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Hello, hello, revisionist history listeners.

We're having a very exciting week here at Pushkin.

You know that I'm Canadian, right?

We actually fly a big Maple Leaf flag here at Pushkin HQ.

Well, this week, we added another Canadian.

The great Jonathan Goldstein, native of Quebec, has brought his acclaimed narrative series Heavyweight to the Pushkin Network.

Oh,

Canada,

our home and native land.

True patriot love

in all our hearts command.

Jonathan and the Heavyweight team represent everything we believe in here at Pushkin, the power of storytelling, the value of intelligence and emotion, the belief that Canadians can and should dominate all aspects of American culture.

Heavyweight examines personal histories and resentments.

It tries to heal old wounds and in the process reminds us of our shared humanity.

Yes, it's that good.

We're dropping the first ever episode here in the feed about Jonathan's quest to reconcile his father with his estranged brother, Buzz.

Enjoy, and there is much, much, much more to come.

And if you want to listen to more heavyweight, which I'm sure you do, check out the show notes for the Revitionist History Team's favorite episodes.

From Gimlet Media, this is Jonathan Goldstein, your old pal.

Is that what it's called?

Gimlet?

Gimlet Media?

That's correct.

It sounds like Giblets, the inside of a chicken, like all the innards.

Well, everybody loves giblets.

You.

Oh, shit, they're my kids.

Hey, guys, I'm up here.

Do you know what my new podcast is about?

No, I don't know anything about it.

Each week, I travel into people's pasts to help them repair something that's been troubling them.

Mm-hmm.

I'm sort of like a therapist.

Like a therapist.

So

yeah.

Do you find that funny?

I just think supportive.

That's the laughter of support.

I think it's great.

I think it's great.

Do you have any questions for me about what my show is and what it's going to be like?

What's the name of your show?

What's the name of your show?

Yes, we're going to go now, but Jonathan's just about to tell me the name of his new show.

And as soon as he tells me, I'm going to bang down on him in five minutes.

No, no, wait.

Do you remember when we used to do that?

Yes, hang up the phone on each other.

Okay, ready?

Yes, Dad.

The name of the show is Heavyweight.

Heavyweight.

You get it?

Two, one.

No, it's not.

Time to say goodbye.

Hello?

Hello.

From Gimlet Media, I'm Jonathan Goldstein, and this is Heavyweight.

Today's episode, Buzz.

Hello?

Hey, Dad.

Hi, Johnny.

Hey, how you doing?

Good, you?

Good, good.

Good Yumtiv.

Shanatova.

Aksamech.

Aksamech.

What's that mean?

I'm not sure.

Oh, oh.

This is my father, Buzz.

I'm calling him at his home in Montreal.

And the reason we're talking crazy talk is because it's Yom Kippur, the Jewish Day of Atonement.

which seems as good a day as any to talk with him about forgiveness.

So I wanted to I wanted to ask you something and I just wanted to gauge your interest.

How would you feel about paying your brother Sheldon a visit?

I have no feelings.

I'm not really interested.

You're not?

No.

My father Buzz is 80 and his brother Sheldon, his only sibling, is 85.

And for the past 40 years, they've pretty much been on the outs.

My father lives in Montreal, and Sheldon lives in Florida, and the last time they saw each other, over 20 years ago, was at their mother's funeral when they had a fight over the details of the arrangements.

Since then, they've hardly spoken.

It worries me because there's not a lot of time left, and I don't want my father to have regrets.

When the subject of his brother comes up, as it often has over the years, my father feels competing things.

He grows angry or defensive, but other times he'll become sad and remorseful.

And it's the sorrow and the remorse that I like best, because it's these feelings that I believe speak to his better self, the self I want to encourage.

I'm not surprised that you're not jumping at the idea, but I'm a little surprised that you're as

against the idea.

Yeah, time's passed.

He hasn't shown much interest.

So I'm respecting that, and I leave him alone.

What he did do was

he called you on your 80th birthday

not so long ago and you felt good about it.

stood over my father, flapping a dish towel hysterically while begging him, to the point of tears, to please stop.

Now you go, my father said, rising from the floor when he was done.

