Share & Catfish & Tell with Kevin Clark, Katie Nolan & Pablo

Welcome to Pablo Torre Finds Out.

I am Pablo Torre, and today we're going to find out what this sound is.

Do these feel like relationships?

These feel like people that are interacting, or is it just like, look at these boobies?

Right after this ad.

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Hello.

Hey, pal.

Oh, wow.

What's up?

What do we got on there?

How?

What do we got on there?

No.

It's brown.

What animal do you think did that?

There's no way it's shit.

On the front of my shit.

Oh, I had.

Oh, I thought it was.

What the f?

I thought I have to eat this donut.

Why do you guys look like you've been doing a podcast without me already?

He started the audio already.

What the f?

You're not that late.

You were late.

I was late.

Kevin is early.

Yeah, well, that's Kevin.

That's Kevin's kind of thing.

Professionalism?

Dorkiness.

It's one word for.

Do you think this is really fun?

You're going to want to not rub it into our rug if it is poop.

Should we do a podcast?

I don't think.

I don't really feel like it today, if I can be honest.

What were you doing that made you late?

I was talking to a class over Zoom.

Where?

Does it really matter?

It matters.

I talked to a Harvard thing last week.

Okay, guys.

What the f ⁇ ?

They barely let me talk at Hofstra, the Harvard of Long Island.

That's right.

It was at Harvard.

It was at Harvard?

Virtually.

You talked to students at Harvard?

I mean, I just want to know how Kevin was already,

you know, ready to one-up me on this.

Neither of you are smart enough for this.

There's something called the

sports analytics thing or something.

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

I've spoken to them before.

That's MIT.

Aren't you guys talking about it?

No, no, no.

I was surprised to Sloan.

And somehow less cool than the MIT one.

And in that way, maybe more cool.

Where do you currently stand on Daryl Maury?

Refused to come on this show.

He did.

I asked him, and he passed.

He doesn't pass on anything.

Do you say respectfully?

I passed.

Let me see.

Let me quote Daryl's.

I think it was even worse than that.

Oh, here.

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Here we go.

Okay.

Daryl.

This is in January, January 18th.

Daryl, hope you're good, amigo.

Oh, I hate that I did.

Oh, I

didn't mean to that out loud.

This is way too behind

on how I booked this.

Jeff Amigo is.

Few people deserve an amigo less than Daryl.

Daryl, you have to read all of it.

Oh, God.

Don't censor it.

Daryl, exclamation points.

Yeah, great.

Hope you're good, comma, amigo, period.

I hate myself.

I really hate that I just read that.

Me too.

Would love for you to come on my show.

What would be the best dates for you?

Oh, wait, wait, wait.

That's a gym sales tactic.

Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.

You're backing him into a corner.

So in the first text,

send me dates.

That's the sales tactic.

You're supposed to go, is it better for you on a Monday or a Wednesday?

You offer them something so they don't feel like the third option of no thanks is available to them.

But Daryl Maury is well trained in the art of no thanks.

This is

wolf of Wall Street shit.

You're selling penny stocks here.

But here's the thing.

I followed up.

I followed up, beating my chest.

He didn't respond.

Rhythmically.

He didn't respond.

No,

after I said, what will be the best dates for you?

Question mark, I said, happy to work around your schedule.

Yeah, I bet.

You've been here with the three days.

Yeah, happy to work around your schedule.

This is your king.

I didn't really have a specific timeline.

I just wanted to have him on the show to talk about it was mid-season, obviously.

Yeah, no, you were chill.

You were super chill.

Seven hours later.

Oh, seven hours later.

Seven hours later.

Oh, cool.

Oh, cool.

No.

Oh, cool.

Cool, cool, cool.

Oh, cool.

Sick, sick.

Thank you for thinking of me.

Oh, no.

Wow.

Oh, Jesus.

This is one unbroken sentence, no punctuation.

Oh, God, damn it.

Let me coordinate with R PR.

So, first of all, he's already sending you back to PR.

He basically said, don't contact me, contact my PR.

That's exactly what he said.

How dare you come straight to me?

Oh, cool.

I can't find the Sixers thing with the art thing.

They deleted it.

But I think I furiously deleted it because they said something along the lines of, we're going to pass on this one.

Yeah.

The this one, really.

This one.

I remember that.

When there's a condescending PR email, I just

buy into a raid.

This one is internal language, I think.

I don't think the this one was supposed to make it out of the house.

It's an attempt to soften a blow, and in reality, it just sharpens.

Yeah, sharpens the I'm deeply unhappy with how things are going right now.

I actually kind of don't want to do this podcast anymore.

I have shit on my shoes.

You do have shit on your shoes.

You do.

Dog, I just got these.

It's crazy.

What?

I splash in it?

If If you can just zoom in, I don't know if we can get

exclusive.

I don't know if I'd get them at the right angle.

It's clearly s, Katie.

No, it isn't.

It's splashed up.

It's not clearly.

Is it?

It would smell.

I have a really powerful house.

It would smell.

Kev, does that smell like anything?

Can you smell that?

Ah, Kevin's gonna do it.

Do it.

For the good of the show.

It's not shit.

I can't believe you just did that.

I can't believe you.

I wanted to find out if I got a small shit.

You need to find out if you had dog on your shirt.

Are you getting up to smell?

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

It's not shit.

That might be shit.

No, it's not!

Kevin Clark is back on Share and Tell.

Magisterial.

