"Laura Linney"

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Speaker 3 Is your team winning? Yeah.

Speaker 3 Wait, but it's Sunday.

Speaker 2 I thought they play Saturday. It's Sunday.
Yeah, they play both in it.

Speaker 3 This is Liverpool that you're rooting for?

Speaker 2 Yeah, mate. Yeah.

Speaker 1 Oh, did they score a goal yet?

Speaker 2 Did they score a goal yet? Oh, hang on a second. We're doing a cold open, but we have a special surprise guest.

Speaker 3 Michael's a princess. Do not turn around.
Do not turn around.

Speaker 2 Michael, you're surrounded by a princess. She's a princess.
You want to say hi?

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 3 It's a tiny Terry. Tiny Terry.

Speaker 2 That was a tiny Terry, and this is an all-new

Speaker 2 Smartless.

Speaker 2 Smart.

Speaker 2 Smart.

Speaker 2 Less.

Speaker 2 Smart.

Speaker 2 Less.

Speaker 2 Sean, I just did this stupid thing to Sean, but I reminded me before you came on, JB. Yeah.
The other day, I keep finding new ways to embarrass Alessandra.

Speaker 2 We're at dinner, just the two of us, over there in the Sag Harbor. And you forgot to wear your wig.
No, and I, no.

Speaker 2 How can you forget? The glue is so thick.

Speaker 3 And you keep it by the keyboard, right?

Speaker 2 Well, the glue's thick. The glue like

Speaker 2 it says six weeks, but let's be honest, after five weeks, it starts to crack.

Speaker 3 You have to reapply.

Speaker 2 Yeah, yeah, you're reapplying. But I have like a caulking gun I can get under there or sometimes

Speaker 2 I could just do a touch-up in the moment. You know what I mean? Like if I'm windsurfing.
Get a good caulk.

Speaker 1 Get a good caulk in there.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 2 But

Speaker 2 right as the

Speaker 2 as our server came to the table, I just go, I go look up the story and go, one second. I go, oh, sorry.
So to answer your question, it's guess who's back, back again. Shady's back.
Tell a friend.

Speaker 2 As if Alice Sitter had asked me the lyrics to that Eminem song. And then I go, sorry, yeah, we're ready to order.

Speaker 3 Did the waiter have any idea?

Speaker 2 No idea. Did it? It would have been lost on me.

Speaker 2 Waiters don't, first of all, they're not there they're not there for entertainment they're not they're not psyched they don't want to laugh at your stupid yeah yeah like when you go have you ever been no but you know like a waiter goes like uh hey we're all out of the the salmon you go all right we're out of here the waiter's like hey fucko i've heard that a million times

Speaker 3 i just want to tell you but you know i've but i've said it a bunch before so apologies but i i have always kind of loved the idea of being a waiter just for the performative element of it where you have different each table is a different stage and you the different audience and you got to figure out who they need you to be in order to get the biggest tip.

Speaker 2 Well, that would have been my game. Let's hope this your new limited series hits because if it doesn't you might get a you might get a chance to try it out.

Speaker 2 Wait a minute.

Speaker 1 Speaking of

Speaker 2 black.

Speaker 3 Oh, Shotty did the nicest thing last night. He came over last night with Scotty and took a look at the first two episodes because we're not locked yet.
I need eyes on it. I need opinions.

Speaker 1 And you're going to shut your mouth for one second because.

Speaker 1 Will have you seen the two episodes? The The first two episodes?

Speaker 2 No, well, no, I'm not there with you.

Speaker 1 No, I just, I didn't know if you could send it to him.

Speaker 2 It's so fucking great. It's so good.

Speaker 3 I'm not going to say, of course you're going to say it.

Speaker 2 He doesn't need to go out of it. I don't need to.

Speaker 1 Yeah, I'd be like, oh, it's really good. Anyway, well, that's kind of...
It's so good. And Jay, that character is unlike anything I've ever seen you play before.
It's so surprising and exciting.

Speaker 1 So it's likable.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 2 No, but

Speaker 1 it's going to be one of those series everybody talks about. It's

Speaker 1 completely. You're completely sucked in right away.
Who's that? Why is that guy?

Speaker 1 And you start asking yourself questions as an audience member, and you know they're going to get answered in the few episodes that follow.

Speaker 3 When you didn't run after the first episode, I knew I was in good shape because you do like to be in bed 5:30.

Speaker 2 JB, it must feel good and

Speaker 2 you've got to get a bunch of demographics. You've got the moron demographic.
Now it's covered.

Speaker 3 They're in. I was really pressing him and Scotty.
I was like, you guys sure you understood everything?

Speaker 2 He asked me that after. He asked me that after.
You sure you understood everything?

Speaker 2 I bet it's going to be great. I have no doubt.
And JB, I'm going to say this too while we're in this vein. I was thinking about the breadth of stuff that you've done.

Speaker 2 I was thinking about the last couple of years. I was thinking about a movie that I love that doesn't get enough attention.

Speaker 1 Airbud 2?

Speaker 2 No, no, no, no, Game Night. Game Night.
Game Night, which I think is so funny.

Speaker 1 So funny.

Speaker 2 So good. And then you do like Identity Thief.
Then you do Ozark. You've done so many different things.
And hats off to you. You don't get enough credit.
You do a lot of great shit.

Speaker 2 So, congrats, and I'm excited for Black Rabbit.

Speaker 2 And the reason I bring it up is because you've been working so fucking hard. I know how exhausted you are, but you've been fucking doing it.
And it's

Speaker 2 very inspiring.

Speaker 3 I really appreciate that. Listener, I apologize for all of this.

Speaker 1 No, no, this is

Speaker 3 we're going to pay it back in space.

Speaker 2 Having said that, I know.

Speaker 1 Couple thoughts.

Speaker 3 Keep your email open, Jay.

Speaker 2 I got some thoughts.

Speaker 3 I was sort of not to

Speaker 3 throw back the wind up the bum, but, you know, I was thinking for some reason this morning, oh, I know why, because our next guest

Speaker 3 is

Speaker 3 a fancy pants in the Tony world,

Speaker 3 that Sean, you want to fucking tone.

Speaker 2 Okay, we're going to.

Speaker 3 No, no, no, but I mean, that's, that's like, we did spend a little time on that, but it does keep coming back to me. That's not something they hand out.

Speaker 3 You know, it's a Tony is a real deal.

Speaker 1 Believe me, it's not lost on me.

Speaker 3 It's like, that's a whole different community that I just very, very you both will do it.

Speaker 1 You both will do it, and you'll both be nominated and you'll both win.

Speaker 3 Yeah, I doubt it.

Speaker 2 But we're no,

Speaker 2 it is. It is pretty amazing.

Speaker 2 And I was even about to do handout to a Tony and Sean and handy from a Tony, but I did it. I'm like, fuck it.
I'm not going to do that because I respect you too much and I love you too much.

Speaker 2 And I'm not going to make a stupid joke and try to connect. It's too easy.
It's too easy and it's too thin. You know?

Speaker 3 What else can we talk about while our listener or listener and guest?

Speaker 1 I got a couple things, but we should probably

Speaker 2 go off the list. Open up the list.

Speaker 1 No, I was just going to say, on the way home, I told Will, Will, you and I were driving home from a friend's house we visited in the hills a couple months ago. Yeah.

Speaker 1 And I told Will the story, but Jay, I haven't told you. So when you go past Greystone Mansion,

Speaker 1 and there's a runaway ramp there, right?

Speaker 2 Yeah, for trucks.

Speaker 2 You heard this? Yeah. James, you heard this?

Speaker 3 No. Oh, no.

Speaker 1 So like several years ago, I was like, well, let's try that.

Speaker 2 Yes, I do. Come on.

Speaker 1 I swear to God, I tried it. And I, because I was like,

Speaker 1 what would it feel like? Because I want to know what it felt like. Well, I didn't know it was.
I thought it was just like an inch of gravel. It was just to stop a truck.

Speaker 1 But it's like 80 feet of gravel. So when I tried to.

Speaker 2 To stop a truck. Yeah.

Speaker 3 It's supposed to completely absorb you like quicksand.

Speaker 1 I drove up it and I damn it. I know.
And I started singing. I was like, holy shit.
I got so scared.

Speaker 2 I peel it out.

Speaker 1 I kick some gravel up and I thank God I got out of there.

Speaker 2 You got out?

Speaker 3 yeah what car were you in your audio no it was before that oh my god you're so lucky you weren't the dumbass next to it calling a tow truck like quicks and just like with your with your hands up like had to try it sorry um

Speaker 2 i know

Speaker 2 i would have loved to have seen that to open up the daily mail and see pictures of you next to the tow truck and just explaining to the cop and then you have to pay because

Speaker 2 they had to come over

Speaker 2 all right here we come

Speaker 3 guest wake it up. Listener, pull the car over.
Our next guest is one of my favorite people in the world, period. Wow.

