‘Nobody Wants This’ Review: Fake Podcasting, Icks, and a Hot Rabbi

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Speaker 5 Hello and welcome to the Prestige TV podcast here on the Ringer Podcast Network. I'm Jodi Walker, joined by my co-host Nora Franciati to discuss the the plain and simple fact, everybody wants this.

Speaker 5 When this is Adam Brody and Kristen Bell back on our television screens, falling in love. That's right.
We're here to talk about the raging Netflix success. Nobody wants this.

Speaker 5 Nora Princiati, they say that relationships are all about timing. Tell me where you were, how you were, when you were, when you stumbled across, nobody wants this.
I did not stumble, Jodi.

Speaker 5 I received like, this was a barrage. Yeah, like a true barrage of text messages, seemingly all at once, from like

Speaker 5 women in my life from various corners who all within like three days of this show going up on Netflix were

Speaker 5 just spamming every group chat. And I mean that in the best way possible, saying, are you guys watching the show? You need to watch this show.

Speaker 5 It is such classic rom-com vibes. I hope everybody's watching this.
And then, you know, one by one, everybody either responded like, yes, I'm watching it. I'm obsessed with it.

Speaker 5 Or, oh my gosh, no, I have to go watch it.

Speaker 5 I swear to you, like

Speaker 5 this happened to me in three different group texts where just someone was like, is everybody watching this? And everyone was like, yes, we're all watching this. So it really felt like a phenomenon.

Speaker 5 And in that context, I was actually kind of a latecomer.

Speaker 5 Like, then I went and checked it out and I too loved it, which as the show itself points out, like the most important things in our lives are going down in the group text.

Speaker 5 And if you're talking about this in the pinned group text, your most, most esteemed, most important group text, yeah, then it's real. I mean, the show has been a huge success.

Speaker 5 It's been number one on Netflix for weeks. It has only just been knocked down to number two by Outer Banks itself.
itself. And honestly, who could hold up against

Speaker 5 such fare?

Speaker 5 I must say, I have been on this show since the second the trailer dropped. Because when you see

Speaker 5 who is in this show, it's absolute TV royalty. And a little peek behind the Ringer curtain.

Speaker 5 I do recall that the first reaction to the trailer in some of the Ringer Slack channels were, this looks like it should have been a movie. I would like to say, no, it shouldn't.

Speaker 5 It's excellent as a TV show.

Speaker 5 Yeah.

Speaker 5 Well, that's romantic comedies as television shows, and I think this is one of the accomplishments of the series, historically a hard thing to pull off, right?

Speaker 5 Because you're playing with this format that is fundamentally based in, yes, chemistry. And I think that's the reason why this works out, but a story where it's will they or won't they?

Speaker 5 And we're figuring out whether or not two people can overcome whatever set of obstacles are in front of them.

Speaker 5 And

Speaker 5 it's usually hard, I think, in a TV format to tell that story

Speaker 5 without it becoming so sort of like herky jerky of, okay, they're facing this problem, but then they get over it, but then there's another problem, but then they get over it, but then there's another problem, but then they get over it.

Speaker 5 Like for a good rom-com, you kind of want that formula to have one will they or won't they arc.

Speaker 5 And I don't know if they totally solved that problem, it's just that the chemistry is so good that it doesn't matter.

Speaker 5 Well, this is my favorite kind of story, which isn't really a will they or won't they. You know that they will quite quickly.
It's a can they or can't they? Like, can they overcome these

Speaker 5 really monumental

Speaker 5 an obstacle so monumental as religion and

Speaker 5 history and your entire culture at play here. So, for anyone not in the know, I'm just going to give a quick description of

Speaker 5 what we're talking about today.

Speaker 5 Nobody wants this is a 10-episode romantic comedy series created by Aaron Foster, one half of the podcasting and entrepreneurial sister duo, spawned by famous music producer and composer and reality TV villain himself, David Foster.

Speaker 5 The series stars Kristen Bell as one half of another sister podcasting duo named Joanne.

Speaker 5 In the show, her podcast is called Nobody Wants This, and it covers love, sex, and relationships from the point of view of two single women dating their way through LA.

Speaker 5 So it's basically a horror story until Joanne meets Noah, a hot modern rabbi played by the inventor of Chrismica himself, Adam Brody. Nora, we're going to get into it.

Speaker 5 This isn't the first podcast we've talked about Adam Brody and Seth going on. And it won't be the last.

Speaker 5 It will not be the last if this show has anything to do with it.

Speaker 5 Noah teaches Joanne about Judaism and vulnerability. And Joanne teaches Noah that the women who host podcasts are perfect main characters who deserve to be adored.
At least that's how I took it.

Speaker 5 Does that all sound right, Nora? Yes. I mean, it is very important to us, I feel, that this is on some level, a story about podcasting.
It's so important that

Speaker 5 the sort of like the architect as the perfect male job for a rom-com is now becoming the podcaster is the perfect woman job. Cause it's not, let's be clear, the perfect man job.
If you

Speaker 5 I don't like saying man job like that, but if you present a male podcaster on a rom-com, you've lost the plot. Red flag.
No, male podcasting in general.

Speaker 5 I'm very sorry to our coworkers, but it's a red flag. And brothers.
Oh, I mean,

Speaker 5 we'll get into the podcasting of it all, but I can't tell you how many times. I have been on, let's just say, a first date and said that part of my job is podcasting.
And some man has been like,

Speaker 5 oh, I've thought about starting a podcast. I bet you have, buddy.
I bet you have. He's a 10, but he has a podcast with his brother.

Speaker 5 It's just me and my brother just talking about what we normally talk about, put on microphones. And to be fair, that is kind of the pitch of the podcast within this show.

Speaker 5 But before we get into that, we have decided that because this is a rom-com series, it only makes sense to sort of define the relationship that we have with this series, starting with what we are in love with, moving on to what we are in a situationship with, aka a little less certain about.

Speaker 5 And finally, a handful of things that we might want to break up with come. Spoiler alert, season two.

Speaker 5 Let's get into what we were in love with, Nora. The casting on this show

Speaker 5 is perfect. Just like from the jump, having these early aughts, teen stars in Adam Brody and Kristen Bell is

Speaker 5 like just that's all it takes. Like just coupling these people up is a perfect premise.
What did you think about

Speaker 5 the casting?

