Ep 94 | How the Left Handed Black People 'Smallpox in a Blanket' | Jason Whitlock | The Glenn Beck Podcast

Even though in Canada I'm widely known for my controversial view that curling is not a sport, I'm not a sports fan at all, which might lead you to be surprised.

My guest today is one of the most prominent sports writers and commentators in America.

Like I said, I'm not a sports fan, but I am a fan of somebody who understands the culture, and sports is part of the American culture, and those who stand for truth.

I especially root for those who stand for truth when it'd be much easier for them not to.

In fact,

I really admire him because he has stood up for truth and lost his job because of it.

Often the best cultural critics are those who hold a mirror up to society and note the flaws that the subjects fail to see or are unwilling to see.

But to do that requires courage and a certain fearlessness because people don't really like when you're like, and you know something else, Beck, you're fat.

The truth can hit too close to home,

and it hurts.

It can be too hard to deal with, might even shatter powerful but false narratives that I am the greatest, in shape, best-looking man on podcast.

Not so much.

That's what my guest has been doing for almost 30 years now, blasting floodlights of truth onto culture through the outside lens of America's sports.

He is an award-winning journalist, radio and TV commentator.

He's worked for ESPN, Fox Sports.

He's been called the most prominent black sports writer in the country.

He's also been called the most hated sports writer in the black community.

But he will be the first to tell you that neither being a sports writer nor being black truly defines who he is.

It's almost as if his entire career has been a rehearsal for the insane cultural chaos of 2020.

Because Because if there was ever a moment America needed to hear this man's voice, it's right now.

Today, Jason Whitlock.

Jason, thank you for dressing up and shaving for us.

I thought this was audio only.

Well, Well, at least you're wearing pants.

And if you're not, don't tell me about it.

Thanks for being on with us.

I met you, what, about a month ago or so?

It's probably been six weeks.

Six weeks.

Six weeks.

You are a remarkable human being.

You just have a passion in you and a mission.

Being a really good, God-fearing man, just nothing's going to stop you, is it?

I don't think so.

I've been on the same mission for a long time, and it's hard to move me off of what I'm passionate about.

And, you know, I got into journalism because I wanted to

speak truthfully on important issues related to the sports world, but also important issues related to American culture.

And, you know, I had a vision when I graduated college in 1990 of what I wanted to do and what kind of conversation I wanted to lead.

And, you know, I'm right on track.

So you saw this coming or you just felt what you had to say was important.

It's the same message from 1990 as it is now?

Pretty much.

Really?

When I grew up, I've read the paper, the newspaper, religiously, because I was a huge Indiana Pacer basketball fan.

And back then,

Glenn, you're old enough to remember, again, the newspaper was everything.

And so if you follow a team, you had to follow the newspaper.

And I actually, I didn't like my newspaper growing up.

I thought that the writers actually wrote their material thinking about the coaches and the players that they were covering, not the readers.

And so I came into this with a mission of I'm going to always write for the readers.

And then the other thing, the other part of my mission was there was a guy in Chicago named Mike Royko, who was the best newspaper columnist in the country at that time, won a Pulitzer Prize.

And his column was picked up, it was syndicated in the Indianapolis newspapers.

And I wanted to be like Mike Royko.

I wanted to be the Mike Royko of sports.

And Mike Royko didn't write about sports.

He wrote about national politics and Chicago politics and race.

And occasionally sometimes he'd write about sports.

I want to do what Mike Royko did in the sports world.

And that was always bigger than just sports.

And I felt like there was a way to talk about the rest of American culture through the lens of sports.

And that's what I've been doing

for my whole career.

So I just want to understand this

because I think that's part of the problem with sports.

And I don't watch sports, so I'm not a sports fan at all, but I have enough friends.

Everybody I know, my wife is a sports fan.

And everyone is sick

of all the politics and the preachiness.

And they're like, I just want to

enjoy the game.

So

were you trying to inject things in to teach or you were just, I don't understand.

What's the difference between what you saw and what we're doing now?

Well,

I'm going to give you a very narcissistic, arrogant answer.

If you really understand my career as a sports journalist,

I came into the lane of mixing sports and culture.

and writing about American culture through the lens of sports.

And I did did it from a traditional sports mindset.

Sports were a celebration of Americana.

And so I've never been involved in politics.

Got it.

But I was conservative.

So my values

were worth it.

I want to finish my point, though, Glenn, because my values were conservative.

And if you go back and look at things I've been writing since 1990, there was always this conservative point of view.

But I won a bunch of awards and became very popular as a sports writer.

I appeared on the Oprah Winfrey show, you know, won some national awards.

No, not some national awards.

You're the only sports writer to win the Scripps Howard Award.

I mean, that's

yeah, for I mean, that's a big deal.

It happened in 2007.

This is a very arrogant statement, Glenn, but it's factual.

A lot of young journalists and my peers watch what I did.

And what you're now seeing in the sports media world is a very bad imitation of the work that I did in building up my career.

Most of these people don't have the courage,

balls to do it.

And so they come with a woke left-wing version of what I did.

So, what you did,

as I listened to you, would have been like what I always loved about baseball and particularly the way the NFL always imaged itself as

these are heroes that are coming up.

This is the American sport and we love the country and it's part of the fabric of America.

That's where you were looking at the cultural connection.

Absolutely.

And it taught the value

that best exemplified America at its best.

That's what sports have always done.

I grew up as a football player, went to college on a football scholarship.

If you look at what Pete Rozelle and the NFL did, they attached themselves in order to overtake baseball.

Football became more patriotic than even baseball.

The military flyovers, the national anthems before the game, all of that.

The NFL

tried to make you feel like the most patriotic thing you can do on a Sunday is go to church and watch football.

And

it was a brilliant business strategy that catapulted football to where it's America's national pastime.

