The Fight Of Your Life — Libby Caswell E5

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Drew and Sue and Eminem's Minis.

And baking the surprise birthday cake for Lou.

And Sue forgetting that her oven doesn't really work.

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And Drew and Sue using the rest of the tubes of Eminem's Minis as party poppers instead.

I think this is one of those moments where people say, it's the thought that counts.

MMs, it's more fun together.

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This is like septic.

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And she knew just what to do.

And I called the hospital and said she's coming in, here are her labs.

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I see my role at United Healthcare as a life-saving role.

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iHeart originals.

This is an iHeart Original.

This story might be hard to hear.

There's detailed talk of suicide and violence.

But we think it's important not to gloss over the reality of what happened to Libby Caswell.

Please take care while listening.

December 4th.

That was our last visit together.

Colleen Huff was Libby's parent aide, a professional assigned by the state to monitor her visits with her son Zaeve and help her work towards regaining custody.

Each week, they'd meet at Cindy's house.

Colleen tells me that Libby would often arrive at these visits excited and happy, as it was the only time she would get to see Zave.

But on this date, December 4th, a week before her death, Libby is in a state of panic.

She was like really upset and she was shaking and she just, she looked at her appearance.

I mean, she was just a mess.

And, you know, I knew something was very, very

different.

Colleen's instincts are right.

After some coaxing, Libby tells her that just a few hours earlier, Devin attacked her on the bed, strangling her.

They had been staying with one of Devin's family friends, Gary Stevens, who happened to witness the incident.

So when I opened up the door, I seen Devin was on top of Libby and he was choking her.

Back at her mom's house, Libby tries to calm down.

She was shaking, so I knew she was afraid.

For years, Libby had kept Devin's abuse mostly hidden, only sharing bits and pieces with certain friends.

But today is different.

Telling Colleen about the strangulation is the only time I know of where she actually reported an act of violence to someone in a position of authority.

And Colleen immediately jumps into action.

I called all the shelters in Kansas City to try to find her a safe place to go.

While Colleen's making phone calls, Libby tries to push aside her distress and connect with Zave.

She cooks him pancakes and changes his outfit.

And eventually, Colleen lines up a bed for Libby at a domestic violence shelter run by the Hope House.

I found a shelter with availability.

I cleared the rest of my schedule.

After the supervised visit, after she got to spend time with her son, she was going to go with me.

I felt like she needed to be in a safe place.

There's a fire through your window

so why do she mind

from iHeart Podcast I'm Melissa Jeltson and this is what happened to Libby Caswell

I can't tell you a single time at night that she'd ever have her blinds open because she always was looking over her shoulder, always.

This is not a homicide, this is a suicide.

All she wanted to do was clean up and get away from him.

She started jumping through all the hoops.

She was like, I know what I need to do now.

And from there,

the last time I saw him, I couldn't even tell you which direction he went.

Somebody dropped the ball.

Watching the water

arise

while I sink tonight

Washing the water

Chapter 5 The Fight of Your Life

December 4th, 2017 was supposed to be a happy day for the Caswell family.

Libby's sister, Natalie, had just given birth to her first child, and this was the day she was coming home from the hospital.

We pulled up to the house and my dad helped me carry, you know, all my bags and stuff in the door.

But the welcome Natalie gets from her family is not at all what she imagined.

Libby is at Cindy's house and she's deeply distraught.

As soon as I walked in the door, she was standing in the living room with my mom and Colleen, and she was just crying, like really upset about something and at the time I didn't know why she was crying.

Then I started hearing what they were talking about.

They were talking about he did something to her and that's why she was so upset.

And so I was like, what's going on?

And so they started telling me about how she was late to her visit because they were at Devin's stepdad's house and he

heard them arguing and walked into the bedroom where they were staying and Devin was on top of Libby choking her.

Despite the circumstances, Libby tries her best to celebrate her sister.

We were in the kitchen and she was asking me questions about the baby and my birth and all that.

