Bonus Episode 8 | Dr. Judith Orloff - Empathy and Intuition in Healing - Mick Unplugged

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Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to another episode of Mick Unplugged, where we uncover the stories and motivations of extraordinary people.

And our guest today is a psychiatrist, an author, and an empath with a unique perspective on emotional healing and intuition.

She's known for her groundbreaking work.

in emotional wellness and mind-body medicine.

Please help me welcome the inspiring, the motivating, the captivating, Dr.

Judith Orla.

Dr.

Judith, welcome to Mick Unplugged.

How are you doing today?

I'm doing great.

I'm happy to be here with you.

I am happy that you are here with me.

So, on Mick Unplugged, we open with your because, right?

That reason, that driving force that pushes us and makes us who we are.

So, Dr.

Judith, I have a question for you.

What was the driving force that led you to pursue a career in psychiatric work and emotional wellness?

Like, what was that because?

What was that fuel that got you going?

Well, I mean, my first answer is my dream life, where I had a dream at a certain point in my life, a night dream, that told me to get an MD and become a psychiatrist in order to have the credentials to legitimize intuition and empathy in traditional medicine.

And this was at a time when I had dropped out of school and I was living with my boyfriend in Venice Beach.

And I did wasn't that isn't what I really wanted wanted to do.

I came from a whole lineage of doctors and I was more creative and a writer, but I enrolled in one class in a junior college and one became two became 14 years of medical training.

And so here I am, you know, years later as a psychiatrist, perfect, perfect profession for me.

I love it.

And in that world, One of the things that is really unique with you is that you are an empath.

And I want you to break that down for listeners.

What is an empath?

And what's that skill set that you are looking for that you're helping people with?

I'm an empath and a psychiatrist, so I combine my traditional medical training, which I revere and love, with an empath.

And an empath, now I wrote the book, The Genius of Empathy, to incorporate being an empath into your life and incorporate empathy into your life.

Empathy is, I look at it like it's a spectrum where empathy is in the middle of the spectrum where you have everyday empathy.

I feel for you.

You know, I care about you.

I care what happens to you.

And then higher up on the spectrum are the empaths.

And the empaths are the ones who are sensitive and open and loving and caring, but they tend to absorb the angst of the world and become an emotional sponge and take on everybody's stress, including the world's stress.

And so the book is meant to give people strategies on how not to do that, how to be an empowered empath and to be that kind of person you want to be, that heart-centered, you know, intuitive, loving person without getting drained by it.

I love it.

And so, your team sent me a copy of the book, and I'm probably three-fourths of the way going through it the second time.

That's how powerful the genius of empathy is.

And the reason that I'm reading it literally back to back is because it opens your mind and your soul.

And for me, it gave me answers to a lot of decisions that I make in life.

I feel like understanding who you are from an empathy level and then how to communicate with others.

And I know that that's probably not the pretense of the book, but that's what I was getting out of it.

And now that I'm going back into it, it's like, oh, Mick, that's why you make the decisions that you make because this is how you're seeing things or this is how you're feeling things.

And that is awesome.

So I would love to hear from you, you know, what are some of the things that people can get out of the book?

Because I don't want to just tell my version.

We have the source right here, ladies and gentlemen.

So let's hear directly from the source.

Well, I divided the genius of empathy up into three parts.

One is healing yourself, how to show empathy towards yourself, which is so important.

How to show empathy in your relationships, which will only improve them and deepen them and stop going to war with each other in relationships.

If you're arguing a lot, if you're having discord, empathy will help you come back together again in a very, very positive way.

And then the third part is the world.

How do we show global empathy?

How do we come together as a humankind to have mercy on each other and have intuition and empathy for what we're all going through and how to do that without taking on the stress, the enormous stress that's going on in the world today?

How to be helpful but not take on the stress.

Absolutely.

And you talked about intuition a little bit there.

How does intuition play a role in your approach to psychiatry?

Well, I tune in to all my patients.

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Intuitively, tune.

And as well as I listen with my traditional medical cap, and then I also listen with with my intuition, which is my gut feeling, my sense of energy, any knowings that come to me, any impressions, sights, smells, sounds, knowings, any flashes that come to me.

So intuition is just goes on all the time.

And creative people know a lot about intuition because they're all, you have to go by intuition.

If you're writing, you have to go with the flow.

You can't just think your way there, you know.

And so intuition is a huge part of who I am.

