EP.266 - DEVENDRA BANHART

Transcript

Speaker 1 Ho ho ho, Adam Buxton here. In just over a week, I'll be meeting Joe Cornish to record our annual Christmas podcast.
And as usual, we'd like to include a few contributions from you, the podcasts.

Speaker 1 The address for submissions is adambuxtonpodcast at gmail.com. You'll also find that address on my website, adam-buxton.co.uk.

Speaker 1 A few things to bear in mind that'll really help us out before you start emailing.

Speaker 1 Thing one, please make the subject header of your emails Adam and Joe Christmas 2025, followed by a description of the contents, for example, made-up joke, egg corn, travelling tale, or superb anecdote.

Speaker 1 Thing two, no personal or work-related messages, please. Just things that will delight me, Joe, and your fellow listeners on Christmas Day.

Speaker 1 And please remember that whatever you send us might be made public. Three, please keep it short, just a few lines, ideally.
We won't have time to read long messages or listen to long audio clips.

Speaker 2 4.

Speaker 1 The deadline for contributions is Monday, the 1st of December at midnight. Festive thank you!

Speaker 2 I

Speaker 2 added one more podcast to the giant podcast bin. Now you have plucked that podcast out and started listening.
I took my microphone and found some human folk.

Speaker 2 Then I recorded all the noises while we spoke.

Speaker 2 My name is Adam Buxton, and I'm a man.

Speaker 2 I want you to enjoy this. That's the plan.

Speaker 2 Hey,

Speaker 1 how are you doing, podcasts? It's Adam Buxton here.

Speaker 1 What the F?

Speaker 1 That's the sound of a motor car.

Speaker 1 And indeed,

Speaker 1 all the other sounds you can hear are the sounds of the city. London town, to be precise.
I'm staying here for a couple of days. Doing a bit of work.
I had an audition yesterday.

Speaker 1 Definitely going to get that.

Speaker 1 Going to see a pop concert tonight. Radiohead, have you heard of Radio Head?

Speaker 1 They're playing at the O2

Speaker 1 and I'm going to go along with my family. Looking forward to that.

Speaker 1 Rosie is back in Norfolk and she's doing well and sends lots of love.

Speaker 1 I thought I would step outside to record this intro.

Speaker 1 rather than just sitting in the room where I'm staying in East London. But you may be able to hear that it's raining.

Speaker 1 It's pretty cold here towards the end of November 2025.

Speaker 1 I found a small park to make me feel as if I'm in the countryside. This is Allen Gardens, right next to Brick Lane in East London.
And it's a small patch of green

Speaker 1 with an elevated train line that you can probably hear ahead of me.

Speaker 1 Walls covered in graffiti everywhere you look around this part of town, but it's good graffiti.

Speaker 1 Anyway, it's not clement, so I'll get on with my intro and tell you about podcast number 266, which features a rambling conversation with American Venezuelan singer-songwriter and visual artist Devendra Banhart.

Speaker 1 Here's some Devendra facts for you. Devendra was born in 1981 in Houston, Texas, America, to a Venezuelan mother and an American father.

Speaker 1 Oh, that's a nice bird up there.

Speaker 1 Bird entrain.

Speaker 1 His parents split up when Devendra was just two, whereupon he and his mother relocated to Caracas, the capital of Venezuela, located at the very top of the South American continent.

Speaker 1 This is where Devendra spent his childhood, absorbing Latin American folk traditions, visual art and bohemian culture, all of which informed the distinctive aesthetic that he would later develop.

Speaker 1 After returning to the U.S.

Speaker 1 as a teen, Devendra earned a scholarship to the San Francisco Art Institute, where he fell in with countercultural and experimental types while nurturing his passions for visual art and music, often skipping classes to busk in and around the streets of San Francisco's Castro district where he was living.

Speaker 1 Devendra dropped out of college in the early 2000s and spent some time hanging out and playing music in Paris where he landed gigs opening for visiting bands that included on one occasion Sonic Youth.

Speaker 1 A few months later, he returned to the States and self-released a CD of demos that he'd been recording over the years which found its way to Michael Jira, frontman of American experimental rock legends Swans.

Speaker 1 Michael was sufficiently impressed to help Devendra pull together more home recordings for release on the 2002 album O Me Oh My.

Speaker 1 The songs on that record and those that followed like Niño Rojo from 2004 and Cripple Crow from 2005 sounded pleasingly out of step with the musical landscape of the early 2000s, where some of the biggest American acts included at that point Eminem, Green Day, Destiny's Child, The White Stripes and Britney Spears.

Speaker 1 Meanwhile, Devendra's music often sounded as if it might have come out of the psychedelic folk scene of the late 60s, with critics noting the similarity of his voice to that of young Mark Bolan, and sometimes the softly quavering vocal delivery makes me think of early Donovan too.

Speaker 1 Like those artists, there's something very ethereal, not to say away with the fairies, about Devendra, both on record and now and then in conversation too.

Speaker 1 Not saying that disparagingly. I'm pro-fairies.
I actually applied to be away with the fairies, but I was rejected. I had to join the Hairies instead.

Speaker 1 But there's a wide range of styles across the ten or so albums that Devendra has released so far. One of my favourites of his was his 2009 album, What Will We Be?

Speaker 1 which is full of beautifully catchy, tuneful songs that are very him, but also steeped in his love of the 80s pop he grew up listening to, as well as Latin American influences, reggae, and much else besides.

Speaker 1 His last record, 2023's Flying Wig, sounds different again, filled as it is with what some might call off-kilter pop, not a million miles from the sound of someone like Aldous Harding, or indeed Kate Le Bon, who produced the record.

Speaker 1 My conversation with Devendra was recorded on an appropriately mellow and golden Norfolk evening back in July 2024.

Speaker 1 Devendra was talking to me remotely via the Zoom from his home in Los Angeles, where of course it's mellow and golden every single day by law.

Speaker 1 Basically the idea originally with Devendra was to record short introductions for two lovely songs that he had recorded specially for the podcast.

Speaker 1 and then play those at the end of an episode with another guest.

Speaker 1 But we ended up having a slightly longer conversation than I'd expected with Devendra asking me a few questions about some of my podcast jingles. He knows how to flatter me.

Speaker 1 Anyway, he seemed genuinely to enjoy them, so we chatted about those. We also spoke about dead dads and therapy in a fun way, of course.

Speaker 1 We also talked about the place that religion has or doesn't have in our lives.

Speaker 1 And we talked about our shared love of the Netflix documentary, The Greatest Night in Pop, about the time in January 1985 when a group of legendary American musicians came together to record the song We Are the World in Aid of Famine Relief in Africa.