But Sheldon shook his head with a smile.

It was like he didn't even think my father was worth the effort.

You know what it is at this point with him?

I'll tell you what it is.

I don't think it's even anger.

He's past anger, and he's past any feelings of animosity.

He's past that.

He just doesn't care.

Yeah.

You know, that's apathy.

And I mean, sometimes he is at least hate or love their emotions.

Apathy is nothing.

Yeah.

You know what, Johnny, as a child, even when I was 10, when I was nine and eight, I was crazy about him.

We had a great, you know, I loved him.

He was the older brother.

He was.

Hello?

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I'm listening.

You know, I just looked up to him, and he had older friends.

Sometimes he'd take me along with him, and he was good.

Somebody trying to call here, binging me here.

Don't you see, Buzz?

It's Father Time who is binging you here.

And Buzz loses track of time.

Air conditioners remain boxed all through July, and expired coupons from the mid-90s make plump his wallet.

So I worry he'll put off reaching out to Sheldon until it's too late.

The most complicated question, the one I keep coming back to, is how did the bad blood begin?

And there are many versions.

An ill-fated trip to Montreal where Sheldon felt slighted about having to stay in my father's basement.

An ill-fated trip to New York where my father felt slighted about having to stay in Sheldon's attic.

Rude words spoken to each other's wives.

In one version of the story, Sheldon's refusal to bring a table to my bris almost resulted in my being circumcised on an ironing board.

But in the version being told today, my father was asked by Sheldon to pay more than his fair share for their mother's funeral.

And I said, you're always working some kind of an angle.

So he got furious.

He got furious.

He started screaming into the phone, go to hell, drop dead, blah, blah, blah.

And he was, that was how that ended.

But I feel he's the kind of guy that he has angles like that, you know.

He has angles.

I always felt I was on the up and up with him, and he wasn't with me.

If you got a stronger sense that he was interested in seeing you,

then would you

inclined to see him?

I wouldn't stay at his house, though.

That's out of the question.

Okay, quick sidebar.

Anytime I've ever raised the prospect of visiting Sheldon, no matter how hypothetical the scenario, my father always makes a point of insisting how no matter what, he would not stay in Sheldon's house, even if he was invited to.

Which, I should point out, he never is.

I wouldn't stay at his house.

How come you

I wouldn't stay there?

I mean, it's not my thing, dude.

How come you always bring that up?

I mean, normally when someone goes to visit someone that they haven't seen in decades, they'll stay at a hotel, you know.

I would stay at a motel or somewhere near his place.

A motel.

Yeah, no, we'd get a place, you know, with an ice machine and, you know.

Why, you want to, you're interested in making a trip?

I mean, I'm interested.

Do you think that there's anything to be gained in

seeing him?

Hmm.

I mean, I guess there's something.

You know, you share your common experience and you talk about the old days and there are things that only he and I can remember, you know.

Yeah.

You know, you what you could do is you could call him and see what what what what his attitude is, you know.

It depends on

how you feel,

what kind of reception you get.

Yeah, I mean,

I would be happy to do that.

I like your initial suggestion that you call him, feel him out, and see what he's like.

Okay, I didn't suggest that, but

you suggested that.

Yeah, I like that.

Of course,

you'll give me an honest reaction.

I'm happy to do it, but

I mean, what are you looking for from...

What do you want to hear from him?

I miss my brother.

I would like to see him.

Okay.

That's all.

Okay.

You understand?

And you come back on me with an honest evaluation.

Hello.

Sheldon.

Yes, speaking.

Hi.

It was quite a shock

getting your phone call.

You said, John,

my hearing is not that great.

Okay.

And when I heard the first message, I'm saying, who the heck is that?

I don't know anybody by that name.

Sheldon now lives outside of Fort Lauderdale, but my few memories of him are from when he lived in upstate New York.

I remember he lived in a trailer.

I remember that he worked at a local prison.

that he smoked cigars, that he looked a little like my father, but was hunched, like the world was weighing down on him.

And he always wore this expression on his face that seemed to say, You gotta be kidding me.

You're keeping okay, you're keeping occupied?

Yeah, I read a lot.

