Who Needs To 'Heed the Call' + TNF Preview & HallmOrrk Spectacular

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The Heed the Call podcast

are running out of therapists willing to talk about child gangs.

And that's saying something here in Los Angeles, am I right?

Welcome to Heed the Call.

Dan Hansis, Mark Sessler, Justin Graver on the ones and twos,

and our guy, Connor Orr.

And this is, again,

this is not an exaggeration if you're newer to the show.

We debuted our program, I believe, on August 10th.

And in that episode, we teased today's show.

Coming up later.

Later today at the end of the episode, the Connor Orr

Hallmark

holiday spectacular.

Let's go!

We're here.

We're dressed up.

Nothing, huh, Justin?

No music cue for

spectacular.

Here we go.

I'm dressed for the occasion.

No.

You are.

Look at you.

All right.

This is Marathon Santa.

He's running a race.

This is a big deal.

It's a big deal.

Yeah.

And we're going to focus on two films

that came out in 2024, produced by Hallmark.

And I'm going to to hope.

One thing I want to get to the bottom of, Connor, when we get there, is

one of the films that we're watching

was under the Hallmark banner.

And then another Christmas film was under the Hallmark Mystery Banner.

But there were no mystery elements as far as I could tell.

So let's stick a pin in that.

It's a magical world, a strange world, and you guide us through it.

And we're very excited.

Yeah.

Boy,

this has been a great year for Hallmark Originals.

I feel like

I've had as much fun doing this as I ever have.

And I mean, I've been doing this whether I've been talking about it in a podcast or not since like 2010.

So, you know,

this is a good year.

And just to make a clear mark to the audience, Connor is not paid by Hallmark.

There is no affiliation on any business level.

There's no back-end points to be gained.

It's just for the love of the game.

It's like when you have intense national whodunit slash mysteries, and there are tons of people out there dedicating hundreds of hours of their own time to get to the bottom of it.

Connor has been grinding this

tape for over a decade, and it shows.

And like, you know, in years past, I would just let him download his information.

This time, I dove in myself a little bit, and I told him before the show, like, it kind of changed not just my week, but my season, my Christmas season.

It has changed it, it's altered it.

Wow, like a huge-esque transformation for this.

Well, yeah,

I heard that reference from someone else last night while we were watching it, and like I was, I was changed.

So, yeah.

I don't want to spend too much time on this because we got stuff to get to, but Mark, why on earth are you wearing a Philadelphia Eagles get-up hoodie today?

What the hell is going on?

I've never worn a hoodie on a podcast ever, I think.

But this was hanging

in.

Now, I received this before we started from a friend of ours based on our previous show when we did a big read on the eagles and i don't you know better than i do actually why i have this because it was sent as a mystery gift to me i believe it was in associated to a read i did on big dom um back at our previous show and that big dom actually sent eagles paraphernalia to me because of it through our good friend Connie Fox.

If I'm not wrong, I believe that's the origin story here.

What about this came?

This came from Big Dom, and I've never worn it till today, but I saw it in the closet.

I thought I'll put it on.

Does it have the Italian flag on the side on the arm?

Absolutely.

It's funny because I've never seen you wear any like league-based memorabilia or merchandise ever until this moment.

Yeah, I largely shun it, and I especially shun it now,

but today, a little different.

It feels a little bit like cozying up to all those bullies that try to come after Connor and I.

We just swat them away like flies.

It's like, please don't bother me.

Look what I'm wearing.

Yeah, I did.

I did internalize that a little bit.

I'm happy for Mark.

It looks comfortable,

but at the same time, don't think that that's lost on me.

From episode to episode, I will cozy up to various subgroups and factions, and that's exactly what's happening.

As I say, within my family, you know,

home team.

And right now, Mark is sleeping with the enemy.

Well, not my intellect, not my total intention, but.

All right.

Justin with a great drop, drop though

Mark wearing the Eagles

Zip-up hoodie.

Could that perhaps transfer the voodoo curse?

Maybe

Connor, maybe we owe Mark an apology.

Maybe he's playing chess right now.

I didn't even think about that.

It's and it's so funny.

Yeah, yeah.

I shouldn't verbalize this because then more people are just going to say it.

But the thing that really ultimately, like, if you want to get me upset, it's to suggest that you're a national analyst, so you don't even watch the games.

And that, like, that's the insult that, like, will ruin the rest of my day.

And I've gotten about 100,000 of those over the last week since the Eagles beat the Steelers.

And it's just like, yes, you're right.

I just...

I turn the TV on and I spin around in circles until I get dizzy and pass out and then arrive at this podcast, you know?

Are you kidding me?

All right.

So yeah, coming up a little bit later, the Hallmark Holiday Spectacular.

We're also going to preview the beginning of week 16, the game between who, Mark?

The Chargers and the Denver Broncos.

Well done,

AFC West.

Well, I get to prepare for the show.

But first,

let's start with...

Let's start with a question, actually, Mark.

What does the namesake of this program?

Here's a gift, by the way, behind me.

Dan Supi Campbell from the great band The Wonder Years sent this to me.

Also a massive Eagles fan.

So the Eagles fans are really just sending the merch our way.

So maybe we should be kinder to them.

It says Heed the Call.

It's a banner and it's the name of our program.

And it's the Credo that we live by on the show.

And it's a phrase that came

into

fashion in our world because of the great late Chris Wesling.

I'm going to ask you, Mark, what does Heed the mean to you to get into the first segment today?

I think we in life, there are moments where it's like, I've got to take, I've got to do what's right here for me, for my soul, take a chance, move, move, level up.

Maybe you're in seventh grade and it's like, do I call this girl on the phone or do I chicken out and go back and watch He-Man?

Do I take a chance here?

Or do I talk to this guy across the room who's famous and I'm going to have one chance to speak to him ever and learn from him?

Do I apply for this job that maybe I'm not ready for?

And if I get it, I'm going to have to learn on the fly.

You know, these are things that we've all done.

Do I go out and stick up for someone who's getting, you know, made fun of by everyone else?

Whether it is, it's heed the call.

It's like be the thing inside of you.

And there's something telling you to do it.

And you either do it or you don't.

And I think that with Wes, there are pointed and tangible examples.

He came from a strange place and took a strange path to get to the NFL and become a great sports writer, but it didn't happen without him taking unusual chances.

And that's what I think it means for me, too.

Well said, beautifully stated.

And in the world of the NFL, you look at the,

you know, our latest power rankings are out, and we have the Bills, non-surprisingly on top of the world right now.

And they are, you know, the fashionable pick now for a lot of people as the team.

Oh, nobody wants to see them.

They feel like they're going to win it all.

But, man, they even gave up like, what, 500, 600 yards on Sunday.

And they have some things to work on on on the defensive side of the ball.

And then you look at the rest of the so-called contenders, and everyone, every team, you could say, uh-oh, take a look at that.

There's somebody that needs to step up.

There's somebody that needs to heed the call.

And

so let's talk about who needs to heed the call.

We're going to talk about on heed the call, who needs to heed the call amongst the contenders in the NFL.

And I'll get us going.

I want to talk about the Lions.

We know what's happening here with the injuries, and

it felt like this week or what came out of the Bills game was the first time I thought to myself when they lose their best cornerback, Carlton Davis, a backup corner in Khalil Dorsey, a Pro Bowl level defensive tackle in Elin McNeil,

and

many of these guys are out for the year.

