#1071: August 13, 2025

Red alert, red alert, red alert, red alert, red alert, red alert, red alert, red alert, red alert,

knock, knock, knock, knock, knock, knock, knowledge fight.

Dan and Jordan, I am sweating.

Knowledgefight.com.

It's time to pray.

I have great respect for knowledge fight.

Knowledge fight.

I'm sick of them posing as if they're the good guys, saying we are the bad guys.

Knowledge fight.

Dan and Jordan.

Knowledge fight.

I need money.

Andy in Kansas.

Stop it.

Andy and Kansas.

Andy in Kansas.

Andy.

It's time to pray.

Andy in Kansas, you're on the air.

Thanks for holding us.

Hello, Alex.

I'm a fifth ten color over here saying I love your room.

Knowledge fight.

Knowledgefight.com.

I love you.

Hey, everybody.

Welcome back to Knowledge Fight.

I'm Dan.

I'm Jordan.

We're a couple dudes like to sit around, worship at the altar of Celine, and talk a little bit about Alex Jerry.

Oh, indeed we are, Dan.

Jordan.

Dan,

quick question for you.

What's up?

What's your bright spot today, buddy?

My bright spot today is that I was sitting around minding my own business.

Sure.

And I get a text out of the blue from my dad.

Uh-oh.

And what is in this text but a couple-month-old article from the New York Times?

Oh, my God.

Let me read you this headline.

Wait, so your dad just recently texted you an article from July 3rd.

From July 3rd.

Okay.

So maybe about a month.

Just about a month.

Yeah.

A month and a half.

Yeah.

Here's the headline.

Okay, what's the headline?

Pinky rings go big.

Subheadline.

As women adopt an accessory traditionally worn by men, designers have begun creating unusual statement pieces for that often overlooked fifth finger.

Pinky rings are all the rage.

Did you incite

a new fashion trend among women?

I know

that I did this before this article.

No, I agree.

You absolutely did.

I was on the pinky ring thing before the times.

You were on the vanguard of pinky rings.

The pinky ring has had a long aristocratic history.

Embraced by many, especially the ancient Egyptians, the rings quickly became accepted as visual status symbols.

Who the fuck are these people?

New York Times, calm your ass down.

Here's a quote from Jesse Thomas, who's a goldsmith and fine jewelry designer in Britain.

Quote, the pinky ring has always been a male-dominated idea, an expression of heritage and lineage, but women are taking it back.

Taking it back from where, to where, why?

Oh, man.

So, yeah, there's some real action going on in the world of pinky rings.

All right.

All right.

I feel like I'm a trendsetter.

I feel like I'm basically David Bowie of Pinky Rings.

I think there's no other conclusion to draw from this article than that you have inspired women to take back the Pinky Ring from perhaps you specifically.

And I would like to say you're welcome.

I have inspired you to take it back, and I'm glad for you to have it.

There you go.

A lot of fun you can have on

that pinky decorating it up.

You've changed things.

You've changed the world.

So anyway, thanks to my dad for sending that article to me.

That was very fun.

So what's your bright spot?

My bright spot, Dan, is that sometimes we do live shows.

Sometimes we will pack up our stuff,

travel, and then go talk in front of other people.

That's true.

That has happened a few times.

Yeah, and it's going to happen again.

What?

It's going to happen again.

Why is this the first time hearing of this?

It's really weird, but you know, I feel like you're almost,

what would I say, secondary to the show?

You know what I mean?

That makes sense.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I like to tell you things last.

You sprung this on me out of nowhere, so please tell me where are you going to drag me to?

We're going to drag you to Portland, Oregon.

What?

Yeah.

The Aladdin Theater on December 19th.

Okay.

December 19th.

Yep.

Pretty close to old holiday season.

Absolutely.

Now, you, unfortunately, I couldn't get you a ticket.

So if you need tickets, you're going to have to, they're not going to go live until Monday.

Mm-hmm.

That's why we're telling you now

so we don't get into a situation where people say, oh, they sold out and I didn't even hear the episode.

Sure.

Yeah, there's time zone things and things have

gone in the past quickly.

Quickly.

So good to have a little bit of a hands-up.

Absolutely.

Yeah, we have, you know, when we've done shows, it seems to be like sometimes outside of the country.

And then we were on the East Coast, and our West Coast peeps, I think, felt like we were giving them the short end of the stick.

Yep.

So we're trying to make up a little bit.

We will be doing it.

This Portland.

Yeah,

ticket link will be in the description.

Yep.

You bet.

What are you excited to see?

In Portland?

Or like, do you know what was great?

The last time I was in Portland, my wife and I went, and we went to see the Thorns, the football club, and it was fucking awesome.

i'm pretty sure it's the thorns uh but the for portland women's football team it was fucking great it was a great time the stadium was packed everybody was fucking into it from the jump i would like to go back okay yeah i will go along with you for that if you come along with me while i scour the streets looking for chuck polaniuk so i can argue with him looking for him specifically yeah okay i have some arguments i want to have with him from college days do you know what's fun about portland it's deceptively small we We might find him.

Okay.

Yeah.

Well,

if people there know him, tell them I'm looking.

We're coming.

We're coming for you, Polanik.

So, yeah, that's exciting.

That'll be a lot of fun.

And I have an idea for an episode that is really fun, and I'm excited to drop on people.

I'm excited to do it.

So, today, episode less excited to do,

and that is we're talking about August 13th, 2025.

Jordan.

Dangerously close to the present day.

Yeah, this is about

a month and 10 days after Pinky Rings broke in the New York Times.

Right, right, right, right.

Let me ask you this.

This is not what this episode is about.

Wait, wait, wait, wait.

Hold on.

Where are we at with Pinky Rings and Epstein dropping?

You know what I'm saying?

Where are we at whenever the news that Trump wasn't going to release?

Wasn't that the 7th?

Okay, right, right, right.

Interesting.

I wonder how long

they might be.

I'm just saying.

I'm just saying.

Maybe this whole pinky ring thing was an attempt to create a smokescreen for the FBI to release the Epstein memo.

This was jangling keys to keep people away from the truth.

It's too obvious.

Yeah.

So this is the day after

Trump started taking over D.C.

Right.

And also the day that Alex finds out that the state courts have determined that they can liquidate all of his businesses.

What a day for him.

Yeah, big day.

Yeah.

Big day.

Big day.

Bad day.

Infamy is one way that that day will live.

Not to fee.

I'm not sure exactly the word, but we'll find it.

Yep.

But first, let's take a little moment here to say hello to some new wonks.

Oh, that's a great idea.

So, first, Emma, I hope the Sodomite sent you a bucket of poop for your birthday.

Thumbs up, emoji.

Love from your sibling and brother-in-law and feline nieces.

Thank you so much.

You're now a policy wonk.

I'm a policy wonk.

Thank you very much.

Thank you.

Next, Dan's adventures in snacking shall henceforth be known as Formulaic Confections.

Thank you you so much, you're an Iowa Policy Walk.

I'm a policy wonk.

Thank you very much.

And please don't agree that Alex should come to South America.

We don't want him.

Also, if he hates immigrants so much, why does he want to emigrate so bad?

Somebody tell him he's full of South.

It's full of South Americans down here.

Thank you so much, you're an Iowa Policy Walk.

I'm a policy wonk.

Thank you very much.

They wanted you to pronounce their quote-unquote name, so they wrote it all as one word.

Yeah, there were no spaces in there.

That was tough.

I bet it was very difficult.

You nailed it, though.

Thank you.

And we got a technocrat in the mix, Jordan.

So thank you so much to Little Pig Boy.

You're an ah, what technocrat?

I'm a policy wonk.

Four stars.

Go home to your mother and tell her you're brilliant.

Someone sodomite sent me a bucket of poop.

Daddy Sharp.

Bomb, bomb, bomb, bomb, bomb.

Jar Jar Binks has a Caribbean black accent.

He's a loser,

little kitty baby.

I don't want to hate black people.

I renounce Jesus Christ.

Thank you so much.

Thank you very much.

Real quick, back to that formulaic confections thing.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I have an Oreo I want to bring up.

Okay.

I have a message about Oreo.

I have an Oreo I want to bring up.

Yeah.

Okay.

So I was at the store and I saw this Oreo, and it's like a

double stuffed type Oreo.

Okay.

So it's a little thick.

It's pretty big.

Yeah.

But it's a cookies and cream cream.

Right.

So the cookies exist.

Yep.

The cream exists.

Yep.

Within the cream, also there is cookies and cream.

Yes.

Okay.

Yeah.

So they advertise it on the front of the package it says made with real oreo cookie crumbs inside the cream and it just it blows my mind because they're already there as cookies oh my god why do they tell me it's real so then in this case i okay wait so are you saying that there was a possibility so okay

now Here's what's raising that question.

They feel like they need to make me aware that they didn't put anything else weird inside there.

Right.

As though they were assuming that I was like, you guys are probably going to put weird shit inside there, right?

Right.

You have unlimited Oreo cookies and crumbs.

Yeah.

I assume.

I assume.

Yeah.

Yeah.

You're not going to put something else in the crude.

Hold on.

Let's send out another order for a billion other people's cookies so we can put them inside our cookies.

Secretly made with hydrox.

Yeah, right?

Like, what are we doing?

What are you guys up to here?

By the way, tastes like an Oreo.

Of course it does.

It's just an Oreo with Oreo crumbs inside.

Real Oreo crumbs.

That's That's the important thing.

That makes me think they're not real Oreo crumbs.

Yep.

It's like something having quotation marks unnecessarily.

Yep, yep.

So we're going to start off today's episode and just give you a little bit of introduction.

As time has dragged on, Alex has been successful in kicking the can down the road in terms of facing the consequences for his defamation of the families of Sandy Hook victims.

He's abused every aspect of the bankruptcy system and stalled it as far as possible.

But on August 13th, the news came in in that time was running out.

Judge Guerra Gamble of the Texas state courts ruled that free speech systems had five days to turn over their property to a receiver, and that this receiver had clearance to change the locks on buildings containing that property.

Obviously, this didn't mean that it was the end of the world for him, but this ruling is a clear sign that these are the stakes that are in play.

Even if this is something that Infowars is able to push back on, they're playing defense against a concrete end of the road, as opposed to much more abstract consequences like we've seen.

It's the difference between having 10 moves left in a chess game and having like two.

There's a lot less road in front of him.

To be totally clear, Alex probably doesn't care about this anymore because he's gotten everything he's wanted out of this situation.

By stalling and delaying any consequences, he's bought himself enough time to create dummy businesses that he can use to exist.

Even if Infowars is seized from him, he can just keep on going on.

He's created the Alex Jones store to replace the InfoWars store and the Alex Jones Network to replace Free Speech Systems, and he's not technically the owner of those businesses, so he believes that they're outside the reach of the courts.

If he's made the most of the time that he's been given, then his customer base should be fully migrated over to the new store by now.

So it's really just kind of a performance thing at this point for him, I think.

Obviously, he can't show weakness or appear to be giving up on the Infowars brand without threatening the morale of the customers that he wants to buy stuff from the new store.

So he needs to keep on looking like he's putting up a fight.

So on the 13th, he ends up having to not do the show.

Oh, because of the court stuff.

That sounds right.

Yeah.

Yeah.

There are more important things at stake.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And I do think that it was probably unexpected because he films a little video to play at the beginning of the show before his ding-dongs take over.

Okay.

It is Wednesday, August 13th, 2025.

I am your host, Alex Jones.

Now, I'm taping this in the morning.

We're about to go live, but I got news just yesterday evening that the Democrat Party law firms, Paul Weiss, the ones that Trump sanctioned and admitted to their law fare,

have been doing bait and switches in the Travis County, Austin, Texas courts with their Soros judge, the same one that ran the show trial three years ago with HBO.

Now, the federal court has blocked them shutting this operation down.

They had their fake auction with The Onion and Bloomberg, and remember all that last year and tried to close this other topic.

So now they went into state court.

We found out they had already appointed a receiver and they were going to try to literally send in the Travis County sheriffs as early as next week.

This is like their seventh or eighth or tenth in last year

and a half or so.

And we did all these filings and showed the judges what was happening.

So then they pulled it out of Guerrero's court and pulled it.

And we're like, okay, they pulled the hearing and then boom

at the 11th hour shoot it to another court for today so now I've got to go run down and deal with that again I'm up here this morning just worked out was getting ready with research and you learned about all this so that's basically it Alex pre-recorded a little video retelling his bullshit version of why he has to go to court and they play that then chase and owen take over hosting with a bit of a vibe of the sword of Damocles hanging over them sure sure sure I don't think they feel in the best mood our boss and the owner of this company is in court talking about how this company will no longer exist.

Yeah.

That's probably a bummer.

Yeah, I think they have to think like, uh-oh.

So just because Alex skipped out on his show doesn't mean that he didn't have info warring to do on the 13th.

After he got done with court, he came back to work because duty called.

He had to carry out his sacred obligation to have a debate with Nick Fuentes about whether or not Trump was putting in a police state.

Just the fact that this was happening, how it was happening, tells us a couple of important things.

The first is that Alex doesn't get to make demands on scheduling anymore.

Nick gets to decide when Alex can have some of his time, because his time is more valuable than Alex's at this point.

In the past, Nick needed to chase Alex's clout, but the roles are entirely reversed at this point.

The second thing we can take from this is that Alex has entirely lost the plot on what his career is supposed to be about, and engaging with Nick is a huge mistake optically.

Alex's entire career has been about trying to push white identity politics and semi-feudal economics under the guise of fighting against a worldwide communist conspiracy that was behind basically everything that's ever happened.

Essentially, his take on Trump's actions in DC is a mask-off moment for him, where he's effectively communicating to the audience that he didn't care about the stuff he sold them the image of caring about, and if they care about it still, they're suckers.

It's a near-perfect mirror of what happened a month earlier with Trump, when he told everyone who still cared about Epstein that they were stupid and he didn't want them as his followers anymore.

In that moment, Trump acted in the furtherance of his actual goals, not seeming to realize that the context of what he was doing clashed with what he'd sold his followers as being his actual goals all along.

This moment is the same for Alex, where he's acting exactly how he thinks he should, and he's furthering the interests he actually cares about, but the only way left to do that involves revealing that he's been lying about what he actually cared about this whole time.

