MYSTICAL: Nicolas Flamel

Exploring otherworldly occurrences takes research, time, and requires following all the loose ends.

But exploring your new So Supernatural merch store, we're making it easy.

Search the different options we hand-picked just for you: tote bags, t-shirts, and so much more.

Visit the So Supernatural shop at sosupernaturalpodcast.com backslash merch to get our brand new merch today.

I'm gonna put you on, nephew.

All right, um welcome to McDonald's.

Can I take your order?

Miss, I've been hitting up McDonald's for years.

Now it's back.

We need snack wraps.

What's a snack wrap?

It's the return of something great.

Snack wrap is back.

There is nothing permanent except change.

That quote comes from the ancient Greek philosopher Heraclitus, but it is just as true today.

As people, we're always growing and reinventing ourselves, and nowhere is change more evident than the physical world around us.

In fact, change is actually the crux of one of the oldest sciences in the world, alchemy.

Alchemy is this ancient field of study that tries to change ordinary metals like lead into gold.

Medieval scientists spent centuries trying to crack it, and according to some accounts, a 14th century alchemist named Nicolas Flamel actually did.

This is Supernatural.

I'm your host, Ashley Flowers.

This week, I'm discussing a 14th century bookseller and philanthropist named Nicholas Flamel.

After decades of struggling to make ends meet, Nicholas mysteriously came into a lot of money.

Some historians think he actually discovered the Philosopher's Stone, an amazing compound that can turn ordinary metal into gold and grant its inventor eternal life.

We'll have all of that and more coming up.

Stay with us.

Wednesday, season two has the whole world buzzing, and it just released its jaw-dropping finale episodes.

If you haven't started watching yet, now is your chance.

Starring the incredible Jenna Ortega as Wednesday Adams, alongside legends like Catherine Zeda Jones playing Morticia Adams and Fred Armison playing Uncle Fester.

Their chemistry is hilarious.

This season is packed with twists you'll never see coming, and the finale promises shocks, laughs, and an ending that will leave you as breathless as a corpse.

If you love the Addams family, you're in for a ride.

Go watch the final episodes of Wednesday Season 2, now playing only on Netflix.

While you're buying new school supplies and trying to plan a new schedule this season, the last thing you want to factor in is a giant wireless bill.

Ditch overpriced wireless because for a limited time, Mint Mobile is offering three months of unlimited premium wireless service for 15 bucks a month.

Mint Mobile gave me better reception in my house, something my former carrier, who shall remain nameless, never could.

Thanks, Mint Mobile.

I can finally call people without hanging out the window.

Get this new customer offer and your three-month unlimited wireless plan for just 15 bucks a month at mintmobile.com/slash supernatural.

That's mintmobile.com/slash supernatural.

Upfront payment of $45 required equivalent to $15 a month.

Limited time new customer offer for first three months only.

Speeds may slow above 35 gigabytes on unlimited plan.

Taxes and fees extra.

See Mint Mobile for details.

If you're a Harry Potter fan, the name Nicholas Flamel is probably ringing some bells for you.

Nicholas and his wife Paranel are mentioned in J.K.

Rowling's first book, Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone.

They're both over 600 years old because in the novel, Nicholas has discovered a magical artifact that makes him immortal.

In the United States, this object is known as the Sorcerer's Stone, but for simplicity, I'm going to stick to the British term, Philosopher's Stone.

Now, supposedly, this stone is incredibly powerful.

Legends about it have been around for about 2,000 years.

They say it has the power to turn any metal into gold, and it's connected to this beverage called the Elixir of Life, which keeps you alive forever.

It's not super clear if the Philosopher's Stone makes the Elixir or if it actually is the Elixir, or if maybe the recipe for the stone is close enough to the Elixir that if you can make one, you can make the other.

Either way, the central idea is consistent.

If you discover the Philosopher's Stone, you can become immortal.

Ancient accounts described the stone as bright red, and it wasn't really a stone at all.

It was actually more like a powder or a fluid, something you'd add to a bubbling vial to create anything you want.

And I do mean anything.

See, alchemists weren't just trying to get rich and achieve immortality.

They were trying to unlock the fundamental secrets of the universe, like why lead is lead and not gold, or why I'm me and not someone else.

And the idea was that with a philosopher's stone, you could transform anything or anyone into whatever you wanted.

And it's not like there's just one stone, because according to alchemical tradition, you can actually make a philosopher's stone.

So researchers weren't necessarily trying to locate one, they were trying to create it.

Supposedly, the closest anyone ever got was this guy named Nicholas Flamel.

