"Jeremy Renner"

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I started, you know what I started eating for breakfast?

Just almonds.

That's it.

Just almonds? Yeah, just almonds. That's it.
Literally. Yep.
Are you really I started eating for breakfast? Just almonds. That's it.
Just almonds?

Yeah, just almonds.

That's it.

Literally.

Yep.

Are you really eating just almonds for breakfast?

Yeah, just almonds and maybe a yogurt thing.

Okay, well, so now it's also a yogurt thing.

I want to take the just off the top of that.

Welcome to Smartless.

Smart.

Smart.

Smart. Smart.
Less. Smart.
Less. Smart.
Less. Hey, Cool Dad.
Cool Dad, you got the long-sleeved shirt on underneath the short-sleeved shirt today. Very 90s.
It's a cold day um, so then once you just wear a long sleeve golf shirt, I know I don't have a long sleeve golf shirt. So I have this and I have the, and if I want to, I could take it out.
Once you wear your short sleeve golf shirt and just put a sweater over the top of it instead of doing the cool dad thing. I am.
I've got a sweater and I'm going to have a shell because it's kind of rainy and it's very unusually cold for Los Angeles. It's really nice.
And I'm teeing off at 1230. Wait, Tracy bought you both golf shirts.
Did she? She did. Yeah, they're here at the house.
Oh, great. Love her.
Did she buy you anything? She did. Driving gloves for the golf cart? Yeah.
She joined me. She got me a new set of clubs.
So I'll see you guys later. You don't want to know who I'm playing with today I'm surprised you didn't ask me Paul you're playing with Paul Paul you're playing with Paul I'm playing with Paul but guess who else who you got you got Paul our buddy from Toronto Paul M we'll call him Paul McAleese and then we'll...
I got a real friend of the show.

Danny Dees.

Danny Dees.

Nice. Danny Dees.

Ah, I love him.

The nicest man in...

The greatest guy ever in finance.

Yes, yes.

Sure.

In many categories.

And then...

JB, our buddy...

You're going to play five, huh?

Football legend, Gareth Bale.

Gareth's in town.

You're going to play five today? Yeah. No, it's me and Paul, Dan, and Gareth.
Oh, sorry. I'm not great with math.
Evidently. So I'm very excited.
I'm doing a home game today, recording from Los Angeles for the first time in a while. It feels nice.
I've got a microphone on a stand now, you know, instead of a,

it's just,

I'm not comfortable with the New York setup.

What if you came home,

you've been away

for a couple weeks

and then you just looked at it

and you just started

to notice like

some of my stuff was there.

Yeah.

Your underwear's in the sauna.

Yeah.

That would be awful.

That's disgusting.

You're like,

and you just notice

like Amanda's wearing

like an oversized shirt to bed and you're like, is that Will's shirt? That's disgusting. And you just notice Amanda's wearing an oversized shirt to bed,

and you're like, is that Will's shirt?

Well, you know what?

We're about a minute from that.

I know.

I know.

Well, guys, before I get into my guest here,

I heard something recently, a description of a podcast.

Okay. We'll never be lucky enough to have a description like this, I think.
Okay. It's a show about people with more balls than a bowling alley.
Yeah. You know, like.
That's Knoxville said that. He said.
Knoxville, that's right. Knoxville said it's called Pretty Sure I Can Fly.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Right? The Johnny Knoxville host with Elna Baker and— From This American Life.

From This American Life.

It's about, yeah, these people that do things that have far more courage

than the three of us put together would ever even dream of having.

Well, thanks a lot.

Right.

And unlike ours, Pretty Sure I Can Fly is educational and inspiring.

Exactly.

Yeah, you're not going to learn a whole lot here,

but we hide it right there in the title. Yeah, it's a great podcast.
Yeah, it's worth checking out. Anyway, Pretty Sure I Can Fly by Smartless Media is out now with Johnny Knoxville and Elna Baker.
So punch it into your nearest podcast playing machine and enjoy. Yeah.
All right, huge apologies to our guests. This has been much too long here for the Regis and Kathy Lee chatter.
Here comes our guest. Sadly, even though I'm in Los Angeles, I still have not written an intro.
Wow. Mostly, though, because I just love this guy.
I don't need to write an intro for him. I know him.
He's a buddy of mine. I think he's a buddy of both of yours as well, but I'm closer with him.

Okay?

Okay.

We'll see.

I'm a big, big fan of his work.

He's an enormous movie star, global.

Wow.

You know, and even just bigger, all-time great guy.

He's got some interesting things to tell us.

I know you're going to love this hour. Everybody, ladies and gentlemen, it's Hollywood's Jeremy Renner.
Jeremy, come on out. There he is.
Look at him go. Hollywood's Jeremy Renner.
What's going on? This guy's a major movie star. You guys better tighten it up.
Look at that. What's happening? What's up, man? I wish we were all together, actually.
I know, right? I haven't seen some faces on the screen, but it's nice to hear you guys. Jeremy, you know where we're all together? Right here.
Over here in the heart. Right here in the heart.
That's right. I didn't see where you were pointing.
I just realized something. I had to reboot my computer right before we started.
All my questions are gone, but that's okay. Oh, I can start.
I can start. No, yeah, you go ahead.
Yeah, Jer, first of all. Welcome.
Yeah, welcome. You look great.
Look at the guns already. The guns are great.
I mean, crazy. You're looking great.
I follow you on Instagram as well, and I love all your positivity. Wait, what? Really? Yeah.
I love all the positive comments. You're always so warm and thankful and grateful to your fans and everybody with all the support, with all the tragedy that you've had.
And you're doing so great. It's so good to see you.
Well, yeah, you're busy. Mayor of Kingstown's out now, right? It started June 2nd, I think.
Yes? It's coming out June 2nd, yeah. Well, when this airs, it'll be out.
So unbelievable start to the season there, Jeremy. Yeah, way to go.
June 2nd. Back on June 2nd, the show came out.
Yeah. Season three.
The first time I ever saw you, I just moved to Los Angeles. And I don i don't know if you like we can cut this if you don't want to talk about it but i watched this reality show called the it factor factor and it was like the one of the first reality shows ever and you were one of the actors they followed around to auditions and see about your career and i was i loved the series and i had another friend um in it as well.
And you, I remember you getting Dahmer or something, playing Jeffrey Dahmer and then, or SWAT. And you had to pick between the two or one of the two.
And I was like, oh my God, this guy's going to be so huge. And we're watching it in real time.
You going on auditions and really going. Yeah, that was a really random thing.
I actually ended up doing that show because I did Dumber already.

