DEBATE: What's the Red Line for Bombing Iran? | Guests: Sean Davis & Joseph Lavorgna | 6/18/25

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This is

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Hello, America.

Welcome to the Glenbeck Program.

We've We've got another fun day for you.

Today,

we're going to talk a little bit,

well, we're going to talk a lot about Israel and Iran and what's going on and the debate here in America.

That again, I just have to start.

I'm so disappointed that we...

I think we feel like, are we all in the fourth grade?

I mean, we are dealing with one of the most significant things

any of us have dealt with in our lifetime.

I don't know of a more serious time than this, and it feels to me like we're all acting like we're in the fourth grade.

We're just name-calling.

I'm going to pull her pigtails and run.

Let's have a serious conversation.

Can we do that without the name-calling or the labels because it's so easy?

This is not an easy thing to talk about, but we need to as a nation.

We'll go there here in 60 seconds.

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You know,

speaking of the mob,

did you see the hello, Pat?

Welcome to the program.

Hello, Jason.

Welcome to the program.

Welcome.

Did you guys see the

Shaw's son making his little speech about how people need to stand up?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I think he might be the the Fredo

of

world leaders.

You know,

he apparently has never done anything.

He has not ever organized any serious movements for the, and, you know, if there is a regime change, can we not

get involved?

Especially if we're like, you know what, we should send the Shaw's family back.

That caused the problem the first time.

We might not want to do that.

What is the big update today, Jason?

Where are we standing today on things?

With bated breath to see what unconditional surrender means, I believe.

Beyond that, it's just strikes back and forth.

It's the same thing for the last couple of days.

So

when the president said yesterday, we

demand unconditional surrender, was that like the royal we?

Who is we?

We and Israel now?

We're demanding

regime change?

Sounds like it.

You know what, Glenn, the funniest thing coming out of this is the Twitter accounts from the Iranian regime.

They've apparently reincarnated Baghdad, Bob.

Apparently.

Yeah, I saw some of this stuff.

This just in.

We just shot down 34 advanced aerial, you know, F-22s.

They tweeted that they have complete control of the skies of Israel.

You don't have

control of the room that you're in.

You don't have that.

We control the airspace.

Well, not the airspace directly over me or our country, but we have control of airspace someplace.

Oh, you really don't.

You really don't.

Now,

Axios

is, I mean, I don't know what to believe anymore because I don't know what propaganda is.

And I, you know, I just, I just don't know.

Two Israeli officials, according to Axios,

claim

that Trump and his aides were only pretending to oppose the Israeli attack in public, that he didn't express opposition in private.

We had a clear U.S.

green light, one claimed.

The goal, they say, was to convince Iran that no attack was imminent and make sure Iranians on Israeli's target list

wouldn't move to new locations.

Netanyahu's age even briefed Israeli reporters that Trump had tried to put the brakes on the Israeli strike in a call on Monday, when in reality the call dealt with cooperation ahead of the attack.

State of play, the U.S.

side has not confirmed any of that.

In hours before the strike, the Trump administration distanced itself from the Israeli operations in public statements and private messages to ally.

Secretary of State Marco Rubio swiftly stated that Israel's attack was unilateral with no U.S.

involvement.

Hours later, however, Trump confirmed that he knew the attack was coming, but stressed the U.S.

had no military involvement.

Okay,

I believe, I mean, no one

on our side, no one in, you know, you think France is going to make a major move without telling us?

Well, they might be stupid enough to do it.

Do you think any of our major allies are going to make a major move in the country without calling the White House first and just saying, hey, I just want to give you the heads up?

And especially if we're the ones at the negotiating table, of course we knew about it.

And of course the president knew that they were going to strike.

What is it about people that they don't understand how to negotiate?

Right.

And this follows perfectly with what Trump has been doing the entire time.

He gave a 60-day

timeframe.

Yes, it was a unilateral.

I hate these diplomatic word salads.

Of course he knew it was about to happen.

Day 61, that's when Trump said, we're not stopping you anymore.

It was all all part of the negotiation from the very beginning.

And yeah, we're not involved except defensively.

Nothing has changed, and he's still at the negotiating table.

This is how you negotiate.

And you have no, you know, do you remember Barack Obama and I think Joe Biden too saying, that'll be a red line.

You cross that red line and there'll be hell to pay.

And then nothing happened?

What do you think Iran learned by that?

You don't ever make threats threats that you're not going.

You make promises.

You never make threats.

Learn that.

If you have to negotiate for jobs or anything else, learn that one piece of negotiation.

Never make a threat.

Because if you're called on it, you have to do it.

Otherwise, you have no credibility.

And beside, it makes it so much easier.

You've already made the decision.

Look, I'm going to do this.

I am willing to do all of this.

But if you're not, then I'm going to to have to go take another job.

And then you're already doing it.

And if the negotiations are going poorly, you know, okay, well, I better start go look for a new house or a new job or whatever.

You know, it takes all of the pressure off of you.

Now, nobody knows how to deal with somebody who's being honest like that, which only gives you extra cards at the table.

Now, we have had negotiators name the last good negotiator for the United States of America that was a president.

I can't.

Ronald Reagan?

Maybe.

Ronald Reagan.

Probably.

Who was the negotiator for the United States that got good deals for us?

In the Cold War, it was Reagan.

Other than that, and why was Reagan successful?

Because he wasn't bluffing.

Well, the Star Wars thing, he was bluffing.

But he wasn't bluffing.

They knew he was just crazy enough to maybe do it.

He was unlike any other president.

The same thing here.

The president, when he said you have 60 days,

they're not going to believe anything he says if somebody's not dropping bombs on them on day 61.

Look, I'm holding them back.

This is what he said to them and to us.

No, Israel, stop.

I don't want you to do this.

I'm negotiating.

I need 60 days.

Don't.

Well, 60 days comes up and they start dropping bombs and everybody acts like they're so surprised.

What did we know?

When did we know it?

I don't know.

I think we knew it the day he said 60 days.

That's when they knew it.

That's when you should have known it.

That's when the whole world should have known it.

But nobody takes a U.S.

president seriously anymore.

They don't take anybody seriously anymore.

They have people who are saying, I'll burn you in the fires of the Islamic fury.

You have people marching in the streets for Sharia law where we're going to rape and kill all the infidels.

and nobody takes those people seriously.

But God forbid, I say something at all about God.

And oh my gosh, I am.

We got to shut him down.

He's dangerous.

What are you out of your mind?

Can we get some perspective here?

Aye aye, aye.

But I don't know.

I don't, I mean,

I'm not sure

that anybody,

anybody

is seeing the full picture.

I mean, I listen to podcasts.

I listen to,

you know, TV.

I read.

I watch, you know, X.

I see what people are saying.

I don't, I have not found anybody that I went, okay, well, they're looking at all sides.

Have you?

Pat, Have you?

Have you seen anybody that you're like, okay, I think they're looking at all sides?

No,

no.

I've seen people breaking down and attacking their own side, and I've seen that on both sides of the aisle.

But I, no, I haven't seen anybody trying to noodle this thing out with

both sides.

Just not happening.

Who's doing that?

We're trying to.

I mean, I saw Glenn Greenwald and

oh, what's his name?

Sagar and Jetty, right?

Glenn Greenwald was on his podcast, and, you know, they were, let me just read some of the transcript here because it's pretty amazing.

They talk about these psyops, and you have this odd?

We'll go ahead and play this odd here.

But what drives me crazy, and I'm sure it must you as well, is we have the same actors in the, in the same, literally the same people who lied us into the war in Iraq now really repeating so many of the same things.

We had Ari Fleischer talking about Tucker Carlson, and this is the guy who lied from the White House podium about weapons of mass destruction.

Glenn Beck, who was on television talking about how America would be greeted as liberators, he apologized in 2014.

But, you know, Glenn, he's back now to actually saying, actually, this time around, they're going to be greeted as liberators.

Let's take a listen to that.

We'll get reactions.

Has Israel asked us to fight their war?

Answer, no.

Is this another Iraq?

Or is it something entirely different?

Well, let me tell you what makes this moment unlike anything else we have faced before.

First, this was not a call to war.

This was not a land invasion.

This is not a campaign to topple a regime and then sit around for 20 years trying to rebuild a culture that doesn't want what we have.

Even though Iran, the Iranian people are good people, the Persians are great people and they do want a life like ours.

But this this was targeted.

This was surgical.

This was preemptive.

Not against an idea, not against a guess, against the very real, very stated intentions of a regime run by men who do not think like we think, okay?

They do not want what we want.

We choose life.

They literally choose death.

These are 12ers.

They are followers of a branch of Shiite Islam that believes not not just in the return of the messianic figure called the Mahadi,

but also that his return can and must be, in their words, hastened or accelerated.

And the only way to do that is to quote, using their words, wash the world in blood.

Okay, I think I'm out at that.

