Kohberger Claims Harassment, Aniston Whines About Fame, and Trump's Massive Legal Victory, with Maureen Callahan, Holloway, Chamberlain

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Welcome to the Megan Kelly Show, live on SiriusXM Channel 111 every weekday at Noon East.

Hey, everyone, I'm Megan Kelly.

Welcome to the Megan Kelly Show.

Wow.

Another day, another massive legal win for Donald Trump in his fight against years of unfair, absurd, targeted lawfare against him.

This one is a stunner.

Let me tell you a story, okay?

It was August of 2023,

and

or maybe it was July, and I saw Trump at a turning point event.

This is before

we kind of like,

I don't know,

we'd made up years ago, but this one, we had the first like real glad hand and chance to see each other, and it was a very nice exchange.

And I spoke with his team behind the scenes, and we talked about the law fare that he was facing.

And the team made clear to me of all the criminal

trials that he was facing, the thing that really had Trump stressed because it was so unfair and threatened his business to its core was this ridiculous possible indictment by Letitia James, not indictment, but civil suit, that threatened to bankrupt him.

And indeed, she got a hard partisan judge, she's a hard partisan, the New York State Attorney General, who ran for office promising to, quote, get Trump.

And then she got a hard partisan judge, this lunatic Judge Engeron.

And it was a judge trial.

He had no right to a jury on it.

And it didn't go his way.

So this one was very important to Donald Trump.

And not surprisingly, this hard partisan judge threw the book at him and entered a nearly $500 million judgment against him.

It is now over $500 million with the interest that's accrued.

And today it was thrown out.

It's amazing.

He's had to live under this for years now.

Not just Donald Trump, but Donald Trump Jr., Eric Trump, both of whom have been pulled into this and harassed.

by this rabid partisan posing as an objective attorney general.

It's not so fun now, is it, Tish?

Now that you're on the receiving end of lawfare.

Unlike Trump, however, you actually appear to have broken the law.

Yeah, you deny it.

Well, you'll get your day in court, too.

We'll see how that plays out.

She's lost completely.

They've left in place some minor injunctive relief against the Trump organization.

None of it's really going to matter that much because Let's face it, the Trumps are busy doing something else for the next couple of years.

And the injunctive relief that she entered against, let's say, like the Suns, was basically like, you can't run this business for the next two years.

I think they'll be fine.

They actually have some other things they can do.

But this was a resounding victory for Donald Trump.

The entire monetary judgment has been vacated.

It's been wiped out.

This is a court of Democrats.

There is only one Republican-appointed judge.

And Republican in New York parlance basically means like a late-day Mitt Romney type.

So for Trump to get

the support of this full court is really shocking.

The court's presiding judge writing that the penalty is, quote, an excessive fine that violates the Eighth Amendment of the United States Constitution, which is the amendment that prohibits cruel and unusual punishments.

Two other judges writing that there should be a new trial entirely, another saying the whole case should never have been allowed,

and Tish James should not have been, should not have brought this to begin with.

She's notoriously anti-Trump completely unethically.

She ran for Attorney General on the promise that she would get Donald Trump.

She salivated thereafter at the prospect of seizing his buildings throughout New York.

Guess what, Tish?

It's not going to happen now.

There is zero chance the New York State Court of Appeals, which is the highest court in New York State, is going to overturn this well-founded decision by the First Department.

And so she's toast.

toast.

It's done.

We're officially awaiting her response to her massive kick in the ass.

We really look forward to that and we'll bring it to you when we get it.

We haven't heard from the president yet either.

We heard from Eric Trump, which I'll get to in a second.

But joining me now to unpack all of this and what it means is Phil Holloway.

He's contributor to MK True Crime.

That's our new True Crime podcast.

We launch it twice a week and it's got all your Kelly's court favorites, including Phil.

Go ahead and download that show right now.

Just search MK True Crime in the podcast search bar and on YouTube, too.

You can follow it, and you can get Phil and our other pals doing great legal analysis on all the hot legal cases.

They are going to have a lot with this one, along with Will Chamberlain, who's senior counsel at the Article III project.

That's, of course, Mike Davis' organization, and they do great work.

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Guys, welcome back.

What a victory, Phil, for the sitting president.

Well, it is a victory.

And, you know, we've talked about this going on, I don't know how many years now.

The lawfare that was waged against Donald Trump, which is all rooted in hard partisanship, as you pointed out.

You know, look, it's all crumbling, Megan, piece by piece by piece.

We saw, you know, Fannie Willis is booted off the RICO case, and now we have Tish James, and she's got her massive judgment, which really was the thing that she wanted, because this was effectively the death penalty if it was enforced, perhaps against the Trump organization.

Interestingly enough, it was grounded in the Eighth Amendment, which we normally see in criminal cases.

It's not that often you see that in a civil case because it prohibits cruel and unusual punishment.

And under the circumstances, a Democrat Court of Appeals says this is cruel and unusual.

It starts out with, of course, a case based on nothing.

The banks were not defrauded.

There were no actual injuries.

There were no money damages that were incurred by any party in this case.

This was pure partisan politics.

And the appeals court has said, look, we, you know, this is just done and wash.

We don't do this.

We can't punish somebody in this way.

It doesn't fit the allegations.

And I do think before all is said and done, that the appeals process will ultimately end this case in its entirety.

But for now, this was a huge victory, and I think it's going to last.

I mean, well, this was such a cockamame, convoluted civil case against him in the first place with a statute that had never been used like this saying,

well,

you undervalued your assets when you filed your taxes, and then you overvalued them when you wanted to get loans on favorable terms dealing with sophisticated banks, and therefore you're a fraudster.

Meanwhile, it's like everyone tries to undervalue their assets when they're dealing with the IRS.

And when trying to get a favorable loan with a bank, sure, you try to get the most favorable interpretation of what you own.

But he was dealing with Deutsche Bank.

He was not dealing with my imaginary viewer, Madge, who's in Iowa and works the farm all day and does not go over spreadsheets and corporate disclosure statements.

Correct.

And that goes right to the intent to deceive, which is necessary in any fraud fraud case.

Like they're not trying to deceive Deutsche Bank.

They expect Deutsche Bank will go down, you know, their statements of financial condition and be very, very careful and look very carefully at all their claims, all their attestations.

So it was a really preposterous case from the outset.

And I think, you know, we remember one of the obvious bizarre valuations was to suggest that Mar-a-Lago was worth something like $20 million.

And Tish James suggested that and said that all of Trump's claims that it was worth half a billion or more were ridiculous.

Well, no, actually, saying that if you've ever been to Mar-a-Lago or you're familiar with the geography of Palm Beach, it's a massive property in one of the most expensive areas for real estate in the entire world.

It's a unique, totally unique property.

20 million would be trivial to purchase it.

And yet Tish James's entire theory of the case was that by saying it was worth $20 million when applying for a loan to Deutsche Bank,

that the Trump organization defrauded Deutsche Bank.

An absurd claim on its face.

And Deutsche Bank didn't complain.

That was one of the ironies of this whole case, Phil, is that the banks actually came in and said, no, absolutely no harm done.

We're good.

He repaid the loans in full, paid the interest.

We're really pleased and we love being in business with him.

And still, Tish James was in there saying, a fraud has been committed.

The people of New York were defrauded.

She never adequately explained why, but she had something in her back pocket.

And that was an even more hard partisan judge, Engeron, who clearly wanted to be a Democratic star.

Yeah, Tiss James knows something about mortgage fraud, but she knows about it maybe in a different context.

She, I think, defrauded the court when she made these crazy claims about the value of these properties.

At least in the business documents, which is standard, there's disclaimers saying, look,

do your due diligence, lender, because we're doing this in good faith, but we want you to do your due diligence and not rely exclusively on our evaluations.

And that's how business is done.

And she completely ignored that.

She made false claims to the court about the actual value of things like Mar-a-Lago, as Will pointed out.

And so she should be disbarred.

This case should be thrown out.

She should be prohibited from ever bringing it back to life.

And, you know, look, I mean, we can talk about her own mortgage fraud problems if you want to, but she really ought to be

focusing on that and focusing less on this particular thing because she has actually committed mortgage fraud.

She has actually benefited financially by making false statements in mortgage loan applications.

Donald Trump wasn't saying that these are some kind of primary residence for which he should get lower interest rates.

She did that.

She needs to be the one held accountable.

The lawfare that was waged against Donald Trump was all rooted in partisanship.

And that's the fundamental flaw in all of this.

And that's why we're seeing it crumble piece by piece.

Yes, those are the allegations against her.

She denies them.

We'll see whether she gets away with that or not, because she's got a couple of legal problems on her hands with respect to her New York properties, with respect to her property down south, and the representations she made in order to get more favorable mortgage rates on her loans.

Something she claims she's horrified by when Donald Trump is doing it, when Donald Trump is applying for loans and allegedly misstates the value of the assets.

She's horrified by it.

It's fraud.

He has to be punished.

No one is above the law.

When Tish James allegedly does it, totally different story.

Now she's complaining about lawfare and retribution.

Okay, literally, nobody feels sorry for you.

This was Tish James as she campaigned.

It was so inappropriate.

Hannity put together this montage.

We often show it.

It was perfectly done.

SOP 50.

I will never be afraid to challenge this illegitimate president when our fundamental rights are at stake.

I believe that the president of these United States can be indicted for criminal offenses.

Oh, we're gonna definitely do.

We're gonna be a real pain in the

name personally.

That man in the White House

who can't go a day

without threatening our fundamental rights.

Yes, we need to focus on Donald Trump and his abuses.

We need to follow his money.

We need to find out where he's laundered money.

We need to find out whether or not he's engaged in conspiracy.

It's important that everyone understand that the days of Donald Trump are coming to an end.

I look forward to going into the office of Attorney General every day,

suing him, defending your rights, and then going home.

So inappropriate, Will.

I mean, it's amazing that one, you couldn't hear it as well in that montage, but her next to the civilian who said, please sue him for us.

Oh, I'm going to sue him.

He's going to know my name personally.

Well, how do you like that now, Tish?

How does it feel to have the president of the United States knowing your name personally and just lifting up the hood a little to see whether you really feel about alleged fraud on banks the way you claimed when you sued him?

Yeah, she's getting turned about and she's going to get turned about in about the harshest way imaginable.

And I think it's really important that she be made an example of.

What What you shown that series of clips is just appalling from any prosecutor under any circumstances to run for office on the promise of prosecuting an individual without any question, without any explanation of the criminal conduct at issue or the people who have been victimized, just saying you're going to use the law to go after someone.

You know, I hear a lot of carping and complaining about Democrats, from Democrats rather, about the DOJ engaging in lawfare and persecution.

And sometimes you hear some more weaker Republicans saying, oh, you're going to open Pandora's box.

And I think the rest of us are just staring at the Pandora's box that's been opened for a decade, targeting President Trump and are wondering when people are going to realize what's going on.

Exactly.

We've been in Pandora's box for years now.

Welcome to the party.

It was clear to court watchers like us that

this was how this case was going to come out.

Anyone who watched the argument before the First Department saw that this panel of judges was not sympathetic to Tish James, we've got a montage of questions.

This This is not Tish James arguing here.

It's her deputy, Judith Vale.

And as soon as she got up to the lectern, she had a hot bench, lots of questions, and none of them was particularly favorable toward her and Tish James' position.

You're going to see this montage.

I want the audience to know, only the first judge who you will hear was appointed by a Republican.

All the other judges.

on this court

were appointed by Democrats.

So this is a Democrat court that just found in favor of Donald Trump.

But here's how the oral argument went a couple months ago, September of 24.

Judith Bail for the New York Attorney General's Office.

All of the defendants repeatedly violated.

Ms.

Bail, can you identify any previous case in which the Attorney General sued under Executive Law 6312 to upset a private business transaction that was between equally sophisticated partners where the supposed victim had the ability and legal obligation to discover the allegedly misrepresented matters by conducting its own due diligence, where the supposed wrongdoer advised the supposed victim through written disclaimers to conduct its own due diligence and to draw its own conclusions, where the alleged misrepresentation almost entirely concerned inherently subjective valuations of properties and businesses.

Yes,

and

where the victim never complained about any fraud in the transaction or losses from it.

