Don't Disrespect Our Oval Office — Trump/Vance v. Zelenskyy

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Hello, this is producer Blake. We've got a lot going on right now.
So Charlie was recording earlier today, but we just had some very remarkable public diplomacy go down in the White House. Volodymyr Zelensky, the president of Ukraine, was in Washington today to sign the rare earth minerals deal that he and Trump recently negotiated.
They held a public conversation with the press in one of the rooms of the White House. And something none of us have ever seen before just happened.
First, let's welcome in who you actually just saw. Alex Marlowe is rejoining us once again.
Are you there, Alex? Yeah, I'm there, Blake. It's absolutely incredible, incredible.
So again, to set this up, I was watching this. A lot of the clips have been out of context.
But what basically happened is Trump and Zelensky were talking out the deal. Trump was saying, I want peace, all of this.
And then J.D. Vance was there, Vice President Vance.
And he talks about, OK, we're going to try to develop better diplomacy with Russia to work towards peace. And something incredible happens where Zelensky, he basically picks a fight with Vance he says he was going on oh we had these deals with russia and then russia broke all these deals so what kind of diplomacy do you want us to do he basically picks a fight with him and it it explodes uh it goes on for about uh 10 minutes so let's do let's do a clip 271 i'm talking about the kind of diplomacy that's going to end the destruction of your country.
Yes, but if you are not strong... Mr.
President, with respect, I think it's disrespectful for you to come into the Oval Office and try to litigate this in front of the American media. Right now you guys are going around and forcing conscripts to the front lines because you have manpower problems.
You should be thanking the President for trying to bring an end to this conflict. Have you ever been to Ukraine that you say what problems we have? I have been to...
Come once. I've actually watched and seen the stories, and I know what happens is you bring people, you bring them on a propaganda tour, Mr.
President. Do you disagree that you've had problems bringing people into your military? And do you think that it's respectful to come to the Oval Office of the United States of America

and attack the administration that is trying to prevent the destruction of your country?

A lot of questions. Let's start from the beginning.

First of all, during the war, everybody has problems.

Even you. But you have nice ocean and don't feel now.

But you will feel it in the future. God bless.
You don't know that. God bless.
God bless. You will not have war.
Don't tell us what we're going to feel. We're trying to solve a problem.
Don't tell us what we're going to feel. I'm not telling you.
Because you're in no position to dictate that. Remember this.
You're in no position to dictate what we're going to feel. We're going to feel very good.
You will feel influence feel very good and very strong. You're right now not in a very good position.
You've allowed yourself to be in a very bad position and he happens to be right about it. You're not in a good position.
You don't have the cards right now. With us, you start having cards.
Right now, you're playing cards. You're gambling with the lives of millions of people.
You're gambling with World War III. You're gambling with World War III.
And what you're doing is very disrespectful to the country, this country. It's back to you.
Far more than a lot of people said they should have. Have you said thank you once? A lot of times.
No, in this entire meeting, you said thank you. You went to Pennsylvania and campaigned for the opposition in October.
Offer some words of appreciation for the United States of America and the president who's trying to save your country. So just a second.
So that recently wrapped up. And then we had this statement just released from President Trump on Truth Social.
I'm not sure what the number is, but let's put it up if we can. We had a very meaningful meeting in the White House today.
Much was learned that could never be understood without conversation under such fire and pressure. It's amazing what comes out through emotion.
I have determined that President Zelensky is not ready for peace if America is involved, because he feels our involvement gives him a big advantage in negotiations. I don't want advantage.
I want peace. He disrespected the United States of America in its cherished Oval Office.
He can come back when he is ready for peace. And a follow-up press conference between Trump and Zelensky, they are reporting, has been canceled.
Zelensky's motorcade pulled up to the White House. I believe he may have already departed.
Alex, what do we make of all of this? Yeah, it's very interesting to watch Zelensky kind of buckle under the pressure of the moment. This was the moment for him to take his medicine, which is that he's vulnerable unless he is the backing of the United States or NATO countries.
He's not a NATO country. The United States, especially President Trump, has been proactive about giving him weaponry.
He got javelin missiles from Trump proactively, which even Biden didn't do that. Trump had been an ally of Ukraine.
And this has been a big myth I talked about with Charlie, people who are just tuning into the show on the pre-tape segment, where I talked about how Trump had helped Ukraine immeasurably. The American media had prevented the public from being aware of that.
And he comes in and he's essentially lecturing us on our emotions. He's appealing to our emotions and how we feel about stuff because Putin invaded.
Buddy, we don't care who started this thing. We just want it to end.
And that was the memo that Zelensky did not get. And Vance made very good points about how Zelensky had come to Pennsylvania and campaigned on behalf of Kamala Harris and the Democrats.
He'd come to campaign for the other guys. And Trump is still trying to broker a peace so no more Ukrainians die.
The price of that peace is going to be he's going to have to share the rare earth with us. That should be a good compromise to any good negotiator.
But Zelensky could not handle it. He kind of freaked out there.
That was an unbelievable thing to scold the vice president and the president about our emotions in the Oval Office. I admit I've never seen something like that happen in the public.
It really is incredible. Charlie tweeted just a few minutes ago that this is the most transparent display of diplomacy in history.
I literally cannot think of another example like it going all the way back. You'll hear about arguments between world leaders that happen at summits that happen in private but nothing where you know a super like an engagement that appeared to be polite appeared to be you know kind of a formality explodes like that goes on for several minutes and it looks like a lot of people are reacting they're saying zelinskiky screwed it up we have a mark teason he is a he was a former speech writer for bush he's kind of a more hawkish republican he literally has ukraine's flag in his uh profile in his profile name on x and he says this is entirely zelensky's fault trump greeted him graciously was ready to turn the page, just said he wanted to get help, help Ukraine get its territory back.
And Zelensky comes in, gets into a fight in public. I've never seen anything like it in my life.
Blake, can I add something here that I think is really important? He's anticipating the American media is going to take his side. And what does that say about the American press? Zelensky is only doing this in front of the press because he thinks they're on his team, not the president of the United States team.
And I got to tell you, I bet he was correct to assume that. Watch how the media reacts to this story, because this one is a total Rorschach test.
If you're on the pro-America side, if you're on the America first side, you see what Trump and Vance did is defend our nation, our sovereignty. What Zelensky did is attack us despite our graciousness and the fact that we've given them so much.
It is totally outside of the realm of possibility that this would have happened if we had oppressed that actually cared about this country more than ukraine and it's such it's such a bafflingly bad play to me because i trump has been the biggest guy in american politics for a decade and i think anyone who isn't honestly looks at the way he is you can kind of understand how you would appeal to trump and if zelensky came in and was just over the top i'm we're so grateful for the aid you've given We're so grateful for the aid. You would have never let this war start, Mr.
President. The war, the invasion didn't happen, you know, while you were president.
If he had that approach, I bet it would like really win Trump over. Trump would think, ah, I can work with this Zelensky guy.
We can we can get something going here. And to instead throw in your lot to just assume, oh, well, the the media the same people who very badly failed at stopping Trump in 2024 they'll tear him down they'll wreck his administration and that will force him to give me more money to keep the war going I just I really cannot figure out what was driving this to happen unless maybe he just didn't expect it to blow up that way.
But he should have he should have backpedaled once he saw what was going on. And instead, they just escalated it.
And they gave us I would say this is certainly the single most memorable moment of of the new Trump administration so far. Yeah, it's explosive.
The reaction online are unbelievable. My my newsroom at Breitbart is everyone is going absolutely nuts for this.
It's just people don't even know what to make of it exactly. For some calamity like this to happen, it's got to be a multifactorial origin.
I think Zelensky probably has some language issues. I bet he could have chosen better words if he was more of a native English speaker.