Speaker 5 I mean, it's it's it's perfect in terms of like

Speaker 5 what Adam Brody and Kristen Bell kind of represent in culture in terms of making you feel all of those like fuzzy nostalgic

Speaker 5 ots TV vibes, which I do think does a good job job of communicating that, like, this is a rom-com that feels like a rom-com.

Speaker 5 Like, it feels like a 2000s rom-com, which I just think is part of why, like, I know that so many of my friends, and I know that I felt this way too, were so excited about this show because it feels like the type of thing that doesn't happen

Speaker 5 that much anymore. Like, in part because it's TV.
And obviously, Netflix has

Speaker 5 gotten into the rom-com game,

Speaker 5 but

Speaker 5 I don't know, a lot of those end up feeling sort of B-level in a way where this just felt like a great romantic comedy. And

Speaker 5 so I think the two of them just sort of like who their fan bases are worked really well for that. But also, just the two of them had incredible chemistry.

Speaker 5 Like that first, the scene in the first episode when they're at the party and they're flirting and they're figuring each other out. I just was like, I'm in.
Like, I'm so in.

Speaker 5 I will watch these two on screen together for as long as I am able to.

Speaker 5 It's just up to a casting casting director to figure out how to get that chemistry and then it's on the actors and i just think i have notes on this show from a storytelling perspective but on a basic level the two of them were just electric on screen together and you can cover up a lot of warts when that's true

Speaker 5 i think that these two are just like TV professionals. I was thinking about that in that first scene where they meet at the party.

Speaker 5 There's like a classic misunderstanding where Kristen Bell's character, Joanne, thinks that, you know, the bearded guy is the rabbi.

Speaker 5 And she's literally talking to Adam Brody's character, Noah, being like, Did you know there's a rabbi here? And we all know that eventually it is going to be revealed that he is the rabbi.

Speaker 5 And really, that doesn't cause much of a run-in. It's just like, oh, yeah, well, hot rabbi.
I'm intrigued.

Speaker 5 But in the scene where they're talking about that there's a rabbi there, he is attempting to open a bottle of wine. And it's so good.
Like the, the beats play perfectly.

Speaker 5 He cannot open this bottle of wine. And they're talking about like their most embarrassing moments.
Embarrassing facts. Yeah.

Speaker 5 Cause she's like, I think it helps to just say something really embarrassing about yourself.

Speaker 5 And he keeps playing at like, he keeps bringing this bottle of wine into his own story and being like, well, this is the most embarrassing thing that happened, has ever happened to me.

Speaker 5 And then later he's like, well, I guess if I had to be honest, it's the fact that I'm a somalier and he can't get this bottle of wine open. It's so, the flirting is so effortless.

Speaker 5 And I was just thinking during that scene, like, how did they choreograph this bottle of wine opening? He's pulling the cork. It's the cork is getting stuck at different places.

Speaker 5 And, and that, it's such efficient. I also have, you know, some qualms with some of the storytelling, but especially that first episode, it's so efficient the way that you meet these characters.

Speaker 5 The fact that she walks into that party in a fur coat that she like can't stop announcing. It's like she's worn it for attention, but she also knows it's too much.
And there is a really,

Speaker 5 I thought, like meaningful, in definitely in terms of how I related to it, ongoing story about how Joanne feels like she's too much and she's always trying to get out in front of it.

Speaker 5 Like if she can just get out in front of it, she won't be too much, but it makes her just so much more.

Speaker 5 And the story is all about like finding someone who appreciates how much you are and who doesn't want you to be any less and who like, not just likes your ugly chinchilla coat, but likes the reason that you wore it.

Speaker 5 And the reason is because.

Speaker 5 You wanted to enter a party and be seen and be known and be understood, even if you like kind of don't like the things that you are being seen, known and understood.

Speaker 5 People will come to understand about you based on that choice. Yeah.
It's so great. It's such a nuanced kind of archetype, but it's also one that we're all familiar with.

Speaker 5 And I think like a lot of people relate to.

Speaker 5 And that's really smart. There's a moment when Joanne is like,

Speaker 5 she's explaining to her sister and her mom something that happened on like her sort of first date with Noah. And she's like, oh, I did this thing where I told the waiter I wasn't staying.

Speaker 5 It was so cute. Like

Speaker 5 she's meant to be a lot. She's meant, I think, to be a little annoying, to be overly snarky.
But

Speaker 5 her desire to be a main character is really like out on Front Street. And I think, obviously, after this show first premiered, people are so taken with Adam Brody.

Speaker 5 And especially women watching the show have such a place in our hearts for Seth Cohen. And Adam Brody is so good in this.
I mean, he is just meant to be on television.

Speaker 5 He's meant to be romancing a woman. But I actually completely disagree that this is like a grown-up Seth Cohen.
I think that's sort of a discredit to Adam Brody.

Speaker 5 I think that this is a totally different character. He's really, he's not very snarky.

Speaker 5 He's very funny, but it's a, it's a really different portrayal of how to be romantic and how to be obsessed with a woman. Like it's, it's very different, I think.
And it's not just a grown-up version.

Speaker 5 I honestly found Joanne to be like a much more parallel character to Seth Cohen.

Speaker 5 I mean, I don't mean a grown-up version in terms of taking a character he's already played and transposing that onto adulthood. But I think part of what is really attractive about the character is

Speaker 5 there's a clear portrayal of like emotional maturity.

Speaker 5 And it's not just that he appreciates that she's a lot and loves her anyway.

Speaker 5 It's that when Joanne's choices and her vulnerability start to get in the way, he's enough of a fucking adult to be like, hey, so I think you're doing this because you're feeling this. And I get that.

Speaker 5 But we're not going to let that shoot ourselves in the foot here. And I think there's just frankly something about that to anyone.
But I think a lot of women and a lot of women who

Speaker 5 spend time

Speaker 5 in the full swath of

Speaker 5 relationships with men and dating apps and all of that jazz, that just leaves a lot to salivate over. That's just, that's, that's a nice thing to see portrayed on screen.

Speaker 5 You heard it here first, fellas. Nothing sexier than communication.
Okay, but like, frankly, like, true.

Speaker 5 True. That, that is the, the thing.
I think that this is

Speaker 5 this relationship.