But Libby can't hide her fear over what had just happened to her and what might happen next.

Her voice was shaky and I was like, why don't you just come home?

I don't, I don't, like we could tell him you're not here.

She just kept saying, like, no, I can't do that.

And I said, well, why?

Like, give me a reason.

Why can't you do that?

I don't understand.

And she said, well, because you don't understand what would happen.

If I stay here, he would know I'm here.

And it's not safe for you.

And it's not safe for Zaye.

You don't know what he would do.

And I have to stay with him to keep him away.

But there is another option, the domestic violence shelter.

Colleen had found Libby a placement at a nearby shelter run by the Hope House.

It felt like a good compromise, an escape from Devon that kept her and her family safe.

Libby agrees to go after her visit with Zaev, but there's a catch.

Colleen would have to escort Libby to the police station first, then the police would take Libby to the shelter.

This is the standard protocol for the intake process at Hope House.

The CEO of Hope House told me that the police are are involved in order to protect staff and new clients during what is often a tense and highly charged moment.

But in Libby's experience, involving the police meant risking a fine or arrest.

It meant being called uncooperative, a nuisance.

At the end of the visit, she changed her mind

and

decided not to go.

Libby didn't say why.

Nobody knows if it was her distrust of police, if she was worried about Devin's reaction, or something else.

And it's possible that if Libby had spoken up about her hesitations, there could have been a different solution.

You know, I tried to talk her into it, but that was...

Well,

if I had to do it all over again, I would have thrown her over my shoulders and put her in my car and made her follow through with that, but she didn't.

And that's the last time I ever saw her.

Libby leaves her mom's house alone at the end of her visit.

She walks out of the front door and drives off in her Black Ford fusion.

I just assumed that I would see her again on Monday so I kind of went about, you know, my life with my newborn.

I think about that a lot, how I don't have any pictures of them together.

They only met one time and didn't really think much of it because I thought she'd be back.

But Libby never made it to that next scheduled visit with Zave.

The following Monday, that was the day her body was discovered.

The next seven days marked the last of Libby's life.

It's hard to know exactly where she was or what she was doing because she didn't see her family again.

Her phone, which would have offered insight into her whereabouts and communications, was never retrieved by police.

But I've been able to gather bits and pieces of what happened during those days from talking to others.

At some point, Libby reconnects with Devin.

My guess is that it was pretty soon after she left Cindy's house.

And it seems to me, based on how her family described her behavior, that she had recently relapsed.

The couple would have had nowhere to stay.

Gary had kicked them out.

Cindy refused to have Devin in her home.

I heard from some friends that they may have stayed in an abandoned house house and also rented a room at another motel in town.

On Thursday, four days before her death, Libby's car is stolen, allegedly by an acquaintance.

She manages to get it back fairly quickly, but it's in rough shape.

And then, one day that week, I couldn't confirm exactly which, Devin has an encounter with a man at his father's house who accuses Devin of stealing his drugs.

The man's furious and reportedly ripping at Devin's shirt, pushing him around.

Then, on Sunday, the day before Libby's death, Devin and Libby meet up for a few hours with Nathan, Libby's childhood friend.

They all drive around town in Libby's car, listening to music and smoking pot.

Nothing about this seems out of the ordinary to Nathan.

This is one of those days that I would have never thought that they were arguing or anything.

I mean, it seemed perfect.

She was all about him and he was all about her.

Until they stop for gas and Devin goes in to pay.

And the second Libby is alone with her friend, her cheerful demeanor drops.

Libby looked at me and said, Nathan,

I don't think I feel safe with Devin anymore.

Like,

I don't know.

Something just seems off right now.

In the brief moment they have together, Nathan offers to have Libby stay with him, but she declines.

Devin gets back in the car and they're off again.

And Libby switches to how she'd been acting before happy carefree

hearing nathan's story i'm struck by how raw this moment of vulnerability is especially for someone like libby so practiced at hiding what she's going through it seems to me like it's a cry for help

it was literally the night before

she died and she waited until he went inside the quick trips to pay for gas.

