Will Hollywood’s behind-the-scenes workers stay?

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Speaker 3 Well,

Speaker 2 that was a week, huh?

Speaker 2 From American Public Media.

Speaker 2 This is Marketplace

Speaker 2 in Los Angeles. I'm Kyrznoll.
It is Friday today. This one is the 28th of February.
It is good as always to have you along, everybody.

Speaker 2 In no particular order, as we get going today, trade and tariffs, a little inflation and maybe some interest rates, and because we can't not

Speaker 2 the politics of this economy. Catherine Rampell is at the Washington Post.
Anna Swanson is at the New York Times. Hey, you two.

Speaker 3 Hey, Kay. Hey, Kai.

Speaker 2 Anna Swanson, we begin with you, and I offer my condolences as the person at the Times who has to cover trade and trade policy in this economy right now.

Speaker 2 I'm not going to ask you where things stand. I'm not going to ask you what's going on.

Speaker 2 I'm going to talk to you, or I want you to talk to me rather, about a great piece in the paper today that you and your colleagues had about how tariffs may not actually be able to do everything that Donald Trump wants them to do, everything, everywhere, all at once.

Speaker 4 You know?

Speaker 5 Thank you. Yeah, definitely.
So it's been sort of an unending parade of tariff threats, right? And the President has talked about a few different rationales for these tariffs.

Speaker 5 So he's talked about them bringing supply chains back to the United States,

Speaker 5 using them as a source of leverage against other countries, and then also always raising massive amounts of revenue for the United States.

Speaker 5 And so, my colleagues and I just pointed out that a lot of those goals just directly undermine and contradict each other.

Speaker 5 So, you know, for example, in raising revenue, if you want to collect revenue, you need people to continue buying imports, which means that they're not switching to buying American goods instead and helping American factories.

Speaker 5 So, you know, it's a problem for the president's agenda. At some point, he is going to have to pick and choose.

Speaker 5 And right now, I think, you know, he's able to have all these different kinds of interests

Speaker 5 allied in favor of his tariff threats because he hasn't really had to pick and choose a goal yet. Right.

Speaker 2 And, you know, those tariffs, last we heard, and it will change between now and then almost certainly.

Speaker 2 They're slated to start on Tuesday, the 4th. Ana, let me ask you this, though.
When you talk to practitioners in the art of global trade, as opposed to

Speaker 2 academics and practicing economists, when you talk to people who are doing it, are they bewildered? Are they they resigned?

Speaker 3 What's the mood?

Speaker 5 Yeah, no, I think people are a bit bewildered. You know, many people did expect the president to double down on his tariff threats and go bigger than he did the first term.

Speaker 5 But, you know, I think it's really important to note that the scale of what the president is doing with these tariffs and with these trade measures is really so much bigger than what he did before in a way that is really astonishing even to the trade community.

Speaker 5 So if all these tariffs would go into effect, it would be the most tariffs since Smoot Hawley and the Great Depression.

Speaker 5 You know, even the China tariffs that he's considering on Tuesday, he's considering adding 10 percent to all imports coming from China on top of another 10 percent that he did a month ago.

Speaker 5 That's already roughly equivalent to all the tariffs that he did during the entire U.S.-China trade war in his first term, which took over a year to unfold.

Speaker 5 So, it's really notable what is going on here in trade.

Speaker 2 Yeah, size and speed. Speaking, Catherine Rimpel, of things he's doing this time, bigger than he did last time,

Speaker 2 the defenestration of the federal government is number one, still ongoing, and number two, hitting now economically critical areas. I want to talk to you about the Internal Revenue Service.

Speaker 2 You did a lot of really cool reporting on that in the last 18 months, two years about some of the modernizations that are desperately needed, which are now not happening.

Speaker 2 This will play out in the larger economy. Yes?

Speaker 6 Absolutely. Well, first of all, it'll play out in the federal government.
If this is a way to save money or reduce budgets,

Speaker 2 save an air quotes there, right?

