"Katy Perry"

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Okay, guys.

It's great to be here.

I'm really happy that we get to do the podcast today.

It's our final SmartList ever.

It's our final SmartList ever.

A very special SmartList.

Don't say that.

People are going to think that that's real.

Let's finish strong. And this guest is really, what a great final guest.
Our final episode. It's not final.
People are going to think it's a final episode. Wait, it's not our final episode? Let us finish.
For today, it will be our last. Sean, don't cut us off, Rude.
For today today. For today, this is our final, final Smartless.

Ever.

Ever.

But not today.

For today.

Sean, with the cutting off.

Welcome to Smartless.

Smartless.

Smartless.

Smartless. Smart.
Less. Smart.

Less.

I put the do in douche.

That'll be our first line of this episode.

Right there.

We just found our in.

I put the do in douche.

That's not good for me.

Wait a second.

Wait, you're saying,

Will, joke's over.

When are you coming home? I know. Soon, right? End of this week, maybe? Yeah, end of this week.
I'm actually really looking forward to it. You were going to come home a little early.
Weren't you threatening to do that? Yeah, I was. First of all, Jason, when were you here? Remember you were going to come and you called me? I was going to come, but...
And then you never followed up. The dude came here.
No way. The dude came here.
What are you talking about? Sean, are you... Did I tell you this when I saw you? What did I see you yesterday? Are you sure you...
Can we talk about this? Wait, did I see you yesterday? I saw you yesterday. No, I saw you Saturday.
Saturday. Saturday.
I talked to Sean last night. I phoned...
Ied him. You phoned him, Granddad? FaceTime bombed him.

That was really funny.

Oh my God,

they were freaking out.

Anyway, keep going.

He was with a bunch,

he was with lesbians

and I was like,

yeah,

you don't have to tell me

they're lesbians.

I got it.

He did say that.

Let's go deeper on that.

Can we have names?

Wait,

Jason,

tell me,

what were you going to say?

So,

I don't know if I can talk,

well,

I guess I can talk about this.

I can just kind of skid along the top of it.

My eldest, my 15-year-old daughter.

We talked a little bit about this, but keep going.

So, she went to Europe this summer in a camp, and she fell in love.

And this guy, he lives in New York.

He is currently married, has three kids, but, you know.

But you can always work it out.

You can work through it.

She loves him.

No, he's her age.

He's 15.

And she was going to fly out there and see him in New York

because they'd been done with camp for a couple of weeks

and she was starting to really miss him.

This whippersnapper gets a hold of my wife and works out a whole surprise to come out and see Franny and visit and surprise Franny. So this guy's been here posting up in my house for three days and just extended his trip another three days as of today.
It was a surprise. He's there now.
Yeah, here now. And he's staying with you.
Staying with us. There's rules.
There's rules. There's rules.
He's an angel, though. He clearly needs no rules.
He just seems to drop straight from heaven. Nice kid.
But tell Will what you did to keep the surprise from Franny. Oh, well, you know, it was the whole thing about, like, well, him landing and then, you know, getting a ride to the house.
And then do we have her, you know, like run into him in a coffee shop here next to the house? Or should we have him just kind of be in the house and have her come downstairs? And, you know, Amanda and I were trying to think. Jump out of the cake.
Well, yeah. Jump out.
Yeah. We didn't want to.
Here, just get in this cake. I was really set on trying to preserve the moment that she sees him that we're not, you know, having, you know, two cameras rolling and making sure.
Because, you know, of course, that's what we want and that's what his mom wants. But anyway kind of we kind of did a little of each and uh i think it was a big success but you told her to you told her to kind of get gussied up for a photo or something oh yeah because amanda amanda thought well gosh you know if i was surprised and i didn't look my best um i'd be upset at whoever surprised me so amanda yes said that she had to like she had to get like her passport picture retaken or some sort of picture that the photographer was nice enough to come over to the house.
And so just make sure you comb your hair before you come downstairs. Yeah.
Wow. Yeah.
It was really, really cute. I love that story.
It's so sweet. Very cute.
Yeah. And you have video.
You'll show me video later. We've got video.
So you did shoot it. You filmed it with a crew.
We did film it, but it was at a tasteful distance. Full crew from Discovery.
I had... Have you ever seen Alone? It's the same production crew that works on Alone.
One nice shout-out for Alone. Will, have you gotten into Alone Frozen yet? Dude, I am in Alone.
We took a break for... I'm now in Alone, the first one where they do couples.
Yeah, so you met your Canadian guys. How about those Canadian fellas? Are those guys not the best?

I gotta watch that. They are such graduates

of Hoser U. They're from Toronto.

And one of them says to his brother

he goes,

and I noticed the casual swearing by

Canadians is so off the charts.

