How Rosanna Pansino Overcame Dyslexia, Risked Everything, and Built a YouTube Empire | E95

Wow, this show is going to be incredible. So buckle up, and I'm sure you're going to enjoy it.
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Plus, it really, really helps me continue to bring amazing guests, okay? So let's dive in. How do you sustain being a digital creator when the average lifespan of a YouTuber or influencer online is three to four years? Rosanna Pansino, a YouTuber, entrepreneur, from overcoming this dyslexia and ADHD to becoming one of YouTube's highest paid creators.
Reading and writing was really difficult for me. Teachers didn't know what to call it then and they just thought I was slow, I was dumb.
It kind of messed with my self-esteem, I would say. I used to bake with my grandma all the time and that was really the way that I showed love for my friends, because I couldn't afford a big fancy gift for like their birthdays.
I didn't receive a check for YouTube for probably a year or two. I didn't even think that this would be a career path for me.
I stumbled into it and I went all in.

I took all of my savings.

I took a big risk, changed my life.

How do you look at the algorithms?

How are they changing?

How are you trying to adapt to them?

What's really important is that you make. Rosanna Pansino, a YouTuber, entrepreneur, author.
She's the creator of Nerdy Nummies. I love that.
The YouTube hit baking show with over 14 million subscribers. Like, come on, Rosanna, that's amazing.
And she has multiple best-selling cookbooks and things. And we'll talk about all your ventures.
But really, from overcoming this dyslexia and ADHD to becoming one of YouTube's highest-paid creators, and now multiple businesses and endeavors, it's really an inspiring story. So first of all, thank you for being on the show, Rosanna.
Thank you for having me. I'm really excited.
And I love nerding out and talking about this because it's not often where I get the chance to like, kick back and reflect on these things. And it's really meaningful because it's like, wow, so much has happened in the last 10 years.
And then you don't really notice it until you take a step back and look at everything and go, hmm, there's a lot going on here. And I love what you said, because as high achievers, we're always moving the goalpost.
It's so rare that we actually look back and we're like, oh, my God, look what I created. But take us back as a kid, Seattle.
How did you grow up? I grew up in Seattle with my mom, my dad, and my little sister. We're very close.
We still are today. My dad passed, but my mom and I are very close.
She moved in with me. So she's my roommate now.
And my sister actually moved right next door. So we're neighbors.
And we work together full-time. We've been working together now for over a decade running my businesses.
So she's just very analytical. So she's a great fit for me.
My little sister, she's into data. She has that beautiful, tedious mind that I don't have.
She's so good at that. And we compliment each other that way.
And growing up, we didn't have a lot of money. So I definitely learned a strong work ethic from a young age.
As soon as I was legally allowed to have a job, I had a job and I was working in the state of Washington. You could work if you were 15 years old, if you had a note from your parents.
Otherwise, was 16 years old. So I was waitressing on and off for about eight years and I had plenty of other oddball jobs.
But in Seattle, I liked learning. I'm very curious, but school was really difficult for me because I noticed that I didn't process information the same as my peers.
Reading and writing was really difficult for me. And I learned later in college when I was diagnosed with dyslexia that that was it.
So, but then I just thought I was slow and teachers didn't know what to call it then. And they just thought I was slow.
I was dumb. And I heard that language a lot.
And it kind of messed with my self-esteem, I would say. But then also a year, I could not understand why I could barely read and write.
I mean, it was really a struggle. I could do it, but it would just take a lot of time.
But then I was in an AP advanced calculus class. Riddle me that.
That was my position where I just didn't understand where I fit in and I didn't understand what was going on. I just thought part of my brain didn't work or something.
But then later on in life, you grow and you realize that standardized school systems were not. Just not the right thing for everybody.
And I love that. And we chatted a little bit about Richard Branson right before you joined.
We have an amazing episode with him. So listeners, if you haven't checked it out, listen to the podcast with Richard Branson.
He is a classic speaker about dyslexic thinkers. And it sounds like we both love him, Rosanna.
He's such an inspiring role model. But you started, I think, cooking with or baking with your grandma.

So there was a baking element.

Talk to me a little bit about that.

Basically, growing up, because we didn't have a lot of money, we would choose from basically

what my parents called functional hobbies.

You know, they were hobbies.

You could be creative, but they were also helping the family.