Speaker 3 There are some people that you meet, have a connection, you become friends, the connection grows, carries through many years, many stages of your life, and theirs. These people become your family.

Speaker 3 There aren't many in our lives. So when you have one, you smile and bounce a little every moment you spend with them.

Speaker 3 And if you're lucky enough to work with one of these people, you end up doing a lot of smiling. So between you guys and her, my cheeks are killing me.

Speaker 3 She's one of our finest actors, an accomplished producer, a rising director, an incredible mother, wife, and daughter.

Speaker 3 She's the recipient of three Academy Award nominations, five Tony's, nine Sags, one one of those, a BAFTA, eight Golden Globes, one two of those, and seven Emmy nominations, won four of those.

Speaker 3 She also has a doctorate from Brown and Juilliard. Guys, please welcome my fake wife but true bestie, Laura Linney.

Speaker 2 Oh my god, oh my god!

Speaker 2 And a dead dog in the background, And the dog in the background. I got it.

Speaker 1 This is a long time coming. Yes, it is.

Speaker 2 And you had to suffer through all that bullshit we were going to talk about.

Speaker 4 I had to earn my place.

Speaker 2 I thought that maybe you and Jason were in a fight. It's been so long.
I thought, what happened?

Speaker 3 She's tough to schedule. You know, she's busy.
And her deal, it's a tough deal.

Speaker 2 Sure.

Speaker 4 Well, I am thrilled to be here. It is great to see all of you.

Speaker 1 You too. I mean, when he was going through all of those noms, like nine,

Speaker 1 I mean, I know

Speaker 1 it's not a seven academy. I mean, it's unbelievable.

Speaker 2 People like her. It's bonkers.

Speaker 3 It's unbelievable. She doesn't suck.

Speaker 2 Laura, I'm going to say this.

Speaker 2 Would you ever think about wearing, getting a t-shirt made that listed all your nominations this year, front and back, that just says, ask me about the Seven Academy Awards. What about them?

Speaker 4 You know, the thing about it is that every once in a while, I mean, I don't know if you guys are like this, but I have to stop and every once in a while, it'll hit me and I'll have to remind myself because you never feel like that's happened.

Speaker 4 Right. I mean, you you never, you know, and I've been nominated a lot and I don't win all that much, but I'm nominated a lot.

Speaker 4 And, but every once in a while, I'll be walking down the street and it will hit me. I'll be like, oh, my God.
Yeah.

Speaker 4 Oh, my God. Like, Sean, like Tony Winner.

Speaker 2 Right.

Speaker 4 Tony winner.

Speaker 2 It's amazing. Congratulations.
No, in a soft ear, but

Speaker 2 Laurie, Laura, I think the thing that keeps us all sort of grounded is,

Speaker 2 and I'm looking at, again, pointing out that your dog is asleep in the background of your shot. No matter what you do,

Speaker 2 how many nominations, no matter how accomplished somebody is, they're always likely in a room where there's a dog that's asleep and doesn't give a shit.

Speaker 2 Do you know what I mean?

Speaker 4 Yeah, and the sock drawer is a mess. And

Speaker 4 there's stuff that hasn't been taken care of. And I'm behind on everything.
And

Speaker 4 I have family members who are peeved at me because they haven't heard from me in so long. And so there's all of that stuff.
Absolutely.

Speaker 4 But then there is you know the wild moment where you're like, oh, oh my God, I cannot believe

Speaker 4 my life has led me here. I cannot believe I've been able to do everything I've been able to do.

Speaker 1 Yes, and that you choose the thing that you chose to do with your life actually paid off.

Speaker 2 Oh my God.

Speaker 2 I mean,

Speaker 4 come on, crazy.

Speaker 3 What about what a great writer you are, too? I'll bet you've got some spin out. You've won plenty of things, but you've been nominated a shit ton too.
So I'll bet there's some speeches.

Speaker 3 Do you keep them in a drawer?

Speaker 2 Do you remember them?

Speaker 3 Because I want to have like a coffee table book once of all the unused speeches and whether it would be anonymous or not.

Speaker 3 Wouldn't that be great? Yes.

Speaker 4 The thing that I found is that you sort of you have a sense if you're in the running to win. And then there are times where you know like I'm not winning.
There's no way I'm going to win.

Speaker 4 So in some ways that's the that's the nicest because then you go and you get to have a good time and you're nominated, but you know you're not going to win.

Speaker 4 So you don't have to worry about I'm going to forget nothing prepared because I know.

Speaker 2 Oh my gosh.

Speaker 4 And then there are the times when you know you're in the running for things and you do have to prepare.

Speaker 4 So I must admit, I do have a few.

Speaker 2 Well, Laura, would it be interesting to go back and look at

Speaker 2 some of those unused acceptance speeches and go like, oh, I was going to think that person, I wouldn't. Not today.
Not today. Not today, I wouldn't.

Speaker 2 It's like going over your will.

Speaker 2 You're out of the will.

Speaker 4 The winds have changed.

Speaker 3 So all of which is to say, as I did say, you don't suck. You're great at what you do, and it started a long time ago.

Speaker 3 Tell us about, like, remember, like the first thing you saw or were exposed to that made you think, oh, I think I'd like to see if I could maybe do that.

Speaker 3 Was it a show? Was it a movie? Was it a play?

Speaker 4 It was the original production of Vanities. that was downtown at St.
Clement's Theater

Speaker 3 in the church.

Speaker 4 I was, well, my father was a playwright, so I grew up around the theater. So I always knew I wanted to be a part of it in some way.
I really didn't think I'd be an actress.

Speaker 4 I really, it took me a long time to sort of get there. But

Speaker 4 I went and saw this play, and Kathy Bates was in it.

Speaker 2 Oh, wow.

Speaker 4 Yeah. Wow.
It's a three-person play.

Speaker 4 You know, it's not the greatest work of, you know, dramatic literature ever written, but there was something about it and being in that space and watching those three women be so wonderful.

Speaker 4 And I remember leaving, I was like, oh, I'm different. Something has changed.

Speaker 4 And it's the power of really good work. You know, teenager? Oh, no, I was younger.
Definitely younger.

Speaker 2 Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 4 I think I was 11 or 12, probably.

Speaker 2 Wow. Yeah.
Wow.

Speaker 3 That's really cool. All right.
So then from there, do you say to your dad, hey,

Speaker 3 what do you think the best first steps might be for me to go in this direction? Or how did you start?

Speaker 4 What happened was my father

Speaker 4 was an apprentice at a theater in New London, New Hampshire called the Barn Playhouse. The New London Barn Playhouse.
And I used to spend the summers with my dad.

Speaker 4 My parents split when I was very young. So I would spend time with my dad during the summers.
And I begged him to let me go work there.

Speaker 2 Begged him.

Speaker 4 So I went and I was a technical apprentice.

Speaker 4 And I broke every child labor law known to them. I mean, I was there for like 14.
Oh, yeah, you know, making a mess and doing all sorts of stuff and being way too young to be doing what I was doing.

Speaker 4 But it was...

Speaker 1 Keeping drunk in the dressing room.

Speaker 4 Like seeing everybody hook up and break up.

Speaker 3 You're refereeing a lot of hookups.

Speaker 4 Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

Speaker 3 But then what about the first time you got on stage and

Speaker 3 like risked, you know, look at me, let's see if I got it.

Speaker 4 Yeah, it was a production of, it was a Christmas show at school.

Speaker 3 Wait, which school?

Speaker 2 How old?

Speaker 4 I was, I don't, I was really young. It was middle school.
And it was the same year that Ms. Magazine came out.

Speaker 2 so we did

Speaker 2 1981

Speaker 2 that's right that's right we did it we did a feminist turn

Speaker 4 we did a feminist turn on Santa Claus where Santa got a cold and Mrs.

Speaker 1 Claus had to take over so I was it was that oh nice I remember the first one of the first things I ever saw that made me go wow I was like 12 years old and I saw a chorus line and I always thought how different how different my life would be if I'd only seen it sooner like at five six seven eight.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 2 Is that what you're saying?

Speaker 3 So then, all right. Now we get, we get,

Speaker 3 you start going, you start building up some momentum, and then you end up,

Speaker 3 you end up at, now,

Speaker 3 does Brown really kind of formalize

Speaker 3 your leap into

Speaker 3 this world, or was it at Juilliard?

Speaker 4 I, well, I think probably at Brown, I was more sort of an academic theater nerd. So I studied theater history and all that sort of fun stuff.
And then and then Juilliard was where it got serious.

Speaker 4 Yeah.

Speaker 3 And the first sort of job that exposed you to the world would be...