It's something that I authentically believe in.

Sports do teach the values that best exemplify America.

But I think that, and again, this is really big picture, but we're starting to now really understand it.

Like China and our competitors figured out if you really want to influence American culture, you have to get in the sports world.

You have to influence that.

If you can turn that left, Marxist, progressive, whatever.

then you have a chance to really influence American culture and spin the whole culture in a negative direction.

When did this happen?

Because Because it seems like to an outside observer,

the American pastime, American football, it was always America.

And then it's seemingly on the outside on a dime.

All of a sudden, it's

hate America.

And this is what's wrong with America and preaching all the time.

And when did that happen?

And why did that happen?

I don't think it was on a dime and there's been a process, but go look at,

and again, I'm not some super harsh Barack Obama critic, but I'm just let the facts speak for themselves.

Barack Obama intentionally partnered with ESPN

because he wanted to get to speak to that sports audience.

Right.

And he, he, every year, the NCAA tournament, Barack Obama filling out his bracket.

Right.

Barack Obama, the greatest basketball fan in the history of the presidency.

Let's go do

short stories on Barack playing basketball at the backyard of the White House and let's Barack at NBA games.

And so there was like a process of like,

let's move

left-wing stuff into the sports world.

And then we all-wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.

That couldn't have happened, though.

I mean,

I've never played basketball.

I don't play sports.

I've never played sports.

And

I almost have no feeling in my hands.

And so

it's like playing with, and we did this on the air, it's like playing with meat mitts.

It's like my hands are in gloves made of meat.

We did what Barack Obama did on ESPN with, you know, shooting the hoops.

I was better at it than he was.

So it had to be something from the inside also of the sports world saying,

we're going to image him because he wasn't that.

I think the other thing as it relates to basketball, and that was Barack Obama's big thing,

Nike, the shoe company.

Nike is a much bigger business, five, six times

more lucrative than the NBA.

Nike actually runs the NBA.

The NBA is a marketing arm of Nike.

Nike's relationship with China is the key to all of this.

Nike

is such a cultural force with its commercials, going all the way back to Michael Jordan, Spike Lee.

Nike is China's partner.

in the manipulation of the sports world.

The NBA being first and foremost, but Nike has its reach all the way into the NFL.

And the next thing you know, Colin Kaepernick in 2016 is the ultimate Trojan horse.

He starts kneeling.

That becomes a thing.

He's at some point reaches an agreement with Nike.

And now

protesting the national anthem is the greatest thing you can do in the sports world.

That's the most heroic thing you can do in the sports world.

And so if you just notice, LeBron James, the demonization, the anti-American sentiment, Colin Kaepernick, the anti-American sentiment, they're Nike

spokespeople.

They get paid by Nike.

They do all these commercials with Nike.

Nike has been the ultimate American critic.

through the sports world and is doing that to make sure that china and the 1.4 billion people they have access to sell shoes to those people and they have access to the slave labor you can get in asia that is

really a pessimistic view or jaded view uh but i think you're right

i mean it's just like it's just such a jaded view that yep they're just selling out their country for shoes but i think you're right.

Oh, it's it's I don't think there's any question about it.

When you look, look at all the human rights abuses they ignore in China.

They got a lot to say about America.

And then for me, Glenn, it becomes personal because there was a kid, I play football at Ball State University.

I'm very connected to all the athletes at Ball State.

I graduated in 1990.

I've probably met every football player that's ever played there since.

One of our kids, 20 years younger than me, got arrested in China on some bogus charges, spent three years inside of a Chinese prison, black kid from Detroit.

Cost me money to get him out of that prison in China after three years.

And so I look at these LeBron James and these other athletes that go over to China every summer to get money from China and do all these appearances and their allegiance to China.

And I just want to ask them, how do you think China treats Black people?

And then in comparison to America, how do you think China treats Black people who aren't multi-millionaire international celebrities like LeBron James?

If LeBron's James' name was Jerome James, how would he be treated in China?

And I actually know how Wendell Brown that played football at Ball State three years inside of a prison.

This is all personal to me.

And so the hypocrisy of the athletes, you know, I don't,

and I know you were being a little bit clever there, but I don't think I have a cynical view on Nike.

I just, these corporations and their global agenda

and how we in America are so

asleep to the fact that all this money we've allowed in from foreign countries gives them the right and the access to influence our culture.

I know.

And they're stealing America right from underneath us, and we're doing nothing about it.

And our corporations are actually aiding and abetting.

Now, as I said in the opening of this podcast, I mean...

All of this, I mean, it doesn't come without working hard for it.

You don't know the hours I have spent behind a bowl of ice cream to get this body.

Now, my wife does that a lot when she thinks about me.

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Have you read much about the Great Reset yet?

No, I've heard about it.

People keep tweeting me about it.

You need to just go to the WorldEconomic Forum.com, so it's their website, and read up.

I am convinced that some of these companies,

because everyone at the global level, you know, everyone, all the big banks, all over the world, all the world leaders, they're all for it.

And I think some of these people

know that a great reset is coming and companies are going to be much more like a Chinese capitalist.

It's called stakeholder.

I'm sorry, yes, stakeholder capitalism, where the government pretty much dictates who owns companies, what you make, how you do it.

And I think some of these companies didn't make a decision between America or China.

They made a somebody, you know, it doesn't take a lot of brains to realize, wait a minute.

So if I choose America, I not only lose China, but I also lose the rest of the world in the end, because the option is go with China, the rest of the world, and

eventually America will be yours as well, because it's all fundamentally changing.

And it is a very cynical view, but the evidence is all there.

That's what's happening to us.

It's a global change.

You've blown my mind and given me a lot to think about.

Yeah.

And my first thought is: what should we do?

What's the advice?