Speaker 1 I've talked about that documentary before on this podcast. I do love it.

Speaker 1 It came out towards the beginning of last year, 2024, and it was fun to share my enthusiasm for one particular scene with Devendra.

Speaker 1 I'll be back at the end to say goodbye, but right now with Devendra Banhart.

Speaker 1 Here we go.

Speaker 1 Ramble chat, let's have a ramble chat. We'll focus first on this, then concentrate on that.

Speaker 1 Come on, let's chew the fat and have a ramble chat. Post on your conversation coat and find your talking hat.

Speaker 1 Tell me about your Friday night and where you are and what you're up to and what the rest of your night looks like.

Speaker 2 Oh, Friday night. I was going to ask you the same thing.
It looks like there's some synths in the corner in the back of your house there. What are those things? It looks like it's perched against the

Speaker 2 floor against the wall there.

Speaker 1 That's a loop a pedal.

Speaker 1 And then over there, there's just sort of MIDI keyboards and things like that. I'm very much an amateur musician.

Speaker 1 I'm someone who's been able to have a musical life thanks to technology because I don't have any formal playing skills.

Speaker 1 So I'm able to go on garage band and have fun with loops and pick out tunes on a MIDI keyboard and things like that. And I play a few chords on the guitar.

Speaker 2 Did you compose and record the two songs that play on your show the most? I mean, there's that intro song, and there's the song about how we're going to have a conversation. Are those both yours?

Speaker 1 Oh, yeah, Ramble Chat. Oh, that's nice of you to have listened to it.
Thank you. I appreciate that.
But

Speaker 1 I didn't compose them. No, those are both.
I mean, I composed some of the jingles from scratch, but those two are examples of things that I sang over bits of library music that I found.

Speaker 2 Have you talked about this at length on the podcast? Those two songs?

Speaker 1 Not at length. Actually, having said that, the first one, the intro theme, I added one more podcast to the giant podcast bin, that's a piece of library music.

Speaker 1 The second one, Ramble Chat, Let's Have a Ramble Chat, that's Logic Pro. And those are loops that I found in there.
So I just pulled a load of those loops together and then added some random beats.

Speaker 1 And then it was very much layering up a symphony of blah, blah, blah.

Speaker 2 Blah, blah, blah. I love it.
Thanks, man. Well, you know, we're good.
No, I want to talk about some of the because already this podcast is so established and has its own lore, it's its own world.

Speaker 2 I've been trying to figure out what it is. Like the second I started listening, and it was your voice, you're walking around, hanging out with your dog,

Speaker 2 I was hooked. But it was like one or two seconds.
I thought, okay, okay, I'm in.

Speaker 2 And what is it about your voice, the way you say the things you say?

Speaker 2 Obviously what you say, you're funny and charming and affable and have this, you know, you have a talent for this thing clearly because in two seconds I thought, oh, I get it.

Speaker 2 I'm going to just listen to this podcast now.

Speaker 2 So that's something I've been trying to figure out. What is it that, because

Speaker 2 it's not that way for me at all. Like, this is torture.
I don't want to do this.

Speaker 2 You know, but I must,

Speaker 2 and it must be that you do want to do this. And

Speaker 2 you're so good at it, but also

Speaker 1 you must must be excited to do this I think or is this like shit I have to go to work today no I love it it's great you know I like your music very much it's really exciting to get to chat with you I don't know what you're like as a person I've seen a few interviews with you but it's very nice to find you so up for the process I never know how it's going to be sometimes I meet people and they don't know anything about the podcast and maybe their PR person has said that it's something worth doing and then you know they do it and maybe it's a Werner-Herzog situation where really they're quite irritated by the technical process and they don't they're not familiar with the podcast so they're a bit confused by why isn't it a more formal interview but I really like it when it's like this when it's getting to know someone who I'm already interested in and who I'm already well disposed to and so it's like

Speaker 1 It's as if I've come to Los Angeles and I've met you at a party and I'm like, oh shit, man, I love your stuff. And then we get to talk for a little bit.

Speaker 1 So that's the nicest scenario as far as I'm concerned. Beautiful.
Do you listen to a lot of podcasts?

Speaker 2 I do. Not a lot, but I do listen to them.
And earlier, when I said I don't want to be doing this, what I mean is that, like you're saying, maybe Werner was irritated by the situation.

Speaker 2 I'm irritated by myself. The fact that I'm a part of this podcast, I find torturous.
I wish I wasn't. I'd love to be a guest.

Speaker 2 That's the thing. The podcast is so incredibly

Speaker 2 perfect for me in a way way because I really love the, and I think we all do, that's why they're so popular, is the feeling of alone together and the feeling of having, like the party's happening in the room next door, and you're invited, sure, but you just kind of want to do your own thing.

Speaker 2 But before I talk to you and bore the hell out of everybody, I want to say that those two songs,

Speaker 2 I was also hooked by those two, I was in because of those two songs. The first one sounds like Robert Wyatt at Aquin Senera.
Oh, wow.

Speaker 2 And the second one sounds like Madness, like the band Madness at like Studio 54 or something. I thought these are great songs.
Thanks. So good.

Speaker 1 Wow, that's amazing. And what amazing references as well.
I'm very flattered by both those comparisons. Thanks so much.
This is going great. Now, why, though, are you...

Speaker 1 Why are you so down on yourself as a guest, though? Do you not like the interview process?

Speaker 1 Have you watched interviews back or read interviews back that have made you cringe and wish you didn't have to do them?

Speaker 2 I think so. I think that must be it.
But I also think that

Speaker 2 I'm not thinking about what I'm going to say while you're talking.

Speaker 2 I'm really listening to you.

Speaker 2 And I'd rather listen to you than tell you about my shit, me, me, me, me.

Speaker 2 At the same time, of course I want to share about myself because I think I'm so special. I do.

Speaker 2 I think I'm so special. But at the same time, the older I get, the less my story matters to me.

Speaker 2 And

Speaker 2 the fact that I feel like you transcend the inherently performative kind of aspect of doing a podcast, because

Speaker 2 the little red button says record. So you're about to perform.

Speaker 2 And

Speaker 2 I feel like, why would I do any of this?

Speaker 2 I write songs and I do these paintings. So that's my version of

Speaker 2 communicating. So it's

Speaker 2 this kind of thing. It isn't like such a thrill.
And, you know, my friends, the European friends, they go, go, oh, I went out last night. What did I do?

