that process of feeling like, oh, wait, maybe I can find self-esteem in this way.
I can't rely on my daughters to do it for me. So maybe I'll do it in this way.
She starts looking at her husband like, I hate this guy. In fact, he's made my life a living hell for the last, you know, 13 years.
By the way, the both daughters had begged her to divorce him. So we're dealing with an unusual situation where the father involved in this situation is actually dysfunctional enough that it's like severe levels of abuse.
Yeah. She decides to leave him.
She's in the middle of a divorce. Not only that, through this process, one of the things that I teach people in the course that I created on ancestral healing was that it's very important to reconnect with your culture.
And a lot of times when people cross the ponds in order to go live in a different country or something like that, it's very difficult. It's like a push and pull between adopting a new culture and trying to hold on to your own culture.
And there's a lot of pain inherent in that picture. So one of the things that this client of mine was doing was learning you know, learning to cook the traditional dishes, to play the instruments, to like celebrate the culture, even wear the clothing.
And so she went back to her mother with this, you know what, mom, I've never learned how to make this food. I want you to teach me how to make this food.
And like from her own description, the experience of having her mother teach her this food for her and also of her, her mother being able to feel her own daughter loving and accepting the culture she came from. It was like they had never bonded more in their life.
Wow. And I just loved that story because I mean, I got to see so much of it, you know? Yeah, no, it's an incredible story.
There's so many layers to it and for them to actually have an authentic relationship and needing, right? Because as kids, if we don't comply, if we don't conform to what our parents want, then we don't attach, but we also don't get our needs met. And so for them to both take their power back and to meet inauthenticity and then have that ripple effect.
And even the dad that got there, she divorced, like he probably that put him on a trajectory of his own healing or change if he wanted to or not. Like it continues to compound.
That's beautiful. Yeah.
I love that. Thank you for sharing that.
And also, as you were talking, I was just hearing like, when people think, you know, in terms of like the goal line of life of like, when I get to become a doctor, when I, even if it's what they want, looking at it from this ancestral healing lens, it's like the real evolution, the real growth for us on a soul level is more about transforming these patterns and consciousness for ourselves and our lineage. It's not just on the goal line, you know, of like what we achieve and where we think we should be in our life.
It opens the perspective to look at it in a much deeper way, which feels more inclusive and true. Like not everyone's meant to be a millionaire.
Not everyone's meant to, you know, it's like, what's the real depth of why were we here on earth school and how can we do this deeper work? So I love that you're doing that with people. I know that boundaries is one form of self-love and I think you and I both think of self-love as more dynamic than just what's on Instagram,

where it's like actually doing our own shadow integration work.

Talk to us about if there's a particular practice that may surprise people around

self-love and healing that you find incredibly powerful.

My favorite one that's like pretty simple, honestly, is involves water.

Water is a very interesting element because it contains memory and it's able to structure itself. So even though water remains H2O, the way that that H2O structures itself can change based off of what that water is exposed to.
We can use this to our benefit by dictating what memory the water holds. So my favorite, one of my favorite practices for this is that you think about something that you dearly love.
Now, if you're struggling with self-love, obviously it's not going to be yourself. It's going to be something else like, oh, I love my son.
I love my cat. I love, you know, walking in the forest.
It doesn't matter. Whatever it is you really dearly love, you're going to picture that in a very, very strong way.
You're going to want it to consume your entire attention. And then you're going to imagine, sense, and feel pushing that energy of complete love out to water.
Look, I look. So let's say you have a glass of water like this.
So let's say that I'm going to pick my son, right? I've got a 15 year old son. He's the light of my life.
And so I'm going to picture him, let him consume my consciousness. I'm going to push my love for my son into this water for two minutes.
something that's important to know is a little side note whenever we're doing this these types of especially mental practices, we do a lot better when we're doing very strong focus for short amount of time than very long amounts of time with less quality focus. So two minutes, you can set the timer, projecting all that love into the water, and then you drink it.
Now, that is to take all of that love that you were projecting externally and take it internally. Don't think this is going to be easy, by the way, because the first time that I did this exercise, I puked.
Tell me more. Well, I can tell you why I puked.
Self-hate is actually an adaptive strategy. We develop patterns of self-hate when it kept us safer around an antagonistic parent.
So in order to take in self-love meant me being more and more and more unsafe ever, right? And it's a real vibrational disparity as well. When you're used to being in these lower vibrational states towards yourself and you take a very high vibrational state and introduce it, there's a sk, it's not a match, right? But what will happen if you keep doing this exercise, which is what I made myself do, kept doing it every day, is that it will increase your vibration and steadily you start to notice that your thoughts towards yourself change, your behaviors change, your choices change.
Some people feel the immediate positive effect, you know, instantaneously, they're like, oh my goodness, I feel so good. It's like an elixir.
Lucky people. But I just wanted to put that little