I think that's part of it.

I think he's completely arrogant because of the American media and the way they've treated him in the past and the Democrat Party that's welcomed him and flown the Ukraine flag and all these people, even establishment rhino-type neocons who have been so pro-Ukraine relentlessly. I don't think he got a dose of reality.
I think this stuff that J.D. Vance was saying is all common knowledge to us.
People listen to Charlie's show. People listen to my show.
They know that Zelensky went and campaigned for Democrats, which was election interference on behalf of the Democrats in our country. They know that we'd given them over $100 billion and a lot of it had disappeared.
We don't know where it went. Tucker says it went to ski resorts and I have no reason to doubt him.
We don't like this guy that much. I don't think he understood that.
I don't think he understood that he needed to come in there and he needed to say, hey, Trump, you're the man. This is your moment.
This is your media now. And I'm going to work with you to broker a peace.
That is the moment we're in. And he couldn't do it.
He tried to save face in some way. And it will go down as perhaps a historic, historic failure for him and for his country.
Let's play another one of the clips here.

I think we can fit this one in just to show what the vibe is.

Let's do a clip 268.

This is another funny exchange.

Let's show it.

She's asking what if Russia breaks the ceasefire?

What if they what if anything?

What if a bomb drops on your head right now?

OK, what if they broke it?

I don't know.

They broke it with Biden because Biden, they didn't respect respect him they didn't respect obama they respect me let me tell you putin went through a hell of a lot with me he went through a phony witch hunt where they used him and russia russia russia russia you ever hear of that deal that was a phony that was a phony hunter biden joe biden scam hillary Clinton, Shifty Adam Schiff. It was a Democrat scam.
And he had to go through that. And he did go through it.
We didn't end up in a war. And he went through it.
He was accused of all that stuff. He had nothing to do with it.
It came out of Hunter Biden's bathroom. It came out of Hunter Biden's bedroom.
We've been on this story so long it's easy to forget sometimes this all kind of started with you remember he gave zelensky the call in 2018 or 2019 and then they said we have to impeach him over that hunter biden we've come we have come a long way since then uh but yeah alex so how do we see this play now let's assume zelensky's correct that the media do take his side and they talk, you know, they'll say Trump disgraced America with his bad diplomatic protocol or whatever. How do you see that shaping out with the American public? Yeah, this might be one where they might see the writing on the wall that they can't do that this time because you cannot come into our Oval Office, one of the hallowed grounds on American soil,

and to be so spoiled.

He just comes off as a spoiled baby.

Trump was trying to be gracious, trying to help him.

And I feel like it is going to be a big,

it's something that Zelensky certainly calculated

he would have the people in the room,

the press who were there, they would have his back.