Speaker 2 Oh, we just had a couple drinks and talked till 2 a.m. And that's like a normal hang.
I had a birthday party. And this is really, I swear this is true.

Speaker 2 I invited a few friends and it said, will you join me for drinks at this bar near my house from 6

Speaker 2 to 6.15?

Speaker 2 This is my birthday party. And this is my birthday wish.
This is my wish.

Speaker 2 It didn't work out. I tried to leave and everyone had a couple margaritas and my friend Anna was just kind of of grabbing me by the shirt.
You're not leaving. Okay, fine.

Speaker 2 I stayed till like seven, I guess. But that was that's like my dream.
6 to 6:15.

Speaker 2 Anyways, I do listen to podcasts. I have a fantasy that while I'm painting and drawing, I'm listening.
I have this huge playlist.

Speaker 2 All this music that I'm going to be listening to.

Speaker 2 It's like I'm watching this movie, I'm painting to this music. But what I really do is listen to podcasts because

Speaker 2 it's such a cozy feeling. So, yeah, now I listen to yours

Speaker 2 and I listen to

Speaker 2 Conan O'Brien's podcast and

Speaker 2 I like Smartless and I like Office Hours. And oh, my friend really just got me into the Blind Boy Boat Club.
I like that. I like Louis Thoreau's.

Speaker 2 But what podcast do you listen to? Or is it like, no, I don't listen to that stuff. I only listen to myself.
You listen to yourself every night. You start with the first episode.

Speaker 2 You listen to every episode.

Speaker 1 I used to do that a bit. I used to stay up, especially through the pandemic, and I would enjoy a podcast.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 1 during the lockdown, I listened to a lot more podcasts, especially one called Athletico Mints, which is a British one about football. But it's not really about football.

Speaker 1 It's mainly about this guy, Bob Mortimer, who is in a British comedy duo called Vic and Bob.

Speaker 2 Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 They're brilliant.

Speaker 1 But he's also brilliant as a solo performer and a guy called Andy Dawson. And he just does a lot of silly voices and I don't know anything about football.

Speaker 1 In fact, I actively dislike football, but I love athletico mints.

Speaker 1 So he just goes off on these sort of flights of fancy and impersonates these football personalities who are real, but I don't know anything about them.

Speaker 1 So to me, it's just like listening to a totally invented universe and not really getting any of the references, but not really minding because they're just funny in themselves.

Speaker 2 Yeah, when you watch a TV show or a movie or, I mean, that's one of the things, right? We're talking about how you need podcasts.

Speaker 2 And you don't have, when I watch a show I love, I don't go, so nice hanging out with those people. I was hanging out with Julia Roberts in that movie.
You don't have that feeling at all.

Speaker 2 So it is that. I had the same thing, but it was,

Speaker 2 I would have a beer in the bath and listen to live Jerry Garcia.

Speaker 2 And that's almost like the musical version of a podcast, because I'm also hanging there. I'm hanging out with them, with all what's going to happen.

Speaker 2 And there's some little feedback, a little thing, I can hear the murmur of the audience. So that's the closest, it's the musical version of the podcast.

Speaker 2 But I don't have that feeling when I'm listening to a recorded song of like, I'm hanging out with that band. I'm hanging out with Tears for Fears during everybody wants to rule the world.
No.

Speaker 2 But the live version, I have that feeling. And it's the the same thing with a podcast versus any other form of kind of media or whatever, that you're just hanging with the person.

Speaker 2 And that's why I feel like I'm ruining the podcast by being a part of it, because I'm not interested in myself. Get me out of here.
Let's talk about you.

Speaker 1 Well, luckily, though, Tivendra, you have a skill that I want to share with the listeners, some of whom will already be familiar with your work.

Speaker 1 Others will be discovering it for the first time, and I'm excited to share it with them. And you've been very kind and recorded a couple of versions of your songs, especially for the podcast.

Speaker 1 Thank you so much for doing that.

Speaker 2 You're welcome. Thank you for having me on and inviting me to do that.
And

Speaker 2 I think it's Two Way Street. Are you going to send me two of your songs?

Speaker 1 Sure, I'll send you whatever you want. I tell you what I could do

Speaker 1 is I can share a song with you

Speaker 1 about losing a phone charger because you had a song on your last album.

Speaker 1 I should have done that. Called Charger.
But I'll play that to you

Speaker 1 after we hear one of your songs. This one is called Fireflies.
Would you like to say anything about fireflies or shall we just jump in there?

Speaker 2 Well, I always wished I'd studied entomology. I mean, I literally am into insects, you know, really into them.

Speaker 2 And

Speaker 2 that's all I want to say about this song.

Speaker 1 All right, here we go. This is Stevantrap with Fireflies.

Speaker 1 with Fireflies

Speaker 1 A drill of light from a firefly

Speaker 1 is a song that's playing

Speaker 1 just a song that's playing now

Speaker 1 We had a lot of dreams that went by

Speaker 1 Was a song that we were singing

Speaker 1 Just a song that we were singing

Speaker 1 When I said I wasn't leaving

Speaker 1 That's when I knew that I was leaving

Speaker 1 We had a lot of time to make it work.

Speaker 1 I know you tried to get near.

Speaker 1 Was it so

Speaker 1 I just couldn't hear

Speaker 1 Now I see you in a stranger's eyes

Speaker 1 Oh

Speaker 1 there's so much I wish I could say

Speaker 1 Just a song I'll sing anyway

Speaker 1 When I said I wouldn't need it

Speaker 1 That's when I knew that I would need it

Speaker 1 Night after night

Speaker 1 Beautiful

Speaker 1 That was fireflies where did you you record that, Devendra?

Speaker 2 In my house, just downstairs. There's this little room where I record demos and

Speaker 2 have a little view of a fig tree. It's quite nice.
I'm fortunate.

Speaker 2 And you live in the country, yeah?

Speaker 1 Yeah, I'm out in Norfolk, outside Norwich. It's a beautiful Friday evening here.
Where are you? Los Angeles?

Speaker 2 Yeah, Maneco Park in Los Angeles.

Speaker 2 And it's quite beautiful as well. Although

Speaker 2 the kind of

Speaker 2 the air is

Speaker 2 laced with the fragrance of garbage water. Oh, bing juice.
Yeah, bing juice. Ben juice.

Speaker 2 Garbage water and bing juice. Welcome to garbage water and bing juice.

Speaker 2 So you're in Norfolk, near Norwich? Yes, that's right.

Speaker 1 Norfolk County. It's just pronounced Norfolk.

Speaker 2 Well, you know, but that's nice. I want to move to the country.
Who doesn't? I get it.