Trump thought he had the political capital to demand that his followers ignore what was right in front of their faces, and Alex is making the same wager with this.

Anyone with half a brain can see that Trump doesn't care about pursuing any justice in the Epstein case, and that Alex has no problem with the police state shit, as long as it's directed at populations he's not a part of and that he views as the other.

This may be a gamble that works for Trump in the long run, but it's probably going to be a lot harder for Alex for three big reasons.

The first is that Trump is a confident bully, and Alex is a weak follower.

For all of his alpha bravado, Alex is desperate for approval and acceptance.

So whereas Trump can say fuck off to his followers and mean it, Alex could never be that brash.

The second is that Trump has real power, whereas Alex is as weak in as a bargaining position as he's ever been in.

I would argue that Alex on public access TV in the 90s was in a more powerful position than he is today because he hadn't worn out his welcome to so many people at that point, and he had nothing but potential.

He was ascending.

Oh, and like just a bottle rocket on him.

Alex has put himself in a position where if he wants to continue broadcasting, he can't own anything.

He's going to be forever in someone else's employment.

Sure, we all understand that Bigley is the company that technically owns the Alex Jones store, but it's really Alex still.

The thing is, according to the courts, Bigley does own it.

Wow.

So that is a reality that can't go away.

This may just be a way for Alex to theoretically elude the bankruptcy courts, but in order to pull it off, he has to give up core pieces of his autonomy, which is one of the main sources of power that he ever had.

The third reason Alex is going to have a harder time gaslighting his audience than Trump is because he's hanging out with Nick.

Nick doesn't need to defend Trump's actions for his brand to work, so he's able to call out things that the audience sees in front of their face.

Alex may be able to use some kind of technicality argument to pretend that Trump's actions are totally cool, but to pull that off, he needs to exist in a bubble.

The audience is being asked to believe that the Emperor has some really sweet clothes, and one of the biggest hurdles to that is having someone on the show who can point out nudity.

When Nick comes on the show

as the side saying that Trump's actions are police state shit, it automatically gives him the high ground in the conversation on Infowars.

Either the debate can be them agreeing that Trump is doing police state shit, or Alex is going to be forced to take the position of defending Trump's actions, trying to convince the audience that the Emperor is a great new fit.

Having this conversation with Nick only makes it more jarring to the audience that Alex's take is what it is.

Alex defending Trump's actions is a fundamentally bad call, and continuing to buddy up with Nick in hope of attracting his audience is the worst thing he could do in addition to that.

It just shines a spotlight on

how hollow everything is.

It's strange.

You know, it is not

because it seems so bald-faced, stupid.

Like,

you would have to be deliberately avoiding looking in the mirror in order to, which he's done his entire life.

So that's, it's believable.

Sure.

But to continue doing it while doing all the rest of this, while your business is being liquided, liquidated, while, you know, like what you're doing is strange.

It would be less strange for him to just go, fuck everybody.

You know, like, I hate all of you.

And fuck you, Nick Fuentes.

You're a Nazi.

Like, it would make more sense for him to just have a meltdown than it does for him to be like, well, a police state's okay.

Start wearing a wig and like deny he was ever bald.

Absolutely.

Just like go

really far afar.

Of course, you should.

Shit's falling apart around your ears.

It would make sense.

I would go nuts.

Yeah.

Why not?

Instead, it's just kind of him going, like, invalidating himself.

Yeah.

And promoting Nick.

Yeah.

It's

wild.

Yeah.

Well, I don't know.

What are you thinking, man?

So the way that Alex is promoting this, it really does feel like it's supposed to to be a debate between Nick, who's critical of Trump and thinks that this is a police state, and Alex, who's like, it's fine.

How else would you, how could you see it as anything else?

That's basically the sales pitch.

Right.

I will tell you that it does not end up being that.

Well, that sounds about right.

That is what you were expecting.

Sure.

Now, the last time that Alex and Nick talked,

you were thinking maybe Alex was drunk.

I was hoping maybe Alex was drunk.

Because he was slurring his words a lot.

And if he's not drunk while he was slurring his words a lot, that would suggest something else was going on.

Yeah, I had the feeling that maybe he was just tired.

Yeah.

And as he introduces this conversation that he's going to have with Nick, he explains that he was just tired.

He was just very tired.

So I was right.

Okay.

It's Wednesday, August 13th, 2025,

502 Central Standard Time.

I'm in Austin, Texas.

And Nicholas J.

Fuentez is in Chicago in his studios.

And we are going to him live for a discussion debate.

But when he was on a few weeks ago, A, I've been up since 5 a.m.

and I was extremely tired.

I was not drunk as some people thought, though, I wish I was.

And

he did a great job

and people enjoyed it, but I didn't bring much debate to it because I do disagree with some things.

That always makes it more interesting to have a spirit of discussion that brings out the best thoughts in people.

But since then, I do have some disagreements on things like Trump wants a police state martial law.

I mean, I think that goes too far, though the direction it's going at some point could become dangerous.

But right now, it's a response to all the tyranny.

What?

Yeah, so he was just tired.

Case closed.

Well, I buy it.

Yeah.

As long as he says he's tired, but he wishes he were drunk.

Well, I mean, I know that he would wish, but he wouldn't do.

I do like the fact that he can look at himself and be like, I kind of sucked.

That last interview, I kind of didn't have nothing.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I was

true.

Yep, yep, yep, yep.

So Alex just lost the debate and hasn't even started.

He's staking out his position as being that Trump's actions could lead to a police state and martial law, but it's justified because of some vague notion of tyranny.

This is Alex's whole shtick.

Like, everything is supposed to be a crazy, slippery slope.

Public assistance programs aren't bad because they help people.

It's because they have the potential to create a state where everyone just relies on the government to provide their basic needs, and then the government can take that all away.

Right.

Alex's argument is that the government helping people isn't bad.

It's the possible consequences of how that dependency could be exploited by an evil government that's the real problem.

In fact, a lot of things that socialists and communists generally advocate for aren't bad things just because they help the poor.

Single-payer health care wouldn't be bad just because it's bad.

It's bad because it would create a situation where the government could create death panels and ration out medical care based on their social preferences.

It's all the next stages down the road that are possible.

So many of Alex's positions are based on some some variation of we can't allow X to exist because it could possibly give the government too much power, and once they have that power, it's too late to take it back.

We can never trust them to use it responsibly, not because they themselves are not trustworthy, but because over time, it is simply not possible for everyone to be trustworthy.

You can't put toothpaste back in a tube.

You can't do it.

Given that this is the basis of so many of his ideas, it's unconvincing for him to say that Trump's actions could lead to a police state, but look pretty good for now.

If If this is an acceptable way to engage with this kind of stuff, then what's the point of opposing the Patriot Act?

Like, what's the point of any of his

conspiracies?

It's like, because, because,

in short, in short,

the calculus is, well, we're never going to have to deal with anybody in power who's not us ever again.

So,

why bother?

You know, like, oh, no, what could bad people do with this against us?

We don't need to worry about it.

Those other people are fucking gone.

So, yeah, let's have infinite power.

That's fun.

Yeah, and I think that Alex's positioning that he's taking now really relies on him thinking that everything is going to be okay.

Yeah.

Like, that the power has been grasped and seized.

Yep.

And, like, I think that that's a little bit of the hubris that he's feeling.

Well, I mean, it's essentially banking on the pendulum finally never swinging again.

Right.

And the pendulum has always swung, even when it really looked like it wouldn't.

Well,

and it also has the feeling of like a bond villain, kind of like.

Sure.

Ha ha, ta-da.

This is who we are.

Power.

I mean, you got to figure reactions being equal,

this next one to this, the reaction to a guy being the Willy Wonka of evil is probably going to be pretty.

I don't know, man.

Willy Wonka brought us candy.

That's fair.

Trump has not brought me any candy.

Ah, then it's going to be worse.

Yeah.

The Wonka bar is one of the best bars.

Anyway, this has been Formulaic Confession.

So, Alex and Nick are going to have a debate.

But I will tell you that it's going to be a while until Nick gets a word in because Alex does a very, very long introduction.

Of course.

And it turns out that he's interested in having a debate with Nick about the police state stuff.

Okay.

But really, he's thrilled that that Nick is fighting with Candace Owens and Tucker.

They're having a big public beef

that is getting so much attention.

Oh my God.

These people are all babies.

Yeah.

This is ridiculous.

And Alex wants a piece of the ass.

He's a bit crazy guy.

I want to cry.

I just decided before we went live, so I'm not sneak attacking Nick with this.

I've made the decision on this.

I said, hey, what topics do you want to cover?

Here's the topics I want to cover.

They're basically the same topics.

I never get into the infighting.

I never get into

all all of the soap opera stuff that happens in conservative, populist, Christian, common sense media,

which is none of those things.

Infighting or whatever you want to call it

with Nick Fuentez and Candace Owens and Tucker Carlson and now everybody piling on against Nick has to be addressed.

And I was thinking about it literally five minutes ago.

And, you know, Nick's a smart guy, so he doesn't mind something being sprung on him.

And I'm like, let's go there first

because I like all these people, and I need them all to succeed, especially people like Elon Musk.

And behind the scenes, you see, Roger, the articles were publishing about trying to get him back in the White House.

It was bad when he left, and a lot of the big problems started then.

That's suspicious.

That is suspicious.

So,

you know, Nick was talking some shit about

Tucker.

Sure.

Tucker called him a fed and said he's a weird gay kid who lives in his parents' basement.

Yeah.

Okay.

Nick didn't didn't care for that much.

I imagine not.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And then he he did an interview with Candace Owens and there was some kind of argument about that, maybe having to do with her putting it behind a paywall or editing it in some way.

Something like that.

Make him look bad.

Whatever you like.

Yeah.

So there's a lot of smoke

around these three.

This trio is

messy.

I mean, you know, if if I thought for a second that these feuds would negatively impact any of them, I would be all for it.

But since I can only see positive outcomes for all three of them through this slap fight,

I'm angry at them.

They will all be able to use it in some way to increase their place in the attention economy, raise numbers and stuff.

It's the smartest thing you can do.

And that is what Alex wants.

Of course.

He wants to be the fourth wheel.

I have had more people come up to me

in the streets, on the hike and bike trail, family, grocery stores.

I mean, basically everywhere I go, they come up and talk about Nick Fuentez and

Tucker Carlson and

all the rest of this, Candace Owens.

And

that's interesting because I know Buzz.

I've been on the air 31 years, had success pretty much right away locally.

And then within a few years, I got syndicated.

So I had big success 25 years ago.

so I know buzzes when I see them and this buzz rivals buzzes when I've like

you know go on Joe Rogan and it gets 100 million views I mean I've I can count on one hand the times I've seen buzzes this big when Trump's come on the show and stuff like that this in ways is bigger and and that shows how seismic it is they call me woody because I know buzz nice well done I don't know

Did you just think of that one or was that in your notes?

I actually thought of like four of them, but I decided just to throw one off.

Okay.

What's your give me your second choice?

Well, I didn't know if I wanted to go keep going with Toy Story.

Sure, I thought Slinky Dog.

Right.

Okay.

Something about a B.

Okay.

Right.

Okay.

Aldrin.

Sure, there's definitely Aldrin.

Call me Mr.

Aldrin.

All right.

So

you're going.

Buzz Aldrin is number four behind something with a B?

Yep.

Dang, man.

Buzz is going to hear this.

And he is going to know that he is at fourth behind maybe a B.

I think that I just, not too long ago, watched that Naked and Afraid where they tear down a beehive.

So maybe, maybe that's on my mind.

Maybe that's why it's a little bit higher than the whole second man on the fucking moon thing.

Second.

Fair enough.

So, yeah, Alex just wants that buzz.

Yeah.

Buzz buzz buzz is

so

it's crazy how transparent this is.

Yeah.

I mean, but

like, why, but why dispense with the niceties?

Like, let's do this.

I have just been slapped by Epstein bullshit.

Now there's a fucking police state.

But what are people talking about?

Not those things.

These three people arguing.

That's the good shit.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Is Nico Fed.

Look, we all know we're a bunch of sycophantic losers who have been outplayed by a psychopathic moron.

But look at us arguing now.

Yeah, I think that the like the certain

incentives that Twitter has built into their

like their space

is really

really drifted them into dangerous waters.

Yeah.

Where it's like the most important thing I think I've ever seen, the biggest buzz is Tucker fighting with Nick Fuente.

You've all lost your minds.

Yeah.

And that was before that's, that was before

when you thought everything was controlled by lizards and shit.

Yeah.

So I was like, man, I thought this was going to be mostly about the Trump DC actions.

Right.

I thought this was going to be about police state stuff.

Right.

I'm really getting the sense that this is mostly going to be about Tucker.

We're really going for trying to broker an agreement between them to do a debate.

What are we doing?

But then Alex said something that really scared me.

Okay.

So there I sprung it.

I want to do that first and go through the other topics with him.

Nick thinks Trump's betrayed everything on the border and deportations.

I'm tracking the numbers.

I know the insiders.

I know they dismantled it under Biden.

He's scaling up.

I know Trump's backed off some on the skilled visa stuff.

So Nick's got his points.

But still, I want to ask Nick, why are you just 100%, it seems, on Trump and not the Democrats?

That's probably my biggest beef.

I think that that indicated to me that Alex wants to be confrontational.

Yeah.

Like he wants to try and get Nick on his back foot before this interview even starts.

Right, right, right.

And to me, that is like, oh, that's a bad idea.

It's not going to work.

Yeah.

He's going to matador this thing and just move to the side and Alex is going to

dive through the cape.

It could not be more like,

okay, 10 years ago, you could say, oh, Democrats, there's a, you know, there's no, there's no, there's no

pushback.

This is, it is just Trump.

Right?

Like, why would you even bother?

Oh, what do the Democrats do?

Who?

Who the fuck are you talking about?

Yeah, right?

I think that Alex's thing, like, here is like, yeah, you're just focusing all of it on Trump and not talking enough about the Democrats.

That's who is there?

That's because I'm serious.

That's the only person who's there.

Because I'm not playing games.

Yeah, what are you talking about?

Yeah, it's meaningless to argue about what...

Jamie Raskin is doing right now.

Oh, who cares?

The only meaningful rightward drift that Alex or Nick is going to be able to achieve is by attacking Trump from the right.

Yep.