But for him to come out and to suggest

that Trump has been anything short of trying to broker a peace that provides a best case scenario for Ukraine is just inaccurate. And he needed to turn that page.
He needed to move on. And he wants to go re-litigate that Putin did invade his territory.
That's true. But again, that is not the focal point right now.
The focal point now is not how this started. It's how we bring it to a peace before things get worse.
It's noteworthy that the average age of the Ukrainian troops now is in the mid-40s. They're mid-40s.
It wasn't how it was at the beginning of the war. They've lost hundreds of thousands of people.
Russia, I think, has lost a million people. It's time to end this thing for the good of humanity.
And anyone who is not prepared to do that is just going to be – it is not going to be welcome in the eyes of Trump who wants this thing cleaned up so he can go back to focusing on his agenda. And Vance jumping in there and defending our honor as a country after Zelensky wasted so much of our money.
And he went against Trump despite how Trump was helpful to him when Trump was president. And Zelensky knew it.
Zelensky didn't hate Trump before. I don't think he hates him now.
It's one of these things where Vance was defending our honor and then Zelensky gets emotional about it like a baby. Unbelievable stuff.
And I just don't know how the media spins it. Maybe, but they'll try.
They will try. And I suppose the million, the $100 billion question is, what is the impact of this on the actual war? Does this somehow bring us closer to peace? And i think the answer is we don't know uh it would i i think i would consider it a tragedy charlie would consider it a tragedy if that were to result in you know if this means there is no peace russia crushes ukraine hundreds of thousands of people die i don't think that's what president trump wants He genuinely does want peace.
We want peace, but we can only have peace if every party involved actually wants it to happen. And today it kind of did have the look that rather than pursuing peace, Zelensky wanted to pursue this dunk on Vice President Vance.
Why don't you give us your thoughts, Alex, on that part of it? Are we closer to peace or farther away? Yeah, yeah, Blake, one thing that's really interesting here that I was thinking about is that there's been a lot of back and forth about whether or not Ukraine has all these these rare earths. And the EU says that they've got all these rare earths.
I've got a lot of them. They've got like 5% of the world's rare earths.
And there's been a lot of dispute about that. Russian media says they don't have as much.
And, you know, I don't tend to trust Russian media at face value, but it's an interesting possibility that maybe Russia was right and the EU was wrong. Again, all else being equal, I tend to trust the EU more than Russia, but who trusts the EU that much? Maybe there's something going on that maybe there aren't as many of these minerals that we thought we were going to get when we were brokering this piece.
And maybe that was part of the underlying thing. Maybe that's why Zelensky was freaking out is that that could have been exposed.
So that's another thing because the deal was not signed. So apparently Zelensky's left the White House, been kicked out of the White House now.
So he's on his way home. And if there's no deal signed yet, then what was this all about? We kicked him out.
Wow. That unbelievable.
Forget the most viral part of this Trump presidency. This feels like a top five crazy moment in the entire Trump era.
Yeah, this is really exciting. This is what we live for in the news business.
And I love to see America defended by, it's a double whammy for me because it's America's first guy. I love to see Vance and Trump defend America, and I just like the clarity with the way both of them spoke.
Zelensky, he's got a disadvantage because it's our home soil and he doesn't speak the language naturally. But Vance and Trump defending our honor was great to see.
I think it's a historic moment for both of those men, and I think the country will ultimately be grateful for that display. It's – yeah, it's a new mode of diplomacy.
It's the most transparent diplomacy we'll ever see. All right.
We actually have Andrew now. Andrew, can you – Yeah, we do.
You're there to join us. What's your reaction? Yes.
I mean, I think what you guys were just saying, I've never in the history of diplomacy of White House visits seen anything like this. It's explosive.
It's unprecedented. I don't know if anybody in the news media landscape knows where things go from here, other than the fact that Zelensky has left the White House house there's been no deal signed i mean that is a complete devolution of that relationship um and it is historic i'm i mean normally these things are scripted everybody plays nice it's everybody's on their best behavior the fact that jd vance blew all that up i mean really it was zelinski but the fact that jd vance stepped in and as alex has defended our country's honor in that moment was striking i think it says a lot about his courage his he's got you know we've been talking about uh doge and big balls well i think we got a we got another guy here uh that that uh that also exhibited a lot of courage under fire and a lot of gusto and and i'm really proud of jd for standing up for our honor he's gonna get lambasted in the in the msm and the legacy news media for breaking protocol whatever i don't care zelensky started this exchange and jd vance wasn't going to sit idly by watching it happen i completely think that zelensky comes out looking like the unhinged foreign oligarch that he is um and i think people with eyes to see it are going to see it i think this changes dramatically at least in the short run the way that that I see this negotiation for peace playing out.

But it could very well mean that Zelensky is going to simply defy anything that the U.S. proposes, even if we try and broker a peace.
Zelensky could very well just try and thumb his nose at the Americans, which is, I would say, political death sentence for him if he actually allows a democratic process to play out within Ukraine. So we're in uncharted territory.
But I absolutely, to your point, Alex, I think before where you said he's never been confronted with the depth of his, just how unpopular he's become, and especially within conservative circles and this was a come to jesus moment for him that he simply refused to acknowledge because he's had smoke blown up as you know what for so long uh with you know hollywood the foreign press our our press in the united states so i i just it couldn't i couldn't be more stunned surprised that this happened, but actually really grateful at J.D. Vann.
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I believe we have another guest. We have Kurt Schlichter joining us from his automobile.
Are you able to hear us, Kurt? I can. How do you like? Beautiful West Texas.
Oh, it looks very lovely God bless America all right I've been on that drive and it's for it's uh it's one heck of a drive and and the the beauty of it is it's full of the kind of Americans that uh Zielinski never talks to Zielinski never sees Zielinski stays in the cities when he comes and doesn't understand that the people out here who have to pay for this in treasure and, if necessary, in blood are. And I don't think he understands that when he runs his little foreigner mouth at the guy we just elected president and gets put in his place, which is subordinate to the United States of America, normal Americans are going to cheer.
And I want to tell you, I say that as a friend of the Ukrainians. I trained Ukrainian soldiers in Ukraine when I was in the army.
I deployed. A Ukrainian unit was with us.
I sympathized with them. I wish they could win their war.
I think they fought very bravely, but're not going to take a lot of gut from some foreign potentate that is not in the cards it's not happening and uh you were right uh andrew they were blowing smoke up his fourth point of contact and uh he got high on his own supply couldn't agree more couldn't agree more um uh we i i'm told we haven played this, so I apologize. I'm coming in late.
I tried to schedule a doctor's appointment conveniently with other scheduling dynamics that we had. Rushed back.
273. This is CNN Christiane Amanpour's reaction to what just transpired in the Oval Office, 273.
Never in the history of modern diplomacy, war, peace, whatever, have I ever, ever, ever seen anything like it. We just have to hope that for the safety of the free world and for the American people, for the European people, for the Ukrainian people, that these two presidents get out of the press and try to iron out their differences.
This was an entirely personal go-to with so many mistruths and misfires. Totally in line with what I was saying.
Nothing like it. Yeah.
Who wants to take the mistruths and miss facts uh well look i haven't had a chance to see the whole exchange i think you saw plenty right there uh it is personal but it's more than just individuals it's about the united states of america and that's why jd vance uh did such a great job standing up for the country. Our country's not going to take guff from little foreign boat dates anymore.
It isn't going to happen. As for Christine Onampoor, you know, it would go a long way if every once in a while you took America's side in a fight.
It would have gone a lot, you know, you'd have done Zelensky a favor if you said hey normal Americans the guys who drive trucks the guys who shoot guns the guys who actually elected this president have a lot of doubts about you Zelensky they look at you they look at your background they don't trust you they think you're corrupt maybe instead presuming to lecture them from some sort of moral high ground, you were handed by a bunch of Hollywood halfwits and regime media superstars. You came in and you made your case about how you're fighting for the freedom of your country against invaders and how you need America's help.
Please, please help us. We're very, very brave.
And now that would have struck an entirely different chord and we'd be in a very different place. But you know what? We're not going to be ignored.
We're not going to be insulted. We're not going to be treated like children told to sit there and be quiet and not spoken until we're spoken to.
That isn't in the cards. That's not how this presidency works.
Well, you know, Kurt, what strikes me here is that this could essentially force Zelensky to run into the arms of Europe and Europe's talking tough on Russia still. But here's the problem.
They have so, you know, they have so lacked. There's been a lack of investment in their own security defense because they've been leaning on the United States.
And so Trump had that one line where he said, you have no cards to play. You have no cards to play.
His only card is to run into the arms of the europeans but the europeans are feckless weak they have not invested in their own security and so is that even a card to play what does zelensky do next well look in worst case it's you know oh please don't throw me inar patch. What, he's going to show Trump by doing exactly what Trump wants him to do?

