"Joy Reid"

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Hilton for the stay. guys i just wanted to say.
I'm so excited that you guys came here today on Armchair Expert. Yeah, we're happy to be here.
I love the way Bateman, I love it. You're so easygoing and you just don't seem like anything really bothers you.
And Sean, you're such a funny guy and you always bring humor to every situation.

But I reserve most of my disdain is for Barney, for Arnett.

Oh, Barney Arnett.

Yeah, he's a bit of a deadweight.

Hey, Dax, hang on.

Yeah, Will, what do you think about all that?

I just, well, I'm finding it a little... Offensive?

I'm a little put off by it.

I don't mean that you're deadweight.

I just mean that, like, you know,

just seems like those other two do a lot more heavy lifting. Well, that's true.
But we love to have him. He's kind of like our mascot.
If I close my eyes, it's like Dax and Will are here. It's simultaneously the best Dax Shepard impression and the worst.
And I hope he's not insulted because I do it all out of love. I love the guy.
I love, love, love the guy. So listen, listener, the bad news is you're not listening to Armchair Expert.

The worst news is you are listening to Smartless.

Can I just say this?

Can I just do it because I'm here?

Do you mind?

Please.

Welcome to Smartless.

Thank you.

Smart.

Less.

Smart.

Less.

Smart. Less.
Smart.

Less.

Hey, guys.

How about global warming?

Is that a thing?

Great way to start a show, Sean.

What do you want?

Everybody be happy?

Just trying to remind everybody how happy and great everything is.

Are you complaining because the air conditioning doesn't work in your mansion?

Yeah, it is hot.

Yeah, what are you worried about? It's hot. It's hot.
That's your explanation. You know, it's summer.
Yeah. But there is...
Global warming is real. Is that what you want to tell our listeners? Oh, fuck off.
It is real. If there was a doubt, yeah.
No, it is real. We believe it.
And also, get vaccinated. I mean, we might as well if we're doing this, I mean, go down the list.
No, I'm just saying if we're going down the list, I mean, these are things that I believe that are true and we're not a political show. The world is not flat either, but I have not independently verified that.
That's another thing I'm hearing. I mean, I got up in an airplane the other day and it's still, it's still looked pretty flat, but I am hearing from people I respect though that if you got up even higher it is round speaking about flat you know did you guys watch the jeff bezos thing that went off you know no wait listen i'm serious the the the rocket thing right i did not know this that when the rocket because we when we watched the the thing go off it looks like it's going straight up, but scientifically speaking, it's actually going parallel to the earth.

Well, after a bit.

After a bit, it starts to tilt a little bit.

No, no, no, no, no.

No, it goes right away.

No, no, Sean's right.

It goes right away.

And the thing, the idea is,

if you think about it,

the way they wait...

Here come the fucking rocket scientists.

Let's hear it.

Jesus.