It's hugely important and i think it results as being it from being empathic as the more i can show you empathy the more my heart opens and then the more my intuition opens love it and you keep going right where i want to go right so now let's talk about empathy a little bit and as an empath one of the things that i got from your book was balancing emotional energy from others so how do you do that how do you balance the emotional energy from others with your own needs well you you learn one principle in the book that I keep going over and over again because it's so important: you observe, you don't absorb.

And that means you have to take a little bit step backwards, you know, not jump into their skin and try and help them.

Empaths are so, you know, wanting to help people.

They tend to overhelp and get exhausted from it, but they literally jump into people's skins and they feel everything they're going through.

And that's not a healthy thing to do.

So observe, don't absorb.

I'll take one step back from you, which is okay.

I could feel you just fine, you know, from one step back.

But if I jumped in, it would be, you know, be too much.

Now, one of the issues that empaths face is

how do I do that?

How do I operate in a world that's so crazy right now, you know, and just so full of polarization and hatred and warring?

And my God, all the most awful human traits are coming to the forefront now.

You know, I'm lambasted by them.

I mean, they're everywhere.

I wouldn't let that discourage you, though, because I believe in the power of empathy.

And in the book, I talk about the power of the individual, which I believe in a lot.

You know, people say, oh, what can I do as an individual?

Everything.

You can start with yourself, begin to, you know, embody what you, the change you want to see.

You know, just treat yourself nice for once.

You know, have empathy.

And now, I want to make the point, there's the mind, we have the mind and we have the heart.

All right, the mind will find all kinds of reasons why not to show empathy.

He doesn't deserve it.

He hurt me too much.

He's been impolite, you know, whatever.

You know, there are a million reasons.

But that isn't where you want to go for empathy.

You want to come down to your heart.

As your heart wants to find all kinds of reasons why to have empathy.

And it doesn't mean letting someone off the hook.

And I want to make that really clear.

It doesn't mean being a doormat.

It doesn't mean any of that.

It just means learning to find something in this poor person who hurt you to feel empathy for.

Maybe they were abused as a child and it's just impossible for them to have relationships, you know, and you got caught in that, that whole pattern.

Maybe that's it.

So you can have empathy a little bit.

And what that helps you do, first of all, is shift the pattern of hate and also allows you to be freer of that person because you're not harboring the resentment which gloms on to you energetically you don't want that and it just helps it float away and you have to try it.

You know, it might sound counterintuitive, but if you just try it, just find one little teeny tiny thing to find empathy with in somebody and see what happens.

I love it.

One of the things that I truly enjoy about you and researching you and seeing all the things that you've accomplished is you've truly mastered emotional wellness.

So what practices or habits have you developed to master the art of emotional healing?

Well, I believe in the heart.

I believe in the power of the heart more than anything.

And so I have meditation practice every night where when the day is over, I sit in front of my meditation space and I have candles and I have flowers and I sit and I let the day go by, you know, go away.

And I tune into myself and I tune into the powers greater than myself because I have deep belief in spirituality as well.

But those listening, you don't have to have that in order to find empathy, but I I do.

You know, it's a very important part of my life to connect with the presence or whatever you want to call it, to help me and guide me to find my right path, to have the words, the right words to say to you so that you can hear me.

You know, that's very important that I reach out to something larger.

But most importantly, in meditation, I put my hands over my heart and I take a breath, I let all the stress of the day go, and I just begin to tune into the power of love.

You can do that energetically.

There's subtle energy in the body that I talk about in the book.

And it's not, we're not just these solid flesh and blood bodies.

We have, we're made up of energy, subtle energy.

Chinese medical practitioners call it qi, prana, shakti.

We learn to tune into this in ourselves to find our true power.

And it comes from the heart.

And you can build that heart up.

And so, you know, at the end of the day, I look outside and everybody's asleep, you know, and I'm sitting there meditating, and it's a wonderful feeling.

I love it.

So, as a psychiatrist, right, like I'm sure you have to deal with emotional boundaries with your patients or clients.

How do you set up or how do you establish emotional boundaries with your clients?

Oh, boundaries are key for an empath to not feel drained by the world.

And certainly, as a psychiatrist, I need to set boundaries with my patients, which, you know, the patients are easier than other people for me.

You know, the patients, I've been seeing patients for you know so many years I know how to sit with them and not get personally involved but be there in order to see with a capital S and to be able to feel what's going on in service of helping them you know I'm pretty good at that and when I come in you know I see my clients during the day I set aside my personal problems and I set aside whatever I'm going through you know we all go through a lot you know and I set aside that so I'm 100% there for you you are my universe when you come and sit in front of me.

And that's how I am with my patients.

It's a bit harder on a personal level because I need to set limits and boundaries to protect my energy.

