"Wayne Gretzky"

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Speaker 2 Oh, hey there. Sorry, just putting on the last layer.
Last little bit of moisturizer. That is the key to looking great this old.

Speaker 3 It's just moisturizer. By the way, if you're a moisturizer company, feel free to reach out.

Speaker 2 Anyway, welcome to Smartless.

Speaker 1 Smart

Speaker 1 Less.

Speaker 1 Smart

Speaker 1 Less.

Speaker 1 Smart

Speaker 1 Less.

Speaker 2 Take some agents in your life.

Speaker 4 2007 was done with that. They let you use it for a while.

Speaker 2 Let me just say that it was a good time.

Speaker 2 Welcome to Smart Liz.

Speaker 4 By the way, that's the second time in three days I've heard you use the term agency. It is a great term.
I'm glad that somebody smarter in your life has used it clearly around you.

Speaker 4 And you're like, huh, sounds intelligent.

Speaker 2 I'll co-opt that. No, I'm not like you.
I don't need to grab words. I've been familiar with this word for a long time.

Speaker 4 I've never heard you use it before.

Speaker 2 I use it all the time. Here's the other one.
You weren't there at dinner last night.

Speaker 2 Oh, you weren't? I wasn't there either. You weren't there either.
And I used to. Why weren't you there, Sean?

Speaker 2 I had a previous business dinner scheduled. Got it.
Sean, business dinner. A previous dinner, business dinner, as opposed to this business dinner.
It wasn't business last night. It was personal, okay?

Speaker 2 I know how I did miss.

Speaker 2 Hey, but what did I do? What did I do? Did you get a little something? You sent cookies or

Speaker 2 in my absence. Can I just say this? And I don't want to seem unappreciative.

Speaker 2 Don't say it. Say it.
Three, two, one. Go.
Tasteless.

Speaker 2 The cookies? Yeah.

Speaker 4 Wait, but I feel like we interrupted. You were about to say something hurtful to me about your new found

Speaker 2 vocabulary. Dry and tasteless.

Speaker 2 I used to have words years ago. I used to say to Jason, we had phone conversations, and I would say to him, you can't use these words.

Speaker 2 And then I would send, give him, I'd write them down on a piece of paper. Do you remember that back in the old days?

Speaker 4 I sure fucking don't.

Speaker 2 What, just in life you can't use these words?

Speaker 2 Are you searching for the words? Or listener, he's looking at no, I was just putting on do not disturb because I noticed that my

Speaker 2 email too.

Speaker 4 So anyway, was it an email from the site word of the day?

Speaker 2 No, again, that's not my issue.

Speaker 2 Oh, you know,

Speaker 4 no, it's pronunciation. So

Speaker 2 yesterday, so, but this is this is on topic. So we were having dinner, and we were talking about something, and Jimmy, our friend, our good friend friend Jimmy Burroughs was listening to my right.

Speaker 2 Yeah, last night.

Speaker 2 Jimmy and Deb came. Yeah.
And Jason,

Speaker 2 Jason's wife, Amanda, was there and his daughter. And so anyway, so I was able to fill the role of Amanda's

Speaker 2 very easily. Very easily.

Speaker 2 She said, you're going over the boundaries. You're doing too much already.
She said.

Speaker 2 But I used the expression, I said, you know, and somebody, they go there, and I guess back in the day, you know, it was de rigueur too. And they're really like, ew, what's de rigueur? What's that?

Speaker 2 Ew, what? To rigue. Like to do regue.

Speaker 2 Like the established, like to do, you know, it's the expected. You said that last night? Yeah, it's not an unusual term.
Yes, it is. Coming out of your mouth.
I've never heard of it.

Speaker 2 What are you talking about? De regue.

Speaker 4 Never heard you say it before. You don't, you don't really speak like an intelligent guy.
And I mean that with all the respect it sounds like.

Speaker 2 Listen, listen, I don't need to cut and paste words, okay? Because

Speaker 2 I've read more this week than you have in your life give me a god damn it's true you do read a lot so that is why it's surprising that time no no he's he's sneaky smart people are always surprised anyway that but it was surprising to me that that word uh generated a lot of uh sideways glances um also wait by the way my niece is in town tracy's daughter mackenzie yeah she's here right now she's standing here Okay, I see her.

Speaker 2 Anyway, I saw her. So like last night.

Speaker 4 It makes a lot of sense. So why you'd follow up with that? Yeah.

Speaker 2 No, but I wanted to get that out because you were like, where were you last night? I had the business dinner and also my niece is here. Okay.
But I know what you mean, Jason.

Speaker 2 It did look like he was looking up on his computer like, here are my talking points.

Speaker 4 Yeah, what were the things I was going to talk about? Oh, yeah, yes. No.

Speaker 2 Sean's new talking points that we both did kitchen. Oh, my nieces.

Speaker 4 So you had a business dinner on a Sunday night. Was it fruitful?

Speaker 2 It was great. I love those guys, Travis and Oli.
Oh, by the way.

Speaker 2 By the way, it might have been fruitful, but I can guarantee you one thing. It was not full of fruit.
I can guarantee you that.

Speaker 2 Wait a minute.

Speaker 1 Wait a minute.

Speaker 2 Oliver.

Speaker 4 What did you do with your niece while you were at this business dinner, this?

Speaker 2 Wait, I want to say this one thing.

Speaker 2 Will, you'll love this. One of my friends is Oli Mickelson, who just got inducted into the UCLA Hall of Fame for soccer.
Wow, that's pretty cool. Yeah, it's amazing.
That's very cool.

Speaker 2 And so I had dinner with him and another friend traveling. Oh, I know he did have dinner because you know what I did, dude? This is true.
Sean, back me up.

Speaker 2 Within the last three days, I FaceTimed with with Sean and he was at Koi.

Speaker 1 I was with David Spade. With David Spade.

Speaker 2 Well, he was there, but you know, he was there, yeah. It was pretty good.

Speaker 4 Did the soccer guy smell like icy cold, like liniment? A lot of soccer players smell like muscle-relaxing cream. They do.

Speaker 2 They smell just fine.

Speaker 4 What was your niece doing during your big deals?

Speaker 2 She was here for a wedding, and then she tried to. I told her how the back door worked.
Hey, keep you clean.

Speaker 4 We've got a real respect to your guest, Albess. She's just a kid.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 2 No, but then she, you know, because she didn't know how the lock works, so I got a call at like two in the morning.

Speaker 2 Oh, hey, wait. I'm sorry, Jason.
What?

Speaker 1 Nothing.

Speaker 2 What did you say? What did he say? He's talking with his mouth full. Remember, he used to give me a shit.
Look at him right now.

Speaker 2 Well, I wasn't telling, I wasn't in the middle of a story, taking a bite. Oh, my God.

Speaker 2 This is so good. The height of hypocrisy.

Speaker 4 You know what I'm eating right now? What? No, guess what I'm eating?

Speaker 4 A think bar.

Speaker 4 You know, what I'm enjoying right now, if you could breathe through your nose, what I'm enjoying right now is the chocolate and uh cream cupcake uh flavor: 18 grams of protein, two grams of sugar.

Speaker 2 Oh man, you saved yourself another 150 bucks when they send you a couple boxes. Way to go, where to go?

Speaker 4 One of the nicest in the world.

Speaker 2 Way to set the think bar high, you fucking dummy.

Speaker 4 All right, so I was almost late today driving to the house in my news.

Speaker 2 I just want to mention a car brand real quick. Your new Hyundai?

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 4 Any other pre-guest chatter, you guys?

Speaker 2 No. Oh, I

Speaker 2 could go on and on.

Speaker 2 He could go on and on. But you know what? Our guest doesn't deserve to have to sit here and listen to our priest because we got a good show.
In fact, this is going to be a great one.

Speaker 2 Oh, we'll see. Yeah.
We will see. We'll see.
I'm crossing my fingers. And you'll notice the expression that I use.
You know, there are a few people who excel at what they do in whatever discipline.

Speaker 2 There are always people who do a lot of, you know, who do it well. But it's rare that you have

Speaker 2 people who dominate in a way that is unlike anybody else has dominated in whatever their discipline is, in the arts. Don't you sometimes get it?