And I want to add to his question, and little to no impact on the public marketplace.

Well, maybe I'll take that first, Your Honor, and work backwards.

There was absolutely a public impact and a public interest here.

There are at least four different public harms from the kind of misconduct here.

The immense penalty in this case is troubling.

So how do you tether

the amount that was assessed by Supreme Court to the harm that was caused here where the parties left these transactions happy about how things went down?

Well, discoursement, Your Honor, looks at taking the gain away from the wrongdoer.

And although this is a large number, it's a large number for a couple reasons.

One, because there was a lot of fraud.

Oh, is it because there was a lot of fraud?

Here, by the way, Phil, is when it happened, the views response,

thinking about the possibility of Tish James seizing Donald Trump's properties throughout New York, which is what Tish James has been promising to this day that she's going to do.

Watch.

This is SOP 50.

You know who

says he cannot come up with the cash to cover his $400 million plus bond

in his New York fraud case.

I can't wait to see the chains on Trump Tower actually on Fifth Avenue.

I'm like, Tony is excited about it.

Sonny Huston should have been more worried about her husband's legal troubles and less focused on Donald Trump's.

As it turns out, all these people wind up revealing themselves.

Time reveals them, or in her case, their family members for what they truly are, Phil.

Well, look, that's what we can expect out of the view because, you know, the view is the view, and we all know what that is.

But what's more troubling to me is watching this assistant prosecutor from the AG's office make this ridiculous argument to the appeals court talking about fraud and disgorgement of ill-gained or ill-gotten gains when there was no actual fraud.

Nobody was defrauded of a damn thing.

There was not one nickel that was defrauded from any of these lenders.

And so the whole thing is just built on a house of cards.

Ingeron, I think, has some responsibility here too, because if you're the judge and the trial judge, you're supposed to make sure that this kind of farce doesn't happen in your courtroom.

But he allowed it and he was a part of it.

And so what I want to know is why we are allowing these judges like this and prosecutors like this to stay involved in these cases.

When Tiss James goes out and makes all of these public comments about how she is focusing her efforts specifically on one individual that she is targeting for political reasons, how is that prosecutor allowed by the judge to remain on the case?

Because

if that's not biased, if that's not bias, expressed bias, I don't know what is.

Phil,

how many times did we have conversations on this show about Fannie Willis and the number of motions that she was subjected to because she made out-of-court statements that were against Trump and the defense team suggesting they were racist?

They played the race card against her.

And that was because she committed ethical violations that they called her out on.

And then she, in defense of herself, went into a church and tried to suggest they were all racist.

That became a new basis to potentially disqualify her because because you're not allowed to even say something like that.

Never mind campaign on the promise to get just some citizen whose alleged crimes you don't even know exist yet.

I mean,

that's why you say she should be disbarred.

I totally agree with you.

In a rational world, in a rational legal world, a trial judge would not allow either of these prosecutors to stay in the case.

A simple motion saying, look, judge, this is what she has said publicly about my client.

She's targeting my client.

And in a criminal context, if you're talking about, you know, targeted, malicious prosecution, that's one thing.

It's the same principle over in the civil case.

You can't just use the awesome power of the state to target and prosecute specific persons with whom you have a political beef.

And it's just so crazy that we're here in August of 2025 having this discussion because this is like law 101.

It's almost like people forgot law that they learned in law school or they were absent the day they taught law in law school.

Ingeron needs to be off the bench.

He has no business presiding over trials in New York.

Letitia James has no business bringing, of all things, mortgage fraud cases now on behalf of the state of New York.

These people need to be out of their jobs.

They need to be dealt with.

They need to be dealt with severely.

And honestly, I'm at the point where I don't know that the appeals process is enough.

It's not enough to just say, all right, Ingeron, you and your $500 million judgment,

just, you know, you're done, no more of that.

That's not enough.

We need to have an appellate process that can send a message to prosecutors and to judges and say, look, you can't do this.

There's rules against

the people.

And these things have teeth.

Yeah.

The whole abuse process was abusive.

It was intended to be abusive of Donald Trump, who has just reacted in a very, very long truth social post.

I'm going to read you just my producer's pulling of the highlights.

Total victory in the fake New York State Attorney General Letitia James case.

I greatly respect the fact that the court had the courage to throw out this unlawful and disgraceful decision that was hurting business all throughout New York State.

By the way, that was something verified by Kevin O'Leary, who was saying the chilling effect this is going to have on companies from wanting to do business in New York.

Sorry, that was my own aside.

Others, continuing here with Trump, were afraid to do business there.

The amount, including interest and penalties, was over $550 million.

It was a political witch hunt in a business sense, the likes of which no one has ever seen before.

That's really true.

Trump's prone to hyperbole, but that's actually true.

Going back to him, every single dollar was thrown out, even the penalties imposed on us by the corrupt judge, one of the most overturned in history, Arthur Engeron.

I am so honored by Justice David Friedman's great words of wisdom, which should be read by everyone.

I would also like to thank the court for having the courage to make this decision, which is already going down as one of the worst business persecutions in the history of our country.

I mean, that's just great, and honestly, good for him.

And here's a little from David Freeman's opinion that Trump cites.

He writes: The Attorney General in her 2018 election campaign for her current office repeatedly promised the voters that her top priority upon being sworn in would be to bring down President Trump and his real estate empire.

Whatever one may think of President Trump's character and policies, Section 6312 was not enacted for the Attorney General to use as a stick with which to beat the opponents of her political party.

I mean, well,

from a judge on a New York State appellate court, that's like as vicious and sweeping a condemnation as you can get.

Yeah, and I think it's really revealing of, you know, this is sort of why President Trump is president now.

I think if you go back to 2023, this case, along with so many of the other obviously unjust prosecutions of him, I think it really cemented Republican support for President Trump in the primary.

And I think it's ultimately, you know, he was ultimately vindicated at the ballot box in the first instance before any of this stuff came forward.

You know, listening to how you guys are talking about this, it just made me think that the actual just result here isn't merely that this gets thrown out.

It's that the state of New York has to compensate President Trump for his illegal fees and his trouble.

It's really ridiculous that they persecuted him in this way.

And, you know, maybe he'll pursue an appeal on that front to say that the state of New York needs to cover his costs.

I think

Tish James personally ought to have to reimburse him.

It ought to come out of her hide.

It ought to come out of her bank account.

Whatever she's got left, it ought to bankrupt her the way it's, you know, it could bankrupt.

She's got multiple homes.

Yeah, well, if it wasn't Donald Trump, nobody else would have been able to afford to defend themselves in this litigation.

So she ought to be on the hook personally, financially, for this type of specious and egregious, malicious prosecution.

Okay, but now what about the remaining injunctive relief, which has not been stricken?

And that's one of the reasons why David Friedman, who Trump just praised, he said I would reverse the judgment entirely and dismiss the complaint.

There was,

I haven't read the whole opinion.

It's 323 pages, but

I think this is a unanimous reversal of the monetary award.

It's not a unanimous decision on all reasons and how they got there, but it's a unanimous reversal on that monetary award.

And

Justice Friedman said, I'd reverse the whole thing.

I would dismiss this complaint

because the other judges left in place, Will, the injunctive relief that Engeron had put in place.

I said in the intro, look, compared to 550 million, this is a nothing burger.

But still, it's kind of bullshit since the whole case is bullshit and it's still standing.

Here it is.

Engeron, in New York State, you call the trial court the Supreme Court.

The Supreme Court won, enjoined Trump and the corporate corporate defendants from applying for loans from any financial institution chartered by or registered within, with the New York State Department of Financial Services for three years.

Two, barred Trump, Alan Weiselberg, his CFO, and another guy from serving as corporate officers or directors in New York for three years and barred Trump Jr.

and Eric Trump from doing so for two years.

Three, permanently prohibited Weiselberg and the other guy, McConney, from serving in financial management roles in New York.

Four, extended the independent monitor's terms for three years.

So they have an independent monitor overseeing the Trump organization, which I know they hate.

And five, required the Trump organization to retain an independent director of compliance.

So you tell me whether any of that should stand, which it is.

It is right now.

I mean, that's grounds alone for him to appeal to the Court of Appeals.

Yeah, so this is where, how bizarre this ruling is.

And you'll forgive me if I make some errors here because, you know, I had maybe 40 minutes to try and get a sense of how to handle on a 300-page judgment.

But my understanding was it was a 2-2-1.

And there were actually three judges who would have tossed out any of the findings of liability.

There were two judges who would have vacated the summary judgment motion and remanded for a new trial.

And then one judge, Judge Friedman, who would have tossed out the whole thing.

But my understanding is because those people couldn't agree on what the proper course forward was between a new trial and an outright dismissal, that the two judges who wanted a new trial instead decided to...

baseline agree with the other two judges and agree to the finding of liability and to the imposition of injunctive relief, which is very, very weird.

Normally, if you have a majority of judges agreeing that somebody shouldn't be found liable, they aren't.

And yet, here that didn't happen.

So I wouldn't be surprised, therefore, if you see Trump try to appeal this and his codendants to try and get all these silly injunctions reversed.

But in the grand scheme of things, the most important thing here to get rid of was obviously this gargantuan monetary issue.

Absolutely.

Absolutely.

I mean, they'll be fine with the W there.

Only since he became president has, I think, forgive me if I don't have the exact numbers, but I just looked at this the other day.

I think, you know, there's what he's worth on paper and then there's what he actually has in the bank, you know, as all of us, right?

Like if you said, what are you worth?

Well, you'd calculate up the equity you have in your home.

What is your car worth?

You know, you'd come up with some number, but it would not equal the amount you have of liquid cash in your bank account.

Same is true for Donald Trump.

And it was estimating that only now since becoming president and, you know, his value, the value of all of his properties properties has gone up and he's whatever.

He's gotten some legal settlements that have gone to his presidential library mostly.

Anyway, they're saying only now is he liquid enough to potentially pay $550 million,

but this would have bankrupted him, Phil.

That was the goal to bankrupt him.

So the relief to Team Trump in seeing that award go away has got to be huge.

Nonetheless,

They should appeal this, should they not, to the Court of Appeals and say the injunctive relief must also go.

Well, I've been thinking about that.

And I'm not really sure because

if I'm representing Trump and I say, look, the whole enchilada or most of it anyway was this gargantuan $500 and some odd million dollar disgorgement order,

I might just say, look, all right, if the state doesn't appeal, we're not either.

We're just going to go ahead and take the W.

But I think it's kind of an academic point because I feel almost certain that despite what might be prudent, I think Letitia James is going to probably appeal.

And so there's going to have to be an answer on appeal.

So I think one way or another, this is going up to the New York Court of Appeals, which is their version of the state Supreme Court.

But if it weren't for the fact that I think James is going to appeal, I might advise my client to just leave the status quo in place because the injunctive relief may be over soon enough anyway, and we can just move on from this.

But that's not Donald Trump's nature.

As we all know, he's going to fight back.

He's going to file that appeal.

James is going to appeal.

Everybody's going to appeal.

And so we get to see what the Supreme Court of New York or the Court of Appeals of New York, I should say, is going to finally do.

Yeah.

Okay.

So my numbers were right.

My team forwards me the following.

Forbes estimates Trump's net worth on paper at $5.1 billion.

He now has approximately $770 million in liquid assets.

That's up from approximately $413 million after Engerong's fraud ruling, with the bump largely thanks to the president's cryptocurrency holdings.

Here, to your point, Will, is what Judge Friedman said.

He said, like to your point about these other judges upholding the injunctive relief despite wanting to reverse the underlying judgment, like not believing that they had proven the fraud.

He writes, to draw a sports analogy, it is as if a team is awarded a touchdown without crossing the goal line.

So there's plenty for the Court of Appeals to chew on, but for now, the important thing is it's a big, it's a huge Trump win.

It's a huge Tish James loss.

There probably will be an appeal that she will not win.

The only question is whether Trump can get rid of that injunctive relief and possibly get his fees paid for.

And now we move on to the portion of the case where Tish James.

is held to the no one is above the law principle and mortgage fraud is deeply wrong principle and possibly ethical violations um potentially brought against her and her law license phase of the story.

Looking forward to that.

Gentlemen, a pleasure.