You know, that's my first stop on the train.

And I'm like, I'm going to get off here, please.

They hate our way of life.

They're again, they choose.

I mean, this is 03.

This is the same thing.

You could probably copy and paste that.

And except this time they're different because they're Persian, which, by the way, is very racist against Arabs.

But it's like, what are we doing here, Glenn?

Also, isn't it kind of ironic that we're supposed to be scared of Aram because they have a messianic religious belief when, like, a third of the Congress wants to arm and support Israel no matter what, because of their messianic view that doing so is necessarily for the return of Jesus, who's then going to send all Jews and other non-believers to hell.

But that's a little detailed that Israel doesn't mind.

I'm not going to listen to stop.

I'm not going to listen to Glenn Greenwald lecture me about my religion for the love of God.

Look, Look, where did I say we would be greeted

as liberators?

And by the way, you'll notice that there was an edit in that.

I was saying there is the possibility.

I was not saying we go in.

I said there was the possibility that this was different this time because there are people on the ground, but I don't want to go and liberate them.

That's not our job.

That's not what I want.

I don't want to go to war.

You know,

so many people put themselves out as the authority.

Do not listen to me as the authority.

I'm a guy trying to figure this out.

I am a guy who doesn't, I no longer believe the press.

I no longer believe the government.

I no longer believe in anything but my God.

Now, I don't know who Glenn Greenwald's God is, but he believes in something, and maybe his God is just himself.

And I don't say this with glee.

I like Glenn Greenwald.

I respect what Glenn Greenwald has done for journalism.

I mean, he was one of the only people that were actually telling us the truth on many subjects.

I don't know.

Maybe he's right this time, but please do not confuse my belief in Jesus Christ and the Bible with someone who says they're going to wash the world in blood.

I don't want to hasten the world into the end times.

I don't want that.

I would really like that to not be happening when I or my family are anywhere near.

It's really bad.

Anybody who says, you know what, let's just bring Jesus back.

No, no, that's a bad idea.

It's going to happen in his time.

Let's leave it alone.

Let's not hasten the return of the promised one.

And by the way, their promised one is the Mahadi.

It is not Jesus Christ.

And if you read anything about the Twelvers, my gosh, it is like they took the book of Revelations as a joke and said, you know what?

Let's make their good guy our bad guy and our good guy their bad guy.

It is the exact opposite of the book of Revelation.

So they're very clear on which side they're on.

And since when do we stop taking people seriously?

You know what?

Let me ask these two clowns.

I'm sorry.

Let me ask these two people

this question.

If Glenn Beck were on today and I said, you know what, we should take all them homosexuals and burn them in the fires of Jesus.

Well, let's just clean out because

all these homosexuals are just polluting the whole world and they're controlling our media and everything else.

We got to kill them all.

Would you be on the air telling people, This guy is the most dangerous guy on the planet.

We have to stop him.

You would pull out every unconstitutional way to try to stop me.

And you know what?

You probably would be right because that's crazy to think that it is crazy to think that but why would you react if someone were saying what i just said and they meant it they meant it and they had a long record behind them of killing people all over the world

wouldn't you be stupid and blind not to at least take that person seriously, you would tell me right now, yes, we would take that seriously, Glenn.

And you should.

Why won't you do it the other way?

Why won't you assign

the dangers of somebody who actually believes it and doesn't say it from a pulpit with

no backing of anything?

When you have them saying it in crowds of millions and they are pumping their poison and their death and they're actually beheading people and throwing gay people off the roofs.

Why don't you take them seriously?

I don't understand it.

It hurts my head.

I would really like to understand your logic.

All right, back in just a second.

There's so much more to cover.

First, let me tell you about the International Fellowship of Christians and Jews.

And yes, I am a proud Christian, very proud to follow Jesus Christ at this time in our history of our world and say, never again,

never again.

That doesn't mean I want war in Iran.

It means I will stand with the Jewish people for their right to live and survive and to have a homeland.

Oh my gosh, the logic is so twisted and dark.

Look, I just want to tell you about the International Fellowship of Christians and Jews.

These are people just like you, just like me, that, you know, all I want to do

is support the Jewish people

to have a right to live.

And that's why the IFCJ will send flak jackets and armored cars.

I have just given them one of my armored cars.

Excuse me.

I have armored cars because, now why am I sounding like

RFK for a second here?

I've given them one one of my armored cars so they can

have them to survive.

So people who are trying to go in and help can actually get in and help.

I would suggest anything you can do to help protect the Jewish people in their homeland, go to ifcj.org, ifcj.org, or call 888-488-IFCJ.

Any gift that you make is welcome.

888-488-IFCJ.

Stand with Israel.

All right, 10 seconds station ID.

Okay, that went way too long.

I'm up against another break.

I'm sorry to do that.

But

we're back in a minute with more.

This is Glenn Beck.

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Welcome to the Glenn Beck program.

I'm glad you're here.

You know, I'm really,

I'm just,

I just think there's some things that need to be said, need to be said.

You know, people who are scoffing at Christians,

you know, because we support Israel or we believe in the return of Jesus.

Let me tell you something.

I'm proudly one of those people, and you can call me names.

I'm not asking you to believe what I believe.

I'm not.

And I hope you're right, actually.

I hope that, you know, we're not at the beginning of

what could be a, you know, 10-year or a 40-year struggle with forces of what I believe are real darkness.

And if you can't say that Islamists, that the regime of Iran

that pumps poison, hatred, and death all around the world.

If you can't say that's darkness or evil,

we can't have a conversation.

I mean, we don't have anything in common.

Your God is equivalence.

And,

you know, and you're a fool for sticking your head in the sand.

But I know who I serve, and

I happen to believe in the Bible.

You know, there's a scriptural warning.

I will bless those who bless Israel.

I will curse those who curse Israel.

That doesn't mean that you condone everything that Israel does or agree with them.

It just means I will not be neutral when someone threatens to wipe the Jewish people off the face of the earth, especially when they say it out loud over and over and over again.

Let me ask you this.

If you were a neighbor,

if you were living in a neighborhood and you had a neighbor who constantly told you over the fence every time you're outside, I'm going to kill you and I'm going to kill all of your family.

And then they start killing your animals.

And then

they start, you know, attacking you and throwing rocks at your family when you're out.

And then they actually attempt to kill or they do.

They kill and rape one of your children.

And no one in your neighborhood backs your self-defense.

How long do you live in that neighborhood?

Right?

What you would do, you would first fight for justice.

and then when everybody in your neighborhood would be against you, what would you do?

You would move.

Oh,

oh, wait a minute.

Isn't that the point of most in the Middle East?

We're going to kill them, or they can just move to a new neighborhood where they won't be welcome there either.

This is a game over and over and over again.

You know,

why didn't we fight this hard over Kim Jong-un or his dad getting nuclear weapons?

Well,

for one,

he's on the other side of the planet, and he looks like a, he's always been just a joke of a dictator because he runs a third world country.

And while he does horrible things to his people, he doesn't have any ability to do anything until he got a nuclear weapon.

Well, why didn't we stop him from getting a a nuclear weapon?

Well, because

he wasn't beheading people.

He wasn't killing people.

He wasn't going over to Japan and saying, I'm going to burn all of you people.

I'm going to burn you all in a nuclear Holocaust.

I'm going to wipe every Japanese person off the map.

And let me ask you, if he did say that, and he was running a campaign where he was raping Japanese children,

killing them in their own own country, bombing them all the time.

Do you think we would have been neutral on him getting an atomic bomb?

There's no way.

There's absolutely no way.

And no one would have this question.

Is it just because it's the Middle East?

Because I understand that.

I really do understand that.

Regime change?

Oh, we've seen this movie before.

How many times?

Oh, they've got weapons of mass destruction.

Seen that movie before.

and it has never worked out well.

I also would like to side with people who are like, how do we afford a war?

But here's the one thing that I have learned, and it has served me well.

It's why in 1999 I said, there will be bodies, buildings, and rubble in the streets of New York City within the next 10 years.

And when all is said and done, you will find it has the signature and the name attached to it, Osama bin Laden.

And everybody said I was crazy.

I wasn't a prophet.

It didn't take it.

All you have to do is listen to people.

Again, you have a neighbor who says, I'm going to kill you and kill all your family.

And they say it over and over again.

And they're making plans.

Do you ignore them?

No, you're a moron if you ignore them.

No, it's not my neighborhood.

It's Iran's neighborhood.

But when fanatics tell you what they intend to do, believe them.

So I'm not calling for war.

And, you know, I heard Tim Dylan in his podcast say, you know, I'm a warmonger and everything else.

Tim, I watch your show.

Do you ever watch mine?

Do you even know who I am, really?

Or are you just a guy?

Because honestly, and I say this to myself as well.

If all you read is social media, you're more dangerous than somebody who doesn't read anything ever.

Do you even know who I am?

Because I watch your show.

