Sydney Sweeney's Return to Cultural Normalcy, Possible Diddy Pardon, and Epstein Media Drama, with Walter Kirn and Alexis Wilkins

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Speaker 1 Welcome to the Megan Kelly Show, live on Sirius XM channel 111 every weekday at Noon East.

Speaker 1 Hey, everyone, I'm Megan Kelly. Welcome to the Megan Kelly Show.
Later today, we're going to be joined by FBI Director Cash Patel's girlfriend, Alexis Wilkins.

Speaker 1 And you're just going to have to wait to find out why she's here.

Speaker 1 It's interesting. Okay, but we begin with Walter Kern.
And boy, do we have a lot to get to, including a report that President Trump is considering giving Sean Diddy Combs a pardon. Is that true?

Speaker 1 Plus what the Sydney Sweeney American Eagle ad campaign tells us about this larger cultural moment. I got thoughts.
Join me now, Walter Kern, editor-at-large of the newspaper County Highway.

Speaker 1 What will the effect of the sparring between President Trump and the Federal Reserve be?

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Speaker 1 Walter, welcome back. Great to see you.

Speaker 2 Great to be back.

Speaker 1 Okay, so the Sidney Sweeney thing to me is interesting on a number of levels. And

Speaker 1 just for the people who haven't seen the story, it's everywhere, but she's an American actress. She's beautiful.
She's blonde. She's got blue hair, blue eyes, and

Speaker 1 white skin. And she's in this American Eagle ad for their genes.
And the tagline is Sidney Sweeney has good genes.

Speaker 1 And now the left is completely freaked out over it, saying that this is about eugenics and white supremacy. I'm going to show the audience just some of the reaction because these nutcases,

Speaker 1 people need to know what they're sounding like. Here's a montage we put together, SOP 23.

Speaker 3 Did American Eagle just run an ad for eugenics?

Speaker 4 Praising Sidney Sweeney for her great jeans in the context of her white, blonde-haired, blue-eyed appearance.

Speaker 4 It is one of the loudest and most obvious racialized dog whistles we've seen and heard in a while.

Speaker 1 Should we be surprised that a company whose name is literally American Eagle is making fascist propaganda like this? Probably not, but it's still really shocking.

Speaker 1 Like a blonde-haired, blue-eyed, white woman is talking about her good genes.

Speaker 1 Like,

Speaker 1 that is Nazi propaganda.

Speaker 6 And you put out an ad of a white, blonde, blue-eyed Hitler's wet queen talking about how much she loves her genetics. It would still be fucking weird.

Speaker 6 But then you add the fact that the nation is on its last fucking leg promoting this Christian nationalism, white supremacist, fascist bigot bullshit, alongside a leader that has explicitly stressed the importance of being gene rich as opposed to gene natural, which falls alongside a lot of the same things that fucking Hitler promoted back in Nazi Germany.

Speaker 6 And it's not too hard to see that this shit is Nazi propaganda.

Speaker 6 No it and the motherfucking butts.

Speaker 1 It's literally eugenics.

Speaker 1 Walter, here's a little quiz for you. See if you can get this right.
What one common thing do you notice among all of those women

Speaker 1 that they're less attractive than sydney swimming there we go i mean literally everyone on earth is but these women are particularly

Speaker 2 we might say genetically challenged yes well what's funny about good genes is that when i first saw the ad i i thought it was a joke about her you know two most uh prominent assets you know yes the idea that it was about her skin or her blue eyes i'm sorry, as a red-blooded American male, it's not her blue eyes or her skin that I first see when I look at that picture.

Speaker 2 You know, I was just in Times Square, Megan, just the other day, and there is a huge video

Speaker 2 billboard in Times Square, a full motion video billboard in which she's lying on a...

Speaker 2 Maybe a bed. She's lying on the ground and she's blowing kisses down at the crowds in the audience.

Speaker 2 And I saw as many people of all sorts of races looking up at her, wishing that they were in that room with her.

Speaker 2 I can tell you, it cut across all lines.

Speaker 1 Yes. So to me, it's very interesting.
I mean, it's predictable that this is where the left went with it. But I think that this ad is resonating.
for a number of reasons. Yes, of course she's gorgeous.

Speaker 1 And just like all models, people will happily happily pay to look at that.

Speaker 1 Like there are American Eagle accurately deduced, they would pay her because people would want to look at her and that they would be drawn to their product if they saw this beautiful woman wearing it.

Speaker 1 They were absolutely right. But I think there's a couple things happening here.
Yes, of course, it does say hotness is back. And that's an important moment in 2025.
We were sick of ugliness.

Speaker 2 Didn't Justin and Timberlake say that once? Sexy was back.

Speaker 1 Why didn't they get on him?

Speaker 2 You know,

Speaker 1 then it went out again.

Speaker 1 We've been suffering with the elevation of objectively homely people in our modeling ads and our fitness ads for years now. And we're over it.
We miss attractive people. That's it.

Speaker 1 Like we're sick of trying to pretend that these objectively unattractive people are the new beauty standard. They're not.
No one ever took to it.

Speaker 1 They tried to cancel Jordan Peterson for saying things like that.

Speaker 1 He was right. Like there is an objective standard of beauty, at least insofar as American cultural cultural values go.
It has nothing to do with white skin.

Speaker 1 Whitney Houston was probably one of the most beautiful Americans ever to walk the earth. It's just, you know it when you see it.
It tends to involve symmetrical features.

Speaker 1 It tends to involve thinness or fitness. It tends to involve, in many cases, they say wide-set eyes, larger lips, thin nose.
There's all sorts of things that people are naturally attracted to.

Speaker 1 You can have it if you're black. You can have it if you're white, brown, whatever.
But here's what I wanted to say.

Speaker 1 This is the piece that no one's saying, and I think we should say it because it's real and there's nothing wrong with it.

Speaker 1 We're sick and fucking tired of the nonsense where you are not allowed to ever celebrate someone who is white and blonde and blue-eyed.

Speaker 1 That we have to walk into a room apologetic for those things, or we have for the past five years. And in a way, this ad is the final declaration that we're done doing that shit.

Speaker 1 It doesn't mean we're better, better, but you know what? We're no worse than any other race or any other hair color or eye color.

Speaker 1 And we're fucking sick of being told that we are by having all of our representation, to use the left's terms, removed from television shows and movies and historical plot lines that involve people who do look like us, but suddenly we've been deemed too offensive to remain white like Anne Boleyn, who needed to be changed into a black woman in order to appeal to people's cultural sensitivities, or, you know, stupid stuff like, oh, they had to change Hermione Granger in the play version of Harry Potter into a

Speaker 1 black girl because something's offensive, I guess, about the red-headed white girl. It's, we're done with that bullshit.

Speaker 1 And by the way, that was bullshit anyway because you don't get representation for other races by erasing the white people and the roles that they've filled and replacing them with people of color, you create new roles, create new stories, and put black people and Hispanic people and Asian people and all the people in the starring roles there and create new art with that.

Speaker 1 The answer was never to go back and start scrubbing Peter Pan to make Tinkerbell something other than a white girl with yellow hair, which is another one that they touched and are trying to do.

Speaker 1 Or Snow White now has to be Latina instead of a white woman with black hair. We're sick of the bullshit.
It's okay to say a white woman with blonde hair and blue eyes is gorgeous with great jeans.

Speaker 1 Period.

Speaker 2 Marilyn Monroe would agree.

Speaker 2 Marlena Dietrich would agree. All the film stars of my youth

Speaker 2 who had these characteristics were celebrated and not for their whiteness, but for their beauty. I don't like it when there's one word for a very complex phenomenon.

Speaker 2 When I was a kid, we weren't white. There were Italians, there were Scandinavians, there were Puerto Ricans, there were this, there were that.

Speaker 2 Now they want to force it all into one box, one category, and then they want to make it controversial. And I refuse to buy into it.

Speaker 2 She is a lovely young woman, too young for me, unfortunately, but not for those crowds in time,

Speaker 2 not for those crowds in times square and she fills a uh a great hollywood uh tradition of of the bombshell she's the bombshell and bombshells used to have certain characteristics that had nothing to do with white supremacy in fact marilyn monroe married a socialist playwright named arthur miller um and uh he was terrible to her

Speaker 2 He wasn't, yes.

Speaker 2 Or Joe DiMaggio.

Speaker 2 There was all sorts of complexity to being white before, but now it's just this big stamp on your file. And I'd like to go back to a little bit broader distinctions.

Speaker 2 But for me,

Speaker 2 the news of Sydney Sweeney is that heterosexuality is legal again.

Speaker 2 I think that there is going to be a baby boom in nine months, because I think a lot of those people in Times Square who were staying in the hotels around Times Square went home with a little more more of a spring in their step after she blew them kisses.

Speaker 2 She's wrong.

Speaker 1 We've been just living through a five-year period where we were told we needed to celebrate Dylan Mulvaney as the new female beauty standard.

Speaker 1 It's a no. Finally, we have an actual woman with amazing breasts and an obviously kick-ass body who is in a dress or inner jeans, whatever.
And it's wonderful. It's like, yes, you know what?

Speaker 2 That's what red-blooded American men want to see and it's what most red-blooded american women at one point or another kind of hoped they might turn out to be whether we did or not is a different story but we can admire it and appreciate it as an ideal you know my my son who looks a lot like me uh only younger uh first saw his first celebrity sighting was hallie berry in a line for a seafood joint in malibu and he said who is she and i said why he wasn't even at the age he was supposed to appreciate feminine beauty um i think it was

Speaker 2 And she's such the most beautiful person I've ever seen.

Speaker 1 Yeah,

Speaker 1 she is.

Speaker 1 You know,

Speaker 1 it's like our son was taking swim lessons when he was a real little guy in the single digits. And there was a very attractive lifeguard.
And

Speaker 1 we said, hey, you know, like, why, why do you like her so much? Because he kept looking at her. He kept wanting to do those swim lessons.
He was like, okay, it's time. I got to go practice.

Speaker 1 And we said, why do you like her so much? And he said, because she looks so good. I mean, like, there's, we're programmed.

Speaker 1 Most heterosexual people are programmed this way. It's what is necessary to the continuation of the human race.

Speaker 1 It's only in the past five, 10, 15 years, I'll give it, where we've tried to shame that out of American men, try to make them feel toxically masculine if they have those thoughts.