I wish I could go back in time and go stay with her at that hotel.

Eventually, Libby and Devin drop Nathan back off at home and continue on their journey.

Around this time, on Sunday evening, Cindy is worried about Libby and repeatedly sending her messages.

She wants to know if Libby is going to make it to her scheduled appointment with Xavier and Colleen, her parent aide, the following morning.

She messages her, Are you gonna be here?

Colleen is expecting you at 9.30 a.m.

Libby replies, I know, mom.

I need to be straight when I come see him.

Those are the last words Cindy would receive from her daughter.

At some point in the wee hours of Monday morning, Libby and Devon arrive at the sports stadium inn.

Along with their friend Nick, they hang out in the parking lot for a bit.

There, they meet another another guest, David Fristo.

He was the one who encouraged Devin to call 911 after Libby's death.

In his conversation with police, Fristo told them he hadn't interacted much with the couple when they first arrived, except some friendly hellos.

When I tracked Fristo down five years later, though, he had more to say.

Hello?

Hello?

Hey, it's Morso.

Okay, I'm gonna go outside on the porch.

I asked Fristo to walk me through what he remembered from his encounter with Devin, Libby, and Nick.

He'd been asleep in his room and woken up by the sound of people talking.

Only reason I went out there and talked to them, because they was exactly right in front of my door, my window, and they was talking so loud and making so much racket that I just got up and went out there, you know, because I'm thinking that they was out there arguing and but they wasn't.

They was out there just having fun talking.

You weren't annoyed that they were like waking you up when you had to go.

No, no, no, no, no, no.

I don't, I don't, no.

But

because it happens all the time when you stay at a motel like that, because it's always something going on.

Fristo told me that they all hung out for a bit in the parking lot.

I'm a person that'll talk to anybody.

I'll talk to a brick wall, you know, so I just went out there and was talking and telling them, you know, we're just talking about everything, anything and everything.

We was talking like what most men talk about you know sports and stuff like that we was talking about football baseball was Devin and the other guy Nick doing most of the talking or was Lippy as as actively in the conversation

not as much she didn't really

voice her opinion about anything really

still Fristo's impression of the couple was that they seemed fine good even i thought they was actually married they both seemed really happy.

I know that much.

They wasn't arguing.

You can kind of sense if somebody's arguing and fighting, but it didn't feel that way to me.

I can't help but think about how Libby also seemed fine to Nathan, one of her close friends, until they got a moment alone and her whole facade crumbled.

It's hard to say because people can put on a good act, you know what I mean?

I don't know.

It's hard to judge people.

I know Libby made at least one more attempt to reach out for help.

I may have been one of the last ones to speak to her on the phone anyway.

At some point, when Devin was out of earshot, she picked up her phone and called her friend Brian.

Basically, that phone call was her telling me that she was at a hotel.

Devin had taken her there or she had met him there or something.

I'm not really sure.

But she didn't feel safe and wanted me to come pick her up.

And it was a very brief call.

It probably didn't last more than two or three minutes.

But best of my recollection, she said,

he's here.

I have to go.

I'll call you back.

I'll call you right back as soon as I can.

I was like, promise me you're going to call me back.

And she said, I promise and click.

And that was it.

And that was the last I spoke to her.

Your drive powers your day.

Now let it power change in your community too.

And when it comes to helping children in the Bay Area, Shell can keep your kindness rolling.

When you fill up at the Purple Giving Pump at Shell, a portion of your purchase is donated to charities like the California Fire Foundation.

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Because giving back doesn't cost you extra.

From September 1st to October 31st, participating Shell stations will donate a minimum of one cent per gallon of the fuel pump from the giving pump or a minimum donation of $300.

There's a lot going on in Hollywood.

How are you supposed to stay on top of it all?

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In the summer of 2022, I found myself standing in the parking lot of the Sports Stadium Inn,

probably pretty close to the same spot where, nearly five years earlier, Libby and Devin had chatted with David Fristo before they checked in to room 319.