That's the only thing that that they can do because they're not going to drive him further left.

Yep.

That's not going to happen.

You don't have to worry about most of the people in Congress on the left.

So, like,

yeah.

And ultimately, your instinct, no matter how much you may or may not appreciate Trump as it is, your instinct is to bite power.

And there's only one power.

You know, like, that's it.

Yeah.

And pushing rightward is also a long-term strategy that helps normalize even further right-leaning stuff for the next candidate.

It's an investment strategy as opposed to just constantly attacking the Democrats.

So

there's a lot of buzz.

So much buzz.

There's so much buzz.

So much buzz.

Are we going to get some of this buzz?

Well, Alex is going to talk about it.

Okay.

As I just said in the intro,

I don't think I've ever seen buzz this big

on a topic.

I mean, every time I go out in public and walk around at least 10, 15 people, you know, I mean, if I see like, you know, the guy comes to clean the pool or something, he doesn't bring it up.

But I mean, if I get around a gas station, a grocery store, anywhere, multiple people bring up Nick Fuentez and this big battle, and everybody thinks he's being ganged up on and he's a really smart guy.

And, you know,

they heard he was a bad guy, but now they love his show.

And the show's been big forever.

He's been around eight years or so, nine years, but it's exploded.

And I know when something explodes like that, I called him a week and a half ago and I said, you better get ready for the big attacks.

And look, I'm not fighting with Tucker or Candice or Elon Musk.

I like

all those people.

And I think they have their own perspectives and their own issues.

And I defended Tucker because he confided in me two weeks after his dad died when I was up there with him for a few days, have a dinner and lunch.

That, wow, I knew he worked with the CIA because USA did and voice from America and all that, but I didn't know he was high level and he was high level.

I said, Tucker, come on.

So I don't think Tucker's lying about that.

So I've said my little intro.

You have have said a little intro.

Why did you say an intro that included Tucker told me two weeks after his dad died that he was a big into the CIA?

Yeah, and Alex has already said on a recent episode that Tucker himself was high-level CIA and fighting in the jungles when he was a kid or whatever.

What are we doing here?

Yeah, so like

this is strange because one of the big attacks that Tucker made on Nick is that Nick is a fed.

Yeah.

And Alex is saying Tucker's a fed.

Tucker's absolutely a fed.

Tucker's totally a fed.

Not only is Tucker a fed, I'm not saying he's a fed.

He told me he's a fed.

It couldn't be more obvious, like one person is being made to look good and the other is not.

Yeah.

And Tucker is on the outs, kind of, of this equation.

I mean...

That's weird.

I don't know why.

Well, okay.

I don't know why you don't just fight.

Because when...

Like boxing?

No, no, no, no.

I mean, like,

Joe Rogan wouldn't have me on, so I'll slit him like a pig.

That's your...

That works.

Be weirdly aggressive, and people will suddenly be like, oh, well, I gotta have you on my show to figure out why you're weirdly aggressive.

Right, right.

Make someone who is who wrongly cares about you worried.

Absolutely.

Yeah.

Tucker Carlson probably fucked a demon.

He said he was attacked by a demon, but when I look at him, I see a buddy.

You know, like that, boom, now you're on Tucker's show.

Yeah.

Those weren't wounds that he had.

Those were scratches on his back.

Those were

love bites.

Yeah.

I mean, I just, I feel really strange about how this has all gone down because, you know, like it starts and it feels like, okay, this is going to be about their fight.

Oh, it sounds like Alex wants to confront Nick about how he's putting too much attention on these conservative people and doing too much infighting.

But now it feels like he wants to side with Nick against these other people.

It's weird.

I don't know where he's coming from.

All right.

I've got a new theory.

And we've talked about this plenty in the past.

The substance.

All right.

Did Nick emerge from Alex Jones's Husk?

Well, we know that he didn't because they're in the same week.

Well, I mean, listen, it's not one-to-one.

The movie.

We don't know.

That movie substance seems fake.

This substance obviously allows you to hatch somebody and then they can continue on.

If they have developed the substance substance in order to make it so you didn't have to disappear for a week.

Right.

Then maybe.

Okay.

Maybe.

Because it would make more sense if he was looking at himself as a younger man, being like, I'm going to try and help you, as opposed to being like, I'm weirdly desperate for your attention.

Boy, does it feel like he's projecting a lot

onto Nick.

Yeah.

A lot of like, you know, when I first got really famous,

you know,

it's when people came out of the woodwork and started attacking me, and that's what's happening with Nick.

Like, you can really feel like he thinks Nick is going through what he went through.

Yeah, Rex didn't want to do this.

Nick really reminds me of me.

Boom.

Chase kind of sucks.

He has a bleeding disorder.

Chase kind of sucks.

Oh my God, he has a bleeding disorder.

Of course he does.

Yeah.

What a good guy.

Owen's too enthusiastic about being me.

Yeah, and then Harrison Smith is just a loser Nazi.

Yeah.

He's not even a fun Nazi.

He's like a Nick with no Riz.

Exactly.

Yeah, fuck that.

Fuck that guy.

So Alex still has not introed Nick.

It just goes on.

Is he even here?

Yeah.

Silently, probably rolling his eyes.

Yeah, right.

And then just like Fuentez at Turning Point and, you know, all these other groups eight, nine years ago, they saw he was a smart guy, charismatic, you know, even when he was 18 years old, bring him in, hire him, and then try to send him to Israel and brainwash him and make him do that.

That made him go the other direction.

They kind of, I would say, accelerated him becoming what he is today.

And it's the same thing when now Charlie Kirk is like, I have the Jewish lobby, the Israel lobby calling up and threatening me, and I've been your greatest ally.

How dare you?

And that's how this process begins.

And then you've got, you know, Flynn, who's like, hey, I'm a big fan of Israel, helped them, worked with them, on and on and on.

But they stood down on October 7th.

They're trying to drag us into war.

They are manipulating the White House and they're a danger.

So I've got to come out against what's happening in Israel.

You have to.

Okay.

There's no other way.

But then I don't want to be associated, not because I get attacked or because the ADL be mean to me, they already are, with the people that take it to the total cuckoo land and, you know, say Ebel only exists because of these interests when there's other fish to fry and other issues as well.

Though Israel, through Netanyahu and others, is trying a full takeover in this power vacuum of the White House.

So now I've gone great guns and said, now this is the big central attack, because it is true what people were saying in the past.

It was partially true before.

Now it really is.

So we have to just be honest about that but that's not because i didn't hold back because i didn't want to be attacked i was being attacked even more what because i was attacking the policies of the globalists which israel supports and others and the and the chi comms allman alignment and so i was getting a big tent and mainlining this that was what i was doing but that was good in the past and it helped build all of this now it's out all out in the open now we move into the out in the open mask off battle battle.

So, this is about 10 minutes into Alex's intro, and beyond the kind of Coke Party vibe about how he's talking, if you pay attention to what he's saying, he's essentially telling the audience that he's been lying to them this whole time.

This actually seems a little bit more self-aware than I generally imagine that he is about this stuff.

It's time for the mask-off battle.

Alex's career has been about creating a big tent, and the way that he did that was appealing to people who weren't primarily motivated by bigotry with conspiracies and pretending to fight for some ideal of the Constitution.

Dumb Nazis would love to revel in yelling about how Alex works for the Jews or something like that, but the more strategic ones always viewed Alex as a net positive because of exactly what he's saying here.

He created the big tent.

He was the funnel that moved normal people far enough to the extreme right that they could be swayed even further once they became disillusioned with him and what the infowar has to offer.

You bet.

Alex was helping create the army and mainstreaming the pathways that led people to being Nazis, and one of the essential aspects of doing that was to differentiate himself from them.

He couldn't be the bridge between normal people and Nazis if he was a Nazi himself, so he had to be different.

In service of making this appearance, he created the image that the Nazi folks were caught up in saying that the only evil that existed in the world was because of the Jews, whereas he thought that there was a bigger picture.

There are many evils and sources of evil in the world.

There's a third way.

What this makes me think of is how people will point out, you know, like Hitler killed a lot of people who weren't Jewish in the Holocaust.

Good for them.

This is meant to remind people that while he had a singular hatred for Jewish people and wanted to eradicate them, he had many other victims, too.

It feels like Alex's position is more or less an attempt to remind the Nazis that they used to think bigger.

They used to have a vision of getting rid of all the people they considered undesirable, not just Jewish people.

Yeah.

And these people who focus so much on, like, these cuckoo people who think that Jews.

They're myopic.

Let's face it.

They're just, you just don't see the big picture, which is they all gotta go.

Whatever is going on in his head, there's something undeniable about how clearly Alex thinks Nick is the future of his shit.

In this long-winded introduction, he's creating a heroic image around Nick and molding the story of his own career to fit in with what Nick is about.

And at the same time, you know, kind of throwing a little shade over at Tucker.

And I mean, it's weird.

It's not.

Again, it makes sense if you just see him as, oh, this is me.

Because if you look at nick fuentes and you're alex and you see him as you then you also see tucker carlson as fucking rush limba you know like you're there to take him down or even see him as tucker carlson earlier in your tucker carlson yeah tucker carlson yeah yeah exactly you see him as bowtie tucker carlson yeah absolutely so so yeah you gotta you have to take him down even if i like him that's also my weakness my weakness is saying like in part of the intro you know i think he's probably bullshit but two weeks after his dad died, he brought me out there and we talked.

And it's like, you're sentimental.

That's part of your whole calculus now.

Whereas Nick Fuentes is just a piece of shit.

He is just a gigantic piece of shit.

And you see yourself in that piece of shit.

Yep.

Yep.

And because of that or something, some combination of variables, it leads Alex to just have his lunch eaten over and over and over again.

So Nick finally gets to start talking.

And I think he pretty succinctly explains his argument with Candace Owen in a way that, like, this is focused compared to Alex for sure.

Yes.

Well, thank you for having me.

It has been certainly a strange couple of weeks with everything that's gone on.

And, you know, I've seen people characterize it on Twitter, the sort of feud that's been going on with Candace, with Tucker, with Elon, with all these different figures.

And I don't know that you would characterize it this way, but I've seen other people say this.

They say it's infighting.

And I don't really like that term because I don't think it does justice to what actually took place, which is that you and I were both really on top of this back in June.

There was a war in Iran.

It really all goes back to this, at least for me.

And I think, you know, you asked me to kind of take the 20,000 foot view, the 30,000-foot view.

To me, the 30,000-foot view has so much to do with the populist movement, with Trump, and with the situation in Iran as it has unfolded over the past few years.

So going back to June, you and I were on this.

I was doing these big streams covering the war.

I did your show.

You were doing huge streams covering the war in Iran.

It was blowing up.

I do this show with Candace Owens, who I've had a little drama with her in the past.

I've also helped her in the past.

I hate women.

So we've had kind of a relationship which has been characterized by sometimes friendliness, but sometimes negativity.

And without relitigating the entire drama, we do a interview in the middle of the war, and we don't talk about the war at all.

We don't talk about Trump.

We don't talk about, you know, our cancellation, the Daily Wire, any of these things.

She's pressing me about drama, things like this.

Now, some people thought it was an interesting interview.

A lot of people are disappointed in what we talked about, or maybe what we did not talk about.

Needless to say, there was this big reaction to how she handled it and that it was behind a paywall, all these things.

Then she goes on Tucker and Tucker Carlson calls me a fed.

I do this big reaction stream to that.

Clearly, that accusation backfires.

Now, I don't know Tucker.

I've never met him.

I've never talked to him.

But he seems to, without watching my show or knowing me, he seems to think that he knows exactly what I'm about and made a very serious accusation.

Not only did he say that I'm an asset of the left or of the federal government, he says, but I'm this weird gay kid in my basement from Chicago.

And who is this guy?

And all this stuff.

This backfires.

And then a week later, I get Elon Musk replying to Milo, accusing me of being a fed.

And you take this whole thing together, and I wouldn't characterize that as infighting.

I would say what that looks like to me is a coordinated attack.

I think it stinks.

I think it reeks of coordination because it's the same types of accusations coming from people that are all connected to each other.

Elon replied to Milo.

Milo did a show with Candace the week before.

Candice did the show with Tucker the week before that.

Well, you know what this all means.

You know, Tucker, Candace, Milo, Elon, they're all working for the Jews.

They're all working for Nanyahu or something.

It is a weird thing because I understand that this will be difficult to communicate.

But this is the type of position.

Like, imagine you're playing like civilization.

You know, you know how they have those campaigns where they'll drop you into, like, oh, here's a thing.

You know, like, oh, you've got this amount of resources.

You've got this whole thing.

Yeah.

And you got to.

You start in like a besieged city and you have to like stabilize things.

You start in media res.

Yeah.

You don't have the baggage of like how you got there, right?

So if I was going to start in media res,

the moment that fucking Tucker, Candace, and Elon all three started saying my name, I'd be like, fuck you idiots.

Yeah.

I want all of you.

Like, this is the best.

I'm...

They would be the best feeling in the world.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

You fucking morons.

It's like, I'm going to say some horrid shit, and then I dare you to rush.

I'm going to eat your lunch, you fucking morons.

You guys are cowards and dumb.

You're stupid.

Yeah.

But you're too rich to know, and I don't care.

I have the one true superpower.

I don't give a fuck about you.

Yeah.

And that's amazing.

And And he has a fan base that only wants him to not give a fuck about these people.

Oh, yeah.

No, the more you fight.

Yeah.

Yep.

Yep.

Idiots.

Yep.

It's a it's a mess.

God, I would, I would, oh, man.

What a space to suddenly fucking jump in a rocket ship and fuck all of these people on your way out.

That's ridiculous.

It is a bizarre thing to imagine just being like, what?

Elon Tucker?

Two fucking idiots.

Wow.

So Nick has explained the reason that Candace Owens and Tucker are attacking him in very simple terms and made it a situation where it all goes back to Nick's position on Trump attacking Iran.

Nick knows that he and Alex were on the same side of that conversation, so this is a really good way for him to frame it.

Alex is going to have a difficult time not siding with Nick because

Weirdly, that was one of the few times that he has gone against what Trump had decided to do.

Yeah.

And it was the right decision for him to make, which is don't attack Iran.

What a weird, what a weird, random, and seemingly arbitrary set of decisions these people have made to put them in a situation that makes no sense.

Yeah.