Speaker 1 Try to tell us, I'm sorry about this woman over here on the left. I speak the truth in my Calvins.

Speaker 1 Yes, okay, she's a black woman, but she's obese and nobody wanted to put on their Calvins, which were here she's wearing underwear.

Speaker 1 By look from looking at this, over here on the right, you want to join the rodeo and be in a full gene outfit by the close of day, given how she's portraying these.

Speaker 2 And remember, this is fashion. Fashion changes.
Because this has been suppressed for so long, she has extra power. Listen, there are probably 20 models of her type who are also damned attractive.

Speaker 2 And if they were flooded into our consciousness for five solid years, we'd probably want to see something else.

Speaker 2 But because they have taken her type and suppressed it, it's called the return of the repressed in Freudian psychology.

Speaker 2 Whatever you keep down, when you try to put a peach ball under the surface of your pool, it will pop up. And she has popped up with a vengeance.
And I love it. It keeps my mind alive.

Speaker 2 It keeps my body alive. It keeps the culture alive.
And if they want to make a villain of her or cast cast a narrative around her that's Nazi-ish, go ahead because we aren't listening.

Speaker 1 We're looking. No, not at all.
It's the Streisand effect. It's had the effect of amplifying her ads and her way more than American Eagle could ever have hoped for.
Their stock is up 20%.

Speaker 1 She's made them hundreds of millions of dollars. I saw the estimate at 200 million.
Don't know whether that's true, but she's increased their stock by 20%.

Speaker 1 So the great thing is, Walter, we're going to get a whole lot more of it.

Speaker 2 Yes. And we're going to get it in real life.
We're going to get people imitating this look. We're going to get people in American Eagle jean shirts unbuttoned to the, you know, nth degree.

Speaker 2 This is going to be, this is going to be good for the environment culturally, I think.

Speaker 1 Yes. You're going to have a bunch of people going as this on Halloween with like a white supremacist sign on, you know, pinned on.

Speaker 1 I can only imagine what's happening in this young woman's real life. She's, she's gotten very famous mostly because of her incredible beauty over the past couple of years.

Speaker 1 She's had some roles, but like not something hugely breakout. I knew her from,

Speaker 1 oh, God, what's the, what's the White Lotus? She was great in the White Lotus, season one. She was great.

Speaker 1 And she's done some other, but like, she's really gotten very famous for her beauty and her sex appeal, which is there in spades. But now she's a household name thanks to this ad.

Speaker 1 And I have to say, good for American Eagle for doing it because it was a bit of a risk. We're not totally post-woke, but I have to tie it to what happened in November of 2024.

Speaker 1 Trump won.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 1 it was the end of the fever swamp we were in. It was the end.

Speaker 1 It was like the unofficial or maybe the official end of all that nonsense, which has been dwindling ever since and will continue to dwindle.

Speaker 1 But it was the American people in part saying, we're done with that bullshit. We're not doing it anymore.
And in some ways, it too was was the return of people being attractive.

Speaker 1 You know, the magazine cover on New York magazine that tried to shame the MAGA Republicans.

Speaker 1 And it was all these young beauties, all these gorgeous young women and gorgeous young men, like leaning into looking good and dressing well and celebrating their youth and their virality.

Speaker 1 Like fucking it. Yes, we're not going to be shamed out of that stuff anymore.

Speaker 2 Well, you know, Megan, political types don't like beauty because it can't be subjugated to slogans. It's something that either works or it doesn't.
It's the same reason they don't like comedy.

Speaker 2 It's either funny or it's not. You're either beautiful or you're not.
And

Speaker 2 you can't subordinate that to agendas and issues and other things. It tells us we're alive first and political second.
And people who want us to be political first simply don't like its power.

Speaker 1 Yeah, well,

Speaker 1 attractiveness is nice, for sure. People like to look at it, at attractive people, but also extremely attractive are clever people who are smart, very attractive, irrespective of the looks.

Speaker 1 If you find a clever person who has a smart brain, that's good. That's a good person to marry.
And what we see on the left is that they've abandoned that.

Speaker 1 Like, that's the whole thing with Stephen Colbert. He actually isn't clever.
You listen to his jokes, they're not clever. Maybe he's smart.
I don't have seen no evidence of it.

Speaker 1 He goes for like the cheapest, most obvious jokes about Trump that only make people clap, not laugh. All he uses are the applause and the laugh tracks.

Speaker 1 He's using laugh tracks on that show because no one's actually laughing. It's like, as opposed to take a Greg Guttfeld, who is clever and brilliant.
And that's why he works.

Speaker 1 That's why that show has lasted, unlike the Colbert. But all those things are back in style now.
You can be irreverent. You can be witty.
You can unleash it. You can be inappropriate.

Speaker 1 If it's funny, go for it. What you can't be is dull, boring, and unattractive is not really a bonus in life, let's face it.

Speaker 2 Well, I just hope that Sidney Sweeney

Speaker 2 does what Elizabeth Taylor did and marries or at least starts going out with somebody like Mickey Rooney, a very small but incredibly witty person.

Speaker 2 I'd hope that she dates a writer, in fact, or, you you know, at least a witty podcaster.

Speaker 1 Or what about Angelina Jolie when she was with Billy Bob Thornton?

Speaker 2 Exactly. Yeah.
You know, Sidney already has a rather homely and somewhat masculine first name, and I think that adds to her beauty.

Speaker 2 I think she should go out with a four-foot-11 writer, and she'll be absolutely blazingly gorgeous by comparison.

Speaker 1 She just gives hope a chance to all those men out there.

Speaker 1 It's possible for for them too. Well, I think it's great because I'm sick and tired of those ads.
I'm sick and tired of being told that we're not allowed to think this way.

Speaker 1 And I'm going to toss it now to our pal Gadj Sad, who, like no one else, can make us laugh in these moments with his, I mean, in this video, literal self-flagellation over the wrong thing in enjoying Sidney Sweeney.

Speaker 1 Watch this.

Speaker 7 I listened, I stopped,

Speaker 7 I learned,

Speaker 7 and now I would like to

Speaker 7 look what I got.

Speaker 7 It's been a while since I brought out the whip of self-loathing.

Speaker 7 Rachel Levine is more beautiful.

Speaker 7 Lizzo

Speaker 7 is more beautiful.

Speaker 7 Dylan Mulvaney is more beautiful.

Speaker 7 Joy Behar

Speaker 7 is more beautiful than Sidney Sweeney. My wife just showed me a photo of Sidney Sweeney.

Speaker 7 I became impotent.

Speaker 2 Man, he really takes a whack at himself. You can't fake that snap of the

Speaker 1 whip.

Speaker 1 He really leaned in on that one. But it's so good.

Speaker 1 That's really what we've been asked. Rachel Levine, he's right.
Rachel Levine was held held up as like this standard to which we needed to aspire.

Speaker 1 The first female admiral ever to be elevated to that level of government.

Speaker 1 That disgusting looking man in a blonde, I don't know if it was a wig or if it's just bad blonde male hair, but it was ridiculous.

Speaker 1 Yeah, and Lizzo, okay, it's fine. Lizzo's had massive weight problems and is obviously now on the shot around a weight loss plan.
Good for her. I'm glad she's losing the weight.

Speaker 1 But why did we have to pretend that we thought the enormously, morbidly obese version of her was incredibly sexy and beautiful? We didn't.

Speaker 1 A very, very small percentage of Americans found that sexy and beautiful. Fucking A.
Why can't we say it? It's so sick of this bullshit.

Speaker 1 Jordan Peterson literally got called in front of the Psychiatric Association of Canada and threatened with losing his license because he was making posts about things like that.

Speaker 1 It wasn't Lizzo, but it was someone like that saying, I don't agree with this beauty standard. I don't find this beautiful.

Speaker 1 It was like one of those Sports Illustrated models who was on the cover of Sports Illustrated, the ultimate depiction of fitness and beauty for decades, which went super fat instead and wanted us to have the same reaction.

Speaker 2 Are you about to put up a video or is it my turn?

Speaker 1 No, it's just your turn. I just decided not to put a video.
No one needs to see it. Okay.

Speaker 2 Well, I mean, how could America be more hypocritical?

Speaker 2 I'm sorry, but this is a country in which, you know, online pornography is rampant, all sorts of forms of sexuality that are hidden away and you know pushed onto phones and so on now we get to kind of enjoy it out in the open with a clothed person i think that that's a i think that's a uh gain for morality frankly that we can all sort of bring it back into the public square because during those times when we were asked to look at rachel levine and so on i would think there were a lot of young men who were furtively going somewhere else to uh get their uh

Speaker 1 well that was sports illustrated actually had a trans person in its magazine. It was a man posing as a woman in a teeny weeny bikini.

Speaker 1 And they wanted American men to look at that and be sexually aroused. And by the way, if you weren't, then you were a transphobe.
That's actually what the left has been telling us.

Speaker 2 And that's cruel, actually. That's brutal to use people's sexuality against them.

Speaker 2 In other words, to force them to, you know, know, pretend to admire things they don't and force them to hide things that they do admire. Isn't that what was done to gay people?

Speaker 2 Don't we deplore the fact that they had to be in the closet?

Speaker 2 Why should heterosexual men who were interested in the likes of Sidney Sweetie have had to hide in closets these last few years? Let's celebrate. coming back out into the open.

Speaker 1 You know, it's like, I'm just, I'm over it. Like Bridgerton,

Speaker 1 all the white royalty had to be made into people of color.

Speaker 1 It's like, this is, and by the way, you can never satisfy the mob because the mob doesn't, didn't like what they did in Bridgerton because I actually wrote this down because they complained that notwithstanding the fact that they've made black actors play traditionally actual white historical characters, it still centers around a, quote, primarily white narrative.

Speaker 1 Well,

Speaker 1 it's about white people who existed. So yeah, whatever happened in their lives, I guess by definition will be a white narrative.
What are we supposed to do? Like, how are we supposed to change it?

Speaker 1 I hesitate to even think to satisfy that we now we have to make the white people story a black narrative. It's just ridiculous.

Speaker 1 So the the Sidney Sweeney ad and the fact that it was done, the fact that it's so successful and it's driving up sales is yet another declaration that the era of woke is dead. It's over.

Speaker 1 It officially died in November of 2024. And now you are just getting your fingers on the pulse and realizing it's no longer beating wokesters.
Come on over back to normalcy if you can.