Speaker 2 I do. But this one deserves a little bit of a preamble because this, to me,

Speaker 2 this person

Speaker 2 has consistently for decades.

Speaker 2 went far and above and far and beyond what anybody had ever done before them and since.

Speaker 2 I'm a little bit nervous right now. My palms are a little, even though I know this person.

Speaker 4 That's the guy that wins the hot dog eating contest every year.

Speaker 2 It's the equivalent of that, but times 100, and he did it every, it's like he did it every year for 25 years. If you told

Speaker 2 eight, nine, ten to twenty-five to forty-year-old me that we'd be sitting here today having this person on our show, I'd call you a liar because I would be too in awe and too nervous nervous to even talk about it.

Speaker 2 Wayne Gretzky. My great love of my life is hockey.
Oh, my God. This man did more than that.
Did I just call it? What?

Speaker 4 Did I just call it?

Speaker 2 It's the great one. It's Wayne Gretzky.

Speaker 1 I got it.

Speaker 1 What? What? Wayne?

Speaker 2 I know who you are. Wayne, I've never called it.
I totally know who you are.

Speaker 1 Sorry, I'm not the hot dog eating guy.

Speaker 1 I was getting disappointed in myself when I heard that. Oh, my God.
Nice to be on your show. Wow.
Nice to have you on the show. on the show?

Speaker 1 We had Will on TNT a long time ago, and I said, Okay, I really want to do your show. I really want to be on it.
Love all three of you guys, and I'm glad I'm here.

Speaker 4 Exploded Will's mind.

Speaker 2 It totally exploded my mind. Well, even more so, Wayne, they put me in net.
They let me hold a goalie stick and a glove in a blocker, and Wayne took a couple shots on me, which was amazing.

Speaker 2 Did he get one through? Did he get one? He got a couple through. Don't worry.
When was that?

Speaker 1 Yeah, I'm a little rusty, a little old, 61. I don't quite have the hands that I used to have when I was younger.
You did okay.

Speaker 4 Do you think there's any chance? Because I know we share a passion for golf. Any chance you think you could ever get, let's say, halfway as good as you were in hockey, in golf?

Speaker 1 Not a chance. No? Two reasons.

Speaker 4 Because you were so good at hockey.

Speaker 1 No, no, no. But you have to practice, right? And every day when I go to the course, Dustin will say to me, let's go to the range, sir.
And I'm always like, Dustin, I am what I am.

Speaker 1 I'm not going to get any better. I hope I don't get worse.
But if you become an elite athlete or whatever sport you're in, the hours of hard work and practice that goes into that,

Speaker 1 exactly what you guys do, too. You don't just do it overnight.
It takes a lot of commitment. And I don't have that commitment for golf, but I have the love for it because it's enjoyable.

Speaker 2 Yeah, yeah, and Sean, you know, he's talking about, Wayne's talking about his son-in-law, Dustin Johnson, who's one of the top-ranked golfers in the world,

Speaker 2 in and out of being number one at various points, you know, and he's just a phenomenal major winner, et cetera, et cetera.

Speaker 2 Who we actually, Wayne, one of the times, uh, Jason, I ran into you and Janet playing golf, I guess, about six months ago. But one other time, we saw Dustin, he was practicing where we were playing.

Speaker 2 And I hit my shot off the fairway into the practice area, and I came through the trees. And I see him there, and I said, Hey, DJ, just hit my shot.

Speaker 1 Nobody can see from here. Just put it on the green, put it on the green.

Speaker 2 I just wanted to hear Jason from the fairway going, What a shot our name!

Speaker 1 I was,

Speaker 1 I guess, thrilled that you guys had enough guts to get in front of him because I still get nervous playing with him. And I'm like, wow, these guys, all right, good for them.
And away you guys went.

Speaker 4 He's a big dude.

Speaker 1 He's just intimidating, but he's so nice. You know, he's one of those guys.
He just has a love for the game.

Speaker 1 And if he plays with a beginner or a tan handicap or with his boys, he has the patience of a saint. He just truly loves the game.
And that's something really special.

Speaker 1 You either have that or you don't. And he has that.
He gets frustrated, I think, playing with me because I'm not very good.

Speaker 1 But I remember we played at Pebble one year, and he told me on the second hole, he said, hit your three, Witzer. And I go, no, let me hit nine iron, nine iron, that long par five,

Speaker 1 number two.

Speaker 1 And there's all these people around the green because we're playing with Jordan Speeth and Dustin Johnson. And I was playing with Jake Owen, the four of us.

Speaker 1 And I'm like, Dustin, the worst thing I can do is be 80 yards out. I can't be 80 yards out.
And sure enough, I was 79 yards out. And I scaled a sandwich and I hit this poor lady right here.
No.

Speaker 1 I couldn't play for two holes. And I was like, okay, this is my last year I'm going to play in this event.
It's too hard playing in front of people. Did you give her the ball?

Speaker 1 Yeah, I gave her the ball. I signed a glove.

Speaker 1 I got her a drink.

Speaker 1 I was getting her anything she wanted. And thankfully, she had glasses on.
It kind of stopped it, or it really would have left a mark.

Speaker 1 And it kind of hit her glasses and it kind of hit her at the right spot. So it wasn't as bad as it could have been.

Speaker 1 But let me tell you something. It's so hard playing in front of people.

Speaker 4 Yeah, Will's have got to experience that.

Speaker 4 I've done it before, but Willie hasn't.

Speaker 1 We're doing the Pebble

Speaker 4 in February.

Speaker 1 Oh, Will.

Speaker 1 Let me tell you something.

Speaker 1 Your knees will be shaking. Yeah.
Oh, yeah.

Speaker 4 Especially when the cameraman runs up and gets behind you in the middle of the fairway

Speaker 4 with his shoulder camera.

Speaker 2 But, Jason, we did it last year when

Speaker 2 we played, what was that, the Genesis. Yeah, we played the Genesis out here.
Yeah, that era.

Speaker 1 That one's not bad because there's not as many people. That's right.
You're going to play Pebble. There's going to be 25,000 people there.

Speaker 1 And let me tell you, if you hit a bad shot, they let you know about it.

Speaker 1 If you hit a good shot, they let you know about it.

Speaker 4 Now, did I hear you say that Justin calls you sir?

Speaker 1 Yeah, he's a very respectful young man.

Speaker 1 Does that that mean that?

Speaker 2 I want Jason to call me Sir. That would be great.

Speaker 4 Well, I'm not sleeping with your daughter.

Speaker 4 Now, what kind of son-in-law is he?

Speaker 1 Oh, he's the best. Is he?

Speaker 1 There's an old saying in golf, when you hit a bad shot, you call it a son-in-law. And people say, what does that mean? You say, that's not quite what I had in mind.
And I'm the opposite.

Speaker 1 My son-in-law is the best. He's great to his kids.
He's a good father. Oh, that's cool.
He's just, he's a wonderful guy.

Speaker 1 And, you know, we moved down here a couple years ago to Florida so we could be by the two grandboys. And my other son, he has a little daughter who's one-year-old, little girl.
Oh, cool.

Speaker 1 So we're all within seven minutes driving together. It's worked out really nicely.

Speaker 1 When he travels, they're in Asia right now. I think they're in Bangkok.

Speaker 1 So the kids, the two boys are able to stay with Janet and I. So at least somebody's here.
Oh, that's great. Yeah.
So it's worked out really nicely. And he's a wonderful guy.

Speaker 4 Has he given you any tips tips that you can use in your golf game?

Speaker 1 Oh, yeah. You know,

Speaker 1 he's incredible because if he played with you, you'd be amazed at how much he's a golf savant. I tell people this all the time.

Speaker 1 He's truly a savant. He knows what kind of grass it is, how thick it is, how much soil is underneath the grass, which way the greens are breaking.

Speaker 1 And I always say to him, why don't you have somebody help you read greens? He goes, why? I'm number one in the world. If I can't read them, who can? And I said, well, good point.

Speaker 1 But, you know, he helps me all the time. I don't go up to the range, though.
I don't practice. But when we're on the course, he'll give me little pointers, little tidbits.

Speaker 1 But he does to everybody he's playing with. He loves it.

Speaker 2 Truly. Jason's so Wayne.
Jason's so jealous.