I go to the gym, I uh go shopping,

you know, here and there, little things here and there.

And so, you still go how often do you go to the gym?

Three times a week.

Wow, and what kind of stuff do you do there?

Well, I do about

20 minutes of aerobics.

Uh-huh.

And then I do a little weight training.

I try to flirt a little with the women there.

Oh, yeah.

My father also goes to the gym.

That's a part of his routine, also.

He was happy to hear from you on his 80th birthday.

Yeah, well,

he didn't call me on my 85th, though.

Tit meet tat

Yeah, like so, you know, maybe we could uh

go out for dinner.

I don't know, that kind of thing.

Uh-huh.

Uh

well, what what kind of uh time frame are we talking about here?

I don't know.

Uh our lives have been much different.

I don't know how much we have to have in common anymore.

Yeah.

We don't have we don't have much in common anymore except the fact that we're elderly and uh retired.

Uh other than that, I don't know what we have in common.

I guess you have your past in common.

Yes.

Uh I'll tell you honestly, I'm not a very sentimental person.

And I ti and I and being a pragmatist, I take things the way they are.

I try not to dwell upon the past

and I try not to

take

people the way I remember them, but as they are.

Do do you think that makes things easier?

Makes things easier for me.

Yeah.

Do other people around you sometimes does it make it harder for other people around you, ever?

To be honest with you,

I've been

in the last few years I've been a loner.

You you would basically almost call me a recluse.

I don't socialize with many people

and

I really don't give a damn what anybody thinks.

Yeah.

And

contrary to popular belief, I like being alone by myself.

I get along with myself very well.

Yeah.

Look,

I don't want to be rude or anything, but I want to go have my lunch.

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

That's fine.

It's fine.

Sheldon, I appreciate your talking to me.

And

you would be amenable to

spending some time?

Why not?

We are brothers.

I mean, we're not close or anything, but

you know, we're not going to have a chance to see each other much in the future.

Yeah.

Is that anything that you think about?

Not much, no.

And so I call my father back and let him know that Sheldon is amenable.

And because I know that for my father, the days tend to pile up like unboxed air conditioners, I have my mother get on the phone to help nail down a firm travel date.

And daddy wants to go?

If dad wants to go, if he wants to go.

Does he want to go?

Next weekend.

We don't have to go on the weekend, we can go during the week.

Yeah.

It's comes as,

you know,

you caught me off guard.

How about I'll call you Wednesday or Thursday?

How's that?

Today's Monday.

Or, yeah, or even if you feel like calling tomorrow, you can call me.

Yeah.

Okay, I'll probably call you at the latest Thursday.

Did you get the Thursday?

At the latest.

That's three days from today.

Yeah.

Okay.

I have to say.

All right, you do what you want to do.

You call me, but I'll.

I'll call you Thursday.

Coming up after the break.

Thursday.

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And so on Thursday, Possibly with a little nudging from my mother, Buzz agrees.

And then my father and I are off to Florida to visit my uncle Sheldon.

My dad and I meet up at the Fort Lauderdale airport.

I flew from New York and my dad from Montreal.

My father's all dressed up, wearing a faux suede sports jacket that I've never seen him in.

We grab our airport rental and prepare for the two-hour drive to Sheldon.

In the 90-degree heat, it's immediately made clear that faux suede might not have been the best fashion choice.

It's like we're on a safari

On the road to Sheldon's, my father will experience a spectrum of feelings.

As we first set out, there's excitement.

You know, my brother was funny in a lot of ways.

I could laugh.

We're going to have laughs with him.

You know what I mean?

He's a very funny man.

A half an hour in, and there's bitterness.

We invited him to your bomb, Mitzvah, and he returned a very cold card.

Sorry, we will not be attending.

It was, you know, so

mean.

You know what I mean?

Even the writing.

An hour in.

And how is Buzz feeling?

I'm relaxed.

Kind of old to get anxious.

You know what I mean?

A half an hour to Sheldon's.

A little bit apprehensive, no.

Yeah.

Ten minutes to Sheldon's.

And Buzz is feeling.

Alright.

Yeah.

He feeling a little.

No, it's going to be strange.

Yeah.