So that was gardening, cooking, baking, or sewing. I love the name, by the way, Functional.
And I mean, I liked all of those things. I was very much a homebody because we didn't have a lot of money to go out.
So I enjoyed all of those things, but I think I liked baking the most because I had a sweet tooth. So I used to bake with my grandma all the time.
And that was really the way that I showed love for my friends. That was my gift to them because I couldn't afford a big fancy gift for like their birthdays.
So I would bake them their favorite cookies or their favorite cake. And that was my way to express love through food because sugar and flour, especially back then, pretty cheap.
I mean, you could get very cheap sugar and flour. So it was a very affordable gift to give to somebody.
Oh my God. I love that.
But you have no clue it's going to become a career, obviously. No, no one's here.
It was just a fun thing, right? Yeah. Just went to school, got through college, which was rough, but I did it.
I learned so much. And, you know, YouTube didn't even exist when I was going to high school.
I didn't even think that this would be a career path for me. I stumbled into it as some friends were doing it, and they thought it would be a good creative outlet for me.
They thought I would enjoy it. So I thought, well, let's just give it a go and have some fun.
So before that, because that was amazing. So you're finishing college.
And if I know correctly, you're not really sure what to do next. So take us there, because I think also when I'm looking at a lot of the people in our audience, a lot of them are right now, there's just so many opportunities.
So it's like, I don't even know what's on the menu and what do I want to do next in my career. So did that scare you? Where did that catch you right after college? I'm a very curious person, I've realized.
And I was interested in so many different fields. And I think my best advice to people would be just try everything.
There's no harm in it to see if you really love it.

I thought I wanted to be a journalist.

So I volunteered, you know, I interned at one of Seattle's top news stations.

And I learned being dyslexic that writing releases on the fly is not for me.

That is not my pacing.

That was not made for me.

Even though I enjoyed how fast paced it was, I liked the energy of it.

Thank you. releases on the fly is not for me.
That is not my pacing. That was not made for me.
Even though I enjoyed how fast paced it was, I liked the energy of it. It just wasn't a great fit for my skillset.
And it often left me feeling frustrated and dumb. And I would have all this negative self-talk about it.
So there was elements that I loved of journalism, like the deep dives. I think documentary style is more my speed to explore stories and get to know people on a deeper level.
I think that that is something I really enjoyed, but I've learned something from each failure. So I worked so many different jobs.
I failed at all of them. No one ever fired me, which nowadays I learned is called the personality hire.
So I basically was a personality hire in many of these situations. But it didn't, at the end of the day, I didn't feel good.
You know, you go home every day and you hear all the time of how many mistakes you're making and how much you're messing up. And I just felt like I didn't fit in anywhere.
And that was rough. And that sounds interesting because it sounds really rough, but it also sounds like later and we'll show it, it sounds like you picked the best pieces and you actually stitched them together to what you're doing now, which is fascinating.
But you decide to move to LA. First of all, why? And what did that do for you? I was working a bunch of jobs in Seattle, a bunch of random jobs after I graduated college.
I taught English in China for a little bit, random program. I was a dog sitter.
I was a church secretary. I was a waitress, a go-go dancer.
I mean, you name it, I've done it. A go-go dancer? I need to hear what that is.
You just like stand on a platform and basically two-step. Like it's not, well, for where I worked, it wasn't very risque.
It was so funny. It was, yeah, my girlfriend owned a bar and I tried to be a bartender.
I got my bartending license in the two weeks training and I was awful at it. I couldn't remember one drink order.
I couldn't remember any of the combinations. And they had a go-go dancer who had gotten in a fight and quit.
And she was like, well, look, Ro, you can't be a bartender, but you can try to be a go-go. And I said, okay, well, let's do it.
I just basically said yes to everything. I tried everything and I just was looking for a home.
And I got a call from an agent in California and they said, I was also a part of this Star Trek's largest fan fiction series that was being made in Seattle and it aired on TV. And I was a PA on the set and one of their actors quit.
So they put me in there. So that was my first little acting role.
And an agent saw it and said, if you move to California, I would take here as a client. And I was like, what? And they were like, we think you're good at this.
And I was like, I have not heard that. Oh my God.
That's so cool. What year is this? That was, oh my gosh.
I'll have to look it up. A hundred years ago.
No, I'm not. Okay.
But I have a picture from it too. I could probably send you as well.
I would love that. I played Ensign Kelly, who was a love interest of sick bay, the doctor.
So that was really fun. And so I moved here and I took, again, every oddball job I could get in entertainment to just get more experience being on sets, behind the camera, in front of the camera, really everything to, again, figure out where the best place was for me.
I didn't know if maybe one day I'd want to direct or one day I'd want to produce or if acting was for me. I just didn't know.
I think it was just all new and fresh and exciting and I wanted to figure it out. And that's when I met some friends while working on some sets who are also creating YouTube content.
And I was like, what's YouTube? What is this? I've never heard of it. And they said, it's digital media.
It's this new video hosting site where you can post your own videos. They just rolled out a YouTube partnership program.
So you can earn an income doing this. And it was really had just started, just emerged.
And it was exciting and new and no one knew where this was going to go. So I started creating content on YouTube just for fun, to get more comfortable in front of the camera, to learn about lighting, camera angles, equipment, because I'm learning about all this stuff on sets that I'm working on.
And I'm like, this is so fun and cool. And I was just vlogging my everyday life.
I vlogged doing an earth cleanup day with my sister. That was my very first video on YouTube.
We were just kayaking down the Duwamish River, picking up trash out of the river for Earth Day. I vlogged going to flight school.
I vlogged, God, just random stuff. And then one day, we were having friends over for an E3 party.
We have a lot of gamer nerdy friends. And I thought, let's make a themed cake because I love to bake.
So I thought, let's make a Mario star cake. I'll make little one up mushroom cupcakes.
And we decided to film it. And that was my very first quote unquote nerdy nummies.
And after I upload that video, the internet went on fire. I don't know what happened, but everybody, the whole community was like, we want more of this.
And it was the first time that the online community, I had ever gotten that response. And they just, hundreds of people were writing me and said, no geeky baking show exists online or on television.
We need it. We want more of this.
So every week I would just keep asking my community, all right, well, what do you want me to make this week? We couldn't do polls back then. They didn't have that feature.
So I would just actually look through the comments and see what people wanted the most. And right now you're still not with a fancy camera or anything.
You're still with what, a flip phone? Like how do you do all these? Oh, now I use a really pretty Canon. No, not now.
Now I use a really pretty Canon. But back then my first was this really cheap, oh, I think my mom got it for me for Christmas.
It was an $80 flip camera where I'm not sure what the resolution was, maybe 720, 480. And I was like, whoa, fancy.
Like, this is high def. Back then, that was.
So, I mean, how funny. And I learned as I went.
And I think the scariest moment was when I realized that the time I put into it, I was getting results. My community was growing and financially things were returning on investment.
So the more hours I was putting in was returning on investment. And that clicked in my brain because I had never thought to be an entrepreneur ever until that moment.
That is where I went, wait a minute, I can do this. I understand this.
I can do this. And I went all in.
I jumped all in. I took all of my savings.
I took a big risk. I bought better equipment.
I hired an editor because that was my bottleneck. And I think the agents at that point didn't understand what you're doing.
For them, that was like, why are you not focusing on TV and other things? Am I right, Rosanna? That is completely correct. I was making YouTube videos simultaneously while working on sets.
I was working on the set of Glee full-time at this time as a union dancer. So I was like a union cheerio cheerleader.
And I was auditioning a lot. I had booked two speaking roles pretty quickly.
So I'm not like a Meryl Streep, but for just getting started, I was already working full-time and I had full health benefits because I was on so many union shows.