Rockets go sideways. Sure.
Right, because it has to do with gravity. I thought it went straight up.
No. So we've covered space.
We've covered what else in this? Global warming. These are all issues.
You know, I do learn a lot from you guys. You know, I need to sort of absorb knowledge in some other way than academia.
Because as you both know, that part of my life was cut a little short. Yeah.
How short, by the way? Well, I got I got to I got to the end of high school, except for two of my final four finals. So no college.
Two tests short. No.
And a high school diploma short. You know, I was thinking, Jason, about you because we've talked about you and your fascination with school and with college.
We've talked about it over a couple episodes, right? Yeah, that I want to know if it's hard. Yeah, you were worried it's hard.
And I'm surprised. I'm surprised that you would be scared because I would think it's just more information.
And we know that you have a propensity. You have an ability to...
Just sound it out. To retain.
Yeah. So you know how to retain.
I mean, look at your face right now. Oh, see, Sean, you just need to wait a little while and then you'll be hurt.
You know, you just got to be patient. Oh, I've been patient for 20 years.
And it'll land. It'll hit you right in the gut.
Your attention is off the charts today. Well, let me tell you something.
With the heat wave that we're dealing with here in Los Angeles, it is great for my water weight problems. Is it as hot where you are, Will, there in Long Island? It is.
It's hot. It's hot here right now, and it's very moist.
Yeah, it's moist out here too. Is it moist there? Yeah, it's humid.
I would much rather freeze than sweat. How about you, fellas? Yeah, 1,000%.
Wait, so hang on. What are we doing? We're talking a bunch of bullshit.
Let's get into something that's worth listening to. Okay.
Today, we have a person joining us that is a critical voice on where we are politically, where we have been, where we are going. She has been a journalist for 25 years.
She's worked on Obama's campaign. She's graduated from Harvard, for God's sake.
She has her own cable news show. She's got incredible style, three kids, and most importantly, a husband named Jason.
Folks, this is the treasure named Joy Reid. Joy? No.
Welcome. Joy on, Joy Reid.
There she is. Well, hello there.
I'm just going to dork out here for a second. I'm going to just fan out on you.
I spend more time with you than I do my family. Every single day, truly.
This is so cool. You're here.
It's so nice to meet you. I know.
It's so cool to be with you guys. Very excited.
One of the interesting things I did in my terrible research that I do for my guests, it's just simply Wikipedia, is that you studied film. Did you have a film degree? I did, yeah.
I graduated with a Bachelor of Arts in Film. Basically, documentary film is what I wound up studying.
From where? At Harvard. They call it Visual and Environmental Studies so that no one will know what it is.
Just to make it sound as boring as possible. Yes.
Well, it was to discourage us from going Hollywood. Is that where you met Jason? Because he's a documentary.
Yeah, no, actually, I met him afterwards. So basically, they try to hide Hollywood under a bushel.
They don't want any of us to aspire to that. So their film degree is called Visual Environmental Studies.
They put the photography majors, the film majors all in there. And then you study a lot of theory and in some filmmaking, you do your final thesis film.
I actually met Jason because when I graduated, I had these sort of dreams of being the girl Spike Lee. And I took a job at School of Visual Arts in the production office as the manager of the production office.
And Jason, who had taken a year off, so he was one year behind me, he was basically my employee inside the production office. That's how I met him.
At SVA in New York? Yeah. Yeah.
Wow. That's so cool.
I love, in your background, there's a little bag that says book nerd on it. Explain to these guys what a book is.
Yeah, that's a bag you'd never see in my house. Tell me, like, growing up.
It'd be empty. The bag would be empty.
What do you mean? What was your, did you feel like a nerd growing up, and were you treated as one? Oh, totally. Totally.
Yeah, no, I was very nerdy. As a kid, I loved, you know, I did the crossword puzzle on Sunday in the newspaper.
I mean, the only things I was really interested in. You could do Sundays? I was really good at it.
I sometimes would have like one thing missing. I still can't get past Monday.
Really? Yeah. Are you serious? I try Tuesdays every once in a while, but I never feel good about myself.
Are you serious? Yeah. It's tough for me.
Listen, I'm going to end this. They're hard.
They're hard. Thank you, Joy.
And the references are like weird cultural stuff. Yeah, it's weird.
I can do it. No, I'll bet you can't, Will.
Now, the reading. How much reading do you get a chance to do nowadays with your busy schedule? Well, I don't get to read.
I mean, you can see I have a whole wall of books behind me. I mean, I don't get a chance to read as much as I would like to unless I have a book, you know, an author on.
I do try to read their books if I'm going to have them on. But because I have to read all day, just the news of day stuff.
I used to do a weekend show. It was so much more leisurely to be able to, like, read a whole book.
Now I can barely cram in all the reading for every day. So I don't have as much time.
And are you fully, are you and your gang over there, are you guys fully reliant on New York Times, Washington Post? Or do you have special access to information to build your news from? Or do you just expose the same stuff that we are? No, we luckily have MSNBC, you know, is part of NBCUniversal. So we, thank God, have NBC News.
We have a whole political unit. So there's enough, you know, independent reporting and political reporters.
We have a whole team that's at Capitol Hill. I actually, now that I'm a D.C.-based show, we're literally like steps away from Capitol Hill.
So we have that. Plus, I have my own sources.
I spend a lot of time texting people who are in politics, who are in campaigns. So we try to do as much as we can on our own.
And our show producers are very aggressive about calling people. And so we don't just rely on life at the time.
Yeah, Jason, they're not getting their news from other news sources. They're the ones who are in.
How do you think this works? It's got to come from somewhere. I don't have smarts.
That's why we invite you. And then you guys just write down stuff you see on CNN.
Do you just copy and paste? What the fuck do you think is going on here? You just report it as your own. So, Joy, you mentioned sources.
So, I'm going to tread lightly here because I know that you're limited in what you can say. But I am fascinated how much does it differ from what we see in movies, you know, with, you know, Deep Throat, you meetick in the, in the garage.
When reporters have sources, and especially now that there's a risk about people hacking your phone and finding out numbers and not a risk, it's a fact. Um, yeah.
Is, is, do you ever meet a source like, um, in person or is it all like an encrypted digital or a combination? How many rainco raincoats do you have? I have all the raincoats. Well, I also have to make it fashion.
So I need a lot of raincoats. They have to have them for like every color.
Yeah, no, we're going to get into your style. Yeah, no.
So we spend a lot of time with sources like either on Signal or WhatsApp. You know, you have to be careful.
You can't just text people as much as you used to, because as you said, I mean, also the government can, you know, can subpoena them. But especially in the last year, because of COVID, everything is digital.
Everything is text. Everything is signal.
It's very little in person. And what is the competition like to secure one of these sources? I would imagine, let's say when Biden was coming in or it looked like he was going to get it and you start to hear about who the cabinet's going to be and how the rest of the government's going to be staffed up.
Is there like a race to like, oh, that's going to be a great source potentially because they're going to have good access. And you might bump into somebody trying to get that same source, maybe somebody from CNN or how does all that work? Is it a is it is there a drama there? The only way that it works that way is, for instance, in the case of like a trial, like let's say the Derek Chauvin trial.
Everyone wants to know who are all these jurors? How do we get to them? Or if there's, you know, a Black Lives Matter case, we all want to connect with the family. We all want to talk to them.
In that sense, the non-political sources. For me personally, I don't like access journalism.
I don't think it's a good way to do journalism, to just try to find out who that person is in that office. Because what they're going to tell you is what the office wants you to know.
That's not really giving you anything that the public needs. The whole idea behind what Woodward and Bernstein did, they didn't get access.
They got somebody who was telling information that the government didn't want us to know. So I really am against the idea of trying to scurry in and find out who are going to be the key people to talk to in the administration.
There are people who do that. That's a part of the job for some parts of journalism.
But I'm not at the NBC News. I'm more of an opinion journalist.
So basically I've developed these sources who are basically friends that I've made over years and years from working in campaigns. These are people I've known forever.