The Sports Stadium Inn sits directly on Highway 40 in Independence, around the corner from the stadium where the Kansas City Chiefs play.

During football season, the motel can attract out-of-town fans, who I imagine are sorely disappointed when they pull up outside a yellowing block of dingy rooms that look like they haven't been updated since the 80s.

Google reviews mention shady characters, dirty linens, and frequent bug sightings.

But for the most part, the clientele aren't football fans.

They're locals with few other places to go.

I knew from reading police reports that the Independence Police Department was often at the motel, responding to 911 calls involving alleged drug sales, robberies, and assaults.

As recently as August 2023, a man was killed there.

But even so, I wanted to see it for myself, to get a better sense of the place, and potentially answer some lingering questions about the crime scene.

When I told Cindy my plan to go, even in the middle of the day, she advised that I should bring someone with me, someone more physically intimidating, which is how I ended up accompanied by a six-foot, 200-pound private investigator who carries a concealed weapon.

I'm Jim Murray.

I'm one of the founders of Star Investigations LLC out of Jefferson City, Missouri.

I've been a private investigator for about close to 40 years now.

Even with Jim Murray by my side, I was having some serious second thoughts.

As soon as we pulled into the parking lot, I felt eyes on us.

People were peeking through the curtains, opening their doors to look at our shiny rental SUV, the nicest in the lot.

Almost immediately, I saw a drug sale take place through a car window.

Jim Murray and I didn't linger to take in the scene.

We headed into the the office and asked to rent room 319.

Now, requesting a specific room was a pretty weird ask.

All the rooms are essentially identical and equally dismal.

And sure enough, the motel clerk told us room 319 was dirty and handed us keys to another room instead.

There was an awkward moment of silence as Murray and I looked at each other.

And then, without skipping a beat, Murray came up with a wild concocted story about how we were a couple and that specific room held special memories for us.

We wanted to return there for old time's sake.

I don't know what the clerk made of this explanation, but eventually when he saw we weren't going anywhere, he said if we really wanted that room, we could come back in 20 minutes and it would be ready.

So we drove around for a bit, then came back and got the keys.

Still the old-fashioned kind with 319 written on a cheap plastic tag.

Holding them in my hands, I couldn't help but imagine Libby doing this exact same thing.

Jim Murray, my producer, and I, grabbed the audio equipment and some notebooks and shuffled inside.

And immediately there was a rapping at the door.

What?

Excuse me?

What?

What are you cool?

Okay, we're just going to be a minute.

She just dropped so I'm going to take some pictures.

Give us about 10 minutes, okay?

Thank you.

The motel clerk told us we were only only allowed to have two people in the room.

You can hear in my voice that I was nervous about their intrusion.

But it wasn't just that.

Standing inside room 319 felt creepier than I had expected.

Honestly, I wanted to get the hell out of there.

And so we moved through the room quickly, taking photos and jotting down details that we thought might be useful later.

See, this door has been repaired, replaced, or going

to vacuum.

Can y'all see morning as you see that?

Jim Murray wanted to take some measurements of the bathroom where Libby died.

He had doubts that Libby, at five foot five, would have been able to take Devin's belt, feed it over the top of the door, and then close it.

What I understand is if the pressure is on this, this just falls out.

Yeah, put the belt there and see if we can

close the door up.

He said the switch was sticking out.

I still don't think it'll work.

I don't, well, maybe it will.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I just don't.

You'd have to just be a real contortionist to do that.

We had planned to spend some time in the room discussing the case, but I changed my mind and suggested we leave right away.

Is there anything else we want to do here or should we hit it?

That's all I needed.

You know what?

Now you've seen it inside.

You've been there yourself.

We took the measurements.

We packed up, piled back into the car, and once we were out of the parking lot, I brought out the recorder.

So we were just at the hotel or the motel room where Libby died and it was very very small you know just enough room for a bed and there were two large mirrors

one facing the bed and one on the side of the bed and a tiny bathroom with a really rickety door on it that almost came off just us opening and closing the door and an absolutely tiny bathroom.