Speaker 4 I was the understudy in a production of Six Degrees of Separation, which was right across the street at Lincoln Center. Oh, wow.

Speaker 4 And I was actually at that theater yesterday watching Holland Taylor in N.A.

Speaker 4 Wow. So it was fun.
Every time I go in that space, it's, you know, it's professionally where I started.

Speaker 2 Wow.

Speaker 4 I was the happiest understudy around.

Speaker 4 There was this room of understudies who were like, hello, yeah. Hey, kid, how you doing? They've been understudies for years.
And I would bounce in, happy as can be. And I would sit in the catwalk.

Speaker 4 and watch the show.

Speaker 3 That's up top. That's overlooking, yeah.

Speaker 4 Yeah, where the lights are. And I would sneak up there and watch just to watch Stalker Channing get better and better and better and better and better.

Speaker 4 And there was one night, I remember Catherine Hepburn came to see the show. Yeah.
And I was in the catwalk watching Catherine Hepburn watch Stalker Channing. Wow.

Speaker 3 And you're by yourself or you're with somebody else?

Speaker 2 That's somebody in the catwalk. I think it has got a lot of fun.

Speaker 2 Laura, I've never heard that before.

Speaker 3 You're up by yourself.

Speaker 3 At Lincoln Center at what, a teenager, young?

Speaker 4 No, no, no. This was after Juilliard.
So I was early mid-20s.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 4 Oh, my God. And because I had done stock and was a technical apprentice, I knew how to get up into the catalog.

Speaker 3 Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you got a little snack with you, a little

Speaker 2 bit of a shit.

Speaker 1 Yes, in high school, I used to hang out up there and just

Speaker 1 when there's no show, we would just go up there and

Speaker 2 except Sean did have a snack with him, right? What was that all time?

Speaker 1 Probably, it's probably Swedish fish.

Speaker 2 But Laurie, like it occurs to me that you're, you were so, like, you had no choice but to do this life that you chose or it chose you. A little bit.
Because it was at such a young age.

Speaker 2 And it was just, that was your life. You were around it.
You were in Summerstock. You were at the thing.
Your dad,

Speaker 2 you know,

Speaker 2 it was all around you. You wouldn't know.

Speaker 4 Thank God it worked out. And thank God I love it as much as I do.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 Do you still love it as much as I do? I love it.

Speaker 2 I love it.

Speaker 3 Do you do more now or less?

Speaker 2 Oh,

Speaker 4 I think more because the longer I'm in it,

Speaker 4 like a new set of problems sort of unlock themselves. It's like I've earned the right to a new set of problems.

Speaker 4 And so it just keeps going. And

Speaker 1 talk about the eight shows a week thing.

Speaker 2 You still enjoy that.

Speaker 4 Yeah, I do. It is, but how insane is that? No one has any idea.

Speaker 2 The most difficult job in the world.

Speaker 4 Unbelievable. And that type of fatigue is a very specific fatigue.

Speaker 3 Well, plus in the one-woman shows you've been doing too.

Speaker 2 Like that's insane. Yeah, that was insane.
That was fun.

Speaker 2 Why did it go? Nowhere to hide in a one-woman show, right? It was, I know.

Speaker 4 And I did it three times. I don't, you know.

Speaker 4 I did it. I did it once in London.
This was a show called My Name is Lucy Barton. And then I did it again in London to see if it would get easier because my first run wasn't that long.

Speaker 4 I was like, well, if it comes to New York, will it get easier? And what I learned is no, it does not get easier.

Speaker 1 It does not easily easily easily easy. Anything it gets harder? Yeah.

Speaker 2 Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 3 So, so you get all this incredible training at Juilliard, and then you come out into, let's say, a show biz.

Speaker 3 What were the biggest challenges coming out of that and into this?

Speaker 2 Into a professional situation, you mean? Yeah.

Speaker 3 Yeah, that's less sort of

Speaker 3 protected in sort of this

Speaker 3 theater world

Speaker 3 and technique and study and culture and entering more of sort of a business.

Speaker 4 Well, you have to learn how to translate what you've learned into an appropriate setting.

Speaker 3 You mean camera versus stage?

Speaker 4 Well, there's that, but then also just on stage. I mean, there's like going to school is very different than being in the profession.

Speaker 4 And going to school, there's a certain type of concentration and there's a certain ability to get things done.

Speaker 4 And you have to learn how to translate that so you're still doing what you're doing, but that it's appropriate for the situation that you're in.

Speaker 4 No one wants to hear about your process when they're working.

Speaker 2 Right.

Speaker 4 No one wants to hear about it.

Speaker 2 You got to deliver.

Speaker 3 Will loves that, actually.

Speaker 4 I remember. because I did it with him on Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles.

Speaker 2 I know we sure did. We did a lot of processing.

Speaker 4 We did a lot of processing there.

Speaker 2 We showed a lot of

Speaker 4 decisions structure.

Speaker 2 I would a turtle walk. That's right.

Speaker 3 I think that turtle's going too fast, realistically.

Speaker 3 But what about, what about, how about like going away from the sort of going into much more of a world of now I got to make a living doing this?

Speaker 3 How do those two things reconcile?

Speaker 4 You know, you just sort of throw yourself in it and you just hope to God it's going to be okay. Right.
You know, and you wait tables.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 4 And you just sort of keep at it. And you realize That's what Jason wants to do.

Speaker 2 That's right.

Speaker 3 I wouldn't be bad. I don't think I'd be bad.
Were you any good as a waiter?

Speaker 4 You wouldn't be good at it because you'd have to touch things. You'd have to touch other people's food, and that would not go terribly well for you.
I don't think that's true.

Speaker 2 You trust people who know you. You'd be awful at it.
I could deliver the food.

Speaker 3 I don't think I could clean up afterwards.

Speaker 2 You know?

Speaker 3 Like when they take the utensils and they gather them in the middle of the plate.

Speaker 4 No, you'd have to touch them. You'd have to do that.

Speaker 3 I'd be so gloved up.

Speaker 4 I don't think so.

Speaker 2 We'll be right back.

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Speaker 3 All right, back to the show.

Speaker 1 I have to ask you, Laura, I was going to wait till the end, but I'm going to ask you now.

Speaker 2 Any great theater stories? Yes, not just

Speaker 2 that.

Speaker 1 A gazillion.

Speaker 1 You must have like a classic

Speaker 1 something that went horribly wrong.

Speaker 2 Oh, Lord.

Speaker 1 Yeah, we can come back to it.

Speaker 3 Because

Speaker 2 he wants a good one. I love them.
They're the funniest stories.

Speaker 4 They are the funniest stories.

Speaker 3 Because so much funny stories.

Speaker 2 Did somebody have a heart attack while they were doing a show once? Yeah, who was that? Never guess. Who was that?

Speaker 3 No, they didn't.

Speaker 2 No, they didn't, but somebody in the audience did. Yeah.

Speaker 4 Yeah, it's usually the good stories usually happen when you're in a show that's really bad. Yeah, yeah.
I mean, really bad, of which I've been in several, and it's so painful.

Speaker 4 And you really think you're going to rip the skin off your body just

Speaker 4 to get out of the embarrassment and the humiliation of it.

Speaker 2 What about, Laura? What about, is there any show that you did that you,

Speaker 2 and by show, I mean, you know, any kind of a stage show that you did where, and not to make anybody feel bad, but that you thought this is going to be the thing, and it just didn't click.

Speaker 4 with audiences. No, you sort of know.

Speaker 2 You kind of know. If it's really bad, You kind of know.

Speaker 4 You know, it's the ones where you think like, oh, this is right on the edge. I don't know.
I don't think this is terrible. I think it's pretty good.
I don't know how good it is.

Speaker 4 You never know how good it is.

Speaker 4 But you know how bad it is.

Speaker 2 That's something.

Speaker 4 That's something you can't run away from. That makes sense.

Speaker 2 Then conversely, was there ever, what was the thing that you thought people will like this, but you were surprised at how well it resonated with people.

Speaker 4 I think, well, I did a production of The Crucible a long time ago with with liam neeson and that that arthur miller was actually involved in wow and before i accepted the job i that you know i was offered goody proctor and i thought oh for sake who wants to do the crucible oh god you know ye buckle shoes and ye oldie speak oh for god's sake and i called my dad and i was like i've been offered goody proctor and i don't know i don't know if i'm he was like oh no he was like you do that You must do that.

Speaker 4 He's like, it is a great play. And it's only because we've all seen nine-hour high school productions of that play that it's sort of, you know, it's badly represented.

Speaker 4 Not that it shouldn't be done there, it should. But, you know, you don't realize how great that play is.
And I had no idea what a masterpiece that thing was. A masterpiece.