How do we

provide this?

The very first thing we have to do is inform ourselves and be able to get this out to the people because immediately the press says it's a conspiracy theory.

It's not.

They're on their own website.

John Kerry just did something with the

World Economic Forum, and they said, so is the great reset too aggressive, do you think, for Joe Biden?

And he said, oh no.

I think people are going to be shocked at how

all-encompassing and how breathtakingly fast this is going to happen under Joe Biden.

How is that a conspiracy theory when they're they're saying those things and it's on their own website?

So we have to tell people.

And then the other thing that is critically important is that you make your choice now

because otherwise you're going to be swept up into it.

And you either believe in standing for American values, American justice, you know, we're a flawed nation, but we're trying to build a more perfect nation.

So we'll get better every day, hopefully.

You have to decide whether you're going to stand.

And the first stand has to be: go back to work.

Open your restaurant.

If you're an entrepreneur, open your store.

Because for this to happen, they must have

the American economy and the entrepreneur overwhelmed with debt and no place to go.

Well, well they've almost won i mean it's almost i mean they're running the small businessman

every day oh i know it's it's i mean we're in the

we're almost at the two-minute warning mark we may be at the two-minute warning mark but there are things we can do um

and it may mean that we have to um

regroup at a later date uh and and start again because it's going to be if they get their way it's going to be bad it's Chinese capitalism I mean you're already seeing it in the social media social media is now telling us what you will and will not read whose opinion you can get who are the authoritative voices that's China you will listen to these authorities and not these

and they'll be banished It's already happening.

We're at the very beginning of it.

I certainly see it in social media

virtually every day.

And I mean,

they get to tell you, it's like Jack Dorsey is one of the most powerful people on the planet.

Oh, yeah.

And we know virtually nothing about him.

He hasn't been vetted, scrutinized,

challenged.

He's

Zuckerberg, virtually the same thing.

We know a bit more about him, but

I just, we've given people immense authority and we have no idea what their qualifications for that are other than they have invented something.

And quite honestly, that's not America.

The Constitution and the Bill of Rights is becoming completely

meaningless because

It's not the government doing this.

It's corporations doing this.

And the Bill of Rights doesn't tell corporations what they can and cannot do.

I mean,

it's a frightening time.

Let me go back to your story.

And

sorry to get off on that tangent with you,

but you need to read it.

Deadspin said that you are the racist rights unwitting attack dog.

People have accused you of

talking to white people and defending America and everything else and doing damage and great harm and you're a danger because

I know I'm guilty of racism

and you just make me forget about it and dismiss it.

How do you respond to that?

Deadspin certainly spent several years trying to cancel me and trying to limit my ability to speak to a black audience and to have any credibility with black readers or black viewers or whatever.

And it's,

you know, I take it somewhat as a compliment, to be quite honest with you, because I think they know that my message has value, real value for black people.

and for all people in general.

But

I do have a mission of

trying to reawaken

Black people to what we're losing spiritually

by

believing that anything that's labeled conservative is against us.

And I don't say that again.

I don't say that in a political sense,

but I do say it also in a political sense in terms of They've created this like code word.

Well, if it's conservative, you can ignore it.

And so that basically means anything in the Bible,

because trust me, the left has labeled virtually everything in the Bible as conservative.

And so it's like, ignore that.

That's no good for you.

Or it's unimportant.

Your political, left-wing, progressive, liberal identity is the most important thing to you.

And anybody that studies my work,

my argument is,

nah, I'm not so sure that liberal is the greatest thing in the world.

And I'm not so sure that everything conservative is the worst thing in the world.

In fact, the conservative principles taught in the Bible, I think, are the greatest thing in the world.

And I refuse

to dismiss or ignore them.

And I think what's really problematic is is that

I have credibility, I think, with athletes and with young people.

And they've done an amazing job of smearing my name and reputation.

But people

find my content,

even if they disagree with it, even if they've been trained to disagree with it, they still read it.

I can still challenge the prevailing sentiment and wisdom of black Twitter or Black progressive liberal ideology.

My voice is still out there and being consumed by black people.

And so I think Dent and other progressives find me a threat.

And, you know, they've smeared me in every way possible.

Thomas Sowell's been through the same thing.

Every other Shelby Steele, every other black conservative, Ben Carson,

every other black person that sticks to any kind of conservative values, that has any kind of public platform, goes through this.

It's the black community waking up to

that.

I mean, that is really, truly the moves of oppressors.

You do and believe as I say, or I will destroy you.

I mean, that's the oppressor.

That is, I don't have a right

among white liberals to think the things that I think.

And

black liberals

are incentivized to attack me

and to paint me as outside the black norm.

And

I am not remotely new to this.

You can go all the way back to Booker T.

Washington.

Oh, yeah, I know.

They smeared him, and he didn't do anything but great things for black people and for America, smeared him.

lifted up W.E.B.

Du Bois, Du Bois as if he's the greatest thing in the world.

And he came came up with one of the most racist theories in the history of the planet, the talented temp.

I have to tell you, I think that that was the point in black history

where it flipped.

I mean, Booker T, when he was alive, and when you're here next time,

because I know you're a Booker T fan, I thought you were coming in today.

I brought a box of his handwritten notes and thoughts on education and

the responsibilities of being black.

It's amazing.

It's just a, I just, I just got it a few months ago.

It's just loose notes from all of his speeches when he was thinking things through

before they actually got to their final draft.

But you'll love it.

But

as I read

Booker T and then I see what W.E.B.

did

right after he died.

There was this effort to demonize him,

destroy everything that he believed in,

and take African Americans into this really,

which I think is happening again, dark, dark place.

Would you agree that that was a major turning point?