Speaker 5 And this is why I love that it was a TV series, but they made a very smart decision to make these episodes 20 to 30 minutes long, 20 minutes long, and something happens in every single one of them.

Speaker 5 They are short. They are eventful.
It doesn't feel like you're watching 10 movies, which would have been way too much.

Speaker 5 It feels like you're watching 10 TV episodes that all go together and give you just a little more time to sort of roll around in both the conflict and the resolution that any good rom-com is based upon.

Speaker 5 You know, they get together. They're almost torn apart.
They stay together. They are torn apart.
They come back together.

Speaker 5 And it's true that a lot of times the sort of emotional moments when they almost fall apart are because of Joanne's difficulty with being vulnerable.

Speaker 5 And they come back together because of Noah's aptitude for communication and maturity and understanding this person that he loves. But it's Noah's sort of

Speaker 5 lifestyle complications that nearly break them apart several times. And it's sort of Joanne's, I would say,

Speaker 5 like

Speaker 5 dynamicness and real commitment. Fortitude.
Yeah. Just like emotional fortitude, even though it's difficult for her

Speaker 5 how much she likes this guy. I really love about this relationship.
It's like, it is not enemies to lovers. It is immediate connection that they really

Speaker 5 like each other and

Speaker 5 they go all in. And even though this show is like silly and funny, there is something really realistic about the relationship.

Speaker 5 Well, and she has, it's funny because like he is so emotionally intelligent with her,

Speaker 5 but he has these relationships with other women in his life where he either doesn't quite know how to stand up for what he wants or he's not quite tuned into what's really going on.

Speaker 5 And

Speaker 5 that's where she shines, right? And not all of those, like we'll get there.

Speaker 5 Not all of those relationships and those characters, I think, are as fully fleshed out as the central characters but she's brilliant with the other women and he's brilliant with her

Speaker 5 and

Speaker 5 she sort of like he sort of brings her along in the relationship and then she sort of unlocks his ability to kind of like understand his whole world.

Speaker 5 And yes, she learns some things about, you know, what it is to be a rabbi and about Judaism in general. And we can talk about that.

Speaker 5 But she kind of like, it's sort of helps him understand how he fits into a world that he's maybe seen in a very like binary sense or something.

Speaker 5 So I don't think it shortchanges her on her ability to kind of like understand people and be emotionally intelligent in her own way. But I do think there's a little bit of like

Speaker 5 letting him do it because it's just like, frankly, very fun to watch on screen. Yeah.
I mean, he's a he's a he's a perfect TV boyfriend. It's, it's just,

Speaker 5 I'm so glad because Kristen Bell, we have gotten a lot of, you know, since Veronica Marsh. She has stayed on our television screens.
Like we've, we've gotten, and, and it's like, she's great.

Speaker 5 It's, it's never enough. But we, we haven't gotten a ton of Adam Brody, you know, I mean, he has been consistent.
He has been around. I like, I've liked him in a lot of things.

Speaker 5 But he, but like, he's just taken

Speaker 5 that much. I mean, I'm assuming by his own choice, which more power to you, Adam Brody.
But like the last thing that I saw him in, which again, I, that his commitment to playing like Jewish men

Speaker 5 is really there. Cause I think the last time I watched Adam Brody in something was Fleischman is in Trouble.
Yeah.

Speaker 5 I really loved him in the sort of like

Speaker 5 dark comedy horror movie Hide and Seek.

Speaker 5 He plays like a brother in this rich, insane family, and he's great in it. And once again, like

Speaker 5 showing through with this sort of complicated heart, like he, he just his,

Speaker 5 he, he really brings emotion to the screen with those big, soulful eyes. And I think these characters are quite well realized, these two main characters.

Speaker 5 I, I do quickly want to touch down on the other other probably two most realized characters, which are the main character siblings, Timothy Simons playing Noah's brother Sasha and Justine Lupe playing Joanne's sister Morgan, who she hosts the podcast with.

Speaker 5 Such good.

Speaker 5 Like again, this feels like in Promising Young Woman when also Adam Brody. Yeah, damn, he makes good choices.
He does. Like he does make, he makes smart choices and does really different things.

Speaker 5 I wonder if this is sort of a road to like a little bit more typical or more frequent roles if he wants them. I don't like know how old his children are.
Maybe that is something that's been going on.

Speaker 5 But from this point on, he could kind of do whatever he wants.

Speaker 5 But this casting of all four of these leads and supporting characters feels like that promising young woman casting where they were just like, we are going to trick you by taking all of these early aughts' heart throbs and turning them into monsters because you innately trust them.

Speaker 5 Timothy Simons, you innately think is an asshole because he's Jonah on Veep forever and forever. He comes into this show and he's, he's still kind of an asshole.

Speaker 5 Yeah, there's not zero Jonah in the chat. There's not an encounter.

Speaker 5 There's a Jonah line to Sasha, but he's like the best case scenario, Jonah. Yeah, it's like the lawful good version where like the sort of bumblingness is there, but he's trustworthy.

Speaker 5 He's sort of played at first, like he will just kind of be like a dum-dum jerk.

Speaker 5 But Timothy Simons is so good. And I always felt this in Veep.
He has this grin, like this smile that does really make you want to love him.

Speaker 5 And he even had it as Jonah, like a certain earnestness that occasionally I would be like, oh, you guys, be nice to him. And then he's just like the worst person alive.

Speaker 5 But now

Speaker 5 you're like, oh, you guys, be nice to him. And he actually is nice.
Like he's a, he is, he's a good brother. He's a good friend.
He's a good dad. He's a good husband.

Speaker 5 He's just, he's just kind of a dummy. And that's so pleasant.
It's so funny to watch on. But he even has his own, like, because here's the thing is like in Veep, there are really no heroes.

Speaker 5 And in this show, there are really no villains right like we should probably acknowledge that these two these two the characters who we're talking about sasha and morgan like their plot line is sort of light infidelity which is not good

Speaker 5 and yet i love them so much and i also don't feel like it ref like somehow I consumed that whole thing and was like, ah, yes.

Speaker 5 And this weird relationship does not reflect on Sasha as a father or a husband. And I continue to trust him innately.