Um, the mustache that Kevin Clark brought to us.

Thank you.

Um, I wanted to start, though, with a story actually related to what it's like when you show up in person looking a little different from how you expect it.

There is this article in the New York Times that is titled The TV Show That Predicted America's Lonely, Disorienting Digital Future.

And it's about the MTV reality series Catfish.

Shout out.

And I guess most of America actually encountered catfish as a term during, if you guys remember this, of course, the Mantai-Teo scandal.

Because

if we remember this.

If we remember this.

What?

Jax Warbrook, the athlete director of Notre Dame, had a press conference in which he talked about what happened to Mantai Teo and his, of course, fake girlfriend.

And he said this.

I would refer all of you, if you're not already familiar with it, with both the documentary called Catfish,

the MTV show, which is a derivative of that documentary.

and the sort of associated things you'll find online and otherwise about catfish or catfishing.

Yes.

Associated things you'll find online and otherwise.

That's a sentence that means absolutely nothing.

I think he's suggesting that we get catfished in order to.

Right.

He's like, maybe you should talk to a lady who's too hot to talk to you.

So that was 2013.

And Katie, I did not realize this.

Katie has, I think, watched more catfish than anybody else on the planet.

Here's the thing.

If you are of this current like young generation, you probably know MTV as the channel that plays that Rob Deerdeck show.

What's that?

Ridiculousness.

Ridiculousness all day or catfish all day.

And so when there's no, when it's not baseball season and I'm sitting at home jobless, not jobless, but jobless, and I need something to watch on like the background of TV, I usually will just put on catfish because it's just, it's one of those shows that has a formula and it hits all the beats of the formula.

So at any point, you can like

pay attention for two minutes and be like, oh, that's where we're at in the story.

And then you can get right back to what you're doing.

It does not distract you too much.

It's very good background television.

The basic premise of the term catfish is also kind of interesting, insofar as the documentary, the way it got coined, is about some quote that someone said in the dock.

It's a very like complicated and stupid metaphor, but basically, let me find it.

It's about fish, right?

So he tells a story about how

he tells a story about how cod

were shipped by boat in vats from Alaska to China, but the fish would arrive mushy and tasteless, right?

And so eventually these fish people added catfish to the vats alongside the cod because they would like nip at them and basically keep them stimulated.

And so the quote in the doc is, there are these people who are catfish in life.

They keep you guessing, they keep you thinking, they keep you fresh.

So that's just the origin of a term that is now universally known as this thing.

I'm sorry, that doesn't make any sense.

Exactly.

I know.

I thought they were exactly with the cod inside the catfish.

Or that they pretended that the catfish were the cot.

Yeah.

None of that.

No, no, so none of that.

So it doesn't.

Did you see that documentary?

Yes.

Theaters.

I did too because the marketing for it was really good.

I remember it was like

time collapses upon itself in my brain, but it wasn't that far after Blair Witch in the sense that it gave

it,

but it wasn't.

that far after.

When did the doc collapse?

Blair Witch was named in 99.

99.

Catfish on the side.

Was it 2005?

2010.

Oh, shit.

So it was further.

Okay, see, time collapse is on self-my brain.

I said that.

I will say the filmmakers of Blair Witch are from Orlando.

It's possible.

I was an early adopter.

God, I always forget that you're from there, and then you immediately remind me.

Oh, yeah, we would never want to build an identity around a hometown.

It marketed itself.

You would never do that.

I did it, and I'm proud of it.

Yours is nothing to be proud of.

I'm extremely proud.

Kitty walked in here with a bag of Dunkin' Donuts.

Whatever.

Anyway.

So it might have ended there, if not for the entrepreneurialism, I suppose, of Niamh Shulman, who got this co-host.

I guess it was Max at the time.

Yes.

That guy Max.

Yep.

But has since had a rotating series of co-hosts.

I think Max was like, this has run its course.

And Niamh was like, no, it has not.

Neve was like, this elevator is still unsafe.

Someone needs to let the people know.

But I suppose that the thing about this show is that it did sort of presage to the article's premise

a lot about what it would be like to interact with people on the internet.

Just like constantly being lied to and then discovering upon

actually physically encountering them how they are not what they promised themselves to be.

And there's a clip from Catfish.

There are so many great episodes.

So many.

I think people get the gist of what happens in it.

This is the clip that I think of.

Come here, we're going to talk.

Yeah, we ain't really, we ain't got to.

We don't talk, baby.

You kidding me?

You can still be my chocolate kiss, too.

You don't forget about that, baby.

Come on.

Come on.

Do you know this kid?

Do you know this kid?

No, I don't know this.

Are you Jess?

Yeah, I'm Jess.

You're Jess?

Yeah.

Man,

what, man?

Come on, the guy's got a family and he's talking to me.

He thinks he's talking to some bride.

But he did think he was talking to a girl.

Exactly.

Right.

Avon crutches.

You're a good actress.

Sure, I like that.

Yeah, why not?

Sure, I like that.

Oh,

how hard it is.

What's your name, by the way?

You skipped that.

My name's Justin.

I want to

take a stab at this.

Sure.

You're gay.

Obviously, I'm not gay.

Well, not so obvious.

I mean,

you are pretending to be a girl online and having a romantic relationship with a guy, so.

I give it to you.

You got me there.

Right.

Okay.

Maybe.

Maybe.

What it was to begin with.

You never thought of it that way.

It was a joke, this fake profile, just playing around with people, whatnot.

