EP.209 - BRIDGET CHRISTIE

I added one more podcast to the giant podcast bin.

Now you have plucked that podcast out and started listening.

I took my microphone and found some human folk.

Then I recorded all the noises while we spoke.

My name is Ad Buxton, I'm a man.

I want you to enjoy this, that's the plan.

Rosie

is sniffing at the track.

She's kind of sniffing around like, yeah, there's definitely something interesting here.

I'll sniff around a little bit.

Is it here?

No, it's not there.

It's yeah, ah, yes, found it, yep.

And then once she's located the spot, she will squat and wee on it.

What are the qualities that she's searching for in this patch of track that mean it's the ideal place for a fluorescent yellow wee wee?

Is it a place that she can smell the presence of one of her enemies, one of the naughty squirrels or the silly rabbits?

And so she weeze on it out of contempt?

Or is it that she likes the spot but thinks the one thing that's missing is some lurid yellow dog wee?

It's impossible to tell, isn't it, Rosie?

Mystery dog.

I love you.

Come on.

Hey,

how are you doing, podcats?

It's Adam Buxton here.

I and my dog friend Rosie are walking along our regular farm track

out here in East Anglia, UK, towards the end of October 2023.

It's cold,

colder than it has been for a few weeks,

nearly glove time.

But it's very bright, the sun is out, and it is a welcome change from the weather we've had the last few days.

The news, of course, is dominated by events in the Middle East and Ukraine,

but also reports about the ongoing flooding

after Storm Babette.

Did you see the video taken by a dog walker in Scotland of a section of the forest floor peeling away from the earth beneath and then flapping slowly up and down

as the wind catches the trees sitting on top?

I guess the roots of the trees spread out rather than go down.

But it looks mad.

It looks like a big kind of mechanical, practical special effect for a film or at a theme park or something.

I put a link in the description.

It's worth seeing

to give you an idea of the ferocity of the wind.

And of course there's been terrible flooding across the country.

I hope you weren't too badly affected wherever you are.

We got quite badly waterlogged out here.

That's a puddle.

But down in the lower fields it's quite flooded still.

It's Sunday as I speak.

On Friday, when the storm really hit,

I was supposed to travel to Sheffield for a bug show, but my train was cancelled.

So I got in the car, started heading towards Sheffield.

But after an hour, I had only travelled a few miles.

I was stuck.

All the roads were waterlogged.

HGVs were getting stuck in the narrower roads and blocking the routes.

You had to keep turning around and trying to find alternate routes, the SAT-NAV rerouting to another road that would be blocked.

I was checking the news and it started saying

don't travel.

So very reluctantly I made my way back to the castle and we had to cancel that Sheffield show.

So I'm very sorry if you're one of the people who were supposed to come that night

and maybe some of you actually turned up at the showroom cinema not realizing that the show had been cancelled.

I'm very sorry if that was the case.

I hope you'll be able to make it to the rescheduled performance which is next Friday the 27th of October, at the same time, 7.30 p.m.

But right now,

I'm a bit husky today.

Don't know why.

I've been doing some singing.

I was doing some yelping

last night, trying to record something, and then again this morning, so maybe that's it.

Anyway, let me tell you about podcast number 209, which features a rambling conversation with the English stand-up comedian, actor, and writer, and returning guest, Bridget Christie.

Christie Fax.

Born in 1971, Bridget grew up in Gloucestershire, down in the southwest of England, where she attended St.

Peter's Roman Catholic High School.

In her early 20s, Bridget earned a scholarship to study at the Academy of Live and Recorded Arts in South London.

Her stand-up career got going in the early 2000s, around the time that she was also earning a living by working on the diary column of the Daily Mail newspaper, a time she later talked about in her stand-up show, My Daily Mail Hell.

That was in 2009, that show.

Bridget has written and performed 13 solo live shows over the years, which also include An Ungrateful Woman, Housewife Surrealist, The Court of King Charles II, her Brexit-themed Because You Demanded It, and A Bic for Her, a show inspired by her consternation that Bic, the pen manufacturers, appeared to think that it was necessary to create a special woman pen.

That show was a great success and spawned a book called A Book for Her.

And there was also a stand-up special for Netflix in 2022 called Stand-Up for Her.

As I speak, Bridget is right in the middle of a UK tour with her show, Who Am I?

That runs up until the middle of December of this year, 2023.

The blurb on Bridget's website says the 50-year-old Fosters Award-winning comedian cannot ride the motorbike she bought to combat her midlife crisis because of early osteoarthritis in her hips and RSI in her wrist, and wonders why there are so many films made by men about young women discovering their sexuality, but none about middle-aged women forgetting theirs.

It's a menopause laugh-a-minute with a confused, furious, sweaty woman who is annoyed by everything.

I recommend catching that if you can.

It was good fun.

There's a link in the description of today's podcast to all the remaining dates on Bridget's website.

In addition to numerous appearances on shows like Have I Got News for You, Alan Davis, As Yet Untitled, and of course The Taskmaster, Bridget has made several series for radio.

Her most recent, Mortal, was recorded during the 2021 lockdown and was a lovingly produced, textured audio landscape that featured funny, profound, and stupid thoughts about the meaning of life and death.

Today's conversation with Bridget was recorded face-to-face in London on a hot day back in May of this year.

And we spoke about Bridget's TV comedy drama, The Change, in which Bridget plays a woman

going through a midlife crisis.

Dusting off her old triumph motorbike that she hasn't ridden in 30 years, Linda sets off alone to the spectacular wilderness of the Forest of Dean, in search of an identity, a purpose, and a tree she climbed as a child.

That's the premise of the show, which is filled with great performances from Bridget herself, as well as a cast that includes Ahmed Jalili, Lisa Tarbuck, Susan Lynch, Paul Whitehouse, Tanya Moody, and Jerome Flynn of Robson and Jerome.

And it's beautifully directed by Al Campbell.

You might know Al, as Barry Shitpease from Charlie Brooker's various wipes.

Bridget and I also talked about smelly fridges.

We talked quite a lot about cleaning.

Bridget was scandalized by my unorthodox mopping technique and disturbed by my toilet cleaning habits.

You might be as well.

We also talked about giving yourself a hard time as a parent.

But we began by literally sniffing each other out.

Back at the end for a bit more waffle, but right now with Bridget Christie.

Here we go.

talking hat.