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Speaker 1 Trump continues to comment on Epstein, and of course, those comments comments continue to be bastardized and used against him by a dishonest press corps.

Speaker 1 He made remarks yesterday about

Speaker 1 how he and Jeffrey Epstein broke up.

Speaker 1 They were good friends for 15 years. They were down in Palm Beach together.
Epstein was connected to everybody down there. And

Speaker 1 it was known.

Speaker 1 I want to tell the audience right now. It was not known that this particular thing you're going to hear was the reason the friendship ended.
There'd been lots of speculation.

Speaker 1 We had on Vicki Ward two weeks ago, who was saying it might have been the fact that Epstein asked Trump to go with him to look at a property he wanted to buy out of bankruptcy and ask him how he could move the pool around.

Speaker 1 And Trump, when he saw the property, decided he was going to bid on it as well out of bankruptcy, and Trump got it. So there was one report that that's why it ended.

Speaker 1 There was another report that Epstein had hit on or behaved in an

Speaker 1 inappropriate way with the daughter of a Mar-a-Lago member. And Trump said, you're out of here.
Now, to his credit, Trump could have just gone with number two and made himself sound, you know, better.

Speaker 1 He didn't. This is back to the Sean Hannity thing.
Trump doesn't get in trouble because he lies. Trump is in trouble because he tells the truth.

Speaker 1 And so they asked Trump about how he and Jeffrey Epstein fell out. He told the story.
And now the left-wing press is going with, and I'm going to play you the sound bike, but they're going with

Speaker 1 Trump knew everything. He knew that girls were being trafficked by Jeffrey Epstein, and he basically allowed it by having Jeffrey Epstein come and poach girls from Mar-a-Lago.

Speaker 1 All right, so here's the question when he talks about

Speaker 1 how

Speaker 1 Epstein stole, that's a reporter's word too, stole Virginia Duffrey, who was the best-known Jeffrey Epstein victim. She was the one who was with Prince Andrew.
She recently died.

Speaker 1 And we all knew that she she worked at Mar-a-Lago, and that's how Jeffrey Epstein first saw her. That we have known that.
Okay, but anyway, watch SAT 10.

Speaker 8 Were some of the workers that were taken from you, were some of them young women? Well, I don't want to say, but

Speaker 8 everyone knows the people that were taken. And

Speaker 8 it was the concept of taking people that work for me is bad. But that story has been pretty well out there.
And the answer is yes, they were. Yes, they were young women.

Speaker 1 What are they doing?

Speaker 8 In the spa.

Speaker 8 In the spa. Yes, people that work in the spa.
I have a great spa, one of the best spas in the world at Mar-a-Lago. And people were taken out of the spa.
Hired by him. In other words, gone.

Speaker 8 And then when I heard about it, I told him, I said, listen, we don't want you taking our people, whether it was spa or not spa. I don't want him taking people.

Speaker 8 And he was fine. And then not too long after that, he did it again.
And I said, out of here.

Speaker 1 Mr. President,

Speaker 8 did one of those stolen

Speaker 8 persons, does that include Virginia Heffrey?

Speaker 8 I don't know.

Speaker 8 I think she worked at the spa.

Speaker 8 I think so. I think that was one of the people.

Speaker 8 He stole her.

Speaker 8 And by the way, she had no complaints about us, as you know. None whatsoever.

Speaker 1 Okay.

Speaker 1 Anybody that's been an employer has probably had an employee stolen, you might use that word by another employee,

Speaker 1 another employer.

Speaker 1 Somebody comes along, they like your employee, they offer your employee more money or better work, you know, conditions, et cetera, a better job, and they leave and they say, oh, they stole that person from me.

Speaker 1 That's clearly what he's saying. I don't understand how the media even thinks it can turn this into, he knew Epstein was a trafficker.
He knew he stole.

Speaker 1 Virginia Duffrey and trafficked her and said nothing about it until a second girl got stolen from Trump. And that was the straw that broke the camel's back.

Speaker 1 That seems to be what they're going with, Walter. What do you make of it?

Speaker 2 Well, Trump gets in trouble because he tells the truth, but he also gets out of trouble because he tells the truth.

Speaker 2 The truth is often a little, you know, jarring or unexpected when you first hear it, but it tends to last longer.

Speaker 2 And this is a very credible story by a guy who was proud of his resort and a big part of a resort.

Speaker 2 I'm sorry, because I live part of the time in Las Vegas and I, you know, go to them, is the spa staff, masseuses,

Speaker 2 people who do nails, do hair, bring you towels, and so on. And he was obviously proud of that.
People go to Florida to relax in that way. And the honesty here is kind of refreshing.

Speaker 2 He didn't like his business being

Speaker 2 degraded by this interloper.

Speaker 2 That's where Trump's values are. I'm afraid he wants to have a great resort.
And he felt that Jeffrey Epstein was making it a less great resort. Now,

Speaker 2 turning that and using the verb stole to sort of latch it on to the subject of trafficking is flat dishonesty and

Speaker 2 the worst kind of torturing the language.

Speaker 2 But

Speaker 2 I believe him. This does not sound like a cover-up artist, this guy.

Speaker 2 This sounds like a guy who's kind of committed to telling the truth, even when it's sort of odd and gives insights into his values that maybe other people wouldn't share.

Speaker 2 He wants the damn best spa and the damn best resort, and Jeffrey Epstein was screwing with that, and that was the problem. Well,

Speaker 2 it has the ring of truth.

Speaker 1 Let me give you, so there's tons of headlines on this now. They're trying to make this a huge deal.
We knew, we knew that Virginia Guffray worked at Mar-a-Lago.

Speaker 1 This is not old, or this is not new news. This was old news.
And she's on the record as having said she had a great time there. In fact, we'll just play it.
We pulled it.

Speaker 1 This is Virginia Duffrey on CBS morning in 2020. Listen to SAT 11.

Speaker 1 Virginia, how did you meet her and what was her pitch to you?

Speaker 17 I'm working at Mar-a-Lago,

Speaker 17 loving it. I'm working in the spa area.
I was reading about anatomy and massage.

Speaker 17 And that's when De Lynn came up to me and said, oh my God, you're reading a book about massage.

Speaker 17 And, you know, long story short, she told me that she knew of a man who was looking for a traveling masseuse. And if he liked me, then I would get educated and I would become a real massage therapist.

Speaker 17 So yeah, I mean, it was

Speaker 17 dream of a lifetime until I got there and the abuse was immediate. She could smell the vulnerability on the person.

Speaker 1 Okay. So that's Virginia Dutre saying.
At Mar-a-Lago, she loved working in the spa. Everything was on the up and up.

Speaker 1 And then she got lured away to go work for Epstein by Ghelain Maxwell, and things went downhill from there.

Speaker 1 You've got headlines like this from the Independent. Trump says Epstein stole underage victim Virginia Dufrey from his Mar-a-Lago spa leading to feud.

Speaker 1 Forbes, Trump says Epstein stole Virginia Dufrey from his employment, the bulwark, Sam's dying. He stole her, a jaw-dropping thing to say.
I just can't get over it. Was she Trump's property?

Speaker 1 And you can keep going. But here's, listen to this.

Speaker 1 This guy from emptywheel.net does a long, deep dive on it and says the following: okay, he says: if Donald Trump learned what happened to Juffre and warned Epstein never to recruit sex slaves at Mar-a-Lago again, it would mean he was aware of what happened to Juffre, aware years before law enforcement first started investigating Epstein.

Speaker 1 It would mean he learned Epstein was trafficking girls, which that New York magazine quote sure seems to reflect where he said he likes young girls. girls, Epstein likes young girls.

Speaker 1 And rather than do something to make Epstein stop, Trump just told him not to do it at Mar-a-Lago.

Speaker 1 That's what this guy gleaned from: she worked in the spa, he stole my employee, and I said, You better not do that again. And then he did, so I ended the friendship.
What in the actual?

Speaker 2 Yeah, this is dishonest. It's not going to play.

Speaker 2 It is

Speaker 2 shocking shocking to me as a journalist to see headlines and

Speaker 2 first paragraphs of stories

Speaker 2 tortured from this very,

Speaker 2 I got to say, innocent statement by him.

Speaker 2 The last thing you read started with the biggest small word in the English language, if, if, if, if.

Speaker 2 Well, we can spin out ifs forever, but the truth is everybody knows what poaching an employee means.

Speaker 2 Everybody knows that Donald Trump at this point did not have the ability to call down a helicopter and have Jeffrey Epstein swept away to a tropical prison. What was he supposed to do?

Speaker 2 Was he supposed to put out an APB on this guy and say, you know, he's taking masseuses?

Speaker 1 Well, and where's the evidence he knew that they were being trafficked? You're really missing a critical event. That was the proof of that.
That was the if.

Speaker 2 That was the if.

Speaker 2 I mean, as a lawyer, this must be so frustrating to you because I'm sure you've seen various ways in which insinuations and

Speaker 2 dubious claims

Speaker 2 are grown from simple statements. But this is dishonest.
And to see the press doing this over and over really reminds me of the Russiagate thing, in which

Speaker 2 small,

Speaker 2 you know, small pieces of not even evidence,

Speaker 2 but of language and other artifacts can be amassed to tell a story that is completely untrue we don't know all the things there are to know about jeffrey epstein and we're hoping that we hear more but at this point this kind of uh this kind of conclusion is almost libelous

Speaker 1 Yeah, absolutely right. There's absolutely no evidence that Trump knew.
This guy tries to spin it based on that one Trump comment from years ago where he's like, oh,

Speaker 1 he loves women and some say he even likes them young.

Speaker 1 That is not the same as he's a pedo sex trafficker of underaged girls. Okay.

Speaker 1 It's your people over on Team Blue who knew that he had come that he had pleaded guilty to an act of prostitution with a minor, which, by the way, is not a thing. That's statutory rape.

Speaker 1 Minors cannot prostitute themselves.

Speaker 1 Anyway, and still showed up at his mansion to try to gladhand with him. All the left-wing press that went to kiss the ring.
It wasn't Donald Trump. He was out of Epstein's life long before all that.

Speaker 1 Anyway, it's just ridiculous. Let me keep going.
Ghelain Maxwell is now

Speaker 1 talking to the DOJ. It's actually kind of annoying.
She spoke with the DOJ. She allegedly gave some names.

