The Moth Radio Hour: Defining Moments

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This is the Moth Radio Hour.

I'm your host, Jodi Powell.

In this hour, we're hearing all about turning points.

The moments when you make a game-changing decision and decide who you're going to be right now or for the rest of your life.

Our first story comes from Jeff Birdsong.

Jeff told this at a Seattle Story Slam, where KUOW is our radio partner.

In college I led wilderness canoe trips in the Boundary Waters canoe area of Minnesota to Camp Widgeewagon.

Try saying that three times quickly.

And as a novice I quickly learned that carrying large canoes and duluth packs across massive portages between beautiful lakes

required a lot of strength.

And so the desire to have a team of youth that were able to complete this task was highly desired.

And right before a trip started, you gathered with the other staff and you got a packet of information about each of the campers' medical forms and parental notes.

And the guy next to me was opening up his packet, and he had every one of his youth, like at 12 years old, over six feet tall, could bench pass like 200 pounds.

He was ecstatic.

I opened up my pack and I had the first one,

Sam.

and Sam was

just had a hernia operation

he was four foot two and he wasn't allowed to carry more than ten pounds my second camper Ben

was allergic to most food groups and if he was bitten by any one of five insects would instantly die

Then there was Frank whose parent wrote has an extreme fear of large unfamiliar animals.

Please do not let any of them near him.

And my last one, Andy, who at age six had had brain surgery and was not operating at the same developmental level as his peers.

And I'm very ashamed and embarrassed to admit, as an idiot 19-year-old boy, I was pretty disappointed.

This was going to be an absolute bummer of a trip.

And in my head, I had already categorized the group, in my own mind, as the misfit group.

And I wished desperately to have the group of kids that this guy next to me had who were all Hulk monsters.

Well, my kids arrived, and they were a pretty decent group, they were pretty pleasant, but it was clear that the portaging was going to be really difficult.

And

after a couple days in camp, they took us out to our portage drop that would be the portage to our first lake of a start of our journey.

We got everybody loaded up with their Duluth packs on and paddles in hand and sent them off on the trail to the lake.

And I picked up then a pack myself and flipped the canoe, a wood canvas canoe, onto my shoulders.

Those were the days.

And I headed out quickly across the trail, overtaking everybody and getting to the end of the lake where I dumped the canoe and headed back for the second canoe, passing all the kids in turn and encouraging them, go, you're doing great.

But where was Andy?

Losing a camper was frowned upon

by the camp director.

I made it all the way back to the start of the portage and there I heard some crying in the woods and I found Andy sitting on a log, tears streaming down his mud-streaked face.

And now I'm panicked.

There was no training in my two-week staff training to prepare me for crying children.

What am I supposed to do?

I had no idea.

So I sat down next to Andy and just asked him what was going on.

And he said, I miss my mom.

The tears are coming down.

And I said, that's okay, Andy.

I miss my mom too.

I was lying though, but

I thought it was important at that point to make that point.

Eventually he calmed down and I encouraged him to put his pack back on.

I flipped the other canoe up on my shoulders and we walked down the trail.

And I'm still a wreck.

The other kids are going to eat him alive.

I had been bullied a lot as a kid.

I knew what kids were capable of.

I'm trying to strategize, but it's hard to strategize carrying an 80-pound canoe on your shoulders, apparently.

I came up with nothing, and pretty soon we were at the end of the portage.

And I was wondering, too, the whole way along,

what's going on with the other kids?

Are they still alive?

It had some kind of Lord of the Flies thing unfolded at the end of the portage.

But when we got there, they were all sitting in a circle eating trail mix.

And they saw Andy come up and they could quickly clearly see that there was a problem.

And they asked Andy, What's wrong?

Oh no, I thought, here we go.

And he said, I miss my mom.

And he started crying all over again.

And then they said to him, It's okay.

We miss our moms too.

Then pretty much all of us were crying.

And I am still freaking out.

I want to relax, but I'm wondering, like, are we ever going to make it to the campsite

by dark?

And are we going to sit here the rest of our lives?

I was, you know, inexperienced.

And finally, I relaxed into it, realizing the specialness of the moment.