I mean, the Europeans have already tried that.

Well, we're just going to have to, you know, you're mad at us for not carrying our fair share of NATO.

So I guess we're just going to have to show you by carrying our fair share of NATO.

Oh, no, please don't do exactly what he wants. There are no cards to play.
Look, I used to negotiate for a living when I was a full-time lawyer, and sometimes you walk in with nothing, and maybe you can bluff, maybe, but if you have a master negotiator like Donald Trump, are you gonna bet on bluffing out bluffing him come on come on that's crazy talk i totally agree uh blake what is this a bluff from trump or is this was this like he he means he means business yeah i feel like you can never know uh trump is he he's very much – That's his genius. Well, yeah.
It's like it's – there was the famous – they called it like the madman theory where Nixon would act like he was very – he would cultivate the idea that he could do anything so that people would respect him. And Trump – the best way to actually have people believe that about you is to actually be that way.
And, you know, Trump really can be a guy who can swerve very much. He can seem this implockable enemy, and then he's actually very eager to make a deal.
But he can hold a grudge, too. And so I think it's one of those things where when you're watching it, you're never quite sure what will happen.
But as we saw in the first term, it had this pattern of eventually working out that it would seem very chaotic. It would seem like it was causing conflict.
And then actually, surprisingly, he'd get on really well with the Mexican president, who was this big left winger, and we'd get remain in Mexico. He would actually successfully renegotiate the trade deals.
He would go North Korea there's this special thing with Trump where whatever he's doing ends up working out surprisingly well I don't know how this will fit into it we'll have to see we'll have to see what unfolds to say the least I very much wonder if maybe what what could happen is Trump will say we're happy to make more concessions with Ukraine, make a better deal. But Zelensky specifically needs to resign.
And that would be an interesting way to get him out and also bring, make Ukraine a democracy again. Say you guys have to hold an election.
We'll support a democracy if it's an actual democracy, not a sort of military dictatorship for the duration. There's a lot of ways I can see this shaking out.
Yeah, and Kurt, I don't know if you saw the statement because I know you're driving, but President Trump released a statement basically saying he's not ready for peace yet. He disrespected us in our cherished cherished oval office but here's how he ends it he says he can come back when he is ready for peace basically trump is saying there's no option to move forward we settle or you're on your own uh i think that's uh an excellent statement of the present situation.
And look, again, as I said, I sympathize with the Ukrainians, but I'm an American, and I believe in American interest. It is in America's interest for this war to end.
It's costing us money. It's risking our lives.
It is not in America's interest for this Ukraine war to continue. We have Zelensky leaving the White House early.
Apparently the agreement they were going to sign has gone unsigned. We saw a diplomatic deal collapse in real time.
I've been reacting here with producer Andrew, who had to leave the doctor's appointment early, as well as Kurt Schlichter. We haven't played every video that we have available from this, so I kind of want to go back to play one of these because they're pretty incredible.
This is a very interesting argument over basically saying the word thank you. Let's play clip 272.
It's going to be a very hard thing to do business like this. I tell you, I said a lot of times to American except that there are disagreements and let's go litigate those disagreements rather than trying to fight it out in the American media when you're wrong.
We know you're wrong. But you see, I think it's good for the American people to see what's going on.
I think it's very important. That's why I kept this going so long.
You have to be thankful. You don't have the cards.
You're buried there. Your people are dying.
You're running low on soldiers. Listen, you're running low on soldiers.
It would be a damn good thing. Then you tell us, I don't want a ceasefire.
I don't want a ceasefire. I want to go and I want this.
Look, if you could get a ceasefire right now, I tell you, you take it. So the bullets stop flying and your men stop getting killed.
Of course, we want to stop the war. But I said to you, I want a ceasefire because you'll get a ceasefire faster than a degree.
Ask our people about ceasefire. What do you think? It wasn't with me.
It doesn't matter for you. That wasn't with me.
That was with a guy named Biden who was not a smart person. That was your that was your president.
It was your president. Excuse me.
That was with Obama who gave you sheets and I gave you javelins. Yes.
I gave you the javelins to take out all those tanks. Obama gave you sheets.
In fact, the statement is Obama gave sheets

and Trump gave javelins.

You got to be more thankful

because let me tell you, you don't have the cards.

With us, you have the cards.

But without us, you don't have any cards.

Just one of several crazy exchanges there.

I want to get this.