So that stability is something that just in entertainment, a lot of actors just crave.

And that was my goal was to be a full time someone working in entertainment so I wouldn't

have to waitress or anything.

And I didn't.

That goal was achieved.

I didn't have to do any other side jobs.

I was just doing entertainment gigs.

So the YouTube was paying the rent and giving some stability, and then this was giving another set of stability? Is that how you saw it? I didn't receive a check for YouTube for probably a year or two because there was a threshold. And I don't know what their threshold is today.

I'm pretty sure they do have a threshold still. But I heard it's a lot more lenient now than when it was when I started.
So I was creating content online, and I could see the community growing, views growing, and financial opportunity because of the numbers. But I hadn't hit the threshold yet.
but I knew it was headed there. I could feel it.
And that's where I didn't tell my dad. That's where I didn't tell my parents that, hey, dad, remember how I saved 10% of my paycheck my entire life? Like, what's that nest egg? And instead of buying a down payment on a home that I've worked my whole life for, I'm going to throw it all into this YouTube channel.
But nobody knows what it is. Nobody knows what it is.
Or, you know, we didn't know. It was just, I had just a really good feeling.
The fact that you had that hunch is in that conviction. That was amazing.
So tell me about the day that you decided, okay, I'm going all in. Do I want the stability and the comfort or am I like leaping into this unknown world? Yeah, I would say that I made the decision, but really my agents at the time, I think that they guided it and they kind of made it for me because they sat me down for a meeting and they gave me an ultimatum in person.
This was a time where new media was really scaring traditional media at the time because it was rising and they were like, what's going to happen? We don't know. And I was like, it's going to be fine.
You guys are still going to be making all the shows. Just distribution is going to change.
And no one was listening to me. It was like, like they just couldn't see that.
And everyone was all up in arms and they just said, you need to pick a lane. You can either keep working in traditional or new media.
And you can't have both. And I said it was short-sighted.
I thought they were being silly. I begged them to just look in the future.
Because I said, I think these things are going to complement each other. I think it's a great tool.
I told them the only commercial I had booked that year, this big Sony project was because the casting director's daughter liked my YouTube channel. So she felt really familiar with my content and how I would perform.
So I was like, see, it's a huge asset. This is a tool.
These are working together. This is a beautiful thing.
And they still... They couldn't see it.
Yeah. They made the decision for me.