Speaker 6 Yes, yes.

Speaker 6 This is radio, so you can't see my air quote hand gestures, but I'm doing them, I promise.

Speaker 6 It is completely the wrong way to go about doing it.

Speaker 6 If you are, you know, we like to talk about, or Trump likes to talk about, running the government as a business.

Speaker 6 If you are running a business, you do not shut down your accounts receivable department, right? The guys who take in the money.

Speaker 6 And he's essentially doing that. So

Speaker 6 they're apparently shutting down taxpayer assistance centers, laying off people who work at these call centers, who help people who are trying to comply with our absurdly complicated tax code.

Speaker 6 They're laying off enforcement people. There was a big investment in enforcement, and nobody likes to get audited, obviously.

Speaker 6 But audit rates, particularly of mega corporations corporations and very high-income Americans, have plummeted or had plummeted in the years prior to

Speaker 6 the IRA passing.

Speaker 6 And that is a huge potential ROI if you invest in enforcement capabilities.

Speaker 6 That's where the money is. And there's been a bunch of research, you know, looking at for every dollar spent on enforcement, how much comes back.

Speaker 6 And for very high-income people, it's something like $6 for every dollar spent, much more than that.

Speaker 6 If you consider deterrence effects, that is not only the revenue that's captured after the audit when the IRS finds that you've been non-compliant in some way, but also the fact that

Speaker 6 people are more compliant basically in the years subsequent.

Speaker 6 And then, and there's a bunch of other stuff that they're doing that is likely to reduce compliance, not just on enforcement. There was reporting today by a colleague of mine at the Post

Speaker 6 that

Speaker 6 DHS is demanding that the Internal Revenue Service hand over information about undocumented immigrants who are paying their taxes. And historically, there has been

Speaker 6 a very well-guarded divide because we want people, even those who may be working off the books in some respect, we want them to pay their taxes.

Speaker 6 So they're not going to pay either because why would you do anything to remain on the government's radar? So we're going to lose a lot of money throughout all of this.

Speaker 2 There are real effects to what's happening. Speaking of real effects, Anna Swanson, can we detour here into what's actually happening in this economy? It is still, for now,

Speaker 2 strong. PCE came in today, 2.5%, which was down just a hair.
GDP came in this week. It's growing, a little slower, but it's growing.
Consumers, though, may be getting a little tired.

Speaker 2 Some things to watch, yes.

Speaker 5 Yeah, no, I agree. So inflation numbers looked a little bit better today, but the problem was that the data showed a pullback in consumer spending, and that was somewhat unexpected.

Speaker 5 So January was a very cold month, and that always has a big impact because people are hibernating rather than spending. And there were also wildfires in California, so it could be

Speaker 5 weather effects. But it does raise a lot of questions about whether these are early signs of a bigger downturn.

Speaker 5 And certainly there's been some more nervousness recently in consumer confidence surveys about the economy and the effect of tariffs. So, the question is really:

Speaker 5 is this just a fluke or is this something more serious that we'll see develop? Trevor Burrus, Jr.: Right.

Speaker 2 Catherine, last question to you, and it comes with a nod to what happened today in the Oval Office between President Zelensky and President Trump.

Speaker 2 Obviously, the Trump administration has decided to reorient America's place in the world and its reputation in the world. And I guess my question to you, as we talk about the politics of this economy,

Speaker 2 is what does that change in reputation mean for the American economy, you think, and the global economy, too?

Speaker 6 I think the core question here is: will America be a reliable ally when we come to an agreement with other countries, whether it's on security-related things, as in the Oval Office meeting that you are referring to, or trade agreements for that matter, will we stick to our word?

Speaker 6 And I think

Speaker 6 we've proven time and time again with this administration that that is not a reliable assumption. You know,

Speaker 6 Trump negotiated, for example, the current agreement with Canada and Mexico regarding trade, you know, the USMCA, the so-called new NAFTA.