I didn't think anything too much of it until, you know, honestly, I started seeing guys like him who were already in a relationship.

So I was like, you know what?

I kind of have this power to use it for something, use it for good.

What I had with him was a little bit personal, and obviously, you guys got a taste of that.

What my message is to tell people: look, you can't just around on relationships that you're in.

You felt like it was your job to sort of teach him a lesson.

Is that my clue?

I'm just want to make sure I understand.

Yes.

You guys were having some sexual.

Oh, yeah.

Yeah.

I want to kiss a real man.

Same girl.

Christ.

Yeah.

A couple things here.

Let's hear them.

I've never seen this show.

You've never?

No.

Not an episode.

Not an episode.

The only reason I know that guy is from the meme.

Really?

And I don't know if the crutches, that was like a temporary thing or was he always on crutches?

Temporary, but I mean, mentally, they're all the time.

I do like the sort of like the detective work.

I'm going to take a stab at this.

And then it's the most obvious sh you've ever heard in your entire life.

I thought that was amazing.

I'm going to, like you become addicted to the shit.

It's good.

They try to schedule a meetup between the two.

And then the big reveals at the end when they...

they are waiting, usually in a park.

Sometimes they go to a person's house and they like confront them.

And there's like the, they go right to commercial as the door is about to open or as the car is pulling up and you're about to find out, is it really them?

In all the episodes I've watched, I think it's been really them three times that I've seen.

Most times you get somebody that is socially awkward,

who

has clearly either insecurity issues, like they are uncomfortable with the way that they look,

or they're like weirdly like manipulative and antisocial in that way.

Like I've seen girls.

I've got a fat guy that we saw before.

And there's a girl who gets confronted and she can't stop laughing.

It's very uncomfortable for the viewer where she's like, I do it because it's fun.

And you're like, oh, it's brutal to watch.

So what does this article say that it

casts?

Yeah.

So basically,

presages.

Sorry, was the word you used, Harvard?

I think presages really does tell the story here.

But there was a student.

I was texting you.

What's so important?

I was texting Cortez.

I want photos for Instagram.

Great.

Great.

The study.

Honesty is the best policy.

What are you going to do?

Lie there and be like, I'm responding.

Yeah, I'm being catfished as we do.

Get my good side.

Good beautiful girl, won't you?

Get the good side of this mustache.

The study that they cited here speaks to the way that this is not just limited.

God damn it, Cortez.

Are you serious?

I didn't know he was going to pick up that.

This is going to leave Shelman.

We're trying to do that.

God stands standing here.

I apologize on behalf of Cortez.

Well, this unfortunately embodies the study that I was going to cite because the study is about how everybody has fallen victim to a scam like this, or at least to a degree that is stunning.

So there's this one study, University of New Hampshire, 1,100 adults were surveyed, about 70% described themselves as a victim of a catfishing scam.

What?

What?

70%.

70%.

And so look, the degree to which one says, hey, I got catfish, I assume there are degrees of this, right?

But clearly, this is a thing that people,

yeah, have encountered.

So I think there's so you mentioned the degrees.

There's so many, but we all get DMs now that are just like, hey, I got one yesterday that said hi are you a boxer and I'm just like I don't where is this going yeah and so I think we all get so that I don't know what did you say what did I say I've been that swears texting yeah um no but like that's why you needed the pictures yeah I think there is

but I think there is an element of like if you get that are you being catfished you just don't respond and you move on with your life but then there are people who have emotional like weeks long or they get their money stolen it's also just the forerunner of how we're all presenting ourselves online

But it doesn't sound like either of you guys have actually been victimized by catfish.

No, I have friends in real life, so I don't need to do weird excursions.

It's a very painful way of thought.

Because I was going to say, I think that it comes down to like, I think we're very lonely right now.

I think people are isolated more so than we think.

I think the pandemic made that worse.

And so I think that people are very vulnerable to

being preyed upon their emotions and like being told that they're loved and wanted.

They're so hungry for that that they look past what seems to us on the outside like very obvious indicators of a scam.

They're like, no, no, no, but it's different for me, but it's not, but it's, I don't blame them for that for falling for it.

I think, and I've read a little bit about like people are okay being lied to in some situations.

Like before the internet, there was a wave of guys who like pretended to be famous people and just just were not.

Like I remember in Orlando, famously, someone pretended to be former Orlando magic forward jeff turner for years and was just like that's that's me like i think rothesberger did that as well i think rothesberger had a had like a had like a guy who like in ohio was like i'm ben rothesberger everybody in like 2004.

and people were like oh yeah okay

remember fake clay thompson Yeah, but this that wasn't a scam.

That was just to get attention.

I think some people are.

What were they scamming?

They're like scamming women or like, hey, let me live with you.

I think that was the real Ben Rothes favorite, honestly.

But that's just my look at at this up.

Fake Ben Rotheser.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

All right.

A man claimed to be Ben Rothesberger and Brian St.

Pierre.

Do they look alike?

I don't know.

Brian Jackson dated two women by pretending to be both of these folks, was charged with harassment for continuing to talk to both women.

Jackson often talked of his teammates and offered to autograph footballs for neighborhood kids.

So what I'm saying is, I mean, neighborhood kids are coming up to fake Brian St.

Pierre or fake Brian Rothsburg and be like, here you go, please autograph a ball.

Like some people just like being lied to.