I don't know if I know as much about it as you do, based off of what you're telling me, the information you have, but I certainly know there was a concerted effort to destroy the image, legacy, and reputation of Booker T.

Washington and lift up W.E.B.

DuBois as if he was the greatest man of that era.

And

I've always rejected it just based off of W.E.B.

came up with a theory, the talented 10,

the most elitist theory in the world, that there was this 10 of african americans who were meant to excel and they would take care of the other 90

and he eventually to his credit disavowed that theory but it still lives on people still talk about the talented 10th it's a joke and so i do think

what you're talking, what you've pinpointed is the birthplace of the split and the the kernel,

the seed that was planted that

LBJ and the great society said, okay, it's time to harvest this or harvest this fruit or

back to this and replant and grow from there.

I do think Booker T and WEB, they represent that.

Do you believe that

And this is one of the things I want to research, you know, in my old age.

I've got a list of a few things.

I just want to know the answer, but it'll take me years to find it.

I have this theory that

you're not the racist that LBJ was in 1960,

and then suddenly be the champion of civil rights and still say many of the same things behind closed doors.

I

because

the

great society, that package was

poison to the spirit and to the

effort of the free man

and the free thinker,

it's destroyed marriages in the black community and families.

Do you think they knew that when they put this together?

Was this a

racist attempt?

Yes.

There's no question about it.

And I'm going to make an analogy that will be a bit controversial, even for me.

Because one,

I'm not, I've heard some people say it was a myth that

the settlers put smallpox in blankets.

and sent them to Native Americans.

Some people say that's a myth that it didn't happen.

Some people say that it did.

But LBJ, the great society, is smallpox and a blanket.

And it's, hey, this is going to keep you warm.

It's going to protect you at night.

It's going to be better than a father.

You don't even need the father in the home.

And literally, the Great Society is a blanket that has been poisoned and it's really there for you to wrap yourself in and die.

If I'm not mistaken, in 1960, African Americans had a better record at entrepreneurship.

They had

the most stable marriages and stable families, more stable than whites were.

And then 10 years later, that's all destroyed?

Come on.

I think

the stable marriages deal is true for the 1920s, but I do believe in the 1960s, we're at about 84%

kids born into two-parent homes.

And certainly the Great Society, the Welfare Check and all the other programs.

Taking,

look, integration, taking kids, forced integration, I might say, taking kids from their neighborhood school and sending them out of their neighborhoods, away from the teachers and principals that their parents actually knew.

It was all a mistake, Glenn.

And it was not, I don't think it was

calling it a mistake.

It was a calculated decision.

okay and and again the the thing i well the reason i compare it to native americans is because

i i do think it was intended to destroy us and if you go back to uh patrick moyhan and and the monahan report that was done under lbj and then rejected by lbj

And Moynihan pointed out like, no, no, we have to invest in the, at that time, Negro family.

We have to invest in black families.

There's a crisis here.

And if we don't invest in the black family, there's gonna, it's just gonna get horrible for black people.

Yep.

And we did just the opposite.

Yeah.

And I just don't, I just don't believe that the guy who's one of the most racist had this big change of heart and then accidentally gave a smallpox blanket.

Just don't buy it.

It was not an accident.

And

the fact that we haven't awakened to this reality, this obvious truth that's staring us in the face, that, and that's what gets me so upset when we talk about defund the police and let's do this, let's do that.

It starts with the family.

There have been no great societies built without families.

You can't sustain yourself

without families.

You know, it's an interesting thing

because I think that there are good-intentioned people that, I know, because I've met them,

that

have marched with Black Lives Matter,

but they had no idea what the organization was.

And they were just like, yeah, I want somebody to listen because we are a community on fire.

But once they know what Black Lives Matter really stands for, which one of their tenants is destroy the nuclear family,

that's not just a black thing, that's a black, white,

Chinese, Indian, every family.

You've got to destroy the nuclear family.

That's poison, intentional poison.

What has to happen,

I think, for white liberals in order for us to move beyond this is

I think a lot of people

adopt the liberal label just because it's like,

I'm liberal.

You can never call me racist.

Right.

And so

I'm not going to ever give up that label.

And if I put on the conservative label, oh my God, you can call me racist.

You can call me sexist.

You can call me homophobic.

That's just too much of a burden to bear.

And so I want to just appeal to people, Americans, just like, hey, man, being American and protecting what we built in this country requires hard work.

It requires you taking a risk.

You can't just sit here and say, well, you know, those people 150 years ago, they were willing to die for America, but I'm not even willing to give up this liberal label that I know is BS, that I know has justified a lot of things that have harmed my country.

We're not even willing to make that small sacrifice.

Give up that label.

Engage in the marketplace of ideas.

Because that's what has been destroyed with this liberal label in my mind.

Right now, because anything they disagree with, oh, that's racist, that's sexist that's home

we can't even have a conversation we can't have i was debating my ideas i was called a racist for saying that barack obama this is the exact quote i think barack obama is a racist no wait that's not right he just seems to have some sort of deep-seated hatred for the white culture I didn't know at the time what critical race theory is.

I didn't know what it was.

What I was feeling

was critical race theory.

That's what that was.

Now we know it.

And

nobody's, nobody, I was called a racist to silence, to be destroyed.

It was an honest, something's not right here.

Something is not right.

Well, Glenn, a lot of times,

it's not even about you.

No, I know.

It's a message to everyone else.

Oh, I know.

Don't you do that because what we just did to Glenn Beck will do to you.

Oh, I know.

What we just did to Jason Whitlock will do to you.

And so no one is even willing to come to your defense

and say, like, hey, you know, I know Glenn.

You know, he's a big thinker.

He's not a racist.

Maybe he said something imprecise.

Yeah.

But he's not a racist.