And

they ate their gorp and trail mix and passed it around and shared about their homes and their moms and their families, crying most of the time.

And then pretty soon they just looked at me and said,

Jeff, are we going to go canoeing or what?

I'm like, hey, okay, let's go.

And we went.

And we didn't go far.

And we didn't go fast.

And the portages were hard.

The packs were always heavy and a big burden.

But this was a fantastic trip.

The kids cared for each other deeply.

They had incredible compassion.

They had each other's backs the whole time.

There was lots of laughter and love.

The next week, I got the group I thought I wanted.

They were all ape men who could carry canoes in one finger at age 12.

The packs felt light, and we went many, many miles.

But they were tormenting each other.

They had huge egos.

They were not compassionate.

The trip sucked, and I longed for my first group of guys.

That first group of guys taught me something invaluable.

That my burden of baggage isn't necessarily the 80-pound canoe bearing down on my shoulders, ripping my shoulder blades to shreds.

It's the burden of baggage in my mind, my biases, my preconceived notions about what is going to be successful, about misperceptions that cause myself harm and others harm.

And for that lesson of life, those beautiful boys that I still remember to this day, I am eternally grateful.

Thank you.

That was Jeff Birdsall.

Jeff spent decades immersed in environmental and outdoor education.

These days, he leads workshops for national service programs and universities across the country.

He has experienced directing two AmeriCorps programs and co-founded the Wilderness Volunteer Corps.

Jeff is now based in Seattle and recently discovered a new passion for storytelling.

Our next story about big decisions comes from Lauren Allen.

Lauren also told this story in Seattle at a grand slam at Town Hall.

Here's Lauren live at the moth.

So, when I was in high school, I was cut from the softball team,

which was pretty sad, but it was even worse because I was the only person who was cut from the softball team,

which implies they had enough room, but they just really didn't want me.

And this came to me as a surprise because I had played a lot of pitch and catch with my dad, and he told me I had a good arm.

But when I got to tryouts, it was the first time I'd ever thrown a softball.

And I found a softball is very different from a baseball.

And although I could throw it really hard, I couldn't aim it.

So the third time I threw it really hard right past my coach's face, she decided to cut me.

And she said, we love your enthusiasm, Lauren.

But we are afraid you will hurt someone

or yourself.

So, this was devastating for me because I had really wanted to be good at something.

I believed that self-esteem needed to be earned.

And at that point in my life, I was bad at everything, so I felt like crap about myself.

But I didn't give up on sports because I saw a movie called Cool Runnings.

And

in this movie, a group of unlikely Jamaican men bond together and end up making a bobsled team that goes all the way to the Olympics.

Nobody thought it could happen.

And I believed I was the Jamaican bobsled team.

I just hadn't found my sport yet.

But if I kept trying, I was sure to succeed against all odds.

So I found out that the track team didn't make cuts.

I thought this is great.

This is gonna be my sport.

Flash forward to my very first race of my very first track meet.

It's indoors because I grew up in Buffalo and it was blizzarding outside.

So there's a balcony above the track where all the other kids are looking down at me and my dad's there too, which is not scary at all.

And then I look around beside me and I see all the other girls that are gonna run against me and they are much more fit than me and they look like they have a lot more self-esteem than me.

So I try to pump myself up and I think of the pep talk from Cool Runnings.

I see pride.

I see power.

I see a badass mother who don't take no crap off of nobody.

And then I start to sprint and I'm flying.

And it's amazing because the other girls are behind me.

And I feel like this is the first time I'm good at something.

And I round the bend and I'm coming back to the finish line and the girls start gaining on me.

So I clench my butt cheeks

and I go into turbo mode.

And I make it across the finish line just in time to hear my coach say, nine more laps, Alan.

Because I was running the mile event

and the other girls soon passed me because they knew something about pacing

and I desperately tried to catch up with them but then I felt it a sharp pain in my side I had a horrible cramp so I raised my arm to try to stretch it out but that was difficult to sustain while I was running so I just kind of chicken-winged

my way

through two laps, three laps, four laps, five laps, six laps.

I knew what lap I was on because my coach was at the starting line counting for me.

And every time I crossed, he looked angrier with me.

Halfway through my sixth lap, all the other girls finished.