What I will ask is that what is the difference between

there's some scamming involved here, but like I do believe at some point, if not already, people are like probably going to be into the idea of like dating AI.

The her.

So let's, yeah,

let's go to the present tense, which is I am constantly, look, my audience.

Is it better to be scammed?

Like

you're talking to a real person or you're just doing the her thing and you're talking to a bot.

If only what I've seen from AI-generated,

typically, I guess in my algorithm, women in my for you page,

if only they were as complicated.

I beg your part.

I've seen men in my for you page.

I don't get anybody in my, I get in my replies, I get a lot of bio, sure, but I'm not getting a lot of like men made in a factory trying to seduce me.

Yeah, my for you page is people mad about Columbia University right now.

All different.

Mine is always like public fights that I don't want to watch.

Yeah, I do get a lot of cafeteria fights.

Yeah.

I get a lot of like, check out this Karen.

You're like, what?

Should I?

But wait, are you guys unfamiliar then with the whole notion that there are like wildly popular pages full of AI generated women who are clearly AI?

Oh my God.

What are you clicking on, Pablo?

Look, they are very, very popular pages.

And it's unclear to me, to Kevin's point, whether people are all being fooled by this or whether whether they're just in

the case.

And might even prefer it,

prefer the idea of being sold a fiction that is, I guess, giving them what they want, which is entirely

specific to

a surface-level sort of relationship.

Do these feel like relationships?

These feel like people that are interacting, or is it just like, look at these boobies?

All right, let me see if it's a good idea.

Because when it comes to look at these boobies, I don't think men

for work.

I don't think men feel like they need to know the woman's real in order to have the boobies make them feel a certain type of way okay so here's one

okay so meet Aitana oh itana's first AI model I mean she's beautiful she's earning 10,000 euros a month she never has to shave her armpits they just come like that look at those boobies she's 25 yep I'm glad they specified I mean Aitana 25 a pink-haired woman from Barcelona receives weekly private messages from celebrities asking her out sorry celebrity Name and shame.

What do you mean, Itana?

I would be afraid to DM an AI bot just because I'd be afraid it was like a

some sort of like a government thing to then they could like expose that we're gonna publish Itana's DMs and you're like no no no no no no who's trusting a robot to keep their weird kinky secrets the creator says this quote one day a well-known Latin American actor texted to ask her out this actor has got five million followers and some of our team watched his TV series when they were kids

He had no idea Itana didn't exist.

Wow.

What does Aitana's bio say?

I'm not real.

I'm not real.

And the men just don't check because they see those talks.

They see those tater tots.

He's on it.

This is how he ends up with the For You page.

He's on Aitana's Instagram right now.

Send her a DM.

Itana Lopez, 310,000 followers.

Virtual soul.

Virtual Soul.

Virtual Soul.

Digital Creator is her occupation.

Barcelona's digital muse.

Yeah.

What does that mean?

Powered by AI.

Powered by AI.

It says she's a gamer.

At heart.

At heart.

And a fitness lover.

And a fitness lover.

And there are some boobies, just to be very.

Are they naked boobies, Pablo?

No, they're clothed.

But they go out past her friends.

Like that's

why the guys are sending DMs.

Right, because they want to see the

DMs.

Do you think she sends

the

you should chat with her and say, how about those playoffs, huh?

Yeah, 50% discount if I put in this promo code.

Oh, it costs money.

Yeah.

Oh, yeah.

To send her a message on Telegram.

This is a scam.

Why do so many people do it?

You should stop seeing this one.

Should I click on the link that says sensitive content?

No.

Continue.

I wouldn't.

You're on MetaLark Wi-Fi.

Are you in a.

Are you in a private browser?

Oh, this is like a...

This is like a Patreon.

This is like an OnlyFans.

Yeah.

Or what I've told is an OnlyFans.

Yeah, good, Pablo.

Good save.

Has the behavior of an OnlyFans.

Sure.

It's all blurred out.

Oh, well.

So.

Pay the $9.99.

I'm going to follow for free.

I'm going to stop signing up for this.

Free?

I am.

He's like, I'm going to take this personal.

I'm going to make this research.

I'm going to finish the research out my head.

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I'm going to read the headline and then I'm going to go into the story.

So here's the headline.

And I don't, I would love for it all to be a slow reveal, but the headline is just so good.

I sent it to Pablo on Friday or Saturday night at like 9 p.m.

I saw it and I said, This is what I want to talk about.

This is what I want to do with my life.

The headline is, and it's from fightful.com.

The Undertaker, colon, a seven-year-old named Bjorn threatened to shoot me in the face and called me a Democrat.

Now, there's a couple things here.

Number one is that I feel like, and maybe this is just me

not seeing it, I feel like there's a lack of just total shithead kids anymore.

Because when I, like, you'd always see like seven-year-olds, you know, in like 1999, and they were just absolute tater.

Do you play video games online?

I don't.

What's going on there?

A lot.

Oh, they're indoors now.

That's the thing.

Yeah, the kids are inside.

They used to be a park stuff.

Yeah, like Dennis the Menace stuff.

Yeah, yeah, there's no more.

Dennis the Menace now is in a house saying racist stuff on chess.

Yes,

yes, yes, yes.

No, well, if Katie speaks, they go, Oh, it's a girl.

Oh, show me your booby.

Like, you know, they don't say boobies, but I do a lot in this podcast.

Let's get into the story here.

It's a five-minute story.

Cortez was upset that it's so long we can't just play the entire video.