And anytime you engage in high-level conversations that are honest yeah you're probably gonna say something that could be construed as insensitive that's the price of doing business and that's what that was was a because i followed it up with no that's not quite right i'm i was trying to noodle it out thinking we lived in an america where you could noodle things out well when you can't

Noodle something out, when you can't talk to each other without fear of, I mean, I had no problem people looking at me, and none of them did at the time,

but looking at me going, oh, wait a minute, that's really offensive.

And then having a conversation.

Instead, everybody shutting up and then knowing what's coming and just, you take it by yourself, I want nothing to do with it.

Especially on something like Marxism.

Where now I was also called a racist because I said, I think he's a Marxist.

I think he has Marxist tendencies.

Racist.

Well,

now you're saying these Marxist things.

You're admitting you're a Marxist and it's not racist now.

Why is it a badge of honor when a few years ago it was a racist?

The only reason is to set an example, shut up.

We'll talk about it when we decide to talk about it.

Glenn, one of the things, it's one of the reasons why I've never given up on writing.

Because

one, I know how dangerous it is out here when you're trying to

express new ideas.

And so that's why I love being a writer.

And I'll never again give up a written platform because I like to write about things first.

and then talk about it.

And if anybody wants to question what I said,

go read my column.

My exact thoughts are right there in my column.

That's the foundation.

And again, it doesn't provide you the ultimate protection, but it does provide you some protection.

Because again, these, I got to say, this other side is very clever and they're very invested.

They got a lot of financial backing.

And guys like yourself, guys like

every word that I've written probably since 1994 has been scrutinized

and hunted down, looking for something.

I got it.

He said this in 1996.

It's the price of doing business today.

So let me take you, jump some ears here, and go back to 2013.

You were hired by ESPN to write the Undefeated, which would explore race, sports, and culture.

You were hired to build that

and before it went on the phone on the air they removed you

as a guy who doesn't know the history of you know shows on espn

that seems strange what happened

uh

i i john skipper who was the president at that time hired me because he thought i was the best sports writer in the country

and there and therefore he thought i was the best black sports writer in the country and it was it's supposed to be a written platform and so he wanted the best he didn't vet his decision with the politicians within esp

there was no disagreement about how good i was as a sports writer But there was a lot of disagreement about my point of view.

And you can't allow a conservative to lead a website for black people.

It cannot happen.

ESPN can't back that.

And so for two years,

the politicians within ESPN,

the leftists at Gawker and Deadspin

waged a war against me.

And

eventually I think ESPN settled on, well, we're going to keep him around and we'll get him to write a

handbook on how we should

do the undefeated.

We'll get his ideas and then we'll dismiss him.

And so they had a guy that they send out to L.A.

to take notes and to allegedly help me orchestrate the undefeated.

They didn't allow me to hire anybody for about a year.

And then after two years, they finally, after I'd written a handbook on here's what the undefeated should be, they let me go and they handed the project to a guy named Kevin Merida that worked at the Washington Post who had the right kind of politics to do the site.

But, you know, and I got to be careful.

Cause I'm, there's like 40, 50 black journalists that have jobs because of the undefeated.

And I've never.

been critical of the undefeated, but the site doesn't have teeth.

And

under the other guy's leadership and what it's, it's a pretty harmless site.

I'm glad people have jobs, but they have not published a lot of important work.

Did you know Don Imos?

Yeah, that's one of the things that launched me on a national platform.

When he said the nappy-headed hose deal in 2006 or 2007, I wrote a piece that said, defending him.

It wasn't much of a defense of him.

It was more like, does he matter?

We don't listen to him.

We don't even know who he is.

And there's all this wild stuff in rap music that we know every word to.

There's all these TV shows and celebrities and black people, all kinds of disrespect we have towards each other.

We need to deal with that.

Don Imos does.

I had never listened to Don Imos's show before that moment.

And most black people hadn't.

So how could he be that important to us?

And that's when Oprah had me on because at that time you could actually have opinions like that.

Yeah.

But yeah, I know who Don Artis is.

So Don was a good friend of mine and

not a racist bone in his body that I ever saw.

He treated everybody like crap.

I mean,

and I like that.

I mean, I have a dark sense of humor.

And he would, he would write to me, he'd send me an email just of a screenshot of me and he'd go, and all it would would say is, you're fat.

You know, he just busted on every, on everybody.

Is there going to be a time when we're going to be able to

just bust on everybody again and just be honest and let it fly?

Yeah, I think

eventually.

I'm hopeful we're going to get back there because

I don't think

what we're doing right now is sustainable because it's so fraudulent.

It's so dishonest and everybody knows it.

And so I just don't think that can be sustained forever.

Now, it has lasted longer than I thought

because the same question

in a different form, I can remember an executive at Fox Sports asked me

six years ago, seven years ago, like, hey man, how long you think this is going to last?

When do you think we're going to get back to normal?

And at that time, I thought it would be two or three years.

Here we are, seven years later, and it's still ongoing.

But I just,

I see

certain people online starting to play the other side, starting to just let it rip and be themselves and build a following and an audience.

And I'm hoping there's enough capitalism left in America that capitalism will win and that people will go where the money is.

Because right now, I don't think people,

there's money being pumped into the left-wing stuff, but it's not really from consumers.

It's from benefactors.

Yeah, it is.

It is.

And I, and I, um,

I think that's the only way this survives is, I mean, that's why the great reset is so terrifying.

That's why what Silicon valley does is so terrifying because the only way

um

to sustain something this unnatural is through force through total control um and that's terrifying

and i would love your thought i wonder because i i've been saying this for a good five years

this tech deal and so much of it concentrated in northern california big tech and these tech billionaires, overnight billionaires.

And that's giving people a lot of power, that much money.

And so that's what I see like sustaining all this.

There's such a concentration of big tech wealth in Northern California.