When we embraced earlier on, it wasn't like a really intimate embrace.

Where did we embrace?

At the door.

Did we?

No, you had your foot.

We didn't.

That was not an embrace.

We not go for an embrace.

Shall I tell you something, Adam?

Yeah.

It was the most awkward greeting because you had your foot on the door to stop.

You had, there's two doors, right?

And you had your back foot, you were really splayed.

And you had your back foot in the interior door.

Yeah.

And you were reaching quite far to keep the other door open.

Yeah.

And then.

I was doing a lot of work at the same time there was a lot of air between us let's say that okay all right well i apologize i i in my mind i was getting ready for an embrace and also i put some aftershave on what which i normally wouldn't wear why did you put aftershave on because i was going to embrace someone oh

what is it i can't smell it well i think it's ckb

sorry

that i haven't worn oh well that was that's quite 90s isn't it is it yeah it is do you know what I wear oh this is like an advert for perfume now but I'm going to tell you because I put some perfume on as well because I was going out yeah

I wear this thing called lust from lush holy mercy oh god it smells so good does it smells like the 80s I should smell it now shouldn't I or is that going to be around

oh yeah okay you come around

oh that's beautiful

it's good isn't it it's very floral oh is it floral yeah don't you think it smells like a bunch of flowers?

Oh, I don't think it's floral.

I think it smells a bit like the sort of perfume a man in the 80s who like picks wild mushrooms.

And

do you remember those men who had like leather necklaces and lovely men with open shirts picking mushrooms?

They're going to go home and make a lovely risotto.

Not a risotto, no.

What are they going to do with the mushrooms?

Oh, no, they like would drink them or, you know, magic mushrooms.

Oh, sort of.

These are kind of spiritual hippie men.

Yes.

Like...

Like a patchouli.

I think it smells a bit sort of patchouli-ish.

So to refer to your TV show, this is a good segue.

The man that you are describing who smells nice,

who is picking mushrooms for a spiritual journey in the woods later on, reminds me of the character in your show, in The Change, played by Jerome from Robson and Jerome, who lives in a cave.

Is that the guy?

No, I had not thought of him at all.

Okay.

I was thinking about some of the biker gang that I used to hang around with.

Mm-hmm.

Sorry, I took a sip of tea there.

Because that was the thing when you were last on the podcast, a few years back, we were talking in front of a small, rainy audience.

It was

an End of the Road Festival.

And you suddenly revealed to me that you were part of this biker gang, which was something I did not know about you at that point.

Now it seems like, well, that's your whole identity in the show, in the change.

That's the person you are being, right?

Yeah, Linda.

Yeah.

And did I establish how you got involved in that world?

It was just,

you know, going to the pub and meeting bikers.

It's as simple as that, really.

And then, you know, getting.

Fragrant bikers.

Yeah.

And then just getting my license and then, you know, playing pool and that sort of thing.

What kind of music were you listening to?

You did tell me.

Oh, you know, Leonard Skynyrd, Credence, you know, Led Zeppelin, Black Sabbath, all that sort of thing.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Janice Joplin.

Sure.

Good, soulful rock.

Yeah.

And do you mind me asking how old you are now?

I'm 52 in August, so 51 now.

There you go.

So we're not too far apart in age.

I'm a little bit older than you.

God, you don't look older than me.

That's nice of you to say.

I feel old.

And you don't seem it.

You have a very young, you know, outlook

perspective.

I think people do look younger if they're kind of nice and happy.

No, but you know, you know.

Well,

may I return the compliment in a way that might sound forced, but I swear is true.

I was thinking earlier on, like, wow, do you dye your hair?

My hair?

Yeah.

No, I mean, I've got a few low lights, but.

Yeah, you're looking very young.

Is this good, listening, listeners, us just telling each other how young we look?

She does look very young, though.

Skin is beautiful, hair luxuriant.

Yeah.

No, you're looking very youthful.

Whatever you're doing is running every day.

Agreeing with you.

Are you running every day?

I love running every day.

If I don't, I feel like I'm going a little bit crazy.

Right.

How long have you been running?

Since before lockdown, so then, but really, really, well, my whole life.

So I started running when I was about 15, and that's just the thing that I like.

I think you've got to find one thing that you like, and that's it.

What are you running from?

Or towards?

Yeah.

What am I running towards?

And I don't listen to anything, so I...

Do you not?

No,

I used to.

And then I thought, oh, now I'm thinking about that and that.

And this is reminding me of this.

So I just clear my mind now.

And have you injured yourself running?

Because I tried to do some running at a certain point, but I very quickly found that my feet were in trouble.

What do you mean?

Maybe I wasn't running with the right shoes or something.

And then a friend of mine said, oh, no, you're too heavy to run.

What?

What kind of a friend is that?

You're too heavy for runs.

Oh, no, he meant it nicely.

I think he was saying, maybe you're going too hard, you've got to wait.

And I mean, there's a whole science to it.

Did you just start running?

What, when I was 15?

Oh, right.

So you started really young.

Like, I'm a run.

Yeah, but much younger than that.

So when I was young, young, I mean, when I was three, four, five, I used to walk.

I would walk a long way.

We would go to hills and, you know, there were nine of us.

And

we would go and

yeah, I'm the ninth child.

What?

Did you not know that?

No way.

Yeah, so we'd go for walks on a Sunday up to the house.

This was in Victorian times.

Yes, I'm that old.

Nine.

Yeah, I'm the ninth.

So, and we would go for walks from our house where we lived in Gloucester, and we would walk up to Robbinswood Hill, which is a hill.

So that would be like a 21-minute walk, and then we'd walk up and down.

But I would walk the whole way, I wouldn't need my pram or anything like that.

And then I was quite sporty, I loved swimming, and

I was just one of those people who, if I saw a field or an open space, I would just have to run through it.

You know, there would just be this urge to

run.

Your hair flowing,

the sun behind you.

All that kind of thing, you know,

tripping up.

But yeah, I would just feel compelled to run.

We've got a running machine.

Oh, I hate them.

Running on a machine, I can't.

I used to be able to do that, but it's just soulless for me.

I'd like feeling the wind on me.

me and yeah absolutely well it's good though in it's good in the winter time

we've got a screen on it there's a screen

oh to watch things you watch people running

they start running and then you follow them Is that interesting?

Yeah, it's pretty good.

Because maybe they're running in Ecuador or something like that.