Thank you for coming on so quickly.

Always happy to be here.

Yeah, thanks for having me.

Wow, what a day.

What a day.

It's all failed.

All the law affair against Donald Trump has failed.

The only thing that actually stuck was that ridiculous defamation case by Eugene Carroll.

for her alleged sexual assault, the date of which she couldn't remember.

Friends couldn't remember.

That's the only thing that stuck.

Okay.

Everything else, Trump has defeated.

He defeated four criminal cases against him.

The U.S.

Supreme Court wound up issuing a ruling that presidents in their official duties largely have immunity, a hugely consequential ruling.

And now this massive judgment that was lingering over him, I'm sure casting a cloud over his entire business and family, has been lifted.

The prosecutor humiliated.

And she's about to learn the hard way that no one really is above the law.

What a day.

And it's about to get even better because Maureen Callahan is here for the rest of the show.

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Maureen Callahan has been crushing it on her show, The Nerve.

It's literally one of my favorites.

I save it all up until the weekend, and then I listen to it while I'm on my run or sitting under the red light, which is a favorite topic thing for me to do.

But I feel like she's always there for me and she's so funny and her topics are so juicy.

It's just like a guilty pleasure, but you shouldn't have guilt because it's just so fun.

And we're going to keep it rolling right here, getting into some topics that she's been keeping an eye on for us.

There is the new CNN documentary on JFK Jr.

I use that term loosely.

Again, documentary.

It is not.

She's got the actual documentary in her book.

And we'll talk about that.

Also, the highly anticipated end of the Sex in the City reboot.

And just like that, Maureen's been all over it.

Plus, Jennifer Anison's new boyfriend, a wellness guru and hypnotherapist.

I have never heard such inane, empty advice from anyone in my life.

And this apparently is doing it for Jennifer Aniston.

We'll talk about it.

Maureen's been all over this on her show.

She's got thoughts.

Joining me now, Maureen Callahan, host of The Nerve on the MK Media Podcast Network.

All you have to do is go into your podcast search bar, type in the nerve, or go to YouTube and type in the nerve, and it'll bring up Maureen's show.

Make sure you subscribe and follow.

Truly, truly, truly, you'll thank me.

How are you doing, my friend?

I'm doing really well.

I'm so happy to see you, Megan.

It's been forever.

I know.

I know.

I can't wait until we're back together physically.

And I've been reading all of your recommendations.

Maureen gave me some great recommendations at the beginning of the summer.

We have to talk about them.

I'm going to tell the audience what they are.

So we're not going to talk about them now because the audience probably hasn't done them yet.

But

you recommended on your show, Gray Gardens.

It's like a documentary that was was done in the 1970s on these two women who are speaking of the Kennedys related to Jackie Kennedy.

And it was one of the most bizarre, entertaining, crazy two hours I've ever watched on television.

So people check it out.

I'd love to go over this with all of us once you've all seen it.

Did, on your recommendation, finally get around to reading Beautiful Ruins by Jess Walter, which was Chef's Kiss.

I know, I can't believe it took me this long.

It was Oh, I'm so fun to read it.

I know I had texted that to you as a rec, but like, I didn't realize you had read it.

So I'm so thrilled because I thought you would love it.

I really did.

Yeah, I've never read it.

And you know what, to be honest, I had started it a couple of times and I never like, it never took for me.

And this is the first time I got past like the opening chapter, which for some reason didn't do it for me originally.

Loved it.

Loved the whole book.

Great recommendation.

Okay, and there's more, but I already told the people about my life with Ted Bunny or the stranger next to me, which is so good.

Yes.

And, you know, I think about that.

I'm always sort of reluctant to recommend it because I feel like, what if somebody's already read it and they're like, that's such an obvious recommendation?

But I usually find most people haven't because the author Anne Ruhl was one of the first females to really do true crime as literature and she's so underrated.

And I think so much about this book when

following the Kohlberger case, like it's all I think about.

It's all I think about is the stranger beside me.

The stranger beside me, exactly.

Kohlberger.

And also, I've been thinking about her.

Now, my dearest friend, she listens to the show every day, Donna.

Now she's listening to the audio because she heard you and I were talking about it.

And now she's texting me her updates on Ted Bundy.

It's very strange to spend time with Ted Bundy.

Thankfully, he died in the electric chair, so it has a happy ending.

Ann Ruhl also wrote a book called Small Sacrifices about this woman who killed her three kids.

And I've been thinking about that in connection with this horrible case we've been covering on AM Update out of California with this missing baby, Emmanuel Harrow, and how the mother claimed that she was knocked out in a parking lot and someone took her baby.

And I'm telling you, that case is falling apart.

We'll see.

The cops are not yet saying that the parents are their suspects, but it seems clear to those of us following the case, the parents are the suspects.

That's my opinion.

And it's horrific what this father has done to his other children.

He's already been convicted of child abuse.

So we'll stay on it.

But anyway, I'm just thinking about these authors that you've recommended.

They've been all over similar cases.

And history repeats itself, Maureen.

You know, so you read these things and they're interesting.

And in part, they're interesting because they provide a new window through which

for you to see current cases and sadly, very similar stories.

Yeah.

And, you know, with this,

the thing with Bundy is so so many,

he's got direct descendants who, when they are caught, say, I was influenced by him.

I read everything I could.

I learned a lot from his M.O.

I learned a lot about how to avoid detection.

We know Brian Koberger was very, very interested in Ted Bundy and had done his reading.

Being active in that sort of pocket of the country is a similar thing, and it's why I hope we continue to get more and more documents,

witness interviews, whatever is available about this case.

I really do think it's not only in the public's best interest, but I think that this case is one that law enforcement and trainees at Quantico should be learning from.

It's true.

I mean, Brian Kohlberger attacked these four kids in their beds in Moscow, Idaho.

And

Ted Bundy did the same thing to a bunch of sorority girls, to other women, many other women.

He attacked them in their beds while they were sleeping.

And now Brian Kohlberger, speaking of him, is actually wanting the prison authorities to feel sorry for him

because he's getting threats of being butt effed.

That's the term that was used against him by fellow prisoners.

Good.

Suffer.

Who says prisoners don't have a heart?

I'm sorry, but I'm like sitting here watching these reports, Maureen, of what the prisoners are threatening him with and and like allegedly flooding his cell with overflowing toilets.

And all I can think is I'd like to shake their hand.

I want to know who these good prisoners are who are trying to do what the justice system failed to.

Agreed.

Have you heard about the

complaints he's leveled?

I mean, he's apparently made his complaints known in writing because he's having trouble sleeping.

Irony of ironies.

Oh, you're having trouble sleeping because all of the inmates in this prison have taken it upon themselves 24-7

to be howling and cat calling through the vents so that he doesn't have a moment's silence.

And I love it.

I love it.

And I think

that there are active conversations about how long they wait until they just murder him in prison.

Like how much they can make him suffer,

how long he'll have to live with that sword hanging over his neck.

that he's going to die, but they're just figuring out the most painful and lengthy way to make that happen.

Yeah, I completely agree with you.

And who are these wonderful men who are who are willing to do this?

I'm sorry, I realize this is very, like, I don't know, somewhat evil.

I don't care.

He

ended these four people's lives in the prime of their youth while they had no chance to defend themselves, though they tried.

He stabbed Xana Cornodel over 50 times as she fought for her life, the deep gashes all over her hands as she tried defensively to put her hands up.

That's Xana on the right in the orange blouse.

And not to mention what he did to Kaylee, who's there right next to Xana in this photo, who he beat the living daylights out of as she fought to save her life too.

I mean,

the stab wounds to their faces, including Maddie's right next to Kaylee in those photos.

Who gives two shits that he cannot sleep at night or that they are threatening him with sexual assault?

This guy actually thinks he's checked into a Marriott, Maureen.

He's his sexual harassment report.

It reads as follows.

Well, the prisoner report, prison report reads that this prisoner submitted a concern form stating that he, quote, has been subject to threats and harassment, recently escalating to overt sexually violent threats and statements.

He received the concern form on August 4th, 2025, conducted an interview with Kohlberger in J-Block, which is where he's housed.

Kohlberger stated a resident that goes by Peru told him, I'll butt F you.

Kohlberger also stated an unknown resident from tier one of J-Block said, the only ass we'll be eating is Kohlberger's.

Oh, was it scary to feel out of control and in danger?

That didn't make you feel good.

None of us gives.

two shits.

You know, to just address the top of what you just said there, I often really

relate to the God of the Old Testament, the God of wrath and vengeance.

And, you know, I think the God of wrath and vengeance would be just fine with what is being meted out to Brian Kohberger, who has the temerity to complain that he's being sexually harassed when this latest document dump from the authorities contains multiple witness interviews from women who said he was harassing me.

He would keep me from exiting rooms by blocking the doorway.

This is a big, big guy.

He would follow me to my car, multiple women.

He would follow me.

He had this thing that he loved to do, which was to go to a professor's office at closing time or an eatery, an establishment, whatever, as they're about to close and walk in and keep talking and never stop.

And this was about power and control and dominance and contempt.

I control you.

There were many formal reports made at that university.

This guy makes me uncomfortable.

He stalks me.

He has cornered me.

He stares at me.

He stands in front of me.

He stands over me.

He doesn't do anything.

One professor said, this guy's a potential future rape.

First of all, this guy's in a criminology course.

You're telling me this school couldn't ID this guy as an

is escalating.

Is it true that those who can't do teach?

Yes, Maureen, I had the same reaction.

She's referring here to the supplemental reports that we're getting.

Well, they're not supplemental, but to some of the reports that the police took while investigating this case that we're just now seeing thanks to the lifting of the gag order.

And that was my reaction too, which is like, how did it take Washington University anything more than a beat when these murders happened to say, I know who did it?

I guarantee you, you should at least be questioning this guy, Brian Kohlberger, who, you know, we are 10 miles away.

And speaking of Ted Bundy, all of of his original murders happened in Washington State.

I do wonder whether that's why Brian Kohlberger went out to Washington State for his PhD.

And look, why was it?

They were all complaining about him.

They were worried about him.

They were predicting he was going to behave criminally.

And then four people, including three young women, get murdered.

How did it take them as long as it did to say that's the guy?

First of all, after the murders, he's showing up to class in a heavy coat covering him neck to wrist to, you know, so, and it wasn't weather appropriate.

He's got bruises and cuts all over his hands.

He's, he's drinking heavily.

He had clearly, he had, by all reports, never been a drinker before.

He was unraveling.

He looked like it's all the markers of a major offender.

But what bothers me so much is the lead up to me.

This guy screamed.

He's an offender.

He is harassing women.

He is making them uncomfortable.

There were, I believe, at least 13 written complaints about him stalking them out to their cars.

There were multiple women who refused to even walk to their cars alone once the sun went down.

I mean, you know how early it gets.

I mean, dark it gets early in the fall months, especially.

And then there's this one thing in the report where

the complaints reached such a crescendo.

And I really think this is a direct result of this coddling culture that we have in America that seems very stubborn.

The complaints about Koberger alone reached such a crescendo that the university decided that they were going to hold a group meeting for all of the students about what constituted appropriate behavior, even though it was only directed at one person, Brian Koberger, who sat in the back of that classroom the entire time with his head in his hands, staring at the ceiling.

Why was there not a direct come to Jesus with Brian Koberger?

You knocked this off or we're kicking you out of school.

You'll get a tuition refund and security will make sure you never show your face again.

Yeah, no, I completely agree.

It's like they knew they had a problem.

When I was reading these documents, my first thought was that I heard Steve Gonsalves say he wasn't planning, at least immediately after the verdict, or not the verdict, but the plea deal, on suing the University of Idaho, you know, for not for failing to keep the students safe.

And they were living in an off-campus housing area anyway.

But

now I'm wondering whether he should consider a lawsuit against the University of Washington, where where Kohlberger was.

I mean, 2020 hindsight, I get it.

You can't necessarily say this guy's going to be a killer, but I certainly hope that the lessons will be taken to heart here.

And you know what, Maureen?

It's just part of like an ongoing, even post-MeToo pattern of women's complaints.

It's like, whatever, there's nothing we can do.

I'm sure she's overreacting.

So he's a little creepy.