Yeah, we'll, it is tempting, though.

It is an unbelievable story.

So, one of someone on the WWE security team tells, is it WrestleMania a couple weeks ago, tells Undertaker, who,

and more power to him, refers to himself as the Undertaker many times in this story.

His name is Mark, I believe it's Mark Calloway.

I believe it's Mark.

Mark William Calloway, age 59.

59-year-old.

So

one of the security detail guys

is a former Navy SEAL.

His son is a huge fan.

Now, his son,

is named Bjorn, as we discussed.

And

the former Navy SEAL does not want the Undertaker to call him because he just wants to be professional about it.

You know, I told the guy, I said, hey, I said,

I hear your son's

a fan.

I said, would you like me to call him?

And he was like, oh, no, no, don't worry.

You know, he was just totally professional.

And I was like, no, it's okay.

I said, you know, I know, you know, I know Larry.

Larry sent me a text and he was like, man, he goes, no,

he's still trying to get out.

I said, just let me FaceTime him real quick.

And, you know, and he goes, well,

I can't FaceTime him.

And I'm like, okay.

And he says, but if you would call him, that would be awesome.

And I was like, yeah.

The dad says, you can't FaceTime him.

Okay.

Red flag.

So he gets on the phone and says, Bjorn, this is the Undertaker.

And he says, hey, Undertaker, how are you?

Undertaker starts to mess with him and say, it sounds like you're getting in trouble at home.

So I start messing with him.

Like I do everybody, right?

I was like, Bjorn, it sounds like to me you're you're you're you're getting in some kind of trouble at home, aren't you?

He goes, No, I'm not getting in any trouble.

I said, No, I'm pretty sure it sounds like you're in, you're up to something.

I don't know what it is, but I can tell you're you're doing something you shouldn't be doing.

He goes, I'm not, I'm not doing anything I'm not supposed to be doing.

You're doing something you're not supposed to be doing.

I was like, No,

and then this kid, this seven-year-old kids go, Hey,

I'll shoot you right in the face.

I about lost it, right?

I said, what?

You're going to shoot me?

And now his dad is like, is mortified, right?

He is just like, oh my gosh, I've put him on the phone.

Now he's threatening the Undertaker.

So anyway, so I thought, you're not going to shoot me in the face.

I'm going to shoot you in the face, right?

So now I'm having an argument with the seven-year-old about shooting him in the face, which I probably shouldn't be talking about this.

It was all in good fun.

Yeah, yeah, you had to be, You had to be there, be there for them all.

So anyway, so we're going back and forth right now.

And then all of a sudden out of nowhere, he goes,

well, you're a Democrat.

And I'm like, I'm a Democrat.

Where did that come from?

What does that mean to you?

There's a couple things here.

I wouldn't, there's bricking the conversation,

which you would do like,

like, he got so excited that he misread this.

Bjorn got so excited, he misread the situation and ended up threatening to shoot the audience.

Named after a Viking, by the way.

In the family.

I feel like Bjorn was like,

this guy comes back from the dead, so let's see what's up.

I feel like Bjorn was being accused of some wrongdoing.

Bjorn, being seven, definitely has done something wrong within the past week.

This dude is with his dad, and so he's like,

I have to back this guy down, or he's going to tell my dad about the bad stuff I did.

Because when you tell a seven-year-old, you know what they've been up to, the first thing they think is is like

I have been up to some stuff it's like the who who was the comedian that had just as an experiment had everybody send their significant other a text that just said I haven't been completely honest with you yeah and then just saw what the person would respond what their significant other would respond with yeah that's basically what taker did to be honored yes I was afraid when I was first watching the video that the little kid was going to be like, yeah, I took some money from my mom.

Like, he was going to admit the thing he did.

I mean, he did something far worse.

Guilty conscience is what you detect.

He's a violent seven-year-old.

Yeah, I didn't know he was going to shoot.

Politically violent.

And also, you know, if you shoot The Undertaker in the face, he's just going to come back.

It's not going to do it.

Maybe that's the problem.

You can't be a big fan of The Undertaker and not know that shooting him in the face isn't going to get you anywhere.

The Undertaker in 2020 donated $7,000 to Donald Trump.

I mean, $7,000?

What's the point?

I mean,

that's the federal maximum for an

in-character wrestler.

Oh, okay.

Taker LLC.

Beyond the specifics of the Undertaker arguing with a seven-year-old about who should be shot in the face or not, it does raise the question of like,

when you were kids, were there people that you were so excited to meet

that you had,

you know, this memory that, yeah, continues to persist?

I was an altar server.

The priest,

this is not where this is going.

Okay.

Spoiler alert.

This ends

without indicting the Catholic Church.

Sure.

Sure.

The priest was the team chaplain of the New York Yankees.

Huh.

And so, what a thrill for me, native New Yorker, giant Yankee fan, to be an altar server.

And our parish priest is the team chaplain of the New York Yankees.

Okay.

And I say, Father McMahon,

I would love an autograph from my favorite New York Yankee, Derek Cheter.

Unique, interesting pick.

Good one.

And

weeks later, I get a signed,

like, I think it was like,

what was it?

It was, oh, it was a team program.

And it says on the program, I still have this.

It says, whatever best wishes

to Pablo Torre.

from Derek Cheter.

And the disappointment is that he misspelled my last name.

He spelled it T-O-R-E.

Excuse me.

T-O-R-E.

Pablo Tor.

Yeah.

Which was disappointing to me because his manager

last name.