Oh, and then you've got all those scenes.

Yeah, suddenly you're running through Dubrovnik.

I don't know.

I'm pleased that you're doing something.

To tie up the original thread

of smells.

Smells.

You smell like a beautiful man collecting mushrooms from the 80s.

And it's called Lust.

Yeah.

Were you embarrassed buying a scent called Lust?

Well, it's a bit of a silly name, isn't it?

I would say, yeah.

Yeah, but the smell's too good.

I don't know what to say.

I just...

I couldn't not buy it because the name was.

But every time I wear it, which is, you know, to gigs, comedians say, what is that smell?

Well, people who smell nice, it's really a wonderful surprise because most people don't bother.

I mean, I remember reading a David Sederis piece, whatever you want to call it, and in passing, he made a reference to the kind of men that wear cologne.

And it was a sort of withering dismissal of the kind of man that wears cologne.

And I thought, yeah, the kind of men that wear cologne.

Oh, me.

But I wonder what he meant.

What kind of a man?

I don't know.

Well, that's the thing, like a man who's too fussy or too

flash or something, or too, or is it sleazy?

I don't think so.

Because obviously, the cliche of a certain kind of 70s sleazy man.

Old spice.

Yeah, splash it all over, you know.

And then be a sexist.

Yeah, exactly.

A lot of aftershave, because that's the other thing, is that I didn't think of that kind of stuff as cologne.

I think of that as aftershave.

Americans call it cologne.

Essentially, what it is is perfume, but it's like calling Pepsi Max Pepsi Max because men don't want to drink diet Coke or whatever.

You know what I mean?

It's the same, it's a diet soda, but they have to have a manly name for it: Pepsi Max,

rather than diet Pepsi.

There's a whole marketing thing, isn't there, with

food and

like there was that what crisps were for men.

I think it was those ridged ones.

Cocks.

Cocks.

That would be one name you could go with.

You could call it for crisps.

Sure.

Crispy cocks.

I don't know.

Yeah, well, like the puffed ones.

They could be cock-shaped.

What's it, do you mean?

Yes, like penis-shaped Watsits.

I don't think anyone would eat that.

Well, you get penis pasta, don't you?

Penis pasta.

Yeah, but that's from a card shop or something.

Sure, well, that's where you could sell cocks.

The crisps.

So what's the female equivalent?

No, no, no one would, no one would buy cock crisps.

This is the maddest idea I've ever seen.

Who's buying penis-shaped pasta?

I think it's women on hen party expeditions, isn't it?

And maybe they'd buy cocks.

What, and then they go out and cook up a big pot of pasta.

I don't know what.

I'm not the one who's making it.

But yes.

That's what they do, and then they laugh and laugh.

They have some chianti and they eat the cock pasta and further.

I did buy a tiny box of chocolate penises.

There you go.

Why is that acceptable?

No, and I kept them in the bag for ages.

Why did you buy them?

I don't know.

They were on the till at what's that card shop that's got all the tuddies in it.

You can't know.

You know, the card shop shop, I do know, but I don't know.

And they sell all those cute little.

That's all this podcast is, is two people of a certain age trying to remember words.

We've got to stop.

My God, we haven't talked about anything yet.

I'm going to get this.

I'm going to pull this together.

All right.

Oh, man.

What?

The other day, we had a problem with the fridge.

And we'd been away for a little bit, got back, and the fridge had defrosted.

And there wasn't that much in it because we were going away.

We knew that we had to clear it out.

But the few items of vegetables that were left in there had gone crazy over about just a few weeks.

But it was a few weeks' worth of crazy mold, long strands of mold.

Yeah.

Wow.

It looked like,

you know, in, I don't know if you watch Stranger Things.

Yeah.

And when they go into the underneath world, it looked like that.

It was all just nuts.

And the

smell terribly.

God, it was.

unbelievable.

There was no meat there.

So it wasn't, it wasn't that, but, but I didn't know you could get that kind of smell from rotting vegetables.

Just terrible.

And I cleaned it out so thoroughly and disinfected everything and the smell just will not shift.

It will go eventually.

Will it?

Yeah.

I'm worried that's not smelling.

Is it just the fridge that smells?

Yeah.

Oh, you'll be alright.

What do you do for...

Have you ever had that problem?

I've had, yeah, I...

But you need to spray the inside of the fridge, the sides of the walls and stuff.

Because something like fungus fungus and that, it's got millions of particles and stuff.

I've sprayed the living shit out of every accessible part of the fridge and the freezer.

Because I know now, having googled this to death, that the air passes around between the freezer and the main fridge area.

So if both of them have got to be totally sanitized because it's just passing the air around.

But it still smells.

It still smells.

I bet it doesn't.

It smells like Satan's Gooch.

Attention.

Hey, congratulations on your show.

You've got a TV show, a narrative.

Well,

I still can't believe it.

Are we calling it sitcom, comedy drama?

What do we call it?

It's comedy drama, apparently.

Okay.

Yeah.

I don't quite know what the difference is.

Well,

it's a terminal thing.

In the olden days, it used to be if you had a sitcom, you couldn't suddenly suddenly lob a sad grenade into it.

It's tricky, isn't it?

Because something like

Steptoe and Son, you might think that that was a sitcom, but then there's lots of sadness and drama in that

as well.

Fair enough.

But maybe that's more the situation is tragic.

Yeah, there was pathos in there, though.

You're right.

I never really watched that show.

No, but I think it's in the style and tone, you're right.

Yeah.

I don't think of the change as a sitcom

do you think of it as more funny than dramatic or you know you're not thinking of it in those oh god i hope it's funny i mean i've tried to make most things that people say funny yeah okay so this is not you i don't know if yeah because like what's fleabag then is fleabag funnier than it is dramatic or what what do you reckon i don't know but 50 50 would you say yeah it is isn't it yeah

One is helping the other.

Something like the Detectorist, which I absolutely love.

that has both.

That's true.

I would be laughing and then crying.

Oh,

the American office.

Yes.

Constantly crying and laughing.

Yeah.

But you would look at that and think it looked like a sitcom.

Yeah.

But is it a comedy-drama then?

I think we've agreed that we don't really know, don't we?

Well, it's not an exact science, is it?

No.

Where did the whole thing come from?

Where did it start?

God, it evolved really over many years.