It's like, no, women have a sixth sense.

It's a gift.

It's the gift of fear, per Gavin DeBecker.

And you would do well to listen to it.

It's like a superpower, not to be ignored, but to be thankful for and to listen to.

And had they done that and ejected this guy from the University of Washington, it's not too far to say those four kids might still be alive today.

100%.

I had the exact same thought while reading through these documents.

I hope those parents mobilize and sue this university because they, at every turn, they turned a blind eye.

And the,

and this is the thing, too.

It's not like he was a philosophy major or a liberal.

We're talking about a criminology department.

And when they minimize this, right?

And they just put all of these, you know, you read that there were HR reports about this, and it's got all that kind of HR sanded down language, you know, just to make it mean nothing.

Yeah.

This, this goes to the kind of minimizing, the institutional minimizing of women's concerns in this way one of the girls I forget whether it was Zanna or Dylan said I felt that it was the survivor it had to be Dylan I felt that being stalked for weeks if not I felt I felt we were being watched I could feel a presence out there I felt the house was unsafe we did we had windows you could see right through when they came home that day and I am in no way blaming the victims but this is how insidious minimizing this stuff

it manifests they came home one day to find the front door off the hinges and they didn't call the police instead like one of the dads just repaired it and that's the moment you go wait no listen to my gut something's really wrong i don't feel safe Yep, I know.

And the dog Murphy had been acting strangely, like alerting and barking when he wasn't, they weren't used to that.

Just to correct myself, I said University of Washington was Washington State, which is a different university.

That's where Kohlberger was, Washington State.

All right, there's a lot more to get get into.

I don't even know where to begin, but you're going to enjoy the rest of the show and wait until you hear the Jennifer Anniston boyfriend.

Okay, that's like going to be the highlight of the two hours.

Maureen stays with us for the full show, and we will be right back.

While you have this quick break, go subscribe to The Nerve, wherever you get your podcast, and on YouTube, just type in the nerve, Maureen Callahan, it'll come right up.

You'll thank us both.

It's wonderful.

Check it out.

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Here with me today, Maureen Callahan.

She's host of The Nerve with Maureen Callahan.

You can go to thenerveshow.com for all the links, giving you exactly where you should subscribe so you never miss a moment moment of the nerve.

And because God, sorry,

looking at Twitter and I'll tell you why, because God is a fair God, just got the news that Kamala Harris is going to go on tour to promote her book, 107 Days on Tour this fall.

I don't know what I've done to deserve this, but this is a lovely gift to those of us in the news.

who've missed Kamala Harris and her inanity and look forward to celebrating her tour, though perhaps not in the way she anticipates.

Steve Krakauer, how is that going to help your pitch to getting her on the show?

Steve says we're going to point out that a hate read counts just as much as a love read.

Jake Tapper sold a lot of books when he came on this show, and so too will you, Kamala Harris.

I promise you.

Maybe not for the reasons you want, but the point is, you need money.

And we'll help you make it by selling your book right here.

Okay, moving on from Kamala Harris, because that is just too juicy.

You, okay, wait, wait.

Before we get to, and just like that, there's a lot of other stuff we have to get to.

Where are we going to start?

The Kennedys.

You literally wrote the book on the Kennedys.

Ask Not.

And it's a great book, and it's such a fun, quick read.

Every single character is more interesting than the next.

Some of the most interesting Kennedys were ones I didn't even really know much about, like Kit Kennedy, who was like one of the forgotten Kennedys.

But in there, we cover JFK Jr.

quite a bit, and there are just alarming stories about him and his bride, Carolyn Bissett.

And now all of it's being rewritten by CNN, Maureen, which is dropping this, quote, documentary called The American Prince.

And I think that's the name of it.

And you have been pointing out that this sounds like it's going to be a complete work of fiction, but once again, CNN will call it a documentary and people will believe it.

So what about it do you believe is a lie?

All of it, except for his name, you know?

So it's three parts.

This is how CNN is going to try to like get their ratings back up.

George Clooney is, you know, yesterday's news.

So let's let's exhume the body or what remained of the body of JFK Jr.

And then let's get people who like they're talking heads on this thing who know nothing and had no connection to JFK Jr.

or Carolyn Bissette or any of the Kennedys who are sitting there opining as if they're experts.

So it's a total F you to the viewing audience.

And then you have like my favorite Kennedy adjacent person of all time.

We did a whole segment on Carol Radzwell.

I heard this.

And is she the daughter-in-law?

of, is it Lee Radzwell who was Jackie's sister, right?

She was Jackie's sister.

and she married this Radzwell, and she had this daughter.

So this daughter is a niece to Jackie Kennedy.

So, yes, Carol was married to Anthony Radziwell, Lee's son.

So not even a blood niece.

She's a married-in niece.

She married in.

She married into the Bouvier side, okay?

There's no Kennedy blood in the Radzowill bloodline.

And Carol, I think,

from all of my reporting on John and Carolyn, these two were masters at making people feel they were closer to them than they really were.

So

Carol Radzewill, late of Real Housewives of New York,

has been going around town since they died saying, Carolyn was my best friend.

We were like sisters.

I don't know if you know, but John was my cousin.

through marriage.

John, you may have heard of him.

John Kennedy Jr.

I mean, you die.

You die.

And then we aired this.

She did this.

This is, so this is the esteem, the very serious regard with which Carol Radzewill holds these legacies.

And she's their self-appointed torchbearer.

Do you remember this kid?

Tyler Henry, who had a show on the e-network called Hollywood Medium?

And

so Carol went on Tyler's show where Tyler pretends just to be a hick.

I mean, he may have his own show in which he's doing readings for celebrities.

And

his way of buying time with them, like his branding is he takes a pen and a pad of paper and he scribbles.

That's the spirit coming through.

So he's scribbling while Carol's in this like well-appointed townhouse, you know, and he's going, I have no idea who you are.

I have no idea who your loved ones are, but you know what's coming through to me?

A young woman who died tragically.

Oh, you don't say?

You don't say?

Like the woman whose death made global headlines.

It's like, and it's Carol taking it all so seriously.

And you just, it's to die.

But so- Okay, we got to play a clip of this gal.

We got to, we got to let the audience see who, who this gal is.

Let's do Sat 3 because I know what she says here isn't true.

It's a very short clip.

Sat three.

Didn't play the game.

She didn't really suck up to anyone.

No one in his family.

She was just like, hi.

Carolyn Bissett did not suck it up to anybody.

And I know from our previous discussions in your book, that's a lie.

Carolyn Bissette Kennedy was dying to add that Kennedy to her name.

She had a, she studied John and his life like with the fervor of a Talmudic scholar.

You know, she had that copy of 1988 Sexiest Man Alive people cover like stashed under her sink.

She really, really wanted it.

She worked hard at making it seem like she didn't want it.

And he

terribly, but she sort of mastered the art of like, I don't care that much.

But she behind the scenes, I mean, I detail it in the book.

She was doing everything she could to get in front of this guy and land him and keep him.

And then she got him and she was like, I don't want this.

This is awful.

Even like an image makeover that she, she wasn't like this effortlessly chic, elegant person before she realized she might have the chance to date him.

No, she really went about, like, one of her friends told me that Carolyn hated exercise, hated it, and that she would hide that she went to this ballet bar class uptown.

She was secretly doing it, and she was like doing everything she could to like cut like 20 pounds of weight.

And then the hair went like super white platinum.

And then we started dressing exclusively in like Japanese designers, like very avant-garde and severe.

And then it was like the red lip with like no other make, you know, it was like a very calculated attempt to make herself into a future first lady befitting the bride of JFK Jr.

It was all architected.

So now none of that will be in the CNN documentary because they feel like they're just going to do American Prince and Princess.

This is royalty.

They're Kennedys.

Obviously Democrats.

We will not be getting similar treatment for Ivanka Trump or Melania Trump.

And you've got this Carol Radzwell who's, I mean, all you had to say was was real housewife alum to know exactly what we're dealing with here, who's running around in this documentary and elsewhere trying to pretend like she's the expert.

Meanwhile, everything she's saying totally contradicts with what you've reported based on people who actually spent a lot of time with these two.

Yeah, I have to wonder what Carolyn's really close friends think of this one running her mouth at any given opportunity.

And I'm very, I'm going to be watching the final episode this weekend with a very, very surgical eye because they're going to cover the deaths.

And they're going to cover.

And I think this is, this, I think, transcends pop culture.

I think this is a very sick, sick thing for the body politic in America.

And it's the reason why people distrust mainstream legacy news outlets.

On the nerve on Tuesday, we're going to be talking about

what those deaths really looked like.

People don't talk about that.

The

carnage at the bottom of that ocean that he caused caused deliberately.

This wasn't a tragic accident.

This isn't the stuff of Zeus striking down Icarus who flew too close to the sun.

This was

done by a guy with a death wish that is well chronicled and not just a death wish for himself.

But as I wrote about in the book, he had a longtime girlfriend who he almost killed, I'm going to say at least three times, at least three times.

Yeah, no, you write about the, I remember the kayaking incident where she had like a broken leg.

She really wasn't supposed to go out in the kayak, but they went anyway.

And then they had a hideous accident that seriously injured her.

And with the plane crash, too,

he had been warned not to go.

Experienced pilots who were at the airport had decided not to take their planes up that day.

He knew he didn't have the experience.

He did it anyway with his bride, with his bride's sister, because truly he had some sort of a death wish.

He had some sort of a sickness that continued to push him to do deeply reckless things.

Yeah, absolutely.

I mean, not only that, here's what we never hear about.

And it boggles my mind because if you're just, if you're in journalism and you're interested in a story and a good story, you would never excise a detail such as this.

That night before he crashed that plane into the bottom of the Atlantic Ocean, en route, he nearly smashed into a packed American Airlines commercial jetliner on his descent to, ironically, Kennedy Airport.

And there were 226 souls on that plane.

And if it were not for the quick thinking of those experienced commercial pilots, he would have slammed into that plane and killed hundreds of people.

But we're still going to pretend he's America's prince.

Okay.

Okay.

Yes.

And like the rewriting of his career as a quote journalist, you know, how they're going to have, I guess, whatever, we're going to revisit George as one of the greatest creations ever.

And, you know, you've, I know you've pointed out, like, he wasn't.

It wasn't.

He had blinders on when it came to anything Kennedy.

And let's face it, this being America, Kennedy relations touch a lot of our modern day stories.

And certainly when he was running this magazine that he launched.

The weird thing to me, so there are two fascinating things to me.

One is, so they're lionizing him as this like visionary.

We saw the blending of pop, okay, whatever.

MTV beat him to it.

MTV was covering Bill Clinton in 92, choose or lose.

That was the real beginning of politics and pop culture.

But he refused to cover the Clinton Lewinsky trial, or scandal rather.

Excuse me.

He refused to cover that because he felt it was too,

it just struck a nerve with him because his father had his own issues with what.

So like that's not.

This is also an ask-not the His father's affair with a pre-teen intern in his marital bed with Jackie in the White House.

Yeah, he got her drunk before she was a virgin, before she knew it.

He was on top of her.

He was inside of her.

To this day, she doesn't know how to describe it.

I describe it as a rape.

I would describe that as a rape.

She was 15 or 16.

She was very young.

She was a White House intern that he had plucked.

He plucked her.

And that's just one example, one example.

So we're not going to touch that.

And in fact, John writes, so again, like, we're going to lionize this guy all day long.

He writes a note to President Clinton.

Mind you, he has no memory of his father, of his years in the White House.

He was two going on three when his father was assassinated.

His letter in some substance says, Dear Mr.

President, please don't get down about what's happening to you.

Vis-a-vis the rumor that Lewinsky had orally serviced Bill under the White House desk, which had been JFK's resolute desk.

He goes on to say, I have been under that desk, and

there's hardly room for a two-year-old, let alone a grown woman, who he then turned to one of his colleagues at George and called a fat ass.

Lovely, lovely.

And then

puts Drew Barrymore on the cover, dressed as Marilyn Monroe, the night Marilyn sang happy birthday, Mr.

President, to his father in 62, basically announcing to the world they they were having this extremely hot sexual affair, his mother's greatest public humiliation, and he did it to, what, sell copies of his failing magazine?