What do you mean?

Me, Joe Torre.

And he

bricked the interaction.

Yeah.

Derek Jeter bricked the autograph.

All right, so I have.

And I resent him.

Okay, why was he putting last names on?

I don't know.

And also best wishes to a child is what I'm saying.

Best wishes to Pablo.

Yeah.

Hey, Pablo.

Hey, Pablo.

Thanks for watching, buddy.

thanks for watching go yank hey amigo go yanks pal did he break the interaction more or less than you with daryl mori oh boy

neither of us emerged looking great i don't remember how old i was i did meet nadia komenich she was the first uh gymnast to get a perfect 10 yeah um

And I just remembered telling her I liked her and she put her arm around me.

And she, look, as a little kid,

I had a tragic haircut.

I had a little boy haircut.

And so.

Did we get a photo of this?

No.

And so I feel like at any point in any interaction with any adult, I got immediate sympathy because I think they knew that, like, what, this poor kid doesn't want this haircut.

Their mom is making them do this.

There's no way they're the most popular kid among their friends.

So they always gave me the like, oh, like they, I always got that energy as a child because I think they were like, what a precocious young lady who looks like a news anchor.

Yeah.

And so that's basically the energy.

I had that being a fat kid.

Yeah.

Like I was always

Stephanie McMahon.

We can do a Stephanie McMahon photo, which will tie into the era of WWE I watch.

Also a photo of Vince McMahon cannot put that photo up anymore.

No, but I'm alarmingly fat in both photos.

But I was always the kid who like, I'd get like, you know, as a big hockey fan, I'm when they flipped the puck too because I looked so fat and childish.

I'm currently a fan of the New York Rangers.

I was a fan of the Orlando Solar Bears when I was a kid.

Solar Bears.

Like polar bears?

No, I just said solar bears.

But for the sun.

I'm not drawing the connection.

Yeah.

All right.

And so I was a big fan of the solar bears growing up.

I love that.

But you were saying, as a hockey fan?

Oh, and so I'd always be the guy where they were like, oh, yeah,

we're going to give the puck or the stick to this kid because he's fat and he's not having a good go of it, you can tell.

And so I'd always clean up that one.

Yes.

You're so cute.

Wait, wait, wait.

Let me see it again.

He's not flipping a puck to that kid.

The fact that you're also wearing like a big polo shirt.

Yeah.

It's like, this little gentleman's working.

He's working out an offback.

The big polo is back.

The polo bears.

The solar bears.

Yeah, the big polo bears.

All right, Katie.

All right.

What'd you got?

Mine's depressing because it's kind of about our lives.

Oh, no.

It's an article in the New York Times.

Ever heard of it?

By John Coblin.

Rhymes with Goblin.

I'm assuming, I'm guessing.

He's Koblin.

Damn it.

I really wanted it to rhyme with Goblin.

Goblin.

Why?

Goblin?

Well, because what's a Goblin?

Goblin's.

It's a Ghoul to a Goblin.

That's right.

Americans New TV have it.

Subscribe, watch, cancel, repeat.

So basically, they're talking about how something like 40% of these streaming services user base is now subscribing when there's a show they want to watch.

and then canceling when there isn't something that they want to watch at that.

So they'll be like, we want to watch, one of the examples they use is a guy who, him and his wife want to watch Poker Face on Peacock.

So they subscribe and they tell each other, like, look, if we're not watching this after a couple weeks, we're going to cancel Peacock.

We do not need to, we have every streaming service known to man.

It's silly to have another one.

So that's apparently the younger generations.

That's like the default almost for their behavior with these apps because a lot of those generations, as we know and we've been told, they're not buying cable.

They're signing up for all these different streaming services.

And because it's so easy to cancel these streaming services,

people will just cancel them when they don't need them and then resubscribe when there's a show that they want to watch.

Cancel culture.

This is a story about cancel culture.

Exactly what cancel culture is.

So these streaming services are now having to try to, they can't ignore this anymore because it's not just like a niche thing happening.

It's like a huge section of their user base.

So they're trying to find ways to combat this.

And one of the ways,

as we all saw saw coming is that they're like reinventing the idea of cable so they want to package with other streaming companies so that if you you're less likely to do this if when you sign up for let's say hulu you're also getting espn plus and whatever the disney plus

there those people are less likely to cancel because they're getting access to more things a lot of companies are thinking about doing that and also offering channels where you can just go and at any time it's like i know peacock does this amazon does it with mgm There's like pre-here's the thing that I've always said, because I still have my cape, my cord.

I did not cut it.

Yeah, same thing.

Because for me, it was just like, well, sports will always be on the TV.

I'll never have to be like, where do I find this?

It's got to be on TV.

I know that probably won't be the case soonish.

And sometimes, especially during the pandemic, I reached a point where I was like, I don't want to have to pick every time I sit down what I'm going to watch.

I want to be able to just go, catfish, go to some channel that has already been chosen.

catfish is probably a bad example because whoever's programming mtv is really just picking those one of those two shows um easy job easy job i want somebody to pick what i'm gonna watch and then i have to choose from my options instead of being like you can watch everything available to you what would you like to watch well there's also the reason channels are valuable is because watching 20 minutes of something and then that's it you're just like oh i'm just gonna watch 20 minutes all right it's commercial and out like that's a hugely valuable experience that we've lost zoomers will never understand watching 20 minutes of saving private Ryan in the middle, kind of forgetting what goes before and after it, and then moving on.