Speaker 3 And then you had incredible audiences for that, I'm sure. And

Speaker 3 that sort of, was that a bit of rocket fuel in your career as far as things that followed that? I mean,

Speaker 3 can you identify a particular job or moment where it felt different to you? Like, oh, the next few years might be a little bit easier than the last few?

Speaker 4 No, I've never been someone who feels a big boost from any one job. I really haven't.
Wow. I think it's been very

Speaker 4 subtle and consistent, and I'll take that. Thank you, Brim.
I mean, that's fine by me.

Speaker 3 Just from me, just as an audience member, I would say

Speaker 3 you hit my radar significantly three separate times early on with Mystic River, Squid and the Whale, and You Can Count On Me. Like those, those were big, big moves for me, just

Speaker 3 as a fan.

Speaker 4 It's funny because different people have different things.

Speaker 4 You know, some people, there's the Love Actually crowd, there's the indie movie crowd, there's the Glenn Eastwood crowd, there's, you know, it's there's the theater people.

Speaker 4 So it's, it's sort of, it's always interesting. The John Adams people.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 I mean, you conquered it all. I know.

Speaker 4 Oh, well, hardly.

Speaker 2 But no, but when you hear those credits, you go like, holy shit. Yeah.
Right? Yeah. And they're so varied.
I mean, we were talking about JB a little bit before.

Speaker 2 And actually, Sean, too, if you think about it, you can say, come, you've won a Tony. I mean, these are...

Speaker 4 Oh, I have not won a Tony. Oh, no.

Speaker 2 No, but I mean. No, but

Speaker 4 Sean won the Tony.

Speaker 2 Sean did.

Speaker 2 No, no, without question, he won a Tony.

Speaker 1 Oh, we should all have one. Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 In

Speaker 2 what was a very

Speaker 2 quiet year. But do you.

Speaker 2 But but you did so many things that were like that worked on so many different levels. I mean, you think about Ozark or You Can Count On Me, which I love.
I mean, we love Kenny Lonergan.

Speaker 1 Yeah, was that your first nom? Was that your first Oscar nom?

Speaker 2 You can count on me? Yes, it was. I remember that.
I remember sitting at home.

Speaker 1 I'm like, I was so blown away, of course, everything before that, but that movie really had an impact on me and you, especially.

Speaker 1 I was just, that's when I first was like, oh my God, I got to find out more about this person.

Speaker 4 And I just thought, you know, there was this, they did a 25-year fundraiser thing. And

Speaker 4 I don't like to watch myself.

Speaker 4 so as Jason knows I know I just don't get it why would you treat yourself to it no please so I went and saw the I went and watched it for the first time in 25 years and I think I've made it maybe the only seen it once and it was so wild and Jason I don't know if you feel this way when you look at stuff from a long time ago but I saw things in myself well I saw things in myself that don't exist anymore yeah they're parts of me that are just from another time that because of age or where I was or the relationship I was in, or parents and dynamics.

Speaker 4 And all of that's gone. And then I could also see the things that I recognize, you know, that is still there.
So it was a wild thing to.

Speaker 1 Yeah, their time capsules kind of a

Speaker 2 moment in your life.

Speaker 3 We had Ruffalo on, and

Speaker 3 he talked really lovingly about sort of how he got the role on You Can Count On Me and his collaboration with Kenneth Lonigren.

Speaker 3 It all still,

Speaker 3 does it all still sit fondly for you?

Speaker 3 Was that as great an experience as it seemed like it was?

Speaker 4 It was a very tough shoot.

Speaker 4 You know, they had like two cents, so we were sitting outside and then we had to clean out.

Speaker 4 Finally, I was like, guys, we need a place to sit. Like, I can't sit outside.
I can't change outside.

Speaker 2 Like, I need a place.

Speaker 4 And so behind the house where we were filming, there was a chicken coop that literally the chickens had left like two days prior.

Speaker 4 I mean, it was like, you know, chicken shit was like hanging in the cobwebs. And I was like, perfect.

Speaker 4 So I went in and we cleaned it up and we all sat in the chicken coop. Oh, that's great.
You know, so it was, it was very rough and tumble,

Speaker 4 but, you know, it bonded us all for life. I mean, Mark is literally like my brother.
And, you know, Kenny and I are still close. And, you know, all of us are sort of.
you know, bonded.

Speaker 4 And that's the thing about what we get to do. You know, the connections that you make,

Speaker 4 Jason Bateman, you know, are deep and meaningful and

Speaker 4 very, very, you know,

Speaker 4 significant in your life.

Speaker 1 That's what it's about.

Speaker 4 Yeah. And you do develop chosen family along the way.
And it's really,

Speaker 4 it's one of the greatest things.

Speaker 3 Do you end up spending more time with people on set than you do your family at home when you're working on something? It's 12 hours.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 3 What else I'd love is Truman Show. Let's not forget about Truman Show.

Speaker 2 I know Truman Show. You see, there you go.
It just keeps going. There's another one.
I know it goes, it's on and on. I like this idea, Laura, that you brought up about this,

Speaker 2 about it being sort sort of a different life and a different

Speaker 2 parts of you that kind of go away. I was talking about this recently with somebody.
And it's an interesting thing as you get older when you start to recognize that. Oh, yeah.

Speaker 4 When you literally have a history. Yeah.
Like you have a history. You have different periods of your life that you've been through.
Not just one, not two, but many.

Speaker 2 And it is wild

Speaker 2 to think.

Speaker 1 Yes. You know, last night, Scotty and I went down a YouTube rabbit hole above

Speaker 1 opening songs to old shows from the 70s and 80s and and 90s. God, how much? We did Silver Spoons.
We looked at it.

Speaker 2 Magic today.

Speaker 1 Yeah, all those Dukes of Hazard, like Facts of Life, Dallas, all that.

Speaker 2 Got one of your life.

Speaker 3 I'd really love to come back as you, Sean.

Speaker 3 I mean, this is how we film nights.

Speaker 2 We go over.

Speaker 1 But I was watching these openings of these shows, and it took me right back. to being a kid.
Like you, something clicks in your brain.

Speaker 1 Whether you're Jones.

Speaker 2 Yes, all those.

Speaker 1 And I didn't, I didn't remember.

Speaker 1 Like the second I saw them, I actually had the feeling of a moment, like you said, of a stage in my life, which you don't sit around and think about until something triggers it. No.

Speaker 3 You know? All right. So now

Speaker 3 you've got, you know,

Speaker 3 will you tell

Speaker 3 these ding-dongs about this great super romantic story of you and Mark meeting each other in one of the most magical places in the world?

Speaker 3 And I just,

Speaker 3 she's got two incredible dudes in her life, her son and her husband.

Speaker 3 All right, you go ahead. So, there you are.

Speaker 4 Okay, so here I am, I have been very, very single for five years or so. And I'm invited to the Telluride Film Festival, where there are two films screening there.
And I think, oh, you know what?

Speaker 4 I've never taken my mother anywhere. I should take my mother to this.
This will be good. I'm just going to fly in, fly out.
Terrific. So I bring my mother.

Speaker 2 The great. We go.

Speaker 4 And, you know,

Speaker 4 sometimes you're paired with

Speaker 4 you know, a liaison who's a little, you know, eccentric. Sometimes those people can be a little, you know, out there.

Speaker 4 And Mark sort of bounded up to us and said, hi, I'm Mark Schauer. I'll be taking care of you for the weekend.

Speaker 2 And I was like, oh, okay.

Speaker 4 Like a nice person. Okay.

Speaker 4 And we spent the weekend together. And I can remember we were waiting to go to a screening.
And we were waiting for Bill Condon, my director, to come downstairs and join us so that we could leave.

Speaker 4 And I remember I turned my head and I looked at Mark and I was like, am I attracted to this person?

Speaker 4 Am I attracted to my handler at the Telluride Film Festival? I was like, I was like, calm down. Like, how wonderful I was feeling anything at all.

Speaker 2 He's got the title of handler.

Speaker 4 That's right. That's right.
You know, yeah. And I thought, you know, I'm going to be gone in 24 hours.
Just be happy you're still alive and get out.

Speaker 4 And, you know,

Speaker 4 my mother was with me, so there wasn't a whole lot.

Speaker 3 Now, were you collaborating with her on this? Did you ask her

Speaker 3 what her take was?

Speaker 2 Oh, no, no, no.

Speaker 4 No. My mother, on the way to the airport, she was like, well, Mark, are you involved with anyone?

Speaker 4 At which point I wanted to fall into the center of the earth.

Speaker 2 No way.

Speaker 4 Center of the Earth. And he was like, no, actually, I've been single for a bit.
She goes, oh, how interesting.

Speaker 2 Subtle.