Speaker 1 Yeah, I'm surprised that you seem like a country person.

Speaker 1 Your family is from Venezuela, is that right? Yeah.

Speaker 2 Which is the jungle.

Speaker 2 Where we're from, the jungle. You know, from I grew up in Caracas, but even Caracas, like this major metropolis, is a jungle city.
Like, you live with the definition of entropy.

Speaker 2 You'd live with this hungry, living, green...

Speaker 2 beast that is really eating eat trying wants to eat you and is going to eat you at night it sounds like psycho. It sounds like the violins of psycho, but it's the crickets, and it's just, but it's

Speaker 2 like murderous, hungry, I'm going to get you. And they sound sharp.
I think that must add to some of the sub-collective subconsciousness of everyone there.

Speaker 2 And then, yeah, the rust, everything's trying to just swallow all these things that humans try to make. It's pretty beautiful, but it's,

Speaker 2 and from the view from where I grew up, you know, you look out, it's just, I'd see sometimes a sloth slowly climbing up a tree and stuff. So it's a good jungle.

Speaker 2 But I feel like country, where you're living,

Speaker 2 you know, country living,

Speaker 2 I feel like that would suit me. And I think that's maybe the next move if I'm fortunate to have another move.

Speaker 1 And where would you go?

Speaker 2 I don't know. I don't know.
I was talking to my therapist about this yesterday. Just yesterday.

Speaker 2 And that's a pretty good question. So what is the what is the sub what is the can you tell me a reoccurring subject of your therapy sessions? That's a pretty good first date question.

Speaker 1 Well, I mean, I'm not currently in therapy. I've only ever done therapy once for a period of about eight months after my mother died in 2020, and

Speaker 1 I was at that point without parents. That was the last parent.

Speaker 1 And the combination of that and the lockdown and various feelings of mortality and middle age and all sorts of things conspired to make me feel sufficiently crazy that I thought it was time to check in with a professional.

Speaker 1 And that was sort of useful. And I think we talked a lot about my relationship with my wife

Speaker 1 and we talked a lot about my relationship with my dad. That's the big one that sort of splurges over everything is the father relationship.

Speaker 1 I keep coming back to that one with quite tedious regularity.

Speaker 1 How about you?

Speaker 2 Well I

Speaker 2 have a therapist that I love very much. I'd had different therapists through my life.

Speaker 2 The first time was an eight-month period, and it was amazing, and I went for a specific reason, and it felt like a lot was uncovered, and then suddenly I got this little pea-sized

Speaker 2 bump on my arm, and then about a week later, it was a golf ball.

Speaker 2 And then I went to the doctor, and they said, well, it looks like some mass, and we're not sure if it's benign or not, but let's just remove it. And they removed it.

Speaker 2 It was a very clear kind of physical manifestation of metaphysical kind of trauma or emotion that had been locked in, in, they're kind of released. And that was years and years ago.

Speaker 2 And then through the years, I just give it a try.

Speaker 2 And then finally, I've got someone that I really love working with, and it feels like a particular relationship that I'm just not going to get.

Speaker 2 It's a very, it is, it's a different relationship from the one I'll have with any friend, with a lover, with a family member. You know, it's so specific.

Speaker 2 And I think you're going to express things that you

Speaker 2 don't express with anyone else. And there's a lot of use, there's something very useful to to that.

Speaker 2 And it's also like if someone tries to give me a foot massage or a back massage,

Speaker 2 I go, Thank you so much, but two seconds is good.

Speaker 2 I'd rather pay someone, you know, I'll pay someone, and then I feel comfortable getting that massage.

Speaker 2 You know, so I don't really want a free, really short massage, or I'd rather just pay for it, okay? And that's how I feel about therapy.

Speaker 2 But about my father, I don't know, my biological father, he killed himself on Halloween five,

Speaker 2 six years ago.

Speaker 1 Fuck. I'm sorry.

Speaker 2 No, no, it's okay. I wasn't raised by him, and I never called him dad.

Speaker 2 The person I call dad is alive.

Speaker 2 And I remember I was nine years old when I said,

Speaker 2 can I call you dad? I was so nervous. Maybe I was 11 even.

Speaker 2 I had never called anyone dad yet. I have a very,

Speaker 2 we were in a Volkswagen Quantum, parked on the side of the PCH, just moved to America. I remember so nervous.
Later on,

Speaker 2 was the first show I ever played, was how nervous I was when I asked my stepfather, can I call you dad? So I hadn't called my biological father dad at all.

Speaker 2 But it was sad because we were just getting to know each other, and he killed himself on Halloween.

Speaker 2 Still my favorite holiday, though. Halloween.
Tell you that.

Speaker 1 That must have been at least a session with the therapist chatting about the Halloween suicide, wasn't it?

Speaker 2 I think, yeah, yeah, we talk about it.

Speaker 2 We talk about it. But

Speaker 2 I think a lot of the sessions lately are about enjoying thinking about moving and how fortunate I am that I have that opportunity. And

Speaker 2 about these two cats. I have two cats.
You know, actually, I really like Eckhart Toll. Eckhart Tolle is so popular, you can buy their books at the airport.

Speaker 2 I'm sure that Heathrow, you can get power of now. But anyways, he has a great line, which is, I have met many Zen masters.

Speaker 2 Most of them were cats.

Speaker 1 Yes, my sister's going to be nodding at that. What are your cats called?

Speaker 2 Oh, they're Yeshe Potato and Pema Prada. Slimy.

Speaker 2 And but why I find them, I mean, they're so fun to have around and I love them, but what they communicate about how to be loved is so, I need that daily reminder, which is,

Speaker 2 you know, respect and patience seem to be these two main ingredients of loving someone. You know, respect my space, respect what I'm asking of you, and be patient with me.
Hmm.

Speaker 2 You know, it just doesn't work when I go like, wow, let's play. Or yeah, you're mine.
Or, you know, any of these things, any of my neurosis starts to kind of creep in.

Speaker 2 They

Speaker 2 will communicate. No, no, no, that's really not how it works.
So, I've been finding that really cool.

Speaker 2 But, what happened?

Speaker 2 Can you talk about your father?

Speaker 2 What was that relationship like?

Speaker 1 Oh, man,

Speaker 1 I've talked about him so much, it's ludicrous. But, potted history is that nothing terrible happened at all.
He was a lovely man, he lived to a ripe old age, 91,

Speaker 1 and

Speaker 1 but he was older, he was from another generation,

Speaker 1 and

Speaker 1 he was quite stern, quite conservative in every sense of the word.