So two weeks after that meeting, I got a letter in the mail, a letter typed, signed that they dumped me from the agency.

I meant to ask this at the end, but did you ever go back to them and say, you know, kind of like the pretty woman, big mistake?

Did you ever actually go back to the thing? No, but I should have. That would have been a moment.
I mean, that was the pretty woman moment, right? That was a big mistake. Huge, huge.
No, but I never talked to them again. They did reach out later wanting to do lunch and I didn't respond.
I think that I just really decided to just keep people in my life that have been supportive. And I did have a really good moment though.
I had a pretty woman moment where we were driving. I was doing this morning show on the back lot of Universal Studios and we had just wrapped and we're driving back home.
And I said, Mike, pull over. That's my boyfriend.
And we pulled over and he goes, what? And I said, I just need to take this in, this moment. And I started crying and I looked and there was the building of my old agency and right above it was this huge billboard for my YouTube original show that was coming out.
And it was just floating right above it. And I still have the video today.
And it was just this trusting my instincts. This is why you trust yourself.
This is the moment. I'll never forget that moment.
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Now back to the show. So you're starting these really basic YouTube videos.
You're seeing clearly the community loves it. It doesn't make money yet.
Now you have to make money out of it. What does that shift look like when now you need to bet everything on this thing, right? Like it better work.
So how does that shift go? That goes to living in a house with six people, a three bedroom apartment with six people and three cats. I'm sleeping on a couch and I am just in startup mode where you are just every second, you know, you're working seven days a week.
You're in starting, in buildup. And I did that for two years straight.
And then after two years is where it started to financially take off. And it became more than a part-time or full-time job.
It really became a career and then developed into a brand. And it changed my life.
And I learned so much, not just about YouTube, but about becoming an entrepreneur, like how to build a startup, the process. And I learned that building businesses is all about building systems.
You just create systems. And I'm really nerdy.
I guess I like doing that. I really enjoy this.
And I'm really curious too. So I like to figure out what wasn't working and then play and figure out, okay, if this doesn't work, then we'll figure out something that will.
So I think I just find a lot of joy in the problem solving like that. It kind excites me it feels like an adventure amazing and why the name nerdy nummies it was so funny it was either gonna be like geeky goodies because it was a lot of things that were based on like video games comics and things that were really considered people called me geeky for liking or nerdy for liking back in the day like it was nerdy back in the day if you played video games at your computer and you were into comics.
And now those things, geek very much became chic. It went more mainstream where now there's all these Marvel superhero movies.
But when I was growing up, that was not the case. And especially when YouTube was first starting, that was still not the case.
I remember this very cool time where Felicia Day, this geeky actress who I adore, she was really at this pivotal moment of where geek was becoming chic. And I just remember her face as the poster of geek becoming chic.
But in the beginning, like you said, there is no really four hour work week. And you need to put all the hats on, which I think is really, really hard for entrepreneurs.
Like I think they don't realize they come from a certain passion, but they don't realize that, wait, now I need to do also the sales and the marketing and the partnership and the editing. So take me there for a second, because I think a lot of people don't understand the magnitude of what goes in, especially in the beginning.
And then as you grow the team, that also gets really scary before it gets easier. So what was that like for you? When we first started, I would film everything myself.
So come up with a creative concept, get all the materials and supplies, actually shoot it, film everything, then be on-camera talent, and then be the editor afterwards,

and then figure out ways to market and promote it and interact with the community once it came out. So you were kind of basically a one-person production company.
And as time went on, we were able to add to this one-person production company and become a 10-person production company. and today I think there's about 10 of us and we keep it really a skeleton crew.