Speaker 4 I left and we ended up, Mark and I ended up just emailing each other. I just thank you.
And I had a great time. And we, emails sort of started to fly.
And then

Speaker 4 he started to get a little nervous. He was like, I don't understand what's going on.
And I immediately called. I said, look, I don't know what this is.
I have no idea what this is.

Speaker 4 I don't know if we're friends. I don't know if it's more.
The only thing I know is I don't want to let it go. So I don't know what to tell you.
And he goes, well, when can we spend some time together?

Speaker 4 And I said, well, I said, I'm on a tour, a press tour when they used to do that. And he goes, well, where are you going to be? I said, I was going to be in Seattle.
I was going to be down.

Speaker 4 I'm going to be in Chicago. He's like, I'm from Chicago.
When are you in Chicago?

Speaker 2 Oh, boy.

Speaker 4 And I was, well, this date. He goes, I'll meet you in Chicago.
Wow. At which point I got very nervous and very scared and tried to get out of it several times.

Speaker 4 And I can remember going down the elevator in Chicago to meet him in the lobby, just terrified. Like, what am I doing?

Speaker 2 What in the world am I doing?

Speaker 4 Jesus God, someone,

Speaker 4 what is happening?

Speaker 3 So at this point, you hadn't been on a date in quite some time.

Speaker 2 Yeah, no, no, no.

Speaker 1 So when you say you're scared, is that what you mean? You're like scared? Like, I don't know how to do the date?

Speaker 4 I just, I didn't know if you, I didn't know this guy. Is he a serial killer?

Speaker 2 Like, what am I doing? Right, yeah, yeah. I don't know anything about this shit.

Speaker 3 He's flown across the country to see what he's doing.

Speaker 2 Oh, my God.

Speaker 2 What is happening? What is happening?

Speaker 2 Where did he, did he live in Telluride at that time?

Speaker 4 Yes. He drove.

Speaker 4 He drove a friend's car, which he had to drop off anyway. He was doing a favor for a friend and he just made it work so that he was.

Speaker 2 You're full of bodies. Yeah, yeah.
You got to get rid of it.

Speaker 2 You got to get get rid of bodies. You put them in a car and you put it in a swash.

Speaker 4 And I got out of the elevator and I turned and I saw him there and like every fear evaporated.

Speaker 2 Oh, I was like, oh, this is going to be fine.

Speaker 4 Yeah. This is going to be okay.

Speaker 4 And that was amazing how you

Speaker 3 could read that in people's faces.

Speaker 4 Yeah. It was really.
Yeah. Like there's just a chemical side.

Speaker 2 It's a little bit there.

Speaker 4 Yeah. Yeah.
Like you just, you're like, oh,

Speaker 2 oh, okay.

Speaker 3 This was how many years ago?

Speaker 4 Oh, my God.

Speaker 4 18, 20, 2004. So almost 20 years ago.

Speaker 2 Yeah. Wow.

Speaker 3 And how old is Bennett now? He's your son.

Speaker 2 He's 10. Oh, God.
Isn't that wild?

Speaker 4 I know. So everybody, go to film festivals.
That's all I have to say.

Speaker 2 Telluride is a magic place. It is.

Speaker 4 Just go, go, go, go, go.

Speaker 2 That's a great, you know what? That's a really nice story.

Speaker 3 Yeah, you didn't have to do any swiping, nothing like that. Although I hear swiping is very, is very nice nowadays.

Speaker 3 I hear it's easy.

Speaker 3 Now, Bennett showing any interest in

Speaker 3 doing what you do?

Speaker 2 No, absolutely not.

Speaker 4 And refuses to watch anything I've ever done.

Speaker 3 My kids the same way.

Speaker 4 I made Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles specifically for him because anything else would emotionally damage him and scar him for life.

Speaker 2 No, won't see it. Refuses.
Roots. What?

Speaker 3 Refuses. Does he explain

Speaker 3 what his problem is?

Speaker 2 Because my kids do.

Speaker 2 It's just weird.

Speaker 2 I think it's weird.

Speaker 3 And they they don't like when something bad happens to me. Like, they can't deal with

Speaker 3 any sort of pain or even any sort of challenge, like running from someone or something like that.

Speaker 2 A black rabbit with you. I'm not going to like that.

Speaker 4 Oh, and I agree with you, Sean. I've seen the pilot.

Speaker 2 Amazing. And

Speaker 4 I knew it was going to be good. No, listen.
I knew it was going to be good, but I had... I was floored by how great it was.
And the thing that is great.

Speaker 2 Tell us why.

Speaker 2 Well, Laura, Laura.

Speaker 4 Hold on, hold on, no, no, no, I'm not done.

Speaker 4 The thing that is amazing when you have a relationship with someone who you've worked with for a long period of time and you watch them grow. Yeah.
And to see Jason

Speaker 2 turn into this unbelievable director.

Speaker 4 I mean, always great.

Speaker 2 But this is a whole other level.

Speaker 4 And I've said this to him. I mean,

Speaker 4 it was absolutely.

Speaker 4 I was undone when I saw it.

Speaker 2 Yeah, he was. I was so proud of it.

Speaker 2 I agree. And I agree.
And I want to say this, too. I agree with you.
And we mentioned it before. I don't want to embarrass you, JB.

Speaker 2 But it's also very confusing to watch somebody, your friend, somebody you love,

Speaker 2 grow while simultaneously they are shrinking. Yes.
That has been...

Speaker 3 Total atrophy. Yeah.

Speaker 2 Yes.

Speaker 2 That.

Speaker 2 I'm playing a drug.

Speaker 1 I saw JB at the pool at his house two days ago. I came over two days in a row.
How did you see him? And he was at the

Speaker 2 light must have have been hitting him directly.

Speaker 3 Now, speaking of directing, Laura came in heroically and agreed to direct episode three and episode four of Black Rabbit.

Speaker 2 She just finished.

Speaker 3 And she crushed this so hard.

Speaker 3 She was,

Speaker 2 we haven't seen it yet.

Speaker 3 No, no, no. I was there for every single day.
And I've seen the dailies. I've seen the stills, et cetera, et cetera.
But, you know, I knew she was going to be an incredible leader on set.

Speaker 3 And as far as just like this culture of friendliness and kindness and support and all that stuff, like the crew just freaking loved her, as did the cast.

Speaker 3 But her comfort with this added responsibility, like as actors, not to belittle acting at all, but actors simply are kind of insulated from, you know, like almost three quarters of the process because things need to be decided on and set up and

Speaker 3 assets need to be put into motion and et cetera. Then the actors come in and do their magical thing.

Speaker 3 She took on all of that, had only done it once before on Ozark, directed one of our best episodes ever.

Speaker 3 And

Speaker 3 her place is about three blocks from our studio. And I said, hey,

Speaker 1 it's real close.

Speaker 3 It's not terrible stuff. There's a good crew.
There's a good cast. We would love to have you.
We please consider it. And it would have been so easy for her to say no.
And so much free time.

Speaker 1 Let me ask you this. And you don't have to pat yourself on the back, but isn't it a gift to have been an actor and then a director?

Speaker 4 Without a doubt. And also, but I really, I can't emphasize enough how

Speaker 4 I would never have done this unless Jason really pushed me to do it. Ever.
I had no desire to do it.

Speaker 2 None. Why?

Speaker 4 I would, A, I didn't want to be one of those like, you know, idiot directors who you're saddled with who didn't know what they were doing. I didn't want to be one of those people.

Speaker 4 You're looking at JB.

Speaker 2 Why are you looking at this? Yes, you're staring right at me.

Speaker 4 And then also, I didn't want to jeopardize my relationship with Jason. Yeah.
I mean, that's another thing.

Speaker 3 Yeah, but that horse left the barn on Ozark, who did such an incredible job on that episode.

Speaker 4 I know, but still, you know,

Speaker 4 I don't think of myself as a director at all. I think of myself as an actress who's directed a few things now.

Speaker 4 But, you know, I don't know, as I've said to Jason, like, I don't know how to thank him for that. How do you thank someone for giving you a whole other sort of thing?

Speaker 2 You don't time?

Speaker 3 But what about now, do you, do you see, I'm going to get you, I've talked to you casually about this, now I'm going to get you on record.

Speaker 3 What part of your life going forward do you see directing being in? Like, what's our ratio going forward?

Speaker 3 I mean, as you, you talked a little bit earlier about how the roles, you kind of implied this, so the roles get better and better the older we get because they're more complicated, they're more nuanced.

Speaker 3 You're drawing on more from yourself.

Speaker 3 So the acting, I'm sure, won't slow down, but there is time to do the directing as well.

Speaker 3 Did you get enough of a challenge and satisfaction from it to make it a bigger part of your life?

Speaker 4 You know, I think I will go with it the way I have gone with the other stuff, which is if it comes my way, or if there's something I find, or if there's something I want to do, then I'll do it.