I think you're funny.

I think you're smart.

I don't agree with you on everything, but I don't have to agree with you on everything.

But saying that I'm a warmonger and calling for war, I just don't understand that.

What I'm calling for is clarity.

and moral courage for waking up in the entire West before it's too late.

And that's not going in and storming and doing a regime change in Iran.

That's just recognizing who our enemy is.

They have infiltrated and not infiltrated, I can't say, they were welcomed in to every Western country.

They are setting every Western country on fire.

At some point, if you don't wake up now and say, you know what, we're shipping you back home.

You will have a war to end all wars

you got to wake up and the way to wake up is to at first admit you got a problem look i'm a recovering alcoholic so there's a couple of things that alcoholics know about themselves

don't get all high and mighty because you don't know i you don't know jack

So I'm not coming to you as an expert.

I'm coming to you as a guy who just has a little bit of insight, and I'm asking you questions that I think are pretty logical.

Now you're going to have to noodle them yourselves, but

at least ask and answer the questions.

At least know morally where you stand on things because the hour is growing late.

And if you don't have an opinion on anything, well, what are you here for?

What were you born for?

You were born just to just to what?

Eat and, you know, watch YouTube videos?

What a waste of life that is.

Have the moral courage to

see the good guy, see the bad guy, and say they're not the same.

I'm sorry, they're not the same.

You know, I think they crossed the line of not the same when they started raping babies.

setting them on fire, raping dead women that they had just killed, and then celebrating and calling their moms and saying, mom, you won't believe how many people I've just killed.

And they sell it.

At least the Nazis tried to hide what they did.

My gosh, how are you not seeing this?

And yes,

I do stand with Israel, but not because I think they're perfect.

I stand with them because they're under threat.

And because when it comes to the Iranian regime, neutrality is not peace.

That doesn't mean we fight their wars, but it's not peace to be neutral.

It's complicity.

But I want to apologize to Glenn Greenwald because I lost.

I have a short temper because,

and there's no reason for it.

We have to stop.

This is so serious.

This is so serious.

What happens if they get a bomb and they decide to drop a bomb?

What happens if they get a bomb and Israel says, this isn't Pakistan.

If they get a bomb and they're threatening to drop a bomb, or

there's intel that they might smuggle one into Israel.

Do we do nothing then?

And if they do drop the bomb, does anybody respond?

And if their ally is Russia and China,

how do you respond without

going into full global nuclear war?

This is the danger that you face.

And I don't know if they're even building one.

I mean, I tend to believe Donald Trump and I tend to believe Tulsi Gabbard.

So which one do I believe now?

I don't know.

But I just love it how the left and how so many now seemingly on the right and the truth tellers

are so willing to let religious crazy people.

I'm not for religious crazy.

You might think I'm a religious crazy people, but I'm not.

I'm saying follow Jesus.

And Jesus was a peacemaker.

Jesus wasn't ever like, go get him.

Defend yourself.

And that's all I'm saying about Israel.

Defend yourself.

You have a right to defend yourself.

I don't understand why

you'll go after anybody you deem as a religious zealot just because they say Jesus, you know, guides them.

That Jesus is paramount in their life.

You know, I don't know.

I can't answer for the 12th century, and I can't answer for people who pervert Christianity, but I can't answer for me.

Jesus never tells me to kill.

He'll tell me to defend myself, not to kill.

And in many cases, even when

you're justified to defend yourself, Jesus might say, don't defend yourself.

Turn the other cheek.

I mean, holy cow.

You're worried about people like me, but you're not worried about Islamic extremists in any country where they have rape gangs, where

they are grooming children off the street, and every single politician and media person is afraid to point it out.

You're afraid.

You're cowards.

I got, you know, I got news for you.

There's a bigger consequence.

There's a much bigger consequence than anything any of us will face in this lifetime.

And if you don't believe that, that's fine.

But do you believe in karma?

Well, you're going to get the karma.

You're going to get what you deserve one way or another.

All right.

I want to get off this negative soapbox.

All right.

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Glenn Beck will be right back.

You know, I've had a lot of wrong opinions, and I have corrected those and apologized for those things that,

you know, it turned out to be incorrect.

But you really have to judge who is doing that and who is not doing that.

Here's a guy who has made mistake after mistake after mistake and has never apologized and has never grown

from the experience in his life.

Cut five, please.

Here's Lindsey Graham.

Well I've said from the very beginning it is in our national security interest to make sure Iran doesn't have a nuclear weapon.

They're an existential threat to our friends in Israel.

They really do mean death to Israel, but they also mean death to America.

There's no doubt in my mind that if the Ayatollah had a nuclear weapon, he would use it to destroy Israel as part of his religious agenda.

His religious agenda includes purifying Islam, going after Sunni Saudi Arabia, destroying the Jewish state, and coming after us because we're infidels.

He is literally a religious Nazi.

So it is my belief that President Trump understands the threat the Ayatollah presents to us, not just Israel, and that he will, at the end of the day, help Israel finish the job.

And that will require, I think, weapons that Israel doesn't possess and maybe joint military operations.

Okay, now here's a guy who just has gotten it wrong every step of the way.

But what part of that do you disagree with other than maybe perhaps the use of

our planes to drop a

bunker buster bomb?

Not much.

I just wish someone else said it and not Lindsey Graham.

Right, right.

Don't like, don't like it.

He's always wrong about war.

And he might be wrong this time.

Makes you question, it should make you pause and and go wait a minute lindsey graham is saying many of the same things i'm saying but here this is a guy who has never met a war that he doesn't like um so you know

we have to look at nuance this is glenn beck let me talk to you about you know when you're fighting leftism

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The fusion of entertainment and enlightenment.

This is

the Glenn Beck Program.

Hello, America.

I want to start with a little story.

See if it makes any sense to you.

What are we doing to ourselves right now?

With everything that's going on in the world, have you noticed?

We're turning on each other.

I'm going to talk about that here in just a second.

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So what are we doing to ourselves right now?

What is actually happening to us?

You know,

let me play a clip from Ted Cruz and Tucker Carlson yesterday.

How many people live in Iran, by the way?

I don't know the population.

At all?

No, I don't know the population.

You don't know the population of the country you seek to topple?

How many people live in Iran?

92 million.

Okay.

Yeah.

How could you not know that?

I don't sit around memorizing population tables.

Well, it's kind of relevant because you're calling for the overthrow of the government.

Why is it relevant whether it's

90 million or 80 million or 100 million?

Because if you don't know anything about the country.

I didn't say I don't know anything about the oversight.

Okay, what's the ethnic mix of Iran?

They are Persians and predominantly Shia.

Okay, this is...

No, it's not even...

You don't know anything about Iran.

Okay, I am not the Tucker Carlson.

You're not an expert on Iran.

You're a senator who's calling for the government.

You're the one who's the government.

You're the one who doesn't know anything about the country.

No, you don't know anything about the country.

You're the one who claims they're not trying to murder Donald Trump.

I'm not saying that.

Who can't figure out a way to say that it's not?

It's a good idea to kill General Suleimani, and you just said it was bad.

They're trying to murder Trump.

Yes, I do.

Because you're not calling for military strikes against them in retaliation.

And if you really believe that.

They're carrying out military strikes today.

You said Israel was.

Right.

With our help.

I said we.

Israel is leading them, but we're supporting them.

Well, you're breaking news here because the U.S.

government last night denied, the National Security Council spokesman Alex Pfeiffer denied on behalf of Trump that we were acting on Israel's behalf in any offensive capacity.

Well, we're not bombing them.

Israel's bombing them.

You just said we were.

We are supporting Israel.

You're a senator.

If you're saying the United States government is a war with Iran right now, people are listening.

It's one of the saddest people.

This is one of the saddest clips I've seen in a long time.

I like Tucker Carlson, and I like Ted Cruz.

I tell you a story about a small town.

It's not unlike yours, not unlike mine.

Three men lived side by side.

One was a baker.

One was a preacher.

One was a schoolteacher.

They had known each other for years.

They had raised their kids together.

They sat on the same bleachers at football games.

They argued about taxes at the diner.

They bought...

brought pies to one another's porches when life fell apart for that family.

And they didn't agree on a lot of things.

One of them was a conservative, another one was a liberal.

The preacher, he was more concerned about heaven than Washington, but they all talked.

They disagreed.

They argued sometimes.

They listened.

Because somewhere deep down, they had one thing in common.

They cared.

They cared about their town.

They cared about their kids.

They cared about what kind of life they were leaving behind for those kids.

Then a storm came.

Bad storm.

Not of wind and rain and lightning and thunder,

but of ideas.

Headlines, hashtags, rumors, bots, people all around that wanted to separate these three men.

They began to mistrust.

It was a storm that whispered in their ears, he's not just wrong, he's evil.

She's not just different, she's dangerous, and little by little the voices that had once shared coffee and laughter were replaced with silence.