This was just posted a short time ago

by Jackie Heinrich with, I believe, Fox News reporting out the story. She says White House officials tell Fox first Trump kicked Zelensky out of the White House.
He did not leave on his own. Trump kicked him out.
It says the rare earths deal was not signed. The White House claims that the Ukrainians were begging to reset negotiations, but Secretary of State Rubio informed them Zelensky needed to leave the White House grounds and return when he is ready for peace.
The president and U.S. officials felt disrespected by Zelensky's rhetoric and his demeanor.
They cited that he was, quote, shrugging and rolling his eyes during the conversation. And then she adds this.
This is incredible. When I went to the upper press to ask what was going on, the lunch that Trump and Zelensky were supposed to be dining on and while talking was sitting out in the hallway.
I am told that White House press office staffers will be eating it. So that's the current state of things.
Zelensky kicked out of the White House and told, come back when you're ready for peace. Oh, man.
When have we ever seen anything like this? And I got to tell you, it's refreshing. And Donald Trump did on purpose.
As he said, I want the American people to see what I'm dealing with. Well, they have, and I got to tell you, most normal Americans are going to go, damn right, Mr.
President, damn right. And you just watch for the people who side with the foreigner.
Just watch for the people who make excuses for the guy who hasn't held an election in years. Watch who sides with us and who sides with them.
I totally, I totally agree with this. You know, I've been thinking about this clip a lot lately, Kurt, it was that Jasmine Crockett and she was.
I think she was talking about the hockey game with U.S. versus Canada.
And she was saying, I'm rooting for Canada. I'm rooting for Mexico.
This is a sitting U.S. Congresswoman who openly admits that she's rooting against her own country.
But yeah, we could say that that's just about a sports event. But that mindset is emblematic across the political spectrum.
It doesn't matter if it's about negotiations with Ukraine, about Greenland, Panama, deporting criminals. All of this, you've got one side of the country, let's call them 35%.
Maybe it's less, maybe it's more. 35% of those is an incredible amount of people in this country that I guarantee you are rooting for foreign nations that are going to be siding with Zelensky.
And that 35%, when you take it to our press corps, is probably more like 85%, 90%. So don't expect you listening in the audience for the U.S.
media to look favorably on what just happened. They're going to say this is blowing up norms.
It's destroying the world order that's been led by America. No, I see it completely differently.
This is President Trump reasserting American dominance and American leadership in a pragmatic, realistic way on the global stage, telling our allies that they will not treat us like garbage anymore. And we're not your kicking post and we're not your piggy bank and we're going to assert our wants needs and desires our interest ahead of everybody else's and to the extent that those align fantastic and to the extent they don't too bad so sad get in line i want to play since we're talking about the press's reaction let's play another clip of the reaction we did cnn.
Now we have MSNBC. Let's play clip 275.
I certainly have never seen anything like what we just watched unfold between the president of the United States and the leader of another country. Give me your take on what we've just witnessed.
We're on live TV, so I'm not going to speak in terms that i would speak if we were off the air but this was horrific this was a tragedy and a tragedy for american national security interests i want to really emphasize that and then another thing let's let's put up 283 quick just because uh ryan ryan found this this is apparently the ukrainian ambassador or someone with their delegation as this is happening just sticking her face into her hands oh no what is happening uh man it's it's amazing yeah like they're saying i wonder what words he wanted to use in private like what's worse than horrific like this was a genocide this was the end of humanity this is that meteor out in space hitting earth and exploding there's a lot of hyperbole i think like i said trump can hold a grudge i wouldn't be surprised you know if ukraine were to come back very aggressively very quickly and say this was extremely bad and we are genuinely ready for peace, Trump does like to make deals. But it's very remarkable, and I think we'll be seeing this shake out over the weekend very, very much so.
I happen to think that Trump is the master at reading leverage and just intuitively understanding this. And I think he's gamed this out.
Game theory in Trump's head has already played out in five different ways. And I think he knows he's got this guy dead to rights.
I think he knows that he said it right there. He says, you've got no cards without us.
With us, you got cards. So, you know, and I tend to believe the press statement from the White House saying he was begging for a reset.
Hey, everything's fine. We argued it out.
What's a little fight? Tomorrow we'll be bros again kind of thing. I think they're not playing around.
And I think this is years of being frustrated, the Biden regime's handling of this conflict. And it just boiled over.
And I think Trump's already sized up the leverage. Kurt, if you want to want to reply you got about 30 seconds till our break look i think that if you like ukraine uh if you truly like ukraine uh like the regime media pretends to like the democrats uh pretend to uh they be honest and say hey zelinski was totally out of line here totally out of line Guys, go to your corners, cool off, get back in there, hug it out, work it out.
But they can't do that.

Yeah, so I was just thinking as I watched that clip where, you know, what's his name on MSNBC was raving how horrific this is. I think it is worth pausing to reflect on what we've said a lot about the Ukraineraine war which is this is a war which 100 did not have to happen if you followed the lead up to that war in late 2021 early 2022 russia was very very very straightforward about what their grievances were with the west they were angry about nato expansion.
They wanted to negotiate. They were saying, if we can make a deal on Crimea, if we can make a deal on leaving military assets away from the border, if we can make deals about who gets to join NATO and so on, they were ready to, they wanted some sort of negotiation.
And we would just refuse to do it. We would howl about their buildup, but we would not negotiate.
And then they invaded Ukraine. Hundreds of thousands of people from both countries are now dead because of this.
We have the evidence that a peace could have been negotiated within the first few days of the conflict, which would have been a much better deal than we are likely to get now it might have literally just been we acknowledge Crimea and we acknowledge Donbass which were two territories Russia already controlled at the time that by all measurements appear to want to be a part of Russia anyway and they threw all of that out and they insisted on plunging a unfortunate country. Ukraine is an unfortunate country.
It is probably the most conflict-wracked of all of the former Soviet countries. It's one of the poorest.
It is a tragic country that has had enough bad things happen to it. And we had war hawks in Washington, war hawks in Brussels, push them into a war that they could not win without foreign support when they could not.
When like we weren't willing to send our own troops to do it. We have people we have people saying this is great because Ukraine is doing the dying for us to kill Russians.
And now all of these people are going to have this moral outrage because Trump got mad at Zelensky for not being grateful for the billions of dollars we've already sent him. And I just, I'm just in awe of how outrageous their like moral posturing can be.
I just, I just had to tee off on that. Sorry, Andrew.
What do you have to think about it? No, I mean, listen, I just find the whole thing, I just think it was a rebalancing. I actually see Trump has gotten into worse fights with Marco Rubio in the past, in my opinion.
I see this as an opportunity for him to really let them know that he's not messing around. He wants peace.
He wants this thing over. He's not interested in Ukraine, you know, trying to get the Donbass back or trying to fight for Crimea.
Ukraine's position is basically we want the entire territorial integrity pre-war back in Ukrainian hands, probably back before 2014. That's not going to happen.
That's not going to happen for a lot of reasons. First of all, Russia's not going to concede that.
Second of all, nobody can make them. Third of all, they're not giving up Crimea.
Fourth of all, these are regions that want to be part of Russia. And yeah, we've lost a generation of Ukrainian men.
They're going to fight it out to the bitter end. That's a terrible strategy.
That's terrible leadership. You've got to know when you've been beat, when you have reached a stalemate.
And the only sensible thing to do, I think Trump sees this, is to basically sue for peace. That's the only sensible thing that is left on the table because we're not going to keep bankrolling this quagmire forever.
And on one level, and when we come back from the break, I'd love to get your opinion on this, Kurt.