Speaker 5 He's just dumb enough to not know what he's doing, which is that weaponized incompetence? Maybe, but like, don't worry about it. Don't worry about it.
It's a 10 episode rom-com and he's very tall.

Speaker 5 I mean, that's kind of the thing is you're always like, are they flirting or is he just so tall that she's standing under him like a tree? It is frequently said, why are you standing so close to me?

Speaker 5 Because he's so tall that it always feels like he's so close.

Speaker 5 and i mean i want to also shout out uh justine lupe from succession willa which is the only thing i'd ever seen her in before she's so good in this and she's so good that i still love the character while also acknowledging that she is like really mean she's yeah she's really mean to her sister her sister's sort of mean back to her but She's going through something.

Speaker 5 Like Morgan is

Speaker 5 going through something, watching her sister and her business partner. And much of that business is founded on them having interesting dating and sex lives that are mostly floundering.

Speaker 5 And we know she's been divorced in the past. That isn't touched on very much.
Like we, we know things about her, but the performance is so funny and winning. And really, so many of my favorite,

Speaker 5 I watched this series right when it came out. I re-watched it to chat about it with you today.

Speaker 5 And so many of my favorite scenes that I was looking forward to were between Morgan and Sasha because they're so weird. They're so weird and they're just so fucking funny.

Speaker 5 When she gets out of the car, he gives her a ride home because he's being nice. And she just keeps saying, This is so weird because it finally comes out that she doesn't have any male friends.

Speaker 5 And she clearly seems very confused about having any sort of platonic male relationship. And they, they sort of work it out in the car.
And you're kind of like, what's going on?

Speaker 5 And then she gets out of the car and she goes, two stars and flips him off with both hands.

Speaker 5 And he says,

Speaker 5 that's going to up my rating by two stars.

Speaker 5 The comedy is

Speaker 5 quick.

Speaker 5 And the chemistry is good between everyone. The show moves fast.
What else did you love about this series, Nora? I loved the basketball scene. I think, like, to me, the two scenes

Speaker 5 where I felt just exhilarated by the pace and the chemistry and the dialogue in a way that is just like everything that I want from a rom-com were the pilot and the scenes at the party and the basketball scene.

Speaker 5 They play a drinking game when

Speaker 5 Joanne calls Morgan in for help with Esther and the wags,

Speaker 5 and they are secretly, or at least secretly to the guys,

Speaker 5 drinking when they miss a basket. Like,

Speaker 5 I loved that scene so much. I thought it was so funny.
I just was, I was laughing out loud the entire time.

Speaker 5 And it is just the, it is the good, clean fun that I am looking for from my romantic comedies. And I felt that everyone involved in making this show understood that and delivered what was necessary.

Speaker 5 I loved that so much.

Speaker 5 This is another like deeply realistic thing is that if you are partnered with a man, I guess anyone, if you are partnered, you are going to have to watch that person do something that is deeply embarrassing and you're going to have to find a way to love it.

Speaker 5 And if that way is Tequila, great.

Speaker 5 Tequila and openly rooting for their demise. Right.

Speaker 5 But, but, Kristen Bell, and this is one of the things that her, that the sister Morgan really jumps on: is that like, you are changing for this man. You love basketball.

Speaker 5 You keep saying that you love basketball.

Speaker 5 And it does feel shameful to suddenly love something just because someone else loves it when that thing is like middle-aged guys in jerseys with a pun on them. But love is love.
The matzah ballers.

Speaker 5 The matzah ballers.

Speaker 5 And she starts out saying, I can barely look at you in that thing. And she ends up wearing it in bed after a game, which I was concerned about because you know he was sweating.

Speaker 5 But the fact of the matter is that this hot rabbi, Noah, has a lot to be in love with. Another thing that has gotten a lot of attention that

Speaker 5 I am in love with is the first kiss, which now the script has come out showing

Speaker 5 what was written out as the action and dialogue for this first kiss. And the action item was just, this is the best kiss that either of these people have ever had.

Speaker 5 I don't know if Adam Brody improv these lines, if they talked about them and came up with them in the moment, but what happens when these two decide and talk about that they might as well have one kiss before they say goodbye to each other forever.

Speaker 5 That's ultimately not what happens. He looks at her and he says, put down your ice cream, put down your bag.
And then he lays one on her with hands,

Speaker 5 not a feeling, not feely hands, hands on her face. There's a lot of hands-on face kissing.
And this is how you know that these two are meant to be.

Speaker 5 Because if someone puts their hands on your face to kiss you when you don't want them to kiss you, it is a very bad move. If you do want them to kiss you,

Speaker 5 excellent move. And it's always a risk you're taking if you're a hands-on face kisser.
But he knows. He knows

Speaker 5 he's taking charge. And I will say, I think in that,

Speaker 5 in the

Speaker 5 photos of the script that they've put online,

Speaker 5 it has that she puts down the ice cream in the bag, but it has it in the format of like a stage direction of she's going to do this.

Speaker 5 And so I give, I give him all the credit for choosing to work that into the dialogue and say, put down your ice cream, put down your bag, which, like, that's giving the people what they want. Right.

Speaker 5 Because I love,

Speaker 5 I love saying that the sexiest thing a man can do is communicate. I hesitate to say the sexiest thing a man can be is confident because that is typically taken the wrong way.

Speaker 5 But in this moment, when he's like, put down your bag, this kiss is about to be so good. You're going to want all your limbs free.
That's pretty good. Likewise, I think

Speaker 5 one of the most telling and just sort of like relatable moments, definitely, I think the scene other than the kiss that has gone sort of the most viral from this show is the monologue from Joanne.

Speaker 5 when she's finally figuring out what it is that's stopping her from leaning into this relationship.

Speaker 5 And her sister, her mean sister, basically tells her that she's her mom, that people think that her mom is too, they think their mom is too much and everyone's scared of their mom and what wild things she's going to say next.

Speaker 5 And that Joanne is

Speaker 5 just like that and that she sort of scares men off. And so, you know, the obvious thing is you.

Speaker 5 you leave before you can scare anyone off because then you never have it confirmed to you that you're scaring them off.

Speaker 5 And so, but Noah's just begging her and begging her to stay and to, and to lean into this and to be serious. And he tells her he doesn't want a fun thing.
He wants a serious thing.