This guy, are you kidding me?

Yeah.

Oh my God, that was an iconic moment with Marilyn and the president.

And his response after she sang that song in that sultry way was so funny.

I remember it was like, thank you for that wholesome rendition of

happy birthday.

Okay, everybody now knows what's happening between me and and Marilyn.

Okay, let's keep going because there's a lot to get through.

I'm going to get to the biggest loser in a second, but we've got to stay, start with Jennifer Anniston.

So Jennifer Anniston is in the news.

She's being profiled.

Is it Vanity Fair profiling her, Maureen?

Who is it?

Vanity Fair, you got it.

Cover story.

Okay, it's Vanity Fair cover story with Jennifer Anniston.

And Jennifer Aniston, you pointed this out on The Nerve.

It's called Zen and the Art of Being Jennifer Anniston.

They call her exquisitely maintained, 56-year-old, a monument to self-care.

Go on about how Gwyneth Paltrow and she are super close friends.

They trade wellness intel.

And there's a lot that jumps out at me in this.

And I'll just tell you a couple things, and then we'll get your reaction.

She has weekly dinners with Jimmy Kimmel.

Jimmy Kimmel.

Now, who could forget Jennifer Anniston's attack on JD Vance during the run-up to the November 2024 election for his childless cat ladies comment?

And she acted like the victim.

How could you?

And also, you're trying to take IVF away, which was a lie too.

And I hope your daughter never needs IVF care since you kind of Cretans on the right want to take it away.

So she's a big woman's rights supporter, Maureen.

Like she never misses a chance.

Jimmy Kimmel, who literally starred in the man show, which for years was doing segments like this one with the ladies.

Watch.

This is just a video.

For the listening audience, it's literally women in bikinis on trampolines, jumping up, doing like the leg move where they go and splits in the air and the camera is underneath them.

We can see up the dresses.

And yeah, these are very fit ladies.

And this is the most mild of what you could get on

the

man show.

I got to say, none of which offends me.

There's a place for this kind of thing.

Like, that's fine.

But these are not my rules.

These are the left's rules that you're not allowed to do this or you're forever more a sexist who should be canceled.

That's the man she's having weekly dinners with, Jimmy Kimmel.

And on top of that,

who's another person who's usually there is Jason Bateman and his wife, Amanda.

And this weird exchange happens in the Japanity Fair piece in which they say Anison, Anniston, is in tune with her friend's kids, too.

Quote: She almost makes us parents look bad because she's so incredibly attentive and consistent with her curiosity and warmth, says Jason Bateman, referring to Anniston's friendship with his two daughters, who are 18 and 13.

She's the first one to call or text about big dates in the girls' lives.

She has questions about boyfriends.

Asked if she would qualify as an aunt, Jason Bateman replies, Aunts you might not see all the time.

She's almost closer to a co-mom with Amanda.

What in the actual F?

If Doug ever told Vanity Fair that I had a co-mom in my motherhood, I would probably punch him hard in the gut and say, How could you have been so stupid and clueless and cruel?

That is quite the comment that he's making about his own wife in an effort to lick the blessed boot of Jennifer Anniston, who this now brings me to your reaction,

is

still complaining about her press coverage.

Notwithstanding the fawning, she's exquisitely maintained and she parties with Jimmy Kimmel and she's like a co-mom.

She's that attentive a friend.

She's still whining.

And you get back to the ultimate whine that we heard from her back in 2005.

You take it from here.

So this, I just, God, the Jennifer Aniston thing.

First of all, she's out in the media promoting her upcoming third or fourth season of The Morning Show on Apple TV, which I hate.

I hate it.

Hate.

Cannot stand it.

Thank you.

That could have been such a great show.

That could have been a really juicy, meaty, substantial show.

Instead, it's terrible.

But in it, she plays what she thinks is a very serious journalist.

She's not.

I got news for you, Jen.

She's not.

And she's in the pages of Vanity Fair on the cover

and this massive spread, spread, which is very Megan Markle adjacent, right?

Like we're in fall gowns doing gardening and getting dirt under our nails.

Okay.

Oh boy, don't get us started.

Right?

Season two.

Anyway, back to Jen.

So she goes, she says, you know,

she's asked about the height of the Brad Angie Jen love triangle and the subsequent fallout.

And she says, you know,

I just don't understand it.

And I guess if people didn't have their little soap operas to occupy their tiny minds, we gave them stuff in the tabloids.

And that to me is just such an F you

to

American audiences who have followed this woman and loved her and taken up for her and made her wealthy and famous beyond her wildest dreams and frankly beyond her limited talents.

Truly, you know, we're not talking Elizabeth Taylor over here in terms of look.

Looks like we're not talking Middle Street over here in terms of acting talent.

She lucked into the greatest pot of gold one could luck into.

Just shut up and be grateful.

That's it.

Yes.

Yes.

Here's the exact quote.

This is her recalling the 2005 interview she gave to Vanity Fair.

So, you know, here we are 20 years later.

It was the first interview she gave after news of the divorce broke.

And she says in this current episode, issue, it was such juicy reading for people.

If they didn't have their soap operas, they had their tabloids.

And of the media frenzy, she says, it's a shame that it it had to happen, but it happened.

And boy, did I take it personally.

They were sort of building us up and then tearing you down, she says, before comparing herself to a pinata.

They think you signed up for it, so you take it.

But we really didn't sign up for that.

You didn't?

How did she not sign up for that?

She was on the cover of Vanity Fair without her pants on and

inside the spread without her pants on.

And she was often without her pants on in the photo shoots she's done over the years and has coveted attention and publicity with the best of them, Maureen.

You did sign up for it.

This is America.

You take the good with the bad when you willingly become a public figure.

100%.

And her marriage to Brad Pitt, it's the same when Carolyn Bassett was like, I didn't realize marrying JFK Jr.

meant I'd be a media target.

Hello.

Yes, you did.

You did.

Same with Jen Aniston.

You don't want that attention.

Don't marry Brad Pitt, biggest movie star on the planet, who, by the way, leveled her up to the film career she was so desperate for when she was on Friends.

Remember Trump.

And Megan Markle, by the way, same exact thing.

Same thing.

You know, it's just, it's so rich to me.

And then she's bitching about the media while she's promoting a show in which she plays a journalist on a morning show.

So we're media, media, media.

You know, you can't have it every way you want it.

You just can't.

The nerve of this woman to actually get that out there and say, oh, the people, like they had their, if they didn't have their soap operas, they had their tabloids.

Okay.

So you are the one who put yourself in the public eye and cultivated and

chased after this kind of attention.

No one would be talking about you if you hadn't put yourself in the public eye, become an actress.

And on top of that, because there are actors out there who don't run around coveting extra attention beyond their acting,

but she did.

She was in all the magazines.

She gave tons of interviews and did tons of magazine spreads, but gets upset when the media coverage goes beyond what she's authorized.

That's not the way it works.

Just be grateful that there's interest.

That interest is why you have several multi-million dollar homes and cars and this luxury wardrobe and why you keep getting cast in these movies.

So shut the fuck up.

No one wants to hear your complaints about how people like their tabloids and their soap operas.

You're damn lucky they do.

That's why they find you mildly interesting.

Yes, and the hypocrisy to complain about it, number one, to your point, Julia Roberts, when do you see her?

When she's not shooting a movie, you don't see her anywhere.

She's way more famous and beautiful than you, Jennifer Anniston.

Secondly, she talked recently.

I don't know if it was in the Vanity Fair piece or elsewhere, but that when, so the whole Brad Angie, you know, media frenzy, right?

She's offered, her next role that she's offered is a movie called The Breakup.

with Vince Vaughan.

Oh, yeah.

What she did.

A long time couple breaking up, and it was a comedy.

And she said her agent was a little bit wary because he thought, oh, this might be too much of a tender spot.

But she thought, no, this is the next thing I do.

And she knew exactly what she was doing.

She knew by doing a film like that, she was going to be extending this narrative of her as the jilted woman who, by the way, if you don't want to participate in tabloid media, don't pose pantsless on the cover of Vanity Fair, spilling your guts about how Brad and Angie wronged you while looking like you're proving you're still ultra effable.

You cannot like, this explains the boyfriend.

This

lack of logic explains the boyfriend.

The boyfriend's okay, we're doing him next, but I want to say something about Julia Roberts.

So yes, a thousand times yes.

And I'm not even particularly a Julia Roberts fan, but I respect how she's handled her private life as a mega star by any measure.

Not only does she not suddenly get photographed at Starbucks like J-Lo manages to make happen everywhere she goes.

Oh, J-Lo's in Italy.

Oh, J-Lo's in Paris.

Oh, J-Lo's, she's on a yacht.

We've never not seen a vacation she's taken.

Gee, how does that happen?

And, but Julia Roberts, I remember reading a story about her.

She's the opposite of like a Kim Kardashian.

Somebody once got a photo of her kid and she was in her car with her kid, like dropping her kid off at school.

And Julia Roberts got out of her car, stopped her car, got out of her car, went over to the car of the paparazzo who was taking the photograph and knocked on the window and said do not publish that that's my child i have not made my my child a public figure it gave him you know read him the riot act and the guy did not publish the photo respect i have to say this is i've done the same with my kids and there are

not to compare myself to julia roberts so she's truly a megastar but i'm just saying there's a reason you've never seen julia roberts kids in photos she makes sure that you know she doesn't use them to propel her own career so while she's not my personal favorite i respect all of that and there's a way of being a megastar without cultivating that kind of attention jennifer anderson could take a lesson okay let's talk about the boyfriend

so who is this guy he's a hypnotist and wellness guru

he's a professional hypnotist he's not just any hypnotist

Excuse me.

I'm sorry to correct you.

No, his name is Jim Curtis.

He's this like good-looking guy who's been bouncing around town forever.

And she started liking his stuff on Instagram.

And he wrote, he's written several books.

I ordered one off Amazon.

And I wish I had it with me.

It's called Shift, Quantum Manifestations for like altering your consciousness.

And it's like a tiny little pamphlet of a book that has like a bunch of QR codes in it.

So you can go link to his app and put money in his pocket.

Sure.

And it's like work.

It's like inanities.

Like,

here's a page with like tons of lines.

There's a lot of white space in the book and a lot of really big font.

Write down,

change the word money to energy, and then write down how you think of money as energy.

It's just like none of it makes any energy.

Wait, we pulled a couple of thoughts from the nerve.

So I was driving my car listening to this.

I was laughing so hard, Maureen.

These are great finds by you.

This is why everyone should be watching and listening to The Nerve.

And

here's a sample of Jen's new Guy Pal.

Repeat after me.

I don't force.

I flow.

I am a magnet for abundance and love.

Repeat after me.

My dreams are already on their way to me.

I am a magnet and confident in my ability to receive.

Repeat after me.

I am resilient.

capable, and ready to face whatever comes my way.

I release fear and step forward with confidence and trust.

Repeat after me.

Love comes easily to me because I am love,

I am loving, and I am lovable.

It's giving like serious Stuart smiley vibes.

Serious vibes, Maureen.

What inanity.

Truly, like, I am a magnet.

I am resilient.

I flow.

I flow.

That's how he got Jennifer Anderson.

Just saying he doesn't force.

He flows, Mo.

My favorite part of this, too, is that

as to Jennifer Anniston's besties, Jimmy Kimmel and Jason Bateman,

whatever you can say about them, they're not total idiots.

Like Jason Bateman is one of the most popular podcasts going.

Jimmy Kimmel hosts all manner of people and converses with them extemporaneously.

They got to sit at the weekly dinners at Jennifer Anniston's and listen to this asshole go on and on about manifesting shit.

You know, know, they're dying.

They're like texting each other under the table, like, you know, making fun of.

Oh my God.

Whenever I see something like this, though, I've learned this.

This is like one of those things you learn, a piece of wisdom, if you will, over the course of your life.

The people who are super into this stuff are the most unhappy people.

Like that's they are the last people you should be taking advice from.

Truly, you should be taking advice from people who are busy and have thriving lives.

They may be tough to get it from because they're busy and have thriving lives.

But the last person you want to take advice from is somebody who's in the advice giving business on talking about flow.

I'm sorry, I feel like Mel Robbins is in that group.