And we shot that movie in two weeks for like $100,000.

So I didn't know what was going to happen with this tiny little movie.

So I did it to kind of promote that.

But then it turned into like this little Cinderella story

because that movie came out and then I got like William Morris,

all these things happened.

And then like you said, the audition for SWAT

Thank you. It was really cool.
I don't know that anybody would do that today. Do you think anybody, that show would work? I don't know.
It'd be hard to kind of catch that. Does anybody know when you're going to break or have any sort of...
Right. Yeah, but I mean, think about all those things over the years where they've tried to, like, get behind this or whatever, but to actually lock on to somebody, to an actor, and then have it pay off and actually become a big movie star.
Yeah, what are the odds? The odds are pretty rare. And then, And then months later, it was like, Jeremy Renner, you were just a huge star and have remained since.
So it was really exciting. Our buddy Sam Jones did a great documentary on Wilco called Trying to Break Your Heart.
And the cameras were with Wilco while they were making Yankee Hotel Foxtrot or Foxtrot Hotel, whatever it um and and the label dropping them because it was too challenging to listen to and then they they went to a different label or made their own i can't remember but then it ends up winning the grammy for best album of the year i think and like i couldn't believe the cameras were there for that whole thing it sounds like this is uh uh something similar yeah yeah yeah you catch a little lightning in a bottle, you know? Yeah, but I mean, but building off of that, Jeremy, I mean, buddy,

why is similar. Very similar, yeah.
Yeah, you catch a little lightning in a bottle, you know. Yeah, but I mean, building off of that, Jeremy, I mean, buddy, watching your career just explode right out of the gate, and it has not stopped yet.
I mean, you know. Well, first of all, Hurt Locker was just phenomenal.
Yeah. And, you know, and everything you've done since, but that was like the thing.
I remember watching that and being like, who's this fucking dude is? Who's this motherfucker taking all of our chops? He's just crushing. Were you always so discerning from an early age in your career to be able to pick what gave you the strength to say no to certain things and not freak out about your paycheck and your rent? Yeah, yeah.
I think that't know where exactly that comes from i know for me it was being very clear and focused on what i wanted and also what i didn't want um early on like i i did a lot of comedy stuff and i'm like it wasn't trying to go down that road and i ended up that's why domino was a great turning point for me to kind of go into darker sort of deeper sort of uh uh character roles and um i just was just kind of clear and then if i didn't connect to it it's an easy no no matter how much money i've turned down more money than i'll ever make in life because i never did something for money that's great you have to you have to be okay with yourself in that. In order to say no to money, mind you, I mean, I think even during that It Factor show, I was turning down a lot of money, and I had no power.
I had no running freaking water. I thought you meant Hollywood power.
But I'm living on $5 a month to eat. Like, it's yum yum donuts.
You get 13 donut holes, 14 donut holes for 99 cents. I'm crushing those for two weeks.
Uh-huh. And, you know, donut hole a day, it's yum yum donuts.
You know, you get like 13 donut holes, 14 donut holes for 99 cents. I'm crushing those for two weeks.
You know, donut hole a day. It's brutal, dude.
But you know that when you know your- Sean's pants are getting crowded right now. You know your limits, right? You know you're allowing yourself to go.
It's like, all right, well, I don't have to say yes to something just from money. And so it gives me the power in the ball to say, to note things.
I love that. And then Clint Barton comes along, you're like, how much? Well, it wasn't that much.
I'm kidding, I'm kidding. Yeah, I'm kidding.
So Hurt Locker happens, you get the Academy Award nomination, and is there then a waterfall of really great options for you that become somewhat problematic because you can't do them all? How do you go about picking through all the great stuff you're looking at then after that? I feel like the calendar filled up pretty quickly. I don't know.
What was next? Was the town next? There's a town, yeah, was next. Was Mission Impossible? There was Born.
And there's Mission Impossible. Then Avengers was booked, but it was shot later.
And then it was Born. And then there was Hansel and Gretel.
And then there was Mission Impossible. So it was like all that happened probably within, you know, six months.
Jesus. And so they're all, for the most part, franchises, if you will.
So like I'm kind of booked up. And so they all got scheduled.
So your next, basically your three, four years, five years is booked. Yeah, it was like four years was, yeah, jammed up.
I was gone for four years. Wow.
And how did you deal with that, with being away from home, living out of a suitcase? I mean, that's a, and all the fame too. Like that transition, talk to us about that.
Well, it's actually interesting because, you know, I was kind of very excited to have the opportunities. And by the time, Born was the last thing that kind of came my way.
And I'd already signed on to Avengers. That's, you know, how many, a decade of your life.
You have to sign on for it. It doesn't mean you're going to do it, but you sign on for it, right? I'm going 50 years old in fucking tights.
So that's what I was having my conversation with the team. So I'm like, am I doing this? Am I really doing this? And then same with Mission Impossible.
I talk with Tom. He's like, all right, well, we're going to do three of these.
I'm like, okay, well, that's – so my whole decade's booked for the most part. And then Bourne comes around, and he's like, oh, wow, I really creatively obviously love to do this.
I love to be involved with Matt, what he did with it. But I had to really pause and say, let me think about this here.
I'm kind of jammed up already. Right.
And this is also I'm the face of the thing, too, kind of different than Mission Impossible. It's much more Tom and this type of thing.
So it was a quick 24-hour sort of thinking session on it, but I had to take pause on it. And all of that's very exciting, but I knew I gave up a decade of my life.
And yeah, and Jeremy, were you worried that when you make these decisions, did you ever go down? Because I wonder if I would go like, yeah, today I want to do it, but how am I going to feel five years from now if I'm locked and exhausted?