But I was determined to finish even by myself because I remembered the dramatic conclusion to cool runnings

where the bobsled tips over and the men knowing they're going to lose pick it up onto their shoulders and they finish with dignity and I was going to be like them

so I rounded the corner and I'm coming back to the start line and that's when I saw my coach walking away

because he had given up on me and that's when I started to cry

And I thought about everybody looking down at me from the balconies above, my dad being disappointed in me.

I thought about the fact that I was really bad at running

and I was stupid to try

and all the other kids were probably angry with me for wasting their time.

And it was a really long lap because it's difficult to run while you're sobbing.

But eventually I made it to the starting line again and I saw a lady there and I asked her, what lap am I on?

And she looked at me and she said, I think you've done enough.

So

I came off the track prematurely.

I went upstairs and I found my dad,

and

I was kind of afraid, but he gave me a big hug and he said, Good effort.

And that was my big break into mediocrity.

I realized, you know, my dad didn't really care that I was slow and the other kids didn't care either.

I also eventually realized that I liked running, although I continued to be horrible at it for the next 14 years.

Power workers, walkers pass me at Green Lake all the time.

But I enjoy it, and just because you're really bad at something doesn't mean you shouldn't do it.

And these days, even though I never found a sport I could crush at,

these days when I look into the mirror, I see pride, I see power,

and I see a woman who is fabulously average.

Thank you.

That was Lauren Allen.

Lauren says she's afraid of most things, but she does them anyway, even if it's often a little foolish.

She used to climb mountains until one of those mountains broke her foot.

Now, she swims with jellyfish and teaches high school science.

Curious which one is scarier?

For that answer, visit themoth.org.

In a moment, we step into the world of love and relationships, where there are countless crossroads.

That's when the moth radio Hour continues.

The Moth Radio Hour is produced by Atlantic Public Media in Woods Hole, Massachusetts.

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This is the Moth Radio Hour.

I'm Jodi Powell.

In this hour, we're hearing stories of defining moments, taking a leap or walking away and hoping the choice made was indeed the right one.

Our next storyteller is Madeleine Potts.

Like our our last two stories, Madeline told this at our Seattle Story Slide.

Here's Madeline live at the moment.

It was the 70s.

I'm that old.

And I was a young single mom.

And I was out exploring my new neighborhood.

I came across a little cooperative art gallery and went in.

And there, amid the weavings and the watercolors and the handmade pottery mugs

was some of the most bizarre sculpture I had ever seen.

Great big, alarming, mixed media, humanoid pieces that reeked of social commentary.

And I thought,

Who in their right mind would ever want to have anything like this?

And then the artist walked over.

He was drop dead gorgeous.

And I said,

how much is that piece?

I'd like to buy it.

It wasn't for sale.

But that's how I met my husband, Robert.

We fell in love.

I married him.

I got the artist and the art.

It was kind of like a buy one, get one free.

And about a year into our relationship, he got asked to do a one-man show.

Oh, he was brimming with ideas.

And he said, I want to do this piece that needs female parts.

Can I do some body casting on you?

Sure, honey.

What you need?

I need your feet.

Okay.

And your legs.

Okay.

And your arms.

Okay.

And your torso.

Okay.

And your head.

And I realized he was going to completely encase me in plaster of Paris.

And I said,

okay.

Because everyone knows you have to sacrifice for art.

So the very next morning, he dropped our little one off at her half-day nursery, and we went right into the studio.

He had these gauze bandages impregnated with plaster.

He put Bob Marley on the record player.

He positioned me.

He got to work.

He did my legs.

He did my arms.

He did my torso.

And when he got to my head,

I had a moment where I thought,

maybe this isn't such a good idea.

But it was for art.

and I said nothing while he bandaged up my head and I said nothing as he draped that plaster across my face and I said nothing until I couldn't say anything because the only parts of my body left visible were my eyeballs and my nostrils and then he whipped two straws out of his pocket

positioned them up my nose, patted them into place with plaster, and the phone rang.

It was the half-day nursery.

We were late picking up my little girl.

And he said to me, It's only two blocks away.

I'll take the car.

I'll go get her.

I'll be back right away.

Will you be okay?