This guy's in that group.

They just sit around and try to think up profundities.

And why do they do that?

Generally, it's because they're depressed and they have to think of something to make themselves feel better.

And this is not the person you should turn to for making your life better.

I truly, I learned this the hard way.

It's so true.

And the other thing that I always find fascinating, Mel Robbins was coming out of a major depression when she struck on this self-help stuff.

She was in a ton of debt, like a ton of debt.

I don't even know how she racked up that amount of debt.

Shock.

She said she was drinking excessively.

You know, like, I'm going to listen to this woman who just came up, you know.

Right.

These are not people who have extensive education in, say, philosophy.

great minds, great literature, sociology.

You know, I don't know where they're,

their credentials are nil.

They're zero.

And this guy.

No, if the credentials are all in the self-help field, run,

run.

That's a problem, right?

It's not the same as taking advice from somebody who's actually accomplished something in the real world and then says, hey, this is something I've learned, take it or leave it.

People like this who are talking about flow are a problem.

It's just like, it's a glaring, I am a depressant.

I am unhappy.

I haven't been able to solve it.

And I'd like to talk to all of those of you who would like to be as unhappy as I am.

Truly.

And I also believe that none of this shit helps.

It actually doesn't help.

You should flush those books, tear those books up, throw them out the window, go for a run, get out in the sun, do something uplifting that will take your mind off of your problems and stop taking lectures on flow from hairy men.

Yes.

And if you really are suffering from clinical depression or something that's treatment resistant, see a physician.

See a psychiatrist who can actually help you with that.

This is not the answer.

These people are charlatans.

Here's my Venmo.

That should be a red flag.

That's a problem.

Okay, so that's Jennifer and good luck to her.

I want to talk about the biggest loser because there's a Netflix documentary out about this hugely popular show.

Maureen actually has a direct connection to this story and we'll play you some sound bites and we will go there right after this quick, quick break.

Maureen stays with us for the show.

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Welcome back to the Megan Kelly Show.

Here with me today, Maureen Callahan, host of The Nerve with Maureen Callahan.

I want to tell you that,

just a programming note, today in the California courtroom, Eric Menendez is making the push to be, or I guess proceeding, to be paroled early.

And tomorrow, Lyle Menendez will make the same push.

Our friends over at MK True Crime include Mark Garragos, who's representing the Menendez brothers.

They're going to have a special episode tonight, which will drop tomorrow morning.

So go ahead and sign up for MK True Crime so you can hear all the coverage of whether these two guys are going to be released early from prison.

Maureen is against it.

If I'm talking to Marsha Clark, I'm against it.

If I'm talking to Garagos, he softens me up.

So

it's tough.

I totally see your point.

It was like, this is like Justice by Kim Kardashian, like a stupid, made-up Ryan Murphy Murphy documentary, winds up getting two kids out of prison, or they're not kids anymore, after a brutal murder where they were absolutely just completely awful.

I mean,

the torture they put their parents through.

But the other side is they've served for a long time.

And I don't know if it, like, do two people kill their kids or kill their parents if like their parents aren't totally awful?

Like, I believe Jose Menendez did molest them.

And Kitty menendez i don't know she probably looked the other way i get i can see both sides maureen what do you think

i was thinking about this again this morning and what i can't get past are the following this was very premeditated i believe they purchased the weapons uh two weeks before

they cooked up their alibi

they

were of age.

They could have left the house.

They could have pressed charges against the father or just had nothing to do with him.

They said that they killed the mother because she was an eyewitness to the murder and she just had to go.

That was their stated reason.

I mean, I remember, I reread a lot of the Dominic Dunn coverage of this as well.

They said that night when the police came to investigate that they were both shocked that they weren't arrested that night, that there was so much physical evidence.

When the medical examiner went over to

Jose Menendez's body, his brain fell out of his skull.

The mother had been shot in the face, unrecognizable.

So, this is my real thing, too.

If I am a victim of sexual violence at the hands of a parent, and I feel the only way I can get rid of this is to kill said parent,

but I'm not in my soul and my heart a killer, I think that would torment me.

I think I would be out of my mind.

And these two went shopping and kept telling lies.

And I don't think that they felt remorse at all.

I think this was a planned crime.

It wasn't

a hair trigger.

I feel my physical safety is in mortal danger.

It wasn't any of that.

And they continue to break the rules all the time in prison, which to me says those are criminal minds.

They're criminal minds.

So I'm against it.

I think it's probably going to happen, but we'll follow it.

And Mark Erigos will be on it along with our other legal panel tonight.

So tune in.

Go ahead and download MK True Crime and you will hear their thoughts.

And he actually knows them and represents them.

So you'll get first-hand analysis of it.

Okay, let's talk about the biggest loser.

There's a Netflix documentary on the biggest loser.

A series I have to admit I never watched.

I never did watch.

Here's some of the trailer for the Netflix show.

I think it's SOT6.

Whoever loses the most weight wins $250,000.

More than 10 million people watched the finale.

It was huge.

To see us in a gym yelling, screaming, that's good TV.

This is what America thinks is healthy and safe.

Being seen as a person and not just a body is much rarer for fat people.

Well, we're big.

Biggest loser was the best thing that ever happened to us.

We were not looking for people who were overweight and happy.

I'm a secret eater.

We were looking for people who were overweight and unhappy.

Maybe it would fix my marriage.

Maybe it would fix me.

I'll do anything to be on your show.

The biggest loser.

They were really reinforcing the stereotypes.

People like making fun of fat people.

And producers loved that.

They were like, we want them to puke.

We want the madness of it all.

Okay,

so your thoughts on this documentary and what comes out in it, which is, it's got the participation of an executive producer, of the star, a couple of the stars there, not Jillian Michaels.

And they are pretty open about what went on on the set.

Your thoughts on it, though?

This is personal for me.

And we're going to do it.

We're going to address it on the mini on Saturday of The Nerve.

I wrote the first big expose of what really went on on the biggest loser.

And trust me when I tell you, that expose caused so much alarm over at NBC, they wound up canceling the show.

Wow.

And

this documentary, even the score of it is sort of like jaunty and like, this is a piece of entertainment.

People's lives were placed in.

serious serious danger with the stuff they were pulling this wasn't just like we're doing some pranks like like fear factor style.

This was like people went to the hospital.

And we're going to talk about even what goes on when you're selected as what they called, they called themselves losers, which the production always tried to spin as like, that's a positive thing.

But I always found it really poignant because they were making fun of these people from the beginning.

And they would get flown to LA and they would be put in these hotel rooms and their phones would be taken from them and they would be isolated for days.

And, you know, there was at least one contestant who told me they got a message that a very close relative was very, very sick in the hospital.

It was touch and go.

And they wanted to go home.

And the producer said, feel free to leave, but there's like 10 people behind you who are going to take your slot.

It was beyond.

I think evil.

And to watch these producers use this doc to try to spin it as a net positive that they did for attitudes towards obesity and helping people lose weight.

By the way, my follow-up to that original expose

was called

We're All Fat Again.

And it was that most of the biggest losers who had shed the weight, we're talking dropping hundreds of pounds in the span of weeks, stuff that is medically, completely against all best advice.

They all gained the weight back and then some.

Mm-hmm.

Yes, I know.

And ironically, if they had just waited 10 years, they could have taken Ozempic and not had to go through any of that.

Right?

Like that, there's really no reason to be 400 pounds in today's day and age.

There actually is this magic shot that is for people that look like that so that they can get well on a more controlled basis at least.

But I don't like when I watched the series, because I knew we were going to be discussing it, I put it on this morning on my on my Netflix and was sort of running around doing my errands watching it.

And my takeaway was

Some people really were hurt.

Like there was one woman who actually collapsed and had to be taken away by Medivac and she said she died and like was brought back.

And it, so it does sound like things got really out of control and they didn't always listen to the medical advice that was given.

But I also was like, these people signed up for it.

I like, you know, reality show stars.

It's like, I, I, I'm of two minds.

It's like, I'm now watching all these real housewives sue Bravo and Andy Cohen for like making them look bad and plying them with alcohol.

I'm like, you signed up to be a real housewife.

What did you think was going to happen?

This is so fascinating because this is a thread that we're continuing to follow on the nerve.

And I've been talking to a lot of people, you know, very smart, savvy people.

And one of them said to me something I thought was so profound.

And we don't talk about fame like this in the culture.

This person said,

it's one thing to be addicted to drugs or alcohol.

It's completely something else to be addicted to fame.

And what happens to a lot of these people on reality TV is their brains get rewired and fame is as much of a dopamine hit as any kind of substance could ever be.

With these people too, the people who signed up for the biggest loser, you're getting one bill of goods sold to you by production and then you get behind the scenes and they are, it is a psychological manipulation.

from beginning to end and they say to them they say to they say to one contestant like uh you may not like these methods and you may be collapsing and vomiting and having heart palpitations and thinking you're going to stroke out.

But if you ever lost a hundred pounds on your own, are you losing weight now?

Well, then just, why don't you just stick with us?

You know, and these people suffered medical, like one woman told me she had stress fractures in her feet from what they were making them do.

They were working them out like they were Navy SEALs.

These are obese people who had never really worked out.

Right, it's dangerous.

It's dangerous.

I know.

Reality TV has spun out of control time after time.

And it's always the same formula.

It's always exploitative.

It's just, it makes me uncomfortable to watch.

I'll say something nice about somebody who works for us now.

You know this, but about a month or two ago, we hired Hope Hicks.

And she's the COO of my company now, like the overarching company that oversees everything.

And Hope Hicks is like brilliant, she's very savvy, and she also happens to be stunningly gorgeous.

And unlike most people who you could say that about, has zero interest in seeing her name in print or her face on TV.

You've never met somebody who is so averse to fame, to the spotlight.

She just wants to do her job.

She just wants to be great at whatever she does.

And she does not want the spotlight.

It's so rare.

When you find one of these unicorns, you're like, what is it?

I don't understand it.

Like, we're like, hey, we should announce, you know, that you're coming on board.

She's like, oh, God, let's just put like a small item out there at best, at most, you know, she's hoping she could have had like a cover of of some magazine.

They'd love to talk to her about her life and all so many interesting things about her.

But I respect it, you know.

But you're right.

Like with a civilian who's already struggling with a weight issue or whatever issue gets her on, let's say, Real Housewives,

there is a drug waiting there of attention and clicks and for the dopamine hit of feeling better about yourself for one second as the episode airs or you get a, you know, a blog post that's favorable about you.

And you have to be very centered and strong to like withstand that lure when you realize the thing I'm doing that's getting that for me is bad for me.

So you're raising a good point.

All right, we have to end it on a more fun note because you've also been taking aim at Sarah Jessica Parker and her reboot of Sex in the City, which is called And Just Like That.

And you have been hate-watching this series.

I couldn't tell whether you were happy it ended or sad it ended because you were enjoying the hate watch or you realized it.

I mean, it was such a terrible show.

It had to go.

It was the very annoying woke reboot of a show that was not woke in any way, but now everyone's trans or a lesbian or non-binary or in bed with the terrible Rosie O'Donnell, which was jarring enough.

And you

have been mourning the end of it on the nerf.

Let me play Sat 9D.

Troublemakers.

We gathered to the veil.

Actually, it's a celebration.

A celebration of bad art that we're all going to be freed from immediately.

It's a true nerve ending.

The cultural abomination that is, and just like that, has been taken out back and shot finally.

For our proceedings today, I have come with the smallest bouquet of dried flowers, which I think is

our sprightly 900-year-old heroine.

And I'm going to light an immemorium candle from our remaining fucks

matchbook.

Safety first.

Well, this light is the metaphor for this show, right?

It's not lighting properly.

Then you went out there.

I got to show this to the audience.

Sarah Jessica

Parker wore this ridiculous hat on her show.

And you spoofed this.

Will you spoof this with your

hat?

I don't know which one is more ridiculous, but it's amazing that they thought she's so stylish, we can literally put like a pizza parlor hat on her head, like a picnic basket

cloth on her head and call it fashion.

So you did what you do, which is great.

and calling out absurdity when you see it.

So your thoughts on the demise of the show and why it happened rather quickly.