Speaker 1 They gave her limited immunity, meaning we won't use anything you say in this conversation against you.

Speaker 1 But now Comer over in the house has issued her a letter saying we want you to come over here and also a subpoena and give testimony on Epstein. And her lawyer wrote back, okay, thanks.

Speaker 1 Any testimony she provides could compromise her constitutional rights and so on. And she's still got an appeal pending.

Speaker 1 Accordingly, our initial reaction was that she would invoke her Fifth Amendment rights and decline to testify.

Speaker 1 However, after further reflection, we'll find a way to cooperate if the following things happen. First of all, she can't risk further criminal exposure without formal immunity.

Speaker 1 So we've got to have formal immunity for this discussion. But we also require the committee's questions in advance.
This woman's a convicted sex trafficker and sex abuser herself.

Speaker 1 She's sitting in there like she's some queen bee now.

Speaker 1 Like, I will get the questions in advance so that I can study them with my lawyer before I say anything, which is all going to be bullshit anyway, people. She's in prison for 20 years.

Speaker 1 She's going to say whatever the hell she thinks she needs to to get a get out of jail free card.

Speaker 1 They request that any appearance be scheduled only after resolution of her Supreme Court petition.

Speaker 1 Of course, if Ms. Maxwell were to receive clemency, she would be willing and eager to testify openly and honestly in public before Congress.

Speaker 1 I think Trump and everyone else should tell this woman to pound sand, to go back into prison and to rotten hell.

Speaker 1 I don't care for Ghelaine Maxwell's post-conviction testimony this badly. I'm not going to believe two words of it anyway.

Speaker 2 Well, but here's the problem. We've started a mania in this country.
I want to know everything about Epstein. Well, who knows more than she? Even if she lies,

Speaker 2 it's a response to this great hunger and this appetite that has been stimulated. She's seeing her moment of advantage.

Speaker 2 And I mean, if I was sitting in jail, I'd be trying to drive as favorable a bargain as I could too.

Speaker 2 Just because she is a scumbag, if a woman can be a scumbag,

Speaker 2 I mean, our fascination with this is going to lead us down some pretty dark alleys.

Speaker 2 And the problem is, it's always the guilty who know the most about the crime.

Speaker 2 And pushing her back into her box or her cell down in Florida, instead of giving her a field trip to Washington or however it was going to be done, you know, does satisfy a desire for justice.

Speaker 2 But now we've got this desire for details, and maybe they're in conflict.

Speaker 1 We're not going to get anything from those grand jury transcripts. The judges have already said no.

Speaker 1 And by the way, it hit today that what was in those grand jury proceedings against Epstein and then Maxwell, Epstein in 19, and then Maxwell more recently is just two law enforcement officers, which is typical, saying what they alleged.

Speaker 1 That's really not all that juicy. That would be the bare minimum of what they needed to say in order to get the indictment.

Speaker 1 So we're not really pursuing any real avenues right now of disclosure because Ghelane Maxwell's testimony, even if they get it, is not trustworthy. It just isn't, not at this point in the game.

Speaker 1 And the grand jury has always been a red herring. So that's where we are on Epstein for better or for worse.
But while we're on the subject of possible pardons, we have to talk about Diddy.

Speaker 1 When I first saw Peter Doocy ask Trump about this, about, I was like a month ago, two months ago, I'm like, it couldn't have been two months because he wasn't found guilty yet.

Speaker 1 But I'm like, why is he asking him about a pardon? Why would he be asking Trump this?

Speaker 1 This was on May 30th.

Speaker 1 Does that make sense? Maybe it was in advance. In any event, I can't remember what day the Diddy verdict was, but

Speaker 1 here's Peter Ducey of Fox asking Trump if he would pardon Diddy, SAT 17.

Speaker 19 You know, this is the apprentice. You mentioned once in 2012 that Diddy was a good friend of yours.
Back then, he has since found himself in some very serious legal trouble.

Speaker 19 Would you ever consider pardoning him?

Speaker 20 Well, nobody's asked. You had a big one to ask, Peter, but nobody's asked.
But I know people are thinking about it. I know they're thinking about it.
I would certainly look at the facts.

Speaker 20 If I think somebody was mistreated,

Speaker 20 whether they like me or don't like me, it wouldn't have any impact on me.

Speaker 1 Okay. So that was before he was found guilty on two charges, but not of the most serious ones, because he was found guilty in June, and that was May 30th.

Speaker 1 But Deadline is reporting, and this is a piece by Dominic Patton, who is their legal reporter. And I'm just going to take a guess here that he's well sourced in Diddy World.

Speaker 1 He's reporting in a piece dated yesterday, Trump now quote, this is in quotes, seriously considering pardon for Sean Combs ahead of sentencing. White House officially says nothing.

Speaker 1 So, and in this piece,

Speaker 1 when you want to figure out who their sources are, you always look at

Speaker 1 who do they say so-and-so denied comment? Because that's usually the source. And he says in this piece,

Speaker 1 the defense team led by Mark Agnifilo and Tenny Garagos had no comment on any pardon talk.

Speaker 1 So that's my guess, that there is talk, that Diddy's lawyers have brought it to the White House, and that they're the ones who gave Deadline the quote, Trump is seriously considering a pardon for Sean Combs.

Speaker 1 I don't know whether Trump actually is,

Speaker 1 but I am here to urge him not to even consider it and much less to do it. It would be an absolute disaster.
It would be a miscarriage of justice. He doesn't deserve it.

Speaker 1 Okay, first of all, just to put it in terms Trump can understand, Diddy can't stand you, Mr. President.

Speaker 1 He was once nice to you. He's turned on you, and he doesn't deserve a favor from you, who he worked actively to stop in 2020.
Here's a clip from Charlemagne on his show going over some of that. Watch.

Speaker 21 White men like Trump need to be banished.

Speaker 21 That way of thinking

Speaker 21 is real dangerous. When you look at it, we don't have no choice.
You know what I'm saying? You can say what you want about Biden.

Speaker 21 I can't say I love to pick either, but hey,

Speaker 21 we got to get him in office, and then we got to hold him accountable.

Speaker 1 Okay, so that was Diddy giving Charlemagne an interview, making clear how anti-Trump he was.

Speaker 1 And on top of that, and more importantly, he is a serial woman abuser, the likes of which we haven't seen in modern America, at least not on the public stage in this way.

Speaker 1 He is a repeated serial abuser. He beat those women to a pulp and didn't even deny it.
He didn't deny it.

Speaker 1 They admitted expressly domestic abuse over and over and over again, something the judge used against them when they they pled for bail, when they said, please let him stay out on bail pending sentencing.

Speaker 1 So he doesn't deserve any sort of a pardon. He got away with all of that.

Speaker 1 He's only being sentenced when he gets sentenced on these minor crimes of basically engaging in prostitution and transporting people for the purpose of it. So

Speaker 1 he got away with the most serious crimes. And so two things.
Number one, what's Trump in trouble over when it comes to Epstein?

Speaker 1 He's in trouble because he is making it look like to the MAGA base, he's part of the elite cabal that covers for other members of the elite cabal. And they don't like that.

Speaker 1 They elected Trump because he promised not to be one of them, but to like bust up them, those groups, and work with the people against them. So this would not help, not at all.

Speaker 1 And there are a lot of people like Viva Fry, who comes on the show as a legal commentator a lot, who already thinks the whole Diddy trial was just a show trial so that you know, he could be found

Speaker 1 guilty on a couple of minor things, but the real meat of the Diddy case, which is how how many other people were being provided access to young women and others and drugs at these parties of note, you know, like famous celebrities, and somehow that's been kept up.

Speaker 1 So, like, there's already people thinking that there's a cover-up here. Trump pardoning Diddy will create another Epstein for him.
It would be a nightmare.

Speaker 1 And last and certainly not least, the GOP is already struggling with female voters. And they're not all lefties.
There are young conservative women who aren't in love with Trump or MAGA. There are.

Speaker 1 And this will not help. It's very clear.
We all saw the videotape of him beating the hell out of Cassandra Ventura.

Speaker 1 But there was so much more testimony about the other women he repeatedly beat all the way up to when he was arrested. He doesn't deserve any of Trump's mercy.
Your thoughts on it, Walter?

Speaker 2 I find him personally loathsome.

Speaker 2 And the idea that he would be walking free with this pass from the president of the united states it is abhorrent to me you're absolutely right though it looks like trump is in some la-la land of special rules for rich and famous people if he does this and it could not be a worse message from a supposedly populist president who cares about main street where when you beat someone on camera you end up in jail getting kicked around by the other guys.

Speaker 2 Number two, there is reason to believe that both Epstein and Diddy may have something in common, which is that someone was protecting them all along, that in some fashion they were connected to intelligence, to law enforcement, that

Speaker 2 they had cover within elite circles. This would

Speaker 2 show us that perhaps that's very true and that they continue to to have it. And we can't, as a society, go forward

Speaker 2 believing that there are two standards of law for celebrities and regular people.

Speaker 2 It's one thing to know that the rich have all these other advantages, but we're in a country right now where, on the left, at least, there is a lot of bubbling anger over oligarchy and all these other things.

Speaker 2 And it may be sort of whipped up or it may not be.

Speaker 2 It may be genuine or may be a a political tactic, but you are playing into their hands and you're just playing into the hands of the devil as far as I'm concerned. If you

Speaker 2 let these people walk free, the least among us, the most powerless, all these kids that go to Hollywood and want to make it

Speaker 2 and are wide-eyed and maybe not, you know, as bright as they could be or as well educated fall into the clutches of these people.

Speaker 2 And I say this as someone who's lived in Hollywood, who's worked in the movie industry, and these guys are predators.

Speaker 2 And there's a hundred like him, maybe not as prolific, not as rich, maybe not as, you know, connected. And we've got to put a stop to this business.

Speaker 1 That's right. And he got away with it.

Speaker 1 He wasn't even found guilty on the worst charges against him, the sex trafficking, the RICO, which brought up in a sort of backdoor way, all the stuff he'd been doing to women serially for the past 20 years.

Speaker 1 He got away with it. He was only found guilty on these two minor charges.
Let him at least serve the time on those.

Speaker 1 And in both cases, in Epstein, you had a man who was a friend of Trump's for some period of time, who went on to become one of, if not the most prolific sex trafficker of all time, who...