I can't say a whole lot about Nicholas's early life, except that he was born around 1330 near Paris.

And just like in J.K.

Rowling's book, he really was married to a woman named Perrinel.

This was Perrinel's third marriage and she'd been widowed twice before.

And between her inheritances and Nicholas's job, the two of them had a comfortable lifestyle.

But they weren't rich.

To help make ends meet, Nicholas worked in Paris as a bookseller, which actually meant something different than what it does now.

Nicholas did more than run a shop, he actually made the books, meaning if he found an interesting text, he would handwrite copies, then bind them into volumes that he could then sell.

This was a big deal because in the 14th century, a lot of people didn't even know how to read.

So Nicholas had to have received an education at some point, but it's hard to say how or why because, again, he didn't seem particularly wealthy.

But then one night everything changed.

According to legend, Nicholas supposedly had this strange dream.

In it, an angel appeared to him and handed him a book with a distinctive cover.

He could tell just from looking at it that it was very old.

The pages were thick and it was bound together with copper fastenings, which was really unusual.

In the Middle Ages, book covers were usually made of wood and leather, so the fact that someone used a semi-precious metal meant it was really special.

Nicholas wanted to take a closer look, so he reached for the book, but the angel refused.

They told Nicholas, quote, one day you will see in it that which no other man will be able to see, end quote.

And as soon as he heard those words, Nicholas woke up.

Weeks went by, and Nicholas couldn't stop thinking about this dream.

And every day when he stepped into his shop, he skimmed the shelves thinking maybe the book was just going to appear.

Of course, it never did.

Until one day in 1357, when Nicholas was probably in his late 20s, a strange man walked into the shop with a book that looked exactly like the one from his dream.

The man asked for two florins, which is probably about $50 today.

But keep in mind, books were super rare and expensive, so this was actually a good deal.

Nicholas agreed to the price, and as soon as the stranger left, he started flipping through the pages.

They were made of bark, not paper, and the book wasn't very long, just 21 pages split into three equal segments of seven pages each.

The last page of each section was covered in these weird, intricate pictures.

Think like snakes twining around crosses and staffs, a bubbling fountain in the middle of a desert, a group of dragons guarding a tree on a hill.

Nicholas could tell that this all meant something, but he didn't know what.

So he skinned the other pages for an explanation, and he couldn't read any of them.

This book was full of weird symbols and a few sections in other languages, mainly Hebrew.

Nicholas didn't know what they said, but gradually he he started to put together a theory.

I mean, remember, this guy sold and transcribed books for a living, and Nicholas knew that he'd seen these symbols in other texts, specifically alchemical works, which is how Nicholas realized he was holding a guide on how to turn lead into gold.

Coming up, Nicholas devotes his life to alchemy.

Whether you're getting back into a routine after summer or looking for a new challenge before the year ends, Rosetta Stone makes it easy to turn a few minutes a day into real language progress.

For over 30 years, Rosetta Stone has been the trusted leader in language learning.

I have been using Rosetta Stone to try and learn Spanish.

My favorite new sentence is, Mi esposa es de Argentina, which means my wife is from Argentina.

Don't wait.

Unlock your language learning potential now.

So supernatural listeners can grab Rosetta Stone's lifetime membership for 50% off.

That's unlimited access to 25 language courses for life.

Visit rosettastone.com/slash supernatural to get started and claim your 50% off today.

Don't miss out.

Go to rosettastone.com/slash supernatural and start learning today.

Now back to the story.

The moment Nicholas got his hands on this mysterious book, he was hooked.

I'm not sure how much he believed in alchemy before, but now he made it his life's mission to decipher the text and hopefully use it as a guide to create his own philosopher's stone.

The problem was Nicholas didn't speak a word of Hebrew.

It wasn't an option for him to just find a native speaker in France because at the time, anti-Semitism was a huge problem.

Authorities had launched programs to harass and intimidate Jewish citizens.

So by this point, a bunch of people had fled the country and those who stayed were naturally suspicious of their neighbors.

So Nicholas couldn't find anyone in Paris who was fluent in Hebrew, much less willing to talk to him.

He literally spent the next 21 years searching without success.

Eventually, Nicholas figured that he could connect with a Jewish community in another country.

And around 1378 or so, he headed to Spain, where a lot of the French Jewish refugees had resettled.

He figured he might find someone there who felt safe enough to talk to him.

And if he was lucky, he might even track down a Jewish alchemist or occultist who could interpret some of these strange symbols too.

Nicholas spent weeks trying to ingratiate himself with the Jewish community in Spain.