Speaker 5 And kind of, what is she scared of? And she says, I'm realizing my biggest fear is that I will become emotionally dependent on a guy who will one day realize I'm too much and break my heart.

Speaker 5 And she says this with her back to him because it is so difficult for her to say

Speaker 5 that she can't look him in the eye. But there's a little moment from Kristen Bell that I love that after she says it, she gives this kind of small smile.

Speaker 5 Like to have just admitted it to herself and to have said it out loud actually is healing something.

Speaker 5 And he does this thing that I love that in between her saying, I'm realizing my biggest fear. And she sort of takes a big breath.

Speaker 5 He comes up behind her and puts his arms around her because he so badly doesn't want her to have this fear that doesn't want her to be

Speaker 5 nor I cried. It doesn't take much, but I cried.
It's a great little piece of writing. It really, that really was a very cute little gesture of like, I'm going to, okay, you want to be turned around.

Speaker 5 You can, if that's what this takes for you to do this, like

Speaker 5 go do that, but I'm going to, I will be here. I will touch you in some way.
Like, I will communicate presence. I will put my hands on your face.

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Speaker 5 My final thing that I love, and probably like not my favorite episode because it's a little bit hard to watch, but there's a whole episode about the ick,

Speaker 5 about Joanne getting the ick from Noah. Finally, like he's this perfect guy, and she's just waiting for the other shoe to drop.
Her sister is definitely waiting for the other shoe to drop.

Speaker 5 And turns out that shoe is that he finds out last minute that he's going to be meeting her parents.

Speaker 5 And he was cool with like being casual and meeting the sister while watching Vanderpump Rules and eating chips.

Speaker 5 When he finds out the parents are coming, he says, I have to get a sport coat and he won't stop calling it a sport coat, which is very difficult for her. He says, I have to get flowers.

Speaker 5 And the only flowers he can find are just the most giant bunch of sunflowers that like no one has a vase large enough for, and that the sister has to get a plastic prego jar, prego pasta sausage jar to put him in, and he can't stop saying a prego, prego in an Italian accent.

Speaker 5 All these icks are stacked on top of each other.

Speaker 5 But the biggest ick of all, which is, of course, not an ick, but a childhood trauma, is that he wants to impress her parents who are separated at a time when she is feeling particularly frustrated by her parents.

Speaker 5 Her dad has come out later in life, leading to the separation of her parents.

Speaker 5 This is difficult for her mom because she is still in love with the dad, but she tries to be cool and fine about it, which results in her sort of screeching in a sing-song happy voice and being overly Earth Mother, as is her way.

Speaker 5 And the dad has brought his new partner who he is incredibly affectionate with.

Speaker 5 And the girls are,

Speaker 5 it's, it's stated a little bit explicitly, but not incredibly explicitly.

Speaker 5 But it becomes clear this is difficult for them to watch because their dad has never shown them that kind of affection and they always wanted it. I love this because the ick is real, sure.
Like

Speaker 5 you like a guy, you're attracted to a guy, and then you see him run in a backpack or you see him chase after after a ping pong ball, as is one of the listed.

Speaker 5 Such a good example. There's such good examples because generally what the ick is, is just like

Speaker 5 internalized patriarchy, you know, it's generally just like seeing a man in a way you sort of don't want to see him because you've been socialized to believe that you shouldn't see a man like that.

Speaker 5 portrayed in a very specific way, like seeing a man run in a backpack. It's like, it's something extremely earnest where the man is extremely vulnerable, and it turns you off.
And like, that is real.

Speaker 5 But what this episode says is that, like, the ick does not have control over you. You have control over the ick.

Speaker 5 And you can say that you are briefly not attracted to someone because you watch them chase a ping pong ball under a table.

Speaker 5 But if you are saying that you're getting quote unquote the ick because a man is being nice to your parents, Joanne, you're going to have to dig a little deeper on that one.

Speaker 5 The ick is coming from inside the house. That's right.
And it's knocking loud.

Speaker 5 And she does with the help of the man that she is trying to turn away and reject because he's being overly nice to her parents.

Speaker 5 He goes through the things and he's like, it was a sport coat, wasn't it? Yes.

Speaker 5 The flowers were too big, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And he's like, okay, I get that, but I'm not going to apologize for the fact that I wanted your parents to like me.

Speaker 5 But I can tell that there's a lot going on with your family right now. And I think you might be feeling something related to that.
And then boom, the ick goes poof.

Speaker 5 He has neutralized the ick with his truth bombs. He, and he says, I understand why you have your guard up, but Joanne, I'm on your side.

Speaker 5 And to like be experiencing this tumultuous family moment that is also being played like it's fine.

Speaker 5 So it's like, you're feeling all these things, but but it's, but everyone's acting like everything is fine, is extremely isolating. And she feels, I think she feels extremely alone in this moment.

Speaker 5 She has her sister who agrees with her, but who also struggles to be vulnerable. And to hear a man or person that you are falling in love with in that moment say, I'm on your side.

Speaker 5 That's a partner, you know, like that's, that's when you're looking down the barrel of like, that's when you fall in love.

Speaker 5 If I, like, if my fiance and I argue, the number one thing that we will say to each other to like get out of the mindset of,

Speaker 5 I feel like I'm not getting what I want and you feel, like, we will literally have a thing where we will look at each other and be like, hold on, same team. And it is like a really powerful.

Speaker 5 tool of just like, don't you make me cry on this podcast, Nora.

Speaker 5 Don't you I want you like I'm we're teammates like we are partnered in wanting the best for each other and like I, it really, that's obviously not a, a unique thing.

Speaker 5 Like, that makes a lot of sense in conflict resolution. But, like, when that moment happened on this show, I was like, no, this is like literally how I solve problems.

Speaker 5 Because it's universal. And you're, there's nothing like being like, oh, none of my experiences are unique when they feel so unique.

Speaker 5 Because like that kind of moment, that kind of tension in a relationship is so heightened and means so much to the individuals involved.

Speaker 5 To see it portrayed on screen like that by two gorgeous, beautiful, perfect actors, you're like, oh, yeah, that's me. I'm Kristen Bay.
I was like, oh, it's me.

Speaker 5 This is a show about me.

Speaker 5 You could pick me up and spin me like a pizza dough. That's me.
That's it. It's exact.
I love being portrayed on screen like this. I know that millennial women are obsessed with this show.