And sometimes they're in an administration and then sometimes they come out.

These are people that are just people I know.

And so they can get me information

that the government maybe doesn't want you to have.

You know what I'm saying?

So I just rely on my personal relationships.

I also have a lot of Republican friends and relationships

because there are people who I've known

and combated with like Michael Steele,

you know, that's been a friend of mine for a long time. Since we used to battle.
We ultimately, because we respected each other, became friends. So I have Republican sources and Democratic.
I know it's wild how far he's traveled. So it's really, to me, it's more relationships.
I'm saying sources, but I really just mean I have relationships. Yeah.
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While Hilton is always expected to have top-notch service,

you'd be surprised at the unexpected places they're offering it now.

They've partnered with AutoCamp,

which offers insanely cool airstreams in iconic outdoor destinations.

Hilton also has an exclusive partnership with small luxury hotels of the world,

providing Hilton Honors members access to luxury small luxury hotels of the world, providing Hilton Honors

members access to luxury boutique

hotels across the globe.

And they've added romantic and refined

nomad hotels and

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favorite college towns to their

portfolio. Explore all

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Hilton Honors points you've been saving

at Hilton.com. Hilton for the stay.
And now, back to the show. Okay, Joey, I want to ask you something.
And keep in mind, I am the least smart of the smart list group here. Agreed.
So I'm asking for many of the people who don't. Sorry, I've got to let him get the statement out first.
You've got to debate him on it. No, I'm sorry.
But you're also the funnest. We'll build a gap in there.
Joey, how dare you? He is the funnest. But I see this phrase thrown around recently, and I truly am asking you because I don't know the ins and outs of it.
What is EDM? No, I know kind of like a broad stroke of what it is, but what is critical race theory? Oh, my God. I had that question.
Thank you. Please.
Yeah. No.
Well, so again, and I say this not as an expert in critical race theory, which I always lead with because the only people who are real experts in critical race theory are lawyers because it's something you learn in law school. So critical race theory was a body of legal theory that grew in the late 1980s at Harvard University when

Derrick Bell was a professor there.

And as a Harvard Law School professor, he and people like Kimberly Crenshaw, who was

his student, went on to ask themselves, when you look at American history, what was built

into the legal system and the laws that made us unequal and brought us to the point where

even the Civil Rights and Voting Rights Acts have not produced material equality?

When you look at all the stats, you see all the ways in which we are still racially unequal in this country, white versus non-white people. They were asking themselves, well, what is it that we can look at in history that brought us to this in the laws? So what critical race theory is, is a way of looking at the legal system and asking what components of it are institutionally structured to keep inequality going.
That's all it is. It has nothing to do with saying white people are, you know, as a matter of fact, it's funny, the argument that it says white people are inherently racist can't be true because critical race theorists believe, and because it's true, that race isn't real.
Because it isn't. Race is a social construct.
It isn't a biological fact. There's nothing different.
If we peeled our skin off, we're all the same. Race is cultural.
It's sort of tribal. But it's like saying a brown dog and a white dog are not both the same species, right? There's no...
Race isn't real. You know, you can take a brown dog and a tan dog and they are perfectly can make a medium color dog, right?