For me the saddest part is just looking at that space between the toilet and that bathtub.

How sad is it to end your life right there in that area?

It did not feel good in that room.

It was a really sad place to go and a sad place for her to have those last moments of her life.

In the weeks after Libby's body was found, IPD never returned to room 319, as far as I can tell.

They didn't go back to measure the tiny bathroom and work through the logistics of Devin's story, nor did they try to track down more guests who'd stayed near room 319 that night, despite the fact that the impression I gathered was that the motel operated almost like a marketplace where people could wander around and buy drugs and sex.

Instead, IPD waited two months for the results of the autopsy to come back.

And even though it was ruled undetermined, they closed the case anyway, much to the shock of Libby's mom, Cindy.

In my mind, I'm thinking,

shouldn't we trust our police department?

We started calling, and they were never available, and we couldn't get hold of anybody.

As the months went by, Cindy came to the harsh realization that IPD was unlikely to do anything else in Libby's case.

She was the only one still searching for answers.

I was talking to another mother who had lost a daughter in independence, and her daughter's death certificate said suicide, but she knew darn well it wasn't by just the photographs and everything her daughter had been through.

The mother was a local woman named Jackie Schroer.

In 2017, her daughter Angela had also died under suspicious circumstances.

She was found shot in the forehead.

Less than two months after her death, the Shrosay police told them the case was closed.

Suicide.

End of story.

But that was just the beginning.

To Cindy, the Shroer's experience already felt eerily similar to her own.

Almost as shocking as learning about their daughter's death, they say was learning how the Independence Police Department dismissed this investigation.

Dismissed was exactly how Cindy felt.

And she wanted to put pressure on IPD, but didn't really know where to begin.

So she asked Jackie.

I called her, and I was like, what do I need to do?

Because I believe I'm in the same situation you are.

And so she said, you need to get your ME records.

You need to get all your police records.

Have you done that yet?

And I said, no, I didn't know I could do that.

I had no idea that you could get the reports and that they were public knowledge.

Since Libby's case was officially closed, Cindy was able to request the complete police file.

This was one silver lining at least.

But Jackie warned her that the road ahead would not be easy.

She started advising me, get your stuff together because this is going to be the fight of your life.

At this point, Cindy knew very few solid facts about Libby's death.

Basically, all she had to go on was what police told her the night she learned her daughter had died.

And so she was prepared to immerse herself in the case file, to learn everything the police saw and did.

But Cindy's resolve was tested almost immediately with the arrival of an IPD disc containing photos of Libby's body.

I didn't look at it at the DVD of the crime scene because I didn't want to.

You can't unsee something that you've looked at.

But Cindy also knew if she was going to get to the truth of what happened to Libby, she really had no other option.

I waited, I think, about three days.

And I prayed.

And I prepared myself.

And then plugged it in early one morning and watched it.

I knew right then that that something was, you know, not right about the scene.

I knew the way her body was positioned.

I knew just by reading all the reports and seeing it that

she didn't die by herself, inflicted, you know.

As painful as it was, the process strengthened Cindy's resolve.

But if Cindy was going to change anyone's mind about what happened, she needed more than just a feeling, which is why she reached out to Jim Murray, the private investigator.

He immediately called the police station the day we hired him in the room before we even left.

He picked up the phone and he called IPD.

I got an appointment to talk with someone, you know, and that was more than we'd ever gotten.

When families face their darkest moments, Your kindness can be the light they need.

And when it comes to helping children in the Bay Area, you can spark hope with Shell.

When you fill up at the Purple Giving Pump at Shell, a portion of your purchase is donated to charities like the California Fire Foundation.

Download the Shell app to find your nearest giving pump, less than two miles away.

Because giving back doesn't cost you extra.

From September 1st to October 31st, participating Shell stations will donate a minimum of one cent per gallon of the fuel pump from the giving pump or a minimum donation of $300.