And I said,

which of course meant, I won't be okay.

Don't go.

But what Robert heard

was,

I will be okay.

Just go.

And he was gone.

And there I was,

alone with Bob Marley encased in plaster of Paris.

But Bob was singing, don't worry about it, babe.

You know, It was the 70s.

I thought the universe was talking to me through my record player.

And very quickly, though, I was not okay.

I started sweating under that cast.

Tears started building up behind my eyes.

My heart started pounding.

My breathing was getting shallow.

I was getting little body twitches underneath that cast, and then my nose started to itch.

And instinctively, I did something.

The only thing I could do, I kind of snorted out,

and those two straws went flying out of my nose

and I could feel plaster filling in where nothing had tingled before and I thought

this is the end of my life

I'm going to die

My little girl is going to come home and instead of having a mommy, she's going to have a mommy.

But just then

my husband came running in.

He saw I was in trouble.

He cut me out of the cast.

And you know what?

It was salvageable.

He finished the piece.

It became the major work of his show.

And at the opening, I thought, why did I submit myself to that?

And of course I answered, It was for art.

But now it's decades later, and I know it wasn't about art.

It was only about love.

Thank you.

That was Madeleine Potts.

At 82, Madeleine is still active telling stories with her local and state guilds.

Sadly, her husband passed away, but he remains a beautiful and eccentric legend among their children and grandchildren.

She said his craftsmanship was impeccable and still serves as the standard they all aspire to.

Our next story is also from the Seattle Slams, and it comes from Jean Cardano.

Five years ago, my partner partner became obsessed with this guy.

He was a former student of hers.

She's a college professor.

And they hadn't seen each other in like 10 years.

And while I was away at a family funeral, she decided to plan and have dinner with him.

And from the way she talked about him, I could tell that she was considering leaving me for him.

And we had been together for nine years at this point, and she had just spent a couple hours with him.

And so I asked, Are you sure you want to do this?

You don't even know this guy.

And she she said, but I do.

We both make art, and we both owned Tercels.

And then she went on to tell me how he loved cars, Toyotas in particular, and how he still owned and drove a Tercel.

And the next day she told me she decided that she would stay with me.

And I said, well, you still need to tell this guy about me.

if you're going to communicate with him.

And the day after that, she told me that she did communicate with him and told him about me

and you know something just fell off and I asked can I see your text and this was the first time in nine years that I had asked to see any of her texts and she was reluctant to show me and I said is there something you need to tell me and she said no and I asked again and she said no again and the text read

I'm sorry I missed your call I wasn't trying to date you.

I was just looking for friends and people with shared interests.

And I'm flattered that I was considered a threat to the fidelity of your relationship.

So unfortunately for me, he had rejected her.

And I say unfortunately for me because we spent the next two years in couples therapy.

And for the first six months,

I think in order to justify her actions, she just went on and on about how good looking this guy was and how amazing he was.

And she even showed me pictures of him and his social media.

And I couldn't help but think that this guy was better than me.

And that maybe I was the reason that our relationship was failing.

And we eventually split up.

And then just last year, last May, I was sitting at a coffee shop.

And I was at the parking lot across the street.

I see this Turcell pull up.

And it's this guy.

And I see him get out of the car and he's with a woman I don't recognize.

And they walk over

to the establishment across the street.

And I turn to my friend and say, something big is about to happen.

And about 10 or 15 minutes later, I decide, okay, it's time for me to go over there and experience this guy.

How amazing he is and how good looking.

Just witness how good looking he is.

So I walked over there.

And somehow they're still at the back of the line.

And I'm right behind him.

And he has has no idea who I am.

This guy who has made such a big impact on my life.

And a Toyota drives by and he says to the woman, they call that voodoo blue.

Toyotas have weird names for the colors of their cars.

And I'm like, this is the guy?

And he's standing there with his stained, sweat-stained ball cap.

gray t-shirt untucked and a flannel covering like a little bit of a beer belly.

And I'm like, this is the guy?

And

And then I strike up a conversation with them

And we talk about the weather local events and how they like to watch Ted Lasso

and Then I realize my failed relationship had not not only had nothing to do with me, but it had nothing to do with him either

And then a couple months go by and I'm at the grocery store sitting in my car in the parking lot and I see him pull up in his Toyota and I think he's alone this time.