Nobody gets beat more on those shows than

Canadians. He's like, fucking hell

of a day, eh?

So it's just beat, hell of a day, eh? I'm just like, oh, these guys are, they're beauts. The guy goes, he's fishing.
He's like, fuck, I better catch something or I'm just going to stab myself in the face, eh? I forget how far they make it. It's so good.
Wait, are you talking about the new one? It's like Alone Frozen? No, no, no. That's season nine.
He's not there yet. I'm past that and now going to start the spinoff, the ex-champions that they drop into a frozen tundra.
This is called Alone Frozen. I haven't started it yet, but I've got a couple episodes all banked up.
I'll be into that. Oh, wait.
By the way, speaking of gussing yourself up, I got a facial the other day.

And the woman, when I'm done, she says, by the way, Will, it's the same spa that I got you a gift card for. Dude, wait.

How often?

Will has six jokes already.

Just right off the word facial.

I've got facial.

Yeah, it was just jizzing my face.

You love a facial.

Jizzing my face.

You gave a facial or you got one?

Sorry, I don't know which joke to use. I don't know.
Okay, so wait. Wait, Sean, so you get a facial? I got a facial.
And when I was done, the woman says, the woman says, your scalp is too tight. Wow, good for you.
Stop teeing them up, Sean. You got to be quicker.
Jason, stop laughing. When I was done, she says to me, I mean, drop the ellipses and keep our net out.
Okay, ready? When I was done, the woman turns to me and says, your scalp is too tight. You think too much.
And I said, sorry, excuse me. She says, you need to stop thinking so hard.
And I'm like, what does that even mean? You must have got a her i had a i i did not have a facial today or give one but i did i did have a like a face what they call like face gym or something this person comes and they like it was i'll set it up and they do this thing they like manipulated my face and moved it all around did all this stuff it was incredible a face gym so like face like cheek push-ups and things like that yeah they come they do all this stuff. It was incredible.
A face gym. So like cheek push-ups and things like that.

Yeah, they come

and they do all this stuff

with this electromagnetic thing

and do all this stuff

and it was like,

I've never had it.

I've had three facials,

I think, in my life.

Yeah.

They were great.

Yeah.

But I just forget.

It's nice.

They're nice.

I forget to do it.

They're nice because, you know.

You look good.

Your skin looks very good.

Sean, you look very good.

Thanks.

Will, you look good. You look great.
Thanks, man. I mean, I'm currently in a relationship, so.
Well, but you're coming out here, right? You're coming out. You're changing area codes? Okay.
So, wait, guys. Before we get to our guests, I have an official announcement.
Oh, boy. Is it facial related? What's that? What did you say? I asked if it was facial-related.
No, it's not. I got Will mid-sip.
I literally spit it out. No, it's not facial-related.
Okay, so the play I did at the Goodman Theater in Chicago earlier this year, it's called Goodnight Oscar. This is the official, official announcement that it's going to Broadway.
No way. Yes.
Performances begin April 7th. Oh, wow.
And if you go to goodnightoscar.com, that's goodnightoscar.com. Spell it.
You'll be one of the first. G-O-O-D-N-I-G-H-T-S-O-S-T-E-R.
It's not K-N-I. This is the sword play you're doing, right? No, it's like good morning, good night.
You'll be one of the first to get tickets if you go to goodnightoscar.com. Tickets go on sale today.
Today. So I hope you call and a great show.
Good night Oscar. Wow, that's great.
This is not the Excalibur one act you were doing. No, it's not.
And it's going to open at the Belasco Theater, which is huge. I mean, it's a great theater.
And I've heard it's a little haunted. So that's going to be exciting.
That is great. Congratulations, Shawnee.
Thank you. I'm excited.
I'm afraid of no ghosts, by the way. It should be mentioned.
No, but Shawneeawnee shawnee congratulations he had a very successful run in chicago listener and he has earned this so i'm gonna go out there and i'm gonna see it uh will are you still thinking about it up in the air up in the air about going to see it yeah and we don't want your matinee money i always came i always i almost came i almost came to chicago and i couldn't do it in the one weekend i had in atlanta anyway yes i I'm going to be there. Are you kidding? We'll carpool.
Thank you guys for being so supportive. I'm excited for you.
I'm so happy for you. Alright, guys, so our guest today, boy, does she make me laugh a lot.
But funny enough, that's not what she gets paid the big bucks to do. She was signed to a major record label at just 15 years old.
She eventually my God. She eventually released her first album under a different name

than what we know her as today.

Jackson.

Jackson.

Joplin.

Janet Joplin.

The self-titled album was heavily influenced by her Christian upbringing,

which I'm going to ask her about, too.