There's a lot going on in Hollywood.

How are you supposed to stay on top of it all?

Variety has the solution.

Take 20 minutes out of your day and listen to the new Daily Variety podcast for breaking entertainment news and expert perspectives.

Where do you see the business actually heading?

Featuring the iconic journalists of Variety and hosted by co-editor-in-chief Cynthia Littleton.

The only constant in Hollywood is change.

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It was an unimaginable crime.

It's four consecutive life terms for Brian Koberger, who killed the four University of Idaho students.

The defense from a sinking ship.

It was clear at that point, he was out of options.

Nearly 30 months of silence until

bombshell development, Brian Koberger appearing set to accept a plea deal just five weeks before his quadruple murder trial was set to start.

No trial, no testimony.

He has pleaded guilty to five criminal counts, one of burglary, and then four counts of murder.

In this final season, we returned to Moscow with with interviews from those still searching for answers.

Why did the prosecution take this?

They were holding all the cars.

How on earth could you make a deal?

What message does that send?

Listen to season three of the Idaho Massacre on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Liz went from being interested in true crime to living true crime.

My husband comes back outside, and he's he's shaking and he just looks like he's seen a ghost and he's just in shock.

And he said,

your dad's been killed.

This is Hands Tied, a true crime podcast exploring the murder of Jim Melgar.

Liz's mom had just been found shut in a closet, her hands and feet tied up, shouting for help.

I was just completely in shock.

Her dad had been stabbed to death.

It didn't feel real at all.

For more than a decade, Liz has been trying to figure out what happened.

There's a lot of guilt, I think, pushing me, and I just, I want answers.

Listen to Hands Tied on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

If you were to imagine a quintessential private eye, Jim Murray might not be too far off.

He's tall, broad-shouldered, with tattoos on his forearms that peek through his rolled-up sleeves.

He has a deep baritone voice that can be imposing if it needs to be.

He really was the perfect person to accompany me, as you heard earlier, to the sports stadium inn.

When Cindy hired Murray in the summer of 2018, he was entering a new phase of life.

After nearly four decades of investigative work, his eyesight was failing him and he was almost ready to stop taking new cases.

Almost.

Because he still makes time for a particular kind of client.

I have kind of retired at this point, but,

you know, my passion is helping families find answers when they're not getting answers.

I've done over the years cases that are ruled to be a suicide and they may be a homicide, suspicious deaths.

So it seems like I end up doing a lot of those.

Murray told me his desire to help families like Libby's stems from personal experience.

Some years back, his own daughter died under suspicious circumstances in Texas.

These tattoos on my arms tell a story.

The scales of justice, that reminds me every day that the state of Texas has failed to bring justice to my daughter and to my family.

That one right there, when it says sheepdogs never rest, somebody harmed my flock.

Those are there for a reason and they're to remind me every day, no matter how bad I feel, no matter what happens.

I got to get my ass up and I got to go because I owe it to my family.

If it weren't for my daughter's case and the Libby Caswells of the world, I'd be at my house sitting by my swimming pool sucking on Margarita by now.

Mari knows what it feels like to be a parent desperately searching for answers.

And he also knows that a PI like him is often much more likely to get information out of a police department than a grieving family member.

Cindy struck me as somebody that was just getting stonewalled at every turn.

And that's really where I came in.

In fact, Murray already had a pretty good relationship with IPD at the time Cindy hired him.

I'm very familiar with independents in my business.

I know a lot of their detectives and they are good people.

Do they make mistakes?

Yeah.

Do I always agree with everything they do?

No.

And I can tell you as a private investigator, we don't always agree with the police.

That's why there are private investigators in the world to go back and take a look at things.

Five months after Libby's case was closed, Jim Murray began to dig through the case file that Cindy had acquired.

I met with her, looked at all the photographs, and knew right away something was definitely wrong.

You've got articles scattered all over the room.

You've got nightstand drawer open.

You've got a man's broken wristwatch out on the bed.