Alex has to be proud of like, well, I didn't fall for that.

I mean,

I've stepped on every rake along the way to get here, but I missed that one.

So that's nice.

So plus, in that rambling intro that he already did, Alex said that Tucker is in the CIA.

Yeah.

So if Tucker is trying to attack Nick as a Fed, that kind of seems like something a Fed would do.

That would be what I would do if I was a Fed.

So that would raise a lot of suspicions about Alex being one of the very few people who were invited on Tucker's tour.

That's, I mean, you know, there's a lot of questions that come up if Tucker's a Fed.

Seems pretty obvious.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So he might be a good faith actor, though.

Tucker might.

And the way that he could prove it is debate Nick.

Sure.

Oh, my God.

That would prove a lot.

And you know what?

Alex could host it.

I saw what you said.

I appreciated that you defended me from the accusation that I'm a fed.

But what I would say is this.

This is sort of where I'm at psychologically.

I don't know Tucker.

I don't know Candace.

I don't know her well.

I've obviously met her and had my interactions with her recently.

But I would say this.

If they are good faith actors, if they're honest journalists, if they mean what they say and say what they mean, if they are who they say they are, maybe this is all just a big colossal misunderstanding.

Maybe they legitimately have real concerns about me.

Maybe it's not coordinated.

And to that, I would say, why doesn't Tucker Carlson have me on his show?

Better yet, why doesn't he talk to me on the phone privately?

I don't need the clout at this point.

I mean, the whole music is going to be a little bit more.

I'll shut up, but that's where I was going to go next.

I can call Tucker and ask him, can you imagine if I hosted a debate even remotely?

And that'd be fair.

That would be massive.

Oh,

if he means well, he should come to bait me.

Step into my trap.

Oh, my God.

Step in.

Come on.

This is a situation where, like,

Drake was convinced that this would not be that hard because Drake was laboring under the misapprehension that he was good at what he did, right?

He sucked, but he didn't know that he sucked.

And that's why he got his ass beat, right?

These people just need to all recognize that they suck, and then they won't get into a

rat beef with Nick Fuentes, where they try and, like, oh, we can step to you.

What are you guys doing?

You're idiots.

Yeah,

he's like, it's very young.

Yeah.

Lived with the internet his whole life.

Yeah.

He's a shitty troll.

You are going to get A minored.

If you fucking, if you, if Tucker Carlson is like,

you're going to get A minored.

That's what's going to happen.

Yep.

Jesus.

And I don't, I would rather die than get A minored.

There's going to be a Groiper war on you.

So, Nick, here he explains how things went bad with him and Tucker.

Yeah.

And his explanation is like, well, it kind of makes sense.

You would accept that if

I hosted a debate with you and Tucker?

Oh, absolutely.

Yeah, of course.

Absolutely.

What?

And you could call it a debate, a discussion, whatever you want to do.

I would do a debate, absolutely, because, you know, he made specific claims pertaining to Joe Kent.

He said the reason that he's suspicious of me is because of my attacks on Joe Kent.

And I've said this to you, and I've said it to Candace, and I've been saying it to anyone who will listen in fairness, almost to the point of being a nuisance.

I've told that story about Joe Kent in so many years.

Even Politicos, a lot of people don't really remember Joe Kent.

I don't remember.

Recap people that don't know then.

Sure.

So Joe Kent ran for Congress in 2022, and he received some backing from Peter Thiel.

And he had a mutual friend, Matt Brainerd.

Matt Brainerd was his first hire on his campaign.

He was a consultant.

Brainerd was at AFPAC.

He was at my convention.

And long story short, Joe Kent attacked me in 2022.

I initially supported him.

I talked to him on the phone.

We were going to send the Groipers out to Washington to help him.

And out of a clear blue sky in 2022, He launches this attack on me and says that he condemns me because of my opposition to Israel and because I talk about race and religion.

He said that my message does not fit with inclusive populism, which is his vision.

Now, in response to his attack, I mobilized the Groipers to Washington and the Groipers that were going to help him then were hurting him.

And I said, we will not reward betrayal.

We will not reward people that claim to be America first, but are really Israel first.

We're going to make an example out of him.

Now, Joe Kent lost.

It was a major upset.

That was rated as a safe Republican district, and he lost by like a thousand votes.

And so credibly, you could say that I caused him to lose, but I caused him to lose to make an example out of someone that says they're America first, but when the chips are down, they're really Israel first.

Now, Tucker was good friends with Joe Kent, and they had this relationship.

Tucker promoted Joe Kent on his show.

And I think that Tucker blamed me for the loss.

This is his friend.

And he said, oh, you made my friend lose.

What motivation would you have to see this guy who purports to be America first?

Why would you want to take him out?

And so Tucker then worked with Max Blumenthal on a hit piece in the gray zone.

And that's where all this you're a federal agent accusation originated was from a hit piece in the gray zone in February 2023, just a couple of months after Joe Kent lost.

And, you know, so maybe that's just a misunderstanding, but I have said repeatedly, I did not come at Joe Kent randomly.

I didn't pick on him because he was great.

I was supporting him.

Then he disavowed me because I criticize Israel.

Like, it doesn't get more on the nose than that.

This story so eloquently illustrates why someone like Tucker doesn't want anything to do with Nick and why associating with Nick is a terrible idea.

Nick is an anti-Semite.

He's not just someone who opposes Israel.

He's someone who's invested in a political project meant to build toward a Catholic authoritarian theocracy and a white nationalist society.

He's very easy to attack, even for conservatives, because for the most part, he's not very subtle about what he believes, and it's pretty extreme stuff.

The problem comes when you get involved with him or you try to use his influence to support your own causes.

Someone like Joe Kent is a pretty Trump Republican kind of politician and you know they've created a party where the Proud Boys and Oath Keepers are acceptable people to associate with.

It's easy to forget now, but in the wake of the 2020 election, Nick was a big figure in the Stop the Steel protests, so you can easily see how someone like Kent could think that this was a guy that I could use.

But as Kent learned the hard hard way, if you make friends with Nick, he will use that against you.

If you give him a reason to believe that you're a supporter of the cause that he pushes, then you will either need to continue to do that or you're going to face an embarrassing public fight with a Nazi and all of his followers.

This is what happened to Joe Kent.

And now, Tucker, he has to know this is exactly what would happen to him if he gives Nick half a chance to get his foot in the door.

Yeah.

This is the Nick model.

He has the one power that they don't have, which is the actual power of exile.

Like, he can say, oh, when I don't want you in my group anymore, you are not allowed in my group anymore.

Whereas for the vast majority of them, that's an empty threat, you know?

Oh, we're fighting about blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

Yeah, but tomorrow we're going to show up.

We're going to say good morning, and then we're going to drink our coffee and we're going to fight about this next thing, right?

He's Nick Puentes is really willing to end it,

which is a power that a lot of people are terrified of.

Yeah, and he's also like cultivated uh audience that so desperately wants to hear what he has to say yeah because it's the thing that people like alex have like teased them about for a very long time yeah and not gratified whereas nick will come out and you know deny the holocaust and shit it's it's hard not to say that

The core reason Nick's fans exist is because they look at everybody else and go, nut up and say it.

Yeah, all these people are watered down.

Exactly.

So, I mean, if somebody else were willing to step into Nick's space with more talent, more charisma, more any number of things, they could probably take that space.

They probably could.

It couldn't be Alex because he has too much baggage.

No, but the reality is

his example is Audacity.

He is the one who is doing it.

Other people could do it, but they won't.

So he's the one who is.

That's the way it is.

Yep.

So they end up talking a bit about January 6th because one of the reasons that Tucker thinks that Nick is a fed is a little piece of video from January 6th.

Ooh.

That

I was blown away that Alex played this on the show.

Oh, shit.

Because it makes Nick look really bad.

Uh-oh.

So here, this is from January 6th.

Okay.

This is the clip that, you know, that has Tucker concerns on a plan so you can respond.

Here it is.

taking the capital.

Keep launching and don't relax.

Never relinquish.

Miss T-Town defense.

We're evacuating the capital.

Break down the barriers and disregard the police.

This capital belongs to us.

And that's exactly how it should be.

These politicians don't represent us.

They betray us.

And now we are forcibly evicting them from the people out now.

They should live in fear of the eviction.

All right.

So you have to remember the climate at the time.

Democrats were taking over capitals all the time, having protests, sit-ins.

They've done it recently in Michigan and Georgia, and it's not called a terror attack.

And I've seen

your description of what you were saying, and I understand it from the time that we're all angry.

They've stolen the election.

That's confirmed.

You're called there.

You go there.

I saw you a few days ago in a clip describe this.

If you could repeat people that information, because

I believe it, I buy it.

Yeah, so as you know,

the January 6th protest, this is something that I almost wasn't even going to attend because at January 6th, it was basically over.

Yeah, we all knew it was over.

We're going to go.

I almost didn't go because we knew that it was bullshit.

So he was the one on the bullhorn, right?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Why does that make him look bad?

Well, because Alex and all of his friends like to say that the stuff that Nick was saying in that clip is what Antifa provocateurs were saying.

Oh.

He's yelling about tearing down the barricades and storming the building.

See,

this is another reason they're all going to lose because that sounds totally fine.

Yeah.

No, I mean, it sounds like what you would expect someone like Nick to be saying.

That's what he should be saying.

But within the mythology of Infowars and how they've tried to sell the story of January 6th, Nick's behavior is fucking fed shit.

Right.

Right.

They have harassed the shit out of like Ray Epps for way less than that.

Gotcha.

That is crazy suspicious.

Right.

Right.

Compared to, and, you know, Alex was there.

There's video of him telling people not to go in.

Yeah.

So like Nick being like,

fucking ignore the police, tear down the barricades.

Like, that's really weird.

I mean, see,

that's the thing about their whole lying, twisted bullshit is, like,

that's what you all were saying.

That's what you think in that moment.

That's what you guys were all doing.

You were stoked.

It was like being in a movie.

It was great.

We're taking over.

Sure, we're only like 20,000 guys and there's a military.

Fine, but we're taking over.

Right until the seesaw teetered, you were all having a really great time.

It was great.

We were doing it.

And then it turns out movies aren't like real life.

Yeah, yeah.

And that video of Nick, I agree with you.

It's not shocking, like, for me assessing a person.

Yeah.

But it's shocking to try and like fit into what Alex needs January 6th to be.

Right, right.

I would have just figured he would have not played that.

Right.

No, it's so weird.

Like, but again, that's what the people want to hear.

That's not, they don't want to hear like, oh, that was feds who was helping us on January 6th.

Nick Fuente's fans hear that and go, Yeah, that's the whole fucking point.

I thought that's why we're here.

Yeah, and I think a large percentage of whatever fans Alex has left probably want to hear that too.

Yeah, like it's probably more in line with what they're feeling.

Like, whatever.

But it's only going to get more popular after the,

they're not going to be able to, like, regulate the Epstein thing.

It's only going to get more popular.

Well, you know, whatever disillusionment people have surrounding that and certainly Alex's willingness to stay on board after all that.

You've got to be thinking, I don't know if this is real.

Like, I don't know if this is a real revolution.

Yeah.

Here we have this guy yelling about how we should destroy the barricades and stuff.

Like, that is what we should have done then.

Disregard the police.

Isn't that what we were told to do when we were sovereign citizens and shit?

Yeah, hold on.

This guy seems like he makes way more sense.

Yeah.

Oh, shit.

He's a Nazi.

Yeah.

So

Alex, he pretends that he wants to move on from talking about January 6th.

Sure.

Because they do talk for a while about that.

They want to move on to the bigger issues.

So I thought, of course, like, okay, we're going to talk about D.C.

Yeah.

The biggest issue.

Nope.

Oh, the biggest issue is buzz.

Buzz, buzz, buzz.

There's a lot of buzz.

Buzz, buzz.

But I'm going to give you the floor right now

on the bigger issue.

Just as a media analyst,

futurist guy,

very good at predicting things.

You predicted Trump would really have big trouble with Israel trying to control his administration.

I don't think they're totally controlled.

They're certainly trying, so we've got to deal with it.

I want to get into Iran, how they're trying to get back in there.

From what I've seen, saying Trump does want a police state.

I disagree, at least so far.

I want to get into all that with you.

But what is it?

People want to know personally what it's like for you

to

have everybody pile on to you, which I would have told these people, I actually did, some of them.

I said, you know, if you think somebody's bad, you understand doing this is making them bigger.

And so,

I mean,

this has exploded and it's only getting bigger now.

And

I'm one of the few people that's experienced what you've gone through multiple times,

like many times, but I wouldn't even say,

well, I've had deplatforming and big blowups that have been as big as this.

Okay.

There's not many people other than like a Trump or even a Tucker getting fired at Fox that have had a blow up this big.

So clearly, I don't think you started this blow up.

and I can see both sides of the beefs and everything, but just what is it like for you now?

What is it like to have all that buzz, kid?

What's it like to be like me?

This is wild.

This is creepy, too.

Yep.

This is extended into the realm of creepy.

Like,

can I just...

Can I just smell your hair for a little bit?

Like, we're creepy.

Well, you know, there is a feeling of like maybe an old over-the-hill athlete being like, what's it like to get that game-winning touchdown yep i remember when i used to do that remind me of what my glory days were like remember when the crowd used to clap their hands at my majesty oh that was a buzz those are the buzz days i don't get that buzz anymore low-type so it's it's just it's definitely the least important question that alex could be asking probably he wants to talk about the big issues sure he named some big issues there were in the preamble to asking about the buzz and he just keeps talking about the buzz

and i know they know this.

The people that have attacked you, they've been hurt by it.

You've been helped by it.

And they're doing good work.

I would like them, like when Trump 40 days ago came out and said there's no Epstein, shut up.

I said, I've never seen any evidence you really involve anything bad.

Why are you doing this?

You need to stop it.

It really hurt him in the polls.

So that's my philosophy is targeting the globalists and focusing on them.

If Republicans or Populists do something bad, I will report it.

But the Democrats are so much worse.

I spend 90% of my time on them.

Trump does this stuff.

Shove about Epstein.

He killed himself.

He didn't do anything wrong.

He wasn't human trapping.

He had no accomplices.

There was no blackmail.

I'm like, do you understand this is the biggest tries and effect ever?

Day one.