Now's my chance to get some answers and get some closure to some of these questions I had.

I could ask him like what did she say on that message and did you actually like her?

But then I thought no I can't do this.

This is too weird.

But then it was my chance, my one and only chance.

So I ran in there and I looked for him and I found him in the moisturizer aisle.

And he's holding a bottle of moisturizer.

and I'm standing right next to him pretending to look at the lip balms and in my head I'm thinking I'm going to get closure now.

I'm going to get these answers and I'm finally going to figure out how what happened here.

And then he pulls out his reading glasses and I'm thinking about his internal dialogue.

Water,

glycerin,

petroleum.

And then all of a sudden that fire I had inside me where I needed closure and I needed these answers from the guy,

just died.

And I realized as I stood there that the answers I needed weren't going to come from an external source, but they had to come from me.

And the answer was that this didn't matter.

And I realized that whatever he had to say to me in that moment wasn't going to make me feel better or worse.

So I turned and walked away thank you.

Jean Cardeno is a musician and computer programmer based in Boise, Idaho.

She has always appreciated listening to people tell their true personal stories, but has recently discovered the challenge of crafting her own.

After telling this story, Jean took a solo road trip in her Silver Nissan NV200 van with porthole windows for some self-exploration and writing.

She also wants us to know she no longer cringes at the sight of a Toyota Turcell.

After the break, we hear about meaningful moments with treasured books, and an unlikely person takes us clubbing when the moth radio hour continues.

The Moth Radio Hour is produced by Atlantic Public Media in Woods Hole, Massachusetts.

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This is the Moth Radio Hour.

I'm Jodi Powell.

Our next story comes from Duncan Hills.

Duncan told this at a Louisiana store slum where New Orleans Public Radio is our media partner.

Okay, so

when my parents retired,

my mother took up fairly normal retiree retiree hobbies like painting and knitting, that kind of thing.

But

my dad decided to take up nightclubbing.

So

I was away at the time.

I initially found out about this while I was traveling in India.

And I had gone to India because my dad was actually born in India originally.

And I was in an internet cafe.

I don't know if any of you remember those old things, but I was in an internet cafe.

And I got this email from my dad.

And he said, look, darling, I'm on dsi.com.

And I was like, what the hell is dsi.com?

It was don'tstayin.com.

And it was kind of in the days before Facebook really got big.

It was kind of a site where people would post clubbing photos and such.

And anyway, so there's a photo of him, of my dad, in his 70s, next to another guy of similar age in this nightclub.

And so I turned to my friend, John, and I said, mate, look at this.

And he leaned over and I was like, my dad, since we've been away, has got into bloody nightclubbing.

So my friend leans over and he goes, Which one's your dad?

And I said, Well, my dad's called Ian, and he's the one on the left.

He's the guy with only one arm.

And my dad had been born in India and he'd caught polio at a very young age.

So, technically, he has two arms, but his left arm didn't work.

He calls himself the one-arm bandit, and that sort of thing.

So, he's pretty cool with it, so no matter it's okay to laugh.

But he's very cool about it.

He's had 70 years to get used to it.

And anyway, so

anyway, so he,

my friend said, all right, so that's that's your dad with the one arm.

And I said, yeah.

And he said, who's the other old guy next to him?

I said, oh, that's his friend.

He's also called Ian.

He's only got one leg.

And so these two guys,

I was kind of a bit concerned that they were going clubbing together just because, you know, I worried that he might have a fall or something like that, you know.

And I thought, I thought it would just be a one-off.

But then when I got back to the UK, it turned out it had become a regular thing.

And so these two were going out clubbing together, tearing up the night and my sisters and I we were both a bit worried we were like you know we were worried that he might be the kind of creepy old guy in a club kind of thing and we were just worried about this and then um but he seems to be making some friends he made some really nice friends in and around the clubs so we were less worried but then it got to a point where he was going up to London to like Fabric Ministry of Sound like the big clubs So my sisters had to sit him down, me and my sisters, and we had to give my dad the drug chat.

And we said,

if anyone offers you white powders or little pills, just say no and stay in school.