So do your pitch pretender

pretend you're back in i'm i'm in channel four i'm your commissioning editor you've come in here so what's the show uh this is how our commissioning editors talk at channel four so what's this show you want to do bridget oh i'm not going to be able to answer that

well thanks for coming in

good luck

That's so, it's God.

Imagine, imagine having, yeah, that would be awful.

But it really did evolve over many years.

The original idea was slightly different.

We did have this central character who was kind of returning and going back.

So that loss of identity and sense of self was always there right from the beginning.

Also, something that was there right from the beginning was the Forest of Dean, which I've always wanted to write something set there.

It's just this magical place.

So it's partly magical because, you know, of the tr of the redwoods and the pine and all of this kind of thing, but also where it is geographically kind of between England and Wales.

It's this little pocket in between the River Severn and the Welsh border.

And it's very unique.

And actually foresters say that they're not English or Welsh, they're foresters.

But

is it massive?

Like compared to somewhere like Dartmoor?

No, it's not.

It's not.

No.

It's not a moor.

It's like

it's a forest with trees in it.

Yeah, and the people are different as well.

Hobbits.

I just.

Look, I love this place.

Yes.

So I don't want to.

It is a love letter to the Forest of Dean.

That's what is really important to me as well.

It's not a comedy about, you know.

Yeah.

But it's an eccentric place and it brings me back and it reminds me of

a time before,

you know, it's just, I'm very romantic about that whole era.

And that's why the change looks a certain way.

Well, it feels like a kind of fantasy world and a fantasy community.

Yeah, well, it is.

It's created in my mind from memories of being a child.

Yes, it's quite dreamlike.

Yeah.

And it does look absolutely great.

It looks like a movie.

It looks like a kind of indie movie, you know.

Yeah, well, it was really inspired by the reason I wanted it to look like that is because

in the 1970s when I went there, so films that I would have been seeing then were like The Deer Hunter and Deliverance, which you know was a bit later, and you know, Westerns that I used to watch with my dad.

And The Forest of Dean reminded me of those films because of the landscape.

The Forest of Dean never really felt like England to me, it felt really epic and cinematic as a child.

Obviously, I was smaller, so everything seemed bigger, but I'm bigger now, so everything's really small.

But what it was, it was essentially that it was trying to get my memories onto the screen you know that was that was a huge part and sort of making this

the setting another character almost and really selling that and also you know during lockdown there was i think we i became really sort of patriotic about my country which i felt had been sort of hijacked from me and i had sort of remembered how how great this country was because we were all kind of stuck here and couldn't go anywhere and you know all the culture that we have, all the rituals, all the archaeology, you know, all this stuff where it's steeped in history and culture.

And I wanted to really showcase that and remind people of how great this country is, and that it was okay to be patriotic.

So that was really important to me as well.

But for all of that to work, you had to have really at its heart a very ordinary, relatable story.

And that's where Linda comes in.

Linda is your character.

Yeah.

And she is married to Ahmed Jalili's character and your sister is Lisa Tarbuck.

She is.

Yeah, so it starts out in a very everyday setting with

very ordinary.

Linda is a 50-year-old working-class mother of two who kind of lost her sense of self over the last sort of 25-30 years.

Easily done.

Doesn't have a job that is rewarding in any way.

And so she has an appointment with the doctor because she's having lots of symptoms that she's quite worried about.

She's worried she may have dementia, things like that.

And then she goes to see her doctor and he explains to her it's actually she's in the menopause, but that lots of women find it liberating.

For a third of women, it is this debilitating, terrible thing, but for a third of women,

it isn't.

And so.

And that third, are they just not experiencing those symptoms, the memory loss, the hot flushes, etc., that are associated?

So a third of women have a really awful time, a third of women are just okay, and a third of women sail through it.

Oh, right.

Yeah, so all it's kind of like what your baby's going to be like, whether they sleep through the night, it's just a bit of a lottery, isn't it?

Exactly, it's a total lot like childbirth and pregnancy and everything.

And puberty, I suppose.

Some people don't have as hard a time through puberty as others.

Yeah, so here the doctor says, My wife has found the change in hormones quite liberating and she hangs off cliffs at weekends.

This reminds Linda that she buried a time capsule in a tree when she was a child, when her mum died, with all her favourite things in it.

But also, before this, Linda's been keeping a chore ledger.

Yeah, that really made me laugh.

Yeah, like just writing every single thing, every chore that she's done over the last like 25 years.

Like, I think this is going to call, I hope this is going to cause a lot of problems

when this goes out.

The chore ledger.

It's such a simple idea, right?

And to what extent is that based on...

Because these are books that the Omajali character later finds after Linda has taken off, getting ahead of ourselves a little bit, but this happens in the first episode.

But then he finds all the ledgers and he's going through and he's just looking at every single, like down to 40-second tasks.

He can't believe that his wife has been dusting the lampshades.

He's like, oh, the lampshades get dusted.

All these things, which are the bread and butter, all the tiny little jobs that someone at home has to do.

Invisible jobs that people don't even know you're doing.

Yeah, that you don't get any thanks for whatsoever.

Yeah.

And she's written them all down.

Yeah, she's written every single one down.

So there's ledgers going back 20 years in the airing cupboard.

Yeah.

Including having sex with her husband.

Yeah.

One minute, 20 seconds.

And he nods.

He's like, not bad.

Oh, I'm quite pleased with that.

Yeah, so that was a huge, you know, I mean, I have been thinking about this for a really, really long time.

And it's just something that we haven't sorted out yet, the distribution of household labour.

I really don't think we have.

And then during lockdown, there was loads of articles about how we were all still at home and yet women were still doing kind of 60, 70%, the lion's share.

And then get this, is that girls were then doing more than boys,

and boys were getting more of their coursework and homework done, and girls were picking up the slack with the household chores.

I found that actually really depressing.

But it seems like a really simple thing as well to me.

Like this should be sorted out now.

And did you ever do anything like keep a log of how much housework you were doing?

No, I wish I had no.

That's kind of the same thing.

No, I only thought about it when I wrote the show.

Yeah.

But it would be interesting.

It would be very interesting.

Who wrote the journals, the logs out for the show?

Because they're quite, yeah, they're very good.

Yeah, I had to, because it had to be my handwriting because then there's a little shot of me actually writing it in, so it had to all match up.

Yeah, that was actually there was a real moment where I was looking down the monitor, and Ben Mulden, our DOP, and Al, the director, they'd got such a beautiful shot of the back of the airing cupboard where you could see all the spines of the books, and then Ahmed.