Speaker 6 And he's already ripping that up with tariffs, as we've discussed, expected next week.

Speaker 6 So what does that mean? It means that we are not a reliable place to

Speaker 6 invest in, per se, to have supply chains linked into.

Speaker 6 I think it's quite likely that we will see kind of a cleavage in the world into countries that do business with China and countries that do business with us as well.

Speaker 6 That may have already been in the works, but we are driving more potential trading partners into the arms of China.

Speaker 6 And, you know, just this general uncertainty over our commitment to free trade, to anti-corruption, I think is likely to drag on

Speaker 6 investment here, investment globally, and potentially global growth.

Speaker 2 Catherine Rampell at the Washington Post and Anna Swanson at the New York Times on a remarkable Friday, to be honest with you. Have a nice weekend, you two.

Speaker 3 Thank you, Kai.

Speaker 2 Wall Street today to end the week and the month. Traders took a breather on this Friday, that PCE number I mentioned, real quick, easing their minds, I suppose.
Details, numbers, when we get there.

Speaker 2 Maybe some time yet before we've got anything like a complete count of exactly how many federal workers the Trump administration has fired or put on leave before firing them.

Speaker 2 And it is for sure going to be a bit before we know what that's going to do to the economy. We'll get the February jobs report from the Bureau of Labor Statistics Friday next.

Speaker 2 But because of the way that data is collected, it is unlikely to give us a good picture of what has been going on. Marketplace's Kristen Schwab explains.

Speaker 8 It's sort of funny that we call the February jobs report the February Jobs Report, because Harry Holzer, a former chief economist at the Department of Labor, says it doesn't really capture all of February.

Speaker 9 It's a snapshot of the month that occurs within a specific week.

Speaker 8 The Bureau of Labor Statistics surveys workers during the seven days that include the 12th day of the month. It's called the reference week.

Speaker 8 And February's reference week happened before a lot of these recent federal cuts, which means they won't show up in the data until the March jobs report.

Speaker 8 Plus, it'll be a while before people who took buyouts show up at all.

Speaker 9 Because they won't be looking for new jobs in most cases?

Speaker 8 They might wait a while to job hunt. Others may have retired.
Martha Gimbel, executive director of the budget lab at Yale, says federal layoffs alone won't change the unemployment rate that much.

Speaker 10 I think people have to keep in mind how big the United States economy is.

Speaker 8 There are more than 2 million federal employees. The total U.S.
labor force adds up to 170 million.

Speaker 10 Just from a pure economy standpoint, the private sector can absorb those people.

Speaker 8 Of course, from a personal standpoint, job loss is difficult, especially for workers who've spent their careers with the government.

Speaker 8 Big picture, federal cuts will ripple out beyond the federal workforce, says Aaron Sojourner, an economist at the W.E. Upjohn Institute for Employment Research.

Speaker 8 Most of of the federal spending is not spent on public employees, but spent on private sector employees through contracts and grants, which means it'll be months before we get a clearer picture of the full impact of these government cuts on the labor force.

Speaker 8 I'm Kristen Schwab for Marketplace.

Speaker 2 The wildfires here in Los Angeles last month were just the latest hurdle in a difficult four or five years for the biggest industry in town.

Speaker 2 The pandemic and then the writers and actors strike put Hollywood in a bit of a skid with studios and streamers cutting back on local film and television production.

Speaker 2 And now there are words that the fires will accelerate that decline. There is a stay in LA campaign, big name actors, calling on those studios and streamers to keep production here.

Speaker 2 And yes, us going to the multiplex or pulling up Netflix is a business for those companies, but it's a livelihood for the tens of thousands of Angelinos who work behind the scenes, the gaffers and location scouts and makeup artists you're not going to see at the Oscars on Sunday.

Speaker 2 And for them, the stakes are high, as Marketplace's Matt Levin explains.