It's going to be very strange.

I mean, the the man is a stranger to me now, and yet he's my brother.

You understand?

It's a very strange feeling.

Yeah.

I wonder if he's getting nervous.

Maybe.

Of course, he's waiting for us, right?

Yeah.

You all set?

Yeah.

Ooh, it's hot.

It's really hot, yeah.

Sheldon lives in the corner house on a quiet suburban street.

Ring the bell.

I guess

Is this his door?

I'll double-check.

Maybe.

Oh, here he is.

Hey.

This is an awful lot of people.

Hi.

This is

Jonathan.

Nice to meet you.

Yeah.

Come in.

Come here.

Thank you.

I smell the good smell of cigar.

Yes.

Lately, I've become a

Oh, you got a cat?

After all the years and the worry and the dread, things seem to be going swimmingly.

We sit down at Sheldon's kitchen table, and my father gets right into it.

Now, there's things I want to know.

You said that Rainy died.

Yeah, she did die.

The dead are a good place to begin.

As a subject, they're easily agreed upon and not likely to spark a fight.

My uncle died.

My uncle died.

He was the youngest brother.

Oh, he died long ago.

He died, eh?

Oh, you know who died?

Who?

Hoffman.

Hoffman.

A real prick.

Yeah, I didn't know him that well.

I didn't know him.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Knish.

Oh, that's shocking.

Yeah, he was fat.

He was fat.

Redhead.

Redhead, right.

Yeah.

Knish.

Yeah.

Remember Johnny?

Johnny was a sex maniac.

Johnny, oh, he would fuck a dog on the street if he saw the dog.

He tried to fuck the dog.

Can I get you guys a cold beer?

I'd like a beer.

Olive beer.

Even though they're in their 80s, Sheldon and Buzz still possess voices and temperaments suited to shouting out Brooklyn tenement windows, while my voice,

Olive,

is best suited to asking a waitress if there will be a sharing charge.

Forgot about that, sorry.

Case in point, this is Sheldon accidentally swiping a a portable microphone receiver off the kitchen table, and me trying to smooth things over.

Take this off, Willie, it's annoying.

No, here, just put it in your pocket there.

Just take it off, will you please?

Thank you, thank you.

Over the next couple of days, my testes will flee like frightened cockroaches, upward, ascending to heights not seen since the bar mitzvah that Sheldon was not attending.

And while we're on the subject of testies, here's Sheldon reminiscing about the time he was examined for a rupture by their family doctor.

Over the years, I've seen my father in the role of husband, uncle, and grandfather, but I've never really seen him in the role of younger brother.

How odd to see it now at 80.

He sits beside Sheldon with this expression I've never seen on his face.

It's wide-eyed, sweet, and deferential.

But as the day wears on, Sheldon and Buzz begin to squabble over their memories, fighting over every little detail.

Remember the halibaloo you had with the

hair dyer, that heavy-set girl?

She's a manicurist.

She was a hair dye.

Manicurist.

No, she was a hair dye.

Here's what happened.

She went over to Irving.

They even argue over the death of their grandmother.

I found her body.

I didn't.

No, I didn't.

My mother was across the street of Greenberg.

I remember walking on her.

I looked in on her.

And I knew she was dead.

I never saw a dead body in my life, but I knew she was dead.

Sure.

So, wait, so you found her or you found her?

I remember looking in on the room to see how she did.

I said it was awfully quiet.

I found her, but let him take the credit.

No, I'm not.

Some credit.

The whole afternoon is like this.

Every subject, even their dead grandmother, somehow becomes fodder for another pissing match.

They're burning up all this time with small talk when what they need is some big talk.

In particular, they need to address a story that I know holds a great deal of meaning for my father.

It took place in 1939.

on the day their mother left them.

I've only ever heard the story from my father, never from Sheldon.

I wanted to to ask what you remember, what your perspective.

Well, I remember that time was when Pop was smacking her around and she ran out in the hall in her slip.

Fighting in the hole?

No,

he was smacking her around.

Smacking her around, yeah.

She ran out, yeah.

So what happened the next morning?

The next morning?

Yeah.

Look in the closet.