The first thing that would probably go through my mind are these signs of a struggle.

We have a term called JDLR, which means just don't look right.

For me, the broken watch, signs of a struggle.

The ransacked room, what are they looking for?

Could there have been a confrontation?

So these are all things that would make it suspicious.

Mari was also struck by the odd position of Libby's body.

She had been found by police in the small space between the toilet and the bathtub, her feet slightly up against the wall i can't see any way the body would naturally fall in that position from a hanging

that was the big telltale to me when you open that door just a little bit that body's going to come down and it's going to fall pretty much to the left side of the toilet because that's the direction the momentum is going to be carrying it

bodies all the way clear on the right side of the of the toilet still just didn't make sense i brought this up with the police and they said oh he admitted that he held her after he found her.

Holding somebody, crying, whatever.

I get that.

You don't pick him up and lay him over here.

Let me lay you over here by the toilet out of the way.

Murray also felt that there was a lack of evidence proving that Libby had ever hanged from the bathroom door.

The mark on the top of the door, which IPD discovered after interviewing Devin, wasn't convincing to him.

He didn't think there was enough damage to indicate Libby died in the way Devin described.

I realized she was a small stature person, but those are pretty flimsy doors.

If you start to lose oxygen, your body is going to have an instinct to survive, even if you want to kill yourself.

When you start losing oxygen, you're involuntarily going to move in some way.

I would have thought that door would have shown more damage than just those little tool marks on the top.

By the time we went to the motel together, the door had been replaced, so there was no way to look into this further.

During Mari's investigation, he also requested records from IPD and got something that Cindy hadn't, a copy of Devin's entire interview with IPD the night of Libby's death.

Mari was stunned by something that happened before the questioning even began.

If you watch his police interview and listen really carefully, The police officer walks out and I know he did it by design, left him with his cell phone to see what he did, and he called his dad.

You can hear the other end of the conversation if you listen closely and I actually could hear his dad saying, I'm not going to lie for you.

And that told me that, okay, why would you need somebody to lie for you?

The audio quality on the tape isn't great, but I've listened to it over and over too.

And my team ran it through some software to clean up the background noise.

From what I can tell, Murray is right.

Here's the critical part of their conversation.

Devin says to his stepmom, tell my dad to come up here and let him know that I was at his house instead.

Hey, tell my dad, tell my dad to come up here

and let him know that I was at his house instead.

His stepmom asks him to clarify.

Is Devin telling them to say he was at their house after he left the scene?

That I was at your house when I left there.

Devin says yes, and then his dad, who's now on the line, says, quote, I can't lie for you.

According to Libby's case file, the police never interviewed Devin's dad or stepmom.

Never asked them if Devin had come over after Libby died, like he told IPD he did.

I haven't been able to speak to Devin's father myself, despite numerous attempts, but I was able to interview his stepmom, Jamie.

I don't recall that phone call.

I don't have a lot of recollection of that night

because honestly,

I

made some bad choices and you know, I had some mind-altering substances in my body in which I'm clean today, but I'm clean now, but I wasn't then.

Devin's the only one who could tell us what he meant when he was talking to his parents parents that night, but he's declined to speak with me.

To my ears, it sounds like he's asking them to cover for him, to say he was somewhere he wasn't.

This moment feels like yet another missed opportunity for IPD, especially if Murray is right that the police were baiting Devin by leaving him alone with his phone.

Why didn't they ask him what he was talking about?

And why didn't they interview Devin's dad to corroborate Devin's story?

There's another moment in Devin's phone call to his parents that struck Murray as ripe for further investigation.

At one point, Devin's dad tells his son that he's concerned about how Nick is acting.

It's hard to make out, but he says, Nick is worrying me, man.

One wrong word and and you're in trouble.

Jim Murray was suspicious of Nick's story already, that he happened to leave the motel just before Devin says he fell asleep for over eight hours and then came right back after Devin called him that night with news of Libby's death.

There was also this tidbit contained within the initial police report.