Like people are just like any other mammal.

We're just one species.

But people in this country invented race

and literally critical race, it's in the thing.

If you read the Harvard description of it,

says race isn't real, it's a social construct.

So you can't say anyone is inherently racist. So how do we uninvent it? That's a great point.
I don't believe in even mentioning it. So my thing is, I debated this foolish dude who's so dumb, he bragged about his strategy.
He said, I don't give a shit about critical race theory. I'm just going to use it and attach every crazy story about awkward ways teachers try to teach anti-racism and call it critical race theory.
I refuse to debate these people on something they made up. Don't debate it.
If you ain't a critical race theory expert, don't debate them on that. You should just talk about the things they want to do, which is book banning, idea banning, teacher mandates.
And so I would just not debate them on critical race theory. I don't.
I refuse to. Yeah.
It makes me think of something that, again, I'd love your take on it. So at what point is it too young to even introduce to a new mind the notion that at one point, the white folks saw the black folks as less than? Because as soon as you introduce that idea to this pure mind, maybe some white kids that are in a bad environment Right.
We'll try that thought on and incorporate it and go, oh, you know what? Yeah. So like, in other words, if they never had that notion, would an instinct of racism ever take hold? Does any of that make sense? It does make sense.
And I think it's a valid question. I think here's the challenge.
They, back in the 19, I want to say 50s or 60s, they did a thing called the doll test in which they took little kids, like second and third graders, and they gave them an array of dolls, black kids. And they said, would you rather play with this little doll who is white or this little doll who is black? And like 90% of them said they wanted to play with the white doll.
And this was consistent over years and years and years of doing it, meaning that even by third grade black children have internalized the idea that black is ugly that black is inferior they've already internalized it so we're talking second graders similarly to that my kids we you know i raised them in florida i was i'm we lived in new york but we moved to florida when um our two older ones were toddler where i was when i was pregnant with my second one um and all three of our kids were pretty much raised in flor. By the time they were in the fourth grade, they had been called the N-word by other kids.
So those kids were, and in the case of the kids who called my kids the N-word, they were not even white. They were brown kids.
They were Colombian. And I had to go and surprise their parents with my Spanish and tell the mother off, right? Which she was very shocked by.
But the bottom line is little kids are already practicing racism on other little kids and on themselves and internalizing self-hate. So I was going to say it starts at home.
Well, the thing is, is that even if you say, well, I won't teach it at school. Believe me when I tell you black kids are already internalizing inferiority and white kids are internalizing superiority by the time they get to the third grade.
So it isn't to say that there's some young age where you can't teach it. They're already getting it.
They're getting it from TV commercials. They're getting it from the way that black people are depicted on the news when they walk by the news and they see all the criminals are black.
But they're not getting the N-word from TV commercials. They're getting that from home.
They're getting that from people. They're getting it from other kids too.
Trust me, they're getting it from other kids too. So then this would be in support of the case of teaching it as early as possible to offset all the crap at home.
Yes. And the thing is, is the better you can do to teach anti-racism to kids and to teach the truth at an age level.
Remember, I mean, I took my kids to church when they were kids and the church we went to had like a kiddie version of the message and a grownup version of the message because they know a kid has a different brain. The Ruby Bridges book that they're trying to ban in Tennessee is written as a children's book.
It's a children's book. It's not written as a, let me lecture y'all about racism from an adult point of view.
It's written from a point of view of a child. So the thing is, is you can have children's books that teach things about different families.
They're books they used to want to ban about teaching different families. What if you're a little kid and you have two moms and no one else in your class can experience that? Are you saying we shouldn't have a children's book in the second, third grade that teaches that your family is normal? You know what I mean? And we had that fight in Florida, a major fight.
They're like, these kids are too young to internalize that. But some of the kids are living that, right? They have two dads or two moms and you're saying it's too young to introduce this concept.
You're not like saying let show like a porn. You're saying, let's like actually talk about their family.
So I don't think any kid is too young to start getting the message that look. Nobody's perfect.
And they're more visual. Your mom and dad aren't perfect.
No one's perfect. Right.
And so if you can teach in a way that's very picture driven, very image driven to say, you know, the ways that we have black people and white people and brown people in this country is the way that we brought them here differently. And you might've come here as an immigrant in your family, other kids who are brown and black may have come here enslaved.
And that was a bad, bad thing. And that was not a good thing.
But here's the thing we changed. And you can talk about the redemption of the country, but you can talk about it in a way that also tells the truth.
I hate that people don't want the truth. Yeah.
You know what's so funny? Well, not funny, but what's so strange for me is growing up in Canada, we, we, it was a different experience. The, the notion of racism obviously isn't solely American.
It does exist in other places as well, but it's, it's, it's something that's really perfected. It's one of the few things we started and didn't steal.
No, it's been perfected

in this country.