We don't know that.

We don't know the things.

You can consider it, right?

That's all you can do is consider it.

And it's like, you're an idiot to say no to these things.

They're amazing opportunities.

They're all quality franchises, if you will. But at what cost? what cost yeah at what cost it will be something i'll be determined later you know yeah yeah and i and i i knew i was going to miss a lot um but i knew that there was an end to it right yeah and so i can like let me go let me let me give it a go and i and yeah don't be wrong there were times where most of the time it was amazing yeah most of.
But then there was like, you know. You hadn't become a dad yet, right? Yeah, I wasn't a dad yet.
Yeah. And so that's why I can have a really good time.
I was a single guy. I can just go out and just focus on work and see the world, right? And get paid to be in shape and all these amazing things, right? It was fantastic.
But I did miss my family that I'm very deeply close with. it's very large and um so i had like four birthdays in a row with my assistant who he was i'm on january 7th and he's he was january 8th and he's exactly a decade younger than me so we celebrated our birthdays together like in a ferrari in abu dhabi going to an f1 i mean you know oh my god That's an episode of Will and Grace or something.
That's great. I mean, you know.

Oh, my God. Wow.
That's an episode of Will and Grace or something. Yeah, exactly.
Yeah, we actually shot it. I don't know.
It was a great thing, but you don't know what will all come down the road. It's a wonderful blessings, and the perspective to take from that, I mean, I'd do the same thing all over again.
Yeah. I don't have the now, but.
Right, right. But the schedule of those huge, huge films with a lot of stunts and special effects, the budget on those allows for a much slower movement, pacing as far as knocking down pages each day.
Was that a big transition for you coming from even, I would imagine The H the hurt locker was uh was something that was not as highly budgeted as these things what is that like that that snail's pace like because sometimes on those stunt films like mission possible the degree of difficulty is just astronomical and the stunt complexity and stuff where you're only shooting like you know what the audience sees is maybe 10 maybe 10 seconds. It might take you a week to shoot that.
Or three weeks. Yeah, yeah.
Like a Mission Impossible, like that. The whole Burj Khalifa.
How do you keep your focus and whatnot during that? Well, initially I think the main difference is just craft services. Yeah.
It's a bit different. Yeah, nice trailer.
It's in the trailer side. But yeah, it does take longer.
A lot of it is in the prep, too, for anything that's that physical. When it's those physical movies, there's so much.
It's months and months of physical prep before you go do it. Getting in shape.
So then while you're doing it, you're training like an athletic team or an athletic sport. Yeah.
And you have to treat it such. What was your favorite way in which to get in shape? Were you into the boxing? Were you into cardio? Were you into just cross-training? I'm sure it's been a bunch of things.
You've been in shape for a long time. Yeah, yeah.
I think it depends on what the role really requires. Most of them, you know, like, for instance, like the Bourne Legacy, that required the most physical.
And so we had to train, like, all sorts of mixed martial arts and judo and just all the different things, man. It's all my...
Did you get, like, have those, like, training mishaps where you end up getting clocked in the face by the guy or you clock somebody in the face while you're a bunch of lawsuits. I might have smashed a dude or two.
Now, when you go over to something like American Hustle or Arrival, is that it must be nice where you don't have to wait around for a bunch of stunt stuff and effect stuff, and you're doing much more sort of, well, it's a different kind of acting on those films. Yeah.
Did you love that transition? Yeah. Well, I mean, it's just sort of, that's kind of more in the decision-making to do the job, you know, it's, it's, those are the easy ones with great directors and great writing and great characters.
You can go in, it was a lot more cerebral, much more emotional context characters and a lot more people to work with. And the other ones like from the Avengers and Bourne and all those Mission Possibles, There's a lot more cerebral, much more emotional context characters and a lot more people to work with.
And the other ones, like from the Avengers and Bourne and all those Mission Impossible, it's much more about the stunts and the physical stuff. Which is fun.
It's just a different muscle to use. And ideally, you're sort of switching back and forth, right? I think so.
I mean, to keep it all interesting, right? I'm on the third season of Mirror Kingstown, right? I've never done that before.

Repeated the same character.

You've done an Ozark and you've done shit most of your life.

And the pace of that though is much faster, right?

That's enjoyable that there's momentum, yeah?

Yeah, yeah.

It's something interesting about it.

There's a controlled chaos in television today, especially.

We're shooting, we shoot like a film, like a 10 hour film in a third of the time, you know, it's crazy. We'll be right back.
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Hey guys, everybody should have a support system, right? Who's your support system? My support system, as you well know, talk about all the time, is Scotty. And of course, my two besties, Will and Jason.
Whenever I have a problem, an issue, I talk to them about it. And if they're not available, I will talk to a therapist.
And I've been going to therapy for a long time and it's always great. So think about your favorite leaders, mentors, and idols.
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And now back to the show. How were you able to struggle through the really outrageously poor direction from a guy like ben affleck how did you get through the town it's just a miracle the results uh that end up on the screen on his films um was it um well just just walk us through it yeah yeah he's's great, man.
I remember meeting with Ben on that.

And that's the first time I met him.

I'm like, I think my first meeting with him, sitting across,

my first question to him was like,

how are you going to direct this thing and act it and star in it?

Yeah.

I mean, you're kind of an okay actor.

I mean, how are you going to direct and act this thing?