He carried copies of some of the pages from his book with him and he asked everyone he met if they could help him.

But all the people he spoke to turned their backs on him, which isn't that surprising.

When translated, the first page of the book warned that if anyone besides a priest or a scribe read it, they'd be cursed.

It's possible that Nicholas figured the hex wouldn't apply to him because he was technically a scribe, or maybe he didn't realize what it said because again, he didn't read Hebrew.

But the refugees weren't going to risk it.

And eventually, Nicholas got tired of all of the doors slamming in his face.

He turned around and headed back to Paris.

But through an incredible stroke of luck, Nicholas found what he was looking for on the journey home.

He somehow heard about this guy named Metra Conch.

Metra Conch was Catholic, but he grew up Jewish and he was familiar with a Jewish mystical philosophy called Kabbalah.

So not only could he help Nicholas, he'd probably be interested in what the book said too.

Nicholas visited Maitriconch in Léon, France, and the second Metriconche laid eyes on the pages, he knew exactly what he was looking at.

Apparently, this book was legendary in the alchemical community, and supposedly the text had been lost for generations before that point.

Naturally, Matra Conch is excited.

He immediately agreed to help Nicholas and he even offered to travel back to Paris with him.

While they were on the road, Matra Conch taught Nicholas everything he knew about Kabbalah, the Hebrew language and alchemy, which ended up being fortunate because before they even got to Paris, Matra Conch fell sick and died.

It was unfortunate, but the good news was that Matra Conch had taught Nicholas everything he needed to know before he passed away.

So even though Nicholas was sad to lose a mentor, he believed that moving forward, he had the information he needed to defeat death forever.

He just had to put Matra Conch's teachings into practice.

As soon as he got back home, Nicholas finally started translating the book's Hebrew.

Unfortunately, the text still didn't make much sense because everything was communicated in symbols and metaphor.

But the Kabbalah principles that Matra Conch taught him were useful enough that he could slowly piece it together.

When Nicholas was in his early 50s, he wrote an entry in his diary about this amazing discovery that he made on April 25th, 1382.

And if you can make it past the formality, it seems to imply that he invented the philosopher's stone.

It said, quote,

I made a projection of the philosopher's stone upon half a pound of mercury, which I transmuted truly into about the same quantity of pure gold, most certainly better than ordinary gold, being more soft and more pliable.

End quote.

In other words, not only did Nicholas have a philosopher's stone, he was using it to make gold.

So it sounds like he really had unlocked the biggest mystery of alchemy, and now he could create anything he wanted.

Which, okay, I know this sounds pretty unlikely, but there is some circumstantial evidence that really does make it seem like Nicholas had his hands on something incredible.

For one thing, right around this time, Nicholas and Paranel started donating a lot of money to charity, as in enough to build facilities for the unhoused and three new chapels throughout France.

Plus, they gave to a local cathedral in Paris and helped finance 14 different hospitals.

The donations were so lavish, Nicholas even caught the attention of France's King Charles VI.

And if he reached out to Nicholas to ask where all his money had come from, Nicholas must have had a good cover story to avoid investigations for fraud.

But other people were still suspicious.

Before this point, Nicholas and Peranel weren't exactly wealthy, but now Nicholas was giving away so much money, the city of Paris eventually named a road after him.

And one of the shelters that he built is still standing today.

It is the oldest stone house in all of Paris, which tells you that he wasn't cutting costs.

This guy had to be loaded.

Naturally, people were speculating on where the money could have come from.

And it wasn't long before people rumored that Nicholas had created a philosopher's stone.

Meanwhile, Nicholas just keeps on making these big ticket purchases, some of them for himself too.

Like, for example, in 1410 or so, Nicholas designed his own gravestone.

It was covered in lavish artwork depicting three wise men with halos around their heads.

They were posing with a key, a star, and a mysterious container with a cross on top.

These images all have symbolic meaning in alchemy.

It's hard to say what they mean though, because alchemy is all about secret messages.

Either way, it seemed odd for him to be thinking about his tomb tomb at all because as far as anyone could tell, he wasn't sick or anything.

I mean, Nicholas was about 80 years old at this point, which was pretty incredible given how low life expectancy was at the time.

But by all accounts, he was in amazing health, almost supernaturally so.

And this wasn't the only time he acted weird about his future death.

Roughly six years later, in 1416, Nicholas wrote a will.

He decided that most of his wealth would go to charity, plus he'd leave a generous inheritance for a nephew.

Obviously, this doesn't sound like someone who's unlocked the secrets of eternal life.