First, may I say, I do believe that the spoofs that you and I have done have truly unleashed an inner actress that I did not know was in there.

I believe so, too.

Right?

It's been so much fun.

I don't know what I'm going to do now that this show is over.

Like,

where will I find my artistic expression?

I don't know.

Well, there's the Kamala Harris tour.

Oh, yes.

Yes.

And Megan Markle part two, of course.

But I don't know if I'm happy or sad.

You know what I really, really, really think was one of the death knells when Cynthia Nixon went on her social media on her boat in Montauk or a boat in Montauk with her red MAGA cap that said make abortion great again.

I think that was it.

They were done.

It was awful.

It was like nobody wanted a

woke reboot of this series at all, but they leaned so far into it.

And now, Maureen, Sarah Jessica Parker is out there saying, there's a million ways to to end this that are easy and familiar and fun but feel exploitative to us we felt this was the honorable thing to do because they said why end the show now in an interview with the New York Times and she said because that's where the story ended and this is a lie she did not want the show to be canceled she did not want to be um was worried she wasn't worried about being exploitative she would have loved to have been exploitative of the audience and the attention she was getting but they pulled the plug So, is this or is this not true?

What she's saying, which is she chose to end it because that's where the story ended.

We could have kept it going, but this was the honorable thing to do.

First of all, I just, she's so precious.

Like, you never read an interview with her where she's just lighthearted and funny and can like laugh at something, let alone herself.

So, it's always, it's becoming increasingly

uncomfortable and insufferable to listen to her.

Radar Online reported in the immediate aftermath of the announcement that, and just like that was ending, that Sarah Jessica Parker, who I believe was the source for this story, because they referred to her as an icon and, you know, all this stuff.

That she was furious, that she was fuming and seething.

The quote was, after all the money, I've made them.

And that she was trying to take this and shop it around to Amazon or Netflix.

How she has the IP, this is HBOs, I don't know, but it goes to show you the desperation, the disbelief.

And then she went on to say in that New York Times, what I call an exit interview, when she was asked, what do you say to the longtime fans of Sex in the City who followed you doing just like that and were heartbroken by what you guys did to the characters and hate watch the show?

What do you say to their complaints about quality control?

And she said, I guess I don't really care.

Right.

She did.

Literally said, I don't care.

Okay.

That's why you're canceled.

That's why you're canceled.

Enjoy your unemployment.

I don't think anybody's going to hire you anytime soon because you have fused in a body horror epic for the ages with this most terrible character of Carrie Bradshaw.

Yes.

I was looking at the ratings for this show.

It was averaging about $500,000, not dollars, 500,000 viewers per episode.

which is unbelievable to me.

That is nothing.

Like, of course, she's canceled.

We beat that by a lot every day here on The Megan Kelly Show, and we probably have 1 20th the budget.

If that, I mean, our show is very cheap to produce.

I pay for my staff, but like, we don't have all the wardrobe and all the other expenses on set locations and all the, whatever.

I've got a Robocam sitting in front of me.

I don't even have a live photographer here with me.

My point is, Of course, you're going to get canceled.

This is not economical.

Why would HBO keep something that's only earning half a million in audience each episode?

That's a joke, Maureen.

The nerve is easily closing in on that.

And you've been around for a few months.

What did she think was going to happen?

It's so wild too, you know,

there's the economic part of it, which is just, you know, obvious why HBO would cancel it, but it was also a laughing stock.

HBO is a brand that considers itself like the Tiffany network of premium cable, right?

Like that's where they want top talent to come and create television that you can't find anywhere else.

And that is a huge, that it's a crime scene.

It's like a, it's a, it's a homicide over at what they were doing over and just like that.

And then Michael Patrick King, the showrunner, who I believe is a misogynistic gay man.

I share your belief.

Thank you.

He went and gave an exit interview to the Hollywood Reporter in which he said, you know, we could have kept going as long as we wanted because the numbers were great.

Is that great?

What else is HBO getting with his other shows?

If that's great, I mean, I'd hate to see piss pork.

Is it?

And then the final episode is such an F you to the viewers who really did try to stick it out.

They showed, there is no reason to show this.

They showed an open toilet with human waste inside.

And it was basically, it was not a none too subtle, this is what we think of you at HBO and all of you viewers who didn't get what we were doing over here as the highest form of art.

Get out.

It's amazing that they didn't get what was happening in the culture.

They just didn't get that we're done with woke.

Even the normie Democrats are done with woke.

The last thing they want to see is fucking Rosie O'Donnell with her weird cold sores showing up in bed with Cynthia Nixon.

Like these are leftist, far-leftist heroines who are loathed by everyone on the right.

It's like saying,

Do we have that clip?

I think we might have pulled that clip.

Okay, here it is.

Here it is.

You

are amazing.

Oh, I have never experienced anything like that.

Oh, God.

This is a nice way to wake up.

Oh, you are really,

really something.

I never dreamed in my first time.

It could be both those things.

First time?

Okay.

I mean, truly, Maureen, this is such a middle finger to the right half of the country.

It had to be intentional.

Think of it.

When you think of far-left activists who are, you know, woke Hollywood types, can you name two more to the left than those two?

So they bring back the series, they wokeify it, they bring in all the proper LGBTQ rainbow coalition, you know,

actors.

They make people non-binary who weren't, you know, they excise Samantha, who was like the most fun and least woke one.

She doesn't even get a role.

And then on top of it, they keep zeroing in on lesbian storylines that involve Cynthia Nixon and Rosie O'Donnell.

F them.

This really was a huge, the whole show is a middle finger to the right half of the country.

It really was.

i mean nobody wanted to see that and i remember watching that episode in real time and they're they're sort of building up to this like moment between rosie oh and cynthia nixon and literally like i think i was not alone with like my hand in front of my face like please don't please don't do this to us please do more of these two in bed and they did it they did it and um the the other thing that i thought was particularly reprehensible and yet another example of cynthia nixon forcing her personal politics and and complete amorality into the show was towards the end of this season, which they were truly opening up storylines and not shutting them down and tying them up.

So, again, lying, my opinion, SJP and her showrunner pal.

Cynthia Nixon's son comes home and says, listen,

I got a girl pregnant and, you know, and she's visibly pregnant.

Like she couldn't deny it.

She's visibly pregnant.

And the Cynthia Nixon character says, is she going to keep it?

Pause.

God.

Or give it up for adoption.

So to my mind, there's no interpreting that in any other way as, is she going to have a late-term abortion?

And if not, do you think you could talk her into it?

Yep.

Yes, of course.

Why would we interpret any other way, given the hat that you point out, went completely viral?

And it was so offensive, we thought at first, it must be made up.

This must be Photoshop.

There's no way Cynthia Nixon, who has a career to maintain, would actually ever tweet out a photo of herself wearing a hat that says, make abortion great again.

But she did.

That's how loathsome she's become.

How by the way, she's going to be helping govern New York soon because she's a big mom, Donnie backer, and he's threatening to put her and other people just like her

in his cabinet.

But I don't know, I feel like even the ending of the show, which, you know, spoiler alert for those of you who don't want to hear this,

it has Carrie

wind up alone.

The season opens, the reboot opens with Mr.

Big,

who, when Sex in the City closed out, she was marrying, you know, like, yay, like, I landed the guy I've been lusting after and wanted and loved.

So she was marrying him.

Miranda was with Steve and they had Brady.

Charlotte was married.

Like, everybody was sort of like settling down and finding a partner.

Samantha had the young guy.

Anyway, now they reboot it and they kick it off by killing off Big.

Big is dead.

He's not just like gone or with a divorce he's dead and then she's got this relationship with aiden that's toxic whatever and it ends with her being alone now there's nothing wrong with being alone but it does seem to be like a statement now like all these characters are either gone or non-binary or full lesbo and now totally alone and there's that's total that's my choice that's totally fine although how does she put it like a i'm not alone i'm just not with anybody i don't know how she put it, but like, it does seem to be a, oh, we've revisited the message we sent with that last finale that like marriage is good and creating a family is good.

We've seen the error of our ways.

There's so much here.

You know, I always thought that the Mr.

Big character was written as like the original Toxic Bachelor.

He was based on a real guy,

like a titan of publishing, magazine publishing.

And I always thought when watching the original Sex in the City, he should have been out of the frame by season two, three at the absolute latest.

That guy was never going to marry a Carrie Bradshaw.

He was going to marry a Natasha, who he later would have divorced, having been caught on page six with multiple influencers, one of whom he would have gotten pregnant.

Carrie would have inherited nothing.

And the actual message should have been that Carrie would realize she was in one of the most unhealthy romantic relationships possible.

That this guy, she was a convenience for him.

That's what she was.

And

marrying her off to him, I always thought was such a betrayal of what really could have been a very, very interesting story about, you know, and then the other thing too, this idea that she's some great writer, she's like a hack.

She's a sex writer for the local penny saver, you know?

And so it's fine to wind up, as you said, with a single woman on her own.

I think Mary Tyler Moore ended up that way, you know?

But it wasn't earned.

It wasn't earned because she was just basically flinging herself at any guy in her vicinity or from her past when it clearly wasn't working out.

And it really felt like I just don't buy it because if this were going to go to a season four,

the Carrie character would be newly coupled up with some other guy.

She's just not wired that way.

I will tell you something.

Now, you know, in my 50s,

a more interesting storyline would have been big is still alive and

they've bumped into the following problem, which thank God I do not have in my marriage, but I have seen now in more friendships than I'd like to say,

the man is the one who has the midlife crisis,

not the woman.

The man has the midlife crisis.

It's not like a new sports car that he needs.

It's some woman who says, I'm going to do all the fun things with you.

It's the woman who did not bear his children.

And she may or may not be younger than he is, but she's offering the allure of the 25-year-old him that used to exist now that he's in his mid-50s and he feels like he sacrificed something by taking care of his family and like working a real job that put food on the table.

But now he's bitter and resentful about it and chooses somebody who's, again, may or may not be younger, but offers the promise of like lost youth that he feels robbed of.

It's fucking ridiculous and pathetic.

And I'm sorry to say I keep seeing this as a repeat storyline.

And I'm, that would have been a much more fruitful place to go and to see what a modern day couple would do with kids, by the way.

What would that modern day couple do when that dynamic presents itself, as opposed to, I don't know, maybe Big had to be killed off because he got, didn't Chris Knoth get a Me Too allegation against him at the time?

I'm not sure.

I don't remember, but there's something around him.

That did, yeah, he was me too'd after they decided to kill the the character off.

I remember hearing about this from someone who would know years and years ago that SJP was fuming at Kim Cattrall for refusing to come back for a third version of the film, and that her plot was to kill Big off because that was the only way she could see moving the story ahead.

But because you and I are like smart, creative people, we can come up with any number of storylines that would be even better.

Two off the top of my head, Big, as the financial genius he is, like he's like a Jamie Dimon, is recruited by the Trump administration administration uh to be a top-level cabinet pick and carry becomes a social pariah and or

uh big

is indicted on insider trading and he's guilty of it and he's not only me too but he's potentially around an epstein level cabal yeah there's a million ways you could go with this and give it give me some high stakes That was my one complaint about the third edition of White Lotus is they made that dad who had the Duke family, family, they all went to Duke.

He was in some sort of financial trouble.

He had done some sort of financial shenanigans in the series.

And they show him obsessing over it and constantly on the phone and taking drugs to like get his mind off of it.

Like I actually wanted to know more.

What did he do?

What's going to happen to him?

I feel like financial fraud is actually really interesting.

And everyone wonders, like, on what level is it happening?

How many fortunes are being made around me that

are illicit, you know, that were, that are ill-gotten gains.

It was, you know, fodder they left untouched for artistic reasons, but I would have liked to see a little bit more.

And yeah, they didn't do anything like that.

I mean, they were just determined to prove to the world how sorry they were that they didn't have more black and pride characters in the OG Sex in the City.

And, you know,

Sarah Jessica Parker, this show, I do believe, existed as a monument to her ego because she's living out of her fantasy life.

She's like got almost a billion dollars.

She has a Grand Mercy Park mansion.

She's super fabulous.

She's always being told she's fabulous.

I think the most beautiful member of that cast was the actress Nicole Ari Parker.

She's one of the black women they brought on to sort of, you know, racialize the show.