Speaker 11 Even if you haven't visited LA, you probably know Randy's donuts.

Speaker 3 Can I please do two plays? Okay.

Speaker 12 Two

Speaker 11 maple bars. It's here at this noisy intersection in Englewood, just a few small traffic jams away from LAX.
You're likely familiar familiar with their plane donut, the 30-foot tall one on the roof.

Speaker 12 I think it might have been the sequel, Iron Man 2, where Tony Stark, Robert Danny Jr., is sitting in his Iron Man suit in the middle of that donut up there.

Speaker 11 Danny Finn is an LA location scout for movies and TV shows.

Speaker 11 He says if a script calls for an authentic LA landmark that's a little less on the nose than the Hollywood sign, Randy's Donuts is a popular go-to. It did make that cameo in Iron Man 2.

Speaker 11 It's in the Ice Cube comedy Friday After Next and a bunch of other stuff, which is why Finn was taken aback when he saw the 2018 cult classic Den of Thieves.

Speaker 12 In the opening of Den of Thieves, there is a heat-style armored car robbery.

Speaker 13 Take your foot off the gas, press the unlock button, and step out of the vehicle that I believe is supposed to be right there.

Speaker 12 Because it's in front of a walk-up style donut shop and there is a little donut on the roof that looks like the size of like a direct TV satellite dish.

Speaker 11 All of Den of Thieves is set in Greater LA and most of it was shot in Atlanta, Georgia. Finn didn't think it worked.
He could tell it wasn't Randy's.

Speaker 12 I felt validated as a Los Angeles location manager. I felt like, yeah,

Speaker 12 you can't do it. Like you really can't replicate LA.

Speaker 11 Major studios are trying though. Film, TV, and commercial shooting days in LA have dropped 39% since 2017.

Speaker 11 Den of Thieves and The Walking Dead and the Avengers movies were filmed in Atlanta because it's cheaper there, mostly because of a very generous 20% state tax credit. Also cheaper in Georgia, a house.

Speaker 11 Paul Audley is the head of the nonprofit group Film LA.

Speaker 14 We did see some migration over the past 10 years of folks from here moving to other production centers.

Speaker 11 He fears the roughly 13,000 homes lost in January's wildfires will only make Los Angeles even less affordable for below-the-line workers, an industry term for people behind the scenes.

Speaker 14 While most below-the-line workers are well-played middle-class, that still isn't enough in many cases here.

Speaker 11 Lighting technician Todd Brown moved to Atlanta from Los Angeles in the summer of 2022. He just wrapped work on the last season of Stranger Things, which was filmed in Jackson, Georgia.

Speaker 11 He was able to buy a 2,400-square-foot house for less than a million dollars, which is basically impossible in L.A. And Atlanta has other professional perks.

Speaker 15 Quite frankly, there's just a little less competition. And so if you come with skills, you will, it will be seen.

Speaker 11 Brown says the workforce in Atlanta is younger. It's the next generation of behind-the-scenes talent from all over the country trying to break in where it's easier.

Speaker 15 Like in Los Angeles, you'd have guys that are like gaffers, and that's because their father was in it or their mother was in it. You know what I mean? It's a trade and there's a legacy to that.

Speaker 11 the temptation to leave la is stronger now after those january fires jeremy whalen gave it a passing thought so we're coming to my new apartment now it's a converted garage that we found after the fires okay whalen and his partner lost the home they owned in altadena where he lived for eight years they're both drivers for film crews ferrying equipment to and from sets and studios in a good year with steady work he'll make about 150 grand although lately it's been less.

Speaker 11 All the furniture he has right now has been donated from those Hollywood studios, including the 70s-looking rug he hopes will be a conversation piece.

Speaker 2 Yeah, it's cool.

Speaker 16 It's a fun rug that was on some set somewhere.

Speaker 11 This to be the threes company.

Speaker 16 Yes, absolutely.