Speaker 1 And I think that he had ambitions for me and my life that I didn't fulfil.

Speaker 1 And I think when

Speaker 1 I ended up being a silly comedian and doing a lot of

Speaker 1 toilet jokes and recreating movies with toys, which is what I did on T V quite a lot in in the 90s with my comedy partner.

Speaker 1 I think he found it a little bit mystifying, and I always got the sense that he just thought

Speaker 1 he'd failed because I wasn't like a more sensible person.

Speaker 2 Wow.

Speaker 2 That's just painful for everyone.

Speaker 1 It is, but that's what happens with parents though, don't you think?

Speaker 1 It's like they probably, I would think that most children, or at least a lot of children, have a sense that their parents are disappointed in them somehow.

Speaker 1 And you just hand that shit on to the children that you have. It's inevitable because you have such high hopes for them.

Speaker 1 And it starts out, and you sort of think, right, I'm going to have kids, and I'm going to do everything right. And I'm not going to make any of the mistakes that my parents made.

Speaker 1 I'm going to give them a brilliant life and turn them into the kind of people that I wished I could have been, but never quite nailed.

Speaker 2 Sounds so easy. It was simple.
done. I mean, I get all, I don't have kids, so I should definitely be giving advice about this.

Speaker 2 And in fact, I think about Ram Das,

Speaker 2 who didn't have kids either, but his, I think if I ever did have kids,

Speaker 2 his beautiful line about that is, as far as children are concerned, just tend to the soil. Let the flower do its thing.

Speaker 2 I think, oh, that's a good one. I think I'd give that a try.
But I'd probably end up being like, no, grow like this and go this way and be a different flower.

Speaker 1 Don't tend to the soil like that. You're doing it all wrong for crying out loud.
Tend to the soil a bit harder. Put your back into it.
Come on.

Speaker 1 That's what I'd be like. Were your parents also kind of seeking enlightenment in that way? Or was that something that you came to independently?

Speaker 2 Oh, I want to ask you that question too. I wonder: what was the kind of what was the religious slash spiritual signifiers in your home?

Speaker 2 You know, what could you identify as being other than this normal world stuff?

Speaker 2 I wonder. So you think about that, and I'll answer your question really quick.
I was born into a family of these two people that were meditating around me a lot.

Speaker 2 There were Buddha sculptures, like fat little cherubic Buddha sculptures everywhere, and then some more Thai-looking Buddha sculptures, some copies of Be Here Now and things like that.

Speaker 2 So I grew up in that environment that was kind of Eastern

Speaker 2 fetishizing Eastern esoteric

Speaker 2 world, plus with my Indian name. So I felt quite comfortable and attracted to that stuff.

Speaker 2 I would see my mom meditating and I would think, oh, she's up there in the clouds, like flying around, seeing all these deities, I bet.

Speaker 2 And they would read to me the stories from just early those Hindu cartoons, you know, the story of Ganesh and Saraswati and Lakshmi. So I was familiar with all that stuff and loved it.

Speaker 2 But also I read Tintin as well. But Tintin in Tibet no less.
Anyways, I thought, wow, so this is interesting. This mysticism, this mystical stuff is really fascinating.

Speaker 2 It wasn't until much later that I in my thirties where I really actually like joined a religion and started to actually practice and build my life around these practices and these rituals that I do every day.

Speaker 2 And I still laugh at that concept of imagining someone meditating being just out there, oh, in bliss.

Speaker 2 It could not be further from the truth in terms of my experience. I'm just sitting, I'm more there than I am the rest of the day.
Everything else is this, like, I'm out there, out there.

Speaker 2 And then I'm sitting down, I'm just dealing with myself, my shit. And at moments, it's beautiful, but most of the time it is nightmare.
It's an apocalypse.

Speaker 2 But tell me about: were you surrounded with, were the crucifixes around? Were you going to church?

Speaker 2 Were you going to temple? I don't know. Were you going to

Speaker 2 the synagogue? I don't know. What was happening?

Speaker 1 No, none of that. It's a hard no for spirituality.

Speaker 2 Hard no.

Speaker 1 It was a spiritual wasteland. I think both my parents grew up religious.
And actually, my mum stayed religious and she went back to

Speaker 1 being a regular church goer in the last 20 years of her life when she was no longer living with my dad and when her children had left home and and her life was hers again and so then she reconnected with the church and I think it was important to her her faith but

Speaker 1 we didn't really get a sense of that when we were living at home we didn't go to church regularly we were sent away to boarding school and I think part of the deal with the schools that we were sent to was that there were regular church services.

Speaker 1 So I know my parents felt that that was an important thing that they wanted their children to experience.

Speaker 1 But I'm sorry to say that it never, you know, as far as we were concerned as students at those schools, it never really meant anything to us. It was something that we had to do.

Speaker 1 And we went there and we thought about other things and we zoned out. And, you know, they were happy moments and quasi-spiritual moments, singing hymns.

Speaker 1 When I think back, some of those hymns are absolute bangers. So So when you're singing for those in peril on the sea and things like that.

Speaker 2 Well, I bet that all of that helped you discover art, you know, because you didn't get, oh wow, it's so turned on by the imagery that spoke to you karmically.

Speaker 2 Because there's I think you're kind of born with this.

Speaker 2 Because with me, it's fascinating, what I'm attracted to naturally, versus what I just have no relationship with, even though I grew up around.

Speaker 2 Well, in Venezuela, it's it's church and it's all it's Christian thing. But I just thought, wow, this is interesting, but I have no, it doesn't speak to me.

Speaker 2 But then I'm a Buddhist, and certain Buddhist deities, particularly in Vajrayana, I'm just weeping. I'm just weeping.
I cannot believe their beauty, and I'm in love. So it feels like a karmic thing.

Speaker 2 And so you didn't necessarily feel that when you'd go to the forced church service, and that longing is still there, even though if we know it or not.

Speaker 2 And you maybe discover it through music and through art, through comedy, right? Maybe you saw some early paintings and heard some songs that you go, whoa, this is metaphysical. This is mystical.

Speaker 1 Yeah, 100%. It was all about music.
I got all of that from listening to David Bowie, from listening to Five Years for the first time and getting lost in that song.

Speaker 1 And being totally transported.

Speaker 1 And weird music, you know, I love the music on the radio. I love madness.
I love all that music in the early 80s in the UK that was really an explosion for so much odd

Speaker 1 stylistically varied music. I don't, I mean, I guess that's the music I grew up with, so I have a fondness for it.