Kind of fucking with him. He's a beast.
Yeah, and he's so damn smart, man. Working with him was so, so great.
And I really learned how, I mean, he gave me so much freedoms. I mean, he says, we're not going to do dialects.
I've never been to Boston in my life. Yeah.
I don't know anything about it, right? And he's like, we're not going to do any dialect coaches. I'm like, okay'm like okay great well what the fuck am i going to do then i'm like all right he introduced me to a bunch of people just got out of prison yeah i had a bunch of armed robbers and all this shit bank robbers so i just hung out with these guys in the bars for a couple weeks uh in town and then i kind of found the character and found what i was going to do oh that's no way that.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. So it was, but if we didn't shoot in Boston, I would have been royally screwed.
Yeah. But thank God we were there because all of my access to what I needed was there.
Yeah. And then he's just one of the, he's so smart.
And he just kind of let me do my thing. And at first he would start he would start to mouth my my lines as i was acting with them and i'm like i had to turn my head i'm like i'm gonna smash this motherfucker i'm gonna smash this fucker but only pissed me off to get me more in the mood but this guy but it was like the very first scene we shot and uh and i don't think he did it after that anymore but yeah he was a great man he really was so great he he was working his butt off man and uh but i really was i i fell in love with him and um i have so much respect for him he's just one of the smartest guys i know actually he's really you know you know it's funny you watch those movies those specifically those boston movies, and if you ask people from Boston one of the things that they hate, and you guys did such a good job in that movie.
Such a good job. And I've talked about this with Matt before, too.
You watch other movies where people do Boston accents, and I'm not going to name them because there are a lot of really big names, really famous actors who've done big Boston movies, and the accents are fucking terrible. And people from Boston hate it.
They get pissed off. And if these people had any idea, and I'm talking big, shiny names.
Yeah. They come in and they fucking- Tell us what one of the names sounds like.
Yeah. It sort of rhymes with- Dude, dude, let me say this, dude.
Fucking, you're not going to get me fucking classic baby trying to get me to say something about these fucking. No, you know what?

I fucking, I used to work.

I worked for fucking Devin Fire Department.

Fucking, my brother works for the fucking Edison.

Shut the fuck up, dude.

Fire Department.

No, fuck you.

Wait, Jeremy, how did you become, how did you become Jeremy Renner, the guy we know today?

Like when you, going back to the first thing we talked about today, when I was like, oh my God, I watched you and coming up and you had all this kind of chutzpah to just want to be great and not worry about anything else but the art of it, where did that come from? Were you a kid that was inspired by something? I got to say, Sean, you've got a lot of chutzpah to use the word chutzpah. Yeah, with the extra chutzpah.
Where do you get a, I mean, you know. Johnny Whitebread over here.
Go ahead, Jeremy.

Fire department.

I didn't really discover acting until I was in college.

Really?

Yeah, yeah, and in theater.

So I went in like with a criminology sort of idea I was going to study

or computer science or some shit, and then took an elective.

And that's, I think I told you, I might have mentioned this to you, Jason, when we had dinner at Downey's, but uh took an elective um and that's i think i told you i might have mentioned this to you jace when we had dinner down here but i saw an elective um when i was signing up for the courses and acting was one of them like i'll do this speech class i'll try this acting thing only thing i that popped in my brain um what i knew about acting was michael j fox and fucking you jace right because he shows he's fucking family ties and all these goddamn just That's the only thing I knew. It's what I knew about acting was Michael J.
Fox and fucking you, Jace, right? Because in his shows, he's fucking family ties and all these goddamn, just the only thing I knew. It's what I watched, right? Growing up.
I mean, all those things. So I'm like, fuck, I'll try it.
I'll try that thing. And went into it.
This guy can do it. Yeah, this fucker can do it.
I can do that shit. No, but that's just kind of what I watched with the kind of, I i guess you know related to and then uh anyway fell in love with with theater and then started studying theater and psychology and just went and ran from there wow which is what i was like 18 19 and um yeah just uh stuck with that well it's funny because you are you are such a sort of actor's actor too you know what i mean like you've got like very natural yeah very natural and you've got this thing you're really you're very serious and you can tell that you take your craft really seriously and that you're very you know everything's well thought out nothing's by mistake you're not just hoping to get lucky in a take you know you know what i mean yeah and and uh so it's funny that it kind of came to you later because it seems like it's really such a it comes so naturally naturally.
Well, I mean, that just comes, I think that's the psychology sort of part of it. And you have to, I think there's a self-awareness and a confidence that, you know, that comes from doing stage.
Yeah. There's, you see a lot of, when people are stage actors, there's a, they hold it in their body a bit more.
They're not just doing a scene or a thing that they, they kind of kind of immerse in it in their body and spirit. Cause you have to do it for an hour and a half, two hours on stage.
Right. You have to really embody it longer than we do when we're doing television and film.
Yeah. That's a good point.
Um, was, was, was music something that, that was, that was sort of pulling at you as well. Did you have to sort of make a decision with yourself whether you were going to kind of put all your weight behind one or the other? No, no.
I never considered music as a career. It's always a form of therapy, artistic.
Bit of a hobby? Yeah, well, it's so much a hobby. I don't really believe in hobbies.
I feel like you either do something or you don't. Right.
I don't have fucking time for hobbies. That's hysterical.
You know what I mean? Very good. I don't have time to just dip my toe in the water.
I'm not taking a fucking bath here in life. Right? Just dipping my toe in it.
It's not happening. So you're going to do something or yeah, you either do it or you don't.
Yeah, Jason, you dumb fuck. Yeah, you're right.
I didn't want like be a player of music right i didn't want to

be a guitar player or a drummer which i am those things or a piano player there's i don't have the time or patience or even excellence or skill set to be able to do that what i did want to do is be able to play instruments to compose to having a form of expression music is a wonderful form to express.

And it's wonderfully shared as well.