She celebrated in the LGBTQ community,

winning many awards for her advocacy and philanthropy.

Guys like me have some pretty badass empowerment anthems

because of her strength.

Please welcome the fantastic, the fabulous Katy Perry. What? What? Katy.
Hi. Katy Perry.
That was a long wait for you, Katy. That was a long wait.
You don't have to wait that long for anything. Katy, you don't have to wait that long.
You could have just hung up on us. Did you hear me cracking my knuckles? I was like, guys, my child just woke up from a nap.
She's desperate to see her mommy. Let's go.
Oh, is that true? Well, not really, but yes. Okay, let's get right into the baby stuff.
How is the kidnapping, boy or girl? She's a girl. She's about to be two years old.
She's doing okay. But, you know, I am working a lot, and I've always worked a lot, and kind of been a matriarchal figure.
Yes, you have been. And I have a wonderful nanny, but I don't have a full-time nanny because I feel like if I had a full-time nanny, then I would never be able to know how to like care for my daughter.
Right. Like I'm meant to.
And so therefore, any day I get off, I'm just like in mom mode. Like it doesn't matter if I've had a show that goes till 11 p.m.
the night before. I'm waking up at 6 o'clock and we're going to go and do breakfast.
And yes, I have the no sleep shakes. But yeah, so I'm doing mom mode today.
And my sister tapped in to do some Play-Doh while we're having a little chat. Well, thank you for taking the time away.
I think as much help as you can get, just for what it's worth, it always made me a better parent so that I could refill my patience tank and my compromise tank and whatever that is. I think help is great as much think there's, I think help is great as much as you can get.
Of course. I mean, it's, we're like super blessed and I'm so grateful, but I also, you know, like want to participate.
And like, yeah, yeah. I want like every, she's two.
So she's at that point where it's like, she's saying new words every day. And the other day she was just saying some words that I didn't teach her.

And I was like, damn it.

That doesn't feel good.

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Now, so she's two.

So then she's walking around.

Oh, yeah.

Oh, yeah.

You have all the corners padded and all that stuff?

Yeah, still.

I actually overheard your conversation about the new boyfriend.

Yes.

Yes.

I think you got to look at the bright side of this is that he's on your turf. She's not over there.
No. Not texting you back.
He's literally in your house. So if you wanted to set up that extra ring camera and throw it in like a old stuffed teddy bear in the bedroom, you know, you could do that.
Might see stuff I don't want to see. Sure.
Might see stuff I don't want to see. Now, are you getting help from dad? Yeah, dad's doing...
Is dad around? Of course, dad is the best, but actually, I was a little tardy for this call because he had just called me to let me know he was alive because he's in the Bahamas right now filming a show where he goes to kind of just the edge of everything extreme, and he's doing an episode on free diving, so he just freedove like over 100 feet. For my sister, Tracy, you're talking about Orlando Bloom.
Yes, Orlando Bloom, yeah. And so he was just calling me to check in and tell me that he's still around, which I'm grateful for because it's been a few days.
He's been learning how to do all these kind of extreme sports.

He's filming a show for Discovery,

and it's just like it's a little nerve-wracking.

Wow, no stunt doubles allowed in that.

Sean can relate.

He has his own stunt double.

You got to go in toes first, right?

Will used to do a lot of – in Acapulco, he did some free diving.

You got to go in toes first.

You lose your toenails on that.

You've seen some of that footage of me. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Sure, from back in the day. And we will be right back.
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Hey guys, everybody should have a support system, right? Who's your support system? My support system, as you well know, talk about all the time, is Scotty and of course my two besties, Will and Jason. Whenever I have a problem, an issue, I talk to them about it.
And if they're not available, I will talk to a therapist and I've been going to therapy for a long time and it's always great. So think about your favorite leaders, mentors, and idols.
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All right, back to the show. Wait, Katie, I want to talk about, by the way, I've like, I know you have to like transfer out of like mom mode for a second and be here to talk about all this stuff.
I wore so many fucking hats. Come on.
Okay, good. Let's do it.
All right, so I did not know your real name was Kate Hudson. Katie Hudson.
Well, yeah, it's Catherine Hudson. Catherine Hudson.
People called me Katie Hudson, but... I didn't know that.
In the beginning, I decided not to do that. How did you settle on Perry? My mother's maiden name Perry.
So if we were living in a matriarchal society, it would have just been easy. Have you cornered Kate Hudson at a party and told her to back off and give you the name back? No, we're best friends.
We get along. That was actually the first thing that we got along on.
How could you not get along with her? She's just... She's effervescent is the think she's so sweet she's just like i can do anything i've got children i can cook i'll show you how to do my yoga pose wait speaking of poses the first time i met you was very brief backstage at either madonna or janet jackson i can't remember but i think it was probably madonna madonna and I didn't stick around because Madonna was like two, three hours late.