It's one of the...

Yeah.

But I will say,

and as a Canadian,

you come here

and I was 20

when I moved to this country

and I was kind of shocked

by it all.

I couldn't...

Yeah.

And I grew up

with American TV and stuff,

but it wasn't until

I actually lived here

that I was like,

holy crap,

this is...

More blatant here.

It's way more blatant.

My husband is British

and he...

Well, he always says,

you know,

my mother used to say it too

because she lived in England

for a long time

and she said,

look,

there's lots of racism

in Holy crap. This is...
It's more blatant here. It's way more blatant.
My husband is British, and he... Well, he always says...
You know, my mother used to say it, too, because she lived in England for a long time. And she said, look, there's lots of racism in England.
It's just more subtle because it's such a class-based system that you more get hit on class than on race on a daily basis. You don't feel it battering you.
And she came here in 1960, and it didn't batter her until she got here and wanted to come here because they all, you know, people outside, my parents are both immigrants.

And they really believe the ideas that they read about, about America. And they come here thinking, I'm going to get a great education.

My kids will have an opportunity.

I mean, hell, my mother's first generation of her kids, one is an actress, one of them is a broadcaster, and one of them is a TV, you know, has a primetime TV show.

Like, it does happen.

But she experienced racism big time in New York. In New York.
And was shocked by it. Yeah, in New York.
Where did your parents immigrate from? My mother came from Guyana, and my father was from the Congo, the Democratic Republic of Congo. Oh, wow.
Cool. Wow.
Yeah. And he was a major Republican.
They used to fight. They were, you know, the marriage clearly didn't last.
He was a conservative Republican-leaning guy, and she was like a liberal pro-Carter, you know, Democrat. And so they were just very opposite.
So, Joy, speaking of showbiz, congratulations on your one year. Is it coming up on one year anniversary of your show? One year.
We're coming up on the 20th of July. Oh, that's great.
Congrats. It's incredible.
We just had ours. We can celebrate every year at the same time.
Congratulations. One year.
Yeah. So obviously when you guys launched, there was different, let's say, programming opportunities for you guys.

This whole sort of dumpster fire.

Are you guys – and I don't mean to ask this in a cynical way, but are you guys finding your conversations about programming the episodes and I'm sure across all news networks and shows, that the attempt to still try to hold the audience's interest, does that go into your thoughts about what leads and what doesn't? Yeah. You know, when we took the show, I was in the midst of, look, I, again, I'm an opinion journalist.
I'm not on nightly news, so I'm allowed to have an opinion. And my dedication, my only mission was to see to it that I did everything in my power to prevent him from getting reelected

because I genuinely believe had he been reelected,

he would never leave.

And he is an autocrat.

Michael Cohen has said that very clearly.

Everyone I know who knows him has said it very clearly.

He is an autocrat.

He wants to be president for life.

He's dangerous.

And so my whole dedication was that.

Huh, absolutely.