They've lost so many key players, and then they lose, obviously, David Montgomery, their running back to a knee injury that will require surgery.

That's a major setback to the offensive side of the ball.

And it's the first time where it crept into my mind.

I was like, oh, man, are the football gods not going to let this happen?

Are they not going to let the Lions finally get to the Super Bowl?

Dan Campbell is doing his part in addition to being the leader of the team.

You know that he's using this as motivational

fodder to get the team to rally at this time when people are starting to doubt them.

Here's a little bit of Campbell from a Tuesday radio appearance.

You know what happens is, you know, you win 11 in a row, you know, and you lose, and then the sky falls.

And I hate to say it, but we're not going to be able to win 11 in a row again for the rest of this season.

We're just not going to be able to do it.

And, you know, what happens is you get used to eating filet, and I'm talking to all of us.

And, well, everything's good.

Life's good, you know.

But you forgot what it was like when you had nothing and you ate.

molded bread.

You know, and it was just fine.

And it gave you everything you needed.

And sometimes you got to get punched in the mouth and remember what it used to be like to really appreciate where you are.

And we'll do that.

And so we got bad taste in our mouth.

We got kicked around the other day.

We lost a few guys.

And you know what?

It's exactly what we needed.

This is exactly what we needed.

So we're going to bounce back.

We're going to respond.

We got guys that are going to about to have an unbelievable opportunity here.

And we will play the game any way needed to win.

We still got a good offense.

We got plenty of defensive players.

I can go rattle them off right now.

We're going to put the best 11 on the field.

We're going to freaking cut it loose.

We're going to play with our special teams.

And I don't give a crap if we've got to win by one point for the rest of the year.

That's what we're going to do.

And I'm going to be happy about it.

We come out of the game with 50 yards of total offense and we win by one.

You're going to see smiles on my face.

I promise you.

All right.

If it's the other way defensively, we give up 700 yards and we win by one point.

You're going to see a f ⁇ ing smile from my ear to ear.

All right.

I can promise you.

So we're going to find a way and we're going to get it done.

That was 97-1, the ticket, Costa and Jansen, who are like, you could tell if you're watching this on YouTube, which you should,

that

I don't know if it's Costa or Jansen, but having to make eye contact with his producers, like, ooh, that's another.

curse word.

We got to pick that up.

We don't want an FCC fine on this.

But the content is so good.

Dan Campbell is digging in.

He's using it as motivation.

But I think who really needs to heed the call?

Because I know Dan Campbell is going to do his job.

And I know Jared Goff and the offense, even without David Montgomery, are going to do their job.

But I think it is Aaron Glenn who really needs to heed the call.

And

I feel for Aaron Glenn because Aaron Glenn is in a position right now in his life.

He was a high-level cornerback for many years, including many of his best years with my Jets.

And now he worked his way up the coaching ranks, became the DC of this high-profile Alliance team.

It feels like he is a slam dunk to be either, you know, a very serious contender for multiple jobs in the cycle in January or, you know, almost certainly, I think, get a job.

However, he is in a little bit of danger if this Lions defense totally craters over the last month and a half in the season and how that could change his stock, his personal stock.

So he has a lot riding on the end of the season personally.

And obviously, for the team.

And he needs to find a way to adjust.

So we're going to learn, I think, a lot about Aaron Glenn here and what the Bills did.

And, you know, I did a lot of reading up on how the Bills had their way

with the Lions, a game in which they piled up 559 yards and what,

40-some-odd points, 45 points

in that win in Detroit.

This is a Lions team that is dealing with a lot of issues in terms of their linebacker group.

And what they did was attack.

Buffalo attacked.

And great job in their scheme with Ty Johnson, as you talked about, Connor,

attacking with Ty Johnson as their top receiver, five catches for 114 yards.

Their tight ends combined for 14 catches for 251 yards on 18 targets, their running backs and tight ends.

So other teams are going to look to exploit that.

And now it is on Aaron Glenn to find a way to disguise their issues, Connor, on defense with talent.

The talent deficiency is obviously at a high level.

They were playing a lot of straight man in this game.

The idea here and what a lot of speculation is, should this team be playing more zoned?

Should there be more blitzing involved?

They have to change things up or they will get picked off.

So Aaron Glenn, heed the call.

I agree.

I mean, I think

that's great thought.

So the Lions actually, they...

They increased their, or I guess their opponent passer rating decreased by 20 points.

If you look 13 games from last season into 13 games from this season, I think it was like a 90-something last year passer rating against the Lions.

On average, it was like a 72.1 heading into last week's game.

What you need to do at this point is recognize that you may need to go back to something like that, where it's sort of a bend-but-don't-break kind of system, and you can't necessarily play up to what Dan Campbell wants you to play up to.

And it's just stunning because going into this year, I thought Detroit was one of the deepest teams I have ever seen.

And it would have taken only a historical anomaly on the injury front to gut them.

But that's what we're looking at right now.

And so can you even continue to play man defense?

Or do you have to really alter what you're doing?

And the good thing is that they do have a backbone in that.

Like Aaron Glenn has...

has a backbone in this.

Like he knows how to switch it up and to go back to what they did last year.

So I'm curious if we do see kind of a fundamental shift in how they approach this.

Isn't it also, in a way, for Aaron Glenn, like this isn't what you'd want to race down the stretch drive with this roster right now.

But in context, he has a chance to really win a job because if they can win a couple playoff games, or I think they just want to go to the Super Bowl, but if you can do it like this, I was trying to think of how many teams have been this banged up that ever won a Super Bowl.

And it reminded me of the Aaron Rodgers Packers team that beat the Steelers because their IR list was wild by the time they got there.

But this is a chance for him to show everyone in the league, I have to communicate with like 12 new people that haven't been here since training camp and make this scheme work and adjust on the fly.

And so, if he heeds the call, like he's head coach material to me, Dan.

I think it goes beyond that, Mark.

I think if they come out of this and write the ship and get to the Super Bowl, I think he'll have his pick of five jobs.

I think it will be underlined that he is not only a guy that's well respected, but he went through hell and then came out on the other side

okay.

He will be battling with his own offensive coordinator for jobs.

That's the oddity there, but yeah.

That's true.

One thing to add here is like, if you want to do a sub heed the call, it's probably Terry and Arnold, right?

Like where you're a rookie, you're kind of one of the last guys left here.

And if

the directive is to continue to play man, it's like, hey, guess who gets the number one wide receiver now in perpetuity until the end of the season?

I mean, that's big time for them.

But I really don't think it can go this way because if you go back and watch that bills game from uh from last week they the way that they even in the backfield they use motion they move guys around it it was clearing out huge swaths of space for the bill like you didn't see that many walk-in touchdowns against the lions this year that was the first time you really saw that in a game that's why i really do think this is this is a glenn thing which is uh it's prescient on your part dan thank you i always thought it was prescient but i've heard prescient get well i think you could just take the compliment i just i'd take the compliment and not not correct the complimentary

Not a correction because I heard somebody else say prescient recently, and I was like, have I been saying it wrong?

I always thought it was prescient, too, but I've not been called that.

So I, again, you know,

you roll with it.

I think you're an honorable person.