You can't really share poetry so so much as you can with music it's more uniting in its experience yeah and so i love music for that and uh that'll always be near and dear to me and very important to me in my life but i don't want some record label saying you got to do this

you got to do that i'm like fuck or i got or i have to do something it's oh i do it for the purity of it for me and the expression of it for me do you have time to to uh still play music with sons of the pioneers no no i i just i just do stuff uh in the studio yeah do stuff in the studio at this point and you know like i did i did for the um from after the accident i um put together an ep of a collection of songs that were about their life death and recovery of this last sort of 16 months of my life yeah or a year of my life and i put out the um the seven songs um on the anniversary of this year yeah wow that's really heavy man i didn't know that. I want to hear about that.
Yeah, me too. Can you talk a little bit about that? I mean, obviously we all heard the devastating news when the accident happened, and then of course that you sort of pulled through and obviously pulled through with colors now, but what a time in your life.
And just walk us through that a little bit if you could. Yeah, and I'd like to know just personally to add it to that is like, what do you, it's a common question, I'm sure, but what do you see differently now that you're on the other side of it? Well, you could have waited for him to answer the first part.
I guess, yeah, I guess the answer to that is like... Yeah, no, don't start at the end like Sean's asking you to.
Let's at the beginning let's help tracy out in wisconsin and tell her what you were doing and what happened and action yeah yeah um yeah look it's uh it it's it's probably one of the greatest things that's happened to me in my life yeah wow and it's not just's not just because it happened to me. It happened to, well, we're talking about it now because you guys are aware of it.
And so there's a lot of people around this planet. Yeah.
It became a very personal experience that happened on my property. He's trying to save my nephew from being ran over by this snowplow and snowcat.
But it's turned into not such a private experience. I didn't know why.
I was already on life support. I didn't, and while everybody else was getting, becoming aware of this incident.
And then I wake up from it. I'm like, why is everybody freaking out? I'm fine.
I'm going to get out of this hospital in two days. I'm walking out of here.
It's no problem. Yeah.
At least that's what the drugs are telling me. You know, I must've been high as a kite thinking that, right? Yeah.
But there's a unifying understanding of

or what was about to become knowledge of who I am as a man,

a brother, a father, and a person.

Not famous for what I did for a living.

I'm not Hawkeye anymore.

I'm like, oh,

this is Jeremy Renner and he overcame this incident or is overcoming this incident.

And there's something really fucking gratifying about that where that changed my life.

Because I didn't never like being a celebrity. I never liked, you know, being adored for people

call me Hawkeye, whatever. But being known for who you are as a human is really

you you know, being adored for, people call me Hawkeye, whatever. It's a, it's being, but being known for who you are as a human is really fucking cool.
Yeah. Something you did completely on your own.
I mean, obviously the help of all the medical staff. And people treat you, people treat you different.
They treat me differently now. They don't treat me like a fan of Hawkeye or whatever it might be.
Yeah. They're like, you know, here's an example.

On March, like two months, three months after the accident,

I took my daughter to Magic Mountain in L.A., right, in Valencia,

to ride all these roller coasters.

I got cleared with all my book.

Go home and ride these things.

But it was like I had to take the little cart around, the little golf cart thing you have to drive around, you know, because I couldn't walk very far. I could maybe walk like, you know, 15, 20 feet.
So I had to drive this cart around. But everywhere I went, and it wasn't like I was being quiet about it, you know.
I was just being me. I had a boom box I brought,.
I think you're having a good time. But I go up the line, right? They let me sort of go up in the front of the line.
But, like, people were like, it was Rudy, like, slow clapping. And like, I'm glad you're okay.
Yeah. It was such, like, a wonderful camaraderie.
Like, normally that situation would be like, oh, let me take something from you. I deserve a selfie.
I want this. I want this i want this i want this take you know touch me whatever now it's like much more there's a level of like um give yeah it was it was but you gave that's a wonderful shift that happened that yeah i think that because you've given so many people so much pleasure through your art and through what you do that that applause is thank you for that and we're so glad that the guy that we love is doing great it was it's really cool but also it's that feeling just that getting that love right feels so good yeah it's it made me believe in in in the in goodness in people that i didn't fucking think existed yeah i love that wow in in in big, big way, right? Not just a group of people and not just a couple of people in my hometown or my neighborhood.
This is like in a pretty global way that this has happened. I think people are most, for the most part, people are good.
Yeah, I know. I believe that too.
I just don't think they're in the right situations to have that come out. You're right.
But you had spent so much time being somewhat, I don't know if I'm using this word correctly, but somewhat objectified, you know, which is kind of baked into the cake. It's kind of what we do.
We all have public jobs and there's certainly nothing to be resentful about with that. But at your level, I'm sure you were just saturated with you being sort of approached and acknowledged as an object and that there's a bit of an ownership from the audience because of that.
Basically, I can understand that. But this was a different kind of acknowledgement.
It was, you know, we're actually people. We're not looking at Jeremy as a commodity.
We're looking at him as a human being. And we could have died just like he almost died.
All right. Well, also, they became allies.
We were equals and they were my ally. They became human.
It's everyone, every thought or prayer, if you will, is something I actually needed. I needed everything to recover.
Right. And on Instagram, when I saw you post that video of you running, like was like one day the accident happened, and it seemed like a week later, but I'm sure it was six months or a year later.
You're jogging uphill this steep driveway. I was like, oh, my God, I can't even do that, and I didn't get hit by a snowmobile.
You know what I mean? Well, but hang on, Sean. What if we put like a stir-fry thing right at the top of it that that's a good incentive you'd get up good incentive i could make it um jeremy you told me something um at that dinner and i hope you're comfortable relaying it uh on this um it was uh a story about you know to to to sort of make the stupid description of it,