I was like, I'm old.

I got to go to bed.

I get it.

But I saw you backstage.

And the first time, we didn't even say hello.

I go, Katie.

I go, you're Sean.

And we both did the lion's pose

because we have the same vocal coach.

Oh, yeah.

Remember that?

We stuck our hands up.

Like that.

Eric Vitro.

Shout out.

Eric Vitro, yeah.

He's the greatest.

The most iconic.

He's like kind of like, he's quirky St. Clair in a Christopher Guest movie.
He really is. He's like a little, he's like a character from a Christopher Guest movie.
Corky St. Clair.
He's the greatest. And the greatest vocal coach ever.
Got me through Broadway. He's amazing.
If I had his name, I would call my business In Vitro. Of course.
How would you not? Of course. How the fuck would you not? Wait a second.
Wait a second. So Sean came up to you at a, after a concert and then did that.
No, before. Oh, before the concert.
Yeah. And were you on your, so you went to Janet Jackson and then were you on your way to Cher or was that? The Holy Trinity? Yeah.
You mean? No, I was like, the Holy Trinity. The Trinity was complete with Katie there.
Sean, you know that Katie doesn't know that I was actually a backup dancer for Janet Jackson. Will was on an episode of Will and Grace where we were both backup dancers to Janet Jackson.
And Sean and I had a dance-off and I was in Tony Jackson's band. Jason, you were there that night.
Yeah. I was there.
So true story. Wait, go back to just for one second with Eric Vitro.
Do you still use him and call him up? Because you're doing a Vegas show. Is it every night you do the Vegas show? No, I do it in like three week installments.
How much do you get for that? How much money do they pay you for that? You don't have to answer that. Don't listen to him.
It allows me the ability to drop my daughter off at preschool and then mommy goes to work and comes back home the next day. So it's like, it's like a, it's such a great routine, you know, it's like, it's something that like pop stars love to do and check off the box.
But it's also, I get to create an incredible, crazy, crazy show that I can't tour with because I couldn't possibly move all these absurd props that are on the stage. But do I call him every single time I sing? No, I actually have a recording.
Yeah, I do too. Yeah, and it's like from like 10 years ago.
Yeah, it's the best. Do you know, so you know Eric Vitro, do you know Scavo? Scavo's the guy who cuts my hair.
That's Sean's beautician. We all know each other.
This community, we just all hang. So in Vegas, so you do three weeks at a time.
What is the place? What is the venue? It's at Resorts World. Resorts World.
Which is the newest hotel on the Strip. Gotcha.
And it's right next to the Wynn. And I started it out on New Year's Eve, I think, or a couple days before New Year's Eve.
Just this past year? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I'm there for this year, and I'll be doing some more shows.
My last kind of announced run so far, and it depends if we'll go next year, is in October. So you do three weeks on, one week off, three weeks on, one week off? No, I don't do that.
Actually, it's kind of crazy. It's three weeks on one week off three weeks on one week off all year no i don't do that

actually it's actually it's kind of crazy it's three weeks on and then sometimes six to nine weeks off oh that's a nice and i it's really easy to become fat elvis in between really incredible so listen katie um i've always this is so cool that you're here so thank you i mean it is Very cool to have you on.

Oh, stop.

I'm only doing this because of...

It's divided between... Katie, I've always, this is so cool that you're here, so thank you.
It is very cool to have you on.

Oh, stop.

I'm only doing this because it's divided between Sean and Amanda.

I'm going to tell her.

I'm going to tell her.

It's mostly Amanda.

I love you, Sean, but Amanda, she's.

No, I get it.

I get it.

We all love Amanda.

She's pretty great.

Will loves Amanda.

She's the real boss of this podcast.

I think Will talks to Amanda more than I do.

Everybody loves Amanda. Next fall on NBC.
She's my real boss of this podcast. I think Will talks to Amanda more than I do.
Everybody loves Amanda.

Next fall on NBC. She's my most

frequent FaceTimer.

Wait, wait, can I go back to

Sean was

I want to talk about

you going to Vegas and doing this stuff.