And the culture of Northern California is being spread all over the country.

And

that's

what is their money endless?

Oh, maybe.

Oh, my gosh.

Yeah.

When 5G hits and the Internet of Things,

it's mind-boggling how it's going to change and how much power and control those that control those portals will have.

You know, let me bring it back full circle.

I was just going through, you were in our museum in the vault.

And yesterday I was in there and I was going through some stuff.

We're trying to organize.

And I found a document

that is the founding document of Silicon Valley.

And it was,

we need a high-tech zone

in Northern California.

It was a nationwide thing.

We're going to put it in Northern California.

And it's going to be an entrepreneurial high-tech place called Silicon Valley.

You know who deemed it that?

Lyndon B.

Johnson.

I have the letter from him.

It's astonishing.

It's astonishing.

Same group of people.

Wow.

Yeah.

You just blow my mind.

Yeah, it's amazing.

It's amazing.

And

I've told some people here in Nashville that if people

that believe in America

and traditional America.

If we're not willing to organize

and write up documents saying what we're going to do and what we're going to build,

we're going to lose the country.

I said, because the other side is organized and they're doing and they got plans.

But I think we don't have to.

We don't have to come up with anything new.

I cannot think of a greater mission statement than

we believe it's self-evident that all men are created equal and they have certain inalienable rights from God and governments are instituted among men to protect those rights.

And I just don't think there's a bigger idea than that.

And

we've never been that country.

We've had places where we were a little closer and a little further away from it.

But

tell me what a goal should be for

a nation or for a group of people that would be better than that.

I don't have something better.

Then maybe the solution is

somebody

less caustic has to take the baton from Trump.

Somebody

smooth with as much resolve.

I agree with you.

And then again, I don't

because I don't, I never liked the tweets.

I never liked the way he would make fun of people, et cetera, et cetera.

It bothered me.

However,

he's a human bulldozer or a human wrecking ball.

And it was

his unwillingness to flinch when all the guns were pointed to him.

And he's like, I don't care.

You're weasels.

It was that

that allowed him to expose

everything he did because they exposed themselves because they didn't know what to do.

I

agree with you.

I think there's a time.

and a place for everything.

And I think

for the four years, I don't know if he could have played it any other way and survived.

No.

But I think now

it's crystal clear that, because here's my takeaway from the election.

I believe there was a lot of corruption.

And I do believe the election was stolen.

That's my opinion.

Right.

But how did they get?

so many thieves?

How did they get so many conspirators?

And it's because,

and look, I agree with Trump.

The media is fake and it's irresponsible.

But they got so many people to be involved in that conspiracy of fraud

because they convinced them that they were stopping America's Adolf Hitler, Donald Trump.

So I completely agree with you.

The difference between Trump and Reagan,

you remember Reagan very

clearly, right?

They tried to do this to Reagan in a softer way.

They tried to paint him as a monster and a warmonger, but he always deflected with just great humor, you know?

And so he had charm and humor instead of bombast.

and boxing gloves.

And so my fear right now

is that the same way they baited everyone into, like, look, we got to cheat.

And this ain't even cheating because we're stopping Hitler.

Right.

It's the same thing going on right now in terms of

President Trump.

And I say it respectfully, I'm not trying to denigrate, but he's the distraction in terms of why people can't see, like, hey, man, China's overtaking this country and the things that you value.

You guys can get all upset about the guy in the White House, but you're ignoring what China is doing to this country.

And so I gotta, I want someone who can get us to focus.

Do you see that person?

No,

I really don't.

And I'm gonna say this.

I could say this on your show.

Glenn, it may take someone black.

I don't care what color they are.

No, no, but it may to get

to take the race thing off the table, because that's one of their biggest tools is race, race, race.

You know, everybody's racist.

If you say you're against China, well, that's racist.

It may take

someone black.

It's why.

I didn't agree with Barack Obama before he became president.

I didn't agree with his policies.

The whole Jeremiah Wright thing made me very nervous about who he actually was.

But actually, on the day he was elected, I got on the air the next day and I said, well, let's hope for the best because he's all of our president now.

And I don't want any president of the United States to fail.

So let's hope for the best because this guy,

if he believes the words of, I'm not a, I don't see things black or white, I see as a human thing, we're all supposed to come together.

He had the greatest chance to just push that right over, you know, the goal line.

All he had to do is just push gently.

Instead, he ran the ball the other direction.

He certainly did.

If,

and I try not to be, because I've never really been critical of any president.

But where Barack let me down is I did think

he was going to be more of a racial unifier.

And I thought

he would, because he,

on the surface, has a great family, I thought he would be

a champion.

of families and particularly the black family.

And

that's the fundamental issue for black people.

It's our family structure.

And I thought he would hammer that.

He could have, but he could have, I'm careful to say this.

He could have so easily been Bill Cosby without all the rape stuff.

Yes.

And that would have been,

it would have been the, it would have put to bed all of this stuff because

Every, I mean, back in the 80s, before the rape stuff or that we knew about it,

Cosby was everyone's dad or everyone's dream of a dad.

You know what I mean?

That was,

I don't care what color you were, that was the family you wanted to live in.

No question.

And look,

I don't know if there's anybody out there, black or white, who

well, you could announce.

You could announce for 2024.

I wouldn't even vote for myself.

Yeah, I know that feeling.

But there's got to be somebody out there who has had enough,

black, white, Hispanic, just somebody out there.

And, you know, I know the media makes it so hard because

They require the requirement now is you have to have lived this perfect life.

And if we find out you did anything, we'll, you know, we'll try to destroy you.

But,

you know,

I guess if,

and I don't even know where Colin Powell is politically, but like if there was some Colin Powell out there 20 years younger,

you know,

it would be an ideal time for him.

But is he a Democrat?

I can't remember.