of basically seeing the light and how there is an absolute similarity, if not identical type of experience that is repeated around the world from people that get this close to death., the way you related to me was in a way that was so sort of encouraging about possibly what that moment is to the point where I think, I don't want to put words in your mouth, but it sounded like you no longer have as much a fear of death as you did before. And after hearing that story, I too share, I'm not looking forward to that moment, but I'm not as fearful of it as I once was.
So to the extent you're comfortable, please. Yeah, yeah.
For me, I think most people have, I have a different relationship with fear, first and foremost, because I worked on it every day, something I was afraid of for a decade. So I just don't have a lot of fear in my life i certainly wasn't afraid of death but you can think that and believe that but it's a confirmation now i found there's a lot of confirmations when you're tested to your limits into your death and come back there's you there's a lot of confirmations that come out of that yeah because i can believe in xyz but now there's proof in the pudding because I went there.
And yeah, the exhilarating piece that happens in leaving this body, right? With these limitations of spinning on this rock and this body with air and gravity, all this bullshit, right? But when you, it's an exhilaration and such a freedom. So you remember feeling that? Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Feeling that? Really? Yeah, yeah. And I take that feeling with me all the time now.
Wow. You can't really put a visual to it because there's no time, place, or space.
It's all sort of a continuum. Every human, every exchange that's happened is happening simultaneously all at once.
It kind of has a little bit of that arrival kind of vibe in it. Wow.
It's like everything's all at once, and it's a continuum. And it's fucking exhilarating as it is peaceful at the same time.
Wow. It's the greatest way I can describe it.
Now, you really did see the light that everybody talks about, yeah? Yeah, to me, it's a sort of fibrous, like a muscle fibrous sort of connectivity to all, it's all energy, right? So I guess that's the feeling that it is. I can't even say it's a visual because I don't feel like any of that's there.
Wow. Now, isn't it true like well you were telling me or something about like you can recreate science has discovered a way to create that with certain drugs or circumstances where you can that that same do you know what i'm talking about like that same light well were you trying to sell sean something out of your van at that moment no uh no i was saying that there if you you go, you know where Encino, well, there's a guy, J-Rock, I told you about.
He's got that DMT hookup? Yeah, and he's got that DMT, and if you... J-Rock.
J-Rock, you go for a weekend. He does a weekend, a weekend, he does a weekend if you take the 118 all the way a guy named Earthquake that would sell me something.
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Listen to The Unusual Suspects

with Kenya Barris and Malcolm Gladwell,

a new podcast on Audible.

Kenya Barris and Malcolm Gladwell

joined forces to interview luminaries of entertainment, sports, business, politics, and more to learn about their paths to success. These deep yet casual conversations reveal unexpected stories that may just change the way you think.
Featured guests include our friend Jimmy Kimmel, the longest-running late-night TV host. Isn't that interesting? David Chang, who is on our show, who's fantastic.
He's the renowned chef and founder of the momofuku restaurant group listen to the unusual suspects with kenya barris and malcolm gladwell on audible now go to audible.com slash unusual suspects and back to the show jeremy um in all seriousness um you know that that is thank you for sharing Yeah, that's really fascinating. You reminded me of some of the specifics of what you were saying there.
And it is, I don't know if encouraging is the right word, but it does confirm for me some of the things I hope that moment is. Well, you have to understand, too, this, right? Your body, like the accident, right, could be the most excruciating pain that someone could go through, right? There's 38 broken bones, my eyeballs out of my head, I'm looking at my eye, I'm looking at my twisted legs, and all these things.
But I'm like, the pain is like really not that bad. Your body kind of shuts it down.
It's like overload, right? It's just a small part in the front of your brain where you feel pain, right? So you can kind of control that as well. Wow.
And so it's interesting. Fuck, I got lost because I got so many visuals from that accident in my brain.

I get a little stuck track.

Well, so the pain, the pain is overwhelming, but the brain then has, it shuts that down, but it is also still working and has an opportunity to experience the other stuff that you're going through, which it sounds like this, this was, this was the big thing that it chose to deal with, which was this opportunity to transition to whatever happens after the body stops working anymore. And you're sort of experiencing what that moment is.
And do you remember having a decision to make? Were you in control of whether you were going to go forward or return back? I mean, I was in control of my breath. And that's all I had to focus on.
Because if you can't breathe, then nothing else is going to matter. I can't, you know, so I had to focus on exhaling so I can then inhale and pop lung and all this stuff I didn't know.
And the thing's still on top of you right then, right? No was i was that it rolled off it rolled completely over me and then um it uh yeah wow yeah yeah it's brutal right but um the yeah just conscious breath conscious breath is uh was pretty important and you know like you like you said there's nothing to freaking worry about at the end of the day um you know I can confirm that. We all have something to look forward to, whether we use God to get there, right, or whatever it is.
But it's something to look forward to, and it's blissful and it's beautiful, and there's accountability and responsibility that comes along with it, and you take it all with you, man. It's amazing.
I love that. You're connected all the time to all you want to be connected to.
To everyone on this planet. Yeah, yeah.
It is all one thing. It's no fucking joke.
It's all energy. Jeremy, did you have, I mean, this shift in perspective is remarkable, I'm sure, and I can see the weight of it, and i can't appreciate it the way that you can obviously but but has this i imagine and you kind of touched on it but talk a little bit about what that shift in perspective has done for you in practical terms on a day-to-day level yeah i think um the clarity um i think everyone is conspiring to keep my life lean and keep the white noise out.

It's, I feel that life is a lot easier,

even though on paper, it's much more difficult

to spend hours just so I can walk every day.

You know, I have to do all this stuff.

Still?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. But I'm in good shape, but I don't have pain.
I have to do just a bunch of stuff, and who cares? I'm still walking, right? They told me I wasn't going to walk. But I think my life being so lean, it's been the best gift.
Yeah, I imagine you don't sweat the small stuff anymore. No, yeah, it wasn't really a guy that did but again it's another one of those sort of confirmation kind of things it's like right the things that were working for me before i really just double down on and um whether like it's you know spending time with those it's like like you jason how much you love your your your family and want to spend time with your family and whatever.
And whatever it is, you just do the things that you love to do. And I was really terrible at doing stuff for myself and asking for help.
Now I'm really good at asking for help because, Jesus Christ, I needed all the help I can get. That's great.
Right? And then so I have no problem asking for help. And I spend so much time on myself and self-care.
I'm like, look, I've got hydrogen water. I've got all these shots.
I've got liposomal gluathotin right here. I've got all this stuff.
I'm doing so many good things for my body. So I honor this vessel that I'm living in right now.
That's so great. Like life is just wonderful because, again, it's so clean and simple.
I love that. Sean feels the same.
Sean, you've got a lot of help from the Frito-Lay company yeah they do a lot of work with you