And so

the good thing was he didn't even drink when he went out.

He would just drive into town.

And I thought, look, I'm going to go with him and just see what this is about.

And so I went up to this club called Mangoes, which at the time was the kind of trendy house club in town.

And

it was the middle of bloody winter in England, and it's freezing cold.

There's a queue around the block.

And dad just walks straight past the queue,

up to the bouncer the bouncer goes Ian

is that Ian Ian you don't have to queue in you come mate he's like he's like you must be Ian's son mate you don't have to pay in you go in you go and I'm like

so I walk into this club I walk into this club My dad's shaking hands, he's high-fiving people, the barman comes straight over, gives him a free drink, the DJ is like shouting him out, and I'm walking in and I had this bizarre moment where I realized I'm never going to be as cool as my dad.

And so

we were still, it was good, but we were still worried about him.

You know, he was getting older and, you know, he's a bit less stable because he only has one arm and things.

And so we were worried that he might have a fall or something.

And he has broken his good arm twice, which is a bloody nightmare.

As I'm sure you can imagine, he literally had to be spoon-fed.

And

so we were kind of a bit concerned about him, but

eventually he did have a fall.

He was in a rowdy club, he got knocked over, he bashed his chin a bit, but he was okay.

But he got a good telling off from my mother and his sister as a result of that.

And so it did, but by this point, he was already hooked, and it was too late.

So he was getting a bit of a name for himself in the town.

It's a town called Reading, it's not far from London.

And he

started going out a lot.

He got interviewed by the local radio.

Club promoters in the town started putting up posters and they'd be like, big name DJ in town with special guest, Ian Hills.

He'd be

and then

on his well then someone on Facebook started a fan page for my dad called the Ian Hills Appreciation Society which has thousands of likes and on his 79th birthday he went out to a big club and there was a DJ playing called Artwork who's a pretty big name in the UK and in the middle of the night they stopped the music and they called him up and they said it would Ian Hills come up on the stage and this club of 2,000 people sang him him happy birthday, which was really sweet.

But the problem was

this was now verging on obsession.

He was going out four times a week, getting in at 5 a.m., sleeping all day, having multiple naps, and mum was getting a bit fed up of this.

And it reached a crescendo, it reached a head at Christmas 2020.

It's the middle of this, in the middle of COVID, and I was on my way back home for Christmas.

And I got a call from Dad.

And he said, oh, darling, I've got some bad news.

And I said, what is it?

He said, I've got COVID.

I was like, are you okay?

And he said, yeah, I'm fine, but I'm in a bit of trouble.

And he said, I think your mother's a bit pissed at me.

And I said, I'm not surprised.

And I said, why?

He said, I called it going to a nightclub.

And so

she was obviously quite cross.

And I said, well, where are you?

And he said,

we're currently driving down to the south coast where they have a little holiday place.

And she was driving him.

And I said, no, stop the car.

Get out of the bloody car.

And he was like, no, it's fine.

The windows are all down.

I was like, oh, my God.

So I was like, now mum definitely has COVID.

And sure enough four days later she tested positive so dad gets banished to the south coast mum is not talking to him and I have never known her so cross with him in 51 years of marriage and anyway

they eventually I said to her look

She was upset because her quarantine then wasn't going to end until well after Christmas.

So I said, look, I'm going to come home for Christmas.

I don't, you know, I'm vaccinated.

I'll be fine if I get the, if I get the disease.

And I said, I'm going to drive down on Christmas Day.

I'm going to pick up dad and I'm going to bring him back.

And so at 5 a.m.

I got up and I am not a morning person, as my girlfriend will attest.

I am not a morning person.

So I drove all the way down to the south coast, picked up my dad, brought him back.

My mum opened the door, face like thunder.

She was furious at him.

But I said, come on,

give him a hug.

Say sorry.

They kissed and made up and we had a nice Christmas.

And a few weeks later, it was his 80th birthday.

And we had a kind of surprise Zoom call for him with all the friends and the family.

And I managed to get in touch with a load of his clubbing mates.

And we had about 30 or 40 of his clubbing mates on this call.

And they all sang him happy birthday, and they told all these really nice stories.