Well, let me just, let me change the subject slightly here. Now, Joy, I don't spend a lot of time on style websites, as it might become a surprise to most people.
But I hope that you're getting the kind of feedback and rewards and accolades that you deserve for, I mean, what's going on with your outfits is incredible. But what's going on, the hairstyle, every episode you're changing, it's just like, where does all this come from? Tell me about your team and where do you get your ideas? And I mean, you know.
Yes, give credit to the team. Let's see the team.
Yes, let's give credit to the team. So let me give credit to the team.
So first of all, for an entire year, I had to do my own hair and makeup. And I am a legit tomboy.
The only other thing I was doing when I was a kid, when I wasn't doing crossword puzzles and watching the news, was sports. I was a very tomboyish kid.
So I never really learned how to do hair and makeup. We're going to get into that.
It was just not a thing I really was ever good at. So over the last year, when we couldn't have hair and makeup anymore, I have a fabulous glam squad in New York.
I couldn't use them. I couldn't use it.
We were all locked down in where we live now in the DMV area. So I got a guy named Fred.
He's Fred for Face on Instagram. And he gave me a tutorial.
So I was doing my own makeup. But when they allowed us to bring hair and makeup back, and also whenever I was in New York and I would use my hair and makeup folks on the side, they're just brilliant people.
So I'm just going to shout out all of them who are Giselle, who braids my hair. I always get my hair braided in the summer.
Giselle the supermodel, incredible. I can't believe it.
Giselle Modeste, who is an incredible braider. She did the braids.
And then I have Cece in New York, Michelle in New York, and then here in D.C., who does my hair, are Janice. Carmen is the hairstylist.
um the third person is jennifer so those are my that is my glam squad what's the pre-call on that i mean you gotta you gotta be on camera you gotta since worried about call times this is yeah i just like this is incredible i think 45 this is the most real that you're getting this we're now at the heart of bateman we're now at the heart of it this is important oh is the pre-call? When are you in the chair? So basically what I have to do is I ride, I get in my car. I'm here in Deez.
I get in my car at 5.15. I have my laptop and I'm working on scripts, working on stuff so I can be in the makeup chair by 6 o'clock so that I can be done by 6.45.
So that's what I do. Wow.
I get 45 minutes. And by the way, Carmen, who does my hair, we never know what she's going to do.
Neither does she. And the makeup and hair team, they just decide in the moment what they feel like based on what I have on.
That's so cool. So they're artists.
They're true artists. So the outfit drives the hairstyle.
The outfit drives it. Is that right? The outfit drives the hairstyle.
Yeah. And their vibe.
They just catch a vibe. I love it.
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All right, back to the show. Well, let me ask you this.
So you're in the car at 5.15. So do you, so what time are you up? Do you have a regime in the morning? Do you work out or are you just straight into the car? We're talking 5.15 in the afternoon.
Oh, it's 5.15 in the afternoon. Yeah, 5.15 in the afternoon.
Because now, you know, we work from home now. Well, because it used to be, you know, you come into the office.
We don't do that anymore. We're still basically from home.
I just go into the studio right before the show. But basically, I have deep insomnia, very bad insomnia.
So if I get, you know, four or five hours of sleep, I pop up at like six, seven o'clock, walk my dog, make sure that she, that we have a puppy. So she has to pee immediately in the morning so she doesn't pee in the house.
And then I pretty much start reading in, figuring out what's going on. I have three show meetings a day, all by phone, oh, three and a half, because I have one meeting with my executive producer and senior producer.
And then we just sort of sort of chop through what we're going to do on the show. I try to read in, they get scripts ready.
I sometimes write like a rant of my own that they have to edit and work on. What in the world do you do when you, when you aren't doing this? I mean, honestly, I, I kind of collapse.
Like I work out twice a week. I have a, I have a trainer now cause I'm trying to, you know, get in shape cause it's summer.
And so I work out with her twice a week. Are we cross training? Are we, are aerobic? Are we pushing weights? I can't do cross-training.
Yeah, I can't do cross-training. It's basically an intensive 30-minute workout twice a week, which is both weights, weights, body weight, and aerobic stuff.
So it's like very intense 30 minutes that kills me. Will is willing to teach you boxing.
Yeah, I'm on the boxing. I love boxing, by the way.
I'm obsessed with boxing. I was a huge Muhammad Ali fan growing up, so I would totally get it.
I have. Well, mine's less Muhammad Ali and more like, you know, Boom Boom Mancini? Beverly Hills house husband.
Oh, got it. No, I'm just like, don't worry, guys.
I got this. Bang.
And then I get knocked out immediately. You know what I mean? When you were younger, what was your sport? What are you watching? So when I started out being a huge baseball fanatic, I used to have a baseball card collection.
I was that serious. But I became like an ultimate football.
Yeah, football and basketball. So I was a Denver Broncos fanatic.
Like I would literally cry if they lost. I was literally a fanatical football fan and I, I was a Nick fan, even though I was supposed to be a Nuggets fan.
So I was born in New York. So I was a New York Knicks for life.
You know, they broke my heart every year. Um, and the Denver Broncos, um, but also baseball.
I was a Yankee fan. Sorry.
Wow. So then Bill Bradley, did you ever, uh, get near, um, I'm saying his name, right? Right.
The, congressman that used to be a Nick? Oh, I never met him. Wow.
Sorry. So then Bill Bradley, did you ever get near, I'm saying his name right, right? The congressman that used to be a Nick? Oh, I never met him.
No. Yeah, I never got a chance to meet him.
But I did, we used to go to training camp. So my mom was a professor at University of Northern Colorado.
And Greeley is where they would do training camp for the Broncos. So I did get to meet a bunch of the Broncos because we would go out to training camp, which was pretty cool.
Got it. Got it.
You still follow baseball. You're still, you're a Yankee fan? No, I've fallen.
Here's what happened. Then I had kids and I fell off of sports.
Like I don't have time because I'm so busy between family and work and I have two podcasts and I'm writing a third book and I am exhausted. And so I don't even have time.
I watched a little of the NBA finals. Yeah, I'm too tired.
Jason, you're the same, right? You got kids, so you just gave up sports and stuff, right? Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I spend all my free time. If I'm not talking to you guys, I'm talking to my kids.
Just about how's your day. And you don't follow any of the sports anymore, right? No.
You gave it all up just like Dora did? Yeah, no. I just need to be with my kids.
But you got to love LeBron James. I follow LeBron.
I love him. He's like the Muhammad Ali of today.
He was just on the show. We just had him on the show.
And he's just an angel. Oh, my God.
I love that guy. He's the coolest.
I mean, he's the guy. He's like doing it the way you should do it.
He's showing everybody because he's playing at the top of his game. And then in his free time and what he does and how, not just that he's giving back, but how he does it and how he's making a difference is setting a whole new standard.
Incredible guy. Incredible guy.
And I think he respects me a lot, too. That's not what he said.
No, it seemed like he respected me a ton. It seemed like he was...
Now, what are your shows... When you do spend...
Because you don't have a lot of downtime. It's crazy, all the stuff that you're doing.
What do you do? Do you have shows? What are the things that you like to watch?