Speaker 1 got away with it too. He got a sweetheart deal in 2008.

Speaker 1 And then when he finally got arrested in 2019, he, quote, killed himself or was allowed to kill himself or was murdered, but he did not have to answer in a courtroom ever in any meaningful way to his victims and what he did to those young women and in a way it would be the same thing if you pardoned Diddy on the the two minor crimes he did get convicted of it's it's the same thing it's telling all these young vulnerable women they don't count we they don't matter that even the top Republican president will cover up any wrongdoing when it comes to that type of a victim, that it's, I don't really see you as victims.

Speaker 1 And in in fact, I'm going to bend over backwards to help this guy who's a serial abuser of women. It just cannot, cannot happen.
Again, I have faith in Trump.

Speaker 1 This could be Dominic Patton being spun by Diddy's lawyers who say Trump is seriously considering a pardon, but I got to believe Trump's smarter than this.

Speaker 2 I get a strong feeling that this defense team is doing what a defense team does and floating something that, you know, in the hopes of making it a reality, in the hopes of forcing someone's hand, or I don't know.

Speaker 1 But

Speaker 2 it would really upset me to think that on the basis of what we know, there's a pardon being considered for this loathsome guy who really got off easy as it was and whose victims,

Speaker 2 most of whose victims we don't know, are sitting at home quietly with their lives wrecked because they didn't want to go along or they did go along. And

Speaker 2 we can't make an example of this type, then we can't make an example of any type.

Speaker 1 Yeah, he already got a slap on the wrist. Now, you can't take away the slap on the wrist.
Like, that's that is not the solution to this problem. Um,

Speaker 1 okay,

Speaker 1 the New York City shooter who was born in Hawaii, who was a high school football player and who drove cross-country from Las Vegas, Nevada, Nevada, where he was a security guard at a casino, to Midtown Manhattan on Monday and opened fire.

Speaker 1 We're learning more about this guy. Now, we knew yesterday when we came to air that he had left a suicide note saying he has CTE and he wants his brain studied and you can't take on the NFL.

Speaker 1 He never played in the NFL. He played high school football only as far as we know.

Speaker 1 And now his high school football coach is on record as saying, as far as I know, he only had one ankle injury when he worked for us.

Speaker 1 There was not like some series of concussions, which you typically see in a CTE case.

Speaker 1 To me, it seems clear this guy just had your your garden variety mental breakdown, which is not unusual, especially among like around 25-year-old men or so. He was right around there.

Speaker 1 I think he was 26 or 7.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 1 he had that kind of a meltdown. I think he blamed CTE.
He said he drank antifreeze like a Pittsburgh Steeler had done years earlier and took his own life by gun. But now it comes out, Walter.

Speaker 1 So it's controversial.

Speaker 1 We knew it was going to be controversial the fact that he had a concealed carry permit out in Nevada because we were told even the night of the shooting by former NYP Deion Fox, the guy had two, count him two, interactions with law enforcement that resulted in mental health referrals.

Speaker 1 They knew this the night of the shooting. So it was obviously on record.
And yet still he had a concealed carry permit. And that shouldn't be under the law in Nevada.
And now we find out.

Speaker 1 the New York Post reporting today that he successfully applied for a gun permit in 2022.

Speaker 1 He held on to the permit after he told the Las Vegas authorities that he was having suicidal thoughts.

Speaker 1 Moreover,

Speaker 1 he notified the cops sometime after, okay, after

Speaker 1 that he got the permit that he was suffering from a mental health crisis.

Speaker 1 Now, they say suicidal ideations are not enough to revoke a permit, but there was another finding that another report I saw that said he said to law enforcement, I think I'm a danger to myself and others, which,

Speaker 1 my God.

Speaker 1 And then he had another mental health contact in Las Vegas in 2024. He was placed and held on a psychiatric hold in 2022 and 2024, according to

Speaker 1 CNN. Here it is.
They say in 2022, Las Vegas police encountered him on the streets where he observed the cop did behavior that made him believe that this guy might be a threat to himself or others.

Speaker 1 Cops took him to a hospital where he was put on a psychiatric hold for an unknown period of time.

Speaker 1 And there were no details on what happened to him in 2024, but it sounds like pretty much the same thing. So here's my point in all this, Walter.

Speaker 1 Yes, we need to figure out how we're not revoking the gun permits of people who are themselves saying that they're dangerous. But the bigger point is it shouldn't have been up to him.

Speaker 1 He should have been put in that institution. And he should have been held there.
He should still be in there. He shouldn't be dead.
Those people in the Midtown Manhattan building should not be dead.

Speaker 1 We should have taken away his civil liberties and protected those of the innocent Americans who are likely to get hurt by this guy.

Speaker 1 And the only reason that we don't do that anymore is because the leftist ACLU, actually ACLU and types that support it, have spent the past 50 years getting rid of institutionalization as a possibility for the deeply disturbed.

Speaker 1 They think it's inhumane. They think it's an affront to their civil liberties.
Even though the Supreme Court has held,

Speaker 1 if they are a danger to themselves or others, you can institutionalize them. You can do involuntary civil commitment.

Speaker 1 But slowly but surely, the left has been getting rid of the facilities and the beds available for that kind of confinement because they're against it ideologically.

Speaker 1 And truly, at its core, that's why those people died in that building on Monday. Your thoughts?

Speaker 2 Well, Megan, I have an unpopular stance about these shootings, which is that they are now used in so many political and narrative ways to advance different agendas that I am suspicious of the whole phenomena.

Speaker 2 In other words, we're getting a real lot of information about his psychiatric state. And that's very uh that's very important for those who

Speaker 2 find that to be their top issue. But

Speaker 2 we're not getting a lot of information about the possibility that he wasn't crazy,

Speaker 2 that the people he ended up killing, which turned out to be two formidable businesswomen,

Speaker 2 were maybe not the random

Speaker 2 victims of violence. In other words, we're two days into this, and I was in New York when it happened.
I was in Midtown.

Speaker 2 We're two days into this, and we've already got a storyline, and we've got morals, and we've got

Speaker 2 policy ideas, and so on.

Speaker 2 Of course, you're right. There's no reason why someone with these sort of encounters with the law and

Speaker 2 this kind of a psychiatric history should have a gun.

Speaker 2 But in some ways, the people who want to take away guns are served by this because they're saying, listen, Americans are crazy and they have easy access to guns.

Speaker 2 Rather than dealing with the psychiatric issues, let's just take the guns away. So it serves them.

Speaker 1 They never want to deal with the psychiatric part.

Speaker 2 They don't want to deal with it. They want to believe that that's impossible to deal with.

Speaker 2 But I think what you're saying is that it's actually quite easy to deal with. When you get these reports and when you have already a legal structure for committing people even,

Speaker 2 you can certainly take away their firearms. You can certainly put them on various lists and you can even commit them.

Speaker 2 if but but but as i say the anti-gun people would rather that not happen because they'd rather we see america as this horrible free-for-all from which we must remove guns and other people would point out america is this generally law-abiding place from which we should remove crazy people and they're you know and

Speaker 2 and i would i would err on the second side at the same time

Speaker 2 we then have the the sticky wicket of had biden been re-elected and it was his decision to decide to define who was crazy he might have added something called white supremacy or the tendency toward extremism and and maybe even used your social media to determine that so we have to be very careful about what our values are and I think it it is common sense to start with separating crazy people and firearms.

Speaker 2 But even that isn't really being allowed by the people you would think would want to see less violence.

Speaker 2 And so

Speaker 2 I hope we can restore some common sense, but I also hope we can stop governing by mass shooting in this country.

Speaker 2 Because it seems like the moral of every mass shooting, once we find the note, once we find the

Speaker 2 bottle of pills in the car and the other clues.

Speaker 2 With Luigi, it was other

Speaker 2 kinds of manifestos and beliefs. And with the trans shooting in Natville, it was a whole other things.

Speaker 2 Let's get

Speaker 2 a fix on what we want to do as a society and not be thrown pillar to post by acts of violence, because that encourages acts of violence.

Speaker 2 When people realize that they can drive the national conversation by shooting someone, that's very appealing to these guys.

Speaker 1 That's why we never say the name of the mass shooters on the show, and I haven't done that in 15 years.

Speaker 2 I heartily agree with that policy, I'll tell you.

Speaker 1 You raise a good point because it's like we don't want bad guys to have access to guns, people who are identified as mentally disturbed, but we don't want that mentally disturbed term to be bastardized to steal people's guns who are just law-abiding citizens with controversial views.

Speaker 1 You know, we'd have to adhere closely to a very high standard so that we didn't sweep just politically unpopular people into the institutions. But I think there is very much a way of doing it.

Speaker 1 We were doing it in the 50s and 60s before we were. We were, at that point, I think I looked this up.
It was, there were 55,000 beds in America for people who were being involuntarily committed.

Speaker 1 And within about 40 years, it had fallen to 14,000. What happened? Did all those people just get better? We had 50,000 or 40,000 people who just, they got better.

Speaker 1 We reduced

Speaker 1 insanity so much that we just got rid of it. No, they're out of the street.
Walk.

Speaker 1 Exactly.

Speaker 2 We sent them outside. We sent them outside and we forced Americans to become hard-hearted enough that every day they can walk past suffering people, that they can learn to ignore it.

Speaker 2 And I really actually resent that my children, my younger children, can't remember a time when that wasn't the case, that their whole life they've had to

Speaker 2 develop the skill set of ignoring crazy people of uh of walking past sick people of hardening their hearts to of hardening their hearts to people with abscesses on their legs or shooting up in a corner i i i don't know that that should have become a permanent feature of the american landscape and uh the idea that it did anything for the for the outdoors people

Speaker 2 is ridiculous. Of course, many of them are so high they don't know whether they're inside, outside, or in outer space.

Speaker 2 But the truth is that the advocacy for their ability to die

Speaker 2 in full view of the public has not been the greatest empathetic stroke of our time.

Speaker 2 It is, in fact, been a form of cruelty to ourselves because we've hardened our own hearts by having to deal with this on the everyday,

Speaker 2 you know, walk to work.

Speaker 1 Well, here is

Speaker 1 one of the reasons I'm bringing it up. Trump is finally doing something about this, and it really hasn't gotten enough attention.