And that's very key in the genius of empathy, how to set limits and boundaries to protect your energy.

But I know many people feel guilty about doing this.

And so I teach my patients how to do it and deal with the guilt because they were taught maybe something else growing up that you're a compassionate person only if you give 200% of the time and you never say no.

And I don't believe that.

You know, I think we need in this day and time, we need to be warriors.

We need to be strong.

That's at a boundary.

You're lost.

You're going to just get drained.

There's no.

no way around it.

So whatever guilt you had from your childhood about speaking up for your knees, you need to work with somebody or work journal about it and begin to heal that so that you can set a boundary you know i i talk about in the book you know how no is a complete sentence you know just saying no i'm so sorry i can't do that i would love to be with you today but i can't you know you say it very sweet and nice and short you don't get into a you know a big discussion about it that's where empaths go wrong.

They want to discuss everything.

No.

You know, don't discuss things when you're setting a boundary.

Just say where you're at, say it nice and polite, and then make it short, in and out.

I am totally borrowing that.

No is a complete sentence.

That is powerful on so many levels, Dr.

Judith.

I think I needed to hear that today.

And I know you didn't know that I needed to hear that today, but no is a complete sentence.

And it is totally okay to use that sentence.

I needed that, Dr.

Judith.

I appreciate you.

I'm so glad.

Yeah, yeah.

Now you can go practice it.

It's fun.

You have such a nice energy.

Your eyes are nice, you know, and the energy from your eyes are good.

So when you say it, it will be very positive.

I'm definitely going to use it.

I'm definitely going to use it.

In your book, you have a complete section on relationships, like you talked about earlier.

So for people that are listening or those that are going to end up watching this episode as well, how can people establish healthy boundaries in their relationships?

You have to learn how to assert your needs and to make a decision.

If you can do this, it's really important to only discuss one subject at a time with a friend or a spouse or somebody else.

You just don't get into 10 million different subjects at once.

Now, that's where people go wrong.

You know, where you can start out with, I feel like you haven't been listening to me.

And then that can escalate to, and you never told me your parents were coming.

And why don't you spend more time with the kids?

And like, by the time you're through your list, the other person is like lost.

All right.

The key to success, if you want to have empathy in your relationships, and that's the goal.

You make that your goal.

You don't, your goal is not to fight.

You have to have rules.

No blaming, no shaming, no fighting, no getting somebody back.

You know, that's not okay in communication.

You won't get anywhere with it except for maybe some release, you know, from an adrenaline rush.

I don't know, but it's not going to get you a good relationship.

I can guarantee you that.

I really want to talk about, you know, I don't feel like you're listening to me.

Can we get together and make a date, put in your request, and have maybe a 10-minute time.

Limit the time you talk about it.

You don't want to go on forever about these things.

You know, and just express that one need.

It's going to be hard if you're not used to doing one need.

Say, you know, I really don't feel like you're listening to me.

And I'd love for us to, you know, for you to just spend some time, you know, just listening to me.

I won't go on and on and on, but I need you.

I love you.

I, you know, and lead with vulnerability.

state your need, one need, so the other person is clear about it.

And then you can use the sandwich technique, which I love, which is you start with something positive, you end with something positive, and you put your request in the middle.

So, you know, you say, I love you, and I'm so grateful for our relationship.

And I would love it if you could listen to me a little bit more so that I could feel more important in your world.

And thank you so much for, you know, supporting us in this.

So that's basically how you do do the sandwich technique.

I love it.

I love that.

And my wife actually uses that pretty much every day with me.

Like, honey,

I love you.

You are so amazing.

But do you mind doing the dishes every once in a while?

It would totally help me because you're so strong and your hands are so soft.

I'm like, oh, yeah.

She just told me to go do the dishes.

Okay, got it.

Exactly.

And you're happy doing the dishes, right?

All the compliments

wholeheartedly, wholeheartedly.

She's sincere, too.

You know, she's very sincere, and you're washing the dishes happily, right?

Right.

You have to make a decision in your relationships.

What kind of relationships do you want to have at work, at home, with family, with friends?

Do you want the kind where you're walked over like a doormat and you don't stand up for yourself?

No, hopefully, not.

Do you want more loving relationships?

Hopefully, yes.

And the secret weapon, your secret weapon is empathy.

Just simply by saying to your spouse, I hear what you're saying and it really is important to me.

You know, those magic words, I hear what you're saying, as opposed to arguing with them or getting in a fight with them.

I hear what you're saying and looking at you and smiling as opposed to fighting.

People get in the habit of fighting a lot.