You just, you keep going.

Zip up your Eagles hoodie.

Eight Lions rank among the top 40 defenders currently on IR when sorted by total EPA.

This is from the athletic.

No other team has more than two in the top 40.

That's historic, Honor.

And one last one.

This is Mike Sando.

52% of Detroit's defensive starters or direct backups are on the IR.

Literally more than half.

Cataclysmic.

Wow.

Connor, who needs to heed the call?

All right.

So I'm going to go,

which is odd.

I mean, I guess naming a MVP frontrunner at this point, but Lamar Jackson.

And the reason that I'm talking about Lamar Jackson is I just got done watching the Steelers match up the first one because they're playing the Steelers again this coming weekend.

And what's going to happen here and what always happens, right?

We saw this with Jared Goff during his run to the first Super Bowl is the entire season becomes distilled as a quarterback in terms of what you see is all the things that gave you the biggest nightmares during the course of the season.

And Pittsburgh, the way that they played Lamar Jackson, a lot of Tampa II, they shut down the entire middle of the field.

Lamar loves going to the middle of the field and they basically forced him to throw deep and out.

And they also did

something really neat, which is like basically

lined up their defensive lineman in like sprinter stances, but like diagonal towards the center.

And what they did was they ran straight at Lamar because they want him to give the ball to Derrick Henry because they think that they have the tacklers, the guys who are athletic enough to handle it.

And so the reason that I say that is because now, you know, like the Giants can't play the Ravens like that.

So the Ravens are just going to beat them 35 to 7, right?

But every other team that Baltimore faces from here on out that's going to be worth their salt is going to have linebackers that can play them the way that Pittsburgh does.

And so we're going to see Pittsburgh again this weekend.

The Chiefs are another perfect example of a team that can play them like Pittsburgh can.

And so now...

All Lamar is getting from here on out is the worst of it, right?

And so how do you respond to that?

And how do you, can you shake that narrative off off your back, right?

That you play poorly against division rivals, that you play poorly in the playoffs, that you play poorly late in the season.

This is a big moment for Lamar, I think.

I'm with you because even bad teams like the Browns have had these pop-up games where they diagnosed off of so much film study.

Everything that you just said was

fascinating.

And it's like they found a way.

And then when that seems to happen to him, He doesn't get back on track in games.

And it's not often.

I mean, we're talking like two or three games a year where he gets kind kind of unspooled and doesn't get back on track.

And it's like, if everyone knows now, so if teams can do it, like this year's Lamar, who I think mentally has been fiery and wants to change all of these stories and these ideas about him, and wants the Ravens too as well.

It's not just a, it's a Ravens story too.

And it's like, we know what you're bringing at us.

We're going to find a way to like figure it out.

And like, how do you win now?

And they finally have the weapons, I think, to do it.

They've got the running back and they've got, you know, they've got the wide receivers and they've got Mark Andrews.

It's like, you can do it now like their defense needs to stop becoming a flag factory but on offense they can do it so i'm with you i think it's there's never been more of a heed the call candidate when you get into december and january than lamar jackson in these last five six years one interesting thing too to add when when you bring up the weapons like one of the things that pittsburgh uniquely right like when tj watts in the game like lamar likes to call a lot of max protect when he sees pressure and so tj watt needed an extra blocker almost every time he was on the field And so what that does is it limits the amount of people who can go out.

Like Lamar likes to have five guys out there because he can just buy a little bit of time and hit somebody.

But again, the deeper into the season you're going to get, every team's going to have an elite pass rusher.

Every team's going to, like, Lamar's being blitzed a lot, right?

Every team is going to send their best players at you, and every team is going to force you now to be able to make it work with maybe two or three wideouts as opposed to the four or the five that you'd like to have out there.

And so sometimes these guys get lost in the shuffle.

Isaiah likely, Mark Andrews, like they might not be able to help.

And

I think Lamar,

this is also prescient,

Connor.

I give you props as well because it can't be overstated that the amount of pressure on Lamar Jackson, and that's part of, I think, where all the fire is coming from.

And Ravens fans don't want to hear about it.

They're sick of people using that against him.

But he's in that place in his career.

And Josh Allen's in a similar place,

even though they've had kind of different track records in the playoffs, but very different track records in the playoffs, but to the point where it's all going to be judged no matter what, even if you won another MVP on what happens in January and hopefully for the Ravens into February.

And I think when you look at their schedule, I mean, it's dotted with some weird losses, but the last two that came in the last month was, yes, 18-16 to the Steelers in Pittsburgh, 24-19 to the Eagles.

And then it's almost like when

stumble and don't really move the ball like you usually do in that Philly loss, then you go to the Meadowlands and torch the Giants for five touchdowns and more touchdowns and incompletions.

And it's almost for the people that have their doubts, it's held against you.

It's like, oh, of course you do that, but we need you to do it when it matters.

So

I think the Lamar of it all is one of the more fascinating subplots

of the NFL, certainly when we get to January.

So good one.

Great one.

Yes, sir.

Grave digger.

I'll just add quickly on the Ravens front.

First of all, we talked about the MVPs being quote-unquote wrapped up after Josh Allen's incredible stretch of games that he's been playing.

I didn't say that.

Lamar Jack.

I said it on Sunday that he threw five.

He's

all

and all the shows are going crazy.

Like the new counterpoint is like, no, you can't say that about Josh Allen now.

And I get it.

Like no one's saying that yet.

Like Josh Allen could like be kidnapped on Friday and he's not going to win MVP if that happened.

Or just injured.

Yeah.

Like that's also possible.

Kidnapped by injury.

Well, Lamar's got a stretch of pretty good teams here where if he balls out against them, he's going to put his name back in the front of the conversation.

But I also wanted to say on the Ravens front, Justin Tucker's a guy who could heed the call at some point.

I think, you know, he might be called upon in the playoffs to go hit a big kick.

He will be called upon.

He will be.

And then Deontay Johnson is a guy for the Ravens that is just like...

One of the weirdest trades of the year was the Ravens trading for Deontay Johnson.

Then he refuses to enter their week 13 game.

So they suspend him for their week 15 game because they had to buy a week 14.

And now he's been excused from team activities this week after he and the Ravens mutually agreed on that arrangement.

So I don't know what's going on with the Ravens or something.

I don't think he's a key-the-call candidate, though.

He's not going to be a reference to the game.

No, he's certainly not.

He's reversing.

It was just a point.

You know what I'm saying?

I'm just going to point on the Ravens passing game is being weird.

The guy.

The guy in the Niners, Devondre Campbell, he did the same thing, and then the Niners and the whole world declared declared jihad against him.

With this situation, it feels like the Ravens have taken a more internalized approach in terms of this mutiny or this desertion of the team.

But yeah, he's obviously not been the guy that they were hoping he was.

But the Ravens,

yeah, they are a very fascinating figure in the AFC.

All right, let's take a break.

And by the way,

I gave Justin.

Tucker a pep talk a couple weeks ago.

Mm-hmm.

And

he took that to heart.

I think he responded.

I think he'll be okay.

He didn't have to attempt a field goal against the Giants, just the five extra points.

But he will be facing challenges down the road.

Let's see what happens.

All right, let's take a break and then we'll hit one more of these and then move to the week 16 preview.

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All right,

we're back.