Speaker 1 Talked about it briefly earlier this week, but he issued an executive order on July 24th called Ending Crime and Disorder on America's Streets.

Speaker 1 And it's a very bold initiative because typically what America's streets look like is up to mayors and governors and state legislators, not the president.

Speaker 1 So good on Trump for doing something from his post, a hell of a lot more than Mayor Brandon Johnson is doing in Chicago, for example. And here is what he says.

Speaker 1 He says, endemic vagrancy, disorderly behavior, sudden confrontations, and violent attacks have made our cities unsafe. The number of individuals living on the streets in the U.S.

Speaker 1 on a single night during the

Speaker 1 last year of the previous administration was just under 275,000. It was the highest ever recorded.

Speaker 1 The overwhelming majority of these individuals are addicted to drugs, have a mental health condition, or both.

Speaker 1 Nearly two-thirds of homeless individuals report having regularly used hard drugs in their lifetimes, an equally large share suffering from mental health conditions.

Speaker 1 The feds and the states have spent tens of billions on failed programs that address homelessness, but not its root causes, leaving other citizens vulnerable to public safety threats.

Speaker 1 And then he goes on to say, we need a new approach. He says, I direct the Attorney General, in connection with HHS,

Speaker 1 to seek in appropriate cases the reversal of federal or state judicial precedents and the termination of consent degrees that impede the United States's policy of encouraging civil commitment of individuals with mental illness who pose risks to themselves or the public or who are living on the streets and cannot care for themselves in appropriate facilities for appropriate period of times.

Speaker 1 And he goes on to say, we'll provide some assistance to the states for this.

Speaker 1 If you need some help, if you need some money, we'll actually give you some money for this to create and staff the appropriate beds and so on so we can get these people off the streets.

Speaker 1 It's an incredible thing. Do the state say thank you? Is the left saying, God bless you, President Trump? This is wonderful.

Speaker 1 No, I Googled this morning every single, like NPR, PBS, it's all about how terrible Trump is, how he wants to recreate one flu over the cuckoo's nest and shove innocent, suffering, homeless people and others into inhumane facilities.

Speaker 1 It's no, it's past time that we had something like this. And I'll just make one more point, Walter.

Speaker 1 Back when I was at NBC,

Speaker 1 I did a series that has been with me ever since. It very much affected me.
I've mentioned it many times on the show on mothers with sociopathic children. And these moms know,

Speaker 1 they know.

Speaker 1 It's no mystery to them that they're raising a sociopath with no empathy for others. It can be a boy, it can be a girl.
And I interviewed many of them.

Speaker 1 And these poor families, they're at their wit's end because they don't have a facility that will take their kid. They know they're raising the next school shooter or mass shooter.

Speaker 1 They can't find a facility that will take their kid. Psychiatrist after psychiatrist.

Speaker 1 One mom, Dawn Davies, told me in one year, she went through 35 psychiatric professionals who either rejected her son,

Speaker 1 who she says has no empathy and is obviously a sociopath if you listen to a whole interview, rejected him because they don't know how to fix that.

Speaker 1 It's not really fixable, or said, Well, okay, maybe we can take on one piece of his many disorders, like his OCD, but really no help.

Speaker 1 And then all these other mothers who said, There's no place to which I can send my child, the only solution is for him to get incarcerated.

Speaker 1 We need him to break the law so he can go to prison, which is not what these moms want. Here's just a little sampling of a couple of those exchanges.
Watch this.

Speaker 1 There is a member of your group with whom we spoke

Speaker 1 who has a, I think, 15-year-old girl, 15-year-old girl, who she admitted killed the family cat, strangled the family dog, attacked her mother with a knife and said she had a plan to kill her and the whole family,

Speaker 1 put poison oak in the mother's shower wash, which she knew the mother was deathly allergic to.

Speaker 1 And she's had to live with her too.

Speaker 1 It's not unlike domestic abuse, domestic violence, violence where you're sentenced, in your case, however, to stay with the abuser. It's my assertion that it is legally mandated, domestic violence.

Speaker 1 When you look at your child, when you look at him, I assume you feel love.

Speaker 1 And what else? Fear.

Speaker 18 I'm afraid that one morning I'll wake up and one of my children will not be alive.

Speaker 18 He's repeatedly threatened my husband. I'm afraid that one day I'll get a call and he will be the next school shooter.
It's possible.

Speaker 18 I hope and pray that it's not. I'm trying everything I can to protect everyone around me, but there's a chance.

Speaker 1 So it's beyond time for us to create facilities like this and to pay for them and to protect everyone else's civil liberties.

Speaker 1 and prioritize those over the civil liberties of the next school shooter or the next homeless maniac who's going to take somebody's life or try to on a subway or mentally disturbed person who has access to guns and has identified himself to law enforcement as a threat.

Speaker 2 Well,

Speaker 2 Megan, I agree with you.

Speaker 2 I'm a reporter and a novelist, meaning that I deal in real life. And I live in a small town where it's very hard to hide the human condition.

Speaker 2 And this situation that you reported on is quite common, I'm afraid. And

Speaker 2 there is nowhere to go.

Speaker 2 You have a child. Well, it's not really a child, maybe a 14-year-old boy or girl.
They're, you know, full-size. They may be stronger than the parent.

Speaker 2 They have access to all kinds of things nowadays, from drugs to weapons and so on. And they're a threat to their family.
What do you do?

Speaker 2 We don't want to do the hard thing in society generally. Sometimes we put up a principle.
Oh, we're going to give them

Speaker 2 their own free reign and

Speaker 2 in the name of civil liberties, we'll let them live in their car or stalk around outside or not, you know, not be subjected to any sort of discipline or confinement if they act in an antisocial way.

Speaker 2 Well, that's a wonderful thing to do if, like the, unlike these people, you don't have to live with the consequences. We have to start doing the hard things.
We have to start,

Speaker 2 I hate to say it, hardening our hearts just a little little bit so that we can get over the hump to do the

Speaker 2 necessary jobs of a civilization, which is stay civilized.

Speaker 2 And if that means the building of new facilities, the hiring of new staff, the promulgation of new programs and codes and standards so that we can

Speaker 2 keep this within the boundaries that we consider civilized, then we have to do that. And all our, you know, all our aeried ideas about

Speaker 2 what's right in some best of all possible worlds can go out the window because this is a urgent crisis. Mental health, drugs,

Speaker 2 autism, which also can be

Speaker 2 in a sort of spectrum that can lead to this kind of behavior. And we know that that is on the rise for whatever reason.

Speaker 2 And so unless we start buckling down, you know, my mom was a critical care nurse. She saw the worst human situations and an ER nurse every night, violence, you know, accidents, just bad, dumb luck.

Speaker 2 And that realism affected me as a person. And I think we have to start getting realistic.

Speaker 2 We can't just look in our phones and live behind our gates and in our doorman buildings if we're well off and espouse these great principles while this kind of real horror and despair and pain is running rampant.

Speaker 1 I totally agree. It's like we too often say, three country, big country, and I know all that and I agree with all that, but there actually is something we can be doing.

Speaker 1 And it has nothing to do with guns because a deranged madman will find a different weapon. They'll find a knife.
We see this in all these other countries that have no guns.

Speaker 1 Mass murders happen all over the place where there are no guns whatsoever with knives, with car bombs, and with cars just running people down.

Speaker 1 I'm sorry, but the crazed deranged lunatic will find a way to do it. It's the other half of the equation that you pointed out.
It's the mental health half that needs to be addressed.

Speaker 1 And for the first time, we have a president who is willing to do it. He's willing to put money behind it.
No coverage. You wouldn't even know he did this.

Speaker 1 Most people didn't even hear about this executive order.

Speaker 1 I want to say one other thing about one of the moms there, Dawn Davies, who wrote this book, Mothers of Sparta, which is, I highly recommend you. It was a haunting book.

Speaker 1 It's a very good read and it's a quick read. And she talked about her son,

Speaker 1 By the way, on the subject of autism, because she pointed out her son has autism.

Speaker 1 Neither Walter nor I nor Dawn would tell you kids who have autism are sociopaths, but it is a frequent qualification or quality in some of the people who do wind up having these problems.

Speaker 1 So it doesn't, it's not like, you know, I have autism in my extended family. These kids are wonderful.

Speaker 1 We're not, no one's saying that they become school shooters. In any event,

Speaker 1 Dawn described her son as having been born like slow. He was not walking at the right age and he was having trouble talking.

Speaker 1 And they could see he was sort of having some neurodivergence, we call it today, issues. Then he got diagnosed with autism when he was five.

Speaker 1 Then he got very badly bullied because he was very different than the other kids. Then he said he was suicidal all before age 12.
Then he got to be age 13 and adolescence kicked in and he was very...

Speaker 1 It switched, like something happened in the brain. A lot happens to these kids.
And he

Speaker 1 started to behave in undesirably social ways, undesirable social behavior, she said. He killed the friend's hamster

Speaker 1 and many animals, which is, you know, I mean, that's every serial killer has done that. I'm not saying her son's going to be a serial killer, but that's what she's worried.
Like, where does this lead?

Speaker 1 He broke into a neighbor's home and so on. And then he developed an obsession with child pornography, as he himself was a child.
It was all over her computer.

Speaker 1 They got him a place. The law required her to have eyes on him at all times, which she couldn't.
She has to have a job to support her other kids and him. We are not helping these people.

Speaker 1 And up until now, we haven't had a president who's even thinking about how to help these people. So I just would love for everybody to get behind this Trump executive order and support.

Speaker 1 This is the kind of allocation we need.

Speaker 1 I don't want to spend 60 billions in Ukraine. I want to take billions of dollars and spend them on our people and things like this so we don't have another tragedy like we had on Monday.

Speaker 1 Walter, I'll give you the last quick word.

Speaker 2 Sometimes to wash the dishes, you've got to shove your hands into the dirty dishwasher and do what, dirty dishwater and do what has to be done.

Speaker 2 America needs to face its demons and start down the road of actually

Speaker 2 helping people who are in distress and not pretending that its values prevent that.

Speaker 2 We can do something about this if we're willing to face ourselves. It's upsetting, but

Speaker 2 we're going to have to tolerate being upset.

Speaker 1 It's pastime. Walter, thank you.
Coming up, a country singer who happens to be the girlfriend of FBI Director Cash Patel. You don't want to miss this exclusive interview.