And I, it really caught me by surprise.

And I got a bit emotional about it because I just thought about all the

hours and days and weeks that all women, like over hundreds of years, would have spent.

It just, I felt the weight of it, you know?

Yeah.

Like this invisible stuff.

And what a waste.

Because it made me think as well, is like, whose time is more valuable?

It feels like to me, society thinks that women's time is less valuable still.

That's how it feels.

Well, there's lots of evidence to support that, but that's

yeah, I guess what I was hesitating about was that

some of these things are so

intertwined with all sorts of other things that go to making a relationship work

and arrangements that you come to,

and they're all being arranged and negotiated within

you know, societal structures, patriarchy, whatever you want to call it.

So it's very hard to disentangle one thing from the other, if you know what I mean.

And there are women I know as well who

claim to like a lot of those routines.

Not talking about my wife, obviously.

She doesn't do anything.

She refuses to do anything and she makes me do all of it.

And I'm hen-pecked.

To a degree, I am talking about my wife.

She will do the thing of

just going into a frenzy of cleaning sometimes.

Every now and then.

Every now and then.

And I'll say, say, it's fine.

Or I'll do it later or whatever.

But in that moment, she can't stop herself.

And I feel like, well, what's going on there?

I feel like I don't want to investigate it too deeply because I'm glad that she's doing it.

But on the other hand, I'm thinking about the kind of thing you're talking about.

Like, why does she feel she needs to do that?

Why does she feel no one else will do it if she doesn't?

That is interesting.

Or will it be done properly?

Will it be done properly?

Yeah.

If it matters to you, or if it matters to me, say,

you know, if I don't want to live in a dirty house, then I shouldn't have to.

And we should see, that's why it's difficult because we all have different levels of acceptability

with what's clean.

You know what I mean?

If women just could relax a little bit

and just not worry so much about everything being so clean and folded, then they could save themselves a lot of time.

Well, I don't fold things, I just shove everything.

My wife's technique now is to

roll everything, roll the clothes, because she was the one that showed me back in the day when we first started having a relationship how to fold clothes.

She's like, you don't fold your clothes.

And so she showed me how to fold a t-shirt the way that they do if you work in a clothes shop or in the gap or whatever.

Sis, I think you're an anomaly.

So

you do most things around the house.

No, I would say she does most things, but I certainly contribute.

And she would tell you.

If she was here, she would not.

I don't think she would be complaining.

Okay, here's the thing.

This is

what I want to talk to you about.

And I'm not, but it's just the language that you used is interesting.

Absolutely.

Interrogate, you push away.

This is a safe, you know, I love you, right?

Absolutely.

You lay it on the line.

It was, but I contribute.

So here's the, I think there's a general feeling that it is

the default is that it is our responsibility and that any help that the kids or you guys do

is helping, like it's a bonus.

Yes, I hear what you're saying.

That's what needs, that's wrong.

Yeah.

Why do I say, well, I will say this.

We used to have a cleaner.

Right.

So that is a big part of the puzzle.

So when we had a cleaner, It was a much fairer distribution.

Any other tasks that needed doing were 100% fairly shared out between us.

Yeah.

Then we didn't have a cleaner.

Yeah.

Like in lockdown.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And then for various reasons, we haven't had one since.

That's when things started getting skewed.

Were you both working from home then?

Yeah, we both work from home.

So my technique is to do things as and when.

Like if things start getting too messy, I'll do a big

splurge.

Big splurge and I'll sweep and I'll.

I've got quite an eccentric mopping technique, which is more or less just to flood the whole area.

And then...

Why don't you wring it out?

Why?

Why?

I'm sorry, this sounds really sexist, right?

But why?

Why

do...

I don't want to say why do men.

Would you do the same if you were wiping down the table?

You put the cloth under the tap and make it all soaking wet and then just slosh it onto the table and or would you wring the cloth out?

First one.

would slosh a soaking wet.

Yeah.

If I had my way, my fantasy kitchen scenario would be to have some kind of hose with a spray, like a shower basically, in the kitchen.

And I would just shower everything down and then I would dry it as if the whole thing was...

But where does all the water go onto the floor?

And so would you be blowing all the debris and crumbs and stuff like that?

Where would you be blowing it up?

No, you sweep that up first.

Sweep up the crumbs first, and then you soak everything, if you're me.

And then, this is the controversial part of the process, right?

Or maybe more controversial part of the process that I'll probably get cancelled for, for some reason I haven't yet considered.

I go and I get a towel out of the laundry room, a dirty towel that's about to be washed, right?

And I'll...

throw it on the ground and I will shuffle around on the towel, soaking up all the water water on the floor.

So this is what you do.

You get all the crumbs and the debris off the kitchen table or island, whatever you've got.

Brush them all up.

Brush them onto the floor.

Yep.

Not into your hand and then into the bin.

No, brush them all onto the floor, but and then do a pass with the dustpan and brush.

Okay, you get it all up off the floor.

Yeah, yeah.

Put that in the bin.

Get the mop.

Get the mop in the bucket.

Get water off.

Half fill the bucket with hot water and some detoll?

You know, like floor cleaning stuff, lemon pine fresh.

Lemon pine fresh.

Put the mop in, but don't wring it out.

Yeah.

So you're just sloshing all the water all over the place.

Sloshing all the water all over the floor.

And rubbing it in, like you're getting your back into

the coffee stains all the way.

All the stains, all the skids, all the pe

mash.

And there's water everywhere.

Water everywhere.

Then to put the mop back in the bucket, go and get a towel from the dirty linen basket.

Yeah.

And then throw that on the floor.

Shuffle about.

Shuffle about on it.

And so the towel gets absolutely filthy.

It's not good for the towel.

You know the problems with this system, right?

No.

I'm not telling you to change your system.

If you were to wring the mop out,

you wouldn't have to use the towel and get the towel.

Listen.

I regret saying listen.

Immediately after I'd said listen like that, I felt sad.

I felt like Alastair Campbell on News Night.

Jordan Peterson.

I've gone on Jordan Peterson's podcast.

Tony Blair.

Listen.

Listen.

Let me tell you about mopping.

I've got one more question.

Has anyone seen you doing this?

No, no, no.

I don't want anyone to see it.

I do it when everyone's out.

Okay, so

you feel like you've won.