I got huge backlash from the, you know, kind of Israel lobby that says, we're MAGA, you're a panicker, the same groups that attacked me when I was, you know, against going to full war with Iran.

So I could see it was synthetic coordinated attack.

And

then I pulled back from that.

And the day day one, I said, Trump's behind this ordered cover-up.

And then two days later, I was like, yeah, I'm the one.

Shut up.

It doesn't exist.

Well, I mean, of course I knew that.

Then I made calls and confirmed it.

Then I made calls to talk to folks that were in long meetings with him.

Then I learned a lot of stuff I'm not even allowed to say.

I halfway leaked it.

You know, they stuck his wife in there and other lies, pissed him off.

They knew what they were doing.

And you can give your own opinion of where you think this is going.

It subsided some.

If you'll just stop saying, don't talk about it, you know, it'll probably go away.

But I'd like to get to the bottom of it.

uh so that's kind of a

again stream of consciousness on that so so take some time here i'm not gonna i'm trying to interrupt and what is it like personally for you and then where do you see this going and then you agree with me that

the fact that so many people across all

the world

are are are really galvanized around you and supporting you

That is not just because you're smart and well-spoken and all the rest of it because people piled on you, which is so obvious.

And people want the underdog.

They can see see it.

I've experienced it myself.

But this is also a bigger symbol of the total collapse of faith in the system.

But people that still try to blame both sides and act like they're anti-establishment, but then still kind of go after whoever they see on the leading edge of intellectual resistance, that's just not smart to turn the country and the world around.

And we want to overcome all this bullying culture and intimidation and just break it.

And you're doing that.

And I'm trying to do that.

And so it just doesn't seem wise, but it is a big complex amalgamation.

So I can see how people see you as an easy target, but not in this climate.

I mean, I mean, obviously, I agree with a lot of what you talk about.

I've been smart.

I've liked chipping on you for eight years.

I think you're doing great.

And you're a popular guest on my show.

And I'm all about good thought and discussion and debate and, you know, what the listeners like.

I'll give my ideas.

You give yours.

But, I mean, I could see years ago, and I told the crew, I said, Nick Fondy's going to get bigger and bigger.

And I said, and I've tried behind the scenes anyway.

And you prescribe that.

I don't want to press the gas so much or you're going to kill you.

But that's not because they're telling me to do that.

I'm getting money to do it.

I'm like, you know, fly too close to the sun here.

But it doesn't matter.

That's where we are anyways.

And so it's kind of damn the maneuvers.

Go straight at them.

So that's my rant.

Go ahead, Nick.

So Alex just can't stop talking.

And a lot of the specific things he's saying aren't really that important.

I can clear it up for you about what he was saying.

Some of them were a little bit related, but you kind of have to know how his brain works

in order for any of it to make sense.

That's the problem.

I can kind of follow it, and that makes me unhappy.

Yeah, that's

almost like knowing another language.

It's no good.

So, the meaning of what he's saying is pretty important, I think, behind these specifics.

He's saying that he sides with Nick over Tucker, and at least part of that, I believe, is because he feels like Tucker isn't playing his role correctly.

Yeah, the same way with Trump being like, you just need to shut up.

Stop it with the Epstein cover-up stuff.

Just be quiet and it'll go away.

Don't fight with Nick unless it's a pay-per-view.

The irony, of course, is we are in a boy who cried wolf situation.

Alex should never be listened to, obviously.

Except you should totally be listening to him right now.

How would you know?

You would never know.

You would assume not to listen to him because, of course, you shouldn't listen to him.

But he's the only person who has actual real-world experience of this thing, and you should listen to him.

It's wild.

Right.

You err on the side of not taking his advice.

Don't listen to him.

But yeah,

in this one instance, actually two, because Trump should have just shut up.

Yeah, no, absolutely.

And Tucker shouldn't be fighting with Nick unless it's mutually beneficial for them.

Yep.

But that's true inside the game.

Right.

And that's true inside the game, like that Alex plays and that Tucker plays and all that.

But Nick's not really playing that.

No.

He's doing something a little different.

Nazi ace.

Yeah, yeah.

So after Alex gives that long, meaningful question.

Nick, I think this is great work.

I hate to say it, but solid stuff.

Okay.

And what I think really resonated with people when I clapped back on Tucker, it wasn't even so much, I spent three hours talking about the CIA and all this stuff.

The part that resonated was the very end of the show where I addressed the personal attacks because in addition to him insinuating that I work for intelligence or something like that, he said I'm a weird gay kid in a basement from Chicago.

I'm a child.

And in the clip that went viral on TikTok and Twitter, I said, Did you forget?

when you did that part of your show that you're always pandering to the young white men?

Isn't that kind of like the lead?

Isn't that like the story of the past 10 years?

Is the young white men who have no meaning in their lives, who are struggling to get married, who can't afford a home, who don't feel any allegiance to the country.

They don't feel like they're a part of the country.

There's no society.

There's no social fabric.

It's like, did you forget that, you know, those are the people that you purport to care about, that you're trying to win over?

You're defending their interests.

And in the clip, I said, I am that guy.

Like, I'm of that demographic.

Probably a minor.

That's great work for Nick.

Like, it sucks.

And, you know, he's as full of shit as anybody.

Of course.

But that's solid.

Yeah, that's what you do.

Obviously, Tucker was mostly just calling him gay.

But instead of even responding to that part, Nick has made this an insult that he's wearing as a badge of honor.

If you ignore the gay part, you can really grandstand about the male loneliness epidemic and how Tucker's whole thing has been about white identity for the past number of years.

If Tucker really cared about all that stuff, like, you know, the stuff that he said that mattered to the audience that he tried to cultivate, then how could he weaponize nick's male loneliness against him like that it's really it's almost solid it's almost obvious if you're not always full of shit yeah nick is a slimy worm and he is too full of shit yeah but this is the kind of response that entirely invalidates tucker's attack yeah and even like It could make you think that Nick is cool with gay people since he didn't get offended.

That's how that

makes him look chiller in response because he's like i'm not gay absolutely

he's not saying that yeah yeah yeah like you would expect these uh uptight right-wingers to nope no it is

i think what we're responding to because i think it's easy for people to to

um pull from our reactions to this some sort of like positive view towards nick fuentes and there is zero positive view towards him nope what there is a a a thing that we are reaching for is an admiration for competence.

There's more of a craft.

Exactly.

It is a thing that this guy is executing in a way that these other people are doing a poor job.

And it's just, it's like what?

It's like when people watch Property Brothers, like, wow, they really built the shit out of that fucking thing.

That's what I'm responding to.

Yeah, and to be totally clear, I would be hard-pressed to say who I think is worse between Alex and Nick.

I think they're both horrible, horrible people.

Yeah, absolutely.

No real redeeming qualities.

None.

Most of the stuff that they say you can't really believe.

And so, yeah,

it's just that

he knows how to be effective now in a way that Alex is, like I said on the last episode, he's a bore

in many senses.

Like, he's.

Yep.

In my preferred world, they don't even exist.

But in this world, competence exists.

So, there you go.

So, Nick, he just wants to talk about the issues.

All this stuff about people calling him gay and all that.

He doesn't want to get bogged down in that.

Let's talk about the buzz.

Like the real.

No.

Oh.

No.

That's what everyone else wants to talk about.

Okay.

Oh, Nick is talking about it.

Sorry.

Nick wants serious shit.

Right.

I don't want adulation.

I don't want the glory.

I just want people to listen to the arguments.

And that's really it.

For as much as people like to talk about my sexuality, people like to talk about my home situation.

Do I live with my parents?

People talk about all this stuff.

It's like, I want to talk about the war in Iran, as you know, because we covered this together.

It's like I'm intensely interested.

And I'm going to take a break and come back and get into the meat and potatoes now and where we agree, where we disagree.

But they're mad.

I'm not talking about Candace and Tucker and all of them because

they're trying to stop the war too and in Ukraine.

But the system is definitely mad.

And we did get hit by the Israeli bots, you and I and everybody else, who were just covering it and saying this is crazy.

And then that is what's weird then after all of that,

which boosted what you're doing, boosted what I'm doing, but I just, like you just cover whatever's interesting.

And I think the truth, that, that,

that you are just a bellwether

of the overall mind of the public.

And that's where I'm always at is where is the public?

And I don't then go where the public is, unless where the public is, is where I'm already going, which I pretty much got them there in many cases.

And so I see someone avant-garde

who is who is having success, and I see all the anti-white, anti-Christian racism that's so intense and who's running at the ADL.

I'm not a guy that just hates Jews in general and the person that is a victim and blames them for everything because there's different groups, different things going on, different power blocks.

But

when

you have the ADL trying to pass federal laws to arrest people that criticize even Zionists, I mean, I played the clips last week.

I mean, this is tyranny.

When you've got

their counterparts passing those laws,

B'nai Brith and all of them in Europe, this is the model.

And so the left, with all its tyranny and its love of Islam and all its censorship, is bad and has been terrible and done more censorship.

But now Trump claims he's getting censorship, but more and more is bringing in the ADL.

And that clips of it saying they're basically running this angle of censorship.

It's totally unconstitutional here in the United States.

So I think this clip helps illustrate a thesis that I've been working off of a bit, which is that the circumstances surrounding Trump attacking Iran have had a ripple effect on Alex and the media space that he occupies, leading him to make explicit some of the baseline under-the-surface anti-Semitic ideas that he's always preached.

In that clip, you hear him say that after the Iran attack, he and Nick were both hit with the Israeli bots.

They were targeted because they were critical of attacking Iran, and that was followed up by attacks from Jewish media figures that Alex has decided work from Mossad, like Ben Shapiro and Mark Levin.

One of the primary beliefs of the InfoWar is that consequences are a sign of virtue, or you always get more flack when you're above the target.

If people are responding negatively to you, it must be because you're doing something right.

Alex is following this thinking and allowing a complete breakdown of his fantasy world to lead him to just being an advocate for anti-Semitism.

The Epstein cover-up really took all the attention away from it, but that and the bombing of Iran are big breaks in the Trump world.

After Alex took the positions that he took on these scandals, he obviously got some heat from areas that he wasn't used to getting heat from.

A lot of the Trump base was disillusioned by these things, and Alex's inability to cover them accurately probably turned some people off.

On the flip side, some hardline Trump fans probably felt like he wasn't being sycophantic enough to the leader.

He's fighting the devil.

Get in line.

At the same time, Alex's actions really went against what he's supposed to stand for, so I can imagine him also getting a lot of heat from his longtime fans.

He said on our last episode that talk show hosts had accused him of abandoning his principles to support Trump taking over DC.

So there's obviously some criticism that is, you know, in this lane.

Sure, sure, sure, sure.

Alex is incapable of taking feedback appropriately, so he experiences all of this negative stimulus as being the ADL and Israeli attacks on him, which must mean that he's over some kind of a target.

But what has he been doing more lately than before?

And the short answer is being openly Nazi-ish.

Yep.

This episode is from August 13th, and the day before, here's something that Nick posted on Twitter.

Quote, at the peak of my popularity, all of a sudden there's a coordinated smear campaign by the biggest conservatives who wouldn't give me the time of day a few months ago.

This is what happens when you start naming names and talking about the Jews, not the neocons, the Jews.

That's who he's buddying up with and promoting as an avant-garde thought leader.

Alex is addicted to Twitter and he spends hours a day on it, so I find it impossible to believe that he wouldn't have seen that tweet.

He knows exactly who he's talking to.

And Nick talking about this coordinated smear campaign is what Alex is talking to him about with like Tucker and Candace and

Elon.

This is what Nick put out as a statement about the thing Alex is interviewing him about.

Alex has seen this.

He knows.

He has to.

Yeah.

Yep.

So, like,

I just think, I think that we have a situation where,

you know, I think the Iran bombing and the Epstein stuff, obviously,

like, two giant blows.

Yeah.

But I also think that it would be more accurately traced back to, like, the big, beautiful bill.

Sure.

I think that set the stage for like this cracking.

Yeah.

And we're now at a point where, like, it's all just breaking down.

Yeah, I mean, it's interesting to watch.

It's also interesting from the point of view of people who are not involved

in an even larger sense, you know, like

the joke of the Democrats not existing.

Not so much that, but just in terms of like, if you are in these Twitter fights, who the fuck cares if you have some sort of leftist idea?

You are not going to have an effect on anybody.

You know, if you're in these places, this is only their space.

This is only where they can communicate.

You know, there's no touching them anymore.

Well,

I think that that's not wholly true, but I do think that

the idea of moderating

an environment where the deck isn't stacked entirely in their favor, that is unrealistic.

But

such a mess.

So

obviously, I thought we were going to just have a whole debate about the martial law in D.C.

Why?

It's pretty much obviously martial law.

Well, now that's interesting.

That is an obvious point because Alex does get to this

and they do disagree.

And then I disagree overall.

I don't want to mischaracterize as having that time the last day or so to watch your show, but I saw some of the tweets and statements, you know, where you're like, I don't know.

Before I thought it'd be good to have National Guard deport the illegals, but God, this could be for Israel to enforce on us.

But then I understand constitutionally what he's doing.

That's why these courts have been upholding ICE, upholding the guard stuff.

So, what Nick had actually tweeted was: I used to think that Trump taking over cities with federal police was based, but now it feels like he's creating a secret police for Israel.

That has the vibe of someone who wants to kind of sound like they're joking, but aren't.

Nick is a Catholic fascist, he doesn't have a problem with a dictator, he has a problem with Trump.

If Trump met his ideological guidelines, what he's doing in DC wouldn't be a problem at all, not even a subject for conversation.

Yeah,

it is shocking, though, when you boil it down what Fuentes believes to be like, shit, the Spanish Inquisition never ended.

They just kept on going.

Wild.

So Nick's take on this

is just like, I love it.

I love it, but also I'm, you know, this isn't the time.

Well, tell us your view on Trump federalizing D.C., talking about Chicago, talking about New York, talking about L.A., National Guard, rapid reaction force.

What do you think Trump's doing?

What's your concern?

Well, in principle, I agree with it.

In principle, I love it.

And I said this on my show last night because Chicago is a dump.

New York is a dump.

And it's worse.

It's violent.

It's filthy.

It's chaotic and all the rest.

And under normal circumstances, I would have loved this announcement from Trump that he's moving the police in to take over.