warning in there in case people think that some of these self-help techniques are like

super cute when they're really hard. But this one is on the easier end of the spectrum.
And

it's surprising because most people would not guess about it. And also it's like, it's not

very hard to focus energy into a cup. And I'm telling you something right now, if you're somebody who really struggles to the point where it's like, you're having a hard time even focusing on stuff, a little workaround on this is that you can do it with music.
You can also have somebody else do it. And then you drink the water and you can also look up, um, like sulferio harmonics or things like that.
There are frequencies that you can look up on YouTube. 528 Hertz is in fact, the frequency of love.
And so you can expose the water to 528 Hertz. Now, if you're going to do that, you can do that for longer than two minutes because you don't have to be the one focusing.
Music can focus for you and then drink the water. And a gift to you and a gift to your son is part of the generational healing too.
Yeah. And I love that, you know, part of the work when I started getting into some of this self-love work and just consciousness work is I would get really high and then I would dip.
I would go back and that contrast was really obvious for me, but I knew not to judge the dip because then I would be stuck in it. And so I just kept doing the work and eventually you can kind of maintain at this frequency in a more useful way.
So I just want to give that caveat for people because they're, you know, throwing up is a physical way. And sometimes it can be like inner critic.
It really starts getting loud as a way to pull you back down to comfort, which is your comfort zone being safety, unconsciously thinking it's safety. So if you're doing some of these self-love practices and the critic or self-sabotaging patterns come up, just bring love to that pattern.
Because if you don't judge it, you don't identify with it, it'll start feeling more safe. And then you can even use visualization as a way to get the green light from your subconscious to know that it's safe by doing some of like knowing that your dreams or your goals or even loving yourself is safe so that it reprograms just so people have a reference point for it.
I love what you're sharing because part of the work, I think, again, is making this work more accessible. How can people heal? How do we normalize this path towards evolving as a species? And I know at one point you talked about that trauma can give people a false sense of power.
And I think that might be important for people to understand in relationship, whether it's them or somebody else, just so that they can learn how to reclaim their power and kind of evolve beyond some of these unconscious habits that can kick up, especially as we're moving towards a more evolved way of being. I'm going to use that word again.
I mean, the primary way that we get into this mentality around false powers with the adaptations that we have to our trauma and how we show up in relationships as a result of doing so. Let's do a boy this time.
You got a little boy. Little boy is in a situation with a dad that develops an addiction.
Because the dad develops an addiction, he kind of vacates the position of father. So he's not really there for his son or his wife because he's not there for his son or his wife.
Mom is in distress because mom is in distress. She's not very available to him on an emotional level.
And so all of a sudden you've got a neglect dynamic going on. Now that can be an emotional neglect dynamic or it can be an emotional and physical neglect dynamic.
What is a child to do in this situation when their vulnerability and their need for somebody, their need for relational dependency needs is not being met, to swing the pendulum to hyper-independence? I'm not going to be fed, so I'm going to get on the countertops and feed myself. I'm not going to be comforted, so I'm going to not need comfort.