Speaker 2 He won't stop at it. We could fill the whole hour with golf questions.
Yeah, I apologize.

Speaker 2 But sadly, we've got Wayne Gretzky here who, you know,

Speaker 2 we want to talk, first of all, Wayne, as I probably told you, but like, as you know, and as a boy from Toronto, you know, hockey is just the love of my life, like it is for you.

Speaker 2 My relationship with is much different. I'm an observer.

Speaker 2 But, you know, for me, I can remember,

Speaker 2 I mean, Sean, you even said, I love the way you said, like, I know who you are. Like, Sean is not a huge sports fan, but he's just like, oh, my God, Wayne, Grants.
Yeah, this is blowing my mind.

Speaker 2 I can, as a kid, I can remember my first.

Speaker 2 My first earliest memories of hockey. And if you're a Canadian kid, it's so rich.
Like that relationship between you and hockey and what it means to you is more than just the game.

Speaker 2 It's about your family and all that kind of stuff. So

Speaker 2 I have those memories, playing at the first outdoor rink at the end of my street, whatever, going to games, being nervous the first time hearing the roar of the crowd.

Speaker 2 And

Speaker 2 you talked about like getting the gear on and how long it takes to get the gear on. Yeah, I get the gear, all of that stuff, the pageantry of right, the ritual of putting all that stuff on.

Speaker 2 Talk to me a little bit, Wayne, about your first memory of your relationship with hockey.

Speaker 1 My relationship goes way back. I started skating when I was two years old.

Speaker 1 Why, how, how come, I don't know. An uncle passed me down a pair of skates.
They were about this big. I still have them.
They're in my parents' house, the first pair.

Speaker 1 And I started skating in the backyard of my,

Speaker 1 my grandparents lived on a farm and they had a, it's called the Nith River, which runs into the Grand River behind her yard and it would freeze in the wintertime. That's where I started skating.

Speaker 1 And you know, I'd be out there for hours and hours, two, three, four, five years old. Come in, and you know this, Will.

Speaker 1 It's the worst feeling, but the best feeling in the world when you take your skates off and you put them over a heater because they're so frozen. And when they start to unthaw, they hurt even more.

Speaker 1 But you get past that stage where it stops tingling and you just think, okay, I can't wait for tomorrow. So I was like every other kid.
And I was saying this, one of my... Fondest memories.

Speaker 1 I remember driving to my very first game with my dad. I can remember it for whatever reason, like it was yesterday.
I was six years old.

Speaker 1 I tried out for this team, and in those days, they had a 10-year-old team. That's if you made that team, that's where you played.
If you didn't make it, you didn't play.

Speaker 1 And I made the team as a five-year-old. Wow.
And the coach said to me, Can we have your birth certificate? And my dad gave it to him. He said, Well, he can't play.

Speaker 1 He's not of age. So I remember driving home crying.
So the next year they said, Okay, well, let him play. And I played on that team for five years.

Speaker 1 But the point of my story was, my very last game, I was so lucky.

Speaker 1 And I always say this to athletes, if you can ever play in New York there's nothing greater nothing nicer nothing better than playing for the Rangers or the Yankees or the Knicks there's something so special about the fans in Manhattan and I got to play my last game at Madison Square Garden and it was a three o'clock game and I always went to the arena like six hours before the game six hours oh yeah because I could get in the locker room at two o'clock for a 730 game nobody could call me nobody could talk to me I'd have a coffee I'd sit in the chat

Speaker 1 I'd have to stream. Yeah, and I'd just relax.
You know, we didn't have cell phones in those days, so people couldn't get a hold of me. So, my very last game, I said, you know what?

Speaker 1 This is what I'm going to do. And I drove my dad.
I said, you know what? You drove me to my first game. I'm going to drive with you to my last game.
So I drove with my dad through Manhattan.

Speaker 1 We were living on the Upper East Side. Got down to Madison Square Garden.
After the game, Janet, my wife says to me, How was the ride with your dad?

Speaker 1 I said, Janet, it was great, but it was the worst 10 minutes of my life going to a hockey game and she said why is that and i said the whole way there all he kept doing was tapping me on the knee saying you know you can play one more year

Speaker 1 i said

Speaker 1 i'm done i said you know what dad i really appreciate it and so the rangers were so nice they bought myself and Janet a new car and they had my dad drive out on the car from the corner.

Speaker 1 And as he drives in on the car to Center Ice, I open the car door to get him out, and he's got his seatbelt on. And I said to my dad, What are you doing with the seatbelt on?

Speaker 1 And he goes, You just never know. I said, Okay, I've seen the Zamboni driver, and he doesn't look good.

Speaker 1 Get him out of the car, and he says, He says to me, Isn't this a beautiful car they're giving me? And I said, I hate to tell you, but I got the thousand goals, not you.

Speaker 1 Broke my heart to tell him it was my car, not his.

Speaker 1 So it all goes back to being a kid, right?

Speaker 1 There's nothing like it.

Speaker 2 That's so cool.

Speaker 4 And we will be right back.

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Speaker 4 How did your folks

Speaker 4 handle

Speaker 4 the fame, obviously,

Speaker 4 of you? That probably gave them a great source of pride. But I bet for them too, back home,

Speaker 4 it was nice. But I bet there were moments where it was really disruptive.

Speaker 4 It was a huge change in your life, but an enormous change in their life as well. Was that something that

Speaker 4 they were comfortable with consistently, or did they have trouble with that?

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 1 My dad was always very comfortable with it. He loved hockey and he loved talking hockey, loved being around people, kids.

Speaker 1 He had a kids hockey tournament for boys and girls till the day passed and they still have it going on to this day over Christmastime. That's great.
It's one of the great tournaments in all of Canada.

Speaker 1 It was difficult.

Speaker 1 You know, at 14 years old, I moved away from home and people always said, oh, you moved away from home to go play hockey. And I really didn't.
I lived in this small town.

Speaker 1 And there was so much media attention. There was so much hype.

Speaker 1 We just kind of got together one day and said, you know what, maybe go live in a bigger city. I moved in with a family I had never met before.
I drove down there the day before school started.

Speaker 1 I was starting grade nine. And I met the people and they became like second parents to me.
I lived with them for two years.

Speaker 2 Was that in Toronto, Wayne?

Speaker 1 Yeah, I moved to Etobicoke. I went to West Humber Collegiate, which is by the airport in Toronto, if you're familiar with Toronto.
And

Speaker 1 it was interesting because I went to high school. None of my friends in high school school knew I played hockey.
I kept it quiet the whole year. Nobody, none of the kids at school,

Speaker 1 I didn't talk about it. Nobody really knew who I was.

Speaker 1 To this day, one of the kids in that school, him and I are still best friends. And every time I go to Canada, go to Toronto, him and I have dinner together.

Speaker 1 And he never played a game of hockey in his life. And I always said to him, I said, I can't, you're the only Canadian I've ever met that's never played hockey.
And we're best friends.

Speaker 1 So I lived there for two years.

Speaker 4 And you lived there because it was a better program for you to be involved in as a hockey player?

Speaker 1 Just kind of, no, I kind of went there to get out of the limelight, to be a normal everyday kid,

Speaker 1 to go to school like everyone else and not be doing interviews and not being centered out. You know, it was interesting because

Speaker 1 with all the good that came with all that attention, there was some jealousies and some negative. that was unfair to a 13, 14 year old, which my parents thought.

Speaker 1 And that's consequently why I moved to Toronto.

Speaker 2 Well, what Wayne won't tell you is,

Speaker 2 because he's humble, is that, you know, he's from a town called Brantford, Ontario, which I'm familiar with because my cousins grew up there.

Speaker 2 And I told Wayne once that my uncle used to have a bookstore in Brantford. So I used to go there all the time.

Speaker 2 And when I was a little kid, it used to say home of Alexander Graham Bell, right, at Brantford, Ontario. And now it's, of course, it's the Wayne Gretzky.
They're like,

Speaker 2 screw the guy who invented the telephone.

Speaker 1 And, you know, my acting career was very minimal. And Lauren Michaels had asked me to host Saturday Night Live.
And I said, no way. I said, I don't want to act.
I can't act.

Speaker 1 I'm flying to Kentucky Derby and I'm reading the paper. And it says, Wayne Gretzky is going to host Saturday Night Live.
And I remember I just pulled the paper down.