I think he's, I'm not sure which he is, but he's a globalist.

So,

you know, the problem is it's trying to find somebody or anyone

who can truly articulate

a true aspirational vision for all Americans to

strive for.

You know what I mean?

We have to have somebody who believes it in their gut.

You know, I think the one thing about Donald Trump is he believed in capitalism and he believed America was the greatest.

But we need somebody who can then articulate that in an aspirational way so people look at it and go, I want to be like that.

I want a part of that.

You know, Donald Trump was this

love-hate thing where

you spent a lot of time going, I know, I know, I know, I know, I agree with you on that.

I know, but,

you know,

we all kind kind of felt like there was this part of him I really love.

And then, why does he do this?

You know, I'm gonna give you this: it's like throwing Hail Marys, and it's crazy.

It's an uncon you know who I think of

is Tony Dungy, the football coach.

That guy, I love him.

Yes, he's great American, great Christian,

great family man, yep, Very measured.

You know,

we just had a reality TV stars.

Why not a coach?

You know what?

That's really the role of the president.

The role of the president is the coach.

He's not a dictator.

He's not the chief lawmaker.

He's a guy who says, look,

here's where we want to go.

Kennedy,

he didn't put the space program together.

He just said, here's what we're going to do, and we're going to do it by the end of the decade.

That's a coach.

That is a coach.

And

we should call Tony.

I will.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Tell me what he says.

Tell me what he says.

I'm sure he's going to say, I don't want to be president.

Let me go back to sports here and political correctness.

I have this theory, and I'm probably wrong.

But the Washington Redskins have been the Washington Redskins, it's not racist.

The owner knows it's not racist.

It was a badge of honor for the first coach who was a Redskin.

I mean,

it was not racist.

And that guy fought and fought and fought and fought, and I thought he'd fight till his dying breath.

Is the name the Washington football team

a placeholder?

Because he's not coming up with anything else.

Fine, I'll call it the Washington football team.

And when all this nonsense is over,

I'll give it a name.

Probably the Washington Redskins.

That's interesting.

I'm not sure what the delay is.

Well, I think they didn't they announce that that is now the name?

They're sticking with it.

Yeah.

Yeah, they're sticking with it until they can figure out what to call themselves.

I'm not surprised that he raised the white flag because he's in the crosshairs.

They've done story after story about...

sexual harassment and they've been trying to connect it to Daniel Snyder.

He's in the crosshairs.

They've been after this guy for a decade.

And here in the last year,

last year or two, things got really hot.

Now, fortunately,

he's made some good hires.

The football coach Ron Rivera is doing a nice job.

I think they won four or five games in a row, have a chance at making the playoffs.

They hired a team president.

I can't think of his name right now, but some black guy,

their team president.

And so he's fought them off, held them at bay pretty good.

And maybe they'll have enough success and there'll be enough heat off of him in two years from now.

Maybe they do return to call themselves the Redskins.

I'm not sure.

I have to tell you this story.

I just thought of it.

You'll appreciate this.

I'm 18 years old.

I know nothing about sports.

I know nothing about the East Coast.

I grew up in Seattle.

I get a job.

as a producer for the morning show in Washington, D.C.

I go out the first day for a job interview, and I'm supposed to just kind of talk to all the people and see, you know, what I think.

The program director, at the end of the day, he comes in and he says, So, what do you think of everybody?

And I said, Well, I have to tell you, I don't know who the hell that sports guy thinks he is, but he is, he is

just

a loudmouth all the time.

And he said, You don't know who he thinks he is?

Well, he thinks he's Joe Theisman

from the Washington Redskins.

And I'm like, okay, he's staying.

He's staying.

Joe Feisman called Monday Night Football.

Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

They called him Joe Heisman in college.

I know, I know, I know.

I want to ask you one question.

I read this in a column of yours, I think it was last summer.

You were talking about growing up in Indianapolis, and you said, Jimmy Whitlock, my dad, quit working the assembly line at Chrysler Motor Company and started his own business in the early 1970s because his supervisor questioned him about reading the autobiography of Malcolm X on their lunch break.

What does that mean?

Tell me that story.

You know, my dad worked at Chrysler and,

you know, he eventually opened a barber shop and then opened a neighborhood tavern in Indianapolis in the inner city.

And he did so because

his boss or his supervisor questioned him about reading the autobiography of Malcolm X.

And my dad said,

I don't want to work anywhere.

where they're questioning me about what book I read.

Okay.

I didn't know if he was reading it or the boss was reading it.

No, no, no, my dad.

Okay, your dad was reading it.

So I understand that.

Now,

was he investigating like all of us would?

You know, I've read Martin Luther King.

I've read Malcolm X.

I'm trying to now, I'm trying now to figure your dad out.

He's either really open-minded and reading everybody as we all should.

Or there's a conflict because isn't he the root of your love for Booker T, your dad?

Yeah.

And so

take, you know, this is happening in the early 1970s.

My dad's reading this book.

But my dad, as a kid and as a young person,

you know, went through some crap here in America.

He left some real scars.

And you got in the 70s, you know, it's...

About a decade or so after

Malcolm X has been assassinated.

The book is popular.

It's written by Alexander.

My dad's reading the book like a lot of people were reading that book.

It's one of the most wildly popular books in the world.

But my dad,

if you understand Malcolm X or the Nation of Islam,

it's all about self-responsibility and taking

responsibility for your life and for

the progress of Black people.

And that's something my dad believed in.

And

he certainly believed in Booker Washington's mentality of cast down your bucket.

Basically,

Booker T.

Washington was the property, the original America first guy.

Born here, instead of dreaming about doing something 100 miles away, 1,000 miles away,

start right here.

And so that was my dad's mentality.