And they constantly dressed her to look like a clown.

Her storylines were always siloed away from the other three women, most especially Sarah Jessica Parker, who I believe was extremely threatened by this woman.

And she's, she's, the stories are legion about her being a nightmare.

They're legion.

I am team Kim Cottrall all day long.

Did Kim Cottrell come back for any portion of this reboot?

So she was offered, so she came back for a cameo in season two, and here's how they got her.

They said, we'll give you a million dollars for like 30 seconds of screen time.

And she said, I'll take it if you make sure that I am not on the set with any of these women, that I don't have to have any kind of interaction with them.

We shoot at two different cameras.

So they shot her in the back of a limousine.

What am I, 80?

A limousine.

On the phone, on the phone with SJP, but never face to face, never face to face.

No way.

Well, it's also very ironic, right?

Because I think Sarah Jessica Parker prides herself on being like this pro-woman.

You know, she's a modern-day feminist.

It's like, then why would you be partnering with that Michael Patrick King?

And I heard you point this out and I thought it was equally offensive like the ejaculate like getting all over Charlotte in the one episode it's like there are so many demeaning moments to women in his work product like if you're all about that why are you partnering with him why are you allowing scenes like that those things actually really are diminishing

So is it fine if it's patting your pocket?

Or what is the ethical standard?

I actually think that she is, she's a very mean, unhappy woman.

I mean, the character that was forced to make the prat fall into the condom filled with Ejaculate was Charlotte, played by Kristen Davis, who is also considered one of the true beauties of the show.

And I think that SJP gets off on punishing them.

You know, in the final or the first Sex in the City movie, the plot line for Samantha was she was so happy in LA, coupled up with her much younger, gorgeous, successful boyfriend that she allowed herself to gain five pounds.

And when she shows up in New York, the Sarah Jessica Parker character reacts with horror.

And the rumored, reported reason that Kim Cottrall wanted nothing to do with this reboot was the storyline that her character would have had to endure was that Miranda's then-teenage son Brady had begun a sexting relationship with a 50-something Samantha.

And Samantha, to put it delicately, did not have a problem with it.

Wow.

Good for Kim Cattrall.

I mean, even the left-wing press has got headlines out right now on the cancellation of this thing saying the big winner is Kim Cottrall.

The big winner of the reboot is Kim Cottrall for not playing, for not participating and not letting this touch her brand.

She's like, the original Samantha is preserved in her, you know, bright blue tight dresses, and that's how we wish her to remain.

Well, Maureen, I thank you for calling my attention to this.

I'm only sorry I didn't miss it.

I have one other question for you.

Have you watched on, I think it's on Netflix, who knows where we watch it anymore?

Like you get to the home screen of your TV, and now there's a search button, and you type in the name of the movie that's been recommended to you, and it pops up, and then you don't know what app you're watching it on.

But in any event, it is called The Better Sister.

Have you seen this?

The Better Sister.

Okay, I think I've seen the first episode.

Julianne Moore's in it.

No, it's

Jessica Beal and Elizabeth Banks.

Okay, yes, I saw the first.

So tell me, should I be watching this?

So I'm only two episodes in.

It's like a thriller.

And so far, I have to say, very much enjoying it.

Though, of course, it's a little woke.

Jessica Beale's character is like an Anna Wintour, except she's just fierce and leftist.

She's not mean, which is like they took all the fun things out of Anna and made her just into like this woke warrior.

But, so whatever.

People are used to watching wokeness to that extent.

It's mild on TV, but it's about whether she kills her husband, who you find out very early in the series, is dead on the floor one night as she walks home.

And so far, I'm into it.

I like a thriller.

I'm into, like, I love all those old thrillers.

I think like one of the best movies I've ever seen.

I love Jagged Edge.

I love What Lies Beneath.

That's a great one with Michelle Pfeiffer.

Fatal Attraction.

I don't think there's anything better.

I just absolutely loved that movie.

I only wish my kids were old enough for me to show it to them because it's just so gripping.

They're not.

It's going to take another 15 years.

Anyway, I love that crap.

And they've moved on in modern-day Hollywood from the great thriller.

You know, now all we have is fucking Marvel, which is great for the 13-year-old boys.

But not for we women who want a real story.

Yes, I would take a romance too.

I like a romantic comedy.

Same.

I just showed Yardley the movie My Best Friend's Wedding.

Speaking of Julia Roberts, that was fun.

Did she like it?

Diaz.

Yeah, it's like, this isn't going to necessarily win an Oscar, but it's just sort of a fun two hours of like, you know,

romantic comedy.

It's a great rom-com.

It is.

It really is.

And the thriller needs to come back.

It desperately needs to come back.

You're so right.

Every movie you just listed, and I haven't seen Jagged Edge, but you're talking like 1980s.

No, I know I have holes, but like the

thrillers in the 80s were so great.

I don't know what was in

water supply, but you homicidal maniac, like it was, but like really well-groomed, successful homicidal maniacs that presumed innocence the same way.

Oh, my God, one of the greatest movies ever made.

And the series was awesome, too.

It was.

It really was.

I couldn't, I couldn't tell what was going to, who did it, you know?

But it was woke.

Scotch, right?

Because they gave him a, it was a mixed marriage.

The reboot was woke.

Totally, it was.

But I mean, I love Scotchore.

I love anything Scotch arouse has written or touched.

He's totally brilliant.

And his books, too, are a little woke.

He, you know, he hates Republicans and he writes about it in there.

I guess if you love the artist enough, you forgive them.

I mean, personally, I'm not a Stephen King fan because I don't like horror.

I like mild horror.

I don't like the deeply disturbing horror like an it.

I like that, that stuff.

I can't sleep at night, but I recognize the guy as a genius.

I just, he's so anti-Trump.

I can't consume him anymore.

You know what I mean?

It's like, I can't really enjoy his work product because all I think about Robert De Niro is kind of getting there too.

We're like, I just see him and I think about his politics, which I don't want.

But I wanted to mention, I like the movie.

Two other movies that are good back from the 80s, 90s

on the thriller front, Sleeping with the Enemy.

That was also

very good.

And

I've gone through this before on the show, trying to think of the name of this movie.

Alec Baldwin, Nicole Kidman, Malice.

I think it's called Malice.

Yeah.

So Anne Bancroft makes a cameo.

She's great.

I love that one.

Alec Baldwin, before he got ruined in Hollywood, height of his powers.

Nicole Kidman, a young Nicole Kidman, super talented, looked unlike anybody else in Hollywood.

He's like a psychopathic doctor, right?

Yes.

And it's a slow reveal.

Alec Baldwin, I know all about Alec Baldwin and what has happened to him, but he was absolutely gorgeous at the height of his fame and success and did that sort of like controlled, like tortured,

you know, mildly irritated role very well.

Like he was strong in Hunt for Red October and in this movie too, Malice, he was great.

You know, it kind of got like, I don't know why people get like weird and corrupted leader.

Like they let their politics take hold of them and then they let it show.

So you forget, you know, you forget about like

the fact that you're just supposed to be acting and inhabiting a character and making people forget that you're Alec Baldwin.

You know, like you put yourself too out there with your politics and you take that away from people.

But anyway, I loved Alec Baldwin at the height of his fame.

And Billy Baldwin, to his credit, also hates Trump.

But Maureen, he came on this show when he was pushing his initiative against fentanyl.

It was Fentanyl Awareness Day.

And he did a documentary on it.

And, you know, a lot of lefties won't come on this show because they know we're not.

But he did.

And he's still out there constantly attacking righties.

And that's fine.

Like, that's the thing people don't understand.

Like,

you are welcome on this show if you have a divergent view from my own.

As long as you want to say it respectfully and you're not like a complete asshole, I'll hear you out here.

And he seemed to have the same attitude.

So he's a good Baldwin.

And then there's Stephen Baldwin, who's probably our favorite Baldwin of all.

You know, it's so funny you say that because

your show is like, it's anybody who listens knows you're not inviting people in to sort of tear them down.

Like you treat your guests like they're guests in your home, you know, and you're looking to have a conversation, but you're not out to spank them or do a gotcha.

To Alec, you know, what he was so good at.

And this, I relate to this as an Irish American who knows these guys well, controlled rage.

He's so good at controlled rage.

And it's one of the things that made him so funny.

This, I think, is the last best Alec Baldwin we ever got as Jack Donaghy in 30 Rock.

I mean, he would make me laugh out loud.

And he had that.

He's so funny.

He is such comedy.

Like, not all dramatic actors can do comedy and vice versa.

But he was so, it's such a shame what happened to him.

What if you had to recommend something more, like, forget the genre.

It could be any genre, but like

what comes to mind when I say what is the best thing you've ever seen?

Like a movie or a series, a TV show, like what is the best bit of entertainment you've ever taken in on the screen?

I'm going to tell you two, and they're both old movies.

One, Laura with Gene Tierney.

It's a Manhattan Noir.

I think I've seen this movie

25 times, and it's so good, Megan, and it's so absorbing.

Every time I watch it, I always forget who the killer is.

Oh, don't tell me.

I won't.

I don't even remember.

And two, now Voyager with Betty Davis.

Way ahead of its time.

Also, super absorbing.

I think you'll love both.

I think both are way up your alley.

Oh, great.

I love the tip.

I mean, and I will get on the other sister.

The meeting, the better.

We don't know which one is better yet, but I will say for me,

it is the BBC's Pride and Prejudice.

with Colin Firth, Jennifer Eale.

There's no substitute for the six-volume set I have it in VHS.

That's how long ago I've been watching this in the 1990s when I first moved to New York.

And I love it so much.

I love the character development.

I love what Jane Austen did, but I love how the BBC brought it to life and the actors they cast are perfect.

And just the buildup of how these two hate each other in the beginning, but the underlying sexual tension.

And then, you know, how they develop the relationship between them is just so well done.

And if you can spare six hours, you know, they take the time to actually develop it.

There's no shortcuts at all.

You can see how they get past absolute loathing to love in each episode, in each small increment.

And I just love it.

I love anything, Jane Austen, but in particular,

that rendering.

So, okay, there we go.

We've given everybody their assignment for the weekend, and I feel like we've done some good here today.

Agreed.

And Pride and Prejudice is now on my list, and we can reconvene and talk about, you know, our movie experiences.

Yeah, it could be, at some point, it could be a reenactment, Maureen.

I'm just throwing it out there.

We'll see.

My quote's gone up, Megan, since space.

Just know that.

Space.

Whatever it is, you're worth it.

Steve Krackauer.

Thanks.

Get on that.

All right, ladies.

See you soon.

Bye, Megan.

All right, don't forget, go to the nerveshow.com, and that will give you all the places you can subscribe and follow Maureen, and you really should do it.

She's so entertaining, as you can see.

And just she's like her, she is like her literary and book and movie and TV recommendations in that she understands like this sort of, I don't know, cultural interest that we have in all things around us, whether it's the Hollywood set or relationships, crime, whatever.

But like her recommendations, she's elevated.

You know, like the books she's recommended to me are literary.

You know, there's like commercial fiction then there's literary fiction that's what doug reads he's more highbrow because he's very very well read um but maureen she's got this nice slice of the conversation the national conversation that's both and i have to tell you it's very appealing to me um my my staff over on one of the places i used to work used to refer to me as high low

because you know I'll I have this weird life where I'll be potentially hanging out with a president one weekend and then I will be like like riding a big truck you know the next weekend or I'll be doing absolutely nothing and sitting there in my with my top ponytail and my sweatpants eating something bad for me and watching bad TV I like I just that's who I am I'm I'm a normal middle class girl who now wound up in this weird life and sometimes has good opportunities but I've never lost my interest in that kind of entertainment and those kinds of trappings and I just think it's human.

It's human.

But it's wonderful to have it delivered by someone who is as smart and well-read and exposed as Maureen, right?

So, like, you, she has our same interests, but she's super erudite and delivers it in a way that feels truly enlightening.

Okay, so that's my extended and yet another long pitch for Maureen Callian, who I love and would recommend in any form.

Okay, have a great weekend.

We're off on Friday, and we'll talk to you on Monday.

Thanks for listening to The Megan Kelly Show: No BS, No Agenda, and No fear.

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