Yes.

Look, something that comes up every time I begin to complain or get asked about questions or complain or get asked about like, why is the industry going this way?

It's like, well, because they killed cable television.

Yeah.

Or because they almost killed cable television to the point where some of us still have it, but the rest of us.

are left trying to cop you you are both on your phones right now i'm doing it because this is my article and i need to to make sure i don't miss any of the important points in it i don't know why kevin's been doing it the entire episode i'm doing it because a i'm working today uh b

I have a short attention span the the the short attention span though is entirely why um it feels like people are presuming cable needs to go away and then everyone's realizing because the business that replaced cable is not nearly as good as cable oh

we got to bring cable back

and it's i mean i don't know if people outside of sports media specifically acutely understand this in the way that I think is very obvious, people who do work inside of it.

But like ESPN, as John Skipper likes to say on the sporting class, the show I do with them here at Metal Arc Media, ESPN was the greatest business model in the history of media.

Even though ESPN, you're talking about it, and you are correct on that, I still don't think they're the biggest beneficiaries.

Biggest beneficiaries are like the weird baseball, like $9 a month team-owned channels, like the Yes Network, like whatever.

There's like 25 of them now.

And basically, baseball is completely propped up by cable television, by these local things.

That's why, like, the collapse of Bally over last year was such a big deal.

And why I'm actually pretty nervous about baseball's future is it literally the so much of it relies on the ability to bilk San Diegans out of $7 a month.

And so, like, ESPN, I think, will survive much better than those channels.

But it's still the same thing, which is non-sports fans paying for for the enjoyment of sports fans.

And what people are realizing to the point of the story is that it is now so expensive that they are cycling through subscriptions like they're flipping through channels.

And the promise of, of course, streaming was that when you're in an a la carte system, which you choose to pay for what you want to eat as opposed to paying for a bunch of stuff that you never watch, you're going to pay less.

And it's going to be easier.

And none of those things have really come true.

It's the way that technology is constantly disrupting things only to then sell you a worse version of the thing they disrupted.

Yeah.

It's like, oh, we're back to cable television.

Cool.

I swear to God, I'm not, I bought my first DVD in 20 years today.

I didn't know they were still doing those.

It's a Blu-ray.

That's sick.

Well, it's the assassination of Jesse James by the Coward Robert Ford, an amazing movie that I just wanted to watch very badly last night.

And I've had this urge many times, and it was like 12 bucks to buy on Amazon.

No place was having a stream, but it streams all the time, but it's one of those that comes off and then comes back on and comes off and comes back on.

And so, how did you play this?

How do you plan on playing this DVD?

I have an Xbox.

Yeah.

Yeah.

That's what those are.

I don't get on the chats to find out about the racist seven-year-olds.

Yeah.

But I do.

I do.

You're using an Xbox in the oldest possible way.

I also like play FIFA.

Anyway, so I literally, it's the same thing where I was just like, I'm tired of every six months being like, where is the streaming?

And if not, paying $2

to buy it, I'm just going to buy a $12 DVD.

I am doing exactly what this is, where it's physical media, cable, bring back 2001.

Well, it's kind of like a parallel to how vinyl also has made a comeback in recent decades relative to the arc of it.

It's because people have been so frustrated by Napster and the domino effects of streaming music that they're like, we people have become, and I think understandably,

like apocalypse preppers.

where it's like, I don't trust this shit to exist and survive.

And so I need my own collection of physical things to put into my pyramid to be buried with so I have access to it for as long as I can.

Well, it's also, sorry, you got it.

I was going to say it's also true of digital media and writing, where a lot of people save everything they've ever written because they have no faith that a private equity company

is just gone.

Truly is like, is

unreadable.

Unreadable.

Well, it's unreadable.

There are some articles by Pablo Torrey that have never been readable, but now like literally physically.

Now they're actually undermined.

It's also that

if you take out the capitalism of it all and you were just to look at the like okay back then we used to have to watch things when they were on tv we had no way of recording it or controlling when we could watch what we wanted to watch and then we've evolved to a place where you can watch anything you want at any time taking the money out of it that sounds like progress but then you remember that the people who were making money off the old model want to make even more money off the new model and they make it to a point where now i can't we don't own anything you have to pay for the ability to access any of the things you want to watch you can never just like go watch them.

And they've gotten to the point where they're getting rid of somebody.

Best Buy just recently was like, we're done with physical media.

We're not selling it anymore.

And I would bet if this keeps going, we would get our next generation of like PlayStations or Xboxes won't even have that slot in them the way that laptops no longer have, unless you specifically ask for it, a CD drive.

Like they're phasing out physical media and causing you to have to pay.

David Zaslov, that's how you got to say that's idiotic.

He's got a court side of Madison Square Garden.

He just, he got a race.

He got a raise.

He got a raise.

And he canceled shows that were made or movies that were made and did not run them because it helped, it was more beneficial for them on the tax side.

And he got a raise.

He made 49.7 million compared with 39.3 million the year before.

Like media is going, like less has been made.

And that guy's making more than he made the year before.

And that should not be the way that it works.

The people that are in charge of giving us the content don't touch the content, have nothing to do with the making of it and are not in any way incentivized to make good content and that scares the

that seems funny that scares the out of me the cancellation part of this is also interesting to me because cancellation look so kevin's wife works for the wall street journal

i subscribe to the wall street journal Part of the reason I subscribe is because I once tried to cancel the Wall Street Journal and it was too difficult.