What are the movies that you like to watch?

So I literally like

I'm a TV kid because I'm a Generation

Xer, so I grew up watching, you know, Coming Home, watching

Star Trek, and if I wasn't watching sports,

I love TV. So I watch a lot of Netflix.

Right now I'm watching a series called Frequency,

which is really, really good.

But I love anything with zombies,

superheroes,

action adventure. Are you a Walking Dead gal? Walking Dead, yes.
Really? I didn't like Fear the Walking Dead at first, but now I'm into it. So yeah, Walking Dead, totally into it.
But I hate Negan though. He's handsome, but I hate him.
You go see a baseball game with Jason and then when we get home, you and I watch all of those things. Yes.
Because everything you just said is everything I love. You do love Star Trek, Sean.
I love it, right? I love all of it. Sean loves space stuff and he loves sci-fi.
Sean, we're going to survive the zombie apocalypse because, see, people put us down for watching zombies, but when the zombie apocalypse comes, we're going to know what to do. What about World War Z? Did you see World War Z? Yeah, that was a good movie.
Oh, my God. Yes, of course.
One of the best movies ever. Well, I saw that, too.
28 Days Later. 28 Days Later is great, too, yeah.
I love Brad Pitt. Yeah, you've seen them all? Well, what's your favorite Brad Pitt movie, Will? Well, Once Upon a Time in Hollywood, but it's the current one because he looks great, but he's so cool, and he's a good dude, and everybody relax.
Brad's fine. Wait, you know the best Brad Pitt movie is Snatch.
Isn't that the name Snatch? It's a British. Yeah, that was great.
Yeah, that's the best Brad Pitt. That's a good one.
I mean, it's a long list, Joy. Let's be real.
How about True Romance? Yeah. Meet Joe Black.
People would put it down, but I love Meet Joe Black. Don't sleep on Meet Joe Black, for sure.
He lives with Anthony Haynes. I like California.
Did you ever see California with Juliette Lewis? California was a good one, too, with Juliette Lewis. Yeah.
Yeah, so good. I love movies.
I love movies and TV. So yeah, any kind of entertainment.
The only thing I don't really like are like romances, which is probably really ungirly. A little rom-com.
A little bit boring. Yeah.
You don't like the romance stuff? It's a little YA, right? It's a bit boring. Yeah.
A little predictable. Yeah.
You know they're going to be together. You know what's going to happen, right? I'm like, is somebody going to get murdered anytime soon?

Am I going to see like a, you know, is there going to be a fight?

Have you watched the Ozarks thing?

Don't bait her into that.

So I keep on being told to watch it.

Is it worth it?

Is it good?

Yeah, I know.

Don't know.

No, it's not. No, honestly, because you don't have a lot of time.

You don't have a ton of time.

And it's super blue. And Sean had told me one time, Sean, I said, Sean, do you like it have a lot of time.
You don't have a ton of time. And it's super blue.

And Sean had told me one time,

and I said, Sean, do you like it?

And he said, it's okay.

You know what I mean?

Like he said it like that.

It's okay.

Yeah.

That's a great Sean Hayes.

That's a great...

Well, listen, we're going to end on that.

It's a high note.

We're going to end on the high note.

It's more of a medium note, but that's okay.

Joy, I get where you got your name from.

Listen, we have really enjoyed it.

And thank you for sharing part of your Saturday with us.

Yeah, it's so nice to meet you.

You guys are awesome.

I'm a fan, and it's been fun hanging out with y'all, so thank you.

Likewise.

Thank you, Joy.

Thank you for taking the time on your Saturday.

Thank you for doing this.

Appreciate it.

See you on the TV Monday.

Cool.

Bye, Joy.

It's cocktail time.