What was, for you

musically, what was, I don't know

who were your idols

growing up? Who were the people you're like, I want to be like that. i want to sound like that like this is the kind of shit i want to do uh jagged little pill by alanis morris that changed my life that was the record that changed how old were you when that came out well that's rude to ask but i don't i mean i'm 37 so i don't know it was like early 20s or i mean i was late teens.
God, that was so good. That was a good record.
But before that, Queen. Queen was like the number.
Freddie Mercury was amazing. I only listened to gospel music my whole life up until I was about 13.
And then I discovered like a greatest hits of Queen and the White Album from the Beatles and Pet Sounds from the Beach Boys. And those three compact discs were on rotate.
That was it. That's amazing.
Were you not allowed to listen to other? Oh, that's what I was going to say. Guys, don't fight.
No, I wasn't allowed. I was raised in a very Christian, but it's like, they call it born again Christian.
So it's like, it's very kind of emotional and like it's new wave. Don't call it new age, but it's not like Catholic.
It's like, it's pretty radical Christian. But no music sounds more like boring again.
You know what I mean? Well, actually there's a whole, like, I mean, there's like all kinds of. You don't have to take that shit from them, Katie.
No, she's with me. You're not offending me, please.
But, no, I grew up with listening to gospel music and Christian music, and there's like a whole Christian music world out there that have their own type of Grammys. I mean, it's the whole thing.
Yeah, it's huge.

Right, huge.

Yeah, it's massive.

Really?

Do you mind if I ask how big a religion plays in your life currently?

Currently?

Yeah.

Religion.

Organized?

No.

I don't believe in the way that I was raised.

Yeah.

Organized religion is not necessarily for me. I'm a big, big seeker.
Orlando is a devout Buddhist and he chants every morning, mostly. And so I kind of follow a little bit more of his philosophy or just the Buddhist philosophy, but I'm actually just like a seeker of all of it.
I mean, like from mysticism to math to geometry to like physics, lots of science. Right, there's something bigger up there that somehow explains all this beautiful miracle stuff, but what that thing is can be for anybody's choosing kind of thing? I mean'm sure it's ultimately gonna be something i don't know if it's anyone's choosing and but i'm sure no but i mean whatever they want to call it right buddha or i have some i have some freaky not freaky but like there's there's some thoughts that i entertain i mean yeah that explains it all kind of thing I mean, I'm into simulation theory.
I'm into, like, NPCs.

Sure.

Let's hear all of it. Somebody just walked me through the simulation thing last weekend.
What's the simulation? Have you guys heard about that? Well, I don't, I mean, I've never been walked through it. That were a part of a simulation? Yeah, but like for instance, my brother is a big gamer and he's into crypto and I'm into crypto and all that stuff.
But they were watching like the X Games of video gaming yesterday. And it was like, it was literally just video gamers on their computers, you know, with their fancy chairs playing FIFA or playing soccer.
And there was a stadium full of people watching these people play their characters, their avatars. And I was like, well, isn't that already happening? Is this like meta, meta? Is this happening with us? Is someone potentially playing us? Right.
And then we're figuring out how to play another game.

And, you know, the metaverse is just like the next dimension of our reality.

I don't know.

Right. Something just outside of what we can see.

And perhaps this is all sort of happening in another place.

And we think we're here, but we're really not kind of thing.

Yeah.

And I don't even smoke weed.

I'm not even allowed to smoke weed because you don't want to smoke weed.

It sounds like you're making it. I mean, what are you talking about? Listen.
It sounds like I'm't even smoke weed. I'm not even allowed to smoke weed because you don't want to smoke weed.
It sounds like you're making it.

I mean, what are you talking about?

Listen.

It sounds like I'm microdosing now.

Here's the other thing.

Keep in mind, I have had those thoughts too

where it's that whole like,

are we in the matrix, all that kind of shit.

Yeah, I love that.