Speaker 5 I hope that a younger generation is watching it too, because I think that that could solve a lot of relationship qualms to just kind of get this sort of understanding of this phrase, the ick, which is like like really, really, I think, taken over.

Speaker 5 And you see that with her sister Morgan being like, you got the ick, you can't get away from it. I saw you, I saw your face.
You hate him now. You got to break up with him.

Speaker 5 It's just like the devil on her shoulder. And she gets through it.
Okay,

Speaker 5 Nora, before we get into a situationship, wrap us up with the final thing that you're in love with about this show. Oh, just simply the sheer volume of Heim.
And who could resist?

Speaker 5 Who could resist? A millennial woman dog whistle. Maybe zillennial oh we're jewish women from los angeles

Speaker 5 uh ding ding ding ding ding everybody's favorite band uh i i loved it i just was like

Speaker 5 because i'm sure i'm sure they loved it too like i'm sure heim was super happy to be involved in this in some way um and so i was just very tickled by that you bring up a great point which is that uh this show is so la core it's it's very i mean spoken by someone who doesn't like you know know a ton about LA.

Speaker 5 See you there next week, by the way.

Speaker 5 It's very LA. They really lean into that, except, of course, that all of the characters are so rich.
And they are a rabbi and

Speaker 5 a podcaster. And everyone.
Well, well, well, well, well, well, well. But the rabbi has family money, an independently wealthy rabbi.
Yeah, they have family money from like real estate, it seems like.

Speaker 5 Unclear. Doesn't really get into it.
But yeah, the one that was really egregious was their podcast manager or their producer or whoever she is, her house

Speaker 5 where she takes the meeting. And it's when Joanne is working from

Speaker 5 in bed and they're talking about how she's working from her bed. Meanwhile, the woman on the other end of the Zoom is like sitting outside on this just like massive

Speaker 5 pool deck

Speaker 5 overlooking a canyon or whatever. There's a fireplace.
There's like, like it's an $18 million house. At one point, that sort of agent woman who is played by Sherry Cola, who has a great

Speaker 5 small role in this,

Speaker 5 says when the sisters are arguing, she's like, I'm going to have to sell my eggs. Right.
Like, how about you sell your house? Yeah. Or like probably just a couple of stocks and bonds that you have.

Speaker 5 They're worth seven trillion dollars. Man.
Right. Like she's throwing like this glamorous dinner party in the first.

Speaker 5 And she says in that dinner party, we don't have enough forks for everyone, which I will say that was another moment when I was like, oh, I haven't had a unique experience in my entire life because I have historically never had enough forks.

Speaker 5 If we're going over eight. Somebody's using a soup spoon to cut the steak.
I'm so sorry. Also, it's not a steak.
It's a vegetarian lasagna. We got it.

Speaker 5 Get into what we are a little less decided on, feeling a little bit more of situationship vibes. On Nora, I am dying to know what you think about the portrayal of podcasting in this television series.

Speaker 5 This is a real, watching the show is a real, is this fucking play about us moment?

Speaker 5 I mean, so

Speaker 5 i have no complaints that aren't in the service of better television i will say i think um

Speaker 5 kai grady the fabulous producer who's producing this episode for us right now any of the other fabulous producers at the ringer uh probably would have some notes about microphone placement also the general concept of having a producer

Speaker 5 There are just like full scenes when they're recording the show and their mom is just sitting next to them and she chimes in. She doesn't have a microphone.

Speaker 5 Every like no one is sitting in a way where they are positioned so that they're speaking into the microphone. It's just the microphone is like somewhere nearby.

Speaker 5 All of this, of course, would contribute to horrible audio quality, something that, you know, we would never, we would never give you. But in general, like, I don't know.

Speaker 5 I don't, I didn't think it was like a ridiculous way to, to showcase podcasting as a job.

Speaker 5 Like I thought the whole, the way they talked about like, oh, we're, we're maybe trying to have the show get acquired. Is this dinner with an important person or not? Like all of that rang

Speaker 5 certainly as true as I needed it to for it not to get in the way of enjoying the show. And that is speaking as someone who does this for a living.

Speaker 5 So I feel like if it didn't bother us, like it probably didn't bother anyone, even though there were objectively some moments that were absolutely absurd. Totally agree.

Speaker 5 I think, in terms of podcasters that we've seen on screen, it's like Sarah Jessica Parker and the Sex in the City reboot, where they basically just pretend that podcasting is radio.

Speaker 5 She has like a live call-in show, and then it's like only murders in the building. You know, we've seen some sort of portrayals of true crime podcasters on television.

Speaker 5 The first of all, calling a podcast nobody wants this is hilarious. I have some questions about calling the show that, but I think calling a podcast that is very funny.
I agree.

Speaker 5 It's a, I thought it was a weird name for the show. It didn't like, like, I, I think you have to work a little too hard to be like, oh, haha.

Speaker 5 Like, yeah, I get how that really, she feels like nobody wants what she's offering and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But it like, it didn't, I don't know that it felt like the right name for the show.

Speaker 5 It's also like very funny now now that the show has been renewed for a second season. Like, nobody wants this has been renewed for a second season.
Everybody wants this.

Speaker 5 I mean, I guess, like, the maybe the idea is that the headlines write themselves, but in terms of everybody wanting this, the Foster Sisters real life podcast is called something like the first ever podcast in the world, which is also a funny name for a podcast.

Speaker 5 But in terms of the podcast as it's portrayed on the show, an absolute affront to professionals like Kai Grady.

Speaker 5 I would say an absolute compliment to professionals like us. Yeah.
That these like cool, effortless girls sitting on a couch. I was like, y'all, that

Speaker 5 posture is not sustainable. If you're going to be doing this all the time, you can't just be sitting crisscross applesauce on

Speaker 5 this lumpy couch. I need to see you in yoga.

Speaker 5 I need to see you sitting up straight in your office chair with lumbar support purchased for you by Spotify once you get acquired. Like this is, this is the state of podcasting.

Speaker 5 But in terms, something that I really liked and related to is the sort of,

Speaker 5 there's a sort of leading with shame around the fact, especially from that we get from Joanne around her podcast.

Speaker 5 And she's always wanting to, again, to get out out in front of it, to make clear that, like, this is not just a podcast about sex. It's about empowering women.