And about halfway through, Dad, he was just in his element.

And my mother turned to me and she said, I've made a decision.

I said, what?

And she said,

and this, bear in mind, comes after he had promised, he had vowed as part of his apology to never go back to the clubs.

And she turned to me and she said,

I think I should let him go back to the clubs

because

how can I take away from something from him that makes him so happy

that was Duncan Hills Duncan originally hails from the UK but moved to the US to pursue his dream of working in human space flight arriving in the country with no job just a few weeks before the COVID pandemic began.

He now lives in New Orleans but grew up in a town called Reading in the UK.

He said it's a town famous only for its jail, its train station and its terrible football team.

And now apparently for his father Ian.

It was a no-brainer after listening to Duncan that we had to talk to Ian.

So we met on Zoom for a quick chat.

I have the pure pleasure here of talking to Duncan's father, Ian.

Tell us a little bit about who you are.

I'm 84 at the moment, Jodie.

Wow.

In terms of background, when I was at boarding school, private school, I was into music then, quite different now.

It was Bill Haley and the Comets and Elvis Presley, all shook up and hound dog and all those things.

I love music.

I used to dance around the kitchen.

And then I retired when I was at the age of 67.

And Duncan said, Dad, I know you like music.

You like dancing.

Let me introduce you to some electronic dance music so at the age of 67 I went to our local club

and

just

asked to be let in and everybody looked at me who is this guy I mean he's about 50 years older than everybody else here but I don't let those things put me off Jody you know

I just loved it and

I'm just having a good old dance a bit of a great big boogie.

And after a while, people came up and joined me because the blokes, the men, just stood around.

I said, come on, come and have a dance.

That's how it all started.

So you mentioned that when you first walked into the club, everybody was like, this guy is much older than everybody that was in here.

Was that intimidating for you, or you just like brushed that off?

I'm never intimidated, Josie.

I was there to have fun.

It wasn't any out too remote to have fun.

And when people could see that, people started joining in, you know.

So

that was the introduction to it.

Funny little story, Jodie.

So I stayed there till late in the evening.

I mean, it was about two o'clock, you know, and I was still there dancing away.

And then at the door, my daughter.

came in with a friend and I said, oh, hello, Andrew.

What are you doing?

Well, she said, I had to to tell my friends about you, Dad.

Dante wanted to come and see you.

But

they couldn't hack it, Jodi.

They couldn't last.

And after half an hour, they had to go.

You know, earlier you said, I don't get intimidated.

I just go out there and do that.

You know, people might be listening to, listen to Duncan's story and then listen to you speaking.

They might be thinking, hmm, I'm of a certain age or I'm a shy, introverted person.

What would you say to them listening?

I used to say to people, age is a number.

It doesn't matter what age you are, you can enjoy.

If you're there to enjoy yourself, you know.

And people used to say to me, Ian, what are you on?

You know, because I used to say that until three o'clock in the morning, are you on MDMA or are you on Ket or Are you on Coke?

Oh, no, no, I said it's something much more lethal than that.

Well, what, what, what, what is it?

It's called soda, water, and ice.

And I used to say to them, come on, guys, come on, guys, get up on the dance floor.

And my motto was rave, don't behave.

Well, within limits, you know what I mean.

Ian, do you still go clubbing?

I don't know, no.

But I've seen what they've introduced here.

I'm very much tempted because I haven't been clubbing now for the past two or three years, but I'm very much tempted because...

What they're starting here locally is day clubs.

So you'll see me there at one of the day clubs, I'm sure, the next couple of weeks.

Even if I don't get last at the very end, yeah, I'll be there leading the way.

That was Duncan Hills' father, Ian Hills.

Our final story on the theme of defining moments comes from Erro McClendon.

Errol told this at a Chicago Story Slum where WBEZ is our radio partner.

Here's Errol, live at the mall.

My father passed away two days after Christmas, one day before my 14th birthday.

He had gone into the hospital a week before Christmas with a massive heart attack and had a second one December 27th,

and that was it.

Now, I know the belief is that if you have a birthday soon after Christmas, you don't have much of a birthday, but that's not true if you're a spoiled only child.