And I have to be honest,

I had it quite recently

and to a certain degree I thought,

if I am, I actually don't want to know because what's the point? Yeah this is pretty intense to try and process any of that information Now what was the other thing you said so simulation and what was the MMT? No. Uh NPC What is that? What is that? Non-player character Non-player character.
NPC It's like that Free Guy Free Guy That's where Sean's movie was all about that. People that are not actively participating in life.
And it's a reference to basically... My dad.
Katie, correct me if I'm wrong. Characters who are extras in video games who just kind of walk around and aren't actually part of the thing.
Wow. I think it's maybe a sociopathic way to explain it, but, I mean, on a more esoteric spiritual level, maybe it's just people that lack awareness or consciousness.
I feel like as soon as that headset thing, the virtual reality thing, when that really, like, takes over, I feel like we're going to have a bunch of those people. They're just like, well, why should I go out? I got this perfect environment that I can just kind of put on my head.
I can stay in my air-conditioned house and I can really kind of go wherever I want. Have you done that, Jason, before? No, but from what I hear about it, it sounds fantastic.
Yeah, because the second you take it off, you forget take it off you forget, oh gosh, I'm in my living room. It really transports you to another world.
Like, it's crazy. But it's really simple.
We're just from aliens, period. That's it.
We're all just stars bound to a body. That's exactly right.
Guys. I've been saying it for years.
Yeah. Oh wait, Katie, I want to talk about just you for a second and your songs and music and everything.
I know we are, but I want to talk about, like, I just, you know, I'm obsessed. So, first of all, I just have to say this.
You know, for as long as we live, Mariah Carey will have a Christmas song that will be played every single holiday season called All I Want for Christmas forever. And there's only a handful of people that have anthems like to a holiday and stuff.
But for as long as we, the next 10,000 years, 4th of July, they will always play Firework by Katy Perry for the rest of our life. Great song.
I mean, isn't that cool? Apparently for 10,000 years. Yeah.
10,000 years until the next polar shift. Yeah.
Then all the pop stars start over. None of us are living more than 40 more years on this planet.
Keep going, Sean. That's the polar shift.
No, but that's just like, obviously. It's so great.
I'm so, look, I'm so grateful. I know.
You don't have to say anything. I just think it's so cool.
It's the best. Yeah.
I mean, and you didn't write it for that purpose, but it became that thing. And now every 4th of July, we just hear that.
I think it's so cool. I just think it's cool.
It's wild. You know, you guys know because you guys have a lot of, I mean, all of you have been in, you know, success for a long time, for more than a decade.
It's like in the beginning, there's a lot of anxiety and worry and doubt and fear and blah, blah, blah. And then you just keep chipping away at chipping away at chipping away.
And then 10 years pass and then 15 years back and you're like, oh, this is going to be okay, I think. Yeah, it's going to be okay.
And the more I decide to live, the better I get at living it, you know? Yeah, yeah. The more you decide to live, meaning the less you pay attention to business and the aspirations and the ambition and stuff and more about like personal life you focus on? I mean, yes, but no, I'm just saying that like, you know, I don't come from anything.
So I just I'm grateful that I've been able to scale these heights. Yeah, yeah.
I wouldn't say that I didn't dream of these heights because I totally did. Yeah.
But just because you dream, it doesn't mean you always get the opportunity to do it. Right, but your work ethic, I mean, it's like song after song, album after album is just massively globally huge.
It's just unbelievable. Thank you.
You know, where does that come from where you're just like, you know what? I got to get another album and another album and another album. And all the people that you collaborate with.
Childhood trauma. Yeah, for sure.
Childhood trauma, it is the gasoline for all art. For a long, long time until it turns against you.
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Now, what does it look like? What does it look like in another 15 years? Is there, would you love to just become a more and more mature singer, songwriter, producer, or all of it? You know, my currency is communication with people. That's what I feel like I'm put on the planet to do.
You're an excellent communic. I watch on American Idol, the way you speak to the contestants, I've seen you in interviews, the way you just speak.
The way you carry yourself is extremely intelligent, very succinct, very... Sean, go ahead and ask her.
He wants to know how much you make on American Idol. He's desperate to know.
And by the way, he's laughing now, and he's also like, but maybe she will. Scratching the question off the list.
No, but seriously. So I'd like to continue scaling with that.
I mean, I love music and, you know, that has been the main, you know, that's my main tree but I have a ton of branches and you know, maybe another tree. By the way, what about acting? Because in all your videos, I swear I'm not just saying this.
You're a really talented actress. And I'm not, I can't be the first person that's like, but in every video, I'm just like, why is she not like in a movie or something? Or like a TV show.
Can I tell you? Can I tell you? Yeah. Let's make some news.
So. You and Orly are doing love letters.
You're doing love letters down at the Gethin. I respect what you guys do, but I think I have a little bit more fun.
Yeah. Oh, wow.
You probably do. Sorry, sorry.
Because I have been on set. I have, you know, I've been around all the actors.
It's slow. I've dated them, married them, blah, blah, blah, blah.
And like the amount of time that you guys sit in a trailer and then the amount of deliveries and takes you do like close up and then wide and over the shoulder. And it's just like I just go on the stage for two hours a night and I do it all in real time in front of a real audience.
And, you know, I feel like I love what I do. And like I would not not do a movie.
Obviously, I have ideas and dreams and I probably will in the future. But it has to be something that I'm totally like so excited for.
Yeah, yeah, it has to be the right thing. And develop and own and all that jazz.
Because, you know, it's a real communal job that you guys have. Yeah.
And my job takes a team, but it's not as communal. Like the buck stops at me.
Yeah, yeah. You know? That's cool.
So I'm like, I love watching films. I love, you know, I respect and admire and I'm in awe of the dedication, the time spent, the effort that all y'all do.
But it's just, it's a lot. Yeah, but you're in the studio for hours and days and weeks, and then you shoot videos for hours and days and weeks.
Videos are just a couple days, right? Videos are two to three days. Alright, well calm down everybody.
No, no, no. I was looking up, Katie, I was looking, I was trying to remember the name of your song.
Anyway, I was just looking up. Give me some context clues, I'll tell you.
Well, no, it was Roar. Sing a little bit of it.
Roar, yeah. But then the question is this.
Well, it's more of a statement. So then Wikipedia decides to tell me that you've sold over 143 million records worldwide.
You've had over a million streams on Spotify. You have nine number one U.S.
singles. I'm like, what? That's what I'm saying.
That's what I said. So when you're saying to her, do you ever want to be an actress? She's like, what? Why the fuck would I go do what you do, you tool? She's like, on top of a mountain.
No, it's an artistic medium. Yes, no, but have you seen her videos? She's like a really fantastic actress.
Yes, I have seen her videos. It's amazing.
If you have a two-year-old, it'll start eventually. Yeah, well.
Okay, so wait. Before we let you go, because it's been too long, you're going to get back to you.
narrating an elizabeth taylor podcast which is