By the way, before we get into the last heed of the call, I should

mention that in addition to the upcoming

Hallmark Spectacular at the end of today's episode, tomorrow night, Wednesday,

at, let me get this right, got to get this plug right.

The Hallmark film Holiday Touchdown of Chiefs Love Story, a watch-along with Connor Orr, Mark, myself, Justin, and maybe some special guests

will be live on patreon.com/slash heed the call at 8.20 Eastern p.m.

on Wednesday, 5.20 p.m.

Pacific.

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Okay, now.

Back to it.

Heed the Call.

Mark Sessler, wrap us up.

You know, for me,

it's Mike Tomlin.

And I think think this is someone who has heated the call.

Year after year on teams that should have underperformed, they overperformed.

But it's been a long time since Mike Tomlin has really taken a team the distance.

And I think right now they're at a point in their season where we are wondering who you are.

You were beaten up by the Eagles.

And I don't see a big shame in that because the Eagles, I think, are the best team in the NFC, not just because I'm wearing this today.

But they've got problems.

The Steelers are a team.

They're going to have to coach their way and be a team to get out of this.

Because without George Pickens, and right now he may not be back for a while, but without George Pickens, it feels kind of like a Damasc Jenga piece.

Without him, they are 29th in success rate, 30th in offensive EPA, 27th in dropback success rate.

And they were absolutely taken to town.

I think their defense, which has always been the core of the Steelers by an Eagles offense, and we talked about it on Sunday, was from the most impressive drive of the season.

A 21 play, they didn't even score points, the Eagles, 21 plays, 88 yards, 10 minutes to just end the game.

How often are the Steelers humiliated in that fashion?

And you have to wonder with this team, what happens next?

George Pickens may not be back.

TJ Watt is compromised.

So what do you do?

Here is what I do if I'm Arthur Smith.

I put Arthur Smith in the basement below like Pittsburgh Paint and Tools Auto Shop with a projector and like General Sal's chicken and say, we've got to take a look at this offense.

And we go absolutely bloody.

we begin to attack with a sense of darkness if we don't have our deep threat our George Pickens and I think if you're Mike Tomlin you are pounding six packs of beer downtown at like Big Helen's bar and tavern you take Darnell Washington who is six foot seven, 264 pounds, and you start to use him all over the field as an absolute destroyer across from Pat Fryermuth.

Calvin Austin, you need to shift and create 14 new plays for this speed merchant who can absolutely get open downfield and expand his role.

Jalen Warren becomes the heart, the beating heart of this offense.

And you find a way to take care of this schedule, which is brutal down the stretch.

You've got Baltimore, Kansas City, and it's Cincinnati.

And none of us care about Cincinnati's record.

That's not where I want to be in week 18 with everything on the line.

So you need to get guys like Alex Highsmith and everyone else to take Lamar Jackson and turn him into a pile of leaves.

This is when Mike Tomlin, who I always think is coach of the year material, can actually really become that.

With a team that no one expected would be here, with a quarterback that no one expected would be here.

You are the Pittsburgh Steelers.

There's no sports team on the planet that is like you.

Amplify the guys behind the guys and go out and take care of the end of your schedule.

And Mike Tomlin becomes the thing that we know he is, which is a shining and gleaming gem.

Like it.

See, I don't need to be convinced on Tomlin.

I do need to be convinced on Arthur Smith and still Russell Wilson.

So like, I would, I like the Steelers as a topic.

I almost like, I more like teeter it to like, can Arthur Smith continue to heed the call and rehab where he is at in his career?

And is Russell Wilson, is this ultimately for real?

And I think we're going to learn a lot because things obviously didn't work out against Philadelphia, right?

And then at Baltimore, now Baltimore, obviously, we know, have had their problems defending the past.

So there should be some

lanes there.

But then, like you said, the schedule is not easy.

The Chiefs after that, and then the Bengals, another team not known for their defense this year.

But I'd like to see the Steelers continue to be dangerous offensively and not kind of being propped up by more of a narrative that now they're exciting.

Because watching that game, the Eagles Steelers game, I'm like, man, this kind of feels a little bit like the other Steelers games the last few years.

I hope this whole thing doesn't run out of steam and we're stuck with a Tomlin team that's just trying to grind him out again.

So

I feel like it's set up well for somebody that has to step up to take the Steelers from good team overachieving this year to actual contender.

I'm with you on Arthur Smith, and that's why I mentioned him.

But I think for Tomlin, he feels like the coach that it's like you've won nine games, you get into the wild card and either win or lose.

And it's like, there's always a stopping point.

I kind of just want to see the pyramid of the coaching staff take them.

deeper than we ever would have expected.

And it starts with him.

It's not like he's some sort of figure of contention.

We know that he's good, but it's like, take them beyond where we thought.

Knock off the Chiefs in the playoffs.

That would do it for me.

Yeah.

I think he needs, doesn't Connor, like, Tomlin, maybe what's been missing for Mike Tomlin since the last Super Bowl run

is, you know, the big-time quarterback or the or the play caller that

can elevate that side of the ball.

He needs that, right?

Like, does you think he has enough on that side of the ball, enough help on the coaching staff, enough talent at the QB position, and obviously the rest of that offense to be that team?

Because I kind of think they're maybe locked in in that second tier with no escape.

I think that I like Arthur Smith.

I think in kind of reconsidering those Falcons teams and how atrocious they really were.

And I think we thought about them differently because they're like, oh, you have a cool running back and a tight end that's sort of big and hurt sometimes.

You know, it's like we expected them to be all of a sudden like the 2,000 Rams.

And I think that Arthur Smith a lot was kind of the victim of circumstance there, but those teams are really tough.

They were actually only behind Mike McDaniel in terms of explosive plays while he was with Atlanta, which is crazy if you think about it, with Desmond freaking Ritter as your quarterback.

But, you know, I like Arthur Smith, the play caller.

I think that these Steelers teams of old were so crazy deep at wide receiver, at running back, at all these other positions that they're just simply not now.

But I would put it to you guys is like, do we reopen the Justin Fields conversation at this point?

Is this a week that we talk about Justin Fields even playing half of the snaps?

Is this a situation where, you know, he

had a zone read package at the end of that last Ravens game that helped them put it away?

Do you roll that out more frequently?

You know, I don't know the answer to that, but like, is that something that you do to maybe get Art Smith going?

Because Russell Wilson is not that, you know, and Russell would prefer to hang in the pocket, but he's still not that kind of player.

That's like where he used Cordero Patterson in so many different ways.

You know, I'm a degenerate.

Like, Cordero Patterson was used that way.

It's like, I wouldn't mind more Justin Field in certain spots, but I wouldn't hand too much over to him.

Seeing how, like, if you, again, I really think it comes down to the Pickens Russell Wilson connection was such a difference maker here.

But I don't hand over the three games and the opponents especially to Justin Fields as the lead guy.

Side guy, sure.

Did anyone else, by the way?

Justin has been an asset to us, man.

Did anyone else totally forget that Cordero Patterson was on this team?

And then I think, in addition to that, he wore something very heavy underneath his uniform.

And they ran like a toss play to him at the end of the Eagles game.

And it was like they tossed the ball to number 84.

And I was like, why the f are they throwing it to the tight?

Like, is the tight end running the ball?