The motel clerk said that a person named Nick was repeatedly calling while IPD was on the scene, asking if the cops had left yet.

Murray wondered if perhaps Nick knew a lot more than he was letting on, so he tracked him down in a nearby county jail where he was being held for an unrelated crime.

This audio is pretty rough, too, but I'll summarize as we go.

How are you, Nick?

All right, good.

My name is Jim Murray.

I'm the investigator, star investigations.

I want to chat with you regarding the death of Libby Caswell.

Now,

tell me what you remember of that day, that evening, things like that.

We actually arrived at like 6:30 that morning.

We tried to check in earlier.

Nick tells Murray a similar story to what he told IPD.

They checked into the sports stadium inn.

Libby was acting suicidal, and then Nick left.

He found out about her death when Devin called him in a panic that night.

I was actually not too far away from the hotel by my buddy's house, and so we would have headed right up to the hotel.

Nick mentioned something to Jim Murray that he didn't tell IPD, that he was dropped back off at the motel by his brother, which is interesting because his brother has actually come up a few times in my investigation.

He's the one that Libby said stole her car earlier that week.

He's also the person whose name and photo were printed out on a piece of paper found in room 319 the night Libby's body was discovered.

Which leads me to wonder, is it possible Nick's brother was in the motel room too at some point?

For that matter, did anyone else come and go from the motel room?

And did Devin stay in the room the whole time as he claims?

All of these questions would be easy enough to answer by simply reviewing the motel's security footage.

But we don't have it because IPD never got it.

Somebody dropped the ball.

If they would have just gone back and got the video, one of two things would have happened.

Either the car would have stayed there all day and not moved, which would have made his story of I was asleep all day a little more palatable.

Maybe he just crashed.

But I would just about

bet my best dog,

and I like her a lot.

that at the end of the day, you would have seen that car come and go on video.

Mari believes Nick is in some way covering for Devin.

And at one point during their conversation, he gives him some friendly advice.

If there's anything you're not telling me or anything like that, don't let your loyalty come back and bite you in the ass.

Nick insists that he's telling Murray everything he knows and that he's genuinely heartbroken about Libby's death.

I'm going to ask you a real serious question.

I want to straight up answer between you and me.

Do you think Devin killed her?

No, sir.

What makes you so sure he didn't?

I mean the passion and love they had in you just, I don't know.

I just

don't see her doing it.

I was pretty, almost 100% positive he didn't do it.

Almost 100%.

Jim Murray, though, at the end of his year-long investigation, is left with the opposite impression.

In In Libby Caswell's case, oh, absolutely, I'm 100% convinced that she was murdered.

On the next episode of What Happened to Libby Caswell, Cindy continues her fight for the truth and tracks down a medical expert to weigh in on Libby's manner of death.

When I reviewed the documents, it was clear that the physical evidence, principally the marks on Libby's neck, were not consistent with a suicidal hanging.

They were consistent with a homicide.

And the Independence Police Department responds to criticisms of its investigations.

I don't have that arrogant, condescending nature about me, so I don't put myself on a pedestal above anybody.

If you can come up with something or an idea, something we haven't thought of, by all means, let me have it.

What happened to Libby Caswell is written, reported, and hosted by me, Melissa Jelton, with writing and story editing by Marissa Brown and Lauren Hansen.

Episodes are edited by Jeremy Thal and Carl Cadel.

Our executive producer is Ryan Murdoch.

For iHeart podcasts, executive producers are Jason English and Katrina Norvell, with our supervising producer, Carl Cadel.

Archival material courtesy of KCTV5 News.

Our theme song is written by Aaron Kaufman and performed by Aaron Kaufman and Elizabeth Wolf.

Original music by Erin Kaufman with additional music by Jeremy Thal.

Our episodes are mixed and mastered by Carl Cadel.

To find out more about my investigation or to send a tip, please email me at whathappenedtolibby at gmail.com.

Thanks so much for listening.

This is an iHeart podcast.