Then suspicion.

Then contempt.

And then the baker accused the teacher of brainwashing his kids.

And the teacher called the preacher a bigot.

And the preacher, heartbroken, went to his chapel, wondering, what has happened?

What has happened?

And one by one, they all just stopped speaking to one another.

They sat on the same bleachers, but on opposite ends now.

They passed each other, but they passed in silence.

When one's house burned down,

nobody called the others to help.

Now, let me ask you:

how close are we to that moment?

How many of our friendships are already buried,

buried deep under the weight of a single disagreement?

I have been wrong in my life more than I've been right.

Are you right more often than you're wrong?

I am wrong more often than I am right.

And I am wrong.

I hope I'm getting better at this, but I am wrong.

And it is only in my arrogance that I fail to say, wow, that was a huge mistake.

When did we forget

to stop giving people the benefit of the doubt?

When did we forget being wrong doesn't make you wicked?

What kind of country are we building if no one is allowed to be right?

No, sorry.

Let me say this right.

When no one is allowed to be wrong on their way to becoming right.

Because when I'm wrong, I learn from it

and I become more right the next time.

What kind of country will we have if no one is allowed to be wrong on their way to becoming right?

or having serious

disagreements on how we view something, but we still have the same love of country and the same basic understanding of what this country means,

and yet we blow each other up.

There's no need for an enemy.

Judging right from wrong isn't just about being right.

It's about how we do it.

Do we look at another person's intent?

Or do we look at just their latest post and not really even know the person?

Do we try to understand or do we rush to destroy?

I can say so many great things about Tucker Carlson and his intent and what he believes.

He believes in the same kind of country I do.

He believes in freedom.

We don't necessarily agree on the way to get there, but I don't doubt his love for country,

and I don't doubt Donald

Ted Cruz's love of country.

And we don't agree on everything,

but I'm not an enemy of those two,

and neither of them are enemies of one another, and yet now they are.

Now you are forced to decide which one is on your side.

We're holding others to standards we can't survive ourselves.

If everybody, if you have to be in complete alignment with me,

not the Constitution, but with me,

me,

and my friends, and the friends that I have today, because I might turn on my friends tomorrow because they don't agree with me.

What is left?

You'll be left standing alone.

You might be right, but you'll be surrounded with nothing.

Trust takes time.

Violation of that trust happens quickly.

But how many times have we really been violated recently?

How many times have people really violated our trust?

And how many times has that violation come from a post

where you didn't even really hear the full context?

Or somebody who is just grinding axes because they both, you like both of them.

But they are just going at it because in the moment, in the heated moment, they can't find a way to each other.

And neither one of them is willing to take a breath and say,

can we start this conversation again?

And if they did, you're not going to see that on social media.

You'll never know if they did that.

Trust takes time.

Humility takes practice.

And grace?

grace is the one thing we all want for ourselves but seem like we're unwilling to give it to anybody else it's easy to win an argument it is really hard to win a person

so maybe we should ask ourselves a couple of questions here am i listening to respond

because i think that's what most of us do

We listen to respond and we respond to win.

Are we listening to respond or are we listening to understand?

Do we want truth or do we want a victory?

Am I giving others the freedom to change their mind

like I may have to tomorrow?

We're headed towards a very different nation where all of us, we're going to be a nation of very lonely victors.

I won, one, one, one, one, one, one.

And the echo just keeps on going because no one is around.

We are all sitting on a hill of ashes shouting, I was right, right, right, right.

Look, I'm not, I don't agree with a lot of things, and I get really, I mean, I get really hot sometimes because I can't believe people's stupidity.

But you know what?

I've been really stupid at times too.

I think

humility is the key to all of this.

And we are so

we're all in our lizard brains.

And now our final battle,

we're just tearing each other apart.

We're tearing our own side apart.

I mean, look at what happened with Elon Musk and Donald Trump.

I like both of those men.

I didn't want to see those guys fight.

I still don't want to see those guys fight.

I would love to see those.

It would be great.

It would be awesome if they could come together.

And even if when they came together, they hugged it out and said, I don't agree with everything he says, but he's still my friend.

And we're still on the same fight.

I don't agree with what he's doing here, here, and here.

And he doesn't agree with me here, here, and here.

But we know one thing, this country is worth worth saving.

And while we might disagree on how to get there, we both know we have to get there.

And if we continue to divide ourselves, there will be no one left to enjoy the country, and we'll never be able to save it by ourselves.

So we can either just keep bashing each other.

And,

you know, I give this monologue to me as well.

I want you to know.

It is so hard for me

to give you the monologue I'm giving you right now for a couple of reasons.

It's not the monologue I want to give.

The monologue I want to give, oh, is really passionate.

It's also not the monologue you want me to give.

Because do you know what is happening with AI right now?

Right now, with AI, they are now changing the algorithms to give you the answer you are looking for.

We are now training AI

to put us into more of a bubble and convince all of us that we are right because it will give you the answer you want.

Could anything be more destructive

When the lights go out, the schools burn down,

your house burns down,

when the next storm rolls in,

it ain't going to be our righteousness that saves us.

It's going to be the friend.

It's going to be the family member that's still willing to pick up the phone, even after the last disagreement,

and say,

I'm here for you.

I'm coming to help.

Back in a minute.

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10-second station ID.

All right.

Let me tell tell you about what's happening on TV tonight.

Jason Buttrell is in.

He is our chief researcher and head writer for the TV show, and we've been working on this one for the last few days.

How would you describe this one,

Jason?

Scary, a little bit.

I think it's very interesting that what we're seeing on the streets of places like Los Angeles, other cities, mass protests, assassinations, political violence.

Some of them are also accompanied with Death to America chants,

which is also happening in another part of the country right now.

I'm going to describe two things for you tonight.

And I'll show you we are on the road to both of them.

One, Gotham.

We don't have real villains anymore.

We don't have the old-fashioned villains.

We have cartoon villains.

They are starting to become cartoon villains

that just want to watch the world burn.

So first question is, do you want Gotham?

Is that what you want?

Because that's where we're headed towards.

and that is what silence will continue to give us.

So, Gotham.

And then,

the beginning of the war to end all wars.

The real end last war.

I believe there could be a case made that we are entering it.

And we could take 40 years before we actually get to, you know, the part where the mountains are split.

Everything is being set up.

Everything is being set up.

And if you just have eyes and ears to see it, and if you've missed some of it, maybe you'll see it tonight.

Tonight at 9 o'clock, the Wednesday night special.

And it'll be on my YouTube channel tomorrow at youtube.com/slash Glenn Beck.

Iran war, U.S.

Riots, an urgent warning about the death of America mob.

Gotham

and the final battle tonight on the Wednesday night special.

How are you doing, Jason?

Good.

How are you doing, Pat?

Great.

I'm

practically perfect.

In every way.

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

I mean,

why wouldn't you be right now?

Yeah, right.

Was that last monologue make sense to you guys?

No, not a word.

Not a word.

You're really not.

Yeah, it did.

It really did.

Yes, it did.

And I feel the same way.

It's too bad that we're tearing each other apart instead of.

No, it's not too bad.

It's the end.

Well, yeah.

If we continue to do that.

It's the end.

Yeah.

We won't have anybody.

We won't have anybody to try.

I asked people this yesterday.

You know, if you were listening yesterday, I asked you,

if you don't trust Donald Trump, and you did, you voted for him, and you knew he was the only guy, he took a bullet for us,

and he was the only guy that could save us.

And now

you're looking at him and going, you know what?

I don't think I can trust him.

He's been duped by the deep state and going to do war.

Who do you trust?

What's next?

Where else do you go?

Who else do you have left in our arsenal?

We're all fighting, and our enemies are cheering.

And I think our enemies are actually kind of putting their fingers on the scale and pushing this one towards us.

We're eviscerating ourselves.

This is Glenn Beck.

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I don't know if you've seen this,

but

real wages in hourly workers are up nearly 2% in the first five months of Donald Trump's second term.

Up nearly 2%.

Now,

let me give you the

history history of this, what a big deal this is.

The last time it went up nearly 1%

was during Nixon in 1969.

Carter had a zero real wage increase.

Reagan,

negative, almost 1%.

H.W.

Bush had negative 3%.

Clinton had negative 0.6.

W had 0.06.

6.

Obama had 0.

negative 0.3.

Donald Trump's first term,

plus 1.3, first time since 1969.

Plus 1.3.

Then Biden down

almost 2%, negative.

And now in the first five months, Trump is back up to almost 2%, 1.7.

You know, he's doing everything that everybody is saying is going to cause economic disaster, and yet it doesn't look like that's actually panning out.

We have a counselor to the U.S.

Treasury Secretary, Joseph

Livorna, and he is with us now.

Joe, how are you?

Glad, I'm great.

That was a great, great summarization.