Now, I didn't have a lot of guests at my birthday party, but my parents and my grandparents were there and we always had a lot of packages.

We had a beautiful chocolate sheet cake and ice cream and it was kind of neat because if I didn't get what I wanted for Christmas, I knew three days later I would get those packages.

But this particular year, my

because of my father's funeral, my mother wasn't able to do my usual birthday.

My father had a huge funeral.

He was a college administrator and everybody knew him throughout the state and beyond, so it was massive.

So all my mother did was give me money to go downtown in Cleveland, Mississippi with my friends and buy what I wanted.

And for a 14-year-old this was like hitting the lottery.

I took my friends, I bought them lunch, I bought them some records, I bought my stuff.

And I came home that night and sitting in my room, I was showing my mother all of the stuff that I had purchased.

And then it hit me.

and I started crying.

I said there were no books.

There weren't any books.

My father had started a tradition on my first birthday by giving me one book, The Pokey Little Puppy.

The second birthday I got two, The Little Engine That Could and the Little Red Hen.

And this continued, adding books every year.

By the time sixth, seventh, eighth birthday, I was getting this one box with a tag on it that that said, Too Speed, that was my father's nickname for me, from Dad.

My mother left the room and she came back with a box with a tag on it, Too Speed from Dad.

I opened it up and there were 14 books.

She didn't know how I would handle getting a present from my father after he was gone.

Now, I usually read those books in two or three months.

I was an avid reader, but this year I rationed them out.

I read one or two a month so that it would last for the whole year.

It was the last box.

On my 15th birthday, I came downstairs.

There were the presents.

There was the sheet cake.

There was the ice cream.

And there was a box with a tag on it.

Two speed from dad.

And I opened it up and there were 15 books.

When we moved to Cleveland to Delta State University in the second grade, my father had gone to the library with the head of the Children and Young Adult Literature Division and prepaid for over 150 books.

So I would have books all the way through my 18th birthday.

So for the next three years, 16, 17, 18, there was always a box with a tag, to speed from dad, that I would open.

The 18th year, knowing that was the last box, I really did ration those books.

And I held on to one for the day of my 19th birthday, the Scarlet Pimpernel.

I came downstairs, there were the gifts, there was the cake, there was the ice cream.

There was no box.

And then I took the scarlet pimpernill and I went upstairs and I read it straight through through the afternoon, through the evening, into the next morning.

And when I finished it,

I cried myself to sleep, holding it to my chest.

Five years later, that's when I said goodbye to my father.

Thank you.

That was Errol McClendon.

By day, Errol is a patient educator where he plays the part of a patient for students in the medical field to help them improve their communication skills.

He got into this career after a 25-year run as a travel agent, a job that became obsolete with the rise of the internet.

Outside of work, he's also a tarot card reader, a Reiki healer, and a paranormal investigator.

Errol still loves reading.

When he reads a book with a deceptively simple narrative, but leaves him with a great universal wisdom, he can't help but think it's one his father would have placed in one of those boxes today.

And that's it for this episode of the Moth Radio Hour.

Thank you to our storytellers and all of the Moth staff and crew, and to you for listening.

I hope you'll join us next time.

This episode of the Moth Radio Hour was produced by me, Jay Allison, and Jodi Powell, who also hosted.

Co-producer is Vicki Merrick, associate producer Emily Couch.

Additional Grand Slam coaching by Larry Rosen.

The rest of the Moth's leadership team includes Sarah Haberman, Christina Norman, Sarah Austin Janess, Kate Tellers, Marina Cluche, Leanne Gully, Suzanne Rust, Sarah Jane Johnson, and Patricia Urenia.

Moth stories are true as remembered and affirmed by the storytellers.

Our theme music is by The Drift.

Other music in this hour from Del Von Lamar Organ Trio, Hermanos Gutierrez, The Westerlies, and Ronan Osnode.

We receive funding from the National Endowment for the Arts.

The Moth Radio Hour is produced by Atlantic Public Media in Woods Hole, Massachusetts.

Special thanks to our friends at Odyssey, including executive producer producer Leah Rhys-Dennis.

For more about our podcast, for information on Pitching It's Your Own Story, and to learn all about the moth, go to our website, themoth.org.

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