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Speaker 1 I'm Megan Kelly, host of the Megan Kelly Show on SiriusXM.

Speaker 1 It's your home for open, honest, and provocative conversations with the most interesting and important political, legal, and cultural figures today.

Speaker 1 You can catch the Megan Kelly Show on Triumph, a Sirius XM channel featuring lots of hosts you may know and probably love. Great people like Dr.

Speaker 1 Laura, Blen Beck, Nancy Grace, Dave Ramsey, and yours truly, Megan Kelly. You can stream the Megan Kelly Show on SiriusXM at home or anywhere you are, no car required.
I do it all the time.

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Subscribe now, get your first three months for free.

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Speaker 1 Welcome back to the Megan Kelly Show.

Speaker 1 Joining me now, a woman who has come under fire in recent weeks following the announcement that no additional Epstein files would be released by the Trump Justice Department and the FBI, which it oversees.

Speaker 1 Alexis Wilkins is a country singer and political commentator, and she's also the girlfriend of FBI director Cash Patel.

Speaker 1 Some online influencers have accused her recently of being the reason we haven't seen the Epstein files. And wait until you hear their theory on why.
She joins me now to share her story.

Speaker 1 Alexis, welcome to the show.

Speaker 24 Hi, Megan. Great to be with you.

Speaker 1 It's great to have you. All right.
So just before we get into this like

Speaker 1 stuff,

Speaker 1 tell us a a little bit about your background because you have very interesting childhood.

Speaker 24 Yeah, so I was born in the United States, moved to Europe when I was young for my dad's job, grew up in Arkansas, spent some time in California, live in Tennessee now,

Speaker 24 started in country music and in music writing, and then transitioned into political commentary when I couldn't stay silent about the industry and the nature of the United States and what was going on anymore.

Speaker 1 Okay, I'm going to show people just a little bit of your music, a music video so they can see. You are legit.
You've won awards. You've opened up for some very, very famous acts.
You're young.

Speaker 1 You're moving up the line, but this is your real job in addition to a lot of charity work that you do. But here's a bit.
This is Country Back. Soph 5.

Speaker 25 When the American dream was a Cadillac, and the red, white, and blue showed them how you act. Things you got,

Speaker 25 you worked for.

Speaker 24 But didn't think twice, got not locked in your door.

Speaker 25 When people did the right thing with no one around, they looked at each other and found common ground. From the music to the flag, I ain't living in the past.
I'm just saying that

Speaker 1 I want my country back.

Speaker 1 Absolutely beautiful. For the listening audience, there were a lot of Trump rallies

Speaker 1 featured in the video, and Trump fans, and Trump himself. You voted for Lee Greenwood, for Sarah Evans, Chris Young, and more.
So this is a legit career.

Speaker 1 And to me, it's interesting because you mentioned you grew up mostly in Arkansas, but you did spend some time in England and Switzerland. You had sophisticated parents.

Speaker 1 And yet, the country thing is real for you because notwithstanding this like international and exciting, you know, presence for some of your childhood, you grew up in heartland America for the most part.

Speaker 24 I did. And it was my favorite place that I lived.
You know, people asked me, oh, did you love Europe? Did you love? And of of course I did, but my favorite place to live was by far Arkansas.

Speaker 24 And so that's where the country music came from. You know, my parents have always loved country music.
And so that's what I grew up on anyway.

Speaker 24 Even before, you know, in the UK and Switzerland, they didn't listen to a ton of country music back then. Now they do, and they have festivals and everything, and it's great.

Speaker 24 But back then, they didn't. And so we would ship in country albums from the states.
So it's what I grew up on.

Speaker 24 And in Arkansas, that's just what, you know, that's the place that I spent the most time growing up.

Speaker 1 All right. So this becomes relevant.
I'm not just making small talk

Speaker 1 because

Speaker 1 you will in 2025 America be accused of being an Israeli spy,

Speaker 1 that you work from Mossad. And near as I can tell, this is only because you're dating Cash Patel.

Speaker 1 That's probably it, to be honest. But I guess if we have to go to a second criterion, it would be that you've done work with Prager You, with our friend Dennis Prager, who is totally brilliant.

Speaker 1 And that institution has produced a lot of conservatives who are all over the internet.

Speaker 1 I think you might be the first of being accused of being an Israeli spy just because you've done a stint with Prager U.

Speaker 1 But do you think I have the entirety of the evidence, quote, against you spelled out here?

Speaker 24 I think that's it. You know, I think people see certain pieces and I get it.
They want to connect things.

Speaker 24 They want to justify, you know, some of the pain that they've been through watching the last four years. And there's pieces of this that

Speaker 24 I understand.

Speaker 24 But I think that they've taken just these pieces of evidence that you've laid out and tied them together in all of the wrong ways.

Speaker 24 I think Prager U is a great institution that is, as you know, Megan, sets out to educate the youth, make short-form content to try to influence people's opinions.

Speaker 24 educate them on things that they might not understand. Constitutional education.
I focused a lot in constitution and policy education in my videos.

Speaker 24 You know, all of this was to speak out about my experience in college and try to tell the youth that they don't have to bend the knee to the left woke institution and make content that would be of good service to the youth as I decided that I couldn't stay silent anymore.

Speaker 24 So seeing these things twisted is not only very confusing, very out-of-left field for me, but also incredibly disheartening.

Speaker 1 Okay, so among others who have come out of Prager U is Candace Owens. And as far as last time I checked, she doesn't really sound like she's part of Mossad.

Speaker 1 So

Speaker 1 going through the Prager U process of becoming a star does not turn one into an Israeli spy. And you've never lived in Israel.
You're Christian, as far as I can glean. Is that true?

Speaker 24 That is true. Yes, I am Christian.
That's been the most interesting thing is you find out things about yourself that you've never put forth and have never believed in your life.

Speaker 24 And you read them on the internet. But yes, I am a Christian.

Speaker 1 Okay, so you're Christian. You went to a Christian university, though I know you've got problems with their adherence to those principles at Belmont University.

Speaker 1 It turns out they're just as woke as the leftist others.

Speaker 1 But so that's your life. And then you're 26, is that right? I am.
Okay. So how did you meet Cash Patel?

Speaker 24 We met in Nashville at an event that we both went to at a friend's house.

Speaker 1 Okay, so you weren't set up. You just happened to meet?

Speaker 24 Yes, we just happened to meet.

Speaker 1 Okay, now there's an age difference there. I had it written down, but I don't remember.
It's a significant age difference, right? How many years?

Speaker 24 I believe it's 18.

Speaker 1 Okay.

Speaker 1 All right. Not as big as Caroline Levitt.

Speaker 1 Bigger than some, smaller than others. And what did you like about him?

Speaker 24 I have always liked, when I met him, I just liked that he was so, so honest. He's exactly who he is all the time.

Speaker 24 His character is incredible. His values are incredible.

Speaker 24 And, you know, we both are very patriotic. So obviously there are things there that we definitely agree on.
But he's just the most honest, you know, most integrity I've really experienced in a person.

Speaker 24 He's fantastic.

Speaker 1 When did you guys get together?

Speaker 24 We got together a little over two and a half years ago.

Speaker 1 So long before he was the head of the FBI?

Speaker 24 Yes, long before. I like to joke that, you know, all of this was not on my bingo card, but here we are.

Speaker 1 Because this is relevant too. I'm not being unnecessarily probing.

Speaker 1 It's just that people are accusing you of sort of being the honeypot where, you know, like they'll send over a spy to sort of get one of our officials, like an Eric Swalwell type, to sleep with them, like China does this.

Speaker 1 And some of these dopes do it. And before they know it, they've been compromised.
And by the way, there's been like no follow-up on him and that whole thing. But that's what some have said.

Speaker 1 But you, boy, if you're a spy trying to get in with Trump administration officials, you were really playing the long game two and a half years before Trump even got into office, picking some random associate of Trump's and betting on him becoming our FBI chief.

Speaker 24 Right.

Speaker 24 It would have been a really long game play. And the thing here, too, is that, you know, you don't know where life is going to go.
You don't know where these things are going to take you.

Speaker 24 You, even before I met Cash, you know, being committed to this movement and saying, okay, there's something seriously wrong with our country.

Speaker 24 And there are sacrifices in music that I'm being asked to make. And there's sacrifices in college that I'm being asked to make.

Speaker 24 You know, people that want you to donate to certain super PACs in order to get on certain tours. It's egregious, the things that you run into.

Speaker 24 And you either go, okay, I'm either going to be a part of this or I'm going to speak against it. And my values led me to speak against it.
And so to live my life.

Speaker 24 very publicly, honestly. I mean, my social media goes back far enough to tell that I have a long history of this,

Speaker 24 of speaking about American values and making sure that people know exactly where I'm coming from. I've worked with veterans organizations for a long time.

Speaker 24 These are the things that I've held for a long time, the beliefs I've held for long before I met him.

Speaker 24 And so it's hard when you make these decisions to sacrifice what I think the mainstream would call success in your career to commit to an ideology and speak out.

Speaker 24 out against what the Biden administration was doing, have my show on Rumble Weekly called Between the Headlines where I was calling all of this out.

Speaker 24 For people to act like there's not enough information out there about me to glean a real conclusion on all of this kind of vigilante research, it's bizarre to me.

Speaker 24 As a pretend I'm a third person, it just doesn't make any sense.

Speaker 1 One of the things that jumped out in your background to me was

Speaker 1 recently I was at the turning point event with Charlie Kirk, and at the end of our interview, he asked me if I had any advice for young people coming up through college college today and I'm gonna play a little bit of it.

Speaker 1 It's relevant. Watch.

Speaker 5 There's 7,000 people here most of which are students. What advice do you have for them fighting on campus trying to figure out what they want to do with their life?

Speaker 5 Let's do a non-Epstein end to all of this.

Speaker 1 Awesome.

Speaker 1 Be who you are. Don't pretend you're a lefty in order to win any professor's good humor.
He's not worth it.

Speaker 1 Get your D on your paper because you refuse to argue that capitalism is bad and wear it like a badge of honor. Bring it with you into your job interview.

Speaker 1 And that will make sure you align with an employer who's right for you. Right? Don't say that you support Planned Parenthood the way they want you to.

Speaker 1 Don't call yourself a feminist because your teacher will give you pats on the head. Stand up for what you really believe in, and that's how we spread the good word.