It's like a gym.

We send some goons to your house.

Well, what they make you do, and I think this is a smart thing, truly, and it's worth paying for in all honesty, of course.

It's that defending Rupert Murdoch and Love You Journal.

They're a good product.

He needs the money.

I need the money.

Kevin, Teddy needs the money.

Teddy needs the money.

But the reality is what they make you do is jump through hoops.

You have to call a number.

You can't just click on a link.

You have to call a number.

Yes.

And so it's like canceling cable.

And none of that to be a coincidence, given the conversation we just had.

The point is, make it difficult for you to to get rid of something because that's what they're going to do.

They're so desperate.

That's this article made me go like, ah, they're going to, they're going to now go, well, if you same way Netflix was like, oh, you can only use this in one household and you have to name your, now they're going to be like, canceling is actually really difficult.

I need to look this up.

There's a huge, um,

there's a huge percentage of AOL's revenue that comes from people just never canceling.

Yeah, that's like gyms.

Like not canceling in 2004 and being like,

I don't know.

I don't know what's going on.

1.5 million people still paying a monthly subscription to AOL.

I I should point out 1.5 million people as of 2021.

And what they get in exchange for their subscription service fee is

technical support and identity theft software.

Oh, God, they love to sell old people on identity theft software.

They're like, listen, people out here want to be you.

Don't let them be.

They say dark web and identity theft.

Old people are like, take my money.

Brian St.

Pierre needs some of that.

But the

artists.

The one thing.

Artists need some of that.

The one thing is that if you are buying identity software, identity theft software from AOL, it is likely too late.

Yeah, it is likely that you've been stolen many times.

Yep.

Yeah, I want to reserve the domain name of

Anerica online, like one letter off, and just sell people fake identity theft software.

That sounds illegal.

All right, what did we find out today, guys?

Oh, God, so much.

We learned, we learned what here today.

We learned.

I'm surprised I didn't anticipate that the head seven-year-olds were all indoors playing video calling Warzone.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

That's why you got to keep your kid off that for a while.

I want my kid to be a huge baseball fan because when I was watching a lot of baseball, I was pretty big dork.

Because you can't, if you're watching baseball, it's like 162

and

you're like reading, you know, you're reading Bill James and stuff, you know?

Yeah.

And then you just never really get

the baseball little kids are all right.

Did you see that clip the other day of a kid?

Go to the tape

of the kid trying to get to his seat and the lady's got her legs up and she

asks her to move and she won't move her feet.

He like yells at her in a really he like owns her in a kind of respectful way.

Was it Bjorn?

Way.

It was Bjorn.

And he said, I'm going to shoot you in the face.

And she said, I'm a Republican.

And then they hugged.

It's weird.

Baseball kids are all right.

Baseball's good for kids.

How about gamer kids?

Not as good.

No, I mean, they can be if their parents would just like, I don't know, be in the same room as them when they game and go, hey, maybe we don't say that word.

What did I learn today?

I learned that there are people who've never seen the show Catfish.

I didn't know that you guys still existed.

I was watching baseball.

Yeah.

I told you.

That's fair.

That is fair.

I was watching 2000.

Did you see the report the other day?

Joey Koch closing out games for the White Sox.

Did you see the report the other day that a lot of streaming services are trying to come up with second screen content, which used to mean stuff that was happening on your phone while you were watching TV.

Now it means stuff that happens on TV while you're on your phone.

So they found that people

were like too, they didn't want things that had too deep of a plot or that needed too much of your attention because they were mostly scrolling their phone, but they did want something to play in the background, which is what I explained.

Catfish was for me.

But these places are now trying to program that.

The reason I watch a lot of history channel documentaries is that I am just not paying attention at all, kind of like me on this show today, where I'm just on the phone.

And the that was a joke, I am paying attention to this show.

I know you think I'm on my phone the whole time, but I'm debating.

You literally have been on your phone this entire show.

That's not true.

People can watch this.

Tally up how many times, how often I was on my phone.

Please turn up

at the bottom of the screen every time.

I was scrolling.

I was buying DVDs.

What I found out today is that Kevin Clark, despite being on his phone this entire episode,

has the oldest possible interests.

Yeah.

Truly.

I think we knew that.

You just did.

He was about to lie.

I cut him off accidentally now

before he could explain why he's into the history channel.

With the docs.

Because the history channel, like the actual channel on camera.

You're a pre-Republican.

You're like, you're in the early stages.

You got to subscribe to the history vault on Amazon Prime.

That's where you get the good stuff.

That's where you get get the goods.

That's where you learn about wars.

Yep, wars and presidents.

They get the best wars.

They paywall the best wars.

They really do.

Yeah, only fans, but for tanks.

You're the panzer.

Only pans.

Blurred out.

Only pans.

Now we're only pans.

Only pans.

There it is.

Wow.

We got there.

Check your phone.

That's for all the people who help make this show what it is, a paywall-worthy product that we give you for free.

Pablo Torre Fides Out is produced by Michael Antonucci, Ryan Cortez, Sam Dawig, Juan Galindo, Patrick Kim, Neely Loman, Rachel Miller-Howard, Ethan Schreier, Carl Scott, Matt Sullivan, Chris Tumanello, and Juliet Warren.

Our studio engineering by RG Systems, our post-production by NGW Post, our theme song, as always, by John Bravo.

We will talk to you on Tuesday.