Well, I was just reading

the tweet from the Treasury Secretary, your boss, Scott Besson.

So

I'm glad that I got it right.

This is

remarkable.

I heard somebody describe this as, well, that's just propaganda.

It doesn't seem like that when you look at the history of every other president.

Having had the pleasure of serving under the president in 1.0, I knew that we had a blue-collar wage boom following passage of the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act of 2017.

So I was just curious.

I said,

how have we done so far?

Because the sense is the economy actually has performed very well and certainly much better than the naysayers.

And I was actually struck by the data when I saw it.

But as you said, it makes complete sense given what President Trump has wanted to do and what Secretary Besson has reinforced and that

we want everybody to do well, but we really need and want Main Street to do well.

And that's what happened under the first Trump Presidency.

And when the one big, beautiful bill is passed, which is going to codify and solidify the permanency of pro-growth business-related tax cuts that incentivize capital deepening and productivity enhancement, then we should continue to see these very strong gains in bluefowler wages.

So it's a really great story, and I appreciate you having me on so that we can at least talk about it, because unfortunately, this good news oftentimes doesn't get reported.

Speak to somebody who don't believe the talking point that illegal immigration actually suppressed U.S.

wages.

Well, it's very simple.

I mean, what you're doing is if you're taking,

if a worker comes in illegally, that allows the employer to pay he or she a below average wage rate.

And in turn, that resets the market lower for everybody else.

Put another way, if a firm does not have access to abundant and we could even call it exploitative labor,

then those wages economically, microeconomics are such, you have to pay more.

You know, you're not kind of faunting the law.

And what that allows then is for wages to be naturally higher.

And what happens is workers, U.S.

workers, then get paid a fair.

Actually fair, when I mean fair, I mean market-based rate.

There's no below market-based rate.

So the economics are pretty solid, and Secretary Besson has highlighted that.

And you should see over time with this

flow of illegal workers coming into the market, you should see nominal wage growth accelerate.

I have a guest on in a little while that's talking about the, and I don't know if you can get into this at all, talking about the

migrant workers on farms and that, you know, we're going to not go after some of the farmers.

And the local farms and the small family farms are saying, no, that's not a problem.

That is a problem with these big industrialized farms.

And they're trying to, you know, put us out.

Right.

I mean,

the president has talked about making some exceptions.

I mean, and again, but like this, to my understanding, Glenn, and correct me if I'm wrong, but in the case of California, you've got migrant workers, seasonal migrant workers who come in, but it's illegal.

This is the point.

It's illegal.

So I think what we want to highlight is the fact there have been millions of people who have come in illegally.

And that cheap source of illegal labor is depressing wages in a way that is to the significant disadvantage of U.S.

citizens.

And that is a totally separate and much bigger, broader, deeper issue than certain select areas, which

may have their own unique microeconomic issues.

Aaron Powell, so we have a wage growth for blue-collar workers up about 2%, almost 2%,

biggest in 60 years,

and bigger than he did in the first term.

What does that tell us?

Does it tell us anything of what is possibly coming?

Because people are still feeling the bite of inflation, although inflation is way down.

It's not down, it's just reduced.

But it is, I mean, it is really close to going into the negative territory for the first time.

What are the things that you expect to see that might signal to somebody like you, when you look at the almost 2% real wages growth going up, what does that tell you is coming?

So to me, Glenn, this just speaks to the incredible competency

and

real world know-how because of his business acupuncture and the President's policies, where he's actually accomplished an extraordinary amount in getting prices down very quickly, as he had promised.

Now, when the bill is passed, the one big beautiful bill is passed, then I'm going to look for significant capital investment, companies investing in plants, companies investing in equipment, companies investing in factories.

And that means they've got to employ people to build those factories.

It means you have to employ people to operate the machinery, to use the capital.

And, you know, not to get too wonky, but the capital-labor ratio, when capital rises relative to labor, you're able to pay labor more money.

So that's what I'm going to look for.

So when the bill is passed, I think you're going to see a continuation of very strong growth, which right now, according to the widely followed Atlanta Fed GDP number, is going to grow upwards of 3.5%, 4% in the second quarter.

And I see no reason, Glenn, once this bill is passed soon, that it just removes any lingering uncertainty on tax policy, because absent passage of the bill, there would be a record large tax increase, which would decimate the economy next year.

So that certainty that we're finally going to make permanent President Trump's policies will be a boon to the average blue-collar worker.

So I don't like a lot of the things in the Big Beautiful bill, but I love a lot of things in the Big Beautiful Bill.

It seems like we're getting a little teaspoon of everything in this thing.

However, I think

the way I look at it, at least currently, the good stuff outweighs the bad stuff in it by far because of that tax cut.

Are you convinced that we're going to get this bill?

I mean, now it's going back to Congress and Congress is saying it's dead on arrival.

Yes.

So, yeah, I mean, yeah,

I mean, the alternative to the bill would be just horrendous.

And I love the fact that they're expanding the credit for investment to include new factories.

I think that is just great.

The bill will go through, and I'm optimistic.

Explain.

I'm an optimist.

Joe, explain what you mean by it would be disastrous, because this is what I keep coming back to on this.

If this doesn't pass.

Right.

If it doesn't pass, Glenn, we're going to have the largest tax increase in U.S.

history, which would meaningfully depress all the things that we want more of that will help drive a continuation of the blue-collar boom.

In other words, you're going to have significant weakness in capital spending, capital investment.

That is the basis for all productivity gains.

It's the ingenuity and investment that companies are making in cutting edge technologies and capital, which needs to be replaced because it gets depleted.

It allows the economy to grow

at a faster pace.

And if we don't pass the bill, all that expensing goes by the wayside.

Marginal rates on capital and labor rise tremendously.

Corporate tax rates increase significantly.

Small businesses that pay those marginal rates would massively suffer.

I mean, it's just...

It's just a very bad situation.

If we want to go back to a high tax, high regulatory environment, as we had in the Obama years when the economy was growing well under 2%, then that's the path we're going to go down.

And I don't see that as being a very economically productive way to go.

Aaron Powell, so do you understand why some people are standing against it and saying, you know, there's not enough cuts in this because they're concerned about the value of the dollar of just, you know,

just spending ourselves into oblivion?

Do you at least understand that argument?

Yes.

I would say that this is a very, very good bill, and that should not be the enemy of perfect.

In a perfect world, sure,

there would be even more spending cuts, but this bill is not designed to address some of the areas where some people would like lower spending.

We're certainly, Glenn, not going to cut our way to prosperity.

We need to grow our way.

to prosperity.

And one of the things I would meaningfully push back against some of the people who understandably are worried about long-term debt is that, look, what assumptions are we making on growth?

Because if we're assuming 1.8% real GDP growth, as the official arbiter is assuming, then, yeah, revenues aren't going to be that great and deficits could be as large as they say.

But if we're going to assume more Trumpian-type growth of, say, 3%, which is much more consistent with the first presidential term of Donald Trump and what this bill has that will allow us to grow at 3% or faster, we're going to get much better revenues.

So I would focus on all the positives, and then we can go back at some point to address some of the others.

But the alternative is just horrendous.

And that's where the pushback needs to be, in addition to the fact that, again,

the deficit assumptions to me are too pessimistic because they're woefully downbeat on how the economy is likely to perform over the next decade.

Let me ask you a final question about interest rates.

The Fed.

Is the Fed going to lower interest rates?

Should they lower interest rates?

Glenn, I'm not at liberty to discuss the monetary policy, but I have to think that Chair Powell and his colleagues have to like this inflation news.

I mean, it is remarkable how the consensus of professional forecasters got the inflation data wrong, virtually all the series for three months in a row.

And I've got to think the Fed has to like the fact that inflation is moving down because of President Trump's policies.

So we'll see what happens going forward.

But that's good news.

I can't thank you enough for everything that you guys are doing.

I just love Treasury Secretary Besson.

I think he's really, really good.

And being on his team must be fascinating.

Yeah, no, I'm very lucky and it's an honor, Glenn.

And thank you so much for having me on your show.

You bet.

Thanks, Joe.

I appreciate it.

Joe is counselor to the U.S.

Treasury Secretary, Joe Lavorna,

and we appreciate him coming on the program.

I think that is really good news.

You know, people are downplaying that, but you know,

it hasn't been done except in his last term since the 1960s.

If it's no big deal, then why hasn't every president had this result?

It means your real hourly wage has gone up nearly 2% in the last five months.

You may not feel it yet, but you will, and especially if you can keep on this track.

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They want you silent, obedient, and blind.

Well, shoot, here we are with open eyes and a bit of rebellious nature.

Hold in line, my friends.

Glenn Beck will be back in a minute.

Oh, poor Alex Padilla, the senator, crying about being handcuffed.

Listen to this.

I was forced to the ground.

First on my knees.

Oh, no.

And then flat on my chest.

And as I was handcuffed

and marched down a hallway.