I feel pretty good.

I put music on.

Okay.

Yeah.

And what I was going to say is that the reason that the technique came around in the first place was that I thought, what is the point of squeezing out the mop

when basically all I'm doing is putting dirty water back on the floor?

Do you know what I mean?

Like soaking up the water with the mop is just kind of spreading out a thin film of filth all over the floor.

But what you're saying, Adam Buxton, is that this mop that was invented a few hundred years ago, probably maybe even longer, and this system of mopping that everyone has accepted I mean, we're talking the world over,

millions of people, you are saying that it is wrong and a much better way is to just slosh loads of water all over the floor that is essentially what you're saying

yeah yeah yeah yeah how many people do you think will go yeah he's damn right i'm gonna do that now well they should give it a try let me ask you this what's your worst domestic chore which is the one that really makes you want to give up oh you just feel like this is not a good way to spend my life the toilet is a bit grim

Doing the toilets.

Do you like doing the toilets?

I don't mind.

I've always been quite gung-ho about toilets.

Oh.

Even.

Do you put your gloves on and everything?

Not as often as I should, probably.

You're going to tell me your system for cleaning the toilets, that's going to be terrible, isn't it?

No, I don't have an eccentric system for cleaning the toilet, I don't think.

I was going to say, though, that I will

occasionally feel compelled to clean up a public toilet.

This cannot be true.

Are you joking?

And I know that I'm not the only person that does this.

What do you mean?

I think it's a mental hang-up.

So will you carry stuff around with you?

No, I'll just improvise with what's there.

Well there isn't going to be anything there.

There's toilet paper.

You will put your hand into the

somebody else's.

This is.

I cannot believe what I'm hearing.

A stranger's PCs.

Look, I'm not going in and grabbing.

Why don't you just go to a different toilet?

Because it stresses me out.

That someone else will see it?

I guess that maybe that's part of it.

That I'll come out and then the next person who goes in will just think I'm a piggy.

It's very thoughtful of you.

Well, it's half thoughtful and half obsessive.

Is this part of...

Do you think living in the country has made you?

I don't.

I just...

Have you got a small hold?

Do you deal with animals?

Have I got a small hold?

hole?

A small holding.

Like, have you got animals?

Like, I don't know.

It seems.

I think maybe if you're around a lot of stuff like that, maybe it's easier.

My Mickey Mouse psychological analysis would be that it's a form of control or something, or it's just a hang-up.

It's like putting back into the community, isn't it?

But it's just quite an eccentric way of doing it, cleaning a stranger's feces in the toilet.

Well, someone's got to do it.

It's like beach cleaning up beaches, isn't it?

Yes.

It's that sort of thing.

Maybe you could arrange like little groups of you to go around.

I feel as if I could be a cleaner.

I think so too.

Well, not floors,

but toilets.

So, anyway, these are the kinds of things that are stressing out Linda in the change.

They're not stressing her out, but

she just wants to mix things up a little bit.

She wants a change.

She wants a change.

Because of the change.

Yeah.

She needs a change.

She's realised that she doesn't know who she is anymore.

You know, no one's interested in what she's up to or how she is or what she's doing.

And she isn't either.

You know, she's lost sight of who Linda is and what she's going to do with the rest of her life.

So it's a sense of purpose, I think, that she's looking for.

And she doesn't have that in her current situation.

You know, that's another thing about the menopause.

I did really want it to be like a positive experience as well, because I I don't want young women to think to dread this thing that's coming and to think that it's all awful.

Because for a lot of women, it really isn't, and it hasn't been for me personally.

I'm feeling really good at the moment, and that's a combination of things, you know, like work finally sort of coming together, and the kids are a bit older, and you know, getting my health sorted out, and you know, and looking forward to what's next.

You know, I don't know if I would

it's it's tricky, isn't it?

Because

I wonder how I would feel if I hadn't had children.

Because obviously that's all stopped now.

I haven't had a period for at least a year, so I'm out the other side of that.

But I've got two beautiful children, and I don't know how I'd feel if I didn't.

I don't know if I'd think, right, so I've gone through all of this puberty and the menopause.

Like, why did I have to go through that?

You know?

Did you always know that you wanted to have children?

No,

it wasn't wasn't part of my big plan.

If someone had asked you when you were 12 or something, what would you have said?

I would have said I'm way too young to have children with you.

Like, we were talking about the children.

I'm calling the police.

We were talking to our children about it the other day.

Yeah.

And all of them just said, no way.

No way.

No way.

A physically, my God.

Just absolutely no.

And also, I think that I just wasn't mature enough before.

You know, I had Luke at 35

30 35 36

and I just don't think I was mature enough and also you know I hadn't met anyone that I wanted to have children with sorry to all my exes you know it just the timing wasn't right yeah I wasn't in the right place you know

so no I was never I was never definitely when I was young I would not have wanted

it just seems so incredibly intimidating yeah to be responsible for

well being pregnant giving birth and then being responsible.

It's like mind-blowingly

mad concept when you're young to most people, I think.

Yeah.

I remember when I was pregnant with my first child and my dad, who had had nine children, saying,

nothing can or will prepare you for it.

Don't read any books.

They won't help.

Just go with your instinct.

And I don't think...

I don't think any parent thinks that they're the best parent in the world.

I can't, well,

actually, someone did say that to me once, and I was really taken aback by it.

It was that they were, or that you were.

That they were.

Because I was like going, oh my God.

You know, I was being very self-deprecating about myself and parenting and all of that.

Because it's a universal law, isn't it?

You say to other parents, come on, blow me, you know, half-term's nearly over, and all of that business.

And

I remember her saying, I think I'm a really amazing parent.

Wow.

And I think I laughed because I thought she was joking but actually she wasn't and that really I was really taken aback by that because I thought that I thought that we all thought that we were winging it yeah yeah yeah

and it is hard it doesn't get easier either no no that's the thing just that the worries change exactly like when they're little it's are they safe are they gonna like run into the road are they eating properly and all of that and then as they get older it's you know are they happy who are they hanging out with where are they

like where are they you know are they going to be in relationships with people who hurt them?

And then when they're older, it's going to change again.

We'll worry about have they got enough money?

Like, what are they?

Yeah, it's just, it doesn't end really.

I know.

It never really goes away.

And I feel as if part of the stage we're at now is coming to terms with that and moving beyond it and sort of accepting that.