Speaker 3 But will you tell your people to look?

Speaker 4 I think they will look.

Speaker 2 Okay. I think they're good.

Speaker 2 What has it done for you as an actor?

Speaker 2 How has

Speaker 2 directing this much now changed? Has it changed the way? But yeah, but no, but do you think it's going to change the way that

Speaker 2 you approach the work now, that you approach material? Not to get into process, but just like

Speaker 2 when you're reading material, do you look at it through a different set of eyes a little bit?

Speaker 4 You know, I'll have to see because the Ozark, which I did, was such

Speaker 4 a blip and sort of I was, my head was spinning the whole time. And, you know, I just didn't know what had happened.

Speaker 4 and then this one was so intense in the best way and so all-consuming literally we we we finished on Thursday I just got out of bed this morning yeah I mean it took me like three days to you know the fatigue it's a whole other level of fatigue look how wiped out her dog still is exactly you know so um

Speaker 4 you know so I'll be really curious to see what it does. Hopefully it will make me a better actress.
I mean,

Speaker 4 that's the hope.

Speaker 3 Did it take more out of you than doing a one-woman show? 18?

Speaker 2 Absolutely. Are you kidding? Absolutely.

Speaker 4 I didn't have to deal with any people. I didn't have to deal with anybody.
It was just me. I only had to deal with my own horrible stuff.
But I didn't have to deal with 200 people.

Speaker 3 And 4,000 questions.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 1 Did you, do you have, you don't have to reveal any names, anything?

Speaker 1 What's the thing that you find difficult in any working relationship?

Speaker 1 Something that gets you, that you won't, first of all, that you won't stand for, or second, that really kind of rubs you the wrong way and you look out for to avoid yeah i i think it's always hard when people have a preconceived notion of what something is supposed to be

Speaker 4 and then you come and you see something very different or you see something be way beyond that

Speaker 4 and it's and that is always a painful negotiation for everybody and i understand from the other point of view like why that would be hard i totally totally get it and we were very lucky on this one you know how amazing all these writers were and and all of that stuff um but But I've seen that from the acting standpoint as well.

Speaker 4 I've really seen it more as an actress. Like people don't see what

Speaker 4 I can just see things very clearly sometimes. And it's, I turn to these people and go, but you wrote this.

Speaker 4 Yeah. I'm just doing what you wrote.
Like whether you are aware of it or not, you wrote this. Yeah.

Speaker 2 You know, so. Right, right, right.

Speaker 2 We'll be right back.

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Speaker 1 and now back to the show

Speaker 2 now you you've been Jason's

Speaker 2 on-screen wife for many years. You were.
Yes, lucky me. Lucky you.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 What's something about Jason Bateman that people might not know?

Speaker 3 That you'd like to divorce him about?

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 2 If we were going to have a divorce, what would it be?

Speaker 2 What is something that Jason Doug does that's kind of unique that you've noticed about him, like a quirk?

Speaker 4 Here's one thing that I think why our friendship is so

Speaker 4 fulfilling for me, at least, and why working is so good is that we work completely differently sure I mean we come from totally different cultures completely different and it's a I love watching him work yeah it's just kind of amazing and it can only that sort of work can only happen and now I believe as well the directing is is benefiting from this as well from someone who's been doing it as long as Jason's been doing it I mean it's in his bones in a way that it will never be with most people he's just you know had the time with it and and well he's only got bones left now you know it's true

Speaker 4 He needs several cheeseburgers. I know.

Speaker 2 I'm just walking back. No, it's really.

Speaker 3 But this is probably what would lead to our divorce. It's too, it's too much work.
It's a workaholic. It's Amanda and I talk about it all the time.
Although

Speaker 3 she doesn't tell me not to, but she's just like, she's asking me this morning, too. We were talking about this other thing.

Speaker 3 She's like, well, is that, if you were to direct that, is that all consuming?

Speaker 2 I was like,

Speaker 2 it always is. It's always going to be all.

Speaker 3 You know, I know. But

Speaker 3 that's why we love it.

Speaker 2 Can we get Amanda on here at some point, too, do you think? Let's talk about a deal.

Speaker 2 And now we're working our way

Speaker 2 into reality. We're going to work towards your real wife, into having Amanda on be amazing.

Speaker 4 I'm the stand-in.

Speaker 3 We'll go around the circle. Next one will be

Speaker 3 either your current partner, Will, or an ex or something like that. Sean, you as well.
We'll all take turns. It'll just be sort of just like a rotating bloodbath.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 Oh my God.

Speaker 4 Well, you sort of test the waters with me. I'm sort of

Speaker 4 as close as you'll get at this point.

Speaker 1 Laura, what do do you do to zone out after you've been working 14 hours and you're done directing something like that or a big play or something?

Speaker 2 I go to bed. Yeah.

Speaker 4 You know, I mean, honestly, there's not a whole lot that happens.

Speaker 2 I mean, what are you going to do this week? You're not, you finished directing that show last week, and now, like, this week is your recuperate. Are you going to yoga? Are you going to Pilates?

Speaker 2 Are you going to

Speaker 2 gym?

Speaker 4 No. No, I'm staring at a wall.

Speaker 2 You're staring at the wall.

Speaker 4 I'm going to stare at a wall.

Speaker 4 I'm going to be really quiet. Really quiet.

Speaker 3 Right.

Speaker 3 Your quiet activity is reading, watching bad reality TV.

Speaker 4 Occasionally, yes. Guilty.

Speaker 2 Are you reading anything good right now? What are you reading right now? Anything good?

Speaker 4 I just picked up, oh God, what's it called? I won't leave you. Do not leave me.

Speaker 2 I forgot. I forgot.

Speaker 4 But I was reading vigorously until Black Rabbit happened.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 4 And then it all fell apart.

Speaker 3 And then you're going to start editing next week, right?

Speaker 2 Yeah, yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 4 But tomorrow, tomorrow, and tomorrow is one of the things I read last year, year, which I just still am floored by.

Speaker 2 Really?

Speaker 4 Tomorrow, tomorrow, and tomorrow, it's wonderful. Fiction?

Speaker 4 Wonderful. Fiction.
Yeah.

Speaker 4 Spectacular. Yeah.

Speaker 2 Is it a thriller?

Speaker 4 No, it's about three friends who

Speaker 4 make video games. It's a world I know nothing about, don't care about.
And boy, this book is glorious.

Speaker 2 It's so beautiful.

Speaker 2 It's just

Speaker 4 beautiful.

Speaker 2 Are the options available?

Speaker 4 I think they're already, I'm sure they're already taken. Also, the librarianist is really good.
I've heard it.

Speaker 2 Patrick DeWitt. Yes, very, very good.

Speaker 4 Yeah.

Speaker 4 So you can join my book club. I'll send you some recommendations.

Speaker 2 I've just been reading this. I'm reading this biography as 20 years old on de Kooning right now that is just absolutely fascinating.
On Bill DeKooning. What's that mean? Willem.

Speaker 2 On the painter, Willem de Kooning. Bill DeKooning.

Speaker 4 There's a Sylvia Plath biography that everybody loves.

Speaker 2 I'm going to write that down too. Laura,

Speaker 3 if you weren't an actor or director, what do you think you would do? You had to do?

Speaker 3 Not where you would have possibly hit a left fork instead of a right fork early on, but like today,

Speaker 3 if you had to pick a different career, what do you think you're best suited for right now?

Speaker 3 Like, would you write books?

Speaker 3 Would you teach at Juilliard?

Speaker 4 I think medicine.

Speaker 2 Medicine. Medicine.

Speaker 4 Yeah, I think medicine. Really?

Speaker 2 I love medicine.

Speaker 2 Like a doctor or something? Yeah.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 1 Do you love medical stuff?

Speaker 2 And like,

Speaker 1 I can't get enough of it.

Speaker 4 Yeah. No, I do.

Speaker 1 I'd like to know people's issues, how they got it, what they're doing.

Speaker 4 And I weirdly know things. Like, how do I know what a pericardium is? Why do I know that?

Speaker 2 But I could see you working with people in maybe medicine and maybe teaching, maybe doing something. You have such a, and I'm going to say that you have such a kind smile.
Yeah. And you really do.

Speaker 2 But she true.

Speaker 3 You know, all the way through Ozark, every weekend almost, she would be flying off to give some sort, because of her show, The Big C, which was centered around cancer.

Speaker 3 Yes.

Speaker 3 She would give these speeches to,

Speaker 2 correct me, Laura,

Speaker 3 patients,

Speaker 3 doctors, medical institutions,

Speaker 3 recovery homes, et cetera.

Speaker 3 She'd just deliver these speeches about the

Speaker 3 will to live and the joy of life or how to deal with grief, et etc.