Speaker 5 It's about making them feel more confident. It's about me being honest so that other people can be honest, so that we can share with each other.

Speaker 5 And the other sexiest thing a man can do is just get that, is just like have no questions,

Speaker 5 exert absolutely no

Speaker 5 shame and like nothing but celebration towards her career. I love that about their characters that they are just so immediately supportive and understanding about one another's careers.

Speaker 5 Like, you love this thing. So, I understand that it is a lovable thing and it is a worthwhile thing.
And I understand what you're doing and I support it.

Speaker 5 That's like what I found most sort of realistic about the podcasting element is how much she thinks about it.

Speaker 5 You know, like how much she wants to be good at it, wants to be better, like really sees it as a job.

Speaker 5 The instinct to justify it somehow and be like, oh, well, like, I host a podcast, but like, not the bad kind. Right.
I swear it's like, it's, it's worthy of being taken seriously.

Speaker 5 Like, I think we are now like venturing into perhaps navel-gazing territory, but I think that that is relatable to all of us.

Speaker 5 And I think probably relatable to a lot of people who do things that are either like adjacent to

Speaker 5 pop culture or

Speaker 5 things that are that can be trivialized in the way that so many things that appeal to women often are

Speaker 5 there's like this instinct to be like yeah but it actually does have some some bigger meaning like it's important for these reasons and the fact that he gets that is again appealing absolutely okay The other thing that I'm in a situationship with, we've touched on a bit, is what was going on with that Sasha Morgan dynamic?

Speaker 5 Like, what are we supposed to be experiencing there?

Speaker 5 Is that being set up

Speaker 5 for season two? It's such an interesting little storyline that like they absolutely did not have to do. It's, it's quite separate.

Speaker 5 It is intriguing. And I was like, Am I supposed to be rooting for infidelity here? Because these two have a lot of chemistry, but also I love Sasha's wife, Esther.
Like, I, she's a great character.

Speaker 5 She, she grows like throughout the,

Speaker 5 throughout the 10, 10 episodes, you, you get to know her more. And I really like their relationship.
Like, she is a lot, he is a lot. They are in love.

Speaker 5 Like, there's never a question that they are like in love. good and they like get each other who like and love each other.
Yeah.

Speaker 5 What you, what'd you make of that?

Speaker 5 So I do wonder if they're setting up a season two, just because I think that dynamic between the two of them, I think it would have been like, I think it would have worked and it would have been fun to watch and it still would have been like funny if it was all a big misunderstanding, right?

Speaker 5 Like if there really was nothing,

Speaker 5 you know, quasi flirtatious or anything going on there, but they just like. they got along, they were friends, but

Speaker 5 he was scared to tell Esther or whatever. And she was just sort of feeling weird because she's figuring out this, like, can I actually be friends with a man thing?

Speaker 5 I think that would have worked, but I do think they chose not to do that based on

Speaker 5 one, the fact that she shares with her sister that she had a sex dream about the brother at one point, which like was very funny, but

Speaker 5 that didn't play to me as

Speaker 5 her own process of figuring out if she can actually have a platonic relationship with a guy, it felt like it was sort of setting something up.

Speaker 5 And then the way that it ends, the season ends, spoiler alert, of course, but the season ending based on

Speaker 5 the realization for Esther that Sasha and Morgan know each other, text, have communication, have some sort of relationship, felt like it was setting that up to be a big part of season two, which, like, I honestly have mixed feelings about because, like you said, I love Esther.

Speaker 5 So, I don't want their dynamic to kind of be pitted against her. And two, because I just think that their dynamic like works even if it's not romantic, right?

Speaker 5 Yeah.

Speaker 5 And

Speaker 5 we'll see. I mean,

Speaker 5 it feels one-sided. Like, it feels like the sister is feeling something that she kind of didn't know that she could feel for like a certain type of guy.

Speaker 5 If I were Esther and I saw some five foot tin woman across the way playfully stealing my husband's cocktail out of his hands, I might also say, Shirley Timmy.

Speaker 5 We got to get rid of these fucking sisters. Yeah, his, excuse me, his virgin cocktail is Shirley Temple.
He is California sober, but it's going to be interesting to watch in season two.

Speaker 5 Nora, as we wrap up, you've mentioned a couple of times some storytelling things. Were there things in this series that you want to break up with?

Speaker 5 Yeah, I mean, look, I think there's been some criticism of some of the portrayals of

Speaker 5 Judaism and Jewish women in particular in this show.

Speaker 5 I'm not Jewish. I think, you know, it's in some ways not totally for me to say how much of an issue that is.

Speaker 5 I certainly hear where those concerns come from. I think the mother in particular is like very one note as a character.

Speaker 5 I do kind of give the show the benefit of the doubt that to me, at least it feels like those issues

Speaker 5 are based in the format of doing this as a TV show,

Speaker 5 where sometimes you just simply do not have very much time to set something up and you need to set something up.

Speaker 5 clearly enough so that we know that this character has this character trait and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. He needs to break up with Rebecca in the beginning.
So she has to do something pretty bad.

Speaker 5 And what is the thing that she did, Nora? She

Speaker 5 discovers

Speaker 5 by breaking into his drawer an engagement ring and then starts wearing it before he's proposed.

Speaker 5 And then it turns out that she's also like talked to his mom about venues and she has completely robbed him of the romance of a proposal. And,

Speaker 5 you know,

Speaker 5 robbed him of a ring. I mean, she stole the ring.
Yeah, she did kind of steal jewelry.

Speaker 5 But then I think over time, like for the rest of the show,

Speaker 5 that character in very limited screen time is allowed to recover a little bit and

Speaker 5 ultimately come off as a more three-dimensional character. There is some

Speaker 5 whiplash of like, that's clearly an awful thing to do and make someone seem so unromantic and so like

Speaker 5 just like not a good partner that it it

Speaker 5 it sets her up for sort of a weird arc, obviously. And you know, the same thing with the mother where she has to function a lot of the time as just kind of like

Speaker 5 a barrier between

Speaker 5 these two people being together.

Speaker 5 I don't want to be too overly critical of things that I think basically come down to the fact that these are 20 minute episodes and there's only so much that you can do.