Speaker 16 You know it, and even if it's not, I'm going to pretend like it is.

Speaker 11 Whelan says the below-the-line community here has really helped him recover after the fires. And that very brief flirtation with leaving LA, well, that scene has been cut.

Speaker 16 The thing about working in Hollywood is that you have generations of

Speaker 16 really skilled, talented people that are here.

Speaker 16 So we really want to fight to stay here.

Speaker 11 He hopes the movement to bring more movies and TV back to LA will make that fight easier. I'm Matt Levin from Marketplace.

Speaker 2 Coming up.

Speaker 3 If I microwave this chicken nugget, it was soggy and really sad, but if I throw it in my air fryer, it's delicious.

Speaker 2 A second act for frozen food, believe it or not. First, though, let's do the numbers.
Dow Industrial is up 601 today, 1.4%, 43,840.

Speaker 2 The NASDAQ added 302 points, 1.6 tenths percent, 18,847, the SP 500 up 92 points, 1.6%.

Speaker 2 Ended things at 59, and 54. For the five days gone by, the Dow up just under 1%, the NASDAQ down 3.5%.
The SP 500 slipped 1% today. Bonds went up.
Yield on the 10-year Tinot, thus down 4.20%.

Speaker 2 You're listening to Marketplace.

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Speaker 2 This is Marketplace. I'm Kai Rizdahl.
Ana and I mentioned this a little bit earlier that consumer spending slid in January on everything from cars to clothing. Makes sense, right? After the holidays?

Speaker 2 One category went up a whole bunch last month, though, 29%, according to the Department of Commerce.

Speaker 2 Utilities, which have been a pain point for low- and middle-income consumers, in particular, as Marketplace's Elizabeth Troval reports.

Speaker 7 January spending is often about essentials, says Morning Consult's Denny Cohen-Hempsey. But utilities are subject to the weather.

Speaker 5 And we've had really cold temperatures on the southern United States and east coast.

Speaker 7 Like snow in Houston. And the cold has a double whammy effect on utilities, especially for natural gas heated homes, says David Tinsley with Bank of America Institute.

Speaker 14 You've got the price of what they're paying for gas rising, but they're also having to burn more gas in order to counter this unseasonably cold weather.

Speaker 7 His review of electricity, gas, and water payments showed a 6% year-on-year increase in January. But households are feeling the pinch differently.

Speaker 7 While richer people pay more for utilities, they often have bigger homes. They don't pay a ton more than people who are poorer.

Speaker 14 It's certainly tougher for people at the lower end of the income distribution.

Speaker 7 That leads some families to make drastic decisions, according to a survey by the Texas Energy Poverty Research Institute. Margo Weiss is their executive director.

Speaker 20 A very high percentage of people leave their thermostats or their air conditioning at uncomfortable temperatures or even turn it off completely because of the fear of being shut off.

Speaker 7 She says households have also given up entertainment, medicine, and school supplies to pay their energy bills. I'm Elizabeth Kroval from Marketplace.

Speaker 2 Frozen foods, maybe throwing a frozen pizza or something in the microwave, have long been a go-to to get something on the table as fast as possible after a busy day.

Speaker 2 Though convenient, frozen foods have gotten something of a bad rap. They're not all that healthy and not all that tasty either.
But the freezer section has gotten something of a rebrand.

Speaker 2 Megan McCarron wrote about it for The Atlantic the other day. Megan, welcome to the program.

Speaker 3 Thanks for having me.

Speaker 2 I am not alone, I'm sure, when I say frozen food, ew.

Speaker 2 But that's changing, you say.

Speaker 3 It is changing. And also, you're definitely not alone in that perception.
I think, yeah, I even read about how I shared that perception for a long time. Yeah.

Speaker 3 I don't know how you grew up eating dinner, Kai, but I grew up eating a lot of frozen meals at times. And, you know, I was never mad about it.