amazing tell me about why and what it's about and elizabeth taylor you only talk about elizabeth taylor i don't understand well i'm learning so much by narrating it um i she's like one of my heroes i mean she just you know she wasn't just an actress she was an activist and expanded she was the first influencer, I would say.

You know, she wasn't just an actress. She was an activist and expanded.
She was the first influencer, I would say. You know, she created a brand and, you know, she had ownership.
She really was such an incredible businesswoman. And, you know, I'm just so inspired by her.
And I resonate a lot with her story and hope to, you know, have as many husbands as her. No, no, no.
What did she have, seven? Seven and one of them was twice, I don't know. Yeah, that was Richard Burton.
Oh, Dickie Burtz. Yeah.
Oh, my gosh. At what point do you think she said, maybe it's me? But anyway, okay.
But last stat that I think is so impressive, and I can name a million of them, is of all halftime Super Bowl shows, yours is the most watched. Worth it.
I think it's incredible. Well deserved.
Thank you. I thought it was amazing.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Was it worth it? Was it worth they talk about, like, they're always like, this year in the Super Bowl, it's going to be Katy Perry. Then they're like, did you guys hear this week, this year in the Super Bowl, it's going to be so-and-so.
Was it that much of a thrill? You can be honest because nobody listens to this podcast. You guys are actually really popular.
I'll bet it was really fun, all the apparatus of that.

Was it fun?

So was it everything that you wanted it to?

Is it the greatest thing?

Yeah, it was everything.

It was like, it was really intense.

It was the most adrenaline.

It was like I had never been close to death.

I had never given birth, so I had nothing to compare it to. Those feelings seem like really intense, you know, life feelings.
But it felt like it was in that same category. You don't really wish it on anyone.
But, you know, it's a rite of passage in some ways. And it separates, I think, people.
And, I mean, it definitely helps catapult and, you know,apult and just puts you in a different thing. Yeah.
And it was amazing. And I got to pick my people that I performed with, which was Missy Elliott and Lenny Kravitz.
But I rehearsed the hell out of it. You did? Well, one of my producers for that particular show, he literally had a cattle prod.
And he would run after me with this cattle prod and it'd just go. And I'd have to, it was like my legs were so sore, but I had to climb and mount that lion again and get on it.
And what you didn't see in between, you know, all the changes and stuff on that particular show is that I was coming down from the lion by literally holding onto a fire pole. So I was like coming down the fire pole.
I was changing, ripping things. I was wearing three costumes under one thing, you know.
There was so much behind the scenes that was going on in order to, like, in order to give it that color and variety and life and just have it be the biggest thing. How long did they let you rehearse that? I don't know.
I rehearsed it for months on end. Really? Months? Yeah, but you only get, like, there's so much room for error in that show.
Yeah, of course. It's only, like, 10 minutes, right? Or whatever.
10, 12 minutes, yeah. And a lot of my show was based on projection.
So the funny thing, well, not funny. I do a lot of projecting, too.
Yeah. No, but, like, it has to get, the light has to be a certain way in order for projection to work.
And that game was running early.

So I was about to get totally screwed.

And something happened.

The universe covered me.

And there were some, you know, calls or fouls or whatever that were called that delayed

the game.

And finally, it got dark enough that the projection would actually be read.

Otherwise, I was going to have a pretty crappy show.