But the announcement about DC and federalizing law enforcement there, it was accompanied by another announcement about a DOD memo where they say they're going to form this new,

it's like a quick response task force made up of 600 National Guardsmen on a rotating basis that'll be stationed in Arizona and Alabama.

Now, to be fair, this is something that they talked about doing five years ago.

They talked about doing this in 2020.

You got 300 National Guard in Arizona, 300 in Alabama.

And that way they could rapidly deploy a federalized military force into a city in the event of civil unrest.

I don't think it's a a terrible idea by itself, honestly.

And like I said, it's been around for five years.

But in principle, my concern with this overall is that right now, we clearly have an occupied government.

Like that's just not in dispute.

So here's where things get dicey.

Alex kind of thought that they were going to have a debate on the margins of supporting or denouncing Trump's actions in D.C.

Alex was going to take the position that what Trump was doing is okay technically, and Nick was going to be against it.

But now here we are, and Nick's position is: I love the police state.

The feds should be sent in to crush dissent.

I just think the Jews run our government, so I don't want a police state right now.

This is different than how I think Alex expected this to go, and actually, it's much worse for him.

Now he's in a position where he needs to agree with Nick, which would mean flipping his stance on Trump's actions in D.C., or disagree with Nick.

If he disagrees, on what basis can he disagree?

Nick's position is basically: the police state is good when I control it.

So the opposite of that would be the police state is never good.

If Alex wants to disagree with Nick on that point, then it cuts against his ability to pretend that what Trump is doing right now is okay.

Right.

Nick doesn't give a fuck about the silly shit that Alex has been doing for the last 30 years.

He thinks cowering in fear about communists is stupid boomer stuff and that dictatorships are based.

They don't agree on whether a police state is good or bad.

So it seems impossible for them to have a coherent conversation about this.

Yeah.

And I don't think Alex realized that or cared when he got into this.

It is, it is just like

there is, there is a language that they are used to communicating, wherein there is a like kind of mutual assured destruction while at the same time a mutually assured benefits.

You know, like as long as we don't fucking go to reality, we can all have our fun.

We can all make a shit ton of money and all of that stuff.

But once you add somebody who is actually at the decision point, like when Alex says something like, you know, I think it's, it's maybe bad, but it's not at a police state yet, right?

Now, the follow-up question to that is, okay, then give me what it would take for you to declare it a police state.

Where the answer is, it is a police state.

Of course, he knows it's a police state.

He's never going to declare it a police state.

He can say, though, maybe not yet, as a way of being like, well, maybe someday, you know, we can coexist here.

Nick is at the decision point.

He says this is a police state, the end.

No.

Now what?

Well, Nick believes the decision point is there, and I think he's on the other side of it.

Right.

Whereas Alex wants to speak in these vagaries.

Right.

Yeah.

No.

And it's incompatible.

In or out time.

But if you are somebody who's just observing this conversation from the outside,

you can't help but recognize that the things that Nick's saying are counter to things that are central for Alex.

Alex cannot think, like, oh, yeah, police state would be good if my guy was running it.

Yeah, he does believe that, but the brand doesn't.

Yeah.

So he's a little in a tortured place here.

Yeah.

The only thing he has is the traditional Bugs Bunny move, right?

If this guy's just going to cross every line, well, then

keep making lines until there's no land and then make him fall off.

Sure.

Yeah.

So

Nick says something else that Alex really can't agree with.

Do I think that means that necessarily they're going to come to New York and arrest everybody that criticized Israel?

Not necessarily.

At the same time, I can't cheerlead an expansion of the security state when, as such, that state is being used to support the interest of a foreign power.

So

when I look at it on an axis of like more government and less government, ideologically, I'm a statist.

Like in a vacuum, I'm in favor of a bigger government.

But when the government is occupied, I have to lean more towards

the libertarian side of that axis, the libertarian poll.

It feels like this is something that Alex might be surprised to hear, that Nick supports a big government.

Right.

They are on opposite teams in a zero-sum game.

Nick wants to have a bigger government doing the things he thinks government should do, and Alex wants the smallest government possible.

Any progress towards Nick's ideal state is a step away from Alex's, unless one of them has been lying about what they want.

Maybe the one named Alex.

What?

The one who's traditionally been known as a non-stop liar?

Yeah, that's one of all kinds.

That's the one.

I mean, you can't possibly hear this guy be like, I want a big-ass government doing...

tyrannical shit that I support.

A government large enough to have enough people to monitor a thousand-mile long ass border or whatever it is?

A government big enough to just have people at every six feet on the border?

That's the size of government he's looking for.

Yeah, it should be giant.

Yeah.

Should be huge.

Everybody should work for it.

But also scary for everyone else.

Obviously.

But not me.

Yeah.

And only Christians in office.

Oh, well, I mean, obviously, because we all know the definition of a Christian and they all agree with each other on what it is.

Yeah.

And

by definition, they're all white.

Yeah.

Well, there we go.

So, Nick, I think he, you know, with the move about the Tucker calling him gay,

I thought that, you know, that's a real good move.

Solid judo.

And then he makes another really good move here where he asks Alex to agree with him.

Oh.

After he said these things that Alex can't agree to.

Right.

And so that's where I have these mixed feelings about it.

I wouldn't necessarily say it's the worst idea, but you do get a little nervous when you see the palantir being deployed, when you see the National Guard coming out, all this stuff.

And at the same time, you see every department is putting out a statement about anti-Semitism.

It's like, okay, how long before this is going to be used against Nick Fuentes and Dan Bilzerian and Jake Shields and these types of people?

That's always my concern.

So I'm wondering, I mean, do you have concerns about that?

Or do you kind of get where I'm coming from?

Because on some level, I think we're on the same page that in principle, this is a good thing, but maybe in practice, it might leave something to be desired.

Obviously,

as George Washington said, fire

government is like fire, a dangerous servant, a fearful master.

So

clearly, I'm the guy making films, writing books, when the Democrats and also Bush, father and junior, were literally trying to train the military and police for gun confiscation, martial law.

That was confirmed.

So we were really worried about that.

But it was the military itself

that would leak the information to us and say that was wrong.

So these forces aren't being trained

for political enforcement or gun confiscation or any of that.

Yeah, so that's cool.

I haven't heard anything bad, so everything's good, I guess.

Alex's answer to that question should be, we are 100% not on the same page about the police state being a good idea.

It should also be so easy to muster up the words, I'm very in favor of small government.

And yet Alex can't.

And I think that speaks for itself.

It's really shocking.

I mean,

I think deep down, a lot of us would be surprised how many people are thoroughly situational in belief systems.

So I don't think that's too strange, but also, man, that sucks that you can't even fake it on your own show.

It's your own show.

I don't think that I would be too bothered by somebody being fairly situational if they're just somebody.

I think if they're an ideologue, I'm going to be a little pissed.

You mean somebody who's made an entire career out of being not that somebody?

Yeah.

Yeah.

And claims that God told them as a kid that they were supposed to fight the devil and gives them prophetic visions and all this dumb bullshit.

I think then I'm going to be a little bit bothered by situationality.

So I know that this is like,

is there a way we can get like a refund of 30 odd years of this man's life?

Like, is there like a, ah, you owe us all a billion dollars now?

Hopefully the liquidation will take care of that.

Fingers crossed.

I want a refund.

So Nick brought up Palantir.

Sure.

And Alex has got to be like, uh-oh, he said Palantir.

So I got to equivocate a little bit.

Oh, my God.

And try and make sure that no one thinks I like Palantir by talking about how Palantir isn't really the biggest problem.

Oh, my God.

And Nick's just not having any of it.

And I've not defended Palantir.

I've explained.

Microsoft, Google,

and of course, Amazon, when you look at government funding, have

thousands of percent more money from the government currently than Palantir

to surveil, to SPY.

15 years ago, Alexa, listen to your house.

You know, Bezos running the CIA servers along with Microsoft.

Now, Palantir is coming in, as they said they would, to offer Trump a system to try to watch all of that and give him control, like one ring to rule them all.

So I'm not defending Alex Karp.

Very troubling

at EU summits.

I helped.

target and surveil everybody across Europe and Germany and the UK and put them in jail for their right-wing speech.

You know, my biggest fear is a Christian nationalist throwing me out of a window.

So he's definitely got his heart on for Christians.

You know, he's definitely got that classic ADL bent to him.

But you see Teal over there backing Trump and other things.

And I know his background, obviously, NQTEL and Poindexter and all that you've covered lately.

Everybody's, well, I'm not taking your thunder away.

You've done a great job presenting it, but that's old news.

I'm glad people are discovering it now.

But that's all true.

My issue is I just see them as a rival group trying to come in and get control.

And the idea that they're going to put us under under a police state they're going to put us under a surveillance state it's already there i want to dismantle the whole thing and then my focus is let's focus on carp

part of the time let's also focus on eric schmidt of alphabet let's focus on those guys too so people get the wide-ranging view but it is true that all of these systems they're bringing in can be turned on the on the people and it is true that palantir has this big enemy list so why don't you speak to that

i guess i would just say in general, when you say the globalists are coming after Trump, I almost don't know who you're talking about anymore because who attended Trump's inauguration?

It was Jeff Bezos, Elon Musk.

It was all the big tech and little tech people.

I saw a clip from CNN the other day and a presenter on CNN said Trump is brilliant.

He's a mastermind.

And what were they talking about?

His coverup of the Epstein files.

So it's like CNN and the New York Times, it's like room service journalism for Trump.

You know, in the middle of this giant scandal, he's walking on the roof and they're saying, Mr.

President, why are you on the roof today?

Like, who's even resisting Trump anymore?

So I mean, look, I defend someone being on a roof.

I'm very, I'm not situational on this.

No, you like roofs.

Yeah.

I think everyone has a right to be on a roof.

Yeah, no, you enjoy it.

At all times, stargazing is fun.

Absolutely.

Even if it's the middle of the day and it's the White House and you're the president.

Wow.

So I don't judge that.

But

yeah, I think that Alex is going to have a tough, he has a tough time rebutting that.

Who is

trying to fight Trump?

Right.

Who is there?

Right.

All of your enemies are

kind of falling in line behind him.

Whoops.

Whoops a doodle.

Yeah.

I mean, it's hard not to just go like, yeah, the guy who's calling them out for all being full of shit is right.

Yeah.

Now he's full of shit, too.

Yes.

But unfortunately, we're in a situation where that's who people are listening to.

Yeah.

Alex has, by getting involved with Nick, put himself in a position where Nick gets to make him look full of shit.

Yeah.

By comparison.

Yeah.

Tucker would be wise to understand that this is the best case scenario of him hanging out with Nick.

Yeah.

This is going to happen to anyone in that right-wing media space who tries to associate with Nick and then doesn't want to be a Nazi.

Yeah, this is like an Ace Ventura level gag where

your your nuts are the speed bag.

Like he is just beating the shit out of those nuts.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So Alex and Nick, they brought up that there's a CNN clip that Nick had tweeted about.

It's a data analyst named Harry Enton, and he's reporting on how interest in the Epstein case and Trump's cover up of it has gone down and how unbelievable that is.

It's not so much that he's like, Trump is a master strategist.

He's like, this is crazy.

People were really, really mad about this.

Search traffic for Trump Epstein has gone down.

And so that's what the guy on CNN is reporting on.

Nick is mischaracterizing it.

But after they play the clip of it,

he and Alex have a little bit of a chat.

I'm seeing me critical of Elon, though.

He's done a great job on X with the free speech overall.

But I've talked to people that were in the meetings.

That was a real split.

And he came out before all this happened three months ago, four months ago, and said, this Epstein thing is going to be a big deal.

It's going to be covered up.

And then I was told by people in the White House, yeah, it's because the CIA and Masada are involved.

They asked Trump to national security.

But then why would he come out and streisand affect all of this, Nick?

Because this is wishful thinking.

Anything big peaks and then subsides and then comes back as an even bigger wave.

And it's not a prediction.

It's a guarantee.

The Republicans have already said, yeah, we want everything subpoenaed, including from the Democrats and the DOJ.

So

they're seeing in, hoping nothing to see here, like the naked gun, nothing to see here.

That's not going to happen, Nick.

I love that guy's accent.

I love the presenter's accent.

It's very interesting.

What's happening?

Celebrating.

He's like, look, no one cares about Epstein with this interesting little accent there.

As far as the

I've seen the guy a lot, he's not normally that excited.

He looks like he's having orgasm here.

He's like, I'm surprised he didn't spike a football.

He was was spiking a Dreidel, I think, so something like that.

Spiking something.

That's a little on the nose.

So here's the caption that Nick added when he posted this video on Twitter, which Alex seems to have missed somehow or isn't reading.

Quote, Jewish CNN presenter is praising Donald Trump's political instincts and his handling of the Jeffrey Epstein scandal, saying the whole thing is a nothing burger.

Trump is another Matrix-approved president.

Couldn't be more obvious.

Seems like Nick is really interested in this guy being Jewish.

And when he's talking about his accent, he's saying he sounds like a

character.

It's the most Hans Landa.

Like, this is Inglorious Bastard shit.

Like, he's...

That is...

That is the Nazi hunter guy.

That's what the Nazi...

Interesting accent.

Like, that's...

What are you picking up these types of details for unless it's to hunt Jews?

Well, it's...

You Nazi.

It's to make these jokes in front of Alex and make him accept it.

Right.

Like, Alex, if he didn't, he's not so oblivious that he doesn't understand when Nick's like, oh, he's going to spike a Dreidel.

Yeah.

Like, he doesn't not understand that he's being anti-Semitic about this.

Yeah.

And

he's just flexing on Alex.

He's just like, I can do this to you now.

Why not?

Why not?

Why wouldn't you?

That's part of the fun of being evil, is getting to step on people like this.

So the conversation surrounding Trump's actions and martial law seemed to have landed in a place where Alex was like, it's cool for now.

Sure.

Maybe bad, but

which is not a thing, but fine.

No.

Yeah.

Unprecedented in terms of his police state coverage in the past.

And Nick seemed to be in the position of like, there's a Zog, and so I don't trust the government, but otherwise I would love this and want more.

Right.

Right, right.

I just want the white version of this.

Yeah.

Yeah.

They didn't really agree, but now now apparently they agree.

Of course.

So I got you on here to debate you

on the police state martial law thing, but then I actually heard what you had to say.