Speaker 3 You'd write these things and you'd fly across the country with your weekends off to talk to these people and buoy them.

Speaker 2 I just

Speaker 2 like an angel. I love that.

Speaker 4 And I sort of use it also as a way for arts advocacy, you know, which is just to talk about the arts as much as I can, anywhere I can, as long as I can, because

Speaker 4 it's so important.

Speaker 3 Like Sean, she's not sitting at home making sloppy joes and figuring out what team loses.

Speaker 2 Sean and Scotty say we're going to talk about farts advocacy. Am I right?

Speaker 2 These two.

Speaker 3 But I just think it's like you're going to cut lines upstairs after you're done with all this angel work. I don't know.
Where does it come from?

Speaker 3 Mom, dad?

Speaker 2 I don't know.

Speaker 4 I think I like people. And I think I, you know, and I love the arts.
I love the arts. I think, I think, like, more than just like a selfish thing, I think it's unbelievably important for culture.

Speaker 2 and society. I can't agree more.
I couldn't. It is so undervalued.

Speaker 4 It's unbelievably medicinal. You cannot, there is no wasted time when you're engaged with the arts.
It will make everything better. I mean, it's just

Speaker 3 at a time when the brain is growing, too. So

Speaker 3 like with the work that you do at Juilliard, too, when kids are, I mean,

Speaker 3 they're not toddlers anymore. They're young adults.

Speaker 3 But I imagine that work for you is super fulfilling.

Speaker 3 Remind me what your role is currently there at Juilliard.

Speaker 2 Yeah,

Speaker 3 tell Tracy in Wisconsin what you're doing there at Juilliard and what Juilliard is for Tracy.

Speaker 4 Juilliard is a arts conservatory school, which is sort of one of the leading schools in the country that teaches music, opera, dance, and drama. There are four departments.

Speaker 3 At Lincoln Center?

Speaker 4 Right across the street from Lincoln Center is the Juilliard School. It's there.
It has a long, illustrious history. I somehow, by the grace of God, got in there.

Speaker 4 And, you know, people will ask, like, what was your big break? And for me, it was getting into that school, hands down, hands down. So I was there for four years.

Speaker 4 and

Speaker 4 about 15 to 18 years ago, they called and asked me to give the

Speaker 4 commencement speech, which I did. And they also invited me to join the board of the school, which I did.
I was the only, I think there were only two artists on the board at that time.

Speaker 4 And I've been on it now for a long time and I'm now vice chair for a limited period of time.

Speaker 4 So I'm very involved there and seeing like what institutions like Juilliard, what they do, how they do it, why they do it, and the you know the challenges that are facing young artists today.

Speaker 4 And also I try to, when I have the time, I try to mentor the outgoing class. I will go in and talk to students.
I'll take them out to lunch.

Speaker 4 And sometimes I can do it and sometimes I can't.

Speaker 1 What is the biggest challenge, Laura,

Speaker 2 for

Speaker 1 a young aspiring actress today? What do you think that biggest challenge is?

Speaker 2 Yeah, really. Right.

Speaker 4 I mean, it's impossible. I mean,

Speaker 4 and which is why Juilliard's making such a concerted effort to go tuition-free. You know, it's and why a lot of schools are because we train these artists at this very, very high level.

Speaker 4 They leave and then they can't support themselves and then they drop out and we lose them.

Speaker 2 Right. Do you, do you spend it? Do you spend a lot of time raising money or working with people or working with groups to try to raise money for the school?

Speaker 2 Are you guys dealing with high net worth individuals, all these people that you need, these patrons, as it were,

Speaker 2 who some of them I mean I'm sure some of that's tough but you need that right you need to have these people in order to keep it running yes the angel people yes and then you need the small donations as well you need people just involved you need people who just to care about the article open your pocketbook for once no i say no jason just did a whole new winter wardrobe i it's you're in right now

Speaker 2 listen

Speaker 2 okay he lost a lot of weight he needs the new clothes yeah just got back from paris yeah he goes

Speaker 1 Speaking of books and stuff, tell me something you've seen that you love recently. A TV show.

Speaker 2 Wait, wait, before we leave the Juilliard thing,

Speaker 3 and speaking of angel people, so

Speaker 3 Laura just continues to blow my mind. So we have this young actor on the show.
His name is Robert Elijah Coleman.

Speaker 3 He was going to Juilliard. He got cast in this show.
He was working on a day, this is a month ago,

Speaker 3 when Juilliard graduation was happening. He had done his four years at Juilliard.

Speaker 3 It's incredible to graduate from Juilliard, but he was scheduled to work on that day.

Speaker 3 Partly my fault I was directing, but Laura was prepping her episodes coming in, so she was around the set. And what she decided to do as a Big Shot at Juilliard was to grab his diploma.

Speaker 3 grab his cap and gown,

Speaker 3 write this long speech, an incredible speech that one would receive if they were lucky enough to be at their ceremony when they're graduated, but he couldn't because he had to be sitting on set.

Speaker 3 She asked me if she could stop production for about five or ten minutes, bring in a cake, do the whole thing, gather the whole crew, and she delivered the speech and she put on the graduation music and everything.

Speaker 3 This kid, the greatest, greatest guy, was so bowled over, as was the whole crew and cast.

Speaker 3 And she presented him with his diploma and full graduation ceremony right there on set after four years of Juilliard.

Speaker 2 Like, it is.

Speaker 3 It's like, who has that idea?

Speaker 2 That is really, really, really sweet.

Speaker 4 That is incredible.

Speaker 4 You know, there are moments in your life. They're big moments that need to be recognized.
And, you know, Eli had been through, I know what it is to go through Juilliard.

Speaker 4 I know what it is to graduate from that school to feel like you've, you know. you've done something and now, oh, God, what's going to happen now? And you've done it with an ensemble of people.
And

Speaker 4 it killed me that he was not going to be with his.

Speaker 3 And he didn't tell anybody on set, he had not mentioned it to anybody that he was missing a graduation.

Speaker 4 I knew, so I went to him. I'm like, are you okay about this? And he was so good-natured about it.
He was so happy to be there. He was like, I'm fine, I'm fine.
And I just

Speaker 4 sort of couldn't, I couldn't stand it. So I, and Jason was kind enough to let me sort of hijack the set for a bit.
So it was fun. It was really fun.

Speaker 1 Yeah, the performance of being at a graduation doesn't come close to doing the thing that you graduated for.

Speaker 2 Right, to get the job. Yeah, and it didn't, absolutely.
Right. And

Speaker 2 it didn't matter that they had to move that day, that he had to shoot that day because Jason had a golf game on the other day.

Speaker 2 That doesn't matter. It doesn't even come up.
No. It doesn't even come up.
We'll work it out. Don't even live up.
Yeah. Because he's got a tea time with his buddies.

Speaker 3 Now, Sean, what was your question that was? I was just going to see.

Speaker 1 I'm always interested in what people are watching recently that you liked or any recommendations, documentaries, movies.

Speaker 4 Alone.

Speaker 2 Alone. Watching alone.
Oh, Jason loves that. I love alone.
Can I just say one more thing? I want to talk about alone.

Speaker 2 Before we get out of the Juilliard stuff, what can people do to support the arts wherever they live?

Speaker 2 Wherever anybody is like, what would be a really important thing that people who listen to our podcast could do to try to help young people get involved in the arts? And what can people do?

Speaker 3 Oh, I know, vote for the Democratic ticket.

Speaker 2 There's that. Well, apart from that, what could people do, honestly, Laura? Go.

Speaker 4 I mean, I think

Speaker 2 Sean. I just thought that was a really good suggestion.
Listen. What's going on at the house.

Speaker 3 Sean's got that update on his iOS where he does a double thumbs up. It's fireworks.

Speaker 4 You know, I think it's go. Find something in your community that is there.
Go with your family. Have a communal experience and go.

Speaker 2 Just buy a ticket. Get off your phone.

Speaker 4 And see what happens. Yeah.
Yeah. You know,

Speaker 4 here's a big name-dropping moment. But Edward Alvey said to me one time, he was, I know.
Pick it up.

Speaker 4 He said,

Speaker 4 listen to Bach for 10 minutes every morning. He says, it organizes the mind.

Speaker 2 Wow.

Speaker 4 And he's right. And so I tell people, when I give these speeches around the country, I tell people, like, try it for two weeks, see what happens.
Just 10 minutes.

Speaker 4 And Jason, you know, because you love classical music, you know, that it's, it does, it permeates your being and it realigns you in a way. Music does.
I mean, Sean, you know this as well. You know,

Speaker 4 it's a powerful thing, the arts. And

Speaker 4 I think it's the most underused resource we have, or one of them, in this country. And it makes me crazy that our government has never really leaned into that.