If anything, Nicholas seemed preoccupied with dying.

And it turns out all of his advanced planning was totally warranted because within a year or two, he passed away.

He was buried next to his wife, Perronell, inside a cathedral right next door to the bookshop where he'd worked all his life.

But just a few months after Nicholas's funeral, these rumors started to circulate.

People claimed he couldn't be dead because supposedly he had the philosopher's stone and presumably he'd used it to create the elixir of life or some other potion that could grant him immortality.

The gossip seemed even more prevalent than when he was alive, to the point that even his neighbors who had known him for years were speculating that Nicholas and Peranel faked their own deaths.

It wasn't long before a local priest caught wind and decided he had to put a stop to the gossip.

I'm not sure why.

He could have disliked alchemy or maybe he worried that if Nicholas wasn't really deceased, the church might lose some of its inheritance.

But whatever the reason, the clergyman had to prove that Nicholas was dead.

So about a year after Nicholas's alleged burial, he apparently hired a couple of grave robbers to dig up his coffin.

It's safe to assume they waited for nightfall to commit the crime.

While the rest of Paris was sleeping, the criminals slipped into the cathedral, and as soon as the grave robbers stepped inside, you can imagine they were tempted by the candlesticks, the alms boxes, and some holy relics from St.

James himself, which legend says were hidden in the church.

But they stayed the course to the far end of the nave where they saw a set of gravestones.

The priest probably told them in advance what Nicholas's tomb looked like, and it would have been hard to miss with all the intricate artwork.

So they started to dig, and they didn't stop digging until they'd unearthed Nicholas's coffin and his wife's.

But when they cracked open the caskets, both of them were empty.

Coming up, we'll explore Nicholas's life after he faked his death.

Your home should show off who you are, telling your story in every detail, meeting you where you are.

Ashley has styles that balance timeless appeal and modern trends to bring your personal look home.

Pairing eye-catching design with features like stain-resistant performance fabric, Ashley offers well-crafted, affordable pieces built to stand up to real life.

Plus, they provide fast, reliable white glove delivery right to your door.

Visit your local Ashley store or head to Ashley.com to find your style.

Now back to the story.

Nobody knows what happened to Nicholas and Perronell after they allegedly faked their deaths.

And that had to be by design.

I mean, you don't pretend to be dead and bury an empty coffin if you want to be found.

For a few decades after their funerals, a handful of eyewitnesses claimed they'd spotted the couple in India, but it's hard to verify those accounts because most of them were anonymous.

There is one secondhand report, however.

It came from an 18th century researcher and an author named Paul Lucas.

In 1714, Paul met a man who claimed he was personal friends with Nicholas.

We don't know this other guy's name, so I'm going to refer to him as Monsieur.

Monsieur told Paul that Nicholas and Perrinel were still alive, even though they would have both been well over 300 years old.

They and Monsieur were three of the seven people in all of history who'd unlocked the secrets of the Philosopher's Stone.

They all kept changing their names and moving around so nobody would notice that they didn't age or die, and they'd all get together every 20 years to catch up.

Now, I know this sounds pretty hard to believe, but Paul thought Monsieur's testimony was really compelling.

In fact, he told other people about the encounter and word spread until a journalist wrote an article proposing that Monsieur was actually Nicholas.

He'd adopted this new identity to hide the fact that he was immortal.

Of course, nobody was able to locate Monsieur to get his sty of the story.

But not long after the meeting between Paul and Monsieur, the strange figure started popping up all over Europe.

He was called the Count of Saint-Germain,

and that's pretty much all we know about him.

No one knows for sure where he came from or really anything about his early life.

However, there's a ton of information about the Count's adult life.

That's because he showed up at basically every important event during this period of European history.

He was a spy for a group of English rebels called the Jacobites.

Allegedly, he helped Catherine the Great overthrow her husband, Tsar Peter III of Russia.

Some even think he founded Freemasonry.

On top of that, the Count was an accomplished chemist who claimed to know the secrets of alchemy, just like Nicholas did.

According to rumors, he even worked closely with a friend to write a pamphlet detailing his alchemical knowledge in the 1780s.

And much later, he allegedly collaborated with two students to write and publish an entire book on his findings.

But the most compelling detail is that a bunch of the people who met the Count noticed that he didn't seem to age.

Supposedly, his appearance didn't change at all from 1745 to 1789.

That's 44 years without a single new gray hair or wrinkle.

And I should note, the last sighting of the Count was in 1789.

That's five years after he reportedly died.

That day, he supposedly had a long conversation with an old friend.