Speaker 1 That's how we convert others over to where we stand, rather than just get ahead pretending we're with them and then only once we have power tell our true feelings. It's not worth it.

Speaker 1 Anybody who came to me with a crappy GPA from one of these elite universities and then showed me all their papers that spoke up for conservatism and America and God, faith, I would hire them in an instant over somebody who emerged with a perfect GPA who went along to get along.

Speaker 1 That's not a leader. That's a sheep.
Don't be like that. Stand up for your beliefs now when it matters.

Speaker 1 Then I read, as I'm reading up on you, you at this private Christian University Belmont received an F in college for your conservative views.

Speaker 1 You actually went and complained to the dean because you knew this professor had it in for you. And you took, I mean, you complained saying, this is a bunch of bull.

Speaker 1 I don't deserve this F, but you preferred to get the bad grade rather than lie about how you really felt when you knew you were sitting there in a progressive professor's. classroom.

Speaker 24 Yes, absolutely. I love what you said, Megan.

Speaker 24 That's exactly the advice that the young people need to hear. And that's what they need to do.

Speaker 24 And that's what, you know, when I was given the F in comparative politics, I, of course, fought it to really make an example for other students that you can do this.

Speaker 24 If you want to run it up the flagpole, at least, you know, get it to the parties where they can maybe complain, they can change, they know that they can't get away with this, you know, all of those good things.

Speaker 24 But honestly, getting the grade was just an indication that I was exemplifying that I wasn't being indoctrinated because it wasn't like I was arguing with everything this professor said at every you know point that he was saying it it was that he knew because of my papers because of what I was saying because of what I was not agreeing with you know this is a comparative politics class it's it's not that it it's not that political and I know that sounds funny but you know what I mean it's it's really you know

Speaker 24 It's really kind of cut and dry. Dictatorships are bad.
You know, this other form of government's good. It should be very simple.
And this guy, as you said, just had it out for me.

Speaker 24 And so when I got the F and I knew I had to do something about it, ultimately, my advice to people going forward is very similar to yours: don't write anything that you don't agree with.

Speaker 24 Don't go forward and have those papers with your name on it that you can't stand behind. And I think that's the most vital piece of information because we have a generation that is so vulnerable.

Speaker 24 Not as much right now because of the messaging that's coming up, but in the last four years, they've just sat there, been good, been good students, been docile.

Speaker 24 And really, it's about standing up for your beliefs and not compromising on them.

Speaker 1 All right, so you've got

Speaker 1 you, this gal, who grows up for a large part in Arkansas, attracted to country music, you become a country music singer and star.

Speaker 1 You are very involved in veterans charities, you're Christian, you went to a Christian university, you stood up for yourself without doing the liberal talking points there, made a record of what they were doing to you.

Speaker 1 You get a show on Rumble. I mean, this is like, you know, basically your next step will be Fox News correspondent in the grand scheme of life.

Speaker 1 But for some reason, the Epstein thing gets blamed on you. And there's a lot of this on the internet.

Speaker 1 There are people with millions and millions of followers in posts that have been seen millions and millions of times accusing you of being a spy for Israel.

Speaker 1 Mostly, mostly Mossad spy, could be other spies. We cut just one in soundbite form, but there's so much more.
Here's just a sample.

Speaker 5 Is the director of the FBI caught up in an Israeli

Speaker 5 This is what people online are pointing to: the fact that Patel's girlfriend, Alexis Wilkins, works for Pregger U, which is a media company that supposedly espouses American values, except for the fact that it is run by a former Israeli military intelligence officer.

Speaker 5 Now, I did a bunch of digging, and unfortunately, there's actually not a lot of public information to go off of in terms of Alexis Wilkins' background.

Speaker 5 He lived in England and Switzerland before settling in Fayetteville, Arkansas when she was nine. It also says that she attended Collège du Le Monde International School in Switzerland.

Speaker 5 Now, interestingly, ChatGBT is calling this a strange biographical gap in that she has no visible friend network or public high school college cohort interviews, which they say is unusual for a public figure in entertainment, and that if a mossade asset were inserted early in life, these gaps would be precisely where you'd hide alternate history or handler training.

Speaker 5 Anyway, I'm not sure what's true or what's not true, but evidently, these are quote classic elements used in honeypot operations, soft power, ideological alignment, and sexual-emotional entanglement.

Speaker 1 Okay. The only piece of that that I can glean that is actually true is the CEO of Prager U

Speaker 1 is actually acknowledges in her bio that she served in military intelligence with the IDF. So she, the CEO of Prager U, has an affiliation, but there's nothing like that about you.

Speaker 1 So when this started coming out, were you shocked? I mean, do you think this is really basically just that you're with cash?

Speaker 24 I was shocked.

Speaker 24 I knew that, you know, that Prager was, this is kind of something that I think people in the deep sides of the internet like to pick at you know when they can't figure out what else is wrong so some of it didn't surprise me when it first started coming up I was like all right you know this looks like this is what they're focusing on today but then to your point Megan these posts got you millions of views and you know I could list all the ways that this hurt me and my family but some examples are the fact that people begin harassing you people start doxing your family people start you know accusing you just aside from all the other stuff that's hurtful the fact that I've dedicated myself to this movement to good values, to speaking to children, to doing things that I thought were good, that were in line with my values, but also the fact that it's accusing me of manipulating the person that I'm with, that I love.

Speaker 24 You know, that's a horrible accusation. And seeing this pop off on the internet, I think the initial ones actually didn't tag me.

Speaker 24 So it was very bizarre to kind of start to see this roll in on my Twitter and it not being a, or my ex, and it not being a good influx of what people were talking about. It was very surprising, yes.

Speaker 1 Now, what did Cash say? Because it's always, it's easier to take the slings and arrows yourself than to see them come to your loved one.

Speaker 24 Very similar to what he said. You know, he, I think he said something similar even when he got confirmed.
You know,

Speaker 24 you can throw whatever you want at me, but don't, I think his example there was don't, don't mess with the agents in the field.

Speaker 24 You know, don't mess with the people who have dedicated their lives to law enforcement. And it's honestly very similar.

Speaker 24 You know, he's fine with people coming after him, printing things that make sense, don't make sense, whatever. Ask him the questions.

Speaker 24 But I think when it came to me, he was very frustrated that something that was limited to the governmental side, something that he's obviously, you know, dealing with, something that transparently, and Megan, you know this, I don't know anything about.

Speaker 24 That's not something that he's allowed to talk about. I have no awareness besides what everyone else is seeing, probably the same questions everyone else has.

Speaker 24 And so for that to be something that came up that put me into the line of fire, you know,

Speaker 24 he was very unhappy, to say the least.

Speaker 1 So he's been in the news a lot lately since the release of that two-page memo, which was reportedly a joint effort between FBI and DOJ.

Speaker 1 And that's what Todd Blanche, the deputy at the DOJ, says, that there is no daylight between FBI and DOJ on it. But of course, there's been all sorts of reports, including my own reporting.

Speaker 1 And this is true, that on the Friday that this all broke, Dan Bongino did tell the administration it's either Pam Bondi or me.

Speaker 1 And the only reason he stayed is because he extracted assurances that more information would be released. But some of my audience has come back and said, whatever happened, it's her or me.

Speaker 1 No, that was true. He did say that.

Speaker 1 Though he had second thoughts once the administration started to say, okay, well, we'll release some more. But

Speaker 1 I'm here to tell you, there was daylight between the FBI and the DOJ on certain portions of that memo. I think that'll be proven.
So

Speaker 1 how big was the cocktail that Cash needed that night?

Speaker 1 And do you think this has been tough on him? Because, you know, this is his base too.

Speaker 24 I think so. You know, I think that it's hard when you see anyone you love being attacked for something that you're doing.
You know, I've encountered it on the smaller scale.

Speaker 24 I've been a public figure for long enough to see, you know, people try to picket my family, try and find people online. You know, they, this is something that people do.

Speaker 24 Hence, you know, it's funny referring back to the chat GPT investigation that was held on the SAT you played, you know, that there aren't any interviews of my friends.

Speaker 24 Well, there aren't any interviews with my friends because I don't want the internet to attack them. You know, I think it's pretty sensical.

Speaker 24 But no,

Speaker 24 he's dedicated to the American people as he always has been. You know, I think that

Speaker 24 when people get into government, they don't just snap into something else.

Speaker 24 You know, people have the same mission that they did on the campaign trail and during the time before they were in government, which is really all I can say on that.

Speaker 24 But I think that, you know, ultimately,

Speaker 24 it's been hard to see me come into the line of fire for something he's already dealing with.

Speaker 1 Would you like to see additional Epstein files released?

Speaker 24 You know what? If people stop calling me a spy, absolutely.

Speaker 1 Yeah, I can understand. For the record, I should ask you, are you a spy for any government?

Speaker 24 Definitely not.

Speaker 24 That is a firm no on that front. Okay.

Speaker 1 Just, I mean, for the record, we like to ask.

Speaker 1 Most spies would not admit to it, but I think your background shows us who you are, what your beliefs are, and what your priorities have been well i'm happy to have given you the chance to come on and clear your name alexis i i'm sorry you've had to go through this but as you know life as a public figure is it's full of ups and downs um on the bright side at least they care about you so so you've got that

Speaker 24 True. No, thank you for having me.
Thank you for letting me speak to this.

Speaker 24 I think that when you're in a space, when you've, you know, as I said, sacrificed other avenues to dedicate yourself to where you want to see American go, how much you care about the American people, how much you care about the history, the Constitution, you know, all these things that I grew up just absolutely loving and finding very important.

Speaker 24 It's really nice to be able to speak on the fact that I am who I say I am and I care about the things I say I care about and hopefully just return to business as usual.

Speaker 1 Well, the whole thing is also insulting to Cash, who I don't know as well as I know some of the administration figures, but he is an extremely bright guy.

Speaker 1 He's very talented and he seems absolutely lovely.

Speaker 1 So like to just look at him and say it's impossible for him to have wound up with this young, beautiful, successful woman is insulting and it's not true.

Speaker 1 And it's, I think, mostly generated by people who probably don't know him. Alexis, thank you, and thanks to all of you for joining me today.
Coming up tomorrow, Glenn Greenwald. We'll see you then.

Speaker 1 Thanks for listening to The Megan Kelly Show. No BS, no agenda, and no fear.

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