You get periods where it's...

less worrying and where everything's kind of working, but you know that at some point there's going to be another bigger problem that's even more insurmountable.

This is the thing, right?

Is that,

you know, my mum always used to say, you don't own your children, you just borrow them and then you have to let them go

at a certain age.

And they're kind of nothing to do with us in a way.

Like, they're individual human beings with their own minds.

And, like, my kids were born the way that they were.

Like, they were literally born the way that they are now.

They're exactly the same as they were when they were little.

I know what you mean.

They haven't changed at all.

And I don't think that we can have any control over that.

And I also don't think that if one turns out really great and is no trouble, I don't know how much credit we can take for that.

And I don't know how much blame we can take equally for ones that turn out to be more rebellious because it's not always necessarily anything to do with us.

And I know that we like to blame ourselves for things, but actually I'm not sure that we should because we can have siblings and children that are complete opposites.

How does that happen?

So then it can't be a parenting thing.

Or at least not exclusively a parenting thing.

I mean, evidently, the way you're brought up does have an impact on how you end up and you live your life.

And parents, to a degree, have to take responsibility for certain choices they make.

And obviously, if you are a terrible parent, if you're abusive, neglectful, or whatever,

you just don't love them.

That's different.

That's different.

You should hoover up the responsibility for that if your children.

But if we take abusive parenting out of the discussion, then I think you do have to let certain things go.

And I think,

I don't know.

I mean, what happens when your children have completely different politics to you or

if they live in a way that is

shocking and disappointing to you?

What do you do?

You have to love them the same, right?

Yeah, in the show, in the change.

Yeah, the kids she leaves them she goes away she texts them though she maintains contact and that's kind of an important part really important of linda's character is that she is in touch she's thinking about them and that sort of makes you more sympathetic because it would feel it would feel kind of cold her just totally running away even though you make the point in the show and it's totally rings totally true that it's so standard for a man just to pick up and bug her off just to take off and totally on his own terms, no warning whatsoever.

Climb up a mountain, ride around America.

Yeah.

You know, do whatever.

Do whatever the fuck.

You know,

it's just not seen in the same way at all.

Yeah.

And then to have no contact with his family, to go off grid, you know.

I think we're judged very differently.

But no, it was really important that this was not a show about a relationship, about a marriage breakdown, about a mother and and her children.

It is about a human's search for themselves.

It is a love story, but it's a love story about one person's love for themselves, you know, and finding that and reconnecting with that person who

they used to be or who she wants to be.

But it was really important that Linda and Steve didn't break up, that there was no problem with her and the children, that she wasn't ill.

I just thought that she's got a right to take a little bit of time.

We're only talking a month or so, you know.

It's just,

there's a really nice dog over there.

There's a really nice dog on a balcony.

Sorry, but your face is lovely, Adam.

But there's a dog outside.

No, that's fair enough.

I can't compete with.

Yeah, there's a nice cat out there as well that I watch.

Behind me.

Yeah, so that was, you know.

Do you like acting?

Love it.

Love it.

Bloody love it.

Yeah, I wasn't joking.

I have been auditioning for years and not getting anything.

Yeah.

It's so weird.

You know, you need to keep going.

That's the message here, Adam.

Is don't ever give up.

Because sometimes your dreams come true.

I mean, this is my first commission and I was 50.

Right.

So I hope that younger writers

don't, you know, it's easy to think, isn't it, when you're much younger that nothing's you want everything to happen straight away and it just doesn't.

I mean, it does sometimes, but...

Just got to keep plugging away.

Got to keep plugging away.

I loved your radio show, Mortal.

Did you?

I thought it was one of the best things I'd heard for years.

Oh, my goodness.

Are you going to do more of those?

We were going to, and then, because I've been writing the TV show, that show, Mortal.

Well, this sounds really arrogant, but we worked so hard on it, and I'm really proud of it because I really wanted to talk about death and mortality.

And I was really grateful that my sister and my friends talked to me about how they felt.

And my sister, especially, was really open and honest with me.

And I'm really grateful to her for that.

But

we worked really, really hard on it, you know.

I just recorded it at home on a little

microphone.

And I was so happy that people responded well to that.

So describe it for someone who hasn't heard it.

Mortal is a four-part radio series about the cycle of life.

So it was birth, life, death, and the afterlife.

And it was talking about...

I've been wanting to talk about death for a long time, but I wanted to make it really funny.

And I wanted it to be kind of comforting and meaningful as well.

But I also wanted it to be absurd because I feel like life and death is absurd.

And I think that we don't talk about it enough.

I loved it.

It's just my favourite kind of thing, a sort of stream of consciousness, but it's also got lovely little verite moments when you're on the phone.

I assume those moments when you're on the phone to your friends and family were not scripted?

I didn't tell them that I was recording them, so I spoke to them all on the phone previously, like say a couple of months beforehand, and asked them if it would be okay if I recorded them at some point.

Aha.

But I never told them when that was.

That's great.

So the ones that ended up in the show, they weren't sure that they were being recorded even then, were they?

Well, with my dad, I asked him and he had said that's okay, but then he said, No, he didn't want to be, but I recorded him anyway because I thought that he wouldn't mind when it went out.

And then he said, and then I got really told off when I went home because his neighbor had said, I heard you on the radio.

And he was like, What?

It worked, it worked very well.

Because people speak in a different way if they know that they're being recorded.

Yeah, it was great.

It all fitted together so nicely.

It was my favourite kind of thing to listen to.

Thank you so much.

I'm delighted that you like that show.

Yeah, thank you.

I loved it.

Do more.

I will do more.

Yes, please.

Yeah.

Oh,

if they'll have me back.

There's a stock photo of you that is used for the Red Women of the Year awards at the Royal Festival Hall.

Really?

And it says

stock?

It says 18th of October 2016.

2016.

Bridget Christie at the Red Women of the Year Awards at the Royal Festival Hall.

And it's not you.

Oh, how brilliant.

Red Women of the Year Awards.

Do you remember going to that?

Yes.

And it isn't me.

Sabalette.

I don't think that she looks like me at all.

Do you?

No.

Who is that?

Do you recognise them?

No.

No, it's not Bridget Christie.

They need to.

So who do I need to get in touch with?

Hang on, it says buy now.

Can somebody buy that photo?

Yeah, it's a stock photo.

So this is the thing, it's like if someone wants a photo of you to illustrate an article or something, they go to this.