Speaker 1 I looked at my wife and I go, really? And she goes, one day you're going to thank me for this.

Speaker 1 So here I am in New York.

Speaker 1 And I was so lucky because Mike Myers and Dana Carvey were so good. They just carried me.
And John Lovitz.

Speaker 1 But the point of my story was one of the most famous people ever to come from Brantford was Phil Hartman. Yes.
And I got to know him that week during Saturday Night Live. He was a genius.

Speaker 1 He was a nice man. And he always said to me, you know, I'm from Brantford too.
And I go, I know, Phil. I love it.

Speaker 2 Hey, when you, hey, Wayne, when you were a kid, when you were living with that family that you didn't know, I want to know about all the awkwardness.

Speaker 2 I did this Kenny Rogers Christmas tour, thank you, many, many years ago. Nobody wanted it.
That's okay. I can still hear you.
No, we'll put it later.

Speaker 2 And on the tour, a couple places we had to stay. I like, they broke us up and we had to stay with families.

Speaker 4 It was so awkward.

Speaker 1 It was like, hello.

Speaker 2 You're sleeping in other people's bed.

Speaker 1 You're eating their.

Speaker 2 You don't know them.

Speaker 1 I mean, isn't that weird? It was very weird at the beginning. The first month, I cried myself to sleep every night.

Speaker 1 And of course, my parents could hardly

Speaker 1 afford to call me. So my dad worked for Bell Telephone, and I knew every day at 4.30, one of his friends at Bell Telephone would get him a free line.
He could call me to see how I was doing.

Speaker 1 And I'd always work my nerve up at 4:30 and say, I'm doing great. I love it.
It's no problem. I'm getting accustomed to this.
I like it.

Speaker 1 I was 14.

Speaker 1 And so, here's the interesting part: we became very close.

Speaker 1 To the day they both passed, they were like second parents to me.

Speaker 1 I would always bring them out to games, whether I played in LA or New York, they'd always come in, treated me like their own son.

Speaker 1 I had a true love with them and for them, and they did for me.

Speaker 1 And I said at the time, and as I went through my career, I said, I'm never going to do this to one of my kids. So what happens? I named my son Ty because I love baseball after Ty Cobb.

Speaker 1 And at the age of 10, he looked at me and he said, you know, dad, I hate baseball.

Speaker 1 Okay, isn't this great? So he wanted to be this hockey player. So at 15 years old, I said to him, I said, now listen, I'm going to tell you something that your grandfather would tell you.

Speaker 1 If you want to pursue this, you got to leave the West Coast. You got to go to Minnesota, Boston.
I said, you can go live with grandma and grandpa in my hometown.

Speaker 1 And then we decided, okay, maybe you can go live with my mom and dad. And then my mom, unfortunately, came down with cancer.

Speaker 1 And I thought, okay, I don't want my 15-year-old son to have to deal with this and go through it. So he moved to Minnesota.
He went to a prep school in Minnesota. He loved it.

Speaker 1 At the end of the year, he said, you know what? I want to come back back home. I just want to play hockey for fun.
I want to continue my education, go to college. And I said, that's great.

Speaker 1 You know, when you're 30 years old, you'll look back and say, you know what, I gave it an honest effort.

Speaker 1 I don't regret anything I did. He loved the school, loved everything about it.
He moved home.

Speaker 1 And I said to him one day, I said, What was one of the things that really bothered you about moving there and playing there other than missing your mother?

Speaker 1 He said, you know, I got tired of every guy that I played against saying, you're not as good as your dad.

Speaker 1 So I said to him, I said, so what would you say to them? And he said, it was pretty easy. I just say, I got news for you.
You're not as good as he is either.

Speaker 2 Perfect.

Speaker 1 You know,

Speaker 2 Wayne, you know, one of the things that I just sort of have noticed before, but it just kind of came into focus, you know, listening to you tell this story is that,

Speaker 2 you know, obviously one of the things, being this,

Speaker 2 being who you are and having this illustrious career and all the things that you did it it's brought you all the way around the world you've met all sorts of people in all sorts of walks of life and you talk about going and living with a family when you're 14 whatever you've been around people your whole life and you you have a gift for talking to people and really listening to people and really engaging with them and i and and you are such a and more than just an ambassador for hockey you're such a just listening you talk and the way that you talk to your kids i i don't know there's something i really admire about the way that you relate to human beings and the way you connect with other human beings.

Speaker 2 I think it's awesome. And is that something that you,

Speaker 2 was your relationship like that with your, were your parents like that? Did they bestow that upon you? I know your dad was a really gregarious guy.

Speaker 2 He's the most famous Leaf fan of all time next to me.

Speaker 1 Yeah, that's true.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 2 Where did that sort of, is that where that came from, do you think?

Speaker 1 No, I'll tell you what. I was the shyest kid you could ever meet.
I was quiet.

Speaker 1 You know, my dad used to say to me, the good Lord gave you two ears and one mouth for a reason. Listen twice as much as you talk.
And I lived by that.

Speaker 1 I was this kid who was in school that if you had to get up and give a speech, I'd be sweating bullets and like every other 14, 15 year old.

Speaker 1 When I moved to Toronto, and this is the rest of my story, they had one son and he was a character.

Speaker 1 And he was two years older than I was, and he was this outgoing, full of life, energy, young man, and we're still close today.

Speaker 1 And he really helped me sort of mature and come out of my shell as far as talking to people and talking with people,

Speaker 1 listening to people. And I just think it was a progression.
And I just learned, you know,

Speaker 1 I always say to people, when you meet your idol, and listen, there's been a lot of times where you meet somebody and you go, wow.

Speaker 1 That guy was having a bad day. He wasn't as nice as I thought he was going to be.
Or that person wasn't as great great as I had him built up in my mind.

Speaker 1 And my childhood idol was Gordy Howe from the time I was, I could think of Gordy Howe, three years old. I used to even go to the barber shop and say, can I get a Gordy Howe haircut?

Speaker 1 That's how much I loved Gordy Howe. And through hockey, him and I became a planet of the apes haircut sometimes.

Speaker 1 You got it.

Speaker 1 You got it.

Speaker 1 And through hockey, Gordy and I became best friends. We were very close.

Speaker 1 He was like a second dad to me.

Speaker 2 What about like interviews, though, like to Will's question?

Speaker 1 Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 1 I got comfortable with interviews at 14, 15, 16.

Speaker 2 Yeah, before that, you were like petrified.

Speaker 1 Yeah, I was scared to death.

Speaker 1 You know, head would be down, kind of shy, stutter a lot, all that kind of stuff. And

Speaker 1 you know who I met at a young age in my career that was incredibly helpful with me off the ice was a great Canadian Alan Thick. He was loved the game of hockey.
He was energetic. He was smart.

Speaker 1 And he would help me do things. And he would help me.
And he always say to me, Wayne, instead of giving the standard interview an athlete gives, here's things that I think can help you.

Speaker 1 And here's kind of things you can chat about and talk about. So Alan was a huge influence in my life.

Speaker 1 Wonderful man. As a matter of fact, I was staying at Alan's house the day I got traded to the LA Kings in August of 1988.
I was down there for a week holiday and I got a phone call.

Speaker 1 You've been traded to L.A. LA.
And I said, Alan, you don't mind if I kick you out of your house. I'm moving in.

Speaker 1 That way. You guys are like.

Speaker 2 That's a special guy.

Speaker 2 Sean, I know you knew Alan too. I did you too, our friend Jimmy Burroughs.
What a sweet. He's the greatest and super funny.
And I've played golf twice in my life.

Speaker 2 And one of them was with Jimmy and Alan. Yeah.

Speaker 2 Wait, Sean, can I also tell you this? Wayne, I'll tell you this.

Speaker 2 In summer of 88, when you got traded, I was doing a summer theater program. You were playing professional hockey at the highest level and owned it every year.
And

Speaker 2 I was at a theater program in London, England. So, anyway,

Speaker 2 but when I found out the news, and there was no internet, it just came across on the news. And it was such big news, it was in the UK, and it was like in the evening paper or whatever.

Speaker 2 And my buddy and I found this Canadian pub down in Covent Garden, and we went to the Canadian, and we just had about 30 beers because we were like, Wayne's going to America.