Speaker 4 Except now our surgeon general is using it for mental health.

Speaker 4 He's encouraging people to get involved in graduate.

Speaker 1 Yeah, I was going to say there's probably a lot less violence in the world. I know that's a crazy thing to say.
But

Speaker 1 if more people are exposed to the arts, there's a lot of people.

Speaker 4 Absolutely.

Speaker 4 And graduation rates skyrocket if the kid is involved in the arts.

Speaker 4 It's just skyrockets. And there's always something somewhere.
And you don't have to be good at it. You don't have to be an artist yourself.
I mean,

Speaker 3 Willie's talking about starting to paint.

Speaker 2 He's going to start

Speaker 4 painting a bit.

Speaker 4 I can do stick figures. I mean, that's

Speaker 4 way beyond.

Speaker 3 We're not expecting more than that from Will.

Speaker 2 It's not going to be.

Speaker 2 I'm not going to be showing anything. It's going to be.

Speaker 3 Yes, you will.

Speaker 3 For this Christmas,

Speaker 3 that's all I want from you.

Speaker 1 And I want shitty painting.

Speaker 2 It's going to be really shitty. I'm excited about it.
I was just thinking about it this morning, actually. Good.
I can't wait to see some of that.

Speaker 4 But I think it's like, you know,

Speaker 4 grab someone you love or grab someone you like and go and have an experience and just see what happens.

Speaker 2 I grabbed somebody I liked at the stop-in shop, but I didn't know him.

Speaker 3 You're going to find out what happens when it's

Speaker 3 adjudicated.

Speaker 2 Check out the Daily Mail. Wait, so let's get to,

Speaker 2 you were talking about alone. You love alone, like JB.

Speaker 3 Yeah, a brand new season just started.

Speaker 2 I have

Speaker 2 watched it because of because of him as well.

Speaker 2 Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 2 I know. It's intense, isn't it?

Speaker 4 I mean, I love the guys who go in. This is early in the first few seasons, the really tough guys who are absolutely going to crush it, and they're gone in two hours.

Speaker 4 They hear like a rustle in the weeks, and they're like, I'm tapping out, I'm tapping out, I'm tapping out. And I think that would be me.

Speaker 4 You know, I wouldn't last for two seconds.

Speaker 1 I tap out before they land the helicopter.

Speaker 3 Celebrity alone would be hilarious.

Speaker 2 I'd be tapping out when I'm connecting flights in Minneapolis. I'd be like, I would hang up on my manager on the phone call about

Speaker 2 the request.

Speaker 3 The great Aline Kashishian would get the hang of it. That's right.

Speaker 4 I love

Speaker 4 the places they build for themselves. Yeah.
You know, those huts and the, it's just sort of like a fairy.

Speaker 1 It's like they took naked and afraid and like kind of just heightened it a little bit. Yeah.

Speaker 4 Yeah. And I also love like these poor people filming themselves at the same time.

Speaker 3 No, that's all part of it.

Speaker 2 I like it when they build a great house.

Speaker 2 Like when a guy, there was a guy once in one of those seasons up in the Northwest Territories in Canada, and he built like this stone house with moss and stuff. You're like, yeah, yeah, moss.

Speaker 2 Like that. Moss.

Speaker 4 Who moss was so?

Speaker 3 And then

Speaker 3 they got to rip it down when they leave. You know, they do that little time-lapse thing when it all goes away.

Speaker 2 It's like, no.

Speaker 2 Laura, we're over.

Speaker 3 We're over time. You will be compensated.

Speaker 3 Checks in the mail.

Speaker 3 We love you.

Speaker 2 I love you most.

Speaker 2 I'm a massive, massive fan.

Speaker 1 Happy.

Speaker 2 Always.

Speaker 2 I love all three of you.

Speaker 4 And, you know, I've been lucky enough to work with two of you. And Sean, we're due.

Speaker 2 Yeah,

Speaker 2 I would love it. Maybe I would love it.

Speaker 4 Figure that out. And thanks, JB.
Thanks, John.

Speaker 3 I love you. I'll see you in a few days.
Say hi to Mark and Bennett. I sure will.
And go feed your dog.

Speaker 4 Love to the family. Will do.

Speaker 2 I'm going to wake them up. Okay.

Speaker 2 Bye. Bye, Laura.
Thank you. Bye.

Speaker 3 Well, that was lovely. It was painful for me.
It was

Speaker 3 a lot of love to receive. I'm not good at that, but thank you.

Speaker 2 Yeah, but you're doing better.

Speaker 1 You're doing better.

Speaker 3 She's,

Speaker 3 I, you know,

Speaker 3 she's, I love if you could, if you could pick a second wife, she would be it.

Speaker 1 Well, imagine if it wasn't her. I mean, it was her for a reason, you know, you guys really connected.
And I can't imagine anybody else playing that part.

Speaker 3 I still remember the day I, I, I, um, she was the first person I went to on Ozark. I, I took her out to breakfast at this restaurant in the bottom of this hotel I was staying in in New York.

Speaker 3 It was there scouting, I think. And we share a manager, Elene Kashishin.
And I said to Elene, I said, do you think Laura would ever consider doing a show again?

Speaker 3 And she's like, we should just talk to her.

Speaker 3 And I met her at that restaurant and just pitched her for an hour and a half and was really nervous about even the possibility of her saying.

Speaker 3 yes or no.

Speaker 3 I just, it was such a big swing because I knew by having her on the show, not only would it, would she be an incredible actor on it, but what she would sort of signal to the audience and to the community in the business about what the show is and what the show isn't.

Speaker 3 Like she's just such a great recruiter of high quality people and a declaration of sort of the quality we're kind of shooting for.

Speaker 3 And it was just such a gift that she said, yes.

Speaker 3 The show would never would have happened without her.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 1 I mean, I can't imagine, I can't imagine anybody else doing that part.

Speaker 2 Yeah. Yeah.
So lucky.

Speaker 3 And what a great guest.

Speaker 1 Yeah. She's, I've always been such a massive fan.
Like, she's an actor's actor.

Speaker 2 And she really is. Exactly.

Speaker 1 And you look at her body. I mean, just goes on and on and on and on and on.
IMDB.

Speaker 2 Yep.

Speaker 1 It's crazy. I love that she was here.
And by the way, long time coming.

Speaker 3 Yes, exactly. Yeah.
That was,

Speaker 3 I mean, I remember talking to her when we got, when we first got started,

Speaker 3 we were still doing Ozark, right?

Speaker 2 Yeah. Oh, God.
Right. Yeah.
Right at the end. That's right.
That's Yeah, dirty.

Speaker 2 I mean,

Speaker 2 for a year.

Speaker 2 Right. Yeah.

Speaker 3 Yeah. I remember talking to her.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 3 Yeah. I remember her sort of just looking at me like, I could just sense she was kind of looking at me like, you're doing what?

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 3 Every week you're what?

Speaker 2 Yeah. Yeah.
Exactly.

Speaker 3 And then, yeah, then she started to say, well, you know, some people are talking to me that apparently they've listened to your podcast or something.

Speaker 2 People are liking it.

Speaker 3 I'm like, you've got it. You've got to come on.
You got to come on.

Speaker 2 And she was like, yeah, okay.

Speaker 1 Well, I was nice. It's nice to know.
Here we go.

Speaker 2 It was nice to know. Oh, here I shall.
Oh, now you're just telling us.

Speaker 3 This is the guy who, when you merge.

Speaker 2 Jason Kurta dropped by or something like that. Is that what it was going to be?

Speaker 3 You know, Sean is supposed to be a terrible merger on the freeway. He either comes in doing 120 miles an hour or doing 30 miles an hour.
And everyone's got to slam on the brakes. Go ahead.

Speaker 2 Zip her in.

Speaker 1 No, I just thought it's nice that she said hi to directing, but she definitely didn't say

Speaker 2 hi to acting. Christ.

Speaker 2 Oh, fuck.

Speaker 2 You hear the words.

Speaker 2 Fucking fuck, dude.

Speaker 2 Holy shit. That is rough.

Speaker 2 We might have to put you on a hiatus.

Speaker 2 You can't initiate it.

Speaker 2 Smart.

Speaker 2 Smart.

Speaker 2 Less.

Speaker 2 Smartless is 100% organic and artisanally handcrafted by Michael Grant Terry, Rob Armjarve, and Bennett Barbico.

Speaker 2 Smart Less.

Speaker 6 At Capella University, learning online doesn't mean learning alone.

Speaker 6 You'll get support from people who care about your success, like your enrollment specialist who gets to know you and the goals you'd like to achieve.

Speaker 6 You'll also get a designated academic coach who's with you throughout your entire program. Plus, career coaches are available to help you navigate your professional goals.

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