A hallway?

Doubt a hallway.

A hallway.

Why am I being detained?

Why?

I don't understand.

Not once did they tell me why.

Yeah, not once.

Oh, I thought I was going to the gas chamber.

I pray you never have a moment like this.

Oh, me too.

Oh, I pray you don't.

But I will tell you,

in that moment,

a lot of questions came.

A lot of questions.

Right.

Yeah.

Like, what was I thinking?

First of all, where are they taking me?

Where are they taking me?

Because I know I'm not just being

caught in El Salvador.

Is that where he's going?

Am I being arrested here?

Am I being arrested?

And the answer was no.

A city already on edge.

From being militarized.

Think

when they see their United States senator

handcuffed just for trying to ask a question.

Just for asking a question.

It's gotten so

you can't even bum rush

Christy Noam, who's giving a press conference now

without being pushed around by somebody.

Right.

It is awful.

It is awful.

And

I hope nobody has that kind of experience.

You know what?

I can guarantee you, Senator, I won't have that experience because I won't bum rush.

You're not going to bum rush Christy Noam.

No, Christy Noam during a live national shot of a press conference.

I'm not going to do it.

So I'm not really that worried about, you know, being tackled to the ground.

So you're saying it's that easy?

Just don't bum rush Christy Noam

in a live press conference without identifying yourself.

Yeah, I think that's pretty.

I mean, it's a

bit of a drink, Danny.

Can it be that easy?

I don't think so.

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Down the road where shadows hide, till the dark on every side.

Stand your ground when

The fusion of entertainment and enlightenment.

This is

the Glenn Beck program.

You know, we are dealing with some of the biggest issues the world has ever seen.

I mean, we're dealing with AI.

We're dealing with the economic collapse of the entire West.

We're dealing with the

invasion of of the Western civilization from mainly Islamic nations, especially when you look overseas in Europe

and the national suicide that everybody in the EU is committing and it looks like we are committing.

And then you have Russia and Ukraine, you have China.

And now you have Israel and Iran.

And everybody is just pointing fingers, labeling one another and yelling and then not listening.

I really wanted to get Sean Davis on because I'm not sure if we agree.

Maybe we do, but

he is the federalist CEO and co-founder.

Really smart guy.

And I'd just like to have a conversation, a normal conversation about

what do we do in this situation?

I don't want to go to war.

I'm not even comfortable with

putting the bunker buster on an airplane that has the United States seal on it.

No, I don't want to be involved in that.

You want to buy the bomb, we'll sell you the bomb, but I don't want to be involved in any of this.

And I don't know when we all decided we were so comfortable that, yeah, you know what, we provide them with some coordinates.

Can we keep that to ourselves if we're doing that?

And I also don't believe our CIA.

I don't believe the Mossad.

I don't believe the media.

I don't know who I believe.

But I do know that

12vers

actually do want to wash the world in blood and would vaporize the Jews if they could.

But would they?

Are they even going for a bomb?

I've been told since 2003.

They're 15 minutes away, Glenn, from having a nuclear weapon.

Well, they haven't done it yet.

Is that just stupid to think?

I don't know what to make of this.

So I thought Sean might be able to help answer some of those questions or just help think it through.

Jason and Pat are with me today as well.

We begin in 60 seconds first.

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Sean, welcome to the program.

Thank you for having me, sir.

You bet.

I'm glad to have you on.

You know,

I'm not sure of anybody's position because the smart people, like I think you are, are asking questions and

not coming out with these bold declarations.

They're just asking questions and sometimes their own response, at least mine is, it's very nuanced.

And I'm not recommending anything.

I'm asking questions and I'm warning about the mistakes of the past.

I don't trust anybody.

But I also think a nuclear-armed Iran is really bad.

But I want Israel to take care of it.

I don't want to be involved in that.

It's their direct threat right now.

Let them take care of it.

Where do we go from here?

What questions should we be asking ourselves, Sean?

Yeah, I love your approach to it because it doesn't start with a conclusion.

It's kind of trying to build what we should be doing from the bottom up, which becomes a discussion of first principles.

And I think that's really important.

I think we probably all agree that we don't want bad people and we don't want our enemies to have weapons they could use to destroy us or our friends.

I think probably everyone agrees on that.

We probably

can I add a caveat to that: not just our enemies, but especially those who are bat crap crazy

or believe in the return of the Mahdi, and I can hasten his return by washing the world in blood.

That kind of puts you in a special category for me.

But anyway, go ahead.

And I think I might even extend it.

I'm not even sure I want our friends and allies to have them.

In a perfect world, we would be the only country with these massive weapons.

Okay.

All right.

I'll go for that.

Yeah.

Right.

Okay.

So

the problem we have is that, you know, know, for, let's call it 80 years, you know, 75, the nuclear toothpaste has been out of the tube.

Soviets got it, then it's expanded elsewhere.

You know, India, Pakistan, North Korea, France, Israel, South

Africa for a time.

They all had nukes.

And to me, the big problem that I have a really difficult time wrapping my head around is how do you solve the problem we created with Gaddafi and Libya?

Yes.

That country gave up their weapons program voluntarily after Iraq, you know, kind of before Iraq became an utter debacle and a cautionary tale.

But they gave up their weapons, and the U.S.

and NATO and our allies, we returned the favor, thanks to Hillary and Obama, by overthrowing Gaddafi and killing him.

And I think what that communicated to every leader on earth, good or bad, was that if you don't want to ever be overthrown, you have to have nuclear weapons.

And so I start with

understanding that fact, what is the best, most effective way to make our enemies, make sure our enemies don't get nuclear weapons.

And I'll tell you, I don't have a good answer because we've heard for 40 years that Iran's on the verge of a nuke.

They're about to get a new.

They're about to have a weapon.

So let's assume we go through with these attacks and we bomb Fordow or Israel bombs it.

What that doesn't get rid of is the incentive.

It temporarily gets rid of a mechanism for, I guess, enriching uranium.

But in four years or five years,

how do we deal with that?

I don't think regime change is a great idea because we've seen how well that works, turns into an unmitigated disaster.

And so I think we just have to start with the question, what is the best possible way to incentivize people we don't like and don't like us to not have weapons?

And I genuinely don't have a good answer to it.

You know what?

I keep thinking every day I do this job, and I think what Reagan said when I was a kid, he said, there's going to come a time, and he was talking about Social Security at the time, but I apply it now to everything.

There's going to come a time when we've made so many mistakes.

There won't be a good solution to anything.

Every choice will be a bad choice.

And I think we're here.

I think we're here.

Everything we do, you're like, I don't know.

I don't know.

I don't want to do the mistakes of the past, but I don't know how to stop this now.

You know, regime change.

Let me just take that one.

Regime change.

It doesn't work.

I loved your post.

I think it was yesterday.

Yes, our military-industrial complex lied about Vietnam,

killed Kennedy, ran a coup against Nixon, then killed another Kennedy, tried to get MLK Jr.

to kill himself, ran drugs through the Americas to fund shenanigans in the Middle East, funded bin Laden and the Taliban, missed 9-11, then lied about weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, got an ambassador murdered in Benghazi, then turned Libya into a slave market run by terrorists, then created ISIS, ran the Russian collusion hoax, tried to overthrow Trump with the Ukrainian hoax, weaponized a bat virus that killed millions of people, then lied about it, and then used the virus

they made to steal an election, then arrest Trump, tried to bankrupt him, tried to make him die in prison.

And then, when they failed, they denied him adequate security, leading him to be shot in the head.

Yeah, they did all of those things.

The drug cartels, Iraq, Bosnia in the 1990s, Iraq and Afghanistan in the 2000s, still Iraq and Afghanistan in 2010, plus Libya, the whole Moronic Arab Spring thing, Ukraine in the 2020s.

These were all disasters that cost millions of dollars and countless lives.

You're right on every single one of those things.

Every single one of those things.

So how do we make a decision now?

Right, and that's why I think it's so important to get to first principles, which is understanding our limitations, understanding history, understanding how other nations view things.

One thing that's driven me nuts in the foreign policy debates that we've had in this country for 20, 30 years is there seems to be zero desire to put ourselves in the position of our adversaries or our opponents and think, how are they looking at things?

You know, some people, if you try to do that, they'll say, oh, well, you're sympathizing with them or you're appeasing.

Well, no,

this is the basic stuff for negotiation.

If you're playing chess against someone, you want to understand what they're going to do next so you can respond to it.

And we just never do that.

And I guess, so I look at this, I think there's probably two major options for either forestalling or preventing a particular regime from getting weapons.

The first one is regime change.

In the short term, you can tell yourself, we're going to go overthrow these people, and then they won't want nukes anymore because we'll put our friends in, and then that'll be good.

Well, that's been ongoing in Iran for 100 years.

You know, the Brits and the Soviets are the ones who came in and put the original Shah in.

It's been a mess over there.