I enjoy working with a skeleton crew because we're all very knowledgeable at very specific things. We fill each slot perfectly.
And I don't know how to say this, but we're just like a steel iron production team. I think people would be shocked to see how much my team can get done.
We're just extremely efficient in the systems that we've made. We're able to make things that people wouldn't think we'd be able to do.
Like the cookbook, or like we've helped partner with HBO, where my production company executive produced my very first baking show with HBO, Bakedopia. Those both of our companies working together and making that.
And I think that's what I've just learned is small and mighty. It can happen.
Before that, roughly how many hours came into a show like this? How long do you think it took? Let's see. Well, before I had a culinary producer, I think I was baking and testing recipes, maybe about 60 to 70 hours a week.
I was in the kitchen doing recipe development, which is a full-time job. I learned that Martha Stewart's show and Rachel Ray, they have multiple chefs who develop recipes and produce all of those things in stages so that when you're shooting for camera, everything's laid out in stages.
So you don't have to wait for something to bake in real time when you're shooting the show. That would be a huge waste of time.
So I learned from those professional food sets how to produce food for camera and I ran with it. So I just learned what they did.
And I put together a team and we would block shoot all these recipe videos. At one point, we were seven months ahead in content.
And for YouTube, that just doesn't happen very often. And then we would do that.
And then while I had that off time, I could then start tackling new projects like cookbooks, TV shows, our baking line that was all over every Walmart store. All of these things I could do once I learned how to do block shooting.
So it was just learning the systems and then applying them. And then how did you decide to expand into what we call portfolio career, which we talked about? Like, I love it because I feel like we're the only one teaching it and you're living it.
How did you start expanding into a cookbook, into shows? How did that start happening and roughly how long after you started this whole thing? Pretty soon. So about three or four years after I started YouTube is when Project Beacon came about.
And that was a program where YouTube used to focus on uplifting and highlighting individual creators who they thought were doing something really cool in the space. Because at this time, it was known for being a free video hosting site, but it wasn't really known as a huge entertainment platform at that time.
And they were trying to really educate the public and media, traditional media, that we weren't just silly cat videos anymore, that there's people on the platform who are incredibly talented musicians, comedians, fashion gurus, makeup gurus, cooking and food gurus. They're Rachel Ray's, but we're just on YouTube versus on traditional.
And so they took a handful of people and they put us on these press tours and all over New York and they set up all these interviews. I was doing interviews at CNBC.
I was on the New York exchange stock floor. What was I doing there? And I was educating basically journalists about how YouTube works and why it's just not silly cat videos anymore.
It's really evolving and changing and entrepreneurs are flocking to YouTube because it's how you can really build businesses. It's just such a great ground to build because it was my home base.
And then from it, I built so much from it. And I really just owe my life to Susan Wajoski, a former CEO of YouTube.
She handpicked me out of a crowd of thousands and thousands and thousands. I had never even met her.
And she asked if I'd like to be a part of this program. Changed my life.
I still get emotional because I miss her so much. She just really believed in the good that YouTube could do for the world.
And she really supported creators. And she just had the same values in business that I do.
I know it's about numbers. I get it.
Business is about numbers. Everyone wants to get the good numbers and be in the good profits.
That's good business. But it's also about people.
And I just feel like Susan got that. And I just really admired her.
She was an incredible person, human, woman, all of it. And for those who don't know, she did pass away.
away it shook the entire world I think she had a really hard year that year as well with her son she was just such a light and she really changed my life I've thanked her in person many times when we got to go do these YouTube summits and they were really intimate and they would invite a hundred of the top creators to these summits and we would spend four days together. And she took the time, even though she's so busy, to spend days with us and just listen to our feedback and give us info and just collaborate.
And it was just wonderful. I learned so much from her.
I think she was just one of my guiding forces. And it was when she took an interest in me and encouraged me is when all those things changed.
And it was just one person, and I know that she was a big deal, but just one fellow female opening the door for me, that it all changed. And that's when publishers started calling my agents and wanting to do cookbooks.

And that's when large companies like Walmart wanted to do a product line. And it all changed.
People's perspectives started to change about digital creators and their influence, like influencers, this new star power. And that was Susan's initiative.
And it just showed that it worked.

It was working and I couldn't express more gratitude

than for her to bring me into that experience

because it changed my life.

Aw, and speaking of hard moments,

let's go there for a second

if you're okay with that, Rosanna.

In 2019, you had your own chair of hard years and I think we all do. It's almost like a muscle we need to go through to prove ourselves or something.
But can you share a little bit and how did you cope with all of it? How did you continue, even though everything was kind of hard? Yeah, so my dad was diagnosed with leukemia. and luckily we got six years with him, but we lost him to leukemia that year.
And at first, I was in shock. I think that that initial stage of grief, I got to speak to a leading grief expert, David Kessler about this stage.
And he says it's almost a grace where I just had to handle everything, be the rock for my family and take care of things. And it's that phase.
And then my team really, really helped me. If I was by myself, I don't think that I would have been able to continue.
It really does take a community like a village. And those systems that I set up in the business are the same systems that saved me.
Because those systems, when I wasn't emotionally okay, were already in place. And they were just steadfast and ongoing.
So if I'm having a terrible day, everything else is already taken care of. So my team really, really helped throughout that time and give me the grace that I needed when I needed to take some time, ups and downs and just be, I don't know, and very adaptive.
I think that that's the other thing is I learned that life is short. And on my mental health, it switched something and me switched where I didn't want to just be on YouTube anymore.
I wanted to really grow. I wanted to really diversify.
I wanted to spread my wings even bigger so that I could have more time with my friends and family because I could still see systems that I had created that could be more efficient and they weren't. And it was just bigger.
So YouTube up until then had been my entire life. And then I was learning how to diversify with that success in other avenues.
So like publishing, baking line, but also opening new businesses, investing in businesses, investing in even just charities, philanthropy work that fulfill me, that I am passionate about. So when I started to do all these things, and that's my biggest advice to everybody is once you get there, once the financially, you have some stability there, diversify.