Bye, bye, bye. See you later.
Cheers. Bye.
Thank you. Bye.
Will, look at that. Listener, Will just put his hands behind his head.
He's flexing. He wants to talk a little bit, I guess, and show us the gun show.
He's completely flexing right now. I'm not flexing, dude.
I'm just being in a natural position, man. Wait.
Did you put a blow dryer to your pits? They're not as wet as they usually are. I always get sweaty pits.
Look at that. It's coming through my hoodie.
I don't sweat except when I do the podcast. But Jason, why are you wearing a hoodie? It's inside.
Why are you wearing a t-shirt? Just because it's part of it. These are my PJs, bro.
But wait, can I say something? First of all, Joy Reid, what a joy. And she is...
Very joyful. Yeah.
I could hang out with her. I could hang out with her and watch some zombie shit for a long time.
Yeah. Do you think you guys would be, I think that you and she would be friends, Sean.
Absolutely. I'm going to call her after this.
You're going to call her. I'm going to call her.
Why not? When I'm down in Florida, next time, I'll look her up. She's not in Florida anymore.
No, she lives in D.C. Washington.
I thought she was in New York and then moved to Florida. You'll have to listen to the interview back.
Oh. She lives in DMV, like D.C., Maryland, Virginia area.
I have to point that out where that is on the map for me. I like something.
She's like, look, I'm an opinion journalist. I like that she sort of owns it the way that instead of sort of, you know, having that hung around her neck as a thing, she's like, yeah, it's my opinion, which I think is really fucking rad.
She just lets it loose. Yeah.
That was a great guest, Jason. She's really cool.
Thank you. I hope I wasn't too starstruck because I just, I mean, I think that she and all her colleagues over there are just doing such an incredible job of things.
Yeah, I mean, I've just been, as you know, the last few years now, I've kind of stopped DVRing a lot of those shows because I end up not feeling great. I think that those people are really good at what they do.
I want to say that. They're all really smart and great.
But for me personally, it was just starting to make me not feel great all the time. Yeah, it's a lot coming at you for the last, you know, three, four, five, six years.
It is. And Jason, we've had this argument before, not even argument, like you've joked to me like, oh, do you prefer to have your head in the sand? And it's not that.
I do sort of keep it up. I keep up with stuff, but I keep it in my peripheral vision.
I keep it very blurry. I mean, I take it pretty seriously and hard too, but you, I remember, you remember the, I think it was the only episode I ever directed of Arrested Development.
It was the day that, was it Bush that got elected? George W. It was the second time, yeah, when he beat.
He got reelected. When he got reelected, when he beat.
Kerry. Kerry.
Right? And you came to work that morning. It was a a big big day we were shooting and i was directing so i was very very stressed out remember do you remember the scene yeah it was me in the banana suit yeah picked up on a crane and dropped in the marina not just that we you and i got into a little tiff because you were mad because i was so in such a bitter mood yeah he shows up all bummed out you didn't even have citizenship yet i know at that point he's showing up all bummed out.
You didn't even have citizenship yet. I know, at that point.

And he's showing up all bummed out

about the American election.

I'm like, guy, we got a full day of work.

I was your understudy.

I was the second banana.

Oh, fuck.

That's high quality.

Fuck, is that good?

This is why Sean gets the big bucks.

That is unbelievable.

Say that one more time.

Sure.

I was your understudy,

so I was known as the second banana.

You guys get that?

Fuck, that's just talk show quick. Right? It is so good.
Yeah, it's really, really good. Thanks, you guys.
Anyway, getting back to Joy, what I think was so amazing about her is her ability to, she seems to give genuine time and consideration to both sides, right? Republican, which would really technically make her bipartisan. Partisan.
Partisan. Partisan.
Partisan. Smart.
Smart. Smart.
Smart. Hey, friends.
Jason here. We're so excited the Smart List has officially joined the SiriusXM family.
We can't wait to announce new surprise guests who we know that you'll love. If you want to be the first to hear new episodes ad-free and a whole week early, subscribe to SiriusXM Podcasts Plus on Apple Podcasts or visit SiriusXM.com slash podcasts plus to start your free trial today.
Hey listener, Sean Hayes here to let you know we're celebrating 250 episodes of SmartList. We're so very, very grateful for all the listeners who tune in every week and to all our friends

who have joined us on the show,

including Bill Burr, Emma Stone,

Larry David, Selena Gomez,

Joaquin Phoenix, and so many more.

We're excited for you all

to hear everything that's still to come.

And if you want to be the first

to hear new episodes

a whole week early and ad-free,

subscribe to SiriusXM Podcasts Plus

on Apple Podcasts

or visit SiriusXM.com slash podcasts plus

to start your free trial today.