Her clothes were gone.

She left.

What happened after this, in my father's telling, is that his mother returned soon after she left with a policeman in tow.

And they came back to try to get you.

They wanted you to come back

with them.

And where were you?

I was there, but they were trying to drag you out of the house.

And

they weren't trying to grab me.

No, no, no, I can stay with my father and grandma and mother.

This is the point of the story for my father.

It proves, once and for all, how his mother loved Sheldon more than she loved him.

Sheldon didn't move out with her, and after a year, their mother returned, and together, Buzz and Sheldon grew up under the same roof, in the same bedroom, often sleeping under the same blankets, each knowing who the mother had chosen, and each having to do their best to carry on and live life with the burden of that knowledge.

A couple times during the day, I ask them why they haven't spoken in so long, and they both insist, maybe out of embarrassment, that they do talk, just not often.

But it isn't true.

In fact, my father learned of Sheldon's wife's death many years after the fact, and then only from me.

Sheldon's daughter got in touch through Facebook, and we made a phone date where she caught me up on her life in Sheldon's.

And a few nights later, while over at my parents' for dinner, I told my father of his sister-in-law's death.

There was a terrible look that fell across his face.

One of sadness, but something else too.

Maybe shock, over just how far he and Sheldon had drifted.

I found out

about Judy, about her death.

Who?

Your wife.

I didn't know about it either until you told me.

Yeah.

Didn't I tell you?

No.

You didn't know about it?

No.

We didn't know.

We didn't know.

She was sick about two years,

Judy.

Too bad.

Well, when she

got the diagnosis, she was already stage four.

What did I know about cancer?

So the surgeon...

So he said, so I says, well, doctor, how did the surgery go?

Oh, he said, it went very well.

But

the cancer is in her liver now.

It's spread.

I said, It's in her liver.

I said, What?

And on top of that, I'm driving home, I'm all fucked up and I'm spaced out, and my driver windows open, and some kids pull up alongside me and flip a lit cigarette into my car.

You know where I usually eat, I come in by myself by the bar.

They got a waitress there who always waits on me.

She takes good care of me.

For dinner, Sheldon takes us to a local outback steakhouse.

As people walk by, he provides a running commentary.

Of an elderly couple.

Don't get like that couple, whatever you do.

It's time for the execution.

Of an overweight couple.

People are fat today.

It's as though he's sharpening his wit, readying it for the main event.

Teasing my dad about Canada.

I don't know how you could take Canada when you're around.

Right.

We got nice neighbors.

It's nice.

It's okay.

I was going to say you're living in the same place for how many years?

Oh, about

over 35, 38 years, something like that.

I'm happy there.

Yeah, yeah.

For my father, I know this is a touchy subject, believing as he always has, that Sheldon looks down on him for the dinkiness of his Canadian life and home.

It's like a constant reminder of just who is second best.

Later, my father will repeat Sheldon's words.

You're still living in that same place, he'll say.

For how many years?

But just then, I watch my father clench and unclench his jaw, as he does when he is brooding.

I know he's trying to take the high road, trying not to ruin the evening.

What?

$200.30 at a kidding?

Sheldon invites us back to his place for cookies, but my father says he isn't up for it.

Thank you.

Good night.

As we walk through the restaurant parking lot to the car, my father is silent.

I find myself feeling protective of him.

After midnight, lying awake in our hotel, my father insisted we stay at one, I lay in bed thinking about that day in 1939, when my grandmother came back for Sheldon, not my father.

For my father, not only did it push him away from Sheldon, making him feel jealous and resentful, but it also cast a shadow over the rest of his life, causing him to always feel passed over.

He's mellowed with age, but as a kid, I saw it come out in all kinds of ways, always sensitive to slights, ready for a fight at the smallest perceived offense.

I wonder if there's a different way for my father to see things.

If there is, the only living person in this world who can help is Sheldon.

When their mom left, Sheldon was nine, my father, five.

Sheldon would have understood a lot more than my father.

Yesterday, Buzz and Sheldon talked like a couple of kids who used to play stickball in the old neighborhood.

Today, If me and my big fat meddling yap have any sway, they'll have a chance to talk as men.