He built a barbershop in the neighborhood he grew up in, eventually

built two bars in the inner city where he lived.

And my dad loved being around black people, loved working with black people, loved socializing with black people.

And so he built a business and a life.

basically in the neighborhood he grew up in or the city he grew up in and found his happiness in America, right where he planted his bucket.

He built a brand new home, uh, like a mile from his bar, and he existed in a small little world,

uh, but he was happy there.

And

uh, you know, I think my dad was influenced by Booker T.

Washington, I think he was influenced by Malcolm X.

Um,

and you know, he certainly had a big influence on me.

Um, last question.

Um,

i understand your dad's uh era somewhat as much as anybody our age can not living through it um one of the i think one of the most tragic stories um that didn't end in violence um is nina simone uh she's are you familiar with nina simone

singer yeah singer she's far superior to uh Ella Fitzgerald.

I mean, I think she is

she is the

the greatest jazz voice and talent, I think, of the 20th century.

Um

and

she had been so horribly abused by her husbands, and she

couldn't get an education, I think, in the state of South Carolina is where she uh where she grew up because she was black.

So she went to New York.

The Juilliard took her.

The woman was a genius.

And the struggle that she had gone through, the struggle that the 60s were, and then she snapped with the killing of Martin Luther King.

She just snapped.

It was, it's over.

Um, and she, she went into the Black Panther parties, and she was like, I mean, one of her songs is,

uh,

I think it's, excuse the language, fuck Mississippi.

I think the name of it is in 1968,

or goddamn Mississippi, that's what it is.

And

she became more and more anti-American, et cetera, et cetera.

She actually moved to Africa.

That didn't work out.

Then she moved to France.

And now nobody knows her name, really.

When she was

she should be known by everyone in America for her talent.

The reason why I bring this up is

I understand the anger and the vitriol and everything from that generation.

Can you compare any of your dad's experience or something like Nina Simone, can you compare that to anybody who is growing up today or,

you know, is in their 30s that is out you know being the big marchers of how much America sucks

no uh America has come a long way and I think

anybody with an objective view on America

has to recognize that I remember

15 years ago, my mother firmly believed

was it 15 years ago?

Yeah, 15 years ago.

My mother firmly believed there would never be a black president.

It just, it's an impossibility.

And I can remember calling her in 2008 after Barack Obama won.

I said, see, mama, I told you.

And

she just, she couldn't believe it.

And

it made her at that time recognize like, oh my God, look look at how far I've come.

Right.

I went from when she was a kid, she couldn't go into a shopping center and try on clothes, they just had to buy them.

And

to now, and to have

both her sons be college educated, both of them be successful,

both of them with the ability to live basically anywhere they want.

And so

I don't get it either.

And for me, I really don't get it because

there's been two

unbelievable and three,

but the two biggest influences are my dad and my grandmother.

And that's not to slight my mother in any way because my mother was awesome.

But my grandmother was the embodiment of Christian love.

And my grandmother's father was nearly lynched by the KKK when she was a child.

They came, took him out of the house,

string him up on a tree.

He did some kind of stance that showed them he was a Mason.

They didn't kill him, beat him up, let him go.

They moved to Indianapolis.

They moved from Kentucky to Indianapolis.

And my grandmother had great bitterness and hatred towards white people.

She became a Christian, and it all went away.

And that was her testimony.

And that after she was baptized and really got deep into Christianity, and all of her bitterness and anger went away.

She was just the embodiment, her name was Lovey.

Everybody called her Mama Lovey.

She was the embodiment of Christian love.

And

I just think of my grandmother and all that she saw.

She died before Barack Obama became president, but all that she saw and all that she overcame.

And

we are now

acting as if

imprecise words, hurt feelings, or whatever,

are the same as what

previous generations experienced and the laws, the laws that they face, there were obstacles to them.

Everybody's feelings gets hurt.

Glenn, I'm sure when you were a kid, and even today, your wife may say something to hurt your feelings tonight.

America does not promise you, oh, you'll never get your feelings hurt.

People won't be rude or disrespectful.

And so it's just this impossible standard that we have set up.

And

look,

I have

seen people,

two of my best friends in high school, I felt like, were denied an opportunity to make the basketball team because the coach had a bias against black kids.

One of them has a very successful insurance agency, great family, has raised three kids, been married for 20 some-odd years, successful businessman.

The other guy, been married for a good 20 years, has a daughter that's on a swimming scholarship at a major university.

Tough things happen to all those.

It doesn't destroy your life.

You can't stop moving ahead, and you certainly can't

just demonize America or ignore all the progress we've made here in America.

Glenn, I just keep repeating this over and over again the last few months as I've watched 2020 transpire.

And it's like people don't have a fundamental understanding of America and what it promises.

America promises freedom, not love.

God promises love.

And so if you really understand that

America is going to give you freedom, make the most of that freedom, because not every country gives you the kind of freedom we enjoy here.

But America does not say your feelings are never going to get hurt.

Everybody you run into is going to love you.

It doesn't say, oh,

there's going to be some unfairness.

America, freedom, and we're going to have laws that try to protect your freedoms.

That's it.

And that's a hell of a promise.

And that's so much more than virtually every other country offers its citizens.

We have to value that, Glenn.

And right now, we just don't, or not enough of us do.

I can't thank you enough, Jason, for being on with me.

I'd like to invite you into my little NATO pack I'm making with people that believe in the Bill of Rights, people who believe in the Bill of Rights.

I'd like you to join the NATO PAC, which is an attack on one is an attack on all.

And we just, we all have to watch each other's back and be there when one is in trouble

or they'll pick us off one by one.

You're exceptionally brave.

I got your back.

I'll never run out of a foxhole.

I'll go down swing.

Likewise, brother.

Likewise.

Jason, thank you.

God bless.

Thank you.

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