I do feel bad for Ukraine on some level.

As Mersheimer said, and we're going to play this clip, they have been led down the primrose path by the West,

saying that we were going to have their back to the bitter end.

It didn't matter what.

We're going to push off Russia, and we're going to bring you into the West. We're going to let you join NATO.
And basically, Putin called the West bluff and said, screw you. I'm going to invade.
Now, I don't like Putin. Putin's not a good guy.
But how would we feel if the—and we got a taste of this with the Cuban Missile Crisis, if Russia was parked outside our doorstep,

pointing nukes at us, pointing weapons at us,

and advancing an alliance that they built

closer and closer to our doorstep.

We wouldn't like it at all.

Now, I'm not saying we would go bomb Cuba,

but that was on the table, Kurt.

You know, I'm not as good of a student of history as you.

But listen, I mean, we've got to understand that Putin is maybe a malicious actor, but he's not an irrational actor.

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Why refi.com. This, uh, this Trump press conference, uh, or, or press briefing with Zelensky ended with Zelensky departing, kicked out of the White House and told to come back when he is ready for peace.
I have a message from a friend of mine that I think is pretty insightful. If I thought that my life and my country's survival depended on my ability to suck up to someone I would just do it and I it is to be more serious for a moment it's sad to think who are the people whose lives might end that didn't have to end because Zelensky couldn't help himself from picking a fight with the country that has bankrolled him more than any other country in the world it's sad to think about and it's unfortunate that it came to this but you also find yourself thinking like did was this a necessary thing that had to happen to show that we are serious yeah i i kind of fall in that camp hey kurt i'm gonna play this john mersheimer clip famous clip i'm sure

you've seen it before but 285 and i'll get your reaction to it 285. but i actually think that what's going on here is that the west is leading ukraine down the primrose path and the end result is that ukraine is going to get wrecked what we're doing is encouraging the ukrainians to play tough with the Russians.

We're encouraging the Ukrainians

to think that they will ultimately become part of the west because we will ultimately defeat putin and we will ultimately get our way and of course the ukrainians are playing along with this and the ukrainians are almost completely unwilling to compromise with the russians and instead want to pursue a hardline policy well as i you before, if they do that, the end result is that their country is going to be wrecked. Kurt Schlichter.
Yeah, I'm not. Look, I'm not a fan of Mearsheimer, but he's right there.
The West told Ukraine, hey, let you and him fight. Oh, we got your back.
And then sort of had its of had its back you know meersheimer for those who don't know him he's a very uh esteemed foreign policy professor written a lot of books uh about you know he's like considered basically the main guy and his branch of foreign policy studies uh neorealism and he's been very astute on this conflict for basically a decade now where he just makes the point. And it was actually a point Obama made a decade ago is what's so funny about how it shows how fanatical the left has gotten, which is just Ukraine is next to Russia.
It has been a part of Russia for most of the past 500 years. It is considered the cultural origination point of Russia.
If you read a history of Russia, it doesn't start with Moscow. It starts in Kiev.
And Russia is just always going to care more about that country than we will. And any diplomacy we're going to do has to account for that, that they care more than we do.
Their ability to

escalate or their willingness to escalate is greater than ours. And there was just this total unwillingness in Washington to account for that.
And it's horrible to think that hundreds of thousands of people died because people in Foggy Bottom wanted to feel like they were tough guys. look the the europeans uh and and the alleged friends of ukraine have really led ukraine down the path uh at the end of the day and you guys have it right you know i i about all this uh inter-slavic stuff and it's stuff that we can kind of know about but we can't feel if you guys you guys remember Goodfellas and how the mob said they were going to make Joe Pesci.
And instead of making him, they shot him in the back of the head. And Robert De Niro and Henry Hill basically said, hey, we're not Italians.
We can't understand what went on with the Italians. It's real Italian stuff.
Well, this is real Slavic stuff. There's a lot of things going on there we don't fully get.
We can approach understanding it. But there's nationalist fires, religious fires, all sorts of things going on that make this very, very dangerous to interfere in.
And interference includes, oh, go ahead. Go ahead.
Wave the red flag in front of the bull. And maybe you'll scare the bull off or maybe the bull will charge.
Unfortunately, this bull charged. And what we've had is a human tragedy unfolding for three years.
There's a way out, and it's not going to be one that Ukraine likes. But you know what? It lost.
We have Alex Marlowe back with us. He was speaking to us just a few minutes ago, and now he's back.
Alex, did you get a chance to see any of those clips we had of the media reaction? We had MSNBC saying that this was, I think, horrific. And that was the word he had to use because he was on television.
He couldn't say what he really thought. I have not had a chance to see the clips because I was doing another hit that I had pre-scheduled.
So sorry to leave you guys for a little bit. But I'm on the MSNBC homepage right now, and it's Trump and Vance berate Ukraine Zelensky in ugly Oval Office

media, in ugly Oval Office meetings. So it's exactly what I predicted an hour ago, Blake,

to you, which is that the media was going to try to spin this as Zelensky's the victim.

And so I don't think all of them are going to be able to stick with this because it did look so