Yeah. Wow.
That's so much pressure. And so you're building up, you're rehearsing, then stuff like that happens.
And it sort of occurs to me, I mean, not only do you have to go and do it, but you are, and especially because you're a solo artist. I know there are a lot of people who you work with and a lot of dancers and people, of course, but it's you, it's your name.
And you're the CEO of Katy Perry, Inc. And you're also the star.
Katy Perry, Inc. Yeah, you know what I mean? But you're all, it's, everybody's leaning on you.
There must be, that's a lot of, must be a lot of pressure. When the call comes in, they're like, hey, Katy, they want you to do a Super Bowl.
Are you like, yes, automatically? Are you like, uh, oh, this is risky? You have to make all these big decisions is my point. Like, it's a lot, I bet.
Big risk, big reward. That's right.
Yeah. That's right.
I like to roll it. I mean, it's admirable as hell.
But I like to roll it with preparation. So when I decide to do something, I'm a super prepper.
It it's not by accident so there's no nerves ever for anything like opening this show in vegas i had been developing it for over a year i had been on stage rehearsing it for months on end i had everything dialed in there were no surprises the only thing we were navigating in that time was covid and we were bobbing and weaving left and right because it was such a crazy time. Yeah.
But the preparation makes the precision. Yeah.
Yeah, for sure. I like that.
Yeah, and it shows in everything you do. Every single thing you do is like perfection.
Thanks, Sean. I really appreciate you.
Yeah, you're drilling it. You're absolutely killing it.

It's amazing.

Katie, we love you.

Thank you for being here.

Thank you for having me.

Thanks for doing this

and taking some time out

from being mommy

and please say hi to daddy.

I will.

I will.

And please say hi

to other mommy, Amanda.

I will.

I definitely will.

Love her.

Thanks, guys.

Thanks, Katie.

Can I give a shout out to my cousin, Jen,

who listens to your podcast, and she's the reason

why I ultimately said yes.

Jen. Thanks to Jen.

Thanks, Jen.

She's a huge fan.

Where's Jen?

Jen is in LA, and she just conquered

breast cancer.

She's a huge, huge fan

of you guys.

She was telling me about Smartless, then someone said, oh, you should do Smartless. I was like, oh, well, my cousin really likes it and she's cool, so I'm going to do it.
But I also like you guys. Very nice.
That's awesome. Please send our love to Jen.
We're saying it right now. Jen, we're sending you our love.
Jen, we love you. We, we do love you.
We're happy for you. Congrats.
It's awesome. We love you too, Katie.
Woo! Love you guys. Thanks so much.
Thanks for doing it. All right.
Bye. Bye.
Oh, I forgot to tell her to text me. She's never going to text me.
You know, just text her. What do you text her? Text her.
I'm kidding. I don't have her info.
And wait for the bubbles. Could you imagine? If I had her digits, is that what you guys say? If I had her digits, I would be texting her all day and night.
Just like a bunch of, like, kitties on skateboards and stuff. I'd just make her just throw her phone out the window.
Just kooky stuff all day and night. I didn't know that she and Amanda were friends.
She has talked with Amanda quite a few times. I dinners and stuff with Orlando and you know Amanda Amanda Amanda leaves the house at night I do not you know I'm a house cat but how great is she isn't that a nice surprise I've never had a lengthy conversation with her I just said hello once and then she came on the show no I don't know her at all oh I just met her once just met her once so fast.
It was so brief. We did like a bit with like, you know.
This should have been in the interview. God, we're bad interviewers.
We're the worst. Oh, my God.
Well, we're not smart. You know, if we were smart, we'd ask good questions.
I know. We'd do research.
I know. But it just occurred to me when she was talking about it.
This goes for all solo artists, but just, you know, how much pressure there is on her. Like, you know, it's insane.
It's incredible. She's on this huge enterprise.
I know. Well, you know, there's a lot of pressure on you too, Arnett.
Who's the CEO of Will Arnett? I know, but you know what I mean? Like, yeah, but I'm not Katy Perry, man. She's on a, you know, she's killing it.
Yeah. It's kind of amazing.
Let's sing Roar one more time. You're gonna hear me roar.
You're gonna hear me roar. Just tickle me.
What about, what about her other song? I do like that song. So catchy.
I like, how does the fire... She's got nine number one in the US.
How does the firecracker one go? It goes... Firecracker.
Firecracker. Wait, wait.
And I can't think of it. Of course, I know it's...
You light it and I will spark it. Is that...
Am I close?

You start this fuse

and I will bang, bang, bang it.

That's it.

Listen to the style of music.

You've got too much Paul Anka in your life.

If I close my eyes, Katy Perry never left.

Every song that Jason sings sounds like a Paul Anka hit.

You are the one.

Wait, how does firework go?

Oh, yeah, wait, I have it here.

And look, and it says, firework written by.

Bye.

Katy Perry.

Beautiful.

All-time best right there.

That was the best one.

Smart.

Nice. Smart Less.

Smart Less.

Smart Less is 100% organic and artisanally handcrafted by

Michael Grant Terry, Rob Armjarf, and Bennett Barbaco.

Smart Less. Hey friends, Jason here.
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