Speaker 5 I have, I have one exception that I just do think is, is unforgivable, which is just like, Kristen Bell, has she ever met a Jewish person?

Speaker 5 Like, this is an adult woman who has a career based in some ways on like kind of knowing about the world and knowing about society and culture. She doesn't know that prosciutto is pork.

Speaker 5 and dating different people. Like, she's never dated a Jewish man.
She's never met a Jewish man. She's never met a Jewish man.

Speaker 5 She doesn't know what Shalom means.

Speaker 5 She lives in Los Angeles. There are two absolutely egregious moments that you have mentioned when she absolutely earnestly asks,

Speaker 5 and what does Shalom mean? And so sorry, it's kind of like a comedic moment. Like, and, and, and so, sorry, real quick, what does Shalom mean? It's like, goral.

Speaker 5 I mean, everybody knows what shalom means.

Speaker 5 Like, if you, it's just, it's a great, and and then the one gift that she brings to the family is a charcuterie board covered in prosciutto, which she says she thought was beef.

Speaker 5 This woman's apartment is too nice to not be intimately familiar with prosciutto. Like it's just, yes.

Speaker 5 These are, these are strange storytelling. shortcuts.

Speaker 5 And it's, it's where I, I, I would slightly disagree on like the, like the, the 20 minute runtime, because they, they do a lot with that 20-minute runtime to bring a lot of color to these male characters.

Speaker 5 And so, there is this thing where, like, um, Esther Zuckerman wrote a great piece in Time, uh, where she, she talks about this sort of, um, perception of non-Jewish women, the shiksa, as is often identified within the show, being idolized by Jewish men in pop culture.

Speaker 5 And then the contrast to that, that,

Speaker 5 I think it would have been really easy to address that, to be like, oh, these Jewish men are obsessed with these blonde, non-Jewish women without making the Jewish women like the ultimate barrier.

Speaker 5 Like Jewish women are constantly presented as sort of like barriers to the main character's happiness and not fun.

Speaker 5 Yeah, and not fun. You like, you, you go through it with,

Speaker 5 I mean, at one point the, the mom says, I'm funny. Like she has to say it.
She's like, I know you don't see me as funny, but I am funny.

Speaker 5 Yeah, because we're not, it's not, it's not really being. I'm not setting you up for that.
Yeah, it's telling, not

Speaker 5 showing.

Speaker 5 So

Speaker 5 there's room for improvement. I think that's absolutely true.
I don't think this is totally true with the mom.

Speaker 5 I do think that a little bit with Rebecca and then definitely with Esther, I think by the end, they've done

Speaker 5 something to round her out and make her seem like a character that you love. I mean, look, like if I'm choosing a person from the show to get a drink with, I would choose Esther.

Speaker 5 And a lot of that is in thanks to the performance of Jackie Tone, who is very funny and gives just like a lot, a lot to the role.

Speaker 5 But I think that's why it makes it like especially a little nerve-wracking there at the end, that it seems like she's been turned even more against these sort of main character sisters.

Speaker 5 But we'll see how it all plays out because the happy ever after that always comes in a rom-com is that these two, at least for now, end up together. It's pretty tentative, honestly.
Like the

Speaker 5 Joanne has said that she'll convert and then she realizes she is making that judgment a little too hastily and she doesn't want to make noah choose between his religion and her and so she basically chooses for him and breaks up with him she says don't run after me and he does a bus pulls away there is seth cohen slash adam brody waiting for her breathing heavy because he literally ran um to basically say i choose you which is bold and i will say the the

Speaker 5 panting post sprint to get where he needs to be to tell this woman something he needs to share from the bottom of his heart. That, I mean, that's some Seth Cohen bullshit.
Absolutely. Oh, that.

Speaker 5 Oh, yeah, it is. And those are, those are the lungs of a teenager.
I'm sorry. I'm so sorry.
I saw that man play basketball.

Speaker 5 He did not run from the venue to the parking lot and beat the coach bus that she rode on. But they do say together, it has been renewed for a season two.

Speaker 5 Interestingly, there are going to be new showrunners.

Speaker 5 Ginny Connor, who is most notably from Girls and a Jewish woman, and Bruce Eric Kaplan, also from Girls. I mean, I love girls, so this seems like a step in the right direction for me.

Speaker 5 Yeah, I mean, I think there's a little bit of, and like the Fosters are staying as executive producers.

Speaker 5 I think there's some amount of like don't mess with success reaction from me, but I love girls. I think

Speaker 5 if there's going to be new people, I think that seems like an exciting choice.

Speaker 5 And I, I'm, I'm mostly just happy that they're bringing it back. Until I watched the final episode, I did not expect that this was even a show shooting for a season two.

Speaker 5 I thought that this was a mini series. Yeah.
I didn't know that Kristen Bell would want to sign on for another long-running show.

Speaker 5 I mean, this is not network television, but it is still a second season. But I'm thrilled.

Speaker 5 And mostly I'm thrilled for the future of rom-com TV, which I think following Starstruck, and which if you have not watched on HBO, please go log on immediately.

Speaker 5 Excellent rom-com television series and the success of Nobody Wants This.

Speaker 5 The future's looking bright.

Speaker 5 Yeah, I think it's not even like TV, right? It's like, whether it's TV or it's a movie,

Speaker 5 it's rom-coms that just are willing to be rom-coms on their own merits.

Speaker 5 Filmmakers are in TV too.

Speaker 5 Like there's sort of the sense of it's a played out format and therefore everybody needs to come up with a way to like twist it on its head or be a little bit cheeky about it or kind of like make meta commentary on the art of the rom-com.

Speaker 5 And I think this is like a really good data point to suggest you don't need to do that.

Speaker 5 So many people love romantic comedies. Just make a good one and people will eat it the fuck up.

Speaker 5 And I hope if there was one takeaway for people who have the power to make TV, make, you know, Netflix miniseries, make movies, whatever, it's that.

Speaker 5 It's just like, if you make a great rom-com, people will come. If you have a great podcast, you don't have to explain it to a man.

Speaker 5 And if you make a great rom-com, you make a great rom-com and we're going to want to watch it right here on the Prestige TV podcast. Nora, thank you so much for joining me.

Speaker 5 Thank you to Kai Grady for producing and we'll see you back here next time. Bye.

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