I'm going to go pick up a habit instead, like sucking my thumb or that progresses to maybe tobacco chew in, you know, my teen years. Progressively, you see the empowerment, putting those in, you know, these quotation marks, because it feels more empowering than the alternative, being hyper in the states of independence.
But you can see that in a relationship, this is absolutely damaging. Because you're getting your power by not needing the other person.
You're getting your power by not being vulnerable. You're getting your power by pushing them away.
Well, how's that going to go in a relationship? Terrible. Is it genuine power? I wouldn't say so.
Because the genuine power is about meeting one's needs. Were the needs met? No, they were not.
The needs were dependency needs. So the way to get genuine power for this particular person is to see what needs that he had actually in childhood.
Those are dependency needs. And then to figure direct ways to get those needs met.
Now to do so, you're going to have to get way uncomfortable because it means things like developing intimacy with your partner as a method of empowerment for meeting those needs rather than pushing them away so you can keep yourself safe. Yeah.
And then there's intelligence and suffering. So it's sometimes feedback that you want relationship, but this hyper vigilance won't actually let you create that intimacy.
So that rupture is a gift. If you can find it, if you can stay with it and see the hardest part is becoming aware.
So I love that you're sharing this to help give examples for, whoa, me chewing tobacco or me being hyper vigilant, you know, is a safety strategy is a, an adaption. Oh, this is important.
Like back to adaptations again, something that's very important. I think you used another word.
It was something like a protection strategy, right? Yeah. Safety strategy.
Yeah. Okay.
So a safety strategy. If you understand safety strategies, you understand the world.
People are walking around and safety strategies all day long, and we've got to take our minds and expand them. Why? Because when you go up to somebody and you saying, hey, what is a protector like? Most people are like, oh, aggressive, domineering.
No, no, no, no. Everyone's in a protection strategy.
It's whatever kept them safe in their particular experience. So you can have, you know, you'll have safety mechanisms in a person that look like super pleasing personalities.
you know, the person who's like, oh my goodness, I could never do something like that. We don't look at that behavior as a safety strategy, and yet it is.
So one of the most important things when we're examining ourselves is to be like, wait a minute, maybe my personality is false, and maybe the things that I am doing, especially in a social setting, it's all to keep myself safe. Whether it's yelling at the top of my lungs or making sure everyone has what they need at the party.
I think this is such an unlock for human potential, not only because when we understand our own safety strategies, then we can look at what's the path to becoming more authentic through compassion, which I love that you bring. We don't need to judge these things.
They made sense in our environments growing up to keep us safe, to keep us alive. And now we get to evolve beyond them.
And so as we are aware of this, it shows up in our relationships. It shows up with, I mean, I teach a lot of around sales.
It's like sometimes people don't want to sell because they're afraid of being rejected because that was a pattern. And so they've been trying to avoid.
And so there's so many ways that it shows up in our practical everyday life that once we become more aware and we really heal it at the root, it can unlock so many aspects of our life. And so I love how articulate you are with the examples and like helping people understand what is it really about and how do we bring compassion