well they know what I need

they make the bags

a little bit easier to open

the McConnell Ice Cream Company

also is one of your

Haagen-Dazs

Haagen-Dazs

Haagen-Dazs

sure

but Jerry you know what

you know the whole thing

such an inspiration

to never give up

to keep going

to take the worst things in life

that come after you

and you come out on top

all of it

I mean it really

I saw

I'm saying

I saw that video

I was like

God he can come after you and you come out on top. All of it.
I mean, it really, I saw, I'm saying, I saw that video. I was like, God, he can come through that.
I got to get off my ass and just take better self of my vessel. Yeah.
Well, you will one day. Jeremy, talk a little bit, if you will, about, because you kind of mentioned it about this sort of, this creative, this sort of, we're all connected, this sort of collective consciousness that is a lot more sort of real and visceral than we think of rather just an idea and your relationship with maybe god even or higher power or whatever that is where do you land on all that stuff and you guys too i don't know yeah well my dad is a theologist and so i'm gonna study all religions growing up oh wow that's cool i love that i've been tense with snakes and i've been in you know all of them studied them all and um and find them all we found them all interesting and organized religion has never ended up being my bag but i think because of it yeah um but i do believe that in anything that believe in anything that makes you a better person a, a conscious person.
Yeah. I think that's great.
Amen. So I got no problems with religion in general.
Yeah. So I land, look, at some point during my recovery, I know I had to give up my body to like the EMTs and the people when I was on the ice for 45 minutes, right? Yeah.
Just struggling for my next breath. And that's where I passed.
And they had to, you know, jam a needle in my chest and do all that stuff, inflate my lung. I gave myself up to them just have to work on whatever they had to do to get me to survive.
But I think there's all, because also those, I knew the guy that, that was working on me and he called one of my best friends who's a firefighter. firefighter says you want to get me to survive.
But I think there's all, because also those, I knew the guy that, that was working on me

and he called one of my best friends

who's a firefighter.

He says,

you're going to want to get to the hospital

because I just took off

on a med effect flight

to the,

to the hospital.

And he called my buddy

who's a firefighter.

He's like,

I just worked on Jeremy.

Dad,

I want to say we did the best we could.

And he's like,

there's no way this fucker's going to make it.

So he went to the hospital

and said,

you want to get there,

go be with his sister, whatever, you know. You know, when those guys say, you don't have a chance, right? So I think there's some fucking divine intervention is the shortest.
I don't know what it is, guys. I don't know.
There is no answer to that. I think the divine intervention is fucking thoughts and prayers, if you will, from others.
It's the will of those doctors. They're like, look at this motherfucker.
We're going to work extra hard. Or die, whatever.
Like, my will, right? My will is fucking, it's strong for me to say that. And I think there's others, that energy goes into others that would help, all those EMTs and the firefighters that were there saving my ass and sheriff department, all those guys that were there to save my ass, right? All connected.
Yeah, it's all connected, man. So as hard as I was working, I think that bleeds into others and they worked harder.
And I think every flower that came in, every nurse that changed a bit, whatever the heck it is, man, that's all like love and all working towards surviving yeah and let that be divine the collective divinity of humans right which i think is fucking brilliant and good the energy of human yes i agree and uh i think that's what the divine intervention is ultimately i don't it's i don't think it's some god or some guy coming down on a carpet or whatever. You know, it's none of these kind of things.
I just think it's an energetic thing. And it's like, I can define it as love.
You know, that's maybe what divine intervention is for me that helps me survive. I think that fucking continues, right? Us just sitting here talking about it, I'm sure thoughts of thoughts are swirling in all of our heads as we're talking right yeah you make me think about what an incredible opportunity everybody has to plug into that network of connectivity 100 where it it is available to all of us and it is labeled different things at different times sometimes it's love sometimes it's religion sometimes it's collaboration you want to call it.
But we're all here and we all kind of come from the same thing. And that whole sort of one plus one makes three equation is again, it's available to us all.
And sometimes I have days where I've got the courage to plug into it and leave myself open to the input from other people. And some days I don't, you know.
And the days that I do have that courage and that openness and that vulnerability and that humanity sort of draw, those days are great for me. And things, you just feel like you're in a slot.

And shit just happens. You get the parking spot in front of the building you're going to.

You make the green light.

It's so true.

All of that silly stuff.

But I don't think that's coincidence.

I think it's, those are the days when you're really open to this community.

But, Jay, there's also the, there's an idea to, first of all, I love plugging into a slot.

But I would say, I would say, that's just OCD, but, but I would say this, I would say, you know, those days when it also, what, for me anyway, my experience is it's really important to whatever energy I'm putting out there, whatever I'm putting in the world, I'm going to get back. And what you were saying, like finding the open spot or whatever, if you're, if I'm driving on the highway or if I'm driving around Los Angeles, I'm going, look at this asshole and fuck this guy and whatever.
Every asshole is going to show up in my experience. But if I, if I surrender and there's a lot of surrender in what you're talking about, throughout everything you've said, there's a lot of surrender and giving up.
And if I surrender and go, I'm not, I'm not in that much of a rush. That's not going to make that much.
Let him, let the guy go ahead of me. And then you know what starts happening? Everything starts opening up because if I keep going, fuck, fuck, fuck.
And every bad, eventually somebody is giving me the finger on the 405. Guaranteed that that's a lock.
But if I start just opening up and just going, taking my foot off the gas and surrendering, and that goes for every aspect of my life. I find it all the time.
I try to do it in little things. It's not easy.
I call it like sort of spiritual calisthenics, just doing things. I'm just putting out good vibes as much as I can.
Sometimes I'll just show up to your house and give you the finger. Like when you answer the door.
Yeah. One time, Sean woke me up in the middle of the night, shaking me.
I opened my eyes and he was just giving me the finger and And he said, fuck you. That's helpful.
I love that visual. But you know what I mean? I think that there's a lot to that.
And I'm feeling like the energy, again, not to sound too freaking hokey, people are going to be like, hey. But, you know, you can feel it.
You've got this kind of vibe that you're putting out there, which is sort of a loving positive vibe yeah so it's no surprise that that's what showed up in your experience and now does that does that translate into like how you approach sorry to get back to this stuff but how you approach work now or is it still the same yeah well i think it's i think i think it's you know i was very terrified to get because i'm i'm to do like fucking fiction yeah i'm still trying to live in reality. I'm trying to live.
It was a hard line for me to cross. Your shit got real, and then your job is to be fake.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. It was a big stretch.
It was very challenging for me mentally to get over that hump. And I still struggle sometimes.