Diversify, diversify, diversify as much as you can, as much as you feel comfortable,

as much as you, you know, and I diversified into low risk, medium risk, high risk, all

over so that the day-to-day pressure wasn't all on my shoulders.

If I had a bad day, if grief hit me, grief stricken, and I needed to really just go take the day to heal, I could do that. And I also learned, hey, you got to get out of startup mode.
You can't keep going like that seven days a week and have longevity to sustain. So I need to change my mindset to be more of a marathon, not a sprint.
So I started doing things

like taking care of myself. Now I sleep eight hours every night.
It's like a non-negotiable.

Well, it took you about 15 years to realize that it's important, right?

It's so important. And I apply it now.
I've been doing it for years and it's just made a huge,

even bigger difference. And I think I'm going to be working until I'm 110 or whatever.
But it's because I want to be. I'm always going to be doing projects that I enjoy that fascinate me.
That's a big part of it too. A lot of the questions I get asked this last year was sustainability.
How, how do you sustain being a digital creator when the average lifespan of a YouTuber or influencer online is three to four years? That's the average. And we've been doing it for I don't know how many years.
Michael, what year are we on? 15? 20, 25. It sounds like 15, right? I don't know, gosh, geez.
But something that's really helped is not doing burnout. Knowing what you can handle and then creating systems for everything else, taking care of yourself, eating good, exercising, getting enough sleep, and then also diversifying.
Because when you do all those things together in that combination, then you don't sweat the small stuff. The small stuff is literally small stuff.
For example, the best example I could give of this is because we're so diversified and everything, if I upload a video and it gets a million views, great. If I upload a video and gets 100,000 views, I can tinker with it.
And there's no stress and anxiety that comes with the performance and views, that analytic, because I do understand that over time, algorithms change, they're always changing, there's different metrics we need to meet. So what it does is it allows me to, if I see something that needs improving, then I have the time and the space and the freedom to really tinker with it, play with it, see what I want to do to fix it.
Versus there's a lot of, especially youth who are entering being content creators and all they're doing is their one YouTube channel or their one TikTok and that's their one focus and there's nothing else.

And so all that matters to them is views,

views, views, views, views.

And they get so stuck on it and they get so anxious

and so stressed and have burnout.

And it's singular focused and they really can't step back

and see a bigger picture.

And that is just my biggest advice to every content creator, every entrepreneur out there is as soon as you're able to get out of startup mode and step back, do it and build systems and do diversifying because then you will laugh. I mean, now when I upload a video, it performs well.
I'm like, wonderful, noted. And if I upload a video and it is performing a little

less, I go, let's take notes. Let's go tinker.
And there's no stress. It's just all fun.
But on the other hand, the algorithms move so fast and it's so hard to catch up. And it seems like if you're not paying, you're really not going to be paid attention and you're running into this full cycle, full gas and neutral.