bad. And the points that particularly Vance was making were so salient and so resonant that Trump is not getting enough credit for all the all the good that he's done for Ukraine over the years and I think that once people realize that what was going on and Zelensky was being ungrateful they're not gonna be able to hang on to this I don't think for too long but you knew they were going to try they have to try because remember everything Trump does is bad and everything Zelensky does is good in the eyes of our press yeah Yeah, and we have breaking news here, Alex.
Let's go ahead and put up 288. So Zelensky has now gone on Twitter X and released the following statement.
He says, thank you, America. Thank you for your support.
Thank you for this visit. Thank you, POTUS, Congress and the American people.
Ukraine needs just and lasting peace. And are working exactly for that do we have the so do we have the curb your enthusiasm music i feel like we've got the realization i mean it it yeah it feels a little bit like here's what's gonna i can almost play out the next three steps alex and i i'm curious if you agree he's to, it says, according to White House sources, he basically begged the White House for a reset.
Like, let's calm down. Let's try this again.
Let's go. So I don't think he's leaving DC.
I think what's going to happen is his people are going to reach out to the White House. They're going to try and say, hey, let's do this behind closed doors.
There's going to be a, I'm sorry, let's get the deal done. You're right.
We need America's support behind us. I don't want to push you into Russia's arms here.
I don't want you to be working closer with Putin than with us. I apologize.
Trump's going to end up getting his deal. And Trump's going to then say, hey, Putin, we got the deal.
It was a little rough getting there, but we got there. And we're on the same page now.
We need peace. We're not going to leave Ukraine hanging.
And he's going to keep playing both sides in such a way until they both meet in the middle. That's how I think Trump is playing this.
He's going to use his leverage on each to get them into a position where he can use them. Yeah, that's how Trump is playing it.
But who knows now, because this was so surprising that Zelensky, who you would think would be a pro by now, I know he was a comedian, but he's been president. He was president of his country for four years, and then he's been a dictator of his country for the last year.
I say that only partially trolling. He certainly has canceled elections and has a lot of the hallmarks of a dictator.
and it's the so he should be able to handle himself in these scenarios and he couldn't

he just completely completely messed up here And so he does need a full mea maxima culpa and he needs to then sign the mineral deal. But that's why I wondered in the last hour with you guys, whether or not the mineral deal is even a real thing.
Like maybe there's something else going on that we're not seeing that we can't see quite yet that maybe we'll come out later. But if this really was just Zelensky freaking out and not handling himself like a diplomatic leader trying to lead a massively consequential negotiation, then he's just got to try to take a mulligan, just say, I'm sorry, let's sign the deal and let's move on.
But can he do that? Is he capable of doing that when all he wants to do is beat Putin? I don't know. Yeah.
And I think that's been a really interesting dynamic here, to the extent that Ukraine really wants to not have to make so many concessions. I mean, I think if you look at a map of Ukraine, Ryan, maybe you can grab that for us, where the territorial expansion of the Russian forces into Ukraine has happened.
I think he's looking at that map and he's already piecing it apart. He's saying like, I'm going to give here, but I want that one.
And I can't come out losing all of it, essentially. And I bet he's sort of picked with...
He's going to lose land, particularly the stuff that Putin took under Obama. And the gravy train is going to slow down.

Knowing America is not going to completely stop,

because unfortunately we keep sending money overseas at insane levels,

but it's not going to be what it was.

And there's going to be more accountability for everything that does get sent going forward.

And so he's not really looking forward to this,

is that he's choosing between bad options.

And I don't think he likes the current slate of bad options that Trump has presented him,

which is partially why he freaked out.

Thank you. forward to this is that he's choosing between bad options and I don't think he likes the current slate of bad options that Trump has presented him which is partially why he freaked out.
This is breaking in the last minute from Jack. I just wanted to get Jackie Heinrich.
She has Senator Lindsey Graham just had lunch in the Oval Office. Graham of course is a big Ukraine supporter.
Speaking from the White House Graham tells Fox he is devastated. My question is whether Zelensky is redeemable in the eyes of the American people from what everyone saw.
Nobody, including me would want nobody, including me would want him as our business partner. Zelensky is going to have to fundamentally change or go.
Zelensky is going to be on your network tonight if i were him i would apologize to the president and the american people so that is lindsey graham one of the most pro-ukraine republicans saying zelensky has to make big changes or leave and that's what we speculated an hour ago maybe you maybe zelensky himself is the price to reopen negotiations between our countries. Can I just make an observation here? And listen, Lindsey Graham is one of those guys that infuriates MAGA.
He infuriates the base. And yet and many times we ask ourselves, why is he keeping this snake close to him, to Trump? Why does Trump keep him close to him? And then at a moment like this, you can almost guarantee the two men talked and Lindsey's like, oh, I got an idea.
I know how to shore this up. I know how to bring this dog to heel.
I'm going to say I was disappointed that I obviously, you know, it's an amazing asset in Trump's back pocket to deploy Lindsey Graham at a time like this and get him on the same page. And Lindsey's a shrewd politician.
He knows who butters his bread. He knows he's got to stay in alignment with the president on this.
And so him coming out saying that is, I mean, I'm looking at the reactions on media it's like when you lose lindsey graham you've lost everything right i mean it's an amazing card to play and it speaks pretty uh pretty well to trump's ability to use different assets and use different allies and keep them close for just such a time as this so is the length so andrew can i add something bl which is so good? Yeah, going back to what we were talking about, where I was half joking about him being a dictator, part of that is because he's losing popularity. And even before this happened, there's a very good chance he wouldn't win if he called an election, which is partially why he's not calling an election.
Now, his constitution does grant him the right to declare martial law, and thus, he doesn't have to have an election. So that's what he's doing.
But again, that basically gives him an indefinite, he could just declare he's at war for infinity and never call an election again, which is why I maintain he is a dictator. But part of it is he thought he would win an election.
He probably would have called it by now to get himself another four-year runway. He's not called it.
And stuff like this could make it even more likely that he would lose. So maybe the move is if this thing does not get resolved very quickly, and Trump are the deal guys, so Trump knows how to negotiate this stuff better than I do.
But maybe the move is if Zelensky does not come right back there, sign that deal. The move is to say the Ukrainian people, they need to have an election right now, frame it up that way.
And that could be a huge squeeze on Zelensky when it comes to negotiating any sort of brokered peace going forward. So Trump has a lot of moves he can play now.
Zelensky, with his tantrum, has given Trump even more leverage than he had previously, which was pretty much all of it. So we have a suggestion in our show chat that i think is amusing enough to read so lindsey graham says zelensky has to fundamentally change what if he came out tonight on fox and seen it did every network delivered an apology wearing a suit and tie i thought you were going a whole different direction there but yes what did you think here we go i don't know i know he's gonna wear an al-sharpton track suit he's gonna get the adidas track suit out he's got to get the big big metal gold chain going what is with that look can we retire that look please i'm just so i don't get as upset about it as you know i know tucker Carlsonains about it a lot.
He said he wasn't going to wear a suit and tie until the war was over. I mean, whatever.
It doesn't bother me, but it doesn't bother a lot. It's like semi-military-ish.
Yeah, it's like he's supposed to be this wartime leader. I don't get worked up about it.
I'm sure it – maybe it's very meaningful to people in Ukraine. Maybe they like it.
I don't get super irate. We clip let me know when it's loaded guys top priority 291 i believe it's loaded go ahead and play it uh president trump handled it in a fashion that if i'm china i'm iran i'm any would-be adversary I'd be worried about right now.
He gave a master class in how to stand up for America. Okay, so what we saw...
It wasn't exactly the clip we wanted, but it's a good clip. And Lindsey Graham is out there defending President Trump quickly.
Alex, what do you make of Senator Graham's tone there?