Speaker 1 But I feel like it was a particularly, peculiarly adventurous time in music with that kind of post-punk new wave.

Speaker 2 And so catchy. Yeah.
Undeniably catchy. I think the specials changed my life without a doubt.
And I was obsessed.

Speaker 2 I didn't like one single Bad Manners song, yet I thought they were the coolest band in the world. And of course, the Body Snatchers, all those bands, it's the best.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 So you also probably found a sense of community, too.

Speaker 1 Yeah, there were so many other people. I mean, I bonded with many people throughout my life over David Bowie and Talking Heads and people like that.
You know, the feelings you described

Speaker 1 that you got from spirituality and being moved to tears. And that's what I get from music and still do.

Speaker 2 Do you have an answer for is there a song

Speaker 2 that you go, you know what? Let's change the song because I'm going to get too emotional.

Speaker 2 Can you think of that song? And I'm sure there's a few, but which one comes up? It's a song that you go,

Speaker 2 maybe I'm not right now, I can't really do that because it's going to hit some spots.

Speaker 1 Well, actually, I think about this a lot, and I've asked a few people that question. I was going to ask you about that because music is definitely something that I got from my mom.

Speaker 1 She was a big music fan, and so that's much more connected with her and after she died

Speaker 1 in fact I think the night after she died I set myself the challenge of listening to One Day I'll Fly Away by Randy Crawford because that was a song that she introduced me to and that I always will associate with her.

Speaker 1 And that was hardcore trying to get through that. And just because it was so baldly

Speaker 1 descriptive of everything that had just happened, the fact that she'd just died and

Speaker 1 everything about it, the yearning and the otherness in that song. And

Speaker 2 oh man.

Speaker 2 I follow the night.

Speaker 2 Can't stand the line

Speaker 2 when

Speaker 2 will I begin

Speaker 2 my life for game.

Speaker 2 One day I'll fly away.

Speaker 1 That's a beautiful song, anyway, but listening to that after my ma died, that was hardcore. But also

Speaker 1 actually, a song that people don't really believe that it can possibly make me emotional, but it does for some reason is Dance the Night Away by the Mavericks.

Speaker 2 I don't think I know how that goes.

Speaker 1 I just wanna dance the the night away.

Speaker 2 You know that one?

Speaker 2 It sounds familiar.

Speaker 1 With senior readers who can sway.

Speaker 2 Jeez,

Speaker 2 I feel like I've heard it, but I can't picture it. I just like hearing you sing it.

Speaker 2 Right now,

Speaker 2 Why does that make you why does that get you weepy?

Speaker 1 Because it's so kind of madly joyful.

Speaker 2 So you're up, you're raised, your tears, you're raised to tears. You have that feeling?

Speaker 1 Yeah, there's just something about like when you see, when you see something done really well, I always remember my dad saying

Speaker 1 about

Speaker 1 these ice dancers called Torville and Dean. Do you remember them?

Speaker 2 No, I don't recall.

Speaker 1 They were amazing. They were sort of Olympic champions and they were British.

Speaker 2 They were lemon juice and garbage.

Speaker 1 They did a famous routine to Ravel's Bolero.

Speaker 1 And they captured the imagination of the world with their ice dancing routine. And I always remember my dad saying,

Speaker 1 It's just so extraordinary to see anything done that well.

Speaker 1 There's something very special about it, and it's true when you see brilliant sports people at the peak of their powers, and you just think, Wow, look at them go, that is magic.

Speaker 1 It's quite moving, you know. And for some reason, that is encapsulated in Dance the Night Away by the Mavericks for me.
It's just so kind of madly optimistic and and joyful.

Speaker 1 Despite how cruel and cold the world is, it's like they're like, fuck it, let's just dance the night away with senoritas who can sway. And

Speaker 1 yeah, it's wonderful.

Speaker 2 I had a moment of this.

Speaker 2 I can relate to having that feeling that way about a song really recently, which is listening to All Night Long, which is, what's his name?

Speaker 1 Perfect Example. Perfect Example.

Speaker 2 Rich, what's his name?

Speaker 2 lionel richie lionel richie yeah i was listening to that song i was in japan and i'm listening to that song which which i had never noticed i'd never i'd never heard it as an adult it's a song you grew up with right so i just this is just recently it's like three weeks ago and i'm listening to that song because i just watched that we are the world documentary and it was so moving i love that documentary so much i was surprised i was kind of avoiding it who cares i'm not interested but then i watched it it's incredible so i got re-interested in lionel ritchie and check out his catalog i'm listening to all night long

Speaker 2 He does, first off, there's like eight accents that he does in that song. It's hilarious.
He's Jamaican, he's British, it's the whole thing. It's super funny and weird.
And

Speaker 2 you cannot help but feel this

Speaker 2 bliss, joy feeling. And I started to dance.
I'm just walking around in headphones and walking around Tokyo. And I started to dance.
And I realized I never dance. I do not dance.

Speaker 2 And I don't see people just dancing. Maybe even a quick little dance walking around.
Something about that made me really emotional, made me really sad. And it was something really beautiful about,

Speaker 2 you know, this: oh, wow, I can just kind of dance anytime, anywhere. This is a strange feeling.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 That's a brilliant example. I get that from that song too.
And that was fun, that documentary, wasn't it, about

Speaker 1 We Are the World.

Speaker 1 Did you like that bit with Bob Dylan looking absolutely lost?

Speaker 2 Of course.

Speaker 2 Of course. It's the best.
The best. It is the best.
It also was so humanizing. Yeah.
It's so sweet because I don't think of him as somebody that I've ever, you know, he's just not a person.

Speaker 2 Bob is just some other being,

Speaker 2 some spectral phantom being that is

Speaker 2 not at all here. So to see him go, I'm not sure how to do this.
Just to even have this human moment.

Speaker 2 Let me talk to Stevie Wonder.

Speaker 2 And then Stevie does his imitation of Bob and how to sing it.

Speaker 1 It's the coolest thing. I loved it.
I loved it.

Speaker 1 And Stevie Wonder, I mean, because it's a two-pronged attack from What's His Face, the producer, Quincy Jones.

Speaker 1 So, Bob, for listeners, for those of you who haven't seen this documentary, there's a bit, they're recording We Are the World. They're sort of doing all the arrangements.

Speaker 1 They're figuring out which of these super celebrities is going to sing which line. They get to Bob Dylan's line.
There's a chance we're

Speaker 2 taking.

Speaker 1 We're saving our own lives.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 1 that's how it ends up. But he doesn't know how how to sing it at all.
So he's literally mumbling. He's like,

Speaker 1 I don't really know what I'm doing.