So how do you look at the algorithms? How are they changing? How are you trying to adapt to them? Talk to us a little bit about it. YouTube's algorithm, it used to focus more on uplifting individual creators as a whole.
And now it's really focused on individual videos and very strict metrics that you've got to hit. So each video, it's got to meet these metrics or it won't get sent out in the algorithm.
And it's much more strict. And what I would also suggest to people, if they're creating content and they realize that it's not performing well on one platform, go post it on another platform.
I'm telling you, play, explore, get into it because I'll upload a video like on YouTube. It'll get a million views.
I'll upload it the same video, maybe on Facebook, get 20 million views. So the algorithms on each platform are different.
And I think what's really important is that you make content that you enjoy and that's authentically you and it's yourself and more of what you want. And then even play with the algorithm, see which platform is the best fit for your content because they're all different.
For example, if you go on a live stream on Instagram or even YouTube, the longer I'm on the live stream on those platforms, my viewers will rush in. I'll have the maximum watch time right up front and then they'll slowly trickle off.
But TikTok's algorithm is just the opposite. TikTok's algorithm, like if you're somebody who wants to do a long live stream, you should be on TikTok.
Because TikTok's algorithm, you go live and the longer you stay on, the algorithm sends more and more people to you. So what I tell people too is that you're not doing anything wrong.
It's not like you're doing a live stream and it's not doing well. You need to find what content you're making and find the right platform with the right algorithm for what you're doing.
So it's kind of like dating. I think of it like a dating app.
You know, I've never been on one, but I'm thinking of it like you just got to find the right fit. And there are a lot of options, but luckily there's not that many.
We've got a handful. So just play with those and see what is the best fit for you.
Because some people are really attracted to doing live streams. They wanna be a live entertainer.
Some people wanna do, like we're doing a podcast, something that's recorded. Some people wanna do long form podcasts.
Some people wanna do short form content. So depending on what type of content you wanna make, just play with those platforms and those algorithms and find the best home for you.
Because YouTube used to be my home for everything. But I will say there's other platforms and algorithms that are a better match for different things.
And I agree 1000%. And you are starting a podcast speaking of.
So on top of all the rest of the things. Why not throw in a podcast, you know? Let's throw in a podcast.
Crazy. I mean, again, I am a huge believer in portfolio careers, but cookbooks, merchandise, licensing deals, TV shows, producing podcasts.
Let's go. Why not? I just really wanted, I think I was doing tutorials for so many years, which I love.
I love them and I enjoy them. But the algorithm on YouTube doesn't like tutorials anymore.
And I think with my new content now, we're playing with it and kind of gamifying food, which has been really fun. My team's having a blast with that.
But I really wanted a space where I could just chill and talk to people who I admire and talk about topics that I find interesting. And just let my community get to know me on a deeper level, because that's what they've expressed a want for.
They've said, we've known you for so many years, but like, we don't know that much about you because you're always doing tutorials. And I thought, wow, that's so true.
I really haven't been able to talk about how I grew up or family memories or fun memories or even really get to see my full personality. So we started a podcast so we could really just dive in and have these conversations and let people get to know me and on a deeper level.
And I think as I'm getting older, I'm just really, that's all I'm craving is just surrounding myself with authentic relationships and wanting deep connections. And even in business and projects, I really am leaning towards people who we just have the same values and we want to be close.
How do you work with your family? Because that can get so hard. I love my husband.
If we work together, oh my God, there would be like a divorce in a week. And he's going to listen to this podcast.
He's going to be like, yeah, no, we're not working together. I think that's actually more normal.
I think that's actually very natural because my sister and her husband actually both worked for me for three years. Her husband works in aerospace.
So he really did not have a desire to build a women's lifestyle baking business. That was not his thing.
But when he moved down here, he said, I'll help you build the business for three years and then I'm going to go back to aerospace. So they worked together for three years and Molly said, she's's glad it was just three years.
And they didn't enjoy working together either. They love each other very much, but it's just wasn't a good fit.
And I think what's really interesting is that my partner, Mike and I, we've been together for over a decade. And when we first met each other, we met as business acquaintances.
They needed, wanted to work with some females for a bunch of YouTube videos that they were making. And they were all these nerdy gamer guys, and they didn't have any girls.
And they wrote all these comedy skits for men and women, and there's no women. So we met at a convention, and we exchanged emails with his business team.
And then he invited me to come work together. So we worked together for a long time and we noticed that we worked really well together.
We worked together, well, we enjoyed each other's company. We also noticed that during lunch break, we enjoyed each other's time.
We liked to joke with each other and made each other laugh. And then it developed into a real friendship, which was nice.
And I didn't see him as more than that then because I was fixated on someone and he was as well. So we just kind of had blinders on.
But as time went on, I was just in that startup mindset, you know, that workaholic for those couple years. And so was he.
And it was so funny because I don't think I could have even dated because I was so driven. I don't think if I would have dated Mike, I probably wouldn't have dated anyone.
But one day it just changed. One day it was just different.
And it was so funny. Our hands touched.
And then we were both like, yes, wait. We're like, wait, do we like each other?

Wait, what's happening? It was really a sweet moment when you realized, and it's rare, it's

rare to meet someone that is your romantic partner and also a business partner. I think that that is

really, really rare. I don't know that this would ever happen again.
I think it just really

came about to be that way. And then with Molly, her and I have always been close.
And I kind of let her boss me around a lot. So I think that's why our relationship works so well.
She's the younger sister, but really a lot of people assume she's older. She's taller, but she's also just so smart and very analytical.
And she's kind of bosses me around, runs my schedule. And then I am very creative.
I get big ideas. I can put systems together, but I am not the best about the day to day.
I really do need my team for that. And my sister's just always been that person in my life.
So then working together in that way, it's natural.