Totally right.

But Graham is a politician.

So Graham's angling for something,

and I don't have a total read on it right this second.

But he is right.

I mean, that was, I thought, masterful by Vance and Trump. And it will go down in their historical canon

as one of their best moments.

Defending America and doing it calmly and articulately,

they presented great arguments.

Trump swooping in there and saying to Zelensky, you have no right to tell us how to feel was so perfect. It was such a classic where Trump just sees things so quickly.
That was the exact right response. That was the moment of the day.
Yes. Yeah, no, I totally agree.
To me, the most striking part about that exchange was Vance goes out on such a limb. I mean, Vance was breaking the seal in a massive way.
Like, we've never seen that. The tearing of the veil.
He's the one who started it. And Trump had an opportunity there to either rein him back in and say, hey, everything's good.
We're good. But he didn't.
He took his side, had his back, and threw down the gauntlet. Ilet.
It was amazing, amazing, quick thinking there by President Trump. And we have we have the other Lindsay clip, right, Blake? Yes, 292, I believe.
This is a missed opportunity. And the question for me, for the Ukrainian people, I don't know if Zelensky can ever get you to where you want to go with the United States.
Either he dramatically changes or you need to get somebody new. Senator, I don't know if you were in the Oval Office.
Go ahead, Blake. Take us to break.
Again, I've said I don't dislike Zelensky as much as a lot of people on our side do. I think he was dealt a very rough hand and he could have fled his country when they were attacked.
He could have set up a government in exile. He could have gone full for an oligarch and he didn't.
But he stepped in it today and we are seeing it. And there's a lot of other things going on in the world, by the way.
I'm seeing breaking news now. Pope Francis is on a breathing machine.
We'll see if anything happens there. A lot is going on, but right now all of the eyes are on the Ukraine deal, which fell into a shambles on live TV.
There is no deal currently. It was not signed, but it sounds like Zelensky hasn't left the country yet.
We may see him try to do a whirlwind apology tour within the next matter of hours. What do you think we're going to see, Andrew? Do you think there's any hope for him? Yeah, and I think Charlie would agree.
I know Charlie's been texting me. He's on campus right now, but he's getting news of this blow up.
But, yeah, listen, I think Trump – I go back to something I said before. I think Trump is a master at understanding leverage.
He's shown this. Now he pushes it really, really far to a point of risk that a lot of your punditry class are not comfortable with.
You know, one of the basic pendulum spectrums that you can assess a human being on is their risk tolerance. Trump has a very high risk tolerance.
And your punditry class does not have a risk tolerance. And so that's why they go into punditry.
That's why they go and get, you know, jobs working for these outlets. And, you know, they're not entrepreneurs.
Trump is an entrepreneur. He understands what it means to play high stakes poker yes sometimes you're going to lose a hand or two but I think Trump sized it up in an instant he understands that he has a lot more leverage in this poker game than Zelensky does and he looked at him and he said you got no cards verbatim he said you got no cards without us you got no cards I think what's going to happen in the next 24 to 48 hours, I don't think Zelensky is leaving.
If he does leave, he's not leaving this conversation. I think what he's going to do is he's going to back channel with the White House and the staff.
And he's going to try and basically apologize, say things got too heated. I apologize.
I didn't mean to disrespect you or your country. You see that indication from his tweet saying, thank you to America.

Thank you to POTUS and to Congress and the American people.

We need peace, and we're going to work on that.

So he's understanding that our appetite for continuing to fund a kinetic war in Eastern Europe is about nothing.

Now, I think the American people, our sympathies still lie with Ukraine. If you took the polling as a nation as a whole, our sympathies are with Ukraine.
I certainly feel sympathetic towards the Ukrainian people, less so towards Zelensky, who I think is an uppity foreigner who has been swindling us out of a lot of treasure and his own people out of blood. I have zero sympathy for him.
But at the end of the day, I think he's going to come back. I think he's going to come back to the table and we're going to get this deal done.
That's what I think. I think Trump wants this deal done.
And I think if he does it, if he signs it, if Zelensky moves forward with this, I think what you're going to see is you're going to see Trump come back into the side of Zelensky, use that as leverage against Russia,

and they're going to hammer something out, and Ukraine's going to have to make some concessions.

There's no reality here where Ukraine does not make a lot of concessions, but they can get peace,

they can get neutrality, they can get European troops on the border. He can get security,

he can get lasting peace, but this is a wake-up call for Vladimir Zelensky. He does not

Thank you. he can get security he can get lasting peace but it's you know this is a wake-up call for vladimir zelinski he does not have nearly the leverage or the star approval that he thought he did in this country and that ultimately will be a good thing but but i want to say this again blake do not expect the pundit class to get this they are not going to.
They're taught one speed, and the one speed is that you don't do this. And Trump's saying, I'm blowing up the playbook.
We do whatever we need to do. We're America, and I'm going to fight for the interests of this country, including getting our money back out of this conflict.
Yeah, I think with Trump, he cares about making deals. That's very much how he perceives a lot of his success as president.
He cares about making deals and he cares about seeing being seen as the dominant player in any deal that happens. He does not want to be seen as the guy who made concessions.
He wants to be the scene as the one who is strong that other people came supplicating themselves to. And I think as long as he gets those things, he can be happy.
So I think if Zelensky really is apologetic, if he really does prostrate himself before Trump and apologize for this and maybe offer, you know, some maybe some additional superficial concession. I think Trump would be happy to make a deal because he does want to be the dealmaker.

Trump does not want to be the guy who just had Ukraine completely implode on him.

So I think we'll eventually see some sort of deal reach.

But we'll see how this unfolds over the coming weekend.

And Charlie will definitely have a lot to say about it on Monday.

We'll see you then.