Speaker 1 And as a Canadian,

Speaker 1 I had a wonderful London story. I was there.
It was at Hyde Park, right? Yeah. They have Canada Day there, which is this huge day that

Speaker 1 all these Canadians come down. They set up these ball hockey rinks.
There's about six of them. Teams sign up.
So all these Canadians flock down there.

Speaker 1 They have Canadian french fries and fish and chips. They have Canadian bands that come out, tragically hip, and they play during the day.

Speaker 1 So I'm standing there with my two boys, and I said, let's go watch this hockey game. So

Speaker 1 my two boys and I, we get behind the net. Now, these guys are intense.

Speaker 1 They're older men they're probably drinking beer running around their shoes whacking and hacking each other and it's really intense and there's this guy standing beside me with a team canada gretzky jersey on and i turned to the guy and i'm trying to make conversation i was going to sign his autograph or get a picture with him and i said hey this game's pretty intense and he just keeps staring straight out he goes yeah this is crazy and i said are you having fun today and he goes yeah this is unbelievable and i said to my two boys i said let's go and they go aren't you gonna sign that for him i said i give him two chances to turn to me.

Speaker 1 I'm not giving him a third. We're out of here.

Speaker 1 And that was my London story. Yeah.
Give me a break.

Speaker 2 I'm trying to lost a game.

Speaker 1 Now, the quarter.

Speaker 2 Now, I'm just back to the actual sport of hockey and me.

Speaker 2 You know what, Wayne? If me and you, just me and you had dinner, I would have a bunch of different questions than Jason will probably. So these are one of my dumb questions.

Speaker 4 A lot of musical theater stuff, Wayne.

Speaker 4 I don't know if it should probably be more of a snack than a meal.

Speaker 1 I don't know.

Speaker 2 No, like just the art of hockey playing. Okay.
So the coordination to me, not knowing anything about it, looks impossible. It's like playing the drums.

Speaker 1 You need your feet and your arms and your hands and your brain and everything.

Speaker 2 And so

Speaker 2 you're going to laugh at this question. No.
Is there any, because of the athleticism, are there any guys who go from hockey to figure skating or figure skating to hockey? Because they're both like...

Speaker 2 God, I love each other. You know, you watch these hockey guys.
I love each other.

Speaker 2 You know, you watch the hockey guys. Like, when you could do other things

Speaker 2 because you have the skill of skating. You know what I mean?

Speaker 1 Actually, it's a really good question because one of the things that my wife, who was a dancer, always says that she would always say to me, you should do ballet because ballet is going to help your hockey.

Speaker 1 And I go, I don't know. When I take my skates off.
the rhythm just leaves my body.

Speaker 1 Ballet wouldn't be good for me.

Speaker 1 But there are guys that start off in figure skating that at 9, 10, 11 switch over. It's probably easier to go that way than to play ice hockey, then go into figure skating.
And I'll tell you why.

Speaker 1 In ice hockey, you're skating more like downhill skiing. So you're kind of sitting on your

Speaker 1 quads. Yeah, you're squatting.
And the blades are actually flat. So you're kind of moving like that.
Whereas figure skating, because of the toe picks, you're more straight up and you're more,

Speaker 1 I guess,

Speaker 1 proper. Right.
And so it's two different sort of skating formulas. So it's tough to go from one to the other.
But

Speaker 1 it's a real good question, actually.

Speaker 2 Wayne, I want to ask you one question, not to get too deep in the weeds on hockey, because these guys won't get it. But I have to clear this up once and for all.

Speaker 2 Back in the day, Wayne was one of the first guys in hockey to wear a Jofa helmet. How did that happen? I've always wanted to know about the Jofa.

Speaker 1 So I don't know if these guys know, but when I turned pro when I was 17,

Speaker 1 and my

Speaker 1 said because he had to sign the contract to validate it because I wasn't 18 and he said two things

Speaker 1 I'll sign this but

Speaker 1 you're gonna finish 12th grade I don't care what you do you're gonna go to school till you're 18 years old so I said okay I'll do that so my first practice and in those days the players would come to the younger guys the new guys and say hey take your helmet off you shouldn't play with a helmet because that's kind of what guys did back then so here I am.

Speaker 1 I took my helmet off and my dad's at my first exhibition game. We're playing in Indianapolis, Indiana.
And I'm out there skating around.

Speaker 1 And all of a sudden, my dad comes running down the stairs at the arena and yelling at me, get your goddamn helmet back on.

Speaker 1 So I'm turning to one of the guys and I said, my dad said I have to put my helmet on. So

Speaker 1 we go to the locker room. And I get this helmet.
And one of the guys said, Wayne, wear this Jova helmet. It's like not wearing a helmet.

Speaker 1 and I was like okay so I get the helmet on and I wore it my whole career I was comfortable with it I got traded or sold to Edmonton I got traded or sold a couple times in my career for a guy that played a lot of years I got sold a lot so I get sold to Edmonton and I'm going to high school in Edmonton and the principal doesn't know who I am.

Speaker 1 Now Edmonton travels more than other teams and so I've gone on the road for five days or seven days.

Speaker 2 Wait, you were going to high school in Edmonton when you were playing there?

Speaker 1 Yeah, in the WHA. And the principal calls me in like early January.
He said, young man, you're going to be a nothing. You're going to mount to nobody.

Speaker 1 You're schooling this and that. I should kick you out.
And I said to him, look, give me till January 26th. And he goes, what's that? I go, I turn 18 January 26.

Speaker 1 If I'm still messing up, you can call me in and kick me out of the school. So the guy goes, okay, I'll do that for you.

Speaker 1 So January 26th, and I used to pick up one of my teammates' daughter was in my classes. We were the same age.
So I'm driving to school, and I'm kind of singing to the music in the car.

Speaker 1 I'm really excited. And she goes, Well, you're pretty happy today.
I said, Yeah, I'm quitting school. I'm going in and telling that principal I'm done.
I walked in the principal's office.

Speaker 1 I said, You know what? I just want to thank you for not kicking me out of school. I quit.
And that was it. I walked out.
You just can't fire me. And I lived up to what my dad wanted.
No.

Speaker 2 So, listener,

Speaker 4 there's a physical element to hockey.

Speaker 4 It's a contact sport, and sometimes things can get rough and tumble, and there can be fights and stuff like that.

Speaker 4 Wayne was famously

Speaker 4 kind of above that fray, never really got into a whole lot of fights, but a lot of

Speaker 4 the heavies on the other side would love to try to get him into that because they want him off the ice. But you always managed to avoid it.

Speaker 4 Was there ever a time in your career when everybody was kind of the same size before they got huge, huge, where you kind of tried to incorporate that into part of your game and and went wow that hurt that my face is real sore and you just was like you know what i'm just gonna be the finesse guy that i was born and and what is the worst injury I don't know about you guys, but if I get punched in the nose, I start crying.

Speaker 1 See how

Speaker 1 your eyes start watering? I'm always amazed at these guys that go back and forth, back and forth, and they just drop their gloves. They go to the pedaling box.

Speaker 1 They sit there for five minutes and they come back out and they go, wow. And you know, I think I had one fight in my career, and this is a really funny story.

Speaker 1 I won Sports Illustrated Sportsman of the Year, which to me was one of my favorite awards that I ever won. It was such an honor to get that.

Speaker 1 So, the publisher of Sports Illustrated flies to Edmonton to present this award, and he's at Center Ice, and he's talking about my sportsmanship and what he brings to the game. He's going on and on.

Speaker 1 I'm in the second shift of that game, and I got into a fight, the only fight I've ever had.

Speaker 1 I come back to the bench, and not one guy said, Good fight, or good job. They all said, What were you thinking?

Speaker 1 The guy who was from Minnesota, Neil Broughton, and him and I still laugh about it today because it was so silly. And my buddy, who was a tough guy at the time, one of the tougher guys ever to play,

Speaker 1 Dave Simenko. And he turns to me and he says, Wayne, you got five minutes for cat fighting.

Speaker 1 That was my last fight. Was it a pretty funny fight? Was there a clear winner? Nothing.
It was kind of like one of these, right? Yeah.

Speaker 1 And one night we were playing in Chicago, and this guy, and I had enough of him, and I kind of grabbed him and he threw me down on the ground. And he's standing over top of me like this.