and really get our needs met in a more authentic and true way. And I I'm curious in terms of,

you know, making healing more accessible, how do you see, or how would you like to see

healing becoming more accessible in the world? Like what do we need to do to evolve,

to help get us there? Normalize it. Yeah.
I mean, that's the first,

when you asked me that question, that's the first place that my mind goes to. It's like, you've been saying something throughout this entire interview, which is calling this an earth school.
I feel like if that was the attitude that all of us took towards life, there wouldn't be so much judgment around us exposing the things we're really not having a good time with and working on them. So this whole picture of healing and problems and getting our hands messy in it, if we could normalize this for once, instead of trying to project out there that all of us have it wonderful, when really we turn the camera off, we're like, if we could just like normalize this, I feel like we would not only have an easier time directly dealing with these things without there being this high degree of shame, but we would also be more advocates for each other going through this entire process.
Yeah. And learning along the way.
I mean, number two, this is about healing becoming accessible, right? Yeah. I mean, a lot of this is about systems changes.
Now, I wish I had a perfect answer for this, because it's really so complicated. And people that think that it's very simple, don't understand how complicated systems are.
But there has got to be a way for people who are in need to have access to the things that they need. And it cannot be dependent on finances.
I wish that I had a perfect model for everyone. I'm sure as hell looking for somebody who does.
But, you know, accessibility is a lot lot about that because this world is ruled by finances. And unfortunately, we're in this position, especially with mental and emotional health, where if you don't have the means, it's very hard to get it.
It's very hard to get high quality. I get excited about technology and it was a way to use it for healing, scaling, healing and transformation.
Even if we hook up, you know, like if there's some type of way that we can track our nervous system by wearing like a hat that tells us when we're dysregulated, we are regulated and using some visualization, of course, in the beginning with like somebody that's trained, I've thought about this, somebody that's trained and we can go into our childhood home, see what was dysregulated in our nervous system that titrates back and forth from red to like in terms of dysregulated to regulated. So it weaves it through in our nervous system.
And I mean, you know, everybody has a cell phone, right? And like, that's more accessible. So if we can find technology, if anyone listens to this and wants to run with us, please do.
Because I just think that that would be one of the most powerful ways to make it accessible on a nervous system level.

You know, EMDR, which is a form of therapy that I think is great.

It can track through rapid eye movement.

I don't know where we're going with this.

I want to help be a part of that conversation.

But I think even just tracking it through the body will be more accessible.

I think we will have to have somebody that's trained to oversee this for a while until

it becomes more dialed in. And yet I get excited about the possibility of that.
I can see that. Yeah.
Yeah. I would just love just to hear in closing, if there's anything that you wish people would know, or if there's something that you want them to take away, just something from either this conversation or something we didn't bring forward that you're like, this is important that I wish more people got.
What it would be is that right now we're at a time and a place within not only human society, but where the universe is right now. We're in a pressure cooker in a big way.
And where each individual is being forced to is towards the very thing that they've been spending their entire life running away from. So for a lot of people who will be listening to this right now, what it feels like in their life is that everything is being taken away from them and everything is falling apart in the worst ways to force them almost in the direction of the thing that they tried to build this whole picture of their life to not be in.
That's because right now the human race is being asked to break free completely from their addictive strategies. Now, most people don't look at their everyday life and the way that they've done things as an addictive strategy, but it actually is.
Now, most of us have addictions wrong. We think it's about the thing that we're going towards when it's really the thing we're running away from.
So the answer, and this is going to be real hard because going in the direction of the thing you spent your whole life building away from is like, I don't really have words for it. It's like an ineffable level of difficulty, but the answer is in.
The answer for everybody right now is to go in the direction and towards an integrating of the very thing that you've spent your whole life trying to avoid. And the faster you do that, the less collapse you will see in your life.
That's freedom. That's freedom.
And, you know, very Joseph Campbell, it's like the cave that you have the courage to enter holds the treasure that you're seeking. So in the courage to actually go there and let it collapse, you find the gift and the power and the freedom that lies within it.
What a gift you are, Teal. Thank you for your wisdom.
Thank you for your heart, for your humor. I know my audience is going to want to stay connected.
Tell us where they can stay connected, what you're up to. I think the best way to do it is tealswan.com, if you just remember my name.
My website is where we've got everything compiled, from events to all my products to everything else that you possibly want. But also, every single Saturday, I release a new video on YouTube about whatever subject is going to be applicable to the human race at that particular Saturday.
So it's really fun to tune in on those Saturdays to see what those topics are about. And I've been doing this for about 14 years now.
And so there is a lot. People who follow my stuff affectionately call it the teal swan rabbit hole.
So feel free to go down it if you'd like to. We'll put show notes, the links in the show notes here below.
Thank you for this rabbit hole that we went into. It's so healing and so heartwarming.
I feel my heart more open and grateful. So thank you.
Thank you. Yay.
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So you don't miss any of the upcoming episodes. I have so much magic.
I can't wait to share with

you. And you can find all this information in the show notes below.
But lastly, if you're on

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