I overall agree with you.

But

that's all my intel.

And I predicted this.

I said, they're going to say Melania was a hooker for Epstein, which they already recycled eight years ago.

And they're going to put in the Jane Does that were fake.

Trump got pissed.

Because he'd already made a deal with the CIA Massad to just kind of shelve it.

They still came back and stung him in the ass with it.

He throws a fit about it because that's the deal he's got, which I'm not agreeing with that deal.

People go, Jones agrees with Trump making that deal.

Look, I've been read in on it.

Okay, let's just say people close to the president.

Because it's so many public officials, so much big stuff.

It would bring down the stock market, he believes.

I'm not saying that's the right way to go.

I said they're going to stab me in the back.

So this kind of makes things so much worse.

Alex is claiming that he's been read in on the cover-up of the Epstein files by people high up in the administration, which arguably makes him part of that cover-up.

There's information that Alex has or is pretending to have which hasn't been made public about the Epstein case, which is a giant problem.

When Alex says that people are misrepresenting his position and saying that he supports Trump's cover-up, that's kind of true.

But to add more nuance to it, Alex's position is that Trump's cover-up of the Epstein case isn't a problem for him.

He might not love it.

He might not think it's the right thing to do, but it's not enough to sway him.

He's not getting off the ship for this.

Also, it's a gigantic problem for Alex to say that he mostly agrees with Nick's position on the police state stuff.

He can't mostly agree with what Nick said unless the things that he's been saying before in all of his documentaries titled Police State were bullshit.

Then maybe.

Yep.

No, you got to listen.

They got to do it.

They're not going to do it, but they got to do it.

Because that's the one lesson that

we really should have learned from Guantanamo Bay: if you say you got to do it and you don't do it, you got to go.

No questions asked.

Sorry.

That's the whole point of you.

Yeah, especially on like

somewhat morally uncomplicated things.

Yeah, if you say you're going to do it and it's very obvious that you should do it and then you don't do it, you got to go.

Yeah.

That's it.

And you got to go quicker.

If you say, hey, you're stupid for

do this.

And if you don't make them go, then it's just never going to, it's just going to keep happening in worse ways until we get Epstein cover-ups.

Yep.

So for Alex, as is the case so much of the time when he's talking to Nick,

the fundamental question that it all comes down to is, please let me keep Trump.

Right.

Please.

Right.

I was doing so good whenever he was coming up.

He's still better than the Dems.

So please, just Nick,

stop making me look bad.

How do you quantify or how do you do this?

Because I'm not a Lesser Two Evils guy, but also...

If I'm in one ship that's only got a small leak and the other ship's sinking, I'm going to stay in the ship that's got a slow leak and isn't sunk yet.

I get to land in.

So I see the Democrats that want to put us all in jail.

They're open pedophiles.

They're open devil worshipers.

They're openly trying to bankrupt things.

They're pure evil.

They're part of the globalist operation.

Sure, they see Trump winning, so some of them are acting nice to his face, but he's fundamentally changing a lot of their systems and, you know, Bitcoin and the National Reserve and 401ks.

And, you know, just he goes on and on and on and on and overriding these federal judges and dominating them and getting a lot better appointments in.

And it would take hours to talk about the good.

I mean, it's 90 plus percent.

And I understand there's been some betrayals and the direction starting to go the wrong way.

So if it keeps going that way, you know, it gets bad.

But how do you separate that?

Because listen, I have people

not as comfortable.

He's talking about Nick Fuentez and all the stuff's going on.

That happens a lot too.

But the other thing I get is.

I get it.

I was at Barton Springs.

I went twice this weekend because my eight-year-old daughter wanted to go twice.

I don't go very often.

We We went Saturday.

She loved us.

We went back Sunday.

And I, you know, it was mob shaking hands, young, old, black, white.

But I had like five people come over and go, when are we going to get indictments?

When are we going to get this up?

And I'm like, hey, whoa, they were like, I'm not in charge.

And I get it, you know, like I said, on the street everywhere.

I even see the news max reporters and stuff saying, hey, we're getting mobbed by people, you know, demanding this stuff.

So, so

I want to try to like, you know, stop the Democrats, block them 100%, try to get good Republicans like Marjorie Taylor Green and others in, build our beachhead, support Trump where he's doing good, try to put pressure on the administration and expose bad actors where we can, where we've already had a lot of effect.

We know it has an effect.

To me,

taking the ball and going home, I'm not saying you've done that, but saying I'm done with Trump two years ago, you weren't of the Israel thing, you were right about that.

I get that.

Isn't it when it's the only thing we got?

You know,

try to then even more jump on it to like try to get it to do what we want.

I mean, it's threading the needle there, but do you get where I'm going?

Yeah, I totally understand what you're saying.

And I think I used to be more of that mindset in the very beginning in like 2017, 2018.

But look, it's been 10 years.

I used to be like you, old man.

Condescending fuck.

I've learned learning.

In the intervening 10 years, I have learned things.

It's been 10 years.

You have not.

Cut it out with this shit about Trump's going to do it.

He's going to make it work finally.

You know, here's what I keep thinking, right?

When you're in a relationship with somebody and you're kind of clinging to them, you know, and they start to pull back, what fixes the relationship?

Clinging harder.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Squeezing as tight as you can and making sure they can't go anywhere.

That makes them want to stay.

That's how you compensate.

That's what you do.

It makes sense.

And it always works.

Yeah.

I hear this metaphor that Alex makes about like, there's a boat with a big hole in it and you're in a boat with a small hole.

What do you do?

And I think it's telling that he doesn't even think that he can swim.

Yeah.

Like he needs a boat.

Yep.

He wouldn't have needed a boat, or at least his character would never have like put himself in a situation where he needs a boat.

Yep.

In 2002, 2003, he would have been like, I'm the champion swimmer.

Yeah.

You either, the choice that you're giving us is you either swim swim or you deny that the ship is sinking until your denial makes you drown.

Yeah.

That's the, that's the choice you're making.

Yeah, the thing he's describing is both ships are going to sink.

Right.

If you can't save yourself.

It's a very classic situation.

Yeah.

Yep.

So, you know, Alex really, he wants permission.

He wants permission to keep Trump around and be like, we can stay in this boat.

Sure.

And Nick is like, it's been 10 years, man.

Got to go.

This guy sucks.

Yeah.

He sucks.

sucks.

In the first term, we didn't get a wall, so we got 10 million illegals four years later.

In the first term, Trump made the vaccine, and then we got the vaccine mandate.

It's like this stuff keeps happening.

And my kind of game theory is to say doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result is insane.

You know, if we keep doing these things and the chance of them succeeding is zero, let's just try something else.

That's why I have always been a proponent of saying, let's just stay home.

Let's have a protest candidate.

Let's run somebody like you.

Let me stop you.

Let's run somebody.

Let me stop here right there.

And I want you to finish up and elaborate.

I just want to say,

I totally agree with you.

And let's talk about this briefly.

We really saw this

because I've been online a long time.

I can tell the groups.

I can go check it.

We know.

We had groups check what I already thought was true.

We had

big Pentagon bot farms, Israeli bot farms, neocon right-wing bot farms, and then the Ben Shapiros and the Mark Levins and all the usual suspects come out instantly when Israel was cranking up to try to drag us into war with Iran a few months ago and say,

you're not real MAGA,

you're imposters, and you're pro-Islam and you're really leftist.

And I immediately saw them flag all our accounts.

I saw our traffic get driven down, which bounced back up because people saw through it.

And I saw the attack

calling me and you and everybody else these traitors.

And they can say, oh, Foynes is really a liberal.

Foyentez is really CIA.

I don't believe that.

But I can tell you this, this guy 100%

isn't because I know me.

I know my mama and daddy.

Okay.

And so the same people doing that to him were doing it to me.

I'm not talking about Tucker and people now.

That's why it was weird to have them come in later.

This was the bad guys.

And Trump, don't be a panicking and all this stuff.

Hey, buddy, we're holding your feet to the firing.

We are demanding.

We are telling you what to do and we are in a charging, not a panicking.

We brought you in.

Populism is happening all over the world, 1776 worldwide.

And I said

many times they would say, you're a panicking.

You're a fake Trump supporter.

I'm like, listen, I'm not make America great again, bitch.

I supported that idea and that movement.

I am 1776 against the tyrants.

I am revolution against tyranny.

I am freedom here and worldwide.

I am America.

All right.

I am the challenge.

I've been on there 31 years, and we are credited by the sociologists and the mainstream Democrats in the textbooks.

That's why they hate me.

Ron Paul and Alex Jones, our listeners and viewers, we're just focal point.

went in and took over Dick Army's tea party in the late 90s, okay?

It happened.

We took it over.

So Alex said that he agrees with Nick, and if that's the case, then what he's agreeing to is that Trump sucks, the revolution was a dud, and that they need to do something else, like throw their support behind a protest candidate.

And that's bullshit because Trump was a protest candidate.

This whole thing is the result of a protest candidate.

Don't even.

Again, you can see that something changed for him around the time of the Iran attack.

I feel like that's a critical moment for the path that he's on now, veering off into this Nazi

but I don't think that he's fully made peace yet with what he's doing.

This feels like him talking through the beats and seeking the approval of a cool, edgy child, but he doesn't have the courage to walk this path on his own yet, and he probably never will.

Alex is too old for this shit, and you can't really just decide that you're a Nazi, but you also still believe all the things that you used to pretend to 30 years into your career.

Yeah.

It just doesn't work because it comes off as disingenuous.

And what do you have to offer that Nick doesn't?

Like, what possible thing could you lure his audience over with if you started to sound more like him?

When Stephen Molyneux was like, oh, I'm a white nationalist, that was a revelation of all the things that he is realizing about himself in the past.

Not him being like, now I'm a white nationalist.

Right.

In the same way, if Alex just goes like, I'm a Nazi,

that would be a better resolution to his expression of himself.

Yeah, and look,

it's been a while since I've revisited Molyneux and his work and shit.

But at least the way it was presented in that documentary, it was plausible that he was like, ah, shit, I am a racist.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

It was a realization.

It wasn't.

Yeah, possible.

It could also be something that he scripted as a PR move.

That's possible, too.

But what he was trying to sell was that, regardless of whether or not it was genuine.

He's Stephen Molyneux.

Everything he does is a lie.

You know, I don't give a shit.

Exactly.

That's a lie.

But I don't think that Alex could sell that.

I don't think that he could have a revelation moment of this stuff because I think he would want to hold on to too much of like his larger mythology, even as he moves it over to be like, yeah, Globalist does mean Jewish.

Well, the other side of that, though, is his revelation would be like, I worked for the devil the whole time.

Ah, shit.

That would require him going away for a while, I think.

yeah.

So, the retelling of the taking over of the Tea Party, I really think that that highlights the emptiness of Alex's ideology.

What did Ron Paul and the Tea Party stand for, if not limited government?

What is it saying about Alex that he could take over a movement like that and somehow steer it into a place where he's agreeing with a pro-police state Nazi statist who wants a larger federal government?

Sure.

Like, how is this possible?

You have to understand that you subverted that.

Yeah.

Like, the Tea Party was an authentic small government.

So what we did was we took over the mob, and it turns out you can't just control the mob.

The mob is crazy.

But also, the mob was going to the left.

Sure.

And then I veered them to the right.

There you go.

That's one way to do it.

And I'm pretending we're still on the same trajectory that we once were.

Right.

So Alex is like, man, man, I'm not an occult.

I'm not MAGA.

No.

I'm a a little MAGA.

Nick.

I'm in a cult.

Nick.

Come on.

I'm not an occult.

I'm an occult.

I'm an occult.

Come on.

I'm an occult.

I'm cool.

Okay.

But, can I please keep Trump?

No.

I want 1776 worldwide, which is happening.

And so MAGA is some little thing.

It's not like I'm some guy in junior high that wants to be in the cool kid class, and I run for school president, and I'm kissing everybody's ass and going to Toastmasters so I know how to properly fold a napkin.

I'm exactly what you did in Pacific.

I'm the globalist.

I'm here to deliver war on their ass with the truth.

I am here to overturn them.

I am here to politically, nonviolently burn them down.

And so I get where you're coming from, Nick, to be to be pro-Trump, get in the system, have them persecute you, kick you out because you wouldn't submit to Israel worship.

To me, it's the same thing.

You try to make me engage in Trump worship.

It triggers me.

I just want to be careful that I don't get too emotional over that and then not continue because some Trump supporters are more sophisticated than Democrats, but Trump's not a cult, but they want to be in a cult.

I want to nicely try to explain to them so they don't, you know, get mad because they think anything coming out of the administration came out of Trump and 55 trillion D beyond God chess.

Okay.

All right.

I mean, I mean, they could, they, you know, get in the toilet when Trump takes a shit and read, read the entrails, you know, like tea leaves to see the future.

I mean, they would worship Trump's shit.

So, so my deal is I know the real world, and I know, here's what I'm meant to say.

I worship Trump

like you do, but

here's the key.

They didn't have all those bots ready, day one, to attack us all with talking points and a massive concert even corporate media attack because we're weak.

It's because we're strong, all of us, the people watching.

And they had to come in there and do that because they're scared of Trump space.

So all I'm saying is don't give up to everybody.

Don't walk away.

Be critical.

Support what's good.

And also be very vocal on what's wrong because that's what the globalists, I mean, the whole BlackRock Pentagon, Israel,

the whole blob wants that.

And I'm just saying support the areas of good things we're getting.

So that isn't what Nick's saying at all.

Nope.

This is just Alex begging Nick to sign off on him continuing to support Trump.

He knows where the wind is blowing and that there's no real place for an Alex in the new media world.

He can't be as media trained and socially acceptable as someone like Charlie Kirk, and he can't be free to say the kinds of things that Nick can.

In the old media environment, that middle position he held was a huge advantage to him, and it kind of made his content the best of both worlds.

But now it's become the worst of both, and I think it's Alex's own fault.

Yep.

I think that the number one driver of this flip is the erosion of any semblance of political correctness.

When political correctness imposed a small amount of social pressure for bigots to speak in code, you had a plausible reason to speak in code, even if you were a true believer.

If you were a Nazi, you could watch Infowars and tell yourself that Alex was,

if he was really free to speak his mind, he'd say Jewish instead of globalist, but he has to speak in code or else he'd be dead.