Like, and then it took me like two minutes to be like, oh, yes, Cordero Patterson is on this team.

And of course, he's getting the ball late in this game.

Why not?

Yeah.

And

along those same lines, you had,

you know, the Mike Williams acquisition.

Also, he had the catch, the touchdown catch in his first game, and he's kind of been pretty quiet for them as well

since.

So there's not, you know,

it's not like they're overflowing with talent on that side of the ball.

I think they've done what they could, though, right?

Like, I mean, there are some teams that have made it to this point, and you're like, why didn't you do anything at the trade deadline?

And Mike Williams is not something, but it's not nothing, right?

And I do think that, you know,

they've recognized their deficiencies.

He has four catches in five games since that Washington debut for the record.

All right.

There you go.

Heed that call.

Good luck to you, everybody.

Now we're going to turn our attention to week 16.

Can you believe it?

That's crazy.

Legitimately insane.

Oh, you're just talking about the August opener where we mentioned Connor's holiday special.

This is unbelievable.

It feels like four hours ago.

Have you noticed, by the way, that you said it's legitimately insane that

the NFL now

puts insane ending on every one of their YouTube clips for

the end of a game or

crazy, but it's always crazy and insane, which are like

clinical terms that we use for people that are being outdated in the sport, you know, are being phased out of the sports lexicon.

But like, I love that, like, in in, like, we've just lost all grip on the art of the language.

And it's just like, okay, you know, the Spencer Rattler overthrows a guy, and it's just like, insane ending.

And it's like, it's not, it's not insane.

It's just a lot of people.

Nothing has tangible meaning at this point.

Those words going from clinical medical terms to just clickbait for garbage videos that are wasting your time.

Rattler pass, of all things.

I hope Thursday night, because I feel like maybe we hit a little bit of a bump in the road.

We were on like a major heater with the primetime games.

I feel like week 15 wasn't quite about it.

So maybe we'll get back to it in week 16, starting with, yes, a big AFC West showdown.

The Denver Broncos and the Los Angeles Chargers.

The Broncos are right on the doorstep now of locking up a playoff berth.

And you get a Chargers team that's coming off a...

you know, pretty dispiriting loss, obviously, against the Buccaneers at home, getting blown out in their own building.

Justin Herbert a little bit beat up.

So you got a really good matchup here that could have a big playoff ramifications, if nothing else in terms of seeding and positioning

because the rest of the AFC behind the Broncos and Chargers not looking so hot.

So it could be more dramatic if some of those teams behind them could win a few games in the last month, but they weren't unable to.

But still, we could get a good one here, Mark.

What did you take out of that Chargers performance on Sunday?

You were watching it live.

Well, yeah, I mean, I think like, as more people get into that game as the week goes on, it was pretty stunning because I think that's like

had the result been in reverse

and I knew about it in September, I would have been like, well, that makes sense because that's sort of everything that we thought a Jim Harbaugh team would do to someone else down the stretch at home.

Because I would have think like the Bucs and the Chargers, I kind of put them in the same category.

But instead, you get a hot Bucs team that puts 200 yards on the Chargers defense, defense, which was the lowest scoring unit coming into the week.

Now they're not.

Now Denver is, so welcome to that.

Like they're getting absolutely flamed by Baker Mayfield.

All right.

The defense is, the defense of the Bucs absolutely massacred Justin Herbert.

That was the bit, one of the biggest concerning elements in this.

He doesn't look healthy.

He's got lower body issues.

He's got a like a thigh issue, and he just could not move the way you wanted.

And I think we're learning like that just makes the way you throw is changed off of that, your confidence level.

And they really got to him, and now you're playing Denver's defense so I think that's very concerning their run game without J.K.

Dobbins he went to IR has been not the same and you're lucky you're like fortune cookie blessed that like lad mcconkey is who he is because other than that you're you're leaning on Quentin Johnston now Quentin Johnston Only four more players have more touchdowns than him.

So I do think that points to their coaching and it points to what they've been able to do with what they have.

But they are weapons poor and I don't think they're able to be the Chargers team we want.

So I think there's a lot of pressure this week specifically on the Jim Harbaugh kind of brand and experience to say, we're a game behind Denver.

And if you beat Denver, you've swept them.

That changes everything over the next three weeks of the season.

I couldn't believe,

I mean, just going back and watching that game again, Justin Herbert was one of the most blitz quarterbacks in the NFL that week.

And Levante David is amazing, but he's also 34.

And in that game, he would just press the line of scrimmage.

And if he saw an opening, he would just take it.

And Justin Herbert could not get away from him and could not get away from anybody.

And, you know, you combine that with the fact that, again, like Quentin Johnson is good when there's space in front of him and, you know, he has time to focus on it.

But Herbert needed him to go up and get balls to like smash people and to be physical.

And he just wasn't getting it.

And I wonder if, you know, Vance Joseph almost does the same thing where it's like you have all these athletic guys in your front, you have some tough dudes up front too.

Do you just absolutely just fire at the pocket again and dare Justin Herbert to get away from you?

Because he might not be able to.

On the Denver side of things, I'm

curious to see what we get from Bo Nick.

So Knicks threw three interceptions against the Colts.

If the Colts were even halfway decent as a team,

I would say that they could have beat Denver.

I think Denver was ripe for the picket in that game, and instead the Colts refused to be competitive.

And the Broncos, and to their credit, they made big plays, none better than Nick Bonito's amazing defensive touchdown in that game.

But Nicks has, he threw three picks in that game by the third quarter, and he had two interceptions the prior week.

And I'm just curious if where Sean Payton goes from here, does he

is he working with the kid quarterback to rein him in?

Are we going to see a more conservative version of Nicks this week and moving forward?

Or is he going to continue to attack the field in the way that made him a rookie of the year candidate in the weeks leading up to week 15?

So, that to me is like on the offensive side of the ball for Denver, is

very interesting to see.

The other side of this with Denver is, yeah, Benito is now, I think, he is in the conversation at least for Defensive Player of the Year.

He's been making plays all year long, and you wonder what is why is the why has Denver been surprising?

They have Benito in the middle of their defense, and they have Patrick Sartain, who's arguably the best cornerback in the league.

That's going to lead to a lot of positive aspects and positive developments for your team.

Now, important to keep in mind that Sertain hurt his ankle against the Colts, and it's a nagging issue.

And I don't know,

Justin, what do we have the latest with Sartain with his ankle going into this game?

Full participant in practice on Monday.

And very encouraging sign that he could play on Thursday night.

So there you go.

So, yeah, those are the two points for me, Connor.

What do you see from Knicks in this game?

And Sertan being healthy helps them so much.

I agree.

I'm eager to see.

I think this is one of those sneaky games where I would watch

and see if Peyton tries to reinbo Nicks in by allowing him to win the game with his legs.

I mean, Bo has shown a shocking amount of athleticism.

He's sort of weaponized the slide, which I love.

I don't know if anyone else has noticed this, but during games when he slides, like he declares it, but he almost does like a hard jump baseball slide.

And seems to me like he picks up like an extra two or three yards because no one wants to go because he's airborne.

Like he's like cleats out, like

it's almost like a karate kick if you watch him like slide.

But I mean, he's been athletic all year.

And I do wonder if, like, okay, you know, the Chargers are a little bit older up front.