Speaker 1 And I'm looking at our bench, and there's five players with legs over top, like they're riding a horse, right? Yeah. Ready to jump on the ice.
And he's standing over top like this.

Speaker 1 And he goes, Don't move. I'm not going to hit you.
And I said, Don't worry, I'm not moving. So the referee kind of got in there.

Speaker 1 I came back to the bench and I said, all right, he could have beat the crap out of me. Nobody's allowed to touch that guy.

Speaker 1 So I said, if he would have hit me, he would have had a couple more fights before the night was over.

Speaker 2 Oh, man. Yeah.

Speaker 1 And it's the punching of the helmets, too, that

Speaker 4 I mean, they never seem to really hurt their hands and they're just slugging these.

Speaker 2 Oh, they do. Yeah.

Speaker 1 Now they have visors on, too. They have visors.

Speaker 2 And then if you fight, if you start a fight, there's like the whole code that if you keep your visor on, that

Speaker 2 you're a jerk because you're going to let the other guy hurt himself. Wayne, I remember, I remember.

Speaker 1 Will knows this. Yeah, go ahead.
No, I was just going to say, Will knows this. There's a few guys that were Hall of Fame type players that also could fight the question you were asking me.

Speaker 1 One of his buddies, Brendan Shanahan, Mark Messier. Those guys were not only Hall of Famers at what they did, but they were also as tough as anybody who ever played the game.

Speaker 2 Yeah. Yeah, you know, Wayne, Shannon once called me about a month after he retired, and it was like a Wednesday afternoon, and he was kind of blue.
And I said, what's going on? You all right?

Speaker 2 And he goes, ah, I just realized I'm never going to fight again. I said, buddy, you're 40.

Speaker 1 I said,

Speaker 2 you're 42. You shouldn't be fighting anymore anyway.
What are you talking about?

Speaker 1 And he's genuinely disappointed. Yeah, he was.

Speaker 2 He was, eh? Like, he was just kind of bummed out. You know, so, Wayne, so you go, your life changes.

Speaker 2 You move out of the house when you're 14. You go play in Toronto.
You play, how many years of junior did you play? Just one, right? Or not even? You played for the Sioux?

Speaker 1 Yeah, I played one year in Sault Ste. Marie as a 16-year-old.

Speaker 2 As a 16-year-old. I mean, which is, you guys have to understand, it's so crazy what Wayne did.
He was just ahead.

Speaker 2 He played on teams that were, he was the young, as he told you, the youngest by about four years. And the parents of the other teams were still mad at him because he was scoring so many goals.

Speaker 1 I played in Sault Ste. Marie, and if you've never been to Sault Ste.
Marie, it's just above Sioux, Michigan. So it's about eight hours north by car from Toronto.

Speaker 1 And the snow is about six feet deep, early December till late March. And we flew around on a DC-3.

Speaker 1 Now,

Speaker 1 flying is one thing, but try getting in a DC-3, and the pilot comes back and says, we need two of the heavier guys to go to the front, and two of the lighter guys to go to the back.

Speaker 1 So I used to ride to pretty much every game like this.

Speaker 1 And it can only fly at 9,000 feet, right? And you're right in the middle of those snow clouds going into Sault Ste. Marie every trip.

Speaker 1 And i i i what was the uh singer ricky valons that's why all i kept thinking was this is not good this dc3 is not fun but i ended up having a fun time there no way

Speaker 2 we'll be right back

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Speaker 2 And back to the show.

Speaker 2 But wait, I was going to say, so you go, you go through all that stuff, Wayne, and then you, you know, you, and then you go into the NHL.

Speaker 2 Well, first you go to the WHA with, with, before that, Indianapolis, then

Speaker 2 Edmonton, the WHA.

Speaker 2 I've always wanted to, this, two questions, I guess. Yep.
Playing in the WHA was, because

Speaker 2 it was a rival league. They tried to start up.
It was a startup league, Sean, to try to rival the NHL, and then they ended up merging a few teams. Was that? It's kind of like the Blitz.

Speaker 2 Well, it was kind of like the ABA in the basketball. Was it an advantage to you a little bit playing a little bit in the WHA before the NHL? Oh yeah.

Speaker 1 Yeah, no question.

Speaker 1 You know, the WHA wasn't as good as the NHL and they were

Speaker 1 stealing all the young players. So there was like 12 of us under the age of 20 that signed.
At the end of that year, the NHL said, okay, we got to come together.

Speaker 1 So four teams dismantled and four teams went into the NHL and they merged.

Speaker 1 It was a good league. Was it as good as the NHL? Absolutely not.
But it was a good stepping stone for me to get one year under my belt living with men playing with men traveling like the men do

Speaker 1 boy in edmonton it was a lot of travel trust me uh we were a long way from i think our closest trip was two and a half hours to win

Speaker 2 so but but it was a good job it was a good stepping stone for me it was a good stepping stone so you go you do that but my point is this from a young age and then you go in and you're thrust into this and you're just you explode on this i mean i know i know a lot of your stats i'm just i'm not reading anywhere off the top of my head i remember the season when you scored 215 points.

Speaker 2 I remember, you know, I mean, all of it to me was just incredible. But for you, with that came a lot of responsibility and a lot of money.

Speaker 2 And all of a sudden, you're thrust into the business of hockey. Were you prepared for that aspect of superstardom?

Speaker 1 Some ways I was. In other ways, I wasn't.
My priority and my focus was just to play hockey.

Speaker 1 I let everything around me just kind of be itself. And I never really concerned myself with things like that.
I really got more heavily involved when I went to LA.

Speaker 1 When I got traded to LA, I remember we were driving by the tennis courts on Van Nuys Boulevard.

Speaker 1 And I remember as we were driving by, I said to my wife, I said, you know, if this was Canada, there'd be 15 kids out there playing ball hockey right now. That's just the way it is.

Speaker 1 Two years later, I went by that same tennis courts and there was a big sign that said, no roller hockey allowed. And I said, you know what? Hockey's coming a long way.

Speaker 1 More and more kids are playing it. It's It's growing.
It's advancing. And so I learned more about the marketing and the business side of the game when I went to LA.

Speaker 1 And then Michael Eisner used to come to all the games and he loved hockey. And Michael decided, okay, I'm going to do this movie, The Mighty Ducks.
He did the movie.

Speaker 1 Nobody thought they would ever have an NHL team called the Anaheim Mighty Ducks. And so he was a huge part of the success of the National Hockey League going to another level.

Speaker 1 And then it just kind of snowballed from there. San Jose, and then, of course,

Speaker 1 Denver, and Dallas, and Phoenix.

Speaker 2 You know,

Speaker 2 when you do something as great as you do and

Speaker 2 for as long as you do, it becomes an addiction, I'm sure. Like, you can't wait to get on the ice.
You can't, that, like you were describing, right?

Speaker 1 Yeah. Listen, people ask me all the time, do you miss hockey? Yeah, I'm sick that I can't play, but I'm 61 and I'm slow and I'm not good.
But every day I get up and say, gosh, I wish I could play.

Speaker 2 Yeah, but I mean, do you so when you pass a an ice rink or a or it's winter time, do you, do you still go on the ice and not play, but just experience that?

Speaker 1 You know, my son does some hockey schools, and I'll get on the ice periodically. And I don't really skate.
I just kind of get out there. Yeah.
But I used to play in a lot of,

Speaker 1 I guess, charity events, charity games. People would say, hey, Wayne, will you jump in? I go, yeah, I'll play a couple shifts.

Speaker 1 And I came home one time, it was about seven years ago. I was about 54 years old.
And I put my bag down and I turned to Janet and I said, you know what? It's the last time I'm ever going to skate.

Speaker 1 And she goes, What are you talking about? And I said, It was the first time in my life that I was scared on the ice, that if I fell, I could seriously get hurt.

Speaker 1 And I said, You know, you can't play hockey like that. You can't play any sport like that, right? And I just said, You know what? I don't want to push it.

Speaker 1 I've had a good run. I love the game.
Everything I have in my life is because of hockey. I don't need to be breaking my leg because I think I can still play.

Speaker 4 What was your secret to what seems to my eyes, you seem like such a happy, peaceful, content guy.