Speaker 3 There's like that one weirdly good, fudgy brownie in kids' cuisine that I still think about sometimes. But yeah, it was, you know, it was a little mid.

Speaker 3 But yeah, American perceptions are really changing about frozen food. And some of it is that the pandemic led people to take a second look.

Speaker 3 Some of it is also that I think the options are getting better.

Speaker 3 And also there's so much information online now about all these hacks to freeze, you know, food you've cooked yourself that that's become like if you're a really nerdy, serious home cook, you're also getting into your freezer.

Speaker 2 Right, right. All right.
So let's go through a couple of those. First of all, you point out that really the relationship that we have with our freezers began to change because of the pandemic.

Speaker 2 And, you know, certainly in my house, we were freezing a whole lot of food.

Speaker 3 Yes, I feel one of the pandemic's saddest accessories was the chest freezer, right?

Speaker 3 Right.

Speaker 2 But there's more to it than just that, right?

Speaker 2 Well-known name-brand cooks are saying, look, frozen food is now not only just acceptable, but actually good. I'm no fan of Gordon Ramsey, but you quote him in this piece.

Speaker 3 Yeah, we didn't actually speak to Gordon, but there

Speaker 3 was sort of

Speaker 3 gave a couple quotes to the press over the years saying, you know, frozen food isn't very good. Or, you know, in 2020, he disparaged microwaves as not really imparting any flavor for cooking.

Speaker 3 And recently he launched his own line of frozen food. This is kind of a familiar move for chefs.
Wolfgang Puck has had a frozen line for a really long time.

Speaker 3 But I think what's really changing is that, you know, you don't just have to microwave frozen food anymore.

Speaker 3 The air fryer has made frozen food, you know, a lot crispier and tastier.

Speaker 3 And so, sort of air fryer mania is another thing that has made people say, wow, like if I microwave this chicken nugget, it was soggy and really sad, but if I throw it in my air fryer, it's delicious.

Speaker 2 You've been writing on food and culture for a good long while. Has your relationship with your freezer changed?

Speaker 3 Most definitely. Yeah, I've been covering food for over 10 years.
And when I started, I would say I wasn't even freezing

Speaker 3 stuff I had made fresh. That was just not interesting to me.
But around that time, you know, I was like a

Speaker 3 canning hipster for a hot minute. And then I started, you know, reading these blogs about, you know, putting up your jam.
I know, ah, youth. Canning's hard, man.

Speaker 2 That's the beauty of the freezer, right?

Speaker 2 You wrap it up well, you pop it in the freezer, and you're good to go. Canning is just, that's a whole different thing.

Speaker 3 Yeah, so that was my gateway. I was like, oh, well, I can make this jam and just put it in the freezer.
Or I made this stock, I can put it in the freezer. Oh, I made this bread.

Speaker 3 I can put it in the freezer. And then from there, you start saying, like, well, why am I so down on these frozen french fries? Like, sometimes you just want some french fries in the house.

Speaker 2 Totally. Can I just say I just discovered you could freeze bread like two years ago? It's embarrassing, truly.

Speaker 3 But once you figured out, you're like, I'm a genius.

Speaker 3 That's right.

Speaker 2 That's right. Megan McCarran writes on food and a bunch of other stuff.
This one was in the Atlantic. Megan, thanks a lot.
I appreciate your time.

Speaker 3 Thank you so much for having me.

Speaker 2 All right, we got to go. No time for a final too much talking up at the top of the program.
Our theme music was composed by B.J. Luterman.
Marketplace's executive producer is Nancy Fargalli.

Speaker 2 Donna Tam is the executive editor. Neil Scarborough is the vice president and general manager.
I'm Kyle Risdahl. Have yourselves a great weekend, everybody.
We'll be back on Monday. See ya.

Speaker 2 This is APM.

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Speaker 18 For over 20 years, Vogelzang Law has helped families across the country fight for justice after asbestos exposure. Call or visit our website and begin your free case review today.
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