You know, you might be able to find a way around them in that way.

Like, you know, try to zone read your way into some first downs and stuff and just get Bo Nix involved that way.

Get him comfortable.

Doesn't necessarily have to be that way.

But I think one of the things that Sean Payton loves about Bo Nix is that Nicks has stood up to him in every moment where, you know, there's been aggression on the table, whether he's right or wrong.

I mean, Bo Nix wants to throw those balls.

I mean, that's why he won that interview with Peyton in the pre-draft process.

And Peyton took a guy that, I mean, you know, there were NFL teams, I don't think, that had him as a first-round grade on him, to their detriment, you know, but, you know, Nick's has got to continue to be himself too.

You're going to have three interception games.

He had a five-interception game from Jared Goff a couple weeks ago.

And to your strategy note there, like Baker Mayfield, two for 25 on the ground, but if you go and watch what happened, especially in the second half, it was the most Baker Mayfield game ever.

And if they didn't get flagged like two or three times on critical Baker Mayfield runs, he would have had about 80 yards.

So there's a real vulnerability there.

And I think that you're absolutely right.

Sean Payton's going to pick up on that and say, we're using Nick's for that reason.

All right.

So

let's see what happens.

And just as I pointed out, the AFC playoff picture is a little bit

muddled in the back end, unfortunately, because we got teams like the Colts and the Dolphins and the Bengals that continued to just shoot themselves in the foot.

So it's very likely that both the Broncos and Chargers make the playoffs.

That said, think about.

Nobody wants to face the Buffalo Bills.

So if you get that seventh spot,

if you manage to win the wildcard round, you're up next in Buffalo.

So, getting out of that spot and protecting, I think the whole idea right now in the AFC is: can we avoid the Buffalo Bills as long as possible?

And then people will say, Well, you also want to avoid the Kansas City Chiefs and you want to avoid the Baltimore Ravens, but no, not at the level.

I don't think you want to avoid Buffalo in the first round of their first playoff game after essentially a bye week while you're in warfare.

So, a lot on the line, even if it's more a long-term situation for these teams.

All right.

Now.

By the way, Broncos clinch a playoff berth with a win or a tie.

Chargers clinch playoff berth with win

and a Dolphins loss and a Colts loss.

Permutations.

And I don't even have to wear dumb brown khakis to do it.

A-O, Carneckie shot in a big spot.

I'm glad you did that, by the way.

Took a shot at Carneckie?

Yeah, I mean, I like him.

He's wonderful on television, but this idea that, like,

he's just reading things as they come in fast.

You know what I mean?

Like, it's just like, and, and every one of these goddamn polls is wrong.

It's been, they've been all wrong since 2016.

Right.

The only people who are taking poll questions are crazy elderly people in the Midwest.

Like, we don't, they're, they're useless.

And so to have the poll numbers just read at me fast is just a thing of the past.

I don't think we need that.

Well, there is that, but then they've used them on the football front, and it feels like sloppy seconds because that's just stuff that you could read like in an NFL preview magazine coming out each week, too.

But the one thing I do think about those polls, like the John King, it's like, how on earth have you memorized the name of every county in the entire country?

Like, I couldn't, that's one thing I could not do unless you got a guy in your ear.

And it's like, he's just whipping around, going through things.

It's like, we've got Franklin County over here.

We've got, it's like, how do you memorize stuff?

What is going on?

I don't know.

I guess I'm a basic because I do like Carnacky.

And I love, I know he's just on the Sunday night pregame show.

All he's doing at halftime is doing like mathematical probabilities, but I'm into it.

I love it.

And he seems like a nice guy to me.

And I don't understand why nice are you doing that.

That's not something about it on the TV show.

I have no problem with the person.

I have a problem with the information.

I hear you, buddy.

All right.

Without further ado, have have some kindness in your heart, Connor Orr.

It's the holiday season.

And that means, as has been teased for months on this program, it is time finally for the Connor Orr Hallmork Holiday Spectacular 2024.

And for those that are unaware,

we mentioned at the top of the show, Connor and his wife are huge fans of this programming.

It is unironic.

It is real as it gets.

And what we do on the show is every year, we take advantage of this carnacle like um insight that he has just like to be plugged in the way this man is it would be a sin not to to use him and have it get out there so what we do we focus on hallmark films hallmark films specifically yeah because as connor often you point out uh there are a lot of imitators out there

but there's only one coca-cola right

yeah you can't have access to the secret recipe you know yeah can you explain to me why we've watched, we're talking about one that's a Hallmark

original and one that's Hallmark Mystery?

Is there a quick explainer there?

Because it was literally driving me crazy.

Yeah, I'm not sure.

I mean, there's two different channels, obviously.

And so as a cable watcher, like there is Hallmark and then there's Hallmark Mystery.

We are subscribed to both of them, obviously.

And it's,

I don't know, you know, I don't know if it's like a bean counting thing or whatever.

You know, I try not to get, you know, it's like the thing where don't go into the kitchen of your favorite restaurant.

You know, I try not to get too far into the weeds there.

But Hallmark Mystery, I do believe they're doing like a blend of like a Christmas murder thing at some point.

So like I do think they're they're diving into some different tenants, which will be interesting.

Yeah.

Very interesting.

All right.

So without further ado, we're going to dig into two films

that are on your list.

And how has the year been overall from the Hallmark perspective?

This has been a juicy year?

Really strong.

Like, you know, we had Lacey Shaber in a movie where they're filming in Iceland.

They're filming in Iceland, you know, like, and it's like a

mystery sort of,

what was the Tom Hank, DaVinci Code kind of like thriller.

Like, I do think that, you know,

they're extending their reach while also

hitting the home runs or the clean singles, right?

That I kind of recommended for you guys.

But I do want to make one point of clarity in this, and that's just like

that.

So, my wife and I do watch normal movies because, like, I feel like it does get to the point where, like, it seems like I have like a, like a Disney-style mental illness, you know, yeah, like, and, and we do, but, but, you know, to tie a bow on it, like, the last two movies, so, you know, we have young kids, right?

And so, in order to, Hallmark fits perfectly into a movie night because it's like, okay, it starts at eight, it's over at 9:40.

We're not exhausted we can pay attention to it you know it's in and out you know but you know the last two times that we sat down to watch a like critically acclaimed film uh or like somebody that this movie that everyone was talking about they were goddamn terrible and it's just like it's just I feel like movies now that are like popular on Netflix like the much watch must watch movies are like they're just not finishing the job anymore and like like there's good they're really good to a point like the last two that we watched were uh the nest with uh uh oh jude law uh and there was another one called fair play

and the uh the plot was the plot lines were incredible and it's like these tense moments and then they're just like nah it's over and my wife and I are sitting there like we just lost a date night to this I think I know what you mean like if nothing else you could be cynical about the Hallmark films but at the very least they're gonna to give you a beginning, a middle, and an end.

It's Chick-fil-A.

Like, you know, it's

exactly what you're getting.

Like, you know, and you're in and out.

You leave feeling good.

And maybe not with Chick-fil-A, but like, you leave.

You leave feeling somewhat better about the world.

And I have no problem with, like, every movie now being incredibly cynical and pointing out like all the disastrous portions of life, which seems to be, you know, whatever.

But like, you know, they're just, it gets, it gets to, it gets you what you want.