So personally, I throw regime change out the window because it opens up Pandora's box of just insanity as we've seen in the Middle East.

Okay, hang on just a sec.

Hang on just a sec.

Wait, wait, on that.

Is there a chance that,

you know, because I never saw it.

I kept saying, you know, when we went into war in Iraq and Afghanistan, show me the person that's, you know, going to have their face on the stamp.

Show me the person that's going to have their face on the money.

I never saw anybody stand up and say, you know, we need to be free and we're going to fight for our own freedom.

You do have those people that are really tired of this, that are much more Western.

I don't want to get involved in a regime change, and I certainly don't want to say, hey, we're going to help you pick a leader.

Oh, my God.

But is there a chance that this time it is different?

Or is that just wishful, stupid thinking?

You know, I think it's probably wishful thinking, but I don't know.

I'll tell you, I have a hard enough time figuring out what's going on politically in my own country.

Think about all the time we spent poring over polls over every election and talking to our neighbors.

This is a country we were born in.

We understand its culture without even thinking about it.

We're fluent in the language.

We can talk to anyone we want whenever we want.

And we have a tough time figuring what out what's going on here.

I don't have a clue what's happening in Iran.

I don't speak any of the three or four different languages over there.

I don't understand the culture.

I've never been there.

I'm not able to talk to people there.

I don't know how to read the news there.

And so the idea that I or really any other Westerner can look at Iran and with any confidence say what the people want or don't want, I think is crazy.

And so I think you kind of have to be humble about your ignorance.

And we are largely ignorant of just about everything happening within Iran and its culture and its people.

I have to say I think you're right on that.

Okay, so that's out.

So what's the next thing?

Yeah, so

we've kind of set aside regime change.

It's probably not a great idea.

Another option is maybe economic incentives.

Yeah, we know you don't want to be overthrown.

That's going to be a hard incentive to overcome.

So you're going to want nukes as regime change insurance.

Maybe we can bribe you out of it.

All kinds of economic assurances and this and that.

The problem with Iran is that they're sitting on oil, which is probably the most precious and important natural resource on Earth.

I don't think that works.

And so I think what we're left with is probably the whack-a-mole that's been going on for years.

And I think the nation that's probably best suited to deal with that whack-a-mole, they're the ones at risk because Iran can't reach us here in the U.S.

They don't have the ballistic missile capability.

They're not a direct military threat to us.

They're clearly a military threat to our friends and allies in the Middle East.

And so I think the least worst option is probably Israel doing what it does every five to ten years and going and trying to degrade their ability to mechanically make this stuff.

Wait to see what happens, do it again over and over and over.

But to me, that's a regional issue.

And yes, they're our allies, and yes, they're our friends, but

it's far more consequential to them than it is to us.

And so I have no problem with them doing what they need to do to address the threats to them.

I'm with you 100% so far.

Now,

I'm very, you know, we are the only ones with the bunker buster that could get into that.

I mean, I think that, what does that go down?

12 stories, 20 stories?

20.

20 stories underground.

You You can destroy anything with a 20-story footprint underground.

We're the only ones that have it.

It has to be dropped from one of our planes.

And I'm very uncomfortable with that.

Very uncomfortable.

I mean, you know what?

You want to buy the bunker buster?

I'll sell it to you, but you've got to drop it.

Once we put that on our plane and we drop it,

aren't we then

part of the war?

Right.

And that, like I said, that might be the least worst option to the extent we have to be involved.

But I think when it comes to foreign policy, I think a lot about what Mike Tyson said, that everyone has a plan until they get punched in the face.

Once you go and drop a bomb on someone, once you engage in offensive military capabilities, now you may rhetorically say, well, it's preemptively defensive.

It's an offensive move whenever you bomb another country.

You are creating

the conditions for all kinds of chaos.

Who knows how they're going to to respond?

Maybe they're rational, they understand, look, we're just going to have to take this one on the chin.

We don't want to fight with the U.S., we don't want to fight with Israel, we're just going to deal with it.

Or maybe they decide, hey, we were in the middle of negotiations and we thought we were trying to get somewhere.

And if they're just going to do this stuff to us, then

to heck with it, we're just going to unleash hell.

That can happen.

Now, I don't know if it will.

It's probably less likely than them just taking it, but it's a possibility.

Whenever you go and punch someone in the face, you

now have to deal with the consequences of how they're going to respond.

All right.

Back with more in just a second.

Can you stay with me just for a few more minutes, Sean?

Of course.

Yeah, okay.

Give me 60 seconds.

We'll be right back with more.

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Before we go back to Sean, Jason, I had you look up in the break

preemptive strikes.

Is that something new?

Because

I know that's, you know, about my age, maybe.

I don't remember people saying we got to preemptively strike more than when

the nukes started coming in.

That's when everybody was like, you got to do it before they get one.

Is this a new thing or has this been going on forever?

Well, I want to start off with saying I'm so glad for Sean and having this conversation because it is sorely needed right now.

It is so bad.

There's a weird irony with preemptive or preventative strikes because the first modern preventive strike in, you know, look into the Cold War era was the start of the Six-Day War when Egypt blockaded Israel, massed 100,000 troops.

Wow.

Then Israel did the first modern preemptive strike.

If they would not have,

they would not be here right now.

So it's just another...

coal in the fire really for you know what is the red line and allowing something like Sean what is the red line is there a red line

For us or for Israel?

You know, any society, is there a red line?

I think

the answer for Israel is a lot sooner than ours, but is there such a thing as a red line to go first and preemptively strike?

I'm sure there is.

I'm sure there is.

It's so situational that I would have a hard time saying right now, this is a red line that satisfies all conditions for all nations.

How about just for Israel right now?

For Israel, I would think it would be a delivery mechanism and

the actual developed warhead.

That's probably what I would look at.

Can

this enemy nation at this moment deliver a nuclear warhead to us right now?

That's what I would say is the red line.

But you know what?

I haven't had the country trying to wipe me off the earth for the last 80 years, 75 years.

So, you know.

5,000.

Right.

But hard for me, you know, just given my position to know exactly what theirs is.

For the U.S., I'd say it's probably close to the same thing, an ability to attack the U.S.

people.

Now, you'll hear from the Pentagon and people saying, well, they can hurt our troops in the region.

My view is, well, that's probably a good reason to not be meddling in other regions all the time because you're putting your people at risk.

Sean, thank you so much.

What a great conversation.

I really appreciate it.

Thank you for being reasonable, rational, and

allowing people to disagree and learn from our disagreements.

Thank you, Sean.

I appreciate it.

You're very gracious.

Thank you, sir.

You bet.

The CEO of the Federalist, Sean Davis.

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You know, I just saw a tweet from Esla

Levant.

He said, I don't understand how Trump's position can be criticized by my friends in America first.

15 years,

Trump has said Iran cannot be allowed to have nukes.

He said it 100 times.

Seriously, search for the word Iran on Trump's feed, and you will get it 100 hits.

Trump engaged in good health negotiations with Iran this year, giving them 60 days during which Trump stopped Israel from attacking Iran.

Iran refused the deal.

So on the 61st day, Trump permitted Israel to take out Iran's nuclear and missile threat, as well as leadership of the IRGC

terrorist group, which just happens to benefit every Arab state in the region, including Saudi Arabia and the UAE.

The price of oil steadily at $75 per barrel, no World War III.

Today, Russia confirmed they're sitting this one out.

No Russian boots on the ground.

And so far, I'm sorry, no American boots on the ground.

And so far, Iran hasn't fired a shot at U.S.

personnel.

Prediction.

There will be another round of Abraham Accords peace treaties within a year.

That's true.

Including Saudi Arabia and maybe even Lebanon.

That's true.

Iran's de facto motto, death to America.

Through Hezbollah, they murdered 241 U.S.

Marines in a single attack.

Don't confuse America first with pacifism or appeasement.

What lessons do you think China and Russia are taking from this past week?

That America is strong or that America is weak?

Don't oversample

extremity online.

Qatar-sponsored Twitter pundits, they are not the party base.

You know, that's Ezra Levant, our friend from Canada, he's absolutely right on this.

And I think our last guest from the Federalists, the CEO of Federalists, is absolutely right as well.

But he, you know, he has a different red line than I think I have.

I guess I would like to have that, but.

His red line seems to be

even Iran can develop a nuclear weapon, but if it can't reach us, then it's not our business, right?

If they don't have

an ICBM that can get it here or a long-range bomber that can get it here, then it's not our business.

And that's something Israel should work out.

Is that what our founders would say, Pat?

I think it would be.

Yeah, I think it would be.

Yeah.

Yeah.

They didn't want us to get involved in anybody else's affairs.

It only involves us if they can strike us.

But that's not President Trump's red line.

President Trump's red line is they can't have a weapon, period.

They cannot be allowed to have a nuclear weapon.

So that's a different red line than

Sean Davis had.