I don't take it super seriously.

I'm in a character that I can do very well,

and I know the show very well,

so it was easy for me to kind of slide back into it.

But if it was a very challenging role,

I couldn't have taken it.

Not challenging in the sense of it,

because this movie, the show's challenging,

but it's that, you know,

if I had to go play Dahmer or something, like something so far from me. Like the spiritual space.
Yeah, I just don't have the energy for it. I don't have the fuel.
I have so much fuel to put into like this reality, this body, all this stuff. I can't just go play make-believe right now.
Because it takes a lot of time to to to get right here every day

just so i can you know have a positive thought so i can progress so i can always keep growing and well you listen to me you need to write books because i'd read i am writing one right now oh you are right yeah i'm writing one right now and it's going to spend the whole summer uh doing it hopefully i can get it out um maybe by the year's end or beginning next year amazing but you know having experiences like this you know i speak to a lot of different people but always something new comes out and i always learn something new in in the process and the questions yeah and it seems like you really light up when you talk about this which again like you said is it's part of the gift of that happening yeah it's a wonderful wonderful said it was the best thing that's ever happened to you. Yeah.
Yeah. It's wonderful gifts.
And it'll be, you know, something passed on I'll have with you guys forever, right? Our exchanges will always have a basis of this, a wink, a wink to knowing, to the knowingness of something. Right.
And we can laugh at all the jokes you want and fart and do all, you know, go play golf terribly and wherever it is. But we know that there's an underlying current of a connectivity to something.
Yes. And it's something beautiful.
Yeah. And you've had that experience firsthand.
And you have very, very generously shared that with not only us but the people listening. And if they're like me, they will hold on to it forever because our mortality is something that we can kind of compartmentalize for a while.
But if you're on the second half, like us guys are, it starts to become a little bit more a part of your thinking day to day. And you've given me a lot more comfort for what the inevitable is.

And I really, really appreciate that.

Yeah, man.

Yeah, and Jeremy, I really mean it.

It sounds cheesy to say it,

but thanks for the lessons today.

And I mean that.

I'm like, wow.

I mean, all the stuff that you're talking about,

I'm now gonna be, like you said,

I'm gonna be thinking about it for the rest of my life.

Because there's, people say the same things

in different ways, but they don't land all the time. And a lot of the stuff you said today really landed.
Well, thanks, brother. That means it's just a shared experience then, right? Yeah, for sure.
It's not a lesson. These are just shared experiences.
Yeah, I love this sort of the shift in perspective. It's pretty amazing.
And as somebody once said, it's really hard to get a new perspective if you can't get perspective. Like, it's like, if you can't just allow yourself to have it, it's hard to get it.
And anyway, I really feel it from you, man. It's fucking awesome.
And before you go, please do another, do a sequel to Arrival, please. It's called Departure.
That's really funny. Jeremy, thank you so, so much for your time today and your level of transparency with what your experience has been.
It's been a real gift, so thank you, buddy. Yeah, man.
I love you guys, man. Appreciate the time.
Love you too, Jeremy. You too, brother.
Well done, man. Yeah, man.
Fucking killer. Thanks, pal.
Hope I see you soon, pal. you soon pal yes sir thanks jeremy have a good day man thank you dude all right bye buddy see you guys uh well i i hope um enlightening yeah i hope that that's that that story i mean the whole interview was uh was really enjoyable but uh man i i just just can't tell you how I have held on to that, what he told me at dinner.
And I'm so appreciative that he shared it with all of us today. Because if you're like me, it's kind of, it's just sort of a nice thing to have in your back, you're in your pocket that it might not.
If you see that train coming well i mean it's gonna happen all of us

yeah everything that's born lives to or what is it everything that lives was born to die something like that i think it's a pink floyd line but we're all going and and what is that moment like uh i hope it's not terrible i hope it's not sad i hope it's not painful it sounds like it's not yeah um shit

I got some fucking

bad

uh oh sad i hope it's not painful it sounds like it's not yeah um shit yeah i got some fucking bad uh-oh i'm ready okay um i know how both you guys die what oh what how do you know is it painful um it's interesting uh it is a little painful how do you know this have you ever seen okay... Because I just...
Okay, you remember the movie... You know that story about that Chilean rugby team? Sure.
Sure, yeah. So, you guys are...
Fuck, it's so crazy. Anyway, you guys end up shipwrecked.
You and Sean, the two of you. Shitwrecked? And fucking Sean eats you, dude.
What? Does he season me at all? You guys get shipwrecked and it's just the two of you Well, then how do I die? in a big container of mayo. But if I eat Jason, Will, how do I die? Well, you die because, no, because, yeah, because he's so malnourished that it ends up poisoning you.
Provides no nutritional value at all to my body. And your body goes into a shock.
No jokes on me. Oh, man.
Well, I just want to say about Jerry, he was so great great he's a perfect example of following your heart and good things happen period you know just like I love that he's such a good guy yeah he really is and honestly it is true when you hear him this is what we've talked about before which is he's clearly had a shift in like what validates him as a person is not about what he does for a living, but who he is as a person. And he can separate those things.
And it's so true because it's so easy, especially doing what we do, to peg your feeling of success or success as a human being to what you do. And that that is your wealth.
Yeah, what he's saying. No, no, the wealth is the...

And it's not.

It's not.

It's the living.

It's the relationships that you have with other people.

And he said that that connection with other people

is really the thing that got him through.

So that's pretty amazing.

Well, that was a nice episode, y'all.

Yeah, really nice.

It was real nice.

I'm sorry to learn that my life comes to an end with Sean taking a big bye out of me. Bye.
Bye. Bye.
Smart. Nice.
Smart. Nice.
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