You know, you get what you need out of it, you know?

All right.

Without further ado, two films we're going to talk about here.

First one is

a very

film I watched yesterday with my wife last night.

We knocked it out.

Very easy.

It was all I need for Christmas.

Let's play that trailer.

You sound great.

I just want to write something that will make my fans happy, but every step feels further from my heart.

When the music starts to fade, dreams only die when you stop watering them can a Christmas romance bring it back are you saying I should shake things up yeah shake things way up trust me

all I need for Christmas part of miracles of Christmas only on the hallmark mystery okay

so I picked this one specifically for you Dan oh really yeah okay go ahead I thought that you would appreciate uh and I'll get to the reasons why I liked it in a second but I thought you would specifically appreciate the plot line of this movie which is very much a, you know, it's an age-old, you know, boy meets girl story, but it's also a kind of a deeper examination of talent in the digital age and the survival of the singer-songwriter, which I thought you would that you would maybe take some interest in.

Yeah, I thought it was very interesting in that the film really, to me, it was like succession crossed with a Hallmark Christmas film.

And then, whoa.

And then also there's like a

yeah, a lingering subplot where the the lead,

the woman in it, I think is Molly or something.

She is very anti-Archer, who's the guy, because he works in tech.

So I think this cross-pollination prescient.

Yeah, boardroom intrigue,

the wonders and the advancements, but also the dangers and the

aversion to big tech invading our lives,

all stuffed into this small town in upstate New York near the Finger Lakes.

You know, unbelievable.

And I thought the thing that really jumped out to me on this one, Connor, is

that Archer, I read one review that I put really well, grew up in a dystopian capitalist nightmare with a father who pitted his son and daughter against each other, going as far to deny Christmas gifts to the child who earned less money during the fiscal year.

Just barbaric, diabolical shit.

So everyone has their own childhood issues, but Archer is the type of guy that has a lot to

fight against.

And my last point is his character is also the one in Fairness, Connor, that I continue to resent in these films.

A, my wife was super into him.

At one point, even remarked that he has big feet.

And I was like, ooh, slow down.

Yeah.

Okay.

But his character, Mark, is handsome.

I watched this.

I watched this this morning.

Oh, you did?

Okay.

Yeah.

Handsome, kind, compassionate, wealthy, and able to cook Cinnabons

from scratch.

First of all, I thought he was like a bit of a BJ Novak combined with a young Robbie Williams.

I was trying to figure out who he reminded me of.

For the background that you mentioned,

to have such a disassociation with his own father and with his sister, too, there's a lot of stuff going on that gets healed.

This is

well, but that all gets solved, though, over time.

Like, he is extremely compliant, extremely domesticated, and rolls into this town with a lot of cheer.

And I get, like, he won her over.

The girl to me,

I think you're right, Connor.

Like, to your point, like, she does not believe in the new age of music production.

She wants to be taken seriously as a, you know, an acoustic, and he's sort of the villain.

I did find it funny that she has this, like, active manager slash agent who can only get her jobs in, like, cafes.

Like, anyone that's tried to get an agent.

Well, but if you've tried to get an an agent you don't get an agent by being like someone doing $14 shows in a in a cap in a coffee shop in the on the side of town but I guess that's how that work this works but that's why I thought the role was so perfectly cast because I think that we all have someone in our lives who deep into their 30s still harbors this dream of like performance in some way shape or form and they will refer to like their 900 followers as like fans on Instagram and so this girl like did perfectly like I know that person.

That person is in my life and actually does kind of look like her.

And so it was like, it was, it really hit home for me there.

But I think the boxes that it checks for me here, you have to have a good meet that is very Christmassy.

And so I think the meetup here was good in that he never really had a Christmas tree, didn't know how to chop down a Christmas tree.

That was one I had not seen before.

And she comes in, shows me how to saw down a Christmas tree.

Um, you know, I thought that was a good one.

And the other secret ingredient for me is it has to have like a weird character actor that I like from something else.

And the singer-songwriter's dad was in a

was in a lifetime original movie about the woman who kept poisoning all of her husbands with antifreeze.

Oh, yeah.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Perfect.

And so, like, that's honestly one of my wife and I's favorite parts is like, oh, where do I know that guy?

And it's like, oh, that's the guy who got killed by drinking Annifreeze in a lifetime movie.

So all of that together, you know, that gets me to like at least like an eight out of ten.

Yeah, his parents really got on, or the parents of the woman, Maggie, really got on my nerves.

They were just always around at all times.

Well, they also like, they wanted her to be with him right away.

Like, you couldn't have been more kind of like just moving the plot along, I thought.

Right.

And then my, and I was going to ask you how many

made from scratch Cinnabons out of 10 you give this film.

But I just want to add

one last thing.

Other than the Archer being the classic archetype of men that I think in these movies, that sets us all back.

Like I said, handsome, kind, compassionate, wealthy.

Could cook Cinnabons from scratch, has never farted.

Like this non-realistic depiction of men creates unrealistic expectations for the women who predominantly watch these movies, and I don't like it.

And finally, the hardest thing to do, they really swung for the fences in this one, Connor, which I respect.

Remember that thing you do,

Tom Hanks' directorial debut in 1996 about the band called The Wonders?

And

that entire movie hinges on there being a song that became a sensation, a Beatles-like sensation.

So the song for the movie has to sound like a song that would be a huge hit and a sensation.

And that is really hard to do.

And that song was actually written by Adam Schlesinger of Fountains of Wayne, Rest in Peace, to Schlesinger.

But the song that they have in this, because her whole dream is, I need to write the next great Christmas song, they unveil it at the end of the movie.

And it's just her saying, wrap my arms around you like a ribbon, like 20 straight times.

And like, this is that, they didn't pull that off.

And I have to ding it for that.

I just had to.

That's a good observation.

That's fair.

I was surprised Mark was talking about how hot the male lead in this was.

Your wife was like, I didn't say how hot.

I just said he looked like, I was trying to figure out who he looked like.

I think if I, but, and, and Dan, your wife was, uh, mentioned it, but like, you mentioned the size of his feet at one point when he's walking in the business.

You're a sex addiction?

You got a problem with sex?

Yeah, you're addicted to sex?

The sex addiction or something?

I'm always surprised at, well, I guess I'm not surprised because the answer is never me, but like who other people find attractive.

And like, if I were to power rank, you know, you're kind of Hallmark leading men, like, he's not in my top seven or eight.

But, like, like, I'm the feedback I'm getting from this is very interesting.

Like, I'm gonna have to ask my wife what she thinks about it.

Yeah, I'm sure she was clocking his feet too.

All right, to our next trail for a film.

Now, I did not see this one, so you guys could guide me through it.

This film is called, what is it?

Santa Tell Me.

Santa Tell Me.

Santa Tell Me.

Like the title.

You like that title.

Santa Tell Me.

What if, instead of giving a holiday makeover to some stranger's house, you revisit your own childhood home?

Oh, wow.

The name of your true love is Nick.

Three rom-com worthy meet cubes, all with guys named Nick.

Aaron Krako and Daniel Lissing, a holiday tale about finding true love.

Nick!

Yes!

In the nick of time.

You have a little snow in your hair.

Santa, tell me.

On Hallmark channel.

Okay, this one on traditional Hallmark.