Do you not afraid that, I mean, you're in charge of all their salaries?

Like if that goes bad, that can get really scary, I'm thinking.

No, I'm not really.

I don't really think about it because when YouTube first started being financially successful, I'd say like when I first started making money on YouTube, I felt very uncertain. We're trailblazing.
No one's ever done this before. No one's ever been an influencer before.
There was no playbook. There's no rule book.
We're making it up as we go. So that was when I was very nervous.
I was really nervous in the very beginning because I did not know what to expect. And I didn't know if this was going to be a long term thing.
That was when I was the most nervous to basically be responsible for people's livelihood. As time gone on over the years and not only YouTube developed, but then all these other social media platforms and ways to generate income.
There's so many different ways now, and it's just incredible. YouTube has memberships, live streaming, Patreon.
You can do merch now. You can do direct sales onto YouTube.
It's the amount of ways now that they have come up with to diversify income even is just incredible. But it wasn't that in the beginning.
In the beginning, I was the most nervous because I did feel responsible for everybody. And it was like this new venture.
It was also motivated me to work really hard because I didn't want it to fail because I felt like people were relying on me. Now it's a lot different because things are so spread out.
There are so many ways to earn income online. It just employs so many people.
It creates so many jobs, the internet. It's just incredible that it's really changed my mindset now.
But I would say I was the most scared in the beginning, girl. I was very nervous when my sister was interested in coming to work for me.
I was the most nervous when we were first starting because I didn't want to let her down. You know, I love her and I didn't want to do that.
And now it's just grown so much. I love that.
Oh, my God. So last advice to your younger self that you wish you'd known or you've done something different so many things i could literally just make a list i i was joking about this with my friend just earlier today actually if we could write a letter to ourselves send it back in time 20 years what would we tell ourselves i want.
And I was like, so many things. One would be take better care of myself from the beginning, meaning sleep enough, you know, eat good, just better care of yourself on the daily.
And then the biggest thing that I've learned is that the people that you keep closest in your life, like closest to you, affect you the most. And I didn't realize that for decades.
And that is just the most important thing that I could tell anyone and I would wanna tell myself is really create the environment, create your tribe. You want friends who are supportive, encouraging.
When you're down, they're gassing you up. You want all that positivity.
People you have fun with, that's who you want to keep near and dear to your heart. And I wish I could have gone back and told myself that years ago because I have a big heart and I love people.
And I think I always try to see the good in everyone. And I think because I always see the potential for people, I'm like, oh gosh, if just these things didn't exist, that your potential to fly could be, you know, and I just hold on to those things and these relationships that they aren't the healthiest for me and they aren't positive for me and they're negative.
And I just don't want to give up on them because I'm just that fighter. And then I realized now that no, the people closest to you truly affect you, like on a deeper level, not just business, but your mental health.
And so be more thoughtful of that. Changing your circle and the people around you changes everything.
I wish I knew that as well way earlier in my career. Like, come on.
And I think another thing that you said, every time we say yes to something, no matter what, because we want to be the nice person, we don't want people to think about us, we say no to something else. And the question is, what are we saying no to? And I think that is just like, I didn't realize it because I wanted to be the good girl, but I was saying no to my dreams or no to possibilities or no to other things that were holding me back.
So I just love that, Rosanna. It's the people pleasing.
You start teaching yourself to not do that and go, hey, step back and go, is this actually good for me? Is this healthy for me? Is this creating more stress in my life? Or is this making me more anxious? And then when you do that, your life changes. Your life changes.
I just had John Annecy on the podcast and he literally says, haters means that you are relevant. And

I'm like, oh my God, this is so good. I love it.
There's a comedy sketch that this comedian, Cat Williams does. And it's a joke where he jokes, if you have 10 haters right now, good.
But by next summer, you better have a. Your goal should be to have 100 because it means you have a voice, you have an opinion.
And when you don't have one, no one opposes you. There's no beef.
And it usually means you're doing something right that's ruffling the feathers of somebody else. So it's pretty...
I love that. I like your example better, but I also love catwalking.
So I can't help it. I love it.
I love it. I love to laugh.
I know. Yeah.
So cheers to many more haters, Rosanna. Cheers.
For both of us. Yes, good chin.
Hey, thank you for the super fun, conversation and cheers to continuously doing fun incredible life and meeting incredible people and just all the experiences and the impact that we can make i love it thank you for having me i cannot wait for the future i think i'm gonna be entertainment, but also into, I don't know, helping people who are dyslexic and have ADHD like me. I love it.
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