Speaker 4 What was your secret to the successful transition from being exposed to an opportunity day in and day out for so many years to excel and dominate?

Speaker 4 When it stopped,

Speaker 4 I'm sure you knew there was no way to be able to replace that.

Speaker 4 Did you just lay some groundwork so that that was a smooth transition into what seems to me a very content life that you're living now? Or was there an adjustment that was uncomfortable?

Speaker 1 No, there's an adjustment. I think that any athlete who said there was no adjustment is lying because

Speaker 1 you have this passion and love.

Speaker 1 And it's like going to school.

Speaker 1 I can remember we used to start school the day after Labor Day and we knew we were in school all year till early June and that's when we got out. Hockey was the same thing.

Speaker 1 I knew I was going to training camp the day after Labor Day and I was at their mercy every single day of practice or travel or games and I did that all year.

Speaker 1 And then you get your six or eight weeks off in the summertime to be with friends and family. And I would say this all the time to people.

Speaker 1 If you're going to be a good athlete in any sport, you have to be extremely selfish. And I mean that in the most positive way.

Speaker 1 Selfish means the night before a game to eat properly, to get your proper rest, the day of a game. to focus and get ready.

Speaker 1 And the people around you, your family, your wife, your kids, your friends, your parents, they all have to be on that same page. And I was lucky.
They were all on that page.

Speaker 1 They understood when I was playing, that was my life.

Speaker 2 Yeah, they set you up for success.

Speaker 1 Yeah. And then when I was done, you know, I was lucky.
I had a great family. My kids are wonderful.

Speaker 1 There's new challenges, right? There's new

Speaker 1 things on the horizon. But I say this all the time.
Nothing's going to ever replace that high that I got being a hockey player. And that's why you still see guys who are 45 or 55.

Speaker 1 They play pickup hockey on Sundays. They still think back to their childhood, right? Yeah.
Like, this was so much fun. I don't want to give it up.

Speaker 1 I want to still keep playing, even though they can't play, even though they're not very good anymore. But they're still out there because the game itself is like

Speaker 1 a drug. It just pulls you in.
If you have that passion for it, there's nothing like it.

Speaker 2 I had that thing, Wayne. You know, for years, I haven't been back to Toronto at Christmas in a few years now, but I would go back and play shiny with the guys I grew up with.

Speaker 2 And I could go down to the rink, like Ramsden Park in Toronto, right across from Rosedale subway station, right off Young Street.

Speaker 2 And I could go and see the same guys who play Shinney there, like on a Sunday or in the afternoons that I've played my whole life with. And I can tell you something.

Speaker 2 And as a guy who did not play at a high level at all, the feeling I'd get from walking from my car to that little dressing room that's run by the

Speaker 2 Parks Department of Toronto to put my skates on, I couldn't do it fast enough. I can't get out there fast enough because I love the game so much that

Speaker 2 I can access that memory now, which is, but I wanted to get into this thing, which is and tell Sean and Jason one of my favorite stories.

Speaker 2 I mean, I have so many favorite stories about you that I've heard that are part of the legend.

Speaker 2 But one is there's a there's a record in hockey, guys, that was that Rocket Richard first broke, which was 50 goals in 50 games, which was almost unheard of.

Speaker 2 So

Speaker 2 he did that, he sets the mark. Wayne had,

Speaker 2 and correct me if I'm wrong, Wayne, but you had 45 goals in 38 games

Speaker 2 leading up to a game, right? So he had 45, so he had to get five more goals, but he had only played in 38 games. And your roommate at the time was Kevin Lowe,

Speaker 2 the great Kevin Lowe, who was your teammate. And Wayne says to him on this day, he says to, he goes, and Kevin Lowe tells the story, I'm going to get five goals tonight.

Speaker 2 And he called the shot and he went out and Wayne scored five goals to score 50 goals in 39 games. Oh, that's amazing.

Speaker 1 Yeah,

Speaker 1 yeah. It wasn't from bragging.
It was more a sense of, if I get this close and don't do it, I'm going to be known as a slug.

Speaker 1 So I felt more pressure to get to that 50 as fast as I could. And it just happened that night.
I got five, so I was pretty excited.

Speaker 2 It just happened. How did that feel, though? What was that feeling knowing that you did that?

Speaker 4 That poor goaltender.

Speaker 1 You know,

Speaker 1 I don't know. It was special.
It was unique.

Speaker 1 I felt honored.

Speaker 1 All that goes with that, right? I look back at it now. I was a kid just having fun, right? I didn't know any better.
I was 22 years old, just doing what I love doing, and you just go play, right?

Speaker 2 What do you think, Wayne, is like the physics behind something you understand and you get.

Speaker 2 You understand more than other players. Like, for example, that example, I went into this game.
I scored

Speaker 2 50 points in how many games. What is it you do? You don't have to to brag or it's not egotistical, but just technically speaking, what is it you do that?

Speaker 2 What is it you have that you don't think other people do? You know, that you can get away with that.

Speaker 2 Well, Wayne, Wayne, before you answer that, to set you up a little bit more, Sean, to kind of like, in addition to that, I remember asking a few people what it was like playing against Wayne, and they would say,

Speaker 2 he had a sense for the game. We always talked about Wayne.
You had a sense for it.

Speaker 2 And because I want to know about this, because they'd say, all of a sudden, the play would be over here and Wayne would be over there. And all of a sudden, the play play would end up over there.

Speaker 2 So, you did you feel like you always had a sense for how plays were going to unfold? Like, did you, I don't know, you know, like, what is that sixth sense?

Speaker 2 Like, how do it's like a it's almost like a quarterback in football. Like, how do they have that, you know, the great ones, how do they have that ability to get away with that?

Speaker 2 He is the great ones, yeah.

Speaker 1 You know what I mean? I think a couple things. First of all, um, I had a tremendous amount of respect for my opponents.
Um,

Speaker 1 I always played each and every guy like they were better than I was and that I had to be at my best to be able to play well.

Speaker 1 The game itself,

Speaker 1 when I started talking to you guys earlier, when I made that team at six years old with 10-year-olds, then at 14 I played with 20-year-olds. Then at 17, I played with men.

Speaker 1 And the one thing I didn't ever have to do, I was never big. I was always the smallest guy.
I was always on the smaller side. I wasn't physically strong.
I wasn't the fastest.

Speaker 1 So my dad always taught me at a young age, you better be smart out there. You better play chess.

Speaker 1 You better be one step ahead because that's how you're going to angle to be as good or better than they are.

Speaker 1 And so I never had to change my game from the time I was six years old till when I retired at 39, I still mentally focused and tried to play the same way.

Speaker 1 So I would say it was my hockey sense, my sixth sense on the ice that was the difference in my skill level. compared to maybe some other guys.

Speaker 2 Yeah, it's just interesting how some people are, some athletes like yourself are more just honed in than others.

Speaker 2 Sean has that in the kitchen.

Speaker 2 He'll be like, I know that there's some Chex mix in that cupboard and he opens it and they're filled with checks mixed. It's kind of amazing.
He makes bugles.

Speaker 2 He mixed with bugles and he's got a sense.

Speaker 2 So now, you know, first of all,

Speaker 2 you know, Wayne.

Speaker 2 Of course, Wayne is known as the great one, which I can't imagine there ever being a better nickname to be given to a guy ever of all time.

Speaker 2 But now you have this new company, this clothing company, Greatness Wins. And I see you're wearing a shot.
You have a t-shirt on, yeah. I was wondering what that was.

Speaker 2 Talk to me a little bit about how this partnership came about and what it's all about.

Speaker 1 Well, I think we got lucky in a sense that Derek Jeter, who was running the Florida Marlins, decided to take a step back and say, you know what, I was helpful in building this Nike shoe line when he was building baseball cleats in the mid-90s.

Speaker 1 And he just kind of dove all in and said, you know, I I really excited about this company that, you know, I want to be part of something that starts from the ground floor.

Speaker 1 And called me and asked me if I wanted to jump on board with him. And of course, anytime Derek Jeter calls you, you take that phone call and say, Okay, I'm definitely in.

Speaker 1 And as I always tell people, nobody told me how to play hockey. I'm not going to tell them how to make apparel, but I'm really excited about it.
They're great guys. They're wonderful.