And I'll note one trope just from the trailer.

And the same thing happened in the other film, in every film.

There's a moment when the couple is sitting together and they've yet to kiss.

They usually don't kiss to the very end of the movie.

But when they're having a moment, a tender moment where they're connecting, it must always start snowing.

Yes.

What's up with that?

You know, I think...

I will say this, that this year there were several, my wife and I both noted this, earlier kisses than we've had.

Like we've had like, you know, maybe like a like two-thirds of the way in, you know, which has been surprising.

Like, it's a nice little mix-up, you know, change up in the formula, but you have to have it, it has to look right, you know, like it has to feel right.

There has to be mistletoe, there has to be lights in the background.

Like, this is a sensory thing, you know.

It's always CGI snow now, too, which bothers me.

I like the practical effects with the snowflakes, but that's another thing.

Your thoughts, guys, on this film?

I so, I mean, you have Erin Krakow, who's like, I mean, if you, if you're looking at like sort of your Greg Maddox Hallmark workhorse, like she is just classic in every sense of the word, like just the person who gets it from start to finish.

It's just like, this is how I'm supposed to act.

This is how I'm supposed to absorb my Christmas wonder.

This is how I'm supposed to accidentally walk with the hot coffee and slam into the hot carpenter.

Like this is, you know, she has all the moves down.

There's no, there's no misfire on this.

There's, there's no, there's There's no, you know,

there's no cringeworthy moment here.

Just like, you know, where you're like, eh, like she, she's a pros pro when it comes to Hallmark.

And do all these Knicks get a, get a turn?

Like, is that what the part of the film is?

Is there anything?

Erotic to it?

I wouldn't call it erotic, but

she finds a,

she's a home renovation show host.

And

so the new producer that gets flown in to kind of big time her suggests that she reno her own home, own childhood home for Christmas.

And at the beginning, it starts with like her wishing to Santa Claus that she wants this magical, perfect life partner and whatever, you know, and then he never answers the wish.

Well, she's going through the house and she finds a letter, magical letter from Santa that's just like, you know, you're going to find the love of your life and his name's going to be Nick.

And then she runs into three hot dudes in five minutes named Nick.

And surprise, it's none of those guys.

So, yeah.

Yeah, like I, well, so I've never watched one of these before in my life,

at least that I can recall.

And about 15 minutes, and I was like, what is, why does Connor watch these?

And what's pulling him in?

And like, I was just being, no, to be honest, kind of just cynical, but I was like, I was watching it with my girlfriend.

I'm like, Connor's like one of my favorite people.

So we're going to keep watching this.

But, you know,

we're 20 minutes in and she's met three of the hottest guys that you'd ever see.

And they're all extremely charming.

And they do do everything to to your point dan they do everything that like uh whether an alpha male or like extremely tall they're all like like six foot five with like the best hair you've ever seen and like they're blowing her off her feet um and so it like we're and she also has the the the the producer guy who you can tell they get they don't get along so she's got that nice tension and so she's got four guys in her life 21 minutes into the movie but she's still somehow without like she's still telling the classic trope sister character like i don't know what to do and i don't have any answers and I'm alone.

It's like, you have four very intriguing men who are dating you literally at the same time.

So, that I was starting, my blood was starting to boil a little bit, but I'll tell you what happened then.

The story goes on.

This was miracle.

Well, the story goes on, and each of these guys kind of worked their way out of the equation until the producer guy that was flown in, and like the one that she haggles with, like, they, he emerges as this perfect sort of soulmate for her.

And it is, you find out that his name actually was not his name, and it it was Nick and like they had and I was and I am a sucker for rom-coms like I'll I'll say this to end at my point that like when you go watch like the end of like crocodile dundee I saw that in the theater as a kid and like it made me cry um like love actually made me cry pride and prejudice made me cry notting hill made me cry like I don't know what's going on but this movie then did the same thing at the very end when they finally had that kiss and I was like I get it Connor I get it I finally get it I'm not gonna go watch one of these every day but it was like it made me less cynical about the holidays, about everything.

And like, I kind of totally see the anchor and the weight around why you do it.

It was a joy.

That makes me so happy.

I'm curious your take, Mark, though, that the pediatric neurosurgeon was absolutely the correct choice for her.

Like, even though she did go at the very end to the producer, and it's the secret guy, the first guy that she like meet-cutes in this one at a coffee shop, they order the same like high fructose corn syrup gingerbread latte and he has one of the best pickup moves that I've ever seen in in my life which is that they both order the same coffee he takes her cup and then

or he takes his cup and writes his phone number underneath it and hands it to her and says maybe we go get something together something well no he was well he they he seemed perfect for it but that's what was getting me annoyed because it's like you know if you're watching this with someone that you maybe in the deep distance, you did your version of this, but now it's like you're just hanging around on the couch all the time, right?

And you've like you got kids.

It's like whatever.

So it's like you just seem like a two compared to this person that you're like imagining them at a coffee shop and someone doing the same thing.

And it's like, I don't need this energy in this living room right now.

But then they all find a way to make themselves look a bit foolish.

throughout.

Like he got conked in the head or something like that.

And like, I love when that happens.

So he did a great line, which actually, like, I don't normally like audibly laugh but he is a pediatric neurosurgeon who like helped children in other countries and their link was that they oh yeah it was like doctors without borders yeah and also pulled off a perfect adult mohawk which was like or like a half mohawk i'll have to watch this film incredible check this out i think this will connect with you dan this one i went to i don't know if i'll cry but i have to watch this So they they they connect over their love of this uh ice skating rink and that they both went to as a child.

He rents the whole thing out And they're ice skating, they're talking, they're getting along well.

And they slip and fall backwards.

And he looks at her and he says, you know, as a doctor, I would suggest you put ice on it.

And they're, because they're laying on a skating rink.

And I was like, this guy is just that.

He's pretty good.

Got it, man.

You know, like, yes.

Like,

got it.

I've also, during this conversation you guys have had, I just started looking at Erin Krakow's Instagram page.

I'm in love.

And I've now followed her on Instagram.

And now we see, do I get a follow back?

You know, you never know.

No, she's 40.

She's 40.

She's right in your, in your range there.

I don't look at age as a number and I cook my own stew ones.

Thank you.

This is just a tease.

I mean, I know you need more of this.

We're doing a live watch of the one.

Listen, we talked about these are two.

Oh, how many, what would be the

one out of 10 ice ranks or whatever?

I would do, so I did eight out of 10 for the last one.

I would do, I would do like 8.35 for this one.

I thought this one was good.

It was a little more inventive.

And the thing with Hallmark, right, is like you got to stay in the ballpark, but you got to press up against the edges in different ways.

And I thought that they found kind of some new ways to surprise me in this one.

All right.

So check both those titles out.

And the one that we've really been excited about, the first collaboration between Hallmark and the NFL holiday touchdown at Chiefs Love Store.

We'll be

live watching that

together on Wednesday night, 8:30 p.m.

Eastern Time, 5:30 Pacific.

So, do not miss

it.

All right, good stuff.

Thanks to everybody for watching.

We'll be back, of course, on Thursday with the week 16 preview in bulk.

And yes, make sure you sign up, www.patreon.com/slash heed the call.

Thank you, guys.

Thank you, everybody.

Till next time, heed the call.

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