Political correctness may have been annoying, but it was also the shield that protected Alex from having to put his big boy pants on and say what he means.

Right.

Those excuses are gone now, and Alex is getting dressed.

And you can see the big boy pants that he's putting on.

They have a swastika on them and they don't fit.

Yeah.

Like, this is just stupid.

Yeah.

He's the victim of his own crushing of

political correctness.

No.

Had the system of political correctness stayed more or less intact, intact, Nick wouldn't be here.

Right.

No, the irony, of course, is that they dismantled political correctness, which was the only thing that kept them going.

But the other irony is that political correctness is what gave them their space to get stronger.

So in essence, them and political correctness worked together to bring Trump about.

Yeah.

No,

it's fascinating.

Yeah, no, I mean,

it's a whirling.

It makes sense.

You're like, oh, if things hurt people, don't hurt them with it.

But then, boy, here we are.

So maybe it didn't make that much sense.

Who knows?

So Alex asks Nick, come on, man, what's going on?

Yeah.

What's going to happen?

Look into your crystal ball.

And Nick's like, we're fucked.

Yeah.

You know, you always ask me, what's the play?

What's the next move?

I think the next three years, to be honest with you, are cooked.

And I know you're in it to win it.

I know you're pushing Trump.

And I know you know people in the administration.

But you know what I think about?

I think about how Mark Levin had lunch with Trump a week before the war in Iran.

I think about how Laurel Loomer enjoys like unlimited access to the president.

Darren Beatty has a job at the State Department.

Darren Beatty runs Revolver.

Why does Alex Jones not get invited to have lunch with the president?

I'm sure you probably could if you push for it.

And I know you know people in the White House, but it's like the real Patriots don't have a seat at the table.

Like the neocons do.

Susie Wiles and these other people that are inside the administration, they weren't loyal to Trump throughout.

You know, Trump's campaign manager on January 6th was saying, you know, this guy needs to be put in jail.

For what it's worth, Tucker had his text messages published and said, I hate Trump.

I can't wait until he's gone.

Why is it that people that are disloyal have access, but the people that were loyal and are loyal to the movement have no access and seem to have very little influence over the president?

So for me, it's like if I don't have a seat at the table, I'm going to flip the table over.

And if you don't want that, then give me a seat at the damn table.

Well, that would be like the nickname.

Absolutely.

Freedom is not given.

It's demanded, enforced.

So Tucker is disloyal on the surface, but he's ultimately perfectly loyal.

And this is the trick that Nick either hasn't figured out yet or doesn't know how to call out.

The reason that people can work with Tucker and like all these people despite their past disloyalty is because everyone involved knows they're playing a game and that they're invested in that game continuing.

Tucker will shift his branding over time, but he'll always be the guy who really wants to sell you an anti-woke, smokeless tobacco pouch.

The bottom line is more important than the headline, and you can count on that even if someone has been a dick to you in the past.

These people don't want to deal with Nick because he isn't playing the same game.

Like Alex, he's an unreliable scene partner.

The main things that have given him relevance in the national scene are instances where he fucked someone over and attacked them from the right in order to advance his own personal brand, like the case of his war against Turning Point USA or the abandonment of Trump and his support of Ye running for president.

Right.

These were things that were opportunistic and arguably principled on Nick's part, but they came at other people's expense.

This is what Alex was trying to teach Nick in the past, how to play a little bit of ball.

But Alex isn't really that great at playing ball.

So he could only give Nick the advice to be a little less obvious about the Nazi stuff, and then maybe he could get more big bookings, like on Tucker's show.

But he doesn't want to play that game.

Nope.

It's very clear.

Yep.

And now Alex is the roles have reversed.

Yeah, the only thing that the game has is the ability to say who gets to play it.

That's what the game, that's the power of the game.

That's what they all know.

If somebody shows up at the game that they didn't invite and is allowed to be a part of it, they're all fucked.

Right.

They all rely on each other to be scene partners in this facade.

It's a team sport.

Yeah.

Like, how long would Steven Crowder's show last if he was having actual conversations with people who weren't lackeys?

Right.

Like, it'd be absurd.

Yeah.

So, like, they,

you know, as a microcosm, so many of these media things rely on that.

Yeah.

That surrounded show wouldn't work if all of the people who were in the 20 seats around the one person weren't YouTube creators.

I was just thinking that exact same.

I was just thinking of that exact same thing of like, this is all bullshit.

Everybody knows

that's the idea.

And if you are somebody who people worry will penetrate that wall of bullshit,

then you're dangerous.

Yeah.

Because that

is what will hurt them.

The only way the illusion works is if it's complete.

If there's a little hole or if you see the cat two times in the fucking matrix or whatever, the illusion's busted and you lose.

Yeah.

And like Alex is a really risky scene partner, but him and Rogan are friends.

Right.

And so that was fine for Rogan to do.

And there's drugs involved.

So it's like, eh, well, did he even really say anything?

Right.

Yeah.

It's perfectly doable.

Yep.

And then there's a risk reward that Alex represented for some people.

Yep.

Tucker decided to take a chance on it.

It's just not, it's not as worthwhile for them anymore.

Nope.

And Nick is not that.

He's not somebody who's

had a 20-year friendship with the biggest podcaster in the world.

Nope.

He's not somebody who these folks really think they could take a chance on.

Alex

was Tucker's guest in Pennsylvania

because

he could get something out of that.

That's why he did that.

Nick would never be that.

And you invite Nick to that fucking thing as a guest, you're going to end up with the audience turning on you.

Yeah.

That's yeah.

And he, because he's got an actual real chip on his shoulder that you can't compete with, you

fucking fat

water

like this.

These people are just so rich.

They're just so fucking rich.

That is a part of it.

You know, that's why you can be like, ah, he's a little gay kid in Chicago in his parents' basement.

It's like, you're just so rich.

Who fucking cares what you say, really?

You know?

Even if you lose your game, you're still going to be fucking rich.

Yeah.

You just don't get to have fun like you used to.

And there has been no point in Tucker's life when that has not been the case.

Right.

And to be fair, I mean, like, Nick's not rich.

Like,

he's doing fine.

Sure.

And always has been.

Sure, sure, sure, sure.

But, like, not on the same level.

You know,

it's not too dissimilar to you're funnier when you ride the bus.

You know, like, you're, as a comic, you're going to be at your hungriest, at your like most technical when you're not rich as shit.

Yeah.

And you're scarier when you're not beholden to games and advertisers.

If I don't know what you're going to do, you have a huge advantage.

Yep.

Yep.

And I think that's one of the things that Alex didn't realize is that over time, people started to figure out like, oh, this is what we kind of can expect from him.

Yep.

And he is less of a dangerous quantity.

He can be on Tucker's show because he's just going to say his catchphrases and go like, 17, 76, bra.

Yep.

You know, who cares?

Yep.

It's not risky.

Anyway,

Trump, remember a couple episodes ago, I think, Alex was saying that people from the administration were calling him and being like, what do you want?

What do you want?

I do recall that.

And you thought that that sounded a lot like a bribe, like an offer of a bribe.

Okay, so if somebody asks you what you would like to do something, right?

And that something is avoid something,

And that something would be against you.

I would describe that as a bribe.

Okay.

Well, Alex disagrees.

Okay.

And he talks about this.

And it kind of sounds like what he's describing is bribe stuff.

Okay.

And they tried to spin it that I was offered to be bribed.

And I guess I was too simplistic about it.

No, when I was criticizing, you know, Trump and the Epstein thing, I got White House calls saying, we think you're right.

We don't know why he's doing this.

There's no evidence he gets really mad.

What do you want?

Like, what do you want us to do?

It wasn't like, oh, we'll give you a bag of money.

It was like, like What do you want?

What do you think we should do?

But it was also like what do you want you want, you know So you know a little bit of the banana.

Oh, there's a bag of money here, but nobody offered me bribe me.

That's what they do.

Oh, that's weird.

It would be very it would be poor bribe form

To say how can I bribe you to stop this?

Mm-hmm.

That's poor bribing sure you got to be very circumspect.

Yeah, and the way Alex is describing this is way too close to a bag of money.

Yeah, how much money would you like to stop talking about?

Yeah, he's like, it's not not that.

There's a little bit of that.

So they were asking, What do I need to do?

And then, but I mean, they were also saying we won't give you big money, money.

But I mean, like, it was more about what do we do.

Yeah, yeah, I also just watched The Mask the other day, and there's some good bags of money.

I love it with the big money sign.

Oh, God, I love a good bag of money.

Yep, it's a burlap sack, perfectly executed, pre-blue die packs.

Those were the glory days of Bank Robin.

Yeah, so you got one last clip here, and it's uh, how Alex ends this interview Just sad.

All right.

Nick Jay Fuentez on Rumble.

Again, they say I can play the clips, even new ones at universities.

Whites are all evil.

White Christians are all evil.

The ADL is funding it.

So you can't be mad at Nick saying then, you know, the ADL is bad and giving their own medicine back.

And that's why the rules have changed.

I don't want to go down this road.

It's the globalists that brought us here.

Nick Fuentez, thank you so much.

Thank you for having me.

Well, that was a good debate discussion.

And I keep trying to debate him, but I overall, he has arguments.

What a worm.

And I don't.

Alex thinks the ADL is too mean to white people, so apparently no one can have complaints about Nick being a Nazi.

This is kindergarten stuff.

And like Alex is saying, oh, you can't be mad at Nick having criticisms of the ADL.

That's not what he does.

That's not what his stance is.

You know, I was just thinking about the whole Nazis.

I was thinking, you know what?

It takes two to tango.

Right.

Is it really the Nazis who we should be mad at?

Isn't it the two parties together?

Who started what?

Who knows?

Yeah.

You know what?

It's not about the past.

It's about the future.

We need to start from here with us having all the power and you having none.

I don't see why that's a problem.

Neither does Nick.

See, it's great.

Alex keeps wanting to debate Nick, but he keeps forgetting that Nick has arguments.

That's fucked up.

Yeah.

He keeps forgetting that he doesn't have arguments and that actually he kind of agrees with Nick.

Right.

And so he goes into these things thinking he's going to disagree.

Yeah.

And then Nick can back back up his points.

He's not rattled by Alex's dumb bullshit.

I hate doing it again, but it's like Drake was like, no, I can totally do a diss track.

We'll just do a thing.

I'll have my thing.

He'll have his thing.

We'll both get extremely popular.

And then that'll be a thing.

But he forgot that he was a shitty rapper and Kendrick is the best.

That sucks.

Alex is doing the exact same.

I'm pretty good at debating.

And then he's like, oh, shit, I don't know anything.

But here's the problem.

Yeah.

We are at a point here, at at least in the context of this episode,

where Drake and Kendrick are coexisting.

Sure.

They are not fighting with each other.

This is pre-not like us.

This is like fucking problems.

They're on the same track.

Right.

You know, like they're coexisting.

Yeah.

They haven't gone at each other.

But when that does happen, if that ever should happen,

Alex is going to get eaten.

Yeah.

Like,

Nick is just going to dance circles around him.

The Super Bowl crowd is going to sing along.

Yes.

Nick is going to get invited to sing at the Super Bowl.

Yep.

Insult Alex at the halftime.

Yep.

It will be that big.

I mean, Alex would be thrilled for the pub.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It works out for him.

Yeah.

I mean, it sucks because

it is one of those things of like, only an idiot would debate Fuentes because if you're smart and you have the arguments back and forth, you'll realize that there's no point to this.

No.

It's going to be, it's either going to be like a, okay, you go your way and I'll go my way, or it's going to be a waste of everybody's time.

I think an argument could be made to having a debate with him sometime in the past, like years ago, maybe, but now, definitely not.

It doesn't make any sense.

Right.

But that means that he only ever talks to idiots, and that makes him look like he's not an idiot.

Right.

When

if he were forced to go up against somebody in a good faith, actual conversation, he's an idiot.

Like, this is the problem.

Yes, and no.

I mean, he's not as stupid as,

like, maybe you'd want.

But, like, yeah,

it's a very artificial

veneer of competence and intelligence because he's hanging out with me.

He's only ever going to mess.

Yeah, it's not hard.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So,

look, I think this is a mess.

Yep.

I think that Alex, a lot of the things that he's saying in the context of this episode are like, hey, look,

it's just fucking anti-Semite time.

This is the way that things are going.

I feel like there's a capitulation that Alex is expressing.

Yeah.

I think that towards the end, he couldn't even keep up his, like, I want to keep Trump.

Yeah.

He started to sound a bit mad and like, nah, fuck it.

Nick's right.

Yeah.

No, he's not.

I've got to leave this boat.

He's like the corporations.

You know, he's like, oh, well, you know, a while back we used to push back, but now I guess we'll just do whatever we're told.

Yeah.

You know?

And,

yeah, that's not great.

That's not great.

It's bad timing for him.

Yep.

Certainly the liquidation is going to add some pressure.

Sure.

But

sucks to be them.

So I guess Alex is now going to, I think he's probably going to want to still maintain his, like, Trump's martial law is pretty cool.

Sure.

It's fine.

But I really don't think he had a good rebuttal to Nick at all.

No.

On the we should have martial law, just not now because of the Zog.

Yeah.

Yeah, that's an insane, because that's an insane thing to say.

Yeah.

To even think that that's not an insane thing to say is only possible because you're surrounded by people like Alex Jones.

Yeah, and it's ironic because the last place you should be able to say it is InfoWars.

Right.

Oh, well.

All of this is maddening.

What a bunch of dumb fucking idiots.

What a bunch of dumb fucking idiots.

So we'll be back to check in on more idiocy.

Indeed.

But until then, we have a website.

Indeed, we do.

It's knowledgefight.com.

Yep.

You can get tickets.

You can get the tickets.

They'll be in the description on Monday.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Well, the tickets go live will be there now.

Right.

But yeah.

And I think there's even a countdown, so when you click on the link, it'll be like, oh, you have have two hours until, you know, very exciting.

I love it.

Anyway, we'll be back.

But until then, I'm Neo.

I'm Leo.

I'm DZX Clark.

I am the Mysterious Professor.

Woo, yeah, woo, yeah, woo.

And now here comes the sex robot.

Andy in Kansas, you're on the air.

Thanks for holding.

Hello, Alex.

I'm a first-time caller.

I'm a huge fan.

I love your work.

I love you.