And you just have to decide what is your red line.

I think

it's probably closer to Trump's than Sean's

because

I don't think they can be allowed to have a nuclear weapon.

I mean, they signed the non-proliferation treaty.

A lot of people say, what business do we have?

Well, they signed the treaty in 1970, along with almost every other nation except four on the planet.

So they've already agreed not to build a nuclear weapon, and we're going to hold them to that because the proliferation is really a dangerous thing.

Let's talk about North Korea for a second, because

I think North Korea, I think Iran learned everything by the way we dealt with North Korea.

Did you agree with that?

Yeah.

Oh, absolutely.

I mean, that is the perfect example, Glenn, because we've gone down this road before.

And you talk about red lines.

The entire, Iran before was North Korea.

Everyone was calling them crazy.

We were trying to get them.

The whole international community was trying to get them to not build a nuclear weapon.

I think it was even Bill Clinton that helped them build a nuclear reactor over there as part of an appeasement.

Then their strategy going forward, the North Koreans, was to ramp up tension, cause a bunch of hoopla, get all this stuff going, and then wait until the United States and the international community swooped in and made a deal for them, usually giving them money, food, whatever.

Another civilian nuclear reactor, whatever.

We played that game, played that game, played that game.

How are they now?

They are fully nuclear armed, multiple nuclear weapons.

Some intelligence reports say with the potential of striking very close to the United States with their missile technology.

Is that what we want for Iran?

Because they're playing the same game.

The Iranians learned nuclear technology, supposedly, from the North Koreans, missile technology from the North Koreans, and now they're following their exact same playbook.

Are we willing to allow a similar situation that's in North Korea now to what's your red line?

I know.

See, it comes down to this, doesn't it?

You know what's weird is there's a new poll out that shows 60%

of people

are

not for boots on the ground.

They do not want us involved in this war.

100%.

80%

say

Iran must not be allowed to have a nuke.

Yeah.

So how do you solve that one?

I think it's very knee-jerk

for people to say, oh my gosh, if we use this bunker-bustering bomb to help destroy the Fordo facility, which is buried deep under the ground and maybe one of the last sites they have, that suddenly we're kicking off World War III and now we're in the war.

I think that's very knee-jerk.

I don't think it's that bad if we do do this.

Now, the problem is,

will Iran then immediately target all of our bases within the Middle East?

That's very possible.

Yeah, they would.

But my red line for Iran is different.

Because

it can't just be a delivery missile or vehicle like Sean, in my opinion, was talking about.

Because what happened after Obama signed the nuclear agreement and everything happened?

They didn't put any restrictions on their militia activity and terror activity.

And that's when they spread all over the Middle East.

Why?

Because it got them closer to Israel.

So they don't need a delivery vehicle.

They can walk it in with a Shiite militia.

So it's different.

So you're advising the president.

I'm the president of the United States.

Pat, I need you to come into the Oval Office.

Jason, I need you to come into the Oval Office.

What the hell do I do?

Under no circumstances should American boots be on the ground.

But I...

Yeah, but let me ask you as the president, Jason,

if I stop them, if I drop this bomb, there's a good chance that they're going to retaliate against our troops.

I just take that.

Mr.

President, first, I love your hair.

It's so amazing.

It's the greatest.

Nobody thought it could ever be combed like this.

It is every day.

Second,

I see the best case scenario if we help drop a bunker buster bomb to completely set that program back and then scale back our activity.

That would be my recommendation.

Pat?

I honestly, I

as far as I would go is the bunker buster bomb.

But, you know, we have to, that has to come from a B2 bomber.

That has to come from this.

So we're in it at that point, and they will retaliate.

So then

you got to decide, all right, then we're going to extend ourselves even more into bombing Iran probably more extensively, right?

Taking out their missiles and their launch sites, which

could eventually lead to boots on the ground.

It's a tough one.

That I would not.

Yeah, it is a tough one.

And that's a tough one.

I don't know if we have been, and maybe it's just because we've grown and we no longer trust, you know, our intel agencies or anything else.

Cause they used to have to go and be like, you know, I don't think they're lying to us.

Why would they lie to us?

Stupid and naive.

So naive.

Sometimes we don't get those times back.

I know, I know.

Well, they might drug us into those times.

But,

you know,

I don't recall a time where it has been this tough to decide.

And I think that's because we've seen the results of this over and over and over again.

We have paid a very high price in blood and guts in the Middle East, and nothing has changed.

But then again, we also take the nuke seriously.

And we see, you know, I haven't heard anybody vocalize this yet, but there are

8,000 terrorists in our country right now that have ties to Hezbollah, Hamas,

you know, some of these al-Qaeda,

and they're all connected in the end.

You know, if they can destroy us, they'll all work together to those ends, and then they'll kill each other after they're done feasting on our bones.

But I don't think I've ever faced something this complex of a problem.

I mean, they get a weapon

and we bomb them or somebody bombs them.

And Russia is like, hey, wait a minute.

They're our allies.

We just bombed them.

Now

they drop a nuclear bomb.

How do we respond?

Do we drop a nuclear bomb on that?

Knowing that Russia and China most likely will be on their side?

I mean, once this thing starts, it doesn't stop.

Yeah.

And this has a lot more ramifications.

We mentioned China, China, you know, Russia, how are they looking at all of this?

That's very key, too, because this is part of Trump's negotiating plan.

So he cannot look weak on this.

It's got to be: he offered up negotiations, you failed to deliver on those negotiations, then the consequences happened.

So if there are no consequences afterwards, then what does that do for his negotiations with China, with Taiwan, or Russia, with Ukraine?

Let me ask you something.

In 10 years,

are we a?

I mean, because who's the real enemy here?

Is it China?

Is it

the Islamist?

Not just in the Middle East, but all throughout our countries, everywhere, everywhere now.

Is it communism, socialism?

Is it ourselves?

I mean, what looks the same in 2025, 2030,

or 2030 or 2035?

What looks the same

as it does now?

With all of those things pressing in on us,

how do you navigate that?

I mean, I think this is maybe, possibly, the hardest time to be president of the United States.

There's just no good answer here.

None.

None.

You know, even if we, even if we cut back our spending, spending, we cut back our spending.

The reason why they don't want to cut back our spending is because people don't have enough money.

And the government is spending money right now.

And

I would like them to give some of our money back.

But

they're borrowing money to spend money to

keep things greased.

I don't know.

It's interesting.

What makes this such a hard decision is we are so equipped with information now.

There's so much data, times when this has failed to happen and gone wildly disastrous for us that we know the consequences when this gets screwed up.

You know, war is what happens when politicians fail.

That used to be the guiding principle back in the day, but we've seen so many times politicians not using that as the reason to go to war, whether it is with Obama and Clinton and Benghazi.

or

pick any other regime change operation.

We've gone to war just for other motivations.

it's hard to decipher now whether we're being lied to or if we're actually going to you know thinking about war because every

you know uh possible solution has now been exhausted what is it

you know it's funny we look at we look at everything that is going on and we think uh

you know how fast we can react to everything

but we don't have any better decision-making abilities on any of it.

You know, we we could react without even thinking, and it'll all be over quickly.

Um, pray for the president, pray for everybody on all sides of this because, boy, this is a this is a big one.

This is a big one.

All right, back in just a minute.

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What you're hearing are your thoughts.

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Been fun in game, fun and games on today's program, hasn't it?

It's been fun for everybody.

You know, something that'll just make you laugh is Congresswoman Elon Omar and her love for America.

Here it is.

Listen to this.

To be coming out of our country.

I mean, I grew up

in a dictatorship.

And I don't even remember ever witnessing anything like that.

To have a democracy, a peaking of hope

for the world to now be turned into

one of the worst countries

where the military are in our streets without any regard for people's constitutional rights.

While our president is spending millions of dollars prompting himself up like a failed dictator with a military parade,

it is really shocking and it should be a wake-up call.

Yeah, it is.

We should send you back a home.

Yes.

You know, you're here as a guest.

I guess you became an American citizen.

She became an American citizen, right?

She has to be in Congress, right?

Yeah.

But, you know, if you hate it here and we're so horrible, why don't you go someplace that is nicer, that you really like?

Right.

Yeah, go to one of the best countries.

You came from Somalia.

That's got to be better than this, right?

Go.

Yeah.

Jim Acosta explaining the American voter.

Listen to this.

The far right in this country has kind of figured out a way to infiltrate, you know, the heartland and to, you know, basically infiltrate, you know, mom and pop from the farm to their point of view.

And as it turns out, a lot of those folks vote in these elections.

And a lot of those folks have been completely led astray.

I hate to say it, but they've just been completely led astray.

And we've all just let this happen on our watch with essentially a business model for delivering the news in this country that just does not work anymore.

Yeah, yeah.

He was speaking at the Center for American Progress.

Oh, okay.

Glenn Beck.