As as brothers even.

Because if not now,

when?

Day two.

This is a damn good cigar.

He sent me...

Oh, Dominican Republic.

They make a damn good cigar in Dominican Republic.

What are you talking about?

Despite the difficulties of last night, the coin is flipped back to the good side.

Sheldon offers my father a cigar, and with the cigar, Some cigar talk.

Some pretty foul cigar talk.

We're riding on Queens Boulevard.

Johnny's in the back seat with the hoof.

He's got his naked ass up in the air and he's humping.

But the funny thing is we had to stop for a light

and there's a truck driver sitting in the cab up high.

He looked out of the car.

It was funny.

Have you guys missed each other?

What?

Do you miss each other?

You know, he asked the weirdest question.

What's that?

What is he abroad?

No, I mean, I don't know.

That's, you know.

Eager to prove to my Uncle Sheldon that in spite of the fact I'm wearing my wife's travel deodorant, I am indeed not abroad, I allow them to return to more pressing matters.

Their prostates.

The guy says, Jesus, he says, your

prostate feels like the moon crate is in there.

He says,

I said, thank you, doctor.

I thought he was complimenting me.

Jesus.

So if I I could steer this away from the prostates.

So my father said that it's significant to him to have come.

What do you say?

I agree with whatever he said.

But what about you?

Do you feel that?

I said I agree with whatever he said.

You want a written contract?

No, I'm happy for that.

It feels like I'm getting a taste of what growing up with Sheldon might have been like.

So again, I make my move.

So I have some questions

just about because the stories that I know from my father, but I'm curious what your take is because you were older.

Do you remember

what was going on when your mom, when your mother left originally?

Like,

why and what was going on?

Didn't you cover this ground before yesterday?

But from my father's perspective, the way I understood it was always you were the favorite.

Did you feel that way?

At this point, Sheldon's face suddenly softens.

I always felt that I got the short end of the stick.

Yeah, but

you were kind of a favorite with my mom.

Yeah, maybe with mom, because maybe temperamentally we were closer than I was with my father.

My father never gave me spit.

Did you ever get any money from my father?

Can't remember.

You've never got a dime.

No, can't remember.

You You never...

One time I sprained my ankle.

That was terrible.

I laid in that bed my ass.

And he says to me, you lazy bum.

Yeah.

Man, he went off on me that time.

He took Sheldon once.

Sheldon happened to say the word fuck.

He came in with that fucking strap swinging

with the buck on it.

And you know, I can understand it leaving us a feeling of resentment and dislike.

That was his way of

communicating with us.

Smack.

What a way.

Smack and then...

What a way.

Was he easier on you, you think?

It wasn't that easy, but he was tough on Sheldon, wasn't he?

I know you were closer to him than I was.

A lot of things that went on, you didn't understand really what was going on.

So you had a different take.

Are you surprised by

Sheldon was getting it so bad?

No.

In Buzz's telling, their father was always a more or less benign, childish figure, incapable of expressing his feelings, and so given to temper tantrums.

For Buzz, it was their mother who was the manipulator, the woman who played the brothers off each other.

But hearing Sheldon's take, it sounds like maybe their mother didn't come to take Sheldon because she loved him best, but simply because he needed more protecting from their father.

For the first time during our trip, I can see my father considering Sheldon's point of view, actually taking it in.

I know it's intense for him, because he can't even meet Sheldon's eyes.

Instead, He looks at me, addresses his comments to me.

You know, it's sad that my father had such a negative impact on him, you know.

Just awful.

Because he had so much going for him.

He was a wonderful son.

He worked hard.

He was a good boy.

He went to school.

Talking like I'm a failure in life.

No, you weren't a failure.

That's the thing that I'm saying.

You weren't a failure.

But all I'm saying is that emotionally, he left an impact on you.

It took a long time for me to get out of that emotion.

And now

I'm at peace with myself.

I can talk about him and laugh about him.

Now I want peace, quiet.

I'm happy living by myself.

Are you lonely, Sheldon?

No,

no.

The last time my father saw my grandfather in full health, my dad was visiting from Canada.

My grandfather asked my father to drive him to the cemetery to visit his parents' grave.