Speaker 1 And so Quincy Jones takes him over to Stevie Wonder and says, Stevie, just give him some ideas.

Speaker 1 Stevie Wonder does a Bob Dylan impression and sort of gives him a read on the line, basically, doesn't he?

Speaker 2 And it's perfect.

Speaker 1 And so he just, so basically, Bob Dylan ends up doing an impression of Stevie Wonders, Bob Dylan impression.

Speaker 2 Ah, that's so cool. I mean, that's how I wrote all my first songs, was trying to cover songs, and it sounded so off.
It was so far from the song I was trying to cover.

Speaker 2 I was like, well, I guess I have my own song now.

Speaker 1 Hmm. You know what? The other song that you have done a beautiful version of for us is called The Body Breaks, and that's an older one.
That's from your album Rejoicing Hands, I think.

Speaker 2 2004. Yeah, yeah, that's an old one.
Oh, hello.

Speaker 1 Look at that. There's a beautiful cat there.
Hello. Can I take a screenshot of you and your beautiful cat?

Speaker 2 Of course. Here we go.

Speaker 2 You're a Hollywood cat now.

Speaker 1 But listen,

Speaker 1 it's been so nice meeting you and talking with you, Devendra. Thank you so much for giving up your time.

Speaker 2 Thanks, Adam. Total pleasure.
I love your work. It's an honor to be a part of this.
I'm going to listen to

Speaker 2 every episode except for this one.

Speaker 2 You owe me two songs.

Speaker 1 Oh yes. Hey look, I'll play you my charger one quickly.
Now let's see if I can do this.

Speaker 1 This is a jingle that features two elements.

Speaker 1 One element is a conservative philosopher that my dad was fond of, a guy called Roger Scruton.

Speaker 1 And it's elements of an essay, an audio essay that I heard of Roger Scruton's, where he's talking about the deadening effect of hearing pop music everywhere you go in public, and that was a sentiment that my dad strongly agreed with.

Speaker 1 So I put that in this jingle.

Speaker 1 And then there's another section in the jingle, which is a sort of, I'm sort of channeling my dad, and he is complaining about not being able to find his phone charger, which is why I thought of your song Charger from your last album.

Speaker 2 Is that real melody?

Speaker 2 Have you seen my phone charger?

Speaker 2 I left it right there.

Speaker 2 Did you see it?

Speaker 2 Have you got it?

Speaker 2 Where's my charger gone? Woof, what?

Speaker 2 Where's my phone charger?

Speaker 2 The battery's about to die.

Speaker 2 It was on the table. Woof, woof, boop.

Speaker 2 Round and round in their heads go the chord progressions, the empty lyrics, and the impoverished fragments of tune.

Speaker 2 And boom goes the brain box.

Speaker 2 At the start of every bar.

Speaker 2 Boom goes the brain box.

Speaker 2 There you go.

Speaker 1 So that was musically, it was inspired by Playboy Carti.

Speaker 2 I mean, all I heard was the follow-up to We Are the World, and all I saw was the world finally singing in harmony.

Speaker 2 To boom, goes the brain box. I I mean, and your father's voice is incredible.
It's incredible. I love this song.
It's brilliant. Good job.

Speaker 1 Thank you so much. Well, it's an honor to play it to you, and it's quite surreal experience having you enjoy it.
So thank you.

Speaker 1 But now we are going to conclude with your beautiful version of The Body Breaks. Is there something you would like to say about this song?

Speaker 2 It's not as good as... Where's my charger?

Speaker 1 Oh, my song. Well, I've got the actual name of the jingle.

Speaker 2 Yeah, what's the name of the jingle?

Speaker 1 I call it Playboy Buckles, is the actual how it's labeled.

Speaker 2 Amazing. Okay, so this song that you're about to play that I recorded just for you, called The Body Breaks, is my attempt at covering Playboy Buckles.

Speaker 2 And like I said, I don't do covers well, so it ended up sounding a little bit different. Alright, great.

Speaker 1 Here is Devendra singing a specially recorded version of The Body Breaks.

Speaker 1 Your body breaks, then your body is fine. I'm open to yours, and I'm open to mine.

Speaker 1 Your body aches, and then it takes its time.

Speaker 2 But you'll get over yours, and I hope to get over mine.

Speaker 2 And the sun will shine

Speaker 2 and the moon will rise

Speaker 2 Your body calls, yeah, your body calls out

Speaker 2 It It whispers at first,

Speaker 2 but it ends with a shout.

Speaker 2 Your body burns, yeah, your body burns strong. Until mine is with yours, mine will burn on.

Speaker 2 My flesh sinks out.

Speaker 2 Mama, come put me out.

Speaker 2 Your body sways like the wind on a swing

Speaker 2 A bridge through a hood,

Speaker 2 a lake through a ring

Speaker 2 Your body stays, then your body moves on

Speaker 2 I'd really rather not dwell on when yours will be gone

Speaker 2 Still within the dark,

Speaker 2 there'll always be a mirror shine,

Speaker 2 one tiny spark

Speaker 2 forever yours

Speaker 2 and mine.

Speaker 2 Wait, continue.

Speaker 1 Hey, welcome back, Podcats. That was Devendra Banhart, and that second performance there was of a track called The Body Breaks.

Speaker 1 Now, you may be able to hear that I am no longer in London Town. It's a day later, and I'm back in Norfolk on a beautiful sunny day now, although it is very cold.
But the skies are blue.

Speaker 1 Over there, you can hear the sounds of guys cutting down Christmas trees. Santa's murderous Christmas tree elves.

Speaker 1 Rosie is back with me. She is loping along beside me.

Speaker 1 We just had a bit of a

Speaker 1 toilet emergency. I won't go into detail.
Suffice to say that

Speaker 1 I think her change of diet following her teeth operation

Speaker 1 has

Speaker 1 complicated things in the nether regions as far as her movements go trying to use all the euphemisms I possibly can to protect you from the reality of what just happened which was

Speaker 1 unprecedented

Speaker 1 with dog legs.

Speaker 1 It was basically a imagine the biggest dingleberry you've ever seen in your entire life in the most hairiest zone.

Speaker 1 I've said too much, haven't I? But that was quite an operation to sort that out, wasn't it, Rosie? I do not consent to being spoken about this way.

Speaker 1 I apologise, but it's only to illustrate that we love you and we'd do anything for you, and I hope you would do the same for me

Speaker 1 if that happened with me.

Speaker 1 Let's wait and see, shall we? Yeah, okay.