And if you're fighting and you're about to say something, you're going to regret because you can destroy a relationship with your words.

I mean, there's some words you will never be able to get out of your mind.

And so if you're about to say something like that, what you need to do is train yourself, take a breath, take a pause, say, I'm going to give this some thought.

I need to take a break to center myself.

Let's reconvene in an hour.

You have to not say those words that are going to destroy your relationship.

Like you're a terrible mother.

You never want to say that to somebody.

Very hurtful.

You know, and you can't get some things out of your head.

And which ones stick, there's no way of predicting.

But if you have these things in your head that you think your beloved says to you, it's hard to let them go.

So you don't want to blurt things out.

That's part of being empathic.

So in the book, it's all practical strategies, how to show empathy during an argument.

Now, how to show empathy if your loved one is going through a physical challenge or an emotional challenge.

How to show empathy if you're burnt out and you don't have much to give, how to show empathy with a co-worker who's a chronic talker and I don't know what to do, I can't interrupt them, you know, kind of thing.

The book is a guide on how to deal with people with empathy, not with disregard for the person.

You know, don't just assume that they're terrible people and they don't deserve any kind of consideration from you.

You know, I talk about the namaste effect, you know, where in India, sometimes when you greet someone on the path, you say namaste, and it means I respect the spirit within you.

I might not like you.

I might not agree with you, which is fine, but I still have a respect for you as a human being.

And if we had that basic respect for one another, even if we disagree, the outcome of our conversations would be different.

That is so true.

You've been so gracious with your time today, Dr.

Judith.

Two questions, and I promise I'll get you out of here.

You know, it's 2024.

The world is evolving.

People are evolving.

How do you see mind-body medicine evolving in the coming years?

I see more of an awareness about empathy and empaths and that empaths aren't going to be misdiagnosed as chronic anxiety disorder or Epstein-Barr or chronic depression.

It's not.

Empaths are going to be seen as powerful, beautiful people who need to learn strategies in order to cope with the world.

So I see evolution there and I see

there's such a strong desire among all the patients that come to me to be seen in an intuitive and an empathic way as well as have my traditional knowledge available to help them navigate if they need to go through the system.

Because I really know how to do that and it's really helpful.

And so I can help people through it.

I see it going in a good direction and I certainly give workshops for healthcare practitioners on how to incorporate intuition and empathy into patient care.

And, you know, more and more physicians are doing that.

And certainly Chinese medical practitioners, acupuncturists, body workers, they're all into it already.

They're way ahead of the doctors.

But we're moving in that direction.

That's great.

Last question.

For the listeners that are struggling today with emotional challenges and with empathy, what words of encouragement do you have for them?

I see you.

I feel you.

You're an important person.

I hope you can show yourself some self-empathy.

There's a chapter, and if you get the book, there's a chapter in the book on self-empathy, what to say to yourself to help build up your own self-esteem.

And when you're going through a really hard time, how to treat yourself, you know, as opposed to beating yourself up, which so many people do.

They go to war with themselves, you know, in the mind, it becomes a torture chamber with negative voices talking.

You want to shift into your heart and say, it's really hard.

This is really hard.

And you're doing the best you can, as opposed to, what's wrong with you?

You shouldn't feel sick now.

Now, whatever these horrible things that we all say to ourselves, if we're not disciplined and come to our empathic, loving hearts.

And be with people like you and

people who are loving and supportive.

You want to have a positive bubble around you when you're going through a hard time.

You don't want to have these energy energy vampires sucking you dry with all kinds of weird behaviors.

No, you want to have love.

Just go where the love is.

That's amazing.

Everyone, the godmother of empath, Dr.

Judith Orloff.

www.drjudithorloff.com.

We're going to have all this available in the show notes.

Dr.

Judith, where else do you want people to find you, follow you, and obviously getting a copy of the genius of empathy?

You can sign up for my free empathy newsletter on my website and just get updates once a month online newsletter, drjudithorlof.com.

And I'm traveling around on a book tour.

So those of you who'd like to come and see me, I'm doing some in-person events.

On May 8th, I'll be in Roman's bookstore in Pasadena in California.

And then I'll be in Portland, New Renaissance Books, next week, and then in Phoenix at the end of next month.

And then I'm giving online workshops as well.

If you want want to get into the empathy conversation, you know, just be honest with where you're at and try and, you know, get more of us to practice empathy and feel the benefits of it.

So thank you so much.

It was so nice meeting you.

I really like you.

It was nice meeting you as well.

You are amazing.

And for all the listeners out there, remember, you're because is your superpower.

Go unleash it.

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