And once there, my grandfather wept inconsolably.

Later that day, he would succumb to a stroke and shortly after be moved to a nursing home.

With Sheldon being more local, the burden of my grandfather's care fell mainly to Sheldon.

It seems like a lot of the family's burdens fell to Sheldon.

They put a lot of the

responsibility on him that my dad should have been taking that responsibility.

And he shouldered that.

Who's going to take care of you?

Who's going to take you to school?

Meet you.

I remember one time I was late or something.

You stood outside that school.

I said, Buzzy, I'm here.

I'm here.

He was good to me.

A lot of times I was mean to you.

Yeah, mean, you know.

You were my older brother.

He used to knock the shit out of me sometimes.

But, you know, that's the way it is with brothers.

Well,

I was good in some ways, some ways I was mean.

Who was not?

Who is not?

Who is not?

So if you feel like you were compelled to see each other now because you knew that, you know, it's an now or never kind of thing, then it means that it was important to you both, right?

To see each other.

You want to take that?

Sure.

I'm not sure.

Yes.

Easy answer, yes.

Yes, because we're not getting any younger.

I mean,

what's down the road?

I'm 80, he's 85.

I mean, because there was a lot of water under the bridge, and we want to close that bridge now.

I want to feel easy now.

I want to say now he's going to be 86.

I want to call him on his birthday and say, happy birthday to him now.

I'm not going to stand in any fucking ceremonies anymore.

As my father speaks, as per his brother's example, dropping F-bombs like he's in a Guy Ritchie film, Sheldon keeps his arms crossed and his eyes shut tight.

He's quiet for several seconds, and then he reaches out to pet his cat.

Should I leave you to cat and my will if anything happened?

If anything happened, I'll take care of the cat.

I'll take care of the cat.

I'm happy I came to see you, that I am.

I'm happy you came here.

That's good, very good.

When it's time to leave, Sheldon walks us outside.

But before we get into the rental, he points across the lawn to his neighbor's house.

He tells my father that it's for sale, and then he tells him the asking price.

And my father says that doesn't sound bad at all.

And Sheldon says that, what with Canada being so bloody cold, my father should consider moving to Florida.

And my father says, maybe he will.

They don't get too emotional.

They don't even hug goodbye.

They just shake hands.

And with that, it feels like Buzz has forgiven Sheldon, and Sheldon has forgiven Buzz.

All right, you take care.

Put her under the bridge.

Take care.

Take care, you too.

Okay.

Safe trip, Otis.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Bless me.

Most me.

Turn right on Northwest, Medford Drive.

Oh my God, I feel so different now.

You know that?

This has taken a lot off my shoulders.

You know?

As we ride to the airport, my father says that the thought of Sheldon all alone in that house with just a cat makes him sad.

Do you really think he isn't lonely?

My father asks.

I assure him that Sheldon seems okay with being alone, but my father doesn't seem so sure.

After all these years, the burden of having lost his brother has been replaced by a new burden, one that might be heavier to bear.

Now that the furniture is returning to its goodwill home

Now that the last month's rent is scheming with the damage it caused Take this moment to decide

if we meant it, if we tried

but felt around from far too much

from things that accidentally tied

heavyweight is hosted and produced by me, Jonathan Goldstein.

This episode was also produced by Wendy Doerr, Chris Neary, and Kalila Holt.

Editing by Alex Bloomberg and Peter Clowney.

Special thanks to Caitlin Kenney, Starley Kine, and Rachel Ward.

The show was mixed by Haley Shaw.

Music in this episode by Christine Fellows, with additional music and ad music by Haley Shaw.

Our theme song is by The Weaker Thans, courtesy of Epitaph Records.

A version of the story appeared on This American Life, and we had a lot of help from the folks there: Ira Glass, Julie Snyder, Jonathan Mendhevar, Sean Cole, and Robin Semion.

A very special thanks to Emily Condon.

Follow us on Twitter at Heavyweight.

We'll have a new episode next week.

We used to call him Mitchie Little Bitchy.

Remember the older brother, the oldest one.

He was comical.

Hey, we're lucky we turned out as good as we did.

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