Speaker 1 In the description of today's podcast, you'll find a handful of links to a couple of Devendra-related videos. One of them is...
Oh, Rosie, a little sneeze there.

Speaker 1 One of them is Devendra's appearance on What's In My Bag, in which interesting people get to wander around amoeba records in Los Angeles and pick out music they're interested in and talk about it.

Speaker 1 That's one of those YouTube shows where I can watch about 20 on the trot.

Speaker 1 One day I'd like to spend an entire evening with some other people who are similarly minded and watch just loads of what's in my bag interspersed with tiny desk concerts on MPR

Speaker 1 and maybe a few of those KEXP, is that what they're called, concerts? They do some really good ones. Actually, we did a bit of that the other night, me and my son.

Speaker 1 First, watching Eddie Murphy clips after I watched the Netflix documentary about Eddie Murphy,

Speaker 1 which I half enjoyed, first half loved, second half, hmm.

Speaker 1 But it did make me go back and

Speaker 1 watch some of the less offensive highlights of Eddie's live material.

Speaker 1 Still pretty funny, a lot of that.

Speaker 1 And we also had a munch on some tiny desks.

Speaker 1 Recent one with Pulp, Aldous Harding. She's a very unnerving, compelling performer.

Speaker 1 Also, if you haven't seen that Catrielle and Paco Amoroso tiny desk concert,

Speaker 1 that's good fun.

Speaker 1 Since I did my intro,

Speaker 1 we went to see Radiohead, when I say we, me and the family,

Speaker 1 and some of our pals, Garth Jennings, with whom I made some music videos for Radiohead back in 2007, just after they'd released In Rainbows.

Speaker 1 And we did the video, myself and Garth, for Jigsaw Falling Into Place, among others, with the helmet cams.

Speaker 1 And when they played that song at the O2 on Saturday night,

Speaker 1 that was quite a moment.

Speaker 1 And Garth Garth and I exchanged looks I think we both felt on some level that it's slightly our song too

Speaker 1 okay so we didn't write it or perform it or anything like that but we made the music video so we are at least a footnote in the life of that song and they did an amazing version of it I had heard them play it before but they nailed everything that is

Speaker 1 so thrilling about that song when they performed it the other night

Speaker 1 and that was just one of many songs that sounded as good as I've ever heard them

Speaker 1 live exit music for a film

Speaker 1 which is one of the songs from okay computer that I have to confess I never really loved as much as some of the other ones on there

Speaker 1 You know, it's that one. It's obviously good,

Speaker 1 but maybe it was. I don't know, I think I used to find it a bit much

Speaker 1 because it builds into a real like

Speaker 1 everything's happening, and all the synthesizers are rumbling, and

Speaker 1 I used to prefer some of the mellower tracks like Subterranean Homesick Alien.

Speaker 1 And then, you know, Paranoid Android, yes, great, you've got all the drama in there, but I don't know. Anyway, so I never connected with Exit Music before, but on Saturday,

Speaker 1 it was incredible. It was incredible.

Speaker 1 His voice is great and also the lighting and the visuals they're playing in the round and they've got this cylinder of semi-transparent screens on which live visuals play but all the visuals are heavily processed.

Speaker 1 and have various different effects applied to them depending on what song is playing and that plus this beautiful light show

Speaker 1 and then all the people holding up the the lights on their phones in some of the tracks like no surprises and that one exit music

Speaker 1 in the O2 arena which is 25,000 people I think it was

Speaker 1 full to capacity perhaps more people in there than they've ever had because they are playing in the round so they're able to use every space really to get audience in

Speaker 1 and it was really one of those moments where you just think come on this is great us all here singing and experiencing this at the same time and there were there were so many moments like that weird fishes is another one where the crowd go nuts and but jigsaw falling into place all those

Speaker 1 you know and the audience are all chanting along and wow nothing beats that feeling of being in a big crowd and

Speaker 1 all just being a part of that music and seeing it performed so well. So, the actual show itself was amazing.

Speaker 1 Getting into the O2 and then getting out again, going on the tube, that wasn't that much fun, but it wasn't too bad.

Speaker 1 Like, immediately afterwards, we got out, and the thousands of people all heading towards the entrance for North Greenwich Tube

Speaker 1 made my heart sink. I said to my wife,

Speaker 1 I don't think I can handle that

Speaker 1 It's gonna give me the fear. Let's just walk.

Speaker 2 She said we can't walk

Speaker 2 so

Speaker 1 We got in the scrum, but it moved fairly quickly. It was mad though.
It was like there had been some disastrous event and just this mob of people moving

Speaker 1 as one into the station and then down the escalator kind of filtering themselves in just this blob of humanity people

Speaker 1 right up against each other barely standing up like you sometimes you feel you're being kept upright by just the pressure of all the people around you pinning you in place it's not good if you've got agoraphobia

Speaker 1 And then on the escalator as well, I was thinking, I hope nobody trips over, otherwise it's going to be gnarly. Anyway, it was fine.
And it was a nice atmosphere.

Speaker 1 It was a mix of people who had just been hanging out at the O2 and a lot of radio head concert goers.

Speaker 1 And everyone was in a good mood. There was no shouting and bad vibes.
You know, sometimes you go to a far-right rally, and afterwards, the crowd is a little more agitated, I find, on

Speaker 1 the tube. Wasn't like that.
on Saturday, I'm happy to say.

Speaker 1 Hey, I forgot to say before,

Speaker 1 I'm going to be on TV on Friday with the Adam Buxton band. We're going to play a song from Buckle Up.
Not sure exactly which song we're going to play yet.

Speaker 1 We were thinking maybe shorts or maybe tea towel. Anyway, we're playing it on the last leg with Adam Hills and Josh and Alex.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 1 that's live, live television. Performing music on live television.
Pretty sure I haven't done that before.

Speaker 1 So tune in. See what happens.
Wish me luck. Well look, that's it for this week.
Thank you to Seamus Murphy Mitchell for his always invaluable production support. Thanks to Helen Green.

Speaker 1 She does the artwork for the podcast. Thank you to everyone at ACAST who liaises with my sponsors.
But as ever, my most hearty heartfelt thanks go to you.

Speaker 1 I appreciate you coming back and exploring another episode. Hope you had a good time.

Speaker 1 How'd you feel about a creepy hug?

Speaker 1 Sure, you do come here, hey.

Speaker 2 Good to see you.

Speaker 1 Hope you're doing alright.

Speaker 1 And until next time, we hang out in the same sonic space.

Speaker 1 Please go carefully because it's very unpredictable out there. And for what it's worth, I love you.