So it's not like someone mistook him for for a lookalike at a distance or something.

Plus, there are records from 1785, just one year after his death, that showed the Count sitting in on a Freemasons meeting.

So as near as anyone can tell, he must have faked his death to assume yet another identity, which sounds a lot like Nicholas's alleged M.O.

In fact, a lot of people who knew what Nicholas and Peranel looked like said that they spotted the couple before the Count's death.

According to rumors, they both attended a show at the Paris Opera sometime in the 1700s.

All of the gossip must have inspired Nicholas to lie low because after the late 1700s, he disappeared for a few hundred years.

But he seemed to pop up again in 1926, this time going by Fulicinelli.

Fulicinelli is a pen name that someone used to publish a book called The Mystery of the Cathedrals.

It's a tough read because it uses a ton of symbolism and metaphor, but allegedly, if you study the text close enough, you can decipher alchemical secrets in it.

Fulacanelli wrote two more books after this one, but only one got published because he destroyed his third manuscript before it could be distributed.

It's hard to say why, though.

In fact, it's hard to say much of anything definitive about Fulicanelli.

Nobody's clear on how old he was or where he came from or what his real name was.

Based on a few conversations with one of his students who helped publish his books, we know he lived in Paris and that he had a wife.

And that's it.

It's not much to go on, but it does fit a pattern that Nicholas set and that the count continued.

They're all Frenchmen who made a splash by sharing their alchemical knowledge, but only with people who were studious enough to decode the secrets.

That's not exactly definitive proof, but if you believe Nicholas is immortal, the clues seem to add up.

Some people even think that Nicholas was actually one of the most famous scientists of all time, Isaac Newton.

It's not super common knowledge, but when he wasn't discovering the three laws of motion or founding entirely new fields of mathematics, Newton was obsessed with alchemy and the philosopher's stone.

He transcribed more than a million words worth of ancient alchemical knowledge during his studies.

To be fair, we know a lot about Newton's early life.

There are records that specify when and where he was born and his parents' names and professions.

We even know where he went to school.

So it's pretty unlikely that a centuries-old bookseller created Isaac Newton's identity from scratch.

Overall, the story of Nicolas Flamel is a lot to take in, especially in the 21st century when most of alchemy has been debunked.

I mean, you could extract gold from other compounds that already contain it, but there's no way that a stone could turn lead into a precious metal or create a magic potion that grants immortal life.

On top of that, a lot of historians think Nicholas never even bothered to study alchemy.

A lot of the details about his story, like the dream with the angel, the book of secrets, and his empty grave, never made it into the public record until centuries after his death.

It's actually a lot safer to assume he was an ordinary bookseller.

Maybe he married richer than he was given credit for, made generous donations to charity later in life, and then this massive legend sprung up after his death.

I don't know where the truth lies.

But if Nicholas was an alchemist, at the very least, we owe him and other medieval alchemists a ton.

I mean, without their research, we wouldn't have chemistry.

Alchemists were were the first people to discover phosphorus.

Their findings about different kinds of metals literally laid the groundwork for the earliest periodic table.

So much of what we know about the natural world today is built on old alchemical research, which means that on some level, alchemy is real.

Whether you can use it to create gold or grant yourself eternal life is up for debate.

But who knows?

Maybe Nicholas figured out something that the rest of us haven't.

And while we're busy reinventing ourselves, maybe he's out there too, always adapting, but never looking a day over 88.

Thanks for listening.

I'll be back next week with another episode.

To hear more stories hosted by me, check out Crime Junkie and all AudioChuck originals.

Your home should show off who you are, telling your story in every detail, meeting you where you are.

Ashley has styles that balance timeless appeal and modern trends to bring your personal look home.

Pairing eye-catching design with features like stain-resistant performance fabric, Ashley offers well-crafted, affordable pieces built to stand up to real life.

Plus, they provide fast, reliable white glove delivery right to your door.

Visit your local Ashley store or head to Ashley.com to find your style.

Hey, so supernatural listeners.

If you enjoy the mysterious and eerie stories we discuss here, then we've got another show you need to check out, Park Predators.

Hosted by our friend Delia Diambra, Park Predators dives into the dark and twisted crimes that have have taken place in some of the most beautiful places on earth.

These haunting cases range from stories of disappearances and murders to unsolved mysteries.

Delia's storytelling will transport you right into the heart of these breathtaking landscapes.

And her dedication to finding the facts ensures that you get all the details of each case.

So if you're looking for some more chilling cases, Park Predators is for you.

Listen to Park Predators available wherever you listen to podcasts.