Speaker 1 And it's an honor for me to be part of it. And plus, I got a free t-shirt today.

Speaker 2 Yeah.

Speaker 2 And thank you for sending us all that stuff.

Speaker 1 I know.

Speaker 1 I'm looking for it.

Speaker 2 Jason loves getting free stuff. I don't know if you heard him talking about the thing.

Speaker 1 We all like free stuff. It's free.
It's for me, and I'll take all three.

Speaker 1 Hysterical.

Speaker 4 Can people get it now? Is it up and running now?

Speaker 1 Yeah, it's online. Yeah.
Yeah. Right here.
Greatness wins.

Speaker 1 Greatness wins. Greatness wins.
Yeah. Golf shirts.
It's just nice apparel. So we're really excited.
Let's go.

Speaker 2 Jason, golf shirt.

Speaker 2 You know, you had mentioned Gordy Howe, and I heard the great story recently from a mutual friend of mine at Jason's. And I don't know, Wayne, if you know the great Skip Bronson, hilarious dude.

Speaker 2 And Skip told me a story when he was involved way back in the day with the Hartford Whalers. He says to Gordy, he says,

Speaker 2 Sean, by the way, Gordy Howe is one of the all-time great hockey players. Wayne's idol and

Speaker 2 a lot of many, many people's idol. And he was a tremendous.

Speaker 2 He says, he said to Skip, says to him, he says, Gordy, how did you never,

Speaker 2 how are you still playing in your 50s? He played into his 50s because he played with his sons, right?

Speaker 1 51.

Speaker 2 51. He says, how did you play so long? And he said, I never picked anything up.
And he goes, what do you mean? He goes, I never picked up a package, an envelope. If anything came in, I'd say no.

Speaker 2 He goes, because I always knew that that's how people injured themselves. So I never.

Speaker 1 I'll tell you,

Speaker 1 Gordy was so wonderful. I'll give you a great story.
We went to the White House in 1980 for the NHL All-Star Game, and Gordy and I were fortunate enough. We sat at the same table as President Reagan.

Speaker 1 And I was a kid. I was 18 years old.
I was sweating. I had a three-piece suit on.
It was probably too tight. And I was sitting there, and I turned to Gordy.
There was like six forks and seven knives.

Speaker 1 And I go, Gordy,

Speaker 1 what fork do we use? He goes, I'll tell you what. I'll watch him.
You watch me. And so Gordy watched President Reagan.

Speaker 1 And then so that night we got home and my dad says to me, how is it having lunch at the White House? And I said, I'll tell you how great Gordy Howe is. And he said, how is that?

Speaker 1 And I said, I heard the president of the United States turn to Gordy Howe and say, you know what, Gordy? I don't trust those effing Russians. I said, I heard the president swear.

Speaker 1 Really?

Speaker 2 That's how cool Gordy Howe is.

Speaker 1 Yeah, that's how cool Gordy was.

Speaker 2 That's cool. Oh, man.

Speaker 2 Wayne, listen,

Speaker 2 you've played a lot of games.

Speaker 2 Who is the toughest goalie you ever ever played? I've always wanted to know that.

Speaker 1 Billy Smith.

Speaker 2 Billy Smith, eh?

Speaker 1 Yeah, he was because they're all so good. They're such great athletes and they're better athletes today than we were 40 years ago.

Speaker 1 But Billy Smith, the game on the line, pressure, and the thing that made him so good is he hated me and I hated him.

Speaker 1 But

Speaker 1 that was when we played, right? And now that we're done and over, we have a mutual respect for each other. And he was, no question, one of the greatest ever.

Speaker 4 Did you you ever roll one off his back? That was one of my favorite moves that you did.

Speaker 4 You know, listener, he'd get behind the net, and the goalie would have his back to him, and he'd flip it up over the net and roll it off the back of goalie's back into the net.

Speaker 1 No, he was too good and too smart for that. He was one of the best.

Speaker 2 People don't do that anymore, right?

Speaker 4 People don't like that.

Speaker 1 If I was back there, he'd be swinging his stick at me.

Speaker 2 He was the great, great goalie for the New York Islanders. And when Wayne played with Edmonton, and they had been the dominant dynasty before Wayne and

Speaker 2 the Oilers came and took over,

Speaker 2 fought the mantle off, right, from those guys. What epic,

Speaker 2 epic hockey. Wayne, you just, I don't know, you just, you made

Speaker 2 so many people's day over the years. You've been such an incredible ambassador for the sport of hockey, and you've done so much.
And it's such a thrill to have you. Honestly,

Speaker 2 it's great to meet you. I could talk to you all day.
I love every time I write you.

Speaker 1 Really respect all three of you guys, and you got a great show. Even talking about it on NBC from what I heard earlier.

Speaker 1 Let's go play some golf, and we'll finish up this conversation all right you guys listen i loved it and will keep uh keep promoting our game you do a great job for the game of hockey thanks guys thanks wayne thanks wayne we'll talk to you soon guys pleasure thanks buddy bye

Speaker 4 oh and he slams the laptop

Speaker 4 only the great one knows the great he's the great one

Speaker 2 yeah yeah i know i don't know like it i it was really cool first of all i said i i know who he is and of course look at this i i don't know what's that you got chills yeah I got chills.

Speaker 2 Wait, were you freaking out, Will, because you were that? Is that like an eye?

Speaker 4 Because he closed the laptop or because he told you you're doing great for the hockey?

Speaker 2 Just anything he says to me, and every time he remembers my name,

Speaker 2 I'm like, I'm just going to end it now.

Speaker 4 Isn't that crazy, you guys? Like, I'm sorry.

Speaker 2 Yeah, I know.

Speaker 4 The three of us have been in this business a long time. We've met a lot of fancy people, but it is, it will never be lost on me how fortunate we are.
And it's thanks to you, listener, that

Speaker 4 we have this opportunity, this platform to talk to these people that are huge heroes to us. And we get to just speak on a peer level and shoot the shit with them.
It's just

Speaker 2 Jason, I really think that people are able to get how much we do respect that position that we have by the virtue of the fact that

Speaker 2 your mouth is full of food. That really sells, that really sells how appreciative is that.

Speaker 4 It's only the finest protein bars made.

Speaker 4 The name is Think.

Speaker 2 So, Wayne, you know what's so great about Wayne, Wayne, though? Like, he's, first of all, not only a great hockey player, but a great storyteller. Like,

Speaker 2 you could say, I had a BLT, and he'd be like, oh my God, I have the greatest story about a BLT. And it's enthralling.
It's like, I was listening to every single word. Like, wow.
Yeah. Yeah, he does.

Speaker 2 He has such a knowledge. And I meant it, he is such a, I've seen him in so many different scenarios.

Speaker 2 I've seen him in, you know, the first time I met him, I was on a plane to Toronto, and Archie was about,

Speaker 2 I don't know, five or six or something. And we were flying up to just the two of us.
And Wayne gets on, last to get on the plane. And he's like two rows in front of us.
Wayne comes back and he says,

Speaker 2 he comes over to me. He's Wayne Gretzky.
And I'm too nervous to say anything. And we're flying up, right? I mean, he's Canadian royalty.
And he says, hey, Will, blah, blah, blah.

Speaker 2 I said, hey, this is my, nice to meet you. Hey, this is my son, Archie.
Archie, how you doing? Blah, blah, blah, blah. And then he's got his boarding pass and he writes his phone number.

Speaker 2 He goes, give me a call. I'm going to Toronto, but give me a call and let's hang out.
Blah, blah, blah. I go, no problem.

Speaker 2 And I got to

Speaker 2 turn to my five or six-year-old and be like, I just got Wayne Kretzky's phone number. Yeah, that's so cool.

Speaker 2 And I, and, and I'm, anyway, I've now subsequently met him, you know, a bunch of times over the years. And he's always such a, and he never, never deviates from that.

Speaker 2 And he's, and he talks to everybody, and he's such a sweet, kind,

Speaker 2 open, generous guy, to quote Jason, generous with his time.

Speaker 2 And, you know, there's something about him that is just, I don't know.

Speaker 4 And his ability was always so clear. I mean, you know, you could,

Speaker 4 even if you had the worst seat in the house, you could see how good he is. You would not need by

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