How long has that been there for?

That doesn't look like me.

I know.

At all.

Right, who do I get in touch with?

The Red Women of the Year Awards.

Age Photostock.

Well, that's outrageous.

I'll send you the link.

Well, you know that someone thought I was Charles II.

You know that story?

No.

I used to do a character of Charles II for my Edinburgh shows.

I did two Edinburgh shows where I pretended to be Charles II.

You've got a bit of Charles II.

I have, right?

But when he was young, not when he was 55.

Sure.

And then Izzy Sutty,

right, fast forward about five or six years, Izzy Sutty, who's a friend of mine, texted me and said, quickly, look up the Daily Mail's website before they realise what they've done and look up a house for sale called Malmesbury House or something.

So I did, and there was my Edinburgh poster of me superimposed onto a horse.

But it was a photograph of me.

And the caption was Charles II fighting the parliamentarians during the Battle of Worcester.

So they thought that that was a painting.

And they'd used a photo of me.

And it was one of the best things that's ever happened to me.

So they'd obviously just googled Charles II and picked the first picture that came up and not seen that it was a photograph of a woman with like a drawn-on moustache.

I had a whole 10 minutes about it, Adam.

This is a Squarespace advert.

Do you want to build a website?

Yes, I will tell you how.

Visit squarespace.com/slash Buxton.

Now start a free trial today, and in minutes you will say my website dreams are finally coming true

Just tell Squarespace what you want to do They'll suggest some templates that might be right for you Drag in pictures and text and some videos And next thing you know your website will be done

Visit squarespace.com slash Buxton today Start your free trial and have yourself a play And when you have decided that you're ready to pay Type in the offer code Buxton Why?

Cause you'll save 10% if it's your first purchase of a website or domain.

Oh, 10%!

That's my favorite percent.

Thank you, Squarespace.

Continue.

Oh, where are you going?

He's gone into the cupboard.

Hey, welcome back, podcasts.

That was Bridget Christie.

Good fun to talk to Bridget.

Always lovely to see her.

There's a link in the description of today's podcast to her website where you'll find her tour dates for the rest of this year.

Really recommend that if she's coming through your town.

It's a good uplifting night out.

And who doesn't need one of those?

Other links in the description of today's podcast.

You've got a link to the webpage for the change, Bridget's comedy-drama series, which was broadcast on Sky.

There is a link to Bridget's radio series, Mortal that I was raving about there.

There is a link to that incorrect stock photo of Not Bridget.

There's a link to that video of Storm Babette making a forest floor flap in Scotland.

Also in the links this week, a rare gift from my YouTube sidebar that popped up this week and that I clicked on.

And for a change, it was something that really cheered me up rather than confused and depressed me.

It is a clip of the Nina Hagen band.

Nina Hagen, German singer who I suppose was part of a punk movement, kind of.

She hung out with Ari up from the slits towards the end of the 70s and got into the whole punk scene, but it's almost quite proggy some of her original stuff.

This clip is of a track from her first album and it's one of the singles from that album called Natur Treine,

which I think means natural tear.

And she was performing with the band in Dortmund in December 1978 as part of the promotion for that debut album that came out the same year.

And that gig was broadcast live by the German music TV show Rockpalast.

And it is one of the best performances I've seen in a long time.

For a start, I mean, I don't really know anything about Nina Hagen other than she's,

you know, very over-the-top in her delivery.

I think she's a kind of opera singer, or at least she has a very operatic voice.

It's that kind of slightly German cabaret

type thing that sometimes I quite like, but other times I just think, oh no, I'm too tired.

But this is great.

I mean, look,

look, it's not going going to be to everyone's taste.

It's extreme,

but it's very entertaining and she is extraordinary as a performer.

Her face, super animated, she looks amazing.

1978.

She's got this heavy black eyeliner that makes her big eyes pop.

She's got cool sort of dyed black hair.

She looks quite modern.

It's quite a modern look that she anticipated.

but she is exploring every single place that the human voice can go soaring swooping yelping burping coughing making chicken noises while also kind of keeping the the it's not a comedy song it's quite a cool sort of song with this descending chord sequence played by these groovy looking German guys with moustaches and dungarees.

Rosie, come on, let's go this way.

But yeah, she is not holding back.

It's good stuff, made me feel happy.

Nina Hagen, by the way, is still with us

and she is still making music.

She put out an album last year, in fact, called Utopia.

Her voice is quite different.

I listened to a couple of tracks.

Sounds like she has smoked all the ciggies.

And drunk all the whiskey.

But she is still plodding on.

Long may she continue.

Right, come on, doglegs.

Let's head back to the castle.

Thank you very much to Seamus Murphy Mitchell for his production support and conversation editing on this episode.

Much appreciated, Seamus.

Thanks to Helen Green.

She does the artwork for the podcast.

Thanks to everybody at ACAST for liaising with my sponsors.

and keeping the show on the road.

I appreciate it.

But thanks,

most especially to you.

I hope you're doing all right.

Stressful times, though, isn't it?

Like, especially, what we sort of me and Bridget were talking a little bit about

this time of life,

not suggesting it's just people in their 50s that have a monopoly on stress.

I remember it being stressful to be young, and I'm sure it's even more stressful in 2023.

Luckily, I think stress stops, I think, once you're over 60, apparently.

It's quite good, something to look forward to.

But yeah, this time of life

when people are getting ill and parents are dying, a couple of close friends lost parents this week

and

children are growing up and

presenting you with their own problems, as Bridget and I were talking about.

Plus all the routine stresses of just being alive and whatever else is going on in the outside world, it's unrelaxing,

and that's why I'm going to give you a hug, Anina Huggin.

Good to see you.

You do smell nice.

Until next time, we share the same outdoor space.

Go easy, keep it together.

I love you.

Bye.

Like and subscribe, like and subscribe

Like and subscribe, please like and subscribe

Give me like a smile and a thumbs up I take a pan for me bums up Give me like a smile and a thumbs up

I take a pan for me buttons up

like and subscribe

Like and subscribe

Like and subscribe Please like and subscribe

Give me me like a smile and a thumbs up.

I take a pat when the buttons up.

Give me the smile and a thumbs up.

I say a pat when it bumps up.

Dislike and subscribe.

Like and subscribe.

Do you like it and subscribe?

Did you like and subscribe?

Give me the smile and a thumbs up